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Speaker 1: What is up Pelasiko's I Am Damna Valley coming at

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you with a break from our NBA team look Ahead

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series and some of the wrap up stuff that Grant

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and I will do to talk with the one, the Only,

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mister Mike Sheer of the Basketball Poetry Newsletter. You should

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subscribe I can't talk today. The link to it will

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be in the podcast and YouTube description as well to

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the social media machine which his handle is at b

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ball is poetry spelled exactly as it sounds. Him very

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easy to remember first time guests, So Mike doesn't know

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what he's getting into just yet, but I'm excited to

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talk hoops with him. He is so good at what

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he does. So again, I just want to echo, subscribe

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to the Basketball Poetry Newsletter. It's dope, Mike. How the

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heck are you doing?

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Speaker 2: I'm doing great. You're just filled with good advice for

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people already. It's a good start. I'm excited to be here.

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Thank you.

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Speaker 1: I'm excited that you came on to do this topic

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that I wanted to do, which is we're gonna talk

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about potential hidden gems from every or not every NBA team.

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We've alternated, We've each picked like seven players. We will

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go through them. Uh, these are We're not saying they're

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gonna be breakout stars or anything. These are just sort

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of names that might be off the beaten path a

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little bit that we think are worth monitoring into next season,

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and of course beyond your list, So you had each

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other's list in advance. Your list did not disappoint. I

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knew there was gonna be some deep cuts on there,

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so I'm excited. Like some of these guys I just

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don't have a great feel for, So I'm excited to

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hear you and watch you drop buckets of knowledge on

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players that I don't even have strong opinions on just yet.

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Speaker 2: That's what I'm here for. And when you say we're

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venturing off the beaten path, we are venturing way off.

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So well, we'll see. I think it's gonna be a

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lot of fun and I'm ready to go.

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Speaker 1: All right, let's begin, and it's your We'll start with you.

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You're the guest of honor here. Who do you have?

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Speaker 2: All right, We're not venturing off the beaten path at

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all with our first one, which is gonna ben Nick

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Mathern Right, we got we gotta keep you guys hoped somehow,

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So I think in in the end and there's to

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be two guys you commonly see referred to as breakout candidates,

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and they're going to be Andrew Debard and Benedict Maden.

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I think that there's a strong case to be made

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for both of them. But I'm really excited to see

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what matherin to do can do given a full starting spot,

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no questions asked. He's going to be given a lot

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more leash, I think because he has just frankly going

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to need their offense from somewhere. I saw a really

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interesting interview with Rick Carlyle on Kaitlyn Cooper's excellent YouTube channel,

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so you should check that out. But he had a

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really can we.

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Speaker 1: Call her newsbreaker Kaitlyn Cooper now that we know.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, she's adding more like honorifics after her name with

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like every passing day, it seems like so. But she

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had a really good interview with Carlisle where Carlo said

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that when Benedict Matheren came into the league, he saw

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a path to greatness that was outdated, specifically citing like

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Kobe Bryant, and I thought that was such an interesting

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insight into his initial mindset, right, and it's like it's true.

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Back in the day, it's like you were expected to

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be a great shot maker, a difficult shot maker in

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order to become a superstar. Nowadays, it's all about trying

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to find the easiest looks. Like, yeah, it's awesome if

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you make the hard one, someone has to do it.

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But like, you want to try to get these efficient looks.

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You want to try to get these high expected value attempts.

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And it's taken mather In a little while to kind

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of figure out how to work within a system where

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that's the end goal. Carlile also cited Pascal Siakam is

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a guy who kind of underwent a similar, similar evolution

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throughout his career and has improved dramatically because of it.

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And he thinks that Mathern has improved in this way

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and he's getting better. You know, you look at Matherin analytically,

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there's a lot of things to like. He's good to

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drive free throws, he's good at getting the rim. He's

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quietly improved as finishing the three pointer is a little mediocre.

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Stubbornly mediocre is the way I say it. But it's

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it's definitely a proof of concept is there. He can

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make three pointers. He just needs to be a little

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more consistent with it. The defense is a problem. The

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defense is going to have to be better, particularly off ball.

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I think Carlisle is somebody who has had sort of

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a short leash for that in the past, but might

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not have a choice year. I think so, well, let

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me pause here for a second. I have a question

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for you, Dan, do you think you can teach feel?

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I think Matherin is somebody who has had to develop

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feel on both sides and feels too often used is

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like are you a good passer? And feels a lot

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exterer than that. I think right like, feel, I think

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is like can you fill in the gaps in the

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game that contribute towards winning on both sides? And I

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think that's something that Madin came in with not a

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lot of and is slowly trying to add to it.

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But do you think that's a thing that you can

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that you can teach?

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Speaker 1: I think there's probably layers to it. If it's a

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feel for like, how do I toggle between what I

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need to do based off what my team needs on

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a given night? I would think that's something that like

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because if you're Ben mcmatherin this season, Indie needs something

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from you that they're not gonna need when Tyrey's Haliburton

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is back next season. And so I could see you

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developing that type of feel my guests would be And

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I'm just not savvy enough when it comes to the

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intricacies of NBA defense. That's a lot harder to do

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on the defense eve end. And I would just point

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to like Karl Anthony Towns as an example like that

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is just like you talk about if you want someone

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to maybe learn defensive feel, it would be him, and

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just like he doesn't have it, And so I don't

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know how you would impart that necessarily on to somebody.

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Speaker 2: Now I think you're right. Like to me, it's like

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you can kind of teach field maybe to get somebody

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from bad to adequate. I don't know that you can

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do it to get from adequate to great on either end.

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But I think this is going to be a year

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where we see if you can teach field. Because this

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is gonna be Matheren's fourth year, He's going to be

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expected to show these major improvements if he wants to

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claim the starting spot that Carlo Lets said outright is

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his right now? Yeah, so I think like Matheren is

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a guy who's primed for a breakup. I do have

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one last interesting fact before I turned it back over

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to you, which is that Mathern actually had the highest

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dunk rate of his career last season, in his third year,

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and that's very unusual. Most players typically peak their dunk

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rates in their first and maybe second year, and then

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it just declines almost universally. And I think there's something

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to him playing with a little bit more force that

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I'm hoping to see carry over into this season. So yeah,

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he's going to have the opportunity. I think the skill

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sets have been building towards something great. I'm not sure

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of it, but I think it's there and I'm excited

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to see what he does.

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Speaker 1: Do you think there's any just I don't know if

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the word is concerned, but because of what I mentioned before,

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where it's you're gonna need like functionally, one thing from

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him this season is just as a shot creator, even

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just for himself, I would assume they're gonna lean on

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that more. They might even be happy with like some

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of the gimmicky stuff he does to try and draw fouls,

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but then like, Okay, now you have to scale it

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back again from when Tyres Haliburton comes back the following

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season if you're the Pacers, or just like based off

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you're like, how do you juggle something like that? Or

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is it just very much like we need this now

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and we're gonna have to like because he's gonna be

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I'm assuming he doesn't get an extension. Maybe he does,

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but if he doesn't, now you're trying to figure out

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how much you want to pay him moving forward without

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maybe knowing Okay, is he the right fit for the

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context of our full strength ecosystem?

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Speaker 2: Yeah? I think you have to be focused on the

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here and now in the hopes that like when, when,

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and if Caliburton comes back at full strength, the things

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that are most important for Matheram will naturally rise to

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the surface, right Like coaches obviously come in and they

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give players explicit roles, explicit things they're supposed to do.

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But there's also sort of a pecking order in an

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NBA offense that arises naturally based on position skill, and

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there are times players can throw that out of whack,

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for sure, and I think Matheren has had a history

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of doing that at times in the past. But I

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think as players get older, as they mature, they have

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a better understanding where they're supposed to fit in. And

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I think Matheren knows this is his year to go

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show out and get paid, as you pointed out, and

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if and when he gets extended, I think it'll be

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a little bit easier for him being like, hey, I've

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proven I can do these things now that Haliburton's back,

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like I can go back to playing a more natural role.

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Speaker 1: He'd be an interesting like most improved player pick, just

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because if you think that he's going to have the

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volume there.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I had that in my notes that I think,

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like Nemhart, I think is the odds had them as

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like very high.

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Speaker 1: I want to say, when I looked a couple I

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haven't looked at any of that stuff that I.

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Speaker 2: Looked a couple of weeks ago, and Nemhart was really high.

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Wasn't that much further down? And truthfully, I think just

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Matherin's mindset of like I'm gonna go out there and

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get buckets. He's already scored call it sixteen points per

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game for his career or something along those lines, but

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very easily it hit the twenty, which I think is

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going to be a sticky number for voters looking at MIP,

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maybe more so than some of the stuff that nem

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Harden might prove like his assistants. So I absolutely think

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that's in play if he comes out and plays to

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his potential.

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Speaker 1: Let's move on to what'll be my first pick. So

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I was debating whether or not to include this player

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because I was looking at it's Atlanta Mogay, the acquisition

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of Christaps porzingis. You have Jalen Johnson there, you have

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on Y Echo conglu Ason. Newell's there as well, but

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like the Hawks are. I'm very high on the Hawks,

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but their front line could be a little bit shakier

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when you look at the time that porzingis traditionally missed

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and then like whatever was going on with him last season.

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Jalen Johnson ever since entering the rotation has not really

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been a billboard for durability dealt with a bunch of

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shoulder stuff. It's like they might need Mogay, And I'm

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really intrigued by the idea of Mogay, someone who like

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can slide between the four and the five. Opponent shot

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eight percentage points worse within six feet against him last year,

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He's averaged over two blocks per thirty six minutes for

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his career. He took like a lot, Like the share

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of his shots that came from three last year was high,

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it was like almost fifty percent or whatever. He does

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not make them is the other problem. There's also like

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real potential for him to do stuff around the basket,

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but again, the finishing is an adventure and their percentages

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aren't great. But I think like as someone who can

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play next to any other big that you basically have

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on Atlanta's roster, there might be an opportunity there for

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him to get some good minutes, especially if they don't

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want to give Newell minutes at the four spot at

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any point right away, because if Porzingis and Jalen Johnson,

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if one of them doesn't miss time, that's gonna be

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like one of the biggest shots in Atlanta for next season.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, totally. And Gay's funny man because he I can't

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prove this, but I swear he takes the biggest strides

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in the NBA. Like when he's caught out a position,

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he's trying to ca and make a block or get

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back to where he's supposed to be he can cover

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an insane amount of ground, like Yiannis levels amount of

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ground with one step. Yeah, like I think the other

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like he's he's willing but not quite able to make

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the three pointer. And I think that his fit as

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sort of a stretch forwards a little more theoretical than

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actual right now. I like him and like, you catch

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him on the right night, and you'll see him do

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all these things that look like a legitimate, like first

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big off the bench type stuff, which I think is

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probably his ceiling on the Hawks. The problem is it's

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hard to get him to do all those things every night.

241
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You kind of have, you know, you might see him

242
00:10:35,000 --> 00:10:36,440
hit a couple threes one night, and then the next

243
00:10:36,519 --> 00:10:38,240
night you might see him get a couple of steals

244
00:10:38,320 --> 00:10:40,480
or have a block. I think the defense is probably

245
00:10:40,480 --> 00:10:43,440
his biggest skill right now. He's the defensive playmaker right

246
00:10:44,360 --> 00:10:48,559
Actually being a strong space defender is something he's still learning,

247
00:10:48,600 --> 00:10:51,720
which is fair because he's played like fifty NBA games

248
00:10:51,799 --> 00:10:53,200
or something. Even last year, when he was a starter

249
00:10:53,279 --> 00:10:54,799
for much of the year, he played less than half

250
00:10:54,799 --> 00:10:58,840
the season. So it's hard for me to disentangle what

251
00:10:59,320 --> 00:11:02,200
Mogay is now versus what he could be one hundred

252
00:11:02,240 --> 00:11:04,440
years further into his career. But I do think your

253
00:11:04,440 --> 00:11:07,440
point about the Hawks is right. They have a very

254
00:11:07,960 --> 00:11:12,480
peculiar front court. There's a surprising amount of like flexibility,

255
00:11:12,519 --> 00:11:14,240
I think in a lot of their players, including Gay.

256
00:11:14,480 --> 00:11:16,799
But what that also means is like roles are very

257
00:11:16,879 --> 00:11:19,480
versatile right now, there's a lot that could happen that

258
00:11:19,559 --> 00:11:21,159
it's hard to pin down until we see what these

259
00:11:21,200 --> 00:11:23,639
guys look like in action, particularly given the injury concerns

260
00:11:23,679 --> 00:11:27,559
of the Porzingises and the Johnson's, who I love. Yeah,

261
00:11:27,679 --> 00:11:30,600
so I'm interested in Gay. I truly, he's only played

262
00:11:30,600 --> 00:11:32,799
fifty games. It's tough for me to say with confidence,

263
00:11:32,879 --> 00:11:34,480
like where he's going to fit in them to this

264
00:11:34,519 --> 00:11:36,039
team if they're all fully healthy.

265
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Speaker 1: The other I don't know if it's a concern, but

266
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you mentioned like to him as a theoretical stretch for

267
00:11:42,360 --> 00:11:44,279
do you feel okay with him at the five, because

268
00:11:44,279 --> 00:11:45,840
one of the other qualms I would pick is just

269
00:11:45,840 --> 00:11:47,960
there's not a lot of physicality to his game, and

270
00:11:48,000 --> 00:11:49,559
it feels like that's why they even up to the

271
00:11:49,559 --> 00:11:51,120
share of his minutes at the four. I mean, some

272
00:11:51,159 --> 00:11:53,240
of that was roster construction stuff. Don't get me wrong,

273
00:11:53,480 --> 00:11:55,320
but it's that if you don't trust him to necessarily

274
00:11:55,399 --> 00:11:57,399
hold up is someone needs to get stronger. Do you

275
00:11:57,399 --> 00:11:59,559
see the potential for him to get more physical? I

276
00:11:59,679 --> 00:12:03,159
remain just decidedly undecided in that arena as to what

277
00:12:03,279 --> 00:12:05,759
position he'd be best at, Like, yeah, breaking case of

278
00:12:05,799 --> 00:12:09,120
emergency at the five, but I think almost like he

279
00:12:09,240 --> 00:12:11,039
might have to be better off at the four, Like

280
00:12:11,080 --> 00:12:12,919
if he's he at least needs to finish better through

281
00:12:12,960 --> 00:12:14,840
contact on the offensive end if you want him to

282
00:12:14,840 --> 00:12:16,799
be able to play like the five role, maybe like

283
00:12:16,879 --> 00:12:19,799
set the stronger streams there. So, and I just don't

284
00:12:19,840 --> 00:12:21,440
know where most of his minutes are gonna come this

285
00:12:21,519 --> 00:12:23,039
year when you look at the makeup of the roster,

286
00:12:23,039 --> 00:12:26,000
because if Jalen Johnson's just healthy, thirty five minutes per

287
00:12:26,000 --> 00:12:29,080
game at the four, just gone right off, right, yeah.

288
00:12:28,960 --> 00:12:30,799
Speaker 2: And that's about work because I think defensively, I like

289
00:12:30,799 --> 00:12:33,399
gave best as sort of like this roamer lurker Jared

290
00:12:34,000 --> 00:12:35,879
Jared Jackson type where he can just like run around

291
00:12:35,919 --> 00:12:37,919
and cause havoc. Right, Like, I don't know that his

292
00:12:38,080 --> 00:12:41,919
gifts are maximized as a five. He is big enough theoretically,

293
00:12:41,919 --> 00:12:43,360
but to your point, like, he has to be a

294
00:12:43,399 --> 00:12:45,320
little bit more forceful if they want to hold up

295
00:12:45,799 --> 00:12:47,759
with him in the middle for more than a minute

296
00:12:47,799 --> 00:12:51,799
or two at a time. He's young enough, in inexperienced enough.

297
00:12:51,799 --> 00:12:54,679
I'm not going to write it off as a lost

298
00:12:54,720 --> 00:12:56,919
cause yet, but right now I think it is closer

299
00:12:56,919 --> 00:12:59,399
to break class in case of emergency. But then again,

300
00:12:59,480 --> 00:13:00,919
like the Hawks of kind of gotten away with that

301
00:13:00,960 --> 00:13:03,120
in the past, Like I don't think when Yako Kongwu

302
00:13:03,279 --> 00:13:05,159
was capable of playing center for the first few years

303
00:13:05,200 --> 00:13:07,240
of his career either, and he developed to a player

304
00:13:07,279 --> 00:13:08,720
who can do that now. I think there's a lot

305
00:13:08,759 --> 00:13:12,240
of similarities sort of in their progression so far through

306
00:13:12,279 --> 00:13:13,879
their careers. I think he has kind of followed him

307
00:13:13,879 --> 00:13:18,679
those footsteps to some ex step. So it's there. I'm

308
00:13:18,720 --> 00:13:20,600
not optimistic, but I'm not going to shut the door

309
00:13:20,639 --> 00:13:21,120
on it either.

310
00:13:22,200 --> 00:13:25,559
Speaker 1: Who do we have for your next pick? Uh? Well, yeah,

311
00:13:25,559 --> 00:13:26,399
I'm excited about this.

312
00:13:27,320 --> 00:13:30,679
Speaker 2: Yeah, So I went with nimiyash Keda. Hopefully I got

313
00:13:30,679 --> 00:13:35,039
that right. For any Portuguese listeners out there, Keava is

314
00:13:35,080 --> 00:13:37,360
a guy who's kind of flashed for a long time,

315
00:13:37,399 --> 00:13:40,679
but he's never been given enough opportunity to really make

316
00:13:40,720 --> 00:13:43,720
it stick. I think he's somebody who is quietly going

317
00:13:43,759 --> 00:13:47,120
to really benefit from just having a guaranteed twenty minutes

318
00:13:47,200 --> 00:13:48,600
or so a night coming forward. I think there's a

319
00:13:48,639 --> 00:13:50,720
lot that once he settles down a little bit and

320
00:13:50,720 --> 00:13:52,320
he feels more comfortable and he's not going to get

321
00:13:52,399 --> 00:13:54,759
yanked after every foul, like I think he's actually his

322
00:13:54,879 --> 00:13:58,320
strengths are going to shine a lot brighter. And truly,

323
00:13:58,360 --> 00:14:01,279
you could pick almost any Celtics center for this spot,

324
00:14:01,399 --> 00:14:03,679
right Like, like I know you're a Chris Buchet fan

325
00:14:03,720 --> 00:14:06,159
who's on the team now, I think like Luca Garza

326
00:14:06,240 --> 00:14:07,960
is going to have a random night where he scores

327
00:14:08,000 --> 00:14:09,720
twenty one points and people are gonna lose their minds

328
00:14:09,759 --> 00:14:12,679
in Boston. But to me, like kenn is the guy

329
00:14:12,679 --> 00:14:15,559
who's like he's got legitimate NBA center size. He's the

330
00:14:15,559 --> 00:14:17,360
biggest amount of court more often than not, and he

331
00:14:17,480 --> 00:14:22,039
uses it well, like he sets some massive screens. He's

332
00:14:22,080 --> 00:14:25,480
a great offensive rebounder. I think he's got pretty good

333
00:14:25,480 --> 00:14:27,559
hands for some of his size. It's not necessarily his

334
00:14:27,600 --> 00:14:29,519
calling card, but this is not going to be a

335
00:14:29,559 --> 00:14:32,960
team that has a lot of amazing passers necessarily either

336
00:14:33,120 --> 00:14:34,879
in Boston, Like, I don't think they're gonna be throwing

337
00:14:34,919 --> 00:14:37,039
these crazy no looks that he catch him off guard.

338
00:14:37,120 --> 00:14:38,480
You know, when he catches his pass, it's going to

339
00:14:38,519 --> 00:14:42,080
be like a system pass that was expected to be there.

340
00:14:42,120 --> 00:14:44,399
He'll be able to turn and mash on somebody. So

341
00:14:44,799 --> 00:14:46,639
it's not that I think Kada necessarily is going to

342
00:14:46,679 --> 00:14:49,120
have this sudden like growth and skill set so much

343
00:14:49,120 --> 00:14:50,600
as he's finally going to be given a chance to

344
00:14:50,600 --> 00:14:53,200
go out there play really hard, which he's good at.

