1 00:00:00,320 --> 00:00:01,080 Speaker 1: Hello, everyone. 2 00:00:02,560 --> 00:00:04,639 Speaker 2: There's a lot of stuff going on in the world. 3 00:00:04,719 --> 00:00:08,720 Speaker 1: And I realized that I have been making videos since 4 00:00:08,759 --> 00:00:13,320 twenty sixteen, and a lot of things have changed since then. 5 00:00:13,759 --> 00:00:16,519 We are in this moment when all of a sudden, 6 00:00:17,320 --> 00:00:20,160 the churches are exploding. They don't know what to do. 7 00:00:20,399 --> 00:00:22,920 They have to build new churches. It's happening at least, 8 00:00:22,960 --> 00:00:25,760 and I know in the Orthodox Church all over America 9 00:00:27,320 --> 00:00:31,199 there's a transformation and culture that has effectively happened, and 10 00:00:31,239 --> 00:00:34,640 we can see it through all these signs. I saw 11 00:00:34,679 --> 00:00:37,439 it at the New Arc conference, where people were not 12 00:00:37,560 --> 00:00:40,640 afraid at all to speak about their faith, about the 13 00:00:40,679 --> 00:00:44,359 importance of God as being the very root of our 14 00:00:44,399 --> 00:00:47,880 being and as the root of our civilization. The transformation 15 00:00:48,240 --> 00:00:52,679 is crazy. And I was going back into my videos 16 00:00:52,719 --> 00:00:55,079 and I noticed the very first talk that I gave 17 00:00:55,119 --> 00:00:58,240 with Joran Peterson back in twenty sixteen at the University 18 00:00:58,280 --> 00:01:02,039 of Toronto, and it was the Resurrection of Logos. And 19 00:01:02,079 --> 00:01:06,719 in that talk, I intimated the sea that was being planted, 20 00:01:07,359 --> 00:01:11,560 and I kind of could see that all of this 21 00:01:12,040 --> 00:01:15,079 was taking place back at the time and the hardest 22 00:01:15,120 --> 00:01:19,280 moment when it looked like everything was nearing collapse in 23 00:01:19,359 --> 00:01:22,799 terms of culture, where we were being completely overwhelmed by 24 00:01:23,079 --> 00:01:26,840 the monsters of ideology, and so I gave this talk 25 00:01:26,920 --> 00:01:28,680 trying to kind of help people see and you have 26 00:01:28,760 --> 00:01:30,879 to think, I'm going to put this talk up now, 27 00:01:30,920 --> 00:01:34,040 and you have to remember that people had no idea 28 00:01:34,079 --> 00:01:36,359 about all the things that many of us are already 29 00:01:36,400 --> 00:01:40,439 now taking for granted. Trying to help people understand the 30 00:01:40,480 --> 00:01:45,599 transformation and culture that that we're seeing beginning at the time, 31 00:01:46,000 --> 00:01:48,480 and also warning people of the dangers. And now we 32 00:01:48,519 --> 00:01:52,799 can see that both the opportunities and the dangers have grown, 33 00:01:53,319 --> 00:01:56,920 and we are standing in a position right now where 34 00:01:56,760 --> 00:02:00,920 the danger of you could call it too strong an identity, 35 00:02:01,000 --> 00:02:04,000 or the danger of a kind of weaponized Christianity is 36 00:02:04,200 --> 00:02:06,959 really in front of us. But also there are true, 37 00:02:07,000 --> 00:02:10,159 beautiful opportunities that have opened up, and we need to 38 00:02:10,199 --> 00:02:13,560 be able to kind of engage with them in enjoy 39 00:02:13,800 --> 00:02:17,840 and in gratefulness. But I thought it'd be interesting for 40 00:02:17,919 --> 00:02:20,159 you to go back and see this talk, which you 41 00:02:20,199 --> 00:02:22,680 know didn't get many views at the time, but is 42 00:02:22,879 --> 00:02:27,759 in some ways a like a little moment of what 43 00:02:27,800 --> 00:02:29,680 was happening back in the day, and you can look 44 00:02:29,680 --> 00:02:32,719 at it now from in retrospect and see what has 45 00:02:32,800 --> 00:02:36,680 actually happened. The funniest thing about it was I mentioned 46 00:02:36,680 --> 00:02:40,680 how Christian symbolism usually when they they're kind of weird people, 47 00:02:40,680 --> 00:02:44,000 they do Christian symbolism talk about aliens, and I kind 48 00:02:44,000 --> 00:02:46,159 of mock that. And now here we are in this 49 00:02:46,199 --> 00:02:49,199 world where all of a sudden, talking about aliens has 50 00:02:49,360 --> 00:02:53,639 great symbolic import But nonetheless, please enjoy this conversation. 51 00:02:53,719 --> 00:02:54,680 Speaker 2: I know it was a lot of. 52 00:02:54,599 --> 00:03:00,199 Speaker 1: Fun for me to watch it again, so thanks everyone. 53 00:03:09,360 --> 00:03:12,879 Speaker 2: This is Jonathan Pshel. Welcome to the Symbolic World. 54 00:03:23,879 --> 00:03:26,319 Speaker 3: Hello friends, this is Richard Roland, and I am inviting 55 00:03:26,360 --> 00:03:30,280 you to join me for my new Symbolic World course, 56 00:03:30,879 --> 00:03:34,000 Tolkien and Universal History. In this course, we're going to 57 00:03:34,080 --> 00:03:37,159 go over the deep mythological and universal history roots of 58 00:03:37,199 --> 00:03:40,960 Tolkien's Legendarium and see how Tolkien sort of shows us 59 00:03:41,000 --> 00:03:48,199 a blueprint for reclaiming a legendary, mythical Christian framework for storytelling, 60 00:03:48,520 --> 00:03:50,840 and in fact, we're going to even do some storytelling 61 00:03:50,879 --> 00:03:54,000 of our own. This is a five week course. It 62 00:03:54,039 --> 00:03:56,319 starts on March the third. We had to postpone it 63 00:03:56,360 --> 00:03:57,879 a week, which means there's a little more time for 64 00:03:57,919 --> 00:04:01,240 you to sign up and I hope to see you there. 