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<v Speaker 1>Hey there, did you know that this podcast as a

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<v Speaker 1>supporters club. By becoming a supporter of the show, you

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<v Speaker 1>gain access to exclusive content and play an active role

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<v Speaker 1>in helping me to continue producing the content you love.

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<v Speaker 2>See the link in the episode description for more details.

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<v Speaker 3>Now let's get back to the episode.

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<v Speaker 4>Welcome to the Great ourn Pagan's Podcast. Here we discuss

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<v Speaker 4>all mathers, Paganism, Evanism, Witchcraft, history and mythology. EVA like

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<v Speaker 4>something nice in the comments. Share this with everyone and

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<v Speaker 4>enjoy yourselves on this amazing episode of the Gray heart

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<v Speaker 4>Bags podcast.

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<v Speaker 5>H m hm, they're very proud of you.

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<v Speaker 6>Interesting.

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<v Speaker 2>I thought i'd just get the recordings started.

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<v Speaker 5>Of me being a medium. Thanks thanks han On.

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<v Speaker 2>Everyone knows.

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<v Speaker 7>If it makes you feel better. I don't necessarily identify

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<v Speaker 7>as we do, but I do. I'm a lucid dreamer

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<v Speaker 7>and I do often see the dead in my dreams.

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<v Speaker 7>So I have a guess as to what you're seeing

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<v Speaker 7>behind me because I see her in my dreams.

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<v Speaker 6>Well, it could be two people.

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<v Speaker 5>It feels like a maternal figure who passed before you

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<v Speaker 5>were born. Interesting, okay, but I'm not seeing a face,

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<v Speaker 5>that's all. I'm getting.

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<v Speaker 2>Faceless and spooky.

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<v Speaker 5>That's how your brother presents himself to me all the time.

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<v Speaker 5>It's faceless, just to see if I spook, and it's like.

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<v Speaker 2>No, And I guess with that introduction, welcome all to

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<v Speaker 2>the Grey Horned Pagans Podcast. As you can hear, as

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<v Speaker 2>you can see, we got started already, and I thought,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, I can try and get everyone together so

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<v Speaker 2>that we may start recording, or I can just hit

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<v Speaker 2>record and see what happens. So here we are, of course,

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<v Speaker 2>with the lovely Wafy fire Faye, who is graciously joining us.

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<v Speaker 8>It's been a while actually since you've been on.

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<v Speaker 2>And of course our guest Emma McDonald, a writer, mostly

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<v Speaker 2>a writer. I've been reading her book today. I've been

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<v Speaker 2>reading it all day. Came through chapter ten, a little

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<v Speaker 2>past chapter ten, kitty, of course. Sorry, sorry.

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<v Speaker 5>Our famiers are always going to be part of the show, honey.

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<v Speaker 5>We can't edit them out. You know this, it's always

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<v Speaker 5>been moving there.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean I couldn't even added the mouth if

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<v Speaker 2>I if I try to, like just make their way

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<v Speaker 2>back in. But yeah, Emma, thank you for joining us,

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<v Speaker 2>and thank you for contacting us or having your agents

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<v Speaker 2>or whoever it is contacting us.

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<v Speaker 6>Michael, thank you so much for having me.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah. No, of course, of course, introduce yourself for the

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<v Speaker 2>people who may not know you just yet but absolutely should.

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<v Speaker 6>Yeah. So I'm Emma. I am an author. My debut novel,

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<v Speaker 6>whispers On's Foul, just came out in October.

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<v Speaker 7>I'm also a witch and if you could see my

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<v Speaker 7>setup behind me, it's a little bit of fact in

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<v Speaker 7>terms of the book because it is a very fictionalized accountant.

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<v Speaker 6>But yeah, so that's me.

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<v Speaker 7>I have my little familiar, as you mentioned, with me,

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<v Speaker 7>who may or may not make other appearance.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm sure they'll they'll make an appearance familiar to of

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<v Speaker 2>a tendency to do so.

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<v Speaker 5>She's already stealing on the show. She's right behind you,

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<v Speaker 5>looking at you fondly and now looking away like I

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<v Speaker 5>didn't do nothing.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that sounds like something that's familiar. How did you

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<v Speaker 2>came up with the inspiration for your book? I mean,

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<v Speaker 2>at first, when I read the summary, I was like, well,

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<v Speaker 2>this is very Harry Potter inspired as well, but with

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<v Speaker 2>a very feminine, witchy tone instat and I definitely do

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<v Speaker 2>recognize some things, but at the same time it's fastly different.

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<v Speaker 7>Yeah, I think as I mentioned, it's a little bit

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<v Speaker 7>like fact meeting fiction. So a lot of the inspiration

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<v Speaker 7>I took from my own life and my own practices.

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<v Speaker 7>And then I have always kind of been a fan

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<v Speaker 7>of the academian at aesthetic. And at some point my

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<v Speaker 7>agent came to me and said, you know, this is

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<v Speaker 7>actually really popular in the market right now.

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<v Speaker 6>It seems to be your vibe. Would you want to

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<v Speaker 6>write something in that vein?

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<v Speaker 7>And I said sure, and we started brainstorming ideas and

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<v Speaker 7>that's kind of.

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<v Speaker 6>How we ended up with the full story.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah. No, it's it's really it's it's an awesome book

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<v Speaker 2>at very very detailed, indeed, like very descriptive. The character

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<v Speaker 2>like you can if you're if you have a rich imagination,

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<v Speaker 2>you can like really just see them in your in

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<v Speaker 2>your mind's eye. That's that's really cool. I mean, I

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<v Speaker 2>guess speaking of familiars, that's one thing that I have

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<v Speaker 2>been reading in your book that I haven't seen written

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<v Speaker 2>in that way anywhere else, that they are tattooed in

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<v Speaker 2>a way and that they can come to life.

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<v Speaker 5>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 7>So it's a lot bit of magic that's tattooed into

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<v Speaker 7>your skin so that you can kind of pull on

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<v Speaker 7>it when you need to have strengthen your casting. So

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<v Speaker 7>in the book, the casters will call upon them if

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<v Speaker 7>they have to do particularly difficult spell work, or just

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<v Speaker 7>for a little bit of company to keep them around.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, no, that sounds I mean, I, like I said,

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<v Speaker 2>I've never seen it written like that before, and especially

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<v Speaker 2>when I read about it's one of the characters having

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<v Speaker 2>a was it a crow or raising tattoo familiar?

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<v Speaker 6>I mean that's the character.

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<v Speaker 2>I have a crow tattoo myself as well.

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<v Speaker 5>Well, you have my familiar on your other side, darling,

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<v Speaker 5>don't you not.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I do, like actually have a wolf on the

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<v Speaker 2>the other side, by the way, Yeah, thanks, thanks. They

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<v Speaker 2>they were a there were a lot of pain six

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<v Speaker 2>and a half and eight hours. So yeah, but you

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<v Speaker 2>mentioned being a witch. I mean just you know, looking

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<v Speaker 2>at your your background, like the room you're in, it's

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<v Speaker 2>like no way, really tell us a little about your

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<v Speaker 2>practices and maybe how you how you have woven that

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<v Speaker 2>into your your writings, because I mean, there's there's magical

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<v Speaker 7>So I tend to kind of gravitate more towards greencraft

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<v Speaker 7>and then also dreamcraft a little bit, but I don't

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<v Speaker 7>know if you can actually see bind me. That little

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<v Speaker 7>wicker thing is just full of all of my herbs

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<v Speaker 7>and tinctures and all the way down.

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<v Speaker 6>And then I do.

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<v Speaker 7>A lot, As I said, I'm a lucid dreamer, and

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<v Speaker 7>so I do a lot of my meditation and intentions and.

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<v Speaker 6>Practices with dreams as well.

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<v Speaker 7>So there's my two kind of evacillate between those two mainly,

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<v Speaker 7>and I think that shows up in my writing a lot.

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<v Speaker 7>So in this book there is obviously the main character

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<v Speaker 7>also kind of has a little bit of a love

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<v Speaker 7>for all things green and growing. And then I do

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<v Speaker 7>have other characters and other books planned that lean a

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<v Speaker 7>little bit more into the dreaming side of things as well,

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<v Speaker 7>and the more esoteric side of things.

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<v Speaker 2>So yeah, no, it's it's dreaming. It seems to pop

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<v Speaker 2>up more and more and more. I've actually done a

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<v Speaker 2>show quite recently with someone who calls himself the dream Wizards,

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<v Speaker 2>all kinds of dream interpretation, which is really interesting. Never

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<v Speaker 2>be much of a loocid dreamer myself, but there is

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<v Speaker 2>definitely there's there's power and Hondad. You have any things

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<v Speaker 2>that you wanted to know, things that you familiar.

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<v Speaker 5>You're you're distracting me. She's talking about something. I am

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<v Speaker 5>so sorry.

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<v Speaker 6>She's also extracted me if it's if it helps.

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<v Speaker 5>Have you practiced witchcraft your whole life or when did

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<v Speaker 5>you start getting into it?

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<v Speaker 6>I think there was a I didn't fully practice my

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<v Speaker 6>whole life.

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<v Speaker 7>I think I was always drawn towards it most people,

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<v Speaker 7>but most of my friends kind of because I have

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<v Speaker 7>gotten more intentional about it in more recent years, and

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<v Speaker 7>people that have known me on either side of that

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<v Speaker 7>have kind of been like, yeah, that just makes a

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<v Speaker 7>lot of sense for you.

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<v Speaker 6>So there's definitely I've always.

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<v Speaker 7>Been drawn to the kind of magic of nature side

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<v Speaker 7>of things, and I've always been a lucid dreamer. In fact,

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<v Speaker 7>my whole family is I didn't realize that people weren't

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<v Speaker 7>lucid dreamers until I was much older, because it was

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<v Speaker 7>very normal in the family to just come down to

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<v Speaker 7>breakfast and be like, so I had this really vivid,

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<v Speaker 7>lucid dream last night and like detail everything.

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<v Speaker 6>And it wasn't until one of my friends I was like, oh,

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<v Speaker 6>you know.

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<v Speaker 7>Like how in dreams you just do this and she

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<v Speaker 7>was like, no, that's not a thing that everybody does.

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<v Speaker 7>So that kind of got me started I think on

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<v Speaker 7>being a little bit more intentional about it and looking

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<v Speaker 7>into various practices and things. And then I did live

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<v Speaker 7>with a coven of witches recently, so that definitely threw

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<v Speaker 7>me more into the wider world of witches and the

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<v Speaker 7>various types of witchcraft.

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<v Speaker 2>So yeah, oh wow, that's so your whole family has

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<v Speaker 2>really been like a witchy family, if you will.

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<v Speaker 7>It's funny because the rest of them are not necessarily

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<v Speaker 7>like they their offices don't like this, but like they're not.

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<v Speaker 6>They don't embrace the I guess they don't.

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<v Speaker 7>They wouldn't identify as witches or really embrace witchcraft, but

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<v Speaker 7>they do just have a habit of casually dropping random

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<v Speaker 7>things like my dad will occasionally be like, oh yeah,

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<v Speaker 7>like you know, a prophetic dream or too. That's not

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<v Speaker 7>a thing that normal people talk about, but they'll just

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<v Speaker 7>talk about it as if it's very normal. But then

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<v Speaker 7>they also won't identify as switches. Were dub into witchcraft all.

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<v Speaker 2>So yeah, that's interesting. So for you, it's like just

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<v Speaker 2>normal tea talk, you know.

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<v Speaker 7>Yeah, but it's framed as like a completely normal it's not.

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<v Speaker 7>It's not anything out of the ordinary until I go

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<v Speaker 7>talk to other people and then they're.

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<v Speaker 6>Like, that's it's a little.

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<v Speaker 8>Witchy, only a little, only a little.

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<v Speaker 2>Trying to keep this going. I'm still a little hungover.

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<v Speaker 8>From last night.

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<v Speaker 5>The wife he told you not to drink too much

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<v Speaker 5>because you have a guest tomorrow, and you didn't listen.

