WEBVTT 1 00:00:07.639 --> 00:00:11.080 You are now listening to True Murder, The most shocking 2 00:00:11.160 --> 00:00:14.160 killers in true crime history and the authors that have 3 00:00:14.240 --> 00:00:21.519 written about them Gaesy Bundy Dahmer, The Nightstalker VTK Every 4 00:00:21.559 --> 00:00:25.239 week another fascinating author talking about the most shocking and 5 00:00:25.359 --> 00:00:29.559 infamous killers in true crime history. True Murder with your 6 00:00:29.559 --> 00:00:40.399 host journalist and author Dan Zufanski, Good Evening. 7 00:00:41.759 --> 00:00:46.520 What drove the inconspicuous sociopath to become a ruthless killer 8 00:00:47.799 --> 00:00:52.000 During his nearly fifteen year reign of terror? Ronald Lloyd 9 00:00:52.079 --> 00:00:57.719 Bailey's braved obsession with sexual sadism held communities across Southeast 10 00:00:57.759 --> 00:01:01.920 Michigan in a shroud of fear from the early nineteen 11 00:01:02.000 --> 00:01:05.599 seventies to the mid nineteen eighties. The former patient at 12 00:01:05.599 --> 00:01:10.079 one of Michigan's foremost psychiatric hospitals abducted as many as 13 00:01:10.120 --> 00:01:15.159 fifteen teens and over time, became a sadistic serial killer. 14 00:01:16.799 --> 00:01:20.920 In this shocking, fast paced account, retired police officer and 15 00:01:20.959 --> 00:01:26.400 true crime author Rod Sadler examines law enforcement's dedicated efforts 16 00:01:26.439 --> 00:01:30.599 in connecting the dots to stop an unknown killer, and 17 00:01:30.680 --> 00:01:34.920 he poignantly chronicles the determination of the victim's families to 18 00:01:35.079 --> 00:01:42.480 triumph over tragedy. Sadler also examines Bailey's insanity defense that 19 00:01:42.640 --> 00:01:46.079 centered on the alleged abuse he endured at the hands 20 00:01:46.200 --> 00:01:50.920 of a psychiatrists. In doing so, the best selling author 21 00:01:51.000 --> 00:01:55.840 of Killing Women asks and answers the question what drove 22 00:01:56.000 --> 00:02:02.719 the inconspicuous sociopath to become a ruthless GUESI. The book 23 00:02:02.719 --> 00:02:07.400 that we're featuring this evening is Depraved Obsession, the gripping 24 00:02:07.519 --> 00:02:11.560 true story of law enforcements hunt for a sadistic serial killer, 25 00:02:12.319 --> 00:02:16.759 with my special guest, retired law enforcement officer and award 26 00:02:16.840 --> 00:02:22.360 winning author, Rod Sadler. Welcome back to the program, and 27 00:02:22.400 --> 00:02:25.080 thank you very much for this interview. Rod Sadler. 28 00:02:26.879 --> 00:02:28.520 Well, thank you for having me again. 29 00:02:29.120 --> 00:02:31.159 This seems to be a regular occurrence every couple of 30 00:02:31.240 --> 00:02:33.400 years and I always enjoy it. 31 00:02:33.439 --> 00:02:34.159 Thank you so much. 32 00:02:34.240 --> 00:02:36.479 Dan, I do too as well. Thank you so much, 33 00:02:36.520 --> 00:02:39.879 and congratulations on your latest Depraved Obsession. 34 00:02:41.280 --> 00:02:42.120 Thank you. Thank you. 35 00:02:42.520 --> 00:02:47.039 May sixth the launch, and I think I'm almost positive 36 00:02:47.080 --> 00:02:49.439 that the readers will find it is by far my 37 00:02:49.520 --> 00:02:50.319 best work yet. 38 00:02:50.599 --> 00:02:51.719 I truly believe. 39 00:02:51.479 --> 00:02:56.599 That, yes, I will concur Let's talk about how you 40 00:02:56.680 --> 00:03:00.639 came to this story. You are a former law enforcement 41 00:03:00.680 --> 00:03:04.599 police officer. Tell us how you came to be involved 42 00:03:04.639 --> 00:03:05.400 in this story. 43 00:03:06.759 --> 00:03:11.319 Well, back in nineteen eighty five, I worked briefly, and 44 00:03:11.560 --> 00:03:14.599 I do mean very briefly in the Detroit area as 45 00:03:14.639 --> 00:03:19.759 a police officer. I can remember driving down US twenty three, 46 00:03:19.800 --> 00:03:24.319 it's a state highway here in the Brighton area, which 47 00:03:24.360 --> 00:03:28.240 is down toward the Detroit area, and I can remember 48 00:03:28.919 --> 00:03:34.080 seeing the news reports of this young teenage boy who 49 00:03:34.120 --> 00:03:37.680 had been kidnapped and his body hadn't even been found yet. 50 00:03:37.680 --> 00:03:40.680 And I can remember driving down US twenty three and 51 00:03:40.719 --> 00:03:44.560 glancing over and seeing the green Oak Township Police Department. 