WEBVTT 1 00:00:04.919 --> 00:00:06.599 It's the Opperman Report. 2 00:00:07.080 --> 00:00:11.000 Joined digital forensic investigator in PI Ed Opperman for an 3 00:00:11.000 --> 00:00:15.679 in depth discussion of conspiracy theories, strategy of New World 4 00:00:15.839 --> 00:00:20.280 Order resistance, hi profile court cases in the news, and 5 00:00:20.440 --> 00:00:24.800 interviews with expert guests and authors on these topics and more. 6 00:00:25.359 --> 00:00:31.879 It's the Opperman Report. And now here is Investigator Ed Opperman. 7 00:00:36.679 --> 00:00:39.640 Okay, welcome to the Opperman Report. 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Our next 78 00:04:20.120 --> 00:04:23.839 guest today is Eric Auday and this is the most 79 00:04:23.839 --> 00:04:25.879 incredible story you're going to hear in a long time. 80 00:04:26.120 --> 00:04:29.199 He's just done a documentary film called Three Years in Pakistan, 81 00:04:29.680 --> 00:04:34.920 The Eric Auday Story aude and basically, the guy got 82 00:04:35.279 --> 00:04:40.079 caught over there with some opium, smuggling some opium and 83 00:04:40.439 --> 00:04:42.720 had spent three years on a Pakistani prison where they 84 00:04:42.759 --> 00:04:48.240 were beating his feet on a daily basis really really 85 00:04:48.279 --> 00:04:52.279 intense stuff. Eric Auday, are you there, I'm here, How 86 00:04:52.319 --> 00:04:55.600 you doing? Thank you so much, man, I really appreciate this. Uh, 87 00:04:55.759 --> 00:04:57.439 tell us about yourself? Who is Eric Day? 88 00:04:58.800 --> 00:05:02.639 Oh? Well, I'm I'm a poker player. I'm a stuntman, 89 00:05:02.720 --> 00:05:06.680 a stunt coordinator. Sometimes. I'm an actor of en acting 90 00:05:06.720 --> 00:05:07.959 for twenty seven years. 91 00:05:08.120 --> 00:05:11.759 And I know, I just I try to be a 92 00:05:11.759 --> 00:05:13.399 happy guy and I go through life. 93 00:05:13.160 --> 00:05:15.680 As easily as possible. That's about it. 94 00:05:15.959 --> 00:05:18.160 Yeah, that's how you come off in this film, and 95 00:05:18.279 --> 00:05:21.720 like a really likable guy and very extensive to IMDb page, 96 00:05:21.720 --> 00:05:23.560 a lot of film mark You've done a lot of stuff. 97 00:05:25.519 --> 00:05:27.879 One thing I was interested in, though, is you got 98 00:05:27.959 --> 00:05:29.639 hit by a bus when you were eight years old? 99 00:05:31.759 --> 00:05:35.920 Not hit, but run over. I got run over by 100 00:05:35.920 --> 00:05:38.040 a bus when I was eight. 101 00:05:38.240 --> 00:05:41.759 I spent a couple almost two years in a wheelchair. 102 00:05:42.399 --> 00:05:47.120 I had over fifty surgeries, and I had my urethras 103 00:05:47.199 --> 00:05:50.879 severed and reconnected. I'm the first person on earth to 104 00:05:50.879 --> 00:05:53.399 have that happen. But yeah, I was in the hospital 105 00:05:53.439 --> 00:05:57.560 for a long time, and you know, from an early age, 106 00:05:57.600 --> 00:06:02.160 I had to deal with pain and a lot of suffering, 107 00:06:02.199 --> 00:06:04.360 and that was that was my life. 108 00:06:04.360 --> 00:06:05.199 That was the life, I know. 109 00:06:05.600 --> 00:06:06.839 Yeah, but then you went on to be like a 110 00:06:06.920 --> 00:06:08.800 high school foot post star and stuff like that. 111 00:06:09.480 --> 00:06:13.639 I was told I'd never walk again, and not only 112 00:06:13.680 --> 00:06:16.720 did that, I do that, But yeah, I played for 113 00:06:16.759 --> 00:06:20.519 a small high school called Bethel Christian up in Lancaster, 114 00:06:20.639 --> 00:06:22.079 and it was a small school. 115 00:06:22.120 --> 00:06:24.879 We had a small division, but I probably proke. 