Speaker 1: The exclaimer to the fair season. Karen's out there, how
dare you? All guests only show do not reflect the
opinions of the host. The purpose of the show is
to have interesting conversations, stretch our minds and grow not
what we want. If you are looking for an echo chamber,
you are and listener discretion's as.
Speaker 2: You talking about extreme I knowledge, we will guilty from
the super They don't fear the questions, they fear the
f so we see see they come thank yousy, but
does the dark and this shows what.
Speaker 3: A Hey, guys, what is happening and what is up?
Hold out that glass, baby, because we're about to fill
it up. Welcome to the Prometheus Lins Podcast, the place
where the conversations are always in the lightning. I'm your
host Doc Brown. Here we like to use the allegory
of the Prometheus lens to take a second look at everything. Guys,
got a really great show for you. This is a
man that I've seen him on various films and made
many many plans to go to this side that he runs.
And I actually I had an interview with the Hailey
Ramsey and I usually ask people at the end of
the show, I'm like, hey, if you know anybody that
would be a good fit for the show. You know,
kind of helped me out and she's like, hey, are
you familiar with the America's Stonehenge. I said, oh, yeah,
I got several DVDs over here that's from La Marzuli
on the America's Stone Hens. She's like, well, I'm he
ends with Dennis. I can set you up with Dennis.
I was like, oh, please, do, please do. So Dennis
was actually available, he was willing to come on and
talk to us today. So I'd like to welcome him
to the show for the first and hopefully the first
of me anding mister Dennis Stone. Dennis, thank you for
coming hanging out with us today.
Speaker 4: Well, hey, dog, thank you so much for having me on.
And thanks to Henley we made the connection. I'm so
happy to be here. Thank you.
Speaker 3: Yeah. For those maybe that's not familiar with this great
site that you have been taken care of these past
what forty years or fifty years? It's been passed kind
of through the family, hasn't it.
Speaker 4: Yeah, actually but almost seventy years, so, but who's who's counting, right,
So my family got involved with us back in eighteen
fifty five. It was a radio show just like we're
doing right now. It was my dad, Robert Stone, and
my dad was interested and always interested in history. He
was raising a new family, me and my sister was
on her way that you were. In nineteen fifty five.
They had just built a house actually by hand, with
a couple of relatives. And my dad had been in
the Coast DoD in the early fifties. He had been
stationed up in Canada, up in Newfoundland right across from
a lot where the Vikings landed at Lonzo Meadow. And
if at the time he was aware of that site,
of course he would have visited it. He just loved
that kind of thing, but at nineteen early fifties it
wasn't known. In nineteen sixty they actually proved that the
Vikings landed there. But after that he get out of
the Coast Guard. He became an engineer at AT and
T in Bell Labatories and he did that for the
next thirty years. But in the evening of in the
summer of nineteen fifty five, it was a Friday night,
around seven thirty, there was a show on one of
the local AM stations. The station is still there today.
It's one of the biggest stations in New England, and
his sister is Boston's one of Boston's biggest TV stations,
you know, so it's a radio and a TV at work.
But back in fifty five, the show on that evening
was called Yankee Yarns. Yankee Yon's host was Alton Hall Blackington,
a native of Maine, and each Friday he would get
on and tell stories all about doing and all sorts
of you know, the history, the mystery and all of that,
and a lot of lore and legends and stuff like that.
And my dad used to listen to that show. He
actually listened to it up in Labrador because you could
listen to it on the evening on the skip wave,
you know, on AM radio. Sometimes you can pick up
things across the country. So that's how he stayed in touch.
That was his social media back in the nineteen fifties,
you know, besides letters back and forth, you know, the
snail mail. But the show that inning was all about
the site we call America stonehngchs today, and he ever
heard about it. He was fascinated by the topic. And
the thing was he only lived up the road seven
miles from this site and never heard of it growing up,
so that really got his interest. But talk about Quinn
and so was just a few days later. Who's at
a barber shop in that town of Derydey, Hampshire, waiting
to have his haircut. He's looking at a magazine on
the table there and as he's flipping through it, he
sees a whole feature article all about the same site
and he's like, oh my gosh, and it's pitches now
we can see what the place looks like, you know,
and that really blew his mind. He looked up at
the bob or the owner, Warren Haywood was the owner
of the barber shop, and he goes, hey, Warren, can
I borrow this? And Warren says, well, how old is
that magazine? My dad goes, well, nineteen fifty two. It's
three years old. He goes, you can have it. So
that weekend they're at my aunt and uncle's house, my
mom's sister and her brother in law and about ten people.
And that was a tradition Saturday nights to gather with
friends at my aunt and uncles. They played cards, they
drank some beers and a few of them smoked back
in those days and no cigarettes and all that. I
was about a year and a half old and my
first cousin lived there, so there were the two of us.
My sister hadn't come along yet, and they're playing cards.
My dad at some point pulled out the magazine and
he passed it around and like my dad, nobody ever
heard of us. It was kind of like, what is
this place that's strange, you know, only down the road
a few miles, but to get to my uncle r
and my aunt my mom's sister, and they looked at it. It
was my uncle Eric goes, wait a minute. We used
to go there in the nineteen thirties on our bicycles.
We used to pick it down there. You know. They
used to ride down about eight or nine miles in
their bike and go up on the hill and sit
them up with the ruins, enjoying the ruins, you know,
just probably fantasizing about what the whole thing was. And
at that time the site was on private property. It
always has been really, but it was not open to
the public, so they were trespassing, of course, having a
good good time like everybody else did. It was kind
of a spot where locals came to do this kind
of thing, and it was a mysterious place, and I'm
sure a lot of legends were woven at that time.
So my dad's next question is can you find the place?
And they're like, it's been twenty years and as far
as we know, it's not open to the public. There's
no road signs. They didn't have Google Earth, it wasn't
on any maps back in those days. You can get
a mobile map, trip whatever, and it's like nothing, you know.
So that Sunday, the four of them got together. I
guess they left my cousin and myself and my grand
one of my grandparents, you know, my grandmother probably, and
they took off driving around north Sale, New Hampshire. So
we're in southern New Hampshire, in the town of North Salem,
and they rode around for a while. They finally found
an old dirt road, kind of overgrown going up the hill,
and they said, I think this could be it. We
don't know, So they poked the car. They walked about
half a mile through the woods up the hill and
again they were trespassing, and finally get to the top
of the hill and they looked and there's the whole
site right in front of them, just as it was,
you know, twenty years before. And at that time there
was a aiming fence as there is today around what
we call the main site complex about one acre. The
channing fence had been put up by the first researcher
in nineteen thirty seven and he put bob wire on
top of it. His idea was to protect the site,
stop people from trespassing, although it didn't really deter everybody,
and to stop people from stealing things from the site, artifacts,
you know, souvenirs whatever. So the fence was locked up.
There's two gates and it was all chained up. There
were signs there so you do not trespass. So they
my dad climbed on the fence. The rest of them
didn't climb. It was kind of hard. You get to
get in the dirt, You're got to go into the
shop wire and thenath too, you know, and climb underneath.
I'll get cut by that. And my dad disappeared for
quite a while, you know, and they're outside wondering what
he's doing where he is, and they can't really see
him too well. In those there's a lot of brush there,
you know, and vegetation. So after quite a while he
finally re emergence from the site and he gets out
there and he's so excited. He's talking about their chambers,
the standing stones, you can walk inside, it structured, all
the different features and so. But he did bring up
the fact at some point that he would love to
get involved with research. He would like to know more
about it. Maybe he could even get involved with somehow
opening it up to the public and maybe even buying it.
At that point, my mom said, you got rocks in
your head. Because he had a lot on his plate,
you know, family, and he was going to college Merrimack
College in Massachusetts, was going to night school too, on
top of at and t raising us. And he was
still adding on a breezeway and garage to a house.
And my sister was a company lawn, you know. But
he did have rocks in his head and a I
think he took it as a compliment rather than either
way it was supposed to be met, you know. So
he met the owner, Malcolm Pearson of Massachusetts after that,
and for the next three years they worked together on
a lease agreement to lease the property, which is about
twenty acres at that time, including the main site and
to open it up to the public. And by nineteen
fifty seven the papers were signed and I was just
looking at them it the other day. It was June twentieth,
nineteen fifty seven. They actually did. They have my dad,
my uncle, some of the board members and they met
at a lawyer's office in Manchester, New Hampshire, and the
lawyer we got all the names and everything and they
went through the whole thing and it's page after page
of this lease agreement to open it to the public.
It's very interesting. And at that time they referred to
it as Patty's Caves. That was a family that was
up there in the seventeen and eighteen hundreds. There were
five generations of shoemakers actually, and they had a big
kind of effect on the site, if you will. But
when they opened it to the public, they were using
the word They changed it from Patty's Caves to the
Stone Village, but that quickly changed to the Stone Ruins
of New Hampshire became the official name of it by
nineteen fifty eight, and so it's going through a number
of names over the years. And we actually opened on
a soft opening on June twentieth nineteen fifty eight, which
is a summer solstice coincidentally, and they did not know
we had any astronomical alignments back in the fifties, so
talk about another coincidence. But on July, I think it
was eleven to twelve, I got it in my book
they actually had the hide opening. The Governor in New
Hampshire came down, you know, and it was a celebration.
We all pitches and everything, and it was kind of
neat to be able to open a site that maybe
people were skeptical that about opening to the public, that
would have an interest to the public, that would be survivable,
you know, as a company, you know if you will.
And here we are coming up on seventy years next year,
when we were sixty nine years this year we've been open.
You know. Sometimes we go through the ups and downs
like every business, you know. But you know, so I'm
like the second generation. My son Kelsey. We only have
one child, Kelsey. He's an engineer like my dad. He's
working at raytheon but he has his hands in it.
He just redid all the interior displays over which is
so cool. And he has a daughter, our five year
old granddaughter and her name is Julie Juliette and she
over there quite often when she's not in preschool and
stuff like that. So before generations that it's been open
to the public, we did become a state Historic site,
and that was nineteen seventy in the fall and there's
a margaret today. It's in Sale, New Hampshire, and twenty
eight one of the main thorough it's actually main street
in Salem, and as it continues into North Salem kind
of in that direction, and then rode twenty eight, he
actually starts in Cape Cord. It goes up to the
White Mountains of New Hampshire. It's an old eye, I guess,
thea trail that the Native Americans turned into a footpath
which became today what it is twenty and a very busy road.
And that's where our historic Marcker has been since nineteen seventy,
which is kind of nice. So our state historic site
privately owned and operated. My dad actually had the fight
for that, as he did most everything else with our business.