52 00:03:44.599 --> 00:03:52.479 They were the original investigating agency in this kidnapping, and realizing, oh, 53 00:03:52.560 --> 00:03:56.439 that's where this young boy was kidnapped from, was green 54 00:03:56.479 --> 00:04:01.840 Oak Township, and always remembered that case. And then as 55 00:04:01.919 --> 00:04:05.919 I was searching for new material for a new book, 56 00:04:06.560 --> 00:04:09.879 a friend of mine that I've known for, oh my gosh, 57 00:04:10.120 --> 00:04:13.960 probably thirty years told me that he was the first 58 00:04:14.080 --> 00:04:20.399 officer contacted by a witness in that case, and he 59 00:04:20.560 --> 00:04:24.600 and another friend of mine were the very first two 60 00:04:24.680 --> 00:04:29.800 officers involved in the kidnapping of Sean Moore. 61 00:04:30.120 --> 00:04:31.160 And so that's how. 62 00:04:31.240 --> 00:04:33.480 He said, would you like to write the book about it, 63 00:04:33.519 --> 00:04:36.519 and I said, Oh, I'd be absolutely thrilled to write 64 00:04:36.560 --> 00:04:39.480 that book. Yeah, And so that's how it all started. 65 00:04:41.959 --> 00:04:45.000 You're right that the abduction and murder of Shawn Moore 66 00:04:45.160 --> 00:04:51.439 became a defining moment for Brighton, Michigan, and for Livingston County, 67 00:04:52.319 --> 00:04:56.240 and the entire community lost its innocence at that time. 68 00:04:56.560 --> 00:04:58.480 And you say it was also a defining moment for 69 00:04:58.560 --> 00:05:01.360 anyone directly involved in the investigation. 70 00:05:03.240 --> 00:05:03.720 It was. 71 00:05:04.759 --> 00:05:07.800 You have to understand in the mid eighties, it really 72 00:05:07.959 --> 00:05:11.439 was a time when a lot of people didn't lock 73 00:05:11.519 --> 00:05:14.879 their doors, a lot of people had a lot of 74 00:05:14.920 --> 00:05:20.399 trust in that area. Brighton was a working class community, 75 00:05:21.279 --> 00:05:25.160 a suburb really. I don't know as they would admit 76 00:05:25.199 --> 00:05:27.639 it today, but really it was kind of a suburb 77 00:05:27.680 --> 00:05:30.120 of the Detroit area, and a lot of people commuted 78 00:05:30.160 --> 00:05:34.759 to Detroit and the surrounding suburbs to work from Brighton, 79 00:05:34.879 --> 00:05:38.079 and Brighton was just a quaint little community. And to 80 00:05:38.199 --> 00:05:43.519 have something like that happen on a Labor Day weekend 81 00:05:43.759 --> 00:05:47.160 in the middle of the day in nineteen eighty five 82 00:05:47.920 --> 00:05:53.240 absolutely took the innocence of Brighton, Michigan and Livingston County 83 00:05:53.240 --> 00:05:59.000 away and anybody that you talked to, anyone that I interviewed. 84 00:05:58.480 --> 00:06:00.519 For the book would agree with that. 85 00:06:00.720 --> 00:06:04.399 It was as if the whole county lost its innocence 86 00:06:04.519 --> 00:06:07.079 because of this kidnapping. 87 00:06:09.360 --> 00:06:12.639 You take the reader to February nineteen seventy six and 88 00:06:13.160 --> 00:06:17.560 right that across southeast Michigan and beyond, people were gripped 89 00:06:17.600 --> 00:06:21.040 in fear with the seemingly random murders of children in 90 00:06:21.079 --> 00:06:25.240 and around Oakland County that spanned the next fourteen months. 91 00:06:25.879 --> 00:06:29.199 And you say the murders began in January, Tell us 92 00:06:29.240 --> 00:06:33.480 about what happens in Macombe County and Cynthia Cadou. 93 00:06:35.199 --> 00:06:40.720 There was a series of children who were murdered, Some 94 00:06:40.839 --> 00:06:43.639 were teenagers, mid teenagers. 