WEBVTT 1 00:00:04.879 --> 00:00:05.839 The planet's tough. 2 00:00:06.000 --> 00:00:08.720 The masters almost surely have a plan. 3 00:00:09.199 --> 00:00:10.519 This clearly made me. 4 00:00:10.599 --> 00:00:13.119 Something there beyond the realm of men. 5 00:00:13.320 --> 00:00:17.199 And until you Flody tested, every last school's tested you 6 00:00:17.960 --> 00:00:18.440 a fine. 7 00:00:18.559 --> 00:00:21.760 The more you think you know, the less you really do. 8 00:00:22.120 --> 00:00:25.600 That's true, doctor, Say, where would. 9 00:00:25.359 --> 00:00:31.519 We be without tec because we know that audienciers just don't. 10 00:00:31.359 --> 00:00:32.679 Know what to creed? 11 00:00:32.960 --> 00:00:38.799 Yet, where would we be without dec the Highest Side 12 00:00:38.960 --> 00:00:42.840 chat Show, Red Car Company? 13 00:00:45.079 --> 00:00:46.520 All right, Higher Side Chatters? 14 00:00:46.560 --> 00:00:48.359 We know that from the printing press of the film. 15 00:00:48.399 --> 00:00:51.880 Real mediums of mass communication have always been weaponized and 16 00:00:52.000 --> 00:00:55.719 used as the main vehicles for propaganda and culture creation. And, 17 00:00:55.759 --> 00:00:58.200 along with the school system dead set on churning out 18 00:00:58.240 --> 00:01:01.719 obedient servants to the management, last movies and media act 19 00:01:01.799 --> 00:01:04.920 is the pacifiers that make many people just content enough 20 00:01:04.959 --> 00:01:08.519 with their life of servitude. Well, today's returning guest, Jay Dyer, 21 00:01:08.560 --> 00:01:11.319 has been picking apart the Titans of Tinseltown for many 22 00:01:11.400 --> 00:01:14.760 years on his website Jay's Analysis, where he methodically breaks 23 00:01:14.799 --> 00:01:17.439 down dozens of films to expose the hidden agendas and 24 00:01:17.480 --> 00:01:23.959 symbolism they contain. He also writes extensively on philosophy, geopolitics, history, conspiracy, 25 00:01:24.200 --> 00:01:26.719 esoterica and more, and we got him here hot on 26 00:01:26.760 --> 00:01:29.840 the heels of his great new book Esoteric Hollywood, Sex, 27 00:01:29.959 --> 00:01:32.799 Cults and Symbols and Film. It's a real treat to 28 00:01:32.799 --> 00:01:35.239 have him here once again, Jay Moman, welcome back to 29 00:01:35.280 --> 00:01:36.239 the Higher Side. 30 00:01:36.519 --> 00:01:39.840 Thank you, Greg. Always a pleasure. I'm glad to be back. 31 00:01:40.000 --> 00:01:42.200 We had a really good time last time talking about 32 00:01:42.239 --> 00:01:45.480 science fiction and propaganda, and I'm sure this. 33 00:01:45.480 --> 00:01:47.079 Will be equally as exciting. 34 00:01:48.120 --> 00:01:50.280 Yeah, man, I really loved that last episode. 35 00:01:50.280 --> 00:01:52.680 I think we also focused a lot on Ian Fleming 36 00:01:52.840 --> 00:01:56.000 and the Bond films. Interstellar was pretty fresh at that 37 00:01:56.040 --> 00:01:57.439 time too, exactly. 38 00:01:57.599 --> 00:02:00.000 And I also really enjoyed this new book of yours. 39 00:02:00.200 --> 00:02:02.840 And maybe a good place to start with that is 40 00:02:02.879 --> 00:02:06.840 that one of the first sections is called film as Ritual, 41 00:02:07.040 --> 00:02:11.719 which is provocative. But how closely related do you think 42 00:02:11.800 --> 00:02:14.120 film and ritual really are? How are they similar? 43 00:02:15.240 --> 00:02:17.759 Well, the idea of ritual could be many things, right, 44 00:02:17.800 --> 00:02:19.800 I mean, we generally think of it as a kind 45 00:02:19.800 --> 00:02:24.199 of religious ceremony that has some connection to deities or 46 00:02:24.280 --> 00:02:28.840 the divine or the celestial, And in modern parlance, I 47 00:02:28.840 --> 00:02:32.199 guess we've kind of disconnected the idea of theater and 48 00:02:32.960 --> 00:02:38.080 plays and acting from that milieu. But that's actually where 49 00:02:38.080 --> 00:02:39.439 it comes from. You know, if you go back to 50 00:02:39.479 --> 00:02:45.159 ancient Greece, the idea of Sophocles, of antigony of the 51 00:02:45.159 --> 00:02:48.639 theater was bound up with the idea of the gods 52 00:02:48.639 --> 00:02:51.479 and the stories of the gods. And you know, it's 53 00:02:51.520 --> 00:02:54.280 the same with Homer, Odysseus. 