You know, like a lot of people. You know, it's
a struggle for everyone, you know, but we're so happy
that the place is still open to the public. You know,
we're still caring for it. We still have our visitors
coming in there, you know, to help support the place,
and the interest is one of the big things, having
people interested in our site. But it's not the only
site like this. It's the most complex when I think,
the most dense on a certain like one hundred and
six acre property, but these structures can be found all
over the Northeast. And even when my dad got involved
with us in the fifties, he became quite quickly aware
of other sites in New England, and one of them
in Hoppington, Massachusetts. That's where the Boston Marathon will be.
When you hear the Boston Marathon and Hoppington, mass there
are stone chambers there and they were known about in
the nineteen thirties. Our first researcher, mister Goodwin, actually visited
that site before. He was from Hotford, Connecticut. He heard
about this whole thing from a friend out in Seattle, Washington,
where he used to live, and said, hey, they knew
Goodwin was into Vikings and ancient sites. Native American maybe
other like Irish called the monks coming over from Ireland
back before the Viking kind of thing, and he told
them because in your area of New England there are
stone structures. Should go visit them. So the acting Chamber
and mass down the streets, the Hoptington Mass again where
the Boston Marathon will begin. That's coming up very shortly.
They're appetising on TV already. And then the upting Chamber
I mentioned to you off the camera, and that Hopkin
Chamber is a pretty phenomenal chamber. That's about an hour
and a half from here. And it looks like an igloo.
This like a gigantic igloo, all built out of stone.
It's got a kind of a core belled roof dome
shaped ten feet by ten feet. The entrance facing the equan.
I think it's the equinox. They always get that one
mixed up equinox or solstice, and some might will actually
go through this fourteen foot entrance which is kind of
like an igloo entrance. But those tabers were known about
even in the nineteen thirties, and several in New Hampshire
and others in Connecticut like the Gungey Womp site right
by the naval base or the Navy base in Groton, Connecticut.
That site's pretty That site was known about with John
tension in sixteen thirty sixteen fifty four, three hundred and
seventy two years ago wrote the John Winthrop the second,
not the first, but John Winterrop the second from Massachusetts.
Since said we got a strong fort here, very unusual
and very unknown. Do we know anything about this? We
think he's referring to that two hundred and fifty acre
site called Gungeywomp site. Today gungey Wop is owned by
it is partly owned by the state today. It was
on YMCA property for decades and decades. We went there
in the sixties, probably in the fifties, but that's a
huge site. But now today we know there's probably about
eight hundred different locations for these structures. Ours is one
with one hundred and six acres. Guney Wumps about two
hundred and fifty acres roughly, and it's two different properties.
I think it's I think part of it's owned by
somebody else now in the state of mass Connecticut's taken
over part of it. And then you'll have like a
chamber down the street and win the New Hampshire. It's
this one structure or plaster or dan Doldy Hampshire. But
you can get it to nowth Stonington, Connecticut. Nos Stonington's
an interesting town and we really became aware of it
ten years ago when a book came out called Ceremonial
Stonework by an author who writes for Yankee Magazine, which
is a New England publication. He's a freelance photographer writer.
He writes about New England fishing villages and sixteen he
put this book together. It took him a little while
to do it and it came out and we became
aware of it. Actually went to a meeting and gorought
in Connecticut. My dad's group before him in nineteen sixty
four had the spring meeting in there in twenty seventeen,
and this guy named Mark Starr wrote the book. And
I'm looking at the book. Before he spoke, I was
aware of they he was going to speak, because we
get the wholdest of speakers. It's a three day it's
a three day meeting. We usually attend one day because
of the business. We can't get away that lung. So
he is Friday, Saturday, and Sunday. It's a three day meeting,
you know. So we got there Saturday and we wanted
to see him speak. But I saw his book first,
and I'm like, wow, And I didn't see his name it
for us, but I'm like, what is this. Well, on
one of the book tables you can buy books by
the different authors and that we're going to be speaking
and stuff. I was blown away. Two hundred and seventy photographs,
eight thousand structures, eight thousand structures. I'm like, this is
going to be the whole northeast part of Canada in
the US. That's a lot of structures. And as I read,
my wife was next to me too. I was looking
at it and like, all of a sudden to get
into it a little bit, and said, twenty five categories
of structures, different types and everything, which we have at
our site. But I'm like, twenty five categories of structures.
And at that point I had found a few walls
that I believe were serpentee in shape, and I had
found a couple of these windows I had mentioned before
the show started, these beautiful lintled windows in the walls.
We have them in the chambers several both these are
in the stone walls themselves. And these were all founds.
Since twenty sixteen, that's a year I retired from flying.
I was at American Airlines. I was captain there, but
I found my first separate wall right after retirement. I
found my first window right after retirement, which was kind
of a nice way to retire, you know, and from
one life style on the road all the time, I
do miss it somewhat today, you know, some of the
good times, but it's a whole lifestyle change. You know,
you're on the road for four or five days, and
then you come home, then you work at the museum,
fix things at break go back on there. But I
had a lot more time on my hands, and I
flew for four two years. But anyway, I started buying
these So by the time we went to that meeting,
I was already aware that we had some things that
looked like snakes, and we had things that were windows.
And when I flipped through his book, one of the
categories was a circuit walls, and I'm like, oh my god,
he's got them here too. I think that's what we
think we have. I didn't know anybody else had him.
I was aware of the Great Serpent momb made out
of earth out in Peebles, Ohio, which we've been to,
and that's amazing. Thirteen hundred and fifty feet long, but
ours a stone wall shaped like a serpent head, body
and tail. And as I'm flipping to the book in
that section, there's four hundred of them in that one town,
thirty feet in length up to three hundred. I think
ninety was the average in length. Some of them are
linear or straight. Some of them actually look like the
head like that kind of ninety degrees. Sometimes we'll have
a tail like that, and others can be s shaped
and some of them and we found on our site
coming on and it looked like they're biting the tail.
And so his is most of them are linear, kind
of straight, but he does have some that curve, and
as you get into the reading, he goes, but next
do on Rhode Island, most of them are curved serpents,
and they'll have a head and the heads can be
a boulder, they can be stack stones. They can be
also stones that are shaped like triangles or diamond shapes.
And we have those all of those at our at
our site. And I'm like, he's got four hundred sherpet
walls there. Some of them come out of the swampy areas.
Some of the stone walls or serpents are going into
the swampy in one of ours, a wide mouth appears
to be heading south right into our swamp. It's right
there right at of what is our one of our swamps,
on top of the hill. And then you know, and
then he got the windows, and its like we have
those same with a like a lentil shill plate sides.
They look just like windows. Some of them are near
the bottom of the walls, somewhere near the top. Many
of them are by themselves. But we have two groups
up there with four of them together so far that
we found he has those two. The function of them
is not known, the reason for them not known. But
now we know that they're all over New England. I
mean they're in New York. These windows are in the
Berkshires and Massachusetts, and some of them are part of
the serpent walls. And not to confused to listeners, we
don't know the correlation yet between the windows and the serpents.
Some of ours seem to be part of a serpent wall,
and some of them seem to be in walls that
do not have a head, body and tail. They're just
in a wall like you know. And I think that
that happens in north Stonington, for instance. But some of
them are part of serpent walls. It's just like now.
Some of our windows of the thirty six we have
have stone shutters. The stones there that will fit right
into the front of the window. You could be used
to block it. One of them which was found on
the shutters age and shutters. That was a surprise, and
that was found in twenty nineteen, a few years after
I found my first couple of windows, and my son's
found some. Some of our rail the researchers, our manager
James has found a couple of these windows. So of
the thirty six, I found kind of most of them,
but the other people are finding them too. You know.
Once there the cat's bag, it's like wow, okay, now
what will be no looking for one of them out
I had four. I worked next to it cleaning up
the brief for a week. We had a force project
to thin out the entire hill, open up all the
astronomical alignments better, which we started in nineteen sixty five,
and to remove the trees near the walls. They wouldn't
cause damage with uprooting when a tree fell over and
also falling on the structures around the walls. And so
we did a two winter, a two year winter thinning
of the entire project. We had a license for three
We wrote a thirty page report on the whole thing,
I guess, which the USDA accepted, and everything that was
kind of cool. Evasive plants, protection of wildlife, protection of
the forest, make it healthier. And so they did that,
and it just really opened up the hill. And they
left some debris behind in that forest forest so you
could just leave it there to Rod. It's white be
taken home for firewood, while I ended up taking most
of it home for firewood, and I didn't want to
see another fire up there. We had a fire in
twenty ten, right after my dad died. It took out
fifteen acres like that. It was a lot of It
was an area I never really got to. It was
a lot of debris and dead stuff there, which is okay,
but if it catches fire, it's a tinder box. It
just goes up in it. When it killed a lot
of really healthy trees because of the heat intensity. So
he said, well, we're going to do fuel reduction too,
you know. So I'm working next to this in February,
like three or four years ago. Next to this wall.
I knew the wall was there, and I'm picking up
debris with my either snowmobiling cart or my ATV in
a cart, and I'm working there over a course for
a couple of days because there's a lot of junk there,
and I take it home. I use it for kindling.
One in my two wigstol. I turned towards the end
when I was about done in that area. I look
over and I'm like, oh my god, there's a window
right there, and it was kind of high in the wall.
And then I looked next to it and I see
another window adjacent to it. And then I looked down
and there's two more windows near the walk, near the ground.
I'm like, I worked here for a week and never
noticed that they can actually hide in plain site. If
you add a little bit of brush there, you don't
even see him. So he has these windows is one
of his categories. But finding out later they're not only
all over New England. But I got a friend from England.
She missed near Stonehem. She lives in near Abury, which
we've been to, which is one of the biggest megalithic
structures in Europe. Anyway, a Priy it stuck the road
from Stonehenge and she does like archaeology. Her dad visited
us in nineteen eighty. She finally came here last year
and did a workshop on our site for two days.
People came from bridgersh She's pretty well known. She's been
on a does podcast, she does TV. She's been on
History Channel. She does Dowsing two in Earth Energies And
during one of the podcasts about fire, I did a
couple with her. She goes then to stay on the
line after we're done, I got to tell you something.
And so we are off air, you know, at that point,
and she did from England. I'm over here. It's five
hour time zone, and but anyway, she says, I got
windows here. Two goes, they're in Dotmore, England, you know,
And she goes, I'm going to send you a picture.
And these are megalithic windows, and we call them soul holes.
Sometimes we report them as portals were energy. She goes,
but they're also called soul hooles. It's one idea is
that the souls could pass through these windows. And she
sends me the picture. It looks like one of ours,
you know, and she was pretty amazed. That we had
these things at our site in the first place, so
they do exist on that side of the ocean. Later on,
just I think a year or two ago, she says,
we did another thing, and then she visited us last year.
She was here for several days. She flew over from
England right into Boston right off here with her daughter.
She brought her daughter River up and so she goes,
we have serpent walls here too. I'm like, you do.
She goes, it's in the same area dotmore near the windows.
I said, well, that's that's really interesting. And then she
sends me some pitches of her surfing walls and guys said,
they do believe these are ancient. She goes, yeah, I believe.