116 00:06:24.639 --> 00:06:28.079 State records with with tackles for a defensive end, and 117 00:06:28.120 --> 00:06:31.240 those records hold to this day. So it turned out that, 118 00:06:32.240 --> 00:06:34.519 you know, it was a lot luckier than most would 119 00:06:34.519 --> 00:06:36.240 have been in my position. I was told I never 120 00:06:36.279 --> 00:06:38.759 walk again and end up doing pretty good in the 121 00:06:39.439 --> 00:06:41.000 inn the high school football world. 122 00:06:41.160 --> 00:06:42.720 And that's in Bethel, Pennsylvania. 123 00:06:43.360 --> 00:06:47.240 No, no, no, that's this is this is Lancaster, California. 124 00:06:47.079 --> 00:06:51.279 Lancaster, California. Okay, okay, And did you go to college 125 00:06:51.279 --> 00:06:52.079 on a scholarship? 126 00:06:54.079 --> 00:06:57.160 I was offered. I was offered like partial scholarships the 127 00:06:57.279 --> 00:06:59.439 smaller colleges, but I didn't want to go. 128 00:06:59.480 --> 00:07:01.120 I wanted to be an actor and a stunt man, 129 00:07:01.160 --> 00:07:03.720 and I moved down to La as soon as I could. 130 00:07:04.600 --> 00:07:07.839 So no, okay, and what about like any residual pain 131 00:07:07.879 --> 00:07:08.879 from this bus incident. 132 00:07:09.920 --> 00:07:12.439 Yeah, for the rest of my life, I'll be I'll 133 00:07:12.439 --> 00:07:14.600 be in pain. But you get used to it, you know, 134 00:07:14.639 --> 00:07:17.279 if you get an ache in your and your hip 135 00:07:17.319 --> 00:07:18.560 and your shoulders and your and. 136 00:07:18.519 --> 00:07:20.720 Your legs, you just get used to it. 137 00:07:20.920 --> 00:07:26.360 So I'm I've gotten used to kidney pains, I've gotten 138 00:07:26.399 --> 00:07:30.279 used to hit pains, And it's sort of why I've 139 00:07:30.319 --> 00:07:32.920 become a stunt man, because I've been just used to 140 00:07:32.959 --> 00:07:34.079 pain my entire life. 141 00:07:34.480 --> 00:07:36.839 Okay, so no pain management, no pain meds. 142 00:07:37.800 --> 00:07:40.439 No. I became when I was a kid. 143 00:07:40.439 --> 00:07:42.759 I became addicted to him, and I'm talking like when 144 00:07:42.759 --> 00:07:45.240 I was eight years old, so they had to weed 145 00:07:45.279 --> 00:07:47.639 me off of it because eventually it wasn't working anyways. 146 00:07:49.240 --> 00:07:51.439 Fascinating life, man, I got to tell you, fascinating When 147 00:07:51.439 --> 00:07:53.120 are we going to get into this whole thing? So 148 00:07:53.279 --> 00:07:55.519 why don't you tell us what happened here with the 149 00:07:55.560 --> 00:07:58.160 whole how you got involved with the smuggling operation. 150 00:07:58.800 --> 00:08:05.519 Well, well see, you're you're discribing it really kind of badly. Actually, Okay, yeah, 151 00:08:06.720 --> 00:08:08.279 I had no idea it was a smuggling I mean, 152 00:08:08.279 --> 00:08:09.759 did you watch the documentary? 153 00:08:09.920 --> 00:08:12.560 Yeah, yeah, yeah, okay, what did you take away from 154 00:08:12.560 --> 00:08:12.879 the duck? 155 00:08:13.120 --> 00:08:15.240 Well, yeah, that you would they tricked you into into 156 00:08:15.839 --> 00:08:18.000 getting jackets or something, leather goods and stuff like that. 157 00:08:18.040 --> 00:08:19.959 You were traveling for this guy horning the gym, right. 158 00:08:20.600 --> 00:08:26.000 Yeah, all right, Well you know it's I was hired 159 00:08:26.040 --> 00:08:29.560 to unknowingly smuggle opium, and that's what happened. 