WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.400 --> 00:00:02.399 Drivers know what trouble sounds like. 2 00:00:02.879 --> 00:00:10.199 No, no, okay forward, oh no. 3 00:00:09.359 --> 00:00:13.880 No, please no, that's why they get covered from Ireland's 4 00:00:13.919 --> 00:00:16.920 soundest car insurance provider, Supervalue Insurance. 5 00:00:17.199 --> 00:00:19.519 Thanks for calling us fin and don't pat yourself up 6 00:00:19.519 --> 00:00:22.359 about it. Sure, I'm driving ten years and parallel parking 7 00:00:22.399 --> 00:00:23.280 still battles me. 8 00:00:24.160 --> 00:00:26.760 Get a quote from Supervalue Car Insurance to get ten 9 00:00:26.800 --> 00:00:28.480 percent off online. 10 00:00:28.039 --> 00:00:31.160 And we'll even throw in forty euroin vouchers. Teasncy's apply 11 00:00:31.239 --> 00:00:33.920 vouchers include two twenty euro or forty eurospent. This car 12 00:00:33.920 --> 00:00:36.960 insurance is underwritten by AX Insurance, Deack, Supervalue Financial Services, 13 00:00:36.960 --> 00:00:39.280 Stack Trading and Supervalue Insurance is regulated by the Central 14 00:00:39.320 --> 00:00:39.920 Bank of Ireland. 15 00:00:40.840 --> 00:00:46.640 Oh hey, it's your two talkative petticab driver who eerily 16 00:00:46.759 --> 00:00:51.439 guessed your astrological sign. It's Ali Ward back with another 17 00:00:51.640 --> 00:00:55.119 fresh as hell episode of Ologies. This is the quickest 18 00:00:55.119 --> 00:00:57.920 turnaround ever in the history of the show ever, and 19 00:00:58.399 --> 00:01:01.240 I guess, given its oceanic I like to think of 20 00:01:01.280 --> 00:01:04.400 it as some treasure that washed up on the beach, 21 00:01:04.560 --> 00:01:08.200 delivered to your senses while it's still shimmering with sea 22 00:01:08.239 --> 00:01:11.719 froth before it starts to stink. Now I have been 23 00:01:12.079 --> 00:01:16.280 tracking this ologist for months and he was always off 24 00:01:16.400 --> 00:01:20.040 on expeditions in remote corners of the Earth being awesome. 25 00:01:20.519 --> 00:01:25.640 And we had an appointment to talk sharks last Friday, 26 00:01:25.920 --> 00:01:29.719 and then I realized, boy howdy, this week is shark week. 27 00:01:29.799 --> 00:01:33.200 This is perfect timing. I don't mean shark week like anything, Uterine, 28 00:01:33.239 --> 00:01:37.480 It's actually Shark Week on Discovery and Natchio has a 29 00:01:37.519 --> 00:01:40.040 Shark week. And then he had to cancel because of 30 00:01:40.040 --> 00:01:42.200 work stuff. It's fair enough, but then he said he 31 00:01:42.239 --> 00:01:45.319 could record just hours before I got on a plane. 32 00:01:45.439 --> 00:01:47.799 So I drove my ass Giddaly down to Long Beach 33 00:01:47.840 --> 00:01:50.239 and I hung out in his lab and I'm now 34 00:01:50.319 --> 00:01:53.840 back home. I'm turning around asides. I'm having the amazing 35 00:01:53.879 --> 00:01:57.480 Stephen Ray Morris edit this in probably a red Bull 36 00:01:57.599 --> 00:02:01.719 induced mania. Honestly, we couldn't be happier about it. It's 37 00:02:01.840 --> 00:02:04.680 very exciting. But before we get to the episode, some thanks, 38 00:02:04.840 --> 00:02:08.159 and some please and some thanks again. So first off, 39 00:02:08.560 --> 00:02:11.800 thanks to the patrons for making this whole show happen 40 00:02:11.960 --> 00:02:15.280 pretty much. At patreon dot com slash ologies, you can 41 00:02:15.319 --> 00:02:18.000 be a member of the club that knows what episodes 42 00:02:18.000 --> 00:02:21.439 are coming up next and submits questions to the ologists 43 00:02:21.919 --> 00:02:24.800 and sees behind the scenes photos from their labs. And 44 00:02:24.879 --> 00:02:28.960 also you help keep the pod free and available to all. 45 00:02:29.639 --> 00:02:34.240 You can also support by putting Ologies on your human body. 46 00:02:34.520 --> 00:02:37.520 You can go to ologiesmerch dot com and you still 47 00:02:37.520 --> 00:02:39.159 have a few more days to cash in on the 48 00:02:39.280 --> 00:02:42.240 July sale. I was like, let's have a summer sale 49 00:02:42.400 --> 00:02:46.000 ten percent off everything. Your whole dang order with the 50 00:02:46.039 --> 00:02:50.599 code