WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.120 --> 00:00:02.240 Telling you that you've kind of figured out all the 2 00:00:02.279 --> 00:00:04.639 secrets and you know you're the great uh, you know, 3 00:00:04.839 --> 00:00:09.759 esoteric masters. It's just a delusion playing on our pride 4 00:00:09.800 --> 00:00:11.560 as human beings to want to be kind of some 5 00:00:11.640 --> 00:00:15.480 kind of special, you know, because of the matrix type 6 00:00:15.519 --> 00:00:15.919 of person. 7 00:00:16.640 --> 00:00:22.600 When I always give these uh talks about demons and 8 00:00:22.920 --> 00:00:27.960 I refer back to kind of folklore, whether it's rumpelstilt 9 00:00:28.039 --> 00:00:28.640 Scan or. 10 00:00:28.600 --> 00:00:33.520 The Genie, the Jendni demon, they're. 11 00:00:33.359 --> 00:00:38.280 All throughout different cultures and stuff like that. It's always 12 00:00:38.320 --> 00:00:42.159 this esotericism, right, you'll get this, you're the person that 13 00:00:43.159 --> 00:00:45.039 And what do you notice in a lot of these 14 00:00:45.079 --> 00:00:49.560 stories and in actual real cases too. For example, Alistair 15 00:00:49.560 --> 00:00:53.960 Curley did he die smarter than ever with his mind 16 00:00:55.240 --> 00:01:00.880 drug addict and a yeah, I've lost his mind. And 17 00:01:00.920 --> 00:01:03.679 there's this devil's bargain right. 18 00:01:05.200 --> 00:01:06.920 All of his women three by the way, that half 19 00:01:06.959 --> 00:01:10.040 of them ended up in insane asylums and committed suit 20 00:01:11.040 --> 00:01:11.239 a lot. 21 00:01:11.359 --> 00:01:11.560 Yep. 22 00:01:12.480 --> 00:01:15.439 So this is kind of a sign of the demonic 23 00:01:15.599 --> 00:01:19.400 right that these people are smart enough to crack the 24 00:01:19.439 --> 00:01:21.200 code and figure this out of stade, what. 25 00:01:21.120 --> 00:01:23.359 Do they do? They end up losing their mind, So. 26 00:01:23.239 --> 00:01:26.519 The devil promises in this bargain, Oh you're the one. 27 00:01:27.480 --> 00:01:30.200 You're you look at your mind, how brilliant it is. 28 00:01:30.840 --> 00:01:32.560 And in the bargain in the contract. 29 00:01:32.599 --> 00:01:36.079 When that you you play around with this, you actually 30 00:01:36.159 --> 00:01:38.159 end up losing the one thing that you thought you were, 31 00:01:38.439 --> 00:01:40.840 that you had and this that. 32 00:01:40.799 --> 00:01:43.280 Was so great. Yeah, you idolize your mind and your 33 00:01:43.280 --> 00:01:45.959 IQ and your reasoning and your you know, powers of 34 00:01:46.079 --> 00:01:50.079 mental faculties, you know, and then the bargain is that 35 00:01:50.079 --> 00:01:52.239 that becomes your god and then you lose it. 36 00:01:52.959 --> 00:01:53.840 Yep, exactly. 37 00:01:54.560 --> 00:01:58.640 It's a really perceptive point. Yeah, so people in the 38 00:01:58.719 --> 00:02:02.200 chat are asking, yes, we are talking about the tendency 39 00:02:02.799 --> 00:02:05.920 of people in the domain of conspiracy, in the domain 40 00:02:06.000 --> 00:02:11.080 of Gamatria online. You know, like when Jim Bob was 41 00:02:11.080 --> 00:02:15.840 debating that Gamatria guy, that was just crazy and it's 42 00:02:15.919 --> 00:02:19.599 like it's number one, it's a con man system. Like 43 00:02:19.639 --> 00:02:21.639 that guy seemed like a conman because he was just 44 00:02:21.680 --> 00:02:23.919 like telling everybody to go buy his course on how 45 00:02:23.919 --> 00:02:26.159 to predict the future and win and like win the 46 00:02:26.199 --> 00:02:29.360 lottery through Gamatria. But to the people who buy into it, 47 00:02:29.400 --> 00:02:32.520 a lot of those people are you know, potentially also 48 00:02:33.240 --> 00:02:37.000 dealing with perhaps some kind of mental issue, like like 49 00:02:37.039 --> 00:02:39.319 father Deacon's talking about Lord of the Nerds. Five dollars, 50 00:02:39.319 --> 00:02:43.039 says Stitch Adam in short, fat, I'll tak you. I 51 00:02:43.080 --> 00:02:46.639 don't know who that is. Reviewed your debate. They said 52 00:02:46.639 --> 00:02:49.840 that you embarrassed philosophy because no one cares about a pistemology. 53 00:02:50.199 --> 00:02:53.080 Father Deacon, you're a professor of a pistemology and logic. 