345
00:14:54,000 --> 00:14:56,200
He's improved his valorid over time. That's always been his

346
00:14:56,279 --> 00:14:58,360
big you know, Bugbear is like he just fouls the

347
00:14:58,360 --> 00:15:01,039
crap out of people. He does that slightly less. I

348
00:15:01,039 --> 00:15:03,240
think he's still learning the intricacies of being a shot

349
00:15:03,360 --> 00:15:06,840
blocker versus being a rim protector, and he leans more

350
00:15:06,879 --> 00:15:09,080
towards the ladder, and their Celtics are slowly trying to

351
00:15:09,080 --> 00:15:13,279
move him towards the former. But I'm hopeful that just

352
00:15:13,919 --> 00:15:15,759
this is just a guy who just really needs to

353
00:15:15,799 --> 00:15:18,200
have twenty games with twenty minutes, and I think he

354
00:15:18,279 --> 00:15:20,879
will be so much more comfortable in that role.

355
00:15:21,639 --> 00:15:24,200
Speaker 1: I think the dearth of other options is really gonna

356
00:15:24,200 --> 00:15:25,879
help him. I would assigned. But if he's not, like

357
00:15:26,240 --> 00:15:28,600
what's gone wrong in Boston? If Cata or I guess

358
00:15:28,600 --> 00:15:30,679
what's gone right? Like who's the breakout Keddy with Katea

359
00:15:30,720 --> 00:15:33,720
is not getting minutes, I'm curious how he'll be impacted

360
00:15:33,720 --> 00:15:36,240
by I guess they still do have plenty of spacing.

361
00:15:36,320 --> 00:15:38,519
If you throw Jalen Brown in there, you have Derek White.

362
00:15:38,799 --> 00:15:40,919
Sam Hauser can shoot the hell of a Peyton Pritchard

363
00:15:41,200 --> 00:15:44,080
because like, generating the rim pressure will be important to

364
00:15:44,080 --> 00:15:45,639
what he does on offense. I am intrue he's got

365
00:15:45,720 --> 00:15:49,039
like almost fifty percent from float to range. Last year

366
00:15:49,039 --> 00:15:50,759
on it was think it was like forty plus attempts

367
00:15:50,759 --> 00:15:55,279
to So that's semi interesting. But they just need bodies

368
00:15:55,320 --> 00:15:57,039
on the front lines. I'm open to anyone, but like

369
00:15:57,080 --> 00:15:58,759
you can tell me they signed someone off the shop, like, well,

370
00:15:58,759 --> 00:16:00,399
that might be a breakout candidate, cause is gonna get

371
00:16:00,399 --> 00:16:01,480
minutes on the front line.

372
00:16:02,080 --> 00:16:06,519
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly. Someone has to compile center statistics, right there's

373
00:16:06,519 --> 00:16:08,320
a certain number of points and rebounds that just go

374
00:16:08,480 --> 00:16:11,159
to any center on any NBA team, And I think

375
00:16:11,200 --> 00:16:13,600
that he is the one most deserving of them on

376
00:16:13,840 --> 00:16:17,480
this Celtics team right now, that I'm not super high

377
00:16:17,519 --> 00:16:19,159
on the Celtics for next year, but there's certainly a

378
00:16:19,240 --> 00:16:22,759
possibility that they overperform in a relatively weak Eastern Conference, right,

379
00:16:22,840 --> 00:16:24,360
And I think that if they do, I think it's

380
00:16:24,399 --> 00:16:27,879
because he is surprisingly competent in a starter role.

381
00:16:28,879 --> 00:16:31,679
Speaker 1: What's like, what is the the date at which the

382
00:16:31,759 --> 00:16:35,120
Celtics will begin forfeiting home games and substituting in the

383
00:16:35,240 --> 00:16:37,840
town watch parties at TD Garden because it seems like

384
00:16:38,320 --> 00:16:40,519
they're headed in that direction. I just I thought they were.

385
00:16:40,960 --> 00:16:42,759
They still have White and Brown and like, it's not

386
00:16:42,840 --> 00:16:45,600
like they sold off Sam Hawser or Peyton Pritchard. Yeah,

387
00:16:45,679 --> 00:16:48,720
but like they've just entered coupon clipping mode here with

388
00:16:48,759 --> 00:16:50,080
the amount of money they shed. So I don't even

389
00:16:50,080 --> 00:16:52,120
have a great feel for what their aim is because

390
00:16:52,320 --> 00:16:54,720
you could argue Keita is like great because he kind

391
00:16:54,759 --> 00:16:57,360
of fuels you don't want to call the stealth tank,

392
00:16:57,440 --> 00:16:59,039
but a gap here. So it's like, yeah, we're just

393
00:16:59,279 --> 00:17:01,480
trying to develop and see what we have moving forward

394
00:17:01,519 --> 00:17:03,840
in some of our cheaper players. But if you're going

395
00:17:03,919 --> 00:17:06,480
to play brown and White, and even to a lesser extent,

396
00:17:06,839 --> 00:17:09,200
Pritchard and Hawsar is Anthony Simon's we're going to be

397
00:17:09,240 --> 00:17:11,640
on this roster when the season starts. They're talking about

398
00:17:11,680 --> 00:17:14,119
they'd like to bring out Horford back still, which I

399
00:17:14,160 --> 00:17:17,119
wouldn't expect them to. I still, I think the Celtics

400
00:17:17,200 --> 00:17:18,799
just sent kind of a clear message. I might be

401
00:17:18,880 --> 00:17:20,759
getting too wrapped up in the well Derek White and

402
00:17:20,839 --> 00:17:22,359
Jail and Brown are still here of it all.

403
00:17:23,079 --> 00:17:25,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, I actually am totally on the same boat as you.

404
00:17:25,599 --> 00:17:27,599
I had a half written Celtics article. I just discard

405
00:17:27,680 --> 00:17:28,680
him because I just didn't know what to make of

406
00:17:28,720 --> 00:17:31,359
these guys. It's like they did. They they're trying to

407
00:17:31,559 --> 00:17:36,000
kind of, you know, run this middle road where they're

408
00:17:36,039 --> 00:17:38,119
not quite tanking into a gap year, but they're not

409
00:17:38,319 --> 00:17:40,359
quite remaining as competitive as they could be. And I

410
00:17:40,400 --> 00:17:42,160
don't really know where that's going to leave them. It's

411
00:17:42,480 --> 00:17:43,720
the East is just going to be so hard to

412
00:17:43,720 --> 00:17:46,440
predict that for the top couple teams. At some of

413
00:17:46,519 --> 00:17:48,759
these teams, maybe Boston, maybe Miami are gonna end up

414
00:17:48,759 --> 00:17:50,440
being better than we think, and some and it might

415
00:17:50,480 --> 00:17:51,720
be the exact same teams, some are going to be

416
00:17:51,759 --> 00:17:53,200
way worse than we think. And it's really hard to

417
00:17:53,240 --> 00:17:56,720
tell right now, at least for me, Yeah, so it's

418
00:17:56,759 --> 00:18:00,559
going to be It'll be telling this see if they

419
00:18:01,119 --> 00:18:04,240
do something to bolster or subtract from their center rotation,

420
00:18:04,400 --> 00:18:06,000
you know, midway through the season.

421
00:18:07,359 --> 00:18:09,119
Speaker 1: My next pick comes from a team that is not

422
00:18:09,279 --> 00:18:11,680
going to struggle to find its identity next season, the

423
00:18:11,720 --> 00:18:14,400
Cleveland Cavaliers and Sam Merrill, which I think is like

424
00:18:15,000 --> 00:18:17,559
kind of on the Benedict Mathren level, maybe not quite

425
00:18:17,559 --> 00:18:19,839
as much of just Okay, people know who this guy is,

426
00:18:20,319 --> 00:18:22,960
but do they know how good that he can absolutely be?

427
00:18:23,039 --> 00:18:24,720
And I think just some of the reaction to him

428
00:18:24,759 --> 00:18:27,200
getting four years and thirty eight million dollars in free

429
00:18:27,200 --> 00:18:31,599
agency made me feel okay about putting him here to where, like,

430
00:18:31,720 --> 00:18:34,559
this dude can shoot and it's like an anomalous combination

431
00:18:34,839 --> 00:18:38,640
of volume and efficiency. The stat I have pulled up

432
00:18:38,680 --> 00:18:41,119
for him is among everyone who is tallied at least

433
00:18:41,119 --> 00:18:43,119
as many minutes as him. Over the past two seasons,

434
00:18:43,480 --> 00:18:46,799
Steph Curry, Klay Thompson, Dante DiVincenzo, and Malik Beasley are

435
00:18:46,839 --> 00:18:49,400
the only players to average over ten threes per thirty

436
00:18:49,440 --> 00:18:51,720
six minutes while hitting them at at least a thirty

437
00:18:51,720 --> 00:18:55,279
eight percent clip. That's insane when you look at the level. Yeah,

438
00:18:55,359 --> 00:18:57,440
when you look at the level of difficulty on some

439
00:18:57,559 --> 00:18:59,720
of his looks, what I think is just I have

440
00:19:00,160 --> 00:19:02,960
shaate the various methods in which he can just bombs

441
00:19:03,000 --> 00:19:05,359
away like it's coming around screens. He can do the

442
00:19:05,359 --> 00:19:08,720
stuff from a standstill. He has the escape dribble to

443
00:19:08,839 --> 00:19:10,960
his game. He doesn't take a lot of twos, but

444
00:19:11,039 --> 00:19:14,039
it seems like he's improved it dribbling away from aggressive

445
00:19:14,079 --> 00:19:16,880
closeouts and can spray the ball out to other shooters

446
00:19:16,880 --> 00:19:19,839
if he gets moving. I like him as just this guy.

447
00:19:20,079 --> 00:19:23,799
Your offense of possessions will never stall out because of him,

448
00:19:23,880 --> 00:19:26,160
and I think I don't want to say he's good,

449
00:19:26,599 --> 00:19:29,200
but there's like a serviceability to the way that he

450
00:19:29,319 --> 00:19:32,640
plays defense, like he just he will try to fight

451
00:19:33,000 --> 00:19:35,519
through screens. He's not super big, but there's like a

452
00:19:35,640 --> 00:19:39,119
toughness there. And I'm wondering if that in a relatively

453
00:19:39,160 --> 00:19:43,000
crowded Cleveland rotation, even without Ti Jerome, you have Lonzo

454
00:19:43,119 --> 00:19:46,079
Ball coming in here. If Dean Wade and DeAndre Hunter

455
00:19:46,079 --> 00:19:47,880
are all healthy at the same time, if Larry Nance

456
00:19:47,960 --> 00:19:50,440
Junior is healthy as well, this might be the year

457
00:19:50,480 --> 00:19:53,240
we see some Jalen Tyson minutes like as a sophomore,

458
00:19:53,759 --> 00:19:56,119
even Craig Porter junior, Like, when you lose Tai Jerome Orre,

459
00:19:56,119 --> 00:19:58,519
you gonna want the half court dribbling element that he provides.

460
00:19:58,880 --> 00:20:01,119
I'm curious to see where his minutes end up, like

461
00:20:01,279 --> 00:20:03,720
in just this gaggle of options from Cleveland. But I'm

462
00:20:03,759 --> 00:20:06,240
going to assume, because they paid him, that he might

463
00:20:06,319 --> 00:20:09,319
be in line for like a fairly prominent role with

464
00:20:09,440 --> 00:20:11,920
this team, more than we've seen over the past couple seasons.

465
00:20:12,039 --> 00:20:13,920
I think that that's going to end up being really

466
00:20:14,000 --> 00:20:14,799
good for the Caps.

467
00:20:15,759 --> 00:20:18,119
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm a big Sam Marril guy, Like I think

468
00:20:18,599 --> 00:20:21,599
the calculus and I'm oversimplifying here, but if the calculus

469
00:20:21,799 --> 00:20:25,440
for Cleveland was Lonzo Ball and San Marril or Ty Jerome,

470
00:20:25,799 --> 00:20:28,279
and I guess maybe Isaaca Korro, I think that they

471
00:20:28,359 --> 00:20:31,279
probably made the right call. I think Merrill Is, as

472
00:20:31,359 --> 00:20:32,880
you pointed out with their stat is one of the

473
00:20:33,039 --> 00:20:36,599
legitimately bet like greatest shooters the NBA has today. And

474
00:20:36,680 --> 00:20:38,319
these are not just like I'm going to stand in

475
00:20:38,359 --> 00:20:39,960
the corner and shoot three. So though there is lots

476
00:20:40,000 --> 00:20:42,119
of that, Like this guy is zooming around right like

477
00:20:42,359 --> 00:20:45,240
this is a real honesty goodness movement shooter, which is

478
00:20:45,279 --> 00:20:47,519
a rare skill in the NBA. Then I think people

479
00:20:47,640 --> 00:20:51,759
realize the only hesitation I have with him here and

480
00:20:52,400 --> 00:20:54,720
is that he was playing, you know, twenty minutes a

481
00:20:54,799 --> 00:20:56,680
game for them last season, which is kind of a lot.

482
00:20:56,880 --> 00:20:59,440
It's unless he becomes a starter, it's gonna be hard

483
00:20:59,440 --> 00:21:01,359
for him to find like too much more than that,

484
00:21:01,880 --> 00:21:06,279
So I think there could be some I think surface level,

485
00:21:06,359 --> 00:21:08,119
his stats might not change all that much. But I

486
00:21:08,759 --> 00:21:10,119
agree with all the things you said, and I think

487
00:21:10,160 --> 00:21:12,519
we'll see more from whom in games that matter because

488
00:21:12,559 --> 00:21:14,599
it won't be Jerome playing twenty eight minutes down the

489
00:21:14,640 --> 00:21:16,160
stretch anymore. They're gonna have to find a way to

490
00:21:16,279 --> 00:21:19,000
get some of that offense somewhere else. And Meryl can't

491
00:21:19,000 --> 00:21:21,240
do the drill draft stuff that Jerome did, obviously, But

492
00:21:22,000 --> 00:21:23,960
he can shoot even better than Like he's a better

493
00:21:24,039 --> 00:21:26,599
movement off ball shooter than Jerome for sure. And I

494
00:21:26,640 --> 00:21:28,599
think he's a better defender as you point it out,

495
00:21:28,640 --> 00:21:32,039
Like he's pretty tough. He's not a defensive playmaker, but

496
00:21:32,079 --> 00:21:33,759
he's strong in the chest right, Like, he's pretty good

497
00:21:33,759 --> 00:21:35,519
at hitting his chest in front of the ball handlers

498
00:21:35,519 --> 00:21:37,680
and taking the blow and not getting knocked back, and

499
00:21:37,839 --> 00:21:39,759
that's all you have to be when you can shoot,

500
00:21:39,799 --> 00:21:41,839
Like Sam Meryl, do you worry at all?

501
00:21:41,960 --> 00:21:43,839
Speaker 1: This is like more of a Caz Macro question, But

502
00:21:43,920 --> 00:21:46,160
it seems like the thing they might miss most about

503
00:21:46,200 --> 00:21:47,960
Ti Jerome that you're probably not going to get from

504
00:21:48,000 --> 00:21:51,160
Sam Merril or Lonzo Ball is just someone who could

505
00:21:51,200 --> 00:21:52,599
come in if you're not if you want to have

506
00:21:52,680 --> 00:21:54,720
Donovan Mitchell off ball, or if there's no Garland or

507
00:21:54,759 --> 00:21:56,799
Mitchell and we know that Garland gets hit in the

508
00:21:56,839 --> 00:21:59,200
face like eighty times per game, so he can time.

509
00:22:00,559 --> 00:22:03,079
Do they have that half court playmaking element there in

510
00:22:03,200 --> 00:22:05,680
that third guard? Because I kind of when I look

511
00:22:05,680 --> 00:22:08,160
at their depth chart, I find myself wondering, is Craig

512
00:22:08,240 --> 00:22:10,400
Porter Junior like the best option is like if you

513
00:22:10,440 --> 00:22:13,119
were looking for someone because that's never been Lonzo's game, Like,

514
00:22:13,200 --> 00:22:14,960
let me come in and run the half court offense.

515
00:22:15,279 --> 00:22:19,359
Speaker 2: Right. A lot of Cavaliers fans would disagree with me,

516
00:22:19,400 --> 00:22:21,240
I suspect, but I still think that there's some untapped

517
00:22:21,240 --> 00:22:24,559
playmaking potential in Max Struce. I would like to see

518
00:22:24,680 --> 00:22:26,119
him get the handle him a little bit more in

519
00:22:26,200 --> 00:22:28,119
like a secondary role. This is something he did a

520
00:22:28,160 --> 00:22:30,119
little bit more often with the heat, I'd say, when

521
00:22:30,240 --> 00:22:33,240
in dire times when other people were injured and Struce

522
00:22:33,480 --> 00:22:35,680
was not featured in this role by any means, but

523
00:22:35,799 --> 00:22:38,640
when he had the chance, he usually did pretty well

524
00:22:38,680 --> 00:22:40,400
with it. And I think that there could be a

525
00:22:40,440 --> 00:22:42,640
little untapped juice there. I don't think Merril's going to

526
00:22:42,680 --> 00:22:45,119
be necessarily running a pick and roll like to your point,

527
00:22:45,160 --> 00:22:47,160
and they are going to miss that for sure, but

528
00:22:47,240 --> 00:22:48,799
I think they are hoping that they can just make

529
00:22:48,880 --> 00:22:50,799
up for it with better all around health and maybe

530
00:22:50,880 --> 00:22:54,039
more well rounded players compared to Drome and you. I

531
00:22:54,119 --> 00:22:56,359
believe you mentioned you know, we might see some Jalen Tyson.

532
00:22:56,440 --> 00:22:58,359
That's something that he hopefully could do a little bit

533
00:22:58,440 --> 00:23:00,200
up too, So hopefully they can kind of fix sit

534
00:23:00,279 --> 00:23:02,079
together in pieces and patches.

535
00:23:02,880 --> 00:23:05,200
Speaker 1: They probably could stand to have Evan Mobley run more

536
00:23:05,240 --> 00:23:05,960
picking rolls too.

537
00:23:06,079 --> 00:23:07,799
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a good point. Yeah, I would love to

538
00:23:07,799 --> 00:23:09,359
see him be a little bit more of a ball

539
00:23:09,400 --> 00:23:11,640
handler up top. Just try it out.

540
00:23:11,680 --> 00:23:14,480
Speaker 1: If nothing else, this team is so good. I kind

541
00:23:14,480 --> 00:23:15,799
of feel like I'm gonna pick the Caves to win

542
00:23:15,839 --> 00:23:17,319
the title this year. I'm not gonna lie like that's

543
00:23:17,319 --> 00:23:17,759
where I'm at.

544
00:23:18,200 --> 00:23:20,319
Speaker 2: Every year, I get super hyped about the Calves, and

545
00:23:20,480 --> 00:23:22,000
so far that has not gone well for me. So

546
00:23:22,039 --> 00:23:26,119
I'm trying to hold my enthusiasm and check that's me.

547
00:23:26,319 --> 00:23:28,359
Speaker 1: I get super hyped about the Pelicans. I think this

548
00:23:28,480 --> 00:23:30,119
is the year that I finally won't get super hyped

549
00:23:30,119 --> 00:23:33,400
about the Pelicans. Though they've Troy Weaver and Joe Dumoores

550
00:23:33,400 --> 00:23:34,440
have sufficiently killed that.

551
00:23:35,119 --> 00:23:38,359
Speaker 2: Yes man tough, And I know some Pelicans fans and

552
00:23:38,400 --> 00:23:40,400
they are down bad. They might be down the worst

553
00:23:40,400 --> 00:23:41,799
of any fan base in the league right now. Even

554
00:23:41,839 --> 00:23:43,640
Dallas at least Alas can talk about Cooper Flagg.

555
00:23:44,880 --> 00:23:47,240
Speaker 1: So your next pick is we have back to back

556
00:23:47,319 --> 00:23:49,440
Raptors coming up. So your next pick is Jacobe Walter.

557
00:23:49,680 --> 00:23:51,160
Can you talk to me a little bit about him?

558
00:23:51,759 --> 00:23:55,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, So Jacoby Walter is not necessarily like a tiny name,

559
00:23:55,079 --> 00:23:56,960
per se was the first round pick just last year, right,

560
00:23:57,000 --> 00:23:59,599
But it feels like nobody paid attention what was going

561
00:23:59,640 --> 00:24:03,079
on and north of the border, just through for injuries,

562
00:24:03,119 --> 00:24:06,640
through like the general Toronto malaise. Like I feel kind

563
00:24:06,640 --> 00:24:08,200
of bad because there was a lot of very interesting

564
00:24:08,240 --> 00:24:10,119
players and developments that happened on this team that were

565
00:24:10,160 --> 00:24:12,519
just lost because the team season was so just aimless.