95 00:06:44.160 --> 00:06:45.959 Cynthia Caddou was one of them. 96 00:06:46.439 --> 00:06:48.920 Off the top of my head, I don't recall the 97 00:06:48.959 --> 00:06:53.720 circumstances around her murder, but there was two or three 98 00:06:53.759 --> 00:06:59.639 of them that occurred, along with four that were attributed 99 00:06:59.680 --> 00:07:04.000 to at least one group or group of killers who 100 00:07:04.079 --> 00:07:09.560 became known as the Oakland County child killings. And Cynthia 101 00:07:09.639 --> 00:07:13.560 Kudo and there were their names escaped me off the 102 00:07:13.639 --> 00:07:15.639 top of my head. But there were two others that 103 00:07:15.680 --> 00:07:19.399 they thought were related to the Oaklan County child killings, 104 00:07:19.800 --> 00:07:22.920 and it turned out eventually they were able to show 105 00:07:22.959 --> 00:07:27.199 that they were not involved or a part of those, 106 00:07:27.720 --> 00:07:31.879 So now the police were left with four other murders 107 00:07:31.879 --> 00:07:37.439 of children. The murders of Mark Stebbens, Jill Robinson, Christine Mahellick, 108 00:07:37.879 --> 00:07:41.480 and Timothy King were the victims of the Oakland County 109 00:07:41.560 --> 00:07:46.920 child killings, and the other three that I do reference 110 00:07:46.959 --> 00:07:49.240 at the beginning of the book turns out they were 111 00:07:49.279 --> 00:07:50.879 not a part of those. 112 00:07:52.240 --> 00:07:56.240 We spoke earlier. Can you explain this Oakland County child 113 00:07:56.319 --> 00:07:59.079 killings and why this book is not specifically about that, 114 00:07:59.199 --> 00:08:02.480 even though it's the title of this What. 115 00:08:02.560 --> 00:08:06.959 Happened was in February of nineteen seventy six, a young 116 00:08:07.040 --> 00:08:10.639 boy named Mark Stebbins came up missing. 117 00:08:12.079 --> 00:08:13.959 His body was found. 118 00:08:15.560 --> 00:08:20.519 In a parking lot shortly a couple days after he 119 00:08:20.800 --> 00:08:25.199 was kidnapped. After that, a young girl by the name 120 00:08:25.240 --> 00:08:30.079 of Joe Robinson, she was twelve. She came up missing 121 00:08:30.480 --> 00:08:34.519 in December of nineteen seventy six. And then there was 122 00:08:34.559 --> 00:08:38.399 another girl who came up missing, Christine Mahellick. She was 123 00:08:38.440 --> 00:08:42.000 ten years old. She came up missing in January of 124 00:08:42.080 --> 00:08:46.279 nineteen seventy seven, and Timothy King, who was eleven at 125 00:08:46.320 --> 00:08:50.639 the time, came up missing in March of nineteen seventy seven. 126 00:08:51.639 --> 00:08:55.639 When these kids' bodies were found, they were as if 127 00:08:55.679 --> 00:08:59.080 they had been taken care of. They had been held, 128 00:09:00.039 --> 00:09:04.919 obviously for several days before they were murdered, and the 129 00:09:04.960 --> 00:09:08.200 police formed a task force in order to find the 130 00:09:08.840 --> 00:09:13.240 Oaklan County child killings or killer, and to this day 131 00:09:13.320 --> 00:09:14.480 he has not been caught. 132 00:09:15.440 --> 00:09:17.000 I do reference. 133 00:09:17.080 --> 00:09:22.480 These murders because these were at a time when Ron Bailey, 134 00:09:23.039 --> 00:09:27.799 the killer that I write about, was a teenager, and 135 00:09:29.399 --> 00:09:35.960 obviously he had a propensity for young children, and there 136 00:09:36.159 --> 00:09:41.279 was some suggestion or some thought that he might be 137 00:09:41.360 --> 00:09:46.039 involved at least in some way in these killings. And 138 00:09:46.200 --> 00:09:50.360 so the book really is not about the Oaklan County childkillings. 139 00:09:50.759 --> 00:09:55.919 It's about Ron Bailey and the two young boys that 140 00:09:56.039 --> 00:10:00.399 he was convicted of killing in nineteen eight eighty four, 141 00:10:00.559 --> 00:10:01.399 nineteen eighty five. 142 00:10:03.399 --> 00:10:07.080 Let's get to this. You call it the beginning. Lavonia Township, 143 00:10:07.279 --> 00:10:12.480 a Detroit suburb over one hundred thousand population, and Ron 144 00:10:12.519 --> 00:10:15.480 Bailey's father, Alfred Bailey. You say Ron was born in 145 00:10:15.600 --> 00:10:19.480 nineteen fifty nine. Tell us about Alfred Bailey, his wife 146 00:10:19.720 --> 00:10:23.120 and Ron growing up well. 147 00:10:23.159 --> 00:10:27.399 Alfred Bailey was, by all accounts, was a workaholic, even 148 00:10:27.440 --> 00:10:33.000 by his own admissions. And Ron Bailey had a brother 149 00:10:33.360 --> 00:10:38.840 also and a sister, and Alfred Bailey was seldom at home. 150 00:10:38.919 --> 00:10:44.879 He worked for a