54 00:02:53.159 --> 00:02:56.080 Is it true that no one cares about a pistemology 55 00:02:56.360 --> 00:02:58.240 As a philosophy professor. 56 00:02:58.599 --> 00:03:01.879 I was trying to keep that hidden. 57 00:03:02.000 --> 00:03:03.759 I didn't want anybody to find that out. 58 00:03:03.800 --> 00:03:06.000 Well, you're gonna get fired now because you've been You're 59 00:03:06.039 --> 00:03:09.400 a fraud. You're gonna get defrocked. You're gonna get defrocked 60 00:03:09.439 --> 00:03:13.479 from philosophy because you you teach a discipline that is no. 61 00:03:13.479 --> 00:03:18.319 Longer told everybody that everybody cared about epistemology, and that's 62 00:03:18.360 --> 00:03:21.319 why I actually have a job teaching a pistemology in 63 00:03:21.360 --> 00:03:26.280 this guymore Man, Well it was a good run, lads. 64 00:03:27.360 --> 00:03:29.960 Time to pack it up. Go back to uh. I 65 00:03:29.960 --> 00:03:31.560 don't know what you used to do. Used to be 66 00:03:31.639 --> 00:03:35.479 a skateboarder or a skier. Maybe you can be a 67 00:03:35.520 --> 00:03:37.599 professional skier because it's over for you. 68 00:03:39.000 --> 00:03:41.080 I used to be a professional. 69 00:03:42.039 --> 00:03:46.879 Clown, rodeo clown, a roller. 70 00:03:46.719 --> 00:03:49.360 Roller blade clown. Is that is that on the totem 71 00:03:49.360 --> 00:03:52.240 pole of clown dum? Is that above or below a 72 00:03:52.400 --> 00:03:53.240 rodeo clown. 73 00:03:53.120 --> 00:03:56.840 Had jenco pants and it was a clown on roller blades? 74 00:03:57.199 --> 00:03:57.719 But is that? 75 00:03:58.199 --> 00:04:00.560 I was like the epitome of the nineties. I feel 76 00:04:00.560 --> 00:04:01.400 like you could imagine. 77 00:04:01.439 --> 00:04:03.960 Okay, but is that above or below a rodeo clowne 78 00:04:04.000 --> 00:04:05.000 in the clown hierarchy. 79 00:04:05.840 --> 00:04:08.360 Oh, that's a great question, only if we had an 80 00:04:08.400 --> 00:04:10.159 epistemologist to answer it. 81 00:04:10.280 --> 00:04:17.040 Huh. I guess we'll never know anything. I don't know, 82 00:04:17.240 --> 00:04:20.000 like I've never looked. 83 00:04:20.240 --> 00:04:27.040 Epistemology is a pretty big field in you know, look, yeah, 84 00:04:27.079 --> 00:04:27.839 it doesn't exist. 85 00:04:27.959 --> 00:04:29.959 There's two streams. 86 00:04:31.480 --> 00:04:41.519 Possibly three, in philosophy, continental that deals with phenomenology, existentialism. 87 00:04:40.600 --> 00:04:41.439 And that kind of stuff. 88 00:04:44.079 --> 00:04:47.959 Then you have analytic philosophy, which deals with philosophy of language, 89 00:04:48.040 --> 00:04:53.279 philosophy of mind, metaphysics, and uh logic. 90 00:04:54.720 --> 00:04:59.120 Then the possible third could just be uh a history 91 00:04:59.120 --> 00:05:02.240 of philosophy. Usually ancient philosophy will. 92 00:05:02.160 --> 00:05:04.480 Go in there. Those are the main stream, the two 93 00:05:04.560 --> 00:05:09.279 biggest streams are just continental and analytics. Among analytic, which 94 00:05:09.360 --> 00:05:14.759 is definitely the dominant school in the United States and 95 00:05:15.079 --> 00:05:22.680 the UK. Ireland, epistemology is huge, So yeah, I don't know. 96 00:05:22.720 --> 00:05:27.079 Where supposedly, although again, do you have a source for 97 00:05:27.160 --> 00:05:29.839 that or is that just all ad hoc from you? 98 00:05:30.639 --> 00:05:33.120 Yeah, you got gosh, you can expose me. 99 00:05:33.600 --> 00:05:36.839 You are done for it, Stan Patron five pounds, Jay, 100 00:05:36.879 --> 00:05:39.959 I learned more here than anywhere else. You helped to 101 00:05:39.959 --> 00:05:42.720 get me out of perennialism and degenerously. Thank you, brother, 102 00:05:42.759 --> 00:05:45.040 hey man, that's great to hear. I hope you're moving 103 00:05:45.079 --> 00:05:48.240 in the direction of orthodoxy. Suki for all five This 104 00:05:48.360 --> 00:05:50.600 is for your foot farts. Yes they were foot farts. 105 00:05:50.600 --> 00:05:53.240 I promise I can keep I can keep mimicking them, 106 00:05:53.279 --> 00:05:55.399 unless you think that I can just rip it on command. 107 00:05:55.800 --> 00:05:59.319 Yon Quantum Yakoub two dollars. That was an uncreative foot fart. Correct, 108 00:05:59.319 --> 00:06:02.959 it was lazy eyes became a member, Daniel became a member. 