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<v Speaker 1>It's Night Side with Dan Ray. I'm WBSY constant some

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<v Speaker 1>news radio.

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<v Speaker 2>I am indeed Ben Parker, and I am indeed filling

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<v Speaker 2>in for Dan Ray on Night's Side this evening. It's

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<v Speaker 2>a one and done. Tonight's the only night. So if

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<v Speaker 2>you like what you're here, then I guess write the management.

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<v Speaker 2>If you don't like what you're here, well, at the

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<v Speaker 2>end of the night, it'll be over. I wanted to

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<v Speaker 2>bring one more thing up real quickly before we move

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<v Speaker 2>on here, and I didn't get to it with Senator

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<v Speaker 2>Oberaker from New York. I spoke to someone earlier today.

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<v Speaker 2>But I've also brought this up many times before when

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<v Speaker 2>it comes to politics and getting things done right, we're

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<v Speaker 2>in this stalemate sometimes and obviously a society where there's

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<v Speaker 2>just a lot of anger between people on one side

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<v Speaker 2>of the aisle and the other side of the aisle,

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<v Speaker 2>and there's lightning Rod issues says, I'll call them, and

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<v Speaker 2>I'm not going to just list them off. You know

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<v Speaker 2>what they are? The ones who are people really get

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<v Speaker 2>upset about them. I wonder why, and I'm sure there's

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<v Speaker 2>a reason, and somebody may bring it up later as

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<v Speaker 2>we go through the evening or as we talk to

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<v Speaker 2>other people tonight. But this is what I always wondered. Look,

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<v Speaker 2>there's plenty of stuff we don't agree on. That's known.

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<v Speaker 2>But there's stuff that we can't agree on, right whether

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<v Speaker 2>it has to do with taxes or helping people or

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<v Speaker 2>this that or the other thing, it doesn't matter what

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<v Speaker 2>it is. But there's a lot of stuff that we

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<v Speaker 2>can agree on. Leave the nasty stuff, the lightning rod

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<v Speaker 2>issues off to the side. I'm not saying ignore them,

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<v Speaker 2>but leave them off to the side. Solve the problems

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<v Speaker 2>we can find solutions to easily, or at least easier,

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<v Speaker 2>and then maybe in the time that we're negotiating about

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<v Speaker 2>the things we can find agreement with, maybe we find

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<v Speaker 2>ways to agree or understand the other side for those

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<v Speaker 2>other issues they really anger causing issues. All Right, That's

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<v Speaker 2>all I want to say. I just why do we

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<v Speaker 2>have to put everything in the freezer and say, well,

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<v Speaker 2>I'm not going to talk to you about this, so

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<v Speaker 2>I'm not going to talk you about anything. I just

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<v Speaker 2>and it can happens from both sides, so it's I'm

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<v Speaker 2>not picking on anybody specifically, but I just let's solve

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<v Speaker 2>the things we can solve, and then we can move

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<v Speaker 2>on to the things we didn't solve in the first place.

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<v Speaker 2>Never mind nine oh nine. It is Tuesday night, Ben

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<v Speaker 2>Parker filling in for Dan Ray on nights side. We're

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<v Speaker 2>gonna switch gears up a little bit here. There was

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<v Speaker 2>some legislation about a curbing housing affordability or taking control

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<v Speaker 2>of housing affordability. Everybody knows, and it's a deal in

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<v Speaker 2>every state right around here, Sure there's a more expensive housing.

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<v Speaker 2>So the problem with housing is a lot bigger of

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<v Speaker 2>a problem in and around Boston. Let's say in New York.

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<v Speaker 2>I would guess in San Francisco. You just named the

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<v Speaker 2>places where it's the most expensive. Right, But the governor

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<v Speaker 2>Heally today signed a borrowing bill, a five point two

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<v Speaker 2>billion dollar borrowing bill that was passed by the legislature

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<v Speaker 2>and is aimed at trying to put an end, or

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<v Speaker 2>at least slow down the problems with housing in the Commonwealth.

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<v Speaker 2>So we are talking to someone who knows a little

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<v Speaker 2>bit about housing. Let me see if I can say

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<v Speaker 2>this all in one breath. Massachusetts Housing and Livable Communities

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<v Speaker 2>Secretary at Augustus joins us. Can I just call you

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<v Speaker 2>the housing secretaries Okay.

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<v Speaker 3>Oh, I've been called worth feel free, all right.

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<v Speaker 2>So this is something that the governor wanted, the legislature

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<v Speaker 2>had tossed around, and obviously, as with anything, there was

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<v Speaker 2>a bit of back and forth and over and under

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<v Speaker 2>and all of that. But finally the deal got done.

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<v Speaker 2>And so now it's done. Now to the layman who's

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<v Speaker 2>not Housing secretary, what does this mean to the commonwealth?

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<v Speaker 2>And and I guess maybe even more importantly is what

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<v Speaker 2>will it mean to the commonwealth?

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<v Speaker 3>Well, first, thanks for having me, Ben, I appreciate it.

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<v Speaker 3>It is a big day in terms of housing production

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<v Speaker 3>in Massachusetts by having Governor Haley signed the Affordable Homes

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<v Speaker 3>Act today. There's kind of two elements to it. As

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<v Speaker 3>you mentioned, this five point two billion dollars worth of

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<v Speaker 3>borrowing that will happen over the next five years, and

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<v Speaker 3>that really supports most of the capital programs that we

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<v Speaker 3>use to build affordable housing, subsidize the building of affordable housing,

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<v Speaker 3>or capital improvements to our public housing. This is one

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<v Speaker 3>of the only states that has forty three thousand units

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<v Speaker 3>of state owned public housing. That's across two hundred and

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<v Speaker 3>forty one cities and towns of Massachusetts. Some of it

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<v Speaker 3>is for elderly and disabled folks, some of it is

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<v Speaker 3>for families, all of it is for folks who are

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<v Speaker 3>often very low income, sometimes even below thirty percent of

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<v Speaker 3>area median income, so very very low income folks who

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<v Speaker 3>in this housing market, if we didn't have those public

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<v Speaker 3>housing units online, many of them would probably be experiencing homelessness.

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<v Speaker 3>So we really want to make sure we preserve the

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<v Speaker 3>public housing that we currently have and make it more habitable,

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<v Speaker 3>more healthy, more updated, and make sure we keep that online.

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<v Speaker 3>And then there are forty nine policy changes that are

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<v Speaker 3>part of this bill, some of which accessory dwelling units.

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<v Speaker 3>They call them in law apartments sometimes where if you're

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<v Speaker 3>single family property owner, you now as of right, can

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<v Speaker 3>add a basement apartment and an attict department above your garage,

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<v Speaker 3>and sometimes it's a family member that lives there, and

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<v Speaker 3>sometimes you just rented out to bring in a little

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<v Speaker 3>extra income. Other states have done that. It's created thousands

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<v Speaker 3>of units at no cost to the state, and so

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<v Speaker 3>that was part of the bill that the governors signed today.

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<v Speaker 3>So is a combination of dollars as well as policy changes.

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<v Speaker 3>The net goal is about forty five thousand units of

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<v Speaker 3>housing will be built over the next five years that

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<v Speaker 3>otherwise wouldn't be built, and about twenty seven thousand units

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<v Speaker 3>of housing will be preserved or improved that otherwise might

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<v Speaker 3>have been in Jeopany.

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<v Speaker 2>Now this is a bond bill, at least a portion

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<v Speaker 2>of it. There is this bond bill, So we're basically

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<v Speaker 2>taking a mortgage to help with housing costs.

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<v Speaker 3>Every five years forever the Borrows reauthorizes capital programs. We

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<v Speaker 3>do it for environmental things, we do it for education,

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<v Speaker 3>school buildings, higher education, dams and bridges, and we do

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<v Speaker 3>it for housing. And so the five year cycle was up.

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<v Speaker 3>This is the biggest authorization the governor file the four

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<v Speaker 3>point one billion dollar bills that legislature added to it.