54 00:02:53.960 --> 00:02:55.120 The Iliad, all of that. 55 00:02:56.520 --> 00:02:59.840 And so what I tried to do was kind of 56 00:02:59.840 --> 00:03:03.439 go back to that ancient perspective and get a window 57 00:03:03.520 --> 00:03:07.319 into that. And I did a lecture I think about 58 00:03:07.319 --> 00:03:10.719 a year ago or maybe two years ago on Plato's Ion, 59 00:03:10.800 --> 00:03:14.280 which is a dialogue that not many people are aware of. 60 00:03:14.639 --> 00:03:17.000 Io In is the name of the dialogue. 61 00:03:16.759 --> 00:03:21.479 And it's a conversation that Socrates has with some poets 62 00:03:21.479 --> 00:03:27.120 and musicians and they're saying, hey, Socrates. 63 00:03:26.719 --> 00:03:30.039 Like, you don't know what truth is, man. 64 00:03:30.199 --> 00:03:33.919 You think it's all this philosophizing and analytical stuff and 65 00:03:34.000 --> 00:03:39.199 it's inspiration, that's the true truth. And Socrates says, no, 66 00:03:39.439 --> 00:03:44.520 you guys are actually just kind of Dionysian madmen. He says, 67 00:03:44.560 --> 00:03:48.719 you're He says, you're inspired by these spirits and conceivably, 68 00:03:49.439 --> 00:03:51.800 you know, there is evidence to suggested in ancient Greece 69 00:03:51.840 --> 00:03:57.360 they actually were perhaps taking callucinogens and narcotics and things 70 00:03:57.400 --> 00:04:00.240 like this. So it's entirely possible that the in the 71 00:04:00.319 --> 00:04:03.080 arts and musicians and so forth poets were under the 72 00:04:03.080 --> 00:04:07.319 influence of drugs and so forth. So in that regard, 73 00:04:07.960 --> 00:04:13.719 Plato and Socrates basically say that it's alternate spirits, alternate gods, 74 00:04:13.759 --> 00:04:18.600 alternate other personalities or entities quote unquote that are kind 75 00:04:18.600 --> 00:04:24.360 of inspiring this performance or this play or whatever. And 76 00:04:24.439 --> 00:04:28.279 when we fast forward to probably the most popular modern 77 00:04:28.439 --> 00:04:32.680 school or technique of serious acting that you know, most 78 00:04:32.680 --> 00:04:35.519 of the A listers are into, you get to the 79 00:04:35.560 --> 00:04:40.839 Stanislovsky method, which is the method acting of Constantine Stanislavski, 80 00:04:41.000 --> 00:04:44.000 who's like a Russian dude from about one hundred years ago, 81 00:04:45.279 --> 00:04:49.680 and his whole idea was that you could, through his craft, 82 00:04:49.720 --> 00:04:54.199 through his methodology, invoke and sort of take on these 83 00:04:54.240 --> 00:04:58.360 other personalities. So that's the perspective that I'm kind of 84 00:04:58.560 --> 00:05:01.920 coming from and looking at. And what's interesting is that 85 00:05:01.959 --> 00:05:05.800 you know, whether you believe that there are actual alternate 86 00:05:05.839 --> 00:05:10.000 personalities or spirits or things that people take on or invoke, 87 00:05:10.199 --> 00:05:14.800 or entities that might invade someone's psyche or conscious mind 88 00:05:14.920 --> 00:05:17.040 or something like that. Whether you believe in that or not, 89 00:05:17.560 --> 00:05:20.759 people do believe in that, and so they will operate 90 00:05:20.839 --> 00:05:25.360 on that belief system, and perhaps under the influence of 91 00:05:25.439 --> 00:05:29.920 drugs or rituals or ceremonies or magic or whatever that 92 00:05:29.920 --> 00:05:33.680 they're into, they may actually sort of go into this 93 00:05:33.800 --> 00:05:36.360 sort of furor this kind of berserk sort of state, 94 00:05:36.439 --> 00:05:38.040 which is what Plato was talking about. 95 00:05:38.560 --> 00:05:39.720 So that's what I start with. 96 00:05:39.759 --> 00:05:42.360 That's why I start as film as ritual, because acting 97 00:05:42.759 --> 00:05:44.439 in the ancient world was ritual. 