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Speaker 3: You are now listening to True Murder The most Shocking
Speaker 3: Killers in True crime History and the authors that have
Speaker 3: written about them Gasey, Bundy, Dahmer, The Nightstalker VTK every
Speaker 3: week another fascinating author talking about the most shocking and
Speaker 3: infamous killers in true crime history. True Murder with your host,
Speaker 3: journalist and author Dan Zupansky.
Speaker 4: Good evening, This is your host Dan Supanski, for the
Speaker 4: program True Murder, the most shocking Killers in True crime
Speaker 4: History and the authors that have written about them. This
Speaker 4: time and the perfect opportunity to recap the first year
Speaker 4: almost of True Murder, and with all the great interviews
Speaker 4: with great authors discussing their fine books. I'll be speaking
Speaker 4: this evening about a few things of interest, the latest
Speaker 4: update on the Sydney tyrheuse appeal, what transpired at court
Speaker 4: and the final verdict on that story at least so far.
Speaker 4: And I'll be talking about the very best books that
Speaker 4: I had the pleasure of reading this year and doing
Speaker 4: interviews and just stressed it to go back and to
Speaker 4: listen to those interviews just to content alone and really
Speaker 4: my objective is to get you to buy some of
Speaker 4: these books, because get you to read some of these books.
Speaker 4: Go to your library if they should have these Get
Speaker 4: these books one way or another. Get to read these books,
Speaker 4: one way or another. And I'm going to be talking
Speaker 4: about some of my favorites from this year that I
Speaker 4: had the pleasure of some I highly anticipated book I'm
Speaker 4: going to talk about called on the Farm for American viewers,
Speaker 4: it's about the Robert Willie Picton and it's from an
Speaker 4: author that you might not be familiar with. Her name
Speaker 4: is Stevie Cameron. This is her second book about Robert Picton,
Speaker 4: one of the worst serial killers ever, one of the
Speaker 4: most bizarre, incredibly interesting and disturbing stories that you'll ever
Speaker 4: ever read, and very very well written. Actually, Gary C.
Speaker 4: King also wrote a book about the subject called Rage
Speaker 4: that you can at least get on. You can order
Speaker 4: as an ebook and it was released in late two
Speaker 4: thousand and eight. Stevie Cameron had written a book about
Speaker 4: Canada's Prime Minister and was more of a corporate business
Speaker 4: true crime reporter, we'll say, and she found this case
Speaker 4: so fascinating and interesting she felt compelled to spend the
Speaker 4: great deal of the last four or five six years
Speaker 4: working on this project to two books about Robert Willie Pickton.
Speaker 4: Also want to talk about some upcoming shows in the
Speaker 4: new year, and I apologize for not having a fresh
Speaker 4: show this week and a fresh show next week on
Speaker 4: the twenty ninth. I may have an encore program on
Speaker 4: the twenty ninth, but I wanted to speak to people
Speaker 4: that have been my dedicated and devoted followers for the
Speaker 4: last year. And some people came on board a little
Speaker 4: bit later, and some people came on right from the
Speaker 4: very beginning to be listening to this program. So I
Speaker 4: appreciate the people listening and sharing the program with other people.
Speaker 4: There have been some great reviews on other sites as
Speaker 4: well talking about the true Crime podcast for those avid
Speaker 4: true crime fans. I want to talk about programs in
Speaker 4: the new year. We have on January fifth coming up,
Speaker 4: Evil next Door, The Untold Story of a Killer Undone
Speaker 4: by DNA by an author named Amanda Lamb. And Amanda
Speaker 4: Lamb has written as author of another tru crime book
Speaker 4: called Deadly Dose and Evil next Door The Untold Story
Speaker 4: of a Killer Undone by DNA with Amanda Lamb, and
Speaker 4: that's January fifth, and apparently on May twenty first, two
Speaker 4: thousand and two, twenty three year old Raleigh, North Carolina
Speaker 4: resident Stephanie Bennett was found murdered in her apartment. Despite
Speaker 4: ample DNA evidence of the scene, investigators could find no
Speaker 4: matches in their criminal databases. Two years into the investigation, however,
Speaker 4: Detective Ken Copeland, known as the garbage Van for leaving
Speaker 4: no stone unturned in his search for evidence, and his
Speaker 4: partner Jackie Taylor, joined the case. After culling through the
Speaker 4: entire file with fresh eyes and re interviewing witnesses, they
Speaker 4: re released a description of a suspect neighbors had seen nearby,
Speaker 4: a man who'd once lived just next door to the
Speaker 4: murder scene. But the suspect refused to hand over DNA sample,
Speaker 4: wiping down anything he touched, and even planning decoy samples.
Speaker 4: This is the gripping story of how a team of
Speaker 4: aggressive detectives doggedly tracked down a killer under suspicion for
Speaker 4: a killing spreed of investigators believe might have spent years
Speaker 4: in cross state lines, and finally brought closure to an
Speaker 4: innocent young woman's grieving family. And I had mentioned amandalam
Speaker 4: is also the author of Deadly Dose, covers the crime
Speaker 4: beat for WRLTV, one of the country's top CBS affiliates
Speaker 4: in Raleigh, North Carolina. So I'm looking forward to that
Speaker 4: interview with her on January fifth. On January twelfth, we
Speaker 4: have my special guest will be Jay Patrick O'Connor. He
Speaker 4: runs a excellent true crime site. If you haven't seen
Speaker 4: this yet, it's called Crime Magazine. J Patrick O'Connor is
Speaker 4: the editor and contributing author as well. He has this
Speaker 4: excellent true crime site and it has excerpted stories, so
Speaker 4: you get to read a lot more than just say
Speaker 4: the little blurb that I read from the back of
Speaker 4: Amanda Lamb's book, but you get a better picture of
Speaker 4: what has actually gone on the story. I would say
Speaker 4: around five thousand words. I am featured on Crime Magazine
Speaker 4: as well as many authors and many stories ranging from
Speaker 4: Charlie Manson to all kinds of stories. And one of
Speaker 4: the stories that's also featured on Crime Magazine is j
Speaker 4: Patrick O'Connor has written a book, The Framing of Momaya
Speaker 4: Abu Jamal and this gentleman is an American originally born
Speaker 4: Wesley Cook, who changed his name in University. He's born
Speaker 4: in nineteen fifty four an American living in Philadelphia. He
Speaker 4: was convicted and sentenced to death for the December ninth,
Speaker 4: nineteen eighty one murder of Philadelphia police officer Daniel Faulkner.