Campologies. There's backpacks and bikinis. You can put Ologies 51 00:02:50.639 --> 00:02:53.240 stuff on your butt. You can also support with no 52 00:02:53.479 --> 00:02:57.879 coin at all. Just by subscribing. You can review or rate, 53 00:02:58.120 --> 00:03:01.879 you can tweet about it, you tell your dentist, whatever. Also, 54 00:03:02.080 --> 00:03:04.919 as you know, I creepily read your reviews and then 55 00:03:04.960 --> 00:03:07.360 I prove it each week by reading you on this 56 00:03:07.479 --> 00:03:10.800 week fantasy Football. Gal says, help, now I have an 57 00:03:10.840 --> 00:03:14.520 Ologies addiction. Guys, I can't stop with this podcast. Send 58 00:03:14.560 --> 00:03:17.240 help or don't, actually please don't and leave me to 59 00:03:17.319 --> 00:03:21.639 keep bathing my mind in Ologies. So nice, so, she 60 00:03:21.680 --> 00:03:24.199 says she got hooked after listening to the two parter 61 00:03:24.360 --> 00:03:28.039 on Fearology, which resulted in a four hour long post 62 00:03:28.080 --> 00:03:31.360 episode discussion on the topic with my mom, herself a psychologist, 63 00:03:31.879 --> 00:03:35.520 and she says, and because this pod normally drops on Monday, 64 00:03:35.680 --> 00:03:38.759 I now actually look forward to everyone's least favorite day 65 00:03:38.800 --> 00:03:43.439 of the week. Technically it drops Monday nine pm Pacific time, 66 00:03:44.120 --> 00:03:46.199 depending on where in the world you are. So thank 67 00:03:46.240 --> 00:03:49.120 you to everyone who left reviews this week. I read 68 00:03:49.120 --> 00:03:51.719 every single one of them. Sometimes they make me cry 69 00:03:51.800 --> 00:03:56.879 because I feel so appreciated. So thank you for that. Okay, 70 00:03:57.039 --> 00:04:00.159 now back to silacka mophology. I know it sounds like 71 00:04:00.199 --> 00:04:02.680 your drunk cousin add a bunch of scrabble letters and 72 00:04:02.800 --> 00:04:04.960 is doing her best to convince everyone that it's a 73 00:04:04.960 --> 00:04:07.520 triple word score, but really it's a term. It's a 74 00:04:07.599 --> 00:04:10.000 rare one, but it exists. So it comes from the 75 00:04:10.039 --> 00:04:14.879 ancient Greek for having the appearance of cartilaginous fish. And 76 00:04:15.120 --> 00:04:16.600 what does it mean. It means we've got a shark 77 00:04:16.639 --> 00:04:19.480 spurt in the house. What a shark expert he is. 78 00:04:19.800 --> 00:04:23.279 So he's been studying sharks for decades. He's appeared on 79 00:04:23.920 --> 00:04:28.199 so many TV shows about sharks it's absurd. And he's 80 00:04:28.240 --> 00:04:31.800 been a marine biology professor at cal State University Long 81 00:04:31.839 --> 00:04:37.160 Beach for twenty years. He's tall, slim, with close cropped hair, 82 00:04:37.279 --> 00:04:40.639 and what I imagine is a perennial tan. He greeted me 83 00:04:40.920 --> 00:04:44.600 this past Sunday today the day I'm recording this, and 84 00:04:44.639 --> 00:04:47.319 he showed me around the Shark Lab. This is a 85 00:04:47.360 --> 00:04:53.879 facility of these gurgling seawater tanks and high tech telemetry devices, cameras, 86 00:04:54.199 --> 00:04:58.120 and suspended in the rafters as a nod to the past, 87 00:04:58.560 --> 00:05:03.759 was a vintage sh shaped submersible. It was amazing. So 88 00:05:03.800 --> 00:05:06.160 we sat down in his tidy office and I asked 89 00:05:06.199 --> 00:05:08.439 him all kinds of stupid shit and he answered with 90 00:05:08.879 --> 00:05:12.839 affable wisdom. So get ready to deep dive into a 91 00:05:12.920 --> 00:05:18.879 world of ancient badasses, eye lasers, behind the scenes, movie trivia, 92 00:05:19.160 --> 00:05:25.600 inside out butts, cannibal twins, Seeming immortality. They're sea kink, 93 00:05:26.439 --> 00:05:32.160 surfer intuition, lottery odds, and your aquatic Many toothed new 94 00:05:32.480 --> 00:05:38.480 role models during this their week Shark Week with selackimorphologist 95 00:05:38.879 --> 00:05:57.279 doctor Chris Lowe. 96 00:05:58.800 --> 00:06:01.839 It's actually the worst sweet. It's great in that we 97 00:06:01.920 --> 00:06:05.639 celebrate sharks. Yeah, just the way we celebrate them is 98 00:06:05.839 --> 00:06:06.879 sometimes not great. 