We don't have that big question about over here in questions,
all these sites could be here. They're accepted kind up
as ancient, but they do like to get evidence to
support that. Obviously common whatever you can date, you know,
so they're over there too, you know. But this mackham
Star's book was simply amazing, and it's eight thousand instructions.
You've lived there for thirty years at that time. In
twenty sixteen, he was told these were all built by farmers.
He goes to the hill landscape. There is very hilly,
very treacherous, very rocky. The soil is very arable for
growing crops, and it just full of rocks. Not Stonington
is a good name for the place. It's not far
from Gungey Womp. It's right down the street from Gungey Womp,
the site I mentioned and guns you up. Now. They
have walls that have been out there. They've looked at
them and didn't make much heads or tail out of them,
whether they were old enough. But they're finding some of
them are surfenteen in shape, yet of some sort a
body and then a tail, and some of our tails
are perfectly pointed. Some of them end up with a
flat slab. One of the first one I found was
twenty seven feet long at a rock, kind of a
rectangular head that looked like it fell from its original position.
It tapered down to this rock that's about four feet long,
and I had rounded corners. It was rectangular with rounded corners,
and as I looked at it, it was in a ridge
of bedrock. Like a lot of the ones in our
Stonington are on origins of bedrock, and that's one of
the things he brings out in his book. I'm like,
that's my first serpent, and I'm like, this thing doesn't
look like a regular stone wall. I was driving through
the woods on my ATV in the direction where my
dad used to live, and I used to go buy
that all the time. You know that particular it's a
snowshoe trail actually, and I was going out there, probably
gathering some wood or whatever. It's clean up. I love
to clean up, take it home and you know, keep
the house warm. I looked over about sixty feet at
that wall and I'm like, that looks so strange. Today
there was the woods, the light was coming through striking
and I said, that look kind of weird. I've seen
that before, but it seems to have a tapered shape.
So walked over to it, got off the ATV. I'm
looking at it, walking around and going, what the heck?
It looks like a snake's, you know, And I'm looking
at the tail. They kind of saying, is that's what's
to represent a rattle? I don't know. I had no clue.
I had no reference for that. I only knew about
the Great Serpent Mountain, Ohio, and so I started showing
that the people and they'll go like you might be
onto something here, you know. And that was in the
spring of twenty sixteen. After that, I found a couple others,
including our great big one hundred and forty foot with
one hundred and thirty seven feet I guess it is.
It's a big S shaped serpent with a triangular head.
It's right on the astronomical trail that we opened up
in nineteen seventy. In fact, my dad and I worked
on that with a couple of our staff members. Nineteen
seventy four, we expanded that trail to take into Somersaults
to Sunset Monolith in a couple other features, and that's
when we went right by that S shaped wall, right
along the whole thing, and never noticed. It was a
big S shape with a triangular head with with a
boulder maybe a boulder maybe two feet across. For three
feet across is the tail, and it sits on bedrock.
You can see the bedrock where the tail ends right
there and where the head is bedrock. The whole thing
just sits on bedrock and it looks like a gigantic
ass and it's so obvious today it's like, how could
we not see this thing in nineteen seventy or set
seventy went by pot of it and seventy four you
went along the whole thing. It's like, how can we
have not seen that? Well, we weren't looking. And you
have blueberry bushes, you have other types of brush there
just concealing it. You'll see the wall, but all you
see is bits and pieces of it. And took us
all these decades later to actually see that. I believe
it is a surfent wall that was like my second one.
Speaker 5: Most days don't look like an emergency. That's why most
people never think about what they're carrying. We do because
preparedness isn't about looking the party, it's about being ready anyway.
Comfort isn't a luxury. It's what keeps you moving when
the day goes longer than planned. That's why every Squatch
Survival pack is made here start to finish. Squatch builds
packs for people who don't assume the day will stay easy.
Rugeru mofman built to last your missions and be passed
down when you're done. Squatch survival gear ready for the
next one.
Speaker 4: And then we found a couple other ones too, and
in that year Skatwald has been doing America on Earth,
you know, starting in two thousand on History Fannel. He
was the host of that fill from twenty twelve. I
think he went on the air just at the end
of twelve and it ran for a couple of seasons.
It went off, came back on again, and then they
moved it over to Discovery Network. But from Annie and
Disney and History Channel, they sold I think the rights
to do it on Discovery Network and they put it
on their Travel channel and he did a couple of work.
He's doing something on Guy at TV now, but he's
been to our site many times. We had a bunch
of people including Alan what was a gentleman's name. He's
from England, Alan trying to think of the gentleman's Alan Butler.
Alan Butler is a kind of a expert on a
lot of the megalithics stuff in Europe. And he's been
on History Channel too, and he was with his wife
and they had a nice on for OUs at our
site visiting his good had been their number many times,
you know. But then he did the TV show there
and everything, so I filled him a couple of my
fervent walls there when they visited in that spring of
twenty sixteen and they were like, I think you got
faprient walls here, you know, And they didn't mention anything
of any in England at Alan never mentioned that at all.
But that really kind of kind of made me feel
we were right on the right path, you know. We
weren't imagining this whole thing. So we kept finding a
few more of these serparent walls. But the biggest thing
we found so far is the watchhouse. The watchhouse is
the first truck you'll see when you visit. We hope
you come up dock and come on up and when
you get there, that's one of the first things you
will see. And if you approach it now we did
that forestry things can actually see the head. It's a
big glacial erratic boulder like a lot of they're all
over New England, you know, and at sites like nostonic
and somebody became the head of the Serpent. In Pennsylvania
there's one that's just like that. You know. They're in
New York and the Hutchon Valley, Dutchess County, Putnam, Westchester
that holding. So you can actually see today as you're
approaching from our visitors that are heading up a couple
hundred feet straight up on our trail. You can see
the profile of it. You'll see the heads. You can
see the wall in front of it, which is the tail,
the serpent tail. You can see the undulations. The wall
goes up, down, up and down several times, heading on
its path around counterclockwise, touching every astronomical alignment mocker where
the sun or the moon rise over or set. It's
you have to have a backsite and foresight to have
an astronomical like a gun sight. So every one of
these mocerstones for the sun rises through sets, the moon
rises a sets, or even some star alignments. They are
part of the body that go around the entire fifteen acres,
come back one more hump, and then a ninety degree
tail right in front of its mouth. And so this
is two thousand, five hundred and fifty feet. This is
over about twelve hundred feet longer than the Great Serpent
Mounder in Ohio, which is supposed the biggest, the biggest
surf and effigy in the world. And I would say
it's the biggest earthen one. Now if ours is what
we believe it is, they have the biggest earthen serpent
in the world, and we may have the biggest surpent effigy,
you know, unless it's one in South America. Will find
that out, you know. I know they have surpents down there,
and some significantly you know, big ones. But I I
think we might have the biggest serpent effigy in the world,
at least that's our knowledge at the moment, you know.
So we have a small one which is twenty seven feet,
and then we have one hundred and thirty seven footer,
and then we have various other sized serpents too, So
a total of sixteen at our property that we know
of today. The last one was found two years ago,
that recent. And who knows, you know, maybe if we
do another show, you know, in another year or so,
maybe we'll have something on that too, you know, maybe
we'll find another one out there possibly, you know. And
the serpent could be uh the ponscel Lay and Draco
is kind of a serpent or dragon safe in the
Northern Hemisphere. They say that inspired the builders of the
Great Serpent Mountain, Ohio possibly, and the Great syrp and
mount in Ohio is so cool it is aligned with
a head towards the summer souls of sun set, and
they said it was a sort of an actual formation
called an ester. It's kind of a rise, I think
of some sort of rocky material and they took advantage
of that. And it turns out it's kind of aligned
with the sunset of the summer solstice, and as the
body meanders back and forth at the one in Ohio,
it aligned with the equinox. I believe the sunrise from sunset.
Somebody can correct me. It was a couple of years
were out there, two years ago, so I forgot some
of the details. And they have the winter solstice too.
But the sap of it, they think being a snake
with an egg in its mouth could represent maybe like
a solar eclipse. Maybe the mouth is eating the sun,
kind of like the moon is eating the sun during
a solar eclipse. Kind of. We know that the automist
foods had their own little eclipse up there. But anyway,
the sape of it being a snake might be because
that constellation Draco and there there's a great surf a moune.
Yeah isn't yeah? Isn't that? And there it is right,
it will.
Speaker 3: Show you this I thought, local, give me a whole
new perspective on this. He's native, he's a Native American,
and he said, this is what he thinks that it
originally was. He said, we believe that it was originally
a turtle. Oh really, so it was a snake, yes,
snake eating a turtle. He said. It kind of symbolized
the the god quasi kettle in South America. So the
people from South America migrating north and basically they're God
swallowing Turtle Island because they called, you know, North America
Turtle Island. I thought that was turtle. Interesting.
Speaker 4: The turtle is a big thing, and that's so cool.
I hadn't seen that one. I do know that with
that turtle is some people suggest it's a nake, and
he may be right, you know, part of his ancient traditions.
They did look at that. There is supposed to be
a monolith there. And when you walk up there and
walk along the whole thing, it's beautiful, absolutely beautifully. Have
a visitor center kind of like hours. You know, you
go in there and get the t shirt, the book,
really nice restrooms and everything, maybe snack. Uh. Then you
go out and you look at it's like, wow, this
is pretty phenomenal, you know. And you get to the
head with the with the egg of the turtle.
Speaker 2: Uh.
Speaker 4: You look over the bank and in its year it
just goes straight down and that's where that and that's
where that stone monolith I think rest today. I don't
know what the authority is there, Ohio or whatever, whether
they would consider looking at that monolith which has fallen.
I can't remember why it's over the bank and today
I don't know if it was vandalizard or just wearing.
Speaker 3: Caretakers did they got tired of weed eating around it,
so the caretakers just do it over the cliff.
Speaker 4: They threw it over the Oh thank you for that.
I I mean, isn't that sad? Like it's in our way?
They got. They didn't do that at Stonehems, although a
few of missing we've been to Stonehems, you know in
Pot of Bits and Distriby too. I know Haley, we
mentioned Haley. I think she actually went down to the
river and swam at it. So if he was down
in that area, we didn't, you know, we didn't wear
at that adventurous. It's you gotta get down there, you know.
So and then the trees that are there today, a
lot of them have been planted in the last sixtew
seven years, and I know there was a resistance taking
the trees. And I love trees, you know, but we
have to manage the forest. It's healthier for the forest,
healthier for the animals. We have more wildlife and our
licensed forest. And we went to University of Hampshire, you know,
for a degree. Because you're gonna have more You're gonna
have healthier trees. You're gonna have and you can you
can do this harvest every fifteen to twenty but you're
gonna see more animals than you had before. You could
have a variety, and you have open space. It's just good.
