WEBVTT 1 00:00:05.040 --> 00:00:08.119 I'm Ali. I came out after twenty years of marriage 2 00:00:08.119 --> 00:00:09.400 and I have three kids. 3 00:00:09.960 --> 00:00:12.400 I'm Melissa and I have two kids, and I came 4 00:00:12.400 --> 00:00:15.000 out at thirty seven after an eleven year marriage. 5 00:00:15.400 --> 00:00:19.280 This podcast is about coming out later and the struggles 6 00:00:19.320 --> 00:00:20.760 and victories that come with it. 7 00:00:21.199 --> 00:00:22.960 When coming out feels like the end of the world, 8 00:00:23.320 --> 00:00:24.960 but it's really just the beginning. 9 00:00:25.679 --> 00:00:38.359 This is the Lesbian Chronicles. Welcome to the Lesbian Chronicles. 10 00:00:38.359 --> 00:00:39.240 This is two fur. 11 00:00:39.600 --> 00:00:41.840 I know our second episode today. 12 00:00:42.039 --> 00:00:44.280 This never happened two A days. I think we're doing 13 00:00:44.280 --> 00:00:46.880 to a day workouts and what I mean not last time. 14 00:00:46.920 --> 00:00:49.159 We've done this twice twice in one day. 15 00:00:49.679 --> 00:00:50.719 Oh god, I don't know. 16 00:00:50.840 --> 00:00:51.799 It's been a hot minute. 17 00:00:51.880 --> 00:00:52.679 It has. 18 00:00:53.000 --> 00:00:54.399 It's better when you're a person. 19 00:00:54.960 --> 00:00:57.520 I agree, you know, it is tough to do like 20 00:00:57.560 --> 00:00:59.439 the what do we're on riverside? 21 00:00:59.640 --> 00:01:00.159 Yeah? 22 00:01:00.240 --> 00:01:01.479 But yeah, and now. 23 00:01:01.320 --> 00:01:03.119 Because you have to worry about how your face looks 24 00:01:03.159 --> 00:01:05.599 when you're like, oh my god, I know. 25 00:01:06.120 --> 00:01:07.439 Yes, I notice. 26 00:01:07.159 --> 00:01:09.840 People comment sometimes on the real Oh but your face 27 00:01:10.000 --> 00:01:11.719 in that one, I can't remember what was said. 28 00:01:11.760 --> 00:01:15.480 Oh was the age gap if you were like because 29 00:01:15.799 --> 00:01:18.760 this woman said, twenty year age gap is acceptable. 30 00:01:19.280 --> 00:01:21.840 It is acceptable. Like, I mean it is, except I 31 00:01:21.840 --> 00:01:22.599 can't help my face. 32 00:01:22.680 --> 00:01:24.760 But again, I think when we think of age gaps, 33 00:01:24.760 --> 00:01:27.480 we're thinking of like the fifteen year old with a 34 00:01:27.519 --> 00:01:29.680 thirty five year old, you know, yeah, like something like that. 35 00:01:29.719 --> 00:01:31.480 And that's where I was like, Oh, there was this. 36 00:01:31.480 --> 00:01:33.439 Thing online recently where I saw this. They have this 37 00:01:33.560 --> 00:01:37.040 older man. I'm saying, like he's probably sixty five to 38 00:01:37.079 --> 00:01:40.280 sixty seven, and he's with what looks like Ohen. He's 39 00:01:40.319 --> 00:01:42.280 with like it looks like a twenty two to twenty 40 00:01:42.280 --> 00:01:45.920 five year old and they're like celebrating their love and 41 00:01:45.959 --> 00:01:47.599 like it's the age is just another. 42 00:01:47.760 --> 00:01:48.840 Together for twenty years. 43 00:01:48.879 --> 00:01:51.840 Well I literally was thinking yeah, right exactly, But then 44 00:01:51.879 --> 00:01:54.120 I was thinking the comments like I'm of course like 45 00:01:54.159 --> 00:01:57.319 my jaw drops and I'm getting judgy quick. And then 46 00:01:57.599 --> 00:02:01.200 then in the comments, it's like everybody's like that's so beautiful, 47 00:02:02.040 --> 00:02:04.959 like like acting like this is we've normalized. 48 00:02:05.400 --> 00:02:07.359 That's so funny because I always go to the comments 49 00:02:07.640 --> 00:02:09.360 once I see a video. I'm like and I have 50 00:02:09.479 --> 00:02:11.759 my thoughts yeah, and I'm like, what are everyone else's thoughts? 