566
00:24:13,160 --> 00:24:16,440
But Walter is the kind of guy that usually I'm

567
00:24:16,480 --> 00:24:17,920
not a huge fan of, kind of more of a

568
00:24:17,960 --> 00:24:20,799
shot taker than a shot maker, not a ton of

569
00:24:20,880 --> 00:24:24,519
positional flexibility as a two guard. But where he's different

570
00:24:24,599 --> 00:24:26,400
than a lot of the other players that archetype is

571
00:24:26,480 --> 00:24:28,759
that he turned out to be a pretty good on

572
00:24:28,920 --> 00:24:31,440
ball defender, and he had this reputation in college to

573
00:24:31,519 --> 00:24:33,000
some extent. I believe I'm not a huge I'm not

574
00:24:33,039 --> 00:24:34,519
a scout, I'm not a college guy. I think he

575
00:24:34,599 --> 00:24:36,440
came in and people were like, he should be pretty

576
00:24:36,519 --> 00:24:38,640
good in the NBA. But there's a lot more like

577
00:24:38,920 --> 00:24:41,759
dot dot dots and question marks after statements like that

578
00:24:41,880 --> 00:24:44,119
than I'm comfortable with. But he ended up being one

579
00:24:44,119 --> 00:24:46,799
of their best perimeter point of attack guys, at least

580
00:24:46,839 --> 00:24:49,759
in like isolation settings. There's a little bit of young

581
00:24:50,240 --> 00:24:51,799
I want to say, there's a little bit of young

582
00:24:51,880 --> 00:24:54,559
Jalen Brown almost in Jacoby Walter's game, where like he

583
00:24:54,759 --> 00:24:56,599
checks out of somebody who should be eventually a pretty

584
00:24:56,640 --> 00:24:58,759
good score in a variety of ways as somebody who

585
00:24:58,799 --> 00:25:01,000
should be a pretty good on balld but like young

586
00:25:01,079 --> 00:25:03,720
Jalen Brown, there isn't much else besides that yet, like

587
00:25:03,799 --> 00:25:06,880
there's no passing, there's no I shouldn't say there's no passing.

588
00:25:06,920 --> 00:25:08,599
He's an okay passer when he wants to be. There

589
00:25:08,680 --> 00:25:14,039
is no decision making in a positive direction, and uh,

590
00:25:14,519 --> 00:25:17,200
he's gonna have to work on just all the other

591
00:25:17,240 --> 00:25:18,559
parts of the game. But I think if you're starting

592
00:25:18,559 --> 00:25:20,039
off with a guy who has showing the ability to

593
00:25:20,119 --> 00:25:22,359
hit some threes, which he ended up at thirty five

594
00:25:22,480 --> 00:25:24,079
percent from deep on the year, but it was forty

595
00:25:24,079 --> 00:25:25,640
percent in the second half of his year. Not that

596
00:25:25,720 --> 00:25:27,839
many rookies get better at shooting from long range and

597
00:25:27,839 --> 00:25:29,680
the season goes on. So I found that encouraging. He

598
00:25:29,759 --> 00:25:31,160
did a good job of gett into the rim. He

599
00:25:31,319 --> 00:25:33,400
just couldn't finish when he was there. But finishing in

600
00:25:33,440 --> 00:25:36,680
the rim is something that rookie guards always struggle with

601
00:25:36,799 --> 00:25:39,640
and almost always improved. So I like the outline of

602
00:25:39,680 --> 00:25:41,240
a guy who's just starting from a base of like

603
00:25:41,319 --> 00:25:43,319
being a pretty good three point shooter, pretty good on

604
00:25:43,440 --> 00:25:46,160
ball defender. Can he get better at the other stuff?

605
00:25:46,359 --> 00:25:49,039
I'm hopeful he can. The counterpoint to this would be, well,

606
00:25:49,119 --> 00:25:51,039
Toronto has a weird number of guys who kind of

607
00:25:51,119 --> 00:25:53,880
need the ball to be good. You have Skytie Barnes

608
00:25:53,880 --> 00:25:56,240
and made it quickly, and RJ. Barrett and Brandon Ingram,

609
00:25:56,640 --> 00:26:00,640
And it is very possible that Walter just find him buried,

610
00:26:00,960 --> 00:26:02,440
not even on the depth charts. I do think he's

611
00:26:02,440 --> 00:26:04,200
gonna get minutes, but he's just buried in like the

612
00:26:04,359 --> 00:26:08,279
offensive pecking order, like even behind the players like Grady Dick. Right. So,

613
00:26:08,880 --> 00:26:11,519
I think his two way upside is actually pretty significant

614
00:26:11,559 --> 00:26:13,559
from what I've seen. I don't know that he's gonna

615
00:26:13,559 --> 00:26:15,319
get the opportunity, but I'm kind of just hopeful that

616
00:26:15,400 --> 00:26:18,640
his ability to fill in some of these other gaps

617
00:26:18,720 --> 00:26:20,720
will rise to the surface and get him kind of

618
00:26:20,759 --> 00:26:22,359
the quote unquote breakout we're looking for.

619
00:26:23,480 --> 00:26:25,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, I feel like I mean, and please tell me

620
00:26:25,960 --> 00:26:27,759
if you think it's overly reductive, but for him to

621
00:26:27,880 --> 00:26:30,400
kind of stand out in the context of their rotation,

622
00:26:30,480 --> 00:26:32,880
it might just come down to what I said, because

623
00:26:32,920 --> 00:26:34,799
I was worried about him scaling down when he was

624
00:26:34,799 --> 00:26:36,640
coming into the league. I'd asked samson Folk about this

625
00:26:36,759 --> 00:26:39,119
during the Raptors look Ahead. I believe then he comes

626
00:26:39,200 --> 00:26:42,200
in last year, over three quarters of his baskets came

627
00:26:42,200 --> 00:26:44,000
off assists. He shot a good enough clip on catch

628
00:26:44,039 --> 00:26:47,119
and shoot threes when you look at what they need around,

629
00:26:47,960 --> 00:26:49,880
Like I know Emmanuel Quickly like can use the ball,

630
00:26:50,000 --> 00:26:51,960
but like it's r J. Barrett, Ingram and Barnes. Those

631
00:26:51,960 --> 00:26:53,799
are the guys that you're like, I think most want

632
00:26:53,880 --> 00:26:55,839
the ball. Maybe Quickly wants it as much, but he

633
00:26:55,920 --> 00:26:57,880
can work off it better than all of those guys,

634
00:26:57,880 --> 00:27:01,640
I would argue, So Kobe Walkson just come in and

635
00:27:01,839 --> 00:27:04,920
drill threes, like whether they're off movement or whether they're standstill,

636
00:27:05,200 --> 00:27:06,759
and Kenny do like some of the catch and go

637
00:27:06,920 --> 00:27:09,559
stuff on his drives, and like, I think that might

638
00:27:09,640 --> 00:27:12,839
be his quickest path because they have enough defensive upside

639
00:27:12,920 --> 00:27:15,759
on the team, Like they can build some really ridiculous

640
00:27:15,880 --> 00:27:18,000
defensive lineups. So I know the data wasn't always there

641
00:27:18,160 --> 00:27:20,880
last year, but just between like John and Mobo and Calin,

642
00:27:20,960 --> 00:27:22,960
Murray Boyles and like you have all these like even

643
00:27:22,960 --> 00:27:25,880
Scottie Barnes can defensive play make Emmanuel quickly. I think

644
00:27:25,920 --> 00:27:28,440
he's better defensively than what we've seen in Toronto so far.

645
00:27:28,559 --> 00:27:30,960
Jamal shed is probably gonna get some minutes. I just

646
00:27:31,000 --> 00:27:34,279
think that Walter's path to like certified playing time might

647
00:27:34,359 --> 00:27:37,079
be we really need shooting around our primary guys, and

648
00:27:37,279 --> 00:27:39,400
especially if Grady Dick is still kind of up and down.

649
00:27:39,680 --> 00:27:42,119
I was all in on Grady at the start of

650
00:27:42,240 --> 00:27:44,759
like he was just flame throwing and doing all this

651
00:27:44,839 --> 00:27:47,160
stuff aside from shooting. So if he's sort of having

652
00:27:47,160 --> 00:27:48,480
it up and down year, I wonder if there's like

653
00:27:48,519 --> 00:27:50,519
a pocket of space for Walter to kind of sneak

654
00:27:50,559 --> 00:27:52,759
in there is I don't think he was build as

655
00:27:52,799 --> 00:27:54,440
a three and D archetype coming out of school. You

656
00:27:54,440 --> 00:27:55,720
could correct me if I'm wrong. It felt like he

657
00:27:55,799 --> 00:27:57,319
was someone who was always gonna want to have the ball.

658
00:27:57,759 --> 00:27:59,480
But if he can like progress into that where it's

659
00:27:59,480 --> 00:28:01,880
even just the three part of that, that'd probably be

660
00:28:01,920 --> 00:28:03,319
pretty huge for Toronto right now.

661
00:28:04,079 --> 00:28:06,119
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think you make a good point, which is

662
00:28:06,200 --> 00:28:07,720
kind of a lumber because I actually think like his

663
00:28:08,160 --> 00:28:11,279
likeliest path to playing time on a neutral team, like

664
00:28:11,359 --> 00:28:13,680
a random team is just him becoming like this awesome

665
00:28:13,920 --> 00:28:16,759
perimeter defender with a six to ten wingspan, so a

666
00:28:16,799 --> 00:28:19,200
little bit of switchability, hopefully a little bit of defensive playmaking.

667
00:28:19,640 --> 00:28:22,440
But I think you're right on this particular Raptors team,

668
00:28:22,480 --> 00:28:24,119
he's just really gonna have to keep shooting the three

669
00:28:24,160 --> 00:28:26,240
ball well, which, like you and I said, like he

670
00:28:26,359 --> 00:28:28,240
did do particularly towards the end of the season, but

671
00:28:28,319 --> 00:28:30,920
it's got to be consistent over a bigger sample size,

672
00:28:30,920 --> 00:28:33,039
I think to really stand out from everybody else fighting

673
00:28:33,119 --> 00:28:35,119
for kind of time and touches on this team.

674
00:28:36,359 --> 00:28:38,519
Speaker 1: We're gonna stick with the Raptors here and go to

675
00:28:38,960 --> 00:28:43,160
ignore the type of want screen Jonathan Mobo. I'm fascinated

676
00:28:43,200 --> 00:28:46,519
by him, and defensively I just kind of have no notes.

677
00:28:46,759 --> 00:28:49,559
It's just he can do everything. He could be super disruptive,

678
00:28:49,599 --> 00:28:52,599
he's super switchable. That is great, and that fits into

679
00:28:52,759 --> 00:28:55,160
just like it seems like what the Raptors want their

680
00:28:55,200 --> 00:28:56,799
identity to be on defense when you kind of look

681
00:28:56,839 --> 00:28:59,759
at the players they've Ascendled Yako Perl notwithstanding of course

682
00:28:59,799 --> 00:29:03,400
on at that front line. But like, I don't know

683
00:29:03,480 --> 00:29:05,839
what to make of him on offense, and it feels

684
00:29:05,920 --> 00:29:09,039
like him hitting corner threes is going to be mission

685
00:29:09,079 --> 00:29:11,720
critical to him, not even just getting minutes on this

686
00:29:11,880 --> 00:29:14,319
Raptors team, but sort of maybe staying in the NBA,

687
00:29:14,480 --> 00:29:17,400
but for this Raptors team specifically, I don't know that

688
00:29:17,640 --> 00:29:20,279
like they're ever gonna have enough space to maximize what

689
00:29:20,359 --> 00:29:22,079
he could do around the rim, because I don't know

690
00:29:22,079 --> 00:29:23,480
if he's someone who's gonna have a bunch of all

691
00:29:23,519 --> 00:29:26,200
these complex finishes, Like he seems most comfortable in the

692
00:29:26,279 --> 00:29:28,720
open floor. He's an absolute terror, and so they will

693
00:29:28,759 --> 00:29:31,079
do stuff like that. Will there ever be the spacing

694
00:29:31,599 --> 00:29:33,160
for him to like kind of get to the basket

695
00:29:33,279 --> 00:29:36,799
unimpeded or with minimal obstacles in the half court with

696
00:29:36,920 --> 00:29:40,480
the current personnel, I'd vote against. No, I don't have

697
00:29:40,799 --> 00:29:42,359
I don't know what to make of him on offense,

698
00:29:42,400 --> 00:29:44,519
but when you watch him on defense, like, if you

699
00:29:44,680 --> 00:29:47,000
just watch him, you're going to feel him for like

700
00:29:47,359 --> 00:29:50,240
x amount of like eight out of ten possessions, You're

701
00:29:50,279 --> 00:29:52,599
just going to feel his presence, it seems like. And

702
00:29:52,720 --> 00:29:56,519
so I find myself wondering, what can that player become?

703
00:29:56,559 --> 00:29:59,039
But then also on this Raptors team that has all

704
00:29:59,119 --> 00:30:02,640
these like non spacing like fours and fives, at this point,

705
00:30:03,279 --> 00:30:05,359
are they gonna continue to try and develop him? Is

706
00:30:05,400 --> 00:30:07,279
he just gonna get shoved down the pecking order? Because

707
00:30:07,279 --> 00:30:10,400
if Scottie Barnes is healthy, if Ingram is healthy, if

708
00:30:10,400 --> 00:30:12,480
you're gonna plan on playing Colin Murray Boyles. I don't

709
00:30:12,480 --> 00:30:14,359
know where that puts him in the pecking order. I'm

710
00:30:14,400 --> 00:30:18,119
like very close to like hashtagging free Jonathan Mobo, but

711
00:30:18,160 --> 00:30:20,279
I'm not there yet. I'm intrigued by him overall, I

712
00:30:20,359 --> 00:30:22,359
just don't know about his long term fit in Toronto.

713
00:30:23,160 --> 00:30:25,759
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm I'm a little bit lower just because he

714
00:30:25,880 --> 00:30:30,319
reminds me a little bit of like Jeremy Sohan in

715
00:30:30,720 --> 00:30:33,079
San Antonio right where he has these funky skill sets

716
00:30:33,279 --> 00:30:35,480
like Son, He's like a good passer, it's a great

717
00:30:35,559 --> 00:30:39,720
switchy defender. But also like Sohn, the scoring touch isn't

718
00:30:39,759 --> 00:30:42,640
really there, like the corner three you mentioned is something

719
00:30:42,640 --> 00:30:44,000
that he needs to find. But he also just needs

720
00:30:44,000 --> 00:30:46,359
to make his layouts, like he was not a great finisher,

721
00:30:46,400 --> 00:30:49,519
as I recall, which is gonna be if you can't

722
00:30:49,519 --> 00:30:52,119
really score from anywhere on the court your offense, you

723
00:30:52,240 --> 00:30:54,160
have to be so good on the other end to

724
00:30:54,200 --> 00:30:56,200
make up for it. And he's just so undersized and

725
00:30:56,359 --> 00:30:58,359
it's not a question of effort, like he tries so hard.

726
00:30:58,480 --> 00:31:00,599
He's very fun to watch, like he is somebody who,

727
00:31:00,720 --> 00:31:02,960
like I definitely would put on an All Heart team.

728
00:31:03,440 --> 00:31:05,119
I don't know that that is necessarily gonna get him

729
00:31:05,119 --> 00:31:09,279
a massive contract after this. So I like the idea

730
00:31:09,319 --> 00:31:11,119
because I like the switchiness. It reminds me of Bam

731
00:31:11,160 --> 00:31:14,119
out of Bio at its best in Miami. Although again,

732
00:31:14,160 --> 00:31:15,839
So's probably a better compet because he's a little bit

733
00:31:15,839 --> 00:31:19,599
smaller like Mogbo. But poke hands love that. He's not

734
00:31:19,640 --> 00:31:21,680
a great screener either, so you can't use him as

735
00:31:21,759 --> 00:31:24,039
like sort of like a pick and roll lob threat

736
00:31:24,160 --> 00:31:26,519
kind of guys. The jumper's not there, the finishing's not there.

737
00:31:26,559 --> 00:31:28,640
He's just so far to go to make an offensive

738
00:31:28,680 --> 00:31:30,400
impact right now, even if I love what he's doing

739
00:31:30,440 --> 00:31:32,119
on the other side, and.

740
00:31:32,240 --> 00:31:34,759
Speaker 1: Is there, like do you even view just like their

741
00:31:35,039 --> 00:31:36,640
like and now they have Mamu in the mix as well,

742
00:31:36,680 --> 00:31:38,920
it was probably like their only floor spacing like four.

743
00:31:39,000 --> 00:31:42,039
I mean, Scottie Barne should probably count there. But I've

744
00:31:42,119 --> 00:31:44,720
just I was almost hesitant to put him. I'm fascinated

745
00:31:44,759 --> 00:31:46,480
by his defense, and I was hesitant to put him

746
00:31:46,480 --> 00:31:47,759
on this list because I was trying to find guys

747
00:31:47,799 --> 00:31:50,000
who might have a chance at having a role next year.

748
00:31:50,039 --> 00:31:52,519
I think if the Raptors want to be good, I

749
00:31:52,599 --> 00:31:54,839
don't know that like Mobo is like factoring in like

750
00:31:54,880 --> 00:31:56,319
are they gonna get would they be more inclined to

751
00:31:56,319 --> 00:31:59,079
play even Shamhay than him right now? And again there's

752
00:31:59,119 --> 00:32:01,200
the CMB of it all to they just said they

753
00:32:01,240 --> 00:32:03,359
have so many this roster makes no sense, and yet

754
00:32:03,359 --> 00:32:04,559
I'm wildly intrigued by it.

755
00:32:04,640 --> 00:32:06,359
Speaker 2: Yeah, there's a lot of guys that you're like, oh,

756
00:32:06,400 --> 00:32:08,599
this guy definitely needs twenty minutes to night, and then

757
00:32:08,640 --> 00:32:11,079
you add it up and you have two full teams

758
00:32:11,079 --> 00:32:12,839
a night playing instead of one, and you're like, oh, oh,

759
00:32:13,119 --> 00:32:15,319
somebody's gonna get hurt real bad by the roster crunch

760
00:32:15,359 --> 00:32:18,279
in Toronto, unless we should say, unless it's like last

761
00:32:18,319 --> 00:32:19,960
year and there's just injuries up and down the roster.

762
00:32:20,400 --> 00:32:22,079
I think MOBOI really thrived sort of at the end

763
00:32:22,079 --> 00:32:23,559
of last year when they gave him a bigger role

764
00:32:23,640 --> 00:32:25,119
and he was able to do a little bit more stuff.

765
00:32:25,279 --> 00:32:28,240
So I don't want to ever say that there's no

766
00:32:28,400 --> 00:32:31,960
chance he's able to like break out, but things to

767
00:32:32,039 --> 00:32:33,599
your point, things will have to go wrong for the

768
00:32:33,720 --> 00:32:35,480
Raptors if Mobo has a breakout, I.

769
00:32:35,480 --> 00:32:39,640
Speaker 1: Think your next potential hitting gem is Brandon Williams, one

770
00:32:39,680 --> 00:32:41,480
of the players I have the least amount of feel

771
00:32:41,519 --> 00:32:43,799
for in this exercise. In case anyone's carry us.

772
00:32:44,359 --> 00:32:47,400
Speaker 2: Well, I would say you are not alone in that brand.

773
00:32:47,440 --> 00:32:49,200
Williams actually was in the NBA a few years ago

774
00:32:49,240 --> 00:32:50,839
for Portland briefly, and then he went and played i

775
00:32:50,880 --> 00:32:53,000
think overseas for a year and then he came back

776
00:32:53,039 --> 00:32:56,200
and he was part of that like ragtag Mavericks group

777
00:32:56,240 --> 00:32:58,279
when they were rationing out they are two way players

778
00:32:58,319 --> 00:33:00,559
because they were about to literally run out of bodies

779
00:33:00,839 --> 00:33:03,759
and then they'd have like fourfeit games. Theoretically it was.

