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It allows me to basically put out an episode every

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putting out two even three a day, and yeah, can't

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Speaker 2: Thank you. I want to.

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Speaker 1: Welcome everyone back to the Pekingona Show. All right, got

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a little panel going here. Ron Dodson's back. Seems like

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we haven't talked to each other in two weeks.

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Speaker 2: How you do it?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm doing great, Pete, thanks for having me.

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Speaker 1: And for the first time on the show, Fesmo Dad,

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How are you doing, sir?

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Speaker 4: Very well? Thank you so much for inviting me pleasure

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to be with you.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, no problem, no problem. Ron, You've given your You've

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given your rundown on who you are. Why don't you

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tell everybody a little bit about yourself?

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Speaker 4: Sure? I'm a Middle East and geopolitical risk analyst. I

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try to help clients understand the commercial impact of geopolitical

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change and what it means for them doing business, and

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this has led me down a bunch of interesting pathways

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as I've had to learn about religion, culture, human nature

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and came to certain conclusions which maybe we can touch

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on during this conversation.

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Speaker 1: Sure, all right, well, wow, there's a lot of places

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we can go, and I have a feeling we're going

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to be here for a little while. But Ron, what's

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on your mind? Why don't you start us off?

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Speaker 3: Oh gosh, okay, Well, I just have to say I

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I get to be guests on some really cool podcasts,

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but I am super excited about this one. The interview

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that Ferris did a month six weeks ago that made

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the rounds on YouTube was utterly fantastic long form deal.

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So I found his thought cogent and willing to step

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outside of what you normally hear in. You know, I

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am a what amounts to a risk are portfolio manager.

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I have a hedge fund and a family office, and

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so we traffic in a lot of the same kind

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of ideas is assessing geopolitical risk. But I was very

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impressed at his ability to not just stay in that

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very narrowly defined lane like when you read the guys

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from you know, Goldman or whatever, and those are all

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smart people. But I was very impressed. So I'm excited

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about this. I I've got a peace coming out in

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Claremont's American mind about the Realist. I don't know when

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this will drop, when this when this UH stream will draw? Okay,

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so on, it should release on Monday or Tuesday in

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the American mind, and I'm going to be making the

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UH the realist case against attacking Iran and uh, I'm

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so my what's on my mind is is realism making

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a comeback. I was very encouraged to see Michael Anton,

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another Claremont guy uh Get placed on the technical side

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of the negotiations with Iran. He comes from a Straussian

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but a realist bent on the Straussian school, So i'm

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i'm I'm very interested to hear what Ferros has to

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say about along those lines and just shoot, we've got

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a lot to This can go a million different directions.

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I love what he had to say about his Christian

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faith and that's a very important thing to me. So

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there's a lot of stuff to talk about today.

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Speaker 4: That's a very very kind introduction, Ron I really appreciate it.

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Thank you. On Iran, I think what's happening now is

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that the Islamic Revolution has failed and there is no

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need to end it militarily because the consequences of that

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are going to be quite severe. So let's sort of

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unpack that a little bit. The whole project of Romaine

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and Ramene, the leaders of the Islamic Revolution, was to

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export that revolution to the rest of them at least

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and Ramene, over the last thirty years forty years of

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his reign, has had a great amount of success in that.

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As President and then as Supreme Leader, he helped establish

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and set up Hazmala and strengthen it quite significantly. The

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American invasion of Iraq paved the way for Iran to

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expand into Iraq itself, and the civil war in Syria

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gave the Iranians a very important say in that country.

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And then after seven October and the subsequent wars with Israel,

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this all came crashing down. Hezballah was decapitated and severely weakened.

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It underperformed militarily very badly, in part because it didn't

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listen to its own military command. The military command of

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Hesbadah had said, don't go into a war of attrition

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with Israel. If you're going to go into a war,

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throw it all in, go quite extreme from the outset,

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and then try to get a ceasefire. Instead. Hesbadah played

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this cat and mouse game with Israel along the border,

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and a year later it was more or less defeated

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and it signed a ceasefire that is indistinguishable from surrender.

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Speaker 3: Pharaoso want to ask you a quick question. Let me

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ask you a quick question on this. Do you see

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the Iranian what amounts to in Western terms Iranian Trotsky Trotsky?

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You know a Trotsky type of of of of missionizing. Uh,

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what their their project? Is do you see it as

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chiefly a Persian project or a Shia project.

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Speaker 4: Both, and I think that the two are inseparable. The

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distinguishing feature of IDUN was that it tried to make

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itself into a pan Islamic power. So the emphasis on

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opposition to the United States and Israel, which went against

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the Shah's policy of alliance with the US and Israel,

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was partly intended to position Iran as a pan Islamist

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power rather than a Shia only power. And so if

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you look at Romani, he was highly influenced by saying

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it Putub say it. Kutub is one of the main

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ideologues of the Muslim brotherhood, and he's the guy who

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really introduced the violent element into brotherhood, thinking with his

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declaration that the entirety of Muslim society was now the

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facto apostate. Hence the importance to re Islamize societies and

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bring and through that re Islamization process, raise the importance

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of Muslims globally and make them into a global geopolitical

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player as opposed to a theater for the competition of

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other great powers, which had been the case starting with

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the decline of the Ottoman Empire in the late seventeen hundreds.

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So this was a reaction to their own decline. They

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looked at themselves said, Okay, clearly we're not practicing Islam correctly.

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Otherwise God would be with us and would not be

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allowing us to get humiliated. The answer is to reform ourselves.

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And Romiani was influenced by this idea, hence the importance

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of imposing Islam and society. So you had this revolutionary

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project and this missionary export of Islam to the rest

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of the world, and particularly the export of militant Islam

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to already Muslim societies, rather the export of militant Islam

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to already Muslim societies with the aim of strengthening them

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in a geopolitical framework. With the fall of with the

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defeat of Hezbealah, things were still acceptable. But with a

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fall of Syria that meant that the Islamic Revolution had

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really been defeated in its project of confronting Israel. Now

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the challenge is that if they make a deal with

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the Americans, it's a double humiliation, because the whole idea

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of the Islamic Revolution was to confront America and Israel.

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You've lost the war against Israel and you're making deals

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with the Americans. Why is there a revolution and why

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is there a revolutionary regime that is quite burdensome on

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the Iranians themselves, and that's had some important economic successes,

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but people are suffering because of the inflation. And this

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is what they're focusing on the effect of sanctions and

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geopolitical weakness on the currency and how that affects day

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to day life, because the average man on the street

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is at the end of the day prioritizing his family

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first and his own standard of living. So this is

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the challenge facing Iran. If they make a deal, it

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discredits them. If they don't make a deal, it could

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break them because of inflation and unrest and because of

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a potential military strike.

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Speaker 1: So, in a way, can I interrupt you for a second.

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It seems like if the more and I'm using this

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term very loose secular would be pushing back against the

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the the religious and they get in bed with the U,

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it seems like they would have to get in bed

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with a foreign possibly with a foreign power, in order

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to defeat these to defeat the radicals, does that mean

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they become just another you know, proxy of the of

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the West or the United States.

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Speaker 4: Look, the big threat for the Uranians now is the

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Turks and the Pakistanis.

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Speaker 3: So this is where I wanted to This is where

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exactly where I wanted to go on. This was the

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the I don't know if you saw a foreign was it.

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The Foreign Minister of Pakistan just yesterday, very revealing in

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an interview, said hey, look, we've been doing all this

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stuff for the US obviously through US A I D.

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That gets cut off and now they're like, well, I

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guess those aren't our bosses anymore. We're going to go

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I'll see if I can find the clip, put it

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in the show notes. But uh uh, it was quite revealing.

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It wasn't typical. Uh it wasn't your typical you know,

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slide of hand kind of talk.

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Speaker 4: You had the same with the Saudis several years ago

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when the Foreign Minister at the time said, look, we

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supported that she had these in a Finistan together and

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we were fully partners in the export of she had

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because this is what the Americas wanted us to do.

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And now you're criticizing us for wanting to change.

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Speaker 3: So what do you what do you see as the

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what's the chief dynamic between uh Artawan and and and Iran.

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Right now, how is it? Does Erdawan still have a

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view of of having this basically you know uh visions

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of former at a Turk grandeur or what what do you?

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What do you what do you see going on there?

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Speaker 4: He's the antithesis of Attitude because Attitude tried to make

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Turkey into a nationalist country and to end their relationship

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between Turkey and Islam, and this led to a series

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of coups by the Turkish military against the encroachment of Islamists.

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The last one was in nineteen ninety seven. And then

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Abdogan takes power in I think two thousand and one,

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and he slowly dismantles the military deep state and these

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secularizes Turkey the facto, even if not the jude He

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hasn't been able to reinvent a political system in the

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same way that Romaine was and to create a fully

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new Islamic constitution.

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Speaker 3: But I was just going to say so, it's a

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very are they on similar track with Egypt, although Egypt

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seems very dependent upon the US foreign aid But no.

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Speaker 4: Egypt has a big fight against the Muslim brotherhood, Whereasin

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is the region's main sponsor of the Muslim Brotherhood in

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partnership with kata.

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Speaker 3: I, didn't realize the Muslim Brotherhood is weakening in Egypt.

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So it's not that it's weakening, it's.

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Speaker 4: That they've locked everybody up who dares think and express

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views supportive of the Muslim Brotherhood. It's just that they've

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re established the tatalitarian police state that tolerates absolutely no

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dissent and no disagreement. But for the Turks, their project

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is to become the leading state of the Muslim world

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and to lead the Muslims of Central Asia, the Caucuses,

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the Balkans, the Middle East and Africa in order to

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become a global power. The big problem that Turkey faces

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is an economic one. Their current account deficit is constantly

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too big. With Iran being weakened and the US looking

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to the possibility of leaving the region, there is a solution,

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which is for the Turks to annex Kirkuk and Northern Syria.

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Kirkuk in Iraq and Northern Syria because already Iraqi KRG

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the Iraqi couldn't The stand region is a Turkish dependency

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more or less mm HM, and so by controlling the

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energy resources of Kirkuk, and the Turks have the technical

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know how to develop that oil and expand its production

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very dramatically. The Turks would no longer be reliant on

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Iran and Russia for energy, which is where they currently are,

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and they would plug their current account deficit and they'd

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be able to stabilize their economy. The agriculture is Russia.

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Speaker 3: Is Russia getting pushed out.

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Speaker 4: Russia made a deal to get rid of Asset. That's

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my read of the situation. My read of the situation

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is that there was a Russian, Turkish Israeli deal to

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get rid of ASAD and figure out some kind of

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new delineation post Ascent. The precise diminies of that clear.

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Speaker 3: Yet, Yeah, are they going to keep that deep water

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port on the mad is my question.

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Speaker 4: There. It's a very vulnerable location right now, given how

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he has changed. And yet despite the intensity of Russian

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air force strikes against the Syrian opposition that she had,

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these who are now ruling Syria, they haven't touched the Russians.

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And the only explanation is that the Turk said, don't

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you dare mm hmm, which is why I'm of the

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view that there was a deal Remember, Turkey and Russia

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are partnering in Africa. We're working together to kick out

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the French and to kick out the Americans and to

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sort of generally expound that into their sphere of influence, right,

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and which puts them with Turkey.

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Speaker 3: Well, and this puts them in, this puts them butt

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up against uh, the Chinese expansionary UH movement moves in

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Africa as well, which is one of the areas I

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wanted to talk about today.

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Speaker 2: So since we're.

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Speaker 3: Because I find that I find where American interests are

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exactly in that is hard for me.

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Speaker 4: To know.

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Speaker 3: Uh, you know, we used to be a little more involved,

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not me personally, uh my, let's call it expertises moreover

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in the in the Pacific Rim, but but in in

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Africa where exactly the levers are currently because I do

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see Russia wanting to be involved there. I know Turkey

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has moved on the basis on the the east, on

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the eastern side to try to exert influence. But where

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they're coming up against, you know, what China is trying

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to do and get done.

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Speaker 4: Look, I don't know enough about Africa to say, but

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what I do know is that the area where the

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Turks and the Russians are cooperating. Is the sort of

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Sahel region and is the Sahara region. So they're not

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yet in a situation where they're directly butting heads with

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the Chinese because a lot of the Chinese interests are

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in the Congo are in South Africa, are basically further

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south in the Africa.

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Speaker 3: Yeah right, they're looking for.

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Speaker 4: The minerals, minerals exactly exactly, so so far there isn't

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a conflict there so far. But I think it's worth

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recalling that China and Russia are natural rivals, and its

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own extremist liberalism, with its obsession with both countries, that

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drove them together into an alliance, going against any sort

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of common sense, which would have always said, don't let

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the biggest industrial powerhouse enter into a full alliance with

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the biggest natural resource powerhouse because the consequences of that

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kind of alliance dominating the Eurasian land mass are going

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to be extreme. For a maritime power like the United States,

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this is elementry, except that everybody from Clinton through Biden

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completely didn't see it that way. First, they opened the

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door to China and they kept on harassing Russia in

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areas where I mean, if you remember the Balkan conflict

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and the conflict over Bosnia Hesbabah. Every few months when

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one of their big leaders gets killed by Israel, they

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then revealed that this guy was actually a commander in

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Bosnia as well, and that he was fighting in Bosnia

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against the Russians with the US Air Force overhead. So

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the way that the United States has sort of used

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radical Islam extremely cynically has been very destructive, while at

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the same time backing Israel to the hilt and opening

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the doors to migration. This is just suicidal policy making.

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This is just stupid, and it's not even stupid, it's

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malicious because there comes a point where you stop thinking

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that these are mistakes and you start assuming that these

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guys are genuinely doing something destructive because they believe it

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benefits them and it enhances their power against everybody else,

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particularly their own citizens.

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Speaker 3: M So this is where we.

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Speaker 4: Are right now. And you know, striking Ian means that

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Turkey becomes stronger, means that Pakistan becomes stronger, means that

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China becomes stronger. And I don't see how that's in

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the West's interests.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't I don't either. I uh, I'm I

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make the point. I am a peace coming out next

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week trying to make the the realist point against striking Iran,

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and I would go so far as you know, I

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think mad tends to work, so I would. I would

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almost you know, John Marsheimer makes the argument, I think

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pretty cogently that that you need a three legged stool

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for long terms to in that area, in that part

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of the world. But I have you know, do I

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think this just happened? Yeah?

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Speaker 1: Is this just left over? Is this just leftover Cold

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War thinking? Because when you look at Russia becoming allied

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with China, it almost seems like, okay, well, the one

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thing they didn't want is Russia to become allied with

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Europe and especially Germany. That's the one thing they don't want.

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They don't want Russia in Germany to be allies. So

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if they're still stuck in Cold War thinking and they're

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still fighting the Cold War essentially, and the reason they

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want to go after Iran is well, because you know

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the ties to Russia, it just seems like this is

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just antiquated thinking. There's you have a bunch of people

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there who are still fighting a war that ended forty

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years ago, and they don't see what the bigger picture

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is when you have all this threat where everything should

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be concentrated in the Pacific right now.

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Speaker 4: Look, I think there's an element of that. The obsession

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of Iran is driven by Iran's own obsession with Israel.

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And there is something that has to be said about Iran,

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which is that it's the only country in the world

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where in the constitution it says we must continue that

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she had until the word of Allah governs all of

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the world, and that sets up an institution to pursue

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that she had, and that's the Islamic Revolution Guard Core.

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So Iran is unusual in that respect. I mean, we

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know that she had this mandatory for Muslims against unbelievers.

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We know that that is sort of part and parcel

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of Islam, but it's the only Muslim state that actually

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codifies it and sets up an institution to do so,

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and that institution gets to decide its own funding and

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to be prioritized above all others. So there is something

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exceptional about Iran. But at the same time, I suspect

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that if Iran was obsessed with Mianma rather than with Israel,

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there will be a lot less attention given to Iran.

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Speaker 3: I tend to agree with you.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah. US policymakers are quite blinkered in one sense.

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They're blinkered in their obsession with Russia. Even though Putin

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is within the Russian spectrum, a liberal leaning leader, he's

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not one of the hardliners by any means. And yet

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they're absolutely obsessed with weakening Russia and pursuing Russian influence everywhere.

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And so they go crazy supportive Azerbaijan against Armenia, even

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when there's a genuine ethnic cleansing of the Armenians in

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areas that have always been Armenian.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, it's terrible.

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Speaker 4: Uh, and so they completely decide to American policymakers could

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decide to completely ignore that. You know, they commemorate the

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Armenian genocide of one hundred years ago, but the ongoing

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ethnic cleansing of Armenians they completely ignore. Okay, that seems

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stupid with Idan. Yes, it's a dangerous regime that's been

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exporting instability, but it's also a reaction to the fact

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that Israel is an expansionist state that is incapable of

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living in peace with the Palestinians. And the Palestinians are

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incapable of living in peace with the Jews. So there

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is this reality to how messed up and interlocked this

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conflict is. And this was one of the reasons that

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brought me to Christianity. You can't look at this conflict

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long enough and not see the role of religion in it.

