WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.440 --> 00:00:04.799 Matt Brown writes the college football well college athletics, but 2 00:00:04.960 --> 00:00:07.519 football heavy newsletter extra points that we use on the 3 00:00:07.519 --> 00:00:08.279 show quite a bit. 4 00:00:08.759 --> 00:00:09.679 Not happy money man. 5 00:00:09.679 --> 00:00:13.439 How you doing, Hey, I'm doing great. It's sunny, it's 6 00:00:13.519 --> 00:00:17.399 eighty degrees here in Chicago. There's no way I could 7 00:00:17.399 --> 00:00:19.440 possibly be upset. Even if it means that I'm going 8 00:00:19.519 --> 00:00:21.559 to be writing a lot this week about legal stuff. 9 00:00:21.760 --> 00:00:23.160 I know you will, and we'll get into it. 10 00:00:23.199 --> 00:00:25.359 I've got to give you my hot Chicago take, though 11 00:00:25.399 --> 00:00:28.640 it's my favorite summer city in America, and then on 12 00:00:28.719 --> 00:00:30.679 either side of summer, I'm like, I got to get out, 13 00:00:30.719 --> 00:00:31.719 I gotta do something else. 14 00:00:33.000 --> 00:00:36.200 I mean, I've lived here for post for a decade now, 15 00:00:36.520 --> 00:00:38.240 I don't think that's a hot take. Most people who 16 00:00:38.320 --> 00:00:42.600 live here think the same thing. From May until September. 17 00:00:43.000 --> 00:00:45.240 I think it's the best place in the entire country, 18 00:00:45.320 --> 00:00:47.640 and it's good enough that I still want to live here. 19 00:00:47.679 --> 00:00:50.439 But in January, and I've lived most of my life 20 00:00:50.479 --> 00:00:52.759 in the Midwest, I still want to walk in front 21 00:00:52.799 --> 00:00:56.000 of a truck by the ench. And it's not just 22 00:00:56.039 --> 00:00:59.079 because it's like six degrees, because it's less of that now. 23 00:00:59.359 --> 00:01:02.000 Just you don't see the sun. Right, even even every 24 00:01:02.039 --> 00:01:04.840 time I land in Utah step outside the plane, it's like, 25 00:01:04.840 --> 00:01:06.840 oh yeah, it turns out my body does need vitamin 26 00:01:06.920 --> 00:01:09.359 D to like not want to die. I understand why 27 00:01:09.400 --> 00:01:11.840 people are happier here. That's that's, that's part of it. 28 00:01:11.920 --> 00:01:13.640 Now for sure. When the weather warms up, you're like, 29 00:01:13.680 --> 00:01:15.640 you know, I'm not depressed, I'm just cold. So now 30 00:01:16.200 --> 00:01:18.680 I feel better. Now I feel better now, all right, Matt, 31 00:01:18.719 --> 00:01:21.480 I'm just stealed thirty thousand foot viewpoint here. Like, where 32 00:01:21.480 --> 00:01:22.120 are we at. 33 00:01:21.959 --> 00:01:25.480 With House b NCAA, Like, what's the timeline and what's 34 00:01:25.480 --> 00:01:25.920 the latest? 35 00:01:25.920 --> 00:01:27.760 What should we know as of today on this Monday, 36 00:01:28.319 --> 00:01:29.319 Well as of. 37 00:01:29.359 --> 00:01:31.920 Today, there's been a little bit of a wrinkle, right, Like, 38 00:01:32.760 --> 00:01:38.120 over the last honestly six plus months, almost everybody in 39 00:01:38.680 --> 00:01:41.760 at the highest levels of college athletics and in the 40 00:01:41.799 --> 00:01:45.599 power conferences and conference offices have been operating on the 41 00:01:45.640 --> 00:01:49.200 assumption that this settlement is going to get approved essentially 42 00:01:49.280 --> 00:01:52.280 as is in early April, and all the revenue sharing 43 00:01:52.319 --> 00:01:54.280 and IL deals that have gone out to athletes in 44 00:01:54.280 --> 00:01:57.680 the last recruiting class and a lot of like vendor hires, 45 00:01:57.920 --> 00:02:00.799 you know, have been pretty explicitly because all of this 46 00:02:00.840 --> 00:02:03.640 is contingent upon the settlement being approved Evan. Last week, 47 00:02:03.719 --> 00:02:08.120 Judge Wilkins says, if you guys don't fix this roster 48 00:02:08.280 --> 00:02:11.520 limit issue that I've pointed out now multiple times, I'm 49 00:02:11.520 --> 00:02:14.039 going to blow up the settlement. So what we have 50 00:02:14.159 --> 00:02:17.560 now is that the plaintiffs, the Plaintiffs Council, and the 51 00:02:17.639 --> 00:02:19.960 NCUBLEA and the power conference folks have to get together 52 00:02:20.000 --> 00:02:22.360 