65 00:04:03,439 --> 00:04:06,439 Speaker 2: By the Ted. Thanks, I really appreciate I appreciate being here. 66 00:04:06,439 --> 00:04:09,759 I appreciate being in Toronto. It's a great town. Today 67 00:04:09,800 --> 00:04:12,599 I spent the day going to the museum and visiting, 68 00:04:12,639 --> 00:04:16,279 so I really enjoying the city. I'm gonna start with 69 00:04:16,279 --> 00:04:24,079 a story. It's March twenty fifteen, and I'm driving. We're 70 00:04:24,079 --> 00:04:26,040 gonna pick up my children at some friend's house on 71 00:04:26,040 --> 00:04:28,920 a Friday night, and it's about half an hour drive. 72 00:04:29,000 --> 00:04:31,079 So I'm settling in and I'm listening to the CBC 73 00:04:31,319 --> 00:04:36,079 like I usually do, but that particular evening, the content 74 00:04:36,199 --> 00:04:40,040 is not usually what you get on the CBC. So 75 00:04:40,160 --> 00:04:44,519 on the air, this University of Toronto professor, and what 76 00:04:44,600 --> 00:04:47,199 he's saying rings a bit off from what I usually 77 00:04:47,199 --> 00:04:50,000 hear on that show. And at first he's talking about 78 00:04:50,120 --> 00:04:54,279 religion and religious symbolism, and he's doing it in a way, 79 00:04:54,879 --> 00:04:57,439 let's say, he's doing it without the usual smugness that 80 00:04:57,480 --> 00:05:00,439 we tend to hear when people talk about religion, especially 81 00:05:00,519 --> 00:05:04,800 about Christianity, and so here he is talking about Christianity, 82 00:05:05,720 --> 00:05:07,319 but I can tell he's not a he's not a 83 00:05:07,360 --> 00:05:10,600 priest or. He's not a preacher. He's a psychologist. He's 84 00:05:10,600 --> 00:05:15,560 a scientist. And so as a talk unfolds, my let's say, 85 00:05:15,560 --> 00:05:19,920 my attention heightens, and after a few minutes, just a 86 00:05:19,920 --> 00:05:23,040 few minutes, I just I can't believe what I am hearing. 87 00:05:24,079 --> 00:05:26,639 As this prof is going through stories of Adam and 88 00:05:26,759 --> 00:05:30,839 he's kanat able, jumping through Shakespeare and Milton and Gerty 89 00:05:31,160 --> 00:05:35,399 and then too Darwin and Nietzsche and Jung. And immediately 90 00:05:35,439 --> 00:05:39,319 I see what he's doing. He isn't just trying to 91 00:05:39,399 --> 00:05:46,519 communicate information. He's dancing across this wide variety of references 92 00:05:47,560 --> 00:05:49,360 because what he wants to do is he wants to 93 00:05:49,399 --> 00:05:56,680 bring out he wants to trace this underlying pattern, and 94 00:05:56,720 --> 00:05:59,879 by doing so, he's trying to awaken something in his list. 95 00:06:00,959 --> 00:06:03,040 He's not just trying to get them to understand, which 96 00:06:03,079 --> 00:06:05,959 is what we usually hear when we listen to talks. No, 97 00:06:06,079 --> 00:06:10,639 he's trying to provoke, trying to shake people into experiencing 98 00:06:11,399 --> 00:06:18,240 how the world is built with meaning. So he talks 99 00:06:18,240 --> 00:06:23,279 about logos, which is true meaning expressed in word is 100 00:06:23,319 --> 00:06:29,519 search for purpose, and logos transform transforms chaos and potentiality 101 00:06:29,839 --> 00:06:36,519 into being. And in opposition to this lies deceit, resentment 102 00:06:37,040 --> 00:06:42,079 gradually dismantle the world and plunge it into ever growing chaos. 103 00:06:43,439 --> 00:06:45,240 I mean, of course he's taken this from the Bible, 104 00:06:45,839 --> 00:06:48,160 the Book of Genesis, from the Gospel of Saint John, 105 00:06:48,759 --> 00:06:55,360 sprinkled with some phenomenology, but he's very clearly describing this 106 00:06:55,519 --> 00:07:03,240 process at all levels of reality, at the individual, the interpersonal, 107 00:07:03,360 --> 00:07:08,519 the social, political levels, and this interaction between logos and 108 00:07:08,959 --> 00:07:12,279 chaos is the main manner we could say by which 109 00:07:12,319 --> 00:07:19,839 the world is constantly sustained. So by this point, I'm 110 00:07:19,959 --> 00:07:23,439 literally cheering in the car. I'm like, I'm hitting my 111 00:07:23,560 --> 00:07:28,160 steering ear, and all I can think is who is this? 112 00:07:28,720 --> 00:07:31,560 Who is this person talking? And why have I not 113 00:07:31,600 --> 00:07:34,519 heard of him before? Like why is he not famous? Well, 114 00:07:34,560 --> 00:07:39,399 I guess we don't ask that question anymore, right, And 115 00:07:39,600 --> 00:07:43,199 especially I'm like, how does he know this? You see? Like, 116 00:07:43,480 --> 00:07:46,759 so the attempt to help people see experience patterns or 117 00:07:46,839 --> 00:07:50,519 meaning and religious symbolism, how it connects to all levels 118 00:07:50,519 --> 00:07:53,240 of reality. That's what I've been trying to do for years. 