Speaker 4: Mumaya Abu Jamal has been described as perhaps the best
Speaker 4: known death row prisoner in the world, and his sentence
Speaker 4: is one of the most debated sentences to this day.
Speaker 4: Before his arrest, he was an activist, a radio journalist,
Speaker 4: and at the time of his rest, a part time
Speaker 4: cab driver. He was also a member of the Black
Speaker 4: Panther Party until October seventy and he did He worked
Speaker 4: at a minority owned radio station and gave the voice.
Speaker 4: He was called the voice of the voiceless. He gave
Speaker 4: a lot of time to cases he felt were cases
Speaker 4: of discrimination or police brutality or those kinds of cases. Anyway,
Speaker 4: he was convicted and JP Patrick O'Connor has written the
Speaker 4: Definitive book about Mumi Abu Jamal and his fight for
Speaker 4: through his appeals his activism mentioned that he was an
Speaker 4: activist and as involved in with the Black Panthers and
Speaker 4: his education and his journalism career and how that could
Speaker 4: have all been involved in what he considers the framing
Speaker 4: of Abu Jamalso, there have been many celebrities and many
Speaker 4: people have come forward in his defense over the years.
Speaker 4: Once they've reviewed the case, we will hear the defendantive
Speaker 4: story about what exactly happened, why he was considered a
Speaker 4: suspect in the first place, why we can should consider
Speaker 4: him not a suspect, and why he is innocent, and
Speaker 4: we will hear all about that from j Patrick O'Connor.
Speaker 4: And in the meantime, please check out his excellence True Crime.
Speaker 4: It's a real must for true crime fans. Crime magazine
Speaker 4: just Crime magazine, so that's an online magazine. On January nineteenth,
Speaker 4: I have the great pleasure of a story that even
Speaker 4: though I reside in Canada, I did not know of.
Speaker 4: This story that's happened in one of our provinces here
Speaker 4: British Columbia on the West coast, including Vancouver. This was
Speaker 4: a story of a sixteen year old boy named Martin.
Speaker 4: His last named Martin, and I won't be doing justice
Speaker 4: to the story, but roughly the story is that he
Speaker 4: was waiting for a skytrain above ground high speed rail
Speaker 4: and a woman approached him and wanted his crucifix, and
Speaker 4: he did not want to give up this crucifix. What
Speaker 4: did transpire was that she had the assistance of a
Speaker 4: gentleman or boyfriend, or a gentleman or a friend, and
Speaker 4: she had given him a piece of jagged glass, broken glass,
Speaker 4: and had told this person that the young man had
Speaker 4: threatened her or tried to stab her, and that was
Speaker 4: the impetus for this man going and slitting this boy's throat. Now,
Speaker 4: typically you would have law enforcements, sometimes the district attorney,
Speaker 4: sometimes independent journalists and freelance journalists or journalists associated with
Speaker 4: reputable newspapers or radio programs or television writing about the case,
Speaker 4: and then interviewing family members and victims, and sometimes the perpetrator,
Speaker 4: or a combination of all of those things. This book
Speaker 4: that we're going to be talking about is called The
Speaker 4: Last Six Minutes, A Mother's Loss and Quest for Justice
Speaker 4: by Sandra Martin's Toner and Matthew's killers have been tried, convicted,
Speaker 4: and sentence, but Sandra Martin's Toner and her family cannot
Speaker 4: escape their grief and their overwhelming sense of loss, and
Speaker 4: they have channeled their anguish into affirmative action for victims.
Speaker 4: The Last six Minutes is the true account of the
Speaker 4: random and violent murder of sixteen year old Matthew Martin's
Speaker 4: and his family's journey through the Canadian criminal justice system.
Speaker 4: Now the family is faced with the killer's appeal and
Speaker 4: the torment perhaps being subjected to another, yet another lengthy
Speaker 4: trial now for parents, she says. Asandra Martin's Toner is
Speaker 4: the founder and executive director of Families Against Crime and
Speaker 4: Trauma FACT, an organization born as a result of the
Speaker 4: random and senseless murder of her sixteen year old son.
Speaker 4: Sandra now works tirelessly to help others that have lost
Speaker 4: the loved one to a violent crime. Here articles appear
Speaker 4: regularly magazines and online publications across Canada. Sandra has witnessed
Speaker 4: first hand the imbalance in the Canadian justice system at
Speaker 4: leaves it's time to see the rights of the victim
Speaker 4: supersede those of the offenders. And Martin's Toner with her
Speaker 4: book The Last Six Minutes and I wanted to I'm
Speaker 4: proud to say as well that my book Trophy Killed
Speaker 4: The Shall We Dance Murder have been nominated for the
Speaker 4: Top thirty True Crime Books by Kim Cantrell and her
Speaker 4: staff at True Crime Book Reviews. So I was very
Speaker 4: privileged to meet Kim Cattrell and to have actually had
Speaker 4: her on one of my programs talking about her site
Speaker 4: and True Crime Book Reviews, and also she reviewed my book,
Speaker 4: and I was very very pleased with her assessment of
Speaker 4: the book and her description of the book and very detailed,
Speaker 4: very comprehensive book reviews True Crime Book Reviews that she
Speaker 4: even has a fictional Friday. So she does an incredible
Speaker 4: job in covering some classic true crime books, some well
Speaker 4: known authors and not so well known authors. She gives
Speaker 4: everybody a shot. She can be very skating in her
Speaker 4: assessment of some people's books, but I think that's what
Speaker 4: gives her the real air of legitimacy and real confidence
Speaker 4: when you go to True Crime Book Reviews that if
Speaker 4: you're going to read a book, you're going to know
Speaker 4: what you're going to be buying, what you're going to
Speaker 4: be getting before you buy it. Courtesy of Kim Cattrell.
Speaker 4: At True Crime Book Reviews, you get a really good
Speaker 4: idea of whether you want, if you're interested in the
Speaker 4: book or not. She states a really good case on
Speaker 4: why you should get these books and what is it
Speaker 4: about them that's so interesting or so different, or so
Speaker 4: something that she hasn't seen before, Because we all know
Speaker 4: we're looking for something a little bit different each time
Speaker 4: we have shed our naivity a little bit and we
Speaker 4: get to read books. I don't say that are worse,
Speaker 4: but we are looking for very interesting stories, and there
Speaker 4: are a lot of great authors out there with a
Speaker 4: lot of great stories. It's just nice to have a
Speaker 4: site they can tell you, listen, this is something you
Speaker 4: might want to check out. So that's a really good
Speaker 4: thing that she was nominated with this book. The last
Speaker 4: six minutes. So we're going to have Sandra Martin's Toner
Speaker 4: on January nineteenth. After that, we're going to have a
Speaker 4: host of other authors. I just don't know the order.
