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Speaker 1: Hi, this is Christina and Carmen, and this is another

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episode of a Spooky Tales, the podcast for all Things Hunted,

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a spooky true crime in Latin America. And today it

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is just true crime and it's very depressing and angering.

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That's just that's been the mood. Yeah, it's my fault,

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and yeah, that's what we have today.

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Speaker 2: No panorma. Sorry, that's the mood in general. Yes, and

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yeah didn't.

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Speaker 1: We don't have a listener story today because we're just

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gonna do the true crime case. But we still are

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receiving them always. So if you have a story that

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you want to send us, you can email as Spooky

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Tales at gmail dot com. You can dm us on

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any of our socials. You can submit it on Discord.

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You can dma on any of our socials like Instagram,

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even TikTok. You can call the Spooky hotline.

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Speaker 2: All are cool.

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Speaker 1: We love receiving them. Okay, and yeah again we're just

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gonna jump straight into my depressing case.

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Speaker 2: Again.

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Speaker 1: It's very infuriating and depressing. I can't stress that enough.

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So I am sharing a case where the murderer, the

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perpetrator is a former Border Patrol agent.

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Speaker 2: Oh that one. Mm hmm. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: When this happened, people asked, how could this happen? How

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could someone who is supposed to protect us become a

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monster and high defect. I would like to remind people

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that that's not the purpose of border patrol. Yeah, yeah,

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they are often the perpetators of violence. So to me,

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when I learned that it was a bored patrol agent

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that there is, it.

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Speaker 2: Was no surprise.

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Speaker 1: You were like, okay, makes sense. Yeah, I'm like shocking

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at all, the least shocked, like I could ever be.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, but I get it.

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Speaker 1: Not everyone's there yet, so yeah, anyway, the case. So,

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in the follow of twenty eighteen, terror struck the normally

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relative safe city of Laredo, Texas, compared to its Mexican counterpart,

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Nuevo Laredo, Latto is pretty safe. Laredo, not Nova Lao,

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is often included in the top ten safest cities in Texas.

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To me, Larelo seems like one of those places you

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only go if you're from there. It's not like a destination,

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like or you're yeah, yeah, yeah, you're there because you

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already live there and like you're not visiting or you

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have family there. That would be the only reason you're visiting. Yeah,

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it's not like I don't know Austin or San Antonio,

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but like I've only ever been to San Antonio. I

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can't like I haven't been to Texas, but if I went,

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I would probably go, Like I don't know like San Antonio,

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I don't know Houston unless we're visiting family. Yeah, Laredo

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is right next to Mexico along the Rio Grande, with

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the population of more than two hundred and sixty thousand.

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Going by crime rates alone, it's way safer than Dallas

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and Houston. So when four women were found dead in

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a span of two weeks, people were terrified. And then

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when connections between the murders were made.

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Speaker 2: That's her grew.

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Speaker 1: Where the connections between the murders. Yeah, okay, what did

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they say? No, I'm just repeating because I thought you

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said murderers and I was like what, oh no, no, Yeah,

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because two of them were found in the same general area,

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like literally so close to each other. Yeah, I was

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giving serial killer. Yes, yes, they were found in the

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rural roads outside of Lareedo. And these women were all

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known sex workers, all working in the same road San Bernardo,

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And this is Laredo's main road, and unlike other places,

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the sex industry here was not somewhere hidden away. Literally

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on the main road, everyone knew where it was. Blocks

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away from the high school, sex workers lined the main

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street out in the open. They were all mostly local

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and very close knit, and one of these close knit

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groups of friends was Melisaramirez, Janelle Ortiz and Claudine Luerra.

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They would sit together on an orange bench and chat

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between clients. They ate at the local takeia together. They

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shared clothes and the costs of motel rooms, and all

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three were very well known in the community. Melisar Ramirez

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was twenty nine, but she still had like this motherly

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role within the community. She had been working in San

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Bernardo for almost ten years, and she grew up in

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Rio Bravo, a low income community thirteen miles south of Ladedo,

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and she lived there with her mom, Cristina ba Navidez,

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and two of her kids, who were seven and three

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when all this was taking place twenty eighteen. It was

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a humble home with kids toy scattered around the yard

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of a mobile home, and Melissa was the third oldest

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of four siblings and as a kid she loved playing

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Mexican music on the accordion, which cool, very cool. She

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memorized all the lyrics of all of Selena's most famous songs,

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and since childhood she was known for her compassion. She

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was a really good student, but all of this changed

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when she was sexually assaulted by the uncle of one

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of her friends. Oh no, this was during high school

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and life became very difficult for her. After this, she

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turned to xanax to cope, dropped out of high school,

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then began using other drugs. By the time she became

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a mother who struggles with addiction were worse and you know,

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like everyone trying to get better, she would swear off drugs,

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be home with her kids and her mom, but it

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was difficult. It's a very difficult thing to do, and

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so then she would leave her kids again with her

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mom and take the bus to downtown Laedo and work

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the streets. And then she would be gone for a

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few days then return home again, and her mom and

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kids were always waiting for her back home. Whenever she

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would get there, Christina would cook Melissa's favorite meal for her.

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She always called her Miniamosa ever since she was a baby,

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and so when Melissa left on September tewod. Christina expected

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her back in a few days, like always, but this

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time it was different. Two detectives and two Texas Rangers

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were at her doorstep and they brought the worst news

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of Christina's life with them. Melissa had been found dead

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on a small access road twenty miles outside of Laedon.

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Speaker 2: It was around noon on.

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Speaker 1: The third September third when the Webb County Sheriff Department

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received a call from a rancher who had discovered a

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woman on the side of a dirt road.

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Speaker 2: She had been.

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Speaker 1: Lying face down. She was shot three times in the

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head and once in her right art, and she had

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been clutching a bag of M and ms when she

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was killed. Next to her there were forty caliber bullet

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casings and so to the police, this meant she had

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been shot execution style like at point blank range. And

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at the morgue, she was quickly identified as Melissa Ramidez.

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They used fingerprints, which then resulted in a two thousand

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and eight arrests for prostitution that she was in the system,

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and that's how they found out so quickly who it was,

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and the investigation started slow efforts with false leads. Christina

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remembered that Melissa had mentioned a man in a black truck,

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but after finding out who this man was, he was

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cleared completely like he had nothing to do with it.

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But unfortunately, rumors of a black truck spread among the

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women on San Bernardo and they were all warning each

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other to avoid a black truck, which again was a

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false rumor or false lead, And surveillance of the site

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showed that a police car had arrived before the assigned unit,

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or had arrived, like before the dispatch call sent a

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police car, there was already an officer there, and so

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this police car on surveillance they could see that it

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drove down the road and it turned around right where

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Melissa's body was, and so at first they were like, well,

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this is probably the murder, revisiting the murder scene. But no,

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after investigating, this was not the case. It was just

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a police officer who had been driving down the road

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to look at property he was going to buy.

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Speaker 2: Oh that's what I thought at first, Yeah, it is.

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Speaker 1: It seemed like that, and so I did leave. I guess,

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why would you want to stay there if you're not working.

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It's like, yeah, well, normally I think he would have

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to call it in, but he wasn't working yet. He

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was just in his car, probably like dropping his daughter

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off at school, and on the way there he stopped

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to look at this property. I'm not sure, but his

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daughter was in the car with oh, and he didn't

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want her to see, of course, so he turned around quickly.

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And so this at first made people think, oh, I

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got it's a police officer. And they were like, you know,

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just chasing these false leads, which again is always like,

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it's part of it, part of the investigation, but it

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sucks when they waste so much time that could have

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been you know, more fruitful. So the only leads they

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had went nowhere. And because of the location of where

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she was found, Border Patrol was brought in to assist

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with the investigation because you know, this area along the

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border is heavily surveilled, like there if we live in

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a state surveillance as a whole United States, that's a

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super state surveillance that they are under, yes, extreme, and

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you know, investigators knew that Border Patrol had automated cameras

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on a lot of these small access roads and they're

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going at all times, and so Border Patrol was asked

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to check license plates for any vehicles that were on

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that road at the time of the murder. And there

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was one Border Patrol in intelligence supervisor named Juanda Vidortis

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who led his team through these checks and he and

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his team cleared every driver.

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Speaker 2: Hmmmm.

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Speaker 1: And so for ten days the investigation was stalled. Melissa's

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killer could be anyone at this point. Then on the

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morning of September thirteenth, ten days after, forty two year

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old Claudine Luerra was found dead two miles from where

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Melissa Amidas had been discovered.

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Speaker 2: Wow, And just like.

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Speaker 1: Melissa, Claudine had been shot multiple times in the head,

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execution style. And they found the same type of forty

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caliber bullet casings next to her too. And it was

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a big rick driver who found her and called nine

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one one. But unlike Melissa, Claudine was still alive.

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Speaker 2: Oh. The driver spotted.

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Speaker 1: Her from where he was driving, pulled over, climbed down

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from his cab and checked on her and found her breathing.

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And not only that, but she hadn't managed to crawl

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from the grass like a hidden spot on the side

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of the road, deep in the grass, she crawled all

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the way to a visible spot on the road. That's

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how he was able to see her. But at this

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point she had been fighting for her life for almost

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five hours.

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Speaker 2: Wow.

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Speaker 1: She was transported to the hospital and she continued to

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live until that afternoon where she died from her head injuries.

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Speaker 2: But a long time.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, And at first, investigators tried to keep Claudine's murder quiet.

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They told the media that a woman died from head

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trauma at the hospital. They were like, yes, that happened,

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but they would say nothing else. But reporters found out

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how close together the women were found, and they connected

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the two murders right away, and so news about a

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serial killer loose on the streets of Ladedo spread quickly.

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And Claudie was one of Melissa's closest friends. But I'm

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not clear if this was part of the news being

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spread or that people just knew they were both sex

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workers that had been found two miles apart from each other.

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But you know, it would seem the killer knew they

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knew each other at least. And Claudine she grew up

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in Laedon. She attended the high school that is just

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a few blocks from San Bernardo. The streets, the street

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that they all worked on, and she had a very

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rough childhood and she never shared what happened to her.

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But something that changed her life forever took place when

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she was five, something traumatic, something that she has always

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said took all good.

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Speaker 2: Away from her. Oh some terrible.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, And she and her sister were known as Las

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Blanchitas in their childhood because they were I want to say,

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half Polish, half Mexican. And for some time she did

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try to move past her trauma. She was working as

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a clerk for the DA's office, but her struggle with

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drugs only got worse. In twenty fourteen. Her kids were

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from her care and plays with her sister, but her kids,

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like the goal of her oldest daughter, was to graduate

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as a nurse, have all their siblings buy a house, sorry,

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graduate as a nurse, buy a house, move all her siblings,

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her aunt, and her mom in the same house. They

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just wanted to all be together, even even through the

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struggles of their mom. Which is it's beautiful because again

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it is something that is so difficult for so many people. Yeah,

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And like Melissa, Claudine always talked about getting better, and

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just days before her own murder, the day Melissa was

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found dead, Claudine went to her older kid at her

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apartment and told her that she was scared and wanted

241
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to leave sex work for good because she was like,

242
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I could be next. And she said she knew who

243
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Melissa had been with last Oh, and Claudine's fears became true,

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but this wouldn't be discovered until the killer's confession. It

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turned out that Claudine was trying to figure out what

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happened to her friend. She set her fear aside and

247
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got into the killer's truck and began to ask questions.