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And you can't look at the pointy headed nerds that

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insist that there is going to be a two state

380
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solution and that solves everything and ignore that actually, because

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of the way that religious Zionism works and the way

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00:26:31,960 --> 00:26:34,759
that Islam works, it's impossible for there to be a

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two state solution. The contested areas are the holiest areas Hebron,

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where Abraham and the patriarchs are buried, Jerusalem, the city

385
00:26:46,359 --> 00:26:50,599
that started it all, the West Bank, which is full

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00:26:50,759 --> 00:26:53,799
of a million and one holy places to the Jews

387
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and to the Muslims and to the Christians. And so

388
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saying that no, you're just going to draw a line

389
00:27:00,079 --> 00:27:04,680
and hand it over to your religious enemies is impossible.

390
00:27:06,559 --> 00:27:17,000
So we look at these conflicts with a very incorrect, unrealistic,

391
00:27:17,359 --> 00:27:23,000
tragedy free lens that's very materialistic and says you're just

392
00:27:23,039 --> 00:27:26,000
gonna divide the land, you know, give them the holy

393
00:27:26,039 --> 00:27:29,160
parts of Jerusalem, and then we'll call a new area Jerusalem.

394
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And that'd be a way to get a two state solution,

395
00:27:32,599 --> 00:27:35,240
which is what Badak sort of proposed data fat in

396
00:27:35,960 --> 00:27:41,400
in the Wye River negotiations. Are you crazy? I mean, really,

397
00:27:42,880 --> 00:27:45,599
the only solution to this is religious conversion. So I

398
00:27:45,640 --> 00:27:50,640
thought i'd at least start with myself. You know, this

399
00:27:50,759 --> 00:27:53,279
is the reality of the conflict in the Middle least,

400
00:27:54,599 --> 00:28:00,599
and appreciating that reality should inform our thing thinking about

401
00:28:00,680 --> 00:28:06,480
everything else. And well, it makes us thank God that

402
00:28:06,599 --> 00:28:11,319
there's a Russian leader who wants to at least in public,

403
00:28:11,400 --> 00:28:16,160
be Christian and endorse Christianity and have good relations with

404
00:28:16,440 --> 00:28:20,519
Catholicism and have good relations with the West in general,

405
00:28:21,920 --> 00:28:26,359
rather than driving him into the arms of godless Chinese, who,

406
00:28:27,640 --> 00:28:31,480
as party policy, wish nothing but harm upon the West.

407
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Speaker 1: Yes, all right, well, let me bring up the controversial thing.

408
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There are a lot of people who have infiltrated the

409
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United States government who have centuries old ethnic animosities towards Russia.

410
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Speaker 4: Yep.

411
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Speaker 1: I mean, when you look at their backgrounds, I think

412
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one time I had counted like twelve of them from

413
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what we're within a their families are within a ten

414
00:29:02,039 --> 00:29:06,880
mile radius of Levov Okay. So these people are still

415
00:29:07,400 --> 00:29:13,200
upset about kemil Netsky from sixteen fifty two, and they

416
00:29:13,279 --> 00:29:17,680
want to destroy Russia. I mean, how do we get

417
00:29:17,720 --> 00:29:18,039
past this?

418
00:29:19,240 --> 00:29:21,799
Speaker 4: I think we get past us by being honest with

419
00:29:21,920 --> 00:29:26,400
ourselves in the following sense. And I really want to

420
00:29:26,440 --> 00:29:32,640
choose my words carefully. Different religious groups have different priorities,

421
00:29:33,079 --> 00:29:41,880
different interests, different identities. Liberalism pretends that there's no problem

422
00:29:42,400 --> 00:29:48,279
with every important envoy to them at least being Jewish,

423
00:29:49,440 --> 00:29:55,440
when practical experience suggests that this is going to bias

424
00:29:55,519 --> 00:29:58,759
opinions in a particular way, in the same way that

425
00:29:58,839 --> 00:30:02,720
if you sent a Musli Brotherhood member to be or

426
00:30:02,839 --> 00:30:08,480
envoy to them at least. So liberalism tries to paper

427
00:30:08,640 --> 00:30:13,279
over the fact that there are divisions in worldview and

428
00:30:13,400 --> 00:30:19,880
that your ancestry and current beliefs are both important to

429
00:30:20,000 --> 00:30:23,839
how you think. You're not raised in a blank slate,

430
00:30:24,880 --> 00:30:30,319
you're not raised in a desert. You're raised in a

431
00:30:30,400 --> 00:30:35,319
context in a particular way of thinking, and this is important.

432
00:30:35,880 --> 00:30:39,559
And the Jewish people have a very important historic memory,

433
00:30:41,480 --> 00:30:51,240
and so the fact that you have this old hatred

434
00:30:52,240 --> 00:30:55,759
that is still alive in some and it's not a

435
00:30:55,880 --> 00:30:59,319
general thing. It's not that every single Jew is this way.

436
00:30:59,559 --> 00:31:01,559
That's not that's not the point, and that would be

437
00:31:01,599 --> 00:31:04,839
a silly argument. But it is the case that if

438
00:31:04,839 --> 00:31:08,640
you are particularly interested in this issue, and you are

439
00:31:08,720 --> 00:31:11,759
drone to it to the extent that you want to

440
00:31:11,880 --> 00:31:16,920
join the Foreign Service and participate in decision making, you

441
00:31:17,000 --> 00:31:18,400
are probably motivated.

442
00:31:19,400 --> 00:31:21,160
Speaker 3: It's a self selecting issue.

443
00:31:21,359 --> 00:31:24,680
Speaker 4: It is a self selecting issue. It's a self selecting issue.

444
00:31:25,160 --> 00:31:29,759
And so if that happens and you are motivated in

445
00:31:29,799 --> 00:31:34,640
this way, then there should be a degree of caution.

446
00:31:35,960 --> 00:31:40,680
But liberalism is essentially a system without immune system, is

447
00:31:40,680 --> 00:31:45,160
a system without an immune system because of the assumptions

448
00:31:45,160 --> 00:31:47,920
that it makes that everybody comes in with a complete

449
00:31:47,920 --> 00:31:52,960
blank slate. And you see this across the board. In

450
00:31:53,039 --> 00:31:55,799
the United Kingdom, in the Home Office, there's a Muslim

451
00:31:55,839 --> 00:32:00,200
network that has hundreds and hundreds of members and the

452
00:32:00,240 --> 00:32:04,680
importance of immigration. It is absurd that this kind of

453
00:32:04,720 --> 00:32:10,160
thing is allowed. It's an absurdity because you know what

454
00:32:10,279 --> 00:32:15,119
the motivations are going to be. The problem has been

455
00:32:15,559 --> 00:32:21,640
that in a way, we're beginning to be aware, or

456
00:32:21,720 --> 00:32:27,480
Westerners are beginning to be aware that Islam is a problem.

457
00:32:27,559 --> 00:32:33,440
But given the historic legacy of Christian Jewish relations, particularly

458
00:32:33,559 --> 00:32:37,720
in the West, it's impossible to say that. Look, if

459
00:32:37,759 --> 00:32:42,559
somebody is Jewish and very supportive of Israel, you want

460
00:32:42,599 --> 00:32:45,839
to take their contributions to Middle East policy with a

461
00:32:45,839 --> 00:32:49,960
grain of salt. Not because they don't know, not because

462
00:32:50,000 --> 00:32:53,720
they're evil, not because they're stupid, but because they have

463
00:32:53,799 --> 00:32:57,640
a stake in this issue, and a deeply personal one.

464
00:32:58,640 --> 00:33:01,680
And maybe they're right, and maybe what they're saying is

465
00:33:01,680 --> 00:33:07,720
absolutely correct, but there must be at least some discussion

466
00:33:07,759 --> 00:33:12,359
of the topic. And yet any kind of discussion that

467
00:33:12,720 --> 00:33:15,759
you know, in the same way that Muslims globally will

468
00:33:15,759 --> 00:33:21,200
support Muslims in Palestine, and therefore you see that Jews

469
00:33:21,200 --> 00:33:28,279
globally support Jews in Israel. Any kind of equality that

470
00:33:28,480 --> 00:33:32,440
comes not from hatred or from moral equivalents, but from

471
00:33:32,440 --> 00:33:39,279
a healthy respect for human nature is seen as hatred

472
00:33:39,400 --> 00:33:44,920
or hostility, or antagonism or something or the other. I

473
00:33:45,000 --> 00:33:50,519
say this about myself is if the I'm a naturalized

474
00:33:50,559 --> 00:33:54,880
British subject, I know I'm Lebanese. I'm not under any

475
00:33:54,880 --> 00:33:58,559
illusions about who I am, but I took an oath

476
00:33:58,920 --> 00:34:01,160
and I try to respect it, and I want to

477
00:34:01,200 --> 00:34:04,279
be loyal to the monarchy in this country because that's

478
00:34:04,319 --> 00:34:09,000
the oath that I took. At the same time, if

479
00:34:09,039 --> 00:34:12,239
there was a conflict between the crown and the Catholic Church,

480
00:34:13,440 --> 00:34:17,679
I accept that I will be torn over this. I

481
00:34:17,800 --> 00:34:21,880
project the same onto others, not out of malice, but

482
00:34:21,920 --> 00:34:26,239
out of an understanding of human nature. And I think

483
00:34:26,280 --> 00:34:29,880
we should be able to say this, and I think

484
00:34:29,920 --> 00:34:34,360
we should be able to discuss this maturely. And if

485
00:34:34,360 --> 00:34:38,159
there is a self selection process that is happening that

486
00:34:38,320 --> 00:34:41,159
is informing policy on Russia and on the Middle East

487
00:34:42,440 --> 00:34:46,119
in a way that is driving together an Islamic Russian

488
00:34:46,199 --> 00:34:52,559
Chinese alliance, we should a say this and b be

489
00:34:53,239 --> 00:34:59,280
humble enough to understand that a united Eurasia is too

490
00:34:59,400 --> 00:35:04,320
large of a military and political and economic challenge and

491
00:35:04,440 --> 00:35:09,119
is therefore a threat to the West, and so any

492
00:35:09,199 --> 00:35:16,480
policies that delivers that should be analyzed correctly, including what's

493
00:35:16,559 --> 00:35:20,599
driving it, and should be countered with a policy that

494
00:35:20,679 --> 00:35:23,559
says no, no, Let's see which of these countries we

495
00:35:23,639 --> 00:35:28,360
can bring on side through some realism, through some humility

496
00:35:29,400 --> 00:35:32,480
to avoid a situation where the West is isolated in

497
00:35:32,519 --> 00:35:34,199
a fight against a United Eurasia.

498
00:35:36,400 --> 00:35:41,239
Speaker 3: Well and for US, this begs the question the next

499
00:35:41,239 --> 00:35:44,519
domino to fall, obviously would be India. It would be

500
00:35:44,800 --> 00:35:51,000
if that alliance were to were allowed to really solidify

501
00:35:51,119 --> 00:35:54,880
between a United Eurasia, then India would it would be

502
00:35:54,920 --> 00:35:57,960
in their interests to participate in that. And so I

503
00:35:57,960 --> 00:36:00,760
think that is one of the reasons you'll see. I

504
00:36:00,800 --> 00:36:06,320
think I think the US, uh, the decision makers in

505
00:36:06,360 --> 00:36:10,599
the US are seeing this flash you know, this oncoming

506
00:36:10,639 --> 00:36:14,920
train uh flashing in their dreams and are doing everything

507
00:36:14,960 --> 00:36:20,480
they can at a late stage to try to get

508
00:36:20,719 --> 00:36:26,199
curry Indian favor pun intended. Sorry I didn't.

509
00:36:25,960 --> 00:36:27,920
Speaker 4: Thank you, but that was amazing.

510
00:36:28,119 --> 00:36:29,920
Speaker 3: I had to. I had to.

511
00:36:30,840 --> 00:36:33,559
Speaker 4: I don't we played very well placed?

512
00:36:33,599 --> 00:36:37,239
Speaker 3: Ye, thank you? So anyway, uh, So I think that

513
00:36:37,360 --> 00:36:44,960
explains part of you know, the pa okay.

514
00:36:46,639 --> 00:36:52,960
Speaker 4: I think that what China is trying to do is

515
00:36:52,960 --> 00:36:55,119
to prepare for a day where it can defeat India

516
00:36:55,639 --> 00:37:02,239
rather resounding. And Pakistan's hatred of India is quite legendary

517
00:37:02,719 --> 00:37:05,800
and it goes it's sort of reciprocated, you know, not

518
00:37:05,920 --> 00:37:10,039
to pick a side here, I personally would always pick

519
00:37:10,079 --> 00:37:12,800
monotheists over pagans. That's a point of principle as far

520
00:37:12,840 --> 00:37:19,320
as I'm concerned. But that's a different conversation. But I

521
00:37:19,360 --> 00:37:23,440
think that India is a bit of its own island

522
00:37:24,280 --> 00:37:29,480
and will want to play its own game, in part

523
00:37:29,559 --> 00:37:34,199
because their reawakening of Indian national pride as part of

524
00:37:34,239 --> 00:37:35,639
the v and as.

525
00:37:35,559 --> 00:37:38,079
Speaker 3: Part of the idealism.

526
00:37:38,519 --> 00:37:44,920
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, exactly isn't going to allow them to be

527
00:37:45,480 --> 00:37:52,840
a a passenger in a geopolitical context. They want to

528
00:37:52,840 --> 00:37:56,039
be their own player. There's a discussion to be had

529
00:37:56,159 --> 00:37:59,199
as to how seriously India can actually expect to be

530
00:37:59,239 --> 00:38:03,760
a player. I find that I tend to be much

531
00:38:03,800 --> 00:38:10,079
more negative on India than others. I don't think that

532
00:38:10,159 --> 00:38:12,920
it has the kind of culture of excellence that has

533
00:38:12,960 --> 00:38:16,000
begun to develop in China, that sort of deepened really

534
00:38:16,039 --> 00:38:19,639
in China, that allows them to be the same kind

535
00:38:19,679 --> 00:38:24,119
of contender as China is. And I partly attribute that

536
00:38:24,320 --> 00:38:29,079
to the chaos of Indian religion, which there is no

537
00:38:29,239 --> 00:38:32,559
Indian religion. There are Indian religions that sort of all

538
00:38:32,599 --> 00:38:37,760
get labeled as Hinduism, but Hinduism isn't one thing. It's

539
00:38:37,760 --> 00:38:40,599
sort of dozens and dozens of different things and different

540
00:38:40,599 --> 00:38:43,039
branches that sort of all go in all kinds of

541
00:38:43,079 --> 00:38:50,159
different directions, and the internal animosities within Indians between Indians overcast.

542
00:38:53,000 --> 00:38:54,519
And this is a country that has one of the

543
00:38:54,559 --> 00:38:57,079
largest Muslim populations in the world, something like two hundred

544
00:38:57,119 --> 00:39:03,639
one hundred fifty million Muslims. Its ability to put itself

545
00:39:03,679 --> 00:39:07,320
together in a unified way and act in a concerted

546
00:39:07,400 --> 00:39:10,519
manner in the same way that China can. Okay, Accepting

547
00:39:10,559 --> 00:39:14,880
that different CCP provincial branches do their own thing while

548
00:39:14,920 --> 00:39:17,440
pretending to obey the central government, et cetera, et cetera,

549
00:39:17,480 --> 00:39:21,480
fair enough. But in India the level of chaos is

550
00:39:21,559 --> 00:39:25,440
much much greater, and I think that that comes with

551
00:39:25,599 --> 00:39:32,079
a geopolitical costs in their ability to execute on the

552
00:39:32,119 --> 00:39:33,920
projects that they commit themselves to.

553
00:39:35,559 --> 00:39:39,800
Speaker 3: Okay, do you think that part of the lack of

554
00:39:40,320 --> 00:39:44,360
perspective in the West to these issues in India is

555
00:39:44,960 --> 00:39:50,519
partially due to the fact that most Westerners their sole

556
00:39:50,719 --> 00:39:55,320
interaction with Indians is with Bramine, because that's mostly who

557
00:39:55,920 --> 00:39:56,519
I think that's.

558
00:39:56,400 --> 00:39:59,280
Speaker 4: A big part of it. I think I don't aware

559
00:39:59,599 --> 00:40:02,559
that most of the Indians that they're dealing with are

560
00:40:02,719 --> 00:40:08,519
from the highest echalons of Indian society and that underneath

561
00:40:08,519 --> 00:40:12,679
that there is a an awful mess.

562
00:40:13,760 --> 00:40:15,159
Speaker 2: I interviewed.

563
00:40:15,440 --> 00:40:20,199
Speaker 1: I interviewed an Indian gentleman who was after he graduated

564
00:40:20,199 --> 00:40:20,719
in India.

565
00:40:20,840 --> 00:40:22,440
Speaker 2: He was educated in Britain.