Speaker 4: I'm looking at a fair amount of books that have
Speaker 4: come out. I want to have Burl Bear back on.
Speaker 4: Burl Bear is a true crime author. He has about
Speaker 4: six true crime books under his belt. His latest is
Speaker 4: Fatal Beauty and Mom Said Kill. He has a broken
Speaker 4: doll and h just the other books don't.
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Speaker 3: He terms and conditions eighteen.
Speaker 4: Plus come to me to mine at this minute. If
Speaker 4: I remember, I'm I'll saying a little bit later in
Speaker 4: the program. But bur Bear hosts the best true crime
Speaker 4: program that I've ever heard, and he's hilarious. I don't
Speaker 4: know how true crime and comedy gets so mixed up,
Speaker 4: but this guy is a veteran journalist. This guy's been
Speaker 4: around forever. He's got a voice of God there, and
Speaker 4: he is one hell of a funny guy. I don't
Speaker 4: know how he gets the humor out of true crime
Speaker 4: sometimes I certainly don't find it very often, But Burl
Speaker 4: Bear just a great guest. I'm going to have him
Speaker 4: back on with one of the moms said killed and
Speaker 4: fatal Beauty. It probably have him on a couple of
Speaker 4: times this year because he is just a fantastic guest.
Speaker 4: But check out his program Burl Bear and Don Woolman
Speaker 4: every week from Los Angeles. Just out sign Los Angeles
Speaker 4: and it's fantastic show and has all the best guests,
Speaker 4: all kinds of different true crime authors that appear on
Speaker 4: his program. And each week he has a great program.
Speaker 4: And it's a Saturday afternoon so check that out. But
Speaker 4: it's of course on demand archived. Dislike this program, so
Speaker 4: you can listen to it any old time you feel
Speaker 4: like it. So check out True Crime Uncensored and of
Speaker 4: course true Crime book reviews. Okay, So I wanted to
Speaker 4: also talk about just for those people who would like
Speaker 4: to know. In my book True Crime of par Trophy Killed,
Speaker 4: the Shall We Dance Murder talked of the notorious now
Speaker 4: notorious suspected serial killer Sidney Teerhughes. Sidney Tierhughes. I had
Speaker 4: been waiting since May twenty first of this year for
Speaker 4: the verdict on Sidney Teerhues's appeal, which was filed in
Speaker 4: January of two thousand and nine. So when I was
Speaker 4: the decision was reserved for three months or pardon me.
Speaker 4: The decision was reserved by three judges pardon me, on
Speaker 4: at the date of May twenty first. Sometimes they make
Speaker 4: a decision, sometimes it's a month or two, and after
Speaker 4: three or four months, especially around that time, I began
Speaker 4: thinking that maybe the authority the judge, maybe at the
Speaker 4: urging and prompting of the defense lawyer, who really has
Speaker 4: never had anybody interfere, we'll say in a trial, I think,
Speaker 4: humiliate him in front of his comrades and now forever,
Speaker 4: and he may believe I'm trying to humiliate him, and
Speaker 4: I am trying to expose him in the book by
Speaker 4: having the transcripts, by having the first interview when he
Speaker 4: didn't know I was speaking with his client when I
Speaker 4: had certain amount of information at my disposal, and I
Speaker 4: think it would be quite ironic when you read the interview.
Speaker 4: So this my effort to defeat him his client, humiliate him,
Speaker 4: interfere with the trial, show him up. Anyway. I thought
Speaker 4: maybe that he would try to use this book, and
Speaker 4: I think I thought that's what the extra time was
Speaker 4: being used for, was to examine my book. And I
Speaker 4: don't know if they didn't do that, but nevertheless, in
Speaker 4: just a few weeks ago. Quietly, it didn't make much
Speaker 4: media fanfare whatsoever that the appeal was denied, dismissed, and
Speaker 4: there'll be no more further trials, so at least for
Speaker 4: the part of my book where my book concludes with
Speaker 4: his appeal, and I predict that his lawyer may use
Speaker 4: my book to try in some way to try to
Speaker 4: acquire another trial for his client. I said, I'm not
Speaker 4: sure if that ever happened. I just know that it's
Speaker 4: finally over. I'm feeling a little bit better that they
Speaker 4: didn't give them another trial. I did, really, I wasn't
Speaker 4: so worried. I mean, I think that there would have
Speaker 4: been much more of a spotlight on this book. And
Speaker 4: it's not so much the book this case. That's still
Speaker 4: my primary focus is to have people understand this case,
Speaker 4: Americans and Canadians, because really, we took the death penalty
Speaker 4: away not that many years ago, and we've come a
Speaker 4: long way since then to lessening the magnitude of murder
Speaker 4: and to the horror of victims and their families, like
Speaker 4: the Sandra Martin Toner's sixteen year voice throw a slit
Speaker 4: for a crucifix. I haven't read the book yet, I've
Speaker 4: read some reviews on it, that's all I know. But
Speaker 4: all I know is that the impact of the judicial
Speaker 4: system is almost as scary and shocking as the impact
Speaker 4: of the murder itself. I'm not saying that that I
Speaker 4: know from experience that the victims in America feel much
Speaker 4: better after going through a trial or going through the
Speaker 4: process there either. But I think we just do have
Speaker 4: a system that has really In my book, the first
Speaker 4: quote I quote from a governor general, one of the
Speaker 4: highest officials in the country, and this is under we
Speaker 4: have two party system usually, but we have another further
Speaker 4: left wing party called the New Democratic Party. But normally
Speaker 4: we have the liberals in power more so than the
Speaker 4: conservatives in power. So you're Democrats versus Republicans, if you
Speaker 4: were to look at it that way. The Liberals, as
Speaker 4: the name implies, or going to be liberal in their lawmaking.
Speaker 4: But this is from Canada's Lister General, Jean Pierre Goer
Speaker 4: on October seventh, nineteen seventy one, and that's why I
Speaker 4: felt I felt important to include this as a quote
Speaker 4: at the very beginning of my book. We have decided
Speaker 4: from now on to stress the rehabilitation of individuals rather
Speaker 4: than protection of society and create a more relaxed atmosphere.