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<v Speaker 3>I think understanding the crisis that we're experiencing across the state.

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<v Speaker 3>Anybody who's tried to buy a first time anybody that

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<v Speaker 3>you know who's a first time home buyer probably tells

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<v Speaker 3>you that they've gone to many open houses and come

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<v Speaker 3>up short. They've put in offers, often over asking, sometimes

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<v Speaker 3>waving home inspections and all sorts of things just to

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<v Speaker 3>try to get that opportunity to purchase a home and

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<v Speaker 3>still aren't able to do it because of the shortage

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<v Speaker 3>of inventory, and so this bill was really designed to

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<v Speaker 3>create more supply. We know it's basically if you're oil

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<v Speaker 3>it all down. It's a supply demand issue. There's too

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<v Speaker 3>few units of housing, rental or ownership opportunities for the

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<v Speaker 3>demand that's up there.

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<v Speaker 2>There's certainly let's to unpacked with this at Augustus, who's

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<v Speaker 2>the Housing Secretary of Massachusetts, joining us about this bill

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<v Speaker 2>signed by the governor today, And you mentioned supplying demand,

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<v Speaker 2>And obviously I think anybody who even took basic economics

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<v Speaker 2>knows what supply and demand is and means. This is

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<v Speaker 2>a question that I'm going to ask because because I'm

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<v Speaker 2>curious about it. If you have more supply, then the

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<v Speaker 2>price of the goes down. People go So if you

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<v Speaker 2>have as we sit right now, right housing prices are

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<v Speaker 2>very high. And Mary and Joanne or Mary and Joe

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<v Speaker 2>and Mary and Mark all just bought houses at the

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<v Speaker 2>high end of the market here right, so six seven,

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<v Speaker 2>eight hundred thousand dollars whatever they bought the house for. Now,

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<v Speaker 2>if more supply comes online, then theoretically the prices will

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<v Speaker 2>go down. Those couples And what do you say, I

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<v Speaker 2>guess to someone who says, who wait, wait a second,

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<v Speaker 2>there's more supply now than these when I bought. Now,

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<v Speaker 2>I'm going to get I'm gonna get stuck on the

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<v Speaker 2>other end of my mortgage. Is that something that people

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<v Speaker 2>should worry about or is that just not something that

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<v Speaker 2>is going to really be a big problem.

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<v Speaker 3>I honestly don't think that's going to be a big problem.

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<v Speaker 3>Maybe prices don't go up as fast as they've been

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<v Speaker 3>going up. But if any of those folks that you

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<v Speaker 3>talked about purchase the house and then they go to

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<v Speaker 3>sell it twenty or thirty years later, I'm sure that

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<v Speaker 3>house will appreciate in value and they will have built

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<v Speaker 3>up quite a bit of equity over the course of

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<v Speaker 3>those twenty or thirty years they own the home. The

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<v Speaker 3>question is, can you know, the kid who's graduating from

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<v Speaker 3>college today in Massachusetts, can they afford to buy a home?

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<v Speaker 3>And if they can't, we're finding we're losing people to

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<v Speaker 3>other states. You know, we lost about twenty thousand popular

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<v Speaker 3>over the last few years, most of the twenty five

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<v Speaker 3>to thirty six year old demographic. Those are the folks

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<v Speaker 3>who are just getting out of school, starting their careers,

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<v Speaker 3>starting their families and quite honestly, are finding themselves priced

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<v Speaker 3>out of the real estate market in the greater Boston

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<v Speaker 3>area and even beyond, And so we're not going to

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<v Speaker 3>be able to compete as a state as the companies

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<v Speaker 3>and businesses that look to locate here to grow here

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<v Speaker 3>look for employees, and if they say to their employees, hey,

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<v Speaker 3>you're going to have to spend fifty percent of your

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<v Speaker 3>income on housing, but if you take a job in

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<v Speaker 3>North Carolina or somewhere else, you're going to spend thirty percent.

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<v Speaker 3>Too often we're losing those talented workforce and that makes

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<v Speaker 3>us less competitive as a state. Not to mention people

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<v Speaker 3>who are on the other end of the economic equation.

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<v Speaker 3>You know, senior citizens who are on fixed incomes. Maybe

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<v Speaker 3>they rent, maybe they're in a three family, three family

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<v Speaker 3>gets sold. Somebody says, hey, I can get way more

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<v Speaker 3>than fifteen hundred dollars a month. It's now twenty four

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<v Speaker 3>hundred dollars a month, but you're living on a fixed income.

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<v Speaker 3>We're seeing a lot of senior citizens be displaced because

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<v Speaker 3>of the really rapid increases in housing costs. So I

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<v Speaker 3>think we can create more supply that gives more power

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<v Speaker 3>to the buyer and to the renter and takes a

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<v Speaker 3>little bit more of the power dynamic that's currently in

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<v Speaker 3>place in our housing ecosystem and create a little more

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<v Speaker 3>equilibrium so that if somebody is offering a property rental

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<v Speaker 3>or sale that's way too high, there's somebody down the

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<v Speaker 3>road that you can take your business to. Right now,

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<v Speaker 3>there's nobody down the road to take your business too.

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<v Speaker 3>That's the problem.

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<v Speaker 2>Massachusetts Housing Secretary at Augustus joining us. So the Governor

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<v Speaker 2>today signing a bill to help with housing issues in

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<v Speaker 2>the Commonwealth, will continue to talk about that and ask

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<v Speaker 2>some more questions about what this means for you and

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<v Speaker 2>me and everyone else involved as we continue on nights Side.

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<v Speaker 2>Ben Parker's sitting in for Dan Ray tonight on WBZ.

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<v Speaker 1>Now. Back to Dan Ray live from the Window World

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<v Speaker 1>Night Side Studios on WBZ News Radio.

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<v Speaker 4>This is all about unlocking housing right because everywhere we go,

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<v Speaker 4>people are paying too much, or they can't afford rent,

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<v Speaker 4>they can't afford a down payment, seniors can't afford to downsize.

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<v Speaker 2>That is Governor Mora Heally as she put her signature

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<v Speaker 2>on a housing bill today that is aimed at helping

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<v Speaker 2>invest in housing in Massachusetts. In fact, it's the Affordable

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<v Speaker 2>Homes Act, the largest investment of its kind in the Commonwealth,

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<v Speaker 2>and with us tonight is the Housing Secretary. It's actually

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<v Speaker 2>housing in Liverpool Communities Secretary Ed Augustus and welcome back

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<v Speaker 2>and listen. I know that the last time we spoke

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<v Speaker 2>was when you were in the City of Worcester doing

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<v Speaker 2>your uh, your your city manager job. So it's been

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<v Speaker 2>a while and you switched jobs and everything.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah. No, I had the great honor to service City

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<v Speaker 3>manager of Worcester for nine years. And you know, Worcester

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<v Speaker 3>is a place I was born and raised and a

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<v Speaker 3>place that really has come a long way in recent years,

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<v Speaker 3>you know, positioned itself for the knowledge based economy. We've

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<v Speaker 3>got nine colleges and universities there. Most people don't realize

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<v Speaker 3>thirty five thousand college students a year go through the

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<v Speaker 3>great colleges in Worcester, a big life science of presence

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<v Speaker 3>and now home to the Worster Red Sox, the Triple

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<v Speaker 3>A affiliate of the Boston Red Sox, which has brought

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<v Speaker 3>a lot of life and energy and a lot of

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<v Speaker 3>visitors to Worcester into the Canal District.

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<v Speaker 2>I think you officially have to say the WU socks,

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<v Speaker 2>don't you wat. And by the way, all those things

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<v Speaker 2>that you mentioned about Worcester, and I'm a Central Mass

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<v Speaker 2>guy at Northern Central Masters, where I grew up and

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<v Speaker 2>still live, so I'm familiar obviously with Worcester. But even

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<v Speaker 2>with all the things you just mentioned, all the colleges,

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<v Speaker 2>all the places that people can work, the WU socks

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<v Speaker 2>and all of that, housing is still a problem there too,

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<v Speaker 2>as it is all across the state. Now me saying that,

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<v Speaker 2>I want to ask you this question when you look

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<v Speaker 2>at this bill, when you look at the help that's coming,

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<v Speaker 2>and I know sometimes people will say, well, what about us,

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<v Speaker 2>what about my town? What about my city? Is this something?