248
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There was a confrontation and then he ordered her at

249
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gunpoint to get out of the truck and when she did,

250
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he also got out behind her, and that's when he

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killed her or not, that's when he shot her. And

252
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again she died in the hospital a few hours. I mean,

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she wasn't able to share this information because of the

254
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condition she was in. This was found out after he confessed. Yeah,

255
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it almost feels like she was trying to stay alive

256
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to try and share this information, but her injuries were

257
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too severe. Yeah, when she died in the hospital just

258
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a few hours after that, the killer was already picking

259
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up his next target.

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Speaker 2: Wow.

261
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Speaker 1: On the evening of like he this was like so fast,

262
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it's insane. It reminds me of in criminal minds when

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like one person killed like someone and then they get

264
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like the itch for it and then like it's a

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kind of like spray killing.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah.

267
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Speaker 1: On the evening of September fourteenth, twenty seven year old

268
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Erica Pena was walking San Bernardo. A white Dodge Ram

269
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pulled up to pick her up, and she of course

270
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heard what had happened to Melissa, just like the rest

271
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of the women who were working that night, but she

272
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needed the money.

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Speaker 2: Plus they had.

274
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Speaker 1: All her to watch out for a black truck and

275
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she knew the man driving. She knew that he was

276
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some sort of law enforcement and he had picked her

277
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up in the past. He was like a regular on

278
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San Bernardo and when she got on it struck he

279
00:15:38,440 --> 00:15:41,679
was normal, talkative. He drove her down to his home

280
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and said his kids and wife are out of town

281
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that weekend, because yes, he was married. Of course he

282
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was course, of course, and they talked while she smoked

283
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a cigarette. But then she asked him if he knew

284
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anything about her friend, Melissa Ramidez, and he started to

285
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act weird. He stopped smiling, he got all the offensive,

286
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and he was like, why would you ask me about

287
00:16:01,960 --> 00:16:04,679
the murder? Why would I know anything about that? And

288
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she thought it was an innocent enough question, like him

289
00:16:07,879 --> 00:16:10,120
being in some sort of law enforcement, he might know,

290
00:16:10,440 --> 00:16:14,240
he might know something. But when he got defensive, she

291
00:16:14,360 --> 00:16:17,639
started to feel uneasy and scared, of course, and she

292
00:16:17,799 --> 00:16:20,039
describes that he stood right behind her and she just

293
00:16:20,080 --> 00:16:23,279
felt like he smelt like death or something like she

294
00:16:23,399 --> 00:16:24,399
felt that and then.

295
00:16:24,320 --> 00:16:25,120
Speaker 2: She threw up.

296
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Speaker 1: She quickly, like she said. She played it off and

297
00:16:29,759 --> 00:16:31,840
said like, oh, maybe it's because I didn't eat before,

298
00:16:31,919 --> 00:16:34,679
like smoking my cigarette, and it just made my stomach like,

299
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you know, queasy. And so they got back in the

300
00:16:36,960 --> 00:16:38,960
truck and went to the gas station so he could

301
00:16:39,039 --> 00:16:42,240
just buy like a snack or something. And when he

302
00:16:42,279 --> 00:16:45,720
got back into the truck, she brought up Melissa again

303
00:16:45,799 --> 00:16:47,799
because now she was like this is now she wanted

304
00:16:47,840 --> 00:16:51,919
to like confirm if her suspicions were true. Yes, And

305
00:16:52,000 --> 00:16:55,399
this time he reached into the side compartment on her side,

306
00:16:55,799 --> 00:16:57,879
pulled out his gun and aimed it at her.

307
00:16:58,200 --> 00:16:58,720
Speaker 2: Oh wow.

308
00:16:58,960 --> 00:17:00,960
Speaker 1: But before he could do anything, she opened the door

309
00:17:01,080 --> 00:17:04,720
so fast and she jumped out, and he reached out

310
00:17:04,759 --> 00:17:06,400
and ripped her shirt off, like trying to pull her

311
00:17:06,440 --> 00:17:09,240
back in, but she fell into the sidewalk, got up,

312
00:17:09,279 --> 00:17:11,759
she sprinted across the gas station, where there happened to

313
00:17:11,799 --> 00:17:14,799
be another police officer, and she was screaming at the

314
00:17:14,799 --> 00:17:16,960
top of her lungs, at the top of her lungs,

315
00:17:16,960 --> 00:17:19,440
that he was going to kill her. But by the

316
00:17:19,440 --> 00:17:22,200
time she reached this officer, the man in the truck

317
00:17:22,279 --> 00:17:26,880
was gone. But this officer was well aware of the

318
00:17:26,920 --> 00:17:31,440
recent killings and thought this was related, and so he

319
00:17:31,519 --> 00:17:34,440
took Eddie got to the Webb County Sheriff station where

320
00:17:34,559 --> 00:17:38,960
investigators interviewed her, and she told them everything that had happened,

321
00:17:39,519 --> 00:17:44,039
and that the man was a Border Patrol agent named David,

322
00:17:44,880 --> 00:17:49,759
and normally she was terrible at directions and addresses, like

323
00:17:49,799 --> 00:17:51,240
even her family made fun of her, and so that

324
00:17:51,319 --> 00:17:52,799
she wouldn't be able to get to her own house

325
00:17:52,799 --> 00:17:55,279
from like the corner store. Sounds like someone I know

326
00:17:55,759 --> 00:17:58,200
both of us, Yeah, yeah, I was going to say,

327
00:17:58,200 --> 00:18:01,440
actually two people I know, two people that share one

328
00:18:01,440 --> 00:18:04,920
brain cell, yes, yeah, yeah, But this time, no, this

329
00:18:05,039 --> 00:18:10,079
time she remembered his address. Wow, And so investigators searched

330
00:18:10,079 --> 00:18:12,119
that up. They got a hit and they found that

331
00:18:12,160 --> 00:18:16,680
it belonged to Juan David Orthiz, the very same intelligence

332
00:18:17,119 --> 00:18:23,240
officer who had been assisting the murdered investigation. Shocking why

333
00:18:23,279 --> 00:18:26,599
they kept getting nowhere? Yeah, shocking Why none of the

334
00:18:26,599 --> 00:18:32,880
cars were matching because he lied. Yeah. And by the

335
00:18:32,960 --> 00:18:35,519
time they arrived at his house, he was gone.

336
00:18:35,920 --> 00:18:36,119
Speaker 2: Yeah.

337
00:18:36,160 --> 00:18:38,359
Speaker 1: By the time they had this information, got a warrant,

338
00:18:38,599 --> 00:18:40,920
then were able to go to his house. Yeah, he

339
00:18:41,039 --> 00:18:44,319
was gone. It was now after midnight on the fifteenth,

340
00:18:45,400 --> 00:18:46,640
and you know, they had a warrant, so they were

341
00:18:46,680 --> 00:18:49,240
able to go inside the house and they found twelve weapons,

342
00:18:49,279 --> 00:18:53,359
including rifles, pistols, and a shotgun. They put out a

343
00:18:53,359 --> 00:18:56,240
bolo with the description of his truck and of him.

344
00:18:56,680 --> 00:18:58,920
But just before the bolo went out, he was already

345
00:18:58,960 --> 00:19:04,319
picking up his next victim. Damn, you can't even chill

346
00:19:04,400 --> 00:19:05,039
for one night.

347
00:19:06,039 --> 00:19:06,240
Speaker 2: No.

348
00:19:08,960 --> 00:19:12,799
Speaker 1: And so this was Grisel la Cantou, who went by

349
00:19:12,880 --> 00:19:16,200
Celli and Celli mostly kept to herself. She carried all

350
00:19:16,200 --> 00:19:18,079
of her things in a bag and she would be

351
00:19:18,119 --> 00:19:22,559
seen packing and repacking this same bag in between clients.

352
00:19:23,119 --> 00:19:26,960
And maybe because she was so quiet and kept to herself,

353
00:19:26,960 --> 00:19:31,559
she wasn't aware of fully what was going on or

354
00:19:31,559 --> 00:19:34,440
the danger she was in when she got into the

355
00:19:34,480 --> 00:19:38,119
men's truck, But she got into his truck. And again,

356
00:19:38,119 --> 00:19:40,359
they're all here because they needed the money. They need

357
00:19:40,359 --> 00:19:43,200
to keep working, so even when there's a dangerous case

358
00:19:43,279 --> 00:19:47,000
like this, they can't stop working. So yeah, she got

359
00:19:47,039 --> 00:19:49,480
into his truck because you know, she had to. And

360
00:19:49,559 --> 00:19:52,920
so he spent twenty miles north on Interstate thirty five,

361
00:19:53,000 --> 00:19:55,039
where he demanded her to get out of the truck

362
00:19:55,240 --> 00:19:58,279
and then he shut her in the neck twice and

363
00:19:58,319 --> 00:19:59,839
then he still hit her over the head with the

364
00:20:00,079 --> 00:20:03,640
an object, like, oh my gosh, that wasn't enough. Why,

365
00:20:03,759 --> 00:20:04,640
like what is the reason?

366
00:20:05,759 --> 00:20:05,960
Speaker 2: Right?

367
00:20:06,519 --> 00:20:09,519
Speaker 1: So then he got back into his truck and sped,

368
00:20:09,559 --> 00:20:12,519
and he must have been speeding because like they're already

369
00:20:12,799 --> 00:20:16,359
looking for him. Yeah, but he sped back to San Bernardo,

370
00:20:16,519 --> 00:20:20,480
using back roads to avoid the very like where they

371
00:20:20,519 --> 00:20:23,759
were doing searches already on the main main roads. And

372
00:20:23,880 --> 00:20:26,720
so then he pulled up next to two women and

373
00:20:26,799 --> 00:20:29,079
he asked if one of them would be his date,

374
00:20:29,480 --> 00:20:34,000
and twenty eight year old Janelle Ortiz agreed because she

375
00:20:34,079 --> 00:20:36,960
had been sleeping under a bridge lately and she really

376
00:20:37,039 --> 00:20:40,400
needed the money, and I mean they needed to feed

377
00:20:40,440 --> 00:20:44,880
themselves and to eat. That's going to outweigh the safety

378
00:20:44,920 --> 00:20:47,279
issues of what's going on right now, like that's always

379
00:20:47,319 --> 00:20:49,359
going to well, and everything was happening so quickly they

380
00:20:49,400 --> 00:20:51,839
might not be up to date on the information. Plus

381
00:20:51,880 --> 00:20:55,400
they had last heard to keep away from a black truck,

382
00:20:55,440 --> 00:20:59,319
like you had said earlier. So yeah that too. So yeah,

383
00:20:59,359 --> 00:21:03,200
she got in his truck. But just a few days before,

384
00:21:03,880 --> 00:21:07,599
her santam Merta figure that she always carried around had

385
00:21:07,720 --> 00:21:10,640
snapped at the head, and she took this as a

386
00:21:10,680 --> 00:21:12,960
sign that something bad was going to hold to her.