Speaker 4: This new policy will probably involve some risk. That's nineteen
Speaker 4: seventy one. By two thousand and three we have the
Speaker 4: incredible murder of Robin Robert Greene by Sidney Tierhuse, And
Speaker 4: by two thousand and three, at least I know, and
Speaker 4: at least Sidney Tierhues knows, and at least the people
Speaker 4: that are in the legal know that we have really
Speaker 4: advanced with that idea. A triple murder that I spoke
Speaker 4: about last week. I had a homicide homicide detective, head
Speaker 4: of homicide detective talking about a triple murder where somebody
Speaker 4: was coming for someone else he escaped out the window. Instead,
Speaker 4: the wife and two as he called babies were shot
Speaker 4: point blank by this killer and his accomplice was with him. Now,
Speaker 4: this killer a triple first degree murder. You know, in
Speaker 4: America you have laws that would ensure likely that somebody
Speaker 4: that did that type of crime would never see the
Speaker 4: light of day. In many states, you would have the
Speaker 4: death penalty, whether they put them to death quickly or
Speaker 4: eventually or not at all. They're in a cell by
Speaker 4: themselves on death row, awaiting technically this death sentence. We've
Speaker 4: taken the death sentence away. I'm not sure the timeframe
Speaker 4: of that any if you can see in a relatively
Speaker 4: short period of time and a generation or so, a
Speaker 4: triple murderer is being prepared for release into the community.
Speaker 4: In Canada, triple murderer first degree murder would have shot
Speaker 4: four people, which said a husband and wife and two
Speaker 4: little kids, point blank because he was angry. So it's again,
Speaker 4: it's not a dry tone on the Canadian judicial system.
Speaker 4: It's just you just get a whole by virtue of
Speaker 4: the story itself. And when I read the transcript, it
Speaker 4: was I found them fascinating because I had never attended
Speaker 4: a murder trial before, and I had thought I understood
Speaker 4: a murder trial because of course I listened and read
Speaker 4: or listened to the news and want and read the newspapers.
Speaker 4: But I had the opportunity to be involved with a
Speaker 4: very interesting case, a very fascinating and amazing case where
Speaker 4: the killer takes the stand, where I take the stand
Speaker 4: against the prosecuting attorney or pardon me, the defense attorney,
Speaker 4: and you get to read every word of this. Every
Speaker 4: word in this I've obviously edited down because it'd be
Speaker 4: much longer, would be a size of the phone book,
Speaker 4: but all the relevant interesting aspects were left in from
Speaker 4: those transcripts. And it's for those who think it's much
Speaker 4: like law and order, it's not anything like law and
Speaker 4: order whatsoever. Now I'm going to use this opportunity to
Speaker 4: talk about Trophy Hill just a little bit. And I
Speaker 4: wanted to mention as well that steadily the story is
Speaker 4: getting out. It's amazing to me that being in a
Speaker 4: city of the size of seven hundred thousand people, with
Speaker 4: the national news coverage for three weeks while the trial
Speaker 4: was on for a week while the crime actually had occurred,
Speaker 4: and other dates where stories about orgon removal and cannibalism
Speaker 4: and all kinds of stories that made national and international headlines.
Speaker 4: Not every newspaper in the US, but a lot numerous
Speaker 4: celebrity sites Richard Gere, Susan Surrander, Jennifer Lopez, the Shall
Speaker 4: We Dance Movie celebrity sites that that's their business. These stories,
Speaker 4: brief accounts were on these sites when the trial happened.
Speaker 4: National news television CTV and newspapers, and whether our national
Speaker 4: broadcaster was there or not, they picked up the news
Speaker 4: feed or the story from the Winnipeg Free Press or
Speaker 4: the Winnipeg Sun, and those stories were carried to almost
Speaker 4: every city in Canada. Yet when I am doing a
Speaker 4: signing at Chapters, which is the biggest bookstore in Canada,
Speaker 4: very much like Amazon, people have not even heard about
Speaker 4: this story. So it is a fascinating It's been a
Speaker 4: fascinating journey for me to realize that this is almost
Speaker 4: like a brand new story to these people that live
Speaker 4: in in Winnipeg. They have no idea even though it
Speaker 4: was prominent in the newspapers for that period of time.
Speaker 4: There seems to be some disconnect between people who read
Speaker 4: books and people who read newspapers. Are It's very interesting
Speaker 4: how we treat these types of stories in the media
Speaker 4: in the first place. In a city like Winnipeg, which
Speaker 4: is known as the murder Capital, rough and tumble town,
Speaker 4: older city, poor er city, so we have we're very
Speaker 4: much like Chicago. We're called the Chicago the North and
Speaker 4: we're comparative in a lot of ways. Maybe I don't
Speaker 4: want to take anything away from Chicago, but we just
Speaker 4: have some similarities and I can say that, you know,
Speaker 4: when we compare it to other cities in Canada, we
Speaker 4: have our fair share of notoriety. We'll say that, and
Speaker 4: again not to say anything bad and disparaging against Chicago,
Speaker 4: but so anyway, that's what I'm getting doing these signings.
Speaker 4: The response has been very you know, people are amazed
Speaker 4: when you give them just even a brief account of
Speaker 4: some of the facts of this. And I think as
Speaker 4: part of it is like again that they had not
Speaker 4: even heard about this, that they're unaware of the story
Speaker 4: and instituitality. So but the book is selling well and
Speaker 4: more importantly getting really good reviews, and that's what's most important.
Speaker 4: It is a little bit pricey. It's eighteen dollars in
Speaker 4: the US. A lot of people been going, geez, that's
Speaker 4: a lot of money. All I can say is that
Speaker 4: I don't think authors are making enough money, and I
Speaker 4: think that some of the information needs to be My
Speaker 4: books that you can get in Canada used a perfect minding,
Speaker 4: so the books look a little bit i'd say better,
Speaker 4: you know, a little bit better quality. I've got four
Speaker 4: hundred pages in my book, so it is. It's chalk
Speaker 4: full of information. This is a six x nine the
Speaker 4: Amazon version and the Canadian version is five by eight,
Speaker 4: and the Amazon version is not got the nice sat
Speaker 4: and finished cover. But the cover looks great and the
Speaker 4: book looks really good and it and again, I think
Speaker 4: that it's would be very interesting to anybody that wants
Speaker 4: to know about I think this new league of serial killer.
Speaker 4: I think we've had a BTK that was operating. You know,
Speaker 4: some thirty years ago. We talk about Zodiac Killer, Charles Manson,
Speaker 4: Ted Bundy, we talk about John Wayne Gacy. Even though
Speaker 4: Bernardo Homalka cases now fairly old. We're getting into twenty years,
Speaker 4: so some of the most notorious serial killers have already occurred.
Speaker 4: The Obviously they're getting guys that have done ten, twelve,
Speaker 4: eight and finally catching up to them after a few years.
