WEBVTT 1 00:00:01.720 --> 00:00:05.160 Since January my Future Fund that's been helping you invest 2 00:00:05.200 --> 00:00:09.000 in your future. While you've been paying in, your employer 3 00:00:09.039 --> 00:00:12.080 has paid in, with the state topping it all up. 4 00:00:12.679 --> 00:00:16.320 It's already growing, with over four hundred million euros saved 5 00:00:16.359 --> 00:00:21.079 by eight hundred thousand participants in just six months. Continue 6 00:00:21.079 --> 00:00:25.480 protecting your future. It's already looking brighter. Learn more at 7 00:00:25.480 --> 00:00:26.679 my Futurefund dot i E. 8 00:00:30.760 --> 00:00:33.560 A cast recommends how are you doing there? 9 00:00:33.600 --> 00:00:36.840 This is David from the David McWilliams podcast, the podcast 10 00:00:36.880 --> 00:00:41.799 that makes economics as comprehensible as possible. We are going 11 00:00:41.840 --> 00:00:44.159 to look at economics through the lens of the World 12 00:00:44.200 --> 00:00:47.159 Cup and a special World Cup Economics series. We're going 13 00:00:47.240 --> 00:00:49.280 to look at countries, we're going to look at players, 14 00:00:49.320 --> 00:00:51.479 we're gonna look at culture, but we're also going to 15 00:00:51.520 --> 00:00:56.159 look at the economies of the countries involved in this 16 00:00:56.479 --> 00:00:59.719 World Cup as it unfolds. So this is one for 17 00:01:00.280 --> 00:01:03.520 economics fans who happened to be into football. Football fans 18 00:01:03.640 --> 00:01:06.760 who happened to be into economics. That's all on the 19 00:01:06.840 --> 00:01:08.480 David McWilliams podcast. 20 00:01:09.040 --> 00:01:12.640 A Cast is home to the world's best podcasts, including 21 00:01:12.680 --> 00:01:15.840 Crime World, The Other Hand and The One You're listening 22 00:01:15.879 --> 00:01:17.079 to right now. 23 00:01:21.840 --> 00:01:25.439 Warning. Some episodes of Where Did the Road Go will 24 00:01:25.480 --> 00:01:29.439 contain a warning. This month's Where Did the Road Go? 25 00:01:29.640 --> 00:01:35.200 Is sponsored by the following awesome individuals, Greg Ross, Alison Cook, 26 00:01:35.319 --> 00:01:40.120 Super Inframan thirty six Dingo, Yvonne Williams and Michael Friske. 27 00:01:40.519 --> 00:01:43.439 Thank you so much for helping make this show possible. 28 00:01:44.239 --> 00:01:49.200 Transmissions Dive. Welcome to Where Did the Road Go? Join 29 00:01:49.280 --> 00:01:54.079 us as we wander off the path and explore lost history, consciousness, 30 00:01:54.400 --> 00:02:01.280 the para, normal, unexplained, mysteries, alternative thought, much more. We 31 00:02:01.359 --> 00:02:04.239 are present on the web at where to the Roadgo 32 00:02:04.719 --> 00:02:08.360 dot com. Now here is your host, sayah. 33 00:02:20.919 --> 00:02:23.319 Welcome to this edition of Where Did the Road Go? 34 00:02:23.479 --> 00:02:27.080 And tonight I have with me mister Christopher Ernstlow There everyone, 35 00:02:27.360 --> 00:02:29.400 and the nameless one Matt Festa. 36 00:02:29.560 --> 00:02:32.159 Hello, my darlings. Again, I have a name. We've been 37 00:02:32.199 --> 00:02:32.599 over this. 38 00:02:32.800 --> 00:02:34.719 I just yeah, I just acknowledged it. 39 00:02:34.759 --> 00:02:36.120 The nameless nameless. 40 00:02:36.199 --> 00:02:40.199 We just call you Matt anyway or Nirala Hotel. 41 00:02:40.240 --> 00:02:42.280 I can never say that, so I'm not even gonna try. 42 00:02:42.400 --> 00:02:44.280 It took me a long time, and that was something 43 00:02:44.319 --> 00:02:47.680 I was very very you know, excited about, and I 44 00:02:47.680 --> 00:02:49.680 don't know when I was about like twelve or thirteen 45 00:02:50.080 --> 00:02:53.000 that I practiced saying it, and I remember telling my 46 00:02:53.039 --> 00:02:55.680 friend Peter on the bus I can now say it. 47 00:02:56.039 --> 00:02:58.240 I thought it was Yarlestep. But maybe I'm just like 48 00:02:58.280 --> 00:02:59.360 saying it with an Australian. 