387
00:21:13,640 --> 00:21:17,160
She had been a devout Santa Morta follower since her transition,

388
00:21:18,039 --> 00:21:21,599
and to her this was an omen So she got

389
00:21:21,640 --> 00:21:26,079
in his truck and he again drove down inners thirty five,

390
00:21:26,400 --> 00:21:29,680
and just like everyone else, he ordered her to get

391
00:21:29,720 --> 00:21:31,640
out of the truck and shot her in the back

392
00:21:31,680 --> 00:21:34,960
of the head. And her last words were, if we're.

393
00:21:34,839 --> 00:21:37,519
Speaker 2: Going to do it, then do it. Wow.

394
00:21:38,640 --> 00:21:40,920
Speaker 1: And then the man did just as he had before,

395
00:21:41,000 --> 00:21:43,480
He got in his truck and sped back into town,

396
00:21:43,640 --> 00:21:48,240
probably trying to find someone else to dam It's absolutely wild.

397
00:21:48,839 --> 00:21:49,359
Speaker 2: Yeah.

398
00:21:49,559 --> 00:21:52,759
Speaker 1: By now it was one am. On the sixteenth and Highway.

399
00:21:52,799 --> 00:21:56,480
Patrol troopers had driven past a Valero gas station where

400
00:21:56,480 --> 00:21:58,759
they saw a white Dodge Ram truck in the parking

401
00:21:58,799 --> 00:22:01,839
lot and it matched the BOLO that had been sent

402
00:22:01,920 --> 00:22:05,200
out earlier, and the truck was unattended, so they went

403
00:22:05,359 --> 00:22:07,759
to look inside the truck and they saw the forty

404
00:22:07,799 --> 00:22:14,759
caliber pistol, which matched the previous scenes crime scenes, and

405
00:22:14,799 --> 00:22:18,279
so the officers headed into the gas station tasers drawn

406
00:22:18,440 --> 00:22:23,559
to apprehend him, but he saw them and he fled

407
00:22:23,680 --> 00:22:27,359
on foot through the side door down San Bernardo Avenue

408
00:22:27,480 --> 00:22:31,480
and he ran until he got to Hotel Eva, where

409
00:22:31,480 --> 00:22:33,279
then he just tried to hide behind cards in the

410
00:22:33,279 --> 00:22:37,000
parking lot, but he was surrounded. And by now this

411
00:22:37,160 --> 00:22:39,680
was all being live streamed by a woman who went

412
00:22:39,720 --> 00:22:45,720
by La Gorliloca Oh wow, Brisila via real who this

413
00:22:45,759 --> 00:22:47,720
is what she did. She had a Facebook page with

414
00:22:47,759 --> 00:22:51,680
over one hundred thousand followers, and she filmed and broadcasted

415
00:22:51,839 --> 00:22:54,240
these kinds of things like that was her job. And

416
00:22:54,279 --> 00:22:56,759
so she was at the scene already. And I don't

417
00:22:56,799 --> 00:22:59,680
remember which one of the victims, but one of their

418
00:22:59,680 --> 00:23:03,039
family members ended up watching the live stream. But at

419
00:23:03,039 --> 00:23:06,359
this point nobody knew that that it was him. No,

420
00:23:06,480 --> 00:23:11,119
that Janelle and Oh they didn't know they had been killed. Yeah,

421
00:23:11,160 --> 00:23:14,279
they had no idea because well, everything again happened so

422
00:23:14,759 --> 00:23:19,079
fast after after Eddieka escaped the other two. He didn't

423
00:23:19,200 --> 00:23:21,400
he did that so fast, and so like their family

424
00:23:21,400 --> 00:23:23,279
members were watching and they had no idea that their

425
00:23:23,279 --> 00:23:25,599
own family members had been murdered by this man. Oh

426
00:23:25,680 --> 00:23:30,880
that's terrible, it is. And so while this was all

427
00:23:30,920 --> 00:23:35,880
being live streamed, police were surrounded him. Jus was hiding

428
00:23:35,880 --> 00:23:37,599
in the bed of a truck in this parking lot

429
00:23:37,759 --> 00:23:40,039
and he got on Facebook and posted to my wife

430
00:23:40,079 --> 00:23:43,160
and kids, I love you, and then he posted doc

431
00:23:43,279 --> 00:23:46,119
or these checks out farewell, I shaid the fuck up

432
00:23:46,200 --> 00:23:47,480
just three years off in God.

433
00:23:48,359 --> 00:23:49,799
Speaker 2: Yeah.

434
00:23:49,960 --> 00:23:52,680
Speaker 1: So at some point he tried to point his gun,

435
00:23:52,920 --> 00:23:55,519
like point his phone like a gun maybe to try

436
00:23:55,559 --> 00:23:58,279
and like have the cops kill him and you know,

437
00:23:58,400 --> 00:23:59,160
like do it.

438
00:23:59,440 --> 00:24:00,480
Speaker 2: Let's try to do.

439
00:24:01,440 --> 00:24:06,359
Speaker 1: Death by cop or what is it called, something like that,

440
00:24:06,519 --> 00:24:09,279
something like that. But it didn't work, and at two

441
00:24:09,319 --> 00:24:11,440
three four am he came out with his hands in

442
00:24:11,440 --> 00:24:14,480
the air and he was arrested. And once they got

443
00:24:14,519 --> 00:24:18,160
to the police station, he refused to talk until they

444
00:24:18,240 --> 00:24:20,400
let him, what is it? They brought him a picture

445
00:24:20,400 --> 00:24:22,200
of his wife and kids, like, go now, you want

446
00:24:22,240 --> 00:24:25,359
to be a family man, now after you've murdered all

447
00:24:25,400 --> 00:24:30,119
these people and you've like please, but who was this man?

448
00:24:30,359 --> 00:24:38,440
I guess, I guess I'll talk about him. His arrest

449
00:24:38,599 --> 00:24:42,480
came at a time when Border Patrol was under public scrutiny. Personally,

450
00:24:42,519 --> 00:24:45,000
they should always be under public scrutiny and shouldn't exist.

451
00:24:45,079 --> 00:24:45,799
Speaker 2: But agreed.

452
00:24:47,720 --> 00:24:52,799
Speaker 1: But his arrest again in twenty eighteen, it was under

453
00:24:53,039 --> 00:24:54,960
It was a time when Border Patrol was under public

454
00:24:55,000 --> 00:24:59,200
scrutiny for accepting unqualified applicants. So then people kept asking, well,

455
00:24:59,200 --> 00:25:03,000
how could they let us heeral killer in? How could

456
00:25:03,039 --> 00:25:06,160
they not see this? But like on paper, he seemed

457
00:25:06,160 --> 00:25:10,079
like a highly qualified applicant. And I would argue that

458
00:25:10,200 --> 00:25:12,599
this is the exact type of person that is attracted

459
00:25:12,640 --> 00:25:17,519
to institutions like Board Patrol. Yeah, I would argue the same, Yeah,

460
00:25:17,680 --> 00:25:20,920
a violent person, because this is a violent agency. Like,

461
00:25:21,160 --> 00:25:22,920
how are you going to tell me that a good

462
00:25:22,960 --> 00:25:25,519
person is going to join an agency that tells their

463
00:25:25,640 --> 00:25:30,079
employees to destroy water for dying migrants, who watches dying

464
00:25:30,160 --> 00:25:32,680
migrants in their face and refuses to get medical help

465
00:25:32,720 --> 00:25:38,200
for them. Yeah, who constantly rape women and children? Who

466
00:25:38,279 --> 00:25:42,079
randomly shoots into Mexico? Right, please?

467
00:25:42,839 --> 00:25:43,839
Speaker 2: So to me?

468
00:25:45,119 --> 00:25:48,200
Speaker 1: Of course, of course it's no surprise. But again, not

469
00:25:48,240 --> 00:25:52,200
everyone's there yet. Not everybody understands this, I think. Yeah, so,

470
00:25:52,559 --> 00:25:55,400
like I was saying on paper, he was the perfect candidate.

471
00:25:55,880 --> 00:25:58,640
He was born in Brownsville, Texas, the oldest of four

472
00:25:58,759 --> 00:26:02,359
kids and a single parent household his mom. He went

473
00:26:02,400 --> 00:26:05,680
to gladys Porter Early College high school, where he ran

474
00:26:05,799 --> 00:26:09,279
cross country. He swam competitively. He was a member of

475
00:26:09,319 --> 00:26:12,079
the Fellowship of Christian Athletes and a member of the

476
00:26:12,160 --> 00:26:17,119
Assembly of God Church, a youth group in the church. Shocking, yes,

477
00:26:18,000 --> 00:26:20,440
and all. This was emphasized during the trial to show

478
00:26:20,440 --> 00:26:23,400
that he was a quote all American boy. Those are

479
00:26:23,480 --> 00:26:27,720
red flags if anything, except the cross country, except the

480
00:26:27,720 --> 00:26:31,559
swimming and cross Nope, except the cross country. Yeah, swimming

481
00:26:31,599 --> 00:26:32,160
is a red flag.

482
00:26:32,200 --> 00:26:35,319
Speaker 2: Sorry, didn't he used to swim?

483
00:26:36,279 --> 00:26:41,079
Speaker 1: No swimming competitive being in sports, oh not recreationally. A

484
00:26:41,400 --> 00:26:44,720
quote A good sorry, A quote, good Christian man who

485
00:26:44,759 --> 00:26:46,079
was suffering from mental health.

486
00:26:46,200 --> 00:26:46,799
Speaker 2: End quote.

487
00:26:48,440 --> 00:26:53,559
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, you know, good man. Don't go on killing spreeds.

488
00:26:54,319 --> 00:26:55,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, it doesn't matter.