and have to make a decision. Do we want to 53 00:02:22.360 --> 00:02:24.919 blow up this settlement and take this thing to trial 54 00:02:25.360 --> 00:02:28.879 where if we lose, the liability for the NC DOUBLEA 55 00:02:28.960 --> 00:02:33.800 at major conferences is twelve billion dollars, which I believe 56 00:02:33.840 --> 00:02:36.400 would essentially liquidate the NC double A if you want 57 00:02:36.400 --> 00:02:39.199 to roll the dice on court, or do we want 58 00:02:39.240 --> 00:02:43.360 to grandfather in roster limits and figure out some sort 59 00:02:43.400 --> 00:02:45.759 of way to make restitution to the athletes that have 60 00:02:45.800 --> 00:02:50.599 been harmed by our refusal to grandfather in roster limit clauses. 61 00:02:51.159 --> 00:02:53.960 And on the surface, you would think, well, that's that's 62 00:02:54.000 --> 00:02:56.360 an easy decision. Of course you should grandfather in the 63 00:02:56.439 --> 00:02:59.639 roster limits. Why are we going to let the thirty 64 00:02:59.719 --> 00:03:02.639 first person on a track roster blow this whole thing up? 65 00:03:02.680 --> 00:03:05.719 But as we wrote, today. It actually gets pretty messy 66 00:03:05.840 --> 00:03:08.479 because a lot of athletes got cut last year, and 67 00:03:08.520 --> 00:03:11.080 you might have some people that are on other schools 68 00:03:11.120 --> 00:03:13.319 now entirely or maybe out of the game, And do 69 00:03:13.360 --> 00:03:15.960 you let them back in? Do you allow a waiver 70 00:03:16.080 --> 00:03:19.360 to let some Olympic sport athletes potentially compete for two 71 00:03:19.360 --> 00:03:22.479 schools in one calendar year. You might have to if 72 00:03:22.520 --> 00:03:24.919 you're gonna want to comply with this ruling. We're gonna 73 00:03:24.919 --> 00:03:27.360 find out in a little over a week what they decided. 74 00:03:27.120 --> 00:03:28.520 To do a little over a week. 75 00:03:28.599 --> 00:03:30.879 So is that can we finally say we actually have 76 00:03:31.120 --> 00:03:33.479 like a hard deadline, like a drop dead date. 77 00:03:33.560 --> 00:03:34.759 Is that what we're expecting now? 78 00:03:35.319 --> 00:03:37.639 I'm gonna have to go double check on my computer 79 00:03:37.680 --> 00:03:40.159 fit exact date. But when Wilkins letter last week was 80 00:03:40.319 --> 00:03:43.199 you've got fourteen days figure this out, Yeah, we can 81 00:03:43.280 --> 00:03:46.560 finally you know, crap or get off the pot. I would. 82 00:03:46.599 --> 00:03:49.280 I would. I would still be pretty surprised if this 83 00:03:49.319 --> 00:03:53.599 settlement is not approved. But given the way the NCAA 84 00:03:53.680 --> 00:03:56.960 and Power Conference attorneys have kind of acted over the 85 00:03:57.039 --> 00:03:59.080 last couple of months, I can't say at zero percent. 86 00:04:00.240 --> 00:04:02.680 Yeah, And that's why I followed up, because you know, 87 00:04:02.800 --> 00:04:05.439 every day. I mean, you're one of my first stops 88 00:04:05.439 --> 00:04:07.599 because we utilized a lot of the stuff you ride 89 00:04:07.599 --> 00:04:09.400 for the show. And then I try to see if 90 00:04:09.479 --> 00:04:11.919 Ross has anything the usual suspects, and it seems like 91 00:04:11.960 --> 00:04:14.199 all you guys that are plugged in are doing the 92 00:04:14.240 --> 00:04:16.079 best you can to nail down a date, but it 93 00:04:16.120 --> 00:04:19.040 seems to be fluid. Are you Is there any part 94 00:04:19.120 --> 00:04:21.240 of you that's surprised that we are sitting here now 95 00:04:21.279 --> 00:04:23.800 looking May right in the face in the next few 96 00:04:23.839 --> 00:04:27.000 days and we are still dealing with all this ambiguity. 