780
00:33:04,279 --> 00:33:06,680
It was a crazy situation. But what that meant is

781
00:33:06,759 --> 00:33:08,759
for like somebody like me, who I'm just trying to

782
00:33:08,799 --> 00:33:10,440
like learn as much about guys. Ever, Like there's a

783
00:33:10,440 --> 00:33:12,640
lot of guys playing for the Mavericks. I'm like, I'll

784
00:33:12,759 --> 00:33:15,319
probably never see this guy again, but just in case,

785
00:33:15,400 --> 00:33:16,960
let me watch a few games and take some notes

786
00:33:17,279 --> 00:33:19,880
and Williams. If there's one thing you need to know

787
00:33:19,880 --> 00:33:22,079
about Williams is that this guy cannot be kept away

788
00:33:22,119 --> 00:33:25,160
from the Rim. I think there's forty eight percent of

789
00:33:25,160 --> 00:33:27,279
his shot attempts came at the Rim last year, which

790
00:33:27,359 --> 00:33:29,880
for a smaller guard is an insane number. This is

791
00:33:29,920 --> 00:33:32,759
an insane number for almost anybody, but particularly smaller guard.

792
00:33:32,880 --> 00:33:35,680
Two six three on a good day, he's six three

793
00:33:35,759 --> 00:33:38,279
if you're you know, generous with the measurements. And he's

794
00:33:38,319 --> 00:33:40,640
not like a super like strong, like run you over

795
00:33:40,759 --> 00:33:43,000
kind of guard either, Like he's just like insane. His

796
00:33:43,400 --> 00:33:46,000
nasty handle, he's got a killer step back. One of

797
00:33:46,079 --> 00:33:47,880
my favorite things about him, this is like a weird

798
00:33:47,960 --> 00:33:52,119
quirk of his game, is he loves these sideways finger rolls.

799
00:33:52,279 --> 00:33:54,200
So nine percent of the finger rolls you see are

800
00:33:54,240 --> 00:33:56,079
somebody running straight at the hoop and finger rolling it

801
00:33:56,200 --> 00:33:58,240
up from directly in front of him into the basket.

802
00:33:58,400 --> 00:34:00,839
He goes past the basket, reaching over and shoulder and

803
00:34:00,880 --> 00:34:03,079
then finger rolls it with no backboard into the rim.

804
00:34:03,160 --> 00:34:05,319
It's very odd, doesn't seem like it should go in.

805
00:34:05,400 --> 00:34:06,720
But he actually was a pretty good finisher, so I

806
00:34:06,720 --> 00:34:10,280
guess it's working out for him. Yeah, Williams is not

807
00:34:10,400 --> 00:34:12,679
like a great defender. His three pointer has been kind

808
00:34:12,679 --> 00:34:14,679
of inconsistent. It was okay last year. We'll see if

809
00:34:14,719 --> 00:34:17,360
that sticks. I don't know, but he gets a lot

810
00:34:17,360 --> 00:34:19,880
of steels, pushes really hard in transition, and I just think, guys,

811
00:34:19,920 --> 00:34:23,199
who are you know, like rim seeking missiles deserve a

812
00:34:23,239 --> 00:34:26,119
spot in the NBA on a Mavericks team that doesn't

813
00:34:26,159 --> 00:34:29,880
have any other point guard besides D'Angelo Russell. I think

814
00:34:29,960 --> 00:34:31,800
that he'll have an opportunity if he can keep up

815
00:34:31,840 --> 00:34:34,519
his finishing from last season. So that's what I'm hoping for.

816
00:34:35,679 --> 00:34:39,159
Speaker 1: They kind of tested the boundaries of his finishing when

817
00:34:39,199 --> 00:34:41,360
you look at some of the spacing in those laps,

818
00:34:41,480 --> 00:34:43,280
and I would argue that there's a chance it gets

819
00:34:43,320 --> 00:34:46,039
worse this year. So he's really gonna like he'll have

820
00:34:46,239 --> 00:34:50,000
d lo and Klay Thompson, but you're you're almost gonna

821
00:34:50,000 --> 00:34:51,920
be playing two non shooters at the four and the five.

822
00:34:51,960 --> 00:34:55,760
If Anthony Davis is your four, and that it's Nauji Marshall,

823
00:34:55,880 --> 00:34:58,400
what is like PJ Okay, Fine, there's PJ. Washington. It's

824
00:34:58,480 --> 00:35:00,480
just their offense is gonna be weird, and so someone

825
00:35:00,519 --> 00:35:03,159
who does like there should be just his player type

826
00:35:03,239 --> 00:35:05,519
until Kyrie Irving comes back, like they need someone to

827
00:35:05,559 --> 00:35:07,400
soak up those minutes. So I'll have the opportunity. I

828
00:35:07,519 --> 00:35:10,440
just it's another guy where I think last year, okay,

829
00:35:10,480 --> 00:35:12,280
what was he had sixty four to sixty five percent

830
00:35:12,440 --> 00:35:15,599
at the rim within that spacing that was around him.

831
00:35:15,840 --> 00:35:18,840
That is fantastic. I just wonder if like this spacing

832
00:35:18,840 --> 00:35:20,800
around him somehow gonna get worse this year.

833
00:35:21,199 --> 00:35:23,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, and he's also not going to be necessarily a

834
00:35:23,840 --> 00:35:25,800
great fit at point guard. I think he's a point

835
00:35:25,800 --> 00:35:28,000
guard size, which is why he's probably gonna get slided

836
00:35:28,039 --> 00:35:29,440
in there, and just because, like you said, the lack

837
00:35:29,480 --> 00:35:32,000
of other bodies. But truthfully, he's probably better off as

838
00:35:32,039 --> 00:35:33,800
a two. There's a little bit of overlap there with

839
00:35:33,880 --> 00:35:35,679
Jayden Hardy, not necessarily in the way they play, but

840
00:35:35,800 --> 00:35:37,960
positionally in size wise. That could you know, make for

841
00:35:38,039 --> 00:35:40,840
a battle for some spot minutes. But yeah, I mean

842
00:35:40,880 --> 00:35:43,400
you just look at this team. It's like Naji Marshall

843
00:35:43,599 --> 00:35:45,119
was playing point guard for them last year and probably

844
00:35:45,119 --> 00:35:47,719
will play some this year. They're gonna run Cooper Flag

845
00:35:47,800 --> 00:35:51,519
at one or two according to Jason Kidd, So the

846
00:35:51,599 --> 00:35:53,639
spacing will be a problem. But I'm confident that Brandon

847
00:35:53,639 --> 00:35:55,239
william will at least get to the rim, and if

848
00:35:55,239 --> 00:35:58,280
he can make sixty percent of his field goal attempts

849
00:35:58,280 --> 00:35:59,480
from there, the more power to him.

850
00:36:00,400 --> 00:36:02,119
Speaker 1: Yeah. And I mean, if he's gonna shoot, he was,

851
00:36:02,239 --> 00:36:04,000
He shot pretty well from three last year, right so

852
00:36:04,039 --> 00:36:05,480
if he's gonna be able to hit his threes, like,

853
00:36:05,519 --> 00:36:07,480
he can certainly play off of whoever they want their

854
00:36:07,519 --> 00:36:09,800
primary ball handler, whether it's Cooper Flag or if it's

855
00:36:09,840 --> 00:36:10,840
de Lo or somebody else.

856
00:36:11,079 --> 00:36:13,119
Speaker 2: Yeah, he's not a super aggressive three point shooter. I

857
00:36:13,159 --> 00:36:15,159
think he might end up having to take more just

858
00:36:15,480 --> 00:36:17,840
because of you know, how clogged it's gonna be in

859
00:36:17,880 --> 00:36:20,239
the middle. So if he's able to make more than yeah,

860
00:36:20,239 --> 00:36:22,119
that'll open up his offensive game even more, of course,

861
00:36:22,280 --> 00:36:23,840
but that's just never gonna be his bread and butter

862
00:36:23,880 --> 00:36:25,840
skill because that's not how he's wired, right, Like it's

863
00:36:25,880 --> 00:36:27,440
one of them. There are some guys who's like, no

864
00:36:27,559 --> 00:36:29,079
matter where you put him that he could be playing,

865
00:36:29,159 --> 00:36:30,800
you know, pick up somewhere, he's just gonna get to

866
00:36:30,800 --> 00:36:33,519
the rack every single time. And that's William's sample.

867
00:36:34,320 --> 00:36:37,079
Speaker 1: There's I've always said, and I used Marcus Smart as

868
00:36:37,119 --> 00:36:39,840
the comp for this, is that there's value in the volume.

869
00:36:40,119 --> 00:36:42,760
Like the percentages do matter. But like Marcus mart had

870
00:36:42,800 --> 00:36:45,119
some seasons where he could be a scorcher, but was

871
00:36:45,199 --> 00:36:46,920
never a great three point shooter. But the fact that

872
00:36:47,039 --> 00:36:49,360
he takes them, the fact that lou Dort takes them

873
00:36:49,440 --> 00:36:51,840
like it just puts an extra layer of pressure on defenses,

874
00:36:51,840 --> 00:36:54,239
even if you're not a five alarm fire from beyond

875
00:36:54,280 --> 00:36:56,320
the arc. So I have it's good that I have

876
00:36:56,440 --> 00:36:58,360
no feel for Brandon Williams, because I have like no

877
00:36:58,480 --> 00:37:00,519
feel for what the like the Dallas. They're just all

878
00:37:00,559 --> 00:37:03,440
over the place. They're they're so huge, they have like

879
00:37:03,480 --> 00:37:05,840
all these veterans, but then they don't have Kyrie. But

880
00:37:05,920 --> 00:37:08,840
then this rookie Cooper Flag who's supposed to be this

881
00:37:08,880 --> 00:37:11,280
transcendent talent, is just in there they want to do.

882
00:37:11,800 --> 00:37:15,079
That team is gonna be like a morbidly curious league pass.

883
00:37:15,039 --> 00:37:18,320
Speaker 2: Washed for me fun. Yeah, and I think there's gonna

884
00:37:18,320 --> 00:37:19,760
be nights where if you catch them up, like if

885
00:37:19,800 --> 00:37:21,840
a couple of other guys can hit from outside, there's

886
00:37:21,840 --> 00:37:23,840
gonna be nice for the Mavericks look like bona fide,

887
00:37:24,000 --> 00:37:28,000
you know, playoff contenders. It's not gonna happen very often, unfortunately,

888
00:37:28,280 --> 00:37:30,039
But to your point, they are so big. I do

889
00:37:30,159 --> 00:37:32,960
wonder if, like Williams, is just relentless rim pressure will

890
00:37:33,079 --> 00:37:35,320
give them a lot more offensive rebounding opportunities too, So

891
00:37:35,480 --> 00:37:38,400
there will be some trickle down positive effects to the volume,

892
00:37:38,440 --> 00:37:40,079
even if the accuracy doesn't stay as high as this.

893
00:37:41,760 --> 00:37:45,360
Speaker 1: My next pick is pelleam Arson of the Miami Heat.

894
00:37:45,599 --> 00:37:48,320
I am like mad, I want them to I want

895
00:37:48,360 --> 00:37:49,960
them to trade people just to make sure that he

896
00:37:50,000 --> 00:37:52,800
gets a ton of minutes. He sold me. I like

897
00:37:52,880 --> 00:37:56,239
the outlines of his game last like going into this

898
00:37:56,360 --> 00:38:00,239
season and then watching him in Summer League really have

899
00:38:00,320 --> 00:38:02,440
sold me. And I know the efficiency is not always there,

900
00:38:02,559 --> 00:38:05,760
but this dude just make things happen when he gets downhill,

901
00:38:06,079 --> 00:38:08,719
like getting defenders on his back hip, like putting pressure

902
00:38:08,760 --> 00:38:10,199
on the defense if he can get to a slower

903
00:38:10,280 --> 00:38:13,519
or get to the basket. He averaged like a shake

904
00:38:13,559 --> 00:38:16,559
Gilgess Alexander in like nine to three Folow attempts per

905
00:38:16,599 --> 00:38:19,159
game in Summer League. The pace at which he can play.

906
00:38:19,159 --> 00:38:21,000
He's not like super fast, but there is like sort

907
00:38:21,039 --> 00:38:23,239
of a change of speed to his dribble. Doesn't need

908
00:38:23,280 --> 00:38:25,840
to get by guys to make things happen. I don't

909
00:38:25,880 --> 00:38:28,119
know the three pointer hasn't necessarily popped yet, but I

910
00:38:28,159 --> 00:38:30,440
think it's trustworthy enough to play him and just have

911
00:38:30,559 --> 00:38:33,880
someone who's like can be a pretty good playmaker at

912
00:38:34,000 --> 00:38:37,199
his size, can just be a luxury. And I'm wondering

913
00:38:37,280 --> 00:38:40,159
if playing on a team, can you get to lineups

914
00:38:40,199 --> 00:38:42,280
where Norman Powell and Tyler hero on him around the

915
00:38:42,320 --> 00:38:44,840
court at the same time, just to okay that spacing

916
00:38:44,920 --> 00:38:46,639
is then maximized, or you're gonna need some of your

917
00:38:46,639 --> 00:38:49,239
other guys to hit their threes, especially if Heywood high

918
00:38:49,239 --> 00:38:52,519
Smith misses any time in the regular season following his surgery.

919
00:38:52,800 --> 00:38:54,760
I also think what will help him some one of

920
00:38:54,800 --> 00:38:57,000
them my takeaways from some league would be once he's

921
00:38:57,039 --> 00:38:59,480
playing alongside Biggs, who can catch the ball a little

922
00:38:59,480 --> 00:39:01,559
bit more concier instantly. I think that'll go a long

923
00:39:01,599 --> 00:39:04,400
way for him too. I just I don't I won't

924
00:39:04,440 --> 00:39:05,679
go as far as to say that I think he's

925
00:39:05,800 --> 00:39:08,239
going to be this starter in the NBA, but I

926
00:39:08,239 --> 00:39:10,840
think there's like a lot of upside here in Larson,

927
00:39:10,880 --> 00:39:14,960
to the point that moving forward, I'm slightly I don't

928
00:39:14,960 --> 00:39:16,840
want to say it this way, but like I he's

929
00:39:16,920 --> 00:39:18,719
more of a mystery box to me than Jimi Hawk

930
00:39:18,880 --> 00:39:20,320
is at this point, and I know that we've just

931
00:39:20,400 --> 00:39:22,599
seen less of him, but there just feels like there

932
00:39:22,719 --> 00:39:25,440
might be something he's elite at, whereas Heimi Hawk is

933
00:39:25,519 --> 00:39:28,119
just feels like at his best he might kind of

934
00:39:28,159 --> 00:39:30,400
sort of fill a bunch of these different gaps. But

935
00:39:30,480 --> 00:39:32,800
maybe I'm also just poisoned by that was kind of

936
00:39:32,840 --> 00:39:34,760
a down sophomore year for him.

937
00:39:36,199 --> 00:39:40,079
Speaker 2: So the most famous Pella Larson play is at least

938
00:39:40,159 --> 00:39:42,320
in heat Twitter Circles, of which I was a part

939
00:39:42,360 --> 00:39:45,639
of back in the day, was sometime halfway through the year.

940
00:39:45,639 --> 00:39:47,039
I don't even remember who they were playing, but he

941
00:39:47,079 --> 00:39:49,840
poked the ball out from behind somebody in the back court,

942
00:39:49,880 --> 00:39:52,039
like as the team was trying to inbound dough on

943
00:39:52,159 --> 00:39:54,119
the floor, wrestled with two of the other team guys,

944
00:39:54,280 --> 00:39:56,119
kind of squirted out some heel lars and picked himself

945
00:39:56,119 --> 00:39:58,079
backup and threw himself on the floor again ten feet

946
00:39:58,079 --> 00:40:01,039
further away, was scraping for the ball, scored it out again,

947
00:40:01,320 --> 00:40:03,519
and then he like kind of like wall climbed on

948
00:40:03,559 --> 00:40:05,719
the floor, snagged it with one hand, and like tossed

949
00:40:05,719 --> 00:40:07,480
it to Terry Rogier and then he hit a three pointer,

950
00:40:07,760 --> 00:40:11,000
and so that was it was three. I was about

951
00:40:11,000 --> 00:40:12,679
to say, imagine how good of a passer you are

952
00:40:12,880 --> 00:40:15,960
to have Terry rose Yer make a shot off your pass.

953
00:40:16,360 --> 00:40:21,199
So yeah, sorry for the straight Terry, but not really anyway,

954
00:40:21,599 --> 00:40:25,599
Larson's uh scrappy is definitely an appropriate term. He's the

955
00:40:25,639 --> 00:40:29,920
effort level is insane that results naturally in a lot

956
00:40:29,960 --> 00:40:33,679
of fouls, so that Miami has not necessarily discouraged. They

957
00:40:33,679 --> 00:40:35,199
have a higher tolerance for that kind of thing than

958
00:40:35,199 --> 00:40:37,400
a lot of teams. I think to see Duncan Robinson

959
00:40:37,440 --> 00:40:40,800
for an example. But yeah, Larson is a lot of fun.

960
00:40:40,840 --> 00:40:43,039
There's a lot of skill there. There's a lot of toughness,

961
00:40:43,079 --> 00:40:46,599
which is something that we know Sposter loves. High Smith

962
00:40:46,679 --> 00:40:49,079
is injured to start the year, Terry year is pretty useless.

963
00:40:49,239 --> 00:40:51,880
I think Larson's ability to fluctuate between the two and

964
00:40:51,960 --> 00:40:54,079
the three will do a good job of getting him

965
00:40:54,079 --> 00:40:56,400
some minutes. I will say Supposter tried to play him

966
00:40:56,400 --> 00:40:57,679
at the four a little bit last year. I can't

967
00:40:57,679 --> 00:40:59,119
remember who they were watching in this one either, but

968
00:40:59,199 --> 00:41:01,920
he got back down about thirty feet in about three seconds.

969
00:41:01,960 --> 00:41:04,400
So he's not quite at like Kyle Lowry stoutness in

970
00:41:04,440 --> 00:41:06,719
the post. But there's definitely at least some potential for

971
00:41:06,840 --> 00:41:10,480
him to be some uber classic Miami uber duper super

972
00:41:10,599 --> 00:41:11,440
small ball four.

973
00:41:12,920 --> 00:41:14,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, I am. Do you do you think that he'll

974
00:41:14,920 --> 00:41:17,440
get like real looks this year? Is there a chance

975
00:41:17,480 --> 00:41:20,199
that they're going to be more invested in, like casperus Ys,

976
00:41:20,320 --> 00:41:22,159
you know, playing more minutes, maybe off rep.

977
00:41:22,679 --> 00:41:24,440
Speaker 2: I think his his chance will be in the beginning

978
00:41:24,480 --> 00:41:25,800
of the season. If we don't see him in the

979
00:41:25,880 --> 00:41:27,760
first ten or fifteen games, I think it's gonna be

980
00:41:27,800 --> 00:41:30,239
a long season for Larsen because I do think like

981
00:41:30,360 --> 00:41:32,559
Miami typically does not rush rookies in. You know, you

982
00:41:32,639 --> 00:41:34,559
could you saw it with Kilolaware last year. It took

983
00:41:34,559 --> 00:41:36,199
a while for him to earn his spot out there.

984
00:41:36,400 --> 00:41:37,880
I think That's been true for a lot of rookies

985
00:41:37,960 --> 00:41:40,239
in Miami's past, even some of the you know, more

986
00:41:40,320 --> 00:41:43,480
highly regarded ones. And like I said, with high Smith injured,

987
00:41:43,599 --> 00:41:45,679
I think there is a path for him to stand

988
00:41:45,760 --> 00:41:48,320
out in training camp and earn some minutes there and

989
00:41:48,320 --> 00:41:51,280
if he can make a good initial depression, Sposer will

990
00:41:51,280 --> 00:41:53,480
definitely give him a look. Sposer gives every look at

991
00:41:53,519 --> 00:41:55,239
some point. That's that's one thing you can say about him.

992
00:41:55,280 --> 00:41:57,199
Other people would say he's inconsistent and e leads to

993
00:41:58,079 --> 00:42:00,960
confidence issues with his players sometimes. But I think if

994
00:42:01,000 --> 00:42:03,000
you're at the twelfth man on Mammy, which lessons not

995
00:42:03,119 --> 00:42:04,800
but even if you were, you're going to get a

996
00:42:04,840 --> 00:42:07,760
look at some point on a Smolster team, So I

997
00:42:07,840 --> 00:42:09,360
think he will get a chance. I think it'll be

998
00:42:09,440 --> 00:42:10,960
the first few weeks of the season, and if he

999
00:42:11,000 --> 00:42:12,519
can take it, he'll establish himself.