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<v Speaker 7>Yes, no problem. I also was I had a late

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<v Speaker 7>night as well. I am not currently but you're somewhat

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<v Speaker 7>decent company.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, okay, Well that's that's I.

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<v Speaker 5>Guess I'm the only one who's like somewhat aware and awake.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, I mean, I'll take the wheels.

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<v Speaker 5>I don't know. I have so much on my plate

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<v Speaker 5>right now with school. I can't think of anything right now.

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<v Speaker 5>My brainch just dead.

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<v Speaker 2>How did you come up with the like in your

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<v Speaker 2>book the Forbidden Practices, slight necromancy and stuff like That's

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<v Speaker 2>that's really what people consider to be more like dark,

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<v Speaker 2>dark kind of witchcraft, although as as you have written it,

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<v Speaker 2>it really sounds a lot more like just mediumship, but

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<v Speaker 2>like on a very like a higher level. Is there

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<v Speaker 2>anything about like the well, let's say, darker side of magic.

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<v Speaker 2>Is it's really mh that like interest you or like I.

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<v Speaker 7>Think I've always been kind of like interested in the

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<v Speaker 7>macab and also you know, all things surrounding kind of death,

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<v Speaker 7>and I mean, and so I did want to even

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<v Speaker 7>though necromancy is in the book categorized as a forbidden magic,

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<v Speaker 7>I did kind of want to explore the depths of

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<v Speaker 7>it and show it in a multifaceted light rather than

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<v Speaker 7>just like it's evil, it's dark, nobody does it. So

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<v Speaker 7>a lot going on with that, and I won't spoil

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<v Speaker 7>anything that's I know you're on the entire lit but

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<v Speaker 7>you know, as you get further into the book, it

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<v Speaker 7>is explored, I think in more detail.

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<v Speaker 6>And I wanted to kind of show.

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<v Speaker 7>That there are multiple sides to you know, any form

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<v Speaker 7>of magic, but this one, in particular in this world

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<v Speaker 7>is quite misunderstood, and just I think there's a there's

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<v Speaker 7>a point that's made in one of.

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<v Speaker 6>The earlier chapters, I think maybe chapter three.

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<v Speaker 7>But in this world, one of the reasons that this

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<v Speaker 7>magic is forbidden is because it is one that they

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<v Speaker 7>just don't understand and they can't control it very well,

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<v Speaker 7>and that is why there's a lot of fear surrounding it,

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<v Speaker 7>because it's kind of beyond the parameters of control. And

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<v Speaker 7>that in the empire, the larger empire that this book

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<v Speaker 7>takes place in, is not something that they enjoy.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah. No, I do remember reading that, of course with

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<v Speaker 2>the age old comments attached to it. But we don't

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<v Speaker 2>know how to control it or you know, it could

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<v Speaker 2>be used for like it could be used for evil

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<v Speaker 2>or dangerous things or or whatever. That's a I mean

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<v Speaker 2>something that is you know, of course very of these times.

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<v Speaker 2>But an argument that really that doesn't hold any true

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<v Speaker 2>true ground. I feel like, you know, I got my

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<v Speaker 2>water thing right here. I can use this for bad

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<v Speaker 2>and for good if I want to. Doesn't make it

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<v Speaker 2>a bad thing necessarily. But I guess with magic, it's

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<v Speaker 2>it's a little little different. It's pretty, it's.

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<v Speaker 8>Innocent, you know, it's how you how Yeah, And I.

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<v Speaker 7>Think I think it very much depends on the person

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<v Speaker 7>behind it rather than the practice itself, because anything can

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<v Speaker 7>be used as a as a weapon or with ill

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<v Speaker 7>intent if somebody is motivated enough to do that. And

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<v Speaker 7>then so in the book, I was interested in looking

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<v Speaker 7>into what that looks like if everybody has magic. So

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<v Speaker 7>it's not just like magic is bad and there's some

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<v Speaker 7>magic users and some non magic users, like everybody in

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<v Speaker 7>this part of the world at least has magic, and

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<v Speaker 7>so it's more of a look at how people kind

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<v Speaker 7>of use their various powers and you know, the ones

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<v Speaker 7>that get maligned and the ones that are celebrated, and yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>Well everybody has magic aside from one, it seems. I mean,

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<v Speaker 2>I'm only on chapter ten. I'm not I don't know

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<v Speaker 2>how it's gonna progress. Of course, I do hope that

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<v Speaker 2>is gonna, you know, progress how I wanted to progress,

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<v Speaker 2>But you know, I'll have to have to read. But

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<v Speaker 2>just the and also what if I'm really interesting, which

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<v Speaker 2>just thinks for incredibly good writing is of course, the

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<v Speaker 2>main character's mother is someone high up in the school,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, the chancellor, and she's the one who is

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<v Speaker 2>like the outcast and all that, and how much of

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00:17:43.920 --> 00:17:48.240
<v Speaker 2>that is reflective on your own life and how much

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00:17:48.400 --> 00:17:52.319
<v Speaker 2>is just you know, I like this, you know, in

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<v Speaker 2>in my books, So I'm gonna write like that as well.

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<v Speaker 5>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 7>So I think the in terms of like the relationships

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00:17:59.319 --> 00:18:02.480
<v Speaker 7>that the character has with her mother is very much

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<v Speaker 7>kind of meant to be an echo of the larger

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<v Speaker 7>issue at the school, where they're so focused on power

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00:18:08.759 --> 00:18:11.200
<v Speaker 7>and prestige and appearances to the point that it is

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<v Speaker 7>really toxic, and I wanted to explore that on a

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00:18:14.920 --> 00:18:17.720
<v Speaker 7>personal level for the main character. So it's reflected both

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00:18:17.720 --> 00:18:21.079
<v Speaker 7>in like the larger setting and in her close personal relationships.

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<v Speaker 7>So that is a bit meant to be like a

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<v Speaker 7>I wouldn't say I took that from real life, but yeah,

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<v Speaker 7>I think there's also something about the genre of dark

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00:18:30.960 --> 00:18:33.480
<v Speaker 7>academia that kind of the whole esthetic of it is

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00:18:33.480 --> 00:18:37.079
<v Speaker 7>this really like beautiful aesthetic, but it's rotten at the core,

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00:18:37.319 --> 00:18:40.359
<v Speaker 7>And so there was there's something about that too that

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<v Speaker 7>I wanted to kind of have that echo in multiple

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<v Speaker 7>places throughout the relationships with the characters, throughout the setting

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<v Speaker 7>up school, throughout the larger setting, and the systems that

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00:18:50.000 --> 00:18:52.599
<v Speaker 7>are in place to kind of all tie together into

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00:18:52.880 --> 00:18:56.200
<v Speaker 7>a commentary on that level of toxicity. And so of

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<v Speaker 7>course having the main character sort of come from this,

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00:18:59.519 --> 00:19:02.000
<v Speaker 7>I didn't want her didn't necessarily come from a position

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00:19:02.119 --> 00:19:05.880
<v Speaker 7>of like extreme hardship, but she is a little just

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00:19:05.880 --> 00:19:09.039
<v Speaker 7>a little bit offbeat from everybody else because she doesn't

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00:19:09.039 --> 00:19:11.119
<v Speaker 7>have access to magic, and so that is a challenge

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00:19:11.119 --> 00:19:12.759
<v Speaker 7>for her, and I think that puts her in a

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00:19:12.839 --> 00:19:17.000
<v Speaker 7>unique position to really appreciate just how toxic this world

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00:19:17.000 --> 00:19:19.519
<v Speaker 7>that she's in is and to have a commentary on

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00:19:19.559 --> 00:19:20.880
<v Speaker 7>that because of it.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, now, and you've you've written that down wonderfully. I

323
00:19:25.880 --> 00:19:30.079
<v Speaker 2>mean I'm trying to spoil too much as well, because

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00:19:30.759 --> 00:19:34.000
<v Speaker 2>I mean I am still fairly new to the dark

325
00:19:34.160 --> 00:19:37.200
<v Speaker 2>academia kind of thing. It's more more my my wife's

326
00:19:37.279 --> 00:19:40.599
<v Speaker 2>kind of gendre. I like the I like the heavier stuff.

327
00:19:43.200 --> 00:19:46.279
<v Speaker 2>But yeah, like I love how the how it's so

328
00:19:46.400 --> 00:19:51.000
<v Speaker 2>incredibly opposite. And as I she my wife will be right,

329
00:19:51.039 --> 00:19:54.640
<v Speaker 2>but she's got some connectivity issues because of course she

330
00:19:54.680 --> 00:19:58.079
<v Speaker 2>does no I mean I I mentioned earlier how I

331
00:19:58.160 --> 00:20:01.640
<v Speaker 2>like do some do season like Harry Potter inspiration, But

332
00:20:01.720 --> 00:20:06.319
<v Speaker 2>this is so incredibly the main character is the the

333
00:20:06.440 --> 00:20:10.720
<v Speaker 2>exact opposite. Really, I'd say, like she's supposed to be

334
00:20:10.759 --> 00:20:13.599
<v Speaker 2>a witch, but as you said, has no access to magic,

335
00:20:14.160 --> 00:20:17.200
<v Speaker 2>doesn't really use magic. I mean the most that she does,

336
00:20:17.400 --> 00:20:21.519
<v Speaker 2>of what everything so far is conjured her familiar ones

337
00:20:21.640 --> 00:20:23.880
<v Speaker 2>against the most amount of magic I've seen her or

338
00:20:24.079 --> 00:20:28.279
<v Speaker 2>have rich her doing so far, Like even her her

339
00:20:28.640 --> 00:20:34.119
<v Speaker 2>dorm room is like nothing is magical, everything is basic,

340
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<v Speaker 2>And I love that that contrast actually because in so

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<v Speaker 2>many speaking of familiars, I yeah, this is this is

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00:20:46.079 --> 00:20:49.480
<v Speaker 2>my familiar. She need ak a big red Yeah, he

343
00:20:49.559 --> 00:20:51.640
<v Speaker 2>is a sweetheart. He's a he's a pain in the ass,

344
00:20:51.680 --> 00:21:00.200
<v Speaker 2>but he's a sweetheart. But I like very much like

345
00:21:00.319 --> 00:21:03.359
<v Speaker 2>the how how you've written that, because in so many

346
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<v Speaker 2>books where like magic is used, it's like the whole

347
00:21:06.519 --> 00:21:12.160
<v Speaker 2>world is magic. Everything is magic, Everyone uses magic. I mean,

348
00:21:12.319 --> 00:21:21.240
<v Speaker 2>of course, yeah, right, sure, yeah, you you just don't care.

349
00:21:21.839 --> 00:21:26.000
<v Speaker 2>Of course, welcome to my familiar. And she you're like

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<v Speaker 2>the main character.

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<v Speaker 8>It's not that she's opposed to magic, but.

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<v Speaker 2>Like almost ashamed that she has no access to it.

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<v Speaker 5>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 6>I think that it's the.

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<v Speaker 7>Her lack of it has been such a sore point

356
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<v Speaker 7>in her life for her that it is something that

357
00:21:49.400 --> 00:21:53.319
<v Speaker 7>she really really wants. I don't know if she, I say,

358
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<v Speaker 7>I don't know, like I'm not the author. I don't

359
00:21:55.599 --> 00:21:58.079
<v Speaker 7>think it's as much that she wants it for the

360
00:21:58.079 --> 00:22:01.039
<v Speaker 7>sake of having magic. I think that base level, she

361
00:22:01.240 --> 00:22:02.880
<v Speaker 7>spends a good deal of the story kind of there

362
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<v Speaker 7>is something that sort of regretful or she laments the

363
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<v Speaker 7>fact that she doesn't have it a few times, And

364
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<v Speaker 7>I think that is because She sees it as a

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<v Speaker 7>way to have power and prestige in the world that

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<v Speaker 7>she doesn't otherwise have. Like she understands that that is

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<v Speaker 7>what she would need to kind of fit into this world,

368
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<v Speaker 7>and without it, there's.