computer technology company GM was just 151 00:10:44.960 --> 00:10:48.840 taking them on board, so he was busy, it seemed 152 00:10:48.879 --> 00:10:52.519 like all the time. He was a coach, though, and 153 00:10:52.720 --> 00:10:55.679 he was a highly respected like little league coach in 154 00:10:55.720 --> 00:10:59.559 the area, so there was some time spent with his children, 155 00:10:59.600 --> 00:11:02.200 but for the most part, he was a workaholic. At 156 00:11:02.200 --> 00:11:05.679 that time, he saw some promise in Ron as a 157 00:11:05.720 --> 00:11:10.600 young baseball player, but Ron Bailey had absolutely no interest 158 00:11:10.639 --> 00:11:15.000 in that at all, and so Ron Bailey would often 159 00:11:15.679 --> 00:11:19.159 get on his bike and take off and be gone 160 00:11:19.759 --> 00:11:22.759 all day long and might not even come home for dinner, 161 00:11:23.320 --> 00:11:26.080 might not even show up until late in the evening, 162 00:11:26.840 --> 00:11:29.879 and so he was basically out on his own. His 163 00:11:30.000 --> 00:11:35.159 mother tried to discipline him when the need arose, but 164 00:11:35.320 --> 00:11:40.960 really it came down to Alfred Bailey disciplining him when 165 00:11:41.000 --> 00:11:44.360 he would get home after working for a twelve hour day. 166 00:11:46.399 --> 00:11:49.879 You're right about the first one of the first incidents 167 00:11:50.399 --> 00:11:53.600 known no doubt Ron was fourteen years old and he 168 00:11:53.639 --> 00:11:55.519 put a knife at the throat of a fifteen year 169 00:11:55.559 --> 00:12:00.360 old and raped him. And he had got him from 170 00:12:00.360 --> 00:12:03.519 a shopping center in Dearborn Heights. He tied his hands 171 00:12:03.519 --> 00:12:07.080 behind his back and molested him before letting him go, 172 00:12:07.440 --> 00:12:10.919 and he demanded his phone number. What happens as a 173 00:12:10.960 --> 00:12:14.039 result of this, and it's interesting you talk about the 174 00:12:14.120 --> 00:12:17.240 reaction when he goes to the police with his parents 175 00:12:17.320 --> 00:12:19.240 and then what he does the next day. 176 00:12:20.399 --> 00:12:23.639 Yeah, he's interviewed by the police after this happens, and 177 00:12:23.679 --> 00:12:30.200 he denies any part in that, completely denies it. And 178 00:12:30.759 --> 00:12:34.799 he lived near the Lavonia Police department and it was 179 00:12:35.639 --> 00:12:39.279 short like within a day. He showed back up at 180 00:12:39.279 --> 00:12:42.879 the Livonia Police Department by himself, and he went in 181 00:12:43.480 --> 00:12:47.600 and he confessed to what he'd been accused of, told 182 00:12:47.639 --> 00:12:52.399 him all the details, and basically he was referred because 183 00:12:52.399 --> 00:12:55.399 he was a juvenile at that time, he was referred 184 00:12:55.440 --> 00:13:01.559 to the juvenile court system and ended up receive in probation. 185 00:13:03.159 --> 00:13:06.240 But this was the beginning of a cycle with him, 186 00:13:06.799 --> 00:13:09.799 and it went on and on and on until he 187 00:13:09.919 --> 00:13:18.679 was eventually prosecuted for another kidnapping. And basically he was 188 00:13:18.799 --> 00:13:24.840 charged with a kidnapping attempted murder of another teenage boy. 189 00:13:25.879 --> 00:13:29.120 And when he went through the court system for those 190 00:13:29.240 --> 00:13:33.759 two felony charges, the judge had a very difficult decision, 191 00:13:33.840 --> 00:13:37.360 and the decision was should he send Ron Bailey, who 192 00:13:37.440 --> 00:13:43.200 was now sixteen years old, into the prison system or 193 00:13:44.080 --> 00:13:49.000 should he give him probation and have him receive psychiatric help. 194 00:13:49.720 --> 00:13:54.799 And the judge chose to refer him for psychiatric help 195 00:13:54.879 --> 00:13:56.480 and put him on five years probation. 196 00:13:58.399 --> 00:14:01.919 As a result, you said that he goes to the 197 00:14:01.960 --> 00:14:07.879 Hawthorne Center, the psychiatric for some term of treatment. Tell 198 00:14:07.960 --> 00:14:10.440 us what happens at that Hawthorne Center and tell us 199 00:14:10.480 --> 00:14:12.120 about the Hawthorne Center itself. 