49 00:02:59.439 --> 00:03:01.960 We see, I'm probably saying it wrong. I probably taught 50 00:03:01.960 --> 00:03:04.560 myself wrong, honestly, because it's going back to me being 51 00:03:04.599 --> 00:03:06.960 twelve and I was much much more of an idiot than. 52 00:03:06.960 --> 00:03:09.080 Well, you got to figure. Lovecraft wrote names that would 53 00:03:09.120 --> 00:03:12.680 intentionally be hard to say, right, they were unspeakable. Yeah, 54 00:03:12.759 --> 00:03:15.039 here you are speaking them. Yeah, you know. I had 55 00:03:15.080 --> 00:03:18.199 trouble with you know, Meredith's blog, and I kept saying 56 00:03:18.280 --> 00:03:20.520 I wanted to call it the Maze of Metonia, and 57 00:03:20.639 --> 00:03:23.680 I like the way that sounds, but instead of met 58 00:03:23.680 --> 00:03:27.280 Noya man, I can't even remember what med Yeah, I 59 00:03:27.319 --> 00:03:29.919 think you're For some reason, my brain's just stuck on 60 00:03:30.400 --> 00:03:31.360 calling it the other way. 61 00:03:31.520 --> 00:03:32.879 No, I get you, I hear you. 62 00:03:33.280 --> 00:03:35.719 It's like I looked at it quickly went oh Medanoya 63 00:03:35.919 --> 00:03:38.919 okay or Metonia. I mean see now I said it 64 00:03:39.000 --> 00:03:39.800 right accidentally. 65 00:03:39.879 --> 00:03:43.159 Yeah, okay, you're thinking Magonia. 66 00:03:43.280 --> 00:03:45.840 It's you know, maybe but I read that when oh 67 00:03:45.840 --> 00:03:47.599 that's a cool name, didn't think too much about it, 68 00:03:47.639 --> 00:03:49.479 and then I heard her on streamers show and they 69 00:03:49.479 --> 00:03:52.000 said it properly, and I went, it's that what it is? 70 00:03:52.039 --> 00:03:55.080 That isn't it? Okay? Brain looked quick and just jumped 71 00:03:55.080 --> 00:03:55.360 to it. 72 00:03:55.439 --> 00:03:58.439 I guess it happens anytime you only know a word 73 00:03:58.479 --> 00:04:00.319 from reading it and then you hear someone actually said 74 00:04:00.360 --> 00:04:01.439 it's like oh. 75 00:04:01.120 --> 00:04:03.639 Yeah, oh yeah completely. 76 00:04:05.120 --> 00:04:07.319 So I guess too. This is going to be a 77 00:04:07.360 --> 00:04:08.840 wandering the road show. We're going to go all over 78 00:04:08.879 --> 00:04:12.560 the place. But I think we should probably address first 79 00:04:12.599 --> 00:04:15.680 off that Gordon White passed away. Yes, and Gordon White 80 00:04:15.800 --> 00:04:17.399 had been on the show. I'm going to put a 81 00:04:17.399 --> 00:04:19.600 compilation of his appearances up. I just haven't had time 82 00:04:19.600 --> 00:04:22.040 to do it, but a few people have requested it. 83 00:04:22.040 --> 00:04:23.800 It was on the show. I don't know how many times, 84 00:04:23.839 --> 00:04:25.920 like two or three shows, but I think they were 85 00:04:25.959 --> 00:04:28.759 a couple of parts for each one. He did a 86 00:04:28.800 --> 00:04:31.839 podcast called rudin Soup. He was a magician over in 87 00:04:31.839 --> 00:04:32.399 the u UK. 88 00:04:32.720 --> 00:04:36.160 Right, No, well, he started in the UK at least 89 00:04:36.160 --> 00:04:38.720 when he started his blog, which is where I knew 90 00:04:38.800 --> 00:04:41.120 him from, which was before he even had the podcast 91 00:04:41.319 --> 00:04:43.920 or the members thing, and that's he was still living 92 00:04:44.000 --> 00:04:45.920 in London and working in the media industry. 93 00:04:45.959 --> 00:04:48.639 Then yeah, okay, all right, I ended up. 94 00:04:48.879 --> 00:04:50.399 Then he ended up. I think it was like two 95 00:04:50.439 --> 00:04:52.160 thousand and eight, maybe it was two thousand and eight. 96 00:04:52.360 --> 00:04:56.240 During the crash, he like lost a lot of money 97 00:04:56.399 --> 00:04:58.600 and I think he lost his savings and his job 98 00:04:58.839 --> 00:05:03.240 and ended up in Tasmania and his partner James ended 99 00:05:03.279 --> 00:05:05.839 up in Tasmania and they bought like a farm and 100 00:05:05.879 --> 00:05:09.560 he got really into what's it called, Like it's like 101 00:05:09.600 --> 00:05:12.199 sustainable farming, but there's a name for it, and there's 102 00:05:12.199 --> 00:05:14.759 a specific name and like, you know, scene for it, 103 00:05:14.800 --> 00:05:15.800 which I totally forget. 