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Speaker 2: You are now listening to True Murder, the most shocking
Speaker 2: killers in true crime history and the authors that have
Speaker 2: written about them. Gasey Bundy, Dahmer, The Nightstalker BTK every week,
Speaker 2: another fascinating author talking about the most shocking and infamous
Speaker 2: killers in true crime history. True Murder with your host,
Speaker 2: journalist and author Dan Zufanski. Good evening, The true story
Speaker 2: of the night, Innocence and evil cross paths. On a
Speaker 2: summer night in two thousand, Amy Shoot and Jason Bergerson
Speaker 2: were set upon by five predatory youths outside of Providence,
Speaker 2: Rhode Island club. It began as a twisted joy ride
Speaker 2: for the young kidnappers. It ended in cold blooded murder
Speaker 2: in a town's relentless fight for justice. The book they
Speaker 2: were featuring this evening is Murder Without Motive, the Amy
Speaker 2: Shoot and Jason Bergerson story with my special guest, retired
Speaker 2: detective and author Raymond Pigatory. Welcome to the program and
Speaker 2: thank you very much for this interview. Raymond Pingatory. Welcome
Speaker 2: to the program, Raymond Pigatory.
Speaker 4: Good afternoon, Dan, and how are you today? Oh?
Speaker 2: Fine, Thank you very much, let's talk about initially, just
Speaker 2: like in this book, here, this happened and occurred in
Speaker 2: June eighth, two thousand and this is in Providence, Rhode Island,
Speaker 2: and you talk about Jason Bergerson and Amy Shoote. Tell
Speaker 2: us a little bit about you where you were as
Speaker 2: a detective at that time. You said you were a
Speaker 2: junior detective. You as you're writing a book, tell us
Speaker 2: where you were in your career before we talk about
Speaker 2: the circumstances when you heard about this crime and got
Speaker 2: intimately and inextricably involved.
Speaker 3: Well as far as being the junior detective, I had
Speaker 3: been in detectives for approximately eight or ninety eights at
Speaker 3: that point, but we still had many senior detectives over
Speaker 3: me who handled a majority of the major clients that
Speaker 3: came in on this particular day. It was a summer
Speaker 3: day pretty much, and many had gone on vacation or
Speaker 3: took days off, etc. And I happened to be, uh
Speaker 3: the low man on the pole, So I was working
Speaker 3: that day along with the two other BCI officer and
Speaker 3: a narcotics officer, So we were at a skeleton crew
Speaker 3: for the day right when the call did actually come in.
Speaker 3: It came in around noontime of that day, and then
Speaker 3: prior to that it had been relatively quiet. And when
Speaker 3: the call came in, I walked into dispatch, and ironically
Speaker 3: I was just about ready to out of lunch with
Speaker 3: one of the patrol officers and they called me ping
Speaker 3: at a at the time, and he turned to me,
Speaker 3: he said, think you had to get down to the
Speaker 3: golf course that was under construction in our town. He said,
Speaker 3: there was a They just found two.
Speaker 4: Bodies right.
Speaker 2: Now. As you do, as you write in the book
Speaker 2: on June nathh you talked about several days before Jason
Speaker 2: Bergerson and Amy. Shoot, now, who are these young people?
Speaker 2: How old were these people? And tell us about their
Speaker 2: relationship and what happened? What were they planning to do?
Speaker 2: What was the relationship about? How long had they known
Speaker 2: each other? Tell us a little bit about their relationship
Speaker 2: and what they were planning to do on that June
Speaker 2: evening in two thousand.
Speaker 3: While Jason Burgison and Amy they were relatively new in
Speaker 3: their relationship, just dating several months.
Speaker 4: Both were into music.
Speaker 3: Jason had gone to Saint claud University and he was
Speaker 3: an inspiring DJ, and Amy at the time was taking
Speaker 3: some time off from going to the University of Rhode
Speaker 3: Island and she was working and on the night of
Speaker 3: the incident, they had made plans with several of their
Speaker 3: other friends to go to a dance club in Providence
Speaker 3: and just do what you know, normal kids do. And
Speaker 3: when I say kids, they were you know, early twenties,
Speaker 3: late teens, and they just wanted to have a good time,
Speaker 3: as many teens would want to do, and ultimately they
Speaker 3: ended up in the city of Providence.
Speaker 2: Now you introduce a character that's important to this story,
Speaker 2: and especially right in the very beginning, as statistically something
Speaker 2: like this might make police look at this person quite
Speaker 2: seriously when something happened close to him like this. Amy
Speaker 2: Shoot talk about Jeffrey Harper and who he was and
Speaker 2: what happened that night with him.
Speaker 3: And Jeffrey Hopper was a former boyfriend of Amy Shoot,
Speaker 3: but he tried to remain relatively friendly with her and
Speaker 3: they were on speaking terms. Jeff realized that Amy was
Speaker 3: moving on in her relationships and she again just started
Speaker 3: dating Jason. Jeff kind of called Amy and they had
Speaker 3: Amy expressed that her and a group of friends, along
Speaker 3: with Jason, we're going to come to a nightclub go
Speaker 3: to a nightclub in Providence, and that you know, he
Speaker 3: was welcome to come. But she also had made the
Speaker 3: understanding that you know, she is now strictly friends with him.
Speaker 3: Their relationship has terminated, but their friendship still carried on.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and there was plans that you write about too
Speaker 2: as well, because they were close friends. And despite the
Speaker 2: relationship with Jason, he still expressed and they made plans
Speaker 2: to call each other.
Speaker 4: When Jeff had gone to the club with the other
Speaker 4: group of.
Speaker 3: People, Amy and Jason and friends, and when Amy was
Speaker 3: going to be dropped off by Jason and go home
Speaker 3: for the night she had Jeff had expressed to her
Speaker 3: that he would like her to call just to check
Speaker 3: in well, no matter what time she got in, and
Speaker 3: that call never came. Once she left the club, things
Speaker 3: went downhill rather quickly.
Speaker 2: Now with this book, you introduced these other characters and
Speaker 2: have this meanwhile moment. While these kids basically are enjoying themselves.
Speaker 2: They like dancing, and they love music, and they have
Speaker 2: quite a few friends, and they're just straight good kids
Speaker 2: with the lives and careers ahead of them. Meanwhile, you
Speaker 2: introduce Gregory flu and Kenneth Day. Now these guys are roommates,
Speaker 2: and you described in the book the kind of room
Speaker 2: that these guys share and the kind of people. They
Speaker 2: were going out that evening to play some pool, you say,
Speaker 2: but they brought a gun. Uh, tell us a little
Speaker 2: bit about Gregory Floyd and Kenneth's Day and their living
Speaker 2: conditions and what they were doing that evening.
Speaker 3: Well, just to get back to Jason and Amy for
Speaker 3: one second. When I when you just said that they were,
Speaker 3: you know, everyday good kids. I can't reiterate enough on
Speaker 3: just how good these kids were. They were you know,
Speaker 3: everybody's son, everybody's daughter. You know, you would you would
Speaker 3: beam with joy if they were your kids. Floyd in
Speaker 3: in Uh, kenned Day were the total opposite, you know,
Speaker 3: they were. They were bad from the get go. Kenned
Speaker 3: Day had allowed Greg Floyd to move into kenned Day's apart.
Speaker 4: Greg Floyd had just.