566
00:40:23,239 --> 00:40:27,440
Speaker 1: His name is Giant Bandari and he basically yeah, he

567
00:40:27,480 --> 00:40:31,599
basically said, you, the West has not met the average

568
00:40:31,599 --> 00:40:34,159
Indian yet quite quite.

569
00:40:34,760 --> 00:40:42,920
Speaker 4: Yes, if you go to the Gulf, you encounter a

570
00:40:43,039 --> 00:40:50,159
very different kind of lowercas Indian and you sort of

571
00:40:50,199 --> 00:41:00,079
see a much bigger golf pun intended between the the

572
00:41:00,079 --> 00:41:03,599
the Indians in the West and the rest of India

573
00:41:05,119 --> 00:41:08,280
when you meet Indians from impoverished backgrounds. I mean, poverty

574
00:41:08,320 --> 00:41:12,320
has an effect on everyone everywhere, fair enough, But I

575
00:41:12,440 --> 00:41:18,480
don't think people appreciate exactly what rural India is and

576
00:41:18,559 --> 00:41:21,760
where it is in terms of its development and how

577
00:41:21,800 --> 00:41:26,960
far it has to go. And I think that they

578
00:41:27,719 --> 00:41:30,880
it's impolite to talk about religion, and it's impolite to

579
00:41:30,920 --> 00:41:34,400
talk about religion affecting culture, and even more so about

580
00:41:34,400 --> 00:41:40,320
religion affecting behavior. Yet in my experience as an analyst,

581
00:41:40,360 --> 00:41:42,840
I found that this is the single most important factor

582
00:41:45,159 --> 00:41:48,440
in understanding how cultures behave and how cultures are different.

583
00:41:50,280 --> 00:41:55,400
So I think that betting on India to counter China

584
00:41:55,480 --> 00:41:59,400
is a bit of an unwise bet, and that you're

585
00:41:59,519 --> 00:42:05,880
better off working with the likes of Indonesia, Vietnam, Philippines,

586
00:42:08,639 --> 00:42:11,719
South Korea, Japan. South Korea with all of its problems,

587
00:42:11,760 --> 00:42:13,519
including a big chunk of you know.

588
00:42:13,880 --> 00:42:16,760
Speaker 3: Of the demographic cliff, that's for sure.

589
00:42:17,559 --> 00:42:24,280
Speaker 4: And the demographic collapse obviously. So I'm not a you know,

590
00:42:25,079 --> 00:42:27,400
India superpower twenty twenty kind of guy.

591
00:42:29,559 --> 00:42:32,280
Speaker 3: I just, yeah, you just hear a lot of it.

592
00:42:32,239 --> 00:42:37,199
I think due to the to to Indian influence in

593
00:42:37,280 --> 00:42:42,840
the UH. You know, the those who have immigrated here

594
00:42:42,840 --> 00:42:49,159
tend to the ones who have done well, have tried

595
00:42:49,159 --> 00:42:52,000
to make their voices heard, and there's some there's some

596
00:42:52,559 --> 00:42:56,400
democratic power. I you know, maybe I'm sensitive to it

597
00:42:56,440 --> 00:43:00,000
because in DFW is probably I think is the large

598
00:43:00,239 --> 00:43:05,320
just South Asian concentration in North America. So where I

599
00:43:05,360 --> 00:43:12,039
am in Dallas, and it's they make their voices very well.

600
00:43:12,079 --> 00:43:14,119
And you know, I get along with every I get

601
00:43:14,119 --> 00:43:17,599
along with anybody. It's not that it's just you know,

602
00:43:17,800 --> 00:43:20,920
a whole different set of presuppositions. You mentioned the whole

603
00:43:21,239 --> 00:43:26,199
monotheist versus pagan thing that becomes very evident if you're

604
00:43:26,239 --> 00:43:29,599
trying to do business, very evident. You know, there's the

605
00:43:29,840 --> 00:43:33,199
it's a joke in the US, but it's a it's

606
00:43:33,199 --> 00:43:38,039
a joke that's true about the Patel Hotel cartel. You know,

607
00:43:38,199 --> 00:43:43,920
forty north of forty percent of all extended stay hotels

608
00:43:43,920 --> 00:43:49,760
in the United States are owned by ethnic Indians. And

609
00:43:49,840 --> 00:43:56,320
it's pretty interesting phenomena that is has gone kind of unnoticed.

610
00:43:57,159 --> 00:43:59,360
Speaker 4: Look, this is something that the West is beginning to

611
00:43:59,400 --> 00:44:03,519
wake up to. As someone from the Middle East, you

612
00:44:04,000 --> 00:44:07,719
automatically know that you're going to do people who are

613
00:44:07,760 --> 00:44:12,960
from your community a favor wherever you can, because the

614
00:44:13,039 --> 00:44:16,280
other communities are a doing the same way and b

615
00:44:16,440 --> 00:44:20,159
out to get you. And this is deeply ingrained in

616
00:44:20,239 --> 00:44:22,719
the Middle Eastern mindset. And this is one of the

617
00:44:22,760 --> 00:44:26,039
reasons for the backwardness of the Middle East, the fact

618
00:44:26,119 --> 00:44:29,400
that this kind of diversity prevents the emergence of a

619
00:44:29,480 --> 00:44:34,440
high trust society. High trust comes from deeply shared interests

620
00:44:34,559 --> 00:44:41,159
and deeply shared values, and the values precede the interests,

621
00:44:41,400 --> 00:44:45,360
because unless you look at the world in a similar way,

622
00:44:45,480 --> 00:44:48,880
you're not going to identify interests in a similar way.

623
00:44:50,519 --> 00:44:55,800
So as the West diversifies its demographics, it's realizing that

624
00:44:55,960 --> 00:44:58,480
actually the rest of the world doesn't really operate this way,

625
00:45:00,079 --> 00:45:02,000
and you're seeing it right now. I mean now in

626
00:45:02,039 --> 00:45:06,400
London there are protests by Indians outside of the Pakistani

627
00:45:06,480 --> 00:45:11,360
High Commission and vice versa because of an incident in

628
00:45:11,360 --> 00:45:14,280
India and Pakistan, and there's a real fear as to

629
00:45:14,519 --> 00:45:16,920
how much this is going to spill over into the

630
00:45:16,920 --> 00:45:21,280
streets in places like Leicester that are highly mixed between

631
00:45:21,400 --> 00:45:27,199
Hindu and Muslim and Pakistani Muslim. So this idea that

632
00:45:27,320 --> 00:45:31,119
you're going to jerk everyone equally, regardless of their blood

633
00:45:31,159 --> 00:45:36,280
relation to you is simply stupid. But Westerners have been

634
00:45:36,360 --> 00:45:39,039
sort of programmed, as one of the consequences of the

635
00:45:39,039 --> 00:45:41,599
Second World War and the atrocities of the Second World War,

636
00:45:42,719 --> 00:45:46,119
that you're not meant to think of ethnic skin first.

637
00:45:48,039 --> 00:45:54,000
But that is a very strange and destructive exception. You're

638
00:45:54,039 --> 00:45:58,679
supposed you're biologically wired to think of your own people first.

639
00:46:00,159 --> 00:46:04,239
The Christian Revolution is in part based on the idea

640
00:46:04,360 --> 00:46:08,400
that you're not going to be tribal, because the Catholic

641
00:46:08,519 --> 00:46:13,199
Church banned cousin marriages in order to end tribes and tribalism.

642
00:46:14,519 --> 00:46:17,679
Several hundred years later, this sort of created the society

643
00:46:17,760 --> 00:46:21,000
that we know today. But the rest of the world

644
00:46:21,000 --> 00:46:25,239
doesn't operate this way. The rest of the world mostly

645
00:46:25,280 --> 00:46:29,559
operates on marrying your cousin from marrying someone that your

646
00:46:29,599 --> 00:46:32,119
family knows very well and trusts very well.

647
00:46:33,639 --> 00:46:37,880
Speaker 3: Faras I think, this is something that's rarely appreciated in

648
00:46:38,840 --> 00:46:48,199
American philosophical, Christian intellectual circles, and that is because everybody

649
00:46:48,199 --> 00:46:51,000
has a hard time holding two things in tension, much

650
00:46:51,079 --> 00:46:53,239
less three. You know, we all are looking for that

651
00:46:53,639 --> 00:46:58,800
simplistic heuristic that's going to explain everything right, and real

652
00:46:58,840 --> 00:47:01,519
life is just not like that. We're called this is.

653
00:47:01,519 --> 00:47:02,920
Speaker 4: Why we believe in the whole. This is why we

654
00:47:02,960 --> 00:47:04,039
believe in the Holy Trinity.

655
00:47:04,719 --> 00:47:07,800
Speaker 5: That's right, and it is meant to confuse your mind

656
00:47:08,280 --> 00:47:10,800
and to make dear to you that there is something

657
00:47:10,840 --> 00:47:14,000
that is transcendent in a way that you will never comprehend,

658
00:47:14,840 --> 00:47:17,480
and that the truth is not accessible to you in

659
00:47:17,519 --> 00:47:18,840
its fullness.

660
00:47:18,920 --> 00:47:23,679
Speaker 4: And therefore you must constantly strive for it and try

661
00:47:23,679 --> 00:47:27,519
to meditate on it in order to be able to

662
00:47:27,679 --> 00:47:29,920
get any kind of understanding of the world.

663
00:47:31,119 --> 00:47:33,360
Speaker 3: That's right, whereas well.

664
00:47:33,360 --> 00:47:38,280
Speaker 4: The yeah, anyway, I could go on about this for

665
00:47:38,320 --> 00:47:38,639
a while.

666
00:47:38,719 --> 00:47:40,920
Speaker 3: Well, no, what I was just saying is is that

667
00:47:41,760 --> 00:47:46,679
it is true that the Christian West has shown that

668
00:47:47,079 --> 00:47:53,239
ordered liberty, not radical licentiousness, but ordered liberty is a

669
00:47:53,239 --> 00:47:58,639
blessing and will unlock incredible wealth and productivity and blessing

670
00:47:58,920 --> 00:48:03,800
on people. But on the other end, and yet outgroup,

671
00:48:03,880 --> 00:48:08,559
but that can't metastasize into radical outgroup preferencing, which is

672
00:48:08,599 --> 00:48:11,800
what you're saying. And let's ever, But on the other hand,

673
00:48:11,840 --> 00:48:15,400
you go the other direction, and radical radical in group

674
00:48:15,480 --> 00:48:21,480
preferencing strikes against ordered liberty. And so these this this

675
00:48:21,480 --> 00:48:26,039
this intellectual philosophical battle which Christianity is supposed to make

676
00:48:26,119 --> 00:48:30,039
you struggle with. It's supposed to make the wise ruler

677
00:48:30,159 --> 00:48:35,239
hold these things intention uh. Is instead we see this

678
00:48:35,360 --> 00:48:39,519
pendulum that just goes back and forth. And it's a

679
00:48:39,599 --> 00:48:44,880
real you know, I I I hope that it doesn't

680
00:48:44,920 --> 00:48:48,960
take radical suffering in order to get this ideal ideal back.

681
00:48:49,599 --> 00:48:54,519
I I question whether that's the actual case. But but

682
00:48:54,719 --> 00:49:01,559
we need to embrace this, the the biblical idea of

683
00:49:02,239 --> 00:49:08,280
wisdom and holding these things intension again, family, state, and church,

684
00:49:09,440 --> 00:49:13,639
or you know, are are three legs of a stool,

685
00:49:13,719 --> 00:49:17,239
and due to you know, the Nick Land talks about

686
00:49:17,239 --> 00:49:22,079
the institutional jealousy between these three that that you know,

687
00:49:22,119 --> 00:49:28,679
you either see fascism, a radical fascism which prioritizes the

688
00:49:28,719 --> 00:49:31,360
state above all. I'm not talking about guys who have

689
00:49:31,880 --> 00:49:35,920
a strong nationalistic view. I'm talking about, you know, the

690
00:49:35,960 --> 00:49:39,840
state above all kind of a hyper Mussolini idea. Or

691
00:49:39,920 --> 00:49:45,679
you see ecclesiocentrism to where the churches is so superseding

692
00:49:45,719 --> 00:49:49,400
over everything else that that there's no place it even

693
00:49:49,639 --> 00:49:52,400
pushes out the family. Or you see these weird tri

694
00:49:53,199 --> 00:49:57,280
radical in group tribalist things. And the truth is you've

695
00:49:57,320 --> 00:49:59,960
got to have all three. And that is just very

696
00:50:00,119 --> 00:50:05,440
very very difficult for in a democratic society for people

697
00:50:05,519 --> 00:50:08,199
to get their arms around, because it doesn't sell. It's

698
00:50:08,280 --> 00:50:09,920
just very very hard.

699
00:50:10,599 --> 00:50:12,000
Speaker 4: Let me go a step further.

700
00:50:12,920 --> 00:50:13,719
Speaker 3: Yeah, let's hear it.

701
00:50:14,480 --> 00:50:21,480
Speaker 4: Radical tribalism is the default setting. If you accept that

702
00:50:22,079 --> 00:50:26,960
you are genetically ninety eight percent Chimpanzee, what you see

703
00:50:27,119 --> 00:50:32,960
there is radical tribalism. If you look at all other

704
00:50:33,039 --> 00:50:37,079
cultures in the world, from the case system to the

705
00:50:37,119 --> 00:50:40,079
way that nepotism works in Korea and China, to the

706
00:50:40,119 --> 00:50:45,960
way that family conglomerates are the norm in Japan, to

707
00:50:46,000 --> 00:50:49,239
the way et cetera, et cetera. You see that the

708
00:50:49,320 --> 00:50:54,519
default setting of humanity is tribalism, and you see that

709
00:50:54,639 --> 00:50:58,679
this is the starting point for all of us. And

710
00:50:59,800 --> 00:51:03,920
you you see in Christianity when Christ emphasizes that if

711
00:51:03,960 --> 00:51:06,719
you have a disagreement with your brother, go and fix

712
00:51:06,760 --> 00:51:10,199
it before you go and pray well. The reason that

713
00:51:10,400 --> 00:51:14,719
example is used is because that's the default setting. Tribalism

714
00:51:14,800 --> 00:51:17,039
and caring for your brother and cousin first is the

715
00:51:17,039 --> 00:51:21,840
default setting. In Lebanon, we say me and my brother

716
00:51:21,880 --> 00:51:23,880
against my cousin, and me and me and my cousin

717
00:51:23,920 --> 00:51:29,639
against any strangers. So that's the initial wiring that you have.

718
00:51:30,960 --> 00:51:33,840
The state in most parts of the world is monarchy.

719
00:51:34,559 --> 00:51:39,880
Then default government system is monarchy, which is the elevation

720
00:51:40,039 --> 00:51:42,840
of one family as the leading family of all of

721
00:51:42,880 --> 00:51:50,519
the others. And that always comes with its own religion

722
00:51:50,920 --> 00:51:55,360
and religious tradition that says that the ties worship of

723
00:51:55,440 --> 00:52:00,559
ancestors to well being and sacrificing for the an sisters

724
00:52:00,760 --> 00:52:03,079
to keep us safe, and so on and so forth.

725
00:52:03,719 --> 00:52:08,920
These are the default settings of humanity. When you understand

726
00:52:08,960 --> 00:52:14,079
the default settings, the extent to which Christianity is revolutionary

727
00:52:15,000 --> 00:52:22,480
becomes slightly easier to perceive. Because God is no longer

728
00:52:22,599 --> 00:52:26,159
the God of a single people. He is the God

729
00:52:26,199 --> 00:52:30,079
of the Jews and the genteels, all of them. And

730
00:52:30,159 --> 00:52:35,519
because conversion is no longer dependent on blood but is

731
00:52:35,960 --> 00:52:41,079
available to all of the world, hence the miracle of Pentecost.

732
00:52:43,039 --> 00:52:45,880
Speaker 3: And a distributed spirit. Yes yeah.

733
00:52:45,920 --> 00:52:49,880
Speaker 4: And the King is no longer just the head of

734
00:52:49,920 --> 00:52:54,840
his own family. He, according to the Old Testament, has

735
00:52:54,920 --> 00:52:58,679
to write the law himself, to copy the law of

736
00:52:58,719 --> 00:53:01,960
God himself, and meditate on it all the day long,

737
00:53:03,280 --> 00:53:06,320
and think that it is God's law that he is

738
00:53:06,360 --> 00:53:11,079
there to implement. And the antithesis of tyranny is the

739
00:53:11,079 --> 00:53:15,679
implementation of God's law, which is justice for all on

740
00:53:15,760 --> 00:53:20,000
an equal footing. So when you understand the false setting

741
00:53:20,039 --> 00:53:24,079
of the world, you understand that every single aspect of

742
00:53:24,159 --> 00:53:29,119
Christianity is revolutionary. But Westerners have been so Christian for

743
00:53:29,159 --> 00:53:34,360
so long that they view it. They view that extreme

744
00:53:34,679 --> 00:53:39,800
revolutionary idea as that a false setting. And because they

745
00:53:39,880 --> 00:53:43,159
no longer practice Christianity and read the Old Testament and

746
00:53:43,280 --> 00:53:48,639
ask themselves why did we transition from the angry God

747
00:53:49,039 --> 00:53:52,679
of Genesis and Exodus to the merciful God of Christ,

748
00:53:53,639 --> 00:53:56,719
And don't try to see that evolution on how God

749
00:53:56,800 --> 00:54:03,480
shaped us. They assume that the the Sermon of the

750
00:54:03,599 --> 00:54:11,199
Mount is the fault setting of humanity. M Practicing religion

751
00:54:11,760 --> 00:54:15,320
makes you dumber, is what I'm saying to you. Mm hmm.