51 00:02:11.840 --> 00:02:13.680 And then I'm like, oh, they don't the either match 52 00:02:13.759 --> 00:02:14.759 or they don't they don't. 53 00:02:14.879 --> 00:02:16.960 For me, they don't almost they don't. 54 00:02:17.000 --> 00:02:19.360 I'm like, oh wait, how am I looking at this wrong? 55 00:02:19.520 --> 00:02:22.400 Like if you're a sixty five year old man and 56 00:02:22.439 --> 00:02:24.960 he's let's say even he's thirty, let's say I got 57 00:02:25.000 --> 00:02:27.919 it here. That's I still think there's something kind of 58 00:02:27.960 --> 00:02:28.560 wrong with that. 59 00:02:28.719 --> 00:02:30.520 I don't know. 60 00:02:30.719 --> 00:02:31.240 I don't know. 61 00:02:31.639 --> 00:02:34.280 Like there's that show Age of Attraction right now on Netflix, 62 00:02:34.280 --> 00:02:36.560 and I have watched that, and I felt a little 63 00:02:36.560 --> 00:02:39.280 creeped out when I just got well. 64 00:02:39.120 --> 00:02:40.000 There's a woman on there. 65 00:02:40.039 --> 00:02:43.479 I think she's like fifty five maybe, and she's with 66 00:02:43.520 --> 00:02:46.719 a guy who's like twenty eight, twenty seven, okay, and 67 00:02:46.759 --> 00:02:48.599 she has a son who's twenty nine. 68 00:02:48.719 --> 00:02:50.520 That's where I felt really creeped out. 69 00:02:50.599 --> 00:02:54.080 But I saw this thing that was like that the 70 00:02:54.199 --> 00:02:56.840 purpose of that show, like the underlying purpose is to 71 00:02:56.960 --> 00:02:59.840 normalize age gaps, like kind of like a like normal 72 00:03:00.240 --> 00:03:03.759 how everybody's kind of acting like Epstein's like no big deal, Like. 73 00:03:03.680 --> 00:03:04.759 Who says no big deal? 74 00:03:07.120 --> 00:03:10.719 The other side okay, the bubble I'm forgetting to say. 75 00:03:11.879 --> 00:03:14.360 That's why, like people are trying to sweep it under 76 00:03:14.360 --> 00:03:16.680 the rug. You know, people will be like, oh, well, 77 00:03:16.719 --> 00:03:19.360 she's sixteen as if that's. 78 00:03:19.159 --> 00:03:21.000 Like a sixteen is a baby. 79 00:03:21.199 --> 00:03:22.360 It is, dude. 80 00:03:22.479 --> 00:03:27.400 It blows my mind because yeah, sixteen is read write 81 00:03:27.479 --> 00:03:28.960 exactly my daughter's thirteen. 82 00:03:29.120 --> 00:03:31.120 Yeah, I'm like yet not even on her radar. 83 00:03:31.240 --> 00:03:33.400 But why are in the comments everybody was like that's 84 00:03:33.400 --> 00:03:34.560 so beautiful. 85 00:03:34.560 --> 00:03:35.080 Like that's just it. 86 00:03:36.120 --> 00:03:37.560 I know, I don't know how I feel. 87 00:03:37.639 --> 00:03:41.400 Yeah, I would say max age gap would be fifteen years. 88 00:03:41.639 --> 00:03:46.000 And if that's for someone who's over the age of thirty. 89 00:03:46.919 --> 00:03:48.560 You might be upsetting someone right now. 90 00:03:48.800 --> 00:03:53.120 I'm saying this with her in mind, because that's that's 91 00:03:53.199 --> 00:03:56.159 less than fifteen true, barely. I had to think if 92 00:03:56.199 --> 00:04:00.000 it was greater than an equal or less than Jesus. 93 00:04:00.080 --> 00:04:02.479 Anyway, let's move on to Urban Pie. 94 00:04:02.719 --> 00:04:04.280 Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, that's right. Okay. 95 00:04:04.319 --> 00:04:06.560 So, well, one thing is Urban Pie was in Bar Rescue, 96 00:04:06.599 --> 00:04:08.960 which we're so proud about, and I haven't seen the 97 00:04:08.960 --> 00:04:11.319 show yet, but I'm going to watch it with Urban Pie. 98 00:04:11.680 --> 00:04:14.199 Yeah, they're showing it tonight. Yeah, okay, so maybe every 99 00:04:14.280 --> 00:04:17.199 night this weekend. They're showing it at eight o'clock this 100 00:04:17.240 --> 00:04:20.800 whole air after that. But Urban Pie is a little 101 00:04:20.839 --> 00:04:25.560 pizza restaurant in the Kirkwood neighborhood of Atlanta, super cute 102 00:04:25.600 --> 00:04:28.480 and lesbian owned. They had that TV show Bar Rescue 103 00:04:28.480 --> 00:04:31.279 come in and revamp the place yep, and does it 104 00:04:31.319 --> 00:04:32.279 looks super cool? 105 00:04:32.399 --> 00:04:34.079 And it does look super cool. So we're going to 106 00:04:34.199 --> 00:04:39.439 kick off takeover yeah, April twenty fifth. It starts at 107 00:04:39.680 --> 00:04:42.120 eight pm or seven pm one, I want to say eight, 108 00:04:42.439 --> 00:04:47.560 but I know it's early enough that like it's doable. 