98 00:05:45.279 --> 00:05:48.519 Yeah, man, I love it that idea that theater and 99 00:05:48.600 --> 00:05:52.199 the practice of acting out those mythological stories is like 100 00:05:52.680 --> 00:05:58.000 an attempt to draw down the power of those entities. Yeah, 101 00:05:57.279 --> 00:06:00.560 it's it's deep stuff, and it's like pretty out there 102 00:06:00.600 --> 00:06:02.759 I think for a lot of people. But I mean 103 00:06:02.800 --> 00:06:05.040 it makes sense. And do you think that there is 104 00:06:05.120 --> 00:06:07.879 a bit of that drawing down of the spirits going 105 00:06:07.920 --> 00:06:09.639 on in modern filmmaking as well? 106 00:06:10.519 --> 00:06:10.720 Well? 107 00:06:10.759 --> 00:06:14.439 Many of the A listers are openly into method acting. 108 00:06:14.680 --> 00:06:18.319 So again, I'm not saying that I can prove that 109 00:06:18.360 --> 00:06:22.800 they actually do it, or that they're possessed or anything 110 00:06:22.839 --> 00:06:25.800 like that, But what I'm saying is that they believe 111 00:06:26.000 --> 00:06:31.199 and act upon the philosophy of Constantine Stanislowski, which was 112 00:06:31.279 --> 00:06:34.519 occulting in nature, and so he really thought that you 113 00:06:34.600 --> 00:06:40.399 could have an alternate persona step in and take over 114 00:06:40.439 --> 00:06:41.120 your persona. 115 00:06:41.560 --> 00:06:42.680 So that's the goal. 116 00:06:42.800 --> 00:06:46.040 Now, whether they actually do that as I'm sure debatable, 117 00:06:46.079 --> 00:06:48.759 but I mean, how many times have we seen people, 118 00:06:48.800 --> 00:06:51.560 for example, if they have a bad trip, right, and 119 00:06:51.759 --> 00:06:55.439 the story is that, you know an Apocalypse Now, who 120 00:06:55.519 --> 00:06:57.759 is a Martin Sheen right? I mean he's supposed to 121 00:06:57.759 --> 00:07:00.600 be really tripping when he goes crazy in that scene, 122 00:07:00.720 --> 00:07:04.839 famous scene in Apocalypse Now, So again this is method acting. 123 00:07:06.439 --> 00:07:07.439 Yeah, it's crazy. 124 00:07:07.439 --> 00:07:09.680 I mean we've talked on the show about the idea 125 00:07:09.800 --> 00:07:13.040 of alternate personalities. I mean, this happens a lot in 126 00:07:13.079 --> 00:07:16.000 Hollywood and music. I mean, so many actors don't even 127 00:07:16.120 --> 00:07:19.160 use their real name, which is kind of strange. I 128 00:07:19.160 --> 00:07:21.399 mean there's no other field like that. And then even 129 00:07:21.439 --> 00:07:24.639 within that, you'll have a lot of musicians in particular 130 00:07:24.680 --> 00:07:28.079 who have alternate personalities, which seems like a weird thing 131 00:07:28.120 --> 00:07:30.399 to do when you're trying to build a specific brand 132 00:07:30.439 --> 00:07:32.959 and you've done all this work to build up Beyonce 133 00:07:33.399 --> 00:07:36.120 and now you're Sasha Fierce or you've built up Garth 134 00:07:36.160 --> 00:07:39.360 Brooks and now you're whatever his alternate persona. 135 00:07:39.120 --> 00:07:39.879 Was that he used. 136 00:07:40.560 --> 00:07:43.560 Very weird that they do that at all, And it 137 00:07:43.680 --> 00:07:46.680 kind of connects to this idea of being more of 138 00:07:46.720 --> 00:07:50.720 a vessel for various personalities or taking on various personas. 139 00:07:50.759 --> 00:07:52.680 So I think you're onto something. 140 00:07:53.639 --> 00:07:55.439 Well, a lot of people think that that's not real, 141 00:07:55.680 --> 00:07:59.639 and I will fully admit that in the case of 142 00:08:01.360 --> 00:08:03.879 oh pop stars and things like that, that it's entirely 143 00:08:03.959 --> 00:08:07.040 possible that a lot of it's just marketing. Right, So 144 00:08:07.079 --> 00:08:09.319 maybe when there's going to be a new Beyonce album 145 00:08:09.519 --> 00:08:12.680 or you know, David Bowie or whoever, they're going to 146 00:08:12.759 --> 00:08:17.160 take on a new marketing persona of Zegge, Star Dust 147 00:08:17.279 --> 00:08:20.240 or Sasha Fears or whatever. So it's entirely possible that 148 00:08:20.240 --> 00:08:24.680 that is marketing. But I also have read a lot 149 00:08:24.720 --> 00:08:30.879 of books from psychiatrists and sociologists and psychologists. For example, 150 00:08:30.959 --> 00:08:34.519 there's a one that's pretty popular called Switching Time, and 151 00:08:34.559 --> 00:08:39.279 this is leave a psychiatrists several years counseling a woman 152 00:08:39.320 --> 00:08:43.320 with multiple personalities. Now, that could be fake. I've heard 153 