Speaker 4: A lot of these people seem to have some psychological disturbances,
Speaker 4: certainly to have the kind of serial killer. When we
Speaker 4: talk about charisma, it's we're talking about.
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Speaker 4: In a negative way. So what we're talking about is
Speaker 4: the kind of chrism of the Hitler or Manson or
Speaker 4: somebody you know, Jim Jones, somebody that has that kind
Speaker 4: of strange, you know, way with people that they're able
Speaker 4: to operate and get away with the very complex serial killing,
Speaker 4: to be able to get away with ten murders or
Speaker 4: twelve or thirty or so. It's the psychopathic killer, the
Speaker 4: person that's charming and disarming. But my book Trophy Kill,
Speaker 4: I talked about the legal drama that you're going to
Speaker 4: get to read about. You get to see my journey
Speaker 4: through the my just my total involvement, but mostly what
Speaker 4: you do get to see that, you know, I think
Speaker 4: the big prize of this book, the very very unique
Speaker 4: aspect of this book is Sidney Teerhuse's own words and
Speaker 4: his own drawings, which become the crucial evidence that trial.
Speaker 4: By the way, so it's not extreneous. It's not. It's relevant,
Speaker 4: and it is deadly relevant to this whole book, So
Speaker 4: it's not included as a lot of people purport to
Speaker 4: do all the shocking photos. Every you know, every true
Speaker 4: crime book claims to have shocking photos, but obviously when
Speaker 4: you go to the middle of the book, what's shocking
Speaker 4: about those photos? So we all know there's nothing shocking
Speaker 4: about those photos. And lots of times the books are
Speaker 4: oversold in terms of the shock or the uniqueness, or
Speaker 4: everybody comparing the book to in Cold Blood, which is fine.
Speaker 4: You know, there are some books with some real parallels
Speaker 4: doing cold Blood. But like my program likes to talk
Speaker 4: about from the very first program, we tried to do
Speaker 4: and this is very hard to do because a lot
Speaker 4: of these books are about cases that are quite old,
Speaker 4: and I found out, you know, I found out soon
Speaker 4: enough that these were the hardest authors to contact so
Speaker 4: that they would do another interview about their book that
Speaker 4: they had written twenty years before. Some of these books
Speaker 4: were not so much in print, or let's put it
Speaker 4: this way, there wasn't so much motivation for either the
Speaker 4: publisher or the author to really come on my program
Speaker 4: and talk about it. But despite that, we covered the BTK,
Speaker 4: we covered Ted Bundy, we touched on Jeffrey Dahmer and
Speaker 4: the Cannibal Killers. We talked about Alien Warno's and lethal
Speaker 4: Intent with Sue Russell. I had Don Lassner and we
Speaker 4: talked about Die for Me, which was Leonard Lake and
Speaker 4: Charles In, Charles ng the Notorious Dungeon Masters, the guys
Speaker 4: that and just an incredible story, Die for Me by
Speaker 4: Jim Fielder. And you see that book that's been around
Speaker 4: for years. It's a scary book. It's the Leonard Lake's
Speaker 4: favorite book was called The Collector by Steve Fowls, I believe,
Speaker 4: and anyway, a classic that was made into a movie
Speaker 4: about a man who collects butterflies and then when he
Speaker 4: wins inherents some money that he has this plot to
Speaker 4: build a special dungeon in his home in the basement,
Speaker 4: a hidden seller of sorts, a dungeon and collect this
Speaker 4: woman that he had been admiring. And he does do that.
Speaker 4: And the book is fictional, and it's written from the
Speaker 4: perspective of the collector, the psychopathic, the psychopath, and then
Speaker 4: it reverts to the perspective of the captive. But the
Speaker 4: book is very tame. It's written in the fifties, I believe,
Speaker 4: and it's in tame in comparison to what Leonard Lake
Speaker 4: and Charles ng imagine in their minds to do. And
Speaker 4: so it's they take the collector and take it to
Speaker 4: extreme levels. So it's it's, uh, you know, it's it's
Speaker 4: it's an extreme story. So it's not that I live
Speaker 4: for Gore, but I if I'm interested in the deviant mind,
Speaker 4: the psychopathic mind, then I have less interest in the
Speaker 4: person that has a organic brain disorder, or the person
Speaker 4: is more remorseful or is remorseful or pretends to be remorseful.
Speaker 4: I gravitate towards Jeffrey Dahmer story. The stats story was
Speaker 4: just incredible. Everything that happened near the cops that could
Speaker 4: have had and arrest much sooner. That's all part of
Speaker 4: the stories of the most fascinating stories are how not
Speaker 4: to beat up on the cops, but how you know
Speaker 4: Ted Bundy escapes from prison from from custody. A couple
Speaker 4: of times the police could have should have arrested Paul Bernardo.
Speaker 4: Just didn't you know a disconnect between different jurisdictions, the
Speaker 4: ego of different jurisdictions the ineptitudes sometimes of police forces,
Speaker 4: the skepticism of police believing certain victims because they happen
Speaker 4: to do drugs or happened to be prostitutes, the apathy
Speaker 4: that seems to be very very prevalent in most stories
Speaker 4: about the public or the media is still using the
Speaker 4: word hooker. Who's forcing the media to use the word hooker?