109 00:04:47.600 --> 00:04:49.600 It's doable for me who likes to be in bed 110 00:04:49.639 --> 00:04:52.560 by ten thirty. But we have a kick ass DJ. 111 00:04:52.879 --> 00:04:55.959 We're taking over the patio. It's going to be it's 112 00:04:56.000 --> 00:04:59.480 the last Saturday of the month. April twenty fifth. Definitely 113 00:04:59.560 --> 00:05:01.199 come out Urban Pie Kirkwood. 114 00:05:01.959 --> 00:05:02.639 We starts at. 115 00:05:02.560 --> 00:05:04.160 Really seven seven pm. 116 00:05:04.240 --> 00:05:08.120 And j Phoebe she's amazing. Yeah, I love how she 117 00:05:08.279 --> 00:05:09.720 dances during dude. 118 00:05:09.800 --> 00:05:10.600 She's fun to watch. 119 00:05:10.639 --> 00:05:11.519 She has fun to watch. 120 00:05:11.680 --> 00:05:13.319 So it's gonna be a good time for sure, because 121 00:05:13.399 --> 00:05:15.519 y'all she'll like put the song on and then go 122 00:05:15.560 --> 00:05:16.399 out on the dance floor. 123 00:05:16.519 --> 00:05:19.079 Totally, so totally it's And then I'm sure the more 124 00:05:19.120 --> 00:05:20.879 I drink, I annoy the shit out of her with 125 00:05:20.959 --> 00:05:23.839 like putting my suggestions for the request. 126 00:05:23.959 --> 00:05:27.120 I DJ that one time and everybody's like up my nose. 127 00:05:26.920 --> 00:05:28.160 Like can you play this? Can you play this? 128 00:05:28.240 --> 00:05:30.399 And I'm like, I don't have Wi Fi and I 129 00:05:30.439 --> 00:05:32.360 have to, like you have to download the songs and 130 00:05:33.000 --> 00:05:35.319 play them. It's not like everybody, I think thinks it's 131 00:05:35.319 --> 00:05:36.399 like a Spotify situation. 132 00:05:36.519 --> 00:05:38.600 There's like a couple though, hit that. I know this 133 00:05:38.639 --> 00:05:41.240 group so well now from Takeover. Oh yeah, there's a 134 00:05:41.240 --> 00:05:45.199 few like you gotta do gold Digger, you gotta do 135 00:05:45.240 --> 00:05:45.920 Whitney Houston. 136 00:05:45.959 --> 00:05:47.600 If you hit those, you're good. 137 00:05:47.639 --> 00:05:48.240 It's a great part. 138 00:05:48.279 --> 00:05:48.639 Solid. 139 00:05:49.079 --> 00:05:51.480 But it's like sometimes the DJs go off the menu 140 00:05:51.560 --> 00:05:53.560 and they try to do a little elect like dance. 141 00:05:53.959 --> 00:05:58.199 What do you call the dm Yeah, it's just sandstorm. 142 00:05:58.800 --> 00:06:00.240 I'm not getting out there. 143 00:06:00.279 --> 00:06:04.600 I don't even know that's ADM, right, I guess what's that? 144 00:06:05.160 --> 00:06:05.399 Can you? 145 00:06:09.279 --> 00:06:11.399 Oh my god, stop leave me alone. 146 00:06:11.639 --> 00:06:15.560 I'm just kidding. Okay, So you found our guests. 147 00:06:15.879 --> 00:06:19.319 I met them while I was visiting Texas and a 148 00:06:19.360 --> 00:06:22.560 lovely couple that has been together for what five years? 