104 00:05:15.920 --> 00:05:17.000 Subsistence farming. 105 00:05:17.160 --> 00:05:19.120 Yes, that might be it. That might be it, And 106 00:05:19.160 --> 00:05:23.519 I might just be a dingba. Well I am a dingbat, but. 107 00:05:23.519 --> 00:05:25.560 I don't think. I don't even remember the last time 108 00:05:25.600 --> 00:05:28.160 he was on. It might have been his there was 109 00:05:28.199 --> 00:05:30.399 a book that had the number eight in it, Pieces 110 00:05:30.439 --> 00:05:33.399 of Pieces of eight. Yes, yeah, I think that was 111 00:05:33.439 --> 00:05:35.040 the last time I had him on, So it's been 112 00:05:35.680 --> 00:05:39.439 probably a decade. Yeah, And I just kind of I 113 00:05:39.560 --> 00:05:41.680 was never like I liked having him on the show. 114 00:05:41.879 --> 00:05:44.160 He was interesting to talk to. I read the books. 115 00:05:44.199 --> 00:05:47.360 I thought they were interesting, but I never got into 116 00:05:47.399 --> 00:05:50.160 his podcast very much, and I just I didn't like 117 00:05:50.199 --> 00:05:52.040 his approach, I guess as part of it. 118 00:05:52.120 --> 00:05:57.000 I mean, you know, I definitely did when I first started, 119 00:05:57.079 --> 00:05:59.560 you know, reading his stuff, because that's when I first, 120 00:06:00.199 --> 00:06:02.720 I guess caught wind of him, was through the blog, 121 00:06:02.879 --> 00:06:05.879 and that was, yeah, way back then. And you know, 122 00:06:06.040 --> 00:06:08.560 I seemed like a person that maybe I wouldn't be 123 00:06:08.600 --> 00:06:11.639 friends with, but I thought some of the stuff he 124 00:06:11.720 --> 00:06:14.120 was talking about was interesting, or at least I thought 125 00:06:14.160 --> 00:06:16.839 it was, you know, I was you know, it meant 126 00:06:16.959 --> 00:06:20.680 something or it resonated with me at a particular time 127 00:06:20.759 --> 00:06:23.439 in the way that he was talking about it. But yeah, 128 00:06:23.560 --> 00:06:26.560 I quickly, sort of not quickly, but I kept on 129 00:06:26.639 --> 00:06:30.319 paying attention, I think up until he started his premium 130 00:06:30.480 --> 00:06:33.639 uh where you started basically have to pay. He was 131 00:06:33.680 --> 00:06:35.680 one of the first people to kind of start that too, 132 00:06:35.800 --> 00:06:40.279 pre Patreon. And you know, I, for me, at least, 133 00:06:40.319 --> 00:06:43.800 I found difficulty with what seemed to me to be 134 00:06:43.920 --> 00:06:47.120 more of a cult mentality, you know, where people were 135 00:06:47.199 --> 00:06:50.319 beginning to treat him in the way that you see 136 00:06:50.439 --> 00:06:55.000 and so many of these sort of conspiratuality situations. But 137 00:06:55.040 --> 00:06:56.920 I know a lot of people that also got a 138 00:06:56.920 --> 00:07:00.639 lot out of the work that he did. Know it's interesting, 139 00:07:00.720 --> 00:07:03.959 I did, I did. I'm on the mailing list for 140 00:07:04.759 --> 00:07:07.839 uh Connor bebe who if people don't know, he's another 141 00:07:08.319 --> 00:07:12.519 sort of a cult personality and he has a you know, podcast, 142 00:07:12.959 --> 00:07:16.879 written books. He and Gordon had a friendship that you know, 143 00:07:17.319 --> 00:07:19.839 was both of them were gay men, and they had 144 00:07:20.399 --> 00:07:22.439 a sort of that was one tie. But they were 145 00:07:22.480 --> 00:07:26.120 also you know, young, similar age, occult interest, so they 146 00:07:26.120 --> 00:07:28.920 were friends for many reasons. But uh, you know, Connor 147 00:07:28.959 --> 00:07:31.519 sent out this email uh to people on his mailing 148 00:07:31.600 --> 00:07:35.480 list a little while ago in regards to Gordon's death, 149 00:07:35.480 --> 00:07:38.240 and I thought it was a pretty savvy and salient 150 00:07:39.000 --> 00:07:41.600 take on the subject. He talked about him from the 151 00:07:41.720 --> 00:07:44.560 standpoint of a friend, but you know, also the falling 152 00:07:44.560 --> 00:07:47.240 outs that they had, and you