99 00:06:07.199 --> 00:06:10.959 So here's your mic and these are stage mics, so yep, 100 00:06:11.120 --> 00:06:14.600 just got it talking to it, and yeah, thank you 101 00:06:14.639 --> 00:06:18.040 for doing this this week. Of all weeks, is this 102 00:06:18.120 --> 00:06:20.800 your Is this week your nightmare? It's shark week your nightmare. 103 00:06:21.199 --> 00:06:25.480 So I was quoted in an article recently saying shark 104 00:06:25.480 --> 00:06:29.040 wee is like my Christmas. Actually it's more like my Halloween. 105 00:06:32.040 --> 00:06:35.079 So so, so it's great in one way, and that 106 00:06:35.199 --> 00:06:37.839 people are celebrating sharks and they're very excited about sharks, 107 00:06:37.839 --> 00:06:43.399 and that's something that that I find great. However, the 108 00:06:43.480 --> 00:06:47.480 Halloween part comes from the horror that's also partly created 109 00:06:48.040 --> 00:06:51.519 in that same kind of tone. So, you know, it 110 00:06:51.560 --> 00:06:54.839 makes it really difficult to educate people about sharks and 111 00:06:54.879 --> 00:06:58.319 to help dispel some of the myths about them when 112 00:06:58.360 --> 00:07:01.000 we still do a lot of fear mongering in some 113 00:07:01.079 --> 00:07:04.160 of the media. So it's really challenging. I'll give you 114 00:07:04.160 --> 00:07:07.439 an example. So here I am on a Discovery Channel 115 00:07:07.480 --> 00:07:10.319 show talking about why shark conservation is so important and 116 00:07:10.439 --> 00:07:14.079 sharks are vital to the ecosystem and why people need 117 00:07:14.079 --> 00:07:17.399 to protect them, and in the background here did it? 118 00:07:17.439 --> 00:07:17.759 Did it? 119 00:07:18.000 --> 00:07:18.160 Did? 120 00:07:18.279 --> 00:07:18.319 It? 121 00:07:18.680 --> 00:07:22.120 Just doesn't match right? So it comes very frustrating and 122 00:07:22.160 --> 00:07:24.800 a little conflicting for the public to understand. Well, wait 123 00:07:24.839 --> 00:07:28.000 a minute, is it about conservation or are we supposed 124 00:07:28.000 --> 00:07:28.759 to be scared. 125 00:07:29.199 --> 00:07:32.079 And so what made you love sharks so much? What 126 00:07:32.120 --> 00:07:34.560 was the moment where you're like, sharks, I'm on your team. 127 00:07:34.680 --> 00:07:37.079 So you know, as a person who grew up fishing 128 00:07:37.160 --> 00:07:39.839 and loving to fish, and I caught thousands of fish. 129 00:07:41.040 --> 00:07:43.079 The first one I caught, the first shark I caught, 130 00:07:43.199 --> 00:07:46.519 I was like, this is different. There's something about this, 131 00:07:46.160 --> 00:07:48.600 This is very different from all the other fish I'd catch. 132 00:07:49.199 --> 00:07:52.240 And it actually forced me to go to the library. 133 00:07:52.800 --> 00:07:54.360 I was not a good student, I hear to school. 134 00:07:54.560 --> 00:07:57.000 Really, how old were you when you went and started 135 00:07:57.000 --> 00:07:57.480 looking into it? 136 00:07:57.480 --> 00:08:00.519 Probably about nine, really, nine or ten. And then I 137 00:08:00.560 --> 00:08:02.439 went to the library and I remember finding a book 138 00:08:02.480 --> 00:08:04.279 about sharks and trying to figure out what kind of 139 00:08:04.279 --> 00:08:06.160 shark this was. And then I was looking through this 140 00:08:06.199 --> 00:08:08.040 book and I'm like, oh my god, there's all these 141 00:08:08.120 --> 00:08:11.399 cool things about these animals. They're like fish, but they're 142 00:08:11.439 --> 00:08:14.079 a different type of fish. And there was just something 143 00:08:14.360 --> 00:08:16.680 about that that just sucked me in. 144 00:08:17.480 --> 00:08:19.199 Is it crazy to you that you get to do 145 00:08:19.240 --> 00:08:21.040 this for a living, Like you're one of the leading 146 00:08:21.240 --> 00:08:23.759 shark experts in the world, Like do you drop your 147 00:08:23.839 --> 00:08:26.639 name and people are like, oh, oh, doctor Christen. Yeah, 148 00:08:26.680 --> 00:08:29.199 he's legit, Like, is it crazy to you that you're 149 00:08:29.519 --> 00:08:30.279 that dude? Now? 150 00:08:31.199 --> 00:08:34.399 Yes, I have to pinch myself every day. But part 151 00:08:34.440 --> 00:08:36.600 of it is I am so lucky to have the 152 00:08:36.679 --> 00:08:40.080 job that I have. I really am. I absolutely love 153 00:08:40.120 --> 00:08:42.399 what I do and it's not just about the sharks. 