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Speaker 1: Where do the movies that we love come.

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Speaker 2: From as you wish?

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Speaker 1: Do they come from some magical place that we ordinary

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folks can only dream of? Are they made by people

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of genius that we can never.

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Speaker 3: Understand, oh, captain, my captain?

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Speaker 1: Or do they come from people just like me and you?

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I'm Batman, a family man or woman who goes to

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the nine to five job every day, but is secretly

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an undercover artist, an undercover artist whose secret identity is

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crying out to be revealed. Three years ago, two regular

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guys began working on a script of a movie that

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they hoped would be something original and something they could

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produce on their own work. With virtually no resources at

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their disposal, they were in a difficult position, but with

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the termination and a steadfast dedication to their goal, they

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made their dream of reality.

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Speaker 2: Look at all those teens.

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Speaker 1: Mike Morgan and Darren Doyle, who are together known as

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the Nuevo Brothers, released this film in May of this year.

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Jason and I were fortunate enough to come across it

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just after its release, and we are honored to have

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them as guests on our show.

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Speaker 3: And you know, this might be our only time ever

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to be able to do this, That's what happens.

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Speaker 2: He's had can or kill each other over cans.

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Speaker 3: There's something very cinematic about a bicycle man.

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Speaker 2: Eighty percent of your film is done in the casting

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and to a point.

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Speaker 3: Where we were writing scripts with I guess this idea

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that you know someone was going to come with a

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wand and make it happen for us.

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Speaker 2: If you almost fell into the lake.

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Speaker 3: At least we spend a lot of time trying to

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find people that would help us get stuff off the ground,

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and ultimately speaking, you just need to go out and

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just do it yourself.

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Speaker 2: Got to be a self starter. You got to do

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it by yourself. Just make crappy little five minute videos.

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Do something. Because Delvalry is a coming tans question. We

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made a conscious decision. We said we're not going to

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write anything else. We're not going to make this is it.

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Speaker 3: If we had settled and with it, we probably wouldn't

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be having this conversation.

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Speaker 2: Out three fourths into the movie. We hit a wall.

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Speaker 1: Since that time, they have earned the following awards. Finalist

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of the twenty twenty Hollywood First Time Filmmaker Showcase, winner

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of the scream at Off Screen twenty twenty and winner

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of the Creation International Film Festival for Best Comedy Short,

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Best Editing and Judge's Choice. We hope you enjoy the

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special edition of the Surely You Can't Serious Podcast?

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Speaker 3: My God.

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Speaker 1: Chairs all right, welcome everybody. We're here for the Surely

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you Can't Be Serious Podcast. Today is a special edition.

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We have two gentlemen with us today. Typically what we

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do is we go and look at movies from our past.

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We look at movies from the eighties or the nineties,

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music from the eighties or the nineties. We've had posts

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on Facebook that you know, what would you think about

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this movie being remade or that movie being remade, and

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almost everyone says, you know what, Hollywood needs to do

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something original. Well, we're with a couple of guys today

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that did something original, and they did it on a

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budget of next to nothing, and we are super excited

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that they are here. They have put together a short

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film that involves greed, murder, and the poverty stricken and

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surrounds that with ideas of God and the Chosen and

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wraps it all in the story of the Goose that

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laid the Golden Egg. And it's just it's a masterpiece,

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especially considering that these guys put this together for only

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two thousand dollars. I was blown away when you guys

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told me how much that costs to make. So we

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are here with our special guests, the creators of the

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movie Canners, Darren Doyle and Mike borgan A doing good.

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How are you guys doing?

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Speaker 3: Thanks for having us.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, we love having you here. First, let's go back

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and tell us how you guys met.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, we met in New Wavo playing hockey. That's where

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we formed our friendship. That's where we came up with

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the name for ourselves in the way of our brothers.

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Speaker 2: Well, not only does it that's where we met, but

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it also means new and novel.

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Speaker 3: But that was kind of cool.

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Speaker 1: I'm really impressed you've taken an old idea and made

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something very new and very unique about it, and I

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think it's fantastic. Mike, you have a video company, correct.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I own feedb Media, which basically relance from a

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wedding days ago, and you know, corporate and anything in between. Event,

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the talk, videography, okay, international pizza expo, that stuff.

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Speaker 1: And Darren, what about you, what's your nine to five?

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Speaker 3: I worked for a wholesale alarm monitoring company pays the bills.

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Speaker 1: Right, yeah, So do you guys all right? Do you

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have families? Are you married, kids, anything like that.

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Speaker 2: I've got a long long term girlfriend. Uh yeah, Karen's

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got a long term girlfriend as well.

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Speaker 3: Mike's my long term girlfriend.

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Speaker 1: It's funny because when I call it, when I'm talking

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to Jason on the phone, my wife will come in

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and she's like, are you talking to your girlfriend? And

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I'm like, yeah, yeah.

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Speaker 3: My girlfriend says the same thing tongue in cheek, of course,

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because I feel I could do better to Mike.

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Speaker 2: And I'm settling as well. So so what's.

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Speaker 4: The ultimate goal for you guys? Do you guys want

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to be big time Hollywood directors and that type of thing?

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Speaker 3: It sounds so shallow. Uh yeah, you know, I'd look

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to have the ability to be able to tell stories

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the stories I want to tell with the people I

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want to tell the stories with. That would be ideal.

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Speaker 2: We don't necessarily care about Hollywood and the insular industry itself.

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That really hard to get into it and you know,

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break in and make the right friends and all that.

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I don't know if you guys ever saw the Mark

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Duplas interview called The Cavalry Isn't Coming. He made a

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really poignant speech at south By Southwest talking about got

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to be a self starter, You got to do it

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by yourself. Just make crappy little five minute videos. Do

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something because Delvalry isn't coming. And it shows the evolution

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of his steps of how they made short films and

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they got into film festivals one with this crappy thing,

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and then boom, next thing, you know, he's working with

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Jason Siegel and getting big budget, you know, and now

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he has a show. He did a league on effects

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and he does a show called Room one oh four.

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I believe it's called on HBO. So find his way

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up as an outsider. So that's kind of our goal.

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And with the way COVID's going, and it's kind of

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leveraging power of the creators because there's not even a

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movie theater to show you're exhibit anyway. So if people

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are willing to put in the elbow grease and they're

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willing to sacrifice their time and effort, they actually could

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make something really cool.

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Speaker 1: Before I knew what you guys had done, I had

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talked to my my oldest boy is like me. He's

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an actor and into those kind of things. And I

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said to him, you know, like things are different now,

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like every every human being walks around with a video

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camera in their hand, and you can put your movies

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out to the public, like to the entire world through YouTube,

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like you guys have done, and who knows what can happen.

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There are people out there who are making really just

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trash who watchers and listeners are just listening to. And

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so if you're able to put together something quality, it's

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not as restrictive as it used to be back when

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we were kids, back when you had to break into

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Hollywood to make a name for yourself.

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Speaker 2: The big keepers are being slowly kicked out, you know.

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It's the powers being leveraged greater. But people at the

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same time a very short attention span. So it's really

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tough to get somebody to sit down for more than

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three minutes and be actually, as you say, have something

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original and I'm kind of worthy and get what two

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hundred thousand views on TikTok if you're cute, you know,

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or something. But breaking in is really hard and getting

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people to care and take the time from our experience.

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If people actually sit down and take the time. Actually,

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either they love it or they don't care. There's no

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really in the middle of our movie so far.

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Speaker 1: Right, well, we're our listenership is going to be mostly guys,

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mostly guys number one, but guys who are who are

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in our age range, who are not I mean, we're

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not watching TikTok videos. We're We're looking for something that's

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more substantial. And to have somebody out there who is

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trying to do it on their own is really exciting.

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I love the idea of original work. I need to

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at this point encourage those other undercover artists that are

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out there. These guys have done it and they've made

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something really high quality. Number one, go look at what

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they've done. And number two, go do it yourself, you know,

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go make something awesome, because the only restriction is the

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restriction that you're putting on yourself.

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Speaker 3: At this point, absolutely I agree.

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Speaker 4: Why don't you, guys, if you don't mind, describe for

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those who haven't seen your video, you know what it is,

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what you've done, what you were attempting to do, and

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just kind of tell us a little bit.

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Speaker 3: About it, what we attempted to do. And I think

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what we accomplished was to try and make a film

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with in the restraints that were put in front of us.

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We had no permits. So this whole film was shot

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guerrilla style filmmaking. We shot it mostly in Long Beach

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and it was a blessing in a sense that the

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police department, a few times we rubbed up against them,

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they really had no problem with us doing what we

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were doing. And getting back to your original point in

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that in dis day and age, everybody's going around with

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cameras and stuff like that. We were using a DSLR

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camera and it's not conspicuous, and we weren't very conspicuous.

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Everybody who saw us thought we were making a documentary. Yeah,

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so right away we and this was like on the

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first day, our first interactions with people, they thought right away,

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immediately we were making a documentary, I guess. And that proved,

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you know, proof of concept that you know, it was

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believable that Joe was a believable homeless person of that.

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Speaker 2: To make up in the.

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Speaker 3: Right So there was authenticity there. So we were very

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happy with that right away. But getting back to your

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point in regards to what we were trying to do here,

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we were trying to make a film to kind of

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highlight all of our influences, which is every filmmaker's first

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film is usually a hodgepodge of their influences, and a

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lot of it was you know, self gratification too, and

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you know, this might be our only time ever to

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be able to do this. This is a moment in

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time that's very special, and we wanted to capture the

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shots we wanted to capture. You know, could counter has

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been told in five minutes, maybe, but I don't think

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it would have been effective as effective as telling a

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really true, fleshed out kind of classic storytelling, like we

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we drew upon ASoP we drew upon the Bible, Like

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the first time we were throwing around these characters of

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Cowboy and Joe, we kind of just applied like canaan

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abel as a canaan Abeles story. You know, one seems

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to be doing better than the other, and one is

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jealous of the other because not necessarily because one is,

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you know, better than the other, is just one is

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just going about it more clever, more genuine, more resourceful

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than the other, you know, and as a result you

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have resentment schusm occurs. But a lot of this story

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was kind of created, was engineered in such a way

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of being able to just being able to execute what

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was on paper to film.

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Speaker 2: You know, taylored the story to what we had access to.

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We had access to friends that could help. We had

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his brother and brother Pat that played Inventor, and he

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was he wasn't doing that. He was running security or

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surly wrangling the dog. I mean, he had many, many jobs.

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And all the costumes could be bought and purchased made cheaply.

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Go to your thrift store. You can buy all that

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stuff dirt cheap. And then we distressed it at home,

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got everything ourselves. Back yard became the studio.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, just on those ideas, and I want to

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I really want to encourage all of our listeners to

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go to go have a look at this. The first

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time that I watched this movie, I just kind of

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was like soaking in the quality of the shots, the

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quality of the acting, the quality of the script, the

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quality of the soundtrack. And it was upon the second

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viewing that I went, oh, my gosh, they've really got

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some deep layers here, and you've got your inventor that

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was played by your brother, who to me is kind

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of the deity character who has he's hanging out next

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to Cowboy, who is the one who is found favor

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with God, and so he's that's why God's next to him.

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And then and then Joe, your protagonist in this thing,

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scoffs at the notion that he's the inventor of the Internet.