Speaker 3: Recently been released from it's called the ACI, which is
Speaker 3: the Adult Correctional Institution, which is our prison here in
Speaker 3: Rhode Island. He had served a short time, a couple
Speaker 3: of months if I recall, and when he got out
Speaker 3: he moved in with kenned Day. Kenned Day and Floyd.
Speaker 3: They lived in a place that was like absolute squalor.
Speaker 3: It was you know, a place that makes your skin
Speaker 3: crawl when you walk in and walk out, and it
Speaker 3: was just like like a nightmaretal too even fathom how
Speaker 3: anybody would want to live in those conditions.
Speaker 2: Right now, you talk about these two guys downtown and
Speaker 2: one of them has a gun, and they talk about
Speaker 2: seeing a guy named that they call a custy, which
Speaker 2: somebody's looking for drugs. So tell us what they encounter,
Speaker 2: what their plan is that's cooked up seemingly spontaneously or
Speaker 2: on the fly here, tell us about that.
Speaker 3: Well, on the fly is definitely a key term. They
Speaker 3: did not truly have a plan formulated throughout the entire night.
Speaker 4: However, kenned Day was down.
Speaker 3: When we call it down city, that's the terminology we
Speaker 3: use for Providence. Even if you live in the city
Speaker 3: of Providence, you're going down into the heart of the city.
Speaker 4: Kenned Day had.
Speaker 3: Been at a local pool wall and he was a
Speaker 3: we're or dealer type of person. And if he could
Speaker 3: make a buck in any way, shape or form, he
Speaker 3: would make a buck. And when I say that, if
Speaker 3: it was whether it's robbing somebody, whether it was trying
Speaker 3: to sell drugs to somebody. In this particular incident, when
Speaker 3: he was at the pool hall, someone had approached about
Speaker 3: buying drugs or selling drugs and had flashed around some
Speaker 3: money and which peaked Kennan Day's interest big time. So
Speaker 3: he had got a hold of Floyd and said, Floyd,
Speaker 3: get down to the city. The city's hot rate. Now
Speaker 3: I got a cussy that I'm looking to rob and
Speaker 3: he's close by, so bring your gun, which Floyd did.
Speaker 2: Right now. What are the circumstances where they hook up
Speaker 2: with Burdick and Samuel Sanchez and Raymond Anderson tell us
Speaker 2: about that.
Speaker 3: All pretty interesting. Burdick was a person that was known
Speaker 3: in the city of Providence. He was a heavy as
Speaker 3: set kid that he would hang up and near the
Speaker 3: Brown University, which is well renowned elite school, but he
Speaker 3: would hang around that area. He would purchase drugs around
Speaker 3: that area.
Speaker 4: And he was.
Speaker 3: Actually waiting at a bus stop to go home to Patucket,
Speaker 3: which is adjacent to Providence. Floyd and kenned Day had
Speaker 3: hooked up with Anderson and Sammy Sanchez, so they were
Speaker 3: riding around city, uh and they happened to see Burdick
Speaker 3: at the bus stop. Floyd knew Burdick from hanging down
Speaker 3: in Providence. They pull over and Floyd says, hey, come
Speaker 3: on the cities. You know, basically, the city's hot tonight.
Speaker 3: There's a lot of students in the city on Thursday nights,
Speaker 3: most of the college uh the several colleges in the
Speaker 3: state of Arouel and several in the city area.
Speaker 4: The kids go.
Speaker 3: Down on a Thursday night and it seems to be
Speaker 3: a big college night where they're all are dancing, walking around.
Speaker 4: So there's a.
Speaker 3: Vast amount of people, a vast amount of targets in
Speaker 3: the guys of kenned Day and company. So once they
Speaker 3: the five collectively got together, their mindset became one, and
Speaker 3: their one mindset was to go out and find someone
Speaker 3: they could rob.
Speaker 4: So that's what they did.
Speaker 3: After they picked up Burick at the bus stop, was
Speaker 3: right around the city looking for a target to rob.
Speaker 2: You right that Burdick steals some Latex gloves and meanwhile
Speaker 2: you talk about Jason and Amy. The club ends closes
Speaker 2: at one o'clock and as we spoke, Amy is expecting
Speaker 2: a call, maybe a two or two thirty So after
Speaker 2: the club and with their friends, what happens with Amy
Speaker 2: and Jason and how do they get separated with their
Speaker 2: friends and what do they do after that club?
Speaker 3: Well, Burdick and Floyd have frequented these pizza establishment. They
Speaker 3: used to help the owner of the pizza Saki's Pizza.
Speaker 3: They used to help the owner unload trucks and did
Speaker 3: meaningless jobs around the pizza place, and in turn, the
Speaker 3: owner would give them.
Speaker 4: Free pizza, etc.
Speaker 3: So it wasn't uncommon for them to be inside the
Speaker 3: pizza up place at all given hours. It was one
Speaker 3: of these establishers that was open till like four or
Speaker 3: five o'clock in the morning. So when they happened to
Speaker 3: walk into this Saki's Pizza, they made a beeline for
Speaker 3: the kitchen area and they went right to the latex gloves.
Speaker 3: They grabbed the gloves and they passed them out amongst
Speaker 3: the five of them. So right there in my mind,
Speaker 3: it's telling me that a plan is really starting to
Speaker 3: kick emotion that if they do something elicit, they're going
Speaker 3: to do it where they're not going to leave evidence
Speaker 3: behind such as a fingerprint. Now, what had happened when
Speaker 3: Jason and Amy went to the nightclub. Prior to going
Speaker 3: to the nightclub to dance, they went to a like
Speaker 3: a barroom, pool hall kind of place and their other
Speaker 3: friends from Massachusetts. It was agreed upon that they would
Speaker 3: meet at this place called Tommy's Place. They met there,
Speaker 3: they played some pool, etc. And then they left their
Speaker 3: car at the Tommy's Place and went to this other nightclub.
Speaker 3: Once that nightclub let out for the night, they went
Speaker 3: back to Tommy's places. Their friends left, so that left
Speaker 3: Jason and Amy alone in the parking lot, so they
Speaker 3: didn't want the night to end. They just sat outside
Speaker 3: of Jason's vehicle and.
Speaker 4: They were listening to music for as kids do.
Speaker 3: And they were just hanging out bothering nobody at this
Speaker 3: particular time except Floyd and Day and Sammy Sanchez and
Speaker 3: Ray Anderson.
Speaker 4: And Harry Burdick.
Speaker 3: They had their own ideas of having a good time
Speaker 3: and that was ultimately to rob somebody and their entire
Speaker 3: night instead of being like normal you know, teenage the
Speaker 3: early twenty year olds enjoying a nightclub scene. They were
Speaker 3: riding around the entire down City area looking to rob
Speaker 3: somebody and they would pick out various targets and for
Speaker 3: whatever reason, their their attempts would fail. I mean, they
Speaker 3: only made one actual attempt to rob somebody when they
Speaker 3: surrounded somebody at a ATM machine and a security guard
Speaker 3: happened to intervene, and that that had failed for them.
Speaker 3: So they ultimate bow that night was to set out
Speaker 3: to make an easy book.
Speaker 2: Now you write that you find out later, much later,
Speaker 2: that they already spotted Jason's vehicle, a white Ford Explorer,
Speaker 2: And then you say that this crew of five spotted
Speaker 2: the Explorer again.