109 00:06:03.079 --> 00:06:14.720 G twenty six says I lost it, Jay, God blessed. 110 00:06:14.759 --> 00:06:16.839 Keep doing your thing and shut down all these haters. 111 00:06:16.879 --> 00:06:22.360 Thanks man, appreciate that. Otis Solier five dollars. Did you 112 00:06:22.399 --> 00:06:26.000 see Albert talking to doctor Joshua on the Trinity. I 113 00:06:26.040 --> 00:06:29.759 did not would you do a review on that? I 114 00:06:29.800 --> 00:06:34.839 don't know. Adam Crazy five Bucks, the lawyer to Orthodox 115 00:06:34.879 --> 00:06:39.240 pipeline Israel. Yeah, shout out to Adam the thank you 116 00:06:39.319 --> 00:06:42.000 for the law bro shout out there. Yeah, you're welcome. 117 00:06:42.160 --> 00:06:44.160 Of course, that's you are who I had in mind. 118 00:06:44.439 --> 00:06:48.519 I enjoy I enjoyed all your West Coast podcast tour. Well, 119 00:06:48.600 --> 00:06:51.199 guess what, the meat of it hasn't even come out yet. 120 00:06:51.319 --> 00:06:55.319 The full four hour Ruslon debate hasn't come out, and 121 00:06:55.720 --> 00:06:59.199 the Hodge Twins hasn't come out, and both of those 122 00:06:59.240 --> 00:07:04.160 are bangers, so the real heat hasn't come yet. Valerian 123 00:07:04.279 --> 00:07:10.399 since twenty runs. Thank you Steve mcloven five dollars. Do 124 00:07:10.439 --> 00:07:14.519 you think Mohammed or a companion saw an icon of 125 00:07:14.600 --> 00:07:17.519 Jesus with a book and took it literal? You know what? 126 00:07:17.600 --> 00:07:19.720 It could be something like that. I mean that you 127 00:07:19.800 --> 00:07:22.040 might be joking, but it literally could be something like 128 00:07:22.639 --> 00:07:25.079 because you know, people think he was influenced by a 129 00:07:25.160 --> 00:07:29.160 Nestorian monks and maybe the Mystorian monks told him. You know, oh, 130 00:07:29.240 --> 00:07:34.480 those Orthodox are apostates. Look at the pictures they have, 131 00:07:34.680 --> 00:07:37.120 and you know, maybe he saw a picture of Jesus 132 00:07:37.120 --> 00:07:39.600 with the Gospels or something and he thought that that 133 00:07:39.759 --> 00:07:42.600 was the ngeal that came down Like that's actually pretty 134 00:07:42.600 --> 00:07:45.800 good because Mohammed was unlettered, right, So he probably did 135 00:07:45.879 --> 00:07:48.160 see an icon and just derived his ideas from that. 136 00:07:48.279 --> 00:07:52.040 Nick twenty bucks, I'm a Protestant here. I love your videos. 137 00:07:52.120 --> 00:07:54.480 I have a question if the Orthodox Church interprets scripture, 138 00:07:55.000 --> 00:07:59.480 who interprets the Orthodox Church's decrees? So again, like we 139 00:07:59.480 --> 00:08:02.560 were saying earlier, to the guy they called the reformed 140 00:08:02.560 --> 00:08:05.600 guy they called it in at the beginning, we don't 141 00:08:05.600 --> 00:08:08.000 make I don't make the argument that the Roman Catholic 142 00:08:08.079 --> 00:08:11.879 apologists do that just appealing to the papacy gives you 143 00:08:11.959 --> 00:08:15.360 this certainty. All of us are in the same boat. 144 00:08:15.920 --> 00:08:18.319 We're all going to have to do the work of interpreting. 145 00:08:19.240 --> 00:08:21.920 The difference between us and the papists or whoever is 146 00:08:21.959 --> 00:08:24.759 that Number one. We have different means that we think 147 00:08:24.800 --> 00:08:27.000 the script that the spirit's using, we think it's the 148 00:08:27.040 --> 00:08:30.959 Council's teaching to the church fathers, experience of the liturgy, 149 00:08:31.040 --> 00:08:33.639 et cetera, et cetera, as well as the Bible. If 150 00:08:33.679 --> 00:08:35.159 you're a Roman Catholic, at the end of the day, 151 00:08:35.240 --> 00:08:38.919 it's you interpreting the papal magisterium. And if you're a Protestant, 152 00:08:38.919 --> 00:08:40.200 at the end of the day, it's you and the 153 00:08:40.200 --> 00:08:43.399 Holy Spirit and the scriptures. So it's not a question 154 00:08:43.480 --> 00:08:49.519 of an infinite regression of interpretation. That's the way that 155 00:08:50.480 --> 00:08:55.000 Roman Catholic pop apologists usually frame this debate in a 156 00:08:55.120 --> 00:08:58.519 very low tier bad way, and that's why many Protestants 157 00:08:58.519 --> 00:09:01.120 come asking us. I'm not faulting you for asking this question, Nick, 158 