489
00:26:55,599 --> 00:26:59,519
Speaker 1: How you want to twist this shit around like good

490
00:26:59,519 --> 00:27:04,759
people don't go on killing spreez. Yeah. Period one month

491
00:27:04,799 --> 00:27:08,119
after his eighteenth birthday, before nine to eleven happened, he

492
00:27:08,200 --> 00:27:10,920
had enlisted in the US Navy as a coreman, so

493
00:27:11,119 --> 00:27:15,240
a medic. He was attached to the Marine Corps Air

494
00:27:15,480 --> 00:27:20,200
Ground Combat Center in twenty nine Palms in California. His

495
00:27:20,359 --> 00:27:23,480
union was deployed to Baghdad in two thousand and three,

496
00:27:24,119 --> 00:27:27,079
where he saw intense combat. As that's probably where he

497
00:27:27,160 --> 00:27:31,599
practiced serial killer killing the first time. Right. Again, we

498
00:27:31,640 --> 00:27:35,960
don't say this like we know not all soldiers, right,

499
00:27:36,039 --> 00:27:39,720
but it is a fact that wherever the US military goes,

500
00:27:41,559 --> 00:27:48,359
sexual assaults increase. Yeah, and so it happened in these places.

501
00:27:49,720 --> 00:27:52,880
So after he met his wife, he got married. Then

502
00:27:52,920 --> 00:27:55,519
he was stationed in Fort sam Houston in the Training

503
00:27:55,599 --> 00:28:00,200
Support Center, and he got a bachelor's degree during that time.

504
00:28:00,319 --> 00:28:02,039
And then in two thousand and nine he left the

505
00:28:02,119 --> 00:28:06,000
Navy and joined Border Patrol pretty much right away, though

506
00:28:06,039 --> 00:28:12,400
he did consider the San Antonio Police Department, but this

507
00:28:12,480 --> 00:28:14,920
part okay, So, but he went with Border Patrol because,

508
00:28:14,960 --> 00:28:18,119
according to a friend quote, he didn't just want to

509
00:28:18,119 --> 00:28:20,720
stop the bad guys. He wanted to use his medical

510
00:28:20,759 --> 00:28:23,319
skills to help migrants who had been traveling for days

511
00:28:23,319 --> 00:28:25,319
in the desert just to get to the US end.

512
00:28:25,400 --> 00:28:29,839
Quote sure, that's what I'm sorry, that's not what Border

513
00:28:29,839 --> 00:28:31,920
Patrol does. If you want to do that, join a

514
00:28:31,960 --> 00:28:35,000
non profit organization like Alotlado, who does leave water for

515
00:28:35,119 --> 00:28:37,079
migrants and care packages.

516
00:28:37,960 --> 00:28:38,200
Speaker 2: Yeah.

517
00:28:39,200 --> 00:28:41,720
Speaker 1: In his spare time from Border Patrol, he worked on

518
00:28:41,759 --> 00:28:46,440
a master's degree in international relations, which he earned in

519
00:28:46,440 --> 00:28:50,519
twenty thirteen. He rose through the ranks and was promoted

520
00:28:50,519 --> 00:28:55,720
to intelligence supervisor in twenty seventeen, putting his international whatever

521
00:28:55,759 --> 00:28:57,920
the hell it was called, degree to use.

522
00:28:58,079 --> 00:28:59,039
Speaker 2: Yeah.

523
00:28:59,200 --> 00:29:01,640
Speaker 1: Though he was again rising through the rings, he was

524
00:29:01,720 --> 00:29:04,759
texting an old marine friend about how hard border patrol was.

525
00:29:05,079 --> 00:29:06,960
He would tell his friend, like, it feels like he

526
00:29:07,039 --> 00:29:09,839
was back in Iraq, that he was going to war

527
00:29:09,960 --> 00:29:10,480
every day.

528
00:29:10,680 --> 00:29:15,880
Speaker 2: Oh what if you just quit? Hold on? Hold on again,

529
00:29:18,759 --> 00:29:19,640
I swear to god.

530
00:29:21,480 --> 00:29:24,480
Speaker 1: His friend told him, quote, Doc, you're a good guy.

531
00:29:24,519 --> 00:29:26,279
You need to take care of yourself and your family.

532
00:29:26,319 --> 00:29:28,200
Have you thought about quitting Border patrol?

533
00:29:28,319 --> 00:29:29,440
Speaker 2: Wow? Wow?

534
00:29:29,720 --> 00:29:34,599
Speaker 1: Did you what an idea? But Juan da Vidortiz replied

535
00:29:34,640 --> 00:29:36,440
that he couldn't do that because he was doing his

536
00:29:36,519 --> 00:29:39,200
best to help all the people who need a help. Again,

537
00:29:39,400 --> 00:29:42,119
who was he actually helping? Is there any like no

538
00:29:42,240 --> 00:29:47,000
record of him actually helping migrants, because like there's maybe

539
00:29:47,039 --> 00:29:51,599
like one story out there of an actual border patrol

540
00:29:51,599 --> 00:29:54,799
officer helping you know, migrants.

541
00:29:55,079 --> 00:29:56,759
Speaker 2: You hear about that, especially more back.

542
00:29:56,559 --> 00:29:59,880
Speaker 1: In the day, you know, now I think it's less

543
00:30:00,119 --> 00:30:04,480
yeah common now, So I'm just so doubtful of that.

544
00:30:04,759 --> 00:30:05,440
Speaker 2: No, me too.

545
00:30:05,519 --> 00:30:09,119
Speaker 1: He wanted probably more opportunity to terrorize people, and that's

546
00:30:09,119 --> 00:30:11,319
why he couldn't lead to feel he was addicted to

547
00:30:11,319 --> 00:30:16,000
that feeling of power. The power, yes, the so like

548
00:30:16,079 --> 00:30:19,440
he had never had any disciplinary actions within bord patrol.

549
00:30:19,519 --> 00:30:21,160
Speaker 2: The only thing on record.

550
00:30:21,759 --> 00:30:24,440
Speaker 1: Disciplined anybody, That's why, But go ahead.

551
00:30:24,319 --> 00:30:24,920
Speaker 2: No they don't.

552
00:30:26,680 --> 00:30:29,119
Speaker 1: But the only thing on record is that a migrant

553
00:30:29,240 --> 00:30:32,640
after he was apprehended by Juan, a migrant reported that

554
00:30:32,960 --> 00:30:34,880
he took a cigarette from him. But he stole a

555
00:30:34,880 --> 00:30:38,400
cigarette from him. So I don't think stealing cigarettes from

556
00:30:38,400 --> 00:30:40,759
migrants is helping them.

557
00:30:41,119 --> 00:30:43,319
Speaker 2: Well, he's helping them to not smoke. You know what,

558
00:30:44,000 --> 00:30:45,440
Let the migrants smoke.

559
00:30:45,480 --> 00:30:50,759
Speaker 1: Okay, you already caught them, Like a migrant's been thrown off, No,

560
00:30:50,880 --> 00:30:55,920
but seriously, and so in his personal life everything seemed fine.

561
00:30:56,000 --> 00:30:58,119
He had just bought a house with his wife and

562
00:30:58,200 --> 00:31:02,519
Sonny in the Signey Sea throw ran of La neighborhood

563
00:31:02,559 --> 00:31:05,000
of Laredo. He spent all his free time with his

564
00:31:05,079 --> 00:31:08,240
kids and wife, except for Saturdays, where he went hunting

565
00:31:08,319 --> 00:31:10,559
or fishing with his best man, Jerry Solie.

566
00:31:12,240 --> 00:31:13,720
Speaker 2: I was going to say where he went hunting for

567
00:31:13,799 --> 00:31:16,359
sex workers. I mean.

568
00:31:18,240 --> 00:31:23,000
Speaker 1: On Sundays he attended the First Assembly of God church

569
00:31:23,079 --> 00:31:26,720
with his family, and FYI, this is an evangelical church.

570
00:31:26,799 --> 00:31:33,160
I'm just on this fact. It is evangelical. The number

571
00:31:33,240 --> 00:31:39,000
one what is that word? Supporters of Trump. Yeah, very

572
00:31:39,039 --> 00:31:43,920
godly of them. This picture perfect American dream life was

573
00:31:44,039 --> 00:31:47,519
not real. At some point, Juanda Vidortis went to the

574
00:31:47,599 --> 00:31:51,119
VA and was prescribed some sort of medication. The VA

575
00:31:51,240 --> 00:31:53,440
has never disclosed what this was because they were like

576
00:31:53,960 --> 00:31:59,799
confidentiality patient confidentially obviously we can't say that. But Jerry Soli,

577
00:32:00,599 --> 00:32:04,839
his friend, said that he Juana Juan or Thiez, had

578
00:32:04,839 --> 00:32:09,440
told him he'd been prescribed antipsychotic medication and he would

579
00:32:09,440 --> 00:32:12,160
also see him drinking and insane him ount while on

580
00:32:12,200 --> 00:32:14,319
this medication, which probably doesn't mix well.

581
00:32:14,880 --> 00:32:15,920
Speaker 2: Yeah.

582
00:32:16,119 --> 00:32:18,960
Speaker 1: At some point in the summer of twenty eighteen, or

583
00:32:19,039 --> 00:32:22,160
thieves also showed Jerry solisa picture of a young woman

584
00:32:22,279 --> 00:32:24,559
on his phone and he said he met her at

585
00:32:24,559 --> 00:32:27,880
Gold's gym. And Jerry was like, what the fuck? What?

586
00:32:28,079 --> 00:32:29,640
Speaker 2: What about your wife? Man?

587
00:32:29,680 --> 00:32:31,720
Speaker 1: What about your wife and kids? Yeah, you're really gonna

588
00:32:31,720 --> 00:32:34,480
throw this all away for some random girlfriend you suddenly have.

589
00:32:35,119 --> 00:32:39,920
This wasn't a girlfriend. It was Melissa Ramirez, his first victim.

590
00:32:40,240 --> 00:32:44,559
Speaker 2: Oh wow, just days.

591
00:32:44,640 --> 00:32:48,200
Speaker 1: After showing Jerry Solisa's picture Juan dirie Rothe's murderer.

592
00:32:48,960 --> 00:32:52,000
Speaker 2: Wow. And he probably.

593
00:32:51,640 --> 00:32:54,039
Speaker 1: Would have been able to continue to hide his crimes

594
00:32:54,200 --> 00:32:57,920
very easily because of his position within border patrol. But

595
00:32:58,039 --> 00:33:02,359
this all went downhill when Eddie got pen escaped. If

596
00:33:02,400 --> 00:33:04,640
she had not escaped and had not given his exact

597
00:33:04,680 --> 00:33:07,079
address like, he would have kept doing this.

598
00:33:07,559 --> 00:33:08,680
Speaker 2: Yeah.

599
00:33:09,119 --> 00:33:11,920
Speaker 1: When news of who he was and his past came

600
00:33:11,920 --> 00:33:15,759
to light, people kept talking about his PTSD his mental health,

601
00:33:16,240 --> 00:33:21,079
citing it as the reason for what he had done.

602
00:33:21,519 --> 00:33:30,119
But no, please, he was misogynistic. He talked about hating

603
00:33:30,160 --> 00:33:33,720
sex workers even though he regularly sought their services.

604
00:33:33,920 --> 00:33:35,839
Speaker 2: They always do that shit.