know, essentially from what 153 00:07:47.319 --> 00:07:50.199 he's saying, or at least my understanding of the email, 154 00:07:50.279 --> 00:07:54.800 it's like, you know, the pandemic broke mister White, as 155 00:07:54.839 --> 00:07:58.240 it did many people, and you know, he threatened Connor 156 00:07:58.360 --> 00:08:01.600 and apparently he was like trying to kill people with 157 00:08:01.639 --> 00:08:04.920 magic behind the scenes that he thought crossed him and 158 00:08:05.000 --> 00:08:06.920 a lot of stuff like that and Connor, you know, 159 00:08:07.319 --> 00:08:09.319 I think I would say obviously, but he kind of 160 00:08:09.319 --> 00:08:11.680 fell out of touch with Gordon, but you know, still 161 00:08:11.720 --> 00:08:14.639 is saddened by his death. I mean, the biggest thing 162 00:08:14.639 --> 00:08:16.959 that I think, in seeing the way that everybody is 163 00:08:17.000 --> 00:08:19.000 dealing with it, is that, you know, I feel the 164 00:08:19.040 --> 00:08:21.079 best way to approach it is the fact that this 165 00:08:21.199 --> 00:08:23.800 was a human and that I see there to be 166 00:08:23.879 --> 00:08:27.800 something that's you know, maybe not so great about. There's 167 00:08:27.839 --> 00:08:30.319 a sanctifying and sort of like calling him a folk 168 00:08:30.399 --> 00:08:33.080 saint and stuff like that, and it's still that same 169 00:08:33.320 --> 00:08:35.720 at least for me. I find that kind of cult 170 00:08:35.799 --> 00:08:38.919 mentality what I would call it that, and I find 171 00:08:38.960 --> 00:08:42.919 it to be off putting. But you know, as far 172 00:08:43.039 --> 00:08:45.480 you know, I think he had some importance for many people, 173 00:08:46.240 --> 00:08:48.919 even if I didn't agree with the stuff that he 174 00:08:49.000 --> 00:08:52.240 was doing. And yeah, it's sad that this, you know, 175 00:08:52.399 --> 00:08:54.679 he was taken away from his friends and family so 176 00:08:55.039 --> 00:08:55.559 so early. 177 00:08:55.720 --> 00:08:58.080 Yeah, so he was only forty four. Yeah, he died 178 00:08:58.120 --> 00:09:01.759 when he was in Peru. It's his natural course. Pauses, 179 00:09:01.799 --> 00:09:03.240 it doesn't say what he died of. 180 00:09:03.639 --> 00:09:06.000 So he and this is again going from some of 181 00:09:06.039 --> 00:09:09.960 the stuff from Connor Bieb's you know, newsletter was that, 182 00:09:10.440 --> 00:09:12.679 you know, he had a heart condition, which I guess 183 00:09:12.919 --> 00:09:15.440 was something that he had been dealing with or started 184 00:09:15.480 --> 00:09:19.080 to deal with a little while ago, and he was 185 00:09:19.399 --> 00:09:22.159 kind of anti VAXX, and I think that he. 186 00:09:24.039 --> 00:09:24.159 Was. 187 00:09:24.320 --> 00:09:26.200 I don't know either that, or maybe I don't. I 188 00:09:26.200 --> 00:09:28.559 don't know the true story, but I know that he 189 00:09:28.840 --> 00:09:32.360 from what I had read in the email and sort 190 00:09:32.399 --> 00:09:35.799 of heard through the grapevine, is that he decided not 191 00:09:36.080 --> 00:09:40.399 to pursue conventional medicine, and that part of his shift too, 192 00:09:40.440 --> 00:09:44.559 because he basically a few years ago shifted to essentially 193 00:09:44.879 --> 00:09:47.919 being an ayahuasca shaman. I mean, I guess there's no 194 00:09:48.000 --> 00:09:49.919 other better way to say it. He said he went 195 00:09:49.960 --> 00:09:53.080 through training to become an ayahuasca shaman and he became one. 196 00:09:53.120 --> 00:09:55.519 So he was, you know, taking people through trips. And 197 00:09:55.559 --> 00:09:57.440 I think this was also part of him trying to 198 00:09:57.559 --> 00:10:00.519 heal his heart condition. From what I gathered, which is, 199 00:10:00.559 --> 00:10:03.600 you know, not necessarily as much as I do believe 200 00:10:03.679 --> 00:10:06.799 in other ways of dealing with the physical body, sometimes 201 00:10:07.279 --> 00:10:09.559 the physical body has to be dealt with physically, So 202 00:10:09.840 --> 00:10:11.679 I don't know that might have been it part of 203 00:10:11.720 --> 00:10:14.320 and you know, we're up in Peru and like near Cusco. 