00:09:01.120 --> 00:09:04.639 it's a fair question. Many Protestants ask us this question 159 00:09:04.919 --> 00:09:08.279 because they've only heard bad Roman Catholic arguments that, well, 160 00:09:08.399 --> 00:09:10.840 you don't have a pope. We have the pope, so 161 00:09:10.879 --> 00:09:13.559 we have certainty. The pope doesn't give you a certainty 162 00:09:13.639 --> 00:09:15.639 if you listen to that guy that we heard the 163 00:09:16.480 --> 00:09:21.960 other day, or or the cal guy Angelo. I put 164 00:09:21.960 --> 00:09:25.759 it on my clips channel. This guy right here, he 165 00:09:27.000 --> 00:09:30.399 literally goes back and forth contradicting himself like twenty times 166 00:09:30.399 --> 00:09:34.159 in sixteen minutes on the very point that you're asking. 167 00:09:34.600 --> 00:09:39.919 And so if any Protestant says, hey, this is an 168 00:09:39.960 --> 00:09:42.799 inconsistent argument from Roman Catholics, I will agree with you. 169 00:09:43.399 --> 00:09:46.879 That doesn't make me Protestant. I'm agreeing with the argument. Right, 170 00:09:47.559 --> 00:09:47.840 Come on. 171 00:09:49.440 --> 00:09:53.039 Both of those positions, because Roman Catholic and Protestant have 172 00:09:53.120 --> 00:09:57.360 the same position, they just go different directions from the presupposition. 173 00:09:57.840 --> 00:10:01.679 They're both thoroughly reductive, right, so they believe they can 174 00:10:01.759 --> 00:10:08.559 reduce an epistemic question to one principle, whereas we would say, 175 00:10:08.639 --> 00:10:12.159 kato holos, it's the whole thing. Number two of I 176 00:10:12.200 --> 00:10:15.279 said this too. Both are thoroughly modern. They have this 177 00:10:15.399 --> 00:10:23.080 kind of Cartesian obsession with absolute certitude infallibility. What's the question? 178 00:10:24.200 --> 00:10:29.240 Can I know that orthodoxy is true or dogmatic? You 179 00:10:29.279 --> 00:10:29.919 don't have to have. 180 00:10:29.879 --> 00:10:31.879 A Cartesian strong theory. 181 00:10:31.639 --> 00:10:34.360 Of knowledge to be like, why have to eliminate every possibility? 182 00:10:34.440 --> 00:10:38.720 My justification has to be induble, clear and distinct. That's insane. 183 00:10:38.799 --> 00:10:42.639 Nobody even holds that in epistemology or philosophy because. 184 00:10:43.279 --> 00:10:45.840 Of what you just pointed out. You wouldn't be able 185 00:10:45.840 --> 00:10:48.679 to know anything if you have that high standard. So 186 00:10:49.240 --> 00:10:50.879 I don't know why, I. 187 00:10:50.840 --> 00:10:51.360 Mean I do. 188 00:10:52.000 --> 00:10:55.399 It's important to point out both those groups are obsessed 189 00:10:55.519 --> 00:11:00.720 with some type of Cartesian certitude of infallibility, but for 190 00:11:00.840 --> 00:11:05.440 some for most of us, would accept that knowledge just has. 191 00:11:05.320 --> 00:11:06.240 To be is it true? 192 00:11:06.799 --> 00:11:09.080 Do I believe it's true? And do I have sufficient 193 00:11:09.159 --> 00:11:13.360 justification for it? Not infallible? Now, of course we have 194 00:11:13.480 --> 00:11:15.120 a level of infallibili and orts doox. 195 00:11:15.200 --> 00:11:18.360 But been noticed we're not obsessed with that. 196 00:11:18.399 --> 00:11:20.799 It's not how do I know absolutely for certain unless 197 00:11:20.799 --> 00:11:23.799 I eliminate every possibility and have a Cartesian and dubability 198 00:11:24.240 --> 00:11:27.559 and can defeat the evil demon deceiving me in a multiverse? 199 00:11:27.600 --> 00:11:33.399 Were like, it's a total insanity, right and totally modern. 200 00:11:34.799 --> 00:11:37.639 Yeah. I think one of the streams x spaces that 201 00:11:37.799 --> 00:11:39.480 you and I were doing when I was on the road, 202 00:11:39.679 --> 00:11:41.440 you had a really good comment on that, how rem 203 00:11:41.480 --> 00:11:45.240 Catholicism is very close to that kind of Cartesian idea 204 00:11:45.399 --> 00:11:49.960 of getting absolute certitude for doctrines. And what's funny is 205 00:11:50.000 --> 00:11:52.159 that the way that they think they do it is 206 00:11:52.200 --> 00:11:55.759 by appealing to this external juridical office called the papacy. 