You know. Well, if they would open that up, you
could actually watch the summer solstice there. But this we
own our property. We kind of can do what we
want to it. We love it, we respect it, but
we can kind of do what we want with the property.
But when you get into like something that's under a
government or a local government kind of thing, sometimes it
takes a while to get things done. Sometimes some people
on the boards and stuff like no, you're not gonna
do that, so which you know this could have voices
of descent and stuff, but I would think that a
few of the trees could be thin for the health.
And it is kind of very but it is a
very rugged drain. On the side of that, looking towards
the summersos that goes over the rebeat into that really heure, Well,
it just goes right down to which I guess the
river down there. You could see it. But if they
opened that up, you could actually watch the summers sunset
over that. That would pretty That's what the ancients were doing,
you know. And it's in I guess the things built
in a meteorite created too. It's made it kind of
a special, isn't that cool? Our site, however, has a
little different geology. There's a it's all bedrock and we
are the Granite State. That's our nickname. Our hill is
about three hundred and sixty feet above sea level. On
the west side is the Stickett River down in the
valley and that runs into the Merrimack. One of the
big New England rivers starts up in the up in
New Hampshire and two rivers merge become the Merrimack River
up near Lake just below Lake Winnipesauke above our state capital,
ponk It above that's and the river goes right down
heads kind of south and then it kind of heads
east and the Spicott River joins it down in the
town of Lawrence, Massachusetts. So our river is a tributary
of the Picket which goes out to the EA coast
and near newbury Port, mass a beautiful historic town and
mass in Amesbury And if you want nice seafood around there,
it's good. And it's right near the ocean. But the
river originally went into Boston and geological times that actually
went down into right into the middle of Boston one time,
and that's where the Essex To now was created over
two hundred years ago. On the old east part of
the ancient river bed part of it. They have a
museum area. I think it's either I think it's a
state historic park. So we're right near a waterway that
was pretty significant and we're on the tributary that on
the west. On the east side of us is a
couple other rivers that eventually meander towards the ocean. Two
but the whole hilltop has been split in half by
a we call it an earthquake earthquake fault line, but
most geologists call it a joint to the entire hilltalk
is cracked right in half and it runs east and west.
He goes right through the center of the main site.
You can actually see the crack, and if you go
one thousand feet to the west, where a glacial cliff
shelter is overlooking the Sticker River, you can go out
to the cliff and you can see the whole clip
that's split in half too. It's pretty cool. So sometime
in the last couple hundred thousand years, I've been told
it's when this took place. It's cracked in a fat
pot of the Clinton Newbury fault line that runs from Clinton,
Massachusets the Newbury massa Fusets. It's like a little brand
to that. It's not the main and every time you
have earthquakes, and it's kind of dormant the actual fault,
but every time you have earthquakes here, we have them
all the time. They come up on TV, they'll come
up on the Boston stations. That area there is very
sensitive to that, and it's possible the ancient people were
tuned into that. I do know that, like Marchia Picio
is built in the fault and they took advantage for
quarrying purposes, but it may have been more even spiritual,
if you have that stresses in the ground and you
have a piece of electric effect or something that can
alter your mind. They say, we've been to Delphi in
Greece and they say there that it's on a fault too,
and if the gases came out in ancient times, they
could have had an effect on the oracles, the priestess.
We've been, Yeah, we're there in nineteen eighty five and
Delphi that was pretty cool. But also in England there's
like in Wales kind of going into England, there's about
seven or eight hundred stone circles. And Maria, my friend
from England, see, he's really you know, a lot of
knowledge about that. It goes, Yeah, it goes every one
of those and I've read it elsewhere besides her. We
were talking about it though, because yeah, every one of
them are on or next to a fault. Every one
of those stone surf, ancient stones, megalithic circles are on
a next to a fault. It does can't be all coincidental,
you know, And I'm like, yeah, and we got that
here at our site too. They will be interested in
the sea in New England where some of these other
sites are located, if they too are near faults, and
then you have to come up with different theories and ideas.
And it may be something to do with that piez
electric the ball lightning. We just don't know, you know,
but we do know in Delphi the gases may have
emanated and caused we were there, we didn't see any
gases with miliony gases, but I guess in a couple
thousand years ago that was taking place there, you know.
So the fault line in our hill is just another
interesting feature on the site and it kind of parallels
other ancient sites too. But our fite is about almost
one hundred and six acres. There's feats all over it.
My dad got involved. They really focused on the main site,
which is about one acre with that sandling fences. Mister
Goodwin put that fence up, as I mentioned in nineteen
thirty seven. But he also worked on a couple other things,
like the watchhouse, which is a satellite famber. It's about
three or four hundred feet from the main site. He
worked he did do work on the watchhouse. He never
saw the serpentine, you know, shape of it or anything
like that, and nobody else did for the next eighty years.
We've been sending our visitors by that since nineteen fifty eight,
and nobody saw that. I never saw that. So so
we have been finding a lot of things in the
last last ten years or so, including a trapezoidal scape too,
and the tapezoidal staate.
Speaker 3: I meant to ask, have any family any artifacts to
show like people actually lived there, Dennis, or was this
like a strictly like ritualistic type place in your guy's opinion.
Speaker 4: Well, Doc, that's an excellent question. Yeah, thank you. We
think a site ceremonial. We do not believe it's a
habitat site and for different reasons. The structures, although a
lot of work went into him. He had to quarry
the stone off the bedrock, they had to shape and
address it, franceport it. In some cases we find some
flabs still today in Stu the site was never complete.
We find thirty We have thirty six flabs all over
the one hundred and six acres that have been detached
from the bedrock, raised with another stone and then they
were doing percussion flaking or dressing the stone, and they
left them there. So the Perkon was found in eighty two,
and the last one was found I would think just
a couple of years ago. We have it in my book.
You know, we'll probably find more of these. So a
lot of work went into these, including dragging some stones
probably a thousand feet up the hill to build some
of the stonework. In other cases the stones were buoyed
right next to the structure, you know, making it a
lot easier for them too. And some of these stones
weighed fourteen punds. Some of the roof flaps that's the
biggest one, about twenty eight thousand pounds, and then they're
smaller ones two. But a lot of work went into
the structures. They don't yield a lot of volume of
space inside of them, Like the oracle tam is pretty big.
It's over twenty seven feet long. It's a long, narrow structure.
But on the east side there's a whole branch of
it that goes almost twenty feet to the east, and
that chamber has five closets. It has a stone bench
feet top ninety degrees into the bedrock, into the rock
and there's no indication of any metal tool markings whatsoever.
This on that particular seat, or the roof slabs, the walls, slabs,
and a lot of the other structures have no sign
of any metal tool markings. But that chamber has two
underground drains. These are parallel stone walls, some of them
the forty five feet long. They parallel each other, maybe
a foot and a half tall, and they put stone
caps on top of the entire length of that, creating
an underground chanel for water to run through. And the
oracle chamber happens. They have two of these trains. There's
about a dozen of these trains on the main site,
so the engineered a whole network of trains to keep
the site dry. They built all these stone tambers, but
again they don't look like houses. They don't have much
space inside of them. But the Oracle tamp is one
that does have. It actually had two windows. One today
is now an exit because it was damaged so much.
This window where the light could go into became a
bigger and bigger opening because people crawling in there over
the last hundred something years, just natural erosion and damage.
And it's an exit and one of them is part
of an eight foot funnel or bed that goes into
the wall. And the thought is this site, this site
was ceremonial, but a priest, a priestess or common could
have been on the site during special times of the
year because there's a bed. It has the seat with
actually three people can sit on today. It had a
it's simney and the ceiling on the north end of
its structure it had originally, and we have the photographs
and they were there. It's the nineteen fifty eight when
we opened. In fifty fifty eight, you were still there
two film movers that could be adjusted to adjustify the
flow of smoke going through it, and we photographed them.
And in nineteen fifty nine we think somebody, we don't
know if it was a visitor or somebody after ours,
stole them and we've never seen the stones. A good
miss a good one actually took them down photographed him
in nineteen thirty something, so those things are missing today.
It has calvings of a deer, although it really doesn't
look like a deer. It looks like an ibex with
the Western European animal inside the oracle chamber. Maybe you're
in a vision for us. Somebody could have left that
calving in the wall. It's not far from that window,
and I'm wondering if the window at one time allowed
some like to enter that it illuminated something inside of it,
like the deer coving. When we did the forestry project,
it did not remove enough trees. You'd have to remove
on avenue from that window to the south southeast, probably
about six hundred feet of trees. We did fin it,
but we didn't get that, like a whole avenue for
that alignment. Maybe that's something in the future we could do.
There's some big old freeze there and everything, and so
we're in any hurry to remove all the tree. It's restore,
you know, but that would be interesting. Maybe we could
stimulate that on computer Sunseeker, the different apps do maybe
I hail the actually found one of our illuminations in
twenty nineteen before the fourth project, and we have the
most beautiful illumination inside the watchhouse on the equinox sunrise
on a stone that's quartzite, looks like an egg and
that illuminates siding at seven point thirty in the morning
and it's a one hour illumination and actually the sun
and the infant sprain the bottom of the stone exactly
the same shape because of the shadow and light and
the way to design the entrance. An hour later it
frames of pop stone and then an ura looks like
a hand pointing at that stone in the back wall.
It kind of looks like an egg. We think now
it represents the womb we got the fertilization of the
egg with the sun rays going in it. And in
twenty nineteen, which he's visited in the spring, we were
still ten months to the forestry project beginning it because
I think, what's to clear the trees out? If you
use your sunseeker up, I think you're going to see
an illumination here in the morning around ninus. You know,
one year later it was open. We saw it. He's
back in Texas, I think at that point and I said,
look what we got. It was beautiful. About two years
later I'm standing there talking to a woman in front
of the chance to me. Watched us and said, you know,
we still have about a half an hour before that
illumination begins at eight o'clock at eight thirty, and I said,
you want to go down in the building to get warm.
Now we have an earlier astronomical sunrise than the Equinoxi.
It's part of the main complex with the alignments. It's
about an eight foot monolith that has fallen, and that's
although it's fallen, we just watch the sunrise over it,
and that's like six something in the morning. And then
we have one near the oracle chamber. We have another
monolist standing there, and that one tourish just a little
bit later. So we watched the first one, we go
to the next one, and then later we go down
to the watchhouse and walk The sun might actually go
into a structure, you know, probably like Chocoal Canyon with
a sun dagger and all of that. So yes, no, yeah,
I don't know. I said, well, you know, we can.
We can hang here if you want. And I turned
around and looked into the chamber behind me, and what
I saw at seven thirty, because I never was there
at that time, was that same saddle might was on
the bottom of the stone. Perfect. I'm like, holy cows.