154 00:08:42.440 --> 00:08:45.759 It's about teaching other people about sharks and teaching other 155 00:08:45.799 --> 00:08:47.759 people about science and why we do it. 156 00:08:48.120 --> 00:08:50.440 So Doctor Lowe grew up off the coast in New 157 00:08:50.480 --> 00:08:54.879 England in a family of working class, honest, cool fishermen. 158 00:08:55.200 --> 00:08:58.879 He told me his favorite day was Wednesday because it 159 00:08:58.919 --> 00:09:02.000 was a Hamburger night. All other knights were seafood nights, 160 00:09:02.039 --> 00:09:04.080 because that's just what his family did, and that's what 161 00:09:04.120 --> 00:09:06.519 they expected him to do, just be a commercial fisherman 162 00:09:06.759 --> 00:09:10.240 or a carpenter. But he really wanted to study marine biology, 163 00:09:10.360 --> 00:09:12.000 and he became the first person in his family to 164 00:09:12.039 --> 00:09:15.440 graduate college, getting a bachelor's in marine bio in Rhode Island, 165 00:09:15.759 --> 00:09:19.559 a master's in biology in Long Beach, and then his 166 00:09:19.679 --> 00:09:25.159 PhD studying hammerhead sharks in Hawaii, which sounds like something 167 00:09:25.200 --> 00:09:28.200 only the guy in those Dozeki's commercials to do, but 168 00:09:28.279 --> 00:09:31.480 it's a real life and he lived it. Hammerhead sharks 169 00:09:31.519 --> 00:09:36.080 in Hawaii. Okay, and so when it comes to shark outreach, 170 00:09:36.679 --> 00:09:40.279 what do you think is the most important thing that 171 00:09:40.320 --> 00:09:42.720 you do, because that is one thing I feel like 172 00:09:42.799 --> 00:09:44.679 humanity can get behind. It's like, if there is a 173 00:09:44.759 --> 00:09:47.320 villain we can all be scared of and pissed at, 174 00:09:47.440 --> 00:09:49.519 it's gonna be sharks. Like we can't even be mad 175 00:09:49.519 --> 00:09:51.639 at bees anymore. We're like, oh, outside of the breeze. 176 00:09:51.639 --> 00:09:54.720 But no one's like, say the sharks. Everyone's like, let's 177 00:09:54.759 --> 00:09:55.519 kill all of them. 178 00:09:56.039 --> 00:09:58.320 Well, I think it's getting better. Okay, that's an exciting part. 179 00:09:58.399 --> 00:10:00.480 I think things are starting to change. It's just taken 180 00:10:00.960 --> 00:10:03.679 longer than I think many of us would have liked 181 00:10:03.679 --> 00:10:07.440 to see happen. And my best example are whales. Okay, 182 00:10:07.720 --> 00:10:09.559 so one hundred and fifty years ago, if we walked 183 00:10:09.559 --> 00:10:12.799 down like Sampedro, or we walked down New Bedford and 184 00:10:12.840 --> 00:10:15.559 you ask people what kind of animal they thought a 185 00:10:15.600 --> 00:10:18.879 whale was, they would say horrible things. Whales were. There 186 00:10:18.879 --> 00:10:21.919 are demons, there are you know all, they're horrible animals. 187 00:10:21.960 --> 00:10:25.159 They killed people. Moby Dick, right, So you think of 188 00:10:25.159 --> 00:10:26.840 the image portrayed in Mobi Dick. 189 00:10:27.200 --> 00:10:30.159 So if like me, you have not yet gotten around 190 00:10:30.240 --> 00:10:35.320 to reading Herman Melville's classic Moby Dick. It's about this 191 00:10:35.440 --> 00:10:38.159 whale who was real, angry, just a son of a bitch, 192 00:10:38.440 --> 00:10:42.799 And it was based on a real, actual albino whale 193 00:10:43.320 --> 00:10:47.480 by the name of Mocha Dick, who, despite sounding like 194 00:10:47.720 --> 00:10:51.240 your friend's barista ex boyfriend, was in fact a sperm 195 00:10:51.240 --> 00:10:54.720 whale and is said to have been a renown monster 196 00:10:55.080 --> 00:10:59.840 who evaded pursuers, was white as wool, and just crew 197 00:11:00.320 --> 00:11:04.799 the seas with nineteen harpoons hanging off of him like 198 00:11:05.039 --> 00:11:09.279 grass clippings on a sticky thigh. Didn't even notice. Now, 199 00:11:09.399 --> 00:11:12.320 for a long time people were like, get bent whales 200 00:11:12.600 --> 00:11:14.159 and their populations declined. 