119 00:07:52,879 --> 00:07:55,879 That's been my goal in life. I would say in 120 00:07:55,920 --> 00:07:59,439 my carvings and my articles, in my talks, and I 121 00:07:59,480 --> 00:08:01,319 would say there's only a handful of people that I 122 00:08:01,399 --> 00:08:05,720 know that I can relate to at that level. You know, 123 00:08:05,879 --> 00:08:08,480 it's not that people don't talk about religious symbolism. Actually 124 00:08:08,600 --> 00:08:11,800 a lot of people do. But usually when you hear 125 00:08:11,839 --> 00:08:14,600 people talk about religious symbolism, at some point you can 126 00:08:14,680 --> 00:08:16,759 kind of picture them in like a tin foil hat, 127 00:08:17,399 --> 00:08:22,160 and then you know they soon extra terrestrials become part 128 00:08:22,199 --> 00:08:26,680 of the of the discussion. But not this guy. He's 129 00:08:26,759 --> 00:08:29,959 just as clear as can be. So when I get home, 130 00:08:31,240 --> 00:08:34,200 so I reach out to him, and I send him 131 00:08:34,240 --> 00:08:38,840 just a little message, you know, just thanking him and 132 00:08:39,240 --> 00:08:42,960 expressing my surprise and linking into a few few articles 133 00:08:43,000 --> 00:08:45,399 i'd written, a few talks i'd given. You know, that 134 00:08:45,480 --> 00:08:48,279 was it. I didn't expect. I didn't really expect an answer. 135 00:08:49,840 --> 00:08:51,679 But then the next morning I get I get a 136 00:08:51,679 --> 00:08:55,159 message thanking me for my message and pointing me to 137 00:08:55,320 --> 00:08:58,960 a few lectures that he had given more specifically on religion. 138 00:08:59,000 --> 00:09:03,399 I thought, that's pretty cool, Like, that's that's nice, this 139 00:09:03,840 --> 00:09:08,200 random quebecer is sending messages to him. But then about 140 00:09:08,200 --> 00:09:10,200 about an hour and a half later, I get this 141 00:09:10,320 --> 00:09:14,360 call and I can't do that. I can't do the 142 00:09:14,399 --> 00:09:23,360 kriminal voice. So anyways, my memories, my memories of that 143 00:09:23,440 --> 00:09:26,399 moment are kind of vague, but I think I probably 144 00:09:26,440 --> 00:09:29,399 acted like a fourteen year old meeting Kanye West or something. 145 00:09:31,519 --> 00:09:33,960 And now his tone is one of surprise, maybe a 146 00:09:33,960 --> 00:09:37,759 bit of confusion, and his basic question, and he's been 147 00:09:37,799 --> 00:09:40,080 asking me this question ever since, is how do you 148 00:09:40,200 --> 00:09:44,159 know this? Because he'd listen to my talk and he 149 00:09:44,360 --> 00:09:48,799 saw the relationship between what I was saying and what 150 00:09:48,840 --> 00:09:51,399 he was saying and the talk that's exactly I had 151 00:09:51,480 --> 00:09:57,159 been talking about how logos organizes potential into experience being 152 00:09:58,399 --> 00:09:59,919 it's why am I Why am I telling you that? 153 00:10:01,080 --> 00:10:03,600 I mean, first of all, I'm telling this as an 154 00:10:03,600 --> 00:10:07,559 excuse because despite what father Ted said, here's this carver 155 00:10:08,039 --> 00:10:12,039 who's standing amongst theologians and professors. So the reason why 156 00:10:13,720 --> 00:10:17,960 I'm here is because since then, Professor Peterson and I 157 00:10:17,960 --> 00:10:20,600 have developed this relationship. Some of you might have seen 158 00:10:20,600 --> 00:10:26,039 the interviews that we did together, but mostly I'm telling 159 00:10:26,080 --> 00:10:29,519 you this because I know I know that it nears 160 00:10:29,559 --> 00:10:32,080 the story of so many people that are probably here 161 00:10:32,480 --> 00:10:35,120 in this room, and a lot of the people that 162 00:10:35,279 --> 00:10:41,080 might hear this on YouTube or in the podcast. I 163 00:10:41,120 --> 00:10:44,360 know that it mirrors. I know, because dozens of people 164 00:10:44,399 --> 00:10:50,240 have told me of that experience. You know, I have 165 00:10:50,320 --> 00:10:52,120 this image I don't know if people have seen it 166 00:10:52,120 --> 00:10:55,399 of Joe Rogan hearing doctor Peterson talk for the first 167 00:10:55,440 --> 00:10:59,120 time and his jaw dropping, you know, and all of 168 00:10:59,120 --> 00:11:02,799 a sudden he sees religion in a completely different way. 169 00:11:03,879 --> 00:11:06,480 And I've even received dozens of message from I would 170 00:11:06,480 --> 00:11:11,480 call them in process atheists who say, you know, my 171 00:11:11,720 --> 00:11:17,080 questions and my thinking have been tilted slightly in unexpected ways. 172 00:11:18,919 --> 00:11:22,240 And that experience I think has been strongest for Orthodox 173 00:11:22,360 --> 00:11:26,480 Christians like myself. In fact, I stopped counting the number 174 00:11:26,519 --> 00:11:31,080 of messages I received from priests asking me, so says 175 00:11:31,120 --> 00:11:35,000 doctor Pearson orthodox or what, and to which I usually answer, no, 176 00:11:35,080 --> 00:11:39,320 he just likes dosci Sky a lot. And there's even 177 00:11:39,399 --> 00:11:44,679 one clergyman who answered to that said, oh, yeah, he's Orthodox, 178 00:11:44,759 --> 00:11:51,279 he just doesn't know it yet. But this correlation has 179 00:11:51,320 --> 00:11:57,320 been persistent. So what is this connection? What made the 180 00:11:57,399 --> 00:12:02,120 connection between a traditional Christian like myself and doctor Peterson 181 00:12:02,519 --> 00:12:06,639 so obvious, so immediate? And all of this I believes 182 00:12:06,720 --> 00:12:13,440 resolved around the notion of logos. The language of logos 183 00:12:13,440 --> 00:12:17,960 is the underlying language of Christianity. Of course, we know 184 00:12:18,559 --> 00:12:21,639 the first vision of logos in Christianity comes from the 185 00:12:21,639 --> 00:12:25,279 Gospel of Saint John. In the beginning was the logos. 