605
00:33:36,160 --> 00:33:39,640
Speaker 1: They always do that, and it's like, yes, he had PTSD,

606
00:33:39,799 --> 00:33:46,519
but the problem is his extreme misogyny and hatred of women. Yeah,

607
00:33:47,200 --> 00:33:52,759
and this already normalized cultural violence. And then he was

608
00:33:52,839 --> 00:34:00,240
in spaces where because violence is normalized in our society already, right,

609
00:34:00,279 --> 00:34:04,640
as well as misogyny, but he was in these spaces

610
00:34:04,759 --> 00:34:10,199
where it was even more, even more normalized. Praise even

611
00:34:10,360 --> 00:34:15,440
expected the military, the evangelical church, Yes, stay mad about it.

612
00:34:16,000 --> 00:34:16,760
Border patrol.

613
00:34:18,119 --> 00:34:18,679
Speaker 2: Yeah.

614
00:34:18,719 --> 00:34:21,119
Speaker 1: And I'm not sure if it was during his confession

615
00:34:21,280 --> 00:34:23,480
or during the trial or both where he would say this,

616
00:34:23,760 --> 00:34:26,119
or he would say sex workers were quote scum of

617
00:34:26,119 --> 00:34:29,760
the earth, trash and that he was quote cleaning up

618
00:34:29,800 --> 00:34:32,760
the street. Of course, of course he said that, and

619
00:34:32,840 --> 00:34:37,360
again he was out here regularly seeking their services. Like,

620
00:34:37,960 --> 00:34:39,960
but they do this, the kind of people that have

621
00:34:40,039 --> 00:34:42,639
the mentality. Somehow it never applies to them, even though

622
00:34:42,679 --> 00:34:44,639
again they are the ones looking for it too.

623
00:34:44,960 --> 00:34:45,760
Speaker 2: It's not their fault.

624
00:34:45,760 --> 00:34:48,519
Speaker 1: It's always a women's fault. It's a sex fault, not

625
00:34:48,559 --> 00:34:51,159
his fault that he's seeking out, they're enticing him. It's

626
00:34:51,199 --> 00:34:53,320
probably his fault. And oh not sorry, it's probably their

627
00:34:53,320 --> 00:34:54,320
fault and his wife's fault.

628
00:34:54,360 --> 00:34:54,880
Speaker 2: Somehow too.

629
00:34:55,519 --> 00:34:58,159
Speaker 1: Yeah, probably, although I can't confirm that in this case

630
00:34:58,199 --> 00:35:02,800
that that was ever believed anyway. Days after his arrest,

631
00:35:02,840 --> 00:35:05,920
one hundred and fifty mourners gathered, including the families of

632
00:35:06,000 --> 00:35:10,480
the women. Claudine Luerra's sister said, quote, but what you

633
00:35:10,559 --> 00:35:12,519
have to understand is that all of these women grew

634
00:35:12,599 --> 00:35:15,719
up in our community. We love them and cared for them.

635
00:35:16,119 --> 00:35:18,920
We always felt hoped they would changed. You might not

636
00:35:19,039 --> 00:35:21,199
understand this, but we never turn our backs on our

637
00:35:21,199 --> 00:35:23,760
loved ones just because they are going through hard times.

638
00:35:23,960 --> 00:35:28,639
That's part of our culture down here. End quote. And yes, yes,

639
00:35:31,239 --> 00:35:35,000
the community came together to donate money for Melissa Ramidez's

640
00:35:35,039 --> 00:35:38,440
cremation because the first thing that her mother, Christina Bernavina

641
00:35:38,559 --> 00:35:41,760
said after the police left was like, how am I

642
00:35:41,800 --> 00:35:43,480
going to tell my grandkids? And how am I going

643
00:35:43,559 --> 00:35:46,199
to pay for a funeral? So they came together to

644
00:35:46,280 --> 00:35:53,159
contribute for this. Erica Pena who escaped, she was so

645
00:35:53,280 --> 00:35:56,840
traumatized by her encounter with Juanda vid Ortiz that she

646
00:35:56,880 --> 00:36:00,440
couldn't go outside. She barely ate or slept. When she sleep,

647
00:36:00,519 --> 00:36:03,360
she had nightmares that he was chasing her in his

648
00:36:03,400 --> 00:36:08,760
white truck and through all this the trial, his wife

649
00:36:08,800 --> 00:36:13,360
continued to support juandavidrtis, Oh my god, I'm sorry, but

650
00:36:13,679 --> 00:36:18,360
if I would never stand by a man period not

651
00:36:21,679 --> 00:36:26,039
end of sentence, No further information necessary. No, like I

652
00:36:26,079 --> 00:36:28,639
know they said, through sickness and whatever, but like in

653
00:36:28,679 --> 00:36:36,239
this a killing spree. No, no, no. But she believed

654
00:36:36,239 --> 00:36:38,400
that it was her fault because she encouraged him to

655
00:36:38,400 --> 00:36:40,760
go to the vier and the medications to the via

656
00:36:40,840 --> 00:36:43,840
gave him caused all of this. It wasn't the medication.

657
00:36:44,880 --> 00:36:48,920
It was a hatred of woman and his supposed moral superiority,

658
00:36:49,480 --> 00:36:54,159
fueled by his environment, and her belief that it's her

659
00:36:54,199 --> 00:36:59,119
fault is also fueled by her environment the evangelical church.

660
00:37:00,119 --> 00:37:05,880
Speaker 2: Yeah.

661
00:37:06,000 --> 00:37:08,079
Speaker 1: During the trial, he said that the reason he did

662
00:37:08,119 --> 00:37:10,199
it was to clean up the streets, that as he

663
00:37:10,320 --> 00:37:14,440
drove down San Bernardo in Laredo, he felt quote the

664
00:37:14,480 --> 00:37:20,519
monster come out. That's not a monster, that a man. Yeah,

665
00:37:20,599 --> 00:37:27,920
that's not a monster, that's the patriarchy. He so he

666
00:37:27,920 --> 00:37:31,039
he I think the first At some point he he

667
00:37:31,119 --> 00:37:34,599
pled not guilty to everything, despite his detailed and lung confession,

668
00:37:35,159 --> 00:37:38,480
which he said he was like, what's it called coerce

669
00:37:38,519 --> 00:37:41,679
to do? Because he was like not not. When he

670
00:37:41,719 --> 00:37:45,239
was arrested, and then he was brought in supposedly, the

671
00:37:45,239 --> 00:37:48,639
detective was like, listen, you already messed up. We already

672
00:37:48,639 --> 00:37:51,960
know you did this. If you confess your at least

673
00:37:51,960 --> 00:37:54,400
your wife can have your pension and you will be

674
00:37:54,559 --> 00:37:57,039
she'll be taken care of. And that sounds like something

675
00:37:57,079 --> 00:38:00,360
they would say. Honestly, it sounds like things they say normally. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

676
00:38:00,400 --> 00:38:02,840
so whatever to me, that doesn't sound like I don't know,

677
00:38:03,239 --> 00:38:05,280
I I don't know if that's coercion. I think that's

678
00:38:05,320 --> 00:38:09,440
their usual line of questioning and explanation and manipulation, which

679
00:38:09,480 --> 00:38:11,960
they are legally. Yeah, I'm not saying it's right, but

680
00:38:12,079 --> 00:38:16,360
legally yeah, they're allowed to lie to you. Yeah. And

681
00:38:16,440 --> 00:38:18,960
so yeah, they were trying to say there was no evidence,

682
00:38:19,039 --> 00:38:22,840
but again, the weapon was in his house, right, so

683
00:38:23,039 --> 00:38:24,800
or on him. I don't one of the two for sure.

684
00:38:24,840 --> 00:38:30,079
But so the detailed and lung confession, which led them

685
00:38:30,119 --> 00:38:32,119
to the two other women that they didn't even know

686
00:38:32,280 --> 00:38:34,800
had been murdered. When he was arrested, he led them

687
00:38:34,800 --> 00:38:35,920
straight to them like please.

688
00:38:37,440 --> 00:38:37,760
Speaker 2: Yeah.

689
00:38:38,119 --> 00:38:40,760
Speaker 1: So all this was shown to the jury, along with

690
00:38:41,480 --> 00:38:48,239
autopsy pictures and one juror was dismissed after the autopsy

691
00:38:48,280 --> 00:38:51,599
pictures because he fainted when he saw them. Oh wow,

692
00:38:52,280 --> 00:38:56,960
that's how impactful it was. On day five of the trial,

693
00:38:57,159 --> 00:39:00,199
he again is when he shared his motive that he

694
00:39:00,239 --> 00:39:02,000
wanted to clean the streets up because no one else

695
00:39:02,079 --> 00:39:06,480
was doing it. Apparently again he sought out these services,

696
00:39:06,559 --> 00:39:10,039
so right. Also he told his friend Melissa Raminez was

697
00:39:10,039 --> 00:39:16,519
his girlfriend. So a different woman who spoke to the

698
00:39:16,639 --> 00:39:21,079
Guardian anonymously under Anna Karen. I don't think this was

699
00:39:21,079 --> 00:39:23,719
included in the trial. I think this happened way after.

700
00:39:23,840 --> 00:39:29,079
She talked to the Guardian. But she said that Juandais

701
00:39:29,199 --> 00:39:32,039
was a regular client of hers and that he was

702
00:39:32,119 --> 00:39:35,960
always talking about Eddie Gapa, the woman who escaped from him,

703
00:39:36,360 --> 00:39:40,280
and when meeting Anna Karen, he would ask about Edika.

704
00:39:40,480 --> 00:39:43,599
Does Edika use needles? Does Ediga take showers? Does Edika

705
00:39:44,639 --> 00:39:47,559
have hepatitis? And the woman would be like, can we

706
00:39:47,559 --> 00:39:48,119
talk about me?

707
00:39:48,280 --> 00:39:48,800
Speaker 2: Like please?

708
00:39:49,719 --> 00:39:51,719
Speaker 1: He would say that Edika was the only one who'd

709
00:39:51,760 --> 00:39:54,440
been to his house and that Anna Karen could be

710
00:39:54,480 --> 00:39:58,039
the second to ever go to his house, but that

711
00:39:58,320 --> 00:40:01,840
he was obsessed with eddieka Pa. Wow, so this doesn't

712
00:40:01,880 --> 00:40:04,320
sound like someone trying to clean up the streets. Well, no,

713
00:40:05,119 --> 00:40:09,559
because we know that wasn't real. Yeah, but luckily he

714
00:40:09,719 --> 00:40:12,480
was found guilty and sentenced to life in prison without

715
00:40:12,519 --> 00:40:17,360
the possibility of parole. Surprisingly, the I don't remember who

716
00:40:17,559 --> 00:40:20,760
was a judge who was like, the death sentence is

717
00:40:20,800 --> 00:40:23,159
not going to be considered because this is Texas. Like,

718
00:40:23,519 --> 00:40:26,480
I'm just surprised. I don't agree with the death sentence

719
00:40:26,559 --> 00:40:29,119
or with the death sentence, but it was off the table.