So I got that picture. I sent that off to
Haley and some friends, and then at eight o'clock it
went to the top of the stone, and then at
eight thirty it did a look like a hand with
an index finger pointing back. And I thought, as it
represents the you know, fertility, its spring and its egg
has just been fertilized. And so next to it is
the the head. The boulder head is part of that
chamber right next to it, and where you stand is
actually at the end of the tail. That serpent sailed
was actually one more stone after it. And we found
out just two years ago. If you stand perfectly on
that stone, that's where you're supposed to stand, I think
to watch the hole illuminate. And we used to stand
next to it and around stuff. I stood on that
stone which is fit at the end of the pointed tail.
And that brings up another thing too. Some of the
tails seem to have another stone beyond it. Sometimes not
all of them, but a few of them have like
stones after it. So you have like a tail. What
we think now is it might represent rattle, because we've
seen this repeat itself kind of like you know, over
and over again. At first, I said, why did they
be that stone there? You know, they've got a beautiful tail.
Then they left like another stone. I would have cleared
it out of there. The stone might be two feet
across or whatever. It seems like it was there intentionally.
On the other side of the serpent, on the head side,
in front of the head some of the heads, I
found a couple other stones, including two long ones in
front of where the mouth and the nose would be, Like,
why do they be that there? They should have had
it cleaner, you know, a little cleaner. And we looked
at it, and then we found a couple more like that.
I said, I think what looking at is the tongue
Like one of them looks like a fourth tongue of
two stones coming out. Another one is like one tongue
coming out. I think they were deliberate. I think it
was something that they did. The other thing we found
in some of the serpents, both here and in north
stone antone eunse where the body will get wider near
the middle, and it could be individual stones that were
stacked to make it wider. In other cases, like at
our site, when of ours, it looks like it's a wide,
months wide mouthed serpent, and it looks like it's going
into our swamp, and it has a ninety degree boulder tail,
and it's on the true north south alignment. The two
north salt axis that goes through our astronomical center, so
we used to call it the south Wall siding in
the nineteen seventies when the astronomical work really took off.
And it goes right through the North Stone, a monolith
that's looking if you looked up you will see today,
but four thousand years ago the stout du ban If
dow Band is part of Draco, the constallationan the Surpent,
So four thousand years ago and earlier, like even the
Egyptians are looking at that and they have a staff
pointing towards Draco six hundred years ago maybe depending how
old you think the pyramids are, but Draco would have
been seen by anybody in the northern Hemisphere, and it
looks like a big dragon or a serpent. And so
four thousand years ago that line from our surpent through
the platform where there it's two pounds for richling, until
mister Goodwin in the nineteen thirties removed them. Unfortunately, we
have photographs and it goes right through the North Stone,
which is a beautiful monolith, and above it is you know,
flowers or dew band. As you go back in time,
so right in the middle of that that south wall,
as I mentioned now, we looks like a serpent heading
to the swamp with a big wide mouth. There's a
big glacial boulder. And what we think after seeing that
at other sites and at our site in a couple
of the other serpents, is it represents either an egg
or it represents they ate it to prey. And so
you know, there's a lot of features we keep discovering,
and one of them in Connecticut, actually, of the four hundred,
there might be more than one, looks like it's setting
its skin. You know, serpents they get rid of their
skin each here there's a name for that. Well, they
actually looks like the stone work makes it look like
the skins coming off the wall going through that yearly cycle.
So they get it in stone to make lipsych How
more obvious can it be that these aren't farmers walls,
you know? And that's just some people spoke much.
Speaker 3: Built serpentry and dragon stuff with the Phoenicians, you know,
like on their ships and stuff like that. And I
know anything against Mary Fayle had had confirmed that stone
that chins fans. I would like for you to touch
on that while I got you today, but with that stone.
Did you find any kind of astronomical alignments with May
the first, which is baill Taine, which was, you know,
a very common celebrated day of the Phoenicians. I was
just wondering because Fritz Zimmerman had found one of the
I think it was a new Ark hinge. Was the
opening the doorway was lined up perfectly to the sunrise
on May first, which was Beltane.
Speaker 4: Oh In? Which site? Was Fritz? That was that the Newark,
Ohio site? Or was it a different one? Oh? We
been of that with Yeah, okay, cause we did visit
the Newark and I know the golf course is going
to get removed. They're going to relocate the golf course
and open up that part of it too. While we
were there. There were just two years ago they were
going to make it a UNESCO World Heritage Site, along
with the Serpent Mound, which is an hour or two
south of there, in the Chillahaukeee Mounds. You know, we
visited those. In the Site Mound, we visited it too.
That's exciting about what Fritz mentions there. I can't remember
if I heard him say that before, but he's been
at our site. You know, we spent a lot of
time with Frids.
Speaker 3: Yeah, he just observed it, I think last year, so.
Speaker 4: We wouldn't have known it when I found lasted six
years ago, so we definitely didn't know that. That's interesting.
But we were at the New Mounds and twenty twenty
did we go there? I think it was either I
think it was twenty twenty three. We were at the
New York Mounts in the site and we took them
all in. You know, we went to the Edawa Mountains
in Georgia. Yeah, we do have we have the four
seasons Summer went to spring and fell. We also have
the cross quarter days and the cross quarter days. One
of them would be the Bell Taine or the May
Day alignment, and that's still in. There is a almost
an eight foot triangular monolith that has actually fallen over
on our site. And I know LA Missouri was quite
interested in having his archaeologists and feelers and Missouri that
Saint Louis, but probably more towards kind of thing. I
think Springfield, I think Missouri. I think I was because
I used to overnight down there. I do Saint Louis
and then with America and we go and do a
fo cop down to Uh you could kind of see
where Branson was down the road. We were above that,
but uh, he was in that area and he was
really fascinated by the Beltaine and they want to do
kind of an excavation around it at some point. I'm
not sure. Elie seemed to put off some of his
travels more recently. He's probably going to get back into it,
but he was, Hey, it's paying attention to some other things,
he told me, rather being on the road in lectures
and stuff. He does some of them too. Yeah, but
he wanted to do something, and maybe it was catch
up stuff at home or something, but he didn't want
to do something in Ireland, but he also wanted to
come to our site, and the Beltane was one of
the big things that they wanted to do. I mentioned
possibly whenever that stone fell over, it actually formed kind
of a time past though of the direct below it.
It stopped the light and the OSL dating I mentioned
could be possibly used on that to see at least
when it fell over. You know, that's the stone that
I would look a little earthquake there. That's the stone
that I actually would like to see possibly excavated. We
don't want to rebuild the site so much in the
Old Asi. There's a lot of rebuilding around the world
of these ancient sites. Say like they do prevent it
to maintenance, maintenance and stuff like that. But in some cases,
if you know where the stone exactly stood, that's a possibility.
You know, you're talking among your researchers and everything to say, yeah,
I think we'd like to stand that up. Will document
it very capfully and now you can see what you know,
what it looked. You could actually observe the sun rising
over it, which would be amazing. Again, they did that
at Stonehengs. You know, I got pictures of frames there
years ago doing Stone Hens.
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Speaker 4: So we do. We have bell T and we have
the sunset for that in the sunrise, and we also
have the bell T stone that's standing up in our
in our visitors center. So when you come up and
visit us, when you walk in, you'll see my diarragmer
that I built in college. It's about thirty acres or
one hundred and six acres. It's the ectronomical alignments. We
added more recently the serpentine walls. We've got some of
them because some of them are off the thirty acres,
and we added some of the windows. Some of the
ones that are on the thirty acre are some of
the ones outside. I can't put them on my diaragm
or it doesn't cover the whole hilt up. But on
your left you'll see a standing stone and it's about
seven feet tall. It's got a little cup toulttle on
top of it, and it's so much like other monoliths
that stand at our site and elsewhere in New England too,
but particularly Vumont has something like eleven hundred monoliths and
just the state of Themont, plus chambers and all of that,
just it's loaded. But this monolith was actually found in
seventy five. They're in a time that Barry Fell with
began investigating our site. Who birth visited us? I think,
and I'm gon say, may I have it in the
book the actual day he visited us and they came
back with George Potter from Texas A and M University
out of Texas with his wife Alberta, and Barry Fell's
wife was named Renee, and they lived in Arlington. Math
originally from New Zealand, with the school in Edinburgh in Vertebrae,
Marine Duallody taught at Hobbed for a couple decades. Toward
the end of his life he ended up in San Diego,
but he had written America BC in seventy sixth, which
I think you mentioned good though he updated that around
nineteen eighty nine. He talked to me on the phone
just before he passed away in nineteen ninety four. He
gave me a call from San Diego, and I think
he just wanted to see if we had any additional
new things. At that point, I didn't have serpent walls
or windows of trapezolia shape. They'll offer him back then.
And then he passed away in ninety four right after that,
but he came in coming to our site, and then
he began of course going all over New England and beyond,
you know, all the way out to the west coast
South America and all of that, because he's doing comparative archaeology,
particularly with the scriptions, you know, and so that's the
that the inscriptions really got involved. But one of that
that stone I mentioned that was in our museum standing
up today has inscriptions on the side of it that
he identified as around the time of Caesar, I think.
And what he says, it's Roman numerals. Ye, that's probably
like the original copy too, you know. And then he
updated to cover up a couple of times. You know,
we fild that in our museum for decades, very controversial,
raised a lot of eyebrows in the academic community, a
lot of pushback by them, and that's another statement of pushback. Uh.
And even today it is some of that's quite a
bit of that's still out there. But he got people
thinking about these mockings that I found all over North America,
South America and at our site. You know. The first
thing was the Deer Coving, actually by Malcolm Pearson, and
he's the bay. My dad actually ended up buying the
site from eventually when Goodwin owned the site from thirty
seventh to nineteen fifty and he was very sick in
the late forties, Goodwin wrote up. He wrote four books,
including The Ruins of Great Island in New England, which
included our site in sixteen other sites. In nineteen forty
six they knew of sixteen sites in the northeast and
again today it's over eight hundred. But then he wrote
The Truth about Leif Erickson before that and The Lure
of Gold, and he wrote the fourth book, I always
forget what it was goodwe was a really interesting gentleman.
But at the end of his life Malcolm Pearson helped
him finish the book and Malcolm's the actually the guy
that told them about our site nineteen thirty six as
a reward for all of Malcolm's help with Goodwin, and
he did a lot, particularly during World War two gas
was ration. They were having a hard time getting around
you had gas cards and all. But so Malcolm really
really helped out Goodwin's quite a bit, and Goodwin was
so thankful that he gave him the site as in
his when he passed away nineteen fifties, and Malcolm loved
the site. He lived in mass ex Musics. Today he
probably could be where he lived in an hour an
hour and a half away. Back in those days, there
were no interstates, so it took him out quite a
while to get up to our property. So he wasn't
always up here all the time keeping an eye on
it from vandalism from people that actually liked the site
or would be walking all over it, you know. Just
it wasn't really protected the way he wanted. Even though
the change fences there, people still fined under it like
my dad did eventually all around it and everything. And
so he actually offered it to the State of New
Hampshire back in the early fifties and we have all
that paperwork. The State of New Hampshire up and Conker.
