Speaker 1: Wait for it, seven o six fifty five KERCID Talk Station,
Speaker 1: A very Happy Tuesday special. Tuesday, We've got Tim Rivers
Speaker 1: American Ghula Chronicles. We've had him on the program a
Speaker 1: couple of times. He'll be on at seven point forty
Speaker 1: now that Hunter Biden has been pardoned, because of course
Speaker 1: they were all just picking on him and had nothing
Speaker 1: to do with his criminal reality. How about the January
Speaker 1: sixth prisoners, what's in store for them? We got the
Speaker 1: inside scoop with bright Bart News political reporter Wendell Huza
Speaker 1: bow Is going to join us in an hour talk
Speaker 1: about guess Hunter Biden, and then Daniel Davis deep dive
Speaker 1: on Russia, Belarus, Georgia, and then my friends at OHC
Speaker 1: the Cancer Special. It's going to be talking about the
Speaker 1: blood cancers that'll happen at the end of the next hour.
Speaker 1: In the meantime, welcome back. Always a real distinct pleasure
Speaker 1: to have Men's Studio. Todd Zenz a recently pending op
Speaker 1: ed piece which appeared in the paper version of the
Speaker 1: cincinn Inquirer. He is a West Prices so Resident retired
Speaker 1: Inspector General the United States Department of Commerce. After thirty
Speaker 1: one years of conducting audits and investigations of federal officials,
Speaker 1: programs and operations. He remains a certified fraud examiner and
Speaker 1: he knows things financial clearly. Todd Zenz Are welcome back
Speaker 1: to the fifty five KRC Morning Show, tackling the problem
Speaker 1: of well City of Cincinnati finances, most notably the still
Speaker 1: ongoing and yet to ever be resolved pension problem. Welcome back,
Speaker 1: my friend. I love having you in studio. Thank you, Brian,
Speaker 1: good morning, and I certainly appreciate you taking the laboring
Speaker 1: or and staying up on what is really a very
Speaker 1: very challenging financial situation. You and I can talk all
Speaker 1: day long about the problems facing the City of Cincinnati.
Speaker 1: I mean we were talking off air, most notably about
Speaker 1: the backlog of just simple fundamental basic things like road
Speaker 1: repairs that mc up and get closer to it a
Speaker 1: little bit. It's just a simple core service, something that
Speaker 1: acts as a financial draw because people are inclined to
Speaker 1: want to move into cities with good infrastructure. You let
Speaker 1: your roads deteriorate over deckage. You went up with a
Speaker 1: four hundred million dollar backlog. They're supposed to do X
Speaker 1: number of millions of dollars of road repairs each year,
Speaker 1: and every year they kick the damn can down the road. Well,
Speaker 1: welcome to the pension program.
Speaker 2: That's exactly right, Brian. They're doing the same thing. They're
Speaker 2: kicking the can down the road. And even when they
Speaker 2: get surplus money like they did this year sixty five
Speaker 2: million dollars, instead of applying that to the pension liability,
Speaker 2: which is an eight hundred million dollars shortfall eight hundred million,
Speaker 2: they decide to put four million of that sixty five
Speaker 2: million towards the pension liability and they spend the rest.
Speaker 2: I think there's about five hundred thousand dollars left of
Speaker 2: that sixty five million that they haven't applied yet.
Speaker 1: And where does that money go off to. It's a
Speaker 1: random decision by the mayor that hey, I'm going to
Speaker 1: spend it over here. And I mean, this isn't the
Speaker 1: power of the purse resting in the hands of Congress
Speaker 1: type situation. With that money, it's like we've got a
Speaker 1: dictator who can just decide on his own terms where
Speaker 1: the money's going to be spent.
Speaker 2: Well, the way it was reported is that they broke
Speaker 2: they broke it down into three different buckets. The mayor
Speaker 2: got to recommend spending, the city council got to recommend spending,
Speaker 2: and the city manager got to recommend spending. But I
Speaker 2: must say that the money that the city manager spent
Speaker 2: all went towards not all, but most went towards public safety.
Speaker 2: The other things were all what we call pet projects.
Speaker 2: The mayor wanted to spend three hundred thousand dollars renovating
Speaker 2: City Hall and you know things like that.