160 00:08:29.560 --> 00:08:30.560 I was I was. 161 00:08:30.480 --> 00:08:32.759 Working for a good friend of mine, and I thought 162 00:08:32.759 --> 00:08:37.159 I was importing expensive leather goods from different countries and 163 00:08:37.200 --> 00:08:39.279 getting a free trip and getting a little spending money 164 00:08:39.320 --> 00:08:43.000 for it. The trips originally were to Turkey, and I'd 165 00:08:43.039 --> 00:08:45.279 get a free trip. I'd go and explore Turkey, come 166 00:08:45.320 --> 00:08:48.919 back through Sweden, I'd have a great time, and by 167 00:08:49.720 --> 00:08:52.679 being hired to import expensive leather goods to beat the 168 00:08:52.720 --> 00:08:56.000 fifty five percent import text back into the US, I 169 00:08:56.080 --> 00:08:58.200 begin a free trip and my friend would be saving 170 00:08:58.200 --> 00:08:59.600 a lot of money on the import tax. 171 00:08:59.720 --> 00:09:02.440 So was a win win. And it turned out that 172 00:09:02.879 --> 00:09:03.919 me and several other. 173 00:09:03.799 --> 00:09:06.679 People were being used to unknowingly smuggle opium, and I 174 00:09:06.720 --> 00:09:07.480 would be the one. 175 00:09:07.360 --> 00:09:09.879 To find out the hard way, right after nine to eleven. 176 00:09:09.720 --> 00:09:13.440 That we were actually being used as dupes, not mules. 177 00:09:13.559 --> 00:09:18.639 Mules are people who knowingly are smuggling illegal contraband. Dupes 178 00:09:18.679 --> 00:09:21.519 have no idea they're being used to smuggle illegal contraband. 179 00:09:22.679 --> 00:09:25.120 I thought it was bad enough to be beating the 180 00:09:25.120 --> 00:09:29.159 import text by bringing in expensive other goods. And we 181 00:09:29.159 --> 00:09:31.559 were told they were bringing in anywhere from twenty five 182 00:09:31.600 --> 00:09:33.519 to thirty thousand dollars worth of leather goods, and we 183 00:09:33.519 --> 00:09:37.639 were saving him fifteen to sixteen thousand dollars on the 184 00:09:37.639 --> 00:09:39.840 import text. And it turned out the leather goods was 185 00:09:39.919 --> 00:09:43.200 just a smoke screen to keep us ignorant of what 186 00:09:43.200 --> 00:09:45.039 it was that we were really being used to bring in, 187 00:09:45.080 --> 00:09:46.240 and that was narcotics. 188 00:09:46.360 --> 00:09:48.039 And I was the one who found out the hard way. 189 00:09:48.320 --> 00:09:49.840 How much were you getting paid for trip? 190 00:09:50.519 --> 00:09:51.440 Eight hundred bucks? 191 00:09:51.559 --> 00:09:52.759 Eight hundred bucks? Okay? 192 00:09:53.480 --> 00:09:57.000 And I'd go through that, you know, in my first 193 00:09:57.000 --> 00:10:00.000 few days on food alone, food and. 194 00:10:00.080 --> 00:10:04.519 Expensive food and exciting you know, adventures and movies and 195 00:10:05.039 --> 00:10:08.200 dinners and all that. So the trip for mean the 196 00:10:08.799 --> 00:10:09.279 I would have. 197 00:10:09.200 --> 00:10:12.679 Done these trips for free, because the triple, the trip 198 00:10:12.720 --> 00:10:15.240 in itself to a to a nineteen year old kid 199 00:10:15.759 --> 00:10:16.679 was the payment. 200 00:10:17.480 --> 00:10:18.960 Gotcha, okay? I was gonna ask you next. You were 201 00:10:19.000 --> 00:10:22.159 nineteen years old. When you were doing this, Okay, Now, 202 00:10:22.240 --> 00:10:24.039 when you were taking these trips back and forth, you 203 00:10:24.399 --> 00:10:27.159 were passing through customs and through were they examining their 204 00:10:27.159 --> 00:10:28.240 dogs and stuff like that? 205 00:10:28.960 --> 00:10:32.120 Yeah, well the customs were there. 206 00:10:32.200 --> 00:10:35.039 I went through customs in Turkey, went through customs in Sweden. 207 00:10:35.080 --> 00:10:37.000 I went through customs at JFK Report. 208 00:10:37.679 --> 00:10:39.799 And you know, the first few trips I made, no 209 00:10:39.840 --> 00:10:40.799 one found anything. 