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<v Speaker 2>Because people live all across the state, as you know,

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<v Speaker 2>and people have trouble living and affording it all across

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<v Speaker 2>the state. Is this uniform in terms of how it's

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<v Speaker 2>going to help people from the Cape to Western Master,

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<v Speaker 2>Eastern Master, Central Mass, from Worcester to Lemonster. Is it

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<v Speaker 2>everybody going to get the same help here?

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<v Speaker 3>Well, there really is an array of different programs within

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<v Speaker 3>this bill that is designed to meet the unique needs

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<v Speaker 3>of different communities around the state. Worcester like Fitchburg and

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<v Speaker 3>Lemonster and Pittsfield and Springfield and Fall River and New Bedford.

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<v Speaker 3>Those are our gateway cities, and there's programs within this

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<v Speaker 3>bill that really help to support our gateway cities which

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<v Speaker 3>have unique opportunities but sometimes unique challenges. This bill also creates,

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<v Speaker 3>for the first time ever something called a seasonal Communities designation,

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<v Speaker 3>and that particularly is going to apply to the communities

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<v Speaker 3>on the Cape, the Islands, and some of the towns

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<v Speaker 3>up in Berkshires that might see their population triple during

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<v Speaker 3>the summer months and have a lot of second or

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<v Speaker 3>third home owners in those communities will only come. They

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<v Speaker 3>own the home year round, but they only stay there

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<v Speaker 3>for a few months of the year or a few

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<v Speaker 3>weekends here and there, and it really changes the housing

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<v Speaker 3>dynamic in that community. The people who have to, you know,

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<v Speaker 3>make those towns work, the DPW employees, the school teachers,

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<v Speaker 3>the folks who work in the hospitality industry, which is

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<v Speaker 3>the lifeblood of all of these tourist communities, are finding

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<v Speaker 3>that they don't have a place for that that workforce

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<v Speaker 3>to live. Fifty percent of the Cape's workforce lives off

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<v Speaker 3>of the Cape. Think about how challenging that is particularly,

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<v Speaker 3>you go further up the cape to get people who

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<v Speaker 3>are able and willing to make that drive every day

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<v Speaker 3>to fill those jobs, and too often we're seeing that

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<v Speaker 3>they're not able to do that and we're having jobs

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<v Speaker 3>not be filmed. The issues on the islands are unique

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<v Speaker 3>but more pronounced in terms of some of the challenges

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<v Speaker 3>that they have, whether it be running the hospitals on

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<v Speaker 3>the two islands or the other kind of essential services

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<v Speaker 3>that allow everybody else to enjoy these amazing places. So

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<v Speaker 3>there's some unique tools in this bill for those seasonal

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<v Speaker 3>communities to help them. So they really are very tailored

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<v Speaker 3>and nuanced programs of design to meet the unique challenges

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<v Speaker 3>and the unique needs of different communities across the stace.

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<v Speaker 2>I want to ask this question of you, Secretary, and

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<v Speaker 2>it's probably an unfair question, but I'm gonna ask it

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<v Speaker 2>anyway because I think it needs to be at least discussed,

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<v Speaker 2>and maybe it's something you have discussed in your job role.

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<v Speaker 2>So we've been dealing with housing prices through the roof

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<v Speaker 2>for a long time. We've been dealing with housing shortages

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<v Speaker 2>for a long time. We've been dealing with homelessness for

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<v Speaker 2>a long time. We've been dealing with all these housing

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<v Speaker 2>related issues for a long time, not just here, all

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<v Speaker 2>across the country. But so here's the question. If we're

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<v Speaker 2>doing stuff about them all the time, and we've been

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<v Speaker 2>dealing with them for a long time, how have we

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<v Speaker 2>not solved these problems yet? I mean, it's probably a

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<v Speaker 2>more difficult thing to answer than my question was to ask.

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<v Speaker 2>But it just seems like, hey, we've been doing this

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<v Speaker 2>for a long time. Shouldn't we have fixed it by now? Yeah?

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<v Speaker 3>I mean, I think part of it. There's a couple

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<v Speaker 3>of things that are at work, I think that have

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<v Speaker 3>made this housing crisis that much more pronounced. One is

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<v Speaker 3>something that's been happening for decades, quite honestly, and that

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<v Speaker 3>is many local comunities have made it very difficult to

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<v Speaker 3>build housing. They've created zoning that doesn't allow many types

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<v Speaker 3>of housing, or requires such large plots of land for

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<v Speaker 3>a single family home that it doesn't allow for the

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<v Speaker 3>more dense housing that often is necessary, particularly near our

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<v Speaker 3>transit notes. That's what the NBCTA Communities Act is really about,

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<v Speaker 3>is removing some of those local barriers that have historically

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<v Speaker 3>existed to create more houses. So I think that's one issue,

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<v Speaker 3>and that's been decades in the works. Post pandemic, we

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<v Speaker 3>saw inflation hit a lot of different sectors. Construction materials,

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<v Speaker 3>the basic elements of building a home, whether it be

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<v Speaker 3>the wood or the steel, depending on how high the

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<v Speaker 3>building is if it's an apartment building, the other physical

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<v Speaker 3>elements saw the prices go up, and even though inflation

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<v Speaker 3>has come down, those prices have not come down, so

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<v Speaker 3>that has made building housing more expensive. And then interest rates.

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<v Speaker 3>You think about it, four years ago, you had the

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<v Speaker 3>ability to get a mortgage maybe at three percent, maybe

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<v Speaker 3>at two and a half percent, fairly cheap money. Now

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<v Speaker 3>you're looking at seven or eight percent interest rate. So

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<v Speaker 3>there's a lot of folks who may want to move.

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<v Speaker 3>Maybe it's time to downsize. The kids have grown up

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<v Speaker 3>and moved away. You want to get a smaller place,

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<v Speaker 3>but you're worried about, you know, trading in a three

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<v Speaker 3>percent mortgage for seven or eight percent mortgage.

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<v Speaker 5>Now.

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<v Speaker 3>Hopefully there's some signals that maybe interest rates will start

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<v Speaker 3>coming down in the near future, and I think as

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<v Speaker 3>that happened, that will be wind at our back in

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<v Speaker 3>terms of housing production. Because every time the interest rates

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<v Speaker 3>come down or go up, one percentage point. It has

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<v Speaker 3>a big impact on the production of housing.

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<v Speaker 2>Right, this Housing Secretary Ed Augustus joining us talking about

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<v Speaker 2>this housing bill that was signed by the governor today.

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<v Speaker 2>Appreciate you taking the time. I mean, I know we

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<v Speaker 2>could do an entire week long series on housing because

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<v Speaker 2>it's such a big issue around these parts. But I

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<v Speaker 2>appreciate you kind of breaking down some of the stuff

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<v Speaker 2>for us and joining us this Stevening on nightside.

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<v Speaker 3>Thanks for having me. Ben, appreciate it being with you, all.

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<v Speaker 2>Right, Thanks a lot, Central mass guy's got to stay together,

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<v Speaker 2>you know that. All that is Ed Augustus, Woroster City

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<v Speaker 2>manager for a long time. I grew up in Worcester

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<v Speaker 2>and now he's the Housing Secretary of Massachusetts. Have you

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<v Speaker 2>ever heard Have you ever heard? Of course you have?

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<v Speaker 2>The shot spotter gun shot detection system seems like a

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<v Speaker 2>great idea. Right, everybody's on board with this, Right, the

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<v Speaker 2>shots ring out and the cops can go and respond

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<v Speaker 2>to it. Maybe not quite that simple. We've got a

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<v Speaker 2>little bit of a controversy around the shot spotter gunshot

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<v Speaker 2>detection system. Of course, it's only a controversy among those

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<v Speaker 2>who have made it that way. We'll talk about that

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<v Speaker 2>coming up with you on here Nightside on WBZ. Ben

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<v Speaker 2>Parker infandam right.