752
00:54:17,039 --> 00:54:21,280
Speaker 3: Mm hmm. That's really good, that's great stuff.

753
00:54:21,679 --> 00:54:25,480
Speaker 1: Well what I think, let me what I think happens

754
00:54:25,599 --> 00:54:29,880
is is that people who are brought up in the

755
00:54:30,000 --> 00:54:35,079
Christian West, now look and see what the Christian West

756
00:54:35,079 --> 00:54:39,400
has become and what you just said about it being revolutionary,

757
00:54:40,079 --> 00:54:44,159
they consider that to be subversive. They consider that to

758
00:54:44,239 --> 00:54:48,000
be the reason why all of this, why the West

759
00:54:48,000 --> 00:54:53,199
has fallen, is because Christians are pussies. Christians won't fight.

760
00:54:54,239 --> 00:54:58,360
Christians allowed this to happen. And it's all because you know, hey,

761
00:54:58,400 --> 00:55:01,199
it's open borders. And you if you, if you have

762
00:55:01,280 --> 00:55:04,360
a natural law, that law applies to everyone. So if

763
00:55:04,400 --> 00:55:07,880
everyone has the right to travel without being you know,

764
00:55:07,920 --> 00:55:12,239
without being having violence put upon them, well then that law,

765
00:55:12,719 --> 00:55:16,119
that law applies to everyone, and why the borders exist.

766
00:55:16,360 --> 00:55:21,119
If Pentecost. If Pentecost brought the whole world together, then

767
00:55:21,159 --> 00:55:24,840
why then then I guess the Tower of Babbel was reversed,

768
00:55:24,880 --> 00:55:27,480
and now there's no everyone speaking. It should be speaking

769
00:55:27,519 --> 00:55:30,079
the same language, and everyone should be together. And then

770
00:55:30,199 --> 00:55:35,400
Christianity is the enemy, because Christianity was the revolutionary spirit

771
00:55:35,679 --> 00:55:36,920
that allowed this to happen.

772
00:55:38,960 --> 00:55:42,079
Speaker 4: Yes, for some of the pagan right this is the case,

773
00:55:42,599 --> 00:55:45,679
but you're also seeing a huge increase in conversions to

774
00:55:45,760 --> 00:55:51,760
Christianity and especially to Catholicism, with people realizing that really,

775
00:55:53,159 --> 00:56:01,239
if you don't want to degenerate into barbaric statism and

776
00:56:02,079 --> 00:56:07,840
a barbaric form of racism as opposed to the natural

777
00:56:08,039 --> 00:56:11,159
human racism that says, I prefer people who are like

778
00:56:11,239 --> 00:56:18,760
me to strangers because that's my default human setting. For

779
00:56:19,039 --> 00:56:22,920
some there is an appeal in that. But for those

780
00:56:22,960 --> 00:56:27,760
of us who want order and to balance order and

781
00:56:27,800 --> 00:56:32,639
liberty rather than worship order for its own sake, then

782
00:56:32,719 --> 00:56:39,239
the answer is christian thought. The answer is serious Christianity

783
00:56:39,920 --> 00:56:43,760
that contends with the difficulties of the Old Testament and

784
00:56:43,920 --> 00:56:49,159
understands God's wisdom in the severity of the Old Testament,

785
00:56:50,239 --> 00:56:58,119
and that embraces the charity and love and forgiveness, I

786
00:56:58,199 --> 00:57:03,199
dare say of the new estimate, but within their proper bounds.

787
00:57:04,480 --> 00:57:09,440
You forgive a killer after he's executed, or when he's

788
00:57:09,480 --> 00:57:16,519
on his way to execution, because you balance forgiveness and justice.

789
00:57:16,880 --> 00:57:23,400
You forgive to not turn yourself into a into a hateful,

790
00:57:24,679 --> 00:57:29,159
rage driven demon. That's why you forgive. You don't forgive

791
00:57:29,239 --> 00:57:31,880
to say well, I'm happy that my son's killer is

792
00:57:31,920 --> 00:57:39,079
walking free. That's just demented. That's another kind of demonic

793
00:57:39,199 --> 00:57:46,400
lethargy and demonic complacency that says, well, I'm indifferent to justice,

794
00:57:46,599 --> 00:57:51,320
I'm indifferent to to to love. I'm indifferent to the

795
00:57:51,320 --> 00:57:55,559
fate of my children. And therefore I choose to just

796
00:57:55,880 --> 00:58:03,440
forgive and forget. You can forgive without forgetting while demanding justice,

797
00:58:03,719 --> 00:58:07,320
and I think that is the correct balance. You don't

798
00:58:07,400 --> 00:58:14,760
let your tragedy turn you beast. You you demand justice

799
00:58:14,800 --> 00:58:21,960
because doing justice is serving God. And you balance the

800
00:58:22,000 --> 00:58:25,800
two together so that you can recover from tragedy and

801
00:58:25,920 --> 00:58:30,000
continue to serve God. And I think fundamentally, if I

802
00:58:30,039 --> 00:58:35,000
wanted to characterize the biggest problems of the West, the

803
00:58:35,039 --> 00:58:38,960
one that I see most is lack of balance. Lack

804
00:58:39,000 --> 00:58:44,599
of temperance. If you're free, you're too free. And if

805
00:58:44,639 --> 00:58:48,199
you want order, you worship the state. Neither of those

806
00:58:48,280 --> 00:58:53,039
is a correct answer. This is why what Ron was

807
00:58:53,039 --> 00:59:00,880
saying about balance, about balancing family, church, nation, and loving

808
00:59:01,280 --> 00:59:03,639
all three of them are are, and learning how to

809
00:59:03,719 --> 00:59:05,559
serve all three of them and to give each of

810
00:59:05,599 --> 00:59:09,679
them as it's due is really the only way to

811
00:59:09,719 --> 00:59:11,639
go about it. Ron is absolutely right.

812
00:59:13,360 --> 00:59:20,559
Speaker 3: You're seeing the rise of pagan Niets Nietzscheism. I think

813
00:59:20,639 --> 00:59:21,400
as a reaction.

814
00:59:22,519 --> 00:59:22,639
Speaker 4: Uh.

815
00:59:24,639 --> 00:59:29,280
Speaker 3: In some of this it's in you know, the less.

816
00:59:28,840 --> 00:59:31,760
Speaker 1: It's a react, Ron, it's a reaction to Jewish power.

817
00:59:32,079 --> 00:59:34,840
That's exactly what it is. If you ask them, they

818
00:59:34,880 --> 00:59:37,679
will tell you. They will say, I am not going

819
00:59:37,760 --> 00:59:42,119
to worship this Jew who was so weak that he

820
00:59:42,159 --> 00:59:46,559
allowed himself to be killed when Jewish power is destroying

821
00:59:46,639 --> 00:59:48,280
what my ancestors built.

822
00:59:49,280 --> 00:59:52,719
Speaker 3: Yeah, although coven Italy, I think the intelligence I mean

823
00:59:52,960 --> 00:59:57,159
this is you know, uh, I know this is going out.

824
00:59:57,159 --> 01:00:01,960
But we can Modern Judaism and covenantal Old Testament temple

825
01:00:02,000 --> 01:00:04,679
worship are two different things. And I can still have

826
01:00:04,840 --> 01:00:10,400
respect for you know the uh uh, you know, the

827
01:00:10,400 --> 01:00:14,559
the the Jewish fellow who I interact with and and

828
01:00:14,599 --> 01:00:17,119
so on and so forth, and still have the opinion

829
01:00:17,159 --> 01:00:23,039
that Old Old Testament temple worship, the Old Testament Tabernacle

830
01:00:23,079 --> 01:00:27,039
and temple cultists and modern rabbinical judaism are just two

831
01:00:27,079 --> 01:00:30,280
different things. They don't see it that way. But I

832
01:00:30,280 --> 01:00:33,719
think the Christian I know, we we Pete and I

833
01:00:33,760 --> 01:00:38,039
were just on a stream together about dispensationalism and dispensationalism

834
01:00:38,079 --> 01:00:40,800
has kind of put a wrench in this understanding. But

835
01:00:40,800 --> 01:00:47,079
but Christian understanding historically is that look, we we we

836
01:00:47,199 --> 01:00:50,599
understand that these are this, this is this modern thing

837
01:00:50,719 --> 01:00:56,199
is a is a reaction to Jesus basically making the

838
01:00:56,239 --> 01:00:59,559
world believe in the in in the Hebrew God, that

839
01:00:59,719 --> 01:01:03,760
he was the messiah. He he he, He proved himself

840
01:01:03,760 --> 01:01:06,960
as Messiah because he fulfilled all this stuff, not just

841
01:01:07,039 --> 01:01:11,880
in the resurrection, but the world believes in yahweh. You know.

842
01:01:12,119 --> 01:01:17,360
It's and so anyway, but that's a very difficult conversation

843
01:01:17,480 --> 01:01:20,480
to have because you get you get all this social

844
01:01:20,519 --> 01:01:23,639
pressure and suddenly you're antisome, you know.

845
01:01:24,400 --> 01:01:24,960
Speaker 4: Uh.

846
01:01:25,239 --> 01:01:31,480
Speaker 3: And and that's unfortunate because my argument always back is is, hey, look,

847
01:01:31,760 --> 01:01:35,039
I'm I can be a gentleman. Here and we can disagree.

848
01:01:35,119 --> 01:01:37,599
I know you're not a you're not a Christian, you

849
01:01:37,639 --> 01:01:40,719
don't believe Jesus is a messiah. We can we can

850
01:01:40,840 --> 01:01:45,639
have a we can have a an adult conversation about this.

851
01:01:45,800 --> 01:01:48,519
But but you tend to get shut down pretty quick.

852
01:01:49,000 --> 01:01:54,239
And I think the way forward, the way forward on

853
01:01:54,280 --> 01:01:56,679
all these issues is if we could be just a

854
01:01:56,679 --> 01:02:03,599
little more honest of these things in the same way. Yeah,

855
01:02:03,639 --> 01:02:04,119
go ahead.

856
01:02:04,679 --> 01:02:07,440
Speaker 4: I think what you need is an adult relationship, not

857
01:02:07,519 --> 01:02:11,920
an adult conversation. And I'll explain what I mean by this.

858
01:02:13,039 --> 01:02:16,119
When you're in the Middle East, a lot of people

859
01:02:16,199 --> 01:02:22,039
pride themselves on having friendships across religions and across different sects,

860
01:02:23,360 --> 01:02:25,760
and having grown up with these kinds of friendships. It

861
01:02:25,800 --> 01:02:30,440
is an objectively good thing and these are real friends, right.

862
01:02:31,079 --> 01:02:36,519
But every time there's a war in Lebanon, each community

863
01:02:36,679 --> 01:02:40,920
goes to its own villages. Now, some of these villages

864
01:02:40,960 --> 01:02:45,280
are mixed, but when there's a conflict, each side stays

865
01:02:45,280 --> 01:02:47,800
on its own side of the village. None of them

866
01:02:47,800 --> 01:02:51,559
are so mixed that they would be sort of the

867
01:02:51,559 --> 01:02:55,559
neighborhoods would be fully intermixed. You know, there is this

868
01:02:55,639 --> 01:02:58,280
neighborhood for that sect, and this neighborhood is for that sect,

869
01:02:58,519 --> 01:03:03,440
and it stays this way. Why is this a more

870
01:03:03,519 --> 01:03:07,079
adult relationship? Not that I want the West to become

871
01:03:07,159 --> 01:03:09,800
Middle Eastern, although it seems that Western leaders want the

872
01:03:09,800 --> 01:03:14,760
West to become Middle Eastern. That's a terrible sense. But

873
01:03:14,920 --> 01:03:18,239
this is an adult relationship because what people understand is

874
01:03:18,280 --> 01:03:20,559
that in times of crisis, you're going to be first

875
01:03:20,599 --> 01:03:25,559
and foremost loyalty your own. That doesn't preclude the possibility

876
01:03:25,800 --> 01:03:29,559
of heroic friendship. That is, you go out of your

877
01:03:29,559 --> 01:03:32,559
way to save someone who is out of your own community,

878
01:03:33,320 --> 01:03:35,400
and to do things that are good for someone out

879
01:03:35,440 --> 01:03:39,519
of your own community. That doesn't preclude that possibility, nor

880
01:03:39,559 --> 01:03:44,800
does it make it less good. It is objectively good. However,

881
01:03:45,559 --> 01:03:50,519
you are aware constantly of the fact that the relationships

882
01:03:50,559 --> 01:03:54,280
may turn sour at a communal level, and in which

883
01:03:54,360 --> 01:03:58,000
case you will follow your own group and your friends

884
01:03:58,559 --> 01:04:01,440
will follow their own, and that might lead to all

885
01:04:01,519 --> 01:04:06,320
kinds of different tragedies. So it's not just about adult conversations.

886
01:04:06,320 --> 01:04:10,239
It's also about adult relationships. And part of these adult

887
01:04:10,280 --> 01:04:16,559
relationships is the recognition of the different as different. Because again,

888
01:04:16,719 --> 01:04:20,960
it's important to emphasize the rest of the world recognizes.

889
01:04:20,320 --> 01:04:27,840
Speaker 3: This similar to recognizing men and women are different exactly exactly,

890
01:04:28,639 --> 01:04:30,880
and so we don't understand that distinctions.

891
01:04:31,760 --> 01:04:33,880
Speaker 4: And perhaps the good news is that now that we're

892
01:04:33,920 --> 01:04:36,360
sort of backing away from the men and women are

893
01:04:36,360 --> 01:04:43,360
the same nonsense, we are going to explore differences in

894
01:04:43,400 --> 01:04:46,360
a more adult way, and in a more mature way,

895
01:04:46,880 --> 01:04:51,159
and in a more realistic way. My concern always is

896
01:04:51,159 --> 01:04:56,440
that we as humans are extremists by nature, especially in

897
01:04:56,480 --> 01:05:02,760
a group, and that therefore, rather than realizing that we're

898
01:05:02,800 --> 01:05:07,960
different and figuring out a way to navigate differences constructively,

899
01:05:09,679 --> 01:05:13,840
we then decide that okay, here we go, and it

900
01:05:13,880 --> 01:05:17,760
turns into more extreme elements. And I think that people

901
01:05:18,159 --> 01:05:23,360
constantly warning against the rise of extremism and calling any

902
01:05:23,480 --> 01:05:27,960
kind of recognition of difference extremism are really contributing to

903
01:05:28,000 --> 01:05:32,599
the possibility of this kind of backlash.

904
01:05:32,960 --> 01:05:40,639
Speaker 3: Yeah, that the denial of the monster in the room

905
01:05:41,079 --> 01:05:46,960
gives room, gives the very lessening of defenses in order

906
01:05:47,000 --> 01:05:53,199
to protect yourself from it. Yeah. So absolutely, you mentioned

907
01:05:53,880 --> 01:05:59,400
going back a little ways, you mentioned Serbia. What do

908
01:05:59,440 --> 01:06:02,679
you think of the uh, you know, people have noticed

909
01:06:02,719 --> 01:06:06,079
the Romanian shenanigans in their election. What do you think

910
01:06:06,119 --> 01:06:08,440
of the same thing going on in Bosnia.

911
01:06:10,280 --> 01:06:12,639
Speaker 4: I haven't been following that, to tell you the truth,

912
01:06:13,039 --> 01:06:16,679
I haven't nothing that. But I've seen clearly that the

913
01:06:16,880 --> 01:06:21,840
EU has decided to drop the fig leaf of respect

914
01:06:21,920 --> 01:06:27,079
for popular will and popular sovereignty right, And I think

915
01:06:27,159 --> 01:06:33,559
that is a It is kind of them to be

916
01:06:33,639 --> 01:06:36,800
more honest, and I hope that everybody else can be

917
01:06:36,880 --> 01:06:40,960
more honest as well, because if we're discarding the idea

918
01:06:41,079 --> 01:06:43,400
that there is respect for the popular will and there

919
01:06:43,480 --> 01:06:48,199
is respect for what the public wants, then there is

920
01:06:48,280 --> 01:06:53,400
going to be a reckoning. And they can, yeah, they

921
01:06:53,400 --> 01:06:57,920
can no longer pretend to sort of have popular support.