210 00:10:40.879 --> 00:10:42.080 No one was ever the wiser. 211 00:10:43.399 --> 00:10:45.799 Okay said, then what happened at that that trip where 212 00:10:45.799 --> 00:10:46.360 you got caught? 213 00:10:47.480 --> 00:10:48.320 Uh? 214 00:10:48.480 --> 00:10:51.200 And I was in Islamabad. I was in Pakistan. The 215 00:10:51.240 --> 00:10:54.360 trips weren't originally to Pakistan. This was the trip was 216 00:10:54.399 --> 00:10:57.159 a mess up, messed up for the for the very 217 00:10:57.159 --> 00:10:59.039 get go. Wasn't even supposed to be my trip. It 218 00:10:59.080 --> 00:11:01.559 was supposed to be my old brother's trip. But when 219 00:11:01.600 --> 00:11:03.200 he found out it was to the Middle East, he 220 00:11:03.240 --> 00:11:06.480 backed out. He wasn't adventurous enough to go. And me 221 00:11:06.639 --> 00:11:08.360 had been a loyal friend. Didn't want to let my 222 00:11:08.399 --> 00:11:11.320 friend down because I had encouraged this job to my 223 00:11:11.519 --> 00:11:12.039 brother and. 224 00:11:12.039 --> 00:11:12.799 I and. 225 00:11:14.919 --> 00:11:18.799 In Islamabad I found out the hard way. That yeah, 226 00:11:18.799 --> 00:11:20.120 I found out the hard way. In as long as 227 00:11:20.159 --> 00:11:24.080 bad there was either someone either blew a whistle or 228 00:11:24.480 --> 00:11:27.039 the cop was just a really good cop and and 229 00:11:27.120 --> 00:11:30.279 did his uh, did his job. And it looked weird 230 00:11:30.320 --> 00:11:32.120 that a white guy was in Islama bad it was 231 00:11:32.120 --> 00:11:34.960 the only white you know, well, I was the only American, 232 00:11:35.039 --> 00:11:37.879 the only white person in the airport, so I stood 233 00:11:37.879 --> 00:11:38.519 out pretty good. 234 00:11:39.080 --> 00:11:41.240 Now, how about when you were on the previous trips, 235 00:11:41.240 --> 00:11:43.759 like when you were handling these leather goods, you couldn't 236 00:11:43.759 --> 00:11:45.799 find anything like hidden compartments and stuff. 237 00:11:45.799 --> 00:11:48.799 You didn't notice that if you opened up those suitcase, 238 00:11:48.879 --> 00:11:51.679 it looked like an empty suitcase you could fill around 239 00:11:51.720 --> 00:11:52.480 and everything it was. 240 00:11:52.559 --> 00:11:56.799 It was an empty, empty, very light suitcase. 241 00:11:57.000 --> 00:12:01.039 But drug drug smugglers are shame still get their products 242 00:12:01.039 --> 00:12:03.200 across any way they can, and they're they're great at 243 00:12:03.200 --> 00:12:05.200 what they do at hiding jobs, and they you know, 244 00:12:05.240 --> 00:12:07.279 they're they're going to continue to do this until the 245 00:12:07.360 --> 00:12:07.840 end of time. 246 00:12:08.399 --> 00:12:10.559 So the drugs were hidden in the suitcase, not in 247 00:12:10.559 --> 00:12:11.559 the actual leather goods. 248 00:12:11.960 --> 00:12:13.120 Had nothing to do with the leather. 249 00:12:13.720 --> 00:12:15.480 If I taken those leather jackets and put them in 250 00:12:15.480 --> 00:12:16.759 another suitcase. 251 00:12:17.799 --> 00:12:18.840 You would have been in trouble man. 252 00:12:20.200 --> 00:12:21.120 I would have I would have. 253 00:12:21.159 --> 00:12:23.600 Known that something was obviously up by their reaction when 254 00:12:23.600 --> 00:12:25.039 they were pissed off that I gave them. 255 00:12:25.399 --> 00:12:27.759 Oh yeah, the other suitcase got jacked up. Here's the 256 00:12:27.799 --> 00:12:28.960 suitcase here, You're welcome. 