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<v Speaker 1>Night Side with Dan Ray on WBZ, Boston's news radio.

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<v Speaker 2>All right, welcome back to Night's Side, Ben Parker filling

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<v Speaker 2>in for Dan Ray tonight. And we've been having a

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<v Speaker 2>whole lot of guests on a little bit of politics,

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<v Speaker 2>a little bit of housing. Now we're going to talk

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<v Speaker 2>a little bit about crime. And I'm gonna be honest

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<v Speaker 2>with you. I always thought this was a pretty good system. Now,

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<v Speaker 2>as a guy who does news and for those who

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<v Speaker 2>don't know, I do news here on WBZ from two

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<v Speaker 2>to six every weekday afternoon. Make sure you tune in

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<v Speaker 2>and catch the news, and don't forget to download the

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<v Speaker 2>iHeartRadio apps. You can take us with you wherever you go. Now,

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<v Speaker 2>we hear in the news here about police responding to

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<v Speaker 2>a shooting, and a lot of times, or at least

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<v Speaker 2>sometimes in various cities, they respond to those shootings because

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<v Speaker 2>of the shot Spotter gunshot detection system. Boston has it,

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<v Speaker 2>and so do many other cities in Massachusetts and across

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<v Speaker 2>the country. Now, there's been some scrutiny lately of that

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<v Speaker 2>activation of the shot we'll get into a little bit

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<v Speaker 2>of why we as we come up. But we have

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<v Speaker 2>a couple of people tonight who are going to talk

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<v Speaker 2>to us about this system. One of them happens to

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<v Speaker 2>be the CEO of Shot Spotter himself, Ralph Clark. First

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<v Speaker 2>of all, Ralph, thank you for joining Nightside this evening.

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<v Speaker 6>Thank you very much for having me.

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<v Speaker 2>And another is someone who is familiar, certainly his name

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<v Speaker 2>should be to people in Boston. He is from Boston.

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<v Speaker 2>He was the police commissioner in Boston. Also in New

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<v Speaker 2>York City, he was the chief of the LA Police Department.

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<v Speaker 2>He's been all over the place and he joins us tonight,

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<v Speaker 2>Bill Bratton. Bill, thanks for joining us.

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<v Speaker 7>Eating good to be back in Boston once again.

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<v Speaker 2>I want to ask. I want to start with Bill

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<v Speaker 2>only because your police background and obviously when something happens,

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<v Speaker 2>in this particular case, a shooting, you want to be

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<v Speaker 2>able to get as police officers to wherever that shooting

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<v Speaker 2>was asap, not only for finding any victims of the shooting,

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<v Speaker 2>but to collect evidence and perhaps get the purp Me

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<v Speaker 2>and as a guy who's had Shot Spotter as part

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<v Speaker 2>of our news stories, what's wrong with that?

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<v Speaker 7>There's a fourth element that adds to that combination, and

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<v Speaker 7>that's to assure the public that we care about crime

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<v Speaker 7>in their neighborhoods. In this particular instance, in terms of

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<v Speaker 7>shots being fired in the neighborhood, whether there's an actual

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<v Speaker 7>victim of the shooting. That in cities around the country

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<v Speaker 7>to eighty percent of shots fired, I never reported, never

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<v Speaker 7>called into nine one one. An amazing statistic that people

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<v Speaker 7>in certain neighborhoods are certain cities is so commonplace that

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<v Speaker 7>they'll stop calling or they assume somebody else is going

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<v Speaker 7>to call. And that figure just was flabagast when I

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<v Speaker 7>first saw that as a chief of police. The idea

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<v Speaker 7>that you assume shotsify it, they're going to call nine

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<v Speaker 7>one one, but they don't. What this technology does. It

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<v Speaker 7>detects the shots being fired instantly. It also identifies the

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<v Speaker 7>caliber of the weapon firing the shots, So is it

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<v Speaker 7>an AI fifteen rifle, is it the smaller Cali king

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<v Speaker 7>a gangun It also detects the number of rounds, which

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<v Speaker 7>is very important information to the responding police. Are they

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<v Speaker 7>responding to a single gun shot, are they responding to

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<v Speaker 7>thirty or forty gun shots in a rapid succession? This

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<v Speaker 7>technology is it is so useful to police, so beneficial

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<v Speaker 7>to the community. I'm flabbergasted that any politician would be

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<v Speaker 7>opposed to its use, its implementation. Yet in this state,

421
00:23:56.640 --> 00:24:00.680
<v Speaker 7>the two senators in Massachusetts I'm opposed the shots far

422
00:24:01.279 --> 00:24:07.000
<v Speaker 7>They feel it's a technology that is not beneficial to

423
00:24:07.160 --> 00:24:10.119
<v Speaker 7>the citizens of the state. I just shake my head.

424
00:24:10.359 --> 00:24:12.319
<v Speaker 7>I just don't understand it.

425
00:24:12.559 --> 00:24:14.599
<v Speaker 2>And Bill, Bill is talking about By the way, and

426
00:24:14.640 --> 00:24:16.960
<v Speaker 2>you may have seen this reported in the in the

427
00:24:16.960 --> 00:24:20.480
<v Speaker 2>media that there was a letter sent by four members

428
00:24:20.480 --> 00:24:24.519
<v Speaker 2>of Congress, including Senators Marking and Warren, that basically talked

429
00:24:24.519 --> 00:24:28.160
<v Speaker 2>about the shot spotter not being accurate for starters and

430
00:24:28.200 --> 00:24:33.799
<v Speaker 2>then being utilized or used in racially biased ways. And

431
00:24:34.119 --> 00:24:37.559
<v Speaker 2>I want to bring in the CEO of Shots of Spotters,

432
00:24:38.039 --> 00:24:42.079
<v Speaker 2>Ralph Clark. Now you explain this to me. I'm just

433
00:24:42.559 --> 00:24:49.000
<v Speaker 2>asking the question, how is technology that identifies a gunshot

434
00:24:49.839 --> 00:24:50.720
<v Speaker 2>racially biased?

435
00:24:52.440 --> 00:24:55.359
<v Speaker 6>Well, the fact is that it isn't racially biased. It

436
00:24:55.480 --> 00:25:00.000
<v Speaker 6>is a technology that's designed to detect, locate, and alert

437
00:25:00.160 --> 00:25:03.759
<v Speaker 6>on instances of gunfire where we know the traditional nine

438
00:25:03.839 --> 00:25:08.200
<v Speaker 6>one one system is effectively broken for these vulnerable communities

439
00:25:08.240 --> 00:25:10.720
<v Speaker 6>when it relates to gun violence, I think, as Commissioner

440
00:25:10.759 --> 00:25:15.160
<v Speaker 6>Bratton stated, you know, eighty to ninety percent of criminal

441
00:25:15.160 --> 00:25:20.400
<v Speaker 6>gunfire goes unreported in these communities. And that's really interesting

442
00:25:20.720 --> 00:25:22.359
<v Speaker 6>to me. I think, you know it's Bill said, you know,

443
00:25:22.440 --> 00:25:25.640
<v Speaker 6>he was flabbergacid by it, and you ask the questions like, well,

444
00:25:25.680 --> 00:25:27.880
<v Speaker 6>why isn't it that people call UH?

445
00:25:28.000 --> 00:25:28.759
<v Speaker 3>Or why is it.

446
00:25:28.839 --> 00:25:31.359
<v Speaker 6>That people don't call nine one one when they hear gunshots?