Speaker 4: No one? So why do we still have the blame
Speaker 4: of being put on a victim? So sorry I went
Speaker 4: off a little bit of a tangent there, But what
Speaker 4: I've tried to do is do a lot of stories
Speaker 4: that are to combine a lot of these things, all
Speaker 4: these confluence. Obviously, there has to be a convergence, a
Speaker 4: confluence of events that occurs that a person can rack
Speaker 4: up forty nine victims. You know, Robert Willie Pickton thirty
Speaker 4: two or thirty three, but they suspected forty nine. Gacy
Speaker 4: had thirty three that they found, Bundy had almost a dozen,
Speaker 4: and other that they were suspected. You know, the Green
Speaker 4: River killer, he was forty nine. There is It's incredible
Speaker 4: that there has to be some police ineptitude. There has
Speaker 4: to be some communication between different jurisdictions, police forces. There
Speaker 4: has to be people that know something but didn't put
Speaker 4: everything together. Some people, it's even more disturbing and shocking
Speaker 4: when you have a psychopathic killer finds a partner, A
Speaker 4: psychopathic killer finds a partner that's a wife. A psychopathic
Speaker 4: partner utilizes their daughter. A psychopathic partner has followers. A
Speaker 4: psychopathic killer goes to prison and has a legion of groupies,
Speaker 4: a legion of followers. Now we have Sidney Tierhus who
Speaker 4: mentions extensively Jeffrey Dahmer, Ted Bundy, Zodiac Killer, and in
Speaker 4: one of his favorites Dennis Nielsen Nilsen, which is like
Speaker 4: the British Jeffrey Dahmer hung around with his bodies, very
Speaker 4: much like a necrofile like Jeffrey Dahmer, and around with
Speaker 4: his bodies, doing stuff with them, trying to keep them
Speaker 4: a weird thing like that. But Sidney takes I guess,
Speaker 4: influences from a few of these people, because not only
Speaker 4: did he commit this incredible murder basically very careful autopsy
Speaker 4: of this dismemberment of this human being, but with the
Speaker 4: display of the human being with all of the organs
Speaker 4: minus all of the organs, it is Jack the Ripper
Speaker 4: and beyond. Even Jack the Ripper didn't do that type
Speaker 4: of display. There has never been anyone that has created
Speaker 4: this horror spectacle like Sidney Tierhuse left for police. None
Speaker 4: of the organs there, all of them gone, the body washed,
Speaker 4: the body cut into eight pieces, decapitated, disemboweled, arms at
Speaker 4: the elbows, legs at the knees, castrated, and then re
Speaker 4: crudely reassembled, staged, posed for police to find, and calm
Speaker 4: and cool as a cucumber during the whole approaching police.
Speaker 4: Then coming back to the hotel room, they noted that
Speaker 4: then submits the interviews right away, smiling for photographers and
Speaker 4: then looking for a journalist to tell his whole story.
Speaker 4: And then I came along, checked the stand, said some things.
Speaker 4: All he wanted someone to do was put some of
Speaker 4: the pieces together. He wanted to talk, but he didn't
Speaker 4: want to go to prison for the rest of his life.
Speaker 4: He knows that if he admitted to everything, he might
Speaker 4: go to prison for the rest of his life. Even
Speaker 4: despite everything he's written, everything that he has drawn, everything
Speaker 4: he has said on the stand, everything that he was
Speaker 4: convicted of, there are still other murders. It's just unequivocal
Speaker 4: Nobody in the history of any murders has committed this
Speaker 4: type of murder at this level if you include the
Speaker 4: things that I just mentioned, the actual murder, autopsy, dismemberment, dissection, mutilation, necrophilia,
Speaker 4: then display posing the calm approach of police, the interviews,
Speaker 4: the smiling faces, the contacting people telling them what he
Speaker 4: had actually done, the glee, the enjoyment of reliving the
Speaker 4: fame that he was so desperately needed and wanted. And
Speaker 4: I found out the incredible reason why Susan Sarandon's jewelry
Speaker 4: was there. What did it have to do with this murder? Well,
Speaker 4: we found out that the victim stole the jewelry, and
Speaker 4: then we found out he was trying to sell the jewelry,
Speaker 4: and that's how we met Sidney Teerhuse. No, Sidney Cheerhus
Speaker 4: does a great job of saying of downplaying the entire
Speaker 4: jewelry and its role, because that's the last thing he
Speaker 4: wanted to do was to tell police that once he
Speaker 4: had possession of the jewelry, that's when he ended his
Speaker 4: reign of horror. No, he wanted to make it a puzzle.
Speaker 4: Am I a serial killer? Which serial killer do you
Speaker 4: think I really am. Do you think I have the
Speaker 4: characteristics of a serial? And then he does quotes like well,
Speaker 4: when you kill, when you kill someone, and when a
Speaker 4: body dies. This is an embarrassment to the Canadian judicial system.
Speaker 4: That's what this book is. I'm not getting any help
Speaker 4: selling this from our national media. This is a criticism
Speaker 4: of the system, the prosecution, the defense. Our hands are
Speaker 4: tied there, handcuffed. We can't do anything this person. My
Speaker 4: fight is to have this person never released from prison.
Speaker 4: And when you read this, you'll say there's no way
Speaker 4: they're going to release I wouldn't bet any money on it.
Speaker 4: I certainly don't know how how they're going to do it.
Speaker 4: But are they going to allow me, an author who's
Speaker 4: looking for publicity, who's used the media before, who's wagged
Speaker 4: a dog before, to get attention to this story? Are
Speaker 4: they gonna let me be at that parole hearing. I
Speaker 4: wouldn't bet on it, but I'm gonna pound the pavement
Speaker 4: to make sure that people realize in this country he's
Speaker 4: up for parole in eighteen years, that this person should
Speaker 4: not get out of prison ever, and people like him
Speaker 4: should not get out of prison ever. We've went from
Speaker 4: the death penalty to no consecutive sentencing, meaning that if
Speaker 4: you have three or five or forty nine murders, you
Speaker 4: still have a parole hearing. Unbelievably, unless you can be
Speaker 4: proven a rapist, then you can't even be considered a
Speaker 4: dangerous offender, which would mean an indeterminate prison sentence. It's incredible. Anyway.
Speaker 4: That's the book Trophy Killed, The Shall We Dance Murder?
Speaker 4: The Trial Revelations of a Psychopathic Killer. It's got some
Speaker 4: good reviews to go to true crime book reviews, and
Speaker 4: maybe it's the book for you. Maybe it's that one
Speaker 4: book that you're looking for you hadn't heard. Of course,
Speaker 4: if you're in America, you figured, geez, we got all
Speaker 4: the serial killers, all the interesting serial killers, all the
Speaker 4: serial killers we need. Hey, we're greatly influenced by you, guys.
Speaker 4: We're fascinated by your culture. And this is a case
Speaker 4: of a real deviant mind being influenced by all the
Speaker 4: famous serial killers of all time and taking a little
Speaker 4: bit from this person, a little bit from that person,
Speaker 4: and realizing, you know, it's people need to be a
Speaker 4: little more sensational these days to get noticed. And did
Speaker 4: he get noticed? Like I say, though it really is
Speaker 4: an indication when people have not even heard about this
Speaker 4: story here, despite all the publicity, despite the front page news,
Speaker 4: despite the TV coverage, despite the story. It's like being
Speaker 4: in London and not hearing about Jack the Ripper, or
Speaker 4: being in Los Angeles never hearing about Charles Manson. Incredible. Anyway,
Speaker 4: I did promise to talk about some other books other
Speaker 4: than my own, and I apologize again. I wanted to
Speaker 4: talk about some of the books that were really over
Speaker 4: and beyond a great read, and some of the authors
Speaker 4: were just a fascinating interview as well. You go way
Speaker 4: back to June and there was an interview with Corey
Speaker 4: Mitchell and his book Savage Son, and he claims that
Speaker 4: this book is one of the most difficult to write
Speaker 4: because the serial killer just was so evil and it
Speaker 4: SAPs so much energy from Corey just to be able
Speaker 4: to do this book. And anyway, Savage Son. So if
Speaker 4: you go back in the archives you will see Savage Son.