922
01:06:58,119 --> 01:07:00,800
They are ruling in a manner that is contrary to

923
01:07:00,840 --> 01:07:06,440
the interests of the public, and they are increasingly abrasive

924
01:07:06,679 --> 01:07:15,159
and unashamed in doing so. And the danger is that

925
01:07:15,239 --> 01:07:18,000
the more they continue down this path, and they've shown

926
01:07:18,039 --> 01:07:20,559
their willingness to crack down on dissent, and they've shown

927
01:07:20,559 --> 01:07:23,760
that they can try to ban Marie Lapin from running

928
01:07:23,760 --> 01:07:27,159
from elections, and they've been trying to overthrow Victor Oddband

929
01:07:27,199 --> 01:07:33,880
for a decade now, the more likely it is that

930
01:07:33,920 --> 01:07:37,239
there's going to be conflict around this in a way

931
01:07:37,239 --> 01:07:42,440
that they don't predict at the street level. And that

932
01:07:42,599 --> 01:07:46,920
is especially the case with the import of enormous numbers

933
01:07:46,960 --> 01:07:51,840
of people from hostile cultures who don't understand what the

934
01:07:51,880 --> 01:07:57,519
West is and have no interest in it. Right, So

935
01:07:57,559 --> 01:08:03,440
they're pushing towards They keep saying that any kind of

936
01:08:03,480 --> 01:08:09,239
opposition to them is extremist far right, and in doing

937
01:08:09,320 --> 01:08:16,319
so they are in a way, uh, animating the possibility

938
01:08:16,359 --> 01:08:18,680
of the rise of genuine far right.

939
01:08:20,000 --> 01:08:24,720
Speaker 3: Yeah, these all these, all these characters between a f

940
01:08:24,840 --> 01:08:29,680
D and Lapin and and uh, the Bosnian fellow and

941
01:08:29,720 --> 01:08:34,039
the Romanian fellow, these do not seem like far right figures.

942
01:08:34,359 --> 01:08:39,359
They seem like pop they seem like right leaning populists.

943
01:08:40,560 --> 01:08:45,319
Speaker 1: They're not anti they're not anti liberal right right.

944
01:08:45,880 --> 01:08:47,800
Speaker 2: You'd say that, no.

945
01:08:47,359 --> 01:08:49,800
Speaker 4: No, no, I I I wouldn't call somebody like Nigel

946
01:08:49,800 --> 01:08:54,479
far anti liberal. Most of Marine Lapan's assumptions are are liberal.

947
01:08:57,760 --> 01:09:01,880
So I don't see the I don't see that a

948
01:09:01,880 --> 01:09:05,680
true alternative has emerged. The idea that the AfD, led

949
01:09:05,760 --> 01:09:12,359
by a lesbian is somehow far right, is genuinely insulting

950
01:09:12,479 --> 01:09:13,119
to the far.

951
01:09:13,039 --> 01:09:20,119
Speaker 3: Right exactly exactly, and it's also intelligence. Yeah, I thought

952
01:09:20,199 --> 01:09:21,600
Zamor was pretty interesting.

953
01:09:24,520 --> 01:09:29,960
Speaker 4: Yes, yes, but he didn't. I think that part of

954
01:09:29,960 --> 01:09:34,880
the problem is the extent of public apathy, and I

955
01:09:34,880 --> 01:09:36,600
think we sort of need to be honest about that

956
01:09:36,680 --> 01:09:40,239
as well. The one of the things that I noticed

957
01:09:40,239 --> 01:09:43,960
when I came to the West was that you constantly

958
01:09:44,039 --> 01:09:46,640
find people in their thirties and in their forties trying

959
01:09:46,680 --> 01:09:54,279
to relive being twenty one. And that surprised me, and

960
01:09:54,279 --> 01:10:00,680
then I joined in it myself, to my shame, But

961
01:10:00,720 --> 01:10:02,000
that was one of the things that I that I

962
01:10:02,000 --> 01:10:04,079
initially noticed when I when I when I got here,

963
01:10:04,119 --> 01:10:08,600
and it just didn't really make sense. The other thing

964
01:10:08,720 --> 01:10:12,560
is that for the most part, there's a culture of

965
01:10:12,640 --> 01:10:16,600
complacency and keep your head down. I mean, the reason

966
01:10:16,640 --> 01:10:19,319
I'm self employed is because I told my former employer

967
01:10:19,399 --> 01:10:21,359
is that no, men can't become women and know, the

968
01:10:21,359 --> 01:10:25,279
West isn't racist. And this was enough to get me

969
01:10:25,359 --> 01:10:28,840
reported to HR. And I was told in no uncertain

970
01:10:28,960 --> 01:10:32,239
terms that HR said that you can't be a manager

971
01:10:32,279 --> 01:10:34,560
in this company, and so there's going to be a

972
01:10:34,640 --> 01:10:37,159
merger soon. Why don't you take a package and buzz off?

973
01:10:37,760 --> 01:10:38,560
Is that fair enough?

974
01:10:38,600 --> 01:10:40,600
Speaker 3: Were you with one of the big banks for us.

975
01:10:41,319 --> 01:10:48,479
Speaker 4: No, no, m So this kind of what surprised me

976
01:10:48,560 --> 01:10:54,439
the most really was that among thousands of employees, it

977
01:10:54,439 --> 01:10:57,640
seems that I'm the only one who said anything. And

978
01:10:57,680 --> 01:11:03,560
I'm not Western, I'm Middle Eastern. And I don't say

979
01:11:03,560 --> 01:11:06,720
this to brag, but I say this to say that

980
01:11:10,199 --> 01:11:13,800
nobody can save you. You've got to stand up for yourselves.

981
01:11:15,199 --> 01:11:15,439
Speaker 3: Yeah.

982
01:11:15,520 --> 01:11:18,000
Speaker 2: Agency well, well, let me ask you fit us.

983
01:11:18,039 --> 01:11:20,720
Speaker 1: Because I was listening to Carl Benjamin the other day

984
01:11:20,720 --> 01:11:24,399
and he did a very very long, long rant and

985
01:11:25,000 --> 01:11:28,199
at one point somebody asked him this. And the reason

986
01:11:28,319 --> 01:11:31,199
it stuck out to me so much is because a

987
01:11:31,239 --> 01:11:33,960
friend of mine has a friend in Britain too, an

988
01:11:34,000 --> 01:11:38,800
academic in Britain, and this person made the same exact

989
01:11:38,439 --> 01:11:42,720
within three days of each other. I heard two Brits

990
01:11:42,720 --> 01:11:45,960
say this, and two very educated, very smart Brits say.

991
01:11:46,800 --> 01:11:50,920
Somebody asked him and said, does anybody love England? Doesn't

992
01:11:50,920 --> 01:11:54,600
anybody love England anymore? And he said, and he said,

993
01:11:54,720 --> 01:11:57,079
and this other person said, it's not that they don't

994
01:11:57,119 --> 01:12:00,000
love England anymore, they don't love themselves anymore.

995
01:12:00,399 --> 01:12:10,000
Speaker 4: Yeah. And if you don't accept divine love, self love

996
01:12:10,039 --> 01:12:15,760
becomes becomes narcissism in the same way that you must

997
01:12:15,800 --> 01:12:22,239
balance love of country, love of family, love of God.

998
01:12:23,680 --> 01:12:29,199
You can't love yourself in a healthy way without divine filiation,

999
01:12:30,279 --> 01:12:32,520
without accepting that you're a son of God and are

1000
01:12:32,560 --> 01:12:38,119
loved by God. Otherwise your self love becomes like Indians

1001
01:12:38,119 --> 01:12:41,520
and pakistanis bragging about how great their own country is,

1002
01:12:41,560 --> 01:12:43,600
and then you look at the country and you realize,

1003
01:12:43,680 --> 01:12:52,199
hold on what So there is this reality here that

1004
01:12:53,520 --> 01:12:58,720
the loss of religion which has been embraced fully by

1005
01:12:58,760 --> 01:13:02,319
the elites. I mean, in Britain it was the Conservative

1006
01:13:02,439 --> 01:13:08,000
party that turned civil unions into homosexual marriage, as if

1007
01:13:08,039 --> 01:13:12,359
such a thing could exist, that they would make that

1008
01:13:12,560 --> 01:13:17,720
it would be the Conservatives to do. This shows you

1009
01:13:18,000 --> 01:13:20,840
how far the love of God is from the elites

1010
01:13:22,600 --> 01:13:25,359
and within all of the Western leaders that are trying

1011
01:13:25,359 --> 01:13:28,680
to revive the West. I think the only person who

1012
01:13:28,680 --> 01:13:32,119
speaks about faith in a in a semi in a

1013
01:13:32,159 --> 01:13:39,960
semi serious way is a Salvador's president. The others. I mean,

1014
01:13:41,760 --> 01:13:45,239
I believe that Trump felt something divine after he was

1015
01:13:45,279 --> 01:13:48,720
saved from the assassination attempt, but I still don't think

1016
01:13:48,760 --> 01:13:52,319
that's well developed. And you look across the West, and

1017
01:13:52,359 --> 01:13:55,920
who are the opposition parties. Nigel fire Arch doesn't mention

1018
01:13:56,079 --> 01:14:02,279
God as far as I'm concerned, Marie Lepenn mentions cultural Christianity,

1019
01:14:02,840 --> 01:14:06,279
as does the mood the a f D is literally

1020
01:14:06,359 --> 01:14:10,760
led by a lesbian. I mean, we can stop there. Uh,

1021
01:14:10,800 --> 01:14:13,840
it's only urban who's also serious about religion and about

1022
01:14:13,880 --> 01:14:18,840
his faith. These are the two say again, Yeah, I.

1023
01:14:18,760 --> 01:14:20,159
Speaker 3: Know he's reformed.

1024
01:14:21,159 --> 01:14:23,319
Speaker 4: I know I know he'll get there. He'll get there,

1025
01:14:23,319 --> 01:14:24,359
you'll you'll all get.

1026
01:14:25,279 --> 01:14:31,840
Speaker 6: His family is all Catholic, right, So this kind of

1027
01:14:32,479 --> 01:14:37,439
not loving themselves does have spiritual roots.

1028
01:14:38,399 --> 01:14:42,800
Speaker 4: And in a way if this you you mentioned the

1029
01:14:42,840 --> 01:14:45,760
sort of issue with Annietzschean right and and all of that,

1030
01:14:46,800 --> 01:14:49,079
Well that's exactly what the right is going to look

1031
01:14:49,159 --> 01:14:50,399
like without God.

1032
01:14:50,880 --> 01:14:51,319
Speaker 6: Mm hmm.

1033
01:14:51,640 --> 01:14:57,840
Speaker 4: It is going it is going to be racist in

1034
01:14:58,439 --> 01:15:02,359
a not in a natural love for your friends and

1035
01:15:02,479 --> 01:15:08,039
family way, but in a somewhat more hateful way. And

1036
01:15:08,119 --> 01:15:12,520
it's going to have consequences. So you need God back

1037
01:15:12,720 --> 01:15:19,560
in the political discourse. This is absolutely necessary. I think

1038
01:15:19,560 --> 01:15:22,239
in Britain there was a Liberal Democrat leader who apparently

1039
01:15:22,279 --> 01:15:25,960
turned out to be Christian, and they just kept on

1040
01:15:26,039 --> 01:15:28,399
attacking him for that until he resigned and they kicked

1041
01:15:28,439 --> 01:15:34,560
him out. But aside from King Charles, who whenever he

1042
01:15:34,600 --> 01:15:37,560
mentions Christianity has to insert a slam into the conversation,

1043
01:15:39,880 --> 01:15:44,079
no public figure in Britain that I'm aware of, mentions Christianity.

1044
01:15:46,079 --> 01:15:52,960
And this, to me is it's very dangerous. It's very, very,

1045
01:15:53,039 --> 01:15:58,399
very dangerous. You need to love your yourself and your friends,

1046
01:15:58,439 --> 01:16:02,760
and your neighbors and your community in an ordered way,

1047
01:16:04,079 --> 01:16:05,680
and that order comes from above.

1048
01:16:07,279 --> 01:16:13,600
Speaker 3: Yeah, otherwise you get positivism and uh, and that's just fancy,

1049
01:16:13,680 --> 01:16:17,720
that's just fancy tyranny. You know, the idea that whatever

1050
01:16:17,760 --> 01:16:24,119
we whatever we say, goes because just because rather than

1051
01:16:24,159 --> 01:16:28,720
you discover, you discover that which is true and lawful?

1052
01:16:29,279 --> 01:16:35,920
Is uh is a radical difference. Uh, that is I

1053
01:16:35,920 --> 01:16:41,319
don't think fully appreciated, especially by the hoy poloy uh

1054
01:16:41,399 --> 01:16:44,199
in in at least in the US. I don't. I

1055
01:16:44,239 --> 01:16:47,800
don't know about UH. You know, we're seeing and so

1056
01:16:47,800 --> 01:16:50,399
so as a result of that, you're seeing you know,

1057
01:16:50,479 --> 01:16:55,840
the UH controversy over the judicial in the UH in

1058
01:16:55,880 --> 01:16:59,359
the US right now, and it's it really boils down

1059
01:16:59,399 --> 01:17:03,199
to that, do we do we create law or do

1060
01:17:03,359 --> 01:17:10,279
we discover law. So and and that's a I want

1061
01:17:10,279 --> 01:17:16,199
somebody to talk to mention that at least at some level. So, yeah,

1062
01:17:16,359 --> 01:17:18,039
I don't know that. That just came to me while

1063
01:17:18,039 --> 01:17:18,640
we were talking.

1064
01:17:19,239 --> 01:17:25,279
Speaker 1: No, you're right, you're right, I guess, I guess I

1065
01:17:25,279 --> 01:17:31,239
got to keep the conversation going then, No, no, no problem.

1066
01:17:31,279 --> 01:17:34,479
I wanted to go back to something because you had

1067
01:17:34,640 --> 01:17:37,840
mentioned very early on in this conversation fit us that

1068
01:17:39,279 --> 01:17:47,560
talking about how the liberalism, the the concepts of how

1069
01:17:47,600 --> 01:17:55,600
the concepts of liberalism basically you they need you to accept,

1070
01:17:56,039 --> 01:17:58,159
they need you to almost take that on as like

1071
01:17:58,199 --> 01:18:01,920
the new religion. Like and you mentioned family. We've mentioned

1072
01:18:01,920 --> 01:18:05,640
family as being first and foremost in everything. You're going

1073
01:18:05,680 --> 01:18:08,479
to prefer your family above everything else. Well, that's what

1074
01:18:08,520 --> 01:18:11,199
liberalism has to do, right, And that's what liberalism has

1075
01:18:11,239 --> 01:18:15,079
been doing for the last hundred years, is tearing all

1076
01:18:15,119 --> 01:18:20,640
that foundation out, and it's torn the foundation of family,

1077
01:18:20,760 --> 01:18:23,479
of church of you know, they wrote about it in

1078
01:18:23,479 --> 01:18:28,279
the book The Authoritarian Personality, the Frankfurt School, Theodore Aderno,

1079
01:18:28,359 --> 01:18:31,640
those guys saying that basically, if we don't want fascists anymore,

1080
01:18:31,880 --> 01:18:33,319
we have to tear down the family. We have to

1081
01:18:33,319 --> 01:18:36,800
tear down the church. We have to basically tear down men.

1082
01:18:37,920 --> 01:18:43,199
So if that, if that is the default of what

1083
01:18:43,359 --> 01:18:47,960
most even people who are maga, most of maga is

1084
01:18:48,039 --> 01:18:51,640
liberal and they're you know, if you if you try

1085
01:18:51,640 --> 01:18:53,560
to tell someone who's maga, you know, you know, we

1086
01:18:53,760 --> 01:18:56,960
really need to you know, reverse o Bergerfeld. They may

1087
01:18:56,960 --> 01:18:59,560
be like, Okay, we need to reverse the law, but

1088
01:18:59,600 --> 01:19:04,680
the whole attitude behind homosexuality, we can't attack that. So

1089
01:19:04,760 --> 01:19:07,520
I mean, how do you go forward? How do we

1090
01:19:07,560 --> 01:19:08,199
deal with this?

1091
01:19:09,319 --> 01:19:12,840
Speaker 4: I don't have a clear answer for you, but I

1092
01:19:12,880 --> 01:19:21,239
think it's important to Liberalism is animated by an erasure

1093
01:19:21,279 --> 01:19:27,000
of difference and distinctions first and foremost, and I think

1094
01:19:27,199 --> 01:19:32,840
emphasizing difference and distinctions as being ordained by God and

1095
01:19:32,880 --> 01:19:36,880
as being a good thing is important. The second point

1096
01:19:36,920 --> 01:19:41,399
I'd make is that the erasure of men isn't going

1097
01:19:41,439 --> 01:19:45,840
to result in what is hoped for by the liberals.

1098
01:19:46,560 --> 01:19:52,000
It's going to result in the emergence of much more animalistic, unbounded,

1099
01:19:52,640 --> 01:19:57,880
merciless men with a mob cheering them on to help

1100
01:19:57,960 --> 01:20:02,920
them avenge themselves against the excesses of liberalism. So there's

1101
01:20:03,239 --> 01:20:05,439
got to be an answer here that sort of says,

1102
01:20:07,760 --> 01:20:11,439
we see what you're doing. We think it's absolutely wrong.