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He scoffs at God. And that's that kind of falls

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into that whole canaanable of you know, Cowboy is just

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loving life and living it up and has found favor

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with God, whereas Joe, who keeps beating his head against

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the wall, is alone and struggling against the world pouring

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down upon him. And I just was like, add, gum,

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this is really solid stuff. To write a good story

255
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is hard enough. But to write a good story that

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throws back to biblical concepts, to fables of the past,

257
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all of those great conversation ideas is really something impressive.

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And I'm a good job. How about that. I'm just

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going to say, a good job, well done, well done.

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Speaker 3: Wow, James. I wish I could like cheap you around man,

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like pull you out anytime I feel bad. I really

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appreciate that, James. And you know, this was three years

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of a lot of hard work, and we were definitely

264
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drawing upon all of our influences and we wanted to

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make something that was meaty and had layers. We love

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the Simpsons and depending on your how sophisticated your palette

267
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is in regards to different things depends on how far

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in on the joke you get, you know, if you

269
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if you can like you know, get the references and

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stuff like that. So, you know, we set out to

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make a film to highlight all of these different elements

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and layers. But like everything, how you know, how the audience,

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how the individual views it. It's subjective, you know, and

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it's not wrong. It's how you view it. It's how

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it's how you connect the dots. And that's great that

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you know. You saw that in those few opening scenes,

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you know, in the interaction between you know, Patrick and

278
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my brother and by the way, that's my brother Patrick,

279
00:14:59,080 --> 00:15:03,000
who played the invent with Poogy the dog, Yeah, the

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dog who was a pleasure to work with.

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Speaker 2: The funny thing is like on top of the allegory

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to the Bible, you know, I saw it as also

283
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the other layer is it's a microcosm of what's going

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on around the water cooler. You know, this is their world.

285
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This is you know, the streets of their water cooler,

286
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and they have they all have their friends, they all

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have their politics, they all have their kinship. And basically

288
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Joe is kind of out of his luck. You know,

289
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he hasn't really figured things out, doesn't have the personality

290
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to get things done. And cowboys are very affable, smart,

291
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work smart, not hard kind of guy. And uh, you

292
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know all runs of business in life, you're gonna have

293
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winners and you're gonna have losers. So that's kind of

294
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the way I saw it too.

295
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Speaker 1: And just to just to kind of lay it, lay

296
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the foundation a little bit here that the idea of

297
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Cannon is, this is based on something. This is a

298
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real group of people that exist out in the world.

299
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Back in the early eighties, they started having deposits on

300
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cans and bottles so that if you return to those

301
00:16:12,159 --> 00:16:15,039
things you got cash back. Well, most folks didn't care

302
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enough to do that, and so those trash, that trash

303
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got thrown out. And what would happen is these canners

304
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would come in, they'd take other people's trash and they

305
00:16:25,919 --> 00:16:28,799
would turn it into there to cash for themselves. And

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there's there there are human beings who live in New

307
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York City, which has the highest cost of living in

308
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the country, who live on being a cannery. They I mean,

309
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they go and get it and get paid for it

310
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as they go. And it's it's a fascinating thing that

311
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even though this might be a class of society that

312
00:16:49,600 --> 00:16:54,200
everyone else looks down upon, they're really doing the They're

313
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involved in the exact same struggle that all of us

314
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are involved in. Whether you're middle class or high class.

315
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It's all about whether fortune shines upon you or not

316
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and what you're willing to do to protect your livelihood.

317
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Speaker 2: And that really exists, especially here in California too. We

318
00:17:15,200 --> 00:17:19,319
met several camp like when we shot at the recycling

319
00:17:19,359 --> 00:17:22,440
center that those were not actors. That was real people,

320
00:17:22,519 --> 00:17:25,519
real camp Those are real canners, And by the grace

321
00:17:25,559 --> 00:17:28,640
of God, we were able to shoot there without any problems.

322
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Everybody was cool. They didn't look into the camera, they

323
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didn't ruin any shots. They just did their thing. And

324
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you would have thought we set that place up to

325
00:17:36,079 --> 00:17:38,920
look like a Hollywood set with background actors. Now they're

326
00:17:38,960 --> 00:17:42,599
just doing their own thing. And it was from the

327
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accounts of when we got the okay to shoot there

328
00:17:45,200 --> 00:17:48,599
in Wilmington, which is a rough city outside of Long Beach,

329
00:17:48,880 --> 00:17:53,920
real rough. The owner of the facility with telling us that, yeah,

330
00:17:54,079 --> 00:17:56,720
you love the script, and that's that happens. He's had

331
00:17:56,960 --> 00:18:00,920
canners kill each other over cans over you know, bill

332
00:18:01,000 --> 00:18:04,720
deal confrontations. Oh yeah, that's that's happened out here. So,

333
00:18:04,880 --> 00:18:07,000
I mean, this is not some people think, oh, it's

334
00:18:07,000 --> 00:18:10,599
so far fetched. Some people say, oh, they wouldn't. They

335
00:18:10,599 --> 00:18:13,079
don't talk like that, they don't act like that. Well

336
00:18:13,559 --> 00:18:16,359
they do, and it happens, and it's you know, it's

337
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not always pretty, but part of the story. You know,

338
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it's real.

339
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Speaker 1: The Just to touch on kind of the technical side

340
00:18:25,680 --> 00:18:28,319
of things, now that I've gushed over your story abilities

341
00:18:28,319 --> 00:18:32,079
a little bit, you know, you guys, you guys shot

342
00:18:32,079 --> 00:18:36,039
this thing for two thousand dollars, and that you relied

343
00:18:36,119 --> 00:18:39,319
upon people willing to work for you, even though you

344
00:18:39,839 --> 00:18:44,319
have had limited experience as directors of a short film.

345
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That that they're willing to do that for you is

346
00:18:47,039 --> 00:18:51,279
impressive number one. But number two, even with that, just

347
00:18:51,319 --> 00:18:54,319
to give some perspective to our listeners, you shot this

348
00:18:54,359 --> 00:18:58,519
for two thousand dollars in two thousand and twenty eighteen money,

349
00:18:58,559 --> 00:19:03,519
I guess so, so, just for some perspective, Steven Spielberg

350
00:19:03,640 --> 00:19:07,759
his first short film, which is called Amblin. He shot

351
00:19:07,799 --> 00:19:12,920
it for I believe it was fifteen thousand dollars, but

352
00:19:13,119 --> 00:19:16,960
it was nineteen sixty eight fifteen thousand dollars, which is

353
00:19:17,079 --> 00:19:20,440
basically about one hundred and thirty five thousand dollars today.

354
00:19:20,799 --> 00:19:24,759
It is I mean, the notion that you did this

355
00:19:25,000 --> 00:19:31,279
for so little money. Comparatively speaking, I'd much rather go

356
00:19:31,319 --> 00:19:32,799
watch your movie. I've seen Amblin.

357
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Speaker 2: It's kind of experimental.

358
00:19:37,480 --> 00:19:41,200
Speaker 1: It's just not that great. And to draw another to

359
00:19:41,279 --> 00:19:44,480
draw another comparison, you guys have done something with this

360
00:19:44,559 --> 00:19:47,839
that Steven Spielberg did do. He didn't use any dialogue

361
00:19:47,920 --> 00:19:51,640
in his in his movie at all, and in Ambulin

362
00:19:51,759 --> 00:19:54,880
at all, it's another, you know, roughly thirty minute long movie.

363
00:19:54,880 --> 00:19:57,279
You guys have done a thirty minute long movie. And

364
00:19:57,559 --> 00:19:59,559
it seems like a lot of folks who are doing

365
00:19:59,599 --> 00:20:03,640
short film elms these days. There's a term called mumblecore

366
00:20:03,799 --> 00:20:07,799
because there's just it's so heavily packed with dialogue that

367
00:20:08,039 --> 00:20:08,440
a guy in.

368
00:20:08,440 --> 00:20:10,240
Speaker 2: A girl on account talking about the relationship.

369
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Speaker 1: Nobody wants to listen to that, you guys, you guys have,

370
00:20:13,759 --> 00:20:17,720
I can't imagine that the actual you know, script of

371
00:20:18,039 --> 00:20:21,480
Dialogue is more than five to ten pages long. Most

372
00:20:21,559 --> 00:20:23,799
of it had to have been about the shots and

373
00:20:23,839 --> 00:20:28,319
the story because there's just not that much conversation between

374
00:20:28,359 --> 00:20:33,759
the characters. It's really more of a visual storytelling. And

375
00:20:33,799 --> 00:20:37,079
then of course, just like Ambulin has has a fantastic

376
00:20:37,480 --> 00:20:39,400
backing soundtrack, Well.

377
00:20:39,240 --> 00:20:41,680
Speaker 2: That's probably influenced by the fact that we didn't have

378
00:20:41,720 --> 00:20:44,200
money to afford a real town guy, so kind of

379
00:20:44,279 --> 00:20:47,119
tailored that a little down too. In fact, I was

380
00:20:47,119 --> 00:20:51,079
the only person that got paid. A hired hand was

381
00:20:51,119 --> 00:20:53,400
two hundred bucks a day right thereon two hundred.

382
00:20:53,200 --> 00:21:00,000
Speaker 3: Bucks, Yeah, two hundred bucks three days. For some crucial scene.

383
00:21:00,279 --> 00:21:02,119
We wanted to have a sound guy there so there

384
00:21:02,119 --> 00:21:05,920
would be no mess around. So we had to have

385
00:21:05,960 --> 00:21:08,279
a sound guy, and yeah, that was pretty much the

386
00:21:08,319 --> 00:21:13,400
only person we had to pay on the project. Everybody

387
00:21:13,480 --> 00:21:19,079
else worked solely on the fact that they liked the project,

388
00:21:19,079 --> 00:21:20,160
they wanted to be part of it.

389
00:21:21,720 --> 00:21:24,720
Speaker 1: So you guys have I've seen in descriptions that you

390
00:21:24,799 --> 00:21:28,279
have out of out there of this film that you've

391
00:21:28,279 --> 00:21:31,799
got a twilight zone. If directed by the Cohen Brothers.

392
00:21:32,279 --> 00:21:34,119
You didn't have a desk in this movie, so I

393
00:21:34,279 --> 00:21:36,319
don't know that I would agree. I think every Coen

394
00:21:36,359 --> 00:21:39,200
Brothers movie has a guy behind a desk at some point.

395
00:21:39,240 --> 00:21:41,920
Speaker 2: Cowboys bike that's where he runs his business.

396
00:21:42,079 --> 00:21:44,480
Speaker 1: Oh okay, yeah that makes sense. All right, Yeah, we'll

397
00:21:44,480 --> 00:21:50,079
go with that. So we know that this movie came out.

398
00:21:50,160 --> 00:21:51,839
It was it January that you put it up.

399
00:21:52,240 --> 00:21:54,440
Speaker 2: We officially released it May first.

400
00:21:55,079 --> 00:21:58,119
Speaker 1: And it took you two years from the time that

401
00:21:58,160 --> 00:22:00,359
you started shooting. Is that right correct?