1000
00:42:14,400 --> 00:42:16,599
Speaker 1: We're up. I'm up again because we're gonna lead into

1001
00:42:16,679 --> 00:42:19,440
your next pick as well. I have Terren Shannon Junior

1002
00:42:19,639 --> 00:42:22,239
from the Timberwolves, who has been deemed too good for

1003
00:42:22,320 --> 00:42:25,320
Summer League in consecutive summer leagues at this point, and

1004
00:42:26,079 --> 00:42:28,840
just as I feel like you very rarely see somebody

1005
00:42:29,239 --> 00:42:33,000
who can generate like the type of pressure that he

1006
00:42:33,159 --> 00:42:35,559
can on defenses, but is also oh, maybe this guy

1007
00:42:35,679 --> 00:42:38,159
can can hit his threes as well, and that's what

1008
00:42:38,280 --> 00:42:40,480
he feels like he could be on the offensive end.

1009
00:42:40,519 --> 00:42:43,719
And I think, like right now, just the defensive intensity

1010
00:42:44,079 --> 00:42:46,559
that he's going to bring, and he's just like such

1011
00:42:46,679 --> 00:42:49,480
this strong dude. I feel like he was one of

1012
00:42:49,599 --> 00:42:52,360
the not that this maybe would have mattered. Perhaps he

1013
00:42:52,480 --> 00:42:54,519
leaves anyway, but this feels like one of the biggest

1014
00:42:54,599 --> 00:42:58,199
reasons why the team was okay quote unquote losing Nikil

1015
00:42:58,199 --> 00:43:00,639
Alexander Walker. I know they're different plays, but it feels

1016
00:43:00,679 --> 00:43:03,320
like they just trust that he can slide in play

1017
00:43:03,360 --> 00:43:05,679
a bunch of minutes for them finally, and if you

1018
00:43:05,719 --> 00:43:08,440
know the the summer league evidence this year, is any

1019
00:43:08,480 --> 00:43:11,599
indication like yeah, he certainly can do that. And so

1020
00:43:11,679 --> 00:43:14,159
I'm curious to see, like what does this look what

1021
00:43:14,239 --> 00:43:15,960
does this do look like? When he's playing in this

1022
00:43:16,519 --> 00:43:20,039
larger ecosystem? Is he gonna continue to shoot thirty eight

1023
00:43:20,079 --> 00:43:22,920
percent from three? We're dealing with very very small sample

1024
00:43:23,000 --> 00:43:25,679
sizes there, So I think that's gonna be when you

1025
00:43:25,719 --> 00:43:28,800
look at Minnesota's offense, like even more so than his

1026
00:43:28,920 --> 00:43:31,239
finishing at the basket, Like they're probably gonna need that

1027
00:43:31,400 --> 00:43:33,920
that shooting element as well around Anthony Edwards, are around

1028
00:43:34,239 --> 00:43:36,280
Mike Conley or are they gonna try Rob dilling Hammett

1029
00:43:36,480 --> 00:43:38,800
as a ball handler there their offense for some not

1030
00:43:38,880 --> 00:43:41,000
for some reason. I think there's legitimate reasons. But that's

1031
00:43:41,039 --> 00:43:42,679
what I have the question marks for because we know

1032
00:43:42,719 --> 00:43:45,440
what they can do on defense, especially with Rudy Gobert,

1033
00:43:45,480 --> 00:43:47,360
and I think we kind of know what Shannon's going

1034
00:43:47,440 --> 00:43:50,239
to bring on that side of floor. But if he

1035
00:43:50,239 --> 00:43:54,199
can give you some like consistent offensive production and quick

1036
00:43:54,280 --> 00:43:57,039
decision making like catch it drive or catch it and shoot,

1037
00:43:57,559 --> 00:43:59,519
like this is someone who I think could be like

1038
00:43:59,639 --> 00:44:04,079
General some pre insanely inflammatory takes by the end this season.

1039
00:44:05,039 --> 00:44:07,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, and this might be the player that you picked

1040
00:44:07,960 --> 00:44:11,159
that I'm highest on. I love Terrence Shannon. I go

1041
00:44:11,199 --> 00:44:12,800
to Summer League in person, and I have to say

1042
00:44:12,840 --> 00:44:15,880
that Shannon in person is even more impressed, in impressive

1043
00:44:15,920 --> 00:44:18,400
than when he's off the screen, because his athleticism, his size,

1044
00:44:18,679 --> 00:44:21,800
his ability to translate like potential energy into kinetic energy

1045
00:44:22,000 --> 00:44:24,159
faster than anybody else in the court really pops when

1046
00:44:24,159 --> 00:44:27,880
you're actually there and watching him. I had him. It's

1047
00:44:27,920 --> 00:44:29,960
interesting that you bring up a Summer League performance because

1048
00:44:30,000 --> 00:44:32,119
I I'm glad he didn't steal my stat, which was

1049
00:44:32,480 --> 00:44:35,320
he had four assists in all of his Summer League

1050
00:44:35,360 --> 00:44:37,920
games last year, four games, so one per game. He

1051
00:44:38,000 --> 00:44:41,119
had nine assists in his first Summer League game this year.

1052
00:44:41,639 --> 00:44:43,280
I'd always pegged him a sort of like a best

1053
00:44:43,360 --> 00:44:45,000
case scenario would be three in D and D, so

1054
00:44:45,119 --> 00:44:47,400
like you know, three is and and defense and dunks

1055
00:44:48,079 --> 00:44:49,880
kind of guy. But if he can actually add some

1056
00:44:50,000 --> 00:44:53,440
secondary playmaking in that Nikhil Alexander Walker Vane, I think

1057
00:44:53,440 --> 00:44:55,480
the ceiling on him as a player is so much higher.

1058
00:44:55,960 --> 00:44:58,280
I was really impressed with his court vision. I was

1059
00:44:58,320 --> 00:45:01,039
really impressed obviously with a three point act and aggressiveness.

1060
00:45:01,119 --> 00:45:02,840
This year, I think he had twenty six and three

1061
00:45:02,920 --> 00:45:07,360
gameson Shannon is a guy who looks like he could

1062
00:45:07,360 --> 00:45:09,679
be a real force. I don't want to get too

1063
00:45:09,719 --> 00:45:14,079
crazy here, but I'm like, there is serious potential for

1064
00:45:14,199 --> 00:45:16,039
him to be a major player, a major starter in

1065
00:45:16,079 --> 00:45:19,760
the NBA. I think there's very few I should I

1066
00:45:19,760 --> 00:45:21,719
should back up. He played three hundred and fifty minutes

1067
00:45:21,719 --> 00:45:23,360
in the NBA last season, right, So I don't want

1068
00:45:23,360 --> 00:45:24,320
to get too crazy here.

1069
00:45:24,280 --> 00:45:27,880
Speaker 1: But you look at sixty eight not garbage time minutes too,

1070
00:45:28,000 --> 00:45:29,400
so it's like even which is wild?

1071
00:45:29,840 --> 00:45:32,239
Speaker 2: Yeah, So im I can hear him pretend like he's

1072
00:45:32,360 --> 00:45:35,280
proven anything. But if you're going purely by feel and

1073
00:45:35,440 --> 00:45:38,400
anecdotal evidence and you know the things that you've seen,

1074
00:45:39,039 --> 00:45:41,199
there aren't that many weaknesses to his game for what

1075
00:45:41,360 --> 00:45:43,800
he's looking to be. So that said, he hasn't done

1076
00:45:43,800 --> 00:45:45,920
anything that league yet. We will see what he can

1077
00:45:45,960 --> 00:45:47,679
do this year because I do think he will be given,

1078
00:45:47,800 --> 00:45:49,440
as you said, that kind of first look in the

1079
00:45:49,519 --> 00:45:53,119
Nikhil Alexander Walker role spark plug off the bench both ways,

1080
00:45:53,199 --> 00:45:54,840
he plays with a ton of force, a ton of energy.

1081
00:45:55,239 --> 00:45:57,079
If he can keep hitting us threes, if he can

1082
00:45:57,199 --> 00:46:00,440
keep showing off this playmaking ability that I'd never before,

1083
00:46:01,039 --> 00:46:02,519
I'm really excited to see what he can do with it.

1084
00:46:03,480 --> 00:46:05,719
Speaker 1: We have another kimber Wolf coming up from you, though

1085
00:46:06,000 --> 00:46:09,719
not and is not Jalen Wells of the Memphis Grizzly. Surprisingly,

1086
00:46:09,760 --> 00:46:11,159
as I had a little bit of a mix up

1087
00:46:11,199 --> 00:46:13,559
twice before he recorded this podcast.

1088
00:46:14,239 --> 00:46:16,079
Speaker 2: There's just too many Jalens in the NBA, now, I

1089
00:46:16,119 --> 00:46:18,199
think is the problem. But no, my guy here is

1090
00:46:18,320 --> 00:46:20,519
Jalen Clark. And it's so funny because I told you

1091
00:46:20,679 --> 00:46:22,280
before we started recording, I'm like, hey, I want you.

1092
00:46:22,400 --> 00:46:24,199
I wanted you to do Terarren Shannon first because I

1093
00:46:24,239 --> 00:46:25,920
think that's the bigger name, and I think that's the

1094
00:46:26,000 --> 00:46:29,280
more likely breakout candidate from just an opportunity sense. And

1095
00:46:29,320 --> 00:46:30,960
then I went and looked at numbers a little more closely,

1096
00:46:31,000 --> 00:46:33,320
and Jalen Clark actually played more minutes than Shannon did

1097
00:46:33,519 --> 00:46:35,880
last year. So my default it should be Shannon coming

1098
00:46:35,920 --> 00:46:38,599
for Clark's minutes, not necessarily the other way around. But

1099
00:46:39,440 --> 00:46:43,360
Clark is super fun. If you're somebody who likes defense

1100
00:46:43,599 --> 00:46:47,480
and just relentlessness. Like Clark was a defensive player of

1101
00:46:47,480 --> 00:46:50,360
the Year in college. Then he tore his achilles, I

1102
00:46:50,400 --> 00:46:52,119
believe on the last day of the Raylar season back

1103
00:46:52,159 --> 00:46:55,639
in twenty twenty three, spent nearly eighteen months recuperating from it.

1104
00:46:55,880 --> 00:46:58,159
Made his debut in the NBA last year in January,

1105
00:46:58,199 --> 00:47:00,760
and then he played every game from February at least

1106
00:47:00,800 --> 00:47:03,559
garbage time minutes. And he's out there to do one

1107
00:47:03,599 --> 00:47:05,000
thing and one thing only, and that's just like create

1108
00:47:05,079 --> 00:47:07,559
havoc in the back court, and he's very good at it.

1109
00:47:07,599 --> 00:47:10,000
He's got long arms, he's got a lot of physicality

1110
00:47:10,079 --> 00:47:11,679
in the way that he was able to get away

1111
00:47:11,719 --> 00:47:13,159
with in the NBA. You'd always see that with young

1112
00:47:13,199 --> 00:47:15,000
guys sometimes they try to be handsy in the back court,

1113
00:47:15,079 --> 00:47:16,840
rest calm from fouls, eighty feet from the hoop, and

1114
00:47:16,880 --> 00:47:18,480
they get benched right and Clark there was a little

1115
00:47:18,480 --> 00:47:19,719
bit of that with Clark, But he was able to

1116
00:47:19,960 --> 00:47:22,199
like steer guys a lot more aggressively than the most

1117
00:47:22,239 --> 00:47:25,039
players of his age. So the defensive instincts, the lateral

1118
00:47:25,119 --> 00:47:27,800
quickness and anjili are still there post achilles, which is

1119
00:47:27,880 --> 00:47:29,840
promising for a lot of different fan bases right now.

1120
00:47:30,360 --> 00:47:33,159
But I think the thing with Clark is that there

1121
00:47:33,480 --> 00:47:36,639
was very little offense at all last year. So if

1122
00:47:36,639 --> 00:47:38,320
you're looking for reasons why he can't break out, it's

1123
00:47:38,320 --> 00:47:40,320
because he basically didn't play offense. It's not even that

1124
00:47:40,400 --> 00:47:42,599
he was bad. He shot like forty percent from deep,

1125
00:47:42,599 --> 00:47:45,480
give or take, and the problem is his usage was

1126
00:47:45,559 --> 00:47:50,159
eleven percent, which is non existent. That's like the guy

1127
00:47:50,239 --> 00:47:52,280
sitting on the bench who catches an errant pass every

1128
00:47:52,280 --> 00:47:54,719
once in a while kind of usage. You know, I'm

1129
00:47:54,800 --> 00:47:56,599
worried that he just is never going to be forceful

1130
00:47:56,679 --> 00:47:57,920
enough on that end to be able to earn the

1131
00:47:57,960 --> 00:48:00,880
playing time. But I hope he does because there's a

1132
00:48:00,920 --> 00:48:02,960
lot of surprising amount of question marks, i'd say on

1133
00:48:03,000 --> 00:48:06,800
the perimeter for the Timberwolves. Will the clock finally turned

1134
00:48:06,840 --> 00:48:10,679
Mike Connley into a pumpkin? Maybe Rob Dillingham never pans out,

1135
00:48:10,760 --> 00:48:13,159
and maybe he can't hold his own defensively enough to

1136
00:48:13,360 --> 00:48:16,519
withstand his to this point theoretical offense. Maybe Terrence Shannon

1137
00:48:16,519 --> 00:48:17,920
doesn't pop the way that you and I both think

1138
00:48:17,960 --> 00:48:22,039
he will. There's a lot kind of of unproven fits

1139
00:48:22,199 --> 00:48:25,199
back there. So if Jallen Clark does start playing big minutes,

1140
00:48:25,199 --> 00:48:27,559
then something probably went horribly awry for the Timberwolves. But

1141
00:48:27,599 --> 00:48:28,800
that's the way it goes when you're the you know,

1142
00:48:28,920 --> 00:48:30,440
tenth e level, the guy on a roster, right Like,

1143
00:48:31,000 --> 00:48:33,880
tragedy ahead of you is generally what gives you your opportunity.

1144
00:48:33,920 --> 00:48:35,239
And that's kind of how the way it is with Clark.

1145
00:48:35,519 --> 00:48:36,840
That doesn't mean I don't want to see him, because

1146
00:48:36,840 --> 00:48:36,960
I do.

1147
00:48:37,639 --> 00:48:41,079
Speaker 1: Well, don't they like they need the Wolves? And I'll

1148
00:48:41,119 --> 00:48:45,440
say Capslock need one of Jalen Clark, Tarren Shannon Junior

1149
00:48:45,559 --> 00:48:47,960
or Rob Dillingham to pop this year, right, Like there's

1150
00:48:48,079 --> 00:48:50,280
just how do you now, Like even with how Mike

1151
00:48:50,320 --> 00:48:53,239
Conley was last year, I don't know, he's not If

1152
00:48:53,280 --> 00:48:54,960
he gets better from last year, it's not gonna be

1153
00:48:55,000 --> 00:48:57,119
a lot better. And so if we're sitting here, you

1154
00:48:57,239 --> 00:49:00,519
lose gnaw and we're saying none of these three guys

1155
00:49:00,599 --> 00:49:04,000
are a regular or reliable part of the rotation, I don't.

1156
00:49:04,639 --> 00:49:07,280
I don't want to overestimate how that would impact the Timberwolves,

1157
00:49:07,280 --> 00:49:09,480
but like, no, they need one of these guys to

1158
00:49:09,559 --> 00:49:12,159
be a real impactful rotation player next year.

1159
00:49:12,840 --> 00:49:15,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, totally. And I that said, like I think we've

1160
00:49:15,920 --> 00:49:19,119
seen that Edwards and Gobert and Read and I guess

1161
00:49:19,199 --> 00:49:21,599
now Julius Randall are a very solid core in regular

1162
00:49:21,599 --> 00:49:24,760
season and playoffs like two straight conference finals. I don't

1163
00:49:24,800 --> 00:49:30,199
know that Clark or Shannon or Dillingham are necessarily instrumental

1164
00:49:30,320 --> 00:49:33,920
to them repeating that sort of thing. But if they're not,

1165
00:49:34,079 --> 00:49:37,039
their margint payers basically zero health wise, right like everybody

1166
00:49:37,039 --> 00:49:38,519
else will have to be healthy and common would have

1167
00:49:38,559 --> 00:49:40,440
to still be good. And I'm not convinced that's realistic,

1168
00:49:40,480 --> 00:49:42,559
So I think you're probably right. In a realistic world,

1169
00:49:42,559 --> 00:49:44,079
you've got to have at least one, and preferably two

1170
00:49:44,119 --> 00:49:46,440
of those guys doing something, and I think they would

1171
00:49:46,440 --> 00:49:49,960
prefer it to being Dillingham and Shannon. But I just

1172
00:49:50,039 --> 00:49:52,119
want to keep Clark out there as an idea because

1173
00:49:52,199 --> 00:49:53,880
when this guy, when they unleash this guy, it's a

1174
00:49:53,920 --> 00:49:55,400
lot of fun for a couple of minutes at that time.

1175
00:49:56,199 --> 00:49:59,599
Speaker 1: Yeah, I've just the dialing camp stuff is fascinating. He's

1176
00:49:59,599 --> 00:50:01,280
not part of the podcast, but I don't like if

1177
00:50:01,320 --> 00:50:03,280
he's not playing a regular role for them next year.

1178
00:50:03,400 --> 00:50:05,880
I don't understand what the plan then becomes for him

1179
00:50:05,920 --> 00:50:07,239
to give up what you did to get him. He's

1180
00:50:07,280 --> 00:50:10,119
drafted eighth overall, and it's you know, I understand that

1181
00:50:10,199 --> 00:50:12,119
he's younger and you're trying to contend for a title,

1182
00:50:12,199 --> 00:50:14,039
but if you weren't going to give him a real

1183
00:50:14,400 --> 00:50:16,719
first year, okay, whatever, But now it feels like you

1184
00:50:16,760 --> 00:50:19,159
almost have to give him real runway to understand what

1185
00:50:19,320 --> 00:50:21,639
you have, Otherwise you get into the discussion of al

1186
00:50:21,800 --> 00:50:25,519
is it ever gonna happen in Minnesota? So and like,

1187
00:50:25,599 --> 00:50:28,360
I still kind of like the shape and like scope

1188
00:50:28,400 --> 00:50:30,480
of his game, but I don't know that I've come away,

1189
00:50:30,760 --> 00:50:33,159
like blown away by anything that he's done since he's

1190
00:50:33,280 --> 00:50:34,320
entered the NBA. Either.

1191
00:50:34,800 --> 00:50:37,519
Speaker 2: I would never understand trading up to draft a player

1192
00:50:37,559 --> 00:50:41,119
who will have a weakness that is always a playoff liability,

1193
00:50:41,199 --> 00:50:44,039
you know, like if Dillingham had fallen to them naturally,

1194
00:50:44,159 --> 00:50:45,559
then sure you take a fly out of it and

1195
00:50:45,559 --> 00:50:47,480
hope he turns into enough of an offensive force to

1196
00:50:47,519 --> 00:50:49,960
be viable in the playoffs. But he's just always going

1197
00:50:50,000 --> 00:50:52,000
to be so bad on defense. I think I can't

1198
00:50:52,039 --> 00:50:56,320
see a future where he's like not being relentlessly attacked

1199
00:50:56,519 --> 00:50:58,559
in the playoffs, and you can be good enough on

1200
00:50:58,679 --> 00:51:00,840
offense to make up for that is possible, but it

1201
00:51:01,000 --> 00:51:02,960
is hard. That is a high bar to clear, and

1202
00:51:03,000 --> 00:51:04,400
I'm just not convinced he can ever get there. I

1203
00:51:04,440 --> 00:51:07,320
never understood that pick. Like, he's fun, he does some

1204
00:51:07,400 --> 00:51:09,599
cool things. It's not that he's a bad NBA player,

1205
00:51:09,639 --> 00:51:11,480
but it was a big price to pay. It was

1206
00:51:11,519 --> 00:51:13,679
their last big shot I think really to add us

1207
00:51:13,840 --> 00:51:15,880
kind of a star ish level guy before you know,

1208
00:51:16,639 --> 00:51:19,639
during this like ant phase, I didn't like where they landed.

