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<v Speaker 1>Hey, folks were recording at Chainlinks smart Con event and

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<v Speaker 1>joining me is Mike O'Keefe, who is the head of

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<v Speaker 1>sales and customer success at Immunify. Mike, great to have you.

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<v Speaker 2>Thanks for having me, Tony, it's great to be here.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Mike, excited to learn about Immunify. But tell us

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<v Speaker 1>a bit about yourself and your background in crypto.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's a little bit of an interesting story how

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<v Speaker 2>I got here. So, I had about almost a decade

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<v Speaker 2>in Tradfy, previously mostly on the buy side, and then

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<v Speaker 2>I went into financial technology, working for first a data

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<v Speaker 2>aggregation and reporting provider for wealth management folks SO family Offices, Aris, etc. Sure,

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<v Speaker 2>then I jumped over to alternative data management and a

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<v Speaker 2>fintech startup. But in between I actually had a stop

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<v Speaker 2>with a customer of mine and we ended up launching

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<v Speaker 2>a company that became a nonprofit, and the nonprofit was

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<v Speaker 2>about fiduciary duty within financial services. And at the same time,

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<v Speaker 2>this is around twenty sixteen or so, I started very

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<v Speaker 2>interested in crypto myself, Sure, and I felt it was

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<v Speaker 2>a lack of fiduciary duty on the part of wealth

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<v Speaker 2>managers to not be considering how they would implement crypto

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<v Speaker 2>into the portfolios. Sure, So eventually years later the opportunity

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<v Speaker 2>to get into crypto security comes my way, and I

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<v Speaker 2>thought to myself, this is it. This is the key

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<v Speaker 2>to get rid of that career risk element that people

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<v Speaker 2>were feeling when they were managing portfolios in regards to

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<v Speaker 2>crypto and remove that and hopefully now we're seeing a

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<v Speaker 2>lot here at Smartcon this year, a lot of trad

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<v Speaker 2>five money coming on chain.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it's incredible the amount of trad FI institutions that

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<v Speaker 1>are now building, whether they're launching et aps, tokenizing stable coins.

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<v Speaker 1>What is it like to see all these folks coming in?

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<v Speaker 2>You know, I like to think I'm not that smart

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<v Speaker 2>of a guy, but I'm smart enough to follow really

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<v Speaker 2>smart people. And so that's one of the other reasons

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<v Speaker 2>I got into crypto is I started to see the

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<v Speaker 2>people who I admired, people I thought that were very intelligent,

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<v Speaker 2>be drawn to the space from the traditional finance spaces,

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<v Speaker 2>from financial services, from technology, and that really drove me here.

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<v Speaker 2>And there's so many brilliant people that are still working

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<v Speaker 2>in TRATFI that are starting to see exactly what I

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<v Speaker 2>can do for their customers or their businesses and how

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<v Speaker 2>you know this high tide can lift all boats.

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<v Speaker 1>So tell us a bit about immunify. What is it

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<v Speaker 1>and what do you guys do?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, So we were founded about almost five years ago

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<v Speaker 2>now and we started bug bounties and crowd security. We

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<v Speaker 2>are by far the most successful bug bounty platform in

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<v Speaker 2>the web three space. We've paid out over one hundred

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<v Speaker 2>and twenty one million dollars worth of bounties to ethical

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<v Speaker 2>white hats or ethical hackers you might call them, or

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<v Speaker 2>security researchers. And recently we've started to expand our presence

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<v Speaker 2>to be a full chain, sorry, a full service solution

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<v Speaker 2>for on chain and off chain security. So we've created

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<v Speaker 2>a Magnus platform where folks can log in single point

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<v Speaker 2>of contact to manage as much of their security operations

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<v Speaker 2>as possible.