Speaker 4: Well, when they were when go ahead, good, oh, go ahead?
Speaker 3: When when flighting Company had been riding around down City
Speaker 3: looking for various targets.
Speaker 4: It wasn't really painting out.
Speaker 3: So Burdick, Harry Burdick said to Floyd and Sammy Sanchez,
Speaker 3: who was was Sammy Sanchez's car. He said, hey, look,
Speaker 3: you know, just just get me back to Patucket.
Speaker 4: I want to go home.
Speaker 3: And Sammy Sanchez basically told him it's not happening. I'm
Speaker 3: not driving me to Patucket. You want to get home,
Speaker 3: you go steal a car. Now, they had spotted Jason
Speaker 3: and he me hanging outside that car listening to music,
Speaker 3: but they had seen them earlier, so they circle around
Speaker 3: back around the city.
Speaker 4: They park on a side street.
Speaker 3: This is Floyd and Burdick in company, and it was
Speaker 3: that that time a plan was formulated.
Speaker 4: By Floyd and Verdick. Verdick said, I'll go rob that
Speaker 4: car and I'll drive home.
Speaker 3: So was at that time that Berdick and Floyd exited
Speaker 3: Seamy Sanchez's car, walked through an alleyway and walked up
Speaker 3: to Jason and Amy and at gunpoint pull Both of
Speaker 3: them were taking your car, but get in it first.
Speaker 3: So in essence, they conjacked Jason and Amy at that point.
Speaker 2: Horrifyingly enough, well horrifyingly you write that a patrol officer
Speaker 2: had spotted Jason and Amy at some point tell us
Speaker 2: about this close brush with that didn't avoid or these
Speaker 2: people didn't avoid this calamity. But the police were very
Speaker 2: close in proximity.
Speaker 3: But when I say close to proximity, it was so
Speaker 3: close that you know, Amy could have reached out or
Speaker 3: yelled out or done whatever and said help me. The
Speaker 3: patrol officer was probably a couple hundred feet away, or
Speaker 3: maybe I would have been more than that. He had
Speaker 3: watched when Floyd and Burdick put Amy and Jason into
Speaker 3: Jason's vehicle. Floyd was in the driver's seat at this time.
Speaker 3: Jason and Amy were in the backseat and Harry Burdick
Speaker 3: was in the passenger in front passenger seat, and Harry
Speaker 3: Burdick had the gun faced on Jason and Amy. Floyd
Speaker 3: drives Jason's car out the wrong way of a one
Speaker 3: way street. It was a short alley way, but it
Speaker 3: was still a weird way and it was still you know,
Speaker 3: indicated it was one way. And when Floyd came driving
Speaker 3: out the wrong way on a one way street, this
Speaker 3: was observed by this officer at the time, and he
Speaker 3: did nothing. The officer never stopped him. He just looked
Speaker 3: at him and Floyd continued on his way. Yeah, so
Speaker 3: horrifying the uh, Danny and Jason, it was just horrifying
Speaker 3: knowing that you know, they're looking at the police and
Speaker 3: you know potentially they could have been saved at that point,
Speaker 3: and you know nothing was done.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Now back with Amy and Jason, how aware or
Speaker 2: not aware of the situation are they? What are the
Speaker 2: perps Floyd and Verdicts saying to these two people about
Speaker 2: their future? Basically, what were they saying? What was Amy asking?
Speaker 2: What were these guys saying to this couple.
Speaker 4: Amy was.
Speaker 3: Asking basically what you know, what's gonna happen with us?
Speaker 3: And and Floyd was trying to calm her down, saying,
Speaker 3: we're just going to go.
Speaker 4: For a ride. Uh, you know, We're gonna ride around
Speaker 4: the city.
Speaker 3: And he started getting into a like attempting to get
Speaker 3: into a normal conversation with Amy, like you know, where.
Speaker 4: Do you go to school? What do you do now?
Speaker 3: And you're trying to engage her in a conversation, which,
Speaker 3: you know, how would one person respond to that when
Speaker 3: being held at gunpoint and here's a person trying to
Speaker 3: talk to you in a normal sense, and when everything
Speaker 3: was as abnormal as could be. And they once they
Speaker 3: drove out that alleyway, they were then Sammy Sanchez in
Speaker 3: his car which still contains Sammy Sanchez, Ray Anderson, and
Speaker 3: Kenned Day. They dropped in behind Floyd, who was now
Speaker 3: driving Jason's vehicle. They just dropped in behind him and
Speaker 3: started following him around city. So his Floyd, Burdick, Jason
Speaker 3: and Amy in one car, the other three individuals in
Speaker 3: their car, and they were just driving around, following each
Speaker 3: other until ultimately they they got tired of being got
Speaker 3: tired of driving around the city, and that's when Sammy
Speaker 3: Sanchez really kicked it in motion.
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Speaker 2: You write about what they initially asked this. Of course,
Speaker 2: these guys are looking for money. So they did try
Speaker 2: in their primitive plan to to look at people or
Speaker 2: target people that might have money. So the question was
Speaker 2: they asked these people about money. How much money did
Speaker 2: Amy and Jason and have. What happens with that request.
Speaker 3: Well, that that comes a little bit later. Once Sanchez,
Speaker 3: driving his vehicle, said to Floyd, follow me, I know
Speaker 3: where to go, and that that place that he took
Speaker 3: them to was the golf Cost that was under construction.
Speaker 3: So once they got to that golf Cost, that's when
Speaker 3: the really started ramping it up, saying, give us your money,
Speaker 3: give us whatever you've got, whether it be jewelry, whether
Speaker 3: it be credit cards, whether whatever it was, anything of
Speaker 3: any type of intrinsic value they were going to take.
Speaker 3: And and Amy and Jason at that point were saying,
Speaker 3: we'll give you everything we have. We only have, you know,
Speaker 3: so much money, Take the car and take our money
Speaker 3: and just leave us, please, and we'll never report the
Speaker 3: cost only never call the police, but just leave us
Speaker 3: and take whatever we can give you. And that dollar
Speaker 3: amount that ultimately Floyd in Company succeeded in getting from
Speaker 3: Amy and Jason was a grand total of eighteen dollars.
Speaker 2: Right, Who initiates the conversation about that they could identify
Speaker 2: them and so they must die. Who does that?
Speaker 4: That was Kenned Day.
Speaker 3: And Kenneth Day, although he did not pull the trigger,
Speaker 3: he was, in my estimation, probably one of the most
Speaker 3: evil people I've ever met, and he was the catalysts
Speaker 3: behind them when I say them collectively, Floyd Berdick, Anderson,
Speaker 3: Sanchez and Day killing Jason and Amy and Kenneth Day
Speaker 3: had indicated to Floyd that we have to kill them.
Speaker 3: They saw our faces and he had been trying to
Speaker 3: shield his face when they were driving around, and when
Speaker 3: they when Sanchez drove up and was side by side
Speaker 3: with with Floyd, and when Floyd was driving Jason's car,
Speaker 3: he put his hand over his face to try to
Speaker 3: obscure his the view that they would have had of him.
Speaker 3: And then he said, let's, uh, let's kill him. They
Speaker 3: saw us.