1103
01:20:11,960 --> 01:20:17,000
Here is the truth, and the truth starts with Christ

1104
01:20:19,600 --> 01:20:25,239
and it starts with the idea that natural law recognizes family,

1105
01:20:26,000 --> 01:20:35,840
nation differences, distinctions and their importance. Men naturally strive for hierarchy.

1106
01:20:36,720 --> 01:20:40,000
This is part of how we are and it helps

1107
01:20:40,079 --> 01:20:44,319
us and enables us to function. If I know my job,

1108
01:20:44,479 --> 01:20:47,359
I do it better than if I don't know. And

1109
01:20:47,399 --> 01:20:50,159
so if someone tells me what my job is, that

1110
01:20:50,319 --> 01:20:54,520
actually helps me in a way. And ultimately that comes

1111
01:20:54,520 --> 01:20:57,199
from God, who gives us our ultimate functions. But there

1112
01:20:57,239 --> 01:20:59,960
are intermediate steps here.

1113
01:21:03,520 --> 01:21:10,279
Speaker 3: I don't know what works now, Yeah, fear us you mentioned,

1114
01:21:10,520 --> 01:21:15,000
you know, liberalism of races distinction. But but Christianity has

1115
01:21:15,039 --> 01:21:19,159
the answer for this because at Pentecost, when the as

1116
01:21:19,159 --> 01:21:24,000
Pete mentioned a minute ago, when the when the curse

1117
01:21:24,159 --> 01:21:29,239
was undone, it wasn't undone in a way to erase difference. Yes,

1118
01:21:29,479 --> 01:21:34,239
it it made difference part of the answer. In other words,

1119
01:21:34,479 --> 01:21:39,319
everybody could could hear the mighty, the mighty deeds of

1120
01:21:39,359 --> 01:21:42,159
God in their own language via either a miracle of

1121
01:21:42,199 --> 01:21:45,479
hearing or a miracle of glossalleia. You know of tongues.

1122
01:21:46,000 --> 01:21:49,640
Uh uh, probably the latter of the former, but there's

1123
01:21:49,680 --> 01:21:52,800
some theological difference on that. But the point is is

1124
01:21:52,840 --> 01:21:59,439
that the different ethne the different groups remained even and

1125
01:21:59,520 --> 01:22:04,560
so that seems lost. In other words, there is this,

1126
01:22:05,279 --> 01:22:11,840
there is a celebration of of there is a there's

1127
01:22:11,880 --> 01:22:18,840
a manifold glory in all these distinct distinctions remaining and

1128
01:22:18,840 --> 01:22:23,079
and and being distinct, I mean with some admixture at

1129
01:22:23,119 --> 01:22:27,640
the edges. Uh. And I think that Christian thought being

1130
01:22:27,920 --> 01:22:32,800
so in the West, being so subsumed into John Locke,

1131
01:22:33,319 --> 01:22:38,000
the tabula rossa, which is where all this flattening comes from.

1132
01:22:38,039 --> 01:22:42,319
I think. Uh. And Locke wasn't a terrible guy. I

1133
01:22:43,079 --> 01:22:47,399
radically disagree with that pose it. But but but I

1134
01:22:47,439 --> 01:22:51,520
think I think a recovery of just oh, the story

1135
01:22:51,680 --> 01:22:56,319
is all these distinctions remained, and and yet there was

1136
01:22:56,359 --> 01:23:00,199
a there was still this reversal of of Babel. Well,

1137
01:23:00,880 --> 01:23:03,479
you know, that does seem lost.

1138
01:23:04,880 --> 01:23:08,840
Speaker 4: I think, firstly, you are absolutely right in everything that

1139
01:23:08,880 --> 01:23:12,359
you've said. Second point that I would add is that

1140
01:23:13,239 --> 01:23:16,399
even though the Liberals keep on preaching equality, they do

1141
01:23:16,479 --> 01:23:20,399
not live by it. If you look at the Labor Party,

1142
01:23:20,560 --> 01:23:26,039
this is the single most nepotistic cabinet and seat of

1143
01:23:26,079 --> 01:23:32,000
political appointments that has ever happened in Britain. In modern Britain,

1144
01:23:32,399 --> 01:23:35,880
they are by far the most nepotistic across the board.

1145
01:23:37,760 --> 01:23:40,960
You had the head of the civil service do a

1146
01:23:41,039 --> 01:23:43,880
hatchet drop to get rid of Boris Johnson and then

1147
01:23:43,960 --> 01:23:48,279
her son, and then she becomes Keir Starmer's chief of

1148
01:23:48,319 --> 01:23:52,359
staff and her son becomes a Labor MP dropped in

1149
01:23:52,439 --> 01:23:56,079
out of the blue. You have husband and wive teams.

1150
01:23:56,279 --> 01:23:58,399
One of them is working in communications, the other one

1151
01:23:58,439 --> 01:24:02,239
is in control of a ministry. And that you have

1152
01:24:02,399 --> 01:24:08,520
rinsed and repeated at nauseum. They Labor Party just decided

1153
01:24:08,560 --> 01:24:14,079
to appoint again Ayan to be their trade representative to

1154
01:24:14,119 --> 01:24:17,760
Ghana and a Nigerian to be their trade representative to Nigeria,

1155
01:24:18,359 --> 01:24:21,199
and on and on and on. And you see this

1156
01:24:21,239 --> 01:24:23,840
and you kind of go, well, guys, this is obviously nepotism.

1157
01:24:24,279 --> 01:24:26,560
You see it in the United States with a Pelosi

1158
01:24:26,600 --> 01:24:29,399
family and her relationship with Newsome and all of that.

1159
01:24:30,159 --> 01:24:32,399
You see it with a Kumo family, You see it

1160
01:24:32,399 --> 01:24:35,680
with a Bush family, You see it with the Clintons.

1161
01:24:36,920 --> 01:24:39,439
So these guys preach one thing and do the other

1162
01:24:40,680 --> 01:24:46,439
constantly across the EU. It's just one big gravy train,

1163
01:24:48,199 --> 01:24:53,239
one massive gravy train. And then the assumptions underneath a

1164
01:24:53,239 --> 01:24:57,600
lot of what they're actually doing today only work in

1165
01:24:57,640 --> 01:25:02,119
a Christian society. So we've ended up in a situation

1166
01:25:02,239 --> 01:25:08,600
where instead of having original sin, we have slavery, racism,

1167
01:25:08,920 --> 01:25:13,680
and sexism and homophobia and whatever it is, these various isms.

1168
01:25:15,359 --> 01:25:18,560
And you go and try that in a Muslim society,

1169
01:25:18,640 --> 01:25:20,960
like try and tell the Muslims that slavery was wrong.

1170
01:25:22,039 --> 01:25:25,319
You can't because Muhammad himself owned a bunch of slaves,

1171
01:25:26,840 --> 01:25:30,560
and it's permitted fully in the Pud'an, and it's not

1172
01:25:30,680 --> 01:25:34,960
been superseded by a new Testament. It's not been turned

1173
01:25:34,960 --> 01:25:38,960
around by a new Testament. It's something that's still fully embraced.

1174
01:25:41,359 --> 01:25:44,359
There is this guilt that, Okay, the West didn't treat

1175
01:25:44,439 --> 01:25:47,039
the people that it's subjected to its empire well enough,

1176
01:25:48,000 --> 01:25:51,159
but it treated them better than anyone else did, and

1177
01:25:51,199 --> 01:25:55,399
better than they treated each other. I mean, African slavery

1178
01:25:55,479 --> 01:25:59,119
was primarily an African affair before the Arabs and before

1179
01:25:59,199 --> 01:26:01,680
the Christian step in, and the.

1180
01:26:02,640 --> 01:26:05,079
Speaker 3: West Africans were pretty good at it, and the.

1181
01:26:05,119 --> 01:26:08,079
Speaker 4: West Africans were very good at it, and the people

1182
01:26:08,079 --> 01:26:11,239
who ended it were the Westerners, and they went as

1183
01:26:11,279 --> 01:26:14,560
far as to end it for the Muslim world. So

1184
01:26:14,600 --> 01:26:19,920
where did that impulse come from? You see the same

1185
01:26:20,039 --> 01:26:23,479
with how these holy groups have been made into the

1186
01:26:23,479 --> 01:26:27,600
Holy victim. In the Catholic Mass, Christ is the Holy Victim,

1187
01:26:27,600 --> 01:26:28,920
and I think it's the same for you, for your

1188
01:26:28,960 --> 01:26:31,159
reformed guys, he is the Holy victim. He's the Lamb

1189
01:26:31,199 --> 01:26:35,800
of God. And this has been replaced by being black,

1190
01:26:35,920 --> 01:26:38,399
or being gay, or being Muslim, or being a minority

1191
01:26:38,479 --> 01:26:41,479
or being this, that or the other, even though technically

1192
01:26:41,479 --> 01:26:44,239
now they're using the term global majority, so they're not

1193
01:26:44,279 --> 01:26:50,039
a minority anymore. But anyway, you see it with transness,

1194
01:26:50,039 --> 01:26:54,960
I mean, transgenderism is a spiritual claim at heart. The

1195
01:26:55,000 --> 01:26:58,560
idea is that there is something within you that is

1196
01:26:58,600 --> 01:27:02,720
different from your appearance, and that this is the real you.

1197
01:27:04,279 --> 01:27:08,279
As Christians, we call it a soul, but they, the perverts,

1198
01:27:08,279 --> 01:27:12,880
call it gender identity and try to sexualize it in

1199
01:27:12,920 --> 01:27:17,000
a way reminiscent of how Islam sexualizes Paradise, you know,

1200
01:27:19,079 --> 01:27:21,279
and you look at it and you're like, God, guys,

1201
01:27:21,359 --> 01:27:24,239
this is nuts. You can't go this far. This is

1202
01:27:24,279 --> 01:27:30,800
a little bit extreme cancelation. It's just excommunication, that's all

1203
01:27:30,840 --> 01:27:35,520
it is. And it operates in the same way because

1204
01:27:35,520 --> 01:27:39,279
you don't get canceled for de industrializing America, you don't

1205
01:27:39,319 --> 01:27:43,720
get canceled for the financial crisis, you don't get canceled

1206
01:27:43,760 --> 01:27:46,159
for any of that. You don't get canceled for I

1207
01:27:46,159 --> 01:27:50,119
don't know, selling weapons to evil people. You get canceled

1208
01:27:50,119 --> 01:27:55,479
for not professing the correct dogma. So it's a sin

1209
01:27:55,760 --> 01:28:01,119
of blasphemy that gets you canceled, it's not an actual

1210
01:28:01,199 --> 01:28:05,720
crime that you commit. And that's exactly Christianity, that's exactly Catholicism.

1211
01:28:05,800 --> 01:28:09,600
If you do something bad, you confess it and you

1212
01:28:09,680 --> 01:28:13,600
seek justice a case yourself if you're sincere in your confession.

1213
01:28:15,199 --> 01:28:20,560
Whereas here whereas what gets you excommunicated in Catholicism is blasphemy,

1214
01:28:21,560 --> 01:28:24,920
is going against the dogma of the Church, and it's

1215
01:28:24,920 --> 01:28:28,279
the same exact thing. So it's important to point out

1216
01:28:28,359 --> 01:28:32,039
to people that even the framework of the extreme liberals

1217
01:28:32,119 --> 01:28:36,079
is fundamentally Christian. And it's important if you want to

1218
01:28:36,159 --> 01:28:39,920
counter this sort of passivity, to explain to people that

1219
01:28:39,960 --> 01:28:43,239
everything that they think about the world is Christian. It's

1220
01:28:43,319 --> 01:28:45,920
just that it's a fine diverged standing of Christianity.

1221
01:28:46,640 --> 01:28:48,039
Speaker 3: Well, yeah, it's an inversion.

1222
01:28:48,520 --> 01:28:51,159
Speaker 4: It's an inversion of Christianity, and to the extent that

1223
01:28:51,199 --> 01:28:53,880
they're trying to be charitable towards strangers and so on,

1224
01:28:53,880 --> 01:28:57,359
and so it's a five years understanding of Christianity. It's

1225
01:28:57,359 --> 01:29:04,279
not a mature, realistic, grounded understanding of well ordered thinking

1226
01:29:05,119 --> 01:29:09,520
that animates Christianity, the faith that sort of built the civilization.

1227
01:29:11,199 --> 01:29:14,880
Speaker 2: So and it is a real Yeah, it's a real religion.

1228
01:29:16,520 --> 01:29:19,159
Speaker 1: Ron and I have a mutual Yeah, Ron and I

1229
01:29:19,239 --> 01:29:22,960
have a mutual friend, Charles Heywood, who sometimes Charles will

1230
01:29:23,000 --> 01:29:25,079
make the argument that it's not a real religion because

1231
01:29:25,119 --> 01:29:27,640
they're not willing to die for it. Oh but they are.

1232
01:29:28,359 --> 01:29:30,800
They're willing to spiritually die for it. And they're also

1233
01:29:30,840 --> 01:29:33,640
willing to basically cut off their body.

1234
01:29:33,319 --> 01:29:33,880
Speaker 2: Parts for it.

1235
01:29:33,880 --> 01:29:36,600
Speaker 1: They're willing to be cut off there, cut their lineage

1236
01:29:36,640 --> 01:29:40,640
off for it. To you know, sever they sever their

1237
01:29:41,560 --> 01:29:44,760
they sever any connection they have with the past or

1238
01:29:44,800 --> 01:29:49,039
their history. So that is that's a work that's worse

1239
01:29:49,319 --> 01:29:50,760
than the formal physical death.

1240
01:29:52,439 --> 01:29:54,439
Speaker 4: Yeah, absolutely, that's a form of death.

1241
01:29:54,520 --> 01:30:00,359
Speaker 3: Yes, yes, do you do you mind if we pivot

1242
01:30:00,399 --> 01:30:04,439
a little bit to Asia, because I would love.

1243
01:30:04,279 --> 01:30:06,479
Speaker 2: To pivot to Asia. Where'd you get that from?

1244
01:30:10,520 --> 01:30:15,039
Speaker 3: So I would love your thoughts on this podcast is

1245
01:30:15,079 --> 01:30:21,760
really Hey, it's Saturday. It's Saturday, so absolutely it's when

1246
01:30:21,760 --> 01:30:25,800
we're taping at least, so, uh, listen to me sound

1247
01:30:25,880 --> 01:30:28,399
old when we're taping. When was the last time any

1248
01:30:28,399 --> 01:30:34,399
of us use tape? So, so do you think it's

1249
01:30:34,439 --> 01:30:39,039
it's it's my posit that, uh, a more regionalistic reality

1250
01:30:39,159 --> 01:30:44,760
is coming regardless just as much as anything. As much

1251
01:30:44,800 --> 01:30:48,960
as uh, you have populism on the rise and so

1252
01:30:49,000 --> 01:30:51,560
on and so forth, but you also just have the

1253
01:30:51,560 --> 01:30:56,960
the changing calculus of power projection in that it's much.

1254
01:30:57,399 --> 01:31:02,720
It's just I can overwhelm these multi million, multi billion

1255
01:31:02,800 --> 01:31:07,680
dollar defense systems with very cheap weapons and so so

1256
01:31:08,119 --> 01:31:15,039
an extended global supply chain. That and the offshoring of

1257
01:31:15,680 --> 01:31:20,720
critical manufacturing. Forget the jobs question. Let's just talk about

1258
01:31:20,760 --> 01:31:25,800
strategic strength and that all these things are going to

1259
01:31:26,119 --> 01:31:29,399
are that that it is impossible for the US Navy,

1260
01:31:29,840 --> 01:31:34,439
even though we have ten carrier groups, it's that only

1261
01:31:34,840 --> 01:31:36,960
maybe four or five of which are ever in the

1262
01:31:37,000 --> 01:31:40,600
water at the same time. Can police all the different

1263
01:31:40,680 --> 01:31:43,239
choke points of the world that's coming to an end.

1264
01:31:43,319 --> 01:31:47,239
These are these are no longer functioning power projections, but

1265
01:31:47,840 --> 01:31:52,279
more of of power totems. If you touch my carrier,

1266
01:31:52,319 --> 01:31:55,119
We're going to nuke you kind of idea, which is silly,

1267
01:31:56,920 --> 01:32:02,399
but I see this in Asia really driving part of

1268
01:32:01,399 --> 01:32:07,920
the new the new reality of of of of a

1269
01:32:08,000 --> 01:32:11,960
of a new regional hegemony rather than a global hegemony.

1270
01:32:12,159 --> 01:32:13,359
What do you think about that.