186 00:12:25,559 --> 00:12:28,519 The logos was with God, and the logos was God. 187 00:12:29,080 --> 00:12:31,240 He was in the beginning with God, and through him 188 00:12:31,320 --> 00:12:34,519 all things were made. Without him, nothing was made. That 189 00:12:34,600 --> 00:12:38,279 has been made. In him was life, and that life 190 00:12:38,320 --> 00:12:41,480 was the light of all mankind. That light shines in 191 00:12:41,519 --> 00:12:47,200 the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it. And 192 00:12:47,320 --> 00:12:51,440 this vision of logos would be continued and developed in 193 00:12:51,519 --> 00:12:58,039 the life of the Church, and especially in the seventh century. 194 00:12:58,039 --> 00:13:00,720 There was a saint. His name is Saint Maximus the Confessor, 195 00:13:01,240 --> 00:13:05,000 and he really brought this image of logos, I would say, 196 00:13:05,000 --> 00:13:12,399 to its most detailed or most elaborate vision. And he 197 00:13:12,480 --> 00:13:16,399 did so by taking the notion of logos that was 198 00:13:16,399 --> 00:13:20,240 in the New Testament, and he brought and united it 199 00:13:20,279 --> 00:13:23,399 with the best of what the Western tradition had already offered. 200 00:13:23,840 --> 00:13:26,120 He was able to prune, let's say, what had come 201 00:13:26,159 --> 00:13:30,279 from philosophy and join it with what the Christian message was, 202 00:13:30,320 --> 00:13:34,080 so that it would attain some clarity and maybe some detail. 203 00:13:38,360 --> 00:13:43,279 And so sam Maximus explains that all things have a logos, 204 00:13:43,879 --> 00:13:47,799 which are which is its reason for existing, its purpose, 205 00:13:48,639 --> 00:13:51,799 and its origin, all at once and even its end. 206 00:13:51,919 --> 00:13:55,519 So it's all those things at once. And on top 207 00:13:55,559 --> 00:13:59,200 of that, each thing has a multitude of logi. That's 208 00:13:59,240 --> 00:14:01,840 a word you never heard before. The logi is the 209 00:14:01,840 --> 00:14:05,919 plural of logos, and so the logi they're like the 210 00:14:05,960 --> 00:14:10,559 different qualities of things. So the blueness of the blue 211 00:14:11,639 --> 00:14:15,080 or the slowness of the slow, and all of these 212 00:14:15,159 --> 00:14:19,840 logis are brought together. They're woven together, we could say, 213 00:14:20,440 --> 00:14:24,879 to sustain the existence of the world. It's really a 214 00:14:24,919 --> 00:14:30,600 map of meaning, to use Georgia's words. Now, these logi, 215 00:14:31,279 --> 00:14:36,519 these essences that say of things, they don't exist independently 216 00:14:36,600 --> 00:14:42,240 in the same way that scientists believe things exist out there. Rather, 217 00:14:42,279 --> 00:14:46,240 they exist as they come together, as they are joined 218 00:14:46,240 --> 00:14:49,240 together in our encounter with the world in a pattern 219 00:14:49,519 --> 00:14:54,679 we could say. So we could say, for example, like 220 00:14:54,759 --> 00:14:59,759 that a sunset has a certain amount of logi, maybe 221 00:14:59,759 --> 00:15:05,399 even indefinite amount of characteristics of a sunset, But as 222 00:15:05,440 --> 00:15:08,919 they come together to be the experience of this sunset, 223 00:15:09,240 --> 00:15:13,080 that's how we experience reality. That's how we become into 224 00:15:13,200 --> 00:15:24,159 contact with reality. So all these qualities that say, light, color, vertical, horizontal, 225 00:15:24,720 --> 00:15:28,159 and the things the sun, the sky, the earth, all 226 00:15:28,200 --> 00:15:29,919 of these things that I could go on, there's an 227 00:15:29,960 --> 00:15:33,159 indefinite amount of them. What's important in making that experience 228 00:15:33,240 --> 00:15:40,519 real is how all those logis are united, so and 229 00:15:40,600 --> 00:15:45,440 in a way they're united within us. And human beings, 230 00:15:45,480 --> 00:15:49,399 for Saint Maximus, are seen as this laboratory where the 231 00:15:49,440 --> 00:15:54,240 whole world finds its cohesion. And he expresses it in 232 00:15:54,279 --> 00:15:59,320 the sense that the human being is a microcosm. You 233 00:15:59,360 --> 00:16:04,320 could say condensation of the cosmos, the place where the 234 00:16:04,320 --> 00:16:09,720 cosmos comes together to make sense. And a good way 235 00:16:09,759 --> 00:16:13,759 to see it is that human beings actually participate being 236 00:16:13,799 --> 00:16:17,279 in the image of God. They participate in creation, and 237 00:16:17,399 --> 00:16:19,440 we see that in the Book of Genesis. The Book 238 00:16:19,519 --> 00:16:24,159 of Genesis, God tells Adam to name the animals and 239 00:16:24,200 --> 00:16:28,960 so by his logos, participating in a limited way, in 240 00:16:29,039 --> 00:16:32,039 the same manner that the divine logos was the source 241 00:16:32,480 --> 00:16:41,679 of everything. And the human participation in this process is 242 00:16:41,720 --> 00:16:47,039 not a relativistic thing. It's not an individual thing. I mean, 243 00:16:47,080 --> 00:16:50,799 though it is flexible, it's nonetheless the most objective of processes. 