Speaker 2: You're right about Kenneth Day. When they realized again in
Speaker 2: their twisted logic that these people must die, then there
Speaker 2: was a statement about, well, what the hell what did
Speaker 2: they say about regarding Amy and what was what were
Speaker 2: the plans and what happened with those plans with Amy?
Speaker 4: Well, Kenneth Day and Ray and and we're sitting.
Speaker 3: They remained inside the Fort Explorer when they told Jason
Speaker 3: to get to get out of the car. When they
Speaker 3: pulled down inside this golf course area, they said get
Speaker 3: out of the car and they left Amy in the car.
Speaker 3: Kenned Day started telling Amy that he wanted sexual favors
Speaker 3: from her and if she did fulfill those he would
Speaker 3: basically help her out in some way up for him.
Speaker 3: And by helping her out, he was, you know, making
Speaker 3: overtures that he would have spare her a life.
Speaker 4: And she had.
Speaker 3: She had told him straight out, she said, listen, please,
Speaker 3: don't do don't do anything to me.
Speaker 4: I'm pregnant. And that kind of stopped the whole process.
Speaker 4: So she.
Speaker 3: She was not pregnant. She just told him that she was.
Speaker 3: And at that time nothing, nothing occurred, No sexual assault occurred.
Speaker 2: You right, that one of these unconscionable killers had something
Speaker 2: to say about these guys sexually assaulting Amy though.
Speaker 3: Well, ironically, and I don't know what I want to call it, ironically,
Speaker 3: for a fleeting moment, Greg Floyd, who was I don't
Speaker 3: want to say he was the master mind behind this
Speaker 3: whole process, but he was the one who he was
Speaker 3: the one who took the gun through the scene, and
Speaker 3: he at that time told both tennant Day and ray
Speaker 3: Anderson leave her alone, don't touch her. And I actually
Speaker 3: asked Floyd that at once once he was brought the custody.
Speaker 3: You know, you were there, you had the gun, you
Speaker 3: were in charge, you're in control. You stopped the sexual
Speaker 3: assault upon Amy, but then you follow through with ultimately
Speaker 3: the murder of them. Yeah, which is it's hard to
Speaker 3: fathom not and it really truly is. Well, all I
Speaker 3: envision was hair, two innocent kids pleading for their lives,
Speaker 3: you know, and at the after pleading for their lives,
Speaker 3: you know, then they want to introduce a sexual assault
Speaker 3: to her, and Floyd stops it.
Speaker 4: And when I just asked them, is they like just
Speaker 4: it blew me away?
Speaker 3: Like how could you stop one thing and carry through
Speaker 3: on the most egregious act that you could commit on somebody?
Speaker 2: Yeah? Yeah, And with this too, you talk about Harry
Speaker 2: Burdick at this point says I'm out of here. What
Speaker 2: happens when this guy tries to get away from these
Speaker 2: guys who was in his corner and who isn't And well,
Speaker 2: what are they accusing him of potentially well.
Speaker 3: Harry Burdick was friends with Greg Floyd, and what had
Speaker 3: happened was he suddenly got a case of the guilts
Speaker 3: and said when they were down inside the golf course
Speaker 3: and they had Jason and Amy out of the vehicle,
Speaker 3: leaning up against bales of hay, sitting on the ground,
Speaker 3: and they were kids were yelling back and forth Floyd
Speaker 3: and company about murdering this innocent couple. Harry Burdick basically said,
Speaker 3: you know, I don't want no part of this, and
Speaker 3: he started walking away. He said, listen, I'm leaving. At
Speaker 3: that point, Sammy Sanchez said to Greg Floyd basically and
Speaker 3: then in this vernacular, he's your boy, go get him
Speaker 3: or I'm gonna kill him. And that's when Floyd and
Speaker 3: put Jason and Amy back inside the Fort Explorer. And
Speaker 3: now at this time, there's like seven of them in
Speaker 3: this vehicle attached to the vehicle, and they're riding up
Speaker 3: the hill trying to get a hold of Harry Burdick,
Speaker 3: and they said, Harry, get back down here, and they
Speaker 3: drove back downside the golf course once again had Jason
Speaker 3: and Amy sitting against bales of.
Speaker 2: Hay, and.
Speaker 4: That's when things really went bad.
Speaker 2: Now what do Amy and Jason think? I know you're right.
Speaker 2: Jason is reassuring Amy that everything will be okay. She
Speaker 2: hasn't been sexually assaulted. What happens next with this group
Speaker 2: of five and Amy and Jason.
Speaker 3: Just just to give you a vision of how despairing
Speaker 3: this moment was. Amy is sitting at clutching Jason and
Speaker 3: he's trying to reassure her as they're pleading with these
Speaker 3: five individuals, leave us alone, let us go. We won't
Speaker 3: report the cost stolen. We gave you our money, everything
Speaker 3: we've had, and he was trying to put his you know,
Speaker 3: put his best word forward to these individuals, saying, please
Speaker 3: leave us alone, Amy, this is gonna be okay. Basically,
Speaker 3: I'm your protector, I'm your boyfriend. I'm going to help you.
Speaker 3: Whether it be in words or in actions at that
Speaker 3: particular moment, I'll never know. But ultimately, once these five
Speaker 3: individuals that are standing before them, you know, with the
Speaker 3: you know, several feet in front of them, and Floyd's
Speaker 3: got the gun in his hand, and they're yelling back
Speaker 3: and forth, and Kenneth Day is really ramping things up,
Speaker 3: saying you got to kill him.
Speaker 4: You got to kill him.
Speaker 3: And Sammy Sanchez turns and says to Floyd, if you
Speaker 3: don't kill them, I will, And then Floyd was at
Speaker 3: that point said listen, stop and wrapped over. And you know,
Speaker 3: again the kids are looking up, they're fleading for their
Speaker 3: life and just for that moment prior to the actual
Speaker 3: and then this was an execution.
Speaker 4: That's what it came down to.
Speaker 3: You know, they're looking at this individual and he's covering
Speaker 3: that short distance and span from them, and they're looking
Speaker 3: at him knowing that at this point their.
Speaker 4: Lives are over. So Floyd shoots Jason.
Speaker 3: And now, you know, I'm trying to think of the
Speaker 3: mindset of Amy, who was either she was alive for
Speaker 3: a fleeting second, for a minut we do not know,
Speaker 3: but she was alive long enough to see her boyfriend
Speaker 3: execute it, and just the powers in her mind at
Speaker 3: that point knowing that she's going to be next, and
Speaker 3: ultimately she was.
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Speaker 2: we just went and had you recount the grizzly details
Speaker 2: of the last minutes of Jason and Amy's lives. What
Speaker 2: do the five perpetrators do? What is their plan now
Speaker 2: that they've killed? Tell us what happens next with the
Speaker 2: five before we talk about what happens with the discovery
Speaker 2: and the investigation that's soon underway.
Speaker 3: Well, the five individuals just left Jason and Amy for
Speaker 3: dead in a golf course, got inside Jason's Fort Explorer,
Speaker 3: divvied up some change and some cash that they had
Speaker 3: found in the Fort Explorer. And when I say divvied up,
Speaker 3: they went to a gas station nearby in the city
Speaker 3: of Providence and they put nine dollars in gas in
Speaker 3: each of the vehicles, that being Sanchez's car and Jason's car.
Speaker 3: So they ultimately they got eighteen dollars, but it was
Speaker 3: eighteen dollars spent on gasoline. So you say about was
Speaker 3: stuffed out for eighteen dollars, You.