447
00:25:31.359 --> 00:25:34.400
<v Speaker 6>And we attribute that to the four rs? I mean,

448
00:25:34.440 --> 00:25:37.599
<v Speaker 6>it's like, do I recognize it as gunfire? Am I

449
00:25:37.720 --> 00:25:40.960
<v Speaker 6>concerned about retribution? I don't want to be a snitch

450
00:25:41.000 --> 00:25:43.920
<v Speaker 6>and then have the perpetrators come to my house and

451
00:25:43.960 --> 00:25:48.839
<v Speaker 6>potentially put me in harm's way. Redundancy, Hey, somebody else

452
00:25:48.839 --> 00:25:51.039
<v Speaker 6>are going to someone else is going to call, right

453
00:25:51.079 --> 00:25:52.920
<v Speaker 6>one of my neighbors are going to call. And the

454
00:25:53.240 --> 00:25:57.319
<v Speaker 6>saddest one to me is the issue of resignation. We're

455
00:25:57.359 --> 00:25:59.279
<v Speaker 6>just resigned to this is the way it is. And

456
00:25:59.400 --> 00:26:04.400
<v Speaker 6>to me flabbergasting that people would not support the idea

457
00:26:04.559 --> 00:26:08.640
<v Speaker 6>of enabling first responders and law enforcement to come to

458
00:26:08.839 --> 00:26:11.559
<v Speaker 6>areas where guns have been fired because what we know

459
00:26:11.680 --> 00:26:14.799
<v Speaker 6>is this, I would be willing to guarantee you and

460
00:26:14.839 --> 00:26:17.319
<v Speaker 6>I've spent two years I went to grad school in Boston.

461
00:26:17.759 --> 00:26:21.680
<v Speaker 6>If a gun is fired in Cambridge near Harvard Business School,

462
00:26:22.160 --> 00:26:24.640
<v Speaker 6>I can tell you people are gonna call and there's

463
00:26:24.720 --> 00:26:27.440
<v Speaker 6>going to be a response. And so my question to

464
00:26:27.559 --> 00:26:30.920
<v Speaker 6>the critics is, if a gun's fired in Dorchester, Jamaica,

465
00:26:31.000 --> 00:26:34.759
<v Speaker 6>planes or Roxbury, don't those residents deserve the same type

466
00:26:34.759 --> 00:26:39.359
<v Speaker 6>of care in response. And there's nothing racist about that.

467
00:26:39.359 --> 00:26:41.079
<v Speaker 6>That's anti racist in my opinion.

468
00:26:41.279 --> 00:26:43.759
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, you know, it's also interesting and we've been this

469
00:26:43.799 --> 00:26:47.480
<v Speaker 2>has been hammered home so many times, especially since September eleventh,

470
00:26:47.480 --> 00:26:51.119
<v Speaker 2>But you know, see something, say something? What about hear

471
00:26:51.240 --> 00:26:54.279
<v Speaker 2>something say something? Wouldn't it make sense? I mean, maybe

472
00:26:54.279 --> 00:26:56.480
<v Speaker 2>I'm just talking from a different upbringing than other people,

473
00:26:56.720 --> 00:26:59.599
<v Speaker 2>but if you hear something that sounds like a gunshot,

474
00:27:00.240 --> 00:27:03.480
<v Speaker 2>I think, I think, and Commissioner you can answer this.

475
00:27:03.839 --> 00:27:06.359
<v Speaker 2>Most police departments would rather you call and be on

476
00:27:06.440 --> 00:27:10.519
<v Speaker 2>the safe side than go maybe it was a car backfiring.

477
00:27:11.599 --> 00:27:15.519
<v Speaker 7>Exactly. And the point that we should really drive home

478
00:27:16.279 --> 00:27:20.440
<v Speaker 7>is that even though in ten to thirteen, ten to

479
00:27:20.480 --> 00:27:25.279
<v Speaker 7>fifteen percent of instances that there is a victim or

480
00:27:25.440 --> 00:27:27.880
<v Speaker 7>that there is a perpetrator still on the scene, when

481
00:27:27.880 --> 00:27:31.279
<v Speaker 7>the police arrive, or that there is evidence recovered the

482
00:27:31.400 --> 00:27:35.440
<v Speaker 7>gun or shell casings, even though on only fifteen percent

483
00:27:35.440 --> 00:27:37.279
<v Speaker 7>of the time by the time the police get there,

484
00:27:38.519 --> 00:27:41.200
<v Speaker 7>do they find evidence, if you will, if there was

485
00:27:41.240 --> 00:27:44.640
<v Speaker 7>actually a shooting, the evidence of the shooting is in

486
00:27:44.759 --> 00:27:49.319
<v Speaker 7>fact the gun shot detection system itself that eighty five

487
00:27:49.640 --> 00:27:53.119
<v Speaker 7>ninety percent of the time it'll detect accurately that a

488
00:27:53.160 --> 00:27:57.039
<v Speaker 7>shot on many shots in some instances have been fired.

489
00:27:57.759 --> 00:28:01.400
<v Speaker 7>This idea of racial act that the idea that is

490
00:28:01.880 --> 00:28:05.400
<v Speaker 7>racially biased. I might point out the boarder I probably

491
00:28:05.480 --> 00:28:08.279
<v Speaker 7>serve on the bord of directors of shots bottom. Ralph

492
00:28:08.359 --> 00:28:13.880
<v Speaker 7>Clark Ukon sym Ralph Clark is African American. Our border directors.

493
00:28:13.920 --> 00:28:17.359
<v Speaker 7>Half of our border directors a minority. Half of our

494
00:28:17.400 --> 00:28:20.680
<v Speaker 7>border directors are women. One of our border directors is

495
00:28:20.680 --> 00:28:24.599
<v Speaker 7>the president of the National Urban League, former mayor of

496
00:28:24.680 --> 00:28:28.079
<v Speaker 7>New Orleans. So these are people that are very racially

497
00:28:28.640 --> 00:28:33.559
<v Speaker 7>sensitive and concerned about what's happening in minority communities, in

498
00:28:33.599 --> 00:28:38.680
<v Speaker 7>particular because the reality of crime and violent crime is

499
00:28:38.720 --> 00:28:44.079
<v Speaker 7>it has a phenomenally significant impact in the poor minority

500
00:28:44.119 --> 00:28:49.400
<v Speaker 7>neighborhoods of our cities in our country. In the irony

501
00:28:49.960 --> 00:28:53.279
<v Speaker 7>of our two senators here in Massachusetts and other politicians

502
00:28:53.559 --> 00:28:58.000
<v Speaker 7>around the country in the ACLU, advocating that somehow or

503
00:28:58.000 --> 00:29:03.160
<v Speaker 7>another this system is racial biased is abserved because the

504
00:29:03.319 --> 00:29:07.960
<v Speaker 7>idea is it is intended to help save minority lives,

505
00:29:07.960 --> 00:29:13.559
<v Speaker 7>Because where is most serious violent crime occurring in minority neighborhoods?

506
00:29:13.559 --> 00:29:16.359
<v Speaker 7>The fact of life, fifty years ago, when I joined

507
00:29:16.359 --> 00:29:20.359
<v Speaker 7>the Boston Police Department, most of the violent crime, most

508
00:29:20.359 --> 00:29:24.440
<v Speaker 7>of the shootings, most of the murders occurred in Boston,

509
00:29:24.640 --> 00:29:31.200
<v Speaker 7>in Mattapan, Dorchester, Roxbury. Today, fifty years later, thank god,

510
00:29:31.240 --> 00:29:34.079
<v Speaker 7>there is much less violence. But where do most of

511
00:29:34.119 --> 00:29:39.000
<v Speaker 7>the shootings, murders, and violent crime occur in Boston in

512
00:29:39.039 --> 00:29:42.279
<v Speaker 7>those same neighborhoods that, fifty years later are still bind

513
00:29:42.359 --> 00:29:46.559
<v Speaker 7>lige minority. So the idea that the system is somehow

514
00:29:46.599 --> 00:29:51.440
<v Speaker 7>and other biased against minorities, it is intended to save

515
00:29:51.599 --> 00:29:54.680
<v Speaker 7>minority lives, and it does. And let me make the

516
00:29:54.720 --> 00:29:58.200
<v Speaker 7>point out one example of that, and this occurs repeatedly.

517
00:29:58.920 --> 00:29:59.880
<v Speaker 3>Police get to the.