244 00:16:50,840 --> 00:16:55,399 As Father Ted mentioned and so we need to be 245 00:16:55,440 --> 00:16:58,120 cautious though, because sat Maximus warns us that it's not 246 00:16:58,559 --> 00:17:02,080 just a philosophy, or it's not just a technical description 247 00:17:02,200 --> 00:17:07,839 of the world. This is important because thinking that religious 248 00:17:07,880 --> 00:17:12,400 stories are exactly the same kind of encyclopedic knowledge of 249 00:17:12,480 --> 00:17:15,160 modern science is the wrong way to go with this. 250 00:17:15,759 --> 00:17:20,960 These logos, these truth about things are our categories of 251 00:17:20,960 --> 00:17:24,039 our engagement with the world. So maybe today we might 252 00:17:24,079 --> 00:17:30,240 call them phenomenological categories. And so the discovery of truth 253 00:17:30,279 --> 00:17:35,640 of logos, it's a personal journey. It's simultaneously a refinement 254 00:17:35,680 --> 00:17:37,799 of our understanding of the world, but at the same 255 00:17:37,839 --> 00:17:42,559 time it becomes a refinement of our person. So to 256 00:17:42,599 --> 00:17:45,880 discover the true nature of things is to walk on 257 00:17:45,960 --> 00:17:50,920 a path of truth. So food is a wonderful thing, 258 00:17:50,960 --> 00:17:54,920 and it's useful for life, but gluttony leads to our destruction. 259 00:17:55,799 --> 00:18:00,759 Wealth is useful to accomplish important things, but avarice the soul. 260 00:18:00,880 --> 00:18:02,960 So you see, it's not just a description of the world, 261 00:18:03,000 --> 00:18:06,319 it's a path that we walk as we discover the world. 262 00:18:09,440 --> 00:18:11,720 And so Sin and this vision of the world, that 263 00:18:11,799 --> 00:18:14,599 horrible world, that horrible world that no one wants to hear. 264 00:18:14,720 --> 00:18:19,480 Sin isn't just the breaking of arbitrary rules, but it's 265 00:18:19,640 --> 00:18:26,559 in the misuse of the world, and that misuse of 266 00:18:26,599 --> 00:18:29,400 the world ends up being an untruth, ends up being 267 00:18:30,039 --> 00:18:34,359 a liar, or something that's false, something that separates things 268 00:18:34,359 --> 00:18:38,759 from each other. It's found when things are not aligned 269 00:18:38,759 --> 00:18:45,839 with their purposes. So, for example, a person is not 270 00:18:46,039 --> 00:18:50,480 only a tool for my own gratification. A person is 271 00:18:50,519 --> 00:18:53,039 not just a tool so that I can advance myself 272 00:18:53,079 --> 00:18:56,039 in the world. And if I treat a person exclusively 273 00:18:56,160 --> 00:19:00,519 like that, then I will inevitably sin against that person. 274 00:19:01,880 --> 00:19:03,559 I mean, of course, it doesn't mean that a person 275 00:19:03,640 --> 00:19:06,720 cannot act as a tool for my gratification. If I 276 00:19:06,759 --> 00:19:10,319 go see the baker and I get bread from him, 277 00:19:11,640 --> 00:19:13,640 he's the method by which I get my bread. But 278 00:19:14,039 --> 00:19:17,039 the baker is not just a baker. He is a 279 00:19:17,079 --> 00:19:20,359 full person, just as myself. So when we steal, or 280 00:19:20,359 --> 00:19:24,119 we lie, or we cheat, it's because we're not considering 281 00:19:24,160 --> 00:19:27,759 the the person facing us to be a full blown person, 282 00:19:27,839 --> 00:19:31,599 to be what they are according to their logos, where 283 00:19:31,599 --> 00:19:35,079 we see them only as limited things, only as tools. 284 00:19:38,240 --> 00:19:41,839 So this is true of people, of things, and of actions. 285 00:19:43,079 --> 00:19:45,680 So I was thinking about I was trying to think 286 00:19:45,680 --> 00:19:47,559 about the best example that I could think of to 287 00:19:48,000 --> 00:19:52,079 show this in terms of action, and I thought of 288 00:19:52,440 --> 00:19:56,880 giving the example of sex. So we did the metaphysics 289 00:19:56,920 --> 00:19:58,359 of Pepe. So I think we can get away with 290 00:19:58,440 --> 00:20:02,920 the metaphysics of sex. I hope. But it's a question 291 00:20:03,000 --> 00:20:05,680 that desperately needs to be answered today in our topsy 292 00:20:05,680 --> 00:20:11,200 turvy times. Let's say, so, what is the logos of sexuality? Well, 293 00:20:11,240 --> 00:20:17,240 it has many logi, many purposes. It's for the propagation 294 00:20:17,359 --> 00:20:20,759 of the species. I hope at least a few of 295 00:20:20,799 --> 00:20:24,000 you still think that, despite what many people would want 296 00:20:24,039 --> 00:20:31,039 us to believe, it creates families and communities. It brings 297 00:20:31,079 --> 00:20:35,400 two people together in a type of communion, in an 298 00:20:35,400 --> 00:20:41,079 expression of love, and it brings pleasure. So those will 299 00:20:41,119 --> 00:20:43,279 be would be some of the logi. I'm sure we 300 00:20:43,279 --> 00:20:45,839 could find more. But some those would be some of 301 00:20:45,839 --> 00:20:49,480 the logi that sex exists, and there could be more. 302 00:20:50,519 --> 00:20:54,200 But the idea and the vision of logos is that 303 00:20:54,279 --> 00:20:56,720 all those things need to be brought together in a 304 00:20:56,799 --> 00:20:59,680 pattern of some sort for them to be a path 305 00:20:59,759 --> 00:21:05,160 towards logos. So if we think of the different logi 306 00:21:05,720 --> 00:21:09,680 and we bring them together trying to think of the word. 307 00:21:09,680 --> 00:21:12,480 What is that word? When we all those things are together. 308 00:21:12,519 --> 00:21:14,119 I think we have a word. It's a sacrament of 309 00:21:14,119 --> 00:21:17,680 the Church. I'll lenth you figure it out, which what 310 00:21:17,799 --> 00:21:21,880 it is when all those things come together. And so 311 00:21:21,960 --> 00:21:24,400 each of the separate purposes of sex that I mentioned, 312 00:21:24,400 --> 00:21:29,039 they're not wrong, they're fine, but they become alive when 313 00:21:29,119 --> 00:21:34,039 we bring them together. If we don't, then each separate 314 00:21:34,119 --> 00:21:38,039 purpose appears as a kind of falsehood. It appears as 315 00:21:38,039 --> 00:21:43,079 a kind of lacking. But that's not enough. Let's say, 316 00:21:43,119 --> 00:21:48,480 for a truly traditional or a truly complete vision of sexuality, 317 00:21:48,519 --> 00:21:52,839 it cannot end there. It has to move towards the infinite. 