Speaker 1: Real important stuff, very important, like the Bengals getting new
Speaker 1: locker rooms for the players. It in yours to everyone's
Speaker 1: benefit when that kind of thing happens, doesn't it. That's right, great,
Speaker 1: great expenditure, taxpayer dollars, they're per ball. So in order
Speaker 1: to tackle this challenge, which, as you point out in
Speaker 1: your op ed piece, and I applaud you for it,
Speaker 1: Cincinnat Council must attack pension liability more aggressively. The Cincinnati
Speaker 1: Futures Commission, now they remember when they rolled out the
Speaker 1: report all the things that the city needs to be
Speaker 1: doing or the things that they should be looking at
Speaker 1: by way of righting this ship. And weren't they the
Speaker 1: ones that said this was the most concerning threat facing
Speaker 1: the City of Cincinnati, or pension liability.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's right, if you read the report. Unfortunately, this
Speaker 2: was towards the back of the report. The report's very
Speaker 2: difficult to read in the first place. But they identified
Speaker 2: three threats, they called them threats. The most concerning is
Speaker 2: the pension liability, And basically the issue is that eventually
Speaker 2: it's going to eat the general fund alive, that by
Speaker 2: the time we get down the road ten, fifteen, twenty years,
Speaker 2: the pension liability, if it's not fixed, is going to
Speaker 2: eat into the general fund to the point where we
Speaker 2: can't afford basic operations. In addition, they're going to be
Speaker 2: they're going to have to reduce benefits even more than
Speaker 2: they have already.
Speaker 1: Well, it can a parallel be drawn to our national
Speaker 1: debt of thirty seven trillion dollars, because more and more
Speaker 1: of that goes to debt service, eating into the rest
Speaker 1: of the revenue that's supposed to fund things like Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid,
Speaker 1: et cetera.
Speaker 2: Right, Well, we already borrow money to the point where
Speaker 2: we spend one hundred and forty million dollars a year
Speaker 2: servicing our debt on our bonds. So this debt is
Speaker 2: even beyond that. This eight hundred million dollars is even
Speaker 2: beyond that, and they're they're just contributing pennies to the
Speaker 2: thing every year compared to what is required to make
Speaker 2: it solvent.
Speaker 1: Pennies directed at the most concerning threat facing the city.
Speaker 2: Yeah, there's definitely a disconnected futures Commission. Their solution, the
Speaker 2: only solution they came up with was to take the
Speaker 2: pension fund and get it to a point. Right now,
Speaker 2: it's sixty eight percent funded. They want to get it
Speaker 2: up to eighty percent funded. And if they feel if
Speaker 2: they do that, they can negotiate with the Ohio Retirement
Speaker 2: System Public Employee Retirement System opers OPERS and therefore offload
Speaker 2: the pension fund to the state. Now, it's very complicated,
Speaker 2: very controversial, because you don't you don't know how the
Speaker 2: two plans compare at this point. But that's their only solution.
Speaker 2: And in order to do that, they want to raise
Speaker 2: four hundred million dollars three hundred and ninety million dollars
Speaker 2: to bring that pension fund up to eighty percent funded
Speaker 2: and well, and had that been.
Speaker 1: Paying into the pension fund on an appropriate level in
Speaker 1: the previous couple of decades, we wouldn't have this challenge
Speaker 1: to start with, and we wouldn't have to worry about
Speaker 1: unloading it on the rest of the Ohio tax payers.
Speaker 2: Right What's interesting is that right now the pension system
Speaker 2: is governed by a federal lawsuit settlement called the Collaborative
Speaker 2: Settlement Agreement from twenty fifteen, where the city agreed to
Speaker 2: bring the pension system to full funding one hundred percent
Speaker 2: funding by twenty forty five. They gave them thirty years
Speaker 2: to get there, and we already know, Brian, that they're
Speaker 2: not going to make it. They're not going to come
Speaker 2: anywhere close.
Speaker 1: It's a pre existing function of government. It's like, you know,
Speaker 1: you got X number of things that you gotta pay
Speaker 1: for every year and that pension is one of them.