Speaker 4: It was in June, i believe sometime, and it was
Speaker 4: a great interview. Corey Mitchell's a veteran radio guy as well.
Speaker 4: He had a program on blog Talk Radio. He edited
Speaker 4: it and had everything to do with In Cold Blog,
Speaker 4: which was an excellent again another true crime must for
Speaker 4: true crime fans. In Cold Blog there seems to be
Speaker 4: some transitionary evolution of the site, even though Corey's doesn't
Speaker 4: seem to be involved. So I expect that the In
Speaker 4: Cold Blog will is if it already hasn't become something
Speaker 4: already which is akin to the same great service of
Speaker 4: In Cool Blog, basically talking and promoting worthy books from
Speaker 4: true crime authors, talking about interesting stories that will be
Speaker 4: of interest to true crime fans. So that was a
Speaker 4: savage son by Corey Mitchell, great read. I did want
Speaker 4: to go back to Slow Death from Jim Fielder, but
Speaker 4: Jim Fielder only wrote the one book, and I spoke
Speaker 4: to him personally quite a bit, and it did affect
Speaker 4: his personal life in a negative way. He did get
Speaker 4: a lot of responses from people that felt that he
Speaker 4: was in the wrong somehow by writing the book that
Speaker 4: he did. I don't see that myself personally, but again
Speaker 4: I have got that from a fair amount authors and
Speaker 4: even from Kim Katrella to true crime book reviews, that
Speaker 4: a lot of people believe that any involvement will help
Speaker 4: promote these criminals and promote their crimes, and Kim and
Speaker 4: Cantrell and I spoke about it. It seemed nonsensical that
Speaker 4: we would be criticized for this by whereas fictional writers
Speaker 4: and people who are fans of fictional writing, I seem
Speaker 4: to get a carte blanche on being able to talk
Speaker 4: about any kind of subject and not being fine or
Speaker 4: writing about any subject and that being fine. And I
Speaker 4: think that people just misunderstand the way why I do
Speaker 4: read true crime, I think, and why she certainly reads
Speaker 4: true crime, is that we're on a certain side of
Speaker 4: the law. We don't feel much sympathy for killers. Of course,
Speaker 4: we could feel some empathy for the perpetrator, but a
Speaker 4: whole lot less than we would for the victim and
Speaker 4: the family, regardless of their social and economic socioeconomic situation,
Speaker 4: or their status, or their where they work or whatever
Speaker 4: for they do. So I think people just mis understand
Speaker 4: and where we're coming from and why we would write
Speaker 4: a review or read true crime at all. And I
Speaker 4: think that there's just some people to misunderstand that. So
Speaker 4: Jim Fielder really wrote a great book and that's why
Speaker 4: it's still sitting in the bookstores now. It's called Slow Death.
Speaker 4: It's about David Ray Parker and I talked about sometimes
Speaker 4: when these killers employ their own daughters or their own
Speaker 4: family to do their evil deeds, and that's what had
Speaker 4: happened in this case. And he's another guy that built
Speaker 4: a special, specially designed, expensive bunker with the purpose of
Speaker 4: enslaving a woman or women, many women, and torturing, killing,
Speaker 4: and he had a partner as well and employed his daughter.
Speaker 4: It's an amazing story. One of those stories where one
Speaker 4: of the scenes in this book, and if you could
Speaker 4: just conjure it up in your mind, whether you despite
Speaker 4: not seeing any kind of visual is that a woman
Speaker 4: escaped naked, running after being held tortured and raped, with
Speaker 4: a big metal dog chain around her neck, running through
Speaker 4: a trailer court, banging furiously on a woman's door to
Speaker 4: be let in, and luckily the woman let her in
Speaker 4: and call police. Meanwhile, the perpetrator and cohorts, a couple
Speaker 4: of them, were in a big car moving slowly through
Speaker 4: the trailer park looking for so the horror I mean,
Speaker 4: I don't have to read fiction anymore. I just read
Speaker 4: true crime, and that's horrifying and scary and it's everything
Speaker 4: I need and wrapped up on in One's a lot
Speaker 4: of people say, well, I don't read true crime, and
Speaker 4: I say, well, you know, all it would take is
Speaker 4: the you know, any of the classics. Jack Olsen was
Speaker 4: just amazing. He just his writing talent was incredible. And
Speaker 4: then rule obviously rules true crime with twenty five or
Speaker 4: twenty six and all these short story anthologies. And and
Speaker 4: she's a great lady and a great interview and very
Speaker 4: generous and doing it for and started off as a cop.
Speaker 4: And her very first book, Stranger Beside Me, is about
Speaker 4: her her incredible involvement in the Ted Bundy case and
Speaker 4: her involvement to Ted Bundy as a friend. And I mean,
Speaker 4: that's that's one of the books that will get you.
Speaker 4: I don't care if you think you're not a true
Speaker 4: crime a reader. You read a book like Stranger Beside Me.
Speaker 4: You read a book like the Creation of a serial Killer.
Speaker 4: You read you Know, on the Farm by Stevie Cameron,
Speaker 4: You read Carla by Stephen Williams about the Bernardo Hamalka case.
Speaker 4: You read the other one. Oh jeez, it's beyond darkness.
Speaker 4: No pardon me, oh, I apologize for this. It's the
Speaker 4: other book by Stephen Williams with the title Darkness in it.
Speaker 4: But Bernardo and Hamalka and the incredible book that's more
Speaker 4: about Carla Hamalka and his correspondence with her, and it's
Speaker 4: called Carla. And these books will scare the of Jesus
Speaker 4: out of you. I mean, I don't read Canadian stories usually,
Speaker 4: but when you have the stories of the magnitude of
Speaker 4: Carla Hamalka and Paul Bernardo, Clifford Olson, the child killer,
Speaker 4: ten children killed and he gave up the bodies for
Speaker 4: one hundred thousand dollars, another fascinating story. This guy is
Speaker 4: still cackling and taunting the police and authorities and government
Speaker 4: and the families from behind I'm prison bars. You have
Speaker 4: Robert Willie Picton, the millionaire pig farmer feeding his victims
Speaker 4: to pigs, slaughtering on his farm, skulls cut in half,
Speaker 4: and buckets and hands and fingers. And the r CMP,
Speaker 4: the police that worked these operations, asking people who had
Speaker 4: received packages of frozen hamburger and pork meat to bring
Speaker 4: them back to the RCMP because they needed to be
Speaker 4: tested for human DNA. It's an You don't get crazier
Speaker 4: stories than the Clifford Olsen story, the Paul Bernardo, Karl Malka,
Speaker 4: Robert Willie Picton. You don't get worst killers than this,
Speaker 4: and Sydney Tierhuse has to be included in that list.