They were going back and forth. Eventually, after I guess
about two years of talking, the state decided they were
not interested in this site. And he's the guy that
my dad met in nineteen fifty five after the radio show.
And Malcolm's family at the same time owned the up
in Faber. We've been talked about that igloo shape up
in Faber that's aligned with the plates and I believe
it's the winter sofis that looks like a big, gigantic igloo.
His family bought that property and one hundred years ago
and Malcolm was sixteen and the owner said, young man
is a root seller or a seller out in the
back have you seen it? And Malcolm w you know,
And that's what got Malcolm involved with this and he
died just after my dad. I think Malcolm died in
two thousand and ten at one hundred years old. His
past and always was his stuff too, and he helps
out the early Sites foundations in the nineteen sixty four
a research nonprofit group. That group ran for ten years
and it dissolved in late sixty three. Some of the
members passed away a few more from from Dartmouth College,
Meldenworth Sduffinson. I think the Great Naotic Explorer is one
of the founding members and in so many other interesting
people that were part of the original group called Early
Sites Foundation. The RAND ten years dissolved. I guess my
dad at ac and P he had a really bad
car accident, was in the hospital for months during that
time when the group, that group folded and my dad
I think talking to my uncle Oz and other people,
other people involved with our site. So we need a
nonprofit organization and that's when they're a New England Antiquities
Research Association with form and it's still going today. In fact,
they just had that spring meeting just two weeks ago.
They have a spring and fall meeting. So Malcolm, yeah,
Malcolm was a guy my dad leached the site from
and all of that, but his family owned the Upton
Chamber up to nineteen seventy and my dad actually leased
the site to sixty five. Well he raised enough capital
to actually purchase the twenty acres of the site, so
in sixty five Malcolm's family owned the Upton Chamber and
then he owned the site because of the he was
willed it by William Goodwin, you know, so it's kind
of how my dad got involved in how the whole
property thing was, you know, and today my dad fortunately
was I'm glad he did it. He actually bought the
whole hill and actually pot up another hill. And that's
we're finding so many of these things because way back
when people say, well it's a sight, the watchhouse, the
the lower well, and a couple other and that's it,
you know, No, these things are all over the entire hill.
And if he hadn't done that, we probably have like
thirty acres and there could be homes sitting up on
the winter solfice today. So that thought really kind of scary,
you know, because this whole area is developed, and our
house abuts the property too. Were on the side of
the hill on a cold des set, and we're next
to one of the walls that has the windows and
has one of the monoliths in it. So when I'm
looking out my back door, I can see one of
the standing monolists, and that one's about seven and a
half feet tall. It looks like one of the ones
in the building we have, like the one in the building.
Speaker 3: Come and that stone that they had found. People was
kind of inconclusive about what it was. But Barry Fail
when he looked at it, he said it he thought
it was what was it Phoenician or Indo Phoenician or
something like that, but he thought that it said basically,
we the Phoenicians dedicate this site to Bail And I'm
paraphrasing there, but it was something like that.
Speaker 4: Is that right? Yeah, that's right, Yeah, that's right. I
got a little sidetracked in that. And Malcolm was there
during the Barryfell era too, and so in the sixties
those stones were found and put on display, and I'm
building his unknown mockings, you know. Sixty seven one of
them was found, and then sixty nine two more found,
including the ballstone that you mentioned, dedicated to ball would
be half of the Canaanites. But in seventy five, when
Barry Fell came up, James Whittall, one of our researchers,
actually brought him to our site. I remember seeing. I
still have a vision of him being there, and it
was kind of exciting having a hobby professor. It was
still unusual for our site. You know, we don't have
anybody from mainstream coming up to our site, and I
remember them walking by our visitor center and they're taking
him up to show them the site and also to
show them eventually the stone inscriptions which were in display,
and so he took them back to Islington, mass excusets
and he made plaster cast. He did a lot of
the making. He would use like aluminum foil and then
he would put a late sometimes he used latex to
the use latex or aluminum and then they would make
a mold out of that on a plaster of Paris,
you know. And we have we have them hanging out
building today. And my parents visited he and his wife,
re An, a doctor, Barry Fell's wife, at their home
in Islington, Mass excuse it the number of quite a
three times, you know. And then Barry Fell started finding
that these the wine is loaded with inscriptions. It has
probably the most inscriptions of anywhere in the Northeast, you know,
up in Woodstock, Vermont, Putney, Pultney, the Woodstock townd to one.
I mean, they the inscriptions are amazing. But what are
you identified at our site with three types of inscriptions?
And the one that you mentioned was he pulled me
was Iberian Punic, so was Nistan. The Romans referra to
the Phoenicians as Punic or Punic I'm probably mispronouncing it.
The Greeks called them the phinnik Ike. That's the best
pronounced the eighth and I can say so. The Phoenicians
were well known by the Egyptians. I mean they were
a maritime power on the east coast of the Mediterranean.
They think they came out of the Red Sea area,
perhaps of the Persian Gulf originally, and they became a
sea coast Nathan about one hundred and twenty miles in length,
and they rooted sidon with some of the other Phoenicians,
very very famous cities. Tyrus, it might pronounce it Tyros,
a little tire here, yes here, you're right, and it
there's so many and Bli boats have to it was
when they're called blaeboat. Anyway, they eventually migrate across the Mediterranean.
They actually went out. They weren't just along the coast anymore.
They had boats going further, and then ships going across,
setting fifty colonies up, including cottage eventually, and then he
did the trading cities all around the Mediterranean, you know,
and they became a huge maritime trading culture. And then
I think Hanno brought out thirty thousand Pathaginians out to
the west coast of Africa. They set up seven trading
colonies and I believe as they went up to England
and they'll bring him back all sorts of different types
of trade items including UH from England would be UH
from Fawnwall. Here would be the bron the U. So
you need copper and you need to make bronz. You
eat ten and they think you're bringing fin back from Kunwall.
I had a guy from Lebanon, he would be in
fact I who was the guy from Lebanon too. This
guy was a Christian leban He was a captain at
a rown, so I didn't really fly with him, but
he was and I talked a little bit about his
his ancest free and the Phoenicians, and he was interested
in that, you know. But he moved out of Lebanon.
In fact, his family was almost prospected because they're Christian
Liban and when he was one of our captains. But
I talked to another visitor site it's totally separate person
that was from there too, and he goes well in
our language. Britain means the land of tin, you know,
and that would have been a source. Get tin makes
it with coffee, you make your bronze age. Bronze Age
was huge, you know.
Speaker 5: So.
Speaker 1: But in the Iberian Peninsula, the Phoenicians were there.
Speaker 4: One of the cities was called costco Nova, I believe
it was called. They're also in Engage or what is
called U looks like it is. It's Caddy on the
west coast and through the school stripped back in seventy three,
our high school went to Spain and we were right
down by Gibraltar, right near Caddy. I don't think we
get into the city of Caddies right there. That was
a Phenician city. They had several different Tanisian cities there.
But Barry Felsay is the type of style of Venisian
that we have is Iberian Phoenician. It came specifically from there.
And he describes why it's different than if you were
entire or back in the Phoenician posts, you know why
it's different or any other place around there. And then
he looked at some of the other mockings we had
and he says, well, you have what we used to
say ogam is olam, which is Celtic olm or ogam.
He goes, that was also the celt'ar in Fain and
Portugal too. He goes, the style that you have is
from that region Ciuth. So you have the ogam or oham,
you have the bunick, which he says from there. And
the other one he said was you have Libyan, and
we know Libyan's on the northern coast of Africa from Libya,
but they were also in Spain too, So he said
they were multi lingual cultures and he believes they kind
of assimilated somewhat intermarried and they would be multi lingual
speaking different language. And then there they launched off to
the New World, whether it was South America or Central
or North America. And he said Plumpus jumped off that
same from right there too to head to the New World,
you know, Christopher Clumbus did. So he said that you
have Benisan living in Celtic mockings at your site, and
then in America. Bas you'll see that it's not just
at our site, it's all over New England, it's into
New York. It goes even up to like a birder
on the milk. I think it's a milk river Old
Woman's found up there, and the other types are found
even out to the West coast and in South America,
like the pair of heavestone in Brazil found by slaves
in eighteen seventy two. They brought it to the attention
of some people, it was not really followed up until
I think Cyrus Gordon looked at it in the last
fifty years. I guess I think Cyrus Boydon he was
one of these tiger Firs. He was familiar with Nearer
or a member of Nearer too, and he looked at it, said,
O Benethians Us, you know if I got that correct,
that story, But that's found in South America, both of
the it's like three thousand stones with mockings found in
South America in about three thousand in North America. Could
that do not seem to be Native American or indigenous?
They seem to be Old World script emetics ven Ethians.
They being kilted that kind of thing. Even in Tennessee,
the bat the bad Creek, bad thing that that's pretty interesting,
but it's remember all the details. They just read the
whole thing about two months ago about it. They did
some commendating so some wood they found it seems to
be Hebrew. I think, I think, I think in the
Hebrew or as part of the Semitic the Phoenicians were
intermingled with the Hebrew, you know, the the U with
the uh. We're trying to say, with the people of
that whole region. Yeah where yeah, yeah, because they're.
Speaker 3: Doing DNA testing and showed their migration, you know, from
the Levant and out into Europe. And then like you said,
they were such a emmerciant class seafaring people. They were
constantly traveling, intermingling with other people and trading with other people.
So they they had to speak the language, you know,
and they.
Speaker 4: Spent they spread their alphabet. That's when they said, apparently
borrowed hieroglyphics from the Egyptians, which there were many. They
only I think they borrowed twenty two. For the original.
It was basically without vowels. It was like even the
Ogam we have did not have vowels, just olgam. Concert
was an earlier version of Ogum or Old Barry Fell says,
and it could be found not only in Ireland, in Scotland,
but it's found you know, in the western part of
Europe right down into Spain, you know, and it's found
over here, but it's an earlier version. It's almost like
a proto ogum. It's like without the vowels. Later on
they brought the vowels in there, I guess. And the
Phoenician was also just caught. There was no vowels, you know,
with twenty two letters. But yeah, the Phoenician alphabets basically
the Latin alphabet we have today. The Greeks adapted it
and they modified it, added things to it, turned some
of the letters. The Hebrews did the same thing. They
adapted it, they used it, they changed it. But I
think the grand how their language alphabet is the Phoenique
and alphabet you know, of everything we used today, you know.
And uh, they were known as the people of the
purple cloth too, and that's where the word phoinique, ike
and punda come from. Apparely, they would take those little
deep those sea fills, the uh, little snails, and they'd
extract the die and some of the some of the
merchants became so wealthy because this dye was worth more
than gold. I guess. Some of them had their fails
in purple, and so it became almost a royal color
because of the expense of it. I mean we're talking
over two thousand something years ago, you know, and at
Purple today.