207 00:11:56.440 --> 00:11:59.639 And it's like, do you understand that from a practical perspective, 208 00:11:59.639 --> 00:12:02.120 you're in an even worse position than a Protestant because 209 00:12:02.159 --> 00:12:05.000 a Protestant it's like them in the Bible, which is 210 00:12:05.039 --> 00:12:08.320 what a few thousand pages, but as a Roman Catholic 211 00:12:08.320 --> 00:12:10.759 gets you in like thousands of pages of papal documents. 212 00:12:10.759 --> 00:12:14.120 It's even more more stuff that you kind of try 213 00:12:14.159 --> 00:12:15.360 to actually. 214 00:12:15.159 --> 00:12:17.039 Have the Protestant actually has the upper hand. 215 00:12:17.159 --> 00:12:20.879 Yeah, in regard to the like on the grounds like 216 00:12:21.120 --> 00:12:23.840 who has more work to do. It's like it's just 217 00:12:23.879 --> 00:12:27.759 such a silly position that it's missing the epistemic point. 218 00:12:27.840 --> 00:12:31.279 But to your point there, Nick, what I would say 219 00:12:31.320 --> 00:12:32.519 is that all of us, at the end of the 220 00:12:32.559 --> 00:12:34.519 day are relying on the Holy Spirit to guide us 221 00:12:34.600 --> 00:12:38.919 for individual certainty. But we disagree on the means that 222 00:12:38.960 --> 00:12:42.759 the Holy Spirit uses, which we just discussed. And then lastly, 223 00:12:43.159 --> 00:12:46.440 the big difference is what's called normive authority. Normativity is 224 00:12:46.440 --> 00:12:48.519 when you can say that there's an ought right, you 225 00:12:48.559 --> 00:12:52.039 ought to do this versus that. And in this case, 226 00:12:52.200 --> 00:12:55.200 the context is referring to a historical body of people 227 00:12:55.240 --> 00:12:58.399 with Norman authority. If you're a Protestant, you don't believe 228 00:12:58.399 --> 00:13:02.840 in that, Okay. The Classical Reformation is very adamant, very clear. 229 00:13:02.879 --> 00:13:05.080 All the Reformers, as far as I'm aware, teach that 230 00:13:05.200 --> 00:13:08.720 nobody has the authority to bind anyone's conscience to their interpretation, 231 00:13:09.320 --> 00:13:12.960 even a presbyter, even a reformer can't bind you to 232 00:13:13.039 --> 00:13:17.639 his interpretation in terms of moral authority and in other words, 233 00:13:17.679 --> 00:13:20.799 like if you don't believe in the Westminster Confessions interpretation, 234 00:13:21.440 --> 00:13:24.559 you are excommunicated, you're out of the church. That doesn't 235 00:13:24.600 --> 00:13:28.279 exist in Protestanism because it's built on write a private interpretation, 236 00:13:28.720 --> 00:13:31.879 freedom of conscience, freedom of worship. Okay, if you read 237 00:13:31.960 --> 00:13:35.399 nic Nicia doesn't work that way. Nicia is very clear 238 00:13:35.440 --> 00:13:40.320 that either you interpret the text of Scripture Affanatius, et 239 00:13:40.360 --> 00:13:43.159 cetera and Homousius to mean that Jesus is fully divine, 240 00:13:43.799 --> 00:13:46.679 or you're with Arias and you're excommunicated from the church. 241 00:13:47.000 --> 00:13:50.120 You're out of here. So that's the difference normative authority, 242 00:13:50.679 --> 00:13:53.559 not the question of how do we get individual certitude? 243 00:13:54.600 --> 00:13:56.919 Bird created by Jesus became a member. How would you 244 00:13:57.120 --> 00:14:01.120 reply to this Protestant argument church history is not trustworthy 245 00:14:01.120 --> 00:14:05.320 because the church wrote history and they protected themselves. Well, 246 00:14:05.320 --> 00:14:06.799 the first thing I said, and all that Father Deacon 247 00:14:06.840 --> 00:14:10.960 comments on it, is that's an assertion. So to say 248 00:14:11.000 --> 00:14:14.279 something like we cannot church trust church history because they 249 00:14:14.320 --> 00:14:18.120 wrote it, well, they who? And on what grounds is 250 00:14:18.200 --> 00:14:22.159 that reason to distrust it? So, first of all, it's 251 00:14:22.440 --> 00:14:24.480 just an assertion. It's not actually argument. It's a claim. 252 00:14:24.519 --> 00:14:27.879 It's not an argument, Father Deacon, what would you say, Well. 253 00:14:27.720 --> 00:14:33.919 It's at atheist like ridiculous standard. For example, you have 254 00:14:34.039 --> 00:14:38.519 the apostles as the eyewitnesses of the resurrection at you. 255 00:14:38.480 --> 00:14:41.039 Know, and they're like, well, that doesn't count because they're biased. 