402
00:22:00,400 --> 00:22:04,039
Speaker 3: We work on the script. We started in like September

403
00:22:04,079 --> 00:22:08,160
of twenty seventeen, and it was done by like Christmas

404
00:22:08,200 --> 00:22:12,440
around twenty seventeen, leading it to January twenty eighteen. The

405
00:22:12,440 --> 00:22:14,920
script actually was one of the quickest scripts that came

406
00:22:14,960 --> 00:22:17,960
together for us. We wrote two other scripts before this,

407
00:22:18,200 --> 00:22:20,880
and this one came together. It did come together overnight,

408
00:22:20,920 --> 00:22:23,000
but it came together quick quicker.

409
00:22:23,400 --> 00:22:26,920
Speaker 1: Yeah. So let's back up just a bit before that. Then,

410
00:22:27,480 --> 00:22:30,680
what's the I mean, and it's probably multiple, but what's

411
00:22:30,720 --> 00:22:33,240
the conversation that you have with each other that you

412
00:22:33,319 --> 00:22:36,799
say we need to make this movie. We're, however, many

413
00:22:36,880 --> 00:22:39,240
years old. It's time for us to make this movie.

414
00:22:39,440 --> 00:22:41,519
We need pretty much how do you feel about it?

415
00:22:41,839 --> 00:22:44,960
Speaker 3: To a point where we were writing scripts with I

416
00:22:44,960 --> 00:22:47,759
guess this idea in our heads that you know, someone

417
00:22:47,799 --> 00:22:50,000
was going to come with a wand and make it

418
00:22:50,079 --> 00:22:52,119
happen for us if you wrote a really good script,

419
00:22:52,279 --> 00:22:55,599
it was going to happen, you know, and like everything.

420
00:22:55,720 --> 00:22:57,880
But what made us want us to tell the story,

421
00:22:57,920 --> 00:22:59,640
It was just out of the fact that we were

422
00:22:59,680 --> 00:23:02,200
able to to do it. We were able to execute

423
00:23:02,279 --> 00:23:06,119
an idea versus our other ideas would require a lot

424
00:23:06,160 --> 00:23:07,880
more help, a lot more money to be able to

425
00:23:07,880 --> 00:23:11,160
get it done. So we decided that this was going

426
00:23:11,200 --> 00:23:13,559
to be the story. This was it. Canners was going

427
00:23:13,599 --> 00:23:16,759
to be it because we saw that, Okay, we could

428
00:23:16,839 --> 00:23:19,680
afford everything involved. We can afford the props or we

429
00:23:19,759 --> 00:23:22,319
have them already. We can get it done. It'll still

430
00:23:22,359 --> 00:23:25,480
have a visual flirt because it has bicycles, there's movement.

431
00:23:25,880 --> 00:23:29,519
We'll find great locations and we can make it happen.

432
00:23:30,160 --> 00:23:33,720
Speaker 2: And a lot of people with funny after the fact,

433
00:23:34,039 --> 00:23:37,160
they had written me emails like four paid emails going

434
00:23:37,319 --> 00:23:40,319
man like it's like you saw my life. My mom

435
00:23:40,440 --> 00:23:42,759
was worked at the post office for thirty years and

436
00:23:43,279 --> 00:23:45,240
mail man. I said, hey, man, check out when you're done,

437
00:23:45,279 --> 00:23:47,559
you know, the family friend. And he didn't get back

438
00:23:47,599 --> 00:23:49,480
to me for like three weeks, and then I finally

439
00:23:49,519 --> 00:23:52,359
asked him and he says, I grew up poor. I

440
00:23:52,400 --> 00:23:56,039
grew up collecting cans. There was a cowboy. Somebody got

441
00:23:56,039 --> 00:23:58,799
to jump on my cans. So like this really hit home.

442
00:23:59,519 --> 00:24:03,240
And the same guy that John Rossino, that provided us

443
00:24:03,240 --> 00:24:05,640
the score for the music, which was huge in the

444
00:24:05,680 --> 00:24:08,519
movie Hell State Northridge, where we got the music, we

445
00:24:08,640 --> 00:24:12,559
got planets. What was it Jupiter? He said, When I

446
00:24:12,599 --> 00:24:14,480
grew up in New York, when I heard that sound

447
00:24:14,519 --> 00:24:16,680
of the printer at the scrap metal when I was

448
00:24:16,720 --> 00:24:19,359
a kid, like it brought me back, like I really was.

449
00:24:19,400 --> 00:24:23,839
There certain people, it resonates with stories, you know. Unfortunately

450
00:24:23,920 --> 00:24:26,119
some people have never you know, I haven't had that

451
00:24:26,200 --> 00:24:28,519
heart of a life where I've collected man for a living,

452
00:24:28,920 --> 00:24:31,200
but some people have. Some people like they don't know

453
00:24:31,240 --> 00:24:33,960
that life, so they don't think it's unbelievable. I thought

454
00:24:33,960 --> 00:24:37,400
we'd breathed life into these characters that you actually believe them.

455
00:24:37,519 --> 00:24:38,440
Speaker 3: You don't think they're just.

456
00:24:38,480 --> 00:24:42,079
Speaker 2: Cookie board cutouts. And it's not like we didn't try

457
00:24:42,079 --> 00:24:43,880
to get preachy in the movie. We didn't try to

458
00:24:43,960 --> 00:24:46,359
leave them message after the meat. We just tried to hey,

459
00:24:46,400 --> 00:24:47,920
this is their life, this is who they are, this

460
00:24:48,000 --> 00:24:49,920
is what they deal with. It's got to be watchable.

461
00:24:50,400 --> 00:24:53,359
Speaker 3: It's not a movie if it's not watchable, and if

462
00:24:53,400 --> 00:24:56,319
other people can't enjoy it, who are not like your

463
00:24:56,359 --> 00:24:59,519
mom and your brother, you know, who don't have this

464
00:24:59,599 --> 00:25:02,720
oblig gation to tell you like it's it's good. So

465
00:25:02,960 --> 00:25:06,599
we definitely, you know, we wanted to get out there

466
00:25:06,720 --> 00:25:09,559
and and tell a story, you know, and we weren't

467
00:25:09,599 --> 00:25:11,559
going to wait anymore for people to you.

468
00:25:11,519 --> 00:25:14,200
Speaker 2: Know, getting somebody to read your script. You try to

469
00:25:14,240 --> 00:25:15,039
try to get somebody to.

470
00:25:15,039 --> 00:25:18,119
Speaker 3: Read your script. That was part of this project. Didn't

471
00:25:18,119 --> 00:25:18,960
even read the script.

472
00:25:19,319 --> 00:25:24,680
Speaker 2: So but we made it. To answer your question, we

473
00:25:24,720 --> 00:25:26,599
made a conscious decision. We said, we're not going to

474
00:25:26,640 --> 00:25:29,559
write anything else. We're not going to make this is it.

475
00:25:29,759 --> 00:25:32,279
We're not We've wasted three four years of coming up

476
00:25:32,279 --> 00:25:33,759
with great ideas that are never going to see the

477
00:25:33,799 --> 00:25:36,319
light of day without a budget. So we said, this

478
00:25:36,440 --> 00:25:41,640
is it. Let's make something watchable, entertaining, funny, yet it

479
00:25:41,720 --> 00:25:45,200
has heart and hopefully we can pull it off, and

480
00:25:45,279 --> 00:25:49,359
people trusted our vision. If anything, we have passion, we

481
00:25:49,400 --> 00:25:51,079
know what we want to do, we have a goal.

482
00:25:51,440 --> 00:25:53,200
We're not like figuring it out as we go. We

483
00:25:53,200 --> 00:25:56,599
were very calculated, so people that we reached out for

484
00:25:56,680 --> 00:25:59,720
actors and crew, they got it. They knew that we

485
00:25:59,720 --> 00:26:02,160
weren't just playing around, even though we didn't have a

486
00:26:02,480 --> 00:26:04,920
necessarily track record like you suggested.

487
00:26:05,200 --> 00:26:07,799
Speaker 1: So you've written the script, what's the next step? Did

488
00:26:07,799 --> 00:26:10,480
you storyboard it before you started talking to people or

489
00:26:10,839 --> 00:26:11,839
what happened next?

490
00:26:12,119 --> 00:26:14,480
Speaker 2: After forty two revisions of that script.

491
00:26:16,279 --> 00:26:20,400
Speaker 3: We went out and we started to location scout, and

492
00:26:20,799 --> 00:26:23,640
that's where a lot of the redrafts came in, because

493
00:26:23,680 --> 00:26:28,039
we were fine in better places and we could incorporate

494
00:26:28,119 --> 00:26:31,519
these places and enhance the story and tell more of

495
00:26:31,559 --> 00:26:34,440
a story. But our first step, pretty much after we

496
00:26:34,480 --> 00:26:39,000
wrote the screenplay, was just getting the ducks in a row,

497
00:26:39,119 --> 00:26:41,240
so to speak, of where we're going to shoot. We

498
00:26:41,279 --> 00:26:43,920
wanted to have all of that done before we even

499
00:26:43,960 --> 00:26:48,480
approached actors. So when we cast our actors and we

500
00:26:48,480 --> 00:26:51,680
were on location, we were intimate with the location. We

501
00:26:51,759 --> 00:26:54,519
knew what the light was like during the day, we

502
00:26:54,599 --> 00:26:57,359
knew what the traffic was like we knew if there

503
00:26:57,400 --> 00:26:59,240
was going to be a lot of people hanging around,

504
00:26:59,359 --> 00:27:02,000
We pretty much which knew what the actors were going

505
00:27:02,039 --> 00:27:04,839
to wear. We had our bikes where bikes were already

506
00:27:04,880 --> 00:27:09,519
being designed during the process of us starting to find

507
00:27:09,559 --> 00:27:12,839
out where we were going to hold auditions, and by

508
00:27:12,880 --> 00:27:15,960
the time we got to casting, the ones that were

509
00:27:15,960 --> 00:27:19,480
coming to audition, unfortunately just weren't up to par. So

510
00:27:19,519 --> 00:27:21,920
we really had to rethink what we were going to do.

511
00:27:22,039 --> 00:27:25,319
So we started to reach out to Backstage, which is

512
00:27:25,920 --> 00:27:30,160
an online database of actors and it's pretty cool because

513
00:27:30,960 --> 00:27:33,880
the partitions which actors are SAG on which actors are

514
00:27:33,960 --> 00:27:37,519
non union. Knowing that we couldn't go with SAG actors,

515
00:27:37,559 --> 00:27:40,519
we went with non union actors. We held our first

516
00:27:40,559 --> 00:27:44,400
audition at the Garage Theater in Long Beach and that's

517
00:27:44,480 --> 00:27:48,000
where we uh, we got Cowboy. That's where we first

518
00:27:48,039 --> 00:27:56,599
discovered Burtis Cutler and man, he was Yeah, he just

519
00:27:56,640 --> 00:27:59,039
came in and he just owned that role like he

520
00:27:59,119 --> 00:28:03,519
came in with such energy and such bravado, and he

521
00:28:03,680 --> 00:28:05,400
just owned that role like that.