97 00:04:28.120 --> 00:04:33.319 I'm a little surprised, and I probably shouldn't be. You know, 98 00:04:33.600 --> 00:04:36.639 one thing that was just reiterated to me by so 99 00:04:36.759 --> 00:04:40.800 many athletic directors, oh for February and March, whether they 100 00:04:40.839 --> 00:04:44.199 were at big schools or small schools, was we don't 101 00:04:44.240 --> 00:04:47.879 know what's going on, right. We are intellectually aware of 102 00:04:47.920 --> 00:04:50.519 this settlement. Charlie Baker sent ings out a couple of messages, 103 00:04:50.560 --> 00:04:53.720 but honestly, we hear about it from you or from 104 00:04:53.800 --> 00:04:57.360 Ross or from the cole often before we do anybody 105 00:04:57.439 --> 00:04:59.759 in Indianapolis. And that's just because all of this is 106 00:04:59.800 --> 00:05:02.360 being done by a handful of of attorneys, some of 107 00:05:02.399 --> 00:05:05.279 whom who don't you know, are outside council. And I 108 00:05:05.279 --> 00:05:07.240 think it was pretty clear that the folks that were 109 00:05:07.279 --> 00:05:11.480 doing the negotiating over the house settlement were not plugged 110 00:05:11.519 --> 00:05:14.360 in and didn't really care all that much about softball 111 00:05:14.360 --> 00:05:17.480 players or soccer players or how any of this stuff 112 00:05:17.560 --> 00:05:21.319 might affect Utah Valley University. And it turns out the 113 00:05:21.439 --> 00:05:25.800 judge has held a little bit differently about that. So, 114 00:05:26.519 --> 00:05:29.000 if you were going to limit your decision making and 115 00:05:29.040 --> 00:05:32.000 your inputs to this very small group of people and 116 00:05:32.079 --> 00:05:35.319 this very small class of athletes, and yeah, there are 117 00:05:35.360 --> 00:05:36.959 a lot of problems here that I think could have 118 00:05:37.000 --> 00:05:38.879 been addressed a couple of months ago and are not. 119 00:05:39.560 --> 00:05:41.519 That's sort of the story of the NCAA though. 120 00:05:42.040 --> 00:05:45.120 For college football fans college back, I mean fans of 121 00:05:45.160 --> 00:05:48.920 collegian athletics, but mainly you know, college football fans in 122 00:05:49.000 --> 00:05:52.160 college basketball too, both of the revenue generators have been 123 00:05:52.199 --> 00:05:55.680 adversely affected. What would you say as far as what's 124 00:05:55.720 --> 00:05:59.000 realistic to hope and expect once this is across the line, 125 00:05:59.000 --> 00:06:00.879 like on the scale of there will still be a 126 00:06:00.920 --> 00:06:03.519 ton of chaos on one end of the spectrum and 127 00:06:03.560 --> 00:06:06.279 this will finally bring guidelines and guardrails on the other 128 00:06:06.360 --> 00:06:08.079 end of the spectrum that will clean this stuff up. 129 00:06:08.480 --> 00:06:11.360 What's realistic to expect pretty quickly after this is across 130 00:06:11.399 --> 00:06:12.399 the line. 131 00:06:12.519 --> 00:06:13.079 I think. 132 00:06:13.199 --> 00:06:15.959 I think if and when this is this is settled, 133 00:06:16.160 --> 00:06:18.040 what I would tell for what I would tell fans 134 00:06:18.199 --> 00:06:22.120 is now you can have some measure of structure for 135 00:06:22.279 --> 00:06:26.199 the next academic year. And honestly, that's about all I 136 00:06:26.240 --> 00:06:30.600 would say. The folks from in at Indianapolis and at 137 00:06:30.639 --> 00:06:33.759 the Power conferences are really hoping that this settlement would 138 00:06:33.759 --> 00:06:37.160 create something of a de facto CBA that would provide 139 00:06:37.240 --> 00:06:40.040 cost certainty and structure over the next over the next decade, 140 00:06:40.079 --> 00:06:43.279 and protection from additional litigation. At this point, I think 141 00:06:43.319 --> 00:06:45.560 there's no chance of that happening. As soon as this 142 00:06:45.680 --> 00:06:48.399 is done and dusted, there will be three other lawsuits 143 00:06:48.439 --> 00:06:51.720 ready to go to challenge this on titleline consideration to 144 00:06:51.839 --> 00:06:54.160 challenge this from the athletes that opted out and still 145 00:06:54.160 --> 00:06:58.160 want another another crack at the ANTITRUSTNATA, and the second 146 00:06:58.319 --> 00:07:02.120 that Deloitte and or whoever ends up kind of functioning 147 00:07:02.160 --> 00:07:06.600 as this intermediary clearing house tries to invalidate a Bagman deal. 148 00:07:07.000 --> 00:07:09.240 They're going to be in federal court two weeks later. 