369
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<v Speaker 6>Just not really much of a chance of that happening.

370
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<v Speaker 7>So she is She does spend a good amount of

371
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<v Speaker 7>the at least in the first half of the story,

372
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<v Speaker 7>for sure, she spends a lot of time just kind

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<v Speaker 7>of I think sort of almost as a reaction to

374
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<v Speaker 7>not having it, Like she embraces a little bit more

375
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<v Speaker 7>of the mundane that is around her in kind of

376
00:22:38.839 --> 00:22:44.240
<v Speaker 7>a spiteful way. Yeah, she can't access magic, so she said, well,

377
00:22:44.279 --> 00:22:48.400
<v Speaker 7>if I can't access it, I'm going to.

378
00:22:47.000 --> 00:22:49.519
<v Speaker 6>Be like aggressively fine with where I am. But she's

379
00:22:49.559 --> 00:22:50.839
<v Speaker 6>not really totally fine with this.

380
00:22:51.640 --> 00:22:54.880
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, no, it seems like very much the I mean,

381
00:22:55.000 --> 00:22:57.920
<v Speaker 2>not that I would know, but like the struggles of

382
00:22:58.000 --> 00:23:01.880
<v Speaker 2>a you know, a young woman growing up and coming

383
00:23:01.960 --> 00:23:05.039
<v Speaker 2>up in the world. But it needs very spiteful like

384
00:23:05.160 --> 00:23:10.440
<v Speaker 2>if I can't use magic, like nothing is gonna be magical,

385
00:23:11.359 --> 00:23:17.359
<v Speaker 2>like my my dorm, Nope, even even my familiar I mean, yeah,

386
00:23:17.400 --> 00:23:20.000
<v Speaker 2>I have one, but I'm not even gonna not even

387
00:23:20.039 --> 00:23:24.400
<v Speaker 2>gonna bother. It's it's it's very spiteful, but that also

388
00:23:24.599 --> 00:23:28.119
<v Speaker 2>at the same time makes for a very interesting story

389
00:23:28.400 --> 00:23:35.400
<v Speaker 2>and also of course has some some murder mystery to it, Yeah,

390
00:23:35.839 --> 00:23:38.480
<v Speaker 2>which of course you know, is a very popular genre.

391
00:23:38.599 --> 00:23:41.960
<v Speaker 2>And I do understand why. I mean, my wife and

392
00:23:42.000 --> 00:23:45.480
<v Speaker 2>I I do hope she's gonna be able to make

393
00:23:45.519 --> 00:23:49.039
<v Speaker 2>it back before the ends long lift technology. I mean,

394
00:23:49.079 --> 00:23:51.079
<v Speaker 2>it's kind of witchcraft, but not you know, if you

395
00:23:51.279 --> 00:23:54.640
<v Speaker 2>don't actually make it work using witchcraft, that'd be great.

396
00:23:54.920 --> 00:23:59.640
<v Speaker 2>Where I was I going with this? No, but I

397
00:23:59.640 --> 00:24:04.559
<v Speaker 2>I yeah, it's it's not like my wife and I

398
00:24:04.640 --> 00:24:08.000
<v Speaker 2>are friends with at least one podcaster who does you know,

399
00:24:08.079 --> 00:24:11.079
<v Speaker 2>true crime, and it's very very popular, so you definitely

400
00:24:11.119 --> 00:24:14.559
<v Speaker 2>know what's genres two hits.

401
00:24:14.839 --> 00:24:16.440
<v Speaker 7>Yeah, I mean, I think part of it is just

402
00:24:16.480 --> 00:24:18.640
<v Speaker 7>my own interest as well, Like I've always loved a

403
00:24:18.640 --> 00:24:21.240
<v Speaker 7>good murder mystery, and I love ghost stories, and I

404
00:24:21.279 --> 00:24:24.599
<v Speaker 7>love magic. So this is just kind of the culmination

405
00:24:24.720 --> 00:24:26.960
<v Speaker 7>of all of those. And they say, right, what you know? So,

406
00:24:27.240 --> 00:24:28.839
<v Speaker 7>I mean, obviously I don't know what it's like to

407
00:24:28.839 --> 00:24:32.359
<v Speaker 7>attend a magical university, but with some caveats.

408
00:24:31.880 --> 00:24:36.640
<v Speaker 2>There that would be awesome though. Yeah, that's I think

409
00:24:36.680 --> 00:24:38.680
<v Speaker 2>that's a good one. If you like, if those kind

410
00:24:38.680 --> 00:24:45.440
<v Speaker 2>of universities would exist, what kind of university would you

411
00:24:45.799 --> 00:24:49.680
<v Speaker 2>want to go to? Like just let's play a little game,

412
00:24:49.759 --> 00:24:54.279
<v Speaker 2>like imagine you're like you're perfect university, perfect magical university.

413
00:24:54.319 --> 00:24:57.079
<v Speaker 2>I mean most of my audience are you know Heathens,

414
00:24:57.119 --> 00:25:00.079
<v Speaker 2>which is Wigans. So we've all had our dreams. What

415
00:25:00.440 --> 00:25:03.279
<v Speaker 2>would what would yours be? Like I've seen so many.

416
00:25:03.039 --> 00:25:07.119
<v Speaker 6>By now, like what kind of magic would I study there?

417
00:25:07.599 --> 00:25:07.839
<v Speaker 2>Yeah?

418
00:25:08.039 --> 00:25:11.039
<v Speaker 8>Just anything, you know, like what kind of magic? Well

419
00:25:11.079 --> 00:25:12.200
<v Speaker 8>would you wanted to be?

420
00:25:12.559 --> 00:25:16.279
<v Speaker 2>Like, I mean, you created this this whole world already.

421
00:25:17.039 --> 00:25:19.079
<v Speaker 6>It's funny because I don't think I would actually like

422
00:25:19.160 --> 00:25:20.000
<v Speaker 6>to attend.

423
00:25:19.759 --> 00:25:22.359
<v Speaker 7>Dun Hollow, which for people unfamiliar, that is the name

424
00:25:22.400 --> 00:25:25.240
<v Speaker 7>of the university in the book, just because it is

425
00:25:25.319 --> 00:25:26.240
<v Speaker 7>very cut throat.

426
00:25:26.000 --> 00:25:28.119
<v Speaker 6>And elitist and there's a lot of problems with it.

427
00:25:28.160 --> 00:25:30.200
<v Speaker 7>But if you know, you could have kind of a

428
00:25:30.279 --> 00:25:34.519
<v Speaker 7>university without that and just go through the enjoyment of

429
00:25:34.519 --> 00:25:36.839
<v Speaker 7>studying magic learning, I think that would be a lot

430
00:25:36.880 --> 00:25:39.240
<v Speaker 7>more appealing. There are different in the books. There are

431
00:25:39.240 --> 00:25:42.440
<v Speaker 7>different schools of magic that people can major in the

432
00:25:42.480 --> 00:25:44.559
<v Speaker 7>same way that a lot of universities, you know, they

433
00:25:44.640 --> 00:25:47.559
<v Speaker 7>have different schools and programs that you can major. So

434
00:25:47.599 --> 00:25:51.160
<v Speaker 7>if I had to pick something along those lines from

435
00:25:51.200 --> 00:25:54.319
<v Speaker 7>from Dunhallow, I would probably pick like the College of

436
00:25:54.400 --> 00:25:58.480
<v Speaker 7>Healing and Herbalism, or there's the College of Illusion.

437
00:25:58.039 --> 00:25:59.240
<v Speaker 6>And Invocation as well.

438
00:25:59.400 --> 00:26:01.759
<v Speaker 7>So kind of I feel like that shouldn't be a

439
00:26:01.759 --> 00:26:03.519
<v Speaker 7>surprising answer, because that means I'm either going to be

440
00:26:03.519 --> 00:26:06.480
<v Speaker 7>studying plants and making potions and such, or I'm going

441
00:26:06.480 --> 00:26:08.640
<v Speaker 7>to be doing like a dream and illusion magic. And

442
00:26:08.880 --> 00:26:11.640
<v Speaker 7>given my earlier answers that I feel like that matches.

443
00:26:11.400 --> 00:26:15.079
<v Speaker 6>Up pretty well for me. Yeah, here's what you would

444
00:26:15.240 --> 00:26:18.079
<v Speaker 6>pick if you you could study it school.

445
00:26:18.160 --> 00:26:18.759
<v Speaker 2>What would I thig?

446
00:26:19.160 --> 00:26:19.440
<v Speaker 5>I don't.

447
00:26:19.839 --> 00:26:24.039
<v Speaker 2>I don't know. I'm not much of a magical practitioner,

448
00:26:24.119 --> 00:26:33.279
<v Speaker 2>but I do. I love symbolism, symbolism, symbology. I love

449
00:26:33.359 --> 00:26:39.559
<v Speaker 2>the study of that and anything practical, anything that I can,

450
00:26:39.680 --> 00:26:43.880
<v Speaker 2>like just work with my hands. I have a no,

451
00:26:44.000 --> 00:26:48.279
<v Speaker 2>I have a good bring. It's weird, but I'm much

452
00:26:48.440 --> 00:26:51.920
<v Speaker 2>much better working with my hands, so god, I don't know. Actually,

453
00:26:52.039 --> 00:26:55.079
<v Speaker 2>I would definitely join sports team.

454
00:26:55.640 --> 00:26:58.119
<v Speaker 7>So it sounds like if you were at you'd either

455
00:26:58.119 --> 00:27:01.039
<v Speaker 7>be in the school of Practical spellcraft, the School of

456
00:27:01.079 --> 00:27:04.160
<v Speaker 7>magical Theory, which is all of the theoretical magic and

457
00:27:04.200 --> 00:27:06.680
<v Speaker 7>the study of the history of it and everything, or

458
00:27:07.039 --> 00:27:09.960
<v Speaker 7>possibly you'd be in if you are more in the

459
00:27:10.000 --> 00:27:13.559
<v Speaker 7>sports side of things, that would be the school of

460
00:27:13.559 --> 00:27:15.839
<v Speaker 7>Defensive Arts, which is all the like throwing fire and

461
00:27:15.920 --> 00:27:19.960
<v Speaker 7>ice and that kind of action based magic sort of thing.

462
00:27:20.640 --> 00:27:25.200
<v Speaker 2>That sounds yeah, throwing fire and ice and lightning even

463
00:27:25.359 --> 00:27:29.640
<v Speaker 2>from what I read around. Yeah, I mean, I'd be

464
00:27:29.799 --> 00:27:33.640
<v Speaker 2>very dangerous because I look way too excited and just

465
00:27:33.640 --> 00:27:41.319
<v Speaker 2>be like, hey, take it. And oh maybe maybe alchemy mmm,

466
00:27:41.799 --> 00:27:46.720
<v Speaker 2>like tinkering with stuff and making stuff go boom.

467
00:27:47.000 --> 00:27:49.240
<v Speaker 6>Yeah, there is there is a school of alchemy in

468
00:27:49.279 --> 00:27:49.799
<v Speaker 6>this as well.

469
00:27:49.839 --> 00:27:51.279
<v Speaker 7>And I don't know if you've gotten to this part,

470
00:27:51.319 --> 00:27:53.480
<v Speaker 7>but like all the students are known for just randomly

471
00:27:53.559 --> 00:27:56.640
<v Speaker 7>blowing things up, and like their whole dorm hall is

472
00:27:56.720 --> 00:27:59.960
<v Speaker 7>just like extra fortified because they know all the weird experiment.

473
00:28:00.720 --> 00:28:04.799
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Yeah, I just read that, read that part shortly

474
00:28:04.880 --> 00:28:08.319
<v Speaker 2>before I before I came on, and that that seems

475
00:28:08.480 --> 00:28:12.119
<v Speaker 2>very appropriate. You know, of course, the halls of alchemy

476
00:28:12.319 --> 00:28:15.759
<v Speaker 2>have to be fortified because you blow up a whole

477
00:28:15.880 --> 00:28:21.839
<v Speaker 2>wing by doing that. Oh man, you're really getting me

478
00:28:22.079 --> 00:28:26.880
<v Speaker 2>back into reading. I've been lacking in that lot.