204 00:10:14.440 --> 00:10:18.000 That's intense altitude, which is really gonna put a strain 205 00:10:18.080 --> 00:10:19.799 on a lot of people. So who knows. 206 00:10:19.960 --> 00:10:23.200 That is a good point. Yeah, I know. We had 207 00:10:23.240 --> 00:10:25.879 him on for Starships. Yeah, and of the books that 208 00:10:25.919 --> 00:10:27.639 I read, that was the one I liked the most, 209 00:10:27.759 --> 00:10:30.200 and then definitely Pieces of Eight. I don't know if 210 00:10:30.200 --> 00:10:32.480 he was on again other than those two, but like 211 00:10:32.519 --> 00:10:34.799 I said, I think they were multi part shows. Yeah, 212 00:10:34.799 --> 00:10:35.720 but I will put them up. 213 00:10:35.759 --> 00:10:37.440 He talked a lot, He had a lot to say, 214 00:10:37.519 --> 00:10:39.960 so I wouldn't I would imagine and if I remember 215 00:10:40.039 --> 00:10:42.679 from listening, because I definitely was listening to those at 216 00:10:42.679 --> 00:10:44.919 the time, I think he talked for quite a bit. 217 00:10:45.399 --> 00:10:47.159 Yeah, and I think Josh was the one that wanted 218 00:10:47.200 --> 00:10:48.879 to have him on. He was the one that turned 219 00:10:48.879 --> 00:10:49.840 me on to him in the first time. 220 00:10:49.919 --> 00:10:52.279 Josh is a very Josh is a you know Josh. 221 00:10:52.360 --> 00:10:54.480 I think we were talking about this prior to the show. 222 00:10:54.519 --> 00:10:58.480 But yeah, Josh and I both we were. We definitely 223 00:10:58.679 --> 00:11:01.879 liked the There were these annual or semi annual podcasts 224 00:11:01.879 --> 00:11:03.240 that he would do for a while. I don't know 225 00:11:03.240 --> 00:11:05.320 if he continued after I stopped listening to him, but 226 00:11:05.519 --> 00:11:08.000 what he would do with the astrologer Austin Kopic, where 227 00:11:08.000 --> 00:11:12.480 they would talk about sort of mundane astrology and predictions 228 00:11:13.320 --> 00:11:16.240 using mundane astrology for the year, which are always interesting 229 00:11:16.320 --> 00:11:19.200 and sometimes, you know, somewhat accurate. And I found that 230 00:11:19.240 --> 00:11:21.559 you can get the same information if you listen to 231 00:11:21.679 --> 00:11:25.360 Austin Kopic on the Astrology podcast with Chris Brennan. They 232 00:11:25.399 --> 00:11:27.720 do one every month, which essentially is doing the same thing. 233 00:11:27.759 --> 00:11:30.799 They're going through mundane astrology, which is oftentimes pretty interesting 234 00:11:30.919 --> 00:11:35.200 mundane meaning of the world, so like not individual horoscopes, 235 00:11:35.240 --> 00:11:38.080 but like what's the horoscope for countries and you know, 236 00:11:38.120 --> 00:11:40.360 what's going on with just the planets you know at 237 00:11:40.399 --> 00:11:40.720 the time. 238 00:11:41.200 --> 00:11:45.039 Interesting? Okay, So yeah, I mean that's it's always unfortunate. 239 00:11:45.159 --> 00:11:48.679 He was young. Forty four is not old, so yeah, 240 00:11:48.720 --> 00:11:50.679 and Matt, you weren't even familiar with them. 241 00:11:50.840 --> 00:11:54.879 Yeah, outside of his appearances on here on various other 242 00:11:54.960 --> 00:11:57.799 mentions of him on here. I hadn't read anything of 243 00:11:57.840 --> 00:12:00.279 his so I was like, did not have, you know, 244 00:12:00.360 --> 00:12:02.799 a huge familiarity with him in his work. So like, 245 00:12:02.919 --> 00:12:04.960 once his death came out, I was hearing all this 246 00:12:05.039 --> 00:12:07.840 other both good and bad things about him all at once. 247 00:12:08.080 --> 00:12:10.919 Yeah, Yeah, I just stopped following him, so I don't, 248 00:12:11.039 --> 00:12:12.879 you know, I didn't know much of what was going 249 00:12:12.919 --> 00:12:14.399 on with him. Yeah. 250 00:12:14.639 --> 00:12:18.639 I generally try to follow like a cult esoteric news, 251 00:12:18.720 --> 00:12:20.559 which is sort of how I heard about but I 252 00:12:21.000 --> 00:12:24.440 I stopped. I mean it was essentially like during the pandemic, 253 00:12:24.519 --> 00:12:27.000 I stopped liking the content that he was, you know, 254 00:12:27.519 --> 00:12:28.759 putting onto his podcast. 