201 00:11:14.720 --> 00:11:18.279 Okay, so around the seventies, when whale populations were really 202 00:11:18.320 --> 00:11:22.759 in the tank, they got the perfect pr makeover. Whales 203 00:11:22.799 --> 00:11:26.519 went from being these demon evil animals to oh my god, 204 00:11:26.639 --> 00:11:29.639 they're like humans. They have babies, they nurse them, they 205 00:11:29.639 --> 00:11:34.320 have little eyelashes, they're intelligent, social animals. And I thought, 206 00:11:34.320 --> 00:11:36.159 if we can do it for whales, why can't we 207 00:11:36.200 --> 00:11:39.799 do that for sharks. So I think that we're in 208 00:11:39.879 --> 00:11:42.840 that motion, we're heading in that direction. But it's really 209 00:11:42.879 --> 00:11:47.399 difficult when the A lot of the programming still pushes 210 00:11:47.440 --> 00:11:48.120 the fear. 211 00:11:47.879 --> 00:11:51.679 Factor, so discoveries Shark Week, who is in no way 212 00:11:51.679 --> 00:11:55.080 sponsoring the show, has been this cable mainstay for like 213 00:11:55.240 --> 00:11:59.919 thirty years. They have shows like Bloodline, The Spawn of Job, 214 00:12:00.720 --> 00:12:03.639 and even a few years ago ran some docu fiction 215 00:12:04.120 --> 00:12:10.559 aka fake news about the extinct Megalodon shark resurfacing and 216 00:12:10.679 --> 00:12:12.320 later they were like, oh yeah, sorry, that was like 217 00:12:12.559 --> 00:12:15.200 not real, we thought, you know. Natt Geo has also 218 00:12:15.279 --> 00:12:18.480 joined the Blood Fund with two weeks of shark Fest. 219 00:12:18.720 --> 00:12:24.080 They have shows like Shark kill Zone and my personal favorite, 220 00:12:24.279 --> 00:12:28.960 Sharkatrez about the sharks near Alcatraz. Now the point is 221 00:12:29.360 --> 00:12:34.000 whales cute and smart. Sharks are scary, steely eyed murderers. 222 00:12:34.159 --> 00:12:37.720 They're branded is like the sociopaths of the sea. Do 223 00:12:37.759 --> 00:12:40.240 you think that if sharks had eyelids their whole story 224 00:12:40.279 --> 00:12:40.879 would be better? 225 00:12:41.559 --> 00:12:43.960 Well, they do have islids, they do, yeah, of course, 226 00:12:44.000 --> 00:12:46.440 some do. Some do. They're called little nick detating membranes, 227 00:12:46.440 --> 00:12:49.080 and they'll fold them up to protect their eyes. They 228 00:12:49.120 --> 00:12:52.159 just fold the wrong way. So maybe that's it. Maybe 229 00:12:52.200 --> 00:12:55.799 they look too alien to us, But I think that's 230 00:12:56.000 --> 00:12:58.000 only part of it, you know, Like dolphins have the 231 00:12:58.039 --> 00:12:58.799 cute little smile. 232 00:12:59.000 --> 00:12:59.279 Yeah. 233 00:12:59.320 --> 00:13:01.039 You know, if you can only get some sharks with 234 00:13:01.120 --> 00:13:05.559 cute little upturned jaws, maybe that would help. Don't say jaws, 235 00:13:05.879 --> 00:13:09.279 don't say jaws. Yes, but I think, you know, part 236 00:13:09.279 --> 00:13:12.759 of it is being slowly demystified. People are starting to 237 00:13:12.799 --> 00:13:15.759 see sharks as being, you know, just like any other 238 00:13:15.799 --> 00:13:18.039 fish in the ocean, although they have a very different 239 00:13:18.120 --> 00:13:19.360 role than many other fish. 240 00:13:19.559 --> 00:13:22.759 So quick question, is a shark of fish? It is, 241 00:13:23.279 --> 00:13:27.080 but about four hundred million years ago they split off 242 00:13:27.200 --> 00:13:30.159 from bony fish and sharks. Instead of bone, they have 243 00:13:30.279 --> 00:13:35.039 skeleton made of lightweight and springy cartilage. They also don't 244 00:13:35.080 --> 00:13:38.320 have swim bladders for buoyancy, but they use their fins 245 00:13:38.399 --> 00:13:40.440 kind of like airplane wings, and they have these real 246 00:13:40.639 --> 00:13:43.960 fatty oily livers to keep them afloat. And they range 247 00:13:43.960 --> 00:13:47.639 in size from great white sharks more on that name later, 248 00:13:47.879 --> 00:13:50.960 which are like twenty feet in length, to these eighty 249 00:13:51.000 --> 00:13:57.120 bitty eight nine inch dwarf lantern sharks and Panama ghost 250 00:13:57.440 --> 00:14:01.080 cat sharks, which kind of both sound like and d characters. 