479
00:28:27.200 --> 00:28:29.359
<v Speaker 8>No, but i've been. I've been lacking.

480
00:28:29.799 --> 00:28:35.799
<v Speaker 2>And I like the fantasy whichy World's building kind of things.

481
00:28:35.960 --> 00:28:40.920
<v Speaker 2>Even though done hollow, it is very very elitist. Indeed,

482
00:28:41.400 --> 00:28:47.039
<v Speaker 2>it's it's almost like really prep Yeah, like prep school.

483
00:28:47.160 --> 00:28:50.039
<v Speaker 2>And she's your your main character. She's kind of a

484
00:28:51.119 --> 00:28:53.519
<v Speaker 2>kind of enormy really.

485
00:28:53.359 --> 00:28:55.400
<v Speaker 6>I mean she even she is a snob sometimes too.

486
00:28:55.400 --> 00:28:56.960
<v Speaker 7>I don't know if you've gotten to those chapters yet,

487
00:28:56.960 --> 00:28:58.519
<v Speaker 7>but there are times where you get you pick up

488
00:28:58.720 --> 00:29:00.400
<v Speaker 7>that she I mean, just because she's a product of

489
00:29:00.440 --> 00:29:01.799
<v Speaker 7>the environment that she grew up in.

490
00:29:01.920 --> 00:29:03.880
<v Speaker 6>She's never really been away from the school, so.

491
00:29:03.799 --> 00:29:07.119
<v Speaker 7>There are times where she she sounds a little snobby

492
00:29:07.160 --> 00:29:10.279
<v Speaker 7>or elitist herself. I wouldn't say she's the worst character.

493
00:29:10.480 --> 00:29:11.880
<v Speaker 7>She's not the guiltiest of that.

494
00:29:11.920 --> 00:29:12.400
<v Speaker 6>At the school.

495
00:29:12.400 --> 00:29:15.799
<v Speaker 7>There's definitely people who are like the antagonists and stuff,

496
00:29:15.839 --> 00:29:17.519
<v Speaker 7>are do that a lot more than she does. But

497
00:29:17.680 --> 00:29:21.720
<v Speaker 7>I mean, even from her kind of lesser position that

498
00:29:21.799 --> 00:29:23.680
<v Speaker 7>she has at the school, where she's, you know, the

499
00:29:23.720 --> 00:29:26.240
<v Speaker 7>outcast of the school. Even she will sometimes throw out

500
00:29:26.240 --> 00:29:27.599
<v Speaker 7>a line or two where it's like, all right, it's

501
00:29:27.599 --> 00:29:28.279
<v Speaker 7>a little judgy.

502
00:29:28.799 --> 00:29:31.000
<v Speaker 6>So yeah, I think that is just a product.

503
00:29:31.160 --> 00:29:35.599
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean i'd have to like read in between

504
00:29:35.640 --> 00:29:38.799
<v Speaker 2>the lines a little bit. I do at the what

505
00:29:38.960 --> 00:29:42.240
<v Speaker 2>is it like the Newcomers bank Hid, like the at

506
00:29:42.279 --> 00:29:43.119
<v Speaker 2>the beginning of.

507
00:29:43.039 --> 00:29:45.079
<v Speaker 6>The school year, the start of term faced?

508
00:29:45.160 --> 00:29:46.160
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, you.

509
00:29:46.119 --> 00:29:50.680
<v Speaker 8>Know open bar. Oh yeah, it definitely tastes yeah, why, it's.

510
00:29:50.559 --> 00:29:57.960
<v Speaker 6>Like that's the exact what I was thinking of. So yeah, she's.

511
00:29:57.240 --> 00:30:00.119
<v Speaker 8>Which sounds recognizable as well.

512
00:30:00.119 --> 00:30:02.200
<v Speaker 2>You know, if it's an open bar and everything is read,

513
00:30:02.279 --> 00:30:03.839
<v Speaker 2>you're not going to get the expensive stuff.

514
00:30:04.559 --> 00:30:07.400
<v Speaker 6>They're not shelling out that much money for the open bar.

515
00:30:08.119 --> 00:30:12.319
<v Speaker 2>No, no, absolutely not. How much of the main character

516
00:30:12.880 --> 00:30:21.079
<v Speaker 2>is like you, but like just bigger, grander. I mean

517
00:30:21.119 --> 00:30:25.720
<v Speaker 2>that's in writing and in like many theatrical kind of things.

518
00:30:25.920 --> 00:30:29.480
<v Speaker 2>I'm a big pro wrestling fan actually, and they often

519
00:30:29.519 --> 00:30:33.720
<v Speaker 2>say that you know your character in that sport even

520
00:30:33.759 --> 00:30:35.759
<v Speaker 2>though it's like ninety percent theater is just like take

521
00:30:35.799 --> 00:30:39.519
<v Speaker 2>something from yourself and blow it up times one hundred.

522
00:30:39.640 --> 00:30:42.319
<v Speaker 2>That So, how much of the at least the main

523
00:30:42.440 --> 00:30:45.680
<v Speaker 2>character is you, and how much of it is just

524
00:30:46.359 --> 00:30:48.759
<v Speaker 2>you know, this is what people want to read?

525
00:30:49.160 --> 00:30:50.519
<v Speaker 6>Yeah, I like to.

526
00:30:50.880 --> 00:30:53.440
<v Speaker 7>I never really want to have what we in the

527
00:30:53.480 --> 00:30:56.039
<v Speaker 7>writing community called a self insert, which is essentially where

528
00:30:56.039 --> 00:30:58.759
<v Speaker 7>the author just takes themselves and makes a fictional version

529
00:30:58.799 --> 00:31:01.079
<v Speaker 7>out of it and to kind of live vicariously through

530
00:31:01.079 --> 00:31:02.680
<v Speaker 7>a character. So I never really want to do that,

531
00:31:02.720 --> 00:31:04.839
<v Speaker 7>but I do like to take, you know, a little

532
00:31:04.960 --> 00:31:08.279
<v Speaker 7>a trait here or an interest there, and kind of

533
00:31:08.440 --> 00:31:11.400
<v Speaker 7>put that into I really do that with every character

534
00:31:11.440 --> 00:31:13.440
<v Speaker 7>that I write, though, Like every single character has at

535
00:31:13.519 --> 00:31:15.960
<v Speaker 7>least one trait that I can relate to because that

536
00:31:16.000 --> 00:31:18.200
<v Speaker 7>helps me build them as a character. So, for example,

537
00:31:18.240 --> 00:31:21.400
<v Speaker 7>the main character shares my interest in plants. But what

538
00:31:21.599 --> 00:31:24.200
<v Speaker 7>I say that I am like her overall in the

539
00:31:24.240 --> 00:31:26.799
<v Speaker 7>way that she thinks about things. No, not really, because

540
00:31:26.839 --> 00:31:28.920
<v Speaker 7>she tends to be a little bit more callous than

541
00:31:28.920 --> 00:31:31.000
<v Speaker 7>I am. Like I would not want to necessarily be

542
00:31:31.039 --> 00:31:34.119
<v Speaker 7>compared to her in that same Vein her best friend Fenn,

543
00:31:34.200 --> 00:31:37.160
<v Speaker 7>for example, like I have like the aspect of his

544
00:31:37.559 --> 00:31:39.799
<v Speaker 7>personality that kind of like wants to get along with everybody,

545
00:31:39.799 --> 00:31:42.160
<v Speaker 7>and it's kinder than probably anybody else at the school,

546
00:31:42.160 --> 00:31:44.039
<v Speaker 7>Like I amfuse a little bit of Not that I'm

547
00:31:44.079 --> 00:31:45.599
<v Speaker 7>trying to throw myself flowers and be like I'm the

548
00:31:45.680 --> 00:31:48.000
<v Speaker 7>kindest person ever, but like that little bit of like

549
00:31:48.079 --> 00:31:50.839
<v Speaker 7>warmth I kind of took from I guess how I

550
00:31:50.839 --> 00:31:53.039
<v Speaker 7>see myself. But then I also have, like you know,

551
00:31:53.240 --> 00:31:55.759
<v Speaker 7>in another character, some of that snark or that like

552
00:31:55.920 --> 00:31:58.359
<v Speaker 7>sharp wit I kind of mix, and then in the

553
00:31:58.400 --> 00:32:00.440
<v Speaker 7>antagonist I will put in some of my flos in

554
00:32:00.440 --> 00:32:02.759
<v Speaker 7>there and explore that. So I think there's a little

555
00:32:02.759 --> 00:32:05.279
<v Speaker 7>piece of me in every single character, not just the

556
00:32:05.319 --> 00:32:11.400
<v Speaker 7>main character. But I think probably she has more traits

557
00:32:11.440 --> 00:32:13.480
<v Speaker 7>in common with me, just because I am spending the

558
00:32:13.480 --> 00:32:15.720
<v Speaker 7>most time with her reson. But I think it's more

559
00:32:15.920 --> 00:32:18.519
<v Speaker 7>taking those foundational traits and then drawing the lines together

560
00:32:18.559 --> 00:32:20.519
<v Speaker 7>as they make sense with a character, rather than trying

561
00:32:20.519 --> 00:32:23.079
<v Speaker 7>to make her an exact copy of me or something

562
00:32:23.079 --> 00:32:25.400
<v Speaker 7>that I could relate to or you know, it's not

563
00:32:25.559 --> 00:32:27.440
<v Speaker 7>I don't go into writing scenes with her being like

564
00:32:27.480 --> 00:32:28.720
<v Speaker 7>what would I do in this scenario?

565
00:32:28.759 --> 00:32:30.839
<v Speaker 6>Like I try to make her a fully fledged all

566
00:32:30.880 --> 00:32:33.960
<v Speaker 6>of the characters really flush out enough where in any

567
00:32:33.960 --> 00:32:35.680
<v Speaker 6>given scene I can kind of feel like, what would

568
00:32:35.680 --> 00:32:38.480
<v Speaker 6>they do in this situation and how it make sense

569
00:32:39.240 --> 00:32:40.559
<v Speaker 6>for the character that I'm built thus far.

570
00:32:41.680 --> 00:32:44.720
<v Speaker 1>Hey there, did you know that this podcast as a

571
00:32:44.720 --> 00:32:48.720
<v Speaker 1>Supporters Club. Welly, becoming a supporter of the show, you

572
00:32:48.759 --> 00:32:52.559
<v Speaker 1>gain access to exclusive content and play an active role

573
00:32:52.599 --> 00:32:55.880
<v Speaker 1>in helping me to continue producing the content you love.

574
00:32:56.880 --> 00:32:59.799
<v Speaker 2>See the link in the episode description for more details.

575
00:33:01.039 --> 00:33:03.960
<v Speaker 3>Now let's get back to the episode.

576
00:33:06.160 --> 00:33:09.880
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, okay, you mentioned Wren, and I know this is

577
00:33:09.920 --> 00:33:12.880
<v Speaker 2>gonna be spoilers, and I I hate you, but I

578
00:33:13.000 --> 00:33:16.160
<v Speaker 2>have to know him and the main character. They have

579
00:33:16.440 --> 00:33:22.759
<v Speaker 2>a history, if you will, history that they well can't

580
00:33:22.759 --> 00:33:26.319
<v Speaker 2>seem to to really let go of. I don't spoilers,

581
00:33:26.359 --> 00:33:30.400
<v Speaker 2>and I shouldn't be acting. But is it gonna like

582
00:33:30.599 --> 00:33:35.599
<v Speaker 2>are they gonna come back together? Or is it you know,

583
00:33:35.799 --> 00:33:37.039
<v Speaker 2>kind of I'm trying.