Speaker 1: Just ignore the hell out of it. And then they
Speaker 1: have to go to federal court and enter into a
Speaker 1: settlement agreement that gives them an additional thirty plus years
Speaker 1: to get to write this ship. And yet they haven't
Speaker 1: lifted a finger in an effort to even comply with that. Yeah,
Speaker 1: they're not going to make it, and so are we
Speaker 1: governed by idiots? Is that what this comes down to,
Speaker 1: are they all just financial illiterates, or if I was
Speaker 1: under that pension pro I would be screaming bloody murder
Speaker 1: about this. What I mean, those who have to rely
Speaker 1: on this pension system. Where are they? Where's the revolt? Yeah?
Speaker 2: Might Well, that's where this collaborative settlement agreement came from
Speaker 2: twelve years ago, is that people got so upset like
Speaker 2: the ASSME union's individual retirement retirees. So that's where the
Speaker 2: collaborative settlement agreement came from in the first place. And
Speaker 2: based on the agreement, it looks like the people could
Speaker 2: come at them again for not complying or not living
Speaker 2: up to their agreement. They could probably reopen the thing.
Speaker 2: I would like to think so, so we'll see what happens.
Speaker 1: It's like, I don't know what the terms of conditions
Speaker 1: of the collaborative agreement are, but if you've been given
Speaker 1: X number of years, it seems to me there are
Speaker 1: probably certain benchmarks that you must accomplish along the way,
Speaker 1: because you can't just wait till the thirtieth year and
Speaker 1: then say, well, oh, that's right, we should have been
Speaker 1: painted to this pension thing because we were obligated to
Speaker 1: do it thirty five years yars ago or whatever.
Speaker 2: Yeah, the agreement doesn't really specify specific amounts that need
Speaker 2: to be.
Speaker 1: Well, there is a failure in terms of entering into
Speaker 1: the agreement.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but it does. It does allow certain things to
Speaker 2: reopen negotiations or reopen the settlement agreement, you know that
Speaker 2: the judge can approve. And this failure to be on
Speaker 2: track for one hundred percent by twenty forty five, I
Speaker 2: think falls into that category.
Speaker 1: I would make that argument. It seems like a winner.
Speaker 1: I'm not going to call it a no brainer, given
Speaker 1: the complexity of the situation.
Speaker 2: But I think the reason that this happens is I
Speaker 2: don't know that their financial illiterates. I think that's probably
Speaker 2: part of it. But I think they just spend money
Speaker 2: on their constituents. They spend all these these things on
Speaker 2: their constituents.
Speaker 1: But aren't the pensioners their constituents.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but that's a that's a smaller number, I think.
Speaker 1: But screw them, they're retired, basically, isn't that the attitude?
Speaker 2: Well, let's just look at the last few weeks.
Speaker 1: All right, let's pause on that note. We have a
Speaker 1: nice foray or entry to start off hitting the ground running.
Speaker 1: When we bring back, Todd Zenzer again check out the
Speaker 1: op ed piece, since any council must attack pension liability
Speaker 1: more aggressively. Actually, I think I would have been a
Speaker 1: little more aggressive in the wording of the op ed piece, Todd,
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Speaker 2: This is fifty five KRC an iHeartRadio station. Here.
Speaker 1: It is nine first one to Wether forecasts partly cloudy
Speaker 1: started that day, it'll be mostly sunny later. I have
Speaker 1: thirty four over night down to twenty three of a
Speaker 1: few clowns Tomorrow for listener lunch, mostly clotty. It'll be windy,
Speaker 1: but I high have forty two wintery snow mixed kind
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Speaker 1: with a high of twenty seven twenty one degrees. Right
Speaker 1: now traffic time. Chuck from the UC Traffic Center.
Speaker 3: You see how weight Ball Center offers comprehensive obesity care
Speaker 3: and advanced sergeic co expertise called five one three, nine three,
Speaker 3: nine two two sixty three. That's nine three, nine twenty
Speaker 3: two sixty three. Crews continue to work with a couple
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Speaker 3: at Harvey Chuck Ingram on fifty five krs the talk station.
Speaker 1: Seven twenty and Happy Tuesday to you. Brian Thomas in
Speaker 1: studio with Todd Zenzer. He knows his stuff when it
Speaker 1: comes to audits and things financial of us A Department
Speaker 1: of Commerce. Thirty one years as the Inspector General, he
Speaker 1: still remains a certified fraud examiner, And basically it sounds
Speaker 1: to me like what we're dealing with is a bunch
Speaker 1: of financial fraud or at least massive in competence on
Speaker 1: the part of the City of Cincinnati. Pension liability outstanding
Speaker 1: total in the whole six hundred and eighty million dollars, right,
Speaker 1: something like that.