00:08:43.360 --> 00:08:50.200 some good argumentation suggesting that the classic story Sybil was fake, 154 00:08:51.000 --> 00:08:53.960 but then again the source calling it fake was NPR, 155 00:08:54.279 --> 00:08:57.440 so well, MPR is not the most reliable source. So 156 00:08:57.519 --> 00:09:00.919 the idea of splits and altered and all this is 157 00:09:01.039 --> 00:09:04.559 very I guess, controversial and debated. And when you look 158 00:09:04.600 --> 00:09:07.200 at the reason why a lot of people dismiss it, 159 00:09:07.519 --> 00:09:12.039 the basis is if it's things like, oh, it's not 160 00:09:12.120 --> 00:09:17.080 possible because it doesn't fit with the idea of materialistic 161 00:09:17.159 --> 00:09:21.279 reductionistic Darwinism or something like this, like you know, the 162 00:09:21.279 --> 00:09:23.919 brain is just matter, and since we're not seeing anything 163 00:09:24.000 --> 00:09:27.399 actually splitting under the microscope or something like this, then 164 00:09:27.440 --> 00:09:30.720 it's not possible. Well, that just is assuming that the 165 00:09:30.759 --> 00:09:34.120 mind of the psyche or the soul is in itself material, 166 00:09:34.840 --> 00:09:38.440 which is an unproven assumption, again based on a person's 167 00:09:39.039 --> 00:09:43.399 belief in materialism. However, if the soul and the psyche exist, 168 00:09:43.919 --> 00:09:46.519 then that opens up all kinds of uh and it's 169 00:09:46.519 --> 00:09:50.200 not strictly material quote unquote, then that opens up, you know, 170 00:09:50.240 --> 00:09:53.840 all kinds of possibilities for what may actually be going on. 171 00:09:53.879 --> 00:09:56.559 And I tend to believe that we don't fully know 172 00:09:57.440 --> 00:09:59.919 and understand the things of the soul and the psych 173 00:10:00.279 --> 00:10:03.960 I mean, the Bible even says this in Paul's letters. 174 00:10:03.960 --> 00:10:08.440 Paul says, you know, man doesn't even comprehend his own spirit, 175 00:10:08.559 --> 00:10:11.000 so how is he going to make these sort of definitive, 176 00:10:11.720 --> 00:10:16.679 so cult scientistic claims about what's possible in the realm 177 00:10:16.679 --> 00:10:21.279 of the psyche? So anyway, yeah, I would say that. 178 00:10:22.039 --> 00:10:24.159 And I remember, like, even in college, the first time 179 00:10:24.159 --> 00:10:27.039 I encountered this idea. One of my first college classes 180 00:10:27.240 --> 00:10:31.200 was a psychology class, and we watched some videos on 181 00:10:32.039 --> 00:10:37.080 people with multiple personality disorder or d ID, and I 182 00:10:37.320 --> 00:10:40.519 think it's. 183 00:10:39.080 --> 00:10:42.039 To all appearances, it appears to be real. 184 00:10:42.279 --> 00:10:44.480 I don't see how all of these people could be 185 00:10:44.639 --> 00:10:47.960 all faking this, So I tend to think it's real. 186 00:10:48.039 --> 00:10:51.960 Now how developed that is in terms of can they 187 00:10:52.200 --> 00:10:54.480 literally call forth all these. 188 00:10:54.320 --> 00:10:56.799 Different persons through trigger words and keywords? 189 00:10:57.559 --> 00:10:59.360 You know, this is actually the plot of this new 190 00:11:00.200 --> 00:11:01.799 Shamelain movie, which I thought was. 191 00:11:01.759 --> 00:11:05.279 Actually really good. Yeah Split Split and Yeah. I went 192 00:11:05.279 --> 00:11:06.840 and saw that. I thought it was great. I enjoyed it. 193 00:11:06.879 --> 00:11:08.639 I tend to think that. I mean, obviously that's a 194 00:11:08.679 --> 00:11:09.039 little bit. 195 00:11:09.000 --> 00:11:12.120 Hollywooded up, but if you read a book like Switching Time, 196 00:11:12.399 --> 00:11:14.159 you know, it seems to line up pretty clear. 197 00:11:14.200 --> 00:11:14.399 What's that? 198 00:11:14.559 --> 00:11:16.960 And I would say that that would be my suspicion 199 00:11:17.399 --> 00:11:18.679 as to what really goes on. 200 00:11:18.879 --> 00:11:21.559 But do I know if Britney has multiple personalities? 201 00:11:21.799 --> 00:11:25.320 She acts pretty loony sometimes and as she looks like 202 00:11:25.360 --> 00:11:28.879 there's these different personas. So I wouldn't be surprised in 203 00:11:28.919 --> 00:11:31.039 her case because I have seen some interviews where she 204 00:11:31.120 --> 00:11:35.600 does seem to act very goofy and change her. 205 00:11:36.840 --> 00:11:38.639 Personality totally right. 