149 00:06:22.759 --> 00:06:25.560 Mary and Jennifer, Welcome to the show. 150 00:06:26.000 --> 00:06:26.879 Thanks for having us. 151 00:06:27.079 --> 00:06:29.920 Yeah, we decided we talk far too much about breakups 152 00:06:29.920 --> 00:06:34.079 and unhappiness that I needed a blended, happy, workout family seriously, 153 00:06:34.480 --> 00:06:36.600 and people actually do say that, They're like, does it 154 00:06:36.639 --> 00:06:40.079 ever work out? Because you guys, it seems like we 155 00:06:40.079 --> 00:06:43.399 always are talking about breaking up, so we want to know, 156 00:06:43.560 --> 00:06:45.959 like how you met, Like, give us a little background, 157 00:06:46.040 --> 00:06:48.399 give us first start where you came out, and then 158 00:06:48.399 --> 00:06:51.800 we'll talk about the Yeah, the meeting. Let's start with Jennifer. 159 00:06:52.040 --> 00:06:54.319 Yeah. Yeah, I mean I think our two stories are 160 00:06:54.399 --> 00:06:55.040 quite different. 161 00:06:55.040 --> 00:06:56.879 We just happened to collide at the same time in 162 00:06:56.879 --> 00:07:01.920 twenty twenty one. But yeah, mine was I had been 163 00:07:01.920 --> 00:07:05.480 in a twenty year marriage and you know, got married 164 00:07:05.519 --> 00:07:08.040 young and did the family thing, had a few kids, 165 00:07:08.600 --> 00:07:13.399 and after you know, waking up and reading Untamed and 166 00:07:14.399 --> 00:07:16.639 you know, having that life changing event, I just couldn't 167 00:07:16.639 --> 00:07:21.600 see the world the same and started reevaluating everything. And 168 00:07:21.959 --> 00:07:25.839 I in twenty twenty one decided to you know, upend 169 00:07:25.959 --> 00:07:28.720 everything and I asked my husband for a divorce and 170 00:07:28.800 --> 00:07:31.120 we started down that process with the kids. 171 00:07:31.160 --> 00:07:35.480 And how long does that take from untamed to six 172 00:07:35.519 --> 00:07:36.720 months building up your courage? 173 00:07:36.800 --> 00:07:40.839 Okay, oh, reading Untamed and courage weeks? 174 00:07:41.040 --> 00:07:41.279 Wow? 175 00:07:41.600 --> 00:07:42.480 Yeah, I was fast. 176 00:07:42.680 --> 00:07:45.240 Yeah, And I think I was probably real fast to 177 00:07:45.240 --> 00:07:47.959 get out of the gate and start trying to act out. 178 00:07:48.040 --> 00:07:48.759 Being with women. 179 00:07:48.879 --> 00:07:49.360 Yeah. 180 00:07:49.639 --> 00:07:56.680 I was embarrassingly eager for that, if I'm honest, But it. 181 00:07:56.759 --> 00:07:59.279 Was gonna say that's not embarrassing everybody, is we all 182 00:07:59.319 --> 00:07:59.959 turn into like. 183 00:08:01.399 --> 00:08:04.000 Yeah, oh the total fourteen year old boy right away. 184 00:08:04.079 --> 00:08:06.199 But yeah, it was real quick, and I you know, 185 00:08:06.240 --> 00:08:07.639 I think it was just the straw that broke the 186 00:08:07.639 --> 00:08:10.480 camel's back. I mean, I think there was many reasons 187 00:08:10.680 --> 00:08:13.720 probably to part ways, and really it was just about 188 00:08:13.759 --> 00:08:16.759 trying to live my authentic life and be true to 189 00:08:16.759 --> 00:08:18.879 who I was. It was something that I think I 190 00:08:18.959 --> 00:08:22.560 touched in college and I didn't get to fully act 191 00:08:22.600 --> 00:08:25.000 out then and it just kind of set dormant. And 192 00:08:25.079 --> 00:08:27.839 I was like, I want to go revisit that, but 193 00:08:27.920 --> 00:08:30.959 outside of marriage, and so I did and asked for 194 00:08:31.000 --> 00:08:31.519 a divorce. 195 00:08:31.600 --> 00:08:32.600 We started that process. 196 00:08:32.679 --> 00:08:36.440 We did it in a collaborative way, which was really 197 00:08:36.480 --> 00:08:38.440 good for the kids, and so we co parent well. 198 00:08:38.480 --> 00:08:42.440 And then I started dating a woman and did that 199 00:08:42.480 --> 00:08:43.559 for about six months. 200 00:08:44.480 --> 00:08:45.440 But it was interesting. 201 00:08:45.519 --> 00:08:49.960 I felt like, rather than making myself fully available, I 202 00:08:50.000 --> 00:08:51.759 only wanted to date married women. 203 00:08:52.240 --> 00:08:53.039 Interesting. 