Speaker 2: Actually, the pension liability is up over eight hundred million.
Speaker 1: Oh oh, here, I am misplacing a couple one hundred
Speaker 1: million dollars. But that's what the City of Cincinnati does.
Speaker 1: You're getting ready to walk in through some extraditional points
Speaker 1: on this. We took a break, Todd, So let's talk
Speaker 1: about it because you and I were engaging in this
Speaker 1: discussion on the break. And in spite of the fact
Speaker 1: that the pension is just woefully underfunded and it is
Speaker 1: under the subject matter of a federal settlement agreement, that's right,
Speaker 1: and we're not compliance, apparently they still ignore it.
Speaker 2: Well, they are ignoring it. That's that's the issue. They're
Speaker 2: continuing to kick kick the problem down the road. You know,
Speaker 2: they just spent sixty five million dollars of the surplus.
Speaker 2: So but over the last three weeks they've come in
Speaker 2: for a proposal of three hundred and twenty five thousand
Speaker 2: dollars for a program a base in California. It's probably
Speaker 2: got probably got a handful of cities that are participating
Speaker 2: for to try to attack youth violence, youth gun violence
Speaker 2: and the idea is to actually pay certain youth to.
Speaker 1: Not commit run to behave that's right.
Speaker 2: So that's three three, that's three hundred and twenty five
Speaker 2: thousand dollars.
Speaker 1: It's just an insane societal regression.
Speaker 2: And then we've got half a million dollars that the
Speaker 2: city council wants to spend on mental health, a mental
Speaker 2: health program for transgender youth. They've got, uh there was
Speaker 2: the Vice mayor was on the radio just the other
Speaker 2: day about historic preservation of North Avondale and she's suggesting
Speaker 2: that the city council can pay for stained glass windows
Speaker 2: for homes in North Assondale. I mean, it's it's you're
Speaker 2: making this up. I'm not making that up. No, I
Speaker 2: heard it myself. So the idea is that there's a
Speaker 2: lot of things to spend money on.
Speaker 1: That silence was me just in a state of absolute disbelief.
Speaker 1: I apologize.
Speaker 2: There's a lot of worthwhile things to spend money on.
Speaker 2: It's never ending. But the point is that dispension liability
Speaker 2: is a threat to the city and they're not doing
Speaker 2: anything about it.
Speaker 1: Well, and you just mentioned I'm not having to go
Speaker 1: with transgender youth and their mental challenges. I can certainly
Speaker 1: acknowledge that they probably do. But I just got done
Speaker 1: going through the Congressional the summary of the COVID nineteen
Speaker 1: Select Subcommittee Report, and it talked about one of the
Speaker 1: consequences of the lockdowns and the lack of education was
Speaker 1: a fifty one percent increase in girls twelve to seventeen
Speaker 1: committing suicide. Wow. Yeah, you know, that is a broad
Speaker 1: much broader than the challenges of the transgender youth, which
Speaker 1: don't make up a sizable chunk of the population. That
Speaker 1: challenge in and of itself alone sounds like a more
Speaker 1: justifiable thing to try to take a stab at.
Speaker 4: But you know, this is the city of Cincinnati. How
Speaker 4: what are they supposed to What do they think they
Speaker 4: could possibly do? Yeah, like four million dollars a year
Speaker 4: to the Green Cincinnati Plan. It's like, is that really?
Speaker 4: Is that really gonna do anything for the environment?
Speaker 2: Absolutely not, absolutely not, But they keep spending. They just
Speaker 2: dedicated what is it, five hundred thousand dollars for a
Speaker 2: green bank.
Speaker 1: And that's the hell's a green bank.
Speaker 2: The green bank is another kind of quasi agency that
Speaker 2: the city's going to set up in order to be
Speaker 2: a clearing house for money devoted to climate change.
Speaker 1: Okay, and everyone who might think that's a great idea.