Speaker 3: Found at tire and they would even use that stuff
to make psychedelics with. So I mean it was a
two double edged sword there.
Speaker 4: Oh okay, I hadn't heard that that that makes sense too, yes,
but we know they treated you know, the king Solomon's
temple was uh, King King the MOS's name, yeah, hied
King Hiram a few down, hire him a bip and
he became you know, creating the over three thousand years ago,
creating that in Solomon's temple. So they actually brought enough
Venisan to do the work for him, you know, So
the Phoenicians and then the seed is Elebanon going down
to Egypt. Big train going on with Egypt too, you know.
But the question is that they they went outside the
gates with griperaltar and then they went into Africa. You know,
let's say they made it into Western Europe too, you know,
and getting finn and stuff like that. Did they make
it across to the America's mainstream doesn't like that idea,
you know, it doesn't fit well with them, and They
used to say the Vikings never even came here, and
then in nineteen sixty they found enough evidence at Lonto
Meadow they so yes, they did come over here. Well.
Samuel Elliott Morrison, the great naval historian who wrote Admiral
to the Europe Admiral of the was it Admiral the
I don't have it sleeply? He wrote Admiral of the
Ocean Sea, also the European Discovery of America from Hobby
Uni Diversity. He had a running battle with good One,
you know, because good One's whole thing was that the
site was it's not historic, it's it's ancient. Is initial
thought was it was Viking because the friend from from
Seattle or the Franwell was the great ruined export. Well,
the thing is he saw biking, riding and everything. I
think he went a little too far. So he got
himself fought up in that, you know, a lot of criticism.
But I think some of his work was probably good,
you know, but he's the one that told good One
about some of the stone structures like in Hopkins in
or acting or you know, the Upton Chamber, because you
got to check him out back home, you know, because
Goodwin had retired from the insurance business, you know, and
he made it back to Hartford to live there, and
so certainly enough to get out there and started seeing
some of these sites and everything. And Goodwin's thought was, well,
maybe the Vikings built this and then throwing it. And
he bought our site in thirty seven, and as he
did more work, he's like, Vikings did not live in
stone structors the US stone of course, you know, and
some of the ruins are on stone and some of
their monuments. But they had then saw it houses, planets,
you know, the sund look like a Viking settlement. And
again he knew of about sixteen. His idea fifted quickly
to the Irish called the monks escaping Viking persecution. And
there are legends up in Iceland and Greenland that kind
of thing about before the Vikings got in there, that
there were robed men with white robes on before and
when they finally made it over in one of the
sagas to possibly where Newfoundland is, you know, where the
Lonzo Meadow is, and maybe a couple other sites, they
saw white robed men. It's in one of the sagas.
It's like they were already here you know, so it's
possible the Irish called the monks who were sea sharing
and they did travel and going back to Saint Brendan
the navigator in the sixth century, you know, taking off
that whole legend about Saint Brennan across in the ocean.
You know, so it's possible the Iris called the monks,
and that's a good one. Basically thought until his dying day,
and he wrote The Ruins the Great Island in New England,
that book on us in forty six, and then he wrote,
like I say, three other books. But his idea was
our site was a monastery and it was about a
thousand years old. It was a place where they lived.
And again you brought up a living thing. We don't
think the site was a living thing. I mean, somebody
could spend some time near during solfice and equinoxes, maybe
other special events, maybe May Day, that kind of the
cross border day thing, maybe other celebrations that we have
no clue that they celebrated, or even weddings or deaths
or something like that. Other than that, I think the
site was probably like a church. It was kept clean,
pretty pristine. One of the Megalythics sites in Europe too.
Almost every one of the more Tune's temples and monuments,
to the best of our knowledge, but they weren't where
people lived. You'd find their refuge, even if a lot
of it would decompose anything organic. But if you had stone, fools,
you had pottery, you know, ceramics, you can still find
the quantity at these megalythics sites, and that makes it
very frustrating for archaeologists. You have a site, you don't
have all the refuge, you don't find the midden for
the tract is. We like that, you know, the archaeologist
love that stuff. It tells a whole story, and when
it's not there, it's like, where do they live? We
want to find where they lived. Then we can find
some of the tools, utensils, weapons, you know, maybe we
can find where the house once stood, even if it's
just the post molds and know all that kind of thing.
So the fifty thousand megalithic sites in Western Europe roughly,
I think Scare Bray up in New York is one
of the habitat sites that survived today. And the reason
they built it out of stone up there, they just
didn't have the wood up there it's a very barren era.
And Fara Bray is amazing. I think it was uncovered
in the eighteen hundreds by a storm, and it had
originally been covered over by a storm thousands of years
ago and it kept as a time capital. When you
look at Scara Bray, you'll see, oh, I'll look like
America's stone Hens, you know, we have that. I haven't
been to Scarabray. I've been to Scotland, but I've never
been to that any but the piltrees it looked a
little bit like our site. But it's really a living site,
you know. It is a Habitat Meije, how which is
down the street a little ways, was actually the ceremonial burial,
you know, the monument kind of thing. But Maye, how
interestingly enough, has some of the best Viking ruins, they say,
anywhere in the world. The Viking through there over a
thousand years. The thing was already a couple three. The
thing is, it was already over three thousand years old
when the Vikings got there. It's over four thousand years old.
I think Stara Bray's close to five thousand years old.
When the Bikings visited over a thousand years ago. It
was already seem the ancients they were, and they put
graffiti all over the walls and the ruins, so it
has yeah, you know, modern graffiti a thousand years old,
and so that's kind of interesting too. That's kind of cool.
The Vikings were like wow, you know. But Stara Bray
and I think one other site in the UK, it's
called Stanley I think it's called Stanleydale. It was another
habitat site. And that's only two habitat sites that are
megalithic that I'm aware of that you can visit. And
near Stoneheng just starting to use wide ground penetration radar.
They've been doing it for a while and it's starting
to find the commun where they lived. They decomposed so
much that they get hidden under the earth. But with
all this modern equipment they're starting to find out. And
then they can do some shovel test bits for testing
and to see if there's what's below the surface, you know,
and they can actually because archeology is kind of invasive,
so you want to try to do the least invasive
thing you can, but sometimes you have to actually go
and do the excavations, you know, like they did it
go Beckley Techi and everything, you know, get in there
and do that and at our fight that's the same problem.
Where did the people live? And our archaeologists that just
retired three years ago. He's in the front cover of
my book. Her name was Pat Hume. She has joined
us in nineteen eighty nine. She was a president in
the Hypshire Archeological Study, which my dad had been a
long term member, and my dad's cousin uncle laws recall him.
He was a vice president of that back in the
sixties and seventies. But see I was mainstream and he
was brought in. I'm not sure if it was reluctantly
or not, but she joined us in eighty nine and
once he got this, it goes, this is not some
crazy farmer building this site, you know, And she started
doing several test pits all over the hilltop soiled depth measuring,
looking for artifacts. He did a repair on the north
Stone starting in nineteen eighty nineteen eighty nine, it was
starting to fall over, so they did an excavation around
the stone. Found a fire pit above the base of it.
Haven't dated it, and the date was thirteen hundred years
old and somebody had built a fire in front of
the north zone and used it as a backstop. And
that's like that's pre historic date. That's you know, that's
thirteen hundred years ago. Somebody built a fire there. The
stone could have been standing there for centuries before. There
are one thousands years but that's the stone of lines
with the polstone, so that really hooked her. He did
another several testpit just the way, just a little short
distance away from that. It wasn't next to the wall
or the North Stone, so it didn't date the future.
But that date came back five thousand BC. What it
looked like was a fire pit. It looked like somebody
was on top of the hill five thousand over five
thousand years ago, Middle Woodland period and actually that would
be the Archaic period, excuse me, Middle Archaic period, and
they were building a fire possibly, so somebody either transiting
the area, hunting or doing something out there maybe, And
this is before the site was built, So we have
some human activity going back over about fifty two hundred
years ago we think, and that was a fire pit,
but it was so small the remains of it, and
it was one of these questions we're not one hundred
percent here. It could have been something natural, but still
everything calls us this was actually a fire pit made
by mand not something natural. You know. They still had
a little bit of question to it. But that was
right next to the thirteen hundred year old fire pit,
that was right up against the base of the stone.
But they dug right down to the bedrock. They found
the stone was sitting in a crevice in the bedrock.
Stones piled around at little cobbles to stabilize it. And
on either side or part of the wall, that's the
serpent body of the twenty five fifty foot serpent. Part
of the whole thing, you know. So we're talking about
the living house, you know, it's the Phoenicians could have
been here, uh as part of it they you know,
that's that could be further investigated, I think by modern
people that do the pigger feet that kind of thing,
you know. But I'm glad you brought that up. Sometimes
we sometimes we forget a little bit about how much
Barrypeld did at the site. He was there on the
site not quite twenty years, you know, but he hadn't
been involved with us since the days of being in
the University of Edinburgh because when there he's starting from Gaelic.
You got into some of the ancient you know, culture,
and that's what really even though he was going to
be a vertebrae marine and zoologist, and he's studying animals
and marine life all around the world. And currents, air currents,
Oakin Currens, primarily Osin Currens, and we got into that,
he says, saying, oh, yeah, people people traveled on these currents.
Speaker 3: Either a paddle or sale. This the currents took him
straight to New England. That's great, you know.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and then he started getting into that, and then
languages and stuff. I think he could read like fifteen
ancient languages. You could speak seven. I think modern languages.
You know, just want to spend well, yeah, really, I
know I have a hot time in English. I don't know,
you know, he could do like six other languages. And
it's pretty pretty amazing guy. If people have a chance
to read his book, you know, I read it with
an open mind. I'm sure since fifty years or it
came out over fifty years ago, there's been a lot
more just in the and Sipson's never mind the surfent
walls and all the other things. We've been talking about today.
One other thing is the standard Union of measure at
our site. You know, Roscoe Whitney was put in guide
to the site in nineteen thirty seven. He was from Leminster,
mass It's about an hour and a half west of here.
He was an MIT graduate infinear and he did a
great job on He had a plane table. We have
pictures of him standing at his playing table in different
parts of the site with a pith helmet on. It
looked like he was in Africa and exactly boring cross
sex and profile and plan views of the entire complex.