257 00:12:29.159 --> 00:12:31.240 It got wet. You know the other suitcase count wet? 258 00:12:31.240 --> 00:12:32.279 I butt you knew it? 259 00:12:33.080 --> 00:12:36.279 Well, yeah, obviously if i'd known then what I know now, 260 00:12:36.519 --> 00:12:38.960 I wouldn't have done the trip, but I would have 261 00:12:39.039 --> 00:12:40.960 been able to pick up that. They're why are you 262 00:12:40.960 --> 00:12:43.320 so mad about a suitcase? I don't understand, because the 263 00:12:43.440 --> 00:12:44.759 jackets was the job. 264 00:12:45.440 --> 00:12:48.519 Now what about how much were how much drugs were 265 00:12:48.519 --> 00:12:51.159 they concealing in these suitcases? You know? 266 00:12:51.399 --> 00:12:53.799 Well, I only know from the one time I got caught, 267 00:12:53.879 --> 00:12:55.799 and that was three point six kg. 268 00:12:57.080 --> 00:12:59.440 So three kilograms I guess, right. And how much is 269 00:12:59.480 --> 00:13:00.039 that worth. 270 00:13:01.679 --> 00:13:02.919 Worth? Like in money? 271 00:13:02.960 --> 00:13:06.720 I don't know, Okay, not a drug smuggler, I don't know. 272 00:13:06.799 --> 00:13:08.679 You never found out for all these years, you never 273 00:13:08.679 --> 00:13:10.720 found out what the street value was and how would 274 00:13:10.720 --> 00:13:12.720 you cost over there in Pakistan or Turkey? What this 275 00:13:12.879 --> 00:13:13.919 was going for over there? 276 00:13:14.639 --> 00:13:16.759 Uh? No, I was in jail. I was in jail 277 00:13:16.840 --> 00:13:18.039 trying to fight for my insence. 278 00:13:18.080 --> 00:13:20.279 I wasn't out there trying to find out how much 279 00:13:20.320 --> 00:13:22.960 exactly that I was being used to smuggle, because that 280 00:13:23.039 --> 00:13:24.000 wasn't my priority. 281 00:13:24.039 --> 00:13:25.840 My priority was getting out of prison. No. 282 00:13:25.919 --> 00:13:27.799 So really so even while you were there in prison 283 00:13:27.840 --> 00:13:30.240 talking to the other prisoners, and you must have chatted 284 00:13:30.279 --> 00:13:32.200 about you know, what you're in for, that kind of stuff. 285 00:13:32.559 --> 00:13:34.600 Okay, have you been have you been to jail in Pakistan? 286 00:13:34.720 --> 00:13:35.679 Not in Pakistan? Though? 287 00:13:36.440 --> 00:13:38.320 How many people do you think speak English and pacts? Oh? 288 00:13:38.360 --> 00:13:40.279 Yeah, that's another thing too, right okay, prime? Right? 289 00:13:40.360 --> 00:13:40.480 Right? 290 00:13:40.600 --> 00:13:42.679 Can that make see you? Because not very many? 291 00:13:42.840 --> 00:13:47.080 Okay, So the conversations in Pakistan weren't Hey, by the way, 292 00:13:47.120 --> 00:13:50.000 you're carrying this much amount and opium and this is 293 00:13:50.000 --> 00:13:51.360 how you cut it, and this is how you sell 294 00:13:51.399 --> 00:13:52.759 it and this is how you move it. No, this 295 00:13:52.840 --> 00:13:57.879 is the questions were why are you American? The Americans evil? 296 00:13:58.279 --> 00:14:01.399 Do you like George Bush? What do you think about Israel? 297 00:14:01.480 --> 00:14:03.519 Those are the questions that people ask you if they 298 00:14:03.519 --> 00:14:05.639 can even speak English. 299 00:14:05.759 --> 00:14:09.200 Okay, let's go to the first Let's start when when 300 00:14:09.240 --> 00:14:11.840 you got caught. Okay, when you got busted and they 301 00:14:11.840 --> 00:14:14.559 picked up described to us at first he didn't think 302 00:14:14.600 --> 00:14:16.600 anything was wrong, right, So, so what happened at there? 303 00:14:16.639 --> 00:14:17.120 At the airport. 304 00:14:17.159 --> 00:14:23.840 It was I guess right, yeah, when they first got caught, well, 305 00:14:23.879 --> 00:14:25.240 that was the second they found the drugs. 