Speaker 2: Right about that there was a plan for another crime
Speaker 2: using the vehicle. Tell us what that was, and then
Speaker 2: who was assigned the vehicle and what were they told
Speaker 2: to do with it.
Speaker 3: Foyd was in charge of the vehicle, and there had
Speaker 3: been some talk that the following day they were going
Speaker 3: to use that vehicle, uh to rob something else. But
Speaker 3: Floyd said, well, I'll keep the vehicle close by to
Speaker 3: his his house, and he had kept it overnight and
Speaker 3: the following day drove around with this car that you
Speaker 3: know he killed somebody for like it was his own vehicle,
Speaker 3: his own personal pleasure vehicle. He had the keys to it,
Speaker 3: and he used it at will.
Speaker 2: Now you read about that there was a few of
Speaker 2: these perpetrators had girlfriends and people in their lives, and
Speaker 2: they made comments and other people made tell us about
Speaker 2: some of the things that were said initially and to.
Speaker 5: Who, well, there are some bragging, uh bragging rights by
Speaker 5: both Ray Anderson, Kenneth Day, even Floyd, who was talking
Speaker 5: to his girlfriend about what had transpired the night before,
Speaker 5: and it was saying how bad they were, and bad
Speaker 5: in a sense of you know, look at me, I'm
Speaker 5: a tough guy.
Speaker 4: I'm a murderer.
Speaker 3: You know, I'm on top of the world in the small,
Speaker 3: demented kind of world that they lived in. These are people,
Speaker 3: strictly street people with the value of life. The value
Speaker 3: of people's property holds nothing to them. So if they
Speaker 3: bragged about a murder to a friend and a friend
Speaker 3: listen to that story. The friends that they had were
Speaker 3: not the normal type friends that the normal type person
Speaker 3: would have. You know, they didn't nobody reached out and
Speaker 3: called the police and said, hey, Jason was killed last night,
Speaker 3: and and Greg Floyd told me about it, or Kennant
Speaker 3: Day told me about it. They did they they didn't
Speaker 3: have that type of conscience.
Speaker 5: M hmm.
Speaker 2: Now, tell us about your involvement with this investigation. It's
Speaker 2: right after this discovery of the bodies. What can you determine,
Speaker 2: you and your team from the crime scene itself, What
Speaker 2: bit of evidence do you have to go from there?
Speaker 2: And how do you proceed.
Speaker 4: Well.
Speaker 3: Originally, this golf course was under construction, as I said earlier,
Speaker 3: and the one of the maintenance men that was the
Speaker 3: like the supervisor of the golf course, had observed off
Speaker 3: in the distance what he perceived to be bags of garbage. Again,
Speaker 3: this is a kind of a secluded area. Half the
Speaker 3: golf courses in Providence the other half of the golf
Speaker 3: courses in Johnston. When ultimately around lunchtime, the groundskeeper drove
Speaker 3: up to pick up his so called bag of garbage,
Speaker 3: he realized that it saw a dead person. He thought
Speaker 3: it was a mannequin at first, but then he realized
Speaker 3: it was a dead person. And that's when he had
Speaker 3: called nine to one one. The dispatch went to Providence,
Speaker 3: who responded to the scene first, but they also notified
Speaker 3: Johnston police because it was so close to the dividing
Speaker 3: line of the two cities and towns. I get down
Speaker 3: to the scene, and I've been on the force for
Speaker 3: some time. At this point I knew where the dividing
Speaker 3: line was U and I walked in and I said, hey,
Speaker 3: you know, guys, this is Johnston scene. We took over
Speaker 3: the investigation, and any investigation you need to number one,
Speaker 3: determine who these people are.
Speaker 4: These two people.
Speaker 3: Are someone's son, daughter, aunt, uncle, brother, sister, and we
Speaker 3: needed to find out who they are. And first and foremost,
Speaker 3: if we also had what type of crime scene we had,
Speaker 3: whether the murdered suicide, was it a.
Speaker 4: Was it a drug induced overdose?
Speaker 3: Because there wasn't a tremendous amount of connage left by
Speaker 3: the gunshot wounds, it was kind of hard to determine
Speaker 3: what it was. And again, you try to keep an
Speaker 3: open mind on an investigation, and if you get tunnel
Speaker 3: vision it could definitely hamper the investigation. So we leave
Speaker 3: all options open. And then what we proceeded to do
Speaker 3: was stot canvas in the area for any type of
Speaker 3: evidence that may be left behind. There was no vehicle
Speaker 3: at the scene, but there were tie tracks leading up
Speaker 3: to Jason and Amy, so that indicated they had got
Speaker 3: there somehow, some way, and most likely it was with
Speaker 3: a vehicle. But again those tracks could have been there
Speaker 3: prior to them. We have to leave an open mind
Speaker 3: to all possible things that come our way.
Speaker 2: When you're investigating this crime. I know this might be
Speaker 2: out of chronological order, but while you're investigating this, there's
Speaker 2: a call comes to the police station. But again, construct
Speaker 2: this this process for us up to that point where
Speaker 2: the call comes in and that information is added to
Speaker 2: what you do know.
Speaker 4: So far. Well.
Speaker 3: Once at the scene, as we're trying to determine who
Speaker 3: these individuals were, Jason and Amy, we had stopt canvas
Speaker 3: in the area and we had started expanding our canvas,
Speaker 3: our crime scene out and we locate a wallet, a
Speaker 3: female's wallet, several hundred feet away from the bodies. We
Speaker 3: started going through the wallet and there is different credit cards,
Speaker 3: et cetera with Amy's name on it. We now have
Speaker 3: a tentative identification of who Amy is, but we still
Speaker 3: needed a positive identification. That was from the medical Examiner's
Speaker 3: office at the time. The Emmy, the medical examer, he'd
Speaker 3: come out to the scene because in Rhode Island, and
Speaker 3: I don't know how, I can't speak for the States,
Speaker 3: they have control of the scene when this body is involved.
Speaker 3: And then they released the scene back to us at
Speaker 3: to investigate. So we needed to determine who these individuals were.
Speaker 4: That was done.
Speaker 3: A positive identification of Amy was made by Amy's mom
Speaker 3: and her boyfriend, which just to make the notification to
Speaker 3: the families is one of the hottest tasks that has
Speaker 3: ever put upon a police officer. There's no training for
Speaker 3: that and it is the worst thing. And to this day,
Speaker 3: you know, it gives me a not in my stomach
Speaker 3: knowing that, you know, you have to walk up to
Speaker 3: people you don't know to know at all, knock on
Speaker 3: their door and say, you know, are you the parents
Speaker 3: of and can you come and identify your child? They've
Speaker 3: been a victim of a murder and it was just
Speaker 3: just it's burned him into my brain. It's just horrific.
Speaker 3: But getting back to the investigation, once we have the
Speaker 3: kids identified and we have Jason's dad telling us, you know,
Speaker 3: Jason had a Ford Explorer.
Speaker 4: Where is it?
Speaker 3: He gives us the license plate on the Ford Explorer.
Speaker 3: We put out a bolo or be on the lookout
Speaker 3: for his vehicle. Ultimately it stopped in the city of
Speaker 3: Providence at the time a patrolman, Jan Carella, and in
Speaker 3: the inside the vehicle. It was being driven by Greg Floyd.