So if anybody says, well, what do we know what
it looked like, you know before good one, Well, we
know what it looks like before good ones. We have
photographs going back to nineteen hundred nineteen twenty. We have
four of them, and I have I believe two of
the nineteen twenty in my book. And we have the
newspapers doing stories on us, like the Hable Gazette with
pictures of a guy named Reverend Ward standing on our
site with the whole site in the background in nineteen
thirty four, nineteen thirty five, but Boston, different Boston papers,
the Globe, the Boston Globe, maybe the Herald Gazette. I
had the Boston Herald, I should say, other papers did
site stories about our site. And that's before good One
never heard of it in thirty six, and then he
visits in thirty six, buys the property in thirty seven,
twenty acres from Fred Dustin. He was part of the
Patty family, believe it or not, Saint Patty family that
was there for over two hundred years. But he made
really great We have all that data today, all the
things that he drew out in the late thirties about
the site, all of these diagrams and everything. But he said,
you know, we were built a site. Either didn't give
a damn or know about many of measurements because I
looked at the heights, width and depth of destructors and
I can't find Imperial measurements, and I can't find in
metric or anything else. He didn't know what they used
for a measuring stick to build this thing with. And
you're going to use something when you build something, whether
it's a car, plane or a building or stone wall,
you're going to measure it right. And years later in
the seventies, before I when I was building my diarragm
or around seventy six seventy seven. I was in college
they built that Diarrham but you will see when you
visit us. I went up and did some measurement with
a couple of other people that worked there at the time,
and we thought we were already aware of a thing
called the megalistic yard, which is thirty two inches point
six before. It's the unit of measure found in some
of the megalytics sites in Europe. I'm already aware of that,
you know. So we started doing some measuring and we
looked at that too and said, oh, there seems to
be something to that, and uh, we made note of that.
We didn't really follow up too much of those fools.
It could be the megalith Yah is very very important.
It's two point seven three feet. It was found by
doctor Alexander Tom of Scotland, and he's considered the father
of aki astronomy too, as he looked at the way
the sites were light up and set up with the
heavens for the sun, moon and stars. And so my
father eventually got in contact with doctor l Alexander Tomb,
actually his son, doctor Archibald Tom in the late seventies
and the early eighties. Doctor Alexander Tom was fuite old
and in starting to have some physical problems. And we
traveled to Scotland in eighty two and we went to well,
I went to England. We took to playing Scotsman up.
We went to Edinburgh's Glasgow and we took I think
it was a bus over to Dunlop and we visited
doctor Alexander Tom. His son Archibald, who was also a
doctor of engineering, met us at the bus stop, brought
us to the family's compound and we had turkey that
evening with the whole family, and it was our Thanksgiving.
They didn't even know that. We said thank you so
much for a thankgiving, you know, with my dad and
I good memories of that, and I didn't appreciate. I
appreciated going there meeting the guy because I heard so
much about him. But it's more even more meaningful fifty
years well, forty forty whatever it is, forty three years later,
it's more meaningful. But doctor Tom here eight Tom, you
look him up. What an amazing guy. And his son,
I understand, his grandson who we probably met. I can't remember.
You know that the detail of that. Maybe in some
pictures will see it. I think the grandson may be
carrying out to work because Tom died in eighty five,
few years about few years out, twenty a half years
after he visited him, and then the Sun died in
ninety five, just ten years later. In the sunsets a
lot of time in Ohio, including the Ohio the Newark
Mounds and the Chilipoffee mom and how they're astronomically aligned.
So doctor Archibald Tom actually spent quite a bit of
time in I always say the early seventies, and he
wanted to visit us. But as we communicated during the
eighties into the nineties, he was starting to have some
physical issues and travel and you know, and then he
passed away in ninety five. So in the seventies I
was aware of that and we started taking I wonder
if we have a make alftic yard here, and you know,
Rashka Whitney also mentioned that he can't find eybe ninety
degree corners on a lot of the stone work, and
I'm wondering if that had to just because some of
the stuff with three it's through stone work, you know,
you know what I mean? It's not nice ninety degree
cornered phones like an Egypt of blocks. But I'm also
wondering if you're referring to the fact that we have
a trapezoidal state, because the corners, they're not going to
be ninety degrees if you have a tropizoid, you know.
And that's what we found on for the structors and
the sack of pickl table fiving the groove on top,
you know, it's trappersoidal shape. So we looked at that
more fostly, more recently, and we're finding what looks like
the megalithic yard may have been used at our site,
and then nearer that group, my dad's dot it has
found other instances where they have taken casful measurements. And
what we've been doing is using handheld lighter. It can
see to a centimeter. And they did the sixteen acres
just outside the astronomical prail. They did sixteen acres in
twenty twenty and now one perabyte of data and you
can actually see the trappizoidal FIP, but you can also
get measurements pretty accurately, and it seems like the megalithic
yard may have been used. But a megalithic yard is
not just two point seventeen CE. Doctor Tom found that.
He called it a megalithic rod. It's two and a
half megalithic yards in nice. That's got to get around it.
And one hundreds of that is the megaalithic inch. Is
also a megalithic fathom, which is a half a megolythic yard.
There's a John Clock from BYU that is written about
his study of measurements in South America, Mexico and in
the southern US, some of the mountain complexes like Poverty Point,
which we got to fear. I think it was two
years ago, and he said one of the measurements for
a couple one of them was eighty three centimeters. And
my buddy from West Virginia near the Great Creek Mountains
US from my publishers, he sent me a thing from
John Clock several pages. You know, he sends me stuff
a lot. I said, did you convert that to infest?
Did you convert that to feet? And he goes no,
I didn't, I says, I just did. And it comes
out it's the thirty two point sixty four inches. That's
a megalithic yard. Eighty three centimeters. He's been talking about
being found in the US Mexico as a measuring system,
and there was another measuring system length to whom he
put in there. I can't recall with that. So he's
finding a megalithic yard, you know, two point seven three
feet here. I'm like, there's got to be a connection there,
you know. Somebody said look at it more to verify
it to a second, you know, the gangs in, and
maybe a third, but we safely have it at our site.
So the sum is an important thing too, because if
the Patty family were building this whole entire complex, it's
some stept they think. You think they'd be using probably
seek imperial measurements. I don't think they'd be using metric necessarily,
and that was something of what around the French revolutionary
time when that came out, or some other measuring system,
you know. But the Spanish bearrah is another measurement that's
actually thirty two point sixty eight inches. Some people suggest
that the megalistic gods started in Spain. It was thirty
two sixty eight. They could have had a wooden yard
stick they ride it to. This is just don't take
me don't sit. This is what happened.
Speaker 3: It's just somebody in that state got wound down and
they kept copying each other kind of or all that would.
Speaker 4: Ride in it shrank, right, I mean, it's just it's
an interesting thought, you know, you consider it. We have
no evidence spot out, but it's like, oh, maybe it
started in Spain. But there's also an Indian from India
a sacred measure per few or whatever, and that is
like just under thirty three anches. It's like the same
almost the same length, you know, very very cool. That
could be investigated a little bit more too, to see
if there's anything to that, you know. Yeah, and any
anything else, you know, any questions you have. That's perfect.
I know, we covered a lot of different stuff today.
Our investigation will continue. We're still we're still doing investigation here.
Unfortunately at other sites, dating methods are using. We using
ground penetration radar. We've done the whole entire hill with
light R. The latest light R we've just done last
last fall. So we just did that about four months
ago with a gentleman from VPI, which is from Maine
to Place. It's an engineering company from Maine to So
we got all that We have all that data, but
if people are interesting, they can check out website. It's
stonehe INUSA dot com. We've had a website since I
think nineteen ninety five. There's a lot of links in there.
But the cool thing about that, if you go in there,
you can actually pull down our eleven minute theater video.
It has doctor David Stuart Smith, myself and other investigators.
It's about eleven minutes long. You can watch that. There's
also a free mobile app you can download if with
an Apple or Android, and if you put it on
your phone it's free. You can do a complete virtual
cour starting at the visitor center and you can take
the entire tour for free from your account or a
lazy boy of our flight. So don't hand you USI
dot com. And once you get in it to stop looking,
you know, and you will see both the video, you'll
see the free mobile app download. There's a lot of
pictures in there. There's a different We just redid the
whole website and there's areas of investigation and some reports
in there, so people can dig a little deeper if
they're interested in information. But we're open every day of
the year except Christmas and Thanksgiving and we have the
next event coming up will be deltain Ax. Really, I
believe we're going to be open for the sun the
sunrise and said on that, I think the next big
one really will be the summer sold because you know
in June, so that'll be the next one. You have
like drumming circles. We have people up there doing yoga
on the site, you know, reyki and other types of activities,
and we do VIP tour those especial they're like a
two or three hour tour with our with our manager James.
I've done many of them. Right now, I'm not doing anything.
I got I got a hip issue right now. I
can't really walk that cull. So yeah, if anybody's interesting,
they can also call us. Our phone number. Email is
on that website too. You know, emails are really cool.
To send us an email, we'll try to get right
back to you, you know, and you know, we hope
some of you can visit the site, but if not,
that app is really good to check it out and
see if you're interested in seeing the site at some point.
Speaker 3: That's awesome. I'm definitely gonna take advantage of that, but
I want to come up and get a tour and
see it myself. But Dannis Man, thank you so much
man for coming on and laying all this stuff out.
I'd love to have you back. I know, I said
begin the show. I hope it's the first many because
you are a wealth of knowledge and we've only just
kind of scratched the surface here, and but I want
you to appreciate it.
Speaker 4: Man.
Speaker 3: I hope you do come back sometime with us.
Speaker 4: Oh, thank you. We've got a lot to talk about.
And when you come up there, I'll try to throw
you around. And you know, we could even do a
live podcast. I mean that's a possibility. We've got a
few of those sometimes it works out nice, you know.
Just something to think about too. You could do something
up there, you know, near the recorder or whatever, and
then you can play it litter. I think people would
enjoy that having you up there, hands on, seeing the place,
you know, and say hi to our out package are
part of our site too. People don't realize el packers
or ancests. There are North American animals. The camel I
was at one of the mounds in Alabama. I'm looking
at a skull. It was a lama skull. It actually
had died there, and it had died there thousands of
years ago, as before the mound was built. And I
had known that the our ol package were domesticated in
South America, but the ancestors were the lamber in the camp.
And there it is, right at one of the ancient moms.
There's one of the ancestors of our l packers right there.
And it's like, that is so cool because I drew
up thinking camels for from Asia and Africa or whatever,
and linemans are from suff They're actually from here. They're
actually so you come up, this is them too. They'll skid.
We've had a couple of them since we started getting
him in twenty two thousand and two we started getting
al packers. But they're up there to greet you.
Speaker 3: Nice. Well, guys, I hope you enjoyed that. Be sure
to check out his website, and I want to make
sure to get those links from him and have those
down in the description below, because especially that that whole
digital thing. Man, you can just check everything out from
the comfort of your catch. You can't beat that. But guys,
be sure check you out.
Speaker 4: Man.
Speaker 3: Appreciate you guys. Hey, just remember the difference between the
known and the unknown. That is the journey, my friends,
so good journey. Guys, all right, Just.
Speaker 2: See smoking heroes and called beast by name, they say.
The friends will costume friends, confide, be somebody agent, the same,
real has a softer face, swim fires, let us be