Speaker 1: Again to the Wall Street Journal Bjorn Lombourg's op ed piece,
Speaker 1: climate change colonialism keeps poor countries impoverished. And his point
Speaker 1: is a brilliant one. You know, if you even want
Speaker 1: to look at the weather related deaths that have gone on,
Speaker 1: even if you want to draw a parallel between climate
Speaker 1: change and weather. Extreme weather took an average of nine
Speaker 1: thousand lives each year over the past decade globally. Yet
Speaker 1: they are spending literally billions of billions of dollars in
Speaker 1: programs that do absolutely nothing for the impoverished countries that
Speaker 1: they claim their saving through their green projects. This is
Speaker 1: a global level talks here. Now we're moving down to
Speaker 1: the Cincinnati City area level, as if what our carbon
Speaker 1: emissions are collectively in the city have anything to do
Speaker 1: with anything.
Speaker 2: That's right.
Speaker 1: I agree with you, Brian toddszens aer hold On. We're
Speaker 1: going to continue this conversation one more segment. First, the
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Speaker 2: In today's Marketers report, here's.
Speaker 1: Your Channel nine first warning weather forecast. Partly cloudie started
Speaker 1: to day with most to send us guys at some
Speaker 1: point later thirty four for the high, end of twenty
Speaker 1: three overnight with a few clouds, windy and cloudy tomorrow
Speaker 1: for listener lunch raycial chili forty two degrees mix the
Speaker 1: snow and uh kind of wintery mix overnight twenty for
Speaker 1: the low, and then on Thursday we're going to see
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Speaker 3: In type of traffic from the Ucum Tramping Center, you
Speaker 3: see health Weight Ball Center offers comprehensive obesity care and
Speaker 3: advanced surgical expertise called five one three nine three nine
Speaker 3: two two sixty three. That's nine three nine two two
Speaker 3: six three step found seventy five slows out of Lachland,
Speaker 3: then very heavy from seventy four to two accidents. One
Speaker 3: at Hoppel, one at the Western It is via the
Speaker 3: King is blocked up between Ready and Burnett due to
Speaker 3: a wreck. Chuck Ingram on fifty five KRC the talk
Speaker 3: station seven thirty fifty five KRC DE talk station. We
Speaker 3: can talk to him for hours. Todd's Enzer former Inspector
Speaker 3: Jenner of the Oast Department of Commerce. You know, is
Speaker 3: what he's talking about when it comes to fraud examinations.
Speaker 3: He also knows what he's talking about when it comes
Speaker 3: to budge. It comes to allocating and properly budgeting. The
Speaker 3: City of Cincinnati well, as revealed this morning in the
Speaker 3: brief amount of time we've been talking, has an epic
Speaker 3: failure in this regard. The pension system is woefully underfunded.
Speaker 3: And I want to go back just briefly tied to
Speaker 3: the idea the since Any Futures Commission put out, which
Speaker 3: again the Sinceinni Futures Commission said, this is the biggest
Speaker 3: gravest threat the city is facing, this pension liability. In
Speaker 3: an effort to deal with that, if they write the
Speaker 3: pension a little bit, they bring this hole down to
Speaker 3: four hundred million, then somehow opers would be willing to
Speaker 3: take it over. Well, like, ohiopen and I'm as as
Speaker 3: an Ohio tax payer and I don't live in the
Speaker 3: city of Cincinnati. I'm like, this is the hole you
Speaker 3: dug yourself in. Don't put that liability on me. Why
Speaker 3: would operhs even agree to take it?
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, I'm not really sure why they would take it,
Speaker 2: But I don't know that the Futures Commission was all
Speaker 2: that confident because they think that just getting to that
Speaker 2: amount would get them to the negotiating table. It's not
Speaker 2: that it would seal the deal or anything like that.
Speaker 2: That's just to get talks going with the pension, the
Speaker 2: state pension system.
Speaker 1: But that would also bring them closer to compliance with
Speaker 1: the consent decree they entered into the federal government, which
Speaker 1: is supposed to be doing anyway.
Speaker 2: That's right, So they should probably go ahead and try
Speaker 2: to reopen that agreement if they give themselves a little
Speaker 2: more time and be more aggressive about bringing that bringing
Speaker 2: that up.
Speaker 1: But then we wouldn't be able to buy new steamed
Speaker 1: glass windows for the folks in Avondel.
Speaker 2: Yeah. The other issue though, is this is regionalizing the
Speaker 2: waterworks and whether that is even a possibility.