256 00:14:42.320 --> 00:14:45.240 We have to find somebody that witnessed an event that 257 00:14:45.360 --> 00:14:49.480 would convert you, who yet don't believe. And so I'm like, well, 258 00:14:49.480 --> 00:14:52.639 this is just a category era. That's like saying I 259 00:14:52.720 --> 00:14:56.120 got this mathematition detic hid of it, but he has 260 00:14:56.240 --> 00:15:00.919 this really amazing kind of mathematical conclusion about completing the 261 00:15:01.000 --> 00:15:04.039 number line between rational and irrational numbers, known as the 262 00:15:04.080 --> 00:15:04.879 detic line cut. 263 00:15:06.759 --> 00:15:10.240 Obviously he's not trustworthy Jay, because he's a mathematician. 264 00:15:10.720 --> 00:15:14.840 So I need to establish that mathematical conclusion. 265 00:15:14.279 --> 00:15:20.120 From somebody who isn't that master. Do you see the problem? 266 00:15:20.360 --> 00:15:22.399 That's a great point. I was not aware. I've never 267 00:15:22.399 --> 00:15:23.200 heard that before. 268 00:15:24.039 --> 00:15:25.159 So that's what they're asking. 269 00:15:25.360 --> 00:15:28.559 It's like, of course, it's going to be the people 270 00:15:29.399 --> 00:15:34.519 who are immersed in the community who are of that 271 00:15:34.879 --> 00:15:37.399 you know, specialization. I want to talk about higher textual 272 00:15:37.440 --> 00:15:40.159 criticism too, because this is the kind of thing that 273 00:15:40.240 --> 00:15:43.440 higher textual critics kind of use it. We'll just treat 274 00:15:43.480 --> 00:15:46.200 this thing as like anything else. But they're inconsistent. They 275 00:15:46.240 --> 00:15:49.720 don't so any other text like Tacitus or anything like that. 276 00:15:49.840 --> 00:15:53.080 If an individual is are real, they don't just simply 277 00:15:53.440 --> 00:15:55.519 historians look at the book. 278 00:15:55.559 --> 00:16:00.320 They'll actually take the evidence from the community. 279 00:15:59.799 --> 00:16:03.639 And history around those and the traditions as part of 280 00:16:03.679 --> 00:16:08.159 the evidence unless proven otherwise. Oh no, no, no, but not 281 00:16:08.240 --> 00:16:11.919 with the church, right, So all for me, none for 282 00:16:12.080 --> 00:16:17.320 the fallacy. So there's a real inconsistency, yes, And categorically 283 00:16:17.679 --> 00:16:20.039 that's exactly the sort of evidence that you would want 284 00:16:20.200 --> 00:16:22.759 is from the people who preserve were part of the 285 00:16:22.799 --> 00:16:24.279 community who. 286 00:16:24.080 --> 00:16:27.399 Wrote the text, right, who were eyewitnesses. So it doesn't 287 00:16:27.440 --> 00:16:27.960 even make sense. 288 00:16:28.000 --> 00:16:32.639 It's like saying, I need a non mathematician to give 289 00:16:32.720 --> 00:16:37.039 me to believe in mathematical conclusion, because mathematicians. 290 00:16:36.320 --> 00:16:39.559 Are biased, exactly, they believe in numbers. We need to 291 00:16:39.559 --> 00:16:41.480 find somebody who doesn't believe in numbers to give me 292 00:16:41.519 --> 00:16:41.679 a man. 293 00:16:41.799 --> 00:16:43.919 That's the only way. How do you know that objectivity 294 00:16:44.039 --> 00:16:46.399 is just from the camp that doesn't believe in it too, 295 00:16:46.440 --> 00:16:50.120 that's exactly the atheist motivation too, Right, It's like I 296 00:16:50.120 --> 00:16:53.720 can only trust somebody who has the atheist presuppositions. Well, 297 00:16:53.720 --> 00:16:55.519 that's just kind of poisoning the well and kind of 298 00:16:55.519 --> 00:17:00.320 waiting the debate for your side from the outset. And 299 00:17:00.360 --> 00:17:02.360 that's why it's important. You know, a lot of times 300 00:17:02.360 --> 00:17:05.799 people don't just appeal to church historians. So for example, 301 00:17:06.440 --> 00:17:09.960 one of the reasons that the patristic writers who end 302 00:17:10.039 --> 00:17:14.240 up being heretics or who are historians or whatever outside 303 00:17:14.279 --> 00:17:17.839 the Church, they're still relevant because they attest to and 304 00:17:17.880 --> 00:17:21.880 become evidences for the Orthodox position the history of the church, 305 00:17:21.920 --> 00:17:25.200 et cetera. Right, Tourtullian is still very valuable. Origin is 306 00:17:25.279 --> 00:17:28.279 very valuable, Eusebius is very valuable. Even though they're not 307 00:17:28.440 --> 00:17:32.160 Orthodox fathers and they're not saints and they're heterodox, they're 308 00:17:32.200 --> 00:17:36.200 still very relevant as well as quote secular historians throughout 309 00:17:36.240 --> 00:17:39.160 that time period too. So no, it's not just relying 310 00:17:39.240 --> 00:17:45.000 on you know, apologists of the church to know church history. 