149 00:07:10.199 --> 00:07:14.199 So there's going there's gonna be some stability just because 150 00:07:14.519 --> 00:07:16.959 you know, millions of dollars of contracts have been sent 151 00:07:17.000 --> 00:07:19.199 out that are contingent upon this thing happening in July. 152 00:07:19.920 --> 00:07:22.439 But I can't tell you what's going to happen in 153 00:07:22.439 --> 00:07:25.639 twenty twenty seven. Your athletic director and your football coach 154 00:07:25.720 --> 00:07:27.920 can't tell you, and I think anybody that says they 155 00:07:27.959 --> 00:07:30.199 absolutely can is selling you something. 156 00:07:31.720 --> 00:07:35.240 Okay, So let's move over here because I feel like, yeah, 157 00:07:35.240 --> 00:07:36.879 I don't know, Matt, maybe you've been coming on the 158 00:07:36.879 --> 00:07:40.000 show for four or five years, and after nil and 159 00:07:40.040 --> 00:07:43.920 transferportal became a reality, and it was clear that administrators 160 00:07:43.920 --> 00:07:48.480 and leaders had failed everybody because there there wasn't anything 161 00:07:48.519 --> 00:07:51.600 that was prepared as far as okay, now now we 162 00:07:51.680 --> 00:07:53.879 know that this is the reality, but here's how it's 163 00:07:53.920 --> 00:07:56.319 going to work. Here are the mechanisms, okay, And none 164 00:07:56.360 --> 00:07:59.199 of that was in place, which has led to a 165 00:07:59.279 --> 00:08:02.199 ton of chaos and sports that we all love. And 166 00:08:02.399 --> 00:08:05.519 I've asked you at different stops whether or not we 167 00:08:05.560 --> 00:08:09.079 are at some point going to move into a reality 168 00:08:09.120 --> 00:08:12.519 of college athletics looking very much like professional athletics and 169 00:08:12.519 --> 00:08:15.240 the players will be able to unionize and they will 170 00:08:15.279 --> 00:08:18.319 be able to collectively bargain with whatever the governing body 171 00:08:18.319 --> 00:08:20.600 looks like. And where will there be a commissioner? Will 172 00:08:20.639 --> 00:08:24.240 college football look like the NFL? Will college basketball look 173 00:08:24.279 --> 00:08:27.120 like the NBA? And you know, a smart guy like 174 00:08:27.160 --> 00:08:29.199 you has been able to help us understand based off 175 00:08:29.240 --> 00:08:31.879 of you know, the Trump administration and changes they're going 176 00:08:31.959 --> 00:08:34.399 to make. How you know things have changed in that direction. 177 00:08:34.519 --> 00:08:37.559 Where where are we at now as far as your 178 00:08:37.600 --> 00:08:39.159 belief of what I know? 179 00:08:39.200 --> 00:08:41.159 You just said, you don't know what twenty twenty seven 180 00:08:41.279 --> 00:08:41.840 is going to look like. 181 00:08:41.879 --> 00:08:45.840 But my opinion, Matt, is the only thing that will 182 00:08:45.879 --> 00:08:48.960 settle most of the issues that are causing the chaos 183 00:08:49.519 --> 00:08:52.600 is a pro model. I still believe that to be true. 184 00:08:52.639 --> 00:08:54.399 Do you think at some point we are going to 185 00:08:54.399 --> 00:08:55.080 see that whenever? 186 00:08:55.120 --> 00:08:59.639 That is my opinion on this. I think is pretty 187 00:08:59.639 --> 00:09:03.519 different from most of my national reporter colleagues, and they 188 00:09:03.519 --> 00:09:05.840 may very well be right. Maybe this is me being 189 00:09:05.960 --> 00:09:07.759 you know, too much of a chicken little or something, 190 00:09:07.799 --> 00:09:12.120 but I legitimately think there is a better than fifty 191 00:09:12.159 --> 00:09:16.600 percent chance that this Congress passes some sort of college 192 00:09:16.639 --> 00:09:19.919 sports bill. Now, that bill may be something that every 193 00:09:20.000 --> 00:09:23.639 single economist and agent and lawyer on Twitter absolutely hates. 194 00:09:24.039 --> 00:09:25.919 It might be a bill that I really don't like, 195 00:09:26.399 --> 00:09:30.320 but I think there is more momentum and a political 196 00:09:30.360 --> 00:09:33.120 coalition that's that's more equipped to make that happen than 197 00:09:33.159 --> 00:09:35.320 there has been over the past couple of years. In 198 00:09:35.799 --> 00:09:39.600 my professional opinion, like the dry Little Secret is no 199 00:09:39.720 --> 00:09:43.440 matter whether you want a clusive bargaining agreement and and 200 00:09:43.679 --> 00:09:46.799 and athletes as employees and a union and that kind 201 00:09:46.840 --> 00:09:50.039 of structure, or whether you