522
00:28:05,400 --> 00:28:07,200
Speaker 2: He didn't just like in the movie, he didn't know

523
00:28:07,240 --> 00:28:10,200
the line. He was just kind of improvising being vertus,

524
00:28:10,759 --> 00:28:12,720
and we ended up changing some of the script to

525
00:28:12,759 --> 00:28:16,319
accommodate his humor. And his character came in with a

526
00:28:17,079 --> 00:28:21,039
cut and with the patches saying don't we call nine

527
00:28:21,079 --> 00:28:23,480
one one, like I'm coming with the guns. And he's

528
00:28:23,480 --> 00:28:27,079
from Texas. He's a former military vet and he's is

529
00:28:27,119 --> 00:28:31,759
the real deal. He is a groundling background acting. So yeah,

530
00:28:31,759 --> 00:28:33,799
and we we had actors that thought they have this

531
00:28:33,960 --> 00:28:36,079
sewed up for and they're just like, Okay, well I'll

532
00:28:36,119 --> 00:28:38,079
be leaving now because that guy is your cowboy, Like

533
00:28:38,119 --> 00:28:40,160
they just left. It's kind of like.

534
00:28:40,839 --> 00:28:43,359
Speaker 3: The devil laid down the fiddle by his feet.

535
00:28:44,960 --> 00:28:48,880
Speaker 2: This was gonna be a cowboy, you know, he was.

536
00:28:49,039 --> 00:28:52,079
Speaker 3: It's kind of like when you hear when when Slim

537
00:28:52,119 --> 00:28:55,359
Pickin shows up at Doctor Strange left set and everybody

538
00:28:55,440 --> 00:28:57,960
thinks like he's already in costume, but like, no, that's

539
00:28:57,960 --> 00:28:58,759
what he just wears.

540
00:28:58,839 --> 00:28:59,039
Speaker 1: You know.

541
00:29:02,440 --> 00:29:04,920
Speaker 3: He showed up like cowboy. But that's that's just the

542
00:29:04,960 --> 00:29:08,400
way he is. And he's awesome. He's he's he's a

543
00:29:08,400 --> 00:29:11,440
hell of a character and has quite a story, quite

544
00:29:11,480 --> 00:29:17,039
a history. He was wounded in Iraq, he was in

545
00:29:17,039 --> 00:29:21,279
the Navy, and yeah, he's a fighter. He's a fighter.

546
00:29:21,720 --> 00:29:23,759
He's going to bury us all, James.

547
00:29:23,759 --> 00:29:27,240
Speaker 2: To answer your question, we did do storyboards, very rudimentary,

548
00:29:27,480 --> 00:29:30,119
crudely drawn. Didn't really help out much at all because

549
00:29:30,200 --> 00:29:32,319
because of the situations, it was not controlled, so we

550
00:29:32,400 --> 00:29:34,400
kind of had to improvise and call it out as

551
00:29:34,400 --> 00:29:36,640
we saw it on the set on location. So yeah,

552
00:29:36,640 --> 00:29:39,039
we did have storyboards, but you weren't very much he

553
00:29:39,640 --> 00:29:40,240
in reality.

554
00:29:40,720 --> 00:29:43,640
Speaker 1: So you had your you had your script, you had

555
00:29:43,680 --> 00:29:48,039
your not very useful storyboards, you had your locations. Get

556
00:29:48,160 --> 00:29:52,640
back to low budget, yeah, and you had your cowboy.

557
00:29:50,839 --> 00:29:55,880
So far, other than the equipment that you already own,

558
00:29:56,039 --> 00:29:59,319
you're still you're still pretty well operating for free. But

559
00:29:59,799 --> 00:30:03,440
there there was a casting issue with Joe, is that right?

560
00:30:03,839 --> 00:30:08,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, we made the rudimentary mistake of merely insinuating that

561
00:30:08,839 --> 00:30:11,440
one of the theater guys caught the part. He looked apart.

562
00:30:11,839 --> 00:30:14,519
He looked kind of like a well fed whino. He

563
00:30:14,599 --> 00:30:16,519
was he looked like he could be on the streets.

564
00:30:17,079 --> 00:30:20,160
And at that point we reached out to every theater

565
00:30:20,240 --> 00:30:22,519
you could try to, and it was a big waste

566
00:30:22,559 --> 00:30:25,640
of time. They're they're just they're not into it. They're

567
00:30:25,640 --> 00:30:28,440
not up the caliber, and then they're not interested. They're

568
00:30:28,480 --> 00:30:30,680
all into their own hustle. Like the theaters. They weren't

569
00:30:30,759 --> 00:30:33,400
very helpful as far as getting us in the right place.

570
00:30:33,480 --> 00:30:36,960
But we had a guy that'll leave unnamed, but we

571
00:30:37,039 --> 00:30:40,319
had him come in and read opposite like cowboys and

572
00:30:40,359 --> 00:30:45,359
other characters to the script going, and we quickly realized that, Okay,

573
00:30:45,480 --> 00:30:47,480
this is not gonna work. I'm not about to put

574
00:30:47,519 --> 00:30:49,920
two years of work into something that from the outgo

575
00:30:50,000 --> 00:30:52,759
isn't gonna work. Was it Ridley Scott? And eighty percent

576
00:30:52,799 --> 00:30:55,440
of your film is done in the casting by casting

577
00:30:55,440 --> 00:30:57,359
the right people. We had to have a second casting

578
00:30:57,359 --> 00:30:59,599
call for Joe. That's where we meant can't hatch and

579
00:31:00,200 --> 00:31:02,599
he has a look as the chops. He kind of

580
00:31:02,599 --> 00:31:05,559
looks like Jeremy Irons. He's got a lot of credits

581
00:31:05,559 --> 00:31:07,839
on his IMDb and he was legit. He had just

582
00:31:07,880 --> 00:31:10,759
been offered to do like a Charlie Manson movie, and

583
00:31:11,160 --> 00:31:13,799
he asked us questions like how serious are you guys?

584
00:31:13,839 --> 00:31:15,319
Are you going to be able to pull this off?

585
00:31:15,920 --> 00:31:18,720
The last movie we worked on, it was they weren't ready,

586
00:31:18,720 --> 00:31:21,119
they weren't this that whatever. So we had to give

587
00:31:21,160 --> 00:31:24,480
him assurances that we were ready. We didn't work, we

588
00:31:24,480 --> 00:31:26,720
were ready to go to work, and we put him

589
00:31:26,759 --> 00:31:29,799
in Cowboy together on the second rehearsal, and we knew

590
00:31:29,799 --> 00:31:31,759
we were ready to go with our two leads.

591
00:31:31,920 --> 00:31:34,359
Speaker 3: And then we held our second audition at a different

592
00:31:34,400 --> 00:31:37,400
theater in Long Beach, and that's where we got the

593
00:31:37,440 --> 00:31:39,960
rest of our actors that we were going to cast.

594
00:31:40,400 --> 00:31:45,039
Chang was. We had another actor originally to play Chang's role,

595
00:31:45,119 --> 00:31:48,359
and fortunately he decided he wasn't going to be in

596
00:31:48,400 --> 00:31:51,200
the film, and then we had to recast, and that's

597
00:31:51,240 --> 00:31:54,920
where we got Jimmy May to play Chang and stuff too.

598
00:31:55,200 --> 00:31:57,160
Speaker 2: His resume, he's been in like one of the Pirates

599
00:31:57,160 --> 00:31:58,279
of the Caribbean.

600
00:31:57,839 --> 00:32:01,400
Speaker 3: Movies, an actor up. Yeah, he's been in like He's

601
00:32:01,839 --> 00:32:05,839
Lamar Yeah the video one of his music videos and

602
00:32:06,039 --> 00:32:09,160
like always like very like you know, Front and Center

603
00:32:09,400 --> 00:32:11,039
never has any dialogue though.

604
00:32:11,000 --> 00:32:15,559
Speaker 2: He's breaking out to talk. He had rules and uh sunny,

605
00:32:15,839 --> 00:32:19,359
it's always sunny in Philadelphia. He's a crazy gambling Asian guy.

606
00:32:19,400 --> 00:32:22,319
So he's been on TV, he's been on films. He

607
00:32:22,440 --> 00:32:25,240
just never had a chance to have a bigger role.

608
00:32:25,400 --> 00:32:28,599
We also had two other possible Joe's and a little

609
00:32:28,640 --> 00:32:32,079
tips for filmmakers out there. One guy was picking my

610
00:32:32,119 --> 00:32:34,319
brand about all the props that we have on the film.

611
00:32:34,680 --> 00:32:36,960
He said, oh, I got that, I got this. He's

612
00:32:37,000 --> 00:32:40,319
like a long time character actor. He says he lived

613
00:32:40,319 --> 00:32:44,400
out in skid rowe the night before customer. He was great,

614
00:32:44,519 --> 00:32:48,440
he was he was awesome. Yeah, he was one hundred dedicated,

615
00:32:48,759 --> 00:32:51,680
but he had this cheesy be kind of like look

616
00:32:51,720 --> 00:32:54,440
and feel that it just wasn't real. And another guy,

617
00:32:54,519 --> 00:32:57,480
from the first minute he comes in, You guy's got

618
00:32:57,559 --> 00:33:00,759
enough bussfair to get me home, Like yeah, like from

619
00:33:00,759 --> 00:33:03,720
the first ten seconds if they're painting, but then you

620
00:33:03,799 --> 00:33:05,400
know it's going to be a good chance. I'm not

621
00:33:05,440 --> 00:33:07,960
gonna be worth working for thirty days. We got lucky,

622
00:33:08,039 --> 00:33:10,480
We got real lucky with kids, Yeah, everybody.

623
00:33:10,759 --> 00:33:12,680
Speaker 4: So that kind of that leads me to a question,

624
00:33:12,920 --> 00:33:15,160
what did you learn that you can pass on to

625
00:33:15,680 --> 00:33:17,440
other sort of grilla filmmakers.

626
00:33:17,640 --> 00:33:20,359
Speaker 3: You know, through this process, I would have stayed clear

627
00:33:20,440 --> 00:33:23,720
of the actors, cut off the theater altogether to waste

628
00:33:23,720 --> 00:33:26,039
of time. And you know, I have you guys seen

629
00:33:26,079 --> 00:33:30,079
that that documentary about Alejandro Judorowski. Do you guys know

630
00:33:30,119 --> 00:33:32,039
who he is. He was gonna He was the guy

631
00:33:32,119 --> 00:33:36,880
that originally was going to make doune Is the documentary,

632
00:33:37,200 --> 00:33:41,599
a really cool documentary. He was a very experimental Chilean

633
00:33:41,680 --> 00:33:45,920
filmmaker and he made a film called Holy Mountain. But

634
00:33:46,160 --> 00:33:51,200
Judarowski was all about spiritual warriors finding spiritual warriors. You

635
00:33:51,240 --> 00:33:53,680
could spend a lot of what a lot of wasted

636
00:33:53,759 --> 00:33:56,559
time looking for spiritual warriors, like they'll find you. So

637
00:33:56,680 --> 00:33:59,759
to speak, it like it happens, like if you set

638
00:33:59,839 --> 00:34:04,079
your focus, like things happen, like God will make it happen.

639
00:34:04,160 --> 00:34:06,039
You know, if you really want it to happen, like

640
00:34:06,640 --> 00:34:08,880
things will start to happen. We spend a lot of

641
00:34:08,880 --> 00:34:12,920
time trying to win people over and trying to find

642
00:34:12,960 --> 00:34:16,079
people that would help us get stuff off the ground,

643
00:34:16,320 --> 00:34:18,440
and ultimately speaking, you just need to go out and

644
00:34:18,480 --> 00:34:21,039
just do it yourself. That's what I would say, Like

645
00:34:21,559 --> 00:34:25,679
forget about trying to get freebies or trying to get

646
00:34:25,719 --> 00:34:28,800
help from other people, because everybody's got their own hustle.