Speaker 3: Johnston Roe Alan Police Department, myself and several other detectives
Speaker 3: respond to the scene in Providence. We take Greg Floyd
Speaker 3: back into our custody at this time to speak to
Speaker 3: him about why he has Jason's vehicle. As we're speaking
Speaker 3: to Jason, as excuse me, as we're speaking to Greg Floyd,
Speaker 3: we receive a phone call at the police station from
Speaker 3: a person identify himself as Harry Burdick. Harry Burdick informs
Speaker 3: one of the detectives over the phone that while watching
Speaker 3: the ten o'clock news he learned about that the Justin
Speaker 3: police were investigating the murders of the two individuals at
Speaker 3: the golf course.
Speaker 4: Harry tells us he knows.
Speaker 3: About the scene and is he in trouble, And so
Speaker 3: we tell Harry, listen, we don't know what story you're
Speaker 3: gonna tell us, but police come to the police station.
Speaker 3: So whatever information you may have, we can stop using
Speaker 3: that as evidence or helping us go forward with our investigations.
Speaker 3: Not so much evidence. I now had left Greg Floyd
Speaker 3: in the interview room by himself. After talking to the
Speaker 3: detectives who spoke to Harry I walked back into the
Speaker 3: interview room and I had told Greg Floyd. I said, Greg,
Speaker 3: we got a problem here. The story that you told
Speaker 3: me in the beginning.
Speaker 4: How you know you.
Speaker 3: Had nothing to do with the car you were trying.
Speaker 3: You were buying that Ford Explorer, which belonged to Jason.
Speaker 3: You were buying it from some lady that you knew
Speaker 3: vaguely and couldn't give a description of, and you met
Speaker 3: her down at Saki's Pizza. I said, that story's not
Speaker 3: gonna hold anything. As I said to him, as a
Speaker 3: matter of fact, I have an eyewitness that's coming into
Speaker 3: the station that's going to tell me that you were
Speaker 3: at the scene. I never learned that from Verdict, but
Speaker 3: I used it. And at that time Floyd looked at
Speaker 3: me and in all seriousness, he said to me, Detective
Speaker 3: that there couldn't have been There were no witnesses. So
Speaker 3: he just implicated himself big time. And you know, I
Speaker 3: always said, thank God, there are you know, dumb criminals
Speaker 3: out there, and this was probably one of the most
Speaker 3: profane of the dumbest, because to make a statement like that,
Speaker 3: he was just I don't know what he's thinking. So
Speaker 3: that really started moving our investigations with throw it at
Speaker 3: a more rapid speed, Burdick comes in. Ultimately, Burdick's story was,
Speaker 3: you know, he was just along for the ride. He
Speaker 3: had nothing to do with this. He actually tried to
Speaker 3: stop the murder and he started walking away, And I
Speaker 3: want to know.
Speaker 4: Part of that.
Speaker 3: That was the only part of the whole story that
Speaker 3: he told us was the truth that yes, he was
Speaker 3: trying to walk away, but he was going to be
Speaker 3: murdered by Sammy Sanchez.
Speaker 4: That was truth.
Speaker 2: So what is the situation with the death penalty in
Speaker 2: Rhode Island and the big issue of federal death penalty,
Speaker 2: possibility of prosecution and how this crime and these criminals
Speaker 2: would qualify. Tell us about that.
Speaker 3: Rhere Island doesn't have a death penalty statue, however, the
Speaker 3: federal government does. And because this was a kajacking murder
Speaker 3: with a high powered, high powered weapon involved, that's where
Speaker 3: the federal government kicked it in because of the kidnapping
Speaker 3: kajacking and ultimately the government has on their books the
Speaker 3: death penalty phase and because Rhode Island didn't have it.
Speaker 3: The people of Rhode Island were so outraged at this
Speaker 3: murder that they they wanted upon the flesh from these individuals.
Speaker 3: So we attempted to use the federal statue so we
Speaker 3: could actually get the death penalty. But it's a petition process.
Speaker 3: It's not just like we show up at the federal
Speaker 3: government and say, you know you, these people are guilty
Speaker 3: put in the death and it just doesn't happen like that.
Speaker 2: Now, with this initiative to try to have these people
Speaker 2: executed in Rhode Island, you provide a lot of statistics
Speaker 2: in your book as well about when was the last
Speaker 2: time somebody was executed in Rhode Island, but also this
Speaker 2: the murders and compared to executions as well. Can you
Speaker 2: tell us about a couple of those fascinating statistics that
Speaker 2: you put in this book to bolster some of your
Speaker 2: I guess claims and arguments in here.
Speaker 3: Well, the last time someone has been put to death
Speaker 3: and Rhode Island was like decades ago, and it had
Speaker 3: been tossed back and forth between the legislature about putting
Speaker 3: it back on the books, as you know, a part
Speaker 3: of the sentencing for something so egregious as an execution,
Speaker 3: but it was not on the books that at that time.
Speaker 3: So therefore that's why we went to the federal government.
Speaker 3: Statistics they always show a story of why things happened
Speaker 3: or when things happened and what you could do with them.
Speaker 3: But statistics did not save these two individuals. So we
Speaker 3: were going to use everything at our power to do
Speaker 3: what we could to get our pound of flesh for
Speaker 3: this egregious act.
Speaker 2: What was the feeling of the families in their entirety,
Speaker 2: the Bergersons and the Shoot families, in terms of their
Speaker 2: desire for this, they.
Speaker 4: Were totally on board.
Speaker 3: Jason's sister Kelly started a petition drive and posted a
Speaker 3: signature of boards and all the local markets throughout the
Speaker 3: mass in Rhode Island. Uh and and people really really
Speaker 3: really got up in arms that you know, just this
Speaker 3: was like, at the time, one of the most egregious acts.
Speaker 4: That Rhode Island had.
Speaker 2: Uh.
Speaker 3: There has since been others, uh, but at that time
Speaker 3: to open the Sunday uh Providence Journal, which is the
Speaker 3: major newspaper in Rhode Island, and on the front coat
Speaker 3: fold is these five individuals, and Kenneth Day is just staring.
Speaker 3: And when he's staring, he's staring like as like the
Speaker 3: devil's looking at you. And that grass that just took
Speaker 3: hold of people and they really were up in arms
Speaker 3: about it. Ultimately, the picture that was put in the
Speaker 3: paper of these five individuals being arraigned.
Speaker 4: That led to other cases that were opened against them,
Speaker 4: and ultimately it was.
Speaker 3: Day was convicted on another robbery he had committed prior
Speaker 3: to this quajacking murder, so it didn't as his close
Speaker 3: up some.
Speaker 4: Cases and it helped.
Speaker 3: But just to see that picture in the paper, it
Speaker 3: was it was hot wrenching to see these evil people.
Speaker 2: You write in a book about a individual named iron
Speaker 2: Nasberg and he had called the police station the day
Speaker 2: after the bodies were found. Why did he call? What
Speaker 2: did he have to say regarding this murder?
Speaker 4: Weber Ironberg?
Speaker 3: He was a unique individual. He was a hanger on.