204 00:08:53.879 --> 00:08:57.360 Wow. Yeah, with the idea being that I was very 205 00:08:57.360 --> 00:08:58.480 busy with my work. 206 00:08:58.320 --> 00:08:59.080 It was safe. 207 00:08:59.399 --> 00:09:00.840 It's very right. 208 00:09:00.879 --> 00:09:03.519 I thought you meant like you wanted the ones that 209 00:09:03.559 --> 00:09:05.840 were taken, but it was like a safety thing. 210 00:09:05.919 --> 00:09:08.039 No, I wanted them to be married to men. I 211 00:09:08.039 --> 00:09:08.559 wanted them. 212 00:09:08.639 --> 00:09:10.399 Did you know it like in your head you were 213 00:09:10.399 --> 00:09:12.639 doing that or was it like in after therapy you're like, wow, 214 00:09:12.679 --> 00:09:15.600 I was picking out available people because I really wasn't 215 00:09:15.600 --> 00:09:16.600 available yet. 216 00:09:16.919 --> 00:09:20.399 It was both. Yeah, I think I didn't want to 217 00:09:20.480 --> 00:09:22.000 be fully. 218 00:09:22.039 --> 00:09:24.240 I didn't want to be number one to anyone because 219 00:09:24.279 --> 00:09:26.200 I didn't have space for them to be a number one. 220 00:09:26.240 --> 00:09:28.919 I was busy with work, I was busy with my kids. 221 00:09:28.919 --> 00:09:30.639 I knew I had just blown up my family and 222 00:09:30.679 --> 00:09:32.759 I didn't have space for it. And I'm I didn't 223 00:09:32.799 --> 00:09:34.960 want someone wanting me more than I could want them. 224 00:09:35.240 --> 00:09:39.039 I needed them to be, you know, safely away. 225 00:09:39.279 --> 00:09:39.720 Yeah. 226 00:09:39.799 --> 00:09:43.360 How old was your youngest when you Denye? Okay, Yeah, 227 00:09:43.799 --> 00:09:46.080 So it was hard, but it was a safe thing. 228 00:09:46.120 --> 00:09:49.480 So the first relationship was very transactional and it worked 229 00:09:49.480 --> 00:09:53.000 great for what it was there to do. And then 230 00:09:53.039 --> 00:09:56.639 that you know, fizzled out and I I had a 231 00:09:56.639 --> 00:09:58.799 friend took a picture, one picture and she was like, 232 00:09:58.799 --> 00:10:01.240 you need to get on the apps, and so one 233 00:10:01.320 --> 00:10:04.279 night I did, and then I just got real lucky 234 00:10:04.559 --> 00:10:05.639 and met Mary. 235 00:10:05.919 --> 00:10:09.480 So wow, okay, so yeah tell us Mary, give us 236 00:10:09.519 --> 00:10:10.360 your background. 237 00:10:10.519 --> 00:10:14.120 Yeah, mine is a little messier, maybe lots of things 238 00:10:14.120 --> 00:10:15.039 that maybe wouldn't advise. 239 00:10:15.159 --> 00:10:19.080 So's you I love Wooden advice. 240 00:10:19.559 --> 00:10:21.240 Yeah, totally, this is what we need to hear. 241 00:10:21.399 --> 00:10:21.639 Yeah. 242 00:10:21.679 --> 00:10:25.600 So like when I so, I was same, I was married. 243 00:10:25.759 --> 00:10:28.360 I was married for ten ten plus years, but say 244 00:10:28.399 --> 00:10:30.279 that relationship. We took ten years to get married, so 245 00:10:30.559 --> 00:10:32.960 we were together for like, oh I was married for 246 00:10:32.960 --> 00:10:33.720 what fourteen years? 247 00:10:33.960 --> 00:10:37.440 How you forget? This was about like twenty four year relationship. 248 00:10:37.679 --> 00:10:40.440 But when I was like twenty twenty one, twenty two, 249 00:10:40.480 --> 00:10:44.080 he was like, I think you're attracted to women that. Yeah, 250 00:10:44.080 --> 00:10:46.240 we weren't married at the time, but yeah, he pointed 251 00:10:46.279 --> 00:10:48.240 it out, and I was like, well yeah, but you know, 252 00:10:48.240 --> 00:10:50.440 there's just not anyone who's like she should explore that, 253 00:10:50.480 --> 00:10:52.159 you know, before we get married, before we have kids. 254 00:10:52.399 --> 00:10:54.200 I was like, oh, that just feels unsafe, right. I 255 00:10:54.240 --> 00:10:57.279 was like worried just