want to try to roll 202 00:09:50.080 --> 00:09:52.879 this thing back to nineteen ninety seven and give the 203 00:09:52.919 --> 00:09:58.000 schools a lot more empowerments to enforce amateurism rules. Either 204 00:09:58.039 --> 00:10:02.639 of those solutions is going to require Congress, because right 205 00:10:02.639 --> 00:10:05.000 now the NC double A is not empowered to make 206 00:10:05.159 --> 00:10:08.600 or enforce virtually any kind of rule without the sports 207 00:10:08.600 --> 00:10:11.480 system ruling and shipping away at it. So I don't 208 00:10:11.480 --> 00:10:13.399 look at that and necessarily think that was lack of 209 00:10:13.399 --> 00:10:17.360 administrator leadership. The lack of administrator leadership was probably more 210 00:10:17.360 --> 00:10:20.039 in two thousand and seven than in twenty twenty four. 211 00:10:20.320 --> 00:10:22.039 But you could come up with the best plan in 212 00:10:22.080 --> 00:10:24.639 the world. I can sit out here and I can 213 00:10:24.639 --> 00:10:26.840 write a three thousand word compromise that a lot of 214 00:10:26.840 --> 00:10:30.320 people would agree with tomorrow, and a second it's enforced, 215 00:10:30.360 --> 00:10:33.519 it's going to get smacked down on anti trust grounds. 216 00:10:33.240 --> 00:10:38.279 I personally think that there are in there are sixty 217 00:10:38.360 --> 00:10:41.320 votes in the US Senate to pass something that says, Okay, 218 00:10:42.120 --> 00:10:44.679 we're going to give the NC DOUBLEA a limited and 219 00:10:44.759 --> 00:10:48.120 conditional anti trust exemption to enforce some of these rules, 220 00:10:48.639 --> 00:10:51.200 and we're going to say that college football players cannot 221 00:10:51.240 --> 00:10:55.480 be employees and that designation only is true if the 222 00:10:55.559 --> 00:10:59.679 NC DOUBLEA commits to XYZ and we can reassess it 223 00:10:59.720 --> 00:11:02.159 every two or three years, and it's gonna make it's 224 00:11:02.159 --> 00:11:04.519 gonna make a lot of trial. War is pretty angry, 225 00:11:05.039 --> 00:11:08.240 but that might be the most reasonably the easiest path here, 226 00:11:08.279 --> 00:11:11.240 because I mean, you know this even better than I do. Locally, Right, 227 00:11:11.759 --> 00:11:14.000 there's a lot of states that don't allow or don't 228 00:11:14.000 --> 00:11:17.600 want collective bargaining for public employees. And if you're in 229 00:11:17.639 --> 00:11:20.000 a place you're not gonna let the firefighters and the 230 00:11:20.039 --> 00:11:22.320 cops and the teachers do it. You're not gonna let 231 00:11:22.320 --> 00:11:23.559 middle linebackers do it either. 232 00:11:24.159 --> 00:11:28.360 Okay, So let's operate off the hypothetical that what you 233 00:11:28.519 --> 00:11:32.440 just outlined will be the direction. Do you agree with 234 00:11:32.559 --> 00:11:34.919 the direction? Is that what you would like to see 235 00:11:34.960 --> 00:11:37.080 happen for the sport? Do you think that's the right move, 236 00:11:37.320 --> 00:11:41.519 because I maintain mad that I and I will stay on. 237 00:11:41.440 --> 00:11:43.840 The hill where I do think the right move is 238 00:11:44.320 --> 00:11:45.039 the pro model. 239 00:11:45.080 --> 00:11:47.840 I mean, if players sign contracts at least they're on 240 00:11:47.879 --> 00:11:50.039 campus for a couple of years, if there is a 241 00:11:50.200 --> 00:11:53.440 salary cap, and I'm using professional terms, then maybe it 242 00:11:53.480 --> 00:11:55.360 does even the playing field a little bit. And of 243 00:11:55.360 --> 00:11:58.120 course there's always money paid into various ways, but that's 244 00:11:58.120 --> 00:12:01.279 not new, that's been going on forever. Uh So, if 245 00:12:01.879 --> 00:12:04.440 if there is a salary structure, a salary cap, and 246 00:12:04.519 --> 00:12:06.960 contracts where players are on campus for a couple. 247 00:12:06.759 --> 00:12:09.000 Of years, I believe that to be the right route. 248 00:12:09.320 --> 00:12:13.159 If the congressional bill that you're talking about is the route, 249 00:12:13.159 --> 00:12:16.120 do you think that will go a long way to alleviate. 250 00:12:15.679 --> 00:12:17.759 Some of the issues that we always talk about. 