311 00:17:45.039 --> 00:17:47.880 There are other sources outside of the church as well. 312 00:17:48.519 --> 00:17:53.319 Now the next question is I'm assuming, due to doctor 313 00:17:53.440 --> 00:17:57.519 Joshua's debate or discussion with Albrich, I've not heard this yet. 314 00:17:58.079 --> 00:18:00.799 I don't know all of doctor Joshua's position. What I 315 00:18:00.880 --> 00:18:04.920 know and what I promote is doctor Branson's position, which 316 00:18:04.960 --> 00:18:13.799 is the Orthodox position. So when people ask about monarchical trinitarianism, 317 00:18:14.119 --> 00:18:17.039 everyone needs to go watch doctor Branson's lectures before you 318 00:18:17.079 --> 00:18:19.279 start trying to argue with it or debate it, or 319 00:18:19.319 --> 00:18:21.519 you're going to misunderstand it. Now, not talking to you, 320 00:18:21.599 --> 00:18:23.720 Let's talk God. When you sent the superched it's a 321 00:18:23.720 --> 00:18:26.960 great question. Can you break down the notion of Jesus 322 00:18:26.960 --> 00:18:29.920 being God by predication or by identity? Why do we 323 00:18:29.960 --> 00:18:33.440 make this distinction so monarchical trinitarianism. If you start with 324 00:18:33.440 --> 00:18:38.200 his lecture here, doctor Branson's going to explain that in 325 00:18:38.359 --> 00:18:41.200 the early Church are particularly in the Creed and in 326 00:18:41.240 --> 00:18:44.599 the Cappadocians, and that's what matters the most, because for 327 00:18:44.680 --> 00:18:47.240 the Trinity constantin up On one is pretty much the 328 00:18:47.359 --> 00:18:51.319 church's dogmatizing of the doctrine of the Trinity, and that's 329 00:18:51.400 --> 00:18:54.680 all Cappadocian theology. In fact, the council actually stated, or 330 00:18:54.720 --> 00:18:57.559 the Emperor at the council said, everyone has to agree 331 00:18:57.599 --> 00:19:03.519 with Nissa's formulation or you're not Orthodox. That's constantinople ones mindset, 332 00:19:04.720 --> 00:19:08.440 and so that mindset is what's called monarchical trinitarianism. Just 333 00:19:08.519 --> 00:19:10.400 like the Creed, it says we believe in one God, 334 00:19:10.480 --> 00:19:13.680 the Father. When we use that term the one God, 335 00:19:13.960 --> 00:19:17.039 we are primarily picking out the person of the Father. 336 00:19:17.200 --> 00:19:21.200 It is not primarily referring to the common divine essence. 337 00:19:21.759 --> 00:19:25.039 And this is a pretty big distinction between the Orthodox 338 00:19:25.039 --> 00:19:28.599 conception of the Trinity and the Tomistic conception of the Trinity. 339 00:19:29.319 --> 00:19:32.720 I would typically say Roman Catholicism in general, at least 340 00:19:32.799 --> 00:19:35.960 pretty much dogmatically if you look at the Fourth Lattering Council, 341 00:19:36.000 --> 00:19:39.680 because it uses the Lombard definition of simplicity, which is 342 00:19:39.759 --> 00:19:43.359 essentially kind of an essentialist, reductionist position identity thesis. It's 343 00:19:43.400 --> 00:19:48.000 called versus you know the Uniates, right, So the Uniates, 344 00:19:48.000 --> 00:19:51.160 which are very much a minority, would probably agree with 345 00:19:51.200 --> 00:19:53.960 the Orthodox on this. So you can't technically say that 346 00:19:54.039 --> 00:19:59.799 every single Roman Catholic has this essentialist Thomistic model, but 347 00:20:00.000 --> 00:20:04.839 at least dogmatically. Officially, for the most part, ninety nine 348 00:20:04.880 --> 00:20:09.440 percent of Romantholicism is not monarchical trinitarianism. So they get 349 00:20:09.480 --> 00:20:14.240 hung up on things like does Jesus derive his divinity, 350 00:20:14.799 --> 00:20:17.720 and does he depend on the Father for his hypostasis 351 00:20:17.759 --> 00:20:20.759 and his uh, for his divinity, for his essence, And 352 00:20:20.799 --> 00:20:23.960 the answer is yes. In fact, it's not just nicea 353 00:20:24.279 --> 00:20:27.160 that teaches. It's not just constant noble, it's nicea one 354 00:20:27.960 --> 00:20:31.559 that teaches that the son depends on the Father for 355 00:20:31.599 --> 00:20:34.839 his existence and for his essence and for his hypostasis 356 00:20:35.119 --> 00:20:36.960 to the whole of the son. The totality of the 357 00:20:37.000 --> 00:20:42.079 son is dependent on the Father. And it's a Muslim 358 00:20:42.160 --> 00:20:46.319 argument to think that because there's dependence, that they're therefore 359 00:20:46.319 --> 00:20:50.960 they are not all God. This is called the Eunomian premise. 