251 00:14:01.320 --> 00:14:03.639 But the point is they're not all the stuff of 252 00:14:04.000 --> 00:14:05.200 cinematic nightmares. 253 00:14:05.960 --> 00:14:08.399 So it's getting people to think along those lines. 254 00:14:08.879 --> 00:14:12.000 And do you think this all started with the Jaws 255 00:14:12.000 --> 00:14:16.240 franchise or have people been kind of demonizing sharks for 256 00:14:16.600 --> 00:14:17.960 you know, before the seventies. 257 00:14:18.759 --> 00:14:24.720 Well, actually, I think that our perception of sharks and 258 00:14:24.799 --> 00:14:29.159 that fear goes way back. It goes back to the 259 00:14:29.159 --> 00:14:33.279 way humans portray all predators. So you know, imagine back 260 00:14:33.279 --> 00:14:36.759 in the early cave days and the men would go 261 00:14:36.799 --> 00:14:39.159 out and hunt some wild animals and they would come 262 00:14:39.200 --> 00:14:42.440 back and tell these stories about these crazy, vicious animals 263 00:14:42.480 --> 00:14:45.799 they saw, and of course the families are sitting around 264 00:14:45.840 --> 00:14:48.120 listening to these stories are going, wow, that's so scaring. 265 00:14:48.159 --> 00:14:51.679 They're describing this animal and the reality of it is 266 00:14:51.879 --> 00:14:56.639 people listen when people talk about that, because your brain 267 00:14:56.759 --> 00:15:00.279 gives you a little squirt of happy juice when you're scared. 268 00:15:00.639 --> 00:15:06.039 Happy juice aka adrenaline aka nor epinephrine is a hormone 269 00:15:06.240 --> 00:15:10.159 that's gleaked out from your adrenal glands during fight or flight. 270 00:15:10.399 --> 00:15:13.039 So for more on this and why fear is a 271 00:15:13.120 --> 00:15:16.120 very lucrative business, you can listen to the two part 272 00:15:16.279 --> 00:15:21.240 Ferology episode with Mary Poffenroth, who is a life changer. Okay, 273 00:15:21.320 --> 00:15:23.080 back to adrenaline. 274 00:15:22.559 --> 00:15:25.399 And It tells you to pay attention to characters that 275 00:15:25.480 --> 00:15:29.320 may be important for your survival. So now what happens 276 00:15:29.360 --> 00:15:32.399 is if people don't encounter that animal, they can embellish 277 00:15:32.440 --> 00:15:35.279 the stories, right, because the chances of that person ever 278 00:15:35.320 --> 00:15:38.480 seeing the animal themselves may be very low. And now 279 00:15:38.519 --> 00:15:41.600 the storytellers are getting rewarded because people are listening to them. 280 00:15:42.279 --> 00:15:44.279 So now they can embellish the stories. They can go 281 00:15:44.320 --> 00:15:47.840 on and on about the gnashing jaws and think about 282 00:15:47.919 --> 00:15:50.600 whalers and fishermen that were out to see for years 283 00:15:50.679 --> 00:15:52.360 and they would come back and they would be telling 284 00:15:52.440 --> 00:15:54.519 these stories to their families, and their families are like, 285 00:15:54.559 --> 00:15:58.320 oh my god, these sharks sound horrible. But now as 286 00:15:58.320 --> 00:16:00.759 people began to see those animals more, as they begin 287 00:16:00.840 --> 00:16:04.919 to encounter them more, those things don't match. So you know, 288 00:16:04.960 --> 00:16:07.919 television's played off that. Jaws played off that. I mean, 289 00:16:07.919 --> 00:16:10.600 when you think about the book and the movie, you 290 00:16:10.639 --> 00:16:15.279 know they're describing something that people were envisioning in their head, right, 291 00:16:15.480 --> 00:16:17.919 and you only had to show a few pictures to 292 00:16:18.000 --> 00:16:21.240 help seal that deal. So the problem was is we 293 00:16:21.320 --> 00:16:24.519 knew very little about sharks at the time Jaws was written, 294 00:16:24.799 --> 00:16:27.159 and we've learned a lot more about sharks since then, 295 00:16:27.679 --> 00:16:31.559 so now it's getting a little harder to embellish the stories. Nonetheless, 296 00:16:31.639 --> 00:16:34.720 our brain is programmed to get a little squared happy 297 00:16:34.799 --> 00:16:38.840 juice when we're scared, So I think that's what makes 298 00:16:38.840 --> 00:16:41.840 