251 00:12:17.960 --> 00:12:20.039 I think the bill that's coming is something that's going 252 00:12:20.080 --> 00:12:23.559 to be written by Ted Cruz, and I admit I 253 00:12:23.600 --> 00:12:25.720 am generally not the kind of person who's going to 254 00:12:25.759 --> 00:12:27.519 go and say with my full chest, I love this 255 00:12:27.559 --> 00:12:31.039 bill that Ted Cruz wrote or that that Senator Lee 256 00:12:31.120 --> 00:12:34.279 is also going to support that. I'm sure we agree 257 00:12:34.320 --> 00:12:38.200 on something. It's a it's probably a smaller rist and 258 00:12:38.600 --> 00:12:41.879 my understanding because i've I've I've heard about drafts of 259 00:12:41.919 --> 00:12:44.200 this of this bill is kind of circulated around and 260 00:12:44.320 --> 00:12:47.840 is not it's not really a secret anymore. It wouldn't 261 00:12:47.840 --> 00:12:50.039 look like that very much like it wouldn't move to 262 00:12:50.080 --> 00:12:53.360 that professional model like now in my opinion, which I 263 00:12:53.399 --> 00:12:55.759 know makes for lousy sports radio. Is I think it 264 00:12:55.799 --> 00:12:57.600 depends on the kind of athlete you're talking about. Like, 265 00:12:57.639 --> 00:13:01.360 do I do I think that professionalization and employment status 266 00:13:01.399 --> 00:13:05.159 and contracts of track athletes and Division one college athletics 267 00:13:05.159 --> 00:13:08.240 makes sense? I'd say probably not. It's very rare that 268 00:13:08.360 --> 00:13:11.480 I run into somebody who wants that and and that 269 00:13:11.600 --> 00:13:13.879 model will probably lead to worse outcomes than what we 270 00:13:13.919 --> 00:13:16.519 have right now. Do I think that big twelve football 271 00:13:16.519 --> 00:13:20.120 players and Big twelve basketball players should be employees and 272 00:13:20.159 --> 00:13:24.039 have a union and head collectively bargain. I do, But 273 00:13:24.840 --> 00:13:27.080 I also am am I can't. I don't. I don't 274 00:13:27.120 --> 00:13:30.320 say that with like deep authoritative absolutely, because I I 275 00:13:31.320 --> 00:13:33.919 it's one thing to say we want collective bargaining. When 276 00:13:34.320 --> 00:13:38.279 a union doesn't exist, it's another thing to have somebody 277 00:13:38.320 --> 00:13:40.720 on the other side of that table to do that negotiating. 278 00:13:40.759 --> 00:13:43.919 And that doesn't exist right now. And if it's created 279 00:13:44.320 --> 00:13:47.879 by management by Congress, by Jim Kabayle at athletes dot 280 00:13:48.000 --> 00:13:50.559 Org out of kind of fiat, I think it's gonna 281 00:13:50.559 --> 00:13:53.279 get its butt kicked for the first several years, which 282 00:13:53.320 --> 00:13:56.799 is often what happened to athlete unions. So then it's like, Okay, 283 00:13:56.960 --> 00:13:59.679 I do I well this do? I want something that 284 00:13:59.720 --> 00:14:02.720 will make my life easier as a reporter, my life 285 00:14:02.799 --> 00:14:06.320 easier as a fan, and will probably benefit my personal fandom. 286 00:14:06.399 --> 00:14:08.360 I went to Ohio State, I root for the bluest 287 00:14:08.399 --> 00:14:11.000 of the blue blood football programs, like it would probably 288 00:14:11.000 --> 00:14:13.559 benefit me, and hope that it would benefit athletes in 289 00:14:13.600 --> 00:14:15.919 twelve years, even if it sucks for people in the 290 00:14:15.919 --> 00:14:20.039 short term. That's harder as not a copount honest to 291 00:14:20.120 --> 00:14:23.039 guys like I don't think there's a I just don't 292 00:14:23.039 --> 00:14:24.919 think there's an easy answer out there. If there is, 293 00:14:25.120 --> 00:14:26.480 we probably would have done it by now. 294 00:14:27.120 --> 00:14:31.879 So for college football and college basketball fans that cannot 295 00:14:31.960 --> 00:14:35.360 stand the fact that we no longer get to know 296 00:14:35.399 --> 00:14:37.919 these kids we no longer get to. You know, the 297 00:14:38.159 --> 00:14:41.039 great Rick mcjari's teams always had the Keith van Horns 298 00:14:41.039 --> 00:14:43.200 and the Andre Millers and the Britton Johnson's that stayed 299 00:14:43.240 --> 00:14:45.039 until they were juniors and seniors. And you and I 300 00:14:45.080 --> 00:14:48.600 have talked about the dynamic of the best Utah football 301 00:14:48.600 --> 00:14:52.799 teams were comprised of kids a coach with recruited that 302 00:14:52.879 --> 00:14:55.759 maybe weren't all that highly thought of and then developed 303 00:14:55.799 --> 00:14:58.879 into juniors and seniors and NFL players and those who 304 00:14:58.879 --> 00:15:01.320 have been the best Utah foot ball and basketball rosters. 