1271
01:32:15,359 --> 01:32:20,439
Speaker 4: I think let's start with the Yeah. I think that's

1272
01:32:20,439 --> 01:32:23,000
a great introduction, and I think you're absolutely right and

1273
01:32:23,000 --> 01:32:25,479
that the West can, the United States can no longer

1274
01:32:25,520 --> 01:32:29,439
be the policeman of the world, especially given the level

1275
01:32:29,479 --> 01:32:34,079
of industrialization and the sheer extent of dependence on China,

1276
01:32:34,800 --> 01:32:37,079
and the fact that China is ahead of the United

1277
01:32:37,119 --> 01:32:42,439
States in a range of technologies. The Aussies identified sixty

1278
01:32:42,439 --> 01:32:45,600
four critical technologies and claimed that the Chinese are ahead

1279
01:32:45,640 --> 01:32:52,159
and fifty seven. If that is true, then it is

1280
01:32:52,319 --> 01:32:56,000
really a very hard time for.

1281
01:32:55,960 --> 01:33:00,079
Speaker 7: The West right now, and so it makes sense to

1282
01:32:59,840 --> 01:33:04,600
try to decentralize responsibility a little bit, because if you

1283
01:33:04,640 --> 01:33:09,119
look at China, they've got a border dispute with everybody.

1284
01:33:08,640 --> 01:33:12,359
Speaker 4: Around them because of the nine dash line. They've got

1285
01:33:12,359 --> 01:33:18,479
a dispute with India, They've got a dispute with the

1286
01:33:20,000 --> 01:33:25,880
with the Japanese, and this puts them in a position

1287
01:33:26,079 --> 01:33:32,159
where their sheer strength encourages others to band together against them.

1288
01:33:33,720 --> 01:33:36,319
The United States has been trying to get to that outcome,

1289
01:33:36,359 --> 01:33:40,079
but in an incredibly clumsy way, and really the main

1290
01:33:40,159 --> 01:33:44,520
obstacle to that outcome is American intervention. And it's much

1291
01:33:44,560 --> 01:33:49,600
harder for anybody to challenge China if it's allied with Russia,

1292
01:33:50,159 --> 01:33:56,479
the world's greatest natural resource, superpower and nuclear power. So

1293
01:33:56,600 --> 01:34:00,760
this is where the Trump doctrine comes in. Has built

1294
01:34:00,760 --> 01:34:04,880
this alliance with Russia and Iran largely as a result

1295
01:34:04,960 --> 01:34:09,399
of Western policy. And this alliance naturally dominates most of

1296
01:34:09,439 --> 01:34:12,319
the Eurasian land mass because if you're in Central Asia,

1297
01:34:12,359 --> 01:34:17,760
good luck, buddy, You're stuck Iran, China and Russia all

1298
01:34:17,800 --> 01:34:20,760
around you. You're gonna do whatever they tell you. And

1299
01:34:20,880 --> 01:34:25,840
these resources get to feed the Chinese manufacturing behemoth and

1300
01:34:25,920 --> 01:34:29,960
became captive and become captive markets for Chinese exports. This

1301
01:34:30,000 --> 01:34:33,319
has been the result result of Western policy. This is

1302
01:34:33,359 --> 01:34:38,800
the legacy of Clinton, Bush, Biden, Obama. You know, the

1303
01:34:38,880 --> 01:34:42,359
answer is to dismantle this legacy, and that requires a

1304
01:34:42,399 --> 01:34:47,119
reconciliation with Russia and a reconciliation with Iran to finish

1305
01:34:47,199 --> 01:34:51,239
these problems. And when you see the world this way,

1306
01:34:52,800 --> 01:34:56,720
the location of the border between Russia and Ukraine is

1307
01:34:56,800 --> 01:35:01,720
an unimportant detail. The point has been conceded that countries

1308
01:35:01,760 --> 01:35:05,119
get to invade each other in annex territory and the

1309
01:35:05,199 --> 01:35:09,079
law of conquest. The fact that we expect conquerors to

1310
01:35:09,079 --> 01:35:13,640
be civilized is another one of these Christian revolutions because

1311
01:35:13,680 --> 01:35:20,359
normally they're just mongols. But you can't have a world

1312
01:35:20,439 --> 01:35:26,199
in which invasion is illegal because it's just not how

1313
01:35:26,239 --> 01:35:29,199
it works. This is different from policing a society. You're

1314
01:35:29,239 --> 01:35:34,279
policing international relations, which are naturally violent and chaotic.

1315
01:35:36,920 --> 01:35:41,800
Speaker 3: Well, and this is why the neoliberal impulse is to erase,

1316
01:35:43,000 --> 01:35:47,640
is to not a race, but regard difference as immaterial

1317
01:35:48,239 --> 01:35:53,239
because in order to remove any what Schmidt would call

1318
01:35:53,399 --> 01:35:59,159
way of life that you know what I talk about

1319
01:35:59,199 --> 01:36:02,119
in common pre suppositions, to try to keep it because

1320
01:36:02,159 --> 01:36:06,159
I think it's ultimately theological. Whether you're whether you're an

1321
01:36:06,199 --> 01:36:11,279
atheist or a devout, your politics is still driven by

1322
01:36:12,159 --> 01:36:14,960
political theology. You can't get away from it.

1323
01:36:15,399 --> 01:36:20,000
Speaker 4: Yes, yes, So what Trump is trying to do with

1324
01:36:20,079 --> 01:36:24,159
Asia is to at least begin to dismantle this behemoth

1325
01:36:25,720 --> 01:36:31,039
by saying to the Ukrainians to pounce sand and now

1326
01:36:31,079 --> 01:36:34,319
that Iran's regional project is defeated, make a deal with it,

1327
01:36:34,760 --> 01:36:39,680
solve these problems. It becomes then a lot easier to

1328
01:36:39,800 --> 01:36:45,119
deal with China. You have countries like Vietnam, like the Philippines,

1329
01:36:45,199 --> 01:36:50,479
like Indonesia. They don't really like China because China doesn't

1330
01:36:50,520 --> 01:36:56,199
have allies. People forget this. China only treats the way

1331
01:36:56,199 --> 01:37:00,840
it treats the world. Commercially. They see eat on down

1332
01:37:01,079 --> 01:37:03,720
because of sanctions, and they try to milk it for

1333
01:37:03,840 --> 01:37:10,000
every dollar, ignoring completely that this breeds resentment. They see

1334
01:37:10,039 --> 01:37:12,600
that Russia needs them and they try to bleed it

1335
01:37:12,640 --> 01:37:17,000
for every dollar. That's how they are their their relationships

1336
01:37:17,039 --> 01:37:18,840
South American fish.

1337
01:37:19,000 --> 01:37:22,000
Speaker 3: So they got the South American The South American fishing

1338
01:37:22,680 --> 01:37:25,439
is yeah one I think it should be getting tons

1339
01:37:25,439 --> 01:37:31,000
of attention because they are they are raping the the

1340
01:37:31,000 --> 01:37:35,359
the the ability for the South Americans to feed themselves

1341
01:37:35,439 --> 01:37:38,239
from you know, from a.

1342
01:37:37,560 --> 01:37:45,039
Speaker 4: It's cautious free a motion, free exploitativeness and empathy and

1343
01:37:45,199 --> 01:37:50,960
empathy free, they don't give it dan about anybody. So

1344
01:37:51,319 --> 01:37:57,199
reducing American pressure on everybody else, including reducing American defense

1345
01:37:57,239 --> 01:38:02,760
of Japan, might be helpful. Because if Russia is free

1346
01:38:02,760 --> 01:38:07,319
from sanctions, the Japanese manufacturing machine is sitting right there

1347
01:38:07,359 --> 01:38:12,640
ready to compete with China, and they're willing. And Japan

1348
01:38:12,680 --> 01:38:18,039
and Russia are also a formidable combination against China and Japan,

1349
01:38:18,159 --> 01:38:22,600
Russia and Vietnam is a very impressive combination. And so

1350
01:38:22,720 --> 01:38:26,319
you constrain the Chinese by giving the Russians and the

1351
01:38:26,359 --> 01:38:32,199
Iranians options so that they're not dependent on China. And

1352
01:38:32,279 --> 01:38:36,119
again I have to emphasize this the stupidity of the

1353
01:38:36,239 --> 01:38:40,520
previous presidents who pushed this alliance together, who created it

1354
01:38:41,239 --> 01:38:45,960
unnatural as it is, through their arrogant, idealistic posturing.

1355
01:38:49,840 --> 01:38:56,600
Speaker 3: Well and the and the the structure of sanctions which

1356
01:38:57,000 --> 01:39:02,119
not only not only forced this alliance but also remove

1357
01:39:02,279 --> 01:39:06,079
the sponge for us to export our inflation. So it

1358
01:39:06,439 --> 01:39:11,560
absolutely came back upon and that uh uh, you know,

1359
01:39:11,680 --> 01:39:14,800
the the the you're a dollar issue. That's a little

1360
01:39:14,840 --> 01:39:18,479
technical we we you know, we could talk about that,

1361
01:39:18,680 --> 01:39:21,800
but but just think of one of the benefits of

1362
01:39:21,840 --> 01:39:25,880
a world reserve currency is you create out there this

1363
01:39:25,880 --> 01:39:29,560
this ability for you to push your inflation out. Now,

1364
01:39:30,199 --> 01:39:32,640
I think we would all agree you shouldn't be printing

1365
01:39:32,680 --> 01:39:36,159
all that money to begin with, but we were. We

1366
01:39:36,199 --> 01:39:39,800
live in the world we've been given. And to create

1367
01:39:39,840 --> 01:39:44,399
a sanction regime which basically takes that sponge and cuts it,

1368
01:39:44,439 --> 01:39:50,600
cuts half of it off. Uh, was insanity. You know,

1369
01:39:50,720 --> 01:39:54,039
actual inflation you know they reported, oh it got up

1370
01:39:54,079 --> 01:39:57,520
to seven eight percent. It was double that at least.

1371
01:39:58,960 --> 01:40:02,199
Speaker 4: The way that they cheat about inflation data and about

1372
01:40:02,279 --> 01:40:05,279
every other kind of data has become truly third world.

1373
01:40:05,720 --> 01:40:10,159
Speaker 3: Oh and the the the employment data in the final

1374
01:40:10,239 --> 01:40:14,279
days of the Biden before the election was so they

1375
01:40:14,720 --> 01:40:18,279
just look at the series of revisions. Uh, it was

1376
01:40:18,520 --> 01:40:22,880
so bad. But you know, again, I don't want to

1377
01:40:22,880 --> 01:40:25,119
get to tech this. The point of this talk isn't

1378
01:40:25,159 --> 01:40:28,359
to get super technical and in the weeds. But but

1379
01:40:28,720 --> 01:40:30,039
it's you know.

1380
01:40:30,199 --> 01:40:32,239
Speaker 4: I think you have a smart audience. They'll understand it.

1381
01:40:33,479 --> 01:40:33,960
Speaker 2: Okay.

1382
01:40:34,640 --> 01:40:38,279
Speaker 4: I think the point that you're making is that they've

1383
01:40:38,319 --> 01:40:43,399
been deceiving us about inflation and about employment for political ends.

1384
01:40:43,880 --> 01:40:46,800
M H. And then at the same time, you heard people,

1385
01:40:46,880 --> 01:40:50,199
you hear people from the liberal right talking about the

1386
01:40:50,239 --> 01:40:58,319
sanctity of deep politicized institutions. If, if even economic data

1387
01:40:58,359 --> 01:41:01,960
is being lied about for politic ends, then let's sort

1388
01:41:01,960 --> 01:41:05,880
of end this discussion and let's remember something that is

1389
01:41:05,960 --> 01:41:10,560
very important again to sort of answer the liberals and

1390
01:41:10,640 --> 01:41:16,119
the soft valied, the yellow valied liberals on the right.

1391
01:41:17,920 --> 01:41:24,119
States can't operate without a dogma, No institution can in

1392
01:41:24,159 --> 01:41:26,720
the private sector. That dogma has become make a book

1393
01:41:27,159 --> 01:41:34,039
fair enough. In a state bureaucracy, to organize something of

1394
01:41:34,079 --> 01:41:37,600
this magnitude of only speaking from sort of a practical

1395
01:41:37,720 --> 01:41:42,399
utilitarian perspective, to organize something of this magnitude, there must

1396
01:41:42,520 --> 01:41:48,399
be shared principles. There must be a shared set of beliefs. Otherwise,

1397
01:41:48,399 --> 01:41:51,119
a behemoth of the size what the federal government has

1398
01:41:51,159 --> 01:41:57,000
two three million employees, or considered a behemoth of the size,

1399
01:41:57,199 --> 01:42:01,680
cannot operate without a dog without a set of beliefs,

1400
01:42:01,680 --> 01:42:06,479
without a set of assumptions. These assumptions throughout the West

1401
01:42:06,520 --> 01:42:11,520
have been deeply left wing liberal, hostile to the idea

1402
01:42:11,600 --> 01:42:16,479
of national identity and hostile to God. There can't be

1403
01:42:16,720 --> 01:42:21,079
a serious political movement that aims to correct the situation

1404
01:42:22,039 --> 01:42:27,720
without recognizing this reality, and therefore they must come in

1405
01:42:27,800 --> 01:42:31,119
with an alternative dogma, otherwise they end up in the

1406
01:42:31,159 --> 01:42:35,199
same kind of chaos of the first Trump term, where

1407
01:42:35,239 --> 01:42:39,079
selections were made not on loyalty or ideology, but based

1408
01:42:39,119 --> 01:42:43,079
on trying to appease different branches of the Republican Party

1409
01:42:43,199 --> 01:42:48,199
and keep things in line. The actual result was factionalism

1410
01:42:48,359 --> 01:42:51,760
and a new Secretary of Defense and a new Secretary

1411
01:42:51,800 --> 01:42:57,079
of State every ten minutes. So you must have a

1412
01:42:57,119 --> 01:43:02,359
commitment to dogma. And what dogma are you going to promote? Exactly?

1413
01:43:02,520 --> 01:43:05,960
Restore the West? What is the West? Is it the Vikings?

1414
01:43:07,279 --> 01:43:11,399
Is it the dramatic tribes? What is the West? The

1415
01:43:11,439 --> 01:43:15,880
West is the union of Jerusalem, Athens and Rome. And

1416
01:43:15,920 --> 01:43:19,000
it cannot be understood in any other way. And that

1417
01:43:19,079 --> 01:43:23,800
is Christianity. Now I'm not going to say that's Catholicism

1418
01:43:23,800 --> 01:43:25,880
out of respect for you, but that we know that

1419
01:43:25,920 --> 01:43:33,279
it is without that animating dogma that says we recognize

1420
01:43:33,319 --> 01:43:37,640
the realities that have always been there, and we recognize

1421
01:43:37,640 --> 01:43:42,920
them in the light of Christ. Any prospect of reform

1422
01:43:43,159 --> 01:43:47,359
is seriously dimmed because it's just going to be tinkering

1423
01:43:47,359 --> 01:43:51,239
around the edges, leading to factionalism, leading to chaos, leading

1424
01:43:51,279 --> 01:43:57,159
to incompetence. Because there isn't a cohesive ideological position. There

1425
01:43:57,199 --> 01:43:59,720
isn't a hymn sheet that everyone can sing off of.

1426
01:44:01,359 --> 01:44:03,960
You're never going to be able to plan for every contingency.

1427
01:44:04,000 --> 01:44:06,359
You're never going to be able to sort of have

1428
01:44:06,720 --> 01:44:11,520
a way of dealing with every single government department. You're

1429
01:44:11,560 --> 01:44:15,840
going to need a set of operating principles. You need

1430
01:44:15,840 --> 01:44:20,000
to articulate those fair enough for your own geographic context.

1431
01:44:21,399 --> 01:44:26,199
But there has to be an intellectual bedrock underneath them,

1432
01:44:26,239 --> 01:44:28,520
and that's not going to be provided by you know,

1433
01:44:30,239 --> 01:44:34,159
make Britain great again, make Germany great again. That's not

1434
01:44:34,159 --> 01:44:36,760
got to do it. It's not going to be done by slogans.

1435
01:44:37,039 --> 01:44:38,439
It's not going to be done by slogans.

1436
01:44:40,000 --> 01:44:45,399
Speaker 3: It's, as Plato said, the righteousness that produces or the justice,

1437
01:44:45,520 --> 01:44:48,399
same word in the Greek Dikaiosune, the same word Paul

1438
01:44:48,520 --> 01:44:52,039
uses for righteousness in the New Testament, can only be

1439
01:44:52,119 --> 01:44:56,359
provided with. It has to be alien. In other words,

1440
01:44:56,399 --> 01:44:59,960
there has to be a standard that is outside the individu,

1441
01:45:00,359 --> 01:45:02,760
which is exactly what you're speaking of. There has to

1442
01:45:02,800 --> 01:45:05,439
be that target, There has to be that bat signal

1443
01:45:05,479 --> 01:45:11,159
for us, it's the cross, it's it's and and. But

1444
01:45:11,159 --> 01:45:17,000
but a nation cannot be it's, it cannot be its

1445
01:45:17,079 --> 01:45:21,680
own tell us. It has to have that that alien,

1446
01:45:21,800 --> 01:45:27,119
that outside of itself, beacon that it is working towards.