it so hard to move away from sharks being these 299 00:16:41.879 --> 00:16:45.399 scary animals and convincing people that they're important and they're 300 00:16:45.399 --> 00:16:47.279 actually not as dangerous as they're made out to be. 301 00:16:48.039 --> 00:16:50.360 Hit me with some stats. We always hear that vending 302 00:16:50.399 --> 00:16:52.399 machines collect three hundred and eighty five people a year 303 00:16:52.399 --> 00:16:53.679 and sharks kill five. 304 00:16:55.039 --> 00:16:58.600 Yeah, yeah, so that those stats, there's tons of them 305 00:16:58.600 --> 00:17:02.120 out there. You know, you're more likely to dive in 306 00:17:02.159 --> 00:17:04.440 a car accident driving on the four or five going 307 00:17:04.480 --> 00:17:07.440 to the beach. Obviously in the parking lot you're more 308 00:17:07.519 --> 00:17:11.599 likely to be run over by another driver than you 309 00:17:11.680 --> 00:17:14.799 ever would by encountering shark. So the thing is is 310 00:17:15.039 --> 00:17:18.319 it's an irrational fear, right, because the stats clearly tell 311 00:17:18.400 --> 00:17:21.880 us that the probability is crazy, crazy low. You have 312 00:17:21.920 --> 00:17:24.599 a better chance of winning the lottery than you do 313 00:17:24.680 --> 00:17:26.039 of being bitten by a shark. 314 00:17:26.359 --> 00:17:29.599 So side note, your odds of getting struck by lightning 315 00:17:29.960 --> 00:17:33.559 are just one in three thousand, getting injured by a 316 00:17:33.599 --> 00:17:37.240 toilet about one in ten thousand. Now, death by sharks 317 00:17:37.839 --> 00:17:44.279 one in three point seven million, and well one in fifteen. 318 00:17:44.319 --> 00:17:47.960 Lottery tickets will win something. The odds for winning the 319 00:17:48.000 --> 00:17:50.920 good stuff like the Mega Million's jackpots, You ready for this, 320 00:17:51.279 --> 00:17:55.559 one in three hundred and two million, So way less 321 00:17:55.640 --> 00:17:58.519 likely than a shark attack, because like, winning actual money 322 00:17:58.519 --> 00:18:02.079 in the lottery is like nah, pretty much like kind 323 00:18:02.119 --> 00:18:02.400 of never. 324 00:18:03.119 --> 00:18:05.240 And that's with millions of people going to the beach 325 00:18:05.319 --> 00:18:09.480 and shark populations coming back in some places. So you know, 326 00:18:09.720 --> 00:18:12.759 it's kind of frustrating sometimes to put out those stats 327 00:18:12.920 --> 00:18:15.160 and then still have people go, I'm afraid to go 328 00:18:15.200 --> 00:18:18.680 with my pool. Really really, I get. 329 00:18:18.519 --> 00:18:21.119 That people are afraid to go in their pool. 330 00:18:21.240 --> 00:18:21.839 Absolutely. 331 00:18:21.920 --> 00:18:23.720 Do they know there's no sharks in their pool? Or 332 00:18:23.759 --> 00:18:25.759 are those people who have sharks in their pool? 333 00:18:26.079 --> 00:18:27.599 No, I don't think they are sharks in their pool. 334 00:18:28.359 --> 00:18:30.519 It's that fear of water. It's the fear of being 335 00:18:30.519 --> 00:18:33.640 in water. And you know that adds another layer. We're 336 00:18:33.680 --> 00:18:36.920 a terrestrial animal, right, so when we go in the ocean, 337 00:18:37.000 --> 00:18:39.839 we're in a form place for many of us. And 338 00:18:39.920 --> 00:18:42.640 you know, it's interesting because many of the people water 339 00:18:42.759 --> 00:18:46.519 people I call them. These are surfers, divers, swimmers. They 340 00:18:46.519 --> 00:18:48.720 spend huge amounts of time in the ocean, and they 341 00:18:48.720 --> 00:18:51.559 feel very comfortable in the ocean. You know, very few 342 00:18:51.599 --> 00:18:53.759 of them ever tell me they're afraid of sharks. 343 00:18:54.440 --> 00:18:56.480 Do you think that the people who are innately or 344 00:18:56.599 --> 00:18:59.799 feel innately afraid of sharks just are like scuba diving, 345 00:19:00.200 --> 00:19:02.839 not for me miniature golf? Sure, do you know what 346 00:19:02.880 --> 00:19:03.920 I mean? Do they self select? 347 00:19:04.160 --> 00:19:06.759 I think so, okay, But I think we can change that. 348 00:19:06.960 --> 00:19:09.519 Those are aspects of our behavior that we kind of 349 00:19:09.799 --> 00:19:10.759 put on ourselves. 