255 00:12:28.840 --> 00:12:31.879 So I, like I said, it just never resonated with me. 256 00:12:32.080 --> 00:12:33.919 Like so, I think after the last time I had 257 00:12:34.000 --> 00:12:35.600 him on, that was probably the last time I really 258 00:12:35.600 --> 00:12:36.480 looked at his stuff. 259 00:12:36.799 --> 00:12:39.080 He had some interesting people on that, you know, I 260 00:12:39.679 --> 00:12:43.519 definitely you know, wish still had platforms. Like some people 261 00:12:43.600 --> 00:12:46.120 have completely gone out of the public business, like Sarah 262 00:12:46.120 --> 00:12:48.919 Ann Lawless, who was a great witch who does poison 263 00:12:49.000 --> 00:12:51.440 path stuff out of Canada, but she's you know, out 264 00:12:51.440 --> 00:12:54.399 of the scene in general. She had some really great 265 00:12:54.440 --> 00:12:59.360 stuff to say. Or like Ramsey Dukes, who's somebody from 266 00:12:59.440 --> 00:13:01.639 sort of the same time as Pete Carroll, you know, 267 00:13:02.320 --> 00:13:05.320 Chaos Magic, but people don't talk about Ramsey Dukes as much. 268 00:13:05.360 --> 00:13:08.559 I think Ramsey Duke is really interesting, like very interesting, 269 00:13:09.120 --> 00:13:12.360 you know, and if you're into you know, psychonaut and 270 00:13:12.720 --> 00:13:17.120 Peter Carroll. You should, you know, definitely look into Ramsey 271 00:13:17.200 --> 00:13:17.960 Dukes as well. 272 00:13:18.080 --> 00:13:20.919 All right, we should also bring up the fact that, 273 00:13:21.639 --> 00:13:24.759 let's gonna call it Tyson has a UFO book out now, 274 00:13:24.960 --> 00:13:27.519 like Mike Tyson, no, what's his name, I. 275 00:13:27.519 --> 00:13:29.759 Would read Mike Tyson's UFO I would do. 276 00:13:29.919 --> 00:13:33.519 Yeah, the the guy who took over for I thought. 277 00:13:33.360 --> 00:13:35.759 The UFO was coming over the over the top, and 278 00:13:35.799 --> 00:13:37.159 I said to myself. 279 00:13:38.000 --> 00:13:39.360 The guy who took over for Sagan. 280 00:13:39.519 --> 00:13:44.039 Oh yes, uh yeah, Neil de Grass, you're right Tyson. 281 00:13:44.240 --> 00:13:47.679 Okay, all my brain was giving you is Tyson, because 282 00:13:47.679 --> 00:13:49.759 that's what it likes to do to me. Yeah, Neil 283 00:13:49.759 --> 00:13:52.240 de Grass. Tyson puts out a book on UFL. 284 00:13:52.000 --> 00:13:53.960 Stand by what Matt said would be much better if 285 00:13:53.960 --> 00:13:54.360 this was. 286 00:13:54.320 --> 00:13:58.960 Mike, and it's like, I mean, this just seems like 287 00:13:59.039 --> 00:14:01.799 the obvious. Oh, the UFOs are big. I guess I'll 288 00:14:01.840 --> 00:14:03.639 write a book about it after the wor. 289 00:14:03.919 --> 00:14:06.799 I used to like him, but I and I'll, you know, 290 00:14:06.879 --> 00:14:09.960 I'll publicly say this because he's more famous than you know, 291 00:14:10.120 --> 00:14:12.919 a hair on my head will ever be or other 292 00:14:12.960 --> 00:14:14.840 way around. One of his hairs on his head is 293 00:14:14.840 --> 00:14:18.799 more famous than I'll ever be, so I can punch up. Yeah, 294 00:14:18.840 --> 00:14:22.279 he seems completely disingenuous, and you know, like he just 295 00:14:22.320 --> 00:14:24.559 complete toes whatever line is going to get him the 296 00:14:24.559 --> 00:14:28.120 most eyeballs and most money. And I've also heard too 297 00:14:28.120 --> 00:14:30.559 there are I think there have been some legitimate in 298 00:14:30.679 --> 00:14:34.080 court sexual harassment allegations against the guy. So he might 299 00:14:34.159 --> 00:14:35.039 just be a dirt bag. 300 00:14:35.759 --> 00:14:38.120 That's a little disappointing. Like I don't agree with his 301 00:14:38.240 --> 00:14:40.360 view on things because he has that toe the line 302 00:14:40.399 --> 00:14:43.840 materialistic sort of thing. But I didn't know that that's unfortunate. 