720
00:40:29,239 --> 00:40:31,000
But he was sentenced to life in prison without the

721
00:40:31,000 --> 00:40:34,280
possibility of parole. And after the verdict, family members of

722
00:40:34,320 --> 00:40:38,079
the victims gave their impact statements. Melissa Tremds, his sister

723
00:40:38,119 --> 00:40:40,760
in law, said that she was quote a loving, kind

724
00:40:40,800 --> 00:40:44,159
and funny person and the hearts of Melissa's children are

725
00:40:44,199 --> 00:40:48,480
now broken. She asked Juanna Vidertis if he knew how

726
00:40:48,559 --> 00:40:51,760
much pain he caused their family, and then she said

727
00:40:51,800 --> 00:40:54,440
that her heart is torn apart, knowing that she won't

728
00:40:54,440 --> 00:40:57,000
to be able to see Melissa, but to visit her

729
00:40:57,000 --> 00:40:57,760
in the cemetery.

730
00:40:58,119 --> 00:41:00,800
Speaker 2: Oh And in.

731
00:41:00,800 --> 00:41:04,039
Speaker 1: Separate interviews, family members of the women have stated again

732
00:41:04,079 --> 00:41:07,559
and again how most online reporting of them refers to

733
00:41:07,599 --> 00:41:10,480
them as just sex workers, as if that makes it

734
00:41:10,519 --> 00:41:14,519
okay what happened to them. And so whenever they talk

735
00:41:14,599 --> 00:41:17,440
with reporters, they share memories and make sure to know

736
00:41:17,519 --> 00:41:21,159
that these women had lives outside of their work. Yeah,

737
00:41:21,400 --> 00:41:25,679
because they did. They were loved by their families. Janelle

738
00:41:25,760 --> 00:41:30,599
Ortica's sister, rossend artis who the rossend ARTISTO used him

739
00:41:30,639 --> 00:41:33,960
pronouns for Janelle, so she said, quote, he was so

740
00:41:34,000 --> 00:41:34,559
sweet with me.

741
00:41:34,679 --> 00:41:35,519
Speaker 2: He really loved me.

742
00:41:35,679 --> 00:41:37,639
Speaker 1: When I heard about what happened, I was in shock.

743
00:41:37,719 --> 00:41:40,159
I didn't know what to do. I drownded my tears.

744
00:41:40,199 --> 00:41:42,159
I just couldn't believe my brother would die that way.

745
00:41:42,679 --> 00:41:44,519
I don't think I'll ever accept the fact that he's

746
00:41:44,519 --> 00:41:46,679
gone forever, but I just have to live with it.

747
00:41:46,920 --> 00:41:50,800
End quote. And the two bonded over makeup and dressing

748
00:41:50,880 --> 00:41:55,480
cue after Janelle came out as trans and Janelle was

749
00:41:55,519 --> 00:42:00,400
burying her favorite red dress, which when Arita give me

750
00:42:00,559 --> 00:42:03,920
chose I know this part almost this part made me cry.

751
00:42:03,920 --> 00:42:07,039
When Aretha Franklin had passed away and they were showing like,

752
00:42:07,119 --> 00:42:10,320
you know, the funeral on TV genor Thesas with her family,

753
00:42:10,800 --> 00:42:12,840
and she was wearing that red dress and she was

754
00:42:12,880 --> 00:42:15,320
like twirling in the red dress. She loved Aria Franklin,

755
00:42:15,400 --> 00:42:16,880
and then she was like in the red dress, and

756
00:42:16,880 --> 00:42:19,519
she's like, this is how I want to go, like

757
00:42:19,559 --> 00:42:22,280
when I go in my red dress. And so they

758
00:42:22,280 --> 00:42:25,760
buried her in her favorite red dress and they took

759
00:42:25,800 --> 00:42:34,519
the flower behind her ear. Oh and it's it's wild

760
00:42:34,599 --> 00:42:38,800
to come across comments about this case because so many

761
00:42:38,880 --> 00:42:41,519
of them are empathizing with Juan da Vidor Theisa and

762
00:42:41,559 --> 00:42:44,360
his family. How well, let me tell you what some

763
00:42:44,400 --> 00:42:46,840
of the comments said. Okay, go on, It's sad to

764
00:42:46,840 --> 00:42:50,480
see a good man go from good to evil. I

765
00:42:50,519 --> 00:42:54,079
would argue maybe he started his evilness a little bit

766
00:42:54,119 --> 00:43:03,920
before he did these things. Because someone also, I have

767
00:43:04,000 --> 00:43:07,519
a problem with painting this kind of thing as evil.

768
00:43:07,599 --> 00:43:09,960
That's not a real man, you know, that kind of thinking,

769
00:43:10,079 --> 00:43:14,599
because because it is, this is the extreme end of misogyny. Yeah,

770
00:43:14,639 --> 00:43:18,679
this is what the patriarchy causes. This is what toxic

771
00:43:18,760 --> 00:43:24,760
masculinity causes. Yeah, so it's not you know, it's not rare.

772
00:43:25,199 --> 00:43:26,559
I mean, it's common.

773
00:43:26,920 --> 00:43:27,360
Speaker 2: I don't know.

774
00:43:27,840 --> 00:43:29,719
Speaker 1: I just I just don't like when people say that.

775
00:43:29,800 --> 00:43:34,760
But obviously no, I agree, they're stupid. Another one I

776
00:43:34,760 --> 00:43:38,639
saw how horrible for his family that something broke in

777
00:43:38,679 --> 00:43:43,840
this good man's mind and made him do this. I

778
00:43:43,920 --> 00:43:46,639
don't I don't think something broke in his mind. I

779
00:43:46,760 --> 00:43:52,320
think I think he hated woman, he hated sex workers,

780
00:43:52,320 --> 00:43:59,239
and he hated himself, and because he is was a repressed,

781
00:44:00,360 --> 00:44:07,440
uh toxic man, he acted out violently, Yeah, instead of

782
00:44:08,920 --> 00:44:12,039
uh going therapy or something. I don't, right, I don't know.

783
00:44:12,079 --> 00:44:12,440
I don't know.

784
00:44:12,719 --> 00:44:13,480
Speaker 2: No, I don't know.

785
00:44:14,000 --> 00:44:17,679
Speaker 1: And obviously, yes, it's terrible for his family, right, his family,

786
00:44:17,679 --> 00:44:20,800
but him, Like, I don't know, I don't know. Like

787
00:44:20,840 --> 00:44:22,559
I don't know how to fully feel about those comments,

788
00:44:22,559 --> 00:44:25,400
except that I don't fully agree. Yet I do feel

789
00:44:25,440 --> 00:44:29,159
that that empathy should always and forever be extended to

790
00:44:29,280 --> 00:44:31,599
the women he murdered and the entire.

791
00:44:31,599 --> 00:44:32,960
Speaker 2: Families who are them.

792
00:44:33,400 --> 00:44:38,639
Speaker 1: Yeah, their children, their sisters, their dads, they're I mean,

793
00:44:38,679 --> 00:44:43,280
come on, yeah. And I want to end with the

794
00:44:43,360 --> 00:44:47,239
quote I found by Christa Daring, executive director of Sex

795
00:44:47,280 --> 00:44:51,280
Workers Outreach Project USA, and she said, part of what

796
00:44:51,400 --> 00:44:53,559
is so saddening about these murders is that they are

797
00:44:53,599 --> 00:44:57,679
so commonplace, and sex workers in general, but specifically those

798
00:44:57,760 --> 00:45:01,559
working outside, must decide every day to risk their safety

799
00:45:01,599 --> 00:45:05,599
in order to survive. The societal stigma against sex work

800
00:45:05,840 --> 00:45:10,280
is a primary driving force behind this violence, and murders

801
00:45:10,320 --> 00:45:16,719
of sex workers typically goes unreported. Yeah and yeah, that

802
00:45:16,960 --> 00:45:23,800
is completely true. And I don't know, I mean, whenever

803
00:45:25,079 --> 00:45:29,880
true crime podcasts talk about this case, it's like obviously

804
00:45:29,960 --> 00:45:32,440
most of them because there's more information about you know,

805
00:45:32,559 --> 00:45:34,760
the perpetrator than the victims.

806
00:45:35,199 --> 00:45:37,320
Speaker 2: But like it's.

807
00:45:37,199 --> 00:45:41,159
Speaker 1: Like going through everything but not emphasizing that, like, sex

808
00:45:41,199 --> 00:45:45,360
workers face this type of violence the most. And another thing,

809
00:45:45,400 --> 00:45:48,800
I know that you know, everyone likes to hate on OnlyFans,

810
00:45:50,280 --> 00:45:55,079
but only fans gives power to sex workers because they

811
00:45:55,159 --> 00:45:58,360
are their own bosses and they are able to do

812
00:45:58,400 --> 00:46:01,800
their work online instead of being out on the street. Well,

813
00:46:01,840 --> 00:46:04,800
it's like this christa daring cent on her quote. Yeah,

814
00:46:05,639 --> 00:46:10,920
specifically those working outside, yeah are in the most danger. Yeah,

815
00:46:11,280 --> 00:46:14,400
and it's true. But I did want to give a

816
00:46:14,440 --> 00:46:18,039
shout out to Well, you all know we love Laney

817
00:46:18,880 --> 00:46:23,280
Laney's podcast, True Crime Cases with Laney, But when Laney

818
00:46:23,320 --> 00:46:27,280
talked about this this case shows an episode on this, Yes,

819
00:46:27,400 --> 00:46:30,360
but you wouldn't know it because almost the whole thing

820
00:46:30,559 --> 00:46:33,679
she just talks about the victims. She just talks about

821
00:46:33,679 --> 00:46:36,239
them and I find it. Yeah, i'll give you the title.

822
00:46:36,320 --> 00:46:37,039
Speaker 2: I just sent it to me.

823
00:46:37,199 --> 00:46:40,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, i'll give you the title. Give me the title,

824
00:46:40,960 --> 00:46:43,280
but send it to me. It's just titled the latter

825
00:46:43,400 --> 00:46:47,360
the serial Killer. Okay, but she She even starts out

826
00:46:47,360 --> 00:46:51,719
the episode talking about how the unfortunate reality is that

827
00:46:51,840 --> 00:46:55,960
the perpetrators of violent crime disproportionately target specific groups of women,

828
00:46:56,079 --> 00:47:00,639
people of color, members of the LGBTQ community, users, and

829
00:47:00,679 --> 00:47:04,960
sex workers, and the victims of this man were all

830
00:47:05,000 --> 00:47:09,519
of those things. Yeah, so, but yeah, it's a yeah,

831
00:47:09,559 --> 00:47:14,440
it's a very informative episode on this, and yeah, I

832
00:47:14,480 --> 00:47:18,079
mean we should always, I don't know, remember them obviously,

833
00:47:19,000 --> 00:47:23,000
And yeah, I think, if not deal with but like,

834
00:47:23,679 --> 00:47:25,079
how do you get I don't know, get rid of

835
00:47:25,199 --> 00:47:27,480
the stigma of sex work? And oh, okay, I was

836
00:47:27,519 --> 00:47:29,239
waiting for you to finish because I was about to

837
00:47:29,280 --> 00:47:30,480
say that, Oh thank you.