350 00:19:10.839 --> 00:19:13.359 So is part of your role as a sharks burt 351 00:19:13.559 --> 00:19:16.519 if you will to give out enough facts so it 352 00:19:16.640 --> 00:19:18.119 counterbalances the fear. 353 00:19:18.400 --> 00:19:21.640 Well, I think that's an important part of it. So 354 00:19:21.759 --> 00:19:24.319 the more we learn about sharks and the more people 355 00:19:24.359 --> 00:19:27.559 begin to see them in a different way like they 356 00:19:27.559 --> 00:19:30.559 would see any other animal like maybe a dog or 357 00:19:30.559 --> 00:19:33.200 a cat, or a mountain lion or anything like that. 358 00:19:33.240 --> 00:19:35.759 The more they know, the less they're going to fear. 359 00:19:36.119 --> 00:19:38.599 And we see that. I see it particularly in kids. 360 00:19:39.160 --> 00:19:42.200 I talk to thousands of kids every year because they're 361 00:19:42.240 --> 00:19:45.319 actually the best, so they quite often haven't developed that 362 00:19:45.359 --> 00:19:50.000 fear yet and sharks and the new dinosaurs. So kids 363 00:19:50.000 --> 00:19:53.519 are really into sharks really, Oh yeah. 364 00:19:53.480 --> 00:19:55.720 I just know that sharks are the new dinosaurs. 365 00:19:55.720 --> 00:20:01.200 That's new dinosaurs, and they're still here. Twenty years ago, 366 00:20:01.279 --> 00:20:03.880 I was really worried at the track we were taking 367 00:20:04.079 --> 00:20:07.240 that this there would be a generation of Americans that 368 00:20:07.319 --> 00:20:10.279 would enter our coastal ocean and never get to see 369 00:20:10.279 --> 00:20:13.200 a shark. And now I'm kind of excited that things 370 00:20:13.200 --> 00:20:16.599 are changing. There's a really good chance that this generation 371 00:20:16.640 --> 00:20:18.519 will be able to go in the ocean and actually 372 00:20:18.559 --> 00:20:19.599 see a shark in the wild. 373 00:20:19.839 --> 00:20:22.440 I love it. For you, that's like amazing good news. 374 00:20:22.559 --> 00:20:23.240 But that's true. 375 00:20:23.240 --> 00:20:24.079 But that's exciting. 376 00:20:24.279 --> 00:20:27.880 It really is. It really is because imagine here's well, 377 00:20:27.920 --> 00:20:30.160 we'll think of it like, you know, coming to LA 378 00:20:30.279 --> 00:20:33.160 and going down Hollywood and seeing a movie star, Right, 379 00:20:33.559 --> 00:20:35.640 that's what it will be like. People will be like 380 00:20:35.720 --> 00:20:38.079 I was in the ocean. I saw dolphin ho hum, 381 00:20:38.480 --> 00:20:41.799 But I also saw a white shark that was freaking awesome. 382 00:20:42.400 --> 00:20:44.279 I love that because if you go in Hollywood Boulevard, 383 00:20:44.440 --> 00:20:46.880 chances are you are not going to see your favorite celebrity. 384 00:20:47.039 --> 00:20:48.599 You're gonna see a lot of other shit. But you're 385 00:20:48.640 --> 00:20:50.119 not gonna see anyone fair. 386 00:20:51.000 --> 00:20:51.759 That was very true. 387 00:20:52.359 --> 00:20:55.960 But when you think of sharks, what kind of place 388 00:20:56.039 --> 00:20:58.720 do they hold in your heart? Like, when you think 389 00:20:58.759 --> 00:21:01.920 of a shark, what key words come to your mind? 390 00:21:02.839 --> 00:21:06.480 You know, they're just amazing. I mean they're amazing. They've 391 00:21:06.519 --> 00:21:09.599 been around for four hundred million years as a group, right, 392 00:21:09.640 --> 00:21:12.640 they've been They've seen the gnarly shit on the planet, right, 393 00:21:12.720 --> 00:21:15.960 I mean, asteroids hitting the planet. They they've been through 394 00:21:16.079 --> 00:21:18.559 all these mass extinctions and they come out the other 395 00:21:18.720 --> 00:21:22.240 end of the pipe and they're still around. That's amazing. 396 00:21:22.400 --> 00:21:22.799 Yeah. 397 00:21:23.079 --> 00:21:25.119 So you know, when you look at all the other 398 00:21:25.240 --> 00:21:28.119 life in the ocean, and during some of those mass extinctions, 399 00:21:28.119 --> 00:21:31.079 we lost over ninety percent of the marine life was gone. 400 00:21:31.279 --> 00:21:35.039 Really that much, huge, huge, huge extinction. 401 00:21:35.400 --> 00:21:38.039