Speaker 4: And all of those people have been included except Sydney Tierho.
Speaker 4: So that is my I've contacted Crime Library, I've contacted
Speaker 4: Catherine Ramsland. There are I'm because I think it's from Canada,
Speaker 4: you know, I mean, I understand the bias in America,
Speaker 4: bigger cities, more notorious killers, more high profile. But Sidney
Speaker 4: two Hues has to be included in with the most
Speaker 4: infamous killers of all time. He just has to because
Speaker 4: of what he has written, because of the way his
Speaker 4: mind works, and because of the incredible murder and murders.
Speaker 4: This story is not finished. I have approached authorities in Toronto.
Speaker 4: I try to use a major author to facilitate the
Speaker 4: reinterview of Sidney Tuo Hughes about other murders. I have
Speaker 4: made some preliminary steps in America as well. Again, I
Speaker 4: think they have enough cases themselves. Even if you were
Speaker 4: to test DNA, even if I were to listen to
Speaker 4: what I have to say it you know, a well
Speaker 4: known profiler, we'd still have some issues. Basically investigating the
Speaker 4: cases of somebody. The victims just not very well known,
Speaker 4: not so important, likely aboriginal, likely homosexual, likely from no buddies,
Speaker 4: family that cared so much, you know, the very least
Speaker 4: important people in society, it seems when they go to
Speaker 4: look at certain cases. But I still have faith that
Speaker 4: I can be successful, and that's all. I'll just leave
Speaker 4: it at that. But anyway, we have a few minutes.
Speaker 4: I'm hoping that no one called while we were doing
Speaker 4: the program, because then I would you wouldn't have heard
Speaker 4: me rambling for the entire hour. But it looks like
Speaker 4: we didn't have any callers, or at least anybody had
Speaker 4: hung around to listen to what I had to say
Speaker 4: or ask any questions. So we've got about three minutes,
Speaker 4: and I wanted to wish everybody a very happy holidays
Speaker 4: despite your situation. I hope this program gives you a
Speaker 4: little bit of relief from what or gives you a
Speaker 4: little bit of enjoyment in your day or your week.
Speaker 4: And I hope you please stay tuned for more and
Speaker 4: more great programs from great authors talking about their fascinating
Speaker 4: and interesting books. And I want to thank people, as
Speaker 4: I wrote in my show description that have been about
Speaker 4: seventy five thousand people who have downloaded programs in the
Speaker 4: last three months, and that's very, very encouraging. A lot
Speaker 4: of those people going to iTunes to do that listening
Speaker 4: at their own convenience. There are more and more live listeners,
Speaker 4: but still obviously people are trained and do appreciate getting
Speaker 4: to listen to the program on their own timetable, being
Speaker 4: able to listen to them whenever they want. I wanted,
Speaker 4: just in the next three minutes to continue with a
Speaker 4: couple more books than programs that they should check out.
Speaker 4: We've had the book Shattered by Catherine Casey. That was
Speaker 4: a very good interview. The just a recent one if
Speaker 4: you missed it at all, but it is in the
Speaker 4: middle of the night with Brian McDonald. The guy is
Speaker 4: a great speaker. Sometimes I get people on and you
Speaker 4: notice that they dominate the conversation, and that's fine. I
Speaker 4: understand how authors. If there is going to be somebody
Speaker 4: who's going to hog the conversation, it's going to be
Speaker 4: an author. And I know that, you know, I understand
Speaker 4: that Brian McDonald really has written a great book. I mean,
Speaker 4: it's just again there's there's really good writers. There's good writers,
Speaker 4: and there's really good writers. And sometimes the story itself
Speaker 4: and sometimes the style that that author picks for that
Speaker 4: particular book just makes for a really gripping read. Rather,
Speaker 4: you know, some read some books are written better than others.
Speaker 4: Some read a little bit better. But I think the
Speaker 4: main criteria is that some of the stories are just
Speaker 4: more compelling. And again that's what the author does, picks
Speaker 4: the great stories, or the publisher says, hey, we've got
Speaker 4: this great story, why don't you tackle it, why don't
Speaker 4: you cover it? So in the Middle of the Night
Speaker 4: by Brian McDonald incredible. What a lot of people listen
Speaker 4: to their program was Luggage by Luggage by Kroger by
Speaker 4: Gary Taylor. He called it a true crime memoir. Kind
Speaker 4: of interesting, very interesting guest as well, The Profiler with
Speaker 4: Pat Brown. Very interesting case. You know, just unlikely person
Speaker 4: to become a serial killer and understanding serial killers in
Speaker 4: psychopaths or life hunting serial killers and side go past
Speaker 4: the profile of a path round. You know, great great book,
Speaker 4: unlikely person Kevin Ball, very fascinating story how she did
Speaker 4: become involved. Another book to come out for the Definitive,
Speaker 4: The Bundy Murders, A comprehensive history by mister Sutherland, and
Speaker 4: it's a great book, The Bundy Murders Kevin Sullivan. The
Speaker 4: Bundy Murders a Comprehensive History. And another book that was
Speaker 4: a little bit out of the norm for us is
Speaker 4: Murdering the High Himalaya Jonathan Green, Loyalty, Tragedy, Escape from Tibet.
Speaker 4: So just go back into the archives and listen to
Speaker 4: some of the programs that you missed, because all of
Speaker 4: them were really good and interesting and fascinating in different ways.
Speaker 4: And I want to thank you for listening this evening.
Speaker 4: If you did did you did bother to hang around
Speaker 4: for the whole hour, I thank you and I sorry
Speaker 4: for you at the same time. But join me again
Speaker 4: on the twenty nine I'll open up the lines and
Speaker 4: see if anybody calls in. I'll have some more interesting
Speaker 4: information and or an encore program. But join me especially
Speaker 4: in January fifth for brand new programs, and stay tuned
Speaker 4: in twenty eleven while we ramp up the heat by
Speaker 4: bringing in more the most shocking killers in true crime
Speaker 4: history and the fascinating authors that have written about them.
Speaker 4: I want to thank you very much. Have a good evening.
Speaker 4: I'll see you next time.