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<v Speaker 1>What you guys, as you're doing is such a critical

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<v Speaker 1>component of the industry security right because regardless of if

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<v Speaker 1>tradfis here or whoever is here, if our assets are

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<v Speaker 1>not secure, if we can't stop bad actors and put

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<v Speaker 1>that buffer there, then it's all going to collapse. So

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<v Speaker 1>walk us through a bit about about how your what

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<v Speaker 1>your tech stack looks like to have the security layers

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<v Speaker 1>and who you're working with.

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<v Speaker 2>Sure. Yeah, So we've taken a very purpose built approach

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<v Speaker 2>to security in that we have a lot of We

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<v Speaker 2>have the biggest library of vulnerability is available in the space,

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<v Speaker 2>so that's going to be hugely powerful. Sure, And the

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<v Speaker 2>other thing that we really value is different security points

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<v Speaker 2>of view in the place. Immunified does not want to

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<v Speaker 2>pretend that we can build the best technology for unchaine

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<v Speaker 2>monitoring as an example. Sure, there are a bunch of

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<v Speaker 2>players who have done that already, but there are a

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<v Speaker 2>bunch of things that we can build. So as an example,

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<v Speaker 2>we have our AI agent which is going to scan

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<v Speaker 2>all those vulnerabilities they just talked about and be able

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<v Speaker 2>to provide output to projects who are either in the

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<v Speaker 2>build stage via ploor request reviews or in the audit

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<v Speaker 2>stage doing the same thing as a compliment to to

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<v Speaker 2>humans in the loop, at least at this stage of

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<v Speaker 2>where we are today.

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<v Speaker 1>Sure.

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<v Speaker 2>Additionally, we've come up with you know, our multi sick

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<v Speaker 2>transaction review as well as our flagship bug bounties, audits

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<v Speaker 2>and audit competitions. On the flip side, we've got many

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<v Speaker 2>great players who are doing things like on chain monitoring

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<v Speaker 2>or chain patrols, brand protection, which is hugely important for projects. Sure,

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<v Speaker 2>and we've started to integrate these best in class partners,

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<v Speaker 2>which you can see, you know, on our website or

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<v Speaker 2>if you can talk to us with our tools, to

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<v Speaker 2>have multiple security points of view, but still just have

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<v Speaker 2>that one touch point.

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<v Speaker 1>So you're working. I see at a list here that

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<v Speaker 1>I put down chain Link, Ethereum Foundation, Optimism, arbitrump. It

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<v Speaker 1>sounds like you're working with the major blockchains to help

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<v Speaker 1>their improve their security.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah. So we've got over three hundred and thirty current customers.

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<v Speaker 2>We've serviced over five hundred customers projects, l ones, l

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<v Speaker 2>two's infrastructure, projects, oracles, you name it. We have a

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<v Speaker 2>solution for pretty much every type of project, every type

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<v Speaker 2>of Web three player in the game, and we have

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<v Speaker 2>pretty tight relationships with many of them, including the folks

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<v Speaker 2>here today.

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<v Speaker 1>You mentioned the use of an AI agent, So are

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<v Speaker 1>you using AI in different ways to help accomplish what

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<v Speaker 1>you're doing?

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<v Speaker 2>We are, right, So there's a few ways that we're

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<v Speaker 2>doing it. The first is pretty straightforward, and you're hearing

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<v Speaker 2>a lot about it, especially in like crypto Twitter, which

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<v Speaker 2>is like who can find the most bugs using an

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<v Speaker 2>AI agent, right, and so that's a little bit of

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<v Speaker 2>a bot race there. On the other hand, we also

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<v Speaker 2>have the orchestration piece, which is just like, how can

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<v Speaker 2>you bring all these security pieces together in a thoughtful way.

