WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.200 --> 00:00:01.919 Latest interview of Elon Muss. 2 00:00:07.879 --> 00:00:11.720 Yeah, be called X, but it would be the most 3 00:00:11.800 --> 00:00:14.599 valuable company in the world. On the other hand, now 4 00:00:14.640 --> 00:00:16.960 that's not all good though. On the other hand, then 5 00:00:17.440 --> 00:00:22.079 a lot of super talented people would have stayed and 6 00:00:22.559 --> 00:00:27.039 because because people got acquired by eBay not long after, 7 00:00:27.199 --> 00:00:31.399 like you know, so there was like the PayPal coup 8 00:00:31.440 --> 00:00:33.600 at the end of two thousand, eighteen months later it 9 00:00:33.640 --> 00:00:41.079 was acquired by eBay. So and and then but you know, 10 00:00:41.320 --> 00:00:43.320 it feels to think of the companies that came out 11 00:00:43.399 --> 00:00:48.399 of PayPal, so called PayPal in Mafia, the YouTube you know, 12 00:00:48.640 --> 00:00:53.719 those that Stephen Chad created YouTube, Jerry Saltman created yelp, 13 00:00:55.960 --> 00:01:03.920 Interpeter created Volunteer, and a bunch of other things. There's 14 00:01:04.400 --> 00:01:10.560 David Sachs created this company, and Reed Hoffmann created LinkedIn. 15 00:01:11.879 --> 00:01:14.079 It's almost like all that market cap still exists, but 16 00:01:14.120 --> 00:01:16.760 now it's allocated on all these other tech companies instead 17 00:01:16.760 --> 00:01:19.079 of X dot com. 18 00:01:19.439 --> 00:01:19.680 Yeah. 19 00:01:19.799 --> 00:01:23.840 So in retest, like I sometimes like it's maybe a 20 00:01:23.879 --> 00:01:29.920 good thing that uh X wasn't vall wasn't achieve those 21 00:01:29.959 --> 00:01:32.959 things because all these other companies would have at least 22 00:01:32.959 --> 00:01:35.920 been delayed or may not have existed. 23 00:01:36.799 --> 00:01:39.079 There's definitely been kind of a resurgence and interest as 24 00:01:39.120 --> 00:01:42.359 we get into kind of cryptographic you know, money and 25 00:01:42.400 --> 00:01:45.159 bitcoin and all that, like interest in this idea, you know. 26 00:01:45.680 --> 00:01:49.359 And it's interesting, like software hasn't even the banking industry yet. 27 00:01:49.840 --> 00:01:52.159 Software has eaten a lot of industries or some that 28 00:01:52.200 --> 00:01:54.760 it just hasn't, and bankings still. 29 00:01:54.400 --> 00:02:00.319 There, you know, stripes, stripes eating them slowly, but pretty 30 00:02:00.319 --> 00:02:05.640 good job. The mags are in trouble if if it's 31 00:02:05.719 --> 00:02:07.079 not stripe as be somebody else. 32 00:02:07.640 --> 00:02:09.400 And you love code, but you don't seem to be 33 00:02:09.400 --> 00:02:12.159 as bullish on bitcoin. Do you have any could you 34 00:02:12.199 --> 00:02:14.080 break down like why, because you're talking about this big 35 00:02:14.159 --> 00:02:17.240 database that's more secure for faster transactions. It seems like 36 00:02:17.560 --> 00:02:19.120 bitcoin's hitting at least some of those. 37 00:02:23.319 --> 00:02:24.800 I'm neither here there on bitcoin. 38 00:02:25.520 --> 00:02:31.400 Yeah, yeah, what do you think when you read like 39 00:02:31.479 --> 00:02:34.800 Satoshi's white paper for the first time, we're like it's pretty. 40 00:02:