Speaker 3: And when I say a hanger on, he liked to
Speaker 3: be in the mix of like bad people, even though
Speaker 3: he wasn't a bad person himself. When I say bad,
Speaker 3: he wasn't a tough guy, he wasn't a murderer. He
Speaker 3: would basically do whatever these people Floyd and Company would
Speaker 3: tell him to do. Nasberg had a clean record. He
Speaker 3: ultimately we sought him out because when we ran the
Speaker 3: background check on the firearm that was used that we
Speaker 3: recovered from Greg Floyd in kenned Day's room. We learned
Speaker 3: that it was purchased by Iris and Nasberg. Iron Ashberg
Speaker 3: reported several of his guns stolen throughout his life. We
Speaker 3: ended up tying Ira of Nashburg back to Greg Floyd
Speaker 3: as being a friend of Greg Floyd.
Speaker 4: And that was when.
Speaker 3: Iras said to me, yeah, I need to talk to you.
Speaker 3: Beyond me talking to him in the presence of his attorney,
Speaker 3: he said, can I come in and talk to you?
Speaker 3: He did come to the police station on a Friday night.
Speaker 3: We sat down. I said, listen, I can't talk to you.
Speaker 3: You've hired an attorney. And he said, I'm waiving all
Speaker 3: my rights. I want to tell you a story, but
Speaker 3: how much time am I going to serve? I said, listen,
Speaker 3: that's way above my pay grade at this point. I
Speaker 3: will get a hold of the people at the US
Speaker 3: Attorney's office. You come back in on Monday. We let's
Speaker 3: all sit down and we'll see what we can hammer out,
Speaker 3: what kind of deal they may or may not be
Speaker 3: able to get. And ultimately Iran never came back on Monday,
Speaker 3: and we learned that over the weekend he had passed away.
Speaker 3: But Ira definitely like to be in the mix of
Speaker 3: bad people, and he was like an easy target because
Speaker 3: they could just at will tell him to do certain
Speaker 3: things and he would do it.
Speaker 2: You're right about the again, the process that would get
Speaker 2: this to the death penalty federal death penalty status. What
Speaker 2: happens in that pursuit tell us what happens.
Speaker 3: It's a petition process to to have the US government
Speaker 3: put somebody to debt. That petition goes before At the time,
Speaker 3: it went before John John Ashcroft, who was the US
Speaker 3: Attorney General, and after review, that was denied. Our request
Speaker 3: to have the US government put Floyd to debt.
Speaker 4: That was denied.
Speaker 3: Floyd, Sanchez and Harry Burdick ultimately pled pled guilty to
Speaker 3: life with our parole with no trial, kenned Day. And
Speaker 3: it was ironic because Sanchez never said a word to us.
Speaker 3: He invoked his right to not speak to us, which
Speaker 3: was you know, his constitutional right. He never said a
Speaker 3: word to us, but ultimately he fled out to life
Speaker 3: with all parole. Kenned Day was the only one that said,
Speaker 3: I want to take this to trial, and we did.
Speaker 3: The youth the United States government took kenned Day to
Speaker 3: trial and the US Federal Court in Providence, and halfway
Speaker 3: through the trial process, the defense attorney for.
Speaker 4: Kenned Day was.
Speaker 3: Asked by the judge judge lagueur is an emotion to dismiss?
Speaker 3: And the judge asked this of the defense attorney several times,
Speaker 3: which made us raise our eyebrows, like, where's this judge
Speaker 3: going with this? And finally the lawyer said, yes, you're on,
Speaker 3: I'm asking for emotion to dismiss, which finned the grudg
Speaker 3: said granted. And we learned that from the judge is
Speaker 3: judge's opinion, which I didn't agree with it and still
Speaker 3: don't that he said that because they didn't have the
Speaker 3: intent to murder prior to them actually going out and
Speaker 3: conjacking Jason and Amy. Then he was dismissing the case
Speaker 3: against Kenneth Day.
Speaker 2: Now, how did Day respond and how does prosecution in
Speaker 2: Rhode Island respond?
Speaker 3: Well, we had a backup plan because he was elated
Speaker 3: obviously that he got off on a federal charge. But
Speaker 3: because he got off on the federal charge, we charged
Speaker 3: him on the state statue of murder and we charged
Speaker 3: him with multiple counts of murder, multiple charges of kajacking
Speaker 3: double jeopardy doesn't apply because it's too distinct in separate jurisdictions. Ultimately,
Speaker 3: we take kenned Day to court on the state murder
Speaker 3: charges and he was convicted on all counts and received
Speaker 3: four consecutive life sentences with our parole.
Speaker 2: Tell us about Gregory Floyd testifying against Kenneth.
Speaker 4: Day during the federal trial Floyd.
Speaker 3: I had gone down to Pennsylvania where Floyd was being detained,
Speaker 3: and I spoke to him at length about clearing his
Speaker 3: conscious He did almost do the right thing by well,
Speaker 3: he stopped the rape of Amy for the sexual assault
Speaker 3: of Amy, but then ultimately he killed them. I said,
Speaker 3: we can offer you nothing else. You are doing life
Speaker 3: with our role. You're going to die in prison. But
Speaker 3: kenned Day was equally as guilty. Will you help us
Speaker 3: against our case in kenned Day and Floyd agreed to
Speaker 3: come back to Rhode Island and he was going to
Speaker 3: now testify against kenned Day. Once Floyd got to Rhode Island,
Speaker 3: that quickly did not happen at trial. So we had
Speaker 3: to use Raymond Anderson as the person that was going
Speaker 3: to testify against kenned Day, and for Raymond's consideration of testifying,
Speaker 3: he received a reduced sentence.
Speaker 2: And what was that reduced sentence.
Speaker 3: It was I believe in the numbers of like thirty
Speaker 3: five years to serve. So Anderson will get out of
Speaker 3: prison when he's in his fifties and the rest are
Speaker 3: all serving life foot out parole.
Speaker 2: You talked about Kenneth Day and some of his behavior
Speaker 2: at court regarding families.
Speaker 3: Well, again, kenned Day was an absolute animal. So when
Speaker 3: he was brought into court in state court, he faced
Speaker 3: the family, he was giggling, laughing, blowing kisses to him.
Speaker 3: Defense table and prosecution table are like side by side,
Speaker 3: and under his breath he was constantly trying to beat
Speaker 3: me into an argument with him, and you know, we
Speaker 3: have to keep.
Speaker 4: A cool ahead.
Speaker 3: But the judge did notice, and the sheriffs did advise
Speaker 3: the judge that what Cannant Day's action were once he
Speaker 3: was being brought into the courtroom, and how much this
Speaker 3: upset the families.
Speaker 4: And then because of that.
Speaker 3: He was brought into court on a different manner, so
Speaker 3: that now he no longer faced the families.
Speaker 2: Tell us what you write about the circumstance where they
Speaker 2: the perpetrators pled guilty received the life without parole. But
Speaker 2: if they would have got the death penalty, you righte
Speaker 2: that with that legal precedent or that what that judge
Speaker 2: decision would have affected it.
Speaker 4: Tell us about that, well, that would.
Speaker 3: Have kicked it into a whole different level of of.
Speaker 4: The case.
Speaker 3: Because if they we sought the death penalty and Kenned
Speaker 3: Day went to trial and was found guilty and the
Speaker 3: judge had reservations about the calidication be dismissed, I believe
Speaker 3: that still would be entangled in the court process today,
Speaker 3: as it was a day's appeal process. Last that lasted
Speaker 3: for a number of years. He appealed everything under the sun,
Speaker 3: and ultimately all his appeals were denied, and that last
Speaker 3: appeal was in two thousand and seven and that was denied.