200 00:14:13.080 --> 00:14:17.639 Well, the Hawthorne Center was a psychiatric hospital for youth 201 00:14:18.480 --> 00:14:25.279 adults were in a nearby regional psychiatric hospital in Northville, 202 00:14:25.480 --> 00:14:28.840 and on the same grounds was the Hawthorn Center, which 203 00:14:28.919 --> 00:14:33.840 was for young adults and children, and that's where Ron 204 00:14:33.919 --> 00:14:38.120 Bailey went first. It was at the Hawthorn Center when 205 00:14:38.240 --> 00:14:43.360 Ron Bailey was first introduced to his new psychiatrist, a 206 00:14:43.360 --> 00:14:47.240 doctor by the name of Jose Tombo, and. 207 00:14:49.039 --> 00:14:50.559 Tombo took a liking to. 208 00:14:50.600 --> 00:14:56.000 Ron Bailey because of his sexuality. 209 00:14:55.840 --> 00:14:57.679 And although. 210 00:14:58.720 --> 00:15:03.759 Later there were accusations that doctor Tombo had forced Ron 211 00:15:03.799 --> 00:15:08.320 Bailey into some sort of a sexual relationship, doctor Tombo 212 00:15:09.639 --> 00:15:14.639 did not actually do that until Ron Bailey was moved 213 00:15:14.679 --> 00:15:18.639 from the Hawthorn Center over to the Northfield Regional Psychiatric 214 00:15:18.759 --> 00:15:25.480 Hospital as an adult, and that's when the alleged advances 215 00:15:25.639 --> 00:15:27.360 from doctor Tombo began. 216 00:15:29.519 --> 00:15:33.159 Another important character he meets that the Hawthorne Center Ron 217 00:15:33.200 --> 00:15:36.559 Bailey is a person named Deb Chesney, and she'll be 218 00:15:36.639 --> 00:15:39.039 important in his story a little bit later. 219 00:15:40.320 --> 00:15:44.159 Absolutely, Deb Chesney was a friend of Ron. They were 220 00:15:44.200 --> 00:15:48.720 about the same age, and they were both at the 221 00:15:48.759 --> 00:15:55.440 Hawthorne Center together and basically Ron was struggling with his sexuality. 222 00:15:55.559 --> 00:15:58.360 He didn't know if he was gay or if he 223 00:15:58.440 --> 00:16:02.600 was a heterosexual. And so he and Deb became very 224 00:16:02.639 --> 00:16:06.200 good friends and eventually dated one another for a short 225 00:16:06.240 --> 00:16:06.960 period of time. 226 00:16:09.360 --> 00:16:14.080 What was the diagnosis the initial diagnosis of Ron Bailey 227 00:16:14.200 --> 00:16:15.480 at that Hawthorn Center. 228 00:16:17.039 --> 00:16:20.759 That's a great question. I don't know specifically what the 229 00:16:21.799 --> 00:16:28.200 diagnosis was. There were arguments in court that he suffered 230 00:16:28.799 --> 00:16:35.799 from schizophrenia and a split personality, but he eventually was 231 00:16:35.879 --> 00:16:41.240 able to leave both the Hawthorn Center and the Northville 232 00:16:41.240 --> 00:16:46.879 Regional Psychiatric Hospital. While he was at Northville, he was 233 00:16:46.960 --> 00:16:54.759 allowed to leave there randomly, almost to go work at 234 00:16:54.759 --> 00:16:58.840 a job, to go visit his family on the weekends, 235 00:16:59.240 --> 00:17:03.960 things like that. That was not common knowledge to the 236 00:17:03.960 --> 00:17:09.960 police investigators at the time, but doctor Tombo felt that 237 00:17:10.480 --> 00:17:16.680 Ron Bailey was well enough to be able to go 238 00:17:17.079 --> 00:17:20.119 to leave the hospital grounds, to go to work, and 239 00:17:20.240 --> 00:17:22.359 to go visit his family. As a matter of fact, 240 00:17:22.519 --> 00:17:24.920 he what's the term I'm looking for? 241 00:17:25.160 --> 00:17:27.799 He was an advocate for Ron in being able to 242 00:17:27.880 --> 00:17:28.319 do that. 243 00:17:28.960 --> 00:17:33.559 One of the diagnosis for Ron was that he suffered 244 00:17:33.559 --> 00:17:34.400 from pedophilia. 245 00:17:34.839 --> 00:17:35.799 He was a pedophile. 246 00:17:36.000 --> 00:17:39.440 Sure, let's use this as an opportunity to stop to 247 00:17:39.480 --> 00:17:44.640 hear these messages you also talk about have to be 248 00:17:44.680 --> 00:17:48.119 a contributor to all of this. He moves in with 249 00:17:48.200 --> 00:17:52.680 a person named George Soper, and George Soper is a 250 00:17:52.720 --> 00:17:56.240 manager of a business, and so he actually is able 251 00:17:56.279 --> 00:18:01.000 to have Ron Bailey employed. Well, tell us a little 252 00:18:01.000 --> 00:18:02.759 bit about this George Soper. 