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<v Speaker 2>So one of the things we've done, as an example,

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<v Speaker 2>is we've got an ability to say, let's look at

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<v Speaker 2>your smart contracts, let's look at the deployers, and let's

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<v Speaker 2>see when a new contract is deployed, can we automatically

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<v Speaker 2>add protection to it without you touching a button? As

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<v Speaker 2>an example. Sure. The last thing is what we call

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<v Speaker 2>our guardian AI. It's I don't know what to do.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm mentoring the space. We are trad five players that

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<v Speaker 2>are coming into the space, and we want to know

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<v Speaker 2>how should we build out our security stack. And we've

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<v Speaker 2>simply implemented best practices into what we call our guardian

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<v Speaker 2>AI and it allows folks to ask basic questions two

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<v Speaker 2>very very intermediate or advanced questions of what should I

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<v Speaker 2>do next to advance my security posture?

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<v Speaker 1>Man, I'm just thinking about a lot of the exploits

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<v Speaker 1>and things that have happened. Do you think that the

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<v Speaker 1>bad actors may also use AI and to try to

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<v Speaker 1>attack blockchains? And different things in the industry.

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<v Speaker 2>I don't see why they wouldn't If it works for them, right,

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<v Speaker 2>if it's an available tool for for some of us,

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<v Speaker 2>why wouldn't they do it as well. The thing is

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<v Speaker 2>that we're you know, at least here at a meati

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<v Speaker 2>files at you know, in other places do have these

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<v Speaker 2>closed source repositories of what's going on. That's a little

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<v Speaker 2>bit you know at mass adoption should be a nice

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<v Speaker 2>tipping point for the space to make sure at least

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<v Speaker 2>you're fleshing out like those very common mistakes that people

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<v Speaker 2>can make.

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<v Speaker 1>Talk to us a bit about some of the common

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<v Speaker 1>threats that you're seeing across multiple blockchains.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so, I think there's been events in the news

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<v Speaker 2>recently that are pretty common mistakes that we've seen over

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<v Speaker 2>the years that are again being brought into the news unfortunately.

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<v Speaker 2>Which is something that we all want to be mindful of,

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<v Speaker 2>is how do you stop us off? How do you

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<v Speaker 2>find it when it's on live production code with funds

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<v Speaker 2>at risk? And a lot of that comes down to

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<v Speaker 2>our bug balanties we've done. It's incredible job our our

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<v Speaker 2>security researcher community and finding those things. I think at

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<v Speaker 2>the end of the day. It really comes down to

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<v Speaker 2>just adding all those layers of Swiss cheese to the

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<v Speaker 2>stack and never getting complacent and always staying vigilant, right,

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<v Speaker 2>because you truly don't know when there's something hidden that

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<v Speaker 2>someone can exploit. And black hats have thee of being

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<v Speaker 2>patient where businesses do not have that advantage.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh for sure. And this is a dumb question and

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<v Speaker 1>I probably know the answer. But who's funding the bounties?

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<v Speaker 1>And so is the projects you're working with?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, the projects themselves fund the bounties. Okay, so they

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<v Speaker 2>we work with them to decide what the funds at

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<v Speaker 2>risk might be, what an appropriate bounty size would be,

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<v Speaker 2>and then they will fund the bounties themselves. Got it.

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<v Speaker 1>And what's on your roadmap? What can we expect in

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<v Speaker 1>twenty twenty six?

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<v Speaker 2>Oh man, So we have a lot of really exciting

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<v Speaker 2>things on our roadmap, more integrations with security partners, a

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<v Speaker 2>few more firstart party tools that we'll be building. The

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<v Speaker 2>big thing that we're really excited about is we have

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<v Speaker 2>announced our token, and the token's utility is, frankly, to

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<v Speaker 2>keep the flywheel spinning between our partners, our projects, and

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<v Speaker 2>our security researchers. Sure and so I think we're creating

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<v Speaker 2>a really nice, a really nice economy with our token

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<v Speaker 2>so that folks can stake the token to make sure

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<v Speaker 2>that they stay more safe, and that incentivizes security researchers

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<v Speaker 2>and the partners UH to work with them to do so.

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<v Speaker 2>So I think that's the biggest change for our business

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<v Speaker 2>in the coming year and the coming months, even as

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<v Speaker 2>well as just the transition from being known as a

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<v Speaker 2>crowd security platform to having this hub and spoke approach

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<v Speaker 2>with the Magnus platform.