1209
00:51:20,000 --> 00:51:21,599
I had not seen enough around to be convinced he's

1210
00:51:21,639 --> 00:51:23,440
part of their like long term solution at point guard.

1211
00:51:23,880 --> 00:51:27,440
Speaker 1: I also don't remember the last like contender who. Yeah,

1212
00:51:27,440 --> 00:51:29,639
you see stuff like Christian Brown with the Nuggets where

1213
00:51:29,639 --> 00:51:31,480
it kind of comes in. He's playing a very sort

1214
00:51:31,519 --> 00:51:34,079
of niche role. But like, who is the last like

1215
00:51:34,360 --> 00:51:38,360
featured youngster to be on a Contender and like develop

1216
00:51:38,519 --> 00:51:42,679
according to well Or while within that title contention timeline,

1217
00:51:42,679 --> 00:51:43,199
I don't.

1218
00:51:43,079 --> 00:51:46,400
Speaker 2: I've reck we say the entire thunder team that counts fair.

1219
00:51:48,840 --> 00:51:51,840
Speaker 1: That's good there. I mean I guess even Houston too

1220
00:51:52,000 --> 00:51:54,159
would be a good like counter there. But you run

1221
00:51:54,239 --> 00:51:56,159
into the camp whitmore problem like they did. It's just

1222
00:51:56,199 --> 00:51:58,440
like can you carve out minutes for these guys to develop.

1223
00:51:58,559 --> 00:52:00,920
So he's he's going to be a polarizing player too.

1224
00:52:01,000 --> 00:52:03,079
We have back to back picks for you. We're on

1225
00:52:03,199 --> 00:52:05,960
the Bay. Who's who's gonna play basketball this year?

1226
00:52:06,000 --> 00:52:08,920
Speaker 2: Right, Mike, Let's hope you know Sadekba is kind of funny.

1227
00:52:08,960 --> 00:52:11,480
He was never like one of my guys necessarily as

1228
00:52:11,559 --> 00:52:13,920
a three and D who is sort of mediocre at

1229
00:52:13,920 --> 00:52:17,000
both those things, I'd say, but he's missed a year

1230
00:52:17,119 --> 00:52:19,679
with his ACL so that's probably not a good thing.

1231
00:52:20,320 --> 00:52:23,760
New Orleans so desperately needs a kind of three, kind

1232
00:52:23,840 --> 00:52:26,119
of D guy with a little bit of size. Like

1233
00:52:26,199 --> 00:52:28,119
you look at that New Orleans front court and it's

1234
00:52:28,679 --> 00:52:32,320
Zion and Queen and Looney and me Si and that's

1235
00:52:32,519 --> 00:52:37,239
four guys who cannot shoot a lick. And like Bay

1236
00:52:37,360 --> 00:52:39,440
isn't great necessarily as a power forward, but he has

1237
00:52:39,480 --> 00:52:43,400
experience doing it. He's a stocky, stocky six seven. He's

1238
00:52:43,400 --> 00:52:45,280
a good rebounder when he's not playing power forward. He's

1239
00:52:45,480 --> 00:52:47,039
just good enough that you can treat yourself with the

1240
00:52:47,079 --> 00:52:49,760
thinking he can play the four. He's just good enough

1241
00:52:49,800 --> 00:52:51,639
of a shooter that he'll stretch the defense a little

1242
00:52:51,639 --> 00:52:53,320
bit as certainly compared to any of those guys. And

1243
00:52:53,400 --> 00:52:54,920
let's be honest, the Pelicans are gonna be playing a

1244
00:52:54,960 --> 00:52:56,519
lot of Jeremiah Fears and a lot of Herb Jones,

1245
00:52:56,519 --> 00:52:59,239
and those guys aren't stretching the defense either. So they

1246
00:52:59,360 --> 00:53:01,880
just desperately need somebody with With Sadik Bay even being

1247
00:53:02,000 --> 00:53:03,920
just sort of okay at both those things that I

1248
00:53:03,960 --> 00:53:05,840
think he's going to come in and just weasel his

1249
00:53:05,920 --> 00:53:07,840
way into like a lot of minutes that nobody saw coming.

1250
00:53:08,239 --> 00:53:10,280
So this is purely this is a fairly known commodity.

1251
00:53:10,360 --> 00:53:12,639
Sadeek Bay. He shoots a lot of threes, he makes

1252
00:53:13,039 --> 00:53:15,920
some of them. He's a pretty good offensive rebounder. He's

1253
00:53:15,960 --> 00:53:18,320
like had moments of pretty good defense that you know,

1254
00:53:18,440 --> 00:53:22,599
have been increasingly fewer and further and further between. But

1255
00:53:23,519 --> 00:53:27,840
Pelicans need somebody so desperately. Even with Sadeek Bay's most

1256
00:53:28,000 --> 00:53:29,559
scene skill set that I have to think he's going

1257
00:53:29,599 --> 00:53:32,880
to get an opportunity and he's always produced play fantasy

1258
00:53:32,960 --> 00:53:34,800
numbers when you you know, have give him a chance.

1259
00:53:34,920 --> 00:53:35,400
So we'll see.

1260
00:53:36,280 --> 00:53:38,119
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, they say it's weird, I think. So

1261
00:53:38,320 --> 00:53:41,079
they have Trey Murphy, they have Sadig Bay, they're just

1262
00:53:41,199 --> 00:53:43,280
like there still feels like there's a dearth of shooting

1263
00:53:43,360 --> 00:53:45,320
on this roster because we know a healthy Derek Queen

1264
00:53:45,360 --> 00:53:47,199
and Jeremiah Fears aren't going to provide enough of it.

1265
00:53:47,320 --> 00:53:49,840
I guess Jordan Poole had a bounce back here last season,

1266
00:53:49,920 --> 00:53:52,039
But I still don't even really understand the theory of

1267
00:53:52,719 --> 00:53:56,440
Let's as the one of the cheapest organizations in NBA history,

1268
00:53:56,519 --> 00:53:59,559
deciding let's give up this expiring contract to add forty

1269
00:53:59,599 --> 00:54:03,719
million dollars of money for twenty twenty six, twenty seven.

1270
00:54:04,159 --> 00:54:06,880
But like, Pool is just I've never been a Pool guy,

1271
00:54:06,960 --> 00:54:09,760
but I recognize what his offensive value was last year. Like,

1272
00:54:09,840 --> 00:54:11,599
I think he's probably a better like passer or pick

1273
00:54:11,639 --> 00:54:13,320
and roll player than people give him credit for. But

1274
00:54:13,679 --> 00:54:16,119
there's also just the peaks and valleys from him were

1275
00:54:16,159 --> 00:54:19,119
so turbulent. I was just so you're relying on just

1276
00:54:19,559 --> 00:54:22,639
it's another weird brew of players, and I'm probably struggling

1277
00:54:22,719 --> 00:54:25,559
to untether myself from what they did in the draft,

1278
00:54:25,800 --> 00:54:29,199
which was just completely irresponsible in my Like, even if

1279
00:54:29,239 --> 00:54:31,960
Derek Queen ends up being the right pick, you still

1280
00:54:32,079 --> 00:54:35,079
like fucked up the move because like you're not gonna

1281
00:54:35,079 --> 00:54:37,320
be look at the West, what is the pathway to

1282
00:54:37,400 --> 00:54:40,519
them being with a deep Bay averaging twenty five points

1283
00:54:40,519 --> 00:54:42,280
a game, I'm purely three point shooting. It's like, that's

1284
00:54:42,280 --> 00:54:44,280
not it gonna get you a top six spot in

1285
00:54:44,400 --> 00:54:47,039
the West. So and I hope they play. You mentioned spacing.

1286
00:54:47,119 --> 00:54:48,840
I said I was gonna shoehorn his name in here,

1287
00:54:48,960 --> 00:54:52,199
like on court Carlo Makovic at some point, like you

1288
00:54:52,280 --> 00:54:55,360
want someone in the front court alongside Zion or Derrek

1289
00:54:55,440 --> 00:54:57,639
Queen or even even me Si to just space the

1290
00:54:57,719 --> 00:55:00,960
floor like he could do that more alongside Zion, I

1291
00:55:01,000 --> 00:55:02,719
would argue would be ideal. And I think he's got

1292
00:55:02,840 --> 00:55:05,000
like he's got more pop to him. I'm not gonna

1293
00:55:05,000 --> 00:55:06,719
say he's going to be a good defender, but I

1294
00:55:06,840 --> 00:55:09,440
want to see Zion with as much floor spacing around

1295
00:55:09,480 --> 00:55:11,199
him as possible. And if you're also trying to blend

1296
00:55:11,280 --> 00:55:13,039
the well, we also want a big man who does

1297
00:55:13,119 --> 00:55:16,280
big man stuff that's not Trey Murphy, that's not Sadik Bay.

1298
00:55:16,440 --> 00:55:19,000
Like it feels like Makovich would be the best bet there.

1299
00:55:19,159 --> 00:55:20,920
So this team has a ton of questions, but I

1300
00:55:21,079 --> 00:55:22,920
do agree with your overall sart of Sadeek Bay that

1301
00:55:23,079 --> 00:55:25,480
they need him to play a ton of minutes, especially

1302
00:55:25,519 --> 00:55:29,559
because they're trying to be good apparently, I assume.

1303
00:55:29,840 --> 00:55:35,159
Speaker 2: They better hope they're at least okay Bay is. One

1304
00:55:35,199 --> 00:55:36,960
thing I'll say about Bay is that he actually does

1305
00:55:37,039 --> 00:55:39,239
have a decent amount of positional flexibility. You know, I've

1306
00:55:39,280 --> 00:55:41,360
been kind of like sounds like I'm damning with faint

1307
00:55:41,400 --> 00:55:45,119
praise kind of because I am. But Bee is capable

1308
00:55:45,159 --> 00:55:46,679
of playing anywhere from the two to the four. And

1309
00:55:46,719 --> 00:55:48,480
the Pelicans, actually, if you look at the roster, are

1310
00:55:48,679 --> 00:55:51,280
very positionally inflexible. There's just not a lot of guys

1311
00:55:51,320 --> 00:55:53,159
who can slide up or down more than one position.

1312
00:55:53,480 --> 00:55:56,239
And I think Bey is somebody who can has proven

1313
00:55:56,280 --> 00:55:57,679
that he can go anywhere from the two to the

1314
00:55:57,719 --> 00:55:59,760
four and he'll just find his way into land. So

1315
00:55:59,800 --> 00:56:02,519
there's need somebody who can be go rebound, which they

1316
00:56:02,639 --> 00:56:04,840
are terrible at, go defend a little bit, which like

1317
00:56:04,880 --> 00:56:06,559
they're terrible at. But he's not gonna be worse than

1318
00:56:07,039 --> 00:56:11,280
Jordan Hawkins, you know. So I yeah, we'll see where

1319
00:56:11,280 --> 00:56:12,920
he just slides at. But I low key I'm like

1320
00:56:13,000 --> 00:56:14,719
kind of interested to see how Sabek Bay does on

1321
00:56:14,760 --> 00:56:15,280
the Pelicans.

1322
00:56:16,599 --> 00:56:19,639
Speaker 1: My next pick is going to be a Champenny listeners

1323
00:56:19,679 --> 00:56:23,000
that this podcast will not be surprised that is justin Champenny, though,

1324
00:56:23,079 --> 00:56:25,639
of the Wizards, not that either of them are what

1325
00:56:25,679 --> 00:56:27,880
you would call a known quantity at this point, but

1326
00:56:28,079 --> 00:56:32,119
I don't think even I sometimes forget or don't fully appreciate,

1327
00:56:32,320 --> 00:56:34,760
like the breadth of the defensive work that they've had

1328
00:56:34,840 --> 00:56:37,760
him do in Washington, like blave kolabally is going to

1329
00:56:37,800 --> 00:56:39,639
defend a lot of the toughest assignments, but the kind

1330
00:56:39,679 --> 00:56:41,719
of after him when you're looking on the perimeter, at

1331
00:56:41,760 --> 00:56:43,480
least to this point, like Champagne has done a lot

1332
00:56:43,519 --> 00:56:45,199
of the heavy lifting there. And he also is just

1333
00:56:45,679 --> 00:56:48,519
for his size and like his his position, like he

1334
00:56:48,639 --> 00:56:50,840
does some stuff around the basket. He was in like

1335
00:56:50,920 --> 00:56:53,400
the eighty fifth percentile of rimpoints saved per one hundred

1336
00:56:53,400 --> 00:56:56,000
possessions last year. And this is all just a guy

1337
00:56:56,079 --> 00:56:59,320
who doesn't eat up offensive usage, like on the ball

1338
00:56:59,360 --> 00:57:01,679
offensive use. He's just gonna come in, He's gonna take

1339
00:57:01,840 --> 00:57:04,000
and hit his threes. Who's at forty two percent of

1340
00:57:04,039 --> 00:57:07,480
his spot up threes last year. I just have an

1341
00:57:07,480 --> 00:57:10,800
appreciation for those guys who come in and play those

1342
00:57:10,840 --> 00:57:12,679
types of roles on offense and then are still just

1343
00:57:12,760 --> 00:57:16,679
really going to ferry a lot of or a very

1344
00:57:16,760 --> 00:57:19,280
heavy defensive workload and it's not always gonna work out.

1345
00:57:19,320 --> 00:57:22,119
The Wizards surprisingly were not a good defensive team last year.

1346
00:57:22,119 --> 00:57:24,400
Who could have seen that coming? But just someone who's

1347
00:57:24,400 --> 00:57:26,599
sponging up those reps in the regular season. I think

1348
00:57:26,639 --> 00:57:29,519
he's someone who helps you streamline the development of all

1349
00:57:29,559 --> 00:57:32,199
your younger players. But if and when you're trying to

1350
00:57:32,239 --> 00:57:34,440
be good, like the Wizards probably will be after this

1351
00:57:34,519 --> 00:57:36,360
coming season, when you look at the way they've structured

1352
00:57:36,400 --> 00:57:39,039
their books, that's also someone who could be a part

1353
00:57:39,079 --> 00:57:42,039
of it. And while this doesn't factor in, he's gonna

1354
00:57:42,079 --> 00:57:44,519
average one point five percent of the salary cap through

1355
00:57:44,599 --> 00:57:45,679
like the next three years.

1356
00:57:45,840 --> 00:57:49,400
Speaker 2: That's insane good value, pretty good value. Yeah, you know

1357
00:57:49,400 --> 00:57:52,360
what I like about Justin CHIMPENNI is like he plays

1358
00:57:52,679 --> 00:57:55,440
like a guy who knows that how to keep a

1359
00:57:55,559 --> 00:57:57,360
job in the NBA. Like he's never gonna be a

1360
00:57:57,360 --> 00:58:00,239
superstar in a so but he'll have random night where

1361
00:58:00,239 --> 00:58:02,199
he can go off. And I'll always be fond Champenny

1362
00:58:02,239 --> 00:58:04,400
because I wrote a nice blurb about him in like

1363
00:58:04,840 --> 00:58:07,320
late December after he'd strung together a couple of games,

1364
00:58:07,360 --> 00:58:09,840
and like a few days later he'd scored thirty one

1365
00:58:09,880 --> 00:58:12,000
against the Knicks, and I was like, ah, I love

1366
00:58:12,039 --> 00:58:14,519
when guys make me look smart. It happens so infrequently,

1367
00:58:14,639 --> 00:58:16,119
so when they do, I always keep it in the

1368
00:58:16,159 --> 00:58:17,760
back of the head. He's like, yeah, shampegny, that's a

1369
00:58:17,760 --> 00:58:20,320
good guy for me. But he's he knows how to

1370
00:58:20,360 --> 00:58:22,039
work without the ball. He's a good off ball cutter.

1371
00:58:22,199 --> 00:58:24,480
He's a really good runner in transition, just like running

1372
00:58:24,480 --> 00:58:25,840
to the hoop or but it's not there running to

1373
00:58:25,880 --> 00:58:27,760
the quarters. He doesn't deally dally, he doesn't get in

1374
00:58:27,840 --> 00:58:30,079
the way of whoever has the ball. There's a bit

1375
00:58:30,159 --> 00:58:31,880
of a I don't want to say this in a

1376
00:58:31,960 --> 00:58:34,800
bad way. Mechanical sounds bad. That's not what I mean.

1377
00:58:34,960 --> 00:58:36,320
What I mean is like he just goes to the

1378
00:58:36,400 --> 00:58:39,199
right places every time without thinking, and that's really important

1379
00:58:39,239 --> 00:58:42,320
for role players. But he scored twenty plus five times,

1380
00:58:42,599 --> 00:58:44,719
including that Knicks game. There is a little bit of

1381
00:58:44,800 --> 00:58:46,679
upside to him. If you just need somebody to eat

1382
00:58:46,800 --> 00:58:48,480
a couple of shots for a quarter or two, like

1383
00:58:48,519 --> 00:58:50,880
I think he can provide a little more offensive versatility.

1384
00:58:50,960 --> 00:58:53,400
Then he typically allows him stuff or maybe is typically

1385
00:58:53,440 --> 00:58:56,800
allowed by his role on the team. And yeah, I

1386
00:58:56,880 --> 00:58:58,760
love Julian sa. I was really pumped to see his

1387
00:58:58,920 --> 00:59:01,400
brother who so the record, Justin is a lot more

1388
00:59:02,440 --> 00:59:04,599
emotional than his brother too, Like I think if Julian

1389
00:59:04,719 --> 00:59:06,960
is a pretty calm and collected dude, in Justin's like fiery,

1390
00:59:07,079 --> 00:59:08,880
like yelling and pupping his mists and stuff like that.

1391
00:59:09,039 --> 00:59:11,320
So I always have a weird fascination with the Wizards.

1392
00:59:11,400 --> 00:59:14,239
Every year they reinvent themselves into something even stranger than

1393
00:59:14,280 --> 00:59:16,199
the year before. Somehow, so I end up watching more

1394
00:59:16,239 --> 00:59:18,599
of them than professionally I probably should. There are other

1395
00:59:18,639 --> 00:59:21,679
teams that, frankly deserve more attention, But I like the Wizards.

1396
00:59:21,679 --> 00:59:23,599
I like Justin Champagne. I was pumps so you put

1397
00:59:23,679 --> 00:59:24,079
them on here.

1398
00:59:24,840 --> 00:59:27,880
Speaker 1: My question with him was, I don't know, I'm curious

1399
00:59:27,920 --> 00:59:29,119
what his role is going to look like when the

1400
00:59:29,119 --> 00:59:32,639
Wizards just have a lot of these like perimeter dudes,

1401
00:59:32,840 --> 00:59:36,079
all of whom either as projects or veterans. When you're

1402
00:59:36,079 --> 00:59:39,440
looking at a Chris Middleton or CJ. McCollum just deserve minutes.

1403
00:59:39,480 --> 00:59:41,559
And so it's like Middleton and went Moore and Keishaw,

1404
00:59:41,679 --> 00:59:45,360
George Corey Kiss, Purple Out, Kolabali aj Johnson is there.

1405
00:59:45,719 --> 00:59:47,800
There's just I mean, Will Riley too is someone else

1406
00:59:48,039 --> 00:59:51,000
who I like. I don't know how married they are

1407
00:59:51,119 --> 00:59:53,039
to all of the We know that McCollum and Middleton

1408
00:59:53,079 --> 00:59:55,920
won't be there much longer most likely, but if they're

1409
00:59:55,960 --> 00:59:57,639
on the roster, you're presumably going to play them, So

1410
00:59:57,679 --> 01:00:00,440
I'm curious to see how his minutes and role get impacted.

1411
01:00:00,480 --> 01:00:02,840
But he's also the kind of guy and you kind

1412
01:00:02,840 --> 01:00:04,719
of alluded to this that if you need him to

1413
01:00:04,719 --> 01:00:06,559
scale up, which I don't think they do, yeah, okay,

1414
01:00:06,559 --> 01:00:08,440
maybe theoretically could, but if you need him to scale down,

1415
01:00:08,519 --> 01:00:10,480
like his game is still gonna fit within the context

1416
01:00:10,559 --> 01:00:11,000
of your team.