647
00:34:28,880 --> 00:34:31,559
Everybody's trying to do in their own thing, and rightfully

648
00:34:31,639 --> 00:34:34,760
so I'm not saying there's anything bad about it, but

649
00:34:34,920 --> 00:34:37,159
ultimately speaking, you have to just pretty much do it

650
00:34:37,199 --> 00:34:42,000
yourself and be realistic, have realistic goals, and make sure

651
00:34:42,039 --> 00:34:46,440
you're able to manage other people's expectations. Because one of

652
00:34:46,480 --> 00:34:49,880
the things that we were up against too was initially

653
00:34:49,880 --> 00:34:52,079
we're told from the actors, once they get the role,

654
00:34:52,719 --> 00:34:55,599
however long this takes. We got all year, guys, we

655
00:34:55,719 --> 00:34:58,320
got all years. This is the first thing from Sorry,

656
00:34:58,400 --> 00:34:59,880
this is the first thing from the actors.

657
00:35:00,360 --> 00:35:01,159
Speaker 2: We got all year.

658
00:35:01,679 --> 00:35:05,400
Speaker 3: We'll get this, and then like once they're around trash

659
00:35:05,440 --> 00:35:07,760
for about eight hours or like, so, how long is

660
00:35:07,760 --> 00:35:08,800
this shoot gonna be?

661
00:35:09,000 --> 00:35:09,119
Speaker 2: Like?

662
00:35:09,199 --> 00:35:12,599
Speaker 3: What are we talking about here? Coming up? And I

663
00:35:12,679 --> 00:35:15,320
got this and I got that. So you have those

664
00:35:15,400 --> 00:35:18,440
pressures too, so you have to be able to manage

665
00:35:18,480 --> 00:35:22,000
those expectations. And that's what I was getting back to. Originally,

666
00:35:22,280 --> 00:35:24,360
we made sure that we had as much work as

667
00:35:24,400 --> 00:35:27,599
we possibly could done before we went out and started

668
00:35:27,599 --> 00:35:30,760
to shoot one frame of this thing, because we knew

669
00:35:30,800 --> 00:35:33,880
that once we got out there, not everyone, even if

670
00:35:33,880 --> 00:35:36,960
they're in the film, is a spiritual warrior. This is

671
00:35:37,000 --> 00:35:39,440
not their baby, so to speak. This is your baby.

672
00:35:39,880 --> 00:35:43,239
They're here to facilitate it, but they're not going to

673
00:35:43,280 --> 00:35:46,480
be here for a year or two years or three years.

674
00:35:46,840 --> 00:35:49,480
They're here to do their job and then they're out.

675
00:35:49,840 --> 00:35:52,039
Speaker 2: Well real quick, if I can backtrack to say one

676
00:35:52,119 --> 00:35:55,000
quick discinct thing about what I learned. Yeah, just make something,

677
00:35:55,079 --> 00:35:58,559
get it on film. Show people have a proof of concept,

678
00:35:58,880 --> 00:36:01,360
because nobody will to help you. If you're nobody and

679
00:36:01,440 --> 00:36:03,480
no name, they're not going to volunte here their time.

680
00:36:03,519 --> 00:36:05,679
And rightfully, so, who are you? You're just the guy

681
00:36:05,719 --> 00:36:08,159
on the camera. But once we showed people this movie,

682
00:36:08,360 --> 00:36:10,360
all the doors are opening up all of a sudden.

683
00:36:10,360 --> 00:36:12,400
People that wouldn't want to give me their time. I'll

684
00:36:12,440 --> 00:36:14,920
do storyboards for you. Oh, I'll help with this. I'll

685
00:36:14,920 --> 00:36:17,360
help with that. So if you have a proof of concept,

686
00:36:17,719 --> 00:36:20,559
which this whole point of the movie was to show that, hey,

687
00:36:20,719 --> 00:36:23,679
you can write, deliver, produce a concept. So my biggest

688
00:36:24,119 --> 00:36:26,719
recommendation is do something that you're proud of that are

689
00:36:26,760 --> 00:36:29,119
going to attract people, because at the end of the day,

690
00:36:29,559 --> 00:36:32,239
brick by brick, you're assembling a crew. Brick by brick,

691
00:36:32,280 --> 00:36:34,000
we're trying to build up a crew. So we go

692
00:36:34,039 --> 00:36:36,119
on to the next project, and the next one and

693
00:36:36,159 --> 00:36:38,760
maybe the next one, and then we'll start big time

694
00:36:38,760 --> 00:36:39,159
of people.

695
00:36:41,039 --> 00:36:43,639
Speaker 4: Hey, listen that just to touch on that. And I'm

696
00:36:43,679 --> 00:36:47,239
with you. I think that's awesome. You guys took a concept,

697
00:36:47,480 --> 00:36:52,159
you made it happen. You created something, and you know

698
00:36:52,239 --> 00:36:55,000
you're out there and you're succeeding, and that's great, D

699
00:36:55,079 --> 00:36:57,440
and I can relate to that. About six months ago,

700
00:36:57,480 --> 00:36:59,119
we had this idea of doing a podcast.

701
00:36:59,599 --> 00:37:02,800
Speaker 1: We had no experience. Try a year and six months ago. Bro, well.

702
00:37:05,599 --> 00:37:09,480
Speaker 4: We've been podcasting for six months. But yeah, but yeah,

703
00:37:09,559 --> 00:37:11,960
we thought nobody but our mom would listen to this too,

704
00:37:12,039 --> 00:37:15,440
you know. And uh, and we've we're having some success

705
00:37:15,480 --> 00:37:18,480
and it's it's thrilling, you know. It's it's exciting that

706
00:37:18,480 --> 00:37:21,280
people are enjoying your work and and enjoying what we're doing.

707
00:37:21,280 --> 00:37:22,920
And it's you guys are making it happen.

708
00:37:23,079 --> 00:37:25,519
Speaker 2: So it's exciting to find like minded people, right, that's

709
00:37:25,519 --> 00:37:28,599
the whole goal. People the same wavelength. That's the that's

710
00:37:28,639 --> 00:37:29,000
the key.

711
00:37:29,280 --> 00:37:30,960
Speaker 1: I'm going to tell you this. I'm not what was

712
00:37:31,000 --> 00:37:33,119
the term you used, time? Yeah, big time. I'm not

713
00:37:33,159 --> 00:37:35,239
big time, and i'm not I'm the opposite of big time.

714
00:37:35,320 --> 00:37:38,079
I'm small time, not even a small time. I'm no time,

715
00:37:39,480 --> 00:37:42,280
but legit, I was. I was listening to a podcast

716
00:37:42,320 --> 00:37:47,400
this morning that has a fascinating almost Coen Brothers type

717
00:37:47,400 --> 00:37:50,360
of feel to the story that's being told, and I

718
00:37:50,360 --> 00:37:52,639
thought this actually would make a good movie. I could

719
00:37:52,639 --> 00:37:54,800
write this script. And I was like, if if this

720
00:37:54,880 --> 00:37:58,400
becomes a movie, I'm going to the new Wavo Brothers

721
00:37:58,760 --> 00:38:01,360
and I'm gonna say, hey, Okay, here's the script. Do

722
00:38:01,400 --> 00:38:03,880
you guys let's make this movie awesome.

723
00:38:05,119 --> 00:38:07,000
Speaker 2: I'll tell you this. If you write it, I'll read it.

724
00:38:07,760 --> 00:38:10,239
Speaker 1: You got your two primary characters, the rest of the

725
00:38:10,280 --> 00:38:13,880
cast gets put together, and then what's the next step.

726
00:38:14,039 --> 00:38:17,159
Speaker 3: Actually, the next step was we went out. We got

727
00:38:17,159 --> 00:38:21,480
their costumes, We messed them up, we dragged them through dirt,

728
00:38:21,639 --> 00:38:24,760
we did all kinds of stuff to you know, the clothes.

729
00:38:25,599 --> 00:38:28,159
Speaker 1: How did you do the tew I'm sitting here thinking

730
00:38:28,159 --> 00:38:31,079
about the teeth. I'm like, those teeth were so nasty.

731
00:38:31,119 --> 00:38:32,679
How did you get so bad?

732
00:38:33,679 --> 00:38:37,159
Speaker 3: Yeah, when we were doing research on makeup, it was

733
00:38:37,199 --> 00:38:39,840
one thing that you know, I've seen in other films

734
00:38:39,840 --> 00:38:41,800
that kind of let me down where it's like, you know,

735
00:38:41,840 --> 00:38:43,599
a medieval film or just that and the other. But

736
00:38:43,639 --> 00:38:45,800
they have beautiful teeth. So we wanted to have a

737
00:38:45,840 --> 00:38:50,519
situation where they had horrible, horrible teeth. So we found

738
00:38:50,519 --> 00:38:53,559
this product. It was movie makeup. It was like a

739
00:38:53,639 --> 00:38:58,960
laquer a tooth lacker, and had different gradations of decay,

740
00:38:59,159 --> 00:39:03,159
like it had like caffeine stains all the way up

741
00:39:03,199 --> 00:39:06,360
to pretty much like you're beyond a ruth canal. You

742
00:39:06,440 --> 00:39:10,400
need to get your tooth pulled. So we we played

743
00:39:10,400 --> 00:39:14,000
around with it and we thought it just brought an

744
00:39:14,079 --> 00:39:18,719
element of realism and authenticity to to the makeup. You know,

745
00:39:19,000 --> 00:39:21,119
it would have looked ridiculous if he was filthy and

746
00:39:21,199 --> 00:39:23,760
had because he had really nice teeth, he had a

747
00:39:23,840 --> 00:39:26,719
nice smile, and it was super white, you know, being

748
00:39:26,760 --> 00:39:30,360
an actor in Hollywood in la he's got nice teeth

749
00:39:30,719 --> 00:39:34,320
and there's snow white. So it would have looked ridiculous

750
00:39:34,360 --> 00:39:38,320
if his teeth were snow white. So fun to get go.

751
00:39:38,480 --> 00:39:41,760
We we decided that that was something that would really

752
00:39:43,880 --> 00:39:46,920
look Yeah. You know they say if you only have

753
00:39:47,199 --> 00:39:48,920
like a couple of you know, if you have a

754
00:39:48,920 --> 00:39:50,960
small budget and you want to do something to make

755
00:39:50,960 --> 00:39:53,480
yourself look younger, you know, get your teeth white and

756
00:39:53,519 --> 00:39:56,280
it has a huge effect on your face, you know,

757
00:39:56,360 --> 00:39:59,760
on how you look. So yeah, we we got the makeup,

758
00:40:00,280 --> 00:40:02,679
we got the clothes down, and then we had a

759
00:40:02,719 --> 00:40:05,679
few rehearsals at my house to work on blocking. I

760
00:40:05,719 --> 00:40:08,199
didn't want to have a situation where every confrontation they

761
00:40:08,239 --> 00:40:11,039
after just standing still and it's just over the shoulder

762
00:40:11,119 --> 00:40:13,840
each time, Like, I wanted to have movement in the scene,

763
00:40:13,960 --> 00:40:17,639
and they're on bikes. So that's why, you know, anytime

764
00:40:17,760 --> 00:40:21,039
Cowboy was on his bike, there was a lot of movement.

