Speaker 1: Hey, this is christ with Hacking your Leadership. On today's
Speaker 1: discussion around employee engagement. I want to kind of do
Speaker 1: a follow up to the episode that we published on
Speaker 1: Monday three days ago. We were talking about accountability and
Speaker 1: we had a tremendous amount of engagement from listeners, lots
Speaker 1: of LinkedIn and Instagram messages from people who are you know,
Speaker 1: we're wondering how best to hold people accountable when it
Speaker 1: comes to you know, the expectations, and it you know,
Speaker 1: it got Lorenzo and I thinking about. One of the
Speaker 1: most important elements of accountability is coaching. Because if if
Speaker 1: the coach, if the accountability is on something that is
Speaker 1: very clearly known and and you know, you know what
Speaker 1: the rules are, the employee knows what the rules are,
Speaker 1: and a rule was broken and it's very black and white,
Speaker 1: then fine, maybe you don't need a lot of coaching
Speaker 1: for that. You just need to make sure that they're
Speaker 1: held accountable. But a lot of accountability ends up falling
Speaker 1: on the heads of people who didn't have the skills
Speaker 1: or the training, or the knowledge or the leadership to
Speaker 1: accomplish the thing that they're now being held accountable for,
Speaker 1: and that never feels good and so a strong culture
Speaker 1: of accountability has to come with a strong culture of coaching.
Speaker 1: And there are very specific elements when it comes to
Speaker 1: effective coaching cultures that will help you in terms of
Speaker 1: holding people accountable and at the very least, it can
Speaker 1: help you as a leader sleep well at night knowing
Speaker 1: that if you have to hold somebody accountable for something,
Speaker 1: that you're never wondering whether or not you gave them
Speaker 1: the tools and resources and skills and abilities and support
Speaker 1: that they needed to get it done to begin with,
Speaker 1: and that their their lack of ability to get the
Speaker 1: lack of it getting done is not rooted in anything
Speaker 1: that you had the responsibility to provide from them in
Speaker 1: the first place.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, I could go on for days. Yeah,
Speaker 2: talk about coaching and accountability.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I think that there is so much to talk about
Speaker 2: an unpack here because I think that for me, when
Speaker 2: it comes to you know, we term we throw the
Speaker 2: term coaching around all the time everywhere for everything, and
Speaker 2: it is the right term, like essence, it's the right term.
Speaker 2: I think where we get lost a little bit when
Speaker 2: it comes to coaching and accountability is that that's where
Speaker 2: we start. We think that coaching is accountability without the
Speaker 2: true and belief of coaching is the intention of helping
Speaker 2: somebody get better at something that they want to get
Speaker 2: better at, you know what I mean, Like I don't
Speaker 2: I don't go to like the local playground and see
Speaker 2: kids playing somewhere and then start coaching them and be
Speaker 2: like you you could, you could swing on those bars
Speaker 2: faster if you do it this way, bring your elbows in. Hey, Like,
Speaker 2: I'm gonna go down to the local park where some
Speaker 2: people are playing basketball and start telling them how they
Speaker 2: should run plays or what they should do. Like they
Speaker 2: didn't raise their hand to want to say, I'd like
Speaker 2: for you to spend time focused on telling me what
Speaker 2: to do to get better at this thing. I'm just
Speaker 2: doing this thing right. Yeah, And I think that I
Speaker 2: think that we forget that there's an element of coaching
Speaker 2: that that is really based within culture. It's based within trust,
Speaker 2: it's based within the relationship. That there should be an
Speaker 2: expectation that if you work at a job and you
Speaker 2: want to paycheck and you want to do things, that
Speaker 2: you should be focused on doing those things well, and
Speaker 2: that if you want to continue to work there, you
Speaker 2: should get better at those things that you're focused on
Speaker 2: Like that, that makes total sense to me. But I
Speaker 2: think sometimes we jump into this idea of coaching and
Speaker 2: immediately start with here's what I see in what you're
Speaker 2: not good at, and therefore I'm here to make you
Speaker 2: better at that, versus me saying Chris, let me tell
Speaker 2: you what my role of coaches, my role of coach
Speaker 2: in all of this together as I'm coaching you is,
Speaker 2: I want to see what you do. I want to
Speaker 2: jump in and help to correct it. We're going to
Speaker 2: do this together. I'm going to be really focused on
Speaker 2: what you're doing so that I can best help give
Speaker 2: you advice on getting better at the thing that you're
Speaker 2: working on. But here's what I need from you in this,
Speaker 2: Like I need to know that you want to get
Speaker 2: better at this thing. I need to know that you
Speaker 2: are committed to putting into practice when I'm giving you,
Speaker 2: and I want you to know that like this is
Speaker 2: not like, it's not personal. I'm not attacking or trying
Speaker 2: to tell you to be a different person or telling
Speaker 2: you that all things you're doing are wrong. But like,
Speaker 2: for us to have a great relationship from a coach standpoint,
Speaker 2: we both have to be on the same page here
Speaker 2: as to the value that we're both trying to add
Speaker 2: to this and what the outcome is going to be.