838
00:47:30,480 --> 00:47:32,480
Speaker 2: You're probably gonna say it in a much better way

839
00:47:32,480 --> 00:47:32,880
than I.

840
00:47:33,000 --> 00:47:39,800
Speaker 1: Yeah, we need to get over our hatred of sex workers,

841
00:47:41,119 --> 00:47:45,960
because yeah, the stigma around sex work makes their work unsafe.

842
00:47:46,199 --> 00:47:48,400
And not only does it make their work unsafe, but

843
00:47:48,639 --> 00:47:54,400
it also brings shame to them. Right, So then they're

844
00:47:54,519 --> 00:47:56,760
if they're wanting to leave that work, they're less likely

845
00:47:56,800 --> 00:47:59,599
to leave that work because now they feel stuck. And

846
00:47:59,639 --> 00:48:03,239
it also so makes victims of sex trafficking less likely

847
00:48:03,320 --> 00:48:06,199
to come forward and seek help because now there's a

848
00:48:06,239 --> 00:48:10,599
stigma type you know, to them as supposed sex workers,

849
00:48:10,599 --> 00:48:14,519
although sex trafficking obviously is not the same. Yeah, And

850
00:48:14,760 --> 00:48:19,880
that's why feminism is important. But not not just any

851
00:48:19,960 --> 00:48:22,320
old timinism, you know what I mean, because there is feminism,

852
00:48:22,400 --> 00:48:25,159
like an intersectional feminism.

853
00:48:25,440 --> 00:48:27,519
Speaker 2: Yeah, then includes everyone.

854
00:48:27,639 --> 00:48:35,119
Speaker 1: Not the other. There's turfs, there's swarfs, not all of those. Yeah.

855
00:48:35,199 --> 00:48:38,360
And then like you know, people are always certain, people

856
00:48:38,360 --> 00:48:41,519
are always talking about saying the children pizza gain blah

857
00:48:41,559 --> 00:48:42,199
blah blah.

858
00:48:42,400 --> 00:48:45,559
Speaker 2: But all of that for a lot of it's not real.

859
00:48:45,800 --> 00:48:49,320
Speaker 1: Also, second, a lot of that would never happen if

860
00:48:50,280 --> 00:48:53,639
sex work was destigmatized in the first place. So yeah,

861
00:48:53,679 --> 00:49:02,000
and safer. So yeah, it starts with carrying about all people, right, Yeah,

862
00:49:02,119 --> 00:49:05,519
bottom line, at the end of the day, have empathy,

863
00:49:05,960 --> 00:49:09,679
care about others, and don't judge others unless it's for

864
00:49:09,760 --> 00:49:12,840
things like going on killing sprees and being a border

865
00:49:12,840 --> 00:49:17,239
patrol agent. Yes, thank you, Wow. Perfect, And with that

866
00:49:17,559 --> 00:49:21,679
we will take a break here and come back with

867
00:49:22,000 --> 00:49:25,360
spooky recommendations or what do they call it on kuts pooky.

868
00:49:25,400 --> 00:49:34,280
They have a good name for a palate cleanser. Okay,

869
00:49:34,559 --> 00:49:38,360
and we're back. Do you have either a spooky recommendation

870
00:49:38,760 --> 00:49:42,639
or something to make us feel happiness? Again?

871
00:49:44,079 --> 00:49:45,880
Speaker 2: There's my phone.

872
00:49:46,159 --> 00:49:52,159
Speaker 1: I listened to listen to your Sister by Nina velh

873
00:49:52,280 --> 00:49:54,239
have heard this. I was gonna ask you about it

874
00:49:54,280 --> 00:49:57,800
because I saw it on your story graph. Yeah and again, Okay,

875
00:49:57,880 --> 00:50:00,280
I know like you and another one in my friends

876
00:50:00,320 --> 00:50:02,559
they see anything with low A four and they're like,

877
00:50:02,599 --> 00:50:04,320
why didn't you like it? And I'm like, no, I

878
00:50:04,519 --> 00:50:05,960
liked it. A three is alike.

879
00:50:06,159 --> 00:50:06,480
Speaker 2: Okay.

880
00:50:07,360 --> 00:50:08,880
Speaker 1: I was like me what Then I was like, oh,

881
00:50:08,920 --> 00:50:11,239
that's yeah, you're right, yeah, yeah, So I read it

882
00:50:11,280 --> 00:50:14,440
three point seventy five out of five. For me, three

883
00:50:14,639 --> 00:50:16,400
means I like it, but there are some.

884
00:50:16,239 --> 00:50:17,360
Speaker 2: Things that you did.

885
00:50:17,519 --> 00:50:20,719
Speaker 1: I didn't like and I didn't love it for it

886
00:50:20,760 --> 00:50:24,360
to be a four. But ratings are subjective and it

887
00:50:24,400 --> 00:50:26,159
was an adorable book, I think.

888
00:50:26,440 --> 00:50:29,360
Speaker 2: Okay, let me just read the description. Okay.

889
00:50:30,079 --> 00:50:32,840
Speaker 1: Twenty five year old Kala Williams is struggling since becoming

890
00:50:32,920 --> 00:50:36,480
guardian to her brother Jamie. Calla is overwhelmed and tired

891
00:50:36,519 --> 00:50:38,519
of being the one who makes the sacrifices to keep

892
00:50:38,559 --> 00:50:41,760
the family together. Jamie, full of good natured sixteen year

893
00:50:41,760 --> 00:50:44,480
old recklessness, is usually off fighting for what matters to

894
00:50:44,559 --> 00:50:47,920
him or getting into mischief, often at the same time. Dre,

895
00:50:48,119 --> 00:50:50,480
their brother, promised he would help raise Jamie, but now

896
00:50:50,519 --> 00:50:53,280
the ink is dry on the paperwork, and in classic

897
00:50:53,360 --> 00:50:56,599
middle child fashion, he's off doing his own thing. And

898
00:50:56,719 --> 00:51:00,320
through it all, the nightmare never stops haunting Calla, carrying

899
00:51:00,360 --> 00:51:03,199
images of her brother's dying that she's powerless to stop.

900
00:51:03,679 --> 00:51:06,519
When Jamie's actions at a protest spiral out of control,

901
00:51:06,599 --> 00:51:09,360
the siblings must go on the run, taking refuge in

902
00:51:09,400 --> 00:51:11,280
a remote cabin that looks like it belongs on the

903
00:51:11,320 --> 00:51:15,360
slasher movie poster rather than an airbnb. The siblings now

904
00:51:15,400 --> 00:51:18,320
face the new threat, where their lives and reality hanging

905
00:51:18,320 --> 00:51:21,760
in the balance. Their sister always warned them about her nightmares.

906
00:51:21,840 --> 00:51:24,880
They really should have listened. So I love the premise.

907
00:51:24,960 --> 00:51:28,719
I'm like, well, what's going on here? So I liked

908
00:51:28,920 --> 00:51:33,159
the sibling dynamics. I liked the horror was good. I

909
00:51:33,239 --> 00:51:36,199
just think for me, it was a little bit too

910
00:51:36,559 --> 00:51:39,079
and it could have been that I listened to the

911
00:51:39,079 --> 00:51:42,079
audiobook instead of reading it, so we have three different

912
00:51:42,119 --> 00:51:45,880
point of views, and sometimes you talk about the past

913
00:51:45,920 --> 00:51:48,000
and something's a present, so that makes it a little

914
00:51:48,000 --> 00:51:50,119
tricky for audiobook. So I think, yeah, it would have

915
00:51:50,119 --> 00:51:53,000
been better if I read it. And then I think

916
00:51:53,159 --> 00:51:57,960
the once they're in the in the horror, it lasts

917
00:51:57,960 --> 00:51:59,679
a little bit too long. It's a little true, too

918
00:51:59,800 --> 00:52:03,440
drawn out, like some parts of it. Yeah, but it

919
00:52:03,519 --> 00:52:06,239
was really good still, and like I would describe it

920
00:52:06,280 --> 00:52:12,519
as like an elder sisters or elder siblings assumed responsibilities

921
00:52:12,559 --> 00:52:14,239
and resentments coming to life.

922
00:52:14,840 --> 00:52:16,039
Speaker 2: Okay, I love that.

923
00:52:16,559 --> 00:52:18,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, So I, like I said, it's so really good

924
00:52:19,000 --> 00:52:21,360
and I think that people would enjoy it. Just for me,

925
00:52:21,559 --> 00:52:24,159
I think the audiobook was a little bit harder to follow,

926
00:52:24,199 --> 00:52:26,920
and I think it could have been shorter, Like I think,

927
00:52:27,559 --> 00:52:31,880
I think it would have been better for shorter Okay, yeah, nice,

928
00:52:32,079 --> 00:52:42,320
all right, I might check it out. I am currently

929
00:52:42,880 --> 00:52:48,559
reading The Hunting of Room nine oh four by Erica T. Worth,

930
00:52:49,599 --> 00:52:54,719
but I am only like thirty percent through, so I

931
00:52:54,760 --> 00:52:59,639
can't say fully if I recommend it or not yet.

932
00:53:00,079 --> 00:53:03,119
But the premise sounded cool enough, so let me share

933
00:53:03,239 --> 00:53:07,280
that really quick. Olivia Becente was never supposed to have

934
00:53:07,320 --> 00:53:09,599
the gift. The ability to commune with the dead was

935
00:53:09,639 --> 00:53:13,920
the specialty of her sister, Niche knightsch I don't remember how,

936
00:53:14,559 --> 00:53:17,119
I don't know how to say it. But when the

937
00:53:17,199 --> 00:53:20,239
sister dies, I can't say her name. I'm sorry. Dies

938
00:53:20,320 --> 00:53:26,119
unexpectedly and under strange circumstances. Somehow, Olivia suddenly can't stop

939
00:53:26,199 --> 00:53:29,679
seeing and hearing from spirits. A few years later, she's

940
00:53:29,760 --> 00:53:33,079
the most in demand paranormal investigator in Denver. She's good

941
00:53:33,079 --> 00:53:35,199
at her job, but the loss of her sister haunts her.

942
00:53:35,480 --> 00:53:37,840
That's what she hears from the Brown Palace, a landmark

943
00:53:37,880 --> 00:53:41,000
Denver hotel. The owner can't explain it, but every few

944
00:53:41,079 --> 00:53:43,599
years a girl is found dead in room nine oh four,

945
00:53:43,679 --> 00:53:47,360
no matter what room she's checked into the night before.