206 00:11:38.960 --> 00:11:43.360 I've seen people have freak outs on drugs where it's 207 00:11:43.360 --> 00:11:45.840 not just then freaking out, like it appears to me 208 00:11:46.000 --> 00:11:50.879 that somebody else was running that machine. The ghost in 209 00:11:50.919 --> 00:11:54.000 the machine was switched out, there was some other ghosts 210 00:11:54.000 --> 00:11:54.360 in there. 211 00:11:54.639 --> 00:11:57.679 Yeah, I mean, I definitely think there's something to this 212 00:11:57.879 --> 00:12:00.840 for sure. Again, I agree with you like it's about 213 00:12:00.840 --> 00:12:04.399 determining to what degree, but yeah, there's something to it 214 00:12:04.480 --> 00:12:04.919 for sure. 215 00:12:05.360 --> 00:12:08.759 And I'm curious do you see. 216 00:12:08.799 --> 00:12:13.679 Film being good vehicles for occult aims outside of invocation? 217 00:12:13.840 --> 00:12:17.879 Are there other things in that occult esoteric toolbox that 218 00:12:18.000 --> 00:12:19.960 are being manifested through film? 219 00:12:22.000 --> 00:12:23.480 Are there good aspects? Sure? Sure? 220 00:12:23.480 --> 00:12:26.720 I don't think you know all the films are nefarious 221 00:12:26.799 --> 00:12:30.240 or propaganda. You know, several chapters in my book are 222 00:12:30.320 --> 00:12:33.080 kind of lighthearted and goofy and satirical, so that they're 223 00:12:33.120 --> 00:12:37.600 not really to be taken, you know, too seriously. I 224 00:12:37.639 --> 00:12:40.639 think the Logan's Run and the Zardag chapters are pretty 225 00:12:40.679 --> 00:12:44.279 I mean, there's some deep dark stuff in those films, 226 00:12:44.320 --> 00:12:46.200 but for the most part, they're just kind of fun 227 00:12:46.279 --> 00:12:51.720 and satirical sci fi versions of like Plato's Allegory the Cave. 228 00:12:52.000 --> 00:12:56.039 And I don't think those are necessarily, you know, nefarious 229 00:12:57.279 --> 00:12:58.080 fair points. 230 00:12:58.360 --> 00:13:01.960 But to clarify, and i'd i'd say good vehicles, but 231 00:13:02.039 --> 00:13:04.279 I don't mean good in a moral sense. But I'm 232 00:13:04.320 --> 00:13:09.159 more curious if you see films acting as useful mechanisms 233 00:13:09.559 --> 00:13:13.159 for other occult aims besides the invocation aspects we talked 234 00:13:13.159 --> 00:13:16.360 about other things in the Magical Toolbox. For example, I 235 00:13:16.399 --> 00:13:20.200 sometimes hear people suggest that a major aim of mass 236 00:13:20.240 --> 00:13:23.240 media and Hollywood is to replace our imagination or to 237 00:13:23.240 --> 00:13:27.279 have us outsource our ability to visualize, because they know 238 00:13:27.360 --> 00:13:31.559 how important the connection between consciousness and matter is and 239 00:13:31.679 --> 00:13:34.120 that we can influence our reality. But not if they 240 00:13:34.240 --> 00:13:37.759 bombard us with all this filler from a young age. 241 00:13:38.120 --> 00:13:40.080 So I guess I'm really asking if you see other 242 00:13:40.159 --> 00:13:43.840 occult related purposes for the Hollywood machine other than the 243 00:13:44.000 --> 00:13:47.759 entity energy draw down aspect that you would laid out already. 244 00:13:48.360 --> 00:13:51.120 Okay, I see what you're saying. I have seen. 245 00:13:51.759 --> 00:13:54.440 My buddy John brought this to my attention. John Adams 246 00:13:54.440 --> 00:13:57.320 over at Hoostbusters. He said, if you look at the book, 247 00:13:57.399 --> 00:13:58.879 I forget the title of it off the top of 248 00:13:58.879 --> 00:14:02.399 my head, but I did look it up. Gregory Bateson, 249 00:14:02.440 --> 00:14:05.720 who is one of the sort of MK ultra guys 250 00:14:05.759 --> 00:14:09.519 in the background, he wrote a book where he did 251 00:14:09.559 --> 00:14:15.080 actually talk about capturing man's imagination, and he saw that 252 00:14:15.159 --> 00:14:20.720 the need to control creativity and imagination was very important 253 00:14:20.759 --> 00:14:24.799 for social engineering because