303 00:14:43.960 --> 00:14:48.440 Yeah, I used to like him so many years ago, 304 00:14:48.519 --> 00:14:50.639 back when he you know, so many figures like him, 305 00:14:50.639 --> 00:14:53.159 they go through this transformation of where they start out 306 00:14:53.320 --> 00:14:56.519 gaining that kind of media attention because they are not 307 00:14:56.679 --> 00:14:59.840 only a good scientist but also a really gifted just 308 00:15:00.120 --> 00:15:03.080 order and communicator in general. But then like the process 309 00:15:03.240 --> 00:15:06.200 of that fame and media attention turns them into the 310 00:15:06.240 --> 00:15:11.600 trolls that they become. Richard Dawkins but uh, way back 311 00:15:11.679 --> 00:15:14.120 when he was just in that early stages. I read 312 00:15:14.159 --> 00:15:17.440 his book that was, oh what was it called, I 313 00:15:17.440 --> 00:15:21.039 think just something like Origin was just really generalized for 314 00:15:21.200 --> 00:15:25.200 a public audience or a broad audience rather history of 315 00:15:25.240 --> 00:15:27.960 the universe from like Big Bang onwards and like just 316 00:15:28.000 --> 00:15:31.840 so well written, really just fascinating stuff pop science, and 317 00:15:31.879 --> 00:15:34.399 like then just seeing him become what he is now 318 00:15:34.559 --> 00:15:36.000 is like the dude. 319 00:15:36.080 --> 00:15:40.159 I mean, he's very charismatic, he's funny, but yeah, he is. 320 00:15:40.320 --> 00:15:43.559 He definitely is the toe the line. I'm just gonna 321 00:15:43.559 --> 00:15:46.360 go with whatever. Ye In the the UFO book, I 322 00:15:46.360 --> 00:15:52.320 saw what's the guy's name? Hmmm, he was a short 323 00:15:52.559 --> 00:15:55.879 Brian Tyler Cohen did is this is it too? Oh? Now, 324 00:15:55.960 --> 00:15:58.919 I haven't looked at this one. Uh Neil and talks 325 00:15:58.919 --> 00:16:00.879 crop circles. I'm sure that'll be great. 326 00:16:00.960 --> 00:16:04.200 Oh yeah, he's gone like completely, he's he's like full 327 00:16:04.240 --> 00:16:05.399 in now. 328 00:16:05.159 --> 00:16:07.519 But he doesn't. He said that in that interview, he 329 00:16:07.639 --> 00:16:10.240 said that, look, you know, all these government people said 330 00:16:10.240 --> 00:16:13.480 that they that they have stuff and that this is real, 331 00:16:13.519 --> 00:16:16.159 and he's like, okay, well, I mean their authorities so 332 00:16:16.200 --> 00:16:18.080 they should know. But he's like, but at the same time, 333 00:16:18.200 --> 00:16:20.600 he's like, I haven't seen any evidence, and they haven't 334 00:16:20.639 --> 00:16:23.919 presented any evidence. So his book apparently is just like 335 00:16:24.080 --> 00:16:27.360 speculative what it would be like to communicate with another 336 00:16:27.519 --> 00:16:31.000 race extra race, and it's kind of like, Okay, that's 337 00:16:31.120 --> 00:16:34.480 kind of better than him suddenly being like yes, UFOs, 338 00:16:34.759 --> 00:16:35.039 you know. 339 00:16:35.360 --> 00:16:37.679 Like I don't know, Yeah, I don't know. I just 340 00:16:37.720 --> 00:16:39.679 don't like the guy at this point. But yes, you're right, 341 00:16:39.720 --> 00:16:40.279 You're right. 342 00:16:41.679 --> 00:16:43.960 I don't like him either. So I mean, honestly, I'm 343 00:16:44.000 --> 00:16:45.840 not a big fan of Carl Sagan either. I mean, 344 00:16:45.879 --> 00:16:48.759 I know that's like blasphemous the people, but reading about 345 00:16:48.759 --> 00:16:51.799 the whole thing with Velakowsky and Sagan and how Sagan 346 00:16:51.919 --> 00:16:55.120 just went after Velakovsky and in a very dirty way 347 00:16:55.440 --> 00:16:57.480 most of the time, it was just like, this is 348 00:16:57.559 --> 00:16:59.759 not okay, this is not what I would expect from 349 00:16:59.759 --> 00:17:00.799 some one like saying it. 350 00:17:00.919 --> 00:17:02.720 Yeah, I agreed, I mean yes. 351 00:17:02.879 --> 00:17:05.480 And again he started out a little more open minded, 352 00:17:05.519 --> 00:17:07.559 but then just became one of those guys