318 00:21:52,960 --> 00:21:56,960 It has to move towards God. And so the ultimate 319 00:21:57,079 --> 00:22:00,519 logos of sexuality is to be an image of the 320 00:22:00,519 --> 00:22:03,400 mystical union with God. I mean, it's to be an 321 00:22:03,400 --> 00:22:06,880 image of our union with that with what is beyond us. 322 00:22:10,960 --> 00:22:15,000 I mean, in that image of the mystical union of 323 00:22:15,079 --> 00:22:20,680 God with the soul of Christ with his Church, the 324 00:22:20,720 --> 00:22:24,599 marriage of heaven and Earth is a completely traditional image 325 00:22:24,599 --> 00:22:28,039 that we find in the Church Fathers, or in our tradition. 326 00:22:29,759 --> 00:22:33,519 And so that that image of the ultimate union, the 327 00:22:33,599 --> 00:22:38,960 highest union with the infinite. Then it comes back down 328 00:22:40,160 --> 00:22:44,480 into the multiple logo, all those other reasons for sexuality 329 00:22:44,519 --> 00:22:47,119 that I mentioned, and it fills them, It makes them 330 00:22:47,160 --> 00:22:52,319 participate in the transcendent purpose and becomes the very relationship 331 00:22:52,359 --> 00:22:56,039 that binds them together. And everything in our lives can 332 00:22:56,079 --> 00:23:03,799 follow that process. Work, food, sleep, beauty. And to engage 333 00:23:03,960 --> 00:23:08,119 the world in that frame is to find light everywhere, 334 00:23:08,160 --> 00:23:12,559 to see life everywhere. The world is no longer made 335 00:23:12,720 --> 00:23:16,400 of the dead, lifeless dirt, the dead, lifeless material that 336 00:23:16,440 --> 00:23:20,920 we use to make things with. And as we become 337 00:23:20,920 --> 00:23:26,000 better as people, more truthful, more grateful, more free, as 338 00:23:26,039 --> 00:23:29,880 we come closer to one another in love, and by 339 00:23:29,880 --> 00:23:33,759 the way, that's what love is. Love is the manner 340 00:23:33,799 --> 00:23:37,640 in which all different things, all different people, all different 341 00:23:37,640 --> 00:23:42,079 intentions can join together and exist in communion and can 342 00:23:42,160 --> 00:23:50,319 become one while at the same time preserving the multiplicity. 343 00:23:51,359 --> 00:23:55,079 And so as we follow this path, the hidden logi 344 00:23:55,119 --> 00:23:59,279 in creation, they shine through the world, and today we 345 00:23:59,359 --> 00:24:02,839 might say that they re enchant the world, and the 346 00:24:02,920 --> 00:24:07,200 world appears bright and full and not the gray and 347 00:24:07,319 --> 00:24:12,799 dead shadows we often live in. So that would be 348 00:24:13,680 --> 00:24:18,519 I hope a summary let's say of that path of logos. 349 00:24:19,960 --> 00:24:22,000 But I haven't really explained what the source of my 350 00:24:22,079 --> 00:24:26,079 excitement was on that Friday night yet, what the source 351 00:24:26,119 --> 00:24:30,759 of the excitement was that has caused all this flurry 352 00:24:30,799 --> 00:24:35,559 of attention to Jordan. And I can tell you I've 353 00:24:35,559 --> 00:24:38,400 been thinking about this now for months now, I mean 354 00:24:38,480 --> 00:24:41,079 some of us, and Jordan has been thinking about this 355 00:24:41,200 --> 00:24:45,480 for months now. And I think by now we can 356 00:24:45,519 --> 00:24:49,079 say that it's really not about gender pronouns. It's not 357 00:24:50,200 --> 00:24:52,839 It's about something that is a lot bigger than that. 358 00:24:56,240 --> 00:24:58,920 And I think I can say confidently by now that 359 00:24:59,039 --> 00:25:04,839 it's about logo. The entire project of postmodernism, the last 360 00:25:04,880 --> 00:25:09,200 thirty forty years of higher culture and higher education, has 361 00:25:09,240 --> 00:25:15,559 been a systematic assault on logos, to decenter logos, to 362 00:25:15,680 --> 00:25:20,400 deconstruct narratives and value hierarchies. So we are left slipping 363 00:25:20,480 --> 00:25:26,640 and sliding without purpose and direction. And now we've reached 364 00:25:26,640 --> 00:25:30,720 the end of what postmodernism has to offer, we can 365 00:25:30,759 --> 00:25:33,799 actually say that you've come to a point where postmodernism 366 00:25:33,960 --> 00:25:40,440 has won basically the cultural debate, and a philosophy which 367 00:25:40,480 --> 00:25:45,599 decries the center and certain certainty has perniciously become the 368 00:25:45,759 --> 00:25:51,079 very center and unquestionable authority it despises. So everything is 369 00:25:51,160 --> 00:25:56,720 upside down, everything is inside out, everything is becoming its opposite, 370 00:25:56,880 --> 00:26:00,440 and all these inversions and chaos are not to be taken. Lately, 371 00:26:00,759 --> 00:26:05,319 it has brought about a sterile age, literally sterile, as 372 00:26:05,440 --> 00:26:14,119 people are not having enough children to fill the society. 