518
00:30:00.079 --> 00:30:02.079
<v Speaker 7>Seeing very quickly because of the nine to one to

519
00:30:02.160 --> 00:30:06.920
<v Speaker 7>one notification and on occasion, should we find a shooting

520
00:30:07.000 --> 00:30:10.720
<v Speaker 7>victim in that shooting victim, they will be able to

521
00:30:10.799 --> 00:30:15.160
<v Speaker 7>treat immediately. They carry traumatis now, and frequently because of

522
00:30:15.200 --> 00:30:18.319
<v Speaker 7>the grievous injury, they will push that victim in a

523
00:30:18.359 --> 00:30:21.960
<v Speaker 7>police car and get them to the hospital. Why because

524
00:30:21.960 --> 00:30:23.960
<v Speaker 7>if they don't get that person in the hospital quickly,

525
00:30:24.039 --> 00:30:26.519
<v Speaker 7>they're going to bleed out and die. So the way

526
00:30:26.559 --> 00:30:30.839
<v Speaker 7>it works, nine to one, one is notified by the

527
00:30:30.880 --> 00:30:33.880
<v Speaker 7>police apartment to send an ambulance, but the ambulance is

528
00:30:33.880 --> 00:30:36.039
<v Speaker 7>going to come five minutes after the police have already

529
00:30:36.039 --> 00:30:40.319
<v Speaker 7>on the scene. So we're seeing repeatedly where police are

530
00:30:40.359 --> 00:30:43.839
<v Speaker 7>now encouraged to take the victims themselves to the hospital

531
00:30:44.160 --> 00:30:46.839
<v Speaker 7>because when that three minutes it takes the ambulance to

532
00:30:46.880 --> 00:30:49.599
<v Speaker 7>get there after the police have already by thanks to

533
00:30:49.640 --> 00:30:52.440
<v Speaker 7>short spot them. That person's don't bleed out, that person's

534
00:30:52.440 --> 00:30:55.200
<v Speaker 7>going to die. So there's been a study that's been

535
00:30:55.240 --> 00:30:57.880
<v Speaker 7>done that pretty conclusively proves that fact.

536
00:30:58.200 --> 00:31:02.119
<v Speaker 2>You guys are good to take a quick phone call here, certainly,

537
00:31:02.160 --> 00:31:04.680
<v Speaker 2>all right, we got Andy and Merrin Mack. Let's let's

538
00:31:04.680 --> 00:31:06.920
<v Speaker 2>see what Andy's up to. Good evening, Andy, welcome to

539
00:31:07.000 --> 00:31:07.559
<v Speaker 2>Night's side.

540
00:31:08.720 --> 00:31:11.039
<v Speaker 5>Hey, good evening, everyone. I appreciate taking the call.

541
00:31:12.319 --> 00:31:13.240
<v Speaker 2>What do you got for a question?

542
00:31:13.400 --> 00:31:13.960
<v Speaker 7>I just want.

543
00:31:14.680 --> 00:31:17.079
<v Speaker 5>I just uh, I guess I got two things. The

544
00:31:17.119 --> 00:31:19.400
<v Speaker 5>one thing was I was in the service and we

545
00:31:19.480 --> 00:31:21.359
<v Speaker 5>had a system called I think it was a boomerang

546
00:31:21.480 --> 00:31:26.559
<v Speaker 5>that's located various reports, uh, mainly from the small arms

547
00:31:26.559 --> 00:31:28.279
<v Speaker 5>fire UH in a.

548
00:31:28.240 --> 00:31:30.119
<v Speaker 3>Three you know, fear and SI degree matter.

549
00:31:30.680 --> 00:31:33.960
<v Speaker 5>I'm guessing it's something similar with this technology.

550
00:31:35.359 --> 00:31:40.519
<v Speaker 2>With UH, I don't know. I think we think we

551
00:31:40.640 --> 00:31:43.200
<v Speaker 2>might have lost Andy. But are you familiar either one

552
00:31:43.240 --> 00:31:45.039
<v Speaker 2>of you then with what he was trying to refer

553
00:31:45.119 --> 00:31:48.799
<v Speaker 2>to the military's version of this, Yeah.

554
00:31:48.640 --> 00:31:51.200
<v Speaker 6>There's there is a system. There was a system called boomerang,

555
00:31:51.240 --> 00:31:55.400
<v Speaker 6>which was an anti sniper technology that would often be

556
00:31:55.720 --> 00:31:58.519
<v Speaker 6>you'd have a sensor attached to humby and it could

557
00:31:58.519 --> 00:32:02.119
<v Speaker 6>tell if there's a sniper fire toward the humbie or

558
00:32:02.160 --> 00:32:05.640
<v Speaker 6>in the general vicinity of the humbie. We operate on

559
00:32:05.680 --> 00:32:09.480
<v Speaker 6>a slightly different principle just for your listeners, for them

560
00:32:09.480 --> 00:32:13.319
<v Speaker 6>to understand how the technology works. We deployed about twenty

561
00:32:13.440 --> 00:32:16.279
<v Speaker 6>to thirty censors per square mile, and the censers are

562
00:32:16.279 --> 00:32:19.799
<v Speaker 6>spread out and they're designed to activate in time, stamp

563
00:32:19.920 --> 00:32:24.319
<v Speaker 6>on impulsion noises, large sounding pops, boons, and bangs, and

564
00:32:24.359 --> 00:32:26.680
<v Speaker 6>when three or more centers are able to detect and

565
00:32:26.799 --> 00:32:30.359
<v Speaker 6>timestamp were able to use the time stamp differential to

566
00:32:30.400 --> 00:32:33.839
<v Speaker 6>be able to do a mathematical calculation to triangulate or

567
00:32:33.920 --> 00:32:37.920
<v Speaker 6>pinpoint the exact location of the gunfire and then go

568
00:32:38.039 --> 00:32:40.079
<v Speaker 6>through a couple of steps to confirm in fact that

569
00:32:40.319 --> 00:32:43.640
<v Speaker 6>pop bloomber bang was gunfire for pushing the alert out

570
00:32:43.680 --> 00:32:48.000
<v Speaker 6>to the subscribing agency, and this typically takes place within

571
00:32:48.079 --> 00:32:51.200
<v Speaker 6>thirty to forty five seconds of the trigger being pulled.

572
00:32:51.200 --> 00:32:54.839
<v Speaker 6>And this is why it represents such a game changer.

573
00:32:55.279 --> 00:32:59.240
<v Speaker 6>I think, as the commissioner stated, the difference between response,

574
00:32:59.319 --> 00:33:03.519
<v Speaker 6>the precise response to a location of a gunfire event

575
00:33:04.319 --> 00:33:07.440
<v Speaker 6>with a two to three minute advantage over the twenty

576
00:33:07.440 --> 00:33:08.960
<v Speaker 6>percent of the time you do get a nine one

577
00:33:09.039 --> 00:33:12.640
<v Speaker 6>one call can effectively make the difference between life and death.

578
00:33:12.680 --> 00:33:15.519
<v Speaker 6>And I'll just say that I know this personally because

579
00:33:15.559 --> 00:33:18.119
<v Speaker 6>one of my dear friend's life was saved as a

580
00:33:18.160 --> 00:33:21.319
<v Speaker 6>result of a shot spot alert where he was actually

581
00:33:21.359 --> 00:33:25.119
<v Speaker 6>shot and the calls came in literally two minutes after

582
00:33:25.440 --> 00:33:27.200
<v Speaker 6>and by the time the calls came in, they were

583
00:33:27.200 --> 00:33:29.960
<v Speaker 6>already had first responders there to scoop them up and

584
00:33:30.039 --> 00:33:32.240
<v Speaker 6>take them to the hospital. Whereas life was saved.