253 00:18:04.079 --> 00:18:07.200 George Soper was he was a neighbor to Ron at 254 00:18:07.200 --> 00:18:12.960 one point and when Ron, George Soper was going to 255 00:18:13.000 --> 00:18:16.880 move to Florida. Is how that all transpired? And Ron 256 00:18:16.920 --> 00:18:20.960 Bailey wanted to move to Florida too. Ron Bailey had 257 00:18:21.039 --> 00:18:29.400 been accused in several incidents of kidnapping young boys over 258 00:18:29.480 --> 00:18:33.480 the years, and he said he told his dad that 259 00:18:33.519 --> 00:18:36.400 he wanted to get a new start and that his neighbor, 260 00:18:36.440 --> 00:18:40.359 George Soper, was moving to Florida and he could move 261 00:18:40.400 --> 00:18:43.920 to Florida, start a whole new life and move in 262 00:18:44.000 --> 00:18:48.799 with George Soper down there. And so Ron Bailey made 263 00:18:49.359 --> 00:18:54.119 arrangements with his probation officer here in Michigan to continue 264 00:18:54.119 --> 00:18:56.559 his probation in Florida. He still had another year or 265 00:18:56.599 --> 00:19:00.279 two on probation, and it was as simple as as 266 00:19:00.880 --> 00:19:03.599 going down there, getting set up with a probation officer 267 00:19:03.640 --> 00:19:07.400 down there so they could supervise his activities. And so 268 00:19:07.519 --> 00:19:12.279 Ron Bailey went down to Florida with George Soper, moved 269 00:19:12.319 --> 00:19:17.200 into a trailer park south of Okala, actually in Bellevue, Florida. 270 00:19:17.880 --> 00:19:21.960 And he initially had a job as a i think 271 00:19:22.160 --> 00:19:27.200 installing alarms, and he lost that job. And George Soper 272 00:19:27.400 --> 00:19:31.599 was working for a tire dealership, was manager there and 273 00:19:31.880 --> 00:19:35.680 got Ron Bailey a job there delivering tires. 274 00:19:37.960 --> 00:19:41.079 And what was his criminal activity in Florida. 275 00:19:42.680 --> 00:19:46.799 His criminal activity in Florida was basically a new hunting 276 00:19:46.839 --> 00:19:51.640 ground for him. He began doing exactly what he was 277 00:19:51.680 --> 00:19:56.759 doing in Michigan and eventually admitted that that he couldn't 278 00:19:56.759 --> 00:20:00.839 help himself. He would pick up young boy, ply him 279 00:20:00.839 --> 00:20:08.519 with alcohol, molest them, and release them. There is some 280 00:20:08.559 --> 00:20:14.400 suspicion that maybe there is a few unsolved murders down 281 00:20:14.400 --> 00:20:19.519 there that he could be responsible for, and. 282 00:20:19.480 --> 00:20:24.079 So the police are looking for him. There's composite drawings 283 00:20:24.160 --> 00:20:27.400 from these assaults where these people are let go, but 284 00:20:27.519 --> 00:20:30.519 they report to police. But then you take us to 285 00:20:31.720 --> 00:20:38.240 Marie Edenstrom and her son Kenny Myers, tell us about 286 00:20:38.240 --> 00:20:41.319 the circumstances that they are in the area. They just 287 00:20:41.920 --> 00:20:44.960 moved from Warren a couple of weeks before. 288 00:20:45.519 --> 00:20:50.200 They did back back in Michigan. Ron Bailey first got 289 00:20:50.240 --> 00:20:56.039 into trouble in Florida for contributing to the delinquency of minors, 290 00:20:56.559 --> 00:21:00.559 and so he fled Florida when he learned that there 291 00:21:00.680 --> 00:21:04.519 was likely going to be charges filed against him. There 292 00:21:04.559 --> 00:21:07.519 actually were charges filed against him, and he fled Florida. 293 00:21:08.119 --> 00:21:14.279 Came back to Michigan in about nineteen eighty three, and 294 00:21:15.480 --> 00:21:21.680 Marie Edenstrom lived in Ferndale, Michigan, and she lived with 295 00:21:21.720 --> 00:21:27.000 her husband and her son, Kenny Myers. And Kenny Myers 296 00:21:27.200 --> 00:21:32.359 was I believe he was fourteen years old, and Kenny 297 00:21:32.400 --> 00:21:34.720 Myers wanted to go out and find. 298 00:21:34.519 --> 00:21:36.200 A job as a young boy. 299 00:21:37.119 --> 00:21:41.039 And he told his mother one night, he said, I'm 300 00:21:41.079 --> 00:21:42.519 going to go out and I'm going to come back 301 00:21:42.559 --> 00:21:44.480 home later and I'll have a job. He was going 302 00:21:44.519 --> 00:21:49.440 to go look at the party stores along Woodward Avenue 303 00:21:49.599 --> 00:21:53.079 nine mile area down in the Detroit area near Ferndale. 