373 00:26:14,720 --> 00:26:16,799 I think, I keep thinking that maybe they're missing a 374 00:26:16,799 --> 00:26:27,359 bit of Folow sentence, but it's also sterile, and that 375 00:26:27,440 --> 00:26:33,680 it has brought about this narcissistic and fragmented culture. You see, 376 00:26:33,720 --> 00:26:38,880 they told us that the center cannot hold, and how 377 00:26:38,920 --> 00:26:42,920 things fall apart, and now everybody is decrying the end 378 00:26:42,920 --> 00:26:45,119 of truth all of a sudden, right everybody is saying 379 00:26:45,119 --> 00:26:47,920 that we're entering an age of post truth, fake news. 380 00:26:48,279 --> 00:26:50,759 I mean, my goodness. They even used it as an 381 00:26:50,880 --> 00:26:55,519 argument against doctor Peterson the debate on gender pronouns. I mean, 382 00:26:55,519 --> 00:26:58,240 it's the postmodernist that Harold did the end of truth 383 00:26:58,440 --> 00:27:02,559 forty years ago. And now they're surprised to see the effect. 384 00:27:02,319 --> 00:27:08,079 Speaker 4: It has, how chaos does not discriminate, how it's turning 385 00:27:08,119 --> 00:27:12,359 against them, just as they turned it against their ideological enemies. 386 00:27:13,880 --> 00:27:16,440 Speaker 2: They wanted to change the world to sand. Now they're 387 00:27:16,480 --> 00:27:23,079 surprised to find it slipping between their fingers. What is 388 00:27:23,160 --> 00:27:27,480 most surprising, and what is most shocking to them is 389 00:27:27,519 --> 00:27:31,680 to find that, now having reached the end of their pursuit, 390 00:27:32,680 --> 00:27:37,160 having thought they had won, they see from within the 391 00:27:37,200 --> 00:27:41,799 decomposing residues of Western patriarchy. They see that there is 392 00:27:41,880 --> 00:27:46,799 a seed that's sprouted, that in the darkest place, there's 393 00:27:46,839 --> 00:27:53,440 a flame that is lit. Logos awakens. The darkness has 394 00:27:53,519 --> 00:28:01,079 not overcome it. Saint John promised us that most modern friends, 395 00:28:02,039 --> 00:28:04,680 if you had just paid attention to the stories, if 396 00:28:04,759 --> 00:28:06,839 you had just paid attention to the stories which are 397 00:28:06,920 --> 00:28:11,079 woven in the fabric of our consciousness, these very stories 398 00:28:11,319 --> 00:28:13,759 you try to deconstruct, you would have noticed that don 399 00:28:13,880 --> 00:28:18,119 always comes, that a seed is always planted, their logos 400 00:28:18,200 --> 00:28:26,680 regains the center. Christ rises from the dead. And I 401 00:28:26,720 --> 00:28:30,799 think that's the excitement we're feeling right now, to find 402 00:28:31,039 --> 00:28:36,279 that small spark, that seed of a meaningful pattern surprising 403 00:28:36,400 --> 00:28:40,160 us in a collapsing world. And it's not just a 404 00:28:40,160 --> 00:28:42,400 pattern of meaning, but it's the beginning of a network 405 00:28:42,440 --> 00:28:44,720 of people. I mean, just in the past two years, 406 00:28:44,880 --> 00:28:49,000 there's a whole new, strange group of public figures that's 407 00:28:49,000 --> 00:28:52,039 arising from the margins, people who are at least trying 408 00:28:52,039 --> 00:28:53,960 to figure it out, who are at least trying to 409 00:28:54,000 --> 00:28:57,319 think clearly and work out ideas, and people who are 410 00:28:57,319 --> 00:29:00,119 as different from each other as you can imagine, and 411 00:29:00,160 --> 00:29:04,559 spanning across gender, race, and cultures, even religious and atheists 412 00:29:04,599 --> 00:29:07,039 alight trying to figure it out. And yet the media 413 00:29:07,440 --> 00:29:13,960 and the activists, they scream hysterically bigot races, sexist, nazi, 414 00:29:14,640 --> 00:29:18,400 all the usual litany of attacks, and they're losing their minds. 415 00:29:18,720 --> 00:29:23,599 The sand is slipping out of their hand. And only 416 00:29:23,640 --> 00:29:27,559 two years ago we would have probably collapsed before this attack. 417 00:29:27,599 --> 00:29:30,920 But now we look around and we find that there 418 00:29:31,039 --> 00:29:35,359 is a still silent center in which to in which 419 00:29:35,359 --> 00:29:41,599 to stand, There is an eye in the overwhelming hurricane, 420 00:29:41,720 --> 00:29:47,240 and we can finally say, we will not accept your frame, 421 00:29:48,079 --> 00:29:54,079 We will not accept your definitions. They are weak by 422 00:29:54,079 --> 00:29:58,359 the very process you use to deconstruct them, to deconstruct 423 00:29:58,359 --> 00:30:08,079 the categories, and we will speak for ourselves. What a relief. 424 00:30:12,119 --> 00:30:14,759 But it is a dangerous time. The time of transition, 425 00:30:14,960 --> 00:30:19,200 the time of chaos is a dangerous time. Firstly because 426 00:30:19,240 --> 00:30:23,160 the enemies of logos will ramp up their hysteria and 427 00:30:23,759 --> 00:30:30,640 totalitarian tendencies as logos awakens. But it is also dangerous because, 428 00:30:30,640 --> 00:30:34,720 as Christ himself told us, the terrors grow amongst the week. 429 00:30:36,319 --> 00:30:41,480 The recentering of logos is the reawakening of identities. We 430 00:30:41,559 --> 00:30:45,880 can't avoid that, and that's a frightening thing, because if 431 00:30:45,920 --> 00:30:52,359 identity stops at the relative logi, without aiming, without uniting 432 00:30:52,400 --> 00:30:56,480 itself to the highest of high, it can be murderous. 