who just 353 00:17:07.599 --> 00:17:08.359 towed the line. 354 00:17:08.640 --> 00:17:11.640 I think it's like it's unfortunately one of those things 355 00:17:11.640 --> 00:17:13.920 that happens to a lot of people once they reach 356 00:17:13.920 --> 00:17:16.720 a certain level of like notoriety, there's a pressure that 357 00:17:16.839 --> 00:17:19.799 becomes upon them where they have to tow this line 358 00:17:20.240 --> 00:17:23.680 or you know, they're going to get essentially canceled and 359 00:17:23.720 --> 00:17:26.119 they're going to lose their livelihood. Not that it's an excuse, 360 00:17:26.160 --> 00:17:27.960 but I do think that happens. And I think, you know, 361 00:17:28.119 --> 00:17:31.319 there's like the weakness of sort of the human I 362 00:17:31.319 --> 00:17:34.599 don't know, ego and the fragility of that. You know, 363 00:17:34.759 --> 00:17:37.440 you can see that, especially if it's you know, they're 364 00:17:37.480 --> 00:17:38.720 faced with hardship. 365 00:17:39.119 --> 00:17:41.799 Yeah, oh totally, yeah, yeah, you know, And I think 366 00:17:41.839 --> 00:17:46.039 that's that's one of the weak spots of science, is thatly. Yeah. 367 00:17:46.079 --> 00:17:48.720 I mean the money aspect of it makes it hard 368 00:17:48.759 --> 00:17:50.400 for anyone to do novel research. 369 00:17:50.599 --> 00:17:54.720 It'll make everybody scream, you know, Collin, me and me 370 00:17:54.839 --> 00:18:00.079 and Matt socialists or whatever. But yeah, it's capitalism, guys, 371 00:18:00.079 --> 00:18:04.279 predatory capitalism. It is off comrades, corporate capitalism. Whatever. 372 00:18:04.720 --> 00:18:08.279 Yeah, it's funny because, uh, I don't generally rewatch stuff 373 00:18:08.359 --> 00:18:10.200 because there's so much stuff I want to watch in 374 00:18:10.240 --> 00:18:12.200 some little time to do it. But I decided to 375 00:18:12.240 --> 00:18:13.240 rewatch Fringe. 376 00:18:13.599 --> 00:18:17.000 Oh nice, And I'm crossing my fingers. It was good. 377 00:18:17.160 --> 00:18:20.400 Oh it's better than it was. So much of the 378 00:18:20.440 --> 00:18:23.359 stuff there like dead on about like it's stuff we've 379 00:18:23.400 --> 00:18:26.200 actually advanced since then, and I'm going, oh, this is 380 00:18:26.279 --> 00:18:30.279 totally a possible thing. Including so episode five is a 381 00:18:30.319 --> 00:18:32.920 guy who's shorting out electronics next to him, like he 382 00:18:32.960 --> 00:18:36.200 gets upset, electronics all start shorting out. I'm like, I 383 00:18:36.240 --> 00:18:39.880 feel like I should have remembered this episode better. But 384 00:18:40.119 --> 00:18:43.319 it's you know, like they're talking about obviously fringe science, 385 00:18:43.519 --> 00:18:45.680 and I'm going a lot of this stuff is not 386 00:18:46.000 --> 00:18:48.759 as fringy as it was back then, like some of 387 00:18:48.799 --> 00:18:52.039 it still is. It's fiction obviously, but like I'm only 388 00:18:52.079 --> 00:18:54.599 in the first season because it was back when TV 389 00:18:54.720 --> 00:18:58.519 had like twenty episodes a season rather than ten like 390 00:18:58.559 --> 00:19:00.759 they do now. That was one of the actually sticking 391 00:19:00.759 --> 00:19:02.480 points where I'm going, Man, I kind of want to 392 00:19:02.480 --> 00:19:06.400 watch it again, but it's one hundred episodes. So yeah, 393 00:19:06.640 --> 00:19:10.400 I'm slowly working through season one, but I'm really enjoying it. 394 00:19:10.480 --> 00:19:12.880 And I'm like, I sort of remember bits and pieces, 395 00:19:13.160 --> 00:19:14.960 but not much as it came out in like two 396 00:19:15.000 --> 00:19:17.559 thousand and eight, so almost twenty years ago. Yeah, and 397 00:19:17.640 --> 00:19:20.359 I'm just like, but this is really good. Like the 398 00:19:21.519 --> 00:19:24.920 actual like freed and Science is actually pretty solid. 399 00:19:25.039 --> 00:19:26.680 I mean I think I based a lot of it 400 00:19:26.799 --> 00:19:31.200 on stuff that actually was going on. Yeah you know, yeah, yeah, 401 00:19:31.240 --> 00:19:34.720