765
00:40:21,159 --> 00:40:23,760
He would circle him, he would go around them kind

766
00:40:23,800 --> 00:40:27,800
of like predatorial, you know, strutting his stuff like a peacock,

767
00:40:28,519 --> 00:40:32,079
especially the final confrontation when he goes around him and

768
00:40:32,119 --> 00:40:35,159
he kicks his bag and stuff like that. We worked

769
00:40:35,159 --> 00:40:40,760
on a lot of that stuff. Cowboy, Burtis, me and

770
00:40:40,800 --> 00:40:43,800
Mike have footage for like proud parents for teaching him

771
00:40:43,800 --> 00:40:48,199
how to ride a bike, So we were working on

772
00:40:48,239 --> 00:40:50,320
some of that stuff. There was a lot of stuff

773
00:40:50,360 --> 00:40:53,559
that we thought initially like, ah, we didn't even think

774
00:40:53,599 --> 00:40:55,280
about it. This is where I'm getting back to the

775
00:40:55,320 --> 00:40:59,159
stuff that you're not thinking about. All the planning, we

776
00:40:59,599 --> 00:41:03,079
made the asumption that everybody can ride a bike no problem,

777
00:41:03,400 --> 00:41:06,840
you know, So Burtis needed some practice on his bike

778
00:41:07,079 --> 00:41:08,880
initially to be able to.

779
00:41:10,320 --> 00:41:12,320
Speaker 2: He almost fell into the lake at least twice.

780
00:41:13,000 --> 00:41:14,639
Speaker 3: It was a few times where we thought he was

781
00:41:14,639 --> 00:41:18,880
going into the drink for sure, very lobbily. I don't

782
00:41:18,880 --> 00:41:21,840
know if it was nerves or not. But the handlebars

783
00:41:21,840 --> 00:41:24,760
were bolted pretty tightly, but by the end of each day,

784
00:41:24,920 --> 00:41:28,519
like the pandel bars were just swinging loosely, like he

785
00:41:28,599 --> 00:41:30,920
would like really like grip them and move them, and

786
00:41:31,000 --> 00:41:34,119
like she was always playing with them. But yeah, we

787
00:41:34,159 --> 00:41:36,519
had stuff like that, like where we had to make

788
00:41:36,519 --> 00:41:38,639
sure he was comfortable on his bike. We had a

789
00:41:38,679 --> 00:41:42,199
few rehearsal with all the actors. Then it was I

790
00:41:42,239 --> 00:41:46,639
believe July eighth, twenty eighteen. It was our first day

791
00:41:46,800 --> 00:41:50,239
of principal photography in Long Beach and it was like

792
00:41:50,360 --> 00:41:52,840
the hottest day of the year. The bikes. We wanted

793
00:41:52,880 --> 00:41:54,440
to do a lot more with the bikes. We have

794
00:41:54,480 --> 00:41:56,880
a lot more shots with the bikes and stuff like that,

795
00:41:56,920 --> 00:41:59,159
but unfortunately, being that it's a short film and a

796
00:41:59,199 --> 00:42:01,719
long short film, but that we weren't able to put

797
00:42:01,760 --> 00:42:04,760
more bike stuff. I think bikes are awesome. I left

798
00:42:04,760 --> 00:42:08,280
to see bikes and films. There's something very cinematic about

799
00:42:08,280 --> 00:42:09,360
a bicycle.

800
00:42:09,199 --> 00:42:11,519
Speaker 1: Shot wise, You've got some great shots, and I'm looking

801
00:42:11,519 --> 00:42:13,559
forward to watching the movie with you guys here in

802
00:42:13,559 --> 00:42:17,159
just a minute. But what scenes did you steal from

803
00:42:17,159 --> 00:42:17,679
somebody else?

804
00:42:17,719 --> 00:42:20,400
Speaker 2: There was some Kubrick, a lot of Koprick inspired horse

805
00:42:20,440 --> 00:42:21,400
perspective shots.

806
00:42:21,559 --> 00:42:23,239
Speaker 3: Yeah, there was a lot of stuff that we still

807
00:42:23,400 --> 00:42:26,840
they steal from. The best, right the line where he says,

808
00:42:26,960 --> 00:42:29,920
my god, it's full of cans. That's just a rip

809
00:42:30,000 --> 00:42:33,559
from twenty ten where you hear Dave say, my god,

810
00:42:33,599 --> 00:42:34,639
it's full of stars.

811
00:42:34,920 --> 00:42:37,639
Speaker 1: Nice, nice, nice, that's good, which.

812
00:42:37,480 --> 00:42:40,480
Speaker 3: Is a great film. You know, I love Stanley Kubrick,

813
00:42:40,519 --> 00:42:42,400
and I think two thousand and one is awesome, but

814
00:42:42,519 --> 00:42:47,360
I thought Peter Heins twenty ten was awesome too.

815
00:42:49,840 --> 00:42:51,480
Speaker 1: So when you guys are out there, when you're out

816
00:42:51,480 --> 00:42:55,239
there shooting, you've both of you are there every day, right,

817
00:42:55,679 --> 00:42:57,960
and then you have whatever actors are in the scene.

818
00:42:58,000 --> 00:43:01,639
Obviously do you have you get a boom operator.

819
00:43:01,239 --> 00:43:05,800
Speaker 3: Some days, quite a few days in the shoot we

820
00:43:05,880 --> 00:43:10,599
had Brent Drubin and Brent he also added music too,

821
00:43:10,920 --> 00:43:14,039
John Theodore. He provided a lot of original music, and

822
00:43:14,079 --> 00:43:17,800
so did Brent Drubin. The music work Joe sitting on

823
00:43:17,840 --> 00:43:21,360
the beach, that's Brent's music the first time where Joe's

824
00:43:21,400 --> 00:43:24,039
writing through and discovered the golden goose as we call

825
00:43:26,239 --> 00:43:29,199
when he peeks in and sees the trash can filling up.

826
00:43:29,280 --> 00:43:30,000
That's a drubn.

827
00:43:31,639 --> 00:43:33,719
Speaker 2: That was that was based on like a Willy Wonka whistle.

828
00:43:33,880 --> 00:43:37,960
Speaker 3: Yeah, Willie Wonka as kind of having a whimsical.

829
00:43:37,840 --> 00:43:41,159
Speaker 2: Disco song where Cowboy is written by by Joe with

830
00:43:41,239 --> 00:43:44,440
the trash bags, that's a drubn. A little disco.

831
00:43:44,280 --> 00:43:49,480
Speaker 3: Song when he's shaving is a druven. Yeah. So he

832
00:43:49,599 --> 00:43:54,320
was instrumental in not only helping us during principal photography,

833
00:43:54,440 --> 00:43:57,119
holding like the bounce board and stuff like that, and

834
00:43:57,239 --> 00:44:00,360
like making sure, you know, if we could possibly get sound,

835
00:44:00,400 --> 00:44:02,360
he would hold and record.

836
00:44:02,360 --> 00:44:07,599
Speaker 2: The friend crackheads. He would for friends people.

837
00:44:07,920 --> 00:44:09,880
Speaker 3: One of the cool things that we were able to

838
00:44:09,960 --> 00:44:12,360
do was that while we were there, like we always

839
00:44:12,360 --> 00:44:14,920
had like a cooler with food and drinks and stuff

840
00:44:14,920 --> 00:44:17,119
like that. We would give people food and drinks, and

841
00:44:17,880 --> 00:44:21,719
everybody for the most part was cope aesthetic, Like nobody

842
00:44:21,760 --> 00:44:24,800
ever gave us any trouble and nine times out of

843
00:44:25,000 --> 00:44:26,800
ten they just wanted to hang out and just see

844
00:44:26,800 --> 00:44:28,719
what we were up to. It was great to have

845
00:44:28,760 --> 00:44:31,639
Brent there because he was great at being very diplomatic

846
00:44:32,280 --> 00:44:35,079
and it would allow us to be able to concentrate

847
00:44:35,239 --> 00:44:38,239
on the scene versus you know, what are these people doing?

848
00:44:38,320 --> 00:44:41,400
Are they stealing our stuff? What's going on? And stuff

849
00:44:41,440 --> 00:44:44,159
like that, and he just wanted to talk. So they

850
00:44:44,159 --> 00:44:47,000
would talk to Brent when we were left alone able

851
00:44:47,079 --> 00:44:49,599
to work on you know, the shop and stuff like that.

852
00:44:49,880 --> 00:44:51,880
Speaker 2: They'd ask Brent, if do you want to steal a

853
00:44:51,920 --> 00:44:52,320
car with me?

854
00:44:55,280 --> 00:44:59,719
Speaker 3: Would have gone and got married to a chick. And

855
00:44:59,760 --> 00:45:02,320
that's that's the thing, Like, there are people in your

856
00:45:02,400 --> 00:45:05,280
life that I'm sure everybody has those people that they

857
00:45:05,320 --> 00:45:09,280
can rely on. I hope they do, because films they

858
00:45:09,679 --> 00:45:13,079
require a lot of help and it's very hard to

859
00:45:13,119 --> 00:45:15,440
pull off something with just two people. You're going to

860
00:45:15,559 --> 00:45:16,719
have to have people there.

861
00:45:16,960 --> 00:45:21,159
Speaker 2: Filmmaking is like construction work with the tripod. Now, it's

862
00:45:21,320 --> 00:45:23,239
it's not fun. It's a lot of work. It's a

863
00:45:23,239 --> 00:45:24,519
lot of sweat, a lot of tears.

864
00:45:24,920 --> 00:45:27,360
Speaker 4: And just know that going in that's nothing good for

865
00:45:27,599 --> 00:45:29,199
young filmmakers here, you know.

866
00:45:29,360 --> 00:45:31,599
Speaker 2: Absolutely sweat.

867
00:45:31,679 --> 00:45:36,519
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's definitely, as Mike said, it's very reminiscent of physical,

868
00:45:37,239 --> 00:45:42,039
laborious construction work, and you're using your mind a lot too,

869
00:45:42,920 --> 00:45:46,000
and you've got to realize when things are not working

870
00:45:46,039 --> 00:45:47,960
in the scene. I guess like it's one of those

871
00:45:48,000 --> 00:45:50,320
things where people go off for like twenty years to

872
00:45:50,360 --> 00:45:53,559
become like present in a moment, where like when you

873
00:45:53,599 --> 00:45:56,679
make films, you got to be present, and the more

874
00:45:56,719 --> 00:45:59,920
present you are, I think that's what separates the great

875
00:46:00,039 --> 00:46:05,159
filmmakers from the lackeys. I think guys that we really admire,

876
00:46:05,320 --> 00:46:08,159
I think they were super present during the whole process

877
00:46:08,320 --> 00:46:11,920
and got it done because there's times man, as Mike said,

878
00:46:11,960 --> 00:46:16,400
it's like wrangling kittens sometimes and it's like sand through

879
00:46:16,440 --> 00:46:19,719
your hands, and you're trying to accommodate all of these

880
00:46:19,760 --> 00:46:23,199
different things all in real time, with the knowledge at

881
00:46:23,199 --> 00:46:25,800
the back of your head too that there's no guarantee

882
00:46:25,800 --> 00:46:27,880
that any of this is going to work. It's definitely

883
00:46:27,920 --> 00:46:31,159
a lot of work, and I would definitely say to

884
00:46:31,239 --> 00:46:34,800
anybody who wants to be a filmmaker, don't worry about it,

885
00:46:34,840 --> 00:46:37,800
because if you really like your story, you'll do the work.