Speaker 3: And anything he could come up with. I mean, his
Speaker 3: job was to try to stay out of jail. Our
Speaker 3: job was to keep him in jail, and we prevailed.
Speaker 2: You talk about the families of the Burgersons and the shoots.
Speaker 2: Amy's mother didn't farewell. Amy's sister tell us a little
Speaker 2: bit about the fallout and a little bit about some
Speaker 2: of the people that went on and continued with life
Speaker 2: successfully despite this disaster.
Speaker 3: Well again, I try to I try to put the
Speaker 3: reader's mindset in the shoes of the family having to
Speaker 3: sit through this process and it just it just beat
Speaker 3: them up to no end. Uh, And it affected everybody
Speaker 3: across the board. We had super highs in the case
Speaker 3: and then horrible low was in the case. And the
Speaker 3: ultimate low was when Day's case was dismissed in federal
Speaker 3: court after we think, you know that we had a
Speaker 3: slam dunk going here that really took its toll on
Speaker 3: Jason's mom, h on Jason's sister. It affected everybody, law
Speaker 3: enforcement family, and to move on, Yes, in law enforcement,
Speaker 3: you have to go on because there are other families
Speaker 3: out there you need to help. But still lingers in
Speaker 3: the back of your head that you know, oh my god,
Speaker 3: these families just went through such a heinous time and
Speaker 3: you know they're never going to get their loved one back.
Speaker 3: And here are these five individuals. Their life really hasn't
Speaker 3: been Actually their life is probably for the better because
Speaker 3: now they're getting the meals, they're getting their their bed,
Speaker 3: they're getting everything they need in life. Because they're type
Speaker 3: of people that really didn't need much in life because
Speaker 3: they didn't have anything in life, and if they get it,
Speaker 3: they stole it anyway.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Yeah, I talked about a couple of these guys
Speaker 2: in Floyd and another were essentially homeless and like you say,
Speaker 2: lived in abject poverty as it were. You write about
Speaker 2: because it seems and you write that some of these
Speaker 2: guys said they seem to be conflicted, or at least
Speaker 2: their heinous behavior seemed in conflict with their normal sort
Speaker 2: of loving behavior that people described. And what you do
Speaker 2: is you look at the work of Lonnier Athens, respected
Speaker 2: criminologists and who had studied the nature of violent crime exclusively,
Speaker 2: and what did you find through Lonnier Athens to try
Speaker 2: to explain how this might have happened.
Speaker 3: Well, once the five individuals collectively, their mindset became one.
Speaker 3: Even if that one good person, I don't think he
Speaker 3: could overrule the other four. And once once that animal
Speaker 3: pack type mentality he kicked in. Unless you're the dominant
Speaker 3: person amongst that group and you had the power to
Speaker 3: persuade you, you were not going to persuade those other four.
Speaker 3: So let's let's turn this whole process around and not
Speaker 3: not commit this murder.
Speaker 4: Some of them.
Speaker 3: I don't want to say they had good qualities because
Speaker 3: I'll never say that. These these people, in my eyes,
Speaker 3: they had nothing good about them.
Speaker 2: Uh.
Speaker 3: Ray Anderson had a small child, and to me, yes,
Speaker 3: he had a child. He loved his child. Well, if
Speaker 3: you loved your child, Jason and Emu were somebody's child,
Speaker 3: and you you were part and apostle to this executioner.
Speaker 2: Uh.
Speaker 3: He he didn't have You know, he lost no sleep
Speaker 3: over this because the Friday night when we caught Floyd.
Speaker 4: He was out at a high.
Speaker 3: School graduation party and uh, you know where where was
Speaker 3: the effect it had on him? They all went about
Speaker 3: their life. The next day when we spoke to Kenneth Day,
Speaker 3: he told me that he was getting ready to call
Speaker 3: the police to tell them about what happened. And I
Speaker 3: said straight out to why didn't you? Well, I don't know,
Speaker 3: because that wasn't in his makeup. He was never going to,
Speaker 3: as he's so called, rat out on any of his friends. Yeah,
Speaker 3: it was a it was a horrible, horrible experience to
Speaker 3: go through as an investigator.
Speaker 4: As a father, I had a daughter.
Speaker 3: Of the same age close to Amy, and you know,
Speaker 3: just looking at her in that golf course, knowing that
Speaker 3: her last moments in life were determined by five and
Speaker 3: five people she never knew. And it's just a horrible,
Speaker 3: horrible thing.
Speaker 2: The outpouring of emotions for the wakes and the funerals
Speaker 2: that followed for Jason and Amy were impressive, even to
Speaker 2: the families that thought they had a lot of friends
Speaker 2: that it was almost overwhelming the responses that they had
Speaker 2: from people, strangers and friends at these events. Weren't they.
Speaker 4: It truly was and.
Speaker 3: Well deserved the outpaaring. And again, I don't know if
Speaker 3: people who had no history with the Burgisons or the
Speaker 3: Shoots attended the wakes and just out of the share
Speaker 3: compassion that some people, some good people have, but there
Speaker 3: was a tremendous outpawing.
Speaker 4: I mean, the Geames were two very.
Speaker 3: Likable kids who had the world in front of them
Speaker 3: and ultimately was taken by five animals who you know,
Speaker 3: wanted to play, They wanted to play god.
Speaker 2: Hm. Well, you know, luckily, through the hard work of
Speaker 2: your team and people involved in the judicial system that
Speaker 2: these for these people anyway, will never see the light
Speaker 2: of day, and one person will receive a significant sentence
Speaker 2: like you say he likely will receive some parole, receive
Speaker 2: parole someday. But congratulations on the investigation. They move very
Speaker 2: quickly and responded appropriately, and obviously you didn't get the
Speaker 2: death penalty, but you got the appropriate sentence for these
Speaker 2: people that they would be behind bars forever.
Speaker 4: Gratulation and thank you very much. I appreciate that.
Speaker 2: I want to thank you for coming on and talking
Speaker 2: about murder without Motive, the Amy shoot and Jason Bergerson's story.
Speaker 2: I know this is on Amazon. Is there a website
Speaker 2: or a Facebook page for people that might want to
Speaker 2: look at more information about this? Is there something like that?
Speaker 4: I would look under the author Paul Leonado. It's l
Speaker 4: O N A R d O.
Speaker 3: He's written numerous books. He specializes in a lot of
Speaker 3: true crying stuff. I would Google or any other search engine.
Speaker 4: Paul Nado.
Speaker 3: He does have a website and you can link up
Speaker 3: to anything you want. Any out additional information that may
Speaker 3: be asked.
Speaker 2: Absolutely, and we just want to mention too, Paul Lenardo's
Speaker 2: co author. Originally he was going to come on and
Speaker 2: talk about this book, but he felt that it would
Speaker 2: be much better for you to come on and with
Speaker 2: your intimacy with this case to come on and talk
Speaker 2: about that, and he was absolutely right. So I want
Speaker 2: to thank you very much, retire Detective Raymond Pinatory, for
Speaker 2: this interview. You have a great evening and it was
Speaker 2: a pleasure speaking with you.
Speaker 3: Good night, Thank you, Danny, and also to you, thank you.
Speaker 2: Good night.