in my view, this is really 254 00:14:24.799 --> 00:14:27.960 the function of Disney, right. It's like it is all 255 00:14:28.000 --> 00:14:31.960 about quote imagination, and what they've done with Disney is 256 00:14:32.000 --> 00:14:37.360 totally weaponized it to capture your children's imagination and really 257 00:14:37.399 --> 00:14:40.279 turn it into a lot of dark social engineering things 258 00:14:40.320 --> 00:14:42.919 like you know, they want to take your kid and 259 00:14:43.440 --> 00:14:46.320 take her from being Hannah Montana and turn her into 260 00:14:46.960 --> 00:14:53.360 gender fluid, disgusting slutty Miley Cyrus. So that's the real 261 00:14:53.440 --> 00:14:54.879 goal of capturing imagination. 262 00:14:55.559 --> 00:14:58.879 Mm hmm, yeah, man, Disney is quite a force, and 263 00:14:58.960 --> 00:15:02.679 I really do enjoy people break down Disney films. Sometimes 264 00:15:02.759 --> 00:15:05.720 it goes too far, I will admit. And I actually 265 00:15:05.799 --> 00:15:08.000 checked out some of the songs on YouTube from that 266 00:15:08.120 --> 00:15:10.879 new one Mona and I guess the Rock plays a 267 00:15:10.879 --> 00:15:14.600 demigod character. I assume from Hawaiian mythology. I think that's 268 00:15:14.600 --> 00:15:16.879 what it's all about. And there is a line in 269 00:15:16.919 --> 00:15:19.799 one of his songs where he describes making the world 270 00:15:19.840 --> 00:15:22.440 and at one point he says, I killed an eel, 271 00:15:22.559 --> 00:15:25.960 buried its guts sprout of a tree. Now you have coconuts. 272 00:15:26.360 --> 00:15:29.720 And I just thought, huh, that's a fairly detailed ritual description, 273 00:15:29.879 --> 00:15:32.000 right there, a bit of an evolution from when you 274 00:15:32.080 --> 00:15:36.279 wish upon a pentagram. And I am being facetious, but 275 00:15:36.639 --> 00:15:39.840 I've heard some researchers make a really compelling case that, 276 00:15:39.960 --> 00:15:44.039 however small, there is a very purposeful occult thread through 277 00:15:44.080 --> 00:15:45.080 a lot of those films. 278 00:15:46.279 --> 00:15:50.000 It's an interesting point. I haven't followed much Disney stuff 279 00:15:51.519 --> 00:15:53.960 or kids stuff in general. I tend to focus on 280 00:15:54.039 --> 00:15:56.720 more well, at least in the first book you know 281 00:15:56.840 --> 00:15:59.960 that I did. It was mainly things that I grew 282 00:16:00.159 --> 00:16:04.440 up with, you know, Spielberg movies, Hitchcock movies, James Bond Kubrick, 283 00:16:04.519 --> 00:16:06.240 things that I watched growing up in high school and 284 00:16:06.279 --> 00:16:09.000 stuff like that. But I'm sure that, yeah, you could 285 00:16:09.039 --> 00:16:11.679 definitely go a whole other rabbit hole, you know, into 286 00:16:11.799 --> 00:16:13.919 kids films and all. 287 00:16:13.799 --> 00:16:15.639 The programming and stuff like that. 288 00:16:15.840 --> 00:16:19.799 And but again, I think that the main tool of 289 00:16:19.840 --> 00:16:24.360 what they do with the kids films is promote mindless 290 00:16:24.440 --> 00:16:28.399 sort of rebellion, promote wells. As you mentioned, they're sort 291 00:16:28.440 --> 00:16:30.919 of the capturing of the imagination and turning it to 292 00:16:31.480 --> 00:16:35.159 really just the service of the system. I mean, you know, Disney, 293 00:16:35.200 --> 00:16:38.600 for example, was for a long time involved in promoting 294 00:16:38.639 --> 00:16:40.919 government propaganda and military recruitment. 295 00:16:41.000 --> 00:16:43.399 That was a big part of what Disney himself stood for. 296 00:16:44.559 --> 00:16:48.600 He had access to and worked at the Laurel Canyon Studios, 297 00:16:49.200 --> 00:16:51.080 you know, where they did all these secret Air Force 298 00:16:51.200 --> 00:16:53.759 films and so forth that I discussed in the book 299 00:16:53.799 --> 00:16:58.759 that comes from Dave McGowan's work. So, yeah, that is 300 00:16:58.799 --> 00:17:01.440 a good question. I mean, only the kids aspect of 301 00:17:01.519 --> 00:17:03.519 something that could be explored more. But I mean I've 302 00:17:03.559 --> 00:17:07.400 seen all kinds of dastardly stuff from Nickelodeon and MTV, 303 00:17:07.680 --> 00:17:09.920 and you know that I think is genuinely intended to 304 00:17:10.279 --> 00:17:11.839 have negative effects on your children. 