Speaker 1: How would that help because so far, as you've explained,
Speaker 1: and we've been over this before with the sale of
Speaker 1: the railroad, they're just selling literally everything is not nailed
Speaker 1: down to make to meet their obligations presently, right, And
Speaker 1: that goes with the pension because right now the pension's
Speaker 1: paying out more than it is taking in.
Speaker 2: That's right. They've got four thousand people taking out or
Speaker 2: beneficiaries that are using the retirement system, and they've got
Speaker 2: three thousand people paying in. In addition, they the pension Board,
Speaker 2: which is an agency of the city, the pension Board
Speaker 2: has to sell its assets. It's reported to the city
Speaker 2: that it has to sell its assets in order to
Speaker 2: even pay benefits and expenses. So they're eating away their
Speaker 2: investment portfolio in order to actually pay their bills, and
Speaker 2: so that reduces their investment income. And they right now,
Speaker 2: according to their financial report, uh, they're one of the
Speaker 2: highest pension systems in the country. I think who are
Speaker 2: using their investments to pay their bills, are eating into
Speaker 2: their investments to pay their bills.
Speaker 1: Which obvious stating the obvious imperils their ability, I mean
Speaker 1: more rapidly each year because the city clearly is not
Speaker 1: replenishing what is being paid out. They haven't prioritized even
Speaker 1: maintaining some even a level of status quo. It sounds
Speaker 1: like right.
Speaker 2: And even their projections that went into that collaborative agreement
Speaker 2: said that they were going to earn seven and a
Speaker 2: quarter percent on their investments. Well they were down below
Speaker 2: seven percent. They're not even hitting that target. So they've
Speaker 2: got a lot of issues. It's kind of a downward spiral,
Speaker 2: and nobody's really worried about it.
Speaker 1: I guess all right, let us just paint a somewhat
Speaker 1: bleak scenario which looks like the trajectory we were on
Speaker 1: while the council people and the city manager and the
Speaker 1: mayor all fiddle. What happens when the pension runs out
Speaker 1: of money?
Speaker 2: Well, I don't know that it's going to run out
Speaker 2: of money.
Speaker 1: It's going to have to Well they're they're eating principle
Speaker 1: up as we talk, apparently, So I what is it?
Speaker 1: What is the future for the city? Sense? Any look
Speaker 1: like if this problem is not fixed.
Speaker 2: Well, they're going to start reducing benefits fairly early, earlier
Speaker 2: than failure. And I don't really know the answer to that, Brian.
Speaker 2: I think they're going to have to find some way
Speaker 2: to shore up the liability, to reduce the liability, and
Speaker 2: they're going to have to reopen their collaborative settlement agreement
Speaker 2: to give themselves more time to get there if they can,
Speaker 2: if they can, And I really think that the city
Speaker 2: just has to start putting money into that pension liability
Speaker 2: to ward off what we're talking about, instead of spending
Speaker 2: it on stupid things, on all these pet projects and
Speaker 2: all this social welfare spend. And they've got to start
Speaker 2: prioritizing their spending. It's as simple as that. And yeah,
Speaker 2: I think it's a real problem for the for the
Speaker 2: people that have to rely on that pension system.
Speaker 1: I clearly want to be there. I sure as hell
Speaker 1: wouldn't want to be there either. So anyhow, well, you've
Speaker 1: shed a huge bright spotlight on a problem that every
Speaker 1: one of the cities should be talking about, certainly those
Speaker 1: in elected capacity, and they should prioritize this as numero unum,
Speaker 1: just like the Cincinnati Futures Commission did. Boy, they thought
Speaker 1: the sun shined out that since a few future Commission's
Speaker 1: bottom until you get to this particular component in their
Speaker 1: chapter in the in the report, uh, and you realize that, no,
Speaker 1: we are on a downward spiral that doesn't look like
Speaker 1: it's going to be fixed.
Speaker 2: Their recommendation was for the mayor to appoint a task
Speaker 2: force to even look into this issue. He hasn't even
Speaker 2: done that.
Speaker 1: Todd Zenzer, you're a brilliant man. I appreciate what you're
Speaker 1: doing on behalf of the citizens of the city of Cincinnati,
Speaker 1: whether they appreciate or not. Uh And hopefully more competent
Speaker 1: people will be elected to deal with the problem. Seventh
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Speaker 2: Hey, it's Ssney and for the past six years,