584
00:33:36.839 --> 00:33:38.519
<v Speaker 7>To think of how I can answer this without false

585
00:33:38.519 --> 00:33:43.839
<v Speaker 7>foot No, they are not the endgame couple, I will

586
00:33:43.880 --> 00:33:49.480
<v Speaker 7>say there. It is explored a little bit both in

587
00:33:49.519 --> 00:33:52.079
<v Speaker 7>this book and there so there is a sequel to

588
00:33:52.079 --> 00:33:52.720
<v Speaker 7>this book as well.

589
00:33:52.759 --> 00:33:55.079
<v Speaker 6>I'm actually working on a book two currently, or I.

590
00:33:55.039 --> 00:33:58.160
<v Speaker 7>Just finished my adits for it, and it is their

591
00:33:58.200 --> 00:34:00.960
<v Speaker 7>relationship is explored a little bit more throughout that book

592
00:34:01.000 --> 00:34:01.960
<v Speaker 7>as well, or.

593
00:34:02.480 --> 00:34:04.640
<v Speaker 6>Kind of in in the background.

594
00:34:04.680 --> 00:34:05.000
<v Speaker 5>Not is it?

595
00:34:05.039 --> 00:34:05.440
<v Speaker 6>But they're not.

596
00:34:05.720 --> 00:34:11.079
<v Speaker 7>They're not the the sort of couple goal of the book.

597
00:34:13.159 --> 00:34:18.599
<v Speaker 8>Oh okay, okay, now I have to keep reading.

598
00:34:19.800 --> 00:34:21.639
<v Speaker 7>You are not the only one to think that they

599
00:34:21.679 --> 00:34:23.880
<v Speaker 7>might be though, I've had most of the people be like, oh,

600
00:34:23.920 --> 00:34:25.159
<v Speaker 7>so they're going to get together at the end, and

601
00:34:25.159 --> 00:34:26.239
<v Speaker 7>I'm like, no.

602
00:34:27.039 --> 00:34:30.800
<v Speaker 2>I mean that's it's kind of what you expect, you know,

603
00:34:30.920 --> 00:34:35.880
<v Speaker 2>with the how like the usual teen dramas, et cetera go,

604
00:34:36.079 --> 00:34:38.159
<v Speaker 2>it's like we know an old flame and you know,

605
00:34:38.280 --> 00:34:40.679
<v Speaker 2>get rekindled and in the end, you know they can

606
00:34:40.880 --> 00:34:45.079
<v Speaker 2>like it's it can just be friendship. Because of the histories,

607
00:34:45.559 --> 00:34:46.079
<v Speaker 2>I will.

608
00:34:45.920 --> 00:34:48.800
<v Speaker 7>Say they like friendship is their main, like the kind

609
00:34:48.840 --> 00:34:51.519
<v Speaker 7>of foundation of their relationship. And I did want to

610
00:34:51.559 --> 00:34:54.039
<v Speaker 7>explore I think a lot of times in fiction we

611
00:34:54.079 --> 00:34:56.239
<v Speaker 7>look at the romantic relationships and that's like the end,

612
00:34:56.280 --> 00:34:58.199
<v Speaker 7>I'll be all and that is the main relationship.

613
00:34:58.239 --> 00:34:59.440
<v Speaker 6>We we give a lot of attention to it.

614
00:34:59.480 --> 00:35:01.440
<v Speaker 7>So I did kind of want to explore with Fenn

615
00:35:01.440 --> 00:35:05.920
<v Speaker 7>and Rose how that platonic or romantic kind of those

616
00:35:05.960 --> 00:35:08.280
<v Speaker 7>lines can get blurred and the relationship still has a

617
00:35:08.320 --> 00:35:11.119
<v Speaker 7>lot of value even if it's platonic. And it doesn't

618
00:35:11.119 --> 00:35:13.000
<v Speaker 7>have to be romantic to be or I guess it

619
00:35:13.000 --> 00:35:17.400
<v Speaker 7>doesn't have to currently be romantic to be impactful.

620
00:35:17.000 --> 00:35:19.920
<v Speaker 6>Or you know, a very strong relationship that they have.

621
00:35:21.559 --> 00:35:26.400
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, no, because that's European. That's also just the sign

622
00:35:26.480 --> 00:35:29.239
<v Speaker 2>of a very good writer. Like there are definitely some

623
00:35:29.400 --> 00:35:33.199
<v Speaker 2>blurred lines between Rose and Fenn, you know their interactions

624
00:35:33.280 --> 00:35:36.400
<v Speaker 2>is like will they won't they? There's the history.

625
00:35:37.559 --> 00:35:39.920
<v Speaker 6>Well I was also because it is a fantasy world.

626
00:35:39.920 --> 00:35:42.440
<v Speaker 7>I was kind of like, would they even perceive of

627
00:35:42.639 --> 00:35:45.119
<v Speaker 7>relationships as clear cut as we tend to in our

628
00:35:45.159 --> 00:35:47.679
<v Speaker 7>society of like you have romantic relationships and you have

629
00:35:47.719 --> 00:35:50.639
<v Speaker 7>friendships and that is it, but like, would romantic relationships

630
00:35:50.679 --> 00:35:53.679
<v Speaker 7>even work the same way in this fantasy world? You know,

631
00:35:53.760 --> 00:35:56.239
<v Speaker 7>it's it's really anybody's like you get to make up

632
00:35:56.239 --> 00:35:57.519
<v Speaker 7>all the new rules for it.

633
00:35:57.559 --> 00:35:58.400
<v Speaker 6>So I kind of had to.

634
00:35:58.320 --> 00:35:59.920
<v Speaker 7>Walk that line up, like it has to be recognizable

635
00:36:00.159 --> 00:36:02.480
<v Speaker 7>readers who do come from this world and are going

636
00:36:02.519 --> 00:36:05.159
<v Speaker 7>to have certain expectations, But also I wanted to play

637
00:36:05.159 --> 00:36:08.239
<v Speaker 7>with like it's not our world, so you know, it's

638
00:36:08.280 --> 00:36:11.400
<v Speaker 7>maybe not entirely fair to the characters to expect them

639
00:36:11.400 --> 00:36:14.920
<v Speaker 7>to behave in the way that you know, to people

640
00:36:15.039 --> 00:36:18.320
<v Speaker 7>might in in our society.

641
00:36:18.559 --> 00:36:22.079
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, okay, I get that. I mean if you're

642
00:36:22.119 --> 00:36:24.320
<v Speaker 2>going to create a fantasy world, then you know, like

643
00:36:24.480 --> 00:36:26.760
<v Speaker 2>by all means break all the rules.

644
00:36:27.079 --> 00:36:29.760
<v Speaker 7>Yeah, which is to say that a book to Polly

645
00:36:29.800 --> 00:36:31.000
<v Speaker 7>Emory also gets explored.

646
00:36:31.079 --> 00:36:33.119
<v Speaker 6>So there's there's all sorts of them.

647
00:36:33.960 --> 00:36:36.480
<v Speaker 2>Really did I did notice that It's a shame that

648
00:36:36.519 --> 00:36:39.079
<v Speaker 2>my my wife isn't able to get back into their

649
00:36:39.159 --> 00:36:42.119
<v Speaker 2>quirining because this is this is up her alley. But

650
00:36:42.480 --> 00:36:49.599
<v Speaker 2>there is some how do I put this like gender

651
00:36:49.880 --> 00:36:56.440
<v Speaker 2>identity love thing because one professor, the one that gets

652
00:36:56.480 --> 00:37:02.000
<v Speaker 2>a verbal beating on around around or at chapter ten,

653
00:37:02.119 --> 00:37:07.880
<v Speaker 2>like where I left off, goes by by they I've

654
00:37:07.960 --> 00:37:11.880
<v Speaker 2>seen it a few more times. And is that something

655
00:37:11.920 --> 00:37:14.360
<v Speaker 2>that you purposefully have written?

656
00:37:15.000 --> 00:37:16.239
<v Speaker 6>Yes, they are, I.

657
00:37:16.159 --> 00:37:18.800
<v Speaker 7>Think again, because it is a fantasy world. I was

658
00:37:18.880 --> 00:37:21.079
<v Speaker 7>very interested in making a world that where gender is

659
00:37:21.079 --> 00:37:24.239
<v Speaker 7>a little bit more fluid. They use in this world,

660
00:37:24.679 --> 00:37:26.920
<v Speaker 7>you know, a plethora of there's a plethora of gender

661
00:37:26.960 --> 00:37:29.920
<v Speaker 7>identities and pronouns that are used. So there are characters

662
00:37:29.960 --> 00:37:33.280
<v Speaker 7>that explore that in this world, or I guess represent that.

663
00:37:33.159 --> 00:37:33.840
<v Speaker 6>But I don't know.

664
00:37:33.880 --> 00:37:35.920
<v Speaker 7>I explore might not be the best word because I

665
00:37:35.920 --> 00:37:40.679
<v Speaker 7>don't go into that necessarily as a storytelling aspect, But

666
00:37:40.960 --> 00:37:44.679
<v Speaker 7>they are you know, fully slush out characters that kind

667
00:37:44.719 --> 00:37:48.599
<v Speaker 7>of just exist and do their thing. But yes, a

668
00:37:48.679 --> 00:37:53.360
<v Speaker 7>gender is gender and sexuality both are very, I guess,

669
00:37:53.559 --> 00:37:56.079
<v Speaker 7>very different from in our society, at least in how

670
00:37:56.079 --> 00:37:58.840
<v Speaker 7>we kind of have the the dichotomy and the binary

671
00:37:59.159 --> 00:38:00.719
<v Speaker 7>that we adhere to a lot of the time.

672
00:38:00.719 --> 00:38:01.880
<v Speaker 6>They don't necessarily have to.

673
00:38:02.199 --> 00:38:05.239
<v Speaker 7>Because it is a fantasy world, and it's my fantasy world,

674
00:38:05.239 --> 00:38:07.480
<v Speaker 7>and I'm a queer woman, so I wanted to make

675
00:38:07.519 --> 00:38:10.880
<v Speaker 7>a very queer friendly world where people have magic and

676
00:38:11.000 --> 00:38:14.800
<v Speaker 7>people are just people in all shapes and sizes and pronouns,

677
00:38:14.800 --> 00:38:18.000
<v Speaker 7>and are just you know, getting up to mischief and

678
00:38:18.039 --> 00:38:19.199
<v Speaker 7>mayhem and magic as.

679
00:38:19.039 --> 00:38:20.559
<v Speaker 2>They are the best triple.

680
00:38:20.599 --> 00:38:22.599
<v Speaker 8>And there is mischief, mayhem and magic.

681
00:38:25.039 --> 00:38:28.239
<v Speaker 2>No, I mean I do. I do like that, And

682
00:38:28.280 --> 00:38:30.480
<v Speaker 2>I guess what I like most about it is how

683
00:38:31.239 --> 00:38:34.840
<v Speaker 2>casual you have written it in and because nowadays, in

684
00:38:36.159 --> 00:38:39.239
<v Speaker 2>you know, regular society, Gosh, I do wish I could

685
00:38:40.000 --> 00:38:45.480
<v Speaker 2>just live in those books sometimes there's so much fuss

686
00:38:46.320 --> 00:38:49.679
<v Speaker 2>about it, or at least online. I don't know how

687
00:38:49.719 --> 00:38:52.360
<v Speaker 2>that is in the real world, if you know, and

688
00:38:53.519 --> 00:38:56.960
<v Speaker 2>you know it comes with I'm Dutch and I know

689
00:38:57.039 --> 00:39:00.760
<v Speaker 2>that here it does live but not as much as

690
00:39:00.760 --> 00:39:03.239
<v Speaker 2>it seems to be in the States. So it's very,

691
00:39:05.199 --> 00:39:09.199
<v Speaker 2>I want to say, very refreshing, how casual you are

692
00:39:09.639 --> 00:39:12.880
<v Speaker 2>about it, Like you're not making a big deal about it.