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<v Speaker 1>M Now, one of the things folks are waiting for

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<v Speaker 1>is the Cloudy Act of Crypto Market Structure Bill to pass.

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<v Speaker 1>We know it's kind of stuck right now we government

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<v Speaker 1>shut down. How are you guys viewing that? Does I

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<v Speaker 1>don't know if you've that addresses security issues or things

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<v Speaker 1>like that, but you know, are there any commonalities common

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<v Speaker 1>ground there?

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<v Speaker 2>You know, we typically just as a as our as

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<v Speaker 2>our general policy, don't really comment on regulation or or

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<v Speaker 2>legislation for really any government. We do participate in, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>working through it when we're able to participate in doing

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<v Speaker 2>that or giving our two cents into what that may be,

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<v Speaker 2>depending on the jurisdiction and Obviously, the nice thing about

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<v Speaker 2>a lot of the things we're working on is that

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<v Speaker 2>the security tools are put in place. The partners that

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<v Speaker 2>we have, we tend to make sure that they are

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<v Speaker 2>compliant or will be compliant with any regulation that comes along. So, okay,

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<v Speaker 2>that is something sort of as a service we'd almost provide,

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<v Speaker 2>is that to make sure that folks who have the

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<v Speaker 2>security posture are remaining compliant with any legislation that comes

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<v Speaker 2>in terms of specific legislation, we stay away from that

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<v Speaker 2>third rail to a specific or specific regulation to we

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<v Speaker 2>stay away from specifics there.

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<v Speaker 1>But that's great that you offer that service and make

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<v Speaker 1>sure it helped them make sure they're compliant with what's

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<v Speaker 1>out the law.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, to the extent that we can, and if we can't,

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<v Speaker 2>we certainly have the partners who can help them.

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<v Speaker 1>You know, are the folks are you working with TRADFI

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<v Speaker 1>institutions that are coming in who have security concerns and issues.

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<v Speaker 1>I don't know if you can name drop or you

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<v Speaker 1>could tell us the type of institutions that they are.

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<v Speaker 2>So our goal from the beginning almost five years ago

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<v Speaker 2>and I've only been here for two and a half years,

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<v Speaker 2>but our goal has always been to bring more funds

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<v Speaker 2>on chain and security is the way to do that.

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<v Speaker 2>So we are absolutely working where and when we can

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<v Speaker 2>with the institutions or blockchains that are linked closely with institutions,

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<v Speaker 2>or infrastructure that is linked closely with institutions, like a

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<v Speaker 2>lot of the folks we're seeing here today, it's Marcan right,

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<v Speaker 2>and have services to provide them, or at the very

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<v Speaker 2>least our security Advisory arm can certainly do that as well. Right,

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<v Speaker 2>we see a lot of we know a lot about

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<v Speaker 2>the web two, we know a lot almost about the

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<v Speaker 2>web two point five spot now of where these things

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<v Speaker 2>start to integrate, and then we don't know a lot

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<v Speaker 2>once we get beyond that. How can you help us

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<v Speaker 2>in that regard? So working with a lot of the

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<v Speaker 2>l ones or the infrastructure projects or the oracles that

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<v Speaker 2>interact with these institutions is certainly right where we want

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<v Speaker 2>to be. That's also place where we've got solutions for

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<v Speaker 2>to help folks.

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<v Speaker 1>PT got it, Mike, great stuff, Looking forward to the

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<v Speaker 1>future updates. Thank you so much for joining.

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<v Speaker 2>Me, Thank you for having me. It was really nice

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<v Speaker 2>to talk to you. Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>Absolutely, This episode is brought to you by Propy, which

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<v Speaker 1>is leading to charge in putting real estate on chain.

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<v Speaker 1>and much more so. If you'd like to learn more

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<v Speaker 1>about Proppy, visit the link in the description