360 00:20:51.160 --> 00:20:54.279 And if you watch the debate between Jake and doctor Branson, 361 00:20:54.720 --> 00:20:59.039 doctor Branson shows through a logic table that Jake is 362 00:20:59.160 --> 00:21:02.559 using a fallacy, and Jake eventually just melts down and 363 00:21:03.039 --> 00:21:07.720 loses it right. He totally flounders loses the debate because 364 00:21:07.720 --> 00:21:11.119 you can't demonstrate that to be amongst the class of 365 00:21:11.160 --> 00:21:15.519 things called God or uncreated, you must possess a sayety 366 00:21:16.000 --> 00:21:19.200 or that you cannot come from another. It's just like 367 00:21:19.359 --> 00:21:21.519 every time we do this analogy, I'm hoping people can 368 00:21:21.599 --> 00:21:27.480 understand it. You can be a carnivore and you can 369 00:21:27.519 --> 00:21:32.240 be an omnivore. Right, they are both amongst the class 370 00:21:32.359 --> 00:21:37.680 of things that eat meat, but one of them has 371 00:21:37.759 --> 00:21:42.240 additional properties of not just eating meat, but also eating vegetables. 372 00:21:42.720 --> 00:21:47.920 But if you are a omnivore, you are also a carnivore. 373 00:21:48.839 --> 00:21:53.400 So omnivore and carnivore are under the class of things 374 00:21:53.440 --> 00:21:58.880 that quote eat meat. Even though the one, the omnivore, 375 00:21:59.440 --> 00:22:01.759 has more things that it eats, has more properties and 376 00:22:01.799 --> 00:22:04.920 traits than the carnivore, it doesn't mean that because the 377 00:22:04.960 --> 00:22:09.480 carnivore lacks what the omnivor has, it's therefore not amongst 378 00:22:09.519 --> 00:22:11.720 the class of meat eaters. It's a very simple, once 379 00:22:11.759 --> 00:22:17.000 again grammar argument, and when you listen to doctor Branson's lectures, 380 00:22:17.039 --> 00:22:19.200 he will actually go into grammar. A lot of these 381 00:22:19.200 --> 00:22:23.079 issues are mistakes that are made in grammar. So likewise, 382 00:22:23.079 --> 00:22:26.960 when it comes to Mormon excuse mean Muslims in the Trinity, 383 00:22:27.920 --> 00:22:30.000 they try to argue that the word God can only 384 00:22:30.000 --> 00:22:32.759 have one reference, It can only refer to the divine essence. 385 00:22:34.279 --> 00:22:37.039 But the word God refers to, at least in the 386 00:22:37.079 --> 00:22:42.240 Cappadocian theology, almost entirely the Father. Does that mean the 387 00:22:42.240 --> 00:22:45.720 Son isn't divine, or isn't quote God, or isn't fully 388 00:22:46.599 --> 00:22:50.480 whatever in terms of nature. No, because he derives his 389 00:22:50.599 --> 00:22:56.480 existence his person is entire hypostasis from the Father. It 390 00:22:56.519 --> 00:23:00.920 does not follow that he's Onto logically subordinate. And to 391 00:23:01.039 --> 00:23:05.200 prove that you have to prove this point about the 392 00:23:05.200 --> 00:23:08.680 logic table that the Unomian premise that that Jake tries 393 00:23:08.720 --> 00:23:13.079 to prove to doctor Branson that somehow to be God 394 00:23:13.759 --> 00:23:17.759 necessarily in the definition of God is a sayity, and 395 00:23:17.799 --> 00:23:22.519 that's not true because the Son does not possess a saiety. 396 00:23:23.839 --> 00:23:27.559 He is from another I think it's Oration twenty three 397 00:23:27.680 --> 00:23:29.640 of Saint Gregor now Sandras, where he says this exact 398 00:23:29.680 --> 00:23:33.839 same thing. So they're getting hung up on words, and 399 00:23:33.880 --> 00:23:37.000 they think that because primarily we use the term God 400 00:23:37.079 --> 00:23:41.400 to refer to the hypostasis of the Father, that somehow 401 00:23:41.400 --> 00:23:45.079