1417
01:00:11,599 --> 01:00:14,280
Speaker 2: Yeah. If I'm some other team, I'm looking hard if

1418
01:00:14,280 --> 01:00:15,880
I can just get him for like a second round

1419
01:00:15,960 --> 01:00:18,000
or you know, something real cheap, because I think to

1420
01:00:18,039 --> 01:00:20,119
your point, the Wizards probably have too many other names

1421
01:00:20,719 --> 01:00:23,679
with overlap on him that theoretically have more upside. And

1422
01:00:23,679 --> 01:00:24,960
I even sure that's true, right, Like a lot of

1423
01:00:24,960 --> 01:00:26,519
the Wizards guy I like, but we don't know what

1424
01:00:26,559 --> 01:00:28,920
they're gonna look like. Champetny is a guy who I

1425
01:00:29,000 --> 01:00:30,920
think is better served on a team trying to win

1426
01:00:31,079 --> 01:00:32,679
than on a team that's trying to build from the

1427
01:00:32,719 --> 01:00:34,400
ground up like the Wizards, because I just think he

1428
01:00:34,519 --> 01:00:37,239
has that veterans game already in him. He's ready to

1429
01:00:37,320 --> 01:00:38,920
go in there and do his part and be a

1430
01:00:39,079 --> 01:00:40,920
ninth man who can He can be your sixth man

1431
01:00:40,960 --> 01:00:43,119
on some nights, you know. And I would like to

1432
01:00:43,159 --> 01:00:45,840
see him sort of in a higher leverage situation than

1433
01:00:45,880 --> 01:00:47,000
what he's going to be in Washington.

1434
01:00:47,880 --> 01:00:50,320
Speaker 1: So I have a I've had a hypothetical trade I've

1435
01:00:50,320 --> 01:00:51,719
been sitting on for a while, but I.

1436
01:00:51,760 --> 01:00:53,079
Speaker 2: Have evolving justin Champenny.

1437
01:00:53,400 --> 01:00:56,920
Speaker 1: Yes, And I haven't proposed I haven't proposed it because

1438
01:00:56,960 --> 01:01:00,960
I think that people most people will hate it, and

1439
01:01:01,079 --> 01:01:02,840
I think I think both fan bases will hate it.

1440
01:01:02,880 --> 01:01:05,440
But are you familiar with the protections on the Wizard's

1441
01:01:05,519 --> 01:01:06,519
pick to New York.

1442
01:01:07,000 --> 01:01:08,559
Speaker 2: You're gonna have to lay them out for me again.

1443
01:01:09,079 --> 01:01:12,360
Speaker 1: So there, it's only for so right this season it's

1444
01:01:12,480 --> 01:01:17,159
down to top eight protection and if it's not conveyed,

1445
01:01:17,239 --> 01:01:19,519
this is the final year it turns into a twenty

1446
01:01:19,599 --> 01:01:22,400
six second and a twenty twenty seven second. Right, if

1447
01:01:22,480 --> 01:01:25,199
you're the Knicks and the Wizards and The trade is

1448
01:01:25,280 --> 01:01:28,199
the Knicks just offer you that pickback, so it's either

1449
01:01:28,239 --> 01:01:30,840
you get your two seconds, which, because they have control

1450
01:01:31,159 --> 01:01:33,039
top eight protection, they could keep it if they want.

1451
01:01:33,320 --> 01:01:35,960
So the Knicks say, here, you could have this pickback unencumbered,

1452
01:01:36,039 --> 01:01:38,599
just in case you're better than you expect, and we

1453
01:01:38,719 --> 01:01:40,840
get justin Champenne. There has to be there't need to

1454
01:01:40,920 --> 01:01:42,840
be money going out, but the Wizards are ultra flexible.

1455
01:01:42,840 --> 01:01:45,199
It can work. Is that insane?

1456
01:01:46,880 --> 01:01:49,079
Speaker 2: It's very creative. I'm very pressed by it. It makes

1457
01:01:49,119 --> 01:01:50,760
sense to me. I mean, I think Champenne would be

1458
01:01:50,880 --> 01:01:53,880
a huge pickup for the Knicks, who just really are

1459
01:01:53,920 --> 01:01:55,760
still trying to bolster their depth. They helped a little

1460
01:01:55,760 --> 01:01:57,679
bit this, you know, this offseason, but there's gonna be

1461
01:01:57,679 --> 01:01:59,320
a lot of nights where you'd rather have Champagne out

1462
01:01:59,360 --> 01:02:02,239
there playing minutes than you know, Jordan Clarkson or whoever.

1463
01:02:03,280 --> 01:02:06,079
And two seconds I think for Champenne is more than

1464
01:02:06,079 --> 01:02:08,960
the Wizards would reasonably ask for from you know, in general,

1465
01:02:09,039 --> 01:02:10,760
just because I don't think his name carries that kind

1466
01:02:10,800 --> 01:02:11,039
of weight.

1467
01:02:11,519 --> 01:02:13,800
Speaker 1: So yeah, that's why I think Knicks fans are gonna

1468
01:02:13,960 --> 01:02:15,599
call me like an asshole or something.

1469
01:02:15,880 --> 01:02:17,960
Speaker 2: Well back around as Knicks fans are known to do

1470
01:02:18,079 --> 01:02:20,440
and apologize to you in a few weeks afterwards when

1471
01:02:20,480 --> 01:02:21,239
they realize.

1472
01:02:23,000 --> 01:02:25,519
Speaker 1: Most of my takes don't warrant an apology after that

1473
01:02:26,039 --> 01:02:26,639
for ready.

1474
01:02:27,320 --> 01:02:30,039
Speaker 2: Go, No, that's good, that's and you know, I will

1475
01:02:30,039 --> 01:02:32,000
say that the Knicks have a very clever and creative

1476
01:02:32,000 --> 01:02:33,719
front office that does seem like the kind of thing

1477
01:02:33,760 --> 01:02:34,760
that they would try to do.

1478
01:02:35,679 --> 01:02:37,480
Speaker 1: They can also use someone who's that cheap when you

1479
01:02:37,599 --> 01:02:39,039
just look at how their books are going to be

1480
01:02:39,119 --> 01:02:39,760
moving forward with it.

1481
01:02:39,920 --> 01:02:41,679
Speaker 2: And the positional flexibility, like I feel like the Knicks

1482
01:02:41,719 --> 01:02:44,000
are always looking for guys who can kind of run

1483
01:02:44,679 --> 01:02:46,280
the big wings to small wings, like you know, I

1484
01:02:46,320 --> 01:02:48,320
think I think Champennie is able to move around the

1485
01:02:48,440 --> 01:02:50,280
lineup a lot. And now I'm being on flexibility is

1486
01:02:50,280 --> 01:02:52,000
you've probably picked up on. Like I think it's important

1487
01:02:52,039 --> 01:02:54,599
for players, role players specifically to be able to plug

1488
01:02:54,639 --> 01:02:56,280
and play in different spots, because if you can only

1489
01:02:56,320 --> 01:02:58,440
play one position or one and a half positions, you're

1490
01:02:58,480 --> 01:03:00,480
not going to have you're not like to have these

1491
01:03:00,519 --> 01:03:03,199
big opportunities. It's it's it's just your team and your

1492
01:03:03,320 --> 01:03:06,199
benefit if you can scale up and down the positional spectrum.

1493
01:03:06,239 --> 01:03:09,199
Speaker 1: Some it feels like everyone's least favorite players now are

1494
01:03:09,320 --> 01:03:11,679
just the pure twos or the pure fours, which would

1495
01:03:11,679 --> 01:03:12,760
support your point there.

1496
01:03:12,880 --> 01:03:15,719
Speaker 2: Yeah, well that goes back to my Jacoby Walter issue

1497
01:03:15,760 --> 01:03:17,039
I think a little bit too right, Like, I think

1498
01:03:17,079 --> 01:03:18,480
he is basically just going to be a peer two

1499
01:03:18,599 --> 01:03:21,000
for his whole career, which is not something I typically.

1500
01:03:20,920 --> 01:03:22,440
Speaker 1: You don't think he might have more defense than like

1501
01:03:22,480 --> 01:03:24,119
it is typically associated with pure twos to.

1502
01:03:24,119 --> 01:03:26,599
Speaker 2: Be guys like one hundred percent, that's what it's not like,

1503
01:03:27,480 --> 01:03:29,079
who's a good example. I don't want to pick on

1504
01:03:29,159 --> 01:03:30,800
Cam Thomas right now, but I think that's certainly how

1505
01:03:30,800 --> 01:03:33,199
people think of Cam Thomas right is, like he's the

1506
01:03:33,679 --> 01:03:36,039
score first, score second. That's all I do kind of too,

1507
01:03:37,119 --> 01:03:39,320
and that is not Jacoby Walter. I think Walter's got

1508
01:03:39,320 --> 01:03:41,280
a lot more defense than that. But but he is

1509
01:03:41,320 --> 01:03:42,519
not a guy who's gonna be playing a lot of

1510
01:03:42,519 --> 01:03:44,079
point guard or a lot of small forward and power

1511
01:03:44,159 --> 01:03:44,559
forward either.

1512
01:03:44,639 --> 01:03:49,079
Speaker 1: So your next pick fascinates me because it implies to

1513
01:03:49,199 --> 01:03:52,480
me at least that you don't think Jalen Green should

1514
01:03:52,480 --> 01:03:56,079
be considered the point guard over Devid Booker. In Phoenix.

1515
01:03:56,320 --> 01:03:59,880
You have Colin Gillespie. How do you feeling about him?

1516
01:04:01,039 --> 01:04:03,760
Speaker 2: So let me start by saying that for my last pick,

1517
01:04:03,800 --> 01:04:06,559
I almost went with Gi Santos on the Warriors, not

1518
01:04:06,760 --> 01:04:09,000
necessarily because of any one thing he has or hasn't done,

1519
01:04:09,039 --> 01:04:11,039
but because they have about four players under contract, and

1520
01:04:11,159 --> 01:04:12,679
like anyone who's on the Warriors right now is in

1521
01:04:12,760 --> 01:04:15,320
line for four hundred minutes a night. But I ended

1522
01:04:15,400 --> 01:04:18,079
up with Caln Gillespie and a guy that I think

1523
01:04:18,480 --> 01:04:20,320
really came on at the very end of last season.

1524
01:04:20,360 --> 01:04:23,000
And March basketball is such a fascinating time because you

1525
01:04:23,119 --> 01:04:25,960
have to throw out the team results entirely. The question

1526
01:04:26,159 --> 01:04:29,360
is what of the crazy player outlier performances that you're

1527
01:04:29,360 --> 01:04:31,800
seeing have some meat to them and what are just

1528
01:04:31,880 --> 01:04:34,199
pure fantasy, right, And that's always the difficult part for everybody,

1529
01:04:34,280 --> 01:04:37,199
like from coaches to media, people like ourselves. So I

1530
01:04:38,000 --> 01:04:39,840
Gillespie came out, He did his damage at the end

1531
01:04:39,880 --> 01:04:41,199
of the season when he finally got a little bit

1532
01:04:41,239 --> 01:04:43,760
of burn after one years, a kind of lightly used nugget,

1533
01:04:44,760 --> 01:04:46,480
and I just really liked what I saw from him.

1534
01:04:46,480 --> 01:04:48,719
There's a lot of Tias Jones, former teammate tst Jones

1535
01:04:48,719 --> 01:04:50,719
in his game, mixed with like maybe a little bit

1536
01:04:50,800 --> 01:04:55,199
of TJ. McConnell's nastiness. But Gillespie came in. He was

1537
01:04:55,239 --> 01:04:59,280
a great game manager, very high four point six turnover

1538
01:04:59,400 --> 01:05:02,000
to us sister turnover ratio, sorry, which is right in

1539
01:05:02,039 --> 01:05:05,760
between Chris Paul and Kyle Lowry for context, unbelievable shooter

1540
01:05:05,800 --> 01:05:08,239
from outside both off the dribble and off the catch.

1541
01:05:08,559 --> 01:05:10,800
We're still talking very small samples even across two seasons,

1542
01:05:10,840 --> 01:05:12,559
but the States back to his college days, like the

1543
01:05:12,639 --> 01:05:14,440
dudes always drilled it from beyond the arc when he

1544
01:05:14,480 --> 01:05:16,519
gets the ball, when he gets a shot up, and

1545
01:05:16,719 --> 01:05:18,559
just like you said, without any true point guard on

1546
01:05:18,599 --> 01:05:20,719
the roster, I think like the backup point guard spot

1547
01:05:20,760 --> 01:05:23,400
should be his basically by default. I think Devin Booker

1548
01:05:23,400 --> 01:05:25,199
will probably be the point guard you know traditionally, which

1549
01:05:25,199 --> 01:05:26,719
I actually pretty high on. I think Devin Booker is

1550
01:05:26,800 --> 01:05:28,079
very underrated for his point guard.

1551
01:05:28,480 --> 01:05:30,920
Speaker 1: Yes, but I lot that take thank you.

1552
01:05:31,480 --> 01:05:34,480
Speaker 2: Wait back right after Chris Paul left and Booker played

1553
01:05:34,559 --> 01:05:35,960
point guard for the first time, I wrote a whole

1554
01:05:36,079 --> 01:05:38,760
article about that was comparing all the tricks he had

1555
01:05:38,800 --> 01:05:42,119
picked up from Chris Paul during their overlapping tenure. That

1556
01:05:42,719 --> 01:05:44,719
that was really fun and really interesting to see Booker

1557
01:05:44,800 --> 01:05:46,559
evolve in that way. But I don't think Booker even

1558
01:05:46,599 --> 01:05:47,960
likes playing point guard full time.

1559
01:05:48,000 --> 01:05:50,159
Speaker 1: You know, It's like I would agree, But isn't it

1560
01:05:50,199 --> 01:05:51,880
like kind of when I saw I was just making

1561
01:05:51,920 --> 01:05:53,639
fun of the Jaalen Green thing because it just feels

1562
01:05:53,679 --> 01:05:55,800
like semantics to say that Jalen Green is the point

1563
01:05:55,840 --> 01:05:59,920
guard because there are positions like I don't know how

1564
01:06:00,159 --> 01:06:03,159
how much value I ascribed to the actual designations of

1565
01:06:03,199 --> 01:06:04,760
them anymore, but like you're gonna try and tell me

1566
01:06:04,840 --> 01:06:07,559
that you want Jao and Green running the majority of

1567
01:06:07,599 --> 01:06:10,480
your offense over Devin Booker. I just you can't. Like

1568
01:06:10,920 --> 01:06:15,400
it feels like starting hit point. Yeah, fair enough. That's

1569
01:06:15,440 --> 01:06:18,480
why the extension for Devin Booker felt like hush money anyway,

1570
01:06:18,519 --> 01:06:19,920
please carry on? Sorry to throw up.

1571
01:06:20,480 --> 01:06:22,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, I the Glesbie, Like I said, he only

1572
01:06:22,880 --> 01:06:25,159
played kind of like scamp minutes across fifteen games, So

1573
01:06:25,239 --> 01:06:27,960
we're talking like sample size is so small as to

1574
01:06:28,039 --> 01:06:31,440
be random noise basically, But for narrative pushing purposes, I

1575
01:06:31,519 --> 01:06:33,920
am obliged to mention that he was ninety nine percentile

1576
01:06:33,960 --> 01:06:37,119
on synergy as a point per possession in the pick

1577
01:06:37,159 --> 01:06:40,039
and roll as a ball handler. So that's if nothing else,

1578
01:06:40,119 --> 01:06:42,800
in his tiny, tiny opportunities, he made the most of them, right.

1579
01:06:43,280 --> 01:06:45,480
But he's got a pretty quick trigger from outside, which

1580
01:06:45,480 --> 01:06:47,039
you have to be when you're six to one in socks.

1581
01:06:48,199 --> 01:06:51,719
The defense is not good, but it is not complete

1582
01:06:51,800 --> 01:06:54,920
doormat either. He will do those like pesky little guard

1583
01:06:55,039 --> 01:06:57,320
things where he'll be poking out balls from behind. He'll

1584
01:06:57,360 --> 01:06:58,679
kind of be leading with his chest and try to

1585
01:06:58,719 --> 01:07:00,360
pull the chair. He'll be doing all the things that

1586
01:07:00,440 --> 01:07:02,599
at least make the offense have to think and work

1587
01:07:02,639 --> 01:07:04,920
for a half second before the health defense behind him,

1588
01:07:04,960 --> 01:07:07,440
which theoretically might exist in Phoenix next year, we'll see

1589
01:07:07,840 --> 01:07:10,119
can coalesce than something to help him out. So I

1590
01:07:10,199 --> 01:07:11,880
think a ceiling was shown when he had a twenty

1591
01:07:11,920 --> 01:07:16,280
two point ten assist game with both Devin Booker and

1592
01:07:16,480 --> 01:07:18,480
Kevin Grant on the court, and it kind of showed

1593
01:07:18,519 --> 01:07:21,480
like what the absolute best you can do, and that's

1594
01:07:21,519 --> 01:07:22,920
not nothing like I think that a guy who can

1595
01:07:22,960 --> 01:07:24,639
do that when he's on a court with future Hall

1596
01:07:24,639 --> 01:07:27,159
of famers, you know, it's showing the ability to take

1597
01:07:27,159 --> 01:07:29,599
advantage of an opportunity and not to be scared of

1598
01:07:29,639 --> 01:07:31,840
the moment, and I'm excited to see what he could

1599
01:07:31,840 --> 01:07:34,679
do given some real runway next year, hopefully leading the

1600
01:07:34,719 --> 01:07:37,480
backup unit and maybe even playing a little bit with

1601
01:07:37,880 --> 01:07:40,679
Booker and Green if one or the other is sitting.

1602
01:07:40,760 --> 01:07:41,360
So we'll see.

1603
01:07:42,719 --> 01:07:46,519
Speaker 1: If you're the Suns, what do you are targeting more

1604
01:07:46,679 --> 01:07:50,039
in quote unquote point guard based on the makeup of

1605
01:07:50,079 --> 01:07:52,840
your roster, where it's something like Colin de Leusbie's skill set,

1606
01:07:53,000 --> 01:07:55,280
or would you rather have he's six' five but he

1607
01:07:55,320 --> 01:07:58,480
can defend like the other team's point Guard Jordan. Goodwin,

1608
01:07:58,639 --> 01:08:00,320
like what is do you think is more value to

1609
01:08:00,400 --> 01:08:02,960
them when you're considering their like primary lineup.

1610
01:08:03,000 --> 01:08:05,880
Speaker 2: Context, well ideally you'd get. Both it'd be A lonzo

1611
01:08:05,920 --> 01:08:08,679
ball situation right, right, like but that's obviously hard to.

1612
01:08:08,760 --> 01:08:10,760
Find AND i think this team is just not going

1613
01:08:10,800 --> 01:08:13,480
to be a good enough defensive. FORCE i think probably

1614
01:08:13,519 --> 01:08:16,159
to make any noise no matter who's at the point

1615
01:08:16,159 --> 01:08:18,119
of attack for, Them so they really have to lean

1616
01:08:18,199 --> 01:08:19,800
more into the offense if they want to be able

1617
01:08:19,840 --> 01:08:23,279
to realize whatever aspirations of success they, have Which i'm

1618
01:08:23,319 --> 01:08:25,159
not high on The suns, whatsoever BUT i think their

1619
01:08:25,239 --> 01:08:27,159
path to being relevant in The west comes through them

1620
01:08:27,239 --> 01:08:29,840
just being a top five, offense which is hard for

1621
01:08:29,960 --> 01:08:32,000
me to. See but having a point guard who can

1622
01:08:32,159 --> 01:08:34,640
take the pressure Off booker And green knock down every

1623
01:08:34,680 --> 01:08:37,199
three pointer given to, them and also you, know run the,

1624
01:08:37,239 --> 01:08:41,279
offense streamline things is probably more important to them right.

1625
01:08:41,439 --> 01:08:44,119
Now BUT i mean they need a lot of. Things

1626
01:08:44,199 --> 01:08:45,680
let's be On shoenix needs a lot of. Things so.

1627
01:08:47,159 --> 01:08:48,760
Speaker 1: He also he did. WELL i don't know if you

1628
01:08:48,760 --> 01:08:50,319
remember The game Of apology if you already mentioned he

1629
01:08:50,399 --> 01:08:52,079
saved their season at one, point remember that was the.