306 00:14:25.240 --> 00:14:25.919 I was panicking. 307 00:14:26.720 --> 00:14:29.399 I tried to They said they were going to hang 308 00:14:29.440 --> 00:14:30.679 me after five o'clock prayer. 309 00:14:30.759 --> 00:14:32.799 I mean it went from they went from. 310 00:14:32.799 --> 00:14:35.600 Zero to ninety nine miles an. 311 00:14:35.559 --> 00:14:36.440 Hour so fast. 312 00:14:37.639 --> 00:14:40.159 When they said they were going to hang me, I panicked. 313 00:14:40.159 --> 00:14:43.639 I rushed to another room to try to find a phone. 314 00:14:43.639 --> 00:14:45.879 I found a phone, and I started calling my manager. 315 00:14:45.919 --> 00:14:47.960 I wanted to call my manager, and my goal was 316 00:14:48.000 --> 00:14:50.559 simply for to tell him because he knew exactly what 317 00:14:50.600 --> 00:14:51.039 I was doing. 318 00:14:51.080 --> 00:14:51.679 He knew I was. 319 00:14:52.120 --> 00:14:53.840 I was working for this man to travel in the 320 00:14:53.879 --> 00:14:56.360 world and important expensive other goods. 321 00:14:56.360 --> 00:14:59.159 I wanted him to warn the others that this was 322 00:14:59.440 --> 00:15:01.200 that we were being used a smuggle opium. 323 00:15:01.279 --> 00:15:02.600 I figured, if I'm going to die, I want to 324 00:15:02.600 --> 00:15:05.320 at least make my life worth something. Turn Out, the 325 00:15:05.360 --> 00:15:06.799 guy who told me they were going to hang me 326 00:15:06.960 --> 00:15:09.000 was just kidding. But by then I look like a 327 00:15:09.360 --> 00:15:10.279 looked like an asshole. 328 00:15:10.279 --> 00:15:11.519 They said. I tried to escape. 329 00:15:11.960 --> 00:15:14.679 The DEA came to the airport to talk to me, 330 00:15:14.679 --> 00:15:16.279 but they didn't believe a word out of my mouth, 331 00:15:16.320 --> 00:15:19.279 because in their eyes, possession is ten tenths of the law. 332 00:15:19.600 --> 00:15:22.279 People think, well, you're either in on it or you're 333 00:15:22.320 --> 00:15:24.679 so stupid that you deserve to be in jail. Anyways, 334 00:15:25.320 --> 00:15:30.360 Well it makes sense to me because if a drug 335 00:15:30.399 --> 00:15:32.720 smuggler can pay you to do the job for them 336 00:15:33.000 --> 00:15:35.000 and not tell you about it, that they're going to 337 00:15:35.039 --> 00:15:36.799 save a lot of money by keeping you in the dark. 338 00:15:36.840 --> 00:15:39.360 They also figure you won't draw suspicion. 339 00:15:38.919 --> 00:15:42.519 To yourself because you don't know you're being used to travel. 340 00:15:42.200 --> 00:15:43.039 With anything illegal. 341 00:15:44.960 --> 00:15:47.120 Before I went to jail, I thought, oh, yeah, if 342 00:15:47.480 --> 00:15:50.399 you're arrested, you're guilty right away. Now, I believe the 343 00:15:50.399 --> 00:15:53.559 majority of people, especially for narcotics related. 344 00:15:53.200 --> 00:15:55.039 Cases, or innocent. I think a lot of people in 345 00:15:55.080 --> 00:15:55.440 jail in. 346 00:15:55.399 --> 00:15:59.440 General are innestent, especially in Pakistan, because in Pakistan. 347 00:15:59.000 --> 00:16:02.399 They will beat They will beat you until you admit. 348 00:16:02.200 --> 00:16:04.279 To the crimes that you're part of, or until you 349 00:16:04.279 --> 00:16:07.600 give up names of people, and they'll start naming off 350 00:16:07.639 --> 00:16:11.000 anyone that they can't think of who has nothing to 351 00:16:11.080 --> 00:16:13.360 do with the crime they're being accused of, simply to 352 00:16:13.399 --> 00:16:15.600 get the beatens to stop so and then when they 353 00:16:15.600 --> 00:16:18.440 grab those new people, those people will start naming off 354 00:16:18.519 --> 00:16:20.559 names to get the beatens to stop. So there are 355 00:16:20.600 --> 00:16:23.159 so many layers of people who are in jail, especially 356 00:16:23.200 --> 00:16:27.279 in Pakistan, for crimes they had nothing or no knowledge about, 357 00:16:27.759 --> 00:16:28.879 but they either admitted to. 358 00:16:28.840 --> 00:16:31.159 It simply to stop getting beat. 359 00:16:31.279 --> 00:16:33.879 Oh you know, explain it though. This isn't some rogue 360 00:16:33.960 --> 00:16:38.240 cops bending the rules. This is their law. There there 361 00:16:38.279 --> 00:16:39.840 are a lots of torture, a confession out of you. 362 00:16:40.440 --> 00:16:42.799 Yeah, it's called physical or man, they're legally allowed to 363 00:16:42.840 --> 00:16:45.279 beat you. I mean people here see oh I got slapped, 364 00:16:45.360 --> 00:16:46.320 No it ell was slapping? 365 00:16:46.399 --> 00:16:48.159 Is I wish it was a slap? 366 00:16:48.320 --> 00:16:51.120 Beating you there is is hitting the bottom of your 367 00:16:51.120 --> 00:16:53.639 feet with a cane, electric cuting you, hanging you up 368 00:16:53.720 --> 00:16:57.080 like a punching bag, punching you like one drowning you, 369 00:16:57.679 --> 00:17:01.440 and then repeating. And the judge it's up to the 370 00:17:01.519 --> 00:17:04.240 judge in the lower the lower courts to decide how 371 00:17:04.240 --> 00:17:07.720 many days of physical remand you get. The prosecutor in 372 00:17:07.720 --> 00:17:11.119 my case wanted ten days, but she only got three. 373 00:17:11.200 --> 00:17:13.119 In those three days, I was torture. But there's people 374 00:17:13.119 --> 00:17:15.799 who last, you know, sometimes they get they get weeks 375 00:17:16.400 --> 00:17:18.680 uh and people die all the time in Pakistan because 376 00:17:18.680 --> 00:17:19.799 of physical Remand. 377 00:17:21.160 --> 00:17:24.359 Okay, so when they start doing this to you, did 378 00:17:24.440 --> 00:17:26.920 you I saw from the movie you did right away 379 00:17:26.960 --> 00:17:29.279 start naming names of this guy who sent you over. 380 00:17:29.160 --> 00:17:34.079 There, right I named one name, Ray Gazarian? 381 00:17:34.359 --> 00:17:37.000 Right now, what about did you know the names that 382 00:17:37.000 --> 00:17:38.880 are people you were meeting with in Pakistan? That kind 383 00:17:38.880 --> 00:17:39.240 of snuff. 384 00:17:40.440 --> 00:17:41.000 At the time. 385 00:17:41.039 --> 00:17:43.799 I knew like first names Joseph and I forget the 386 00:17:43.799 --> 00:17:44.559 other guy's name. 387 00:17:44.599 --> 00:17:48.400 I knew those guys, but my contact was Ray. He 388 00:17:48.480 --> 00:17:49.880 made it, you know, it was all about Ray. 389 00:17:49.880 --> 00:17:51.720 They came to the I was picked up from the 390 00:17:51.839 --> 00:17:55.160 airport and then driven to the hotel. They left me 391 00:17:55.200 --> 00:17:57.519 at I was supposed to hang with these guys for 392 00:17:57.599 --> 00:17:59.319 the week, but they said that Ray messed up and 393 00:17:59.359 --> 00:18:02.279 I was supposed to me to Karachi, which is nowhere 394 00:18:02.319 --> 00:18:03.240 near Islamabad. 395 00:18:03.359 --> 00:18:05.039 Karachi's way way way south. 396 00:18:07.039 --> 00:18:09.599 And so instead of hanging out with me for a week, 397 00:18:10.160 --> 00:18:12.400 you know, and showing me around and keeping me safe, 398 00:18:12.440 --> 00:18:14.960 which is what one of the one of the enticing 399 00:18:15.000 --> 00:18:17.400 factors that Ray says, Hey, you're because when you hear 400 00:18:17.400 --> 00:18:19.599 the word Pakistan, no one wants to go to Pakistan. 401 00:18:19.680 --> 00:18:21.160