305 00:17:11.839 --> 00:17:13.160 I mean, the whole goal of all of it is 306 00:17:13.200 --> 00:17:14.039 a depopulation. 307 00:17:14.880 --> 00:17:17.359 Yeah, I mean it could be a stretch, but I've 308 00:17:17.359 --> 00:17:20.279 even heard people talking about the sliming of kids on 309 00:17:20.359 --> 00:17:24.279 Nickelodeon being you know, symbolic of semen. 310 00:17:24.720 --> 00:17:26.000 I mean, that might. 311 00:17:25.839 --> 00:17:27.960 Be a stretch, but I'm like, that is kind of 312 00:17:28.039 --> 00:17:29.680 kind of creepy too when you think about it in 313 00:17:29.720 --> 00:17:30.319 that context. 314 00:17:30.400 --> 00:17:32.240 But let's get into Spielberg a little bit. 315 00:17:32.279 --> 00:17:35.240 You write about them a decent amount in esoteric Hollywood, 316 00:17:35.559 --> 00:17:39.160 breaking down several of his movies, and if there were 317 00:17:39.319 --> 00:17:43.720 a larger, semi organized machine behind Hollywood, Spielberg would have 318 00:17:43.759 --> 00:17:46.680 to be involved. So when you look at the totality 319 00:17:46.680 --> 00:17:49.480 of his films, do you see an over arching aim 320 00:17:49.640 --> 00:17:51.400 or agenda that becomes more clear? 321 00:17:54.119 --> 00:17:58.319 Yeah, I think you could boil down like probably three 322 00:17:58.720 --> 00:18:02.920 major themes that Spielberg deals with. He deals with holocaust, 323 00:18:03.039 --> 00:18:08.000 he deals with familial relations, and he deals with aliens. 324 00:18:07.799 --> 00:18:12.240 That's the three things that he's focused on. So what 325 00:18:12.319 --> 00:18:15.920 I folks, well, alien slash transhumanism and so forth. So 326 00:18:16.000 --> 00:18:18.480 what I focused on in my book was the alien 327 00:18:18.559 --> 00:18:22.400 and transhuman myths and stories that he's focused on and 328 00:18:22.480 --> 00:18:27.279 so he interestingly does have a penchant for Philip K. Dick, 329 00:18:27.319 --> 00:18:30.880 who I think is very fascinating as a writer and 330 00:18:30.920 --> 00:18:35.079 a character. Because you know, Spielberg did Minority Report, so 331 00:18:35.759 --> 00:18:38.319 there's a chapter on Minority Report that I do that 332 00:18:38.400 --> 00:18:42.559 focuses on dystopia and how tech can lead to dystopia. 333 00:18:42.640 --> 00:18:45.200 So not everything in Spielberg is bad. I don't think 334 00:18:45.240 --> 00:18:48.799 he's totally nefarious or anything like that. And I don't 335 00:18:48.839 --> 00:18:51.880 actually go after anybody personally or any of the directors. 336 00:18:51.920 --> 00:18:55.000 I just kind of try to decode the films and 337 00:18:55.119 --> 00:18:58.519 see what patterns and meanings I can find in the symbolism. 338 00:19:00.039 --> 00:19:01.200 What is Spielberg all about? 339 00:19:01.400 --> 00:19:03.799 Was I said, aliens and transhumanism, And I think those 340 00:19:03.799 --> 00:19:07.559 two things are linked. For one, because I personally am 341 00:19:07.599 --> 00:19:12.279 not convinced that there's like extra biological entities. But I 342 00:19:12.279 --> 00:19:15.720 think that if you watch movies like ET and then 343 00:19:15.720 --> 00:19:18.720 you watch something like his version of or the Worlds, 344 00:19:19.319 --> 00:19:25.880 the cold calculated scientistic approach that the so called aliens 345 00:19:25.880 --> 00:19:29.400 have sure does seem to match up to the cold 346 00:19:29.440 --> 00:19:32.960 calculated scientistic approach of the deep state and the military 347 00:19:32.960 --> 00:19:37.640 industrial complex and the international corporations. Yeah, they have that 348 00:19:38.079 --> 00:19:41.000 because like, so at the end of Closed Encounters, what's 349 00:19:41.000 --> 00:19:46.640 it all about. Well, they're stealing, abducting kids and family members, 350 00:19:47.519 --> 00:19:49.400 and you get the impression at the very very end 351 00:19:49.440 --> 00:19:52.039 that they're doing some kind of genetic modification on these 352 00:19:52.039 --> 00:19:54.680 people and then they're like giving them