585
00:33:32.559 --> 00:33:35.960
<v Speaker 2>That is pretty incredible. CEO of shot Spotter Ralph Clark

586
00:33:36.079 --> 00:33:38.359
<v Speaker 2>is with us, along with a former Boston Police commissioner,

587
00:33:38.440 --> 00:33:41.920
<v Speaker 2>New York Police Commissioner chief in LA and he's been

588
00:33:41.920 --> 00:33:44.559
<v Speaker 2>all over the place. Here's a Boston guy, Bill Bratton

589
00:33:44.640 --> 00:33:47.319
<v Speaker 2>is with us, and we'll continue our conversation about the

590
00:33:47.680 --> 00:33:52.759
<v Speaker 2>shot spotter system and why they think the people who

591
00:33:52.839 --> 00:33:56.160
<v Speaker 2>are against it are well wrong. Ben Parker filling in

592
00:33:56.200 --> 00:33:58.200
<v Speaker 2>for Dan Ray on night Side.

593
00:33:59.599 --> 00:34:02.559
<v Speaker 1>Now back to Dan Ray live from the Window World

594
00:34:02.720 --> 00:34:03.839
<v Speaker 1>Life Side Studios.

595
00:34:03.920 --> 00:34:06.960
<v Speaker 2>I'm WBZ News Radio. All right, we're back and we're

596
00:34:07.000 --> 00:34:09.400
<v Speaker 2>talking about shot spot her. And before we get back

597
00:34:09.400 --> 00:34:11.159
<v Speaker 2>to our guests, I want to bring Andy and Merrimac

598
00:34:11.199 --> 00:34:12.840
<v Speaker 2>back because he got to cut off and I just

599
00:34:12.840 --> 00:34:15.119
<v Speaker 2>want to make sure he gets his question in fairly.

600
00:34:15.159 --> 00:34:16.039
<v Speaker 2>Hey Andy, go ahead.

601
00:34:17.400 --> 00:34:18.320
<v Speaker 5>Hey, Sorry about that.

602
00:34:18.440 --> 00:34:18.599
<v Speaker 7>Yeah.

603
00:34:18.639 --> 00:34:21.800
<v Speaker 5>No, I was mainly colleges to bring up the boomerang system,

604
00:34:21.880 --> 00:34:24.400
<v Speaker 5>and it seems like there was a familiar sort of

605
00:34:24.480 --> 00:34:30.280
<v Speaker 5>system of systems, but definitely awesome and you know, a

606
00:34:30.360 --> 00:34:34.760
<v Speaker 5>force multiplier for the police. It just, you know, for me,

607
00:34:35.199 --> 00:34:37.159
<v Speaker 5>the second part of what I was calling about with

608
00:34:37.199 --> 00:34:40.280
<v Speaker 5>the HD, I think it's the twenty two forty new

609
00:34:40.400 --> 00:34:46.039
<v Speaker 5>legislation that basically ramps up firearm control, so to say,

610
00:34:46.840 --> 00:34:49.920
<v Speaker 5>kind of marketed towards coast guns. So i'm you know,

611
00:34:49.960 --> 00:34:55.199
<v Speaker 5>if they're if they're gonna pair the law enforcement officers

612
00:34:55.280 --> 00:34:58.480
<v Speaker 5>up with this new system, it seems like we're taking

613
00:34:58.559 --> 00:35:01.960
<v Speaker 5>away you know, legal fire arms from laura biding citizens,

614
00:35:02.400 --> 00:35:06.360
<v Speaker 5>will also making more of a detriment for our law

615
00:35:06.440 --> 00:35:09.440
<v Speaker 5>enforcement personnel to respond to any sort of shot calls.

616
00:35:09.440 --> 00:35:12.000
<v Speaker 5>I don't know if you can make any opinions on it, all.

617
00:35:11.960 --> 00:35:14.400
<v Speaker 2>Right, appreciate it, Thank you, Andy. I don't know if

618
00:35:14.679 --> 00:35:17.679
<v Speaker 2>if that well, I mean, obviously, this is an argument

619
00:35:17.719 --> 00:35:19.960
<v Speaker 2>that's always made about guns, and you know the laura

620
00:35:20.039 --> 00:35:22.880
<v Speaker 2>biding one with a gun can take out a criminal

621
00:35:22.880 --> 00:35:25.960
<v Speaker 2>with a gun. But I mean you obviously, and this

622
00:35:26.079 --> 00:35:28.360
<v Speaker 2>is to either one of you. But you know, having

623
00:35:28.440 --> 00:35:32.119
<v Speaker 2>less gun play and gun fire on the streets is obviously,

624
00:35:32.239 --> 00:35:34.599
<v Speaker 2>I think every law enforcement person's goal, right.

625
00:35:36.199 --> 00:35:39.800
<v Speaker 7>So definitely that's in one of the goals of Shots Bought.

626
00:35:39.800 --> 00:35:44.119
<v Speaker 7>It is to actively identify just how much gunfire is

627
00:35:44.159 --> 00:35:48.280
<v Speaker 7>occurring in American cities, and there's a phenomenal amount of it.

628
00:35:48.360 --> 00:35:51.239
<v Speaker 7>Based on the fact that eighty to ninety percent of shots.

629
00:35:51.360 --> 00:35:54.599
<v Speaker 7>As Ralph indicated, I never called into ninety one one.

630
00:35:55.440 --> 00:36:00.519
<v Speaker 7>So the system is intended to whenever possible that shots

631
00:36:00.519 --> 00:36:02.320
<v Speaker 7>of PI it, to try to get the police there

632
00:36:02.400 --> 00:36:05.559
<v Speaker 7>quickly enough so that they can help a victim that

633
00:36:05.760 --> 00:36:09.800
<v Speaker 7>I need attention or a rest to perpetrator who's using

634
00:36:09.840 --> 00:36:14.960
<v Speaker 7>that firearm inappropriately, whether they legally possess it illegally possess it.

635
00:36:15.840 --> 00:36:17.840
<v Speaker 2>I want to think I was going to say that,

636
00:36:18.039 --> 00:36:22.760
<v Speaker 2>I just want to throw this out real quick for you, Ralph,

637
00:36:22.840 --> 00:36:26.960
<v Speaker 2>and the whole racial background, and as Bill mentioned, I mean,

638
00:36:26.960 --> 00:36:30.599
<v Speaker 2>you're African Americans, so that kind of diffuses that situation.

639
00:36:30.760 --> 00:36:34.559
<v Speaker 2>But so if you look into a place like Jamaica,

640
00:36:34.599 --> 00:36:37.360
<v Speaker 2>Plain or Roxbury or Dorchester or wherever, and sure there's

641
00:36:37.519 --> 00:36:42.599
<v Speaker 2>neighborhoods and areas there where there is predominantly African American populations.

642
00:36:42.800 --> 00:36:46.159
<v Speaker 2>But by saying that having this system in one neighborhood

643
00:36:46.199 --> 00:36:50.360
<v Speaker 2>over another is inherently racist seems weird because you would

644
00:36:50.440 --> 00:36:54.280
<v Speaker 2>be implying that no white people or other races live there,

645
00:36:54.280 --> 00:36:57.159
<v Speaker 2>and no white people or other races ever fire a

646
00:36:57.199 --> 00:36:58.320
<v Speaker 2>gun in those neighborhoods.

647
00:36:59.719 --> 00:37:02.800
<v Speaker 6>Yeah, it just doesn't come into our consideration, we want

648
00:37:02.800 --> 00:37:06.079
<v Speaker 6>to be deployed where criminal gunfire takes place. And I

649
00:37:06.079 --> 00:37:08.599
<v Speaker 6>think the critics of the system that try to make

650
00:37:08.639 --> 00:37:11.760
<v Speaker 6>it a racial issue are looking at it more from

651
00:37:11.800 --> 00:37:14.960
<v Speaker 6>a i'll call it criminal justice reform lens as opposed

652
00:37:15.000 --> 00:37:18.199
<v Speaker 6>to a victimization lens. And we spent a lot of

653
00:37:18.239 --> 00:37:22.760
<v Speaker 6>time talking about the victims of gun violence, ie gunshot victims.