305 00:15:01.320 --> 00:15:03.240 I think it's pretty much the same thing with Breagham Young. 306 00:15:03.320 --> 00:15:06.320 So fans that cannot stand the fact that they're losing 307 00:15:06.360 --> 00:15:09.679 their favorite players every year, would you just say that 308 00:15:09.720 --> 00:15:11.360 you better get used to it, because that's how it's 309 00:15:11.360 --> 00:15:11.799 going to be. 310 00:15:14.240 --> 00:15:18.759 Probably unless the Byus and Utah's of the world begin 311 00:15:18.879 --> 00:15:23.240 to recruit a very different kind of person and begin 312 00:15:23.360 --> 00:15:26.600 to really go out of their way to offer value 313 00:15:27.320 --> 00:15:31.840 independent of just money. And a lot of programs like 314 00:15:31.879 --> 00:15:33.960 to talk about, hey, we want to be transformational, we 315 00:15:33.960 --> 00:15:35.919 don't want to be transactional and like and I believe 316 00:15:35.919 --> 00:15:39.279 in their heart they mean that, but it's hard to 317 00:15:39.320 --> 00:15:41.200 get a twenty year old to buy into it when 318 00:15:41.240 --> 00:15:43.600 you don't under a twenty year ol. Like if we 319 00:15:43.919 --> 00:15:46.240 go back at time and talk to our twenty year 320 00:15:46.279 --> 00:15:49.000 old selves and look at various schools, I mean like, hey, well, 321 00:15:49.039 --> 00:15:51.399 because of this school, look how much money their forty 322 00:15:51.480 --> 00:15:53.840 year old alumni make. And look how this is connected 323 00:15:53.840 --> 00:15:56.080 to US world and news report, and look at it. 324 00:15:56.120 --> 00:15:57.799 All these things that will pay off in your thirties. 325 00:15:58.159 --> 00:16:01.399 We wouldn't care, would care about the amount of money 326 00:16:01.399 --> 00:16:05.360 that's available right now, playing time, maybe availability of cute girls, 327 00:16:06.039 --> 00:16:09.919 and maybe proximity to mom and dad, right And I 328 00:16:10.799 --> 00:16:13.320 know that schools try to do this. I know that 329 00:16:13.360 --> 00:16:16.960 both BYU and Utah don't recruit every single five star 330 00:16:17.000 --> 00:16:18.919 guy because you need somebody who's going to be comfortable 331 00:16:18.960 --> 00:16:21.360 in Utah, somebody who's going to be successful in this 332 00:16:21.440 --> 00:16:25.639 kind of environment. Probably not somebody who wants to be 333 00:16:25.759 --> 00:16:28.679 on every single commercial. But I think it will be 334 00:16:28.840 --> 00:16:33.600 very difficult in the foreseeable future to keep eighty five 335 00:16:33.679 --> 00:16:36.320 percent of the kids that you sign as high schoolers, 336 00:16:36.399 --> 00:16:40.559 or eighty percent of them on your team moving forward. 337 00:16:40.639 --> 00:16:44.960 It's it's difficult to look somebody in the eye and 338 00:16:45.000 --> 00:16:47.799 say no, you shouldn't go accept that eight hundred thousand 339 00:16:47.840 --> 00:16:50.080 dollars check at Arkansas. 340 00:16:49.879 --> 00:16:52.559 That's hard, Yeah, for sure. 341 00:16:52.679 --> 00:16:55.240 And you know one more thing here than I do 342 00:16:55.279 --> 00:16:57.399 have a BYU question, because we were talking about this 343 00:16:57.440 --> 00:17:01.240 earlier in the show, Like the dynamic of NI, I 344 00:17:01.279 --> 00:17:03.919 don't think is a bad I don't think it's a 345 00:17:03.919 --> 00:17:06.039 bad thing. I don't think in theory. I think it's 346 00:17:06.079 --> 00:17:11.240 a positive thing. Nil itself, to me, isn't the problem, right, 347 00:17:11.759 --> 00:17:13.519 It's the way it's administered. 348 00:17:13.680 --> 00:17:15.799 It's the lack of guidelines and guardrails. 