1447
01:45:28,600 --> 01:45:31,000
And Uh, I mean this is what got Plato and

1448
01:45:32,039 --> 01:45:35,960
Aristotle run out of Athens, uh, you know, and constantly

1449
01:45:36,000 --> 01:45:39,800
on the run because the was this was this idea.

1450
01:45:39,840 --> 01:45:44,039
I think they were ultimately seeing, uh, pointing towards a

1451
01:45:44,680 --> 01:45:48,880
realizing the pantheon was a disaster. There's a monotheistic ideal,

1452
01:45:48,920 --> 01:45:51,119
even if they didn't have the language to completely put

1453
01:45:51,199 --> 01:45:55,000
their arms around it yet. But that's that's what we're

1454
01:45:55,119 --> 01:45:58,239
that's what we're talking about. Is that's the recovery.

1455
01:45:59,319 --> 01:46:03,439
Speaker 4: Yes, And under that light you set your own national policies,

1456
01:46:03,439 --> 01:46:06,039
and you fix your own local issues, and you sort

1457
01:46:06,039 --> 01:46:11,920
of define your priorities based on your situation. But there

1458
01:46:12,039 --> 01:46:16,079
is a guiding light above all of that.

1459
01:46:20,000 --> 01:46:23,479
Speaker 3: There's going to be a guiding light you just whether

1460
01:46:23,520 --> 01:46:25,840
you like it or not, it'll just be this niche.

1461
01:46:26,279 --> 01:46:31,960
You know. Again, all politics is the is theological yes,

1462
01:46:32,199 --> 01:46:35,560
And if you know you can you don't have to

1463
01:46:35,600 --> 01:46:39,319
love Carl Schmidt. He was just But but that third

1464
01:46:39,520 --> 01:46:43,600
essay in that political theology book. Everybody talks about the

1465
01:46:43,720 --> 01:46:48,800
other essays, but the third essay in that book is

1466
01:46:48,800 --> 01:46:53,479
is critical because it describes reality in that all politics

1467
01:46:53,880 --> 01:47:00,760
are secularized principles derived from your understanding of who God

1468
01:47:00,880 --> 01:47:04,039
is and how He works in the world. And you're

1469
01:47:04,279 --> 01:47:06,720
and so you tell me you're an atheist. Okay, I'll

1470
01:47:06,720 --> 01:47:09,039
tell you what your politics is going to be. It's

1471
01:47:09,079 --> 01:47:12,760
going to be a material dialectic that is that treats

1472
01:47:12,800 --> 01:47:14,439
me as a bag of meat.

1473
01:47:15,319 --> 01:47:20,159
Speaker 4: And so, as a former atheist, I think atheists are

1474
01:47:20,199 --> 01:47:26,880
just deeply disappointed Christians looking for guidance. Mm. Atheists are

1475
01:47:27,079 --> 01:47:31,279
just Christians who are angry at the world not being

1476
01:47:31,359 --> 01:47:34,760
Christian enough and of God having given us free will.

1477
01:47:35,960 --> 01:47:38,439
Speaker 3: M okay, you know that's good.

1478
01:47:38,560 --> 01:47:42,279
Speaker 1: The one of the arguments I was having yesterday was

1479
01:47:42,439 --> 01:47:48,239
as people were complaining about Trump, you know, arresting judges,

1480
01:47:48,760 --> 01:47:54,039
and well, what about the constitution. Yeah, I'm having an

1481
01:47:54,119 --> 01:47:56,640
argument with people, and you really that's when you realize

1482
01:47:56,680 --> 01:47:59,920
the whole skyt Adams thing of you're watching two different movies. Yeah,

1483
01:48:00,119 --> 01:48:03,560
I'm telling them, I'm telling them the constitution doesn't mean

1484
01:48:03,560 --> 01:48:06,199
anything if you don't have a foundation. The foundation has

1485
01:48:06,239 --> 01:48:10,600
been washed away. It was it wasn't built. It was

1486
01:48:10,640 --> 01:48:14,560
built on sand, it was not built on stone. So

1487
01:48:14,600 --> 01:48:17,920
it's been washed away. And you know, people want to say, well,

1488
01:48:18,119 --> 01:48:19,680
we need to follow this, and we need to follow

1489
01:48:19,720 --> 01:48:21,399
that if we just follow this, and I'm like, no,

1490
01:48:21,880 --> 01:48:26,159
the whole thing is you know, I mean, Thomas and

1491
01:48:26,199 --> 01:48:30,239
I have been having this series where we're discussing continental philosophy,

1492
01:48:30,640 --> 01:48:33,680
and you know, basically in the first two episodes what

1493
01:48:33,720 --> 01:48:38,439
we said is Socrates deserve to die. He subverted the

1494
01:48:38,479 --> 01:48:43,600
culture of Athens. He basically he tore away the foundation.

1495
01:48:44,199 --> 01:48:47,880
And then when you look at what, oh, Plato and

1496
01:48:48,039 --> 01:48:51,840
a Plato and Aristotle get run out. Why because Socrates

1497
01:48:51,840 --> 01:48:56,880
had changed Athens to the point where they accepted all this.

1498
01:48:57,000 --> 01:48:59,520
And then when somebody comes along it says, no, it's

1499
01:48:59,520 --> 01:49:02,840
actually the way, it's actually points towards Monotheism, it actually

1500
01:49:03,039 --> 01:49:06,720
points towards Christ. He gets run out because Socrates had

1501
01:49:06,720 --> 01:49:11,119
perverted what was it what had existed, and what existed

1502
01:49:11,279 --> 01:49:15,399
was basically civilization, you know, And and our argument is

1503
01:49:15,399 --> 01:49:18,600
is that civilization hasn't existed since the Peloponnesian War.

1504
01:49:22,800 --> 01:49:37,319
Speaker 4: I don't know anywhere near enough to begin to answer you.

1505
01:49:30,439 --> 01:49:36,920
Speaker 1: What what What it comes down to is if everybody's arguing,

1506
01:49:37,920 --> 01:49:40,560
why is the house falling down, and they're like, well

1507
01:49:40,600 --> 01:49:44,239
there's well look at that beam right there, look at that. No,

1508
01:49:44,479 --> 01:49:48,560
it's the foundation. The foundation has been And if you

1509
01:49:48,560 --> 01:49:52,039
don't get the foundation, no, no.

1510
01:49:52,479 --> 01:49:57,359
Speaker 4: The foundation. I think again, it's not to sound like

1511
01:49:57,359 --> 01:50:01,319
a broken record, but perhaps it's it's it's it's the

1512
01:50:01,439 --> 01:50:07,960
enthusiasm of the confort. The foundation is Christianity, and as

1513
01:50:08,079 --> 01:50:11,199
Chesterton says, our God knows his way out of the grave.

1514
01:50:13,720 --> 01:50:16,039
So it's not dead and it's not over, and there's

1515
01:50:16,079 --> 01:50:19,640
no point in being sort of black pilled, as the

1516
01:50:19,680 --> 01:50:26,279
kids apparently say. But it is also important to recognize

1517
01:50:26,319 --> 01:50:30,439
where we are and how bad things are, and what

1518
01:50:30,560 --> 01:50:32,840
are some of the steps that we need to do

1519
01:50:33,079 --> 01:50:37,000
to sort of to answer this. So the foundation is

1520
01:50:37,600 --> 01:50:42,199
severely weakened, but this is an undying foundation, and this

1521
01:50:42,319 --> 01:50:45,439
is a foundation on which you can always rebuild. So

1522
01:50:45,880 --> 01:50:48,840
I just want to because I don't like black pilling

1523
01:50:48,880 --> 01:50:52,279
as a general approach to life. You know, I don't

1524
01:50:52,279 --> 01:50:57,000
find any use in it. Yeah, that's what I want.

1525
01:50:56,920 --> 01:50:57,840
Speaker 2: To tell the black pill.

1526
01:50:57,960 --> 01:51:01,600
Speaker 1: The black pill comes in when you're there rigid ideologue

1527
01:51:01,640 --> 01:51:07,520
about like like politicans, well in results. Yeah, I'm not

1528
01:51:07,600 --> 01:51:10,680
the biggest Thomas soul fan. I think people have over

1529
01:51:11,199 --> 01:51:13,039
people use him too much. And I think a lot

1530
01:51:13,039 --> 01:51:15,119
of the a lot of the reason in the States

1531
01:51:15,159 --> 01:51:20,000
that people use him is because conservatives like having a

1532
01:51:20,039 --> 01:51:22,119
black guy they can they can refer to.

1533
01:51:22,279 --> 01:51:24,680
Speaker 2: I'm sorry, I think that that's just that's just the truth.

1534
01:51:25,159 --> 01:51:25,800
But he said that.

1535
01:51:26,279 --> 01:51:29,760
Speaker 1: He said that there's there's no perfect, it's all trade offs.

1536
01:51:30,279 --> 01:51:34,680
Your life is going to be about trade offs, and yah,

1537
01:51:35,680 --> 01:51:39,479
yeah yeah. So I think that's where the black pilling

1538
01:51:39,560 --> 01:51:41,920
comes in. Is somebody who used to be a libertarian,

1539
01:51:41,920 --> 01:51:45,319
who used to be an narco capitalist. I look at

1540
01:51:45,319 --> 01:51:47,720
that and I'm like, oh, well, they I was right

1541
01:51:47,800 --> 01:51:51,439
all the time because I was always pointing towards the perfect,

1542
01:51:51,760 --> 01:51:53,720
and I was saying, oh, well, if it doesn't meet

1543
01:51:53,760 --> 01:51:56,159
this then and I stand by the perfect. I know

1544
01:51:56,199 --> 01:51:59,039
what the perfect is. If it doesn't meet this, then

1545
01:51:59,279 --> 01:52:01,800
oh it's all wrong. And that's where black pilling comes in.

1546
01:52:01,840 --> 01:52:05,359
It's like I knew, I knew voting for Trump was

1547
01:52:05,399 --> 01:52:08,039
going to be better than voting for Kamala because I

1548
01:52:08,119 --> 01:52:11,199
honestly think Kamala would have some of us killed. I

1549
01:52:11,239 --> 01:52:13,560
mean that under her regime, some of us would be

1550
01:52:13,640 --> 01:52:15,640
killed and some of us would be taken out.

1551
01:52:15,960 --> 01:52:19,840
Speaker 4: And that underestimated and we see it here in Britain.

1552
01:52:20,159 --> 01:52:24,159
What's happening to us? Yes, sorry I interrupted you.

1553
01:52:24,199 --> 01:52:26,720
Speaker 1: No, that's fine, And I think you know, if we

1554
01:52:26,760 --> 01:52:28,000
want to have it, if we want to have a

1555
01:52:28,039 --> 01:52:31,359
conversation the next time it is, I think a good

1556
01:52:31,399 --> 01:52:33,960
place to start would be the fact that, and I've

1557
01:52:34,000 --> 01:52:37,920
been talking about this a lot lately, is Trump can

1558
01:52:37,960 --> 01:52:40,600
do all he wants, but if the left ever gets

1559
01:52:40,640 --> 01:52:44,840
in power again, the people who supported Trump, they're going

1560
01:52:44,880 --> 01:52:49,560
to come after us. Yes, So, I mean that's that's

1561
01:52:49,600 --> 01:52:52,520
how the system is broke. The system is broken because

1562
01:52:53,039 --> 01:52:56,279
if people are just voting in every if people get

1563
01:52:56,319 --> 01:52:58,600
to vote every two to four years, and you have

1564
01:52:58,720 --> 01:53:01,119
the threat of someone coming back in who wants you dead,

1565
01:53:01,159 --> 01:53:05,640
who wants half the population dead, well I don't that

1566
01:53:05,840 --> 01:53:06,880
is that a democracy?

1567
01:53:07,279 --> 01:53:11,760
Speaker 3: Is that proscription? You're describing proscription in return of the

1568
01:53:12,319 --> 01:53:18,720
of the late Republic, uh, proscriptive reality, which is what

1569
01:53:18,880 --> 01:53:21,840
gave rise to one of the things that gave rise

1570
01:53:21,880 --> 01:53:24,119
to Caesar. Caesar was able to say I'm gonna end this.

1571
01:53:24,439 --> 01:53:29,560
I'm everyone's leader, and uh. And so that's the question.

1572
01:53:29,560 --> 01:53:33,720
You know, Michael Anton has written about this, uh, and

1573
01:53:34,119 --> 01:53:38,000
I find him pretty compelling on that. For For me,

1574
01:53:38,319 --> 01:53:42,560
the thing that I think would help, regardless whether you're

1575
01:53:42,600 --> 01:53:47,680
Catholic or or Protestant or or Orthodox, is a recovery

1576
01:53:48,039 --> 01:53:51,079
of the preamble to the Great Commission. You know, everybody

1577
01:53:51,119 --> 01:53:54,800
remembers make disciples of all the name everybody. But but

1578
01:53:54,960 --> 01:53:58,560
we forget this the sentence Jesus says right before that

1579
01:53:58,640 --> 01:54:02,279
which is all on heaven and earth has been granted

1580
01:54:02,319 --> 01:54:07,359
unto me. And so there is there's not a Yes,

1581
01:54:07,560 --> 01:54:11,640
power can corrupt, but there's not a there is not

1582
01:54:11,880 --> 01:54:17,560
a some kind of weird spiritual prohibition on the wise

1583
01:54:19,000 --> 01:54:23,760
exercise of power in a Christian framework. There's just not.

1584
01:54:24,720 --> 01:54:28,960
And we need to understand that that what is best

1585
01:54:29,079 --> 01:54:32,000
for the world, what is best for the sinners and

1586
01:54:32,039 --> 01:54:35,720
the pagans even, is for us to want for the

1587
01:54:35,880 --> 01:54:42,159
wise to exert power. And we can't be bashful about that,

1588
01:54:42,560 --> 01:54:48,800
you know. I see this general Jesus meek and mild

1589
01:54:49,640 --> 01:54:53,600
as a totalizing impulse over everything. And then there's no

1590
01:54:54,680 --> 01:54:57,439
you know, I shouldn't you can't even then you can't

1591
01:54:57,439 --> 01:55:00,399
even comment on who who needs to be dog catcher,

1592
01:55:00,520 --> 01:55:03,920
much less what are what's wise policy to take care

1593
01:55:03,960 --> 01:55:05,680
of people and promote peace.

1594
01:55:06,359 --> 01:55:13,680
Speaker 1: So I it's the we, it's the we lose down here, Yeah,

1595
01:55:13,800 --> 01:55:17,319
which is anyway I'm about to Jeff.

1596
01:55:18,000 --> 01:55:18,800
Speaker 2: All Right, gentlemen, I go.

1597
01:55:19,399 --> 01:55:22,159
Speaker 1: I know that Ron has a heart out, so fitess

1598
01:55:22,239 --> 01:55:25,720
please promote what your promote your substack, promote what you want.

1599
01:55:26,720 --> 01:55:31,079
Speaker 4: Oh, thank you. You could find me on modadgeopolitics dot

1600
01:55:31,119 --> 01:55:35,439
com and on uh convert or die dot net and

1601
01:55:35,720 --> 01:55:40,039
on my my Twitter, my dad g E O p

1602
01:55:41,600 --> 01:55:44,760
and thank you so much for for speaking with me.

1603
01:55:44,960 --> 01:55:46,800
It's been a pleasure to speak to you both, Ron

1604
01:55:46,840 --> 01:55:47,479
and Peter.

1605
01:55:48,920 --> 01:55:50,760
Speaker 2: Of course, Ron, what do you got?

1606
01:55:51,800 --> 01:55:52,239
Speaker 4: Uh?

1607
01:55:52,640 --> 01:55:56,279
Speaker 3: I you can find my writings at American Reformer and

1608
01:55:56,439 --> 01:56:00,159
at the American Mind part of the Claremont Institute. I'm

1609
01:56:00,159 --> 01:56:07,399
on Twitter, uh, Ron Dodson, Uh at Ron Dodson and uh.

1610
01:56:07,439 --> 01:56:09,840
And then I have a substack which is the Eyes

1611
01:56:09,960 --> 01:56:16,479
of Apilles and UH. But Ron Dodson at substack uh.

1612
01:56:16,520 --> 01:56:19,000
And Hey, for us, this has been a real pleasure

1613
01:56:19,119 --> 01:56:23,159
what a uh, what a brilliant mind God has blessed

1614
01:56:23,199 --> 01:56:24,760
you with. This was fun for me.

1615
01:56:25,199 --> 01:56:28,600
Speaker 4: You're too glad to thank you. Amazing to speak to

1616
01:56:28,600 --> 01:56:29,000
both of you.

1617
01:56:30,039 --> 01:56:32,319
Speaker 1: Yes, very much so, and let's do it again real soon.

1618
01:56:33,079 --> 01:56:36,720
Hang out and uh hang out until while we're closing this.

1619
01:56:37,039 --> 01:56:38,920
Thank you everybody for tuning in. Appreciate it.

1620
01:56:59,199 --> 01:56:59,239
Speaker 4: H