946
00:53:48,000 --> 00:53:51,000
As Olivia tries to understand these disturbing deaths, the past

947
00:53:51,000 --> 00:53:54,639
and present collide as Olivia's investigation forces her to confront

948
00:53:54,679 --> 00:53:59,480
a mysterious and possibly dangerous cult, a vindictive journalist, betrayal

949
00:53:59,559 --> 00:54:03,599
by her friend friends, and shocking revelations about her sister's

950
00:54:03,639 --> 00:54:08,800
secret life. So I mean it had me at someone

951
00:54:09,599 --> 00:54:13,840
dying in room nine oh four. Every it was a year,

952
00:54:14,760 --> 00:54:18,519
every few years, even though that's not the room they

953
00:54:18,519 --> 00:54:21,280
slept in. Like the minute that I saw that, I

954
00:54:21,320 --> 00:54:24,119
was like, I must, I must check this out. So again,

955
00:54:24,199 --> 00:54:26,199
I'm not fully done with it. I don't know if

956
00:54:26,239 --> 00:54:28,280
I can recommend it or not. I do have an

957
00:54:28,320 --> 00:54:30,320
actual recommendation, though, I just want to share that that's

958
00:54:30,320 --> 00:54:33,440
what I was reading. I went to watch twenty eight

959
00:54:33,519 --> 00:54:39,719
years later, and I do recommend it. I think you

960
00:54:39,760 --> 00:54:40,679
and I were already talked.

961
00:54:40,880 --> 00:54:42,000
Speaker 2: Oh fuck, I dropped my fitches.

962
00:54:43,639 --> 00:54:45,239
Speaker 1: I know you and I were already talking about it,

963
00:54:45,239 --> 00:54:47,679
and I was telling Carmen that, like, I saw a

964
00:54:47,719 --> 00:54:50,480
lot of complaints about it and not being not feeling

965
00:54:50,519 --> 00:54:53,079
like a sequel, And I do agree that it doesn't

966
00:54:53,079 --> 00:54:55,360
feel like a sequel, but I don't care.

967
00:54:55,519 --> 00:54:56,320
Speaker 2: But you're fine with that.

968
00:54:56,400 --> 00:54:58,519
Speaker 1: I'm fine with that. It doesn't matter to me because

969
00:54:58,639 --> 00:55:03,280
it feels like just an installment in the universe of

970
00:55:04,199 --> 00:55:08,079
these zombies of twenty eight years later or twenty weeks

971
00:55:08,159 --> 00:55:11,280
days whatever. It's like it's happening in the same place,

972
00:55:11,400 --> 00:55:13,880
in the same but it's not a continuation of like

973
00:55:13,920 --> 00:55:17,360
the same exact people. You know. It's just a story

974
00:55:17,400 --> 00:55:20,440
within this universe, and it's a coming of age story,

975
00:55:20,599 --> 00:55:24,360
if anything. I love coming of age stories. Yes, a

976
00:55:24,400 --> 00:55:28,480
story of a young person realizing that their father is

977
00:55:28,519 --> 00:55:32,239
not who they thought they were. I love that, Yes,

978
00:55:32,280 --> 00:55:36,119
because when we when you come to that realization, your

979
00:55:36,119 --> 00:55:38,880
world shatters and you're fine later, you know, but for

980
00:55:39,000 --> 00:55:41,800
that moment in time when you're grappling with that, wow wow,

981
00:55:41,840 --> 00:55:45,199
it's like who who even at my life changing? And

982
00:55:45,280 --> 00:55:49,760
so and naturally because of this discovery, he wants to

983
00:55:49,800 --> 00:55:53,159
reject his father, but because of what his father has

984
00:55:53,199 --> 00:55:56,920
taught him, he's able to survive. Wow wow wow wow.

985
00:55:57,559 --> 00:55:59,960
And love how you said that too, Like that may

986
00:56:00,199 --> 00:56:01,360
me want to watch it. At first, I'm like, I

987
00:56:01,400 --> 00:56:02,880
don't really care if I watch it, But now that

988
00:56:02,920 --> 00:56:04,679
you described it that way, it makes me want to

989
00:56:04,679 --> 00:56:07,480
watch it. If if you don't go into it expecting

990
00:56:07,519 --> 00:56:09,840
a straight up zombie movie, which I never do, I'm

991
00:56:09,840 --> 00:56:12,840
therefore the drama. It's like drama in a zombie universe,

992
00:56:12,920 --> 00:56:16,159
right yeah, yeah, and so again I love a comment

993
00:56:16,239 --> 00:56:19,320
of h story. And then you know, someone realizing their

994
00:56:19,320 --> 00:56:21,960
father's not who there they were grappling with that it's

995
00:56:22,119 --> 00:56:24,079
when you look at it from that lens, it's it's

996
00:56:24,119 --> 00:56:28,960
a beautiful story. The the way it was shot is

997
00:56:29,000 --> 00:56:34,880
also so interesting, like it plays with the normal like

998
00:56:34,960 --> 00:56:36,840
movie format to me, Like it's not like a straight

999
00:56:36,920 --> 00:56:39,280
up like like there's some scenes where they almost seem

1000
00:56:39,320 --> 00:56:42,239
like jarring, like just like jumping. Okay, yeah, one sing

1001
00:56:42,280 --> 00:56:44,679
to another or like just the way it was shot.

1002
00:56:45,599 --> 00:56:49,960
But yeah, it's beautiful. Also like the I don't think

1003
00:56:49,960 --> 00:56:51,800
this is very much spoilers. I think this is in

1004
00:56:51,840 --> 00:56:54,960
the trailer, but they're on an island and like there's

1005
00:56:55,000 --> 00:56:58,440
this and this is like this is a real island,

1006
00:56:59,159 --> 00:57:02,079
but like it's connect to it's a real place, it's

1007
00:57:02,079 --> 00:57:04,719
a real place. It's connected to like England or Britain. Sorry,

1008
00:57:04,760 --> 00:57:08,000
I'm at the difference, and like there's I googled it

1009
00:57:08,039 --> 00:57:11,199
once and I freaga already. Yeah, I'm sorry. But there's

1010
00:57:11,239 --> 00:57:14,639
like water that whenever it's a high tide, the path

1011
00:57:14,760 --> 00:57:18,239
is covered, you can't go you can't go there at

1012
00:57:18,239 --> 00:57:22,920
the time. Fuel Yes, but it works if you're trapped. Yeah,

1013
00:57:23,000 --> 00:57:25,280
but it also works if you're like trying to stay

1014
00:57:25,280 --> 00:57:27,880
safe from zombies. They can't cross at a certain time,

1015
00:57:28,079 --> 00:57:31,880
you know, true. So yeah, I loved it. I loved it.

1016
00:57:33,280 --> 00:57:39,039
I do recommend it. If you're not expecting just another

1017
00:57:39,039 --> 00:57:43,360
sequel or like zombies alone, then yes. But if you're like, no,

1018
00:57:43,440 --> 00:57:46,280
I don't want any coming of age story, I hate kids,

1019
00:57:46,320 --> 00:57:50,840
I can't watch it, then don't them kids. But I

1020
00:57:50,880 --> 00:57:53,760
love a coming of age story I know. Yeah, same, yeah, same,

1021
00:57:54,480 --> 00:57:57,559
So yeah, that's that's why I do recommend it. And

1022
00:57:57,599 --> 00:58:01,079
so yeah, I feel that we have reach the end

1023
00:58:01,119 --> 00:58:06,960
of the episode. Unless you have anything else to share, no,

1024
00:58:07,039 --> 00:58:11,880
I think that's it. Okay, all right, and in that case,

1025
00:58:13,800 --> 00:58:15,599
stay a spooky. We'll catch e ryuin next time.

1026
00:58:15,719 --> 00:58:16,719
Speaker 2: Bye Bye.

1027
00:58:18,119 --> 00:58:20,960
Speaker 1: As Book Tells is hosted by Christina and Carmen, produced

1028
00:58:21,000 --> 00:58:24,519
and edited by Christina, researched by Christina Carmen and with

1029
00:58:24,599 --> 00:58:26,880
the help of Don shout out with Don. If you

1030
00:58:26,880 --> 00:58:29,480
aren't joining the podcast considerably going to say five star review,

1031
00:58:29,519 --> 00:58:31,280
we would really appreciate it. If you don't want to

1032
00:58:31,320 --> 00:58:33,599
the professor review, just don't leave a review, but don't

1033
00:58:33,639 --> 00:58:35,960
leave anything lower than that, please, I'm just kidding. You

1034
00:58:36,000 --> 00:58:38,480
can reach out to the podcast at a Spooktels at

1035
00:58:38,480 --> 00:58:40,280
gmail dot com. You can go to our website at

1036
00:58:40,320 --> 00:58:43,599
bookitos dot com and fill out the contact form. If

1037
00:58:43,599 --> 00:58:45,639
you want to support the podcast, you can join our

1038
00:58:45,679 --> 00:58:49,920
Patreon where we send exclusive stickers, have bonus episodes. Eight

1039
00:58:49,960 --> 00:58:53,079
dollar members get an exclusive key chain. It's super cool.

1040
00:58:53,119 --> 00:58:55,679
I got new ones and these ones are huge. And

1041
00:58:55,760 --> 00:58:58,000
if you want to support, but you can or don't

1042
00:58:58,000 --> 00:59:00,199
want to join the Patreon, that's fine too. We can

1043
00:59:00,239 --> 00:59:03,599
also get some merch. You can find shurets to say

1044
00:59:03,639 --> 00:59:06,559
a spooky and old English letters. There's a beanie. I

1045
00:59:06,639 --> 00:59:10,199
love the beanie. There's also a hat. There's a no

1046
00:59:10,360 --> 00:59:14,000
Mamus shirt which is a fan favorite. There's a lot

1047
00:59:14,000 --> 00:59:17,119
of options, crap tops, sweaters. It's almost swetter weather. We're

1048
00:59:17,199 --> 00:59:20,239
nearing a Spookie season, so yeah, get your hoodies. You're

1049
00:59:20,280 --> 00:59:22,159
gonna need them. If you don't want to do all that,

1050
00:59:22,159 --> 00:59:25,159
that's fine too. You can just listen like you're listening now,

1051
00:59:25,199 --> 00:59:26,920
and that's the best support that you can give us,

1052
00:59:26,960 --> 00:59:29,559
like I always say in our ad break and yeah,

1053
00:59:29,599 --> 00:59:33,159
if you like history, you can follow Estoria's Unknown Mining,

1054
00:59:33,199 --> 00:59:37,039
Carmen's other podcasts, and you can find as spooky tails

1055
00:59:37,039 --> 00:59:40,079
on all of our socials at Spooky Tells All. This

1056
00:59:40,119 --> 00:59:43,840
is in the show notes and we appreciate every single listen.

1057
00:59:43,920 --> 00:59:45,920
Speaker 2: Thank you so much. Stay as spooky