304 00:21:53.519 --> 00:21:55.960 And so he left on his bike at about seven 305 00:21:56.000 --> 00:21:59.079 o'clock at night, and it was the last time Missus 306 00:21:59.200 --> 00:22:02.519 Edenstrom ever saw him. He never came back that night. 307 00:22:03.400 --> 00:22:07.039 They went out looking for him. Sadly, they couldn't find him, 308 00:22:07.279 --> 00:22:10.000 so they went and reported him missing to the Ferndale police. 309 00:22:10.359 --> 00:22:11.759 This was in nineteen eighty four. 310 00:22:13.160 --> 00:22:15.640 It was the I believe it was the following day 311 00:22:15.720 --> 00:22:20.559 when his body was discovered about twenty miles away from 312 00:22:20.640 --> 00:22:25.039 Ferndale in a place called Heinz Park, down in a 313 00:22:25.119 --> 00:22:30.720 Detroit suburb of Westland. Kenny had been strangled with a 314 00:22:30.799 --> 00:22:32.680 belt and sexually assaulted. 315 00:22:35.400 --> 00:22:38.680 Very interesting too, you say that there was a woman 316 00:22:39.079 --> 00:22:42.839 very crucial to this story, Dolly May Banks. She sees 317 00:22:42.920 --> 00:22:45.960 something a couple of days before, but then once this 318 00:22:46.279 --> 00:22:49.960 becomes in the media and this news story reported, she 319 00:22:50.160 --> 00:22:53.400 remembers what she saw and notifies police. Tell us about 320 00:22:53.519 --> 00:22:56.799 Dolly May Banks and what she saw and what she reported. 321 00:22:57.680 --> 00:23:01.319 Well, Dowley was just a woman who lived along I 322 00:23:01.400 --> 00:23:02.559 think it was nine mile Road. 323 00:23:04.119 --> 00:23:08.160 She was sitting on her porch or she was. 324 00:23:08.440 --> 00:23:11.039 She liked to watch traffic through her front window. And 325 00:23:11.240 --> 00:23:13.759 she was sitting in her living room looking at traffic 326 00:23:13.799 --> 00:23:17.000 going by, and she noticed a young boy on a 327 00:23:17.079 --> 00:23:21.440 bicycle riding along, riding along the street on the opposite side, 328 00:23:21.960 --> 00:23:24.920 and she noticed the brown station wagon pull up and stop. 329 00:23:26.160 --> 00:23:30.200 And then the driver that station wagon put it in 330 00:23:30.319 --> 00:23:35.279 reverse and backed across a lane of traffic into a 331 00:23:35.400 --> 00:23:42.680 parking lot and blocked the young teenage boy from advancing, 332 00:23:42.759 --> 00:23:45.720 if you will, and he jumped out and he grabbed 333 00:23:45.759 --> 00:23:48.759 the boy, dragged him off his bike, put him in 334 00:23:48.839 --> 00:23:54.799 the station wagon, and fled with him. Missus Banks, who's 335 00:23:54.920 --> 00:23:59.279 watching this, thinks at first, oh my gosh, did I 336 00:23:59.440 --> 00:24:04.039 just witness kidnapping? And then she convinced herself that it 337 00:24:04.160 --> 00:24:10.079 was probably just a father disciplining his son. And it 338 00:24:10.359 --> 00:24:15.000 was later that night or the next day when she 339 00:24:15.119 --> 00:24:20.880 saw the news reports of Kenny Meyer's missing and she realized, 340 00:24:21.039 --> 00:24:25.160 oh my gosh, that's what I saw. She had witnessed 341 00:24:25.160 --> 00:24:25.799 the kidnapping. 342 00:24:29.160 --> 00:24:33.160 Ron Bailey realizes that maybe somebody spotted his station wagon. 343 00:24:33.759 --> 00:24:36.920 And so what does he do as a result regarding 344 00:24:37.000 --> 00:24:38.240 that station wagon. 