433 00:30:58,359 --> 00:31:01,680 And it has been increasing the murderous just in the 434 00:31:01,720 --> 00:31:07,160 past century. And it is in fact the very murderous 435 00:31:07,200 --> 00:31:11,759 and genocidal tendency of identity which provoked the postmoderns to 436 00:31:11,799 --> 00:31:15,240 deconstruct identity in the first place. And there's a part 437 00:31:15,319 --> 00:31:19,519 where we can't blame them for them. I mean, in 438 00:31:19,559 --> 00:31:25,240 the shadow of Auschwitz, what else can you do? So 439 00:31:25,319 --> 00:31:31,240 what will strive from this new sprout will depend on us, 440 00:31:31,240 --> 00:31:34,920 will depend on all of us. What will rise from 441 00:31:34,920 --> 00:31:39,880 this chaos we've seen exciting but also frightening. The possibilities 442 00:31:39,920 --> 00:31:42,200 of what that might look like. I mean, will it 443 00:31:42,240 --> 00:31:46,720 be race again, so that we inch towards genocide? Will 444 00:31:46,839 --> 00:31:50,960 only be nationed, so we're tempted to revisit the world wars? 445 00:31:52,079 --> 00:31:54,839 Will it only be gender? Will it only be class 446 00:31:55,960 --> 00:31:58,119 and the scheme drawn out for us by sam Maximus. 447 00:31:58,119 --> 00:32:02,119 The ultimate identity, the place where all meaning finds its resolution, 448 00:32:02,599 --> 00:32:05,759 is the divine logos, the source of everything. That is 449 00:32:05,799 --> 00:32:09,079 our trajectory as we walk the path of Logos, as 450 00:32:09,119 --> 00:32:12,599 we are transformed by truth. The finality is to be 451 00:32:12,759 --> 00:32:17,599 united with God. And I know that for some people 452 00:32:17,720 --> 00:32:22,119 just the word God causes allergic reactions. And I'm sure 453 00:32:22,119 --> 00:32:24,640 people listening to this will be developing hives on their 454 00:32:24,680 --> 00:32:28,759 skin as they hear this. But maybe we can just 455 00:32:28,759 --> 00:32:32,240 think of it this way. For identity to be more 456 00:32:32,359 --> 00:32:36,519 than a weapon, it must reach its highest point in 457 00:32:36,599 --> 00:32:42,960 something that is beyond duality. And so finding seeing our 458 00:32:43,039 --> 00:32:46,680 highest identity in God is finding unity with everything and 459 00:32:46,759 --> 00:32:53,759 the source of everything. And in terms of Christianity in particular, 460 00:32:55,079 --> 00:32:58,200 the identity with Christ is different from other identities because 461 00:32:58,400 --> 00:33:02,039 it's the identity with the cross. Mean, it's to identify 462 00:33:02,119 --> 00:33:05,559 with suffering. I mean, it's not the identity of a 463 00:33:05,599 --> 00:33:10,119 self serving power, but the identity of a self emptying power, 464 00:33:10,720 --> 00:33:15,839 of power bound in love that empties itself out of love. 465 00:33:19,079 --> 00:33:21,279 I mean, it doesn't mean that we shouldn't struggle. It 466 00:33:21,319 --> 00:33:23,319 doesn't mean that we should just lay down and give up, 467 00:33:23,400 --> 00:33:26,519 that we should let our enemies destroy what we value most. 468 00:33:26,880 --> 00:33:29,640 I mean, Christ bought brought a whip into the temple 469 00:33:29,720 --> 00:33:34,200 after all, But what it really entails, what's important about it? 470 00:33:34,559 --> 00:33:37,079 And this is something that is echoed profoundly in what 471 00:33:37,240 --> 00:33:41,160 doctor Peterson has been telling us. That we must first 472 00:33:41,200 --> 00:33:46,000 walk on the path of logos ourselves. We must embrace 473 00:33:46,039 --> 00:33:48,920 our own suffering in that truth, we must take up 474 00:33:49,079 --> 00:33:54,880 our cross. We must do so with the desire to 475 00:33:54,920 --> 00:33:57,759 first get rid of the lies which blind us, to 476 00:33:57,839 --> 00:34:02,200 straighten our own path, and in doing so well, that 477 00:34:02,440 --> 00:34:07,680 is how we will change the world. Since Saraphim Sorrow 478 00:34:07,920 --> 00:34:11,960 is known to have said, save yourself, and thousands around 479 00:34:12,000 --> 00:34:17,320 you will be saved. As we walk on that path, 480 00:34:17,400 --> 00:34:22,039 As we strip away our own excesses rather than rather 481 00:34:22,079 --> 00:34:25,840 than looking at the imbalances of others, as we strip 482 00:34:25,880 --> 00:34:29,880 away our bad habits and our narcissism, rather than acting 483 00:34:30,000 --> 00:34:37,079 like victims, the world will change, and we will start 484 00:34:37,119 --> 00:34:41,719 to see and to experience logos, to fully live within 485 00:34:41,880 --> 00:34:45,199 the patterns of meaning that constitute the world. If you 486 00:34:45,239 --> 00:34:49,320 take that journey, I guarantee that the universal patterns of 487 00:34:49,440 --> 00:34:54,480 meaning will manifest themselves so strongly in your life that 488 00:34:54,639 --> 00:34:58,280 at first you'll use the word synchronicity, but soon you 489 00:34:58,320 --> 00:35:03,559 will have no other word to use. Sides heracle and 490 00:35:03,599 --> 00:35:07,920 the postmodern chaos will vanish as wax melts before the fire. 491 00:35:08,840 --> 00:35:12,599 And logos, the very logos that rises from the grave, 492 00:35:12,880 --> 00:35:18,079 will fill your world and the world with life and life. 493 00:35:18,760 --> 00:35:19,079 Thank you. 494 00:35:30,320 --> 00:35:33,199 Speaker 1: If you enjoy these videos and podcasts, please go to 495 00:35:33,199 --> 00:35:35,960 the Symbolic World dot com website and see how. 496 00:35:35,840 --> 00:35:38,679 Speaker 2: You can support what we're doing. 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