physical safety. So I just never 256 00:10:57.320 --> 00:10:59.639 touched it. And then in twenty eighteen, I just like 257 00:10:59.720 --> 00:11:02.480 left job and I was kind of in a space where, like, 258 00:11:03.080 --> 00:11:05.480 you know, I just need to figure things out. And yeah, 259 00:11:05.480 --> 00:11:08.279 and I went to the gym, and I kept going 260 00:11:08.320 --> 00:11:10.639 to this one instructor's class and then one day I 261 00:11:10.720 --> 00:11:13.360 was like, you know, at academy, trying on cute workout 262 00:11:13.360 --> 00:11:14.840 outfits and I'm like, what am I doing? 263 00:11:14.879 --> 00:11:17.519 And I was like, oh, oh wow. 264 00:11:17.600 --> 00:11:17.919 Yeah. 265 00:11:18.000 --> 00:11:19.480 So I went home and I told him. 266 00:11:19.519 --> 00:11:21.840 I was like, hey, remember that conversation we had back 267 00:11:21.879 --> 00:11:24.799 when I was twenty one, Like I found someone? 268 00:11:25.200 --> 00:11:25.679 Oh my god. 269 00:11:25.720 --> 00:11:26.759 I was like, well, why do you ask her out 270 00:11:26.759 --> 00:11:28.159 when you go to dinner? And I'm like, well, I 271 00:11:28.159 --> 00:11:30.039 don't want to go to dinner with her, that's not 272 00:11:30.360 --> 00:11:32.759 That's not what I'm thinking about. And so he's like, well, 273 00:11:32.759 --> 00:11:35.559 you're free, rein, and so we kind of that was 274 00:11:35.559 --> 00:11:37.399 the start of an open relationship for me. 275 00:11:37.759 --> 00:11:38.559 Like how but what. 276 00:11:38.600 --> 00:11:39.840 He wasn't threatened at all? 277 00:11:40.360 --> 00:11:43.919 He he wasn't, I think because we had talked about 278 00:11:43.960 --> 00:11:48.320 this and and I'll say from that time for like 279 00:11:48.320 --> 00:11:50.080 twenty one up till how old am I at that 280 00:11:50.120 --> 00:11:54.799 time forty two? He like very very open about being 281 00:11:54.799 --> 00:11:57.639 attracted to women, Like I mean, honestly, all I did 282 00:11:57.720 --> 00:12:01.320 was watch lest me important, Yeah, constantly, Like he was 283 00:12:01.360 --> 00:12:04.159 aware of this, so it wasn't a big surprise to him, 284 00:12:04.200 --> 00:12:05.799 and I think maybe kind of a relief that it 285 00:12:05.840 --> 00:12:08.240 was just like out there, and so he's like. 286 00:12:08.320 --> 00:12:09.600 Go, go pursue this. 287 00:12:09.639 --> 00:12:11.679 So my my pursuit was to go stand in the 288 00:12:11.679 --> 00:12:14.840 front row of this woman's classes for six months and 289 00:12:14.879 --> 00:12:15.480 just stare at. 290 00:12:15.360 --> 00:12:19.639 Her very embarrassing, made her comfortable. 291 00:12:19.759 --> 00:12:22.039 No, not at all super straight, And another friend in 292 00:12:22.039 --> 00:12:25.600 class was like, she's super straight, and like well, and and. 293 00:12:25.600 --> 00:12:27.480 My attitude at the time was like, it's all right, 294 00:12:27.720 --> 00:12:30.159 I will be persuasive. Like I just was so focused. 295 00:12:33.120 --> 00:12:38.159 I think, well, my dream job had just like I 296 00:12:38.200 --> 00:12:39.879 had been unemployed and then my dream job like fell 297 00:12:39.919 --> 00:12:41.559 out of the sky and I was like, I just 298 00:12:41.600 --> 00:12:43.240 have to ask for it and asked the universe for it. 299 00:12:43.399 --> 00:12:45.039 And I told him that and he was like, I 300 00:12:45.039 --> 00:12:46.279 don't think it works that way. 301 00:12:46.600 --> 00:12:48.799 So anyway, finally, after six months in that working, he's like, well, 302 00:12:48.799 --> 00:12:49.759 why are you get on the apps? 303 00:12:49.879 --> 00:12:54.720 So I did? He said this, yes, yes, yeah. 304 00:12:54.600 --> 00:12:57.120 No, no, you don't want a question, you don't want. 305 00:12:56.960 --> 00:12:59.679 To have him. 306 00:12:59.720 --> 00:13:02.480 So then we started sort of outlining what an open 307 00:13:02.519 --> 00:13:06.519 relationship would look like with me dating like dating, My 308 00:13:06.639 --> 00:13:09.559 rule was like no and the way I kind of 309 00:13:09.720 --> 00:13:14.279 justified it was I'm not a non monogamous person, highly monogamous. 