693
00:39:12.880 --> 00:39:17.519
<v Speaker 2>It's like, yeah, they are, they're them, They're a you know,

694
00:39:17.599 --> 00:39:20.599
<v Speaker 2>a character in this book, who are you know? Who

695
00:39:20.679 --> 00:39:24.840
<v Speaker 2>do magic? And that's that's really It's like it's it's

696
00:39:25.559 --> 00:39:29.559
<v Speaker 2>part of them, but it's not like the main thing.

697
00:39:29.639 --> 00:39:33.039
<v Speaker 2>And I do find it very refreshing. I gotta saying,

698
00:39:33.079 --> 00:39:36.239
<v Speaker 2>you know, from all the buha and fuzz that everybody

699
00:39:36.239 --> 00:39:39.719
<v Speaker 2>always makes about it, it's just like, yeah, this and

700
00:39:40.239 --> 00:39:42.840
<v Speaker 2>that's it, but that's not what it's about, right.

701
00:39:42.840 --> 00:39:44.880
<v Speaker 7>And I think part of the reason that that's not

702
00:39:44.920 --> 00:39:47.039
<v Speaker 7>what the story is about is because I am a

703
00:39:47.039 --> 00:39:48.920
<v Speaker 7>cis gender woman. So I don't really feel like that's

704
00:39:48.920 --> 00:39:51.199
<v Speaker 7>my story to tell, to like go in and delve

705
00:39:51.239 --> 00:39:54.800
<v Speaker 7>into the nuance of those topics, because that's just that's

706
00:39:54.840 --> 00:39:57.920
<v Speaker 7>not my personal reality. And I wouldn't want to take

707
00:39:57.960 --> 00:40:00.679
<v Speaker 7>those stories away from the people who have them as

708
00:40:00.719 --> 00:40:04.320
<v Speaker 7>their lived experience. But obviously people, as I said, of

709
00:40:04.360 --> 00:40:07.320
<v Speaker 7>all you know, shapes and sizes exist in our world,

710
00:40:07.320 --> 00:40:07.880
<v Speaker 7>and I think.

711
00:40:07.760 --> 00:40:10.360
<v Speaker 6>They should exist in fantasy.

712
00:40:09.920 --> 00:40:12.239
<v Speaker 7>Too, and you know, they have their own stories and

713
00:40:12.239 --> 00:40:15.079
<v Speaker 7>they have their own wants and desires and motivations, and

714
00:40:15.360 --> 00:40:18.000
<v Speaker 7>so that was kind of as I was building characters,

715
00:40:18.039 --> 00:40:20.960
<v Speaker 7>it was just very natural. I think also because another

716
00:40:20.960 --> 00:40:23.039
<v Speaker 7>reason that it isn't necessarily a huge focal point in

717
00:40:23.079 --> 00:40:25.119
<v Speaker 7>the story is because in this world gender is so

718
00:40:25.199 --> 00:40:27.360
<v Speaker 7>fluid and it's just an accepted thing. So there's not

719
00:40:27.519 --> 00:40:30.719
<v Speaker 7>really there's never really going to be a big hella

720
00:40:30.800 --> 00:40:33.280
<v Speaker 7>baloo made out of it because in that world, or

721
00:40:33.280 --> 00:40:35.719
<v Speaker 7>somebody is like, oh, these are my pronouns. That's just

722
00:40:35.760 --> 00:40:38.119
<v Speaker 7>what people use. There's no there's no like, oh but

723
00:40:38.199 --> 00:40:41.440
<v Speaker 7>what about this, Like everybody is just kind of comfortable

724
00:40:41.480 --> 00:40:43.559
<v Speaker 7>and aware and we'll just roll with it like that's

725
00:40:43.719 --> 00:40:47.920
<v Speaker 7>that's a big part of their culture or just in

726
00:40:47.960 --> 00:40:50.880
<v Speaker 7>general in this world. So yeah, I was as I

727
00:40:50.960 --> 00:40:53.639
<v Speaker 7>was making the characters, that was something that just I

728
00:40:53.719 --> 00:40:57.079
<v Speaker 7>kind of went with what felt most natural for each character,

729
00:40:57.199 --> 00:40:59.199
<v Speaker 7>and you know, so there it is. It is very

730
00:40:59.239 --> 00:41:02.480
<v Speaker 7>casual for I think a lot of reasons because I

731
00:41:02.599 --> 00:41:05.800
<v Speaker 7>just and I think it's also good for people to

732
00:41:05.840 --> 00:41:09.039
<v Speaker 7>get representations sometimes that is just showing people living their

733
00:41:09.079 --> 00:41:15.039
<v Speaker 7>lives like people of various backgrounds and ability and gender identity, sexuality,

734
00:41:15.079 --> 00:41:17.119
<v Speaker 7>like just living their every day lives and that every

735
00:41:17.199 --> 00:41:19.559
<v Speaker 7>day lives might have murder, mysteries and magic, but you

736
00:41:19.599 --> 00:41:22.760
<v Speaker 7>know it is they're just there and they don't have

737
00:41:22.840 --> 00:41:25.360
<v Speaker 7>to you know, be a lesson or be you know,

738
00:41:25.360 --> 00:41:26.639
<v Speaker 7>some beacon of representation.

739
00:41:26.719 --> 00:41:27.960
<v Speaker 6>They can just be people.

740
00:41:28.079 --> 00:41:29.920
<v Speaker 7>And that was kind of what I was trying to

741
00:41:29.960 --> 00:41:34.960
<v Speaker 7>focus on when I was writing them as just people

742
00:41:35.000 --> 00:41:37.880
<v Speaker 7>being people. Yeah, because that is really, at the end

743
00:41:37.920 --> 00:41:39.400
<v Speaker 7>of the day, that is what people are.

744
00:41:39.480 --> 00:41:42.960
<v Speaker 2>So yeah, and it's it's about the story. It's about

745
00:41:43.000 --> 00:41:46.559
<v Speaker 2>the magic. It's about the Avengers. It's not about them.

746
00:41:46.639 --> 00:41:49.280
<v Speaker 2>I mean, yeah, you know they go through those avengers,

747
00:41:49.320 --> 00:41:54.320
<v Speaker 2>they practice the magic, but it's not about them. You

748
00:41:54.400 --> 00:41:57.880
<v Speaker 2>said you were finishing up your second book, second book

749
00:41:57.880 --> 00:42:02.000
<v Speaker 2>in the series. Can you was a little about that

750
00:42:02.159 --> 00:42:04.679
<v Speaker 2>or is it like really no.

751
00:42:04.639 --> 00:42:06.840
<v Speaker 7>It's I can't say too much about it because some

752
00:42:06.880 --> 00:42:09.159
<v Speaker 7>things aren't set in stone yet, so there's a lot

753
00:42:09.159 --> 00:42:11.840
<v Speaker 7>about it that might still change. But it does follow

754
00:42:12.159 --> 00:42:15.679
<v Speaker 7>Rose at another year at Done Hollow, and this time

755
00:42:15.880 --> 00:42:19.079
<v Speaker 7>with a magical tournament taking place. So there's some other

756
00:42:19.199 --> 00:42:21.000
<v Speaker 7>magical schools that come into the picture, and some other

757
00:42:21.079 --> 00:42:23.119
<v Speaker 7>forms of magic that we get to explore through some

758
00:42:23.199 --> 00:42:26.880
<v Speaker 7>new characters, and there are still the ghosts and the

759
00:42:26.880 --> 00:42:29.440
<v Speaker 7>necromancy and a little bit of that horror element as well.

760
00:42:29.880 --> 00:42:32.719
<v Speaker 6>Nice, So that does come back. But beyond that, I.

761
00:42:32.639 --> 00:42:34.519
<v Speaker 7>Don't want to say too much more because I don't

762
00:42:34.559 --> 00:42:36.679
<v Speaker 7>want to spoil the ending for you, Envy.

763
00:42:37.159 --> 00:42:40.000
<v Speaker 6>You know, some of that stuff might change from book one, sorry,

764
00:42:40.000 --> 00:42:42.000
<v Speaker 6>from book two, like from where it is now.

765
00:42:42.000 --> 00:42:43.760
<v Speaker 7>But I will say that it is a little a

766
00:42:43.760 --> 00:42:45.800
<v Speaker 7>little darker and a little sexier than Book one.

767
00:42:46.000 --> 00:42:47.480
<v Speaker 6>Is kind of the vibe for book two.

768
00:42:47.760 --> 00:42:52.440
<v Speaker 2>Okay, so close the blinds and turn off the big lights.

769
00:42:53.039 --> 00:42:55.880
<v Speaker 7>Yeah, my close family is not allowed to read book two.

770
00:42:56.119 --> 00:43:01.320
<v Speaker 8>We'll put it that way, okay, Okay, get a little smutty, okay.

771
00:43:01.440 --> 00:43:01.639
<v Speaker 5>Yeah.

772
00:43:01.719 --> 00:43:03.800
<v Speaker 6>So in the book one it is so this is

773
00:43:04.440 --> 00:43:05.400
<v Speaker 6>adult fantasy.

774
00:43:05.400 --> 00:43:07.480
<v Speaker 7>It's labeled as adult, and book one, I think a

775
00:43:07.480 --> 00:43:09.280
<v Speaker 7>lot of people are look it reads a little bit

776
00:43:09.400 --> 00:43:11.719
<v Speaker 7>ya because they are I mean, they're younger, they're in

777
00:43:11.800 --> 00:43:14.559
<v Speaker 7>college and everything. It earns it's adult rating. In book two,

778
00:43:15.079 --> 00:43:18.159
<v Speaker 7>so that is why the whole series adult.

779
00:43:18.760 --> 00:43:23.119
<v Speaker 8>Okay, yeah, well then I know my wife's gonna love it,

780
00:43:25.519 --> 00:43:28.360
<v Speaker 8>and probably most of my female audience.

781
00:43:28.559 --> 00:43:31.559
<v Speaker 2>I definitely have some friends who are gonna absolutely.

782
00:43:31.400 --> 00:43:34.960
<v Speaker 7>If they're Romanticy fans, they hopefully will be fans of well,

783
00:43:34.960 --> 00:43:38.280
<v Speaker 7>hopefully the whole series, but book two really is geared

784
00:43:38.320 --> 00:43:39.800
<v Speaker 7>more they're Romanticy people.

785
00:43:41.840 --> 00:43:44.920
<v Speaker 2>I'm actually I'm gonna at least send the link to

786
00:43:45.000 --> 00:43:47.559
<v Speaker 2>your book. I'm gonna send it over to my sister.

787
00:43:47.719 --> 00:43:51.519
<v Speaker 2>She's not, like, really a magical practitioner, but she does

788
00:43:51.719 --> 00:43:55.639
<v Speaker 2>love a good story. And I think since she is,

789
00:43:57.880 --> 00:44:02.280
<v Speaker 2>what is she a believe? She doesn't I mean anyway,

790
00:44:02.360 --> 00:44:05.719
<v Speaker 2>she's some sort of sexuality as well. I don't, I don't,

791
00:44:05.840 --> 00:44:07.639
<v Speaker 2>I don't know. She's my sister, I don't. I don't

792
00:44:08.119 --> 00:44:12.039
<v Speaker 2>busy myself with that. But she's very very open minded

793
00:44:12.199 --> 00:44:14.920
<v Speaker 2>and free thoughts, you know, gen Z. Of course, I

794
00:44:15.360 --> 00:44:18.239
<v Speaker 2>do think she'll she'll definitely like it. I mean, I

795
00:44:18.559 --> 00:44:22.119
<v Speaker 2>know my wife is going to absolutely just devour the books.

796
00:44:22.440 --> 00:44:23.320
<v Speaker 6>That's such a compliment.

797
00:44:23.840 --> 00:44:31.320
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. No, absolutely, any plans for like another series, like

798
00:44:31.440 --> 00:44:34.360
<v Speaker 2>are you are you going to make writing your your thing?

799
00:44:34.480 --> 00:44:37.719
<v Speaker 2>Or is she's going to be more of a psychs project?