654
00:37:22.800 --> 00:37:26.079
<v Speaker 6>But I think if you understood the trauma involved, especially

655
00:37:26.119 --> 00:37:29.639
<v Speaker 6>with young people that are exposed to the violence of

656
00:37:29.719 --> 00:37:32.280
<v Speaker 6>hearing gun bunts, they go to bed to the sound

657
00:37:32.320 --> 00:37:34.360
<v Speaker 6>of gun violence, they wake up to the sound of

658
00:37:34.400 --> 00:37:38.559
<v Speaker 6>gun violence. If we ever total the cost of the

659
00:37:38.679 --> 00:37:43.119
<v Speaker 6>trauma inflicted on these communities to hear and experience that

660
00:37:43.199 --> 00:37:46.119
<v Speaker 6>amount of gun bounds and then still not have police

661
00:37:46.199 --> 00:37:49.960
<v Speaker 6>and first responders be able to come to investigate and

662
00:37:50.039 --> 00:37:53.360
<v Speaker 6>treat it as a priority in care, that's further victimization.

663
00:37:53.480 --> 00:37:57.960
<v Speaker 6>That's twice victimization, and to me, that is that's racist.

664
00:37:58.000 --> 00:38:00.480
<v Speaker 6>To me, I mean, we need to care about thectims.

665
00:38:00.519 --> 00:38:03.079
<v Speaker 6>And I think when you look at it through that lench,

666
00:38:03.119 --> 00:38:06.400
<v Speaker 6>it comes to a very different conclusion than the credits.

667
00:38:06.440 --> 00:38:09.079
<v Speaker 6>So I think you're driving just to a different agenda.

668
00:38:09.519 --> 00:38:12.039
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, we're down to our last minute, but that CEO

669
00:38:12.039 --> 00:38:16.480
<v Speaker 2>of shot Spotted, Ralph Clark, and former NYPD and BPD

670
00:38:16.800 --> 00:38:19.159
<v Speaker 2>police commissioner Bill Bratton is with us. And before I

671
00:38:19.239 --> 00:38:20.760
<v Speaker 2>just want to get this out there and then I'll

672
00:38:20.840 --> 00:38:22.880
<v Speaker 2>let you guys respond to it real quickly. There was

673
00:38:22.920 --> 00:38:26.639
<v Speaker 2>this letter sent by, among others, Senator Market and Senator

674
00:38:26.639 --> 00:38:32.159
<v Speaker 2>Warren about the complaining or criticizing this technology. And before

675
00:38:32.360 --> 00:38:34.920
<v Speaker 2>you think, well, this guy's the CEO of a shot spotterer,

676
00:38:34.960 --> 00:38:36.440
<v Speaker 2>of course you're going to say this, Well, there's a

677
00:38:36.519 --> 00:38:39.119
<v Speaker 2>letter here in response to the letter that was written

678
00:38:39.119 --> 00:38:43.199
<v Speaker 2>by the lawmakers that, among other things, says, we believe

679
00:38:43.239 --> 00:38:46.440
<v Speaker 2>you've been misinformed and this formed the basis of your

680
00:38:46.480 --> 00:38:49.039
<v Speaker 2>May fourteenth letter, a letter that draws misleading and frankly

681
00:38:49.119 --> 00:38:53.639
<v Speaker 2>dangerous conclusions that compromised public safety. That letter, that part

682
00:38:53.960 --> 00:38:58.440
<v Speaker 2>of that bigger letter, was not signed by Ralph Clark.

683
00:38:58.519 --> 00:39:03.199
<v Speaker 2>It was signed by a police commissioners and chiefs all

684
00:39:03.239 --> 00:39:06.880
<v Speaker 2>across this fine state, including Michael Cox out of Boston,

685
00:39:07.599 --> 00:39:09.679
<v Speaker 2>the Cambridge, Somerville, Revere. I'm not going to read them

686
00:39:09.679 --> 00:39:13.039
<v Speaker 2>all because they'll waste too much time. So this gentleman

687
00:39:13.519 --> 00:39:17.159
<v Speaker 2>and commissioner Brighton. This shows that this is being used

688
00:39:17.159 --> 00:39:23.400
<v Speaker 2>by lots of police departments to do lots of good, and.

689
00:39:23.400 --> 00:39:26.639
<v Speaker 7>It does do lots of good in one hundred and

690
00:39:26.639 --> 00:39:30.039
<v Speaker 7>seventy cities around America and Ralph.

691
00:39:29.800 --> 00:39:31.199
<v Speaker 2>I'll let you get the kind of the last word

692
00:39:31.239 --> 00:39:33.880
<v Speaker 2>in here. Obviously, you're not going to give up trying

693
00:39:33.880 --> 00:39:37.280
<v Speaker 2>to use your technology to save the lives that you

694
00:39:37.400 --> 00:39:38.239
<v Speaker 2>say it does save.

695
00:39:39.559 --> 00:39:39.599
<v Speaker 3>No.

696
00:39:39.760 --> 00:39:44.159
<v Speaker 6>Absolutely, it's a calling for myself and my other three

697
00:39:44.280 --> 00:39:47.880
<v Speaker 6>hundred plus colleagues. This is a mission orient work. We

698
00:39:48.000 --> 00:39:51.559
<v Speaker 6>care deeply about this work and the significance of it

699
00:39:51.639 --> 00:39:55.840
<v Speaker 6>in terms of saving lives and helping hold police in

700
00:39:55.920 --> 00:40:00.280
<v Speaker 6>first responders to be more accountable, to prioritize responding to

701
00:40:00.679 --> 00:40:03.199
<v Speaker 6>ongoing persistent gun violence. And I think I would just

702
00:40:03.199 --> 00:40:05.199
<v Speaker 6>add to I know there was a letter from the

703
00:40:05.480 --> 00:40:07.800
<v Speaker 6>chiefs of police and commissioners, but I think it's also

704
00:40:07.880 --> 00:40:12.039
<v Speaker 6>important to note that your mayor, who some would argue

705
00:40:12.119 --> 00:40:14.880
<v Speaker 6>is a progressive mayor, is very supportive of the technology

706
00:40:14.880 --> 00:40:16.760
<v Speaker 6>as well. And I can say that coming from a

707
00:40:16.800 --> 00:40:19.239
<v Speaker 6>place like Oakland, California, which I was born and raised

708
00:40:19.239 --> 00:40:22.480
<v Speaker 6>and currently live, that also is known to have progressive chops.

709
00:40:22.679 --> 00:40:25.280
<v Speaker 6>It's used in Oakland as well, and so I think

710
00:40:25.400 --> 00:40:29.559
<v Speaker 6>progressive mayors in political leadership that really understand the value

711
00:40:29.559 --> 00:40:32.519
<v Speaker 6>of life and understand how important it is to support

712
00:40:32.559 --> 00:40:36.639
<v Speaker 6>police and do a better job in responding to these

713
00:40:36.719 --> 00:40:39.400
<v Speaker 6>communities and the issues around gun violence. I think is

714
00:40:39.440 --> 00:40:42.559
<v Speaker 6>incredibly important and we count them as very valuable allies.

715
00:40:42.599 --> 00:40:43.199
<v Speaker 7>All us work.

716
00:40:43.280 --> 00:40:44.840
<v Speaker 2>Thank you, I appreciate it. We'll let you guys go.

717
00:40:45.079 --> 00:40:47.840
<v Speaker 2>That was a CEO of a shot spotter, Ralph Clark,

718
00:40:47.880 --> 00:40:50.920
<v Speaker 2>and the former of BPD and NYPD and Chief out

719
00:40:50.920 --> 00:40:53.639
<v Speaker 2>in La Bill Bratton, joining the show to talk about it.

720
00:40:53.719 --> 00:40:55.599
<v Speaker 2>We will have much more coming up. Perhaps you've been

721
00:40:55.639 --> 00:40:58.199
<v Speaker 2>watching the Olympics, maybe you haven't. We'll talk about the

722
00:40:58.199 --> 00:41:01.360
<v Speaker 2>Olympics straight ahead on nights side of d BC m

723
00:41:01.559 --> 00:41:01.679
<v Speaker 2>HM