Speaker 2: And I think that like so much of that dialogue
Speaker 2: and conversation is just assumed and it's never had or
Speaker 2: it's like big picture, big theory, and we don't talk
Speaker 2: to the individual about it, and therefore there's this massive
Speaker 2: disconnect in the actual behavior of coaching, which then then
Speaker 2: just leads into just accountability. And then it's like, well,
Speaker 2: then then you know, we're not actually coaching with the
Speaker 2: intent of making better, We're coaching with the intention of
Speaker 2: getting rid of you, and like those things, that doesn't
Speaker 2: work well if you're trying to build a true culture
Speaker 2: of coaching, do that have honest accountability?
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think there's a lot of a lot of
Speaker 1: issues and instances where leadership tends to blur the lines
Speaker 1: between coaching and accountability. Even though they are far far
Speaker 1: different things from each other, they're almost becoming synonymous in
Speaker 1: the minds of a lot of people. And so what
Speaker 1: I want to do is I want to start talking
Speaker 1: about some of the ways in which those things are
Speaker 1: different and how they need to be treated as different.
Speaker 1: When you are interacting with your people. But first you
Speaker 1: want to get up toward from one of our sponsors.
Speaker 1: All right, If you're leader are people, you start thinking
Speaker 1: about the fact that if you look at a coach
Speaker 1: of like a sports team, a coach of like a
Speaker 1: baseball team or a football team who's running a practice,
Speaker 1: you don't look at that as punitive or like someone's
Speaker 1: being held accountable for something. You look at the relationship
Speaker 1: is that the coach is helping to train and teach
Speaker 1: the team of people what to do. And so if
Speaker 1: your idea of coaching is that that's a great way
Speaker 1: to go forward, meaning you are working with your people
Speaker 1: in order to help them get better at the skills
Speaker 1: they need to get better at. If you're using coaching
Speaker 1: as a term for what it means to go up
Speaker 1: to somebody and say this is what you're doing wrong
Speaker 1: and this is how you need to get better at it,
Speaker 1: that's not coaching. That's accountability, and accountability can't be there
Speaker 1: without the coaching. First, A strong culture of coaching has
Speaker 1: to be in place before you can hold people accountable,
Speaker 1: because you have to know that you've given them the
Speaker 1: tools to be able to do the things that you're
Speaker 1: expecting of them before you can hold them accountable to
Speaker 1: actually doing it. They won't just have those skills simply
Speaker 1: because you told them they need to have them. And
Speaker 1: so when you think about coaching, think about a couple
Speaker 1: of things. One, you're looking for development over direction. You're
Speaker 1: not telling people what to do. You're telling people how
Speaker 1: to get better at something. That's very different than giving
Speaker 1: them a process. Anybody can give somebody a process. You
Speaker 1: can write it down on a PowerPoint and email it
Speaker 1: to an entire company. Development requires the interaction one on one,
Speaker 1: and it requires people to be in to the idea
Speaker 1: that you are developing them. The second thing is results
Speaker 1: will never be there unless there's a relationship between the
Speaker 1: leader and the employee. People aren't going to put forward
Speaker 1: their best effort and listen to the things that you're
Speaker 1: saying to them when it comes to coaching. If they
Speaker 1: don't trust that your goal is to help them get
Speaker 1: better and to help the open doors for them. If
Speaker 1: they perceive your motivation for giving them the coaching is
Speaker 1: how you can make their job easier, or how they
Speaker 1: can make your job easier, or how they can stop
Speaker 1: being a pain in your side, then you've already lost them.
Speaker 1: And then the third thing is there needs to be
Speaker 1: a support system in place for the things that you're
Speaker 1: doing from a coaching standpoint, meaning the people you're coaching
Speaker 1: need to be able to look at broader organizational support
Speaker 1: for the process you have in place to coach them.
Speaker 1: So there needs to be a an interval. There needs
Speaker 1: to be a the amount of times you interact with
Speaker 1: a person and what it's gonna entail, so that when
Speaker 1: those things happen, those coaching interactions happen. They don't start
Speaker 1: the interaction from a standpoint of Oh, I'm being held accountable.
Speaker 1: I'm being held accountable. Then the defense mechanisms come up,
Speaker 1: and then a coaching interaction might only last ten minutes.
Speaker 1: If the first four and a half of them are
Speaker 1: the employee having to come down from the defensive standpoint,
Speaker 1: then you've already wasted half the session and you've lost
Speaker 1: the ability to coach them. They need to look at
Speaker 1: those interactions as something they can be excited about. Oh great,
Speaker 1: here's another one where I can help get better. Not
Speaker 1: another time where I'm being judged or hell accountable. Another
Speaker 1: time I'm getting some one on one time to get
Speaker 1: better at the skills I need to get better at
Speaker 1: Almost like if your coach said, hey, we think you're
Speaker 1: gonna be great at this, I'm gonna have you work
Speaker 1: with a batting coach, not just me, to get better
Speaker 1: at this thing. Right there. You never look at that
Speaker 1: as punitive. You look at that as oh, awesome, someone
Speaker 1: is investing in me in my future to get better.