886
00:46:37,880 --> 00:46:40,280
But it's not work. It's not work like your mom

887
00:46:40,280 --> 00:46:42,000
tells us to go out and you know, break the

888
00:46:42,079 --> 00:46:43,880
lawn of the leaves and stuff like that. It's a

889
00:46:43,920 --> 00:46:49,800
different type of work, and it's very satisfying. It's super satisfying.

890
00:46:49,199 --> 00:46:52,679
Speaker 1: And I can identify you. It's hard, long work that

891
00:46:52,760 --> 00:46:53,119
you love.

892
00:46:53,840 --> 00:46:56,320
Speaker 2: Imagine that's doing it outside with bums out there.

893
00:47:00,960 --> 00:47:04,480
Speaker 1: Okay, so we've got production, we've got pre production, we've

894
00:47:04,519 --> 00:47:08,920
got production. Now let's talk about the infamous post production

895
00:47:09,039 --> 00:47:11,719
experience that you have. You've got roughly three and a

896
00:47:11,760 --> 00:47:13,880
half four hours of footage that you've got to bring

897
00:47:13,960 --> 00:47:18,159
down to thirty minutes or so, and then what happens.

898
00:47:18,400 --> 00:47:21,360
Speaker 2: Okay, so I'm pretty experienced. In the final cup brow

899
00:47:21,400 --> 00:47:25,239
I've been cutting EBS Food Review shows everything you can imagine,

900
00:47:25,599 --> 00:47:28,800
smaller scale, probably forty five minutes at the most, you know,

901
00:47:28,920 --> 00:47:34,159
far less cuts and out three fourths into the movie,

902
00:47:34,760 --> 00:47:35,800
we hit a wall.

903
00:47:37,079 --> 00:47:42,599
Speaker 3: Right at the Cowboy Joe scene, the confrontation scene. That's

904
00:47:42,679 --> 00:47:44,880
where that anomaly shows up. I'll let you go ahead.

905
00:47:44,960 --> 00:47:47,960
Speaker 2: Well, what happens is it's not just five hundred and

906
00:47:47,960 --> 00:47:50,400
six hundred cuts from the movies for the video. That's

907
00:47:50,400 --> 00:47:53,000
not a problem for my computer. What's happening is you

908
00:47:53,079 --> 00:47:56,760
have thousands and thousands of audio files for everything you

909
00:47:56,880 --> 00:47:59,760
heard in that movie was put in by hand, particulously

910
00:48:00,440 --> 00:48:04,079
slowing the computer ever so slowly. We learned after reaching

911
00:48:04,119 --> 00:48:08,159
out to Final Cut user groups that Final Cut has

912
00:48:08,199 --> 00:48:11,840
a brick wall around twenty five hundred files into a

913
00:48:11,880 --> 00:48:16,760
project one library. Our entire timeline was six seven thousand files.

914
00:48:16,760 --> 00:48:19,000
So we had hit the wall. And this is not

915
00:48:19,079 --> 00:48:21,280
like a selling point for Final Cut. Now with twenty

916
00:48:21,320 --> 00:48:24,559
five hundred files, No, they don't talk about that. That's

917
00:48:24,599 --> 00:48:27,599
not really expressed and it's probably not common. People don't

918
00:48:27,599 --> 00:48:30,400
have that many files in one movie because typically you

919
00:48:30,400 --> 00:48:33,119
would have sound recorded and you'd have one track a

920
00:48:33,199 --> 00:48:37,320
post to thirty with the crickets height walking like. All

921
00:48:37,320 --> 00:48:39,960
of that was particulously put in by hand. So anyway

922
00:48:40,159 --> 00:48:42,800
we hit a wall or Final cut A couldn't play

923
00:48:42,840 --> 00:48:45,719
back the footage on the computer. We put in a

924
00:48:46,119 --> 00:48:49,280
ominous black hole in our footage right where the confrontation

925
00:48:49,519 --> 00:48:52,679
is where Joe is kissing Cowboy's hand. It added a

926
00:48:52,719 --> 00:48:56,679
black bar footage blocking out our footage over the footage

927
00:48:56,679 --> 00:48:59,280
in the timeline, and no matter what we did, I've

928
00:48:59,280 --> 00:49:02,239
never seen it restarted it. I reached out to a

929
00:49:02,280 --> 00:49:06,519
gentleman named Ronnie Curtains, who's like a high end final

930
00:49:06,519 --> 00:49:08,880
cut guru and he was like, I've never seen anything

931
00:49:08,920 --> 00:49:12,079
like this. Yeah, he was from Belgium. So we're doing

932
00:49:12,119 --> 00:49:15,719
skype like walk me off the edge meetings like what

933
00:49:15,760 --> 00:49:17,199
are we gonna do? How are we going to get

934
00:49:17,239 --> 00:49:19,440
out of this? And he's like, oh, well, well I'll

935
00:49:19,440 --> 00:49:21,079
talk it to the Apple and we'll see if we

936
00:49:21,079 --> 00:49:23,559
can find a work around. And they never found anything.

937
00:49:24,039 --> 00:49:26,159
So we had to rent a new top of the

938
00:49:26,199 --> 00:49:29,719
line iMac with the Bilton five K monitor in order

939
00:49:29,760 --> 00:49:34,320
to finish this film because my twenty twelve PowerMac, which

940
00:49:34,360 --> 00:49:36,960
was maxed out, couldn't handle it. So that was luckily

941
00:49:37,079 --> 00:49:40,519
donated by Darren's brother half like more than half the money,

942
00:49:40,880 --> 00:49:42,880
which was like five or six hundred, five hundred bucks.

943
00:49:42,920 --> 00:49:45,679
I think it was luckily that allowed us to circumvent

944
00:49:45,679 --> 00:49:48,039
the problem and put it on another computer. And then

945
00:49:48,079 --> 00:49:50,400
we had to bring all the footage over to another computer,

946
00:49:50,679 --> 00:49:53,159
all the files, all the editing, you know, all that stuff,

947
00:49:53,159 --> 00:49:55,239
which wasn't fun. As you can imagine me and Darren

948
00:49:55,239 --> 00:49:57,199
are pulling our hair out. You might have read Job

949
00:49:57,280 --> 00:49:57,840
in the Bible.

950
00:49:57,920 --> 00:49:58,199
Speaker 3: That was.

951
00:50:01,199 --> 00:50:03,039
Speaker 2: A lot of turning on each other. Me and Darren

952
00:50:03,440 --> 00:50:05,920
like get mad, at each other like like, you know,

953
00:50:05,920 --> 00:50:13,599
who are you gonna blame? Well, this is blame the dynasty. Okay.

954
00:50:13,679 --> 00:50:17,599
Speaker 1: So one of the most amazing features of the movie

955
00:50:17,840 --> 00:50:22,239
is the soundtrack. I was really impressed with the quality.

956
00:50:22,320 --> 00:50:25,039
I mean, this is like a professional soundtrack. So given

957
00:50:25,079 --> 00:50:27,480
that you guys did this for two thousand dollars, how

958
00:50:27,519 --> 00:50:28,320
did you get that done?

959
00:50:28,559 --> 00:50:31,360
Speaker 2: Well, we knew coming into the film that music was

960
00:50:31,360 --> 00:50:34,119
gonna be quintessential and that it's gonna be an unseen

961
00:50:34,199 --> 00:50:36,719
character in the movie. But it tells you how to think,

962
00:50:36,760 --> 00:50:39,840
how to feel, and you definitely have to have good

963
00:50:39,880 --> 00:50:43,039
quality music otherwise I'll take you out of the moment. Anyway,

964
00:50:43,159 --> 00:50:46,960
we went online and found some sources for online scoring,

965
00:50:47,360 --> 00:50:51,000
and we went through a few interviews and a few samples,

966
00:50:51,639 --> 00:50:54,599
and we let we let our guy, John Theodor give

967
00:50:54,679 --> 00:50:57,760
us Okay, here's the opening up our movie. Send us

968
00:50:57,760 --> 00:50:59,639
an example of what you would do for this. You know,

969
00:50:59,719 --> 00:51:02,440
we paint the picture of what emotion you're going for.

970
00:51:02,760 --> 00:51:04,719
And he nailed it out of the park at home run.

971
00:51:04,840 --> 00:51:07,880
You know, he just like wow. And it turns out

972
00:51:08,000 --> 00:51:11,840
John Fiodor he studied under Hans Zimmer, you know, from

973
00:51:11,840 --> 00:51:15,199
the Great composer that's done things like Conception and Gladiator,

974
00:51:15,800 --> 00:51:18,719
and he's got a you know, huge repertoire, so we

975
00:51:18,800 --> 00:51:21,719
totally lucked out. And he did about seventy percent of

976
00:51:21,760 --> 00:51:24,920
the soundtrack on top of our friend Brent Drubin, who

977
00:51:24,920 --> 00:51:28,000
did the rest. But yeah, he came through big and

978
00:51:28,039 --> 00:51:30,480
we definitely couldn't have done the movie without him. We

979
00:51:30,519 --> 00:51:35,719
made him deep, dig real deep into his palette. You know,

980
00:51:35,760 --> 00:51:38,599
how do you make music about a homeless person? You

981
00:51:38,639 --> 00:51:40,920
know what I mean? And it's kind of a Western too,

982
00:51:41,000 --> 00:51:43,840
and it's also urban, and it's also got a lot

983
00:51:43,880 --> 00:51:46,159
of layers of what's going on there, So it's not

984
00:51:46,280 --> 00:51:49,280
your run of the mill soundtrack. You definitely wouldn't find

985
00:51:49,280 --> 00:51:51,239
this in any other film. Very custom.

986
00:51:51,480 --> 00:51:54,559
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's it's fantastic. So you're saying that he created

987
00:51:54,599 --> 00:51:57,280
it specifically for you movie. This wasn't something that he

988
00:51:57,320 --> 00:52:00,440
had pre existing. He watched movie just like any other

989
00:52:00,440 --> 00:52:03,559
composer and composed the soundtrack from what he was watching.

990
00:52:03,719 --> 00:52:05,800
Speaker 2: We ran, we put him through the wringer. I mean

991
00:52:05,920 --> 00:52:10,119
some versions were twenty fifteen versions, redoing it, redo it.

992
00:52:10,199 --> 00:52:13,239
So we were very hard on him to get him

993
00:52:13,280 --> 00:52:15,639
to what we wanted to be. But once we broke

994
00:52:15,679 --> 00:52:17,800
him out of the shell, and he was often running

995
00:52:17,840 --> 00:52:22,239
and he was very creative. He added things like elements

996
00:52:22,320 --> 00:52:25,800
of bike sounds and gears and jugs and things you

997
00:52:25,800 --> 00:52:27,639
would find on the streets. He put that in the

998
00:52:27,719 --> 00:52:31,360
soundtrack to supplement the music, so it became part of

999
00:52:31,400 --> 00:52:34,320
the environment and the music. So he probably hates us,

1000
00:52:34,320 --> 00:52:35,960
and he probably will never work with us again. But

1001
00:52:36,400 --> 00:52:38,679
I think, in my opinion, that really made the project

1002
00:52:38,719 --> 00:52:39,559
the best it could have been.