800
00:44:37.960 --> 00:44:41.079
<v Speaker 7>I mean, hopefully hopefully I can make it work full time,

801
00:44:41.119 --> 00:44:43.639
<v Speaker 7>that would be ideal. I do have plans for I

802
00:44:43.639 --> 00:44:46.599
<v Speaker 7>don't know about future series, but definitely future stories sometimes

803
00:44:46.599 --> 00:44:49.239
<v Speaker 7>set in the same world to explore different parts of

804
00:44:49.400 --> 00:44:52.360
<v Speaker 7>the larger world that dun Hollow is set in, rather

805
00:44:52.400 --> 00:44:55.400
<v Speaker 7>than I think in this book it's a very contained setting.

806
00:44:55.400 --> 00:44:57.320
<v Speaker 6>You're really just at dun Hollow. You don't get to

807
00:44:57.360 --> 00:44:58.360
<v Speaker 6>explore much else.

808
00:44:58.519 --> 00:45:01.280
<v Speaker 7>So I definitely have some thought and story ideas and

809
00:45:01.320 --> 00:45:04.400
<v Speaker 7>plans around that. I do have another project that I've

810
00:45:04.440 --> 00:45:06.800
<v Speaker 7>just started working on now that I've completed my edits,

811
00:45:06.840 --> 00:45:08.840
<v Speaker 7>but I really can't say that much about that one

812
00:45:08.880 --> 00:45:10.639
<v Speaker 7>because it is very very early days.

813
00:45:10.760 --> 00:45:13.480
<v Speaker 6>So yeah, that's definitely there's more in the works. After

814
00:45:13.559 --> 00:45:14.400
<v Speaker 6>I read these stories.

815
00:45:15.760 --> 00:45:20.159
<v Speaker 2>Well, I guess I'll just have to have to keep

816
00:45:20.159 --> 00:45:22.920
<v Speaker 2>an eye on it. So you're the plan is to

817
00:45:23.079 --> 00:45:29.039
<v Speaker 2>really like do more of a world's expansion, because we

818
00:45:29.199 --> 00:45:39.400
<v Speaker 2>do hear about the the other kingdoms, So is it going.

819
00:45:39.320 --> 00:45:40.840
<v Speaker 8>To be like more more worlds?

820
00:45:41.760 --> 00:45:43.800
<v Speaker 6>Yeah, I mean I would love to.

821
00:45:43.880 --> 00:45:46.480
<v Speaker 7>I mean, it really depends on what I'm able to write,

822
00:45:46.519 --> 00:45:49.639
<v Speaker 7>what it is selling in the market at the time,

823
00:45:49.679 --> 00:45:51.639
<v Speaker 7>you know, that kind of thing, So very much depending

824
00:45:51.719 --> 00:45:53.360
<v Speaker 7>on that. But I do have a lot of ideas

825
00:45:53.360 --> 00:45:55.400
<v Speaker 7>that are set in various times throughout the world, so

826
00:45:55.440 --> 00:45:57.920
<v Speaker 7>some of them will There's a lot of little throwaway

827
00:45:57.960 --> 00:46:00.559
<v Speaker 7>lines actually in this book that I tossed in there

828
00:46:00.559 --> 00:46:02.559
<v Speaker 7>because there are other story ideas that I have and

829
00:46:02.599 --> 00:46:06.000
<v Speaker 7>they are meaningless to anybody but meet at this point,

830
00:46:06.079 --> 00:46:07.760
<v Speaker 7>but I would love to explore them more and tell

831
00:46:07.800 --> 00:46:09.920
<v Speaker 7>more stories about that so that it really does feel

832
00:46:09.960 --> 00:46:13.159
<v Speaker 7>like a very interconnected, lived in world that has like

833
00:46:13.199 --> 00:46:15.320
<v Speaker 7>its own history and everything. Because I am a giant

834
00:46:15.360 --> 00:46:18.199
<v Speaker 7>history nerd and a giant language nerd, Like I'm all

835
00:46:18.199 --> 00:46:21.320
<v Speaker 7>about linguistics, so I do have like languages and histories

836
00:46:21.360 --> 00:46:23.599
<v Speaker 7>and cultures and magic systems made up for all of

837
00:46:23.599 --> 00:46:25.199
<v Speaker 7>these different places in the world, and.

838
00:46:25.239 --> 00:46:27.320
<v Speaker 6>I may or may not, you know, get to explore

839
00:46:27.360 --> 00:46:28.840
<v Speaker 6>those so hopefully fingers crossed.

840
00:46:29.320 --> 00:46:33.360
<v Speaker 2>Oh so you have the world like build already, you

841
00:46:33.519 --> 00:46:35.679
<v Speaker 2>just have to get it down on paper.

842
00:46:36.199 --> 00:46:39.199
<v Speaker 6>Yeah, the ideas stage. I'm great at the ideas stage.

843
00:46:39.199 --> 00:46:42.360
<v Speaker 7>It's the drafting and editing and actually getting a book

844
00:46:42.360 --> 00:46:44.960
<v Speaker 7>written that well, we'll have to see about. But yes, yeah,

845
00:46:45.000 --> 00:46:47.760
<v Speaker 7>there's there's a whole there's a whole world to explore

846
00:46:47.880 --> 00:46:49.880
<v Speaker 7>in the larger setting of this book.

847
00:46:50.719 --> 00:46:54.480
<v Speaker 2>Awesome. Well, I am very much looking forward to finishing

848
00:46:54.480 --> 00:46:56.360
<v Speaker 2>the book. I think you do.

849
00:46:56.440 --> 00:47:00.800
<v Speaker 8>I don't really have any plans for tomorrow.

850
00:47:01.280 --> 00:47:09.159
<v Speaker 2>So yeah, if I don't finish the book by tonight already, well, if.

851
00:47:09.039 --> 00:47:10.599
<v Speaker 6>You do finish it by tonight, I will take that

852
00:47:10.599 --> 00:47:11.519
<v Speaker 6>as a huge compliment.

853
00:47:12.880 --> 00:47:17.679
<v Speaker 2>I mean, I'm a chapter ten. Looking at the pages,

854
00:47:17.719 --> 00:47:22.599
<v Speaker 2>I believe I'm on about a third. So yes, the.

855
00:47:22.519 --> 00:47:24.239
<v Speaker 6>First half of the book is much longer than the

856
00:47:24.239 --> 00:47:24.760
<v Speaker 6>second half.

857
00:47:24.800 --> 00:47:29.000
<v Speaker 7>So once you hit I think click page, the chapters

858
00:47:29.039 --> 00:47:30.840
<v Speaker 7>get a lot shorter. There's a lot more packed into

859
00:47:33.280 --> 00:47:34.880
<v Speaker 7>You're through the longest part already.

860
00:47:34.880 --> 00:47:40.119
<v Speaker 2>I think I did notice that in the first couple

861
00:47:40.119 --> 00:47:43.320
<v Speaker 2>of chapters are really setting the scene and kind of

862
00:47:43.599 --> 00:47:47.679
<v Speaker 2>building up the characters and the relations between the characters,

863
00:47:47.719 --> 00:47:51.320
<v Speaker 2>setting up the spooky ghost the gross stuff.

864
00:47:51.920 --> 00:47:57.039
<v Speaker 7>Really yeah, the ghosts are probably way spookier than they

865
00:47:57.079 --> 00:47:59.800
<v Speaker 7>need it to be, like Bay, grosser than they needed.

866
00:48:00.280 --> 00:48:02.199
<v Speaker 6>But I had a lot of fun writing the scenes.

867
00:48:03.199 --> 00:48:06.400
<v Speaker 2>Oh I bet, I bet, I'm actually streaming this life.

868
00:48:06.440 --> 00:48:09.199
<v Speaker 2>I wasn't intending on doing this life, but I really

869
00:48:09.239 --> 00:48:12.679
<v Speaker 2>got a got the question in the in the chat,

870
00:48:12.840 --> 00:48:17.760
<v Speaker 2>where can we find your book or books? With time?

871
00:48:18.679 --> 00:48:22.039
<v Speaker 7>So I do have a website that should have all

872
00:48:22.079 --> 00:48:25.199
<v Speaker 7>of the links updated hopefully. Also, I'm so the website

873
00:48:25.280 --> 00:48:27.119
<v Speaker 7>is Emma McDonald author dot com.

874
00:48:27.159 --> 00:48:29.719
<v Speaker 6>And then I'm also on.

875
00:48:28.960 --> 00:48:35.280
<v Speaker 7>Instagram under I think it's I'm a McDonald underscore author actually,

876
00:48:35.320 --> 00:48:38.039
<v Speaker 7>and that has ma link tree with all of the

877
00:48:38.079 --> 00:48:40.119
<v Speaker 7>links in various places that you can buy the books

878
00:48:40.360 --> 00:48:42.800
<v Speaker 7>depending on what country and region you're in and where

879
00:48:42.800 --> 00:48:43.639
<v Speaker 7>it might be available.

880
00:48:43.960 --> 00:48:47.679
<v Speaker 2>So yeah, I mean, I was fortunate enough to get

881
00:48:47.719 --> 00:48:51.760
<v Speaker 2>a copy in in my email. But it's it's it's

882
00:48:51.800 --> 00:48:55.800
<v Speaker 2>worth it's so for that is am I McDonald's author

883
00:48:56.320 --> 00:48:59.800
<v Speaker 2>dot com. Yes, awesome, And.

884
00:48:59.760 --> 00:49:04.119
<v Speaker 7>That's an AC for McDonald because sometimes people spell it mc.

885
00:49:04.199 --> 00:49:08.280
<v Speaker 2>So yeah, yeah, I mean Americans, you know, that's the

886
00:49:08.320 --> 00:49:09.480
<v Speaker 2>only McDonald that they know.

887
00:49:10.000 --> 00:49:10.400
<v Speaker 6>That's true.

888
00:49:10.480 --> 00:49:12.119
<v Speaker 7>Yeah, I get I feel like I did that a

889
00:49:12.159 --> 00:49:14.679
<v Speaker 7>lot because I'm in the States and people are always

890
00:49:14.800 --> 00:49:15.360
<v Speaker 7>misspll it.

891
00:49:15.400 --> 00:49:17.800
<v Speaker 8>So that might just beive me think awesome, Well I am.

892
00:49:17.960 --> 00:49:20.519
<v Speaker 2>I'm definitely going to keep an I out, definitely going

893
00:49:20.599 --> 00:49:26.079
<v Speaker 2>to finish book one. Any idea of when you're gonna

894
00:49:26.079 --> 00:49:28.880
<v Speaker 2>be publishing book two. I know you're like you're still

895
00:49:28.880 --> 00:49:32.599
<v Speaker 2>in the editing phase, which is the siest face of all.

896
00:49:33.280 --> 00:49:34.559
<v Speaker 6>Yeah, it's not fun.

897
00:49:34.840 --> 00:49:36.920
<v Speaker 7>I think I don't have an exact day, but I

898
00:49:36.960 --> 00:49:39.440
<v Speaker 7>believe the goal is to have it out by October

899
00:49:39.480 --> 00:49:42.320
<v Speaker 7>of twenty twenty five, so first one year after book

900
00:49:42.320 --> 00:49:46.239
<v Speaker 7>one came out, so I think sometime just in time

901
00:49:46.280 --> 00:49:47.480
<v Speaker 7>for Halloween next year.

902
00:49:47.559 --> 00:49:48.599
<v Speaker 6>I guess this is what I would say.

903
00:49:49.159 --> 00:49:51.679
<v Speaker 2>Of course. Of course, that was a question that I

904
00:49:51.719 --> 00:49:54.840
<v Speaker 2>had in my mind, like did you specifically pick October?

905
00:49:55.159 --> 00:49:57.920
<v Speaker 7>That was not me, That was the publisher and the

906
00:49:57.960 --> 00:49:59.960
<v Speaker 7>marketing team decided when it was going to be published.