310 00:13:14.600 --> 00:13:15.600 But and I will just. 311 00:13:15.519 --> 00:13:18.559 Put in there that this relationship should have ended. Of course, 312 00:13:18.639 --> 00:13:21.480 like six months into it. Having started, the relationship was 313 00:13:21.480 --> 00:13:24.159 not good. It's like pretty much a sexless marriage. So 314 00:13:24.440 --> 00:13:26.720 I think for him this was like a way to 315 00:13:27.080 --> 00:13:30.320 like reactivate all of that. So there were rules around, 316 00:13:30.360 --> 00:13:32.559 like if I had sex with a woman, then I 317 00:13:32.600 --> 00:13:35.879 had to come home and do the same thing, which 318 00:13:35.919 --> 00:13:38.960 was awful, but so there are lots of rules around that, 319 00:13:39.039 --> 00:13:42.080 like complete transparency, so he always knew like where you 320 00:13:42.159 --> 00:13:44.840 are stating yes, and so what felt good to me 321 00:13:44.960 --> 00:13:47.360 was not lying about it. Yeah, right, So there was 322 00:13:47.399 --> 00:13:50.559 never any like cheating, And initially I just figured I'd 323 00:13:50.559 --> 00:13:54.639 just be super transactional and so for two plus years 324 00:13:54.799 --> 00:13:56.759 I was on as many apps as I could get on, 325 00:13:56.919 --> 00:14:00.720 and I like, I was like constantly checking them and 326 00:14:01.039 --> 00:14:04.080 going on multiple dates a week and and that's like fascinating. 327 00:14:04.120 --> 00:14:04.679 Yeah it was. 328 00:14:04.759 --> 00:14:05.000 It was. 329 00:14:05.200 --> 00:14:07.240 I have lots of crazy dating stories. It was kind 330 00:14:07.240 --> 00:14:07.639 of awful. 331 00:14:07.720 --> 00:14:09.960 And were you like because like if I'm you, like, 332 00:14:10.000 --> 00:14:12.399 I remember when I came out, I was so excited 333 00:14:12.440 --> 00:14:14.919 about these women, but I would date that. It's like, 334 00:14:15.000 --> 00:14:17.840 I think then my husband would have gotten me. Never 335 00:14:18.080 --> 00:14:20.039 there'd be no weekend night I'd be home with them 336 00:14:20.039 --> 00:14:21.919 because I would want to be with my catalyst. 337 00:14:22.200 --> 00:14:22.440 Yeah. 338 00:14:22.480 --> 00:14:26.320 Well, luckily I had a kiddo, so she she was nine. 339 00:14:26.440 --> 00:14:28.799 I think when all that started about eight, yeah, eight 340 00:14:28.919 --> 00:14:32.519 to nine, and then eleven when we ended up getting divorced. 341 00:14:32.519 --> 00:14:35.159 But it's right, so I'm balancing kidd activities and like 342 00:14:35.320 --> 00:14:38.159 work and also totally yeah, and also like as you 343 00:14:38.200 --> 00:14:40.799 guys have talked about, like women are flaky. So it 344 00:14:40.840 --> 00:14:43.519 was so hard, like for so the six months I 345 00:14:43.519 --> 00:14:46.000 spent staring at her on the stage that didn't turn 346 00:14:46.039 --> 00:14:47.960 into anything, and then dating it took a very long 347 00:14:48.000 --> 00:14:51.519 time online before it materialized into it like anybody that 348 00:14:51.559 --> 00:14:54.600 I that would ever stick. Yeah, And so the first 349 00:14:54.679 --> 00:14:57.480 experience was like physically not very satisfying, but I'm like, oh, 350 00:14:57.519 --> 00:14:59.080 I will never not do this. I came home and 351 00:14:59.120 --> 00:15:01.720 said that, like, I am absolutely never not do this. 352 00:15:01.840 --> 00:15:02.720 But it never. 