1003
00:52:39,599 --> 00:52:42,599
Speaker 1: Well, it's a name for folks to remember, John Theodore.

1004
00:52:44,880 --> 00:52:48,079
You have this fantastic effect that takes place during the

1005
00:52:48,159 --> 00:52:52,400
murder scene where the graffiti on the walls is of faces,

1006
00:52:53,039 --> 00:52:56,280
and the camera is kind of jumping into the faces

1007
00:52:56,320 --> 00:53:00,039
as if they are the witnesses of this murder. I

1008
00:53:00,159 --> 00:53:03,960
lent stone witnesses of what's going on. I thought it

1009
00:53:04,000 --> 00:53:07,119
was beautifully done. Let me ask this. It was all

1010
00:53:07,119 --> 00:53:09,920
of that graffiti already there. Did you guys do anything

1011
00:53:10,079 --> 00:53:11,920
or were you just like there it is? That's a

1012
00:53:11,920 --> 00:53:12,480
perfect face.

1013
00:53:12,559 --> 00:53:14,920
Speaker 2: Well, to be honest with you, I had Darren sneaking

1014
00:53:14,960 --> 00:53:19,920
at night and paint that mural. No, we got super

1015
00:53:20,000 --> 00:53:22,719
lucky that everything you see on site was done by

1016
00:53:22,760 --> 00:53:26,440
local artists from around the area, and Darren found all

1017
00:53:26,480 --> 00:53:30,320
the locations google apps and doing walks and doping things out.

1018
00:53:30,480 --> 00:53:32,440
That's just call the fame part of it is he

1019
00:53:32,519 --> 00:53:34,679
found all these places and he's like, oh man, you

1020
00:53:34,719 --> 00:53:36,440
got to see these mural He would take pictures on

1021
00:53:36,480 --> 00:53:38,960
his phone. I think we incorporated that. Okay, we got

1022
00:53:38,960 --> 00:53:41,000
to put that in based on that, So it wasn't

1023
00:53:41,000 --> 00:53:42,880
we didn't write that. We saw that and said, okay,

1024
00:53:42,880 --> 00:53:44,800
we're going to take advantage of that. So that was

1025
00:53:44,840 --> 00:53:47,960
just kind of serendipitous, right, Darren, Am I romanticizing that?

1026
00:53:48,079 --> 00:53:48,800
Speaker 3: Or no?

1027
00:53:48,920 --> 00:53:49,719
Speaker 2: I know, You're right.

1028
00:53:49,840 --> 00:53:52,360
Speaker 3: We knew, like we didn't have the budget to be

1029
00:53:52,440 --> 00:53:55,760
able to pull off something on camera that was brutal,

1030
00:53:55,960 --> 00:53:58,320
nor did we want to. I said initially, I would

1031
00:53:58,320 --> 00:54:00,760
have liked the two brands just to have actility to

1032
00:54:00,800 --> 00:54:03,920
see what could have become of that scene if we

1033
00:54:03,960 --> 00:54:07,039
went in that direction. But yeah, we knew that we

1034
00:54:07,079 --> 00:54:09,679
wanted to have a situation like I think, you know,

1035
00:54:10,199 --> 00:54:13,519
Alfred Hitchhawk said, you know that what you don't see

1036
00:54:13,599 --> 00:54:16,320
is what's terrifying. One of the most effective things, as

1037
00:54:16,320 --> 00:54:18,880
you said about jobs, was that you don't see the Shark.

1038
00:54:19,039 --> 00:54:21,079
One of the most effective things about Alien is that

1039
00:54:21,159 --> 00:54:23,400
you don't really get to have a good look at

1040
00:54:23,400 --> 00:54:26,000
the alien for pretty much the whole film. But yeah,

1041
00:54:26,639 --> 00:54:31,400
we wanted to use the art and yeah, there's something weary,

1042
00:54:31,559 --> 00:54:35,679
haunting yet about those faces just staring blankly, so to speak.

1043
00:54:35,800 --> 00:54:38,840
And that's the thing to young filmmakers too, is that

1044
00:54:39,480 --> 00:54:43,480
you've got to use what's there and spending time finding

1045
00:54:43,559 --> 00:54:47,119
good locations. That's you know, that's key. This film could

1046
00:54:47,119 --> 00:54:50,039
have looked like, you know, a really really bad student

1047
00:54:50,119 --> 00:54:53,079
film very easily if we got lazy and decided to

1048
00:54:53,119 --> 00:54:55,480
shoot in different places that didn't have that look.

1049
00:54:55,719 --> 00:54:58,840
Speaker 2: Our first Golden Goose house, where the Golden Goose was,

1050
00:54:59,000 --> 00:55:01,719
we were going to say, for a parking lot in

1051
00:55:01,719 --> 00:55:03,320
a restaurant, you know what I mean, where can you

1052
00:55:03,320 --> 00:55:07,480
shoot openly in public with somebody simulatingly getting murdered, you know,

1053
00:55:07,480 --> 00:55:09,039
And that was going to be in sam or Nadinos,

1054
00:55:09,039 --> 00:55:10,159
So that wouldn't have turned out.

1055
00:55:10,199 --> 00:55:12,679
Speaker 3: Well. We got there and we're like, dude, are we

1056
00:55:12,679 --> 00:55:14,880
really going to put all this work into this film

1057
00:55:14,920 --> 00:55:16,159
and shoot this scene here?

1058
00:55:16,199 --> 00:55:17,480
Speaker 2: It is next to a red lobster.

1059
00:55:20,199 --> 00:55:23,760
Speaker 3: Don't settle. I always always keep looking and I use

1060
00:55:23,840 --> 00:55:26,480
Google Map. I love Google Map. I spend a lot

1061
00:55:26,480 --> 00:55:29,360
of my free time just looking around planet Earth on

1062
00:55:29,440 --> 00:55:32,039
Google Map and stuff like that. And I found a

1063
00:55:32,079 --> 00:55:34,239
lot of places on Google Map, and then I would

1064
00:55:34,320 --> 00:55:37,599
drive there and check them out. And yeah, that was

1065
00:55:37,639 --> 00:55:39,840
the best way to go about it for us, was

1066
00:55:39,920 --> 00:55:42,559
to kind of make sure that the place had that

1067
00:55:42,639 --> 00:55:44,920
look and then we could work inside. You know, we

1068
00:55:44,960 --> 00:55:47,639
could we could kind of develop the scene even more.

1069
00:55:47,760 --> 00:55:49,400
There was a lot of stuff that was on paper

1070
00:55:49,519 --> 00:55:52,400
that even got more developed once we were there, and

1071
00:55:52,559 --> 00:55:54,679
it just enhanced the scene and made it that much

1072
00:55:54,679 --> 00:55:57,159
better because we didn't settle. If we had settled, it

1073
00:55:57,199 --> 00:55:59,440
would we probably wouldn't be having this conversation.

1074
00:55:59,760 --> 00:56:04,360
Speaker 1: So once you got the rental Mac and moved your

1075
00:56:04,400 --> 00:56:07,920
files over, was it relatively smooth at that point?

1076
00:56:08,440 --> 00:56:09,679
Speaker 3: Not really moving?

1077
00:56:11,360 --> 00:56:13,800
Speaker 2: There's always problems, you know. You never know until you

1078
00:56:13,840 --> 00:56:15,679
start doing something and you have a deadline, then you're

1079
00:56:15,679 --> 00:56:17,719
gonna start finding what the problems are. This is kind

1080
00:56:17,719 --> 00:56:20,159
of uncharted territory, you know. Next time, I'd love to

1081
00:56:20,159 --> 00:56:22,119
hand this off to somebody else to like make make

1082
00:56:22,159 --> 00:56:25,119
it their nightmare. Because we had to absorb all the

1083
00:56:25,119 --> 00:56:27,599
problems by one A lot of time and effort to

1084
00:56:27,639 --> 00:56:30,320
be side by side on a project for two years.

1085
00:56:30,400 --> 00:56:32,320
Speaker 1: It's impressive that you guys are still friends.

1086
00:56:32,400 --> 00:56:33,599
Speaker 2: Yeah, it really is.

1087
00:56:33,800 --> 00:56:35,679
Speaker 3: Actually, this is the first time we spoke since.

1088
00:56:39,119 --> 00:56:42,440
Speaker 1: All right, everybody, that is all the time we have, unfortunately,

1089
00:56:43,000 --> 00:56:45,800
But be sure and go. If you haven't already check

1090
00:56:45,840 --> 00:56:49,559
this movie out on YouTube. You can visit their website

1091
00:56:49,719 --> 00:56:54,679
at cannersmovie dot com. Guys are really appreciate you meeting

1092
00:56:54,679 --> 00:56:57,679
with us and going through this interview process. You've got

1093
00:56:57,679 --> 00:56:59,840
a great piece of work there. Thank you so much,

1094
00:57:00,199 --> 00:57:01,800
or for letting us have some of your time.

1095
00:57:01,960 --> 00:57:05,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, thank you so much, Shirley, don't you sure. We

1096
00:57:05,519 --> 00:57:08,559
appreciate giving us a venue, giving us a place to

1097
00:57:08,599 --> 00:57:11,719
talk about the art our art, and we love your podcast.

1098
00:57:11,760 --> 00:57:13,559
We're going to spread it like the gospel. We really

1099
00:57:13,599 --> 00:57:15,360
think that you're on something good there. So well. We

1100
00:57:15,400 --> 00:57:17,639
grew up with the eighties and nineties and I'm glad

1101
00:57:17,679 --> 00:57:20,880
that you guys are doing something original and something well done.

1102
00:57:21,239 --> 00:57:24,079
Speaker 1: We look forward to meeting with you again soon when

1103
00:57:24,599 --> 00:57:25,360
you're big time.

1104
00:57:26,880 --> 00:57:27,280
Speaker 2: Let's hope.

1105
00:57:27,400 --> 00:57:27,760
Speaker 3: Thank you.

1106
00:57:27,840 --> 00:57:29,519
Speaker 2: Okay, take care man, thank you for take care.

1107
00:57:30,400 --> 00:57:33,239
Speaker 1: All right, everybody, please be sure and join us. Next

1108
00:57:33,280 --> 00:57:38,239
week we have a special Halloween series of episodes. Yeah,

1109
00:57:38,280 --> 00:57:39,239
we were really excited.

1110
00:57:39,239 --> 00:57:42,079
Speaker 4: We're going to do Fright Night versus Lost Boys the

1111
00:57:42,079 --> 00:57:43,800
These are going to be fun movies to talk about.

1112
00:57:44,159 --> 00:57:46,920
Speaker 1: Such great movies and perfect for this time of the year.

1113
00:57:46,960 --> 00:57:48,360
Can't wait to get into it.

1114
00:57:48,480 --> 00:57:51,559
Speaker 4: You or I may die by stereo sometime during the podcast.

1115
00:57:51,599 --> 00:57:52,119
Speaker 1: We're not sure.

1116
00:57:54,360 --> 00:57:56,280
Speaker 4: All right, Well, thanks for joining us this week. This

1117
00:57:56,440 --> 00:57:58,280
was a special one. I hope you enjoyed it. Join

1118
00:57:58,360 --> 00:58:00,239
us next week. We'd get right back into or a

1119
00:58:00,320 --> 00:58:01,119
movie matchupl

1120
00:58:04,440 --> 00:58:04,639
Speaker 1: Mh