349 00:17:16.319 --> 00:17:19.960 So you know, ultimately to your point, I would never 350 00:17:20.000 --> 00:17:21.960 have the nerve to tell anybody to turn out a 351 00:17:21.960 --> 00:17:23.759 bag like we're all trying to make our way through 352 00:17:23.799 --> 00:17:27.119 the world, and if you could parlay your newsletter into 353 00:17:27.160 --> 00:17:29.480 ten times what you're making right now, then go do it. 354 00:17:29.519 --> 00:17:30.359 Whatever that looks like. 355 00:17:30.440 --> 00:17:32.640 If I had a different offer to do the show 356 00:17:32.640 --> 00:17:34.799 in a different market for five times my salary, I 357 00:17:34.799 --> 00:17:36.599 want to go be able to do that. So I 358 00:17:36.640 --> 00:17:40.079 don't necessarily begrudge any young athlete for going to get 359 00:17:40.079 --> 00:17:43.599 their money at all. But is there any sort of 360 00:17:43.680 --> 00:17:47.759 way that we haven't necessarily discussed to make sure that 361 00:17:47.839 --> 00:17:50.440 those decisions and I know they've tried to close the 362 00:17:50.480 --> 00:17:53.880 portal here and the calendar is not as wide open 363 00:17:53.920 --> 00:17:54.559 as it used to be. 364 00:17:55.079 --> 00:17:57.039 But outside of signing a contract, I. 365 00:17:56.960 --> 00:18:00.160 Just don't see any other way of keeping these kids 366 00:18:00.200 --> 00:18:02.480 on campus if they can. I mean, we've had a 367 00:18:02.480 --> 00:18:06.039 couple of transfer portal losses for the Utes just over 368 00:18:06.079 --> 00:18:07.119 the past couple of weeks. 369 00:18:07.119 --> 00:18:10.000 You know, Zach William's going to USC and there's. 370 00:18:09.839 --> 00:18:13.359 All this debate online about you know, there's the incestuous 371 00:18:13.519 --> 00:18:15.920 nature between the Utah and BYU coaching staff. 372 00:18:16.359 --> 00:18:17.839 Right, and so are you poaching? 373 00:18:18.480 --> 00:18:21.400 I've seen this on Twitter, right right, right, Yeah. 374 00:18:21.240 --> 00:18:23.720 Yeah, they're poaching our player and like you can't call 375 00:18:23.759 --> 00:18:25.160 it poaching because it's allowed. 376 00:18:25.240 --> 00:18:28.079 It's not against the rules. Like nobody is doing anything 377 00:18:28.119 --> 00:18:28.920 to fary us here. 378 00:18:29.359 --> 00:18:32.680 So is there a way to you know, because again 379 00:18:32.759 --> 00:18:34.680 to your point, go get your back, I'm not saying 380 00:18:34.799 --> 00:18:36.440 I'm not saying don't. But is there a way to 381 00:18:36.519 --> 00:18:38.559 at least keep these kids on campus for a couple 382 00:18:38.599 --> 00:18:42.440 of years. That's a good situation for them and the institution. 383 00:18:43.480 --> 00:18:45.880 So I think there's there's a couple of things. If 384 00:18:45.920 --> 00:18:48.799 I can wave a magic wand right, because we actually 385 00:18:48.839 --> 00:18:51.440 we do have contracts, right Like I in addition to 386 00:18:51.480 --> 00:18:55.160 running a newsletter, I have a software product that that 387 00:18:55.240 --> 00:18:59.400 collects coach and administrator and vendor contracts and I sell 388 00:18:59.400 --> 00:19:01.920 that to news rooms and agencies and other people. And 389 00:19:02.039 --> 00:19:05.400 there are contracts between schools and athletes that are in there. 390 00:19:05.400 --> 00:19:08.400 And we're seeing this right now with Arkansas about Arkansas's 391 00:19:08.400 --> 00:19:11.559 ability to recoup some of that buyout money from you know, 392 00:19:11.640 --> 00:19:15.319 from from Nico's little brother. And and there's there's a 393 00:19:15.319 --> 00:19:18.240 good legal case to be had that those those posits 394 00:19:18.240 --> 00:19:21.799 are not enforceable. So then even a contract doesn't necessarily help, 395 00:19:21.920 --> 00:19:23.720 Like it kind of depends on what some judges and 396 00:19:24.119 --> 00:19:27.960 lawyers end up saying. One policy that does not get 397 00:19:27.960 --> 00:19:31.839 discussed very much federally that I think would meaningfully help, 398 00:19:31.839 --> 00:19:33.839 and this is something that I think lawmakers could do, 399 00:19:33.920 --> 00:19:38.839 even in Utah, is to have actual aggressive and meaningful 400 00:19:39.400 --> 00:19:44.920 agent licensing metrics and a law enforcement body or some 401 00:19:45.039 --> 00:19:47.640