907
00:50:00.039 --> 00:50:03.599
<v Speaker 7>So I think they probably figured witchy spooky story a

908
00:50:03.639 --> 00:50:06.000
<v Speaker 7>perfect time for Halloween. So that wasn't my choice, but

909
00:50:06.480 --> 00:50:08.559
<v Speaker 7>I think that was an intentional choice.

910
00:50:09.119 --> 00:50:11.480
<v Speaker 2>I mean they yeah, they did.

911
00:50:11.559 --> 00:50:14.519
<v Speaker 8>They did right, They did catch the vibe. Yeah, So

912
00:50:15.119 --> 00:50:18.360
<v Speaker 8>is there anything that you wanted to tell us?

913
00:50:18.400 --> 00:50:21.440
<v Speaker 2>Anything that I should have asked?

914
00:50:21.760 --> 00:50:26.840
<v Speaker 6>Maybe that's a loaded question. I can't think of anything

915
00:50:26.840 --> 00:50:27.679
<v Speaker 6>off the top of my head.

916
00:50:27.679 --> 00:50:31.440
<v Speaker 7>I feel like we've covered all things witchy and writing

917
00:50:31.519 --> 00:50:32.719
<v Speaker 7>processes and.

918
00:50:33.519 --> 00:50:36.320
<v Speaker 6>Books one and two. I feel like that covers all

919
00:50:36.320 --> 00:50:36.960
<v Speaker 6>the big things.

920
00:50:37.000 --> 00:50:37.280
<v Speaker 5>Really.

921
00:50:38.920 --> 00:50:43.000
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean once you're once book two is published,

922
00:50:43.000 --> 00:50:45.880
<v Speaker 2>you are of course more than welcome to come back on.

923
00:50:46.239 --> 00:50:50.760
<v Speaker 2>I would love to also promote your your book and hopefully,

924
00:50:50.840 --> 00:50:55.000
<v Speaker 2>you know, turning into a series, and I'm actually reading

925
00:50:55.880 --> 00:50:59.159
<v Speaker 2>like kind of a girly book. You know. Also how

926
00:50:59.239 --> 00:51:03.440
<v Speaker 2>you described Wren, it's like every girl's every girl's dream,

927
00:51:03.760 --> 00:51:07.800
<v Speaker 2>you know, Carrie, just you know, handsome and every girl

928
00:51:07.920 --> 00:51:11.159
<v Speaker 2>wants him, and every guy wants to be him, and it's.

929
00:51:11.880 --> 00:51:14.039
<v Speaker 6>All the guys want him to everybody wants.

930
00:51:15.280 --> 00:51:18.800
<v Speaker 2>I mean, the way you describe him, I can't blame them.

931
00:51:19.559 --> 00:51:23.039
<v Speaker 2>I really can't blame them, and I'm I'm astray, dude,

932
00:51:23.079 --> 00:51:25.159
<v Speaker 2>but even I'm like, Okay.

933
00:51:24.280 --> 00:51:25.840
<v Speaker 8>I get it, I get it.

934
00:51:25.960 --> 00:51:27.119
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, for sure, No.

935
00:51:27.280 --> 00:51:27.719
<v Speaker 5>This was.

936
00:51:29.320 --> 00:51:31.559
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, this was great. I'm gonna get right back to reading.

937
00:51:31.599 --> 00:51:34.159
<v Speaker 6>I have to no greater compliment than that.

938
00:51:35.119 --> 00:51:36.800
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I know for sure. I still have to do

939
00:51:36.880 --> 00:51:39.679
<v Speaker 2>another another life stream and room room reading with you

940
00:51:41.599 --> 00:51:45.159
<v Speaker 2>in a moment, but after that's straight reading. I'm keeping

941
00:51:45.239 --> 00:51:47.880
<v Speaker 2>my phone on side, and then it's gonna I'm just

942
00:51:47.880 --> 00:51:49.800
<v Speaker 2>gonna say, I'm gonna ignore the wife. But I shouldn't

943
00:51:49.800 --> 00:51:52.840
<v Speaker 2>be doing that. Maybe I don't go that far invoke

944
00:51:52.920 --> 00:51:55.559
<v Speaker 2>the wrath of the fire. Fay. No, thank you, yeah, no,

945
00:51:55.679 --> 00:51:58.480
<v Speaker 2>so thank you very much for coming on. This was

946
00:51:58.639 --> 00:52:04.119
<v Speaker 2>great having Yeah, which you writer, there are too few

947
00:52:04.159 --> 00:52:04.519
<v Speaker 2>of those.

948
00:52:04.960 --> 00:52:07.320
<v Speaker 7>Well, hopefully there'll be more of us in the future.

949
00:52:07.480 --> 00:52:09.400
<v Speaker 7>If that's john revis it gets more.

950
00:52:09.239 --> 00:52:12.800
<v Speaker 8>Popular, well you're setting a bar, that is, that is

951
00:52:12.840 --> 00:52:13.280
<v Speaker 8>for sure.

952
00:52:13.679 --> 00:52:14.079
<v Speaker 5>Thank you?

953
00:52:14.719 --> 00:52:17.440
<v Speaker 8>Yeah, no, absolutely absolutely.

954
00:52:16.960 --> 00:52:19.760
<v Speaker 2>And yeah for everyone who has been watching. For everyone

955
00:52:19.800 --> 00:52:23.239
<v Speaker 2>who has been listening, thank you so much. Do visit

956
00:52:23.320 --> 00:52:28.519
<v Speaker 2>her website Emma McDonald author dot com. And it was

957
00:52:28.599 --> 00:52:32.559
<v Speaker 2>Emma McDonald underscore author on Instagram.

958
00:52:32.639 --> 00:52:34.880
<v Speaker 6>Yes, I can confirm that for you quickly.

959
00:52:34.960 --> 00:52:36.519
<v Speaker 7>I feel like I should know that off the top

960
00:52:36.559 --> 00:52:38.599
<v Speaker 7>of my head, but unfortunately I do know.

961
00:52:38.960 --> 00:52:39.639
<v Speaker 5>It is. Yeah, m A.

962
00:52:39.679 --> 00:52:43.840
<v Speaker 7>McDonald underscore author on Instagram and that has all of

963
00:52:43.920 --> 00:52:46.519
<v Speaker 7>the links listed in my bio for anybody interested.

964
00:52:48.880 --> 00:52:51.960
<v Speaker 2>Yes, I found you. I'm gonna follow right away. So

965
00:52:52.239 --> 00:52:54.280
<v Speaker 2>why am I reading these kind of books? And I

966
00:52:54.440 --> 00:52:56.880
<v Speaker 2>actually I'm actually liking it. I keep surprising this though.

967
00:52:57.039 --> 00:52:59.760
<v Speaker 2>Yeah again, thank you everyone for more than we do

968
00:52:59.840 --> 00:53:02.400
<v Speaker 2>with the Gray Armed Pagans and The Grand Pagans Podcast.

969
00:53:02.440 --> 00:53:05.679
<v Speaker 2>Go to our website ww dot Grey Armed Pagans dot com.

970
00:53:05.760 --> 00:53:09.079
<v Speaker 2>Don't forget to like, share, subscribe, leave something nice in

971
00:53:09.119 --> 00:53:11.880
<v Speaker 2>the comments, you know, do it of your own world

972
00:53:11.880 --> 00:53:14.280
<v Speaker 2>building in the comments, because why not, you know, or

973
00:53:14.360 --> 00:53:15.760
<v Speaker 2>if you they can say what.

974
00:53:15.880 --> 00:53:17.559
<v Speaker 7>School they'd like to go onto. There is actually a

975
00:53:17.639 --> 00:53:22.199
<v Speaker 7>quiz for that as well. Yeah, I actually will put

976
00:53:22.199 --> 00:53:24.400
<v Speaker 7>that in my like tree so people can access that

977
00:53:24.480 --> 00:53:25.199
<v Speaker 7>if they would like to.

978
00:53:25.400 --> 00:53:26.719
<v Speaker 6>There is a quiz you can find out where you

979
00:53:26.760 --> 00:53:27.800
<v Speaker 6>would land Dunholm.

980
00:53:28.960 --> 00:53:30.519
<v Speaker 2>Well, I know my wife is going to take that

981
00:53:30.559 --> 00:53:33.440
<v Speaker 2>quick right away because she can't stop taking those Harry

982
00:53:33.480 --> 00:53:40.800
<v Speaker 2>Potter quizes. I do love her, but sometimes anyway. Yeah,

983
00:53:40.920 --> 00:53:43.760
<v Speaker 2>thank you again. I'm definitely going to finish the book.

984
00:53:43.800 --> 00:53:48.760
<v Speaker 2>I am looking forward to part two already, even though

985
00:53:48.760 --> 00:53:54.719
<v Speaker 2>I haven't finished this one. Yeah, when you actually finished one, yeah,

986
00:53:54.800 --> 00:53:55.960
<v Speaker 2>I'll definitely.

987
00:53:56.000 --> 00:53:58.679
<v Speaker 8>I'll leave it like a review. Can I do that

988
00:53:58.719 --> 00:54:00.000
<v Speaker 8>on your website as well?

989
00:54:01.320 --> 00:54:03.360
<v Speaker 6>Leave on good Reads or story graph? I don't know

990
00:54:03.400 --> 00:54:05.480
<v Speaker 6>what you prefer to use. I just love to get

991
00:54:05.480 --> 00:54:06.159
<v Speaker 6>a review there.

992
00:54:07.159 --> 00:54:09.719
<v Speaker 2>I should have an account on good Reads, so I

993
00:54:09.719 --> 00:54:13.119
<v Speaker 2>think that's most easiest, awesome. No, when I have finished

994
00:54:13.119 --> 00:54:18.199
<v Speaker 2>it by tomorrow morning, I I'm probably gonna have to

995
00:54:19.000 --> 00:54:21.800
<v Speaker 2>have it sync in a bit first because it's I mean,

996
00:54:22.599 --> 00:54:26.000
<v Speaker 2>I'm getting there even chapter tens like things are you know,

997
00:54:26.079 --> 00:54:31.840
<v Speaker 2>we're getting there. Yeah, thank you all so much again.

998
00:54:32.119 --> 00:54:36.199
<v Speaker 2>This has been an amazing and I am. Yeah. I'm

999
00:54:36.239 --> 00:54:38.559
<v Speaker 2>looking forward to having you on again when you have

1000
00:54:38.639 --> 00:54:45.400
<v Speaker 2>finished part two. So until then, everyone, Yeah, have a

1001
00:54:45.400 --> 00:54:47.920
<v Speaker 2>good evening, have a good day, have a good wherever

1002
00:54:48.320 --> 00:54:50.760
<v Speaker 2>you are, whatever you are, and I will catch you

1003
00:54:50.800 --> 00:54:52.239
<v Speaker 2>all next time. Bye bye.

1004
00:55:04.920 --> 00:55:09.960
<v Speaker 4>This was yet another amazing episode of the Greyhorn Pagans podcast.

1005
00:55:10.320 --> 00:55:11.920
<v Speaker 4>We thank you all for watching.

1006
00:55:12.039 --> 00:55:13.880
<v Speaker 2>We thank you all for listening.

1007
00:55:15.079 --> 00:55:19.519
<v Speaker 4>Remember to like, share, subscribe, and hit that notification bell

1008
00:55:19.679 --> 00:55:22.000
<v Speaker 4>so you will be notified whenever we.

1009
00:55:21.920 --> 00:55:23.039
<v Speaker 6>Upload something new.

1010
00:55:23.920 --> 00:55:28.000
<v Speaker 4>Support us on Patreon for early access and for everything

1011
00:55:28.039 --> 00:55:30.280
<v Speaker 4>else that we do with the tribe. For everything else

1012
00:55:30.480 --> 00:55:34.480
<v Speaker 4>that we do with the podcast, find us on www

1013
00:55:34.960 --> 00:55:36.840
<v Speaker 4>pagans dot com.

1014
00:55:36.960 --> 00:55:39.679
<v Speaker 6>For now, we thank you, and until next time,