353 00:15:02.960 --> 00:15:05.320 It didn't occur to me because I hadn't done it. 354 00:15:05.320 --> 00:15:08.519 I hadn't executed on a divorce for twenty four years 355 00:15:08.559 --> 00:15:10.399 or twenty two years at that point It never occurred 356 00:15:10.440 --> 00:15:12.120 to me that like this was what was going to 357 00:15:12.159 --> 00:15:14.159 break it. I was like, oh, I can just I 358 00:15:14.200 --> 00:15:16.480 can just do this. I can be transactional with my 359 00:15:16.559 --> 00:15:18.559 men for a long time, and then over the two years, 360 00:15:18.600 --> 00:15:21.360 what I learned is I was always looking for something. 361 00:15:21.399 --> 00:15:23.320 I'm like, where is the connection? There's not enough connection 362 00:15:23.399 --> 00:15:25.399 with this person, Like Y person doesn't work for me. 363 00:15:25.440 --> 00:15:27.720 I'm going to move on because I'm looking for more. 364 00:15:27.840 --> 00:15:30.360 Like you're texting, like would it be like a relationship 365 00:15:30.360 --> 00:15:32.519 board and it's transactional? Is it literally I'm going to 366 00:15:32.559 --> 00:15:34.240 meet you Saturday night and sleep with you? Or was 367 00:15:34.240 --> 00:15:35.840 it like we're texting I'm excited. 368 00:15:35.600 --> 00:15:39.279 To see yeah, texting excited to see like dates like yeah, 369 00:15:39.320 --> 00:15:40.799 And I mean there were some people you know, went 370 00:15:40.840 --> 00:15:43.960 on like camping trips with and like you know, like 371 00:15:44.000 --> 00:15:44.679 slept over. 372 00:15:44.639 --> 00:15:47.399 And dream building. Maybe you would believe for them. 373 00:15:47.440 --> 00:15:48.080 Not without it. 374 00:15:48.200 --> 00:15:50.720 No, I got not with any not until I met 375 00:15:51.440 --> 00:15:53.360 not until I met you. But I like, so things 376 00:15:53.360 --> 00:15:57.399 had just gotten really awful and dating like I just 377 00:15:57.440 --> 00:15:59.480 felt it just felt empty, right, I was like, there 378 00:15:59.559 --> 00:16:00.840 there was a per Then I started to kind of 379 00:16:00.840 --> 00:16:03.279 develop feelings for and she was super avoidant and it 380 00:16:03.320 --> 00:16:06.879 was awful, and that started making me like reflect on 381 00:16:06.919 --> 00:16:09.720 what was going on at my marriage, like seeing the 382 00:16:09.720 --> 00:16:12.799 parallels there, and so I just took a pause like 383 00:16:12.840 --> 00:16:15.720 a stunt, like it was when January twenty twenty one, Yeah, 384 00:16:15.759 --> 00:16:19.000 started going to therapy and just took a long break. 385 00:16:19.039 --> 00:16:21.039 And it was kind of right when I had gotten 386 00:16:21.039 --> 00:16:24.720 back into dating when we met the same Yeah, I'm bumble. 387 00:16:25.320 --> 00:16:26.080 I saw your picture. 388 00:16:26.120 --> 00:16:28.240 You put like a very tiny picture I could barely 389 00:16:28.279 --> 00:16:30.360 see in very few words, and I always optimize. 390 00:16:30.399 --> 00:16:32.399 I put as many words and as many pictures. 391 00:16:32.120 --> 00:16:35.759 As I could possibly put. Yeah, But then you were 392 00:16:35.799 --> 00:16:37.840 just like such a good communicator, Like that was like 393 00:16:38.440 --> 00:16:40.360 that was so hard in dating is that people were 394 00:16:41.399 --> 00:16:43.799 like once you connected, then maybe they communicate, but then 395 00:16:43.799 --> 00:16:45.039 they disappear for days on end. 396 00:16:45.399 --> 00:16:48.320 You just so like a constant communication. 397 00:16:48.519 --> 00:16:49.879 Yeah, It's like would be so hard. 398 00:16:49.879 --> 00:16:52.159 I think that's such a like a red flag like 399 00:16:52.240 --> 00:16:54.440 that people can tell early on but they. 400 00:16:54.360 --> 00:16:55.679 Don't pick up on. Yeah. 401 00:16:55.840 --> 00:16:58.440