345 00:24:38.920 --> 00:24:43.119 Well, he sold it. About it I think it was 346 00:24:43.160 --> 00:24:46.599 six or seven months later he sold that station wagon. Well, 347 00:24:46.640 --> 00:24:49.000 first he drove it back and forth to work every day, 348 00:24:49.559 --> 00:24:54.079 and after the news of Kenny Meyer's abduction hit the media, 349 00:24:54.759 --> 00:24:58.920 he parked that station wagon in the weeds at his 350 00:24:59.279 --> 00:25:02.200 employer and he left it there and he would get 351 00:25:02.279 --> 00:25:04.400 friends to pick him up and take him to work 352 00:25:04.480 --> 00:25:08.400 every day, or he'd walk to work or hitchhike because 353 00:25:08.440 --> 00:25:11.880 he was afraid that someone would eventually spot that station 354 00:25:12.039 --> 00:25:15.839 wagon and make the connection to Kenny Myers abduction. And 355 00:25:16.119 --> 00:25:20.119 so finally his boss said, you know, get it off 356 00:25:20.200 --> 00:25:23.880 our property. His boss and his coworkers had never made 357 00:25:23.960 --> 00:25:29.279 the connection to the Kenny Myers abduction. So Bailey took 358 00:25:29.319 --> 00:25:32.359 it off the property there and he ended up selling 359 00:25:32.400 --> 00:25:37.759 it and he bought a nineteen eighty five Jeep Renegade, 360 00:25:38.519 --> 00:25:42.480 brand new, right off the lot, and that was his 361 00:25:42.640 --> 00:25:45.640 new vehicle that he had switched to. 362 00:25:47.839 --> 00:25:50.839 You're right that he was close with his parents, or 363 00:25:50.839 --> 00:25:53.720 at least his parents thought they were close with Ron Bailey, 364 00:25:54.359 --> 00:25:56.960 but he surprises them when he shows up in Michigan 365 00:25:57.079 --> 00:25:58.759 because they thought he was still in Florida. 366 00:26:00.519 --> 00:26:03.759 He yeah, As a matter of fact, in the Kenny 367 00:26:03.839 --> 00:26:09.400 Myers abduction, they thought the police thought, well, Ron Bailey 368 00:26:09.400 --> 00:26:13.720 would be a great suspect, except he's in Florida, right, 369 00:26:13.920 --> 00:26:17.160 So they never even considered him as a suspect, and 370 00:26:17.559 --> 00:26:20.960 so they thought he was in Florida. When Ron Bailey 371 00:26:21.039 --> 00:26:25.039 moved back to Michigan, his parents. He never even went 372 00:26:25.119 --> 00:26:28.920 and saw his parents until Christmas of nineteen eighty three 373 00:26:29.680 --> 00:26:33.480 or nineteen eighty four, and it was at that time 374 00:26:33.559 --> 00:26:37.599 they realized, oh, oh my gosh, he's back here. So yeah, 375 00:26:37.680 --> 00:26:40.119 nobody knew that Ron Bailey had come back to Michigan. 376 00:26:42.440 --> 00:26:45.160 You say that it's some kind of odd behavior. He 377 00:26:45.599 --> 00:26:50.680 decided to buy a pleasure boat through financing, and also 378 00:26:50.839 --> 00:26:54.319 that he surprised relatives like his cousin and said that 379 00:26:54.400 --> 00:26:57.240 he was just heading up north and he'd brought some 380 00:26:57.440 --> 00:27:01.079 guns along for some target practice, and one of these 381 00:27:01.119 --> 00:27:03.119 people that asked to see the guns. It was a 382 00:27:03.200 --> 00:27:07.000 twenty two rifle and a twelve gage shotgun. And he 383 00:27:07.079 --> 00:27:09.359 also had a couple of gym bags in a wooden box, 384 00:27:09.599 --> 00:27:12.319 and that relative asked him what was in the box. 385 00:27:13.680 --> 00:27:15.559 Yeah, ammunition was in the box. 386 00:27:15.799 --> 00:27:19.480 And this was in This was now nineteen eighty five, 387 00:27:20.319 --> 00:27:24.160 this would have been Labor Day weekend. Ron Bailey shows 388 00:27:24.240 --> 00:27:29.440 up in a small town called Fowlerville, actually outside Fowlerville, Michigan, 389 00:27:29.720 --> 00:27:33.240 where his cousins lived, and just on a whim, he 390 00:27:33.799 --> 00:27:37.160 pulls in to visit them and he says, yeah, I'm 391 00:27:37.240 --> 00:27:40.279 going up north for the weekend. Tries to see if 392 00:27:40.400 --> 00:27:45.279 his teenage cousin can go, but the dad says no 393 00:27:45.559 --> 00:27:48.799 because he's been he's got some other stuff to do. 394 00:27:49.480 --> 00:27:52.839 And so Ron Bailey he shows off his gun and 395 00:27:53.359 --> 00:27:55.400 the guns that he's got, and he shows off the 396 00:27:55.480 --> 00:27:59.039 new jeep and basically he's only there for a couple hours. 397 00:27:59.400 --> 00:28:02.039 He drinks a couple of beers with his cousin and 398 00:28:02.200 --> 00:28:06.000 he leaves. At that point, those people were instrumental witnesses 399 00:28:06.319 --> 00:28:09.960 in his trial to show that he was in the 400 00:28:10.160 --> 00:28:14.480 area Fowlerville is very near within seven or eight miles 401 00:28:14.559 --> 00:28:18.680