1630
01:08:52,159 --> 01:08:53,960
NARRATIVE i can't remember who they were playing. On i'm

1631
01:08:54,000 --> 01:08:56,039
SURE i posted about it in the moment where it's,

1632
01:08:56,119 --> 01:08:58,319
like oh, congreless we just say everyone after it was

1633
01:08:58,359 --> 01:09:00,560
like maybe The sons have really turned a Like Congo

1634
01:09:00,600 --> 01:09:02,239
lespie came it and pumped in like whatever was like

1635
01:09:02,279 --> 01:09:05,239
fifteen or seventeen points or. Something so kind of have

1636
01:09:05,359 --> 01:09:08,039
that in him, too and it feels like he's probably

1637
01:09:08,079 --> 01:09:10,000
gonna play LIKE i don't when you're looking at aside

1638
01:09:10,000 --> 01:09:12,720
From green And booker in terms of guards who can

1639
01:09:12,760 --> 01:09:16,399
handle the, BALL i, mean Unless Jared butler shows something in,

1640
01:09:16,520 --> 01:09:18,199
CAMP i don't, know like who else is gonna be

1641
01:09:18,399 --> 01:09:20,720
or like you're not Putting Dylan brooks Or Grayson allen

1642
01:09:20,800 --> 01:09:21,319
in that type of.

1643
01:09:21,399 --> 01:09:25,000
Speaker 2: Role, Yeah AND i do think that he has the

1644
01:09:25,119 --> 01:09:28,239
kind of like feistiness that coaches like that, bring you,

1645
01:09:28,319 --> 01:09:31,079
know the, energy the energy LIKE i mentioned McConnell, Before

1646
01:09:31,119 --> 01:09:32,640
AND i think this is where the comparison, is like

1647
01:09:32,720 --> 01:09:35,000
he unless he doesn't have Like Tyas's, jones like mid

1648
01:09:35,119 --> 01:09:37,359
range craft his for some, reason it's no floater. Game

1649
01:09:37,600 --> 01:09:39,920
he prefers take these like eight foot pull ups instead

1650
01:09:39,920 --> 01:09:42,000
of just like a one handed, floater and he cannot

1651
01:09:42,000 --> 01:09:43,359
get to the rim at. All that's not gonna be

1652
01:09:43,359 --> 01:09:46,039
as necessary on a team that, has you, know the

1653
01:09:46,439 --> 01:09:51,840
two stars at guard. Already BUT i completely lost the

1654
01:09:51,880 --> 01:09:54,520
threat of what your question. Was i'm SORRY i got. Distracted,

1655
01:09:54,760 --> 01:09:55,119
oh just.

1656
01:09:55,159 --> 01:09:56,800
Speaker 1: That he's it feels like he's in when you're just

1657
01:09:56,880 --> 01:09:59,560
kind of looking at After green And, booker like who

1658
01:09:59,600 --> 01:10:02,000
else are you gonna trust to generate any type of

1659
01:10:02,079 --> 01:10:04,720
offense for themselves or, brothers like he's their best ball.

1660
01:10:04,760 --> 01:10:06,920
Handle so unless you think That Jared butler is gonna

1661
01:10:06,920 --> 01:10:08,560
pop in camp or that you want to See Dylan

1662
01:10:08,600 --> 01:10:09,880
brooks are grace now and in that. Role AND i

1663
01:10:09,920 --> 01:10:11,479
think we all. Know the answer that question is, no

1664
01:10:12,159 --> 01:10:14,159
it don't feel like he's in line unless they change

1665
01:10:14,199 --> 01:10:17,159
something about their backcourt personnel in line for a pretty

1666
01:10:17,199 --> 01:10:18,680
big role this, year which is WHAT i think makes

1667
01:10:18,720 --> 01:10:19,479
it's a really good. PICK.

1668
01:10:19,920 --> 01:10:21,920
Speaker 2: Yep that's why this is when we, say you, know

1669
01:10:22,000 --> 01:10:24,800
this is titled breakouts or hidden gym, breakouts, right and,

1670
01:10:24,920 --> 01:10:26,319
like these are guys who are gonna need a lot

1671
01:10:26,359 --> 01:10:28,199
to go right for them to fulfill. That but we're

1672
01:10:28,239 --> 01:10:30,039
not tying breakouts like these guys are becoming all. Stars

1673
01:10:30,079 --> 01:10:31,800
we're not even tying breakouts in some, cases like these

1674
01:10:31,840 --> 01:10:35,000
guys are going to become starters like breakouts for most

1675
01:10:35,119 --> 01:10:38,479
of the league is going from FRINGE nba player to

1676
01:10:38,680 --> 01:10:41,399
SOLID nba. Player that's what most of the players are

1677
01:10:41,439 --> 01:10:43,439
trying to. Do that is a breakout for, them and

1678
01:10:43,600 --> 01:10:44,359
it should be for us.

1679
01:10:44,399 --> 01:10:49,359
Speaker 1: Too my final pick in our final player actually kind

1680
01:10:49,399 --> 01:10:51,479
of like. Bookend we're bookending this nicely to where it

1681
01:10:51,560 --> 01:10:53,319
might be too high profile at this point with the

1682
01:10:53,359 --> 01:10:56,319
way that he also played In Summer. LEAGUE i will

1683
01:10:56,359 --> 01:10:58,560
never FORGET i had to do a redraft of the

1684
01:10:58,560 --> 01:11:02,279
twenty twenty four draft a month after the season. STARTED

1685
01:11:02,319 --> 01:11:04,319
i believe maybe it was two MONTHS i had Aj

1686
01:11:04,439 --> 01:11:06,920
mitchell going in the lottery and people were just so.

1687
01:11:07,199 --> 01:11:10,680
Mad this dude can just, Play And i'm convinced like

1688
01:11:10,760 --> 01:11:13,239
he might be the player who single handedly helps keep

1689
01:11:13,279 --> 01:11:16,479
their big three together longer than people. Anticipate because he's

1690
01:11:16,520 --> 01:11:18,600
on a cheap deal, now the role he's gonna have

1691
01:11:18,720 --> 01:11:21,079
is gonna continue to repress his price, tag kind of

1692
01:11:21,159 --> 01:11:24,479
like A Kenrich williams. Situation he defends with just an

1693
01:11:24,520 --> 01:11:27,399
intensity that is incredible for someone at six to. THREE

1694
01:11:27,479 --> 01:11:29,199
i like the way he navigates the, floor whether he's

1695
01:11:29,199 --> 01:11:31,079
trying to fight screens or if he's defending away from the.

1696
01:11:31,159 --> 01:11:33,720
Ball can provide some help when you're looking at him on.

1697
01:11:33,800 --> 01:11:36,279
OFFENSE i think he showed a lot more self creation

1698
01:11:36,439 --> 01:11:39,039
and playmaking And Summer league that's SOMETHING i don't know

1699
01:11:39,159 --> 01:11:41,319
how much Okay se is gonna tap into when you

1700
01:11:41,399 --> 01:11:43,880
look at like the scope of their team right. Now

1701
01:11:44,279 --> 01:11:46,359
but he also just like he moves really well without the.

1702
01:11:46,439 --> 01:11:48,920
Ball he can probably hit just enough of his threes

1703
01:11:49,239 --> 01:11:50,920
can be a little mid range heavy for, me but

1704
01:11:51,000 --> 01:11:54,079
the fact that he's comfortable getting to those. Spots this

1705
01:11:54,279 --> 01:11:56,840
is just like the fact that the thunder have him

1706
01:11:57,119 --> 01:11:59,560
And Cason wallace And Jaylen williams And shade like this

1707
01:11:59,680 --> 01:12:01,960
is just Like Blue dor like their depth of just

1708
01:12:02,439 --> 01:12:06,399
guys who are too small to be considered. Wings, basically

1709
01:12:06,479 --> 01:12:09,000
it's just even THOUGH i Know Jay dubb's wing, whatever

1710
01:12:09,680 --> 01:12:13,560
it's it's just insane to. Me like it's just absolutely,

1711
01:12:13,600 --> 01:12:16,960
insane AND I i would bet on any OTHER nba,

1712
01:12:17,079 --> 01:12:20,439
Team like he's probably just in the top seven of

1713
01:12:20,520 --> 01:12:22,119
the rotation right. Now maybe. NOT i don't want to

1714
01:12:22,119 --> 01:12:24,399
get Matt eshbi and say twenty nine other teams would start,

1715
01:12:24,479 --> 01:12:26,880
him BUT i think maybe in half the, league like

1716
01:12:26,920 --> 01:12:28,960
he'd be worth like one of your top seven or

1717
01:12:29,000 --> 01:12:30,359
eight rotation spots pretty.

1718
01:12:30,359 --> 01:12:33,880
Speaker 2: Clearly, yeah he's another guy WHO i think came in

1719
01:12:34,279 --> 01:12:37,199
really early and just knew how to thrive in his

1720
01:12:37,319 --> 01:12:41,079
SUPPORTING nba, role which is pretty rare for. Rookies But

1721
01:12:41,399 --> 01:12:43,039
mitchell comes in and like you said my notes On

1722
01:12:43,119 --> 01:12:46,159
mitchell early in the, year like this guy's pretty good at. Everything,

1723
01:12:46,439 --> 01:12:48,239
no no more, notes that's. It that was. It like

1724
01:12:48,600 --> 01:12:50,319
whatever you want to say AN nba player at his

1725
01:12:50,399 --> 01:12:51,800
size and positions should be able to, do he can

1726
01:12:51,840 --> 01:12:53,800
do pretty. Well that's.

1727
01:12:53,880 --> 01:12:56,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, sorry go, AHEAD i thought you PAUSED i thought

1728
01:12:56,960 --> 01:12:59,239
you were just just, done and when, no please go.

1729
01:12:59,359 --> 01:13:01,760
Speaker 2: ON i really don't have too much more in. That

1730
01:13:01,840 --> 01:13:04,600
it's Like mitchell's. Cheap he's. Good he's good at almost.

1731
01:13:04,640 --> 01:13:06,760
Everything he will be able to fill in for whatever

1732
01:13:06,840 --> 01:13:09,720
gaps the thunderneed from their back, court which might not

1733
01:13:10,039 --> 01:13:12,119
be anything next. YEAR i almost wonder if to your,

1734
01:13:12,159 --> 01:13:15,680
Point mitchell isn't a better candidate for this next year

1735
01:13:16,000 --> 01:13:18,239
or in two. SEASONS i, suppose because next year there's

1736
01:13:18,239 --> 01:13:21,159
still going to be so many, incumbent bigger names on

1737
01:13:21,199 --> 01:13:22,920
the roster than. Him but that, said like he still

1738
01:13:23,000 --> 01:13:24,640
was able to scrounge out a couple of minutes even

1739
01:13:24,680 --> 01:13:26,600
in the, playoffs even after coming back from a long injury.

1740
01:13:26,640 --> 01:13:29,640
Absence we know Coach dagnold's going to play pretty much

1741
01:13:29,640 --> 01:13:32,279
his whole roster a few minutes to, night, right like

1742
01:13:32,319 --> 01:13:36,199
he is a pretty generous minutes distributor towards the end

1743
01:13:36,239 --> 01:13:38,960
of the. Bench SO i Like mitchell a lot as a.

1744
01:13:38,960 --> 01:13:41,880
PLAYER i don't know exactly what his long term role

1745
01:13:42,079 --> 01:13:44,720
is right. Now he's almost so amorphous it's hard for

1746
01:13:44,800 --> 01:13:48,039
me to see, where like what his final shape will look,

1747
01:13:48,119 --> 01:13:50,600
like if that makes. Sense BUT i think he can

1748
01:13:50,720 --> 01:13:52,079
be a lot of Different he can wear a lot

1749
01:13:52,079 --> 01:13:52,840
of different hats and that's.

1750
01:13:52,880 --> 01:13:56,199
Speaker 1: HELPFUL i also don't. KNOW i know he's a bigger,

1751
01:13:56,239 --> 01:13:59,359
player but like, Now nicole A topitch is presumably going

1752
01:13:59,399 --> 01:14:01,039
to be in the, fold and so did Aj. Mitchell

1753
01:14:01,079 --> 01:14:03,000
did we already see or at least looking through the

1754
01:14:03,039 --> 01:14:05,520
lens of next, season do you already see Aj mitchell's

1755
01:14:05,560 --> 01:14:07,760
role kind of tap out when the thunder we're dealing

1756
01:14:07,760 --> 01:14:09,279
with injuries at the beginning of last. YEAR i, mean

1757
01:14:09,319 --> 01:14:11,479
even playing as many minutes as he did on a

1758
01:14:11,600 --> 01:14:14,800
title favorite as a rookie that was on a two way,

1759
01:14:14,840 --> 01:14:18,159
contract that was more than just oh injury disaster kind

1760
01:14:18,199 --> 01:14:21,439
of struck. Them So i'm curious to see how that,

1761
01:14:21,640 --> 01:14:23,880
impacts like when they get when it gets down to

1762
01:14:23,960 --> 01:14:26,039
like a normal rotation in the regular season and guys

1763
01:14:26,039 --> 01:14:28,159
aren't injured or don't have a night. Off i'm curiously

1764
01:14:28,239 --> 01:14:31,239
where he factors, in because they do have more equity

1765
01:14:31,319 --> 01:14:34,520
and theory invested In Nicola topics than they would Aj.

1766
01:14:34,720 --> 01:14:36,920
Mitchell BUT i think Aj mitchell is going to be

1767
01:14:37,039 --> 01:14:38,800
way better at filling the defensive, gaps and it is

1768
01:14:38,800 --> 01:14:41,039
probably just the he's the better off ball offensive. PLAYER

1769
01:14:41,039 --> 01:14:42,720
i think it was a thirty seven percent on his

1770
01:14:42,760 --> 01:14:45,359
above the break cripples last. Year and even like his mid,

1771
01:14:45,439 --> 01:14:47,199
rangers they do tend to come in within the flow

1772
01:14:47,239 --> 01:14:47,840
of the offense.

1773
01:14:47,920 --> 01:14:50,199
Speaker 2: Too, YEAH i, mean do you Think presty's somebody who

1774
01:14:50,680 --> 01:14:53,199
and Dang ark somebody who really cares about like your

1775
01:14:53,399 --> 01:14:55,239
pedigree up to this point, though you, know LIKE i

1776
01:14:55,520 --> 01:14:56,680
hear all the things just SAYING i, agree BUT i

1777
01:14:56,680 --> 01:14:59,119
almost feel like they are very much a what can

1778
01:14:59,159 --> 01:15:00,600
you do for me right now? Now because we're trying

1779
01:15:00,600 --> 01:15:02,600
to win championship right now, Organization, LIKE i don't think

1780
01:15:02,600 --> 01:15:04,880
that too much we'll get a special treatment. NECESSARILY i

1781
01:15:05,000 --> 01:15:07,199
think that If mitchell comes out and he's playing the,

1782
01:15:07,199 --> 01:15:08,520
best he's the guy who's gonna get the most.

1783
01:15:08,520 --> 01:15:13,000
Speaker 1: Minutes that's probably. Fair, uh there's just so many guys

1784
01:15:13,239 --> 01:15:13,399
on that.

1785
01:15:13,600 --> 01:15:16,399
Speaker 2: Game they're so it's crazy to. THINK i will tell

1786
01:15:16,439 --> 01:15:19,039
you that my, deepest darkest fear as AN nba writer

1787
01:15:19,239 --> 01:15:21,560
is we're about to enter this golden era of thunder.

1788
01:15:21,600 --> 01:15:24,039
Basketball not BECAUSE i have any dislike towards thunder, basketball

1789
01:15:24,079 --> 01:15:27,199
BUT i remember the narratives when it was Like warriors

1790
01:15:27,439 --> 01:15:31,039
and And cavaliers and the files every single. Year AND

1791
01:15:31,159 --> 01:15:33,640
i wasn't necessarily writing about basketball back, then not like,

1792
01:15:33,760 --> 01:15:36,720
this but it was just like that sense of inevitability

1793
01:15:36,800 --> 01:15:38,920
doesn't matter as much to people who are watching basketball

1794
01:15:39,039 --> 01:15:40,960
just for the love of the, game but it matters

1795
01:15:41,119 --> 01:15:44,119
so much for the discourse around the season and what

1796
01:15:44,319 --> 01:15:46,159
like the average fan who turns in to watch a,

1797
01:15:46,199 --> 01:15:48,239
game you, know THE tnt game once a, week is

1798
01:15:49,039 --> 01:15:51,720
Watching AND i just think, that, like if we're gonna

1799
01:15:51,840 --> 01:15:54,399
enter a period where The thunder win three of the

1800
01:15:54,439 --> 01:15:58,479
next four, championships it's gonna be tough for THOSE i

1801
01:15:58,520 --> 01:16:00,239
think it's gonna be tough to come up with like

1802
01:16:00,399 --> 01:16:03,279
interesting storylines throughout the year. Basically so that's my kind

1803
01:16:03,319 --> 01:16:05,319
of like What i'm most worried. About And i'm worried

1804
01:16:05,359 --> 01:16:07,800
that mitchull will be a contributor to my downfall as

1805
01:16:07,800 --> 01:16:08,199
AN nba.

1806
01:16:08,279 --> 01:16:10,800
Speaker 1: WRITER i, MEAN i guess that's a good, Point but

1807
01:16:10,920 --> 01:16:12,520
it seems like we're still set up to have like

1808
01:16:12,600 --> 01:16:15,000
some real mystery going on in The Eastern conference for

1809
01:16:15,119 --> 01:16:17,600
years to, come just because The knicks aren't really, young

1810
01:16:17,720 --> 01:16:20,000
The cows aren't super, young and they're getting, expensive so

1811
01:16:20,560 --> 01:16:23,119
and who knows how The celtics rebuild. Themselves you could

1812
01:16:23,159 --> 01:16:27,000
become an Exclusively eastern CONFERENCE nba. Writer isn't that? Exciting

1813
01:16:28,319 --> 01:16:29,039
that's what we all dream?

1814
01:16:29,079 --> 01:16:30,560
Speaker 2: About More Chicago bulls. Content?

1815
01:16:30,640 --> 01:16:34,720
Speaker 1: Please oh, god, no please, No, mike this was really.

1816
01:16:34,800 --> 01:16:37,920
GREAT i appreciate the. Stuff your content is. Amazing this

1817
01:16:38,039 --> 01:16:40,359
was amazing to finally get to talk to. You are

1818
01:16:40,359 --> 01:16:42,119
you able just to tell our listeners where they could

1819
01:16:42,119 --> 01:16:44,279
find you at all the fantastic work that you.

1820
01:16:44,359 --> 01:16:47,159
Speaker 2: Do, Yeah So i'm kind of all over the. Place

1821
01:16:47,239 --> 01:16:49,720
you can find some of my stuff at Hoopsipe Center,

1822
01:16:49,840 --> 01:16:51,920
hub a few other. PLACES i. Think the main, one,

1823
01:16:51,960 --> 01:16:53,800
THOUGH i want you to focus, on, please is basketball,

1824
01:16:53,800 --> 01:16:55,680
Poetry so check that. OUT i write two to three

1825
01:16:55,720 --> 01:16:58,720
times a week. There i'm also at Bee ball's poetry

1826
01:16:58,800 --> 01:17:01,199
On twitter basketball, poetry it turns out is one character

1827
01:17:01,279 --> 01:17:04,439
too long for A x, Handle so At beeba is,

1828
01:17:04,520 --> 01:17:09,119
poetry and At nascal poetry blues. Guys so, Yep i'll

1829
01:17:09,159 --> 01:17:12,560
just keep saying those words until it subliminally entices people

1830
01:17:12,600 --> 01:17:14,560
to go online and google me and go from.

1831
01:17:14,600 --> 01:17:17,039
Speaker 1: There, well the links are in the YouTube and podcast

1832
01:17:17,079 --> 01:17:19,039
you bet as, well so you can find him that.

1833
01:17:19,159 --> 01:17:21,119
Way and the work he puts out is incredibly in.

1834
01:17:21,239 --> 01:17:23,279
Depth so once again this was. Great thank you for

1835
01:17:23,359 --> 01:17:25,079
giving me so much of your time doing just eighty

1836
01:17:25,119 --> 01:17:27,039
minutes on this exercise was a blast to get to

1837
01:17:27,600 --> 01:17:29,880
chop it up with you and rest a. SHORT i

1838
01:17:29,920 --> 01:17:33,079
will be pestering you again down the, line so until next.

1839
01:17:33,159 --> 01:17:34,680
Time it as, always we moved to shout out to the,

1840
01:17:34,720 --> 01:17:37,399
one the, only the, indelible the real hitting gem where

1841
01:17:37,399 --> 01:17:39,279
we couldn't pick him because he hasn't signed His MAX

1842
01:17:39,439 --> 01:17:43,479
nba contract just, yet Mister Frank HeLa kina