back to you 353 00:19:54.759 --> 00:19:57.119 like twenty years later or something, and they haven't aged. 354 00:19:58.160 --> 00:20:01.720 So the idea is, oh, the alien no overlords are 355 00:20:01.720 --> 00:20:09.319 working on genetic modification, hybridization, GMOs, halting, the aging process, 356 00:20:09.519 --> 00:20:11.119 you know, all these kinds of things that we in 357 00:20:11.160 --> 00:20:15.720 the conspiracy world really believe the oligarchs are working on 358 00:20:15.799 --> 00:20:19.839 and are into. So I think that's the real meaning 359 00:20:19.839 --> 00:20:23.400 of something like Close Encounters, which actually kicked off the 360 00:20:23.440 --> 00:20:28.640 modern alien Hollywood blockbuster phenomena. I can't really think. I mean, 361 00:20:28.680 --> 00:20:32.400 there was there probably were alien movies, no doubt, many 362 00:20:32.440 --> 00:20:36.960 of them prior to Close Encounters, but making aliens into 363 00:20:37.000 --> 00:20:40.640 a giant blockbusters, you know, it begins, I would say 364 00:20:40.680 --> 00:20:42.839 with if you don't count two thousand and one, which 365 00:20:42.880 --> 00:20:44.960 I tend to believe two thousand and ones about AI 366 00:20:45.480 --> 00:20:51.279 not so called aliens but extra terrestrial beings, you get, 367 00:20:51.599 --> 00:20:53.920 you know, you get Close Encounters, which is based on 368 00:20:54.519 --> 00:20:57.559 Jail and Heinek and Jacqueville, Right, this is both of 369 00:20:57.599 --> 00:21:00.519 their works. We're kind of the basis for what was 370 00:21:00.559 --> 00:21:02.839 going on in Close Encounters. And actually I believe Heinek. 371 00:21:03.680 --> 00:21:06.759 I found sources saying that Jalen Heineck was actually consulting 372 00:21:07.079 --> 00:21:11.519 with Spielberg on the set. So yeah, so I think 373 00:21:11.559 --> 00:21:14.200 that you're talking about people from the deep state who 374 00:21:14.599 --> 00:21:18.880 know about what the UFO and on really is sort 375 00:21:18.920 --> 00:21:23.960 of consulting with Bilberg. Spielberg's putting out his version of it. 376 00:21:24.319 --> 00:21:27.400 And you know, then when you look at Et, I 377 00:21:27.440 --> 00:21:30.759 think Et is actually about this idea of the Et. 378 00:21:30.720 --> 00:21:32.799 Is more like a familiar spirit than he is like 379 00:21:32.799 --> 00:21:34.519 an alien. That's why he has this. 380 00:21:34.720 --> 00:21:39.480 Very strange bonded connection with Elliott. And you know when 381 00:21:39.519 --> 00:21:43.720 Et gets drunk and burbs, Elliot's drunk and belching. Right, Yeah, 382 00:21:44.160 --> 00:21:46.680 this is very very weird stuff going on there. 383 00:21:46.720 --> 00:21:50.119 But yeah, man, and this is exactly what I wanted 384 00:21:50.119 --> 00:21:54.119 to get into because I love that ET analysis and 385 00:21:54.240 --> 00:21:57.119 it's it's so interesting you talk about in the film 386 00:21:57.119 --> 00:22:00.920 Meet You mentioned the shadow government researcher in the movie 387 00:22:01.039 --> 00:22:03.759 is named Keys, and that it's a reference to the 388 00:22:03.880 --> 00:22:06.440 Key of Solomon. And let's get into this bit. What 389 00:22:06.559 --> 00:22:09.920 is the significance there is that message part of the 390 00:22:10.680 --> 00:22:13.680 uh subtly saying that Et is a familiar spirit or 391 00:22:13.720 --> 00:22:15.799 a demon rather than a space alien. 392 00:22:17.519 --> 00:22:21.160 I would say so because you look at what his 393 00:22:21.279 --> 00:22:24.519 so called powers are, and they again, they match up 394 00:22:24.759 --> 00:22:27.960 much closer to something like a familiar spirit supposedly than 395 00:22:28.000 --> 00:22:32.759 it does any sort of quote alien. It's almost as 396 00:22:32.799 --> 00:22:37.400 if Elliott invokes Et to come and they have this. 397 00:22:37.640 --> 00:22:42.359 It's almost like Et is his higher self or his 398 00:22:42.759 --> 00:22:45.039 you know, sort of holy guardian angel or something. And 399 00:22:45.119 --> 00:22:47.200 I think there's a lot of bizarre, sort of Crollian 400 00:22:48.480 --> 00:22:51.319 dish imagery in the film too, with you know, the 401 00:22:51.359 --> 00:22:55.000