Speaker 1: Your people need to feel the exact same way about
Speaker 1: you and the interactions you have with them. If you're
Speaker 1: calling it a coaching interaction.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's such a great call. I think it's It
Speaker 2: reminds me of when we talk about development versus training,
Speaker 2: and I will constantly say, like, development is a feeling, yeah,
Speaker 2: because you get to decide like do I feel developed
Speaker 2: or not?
Speaker 1: Right?
Speaker 2: Training is an action like I can train you on
Speaker 2: how to do this. I developed you, I developed exactly.
Speaker 2: But yeah, but we will say like I'm great at developing.
Speaker 2: People will argue like do they feel developed? Right? Like
Speaker 2: what are you doing to not just maybe connect the
Speaker 2: dots on the language for them, but how are you
Speaker 2: approaching the conversation, the dialogue, the actions in a way
Speaker 2: that people feel like they were truly impacted and then
Speaker 2: they got something from it, and it's the same thing
Speaker 2: that you're talking about when it comes to coaching, like like,
Speaker 2: there has to be this feeling, there has to be
Speaker 2: this understanding, there has to be this this level of
Speaker 2: trust and acceptance that we're doing this together when it's
Speaker 2: at its best. And when somebody says, I don't want
Speaker 2: to get better, I don't care if you help me,
Speaker 2: and I have no of changing my behavior, then that's
Speaker 2: not even coaching. That's just like you shouldn't be here
Speaker 2: and we're going to have a different conversation, sure, right,
Speaker 2: So like let's not let's not bundle those things together.
Speaker 2: If you're getting that type of pushback or that type
Speaker 2: of attitude, then there's something else that's that's broken here
Speaker 2: that has nothing to do with the intention around coaching,
Speaker 2: but that that coaching piece should feel really great. And
Speaker 2: when you have that, it becomes significantly easier for there
Speaker 2: to be accountability amongst the team, amongst yourself, amongst where
Speaker 2: you're going, because that trust aspect is now like, okay,
Speaker 2: the accountability is happening because you're not doing what you
Speaker 2: said you were going to do or that we committed
Speaker 2: to or that we agreed to. That's a different conversation.
Speaker 2: But that is is, when done correctly, is coming from
Speaker 2: a place of we've had these a great you know,
Speaker 2: we've had these agreements, we've done these things together, We've
Speaker 2: poured into the to the coaching aspect of it. We're
Speaker 2: doing the best that we can. You're just choosing not
Speaker 2: to at this point, right, I completely agree with that.
Speaker 1: The last thing I want to say about this, and
Speaker 1: I think it's really important to remember, is that you
Speaker 1: as a leader, have to preface these coaching interactions as
Speaker 1: what they are and make sure that your employees understand
Speaker 1: this is not accountability. This is not telling them what
Speaker 1: they've done wrong. This is not telling them how they've
Speaker 1: failed you, or how they need to get better at
Speaker 1: this or this is going to happen. That isn't coaching.
Speaker 1: So if you're coaching somebody, you need to tell them
Speaker 1: what that means, what it looks like, and when it's not.
Speaker 1: And the reason this is so important is that there
Speaker 1: are very few organizations and the workforce as a whole
Speaker 1: does not have a strong culture of coaching. There's a
Speaker 1: pretty strong culture around accountability from leader to employee that
Speaker 1: exists across organizations and as if an employee, and I
Speaker 1: would I would make an argument that the vast majority
Speaker 1: of employees have not worked for organizations that have strong
Speaker 1: coaching cultures. And you combine that with the fact that
Speaker 1: it's not ubiquitous, and people will interpret coaching interactions as
Speaker 1: accountability interactions unless you tell them it's not, and you
Speaker 1: make them feel like it's not, and you make sure
Speaker 1: they understand what the differences between the two, and that
Speaker 1: your desire in these interactions is to help them get better,
Speaker 1: not to hold them accountable or to make the paper
Speaker 1: trail happen so that you can get rid of them.
Speaker 1: It is because you desire an outcome that says getting better.
Speaker 1: These things will open doors for you, It will make
Speaker 1: you happier at work, it will create a strong relationship
Speaker 1: between us of collaboration. All those positive things happen out
Speaker 1: of coaching interactions. But again, you have to define them
Speaker 1: as that so the employee knows what is about to
Speaker 1: happen and what has just happened. Otherwise they will just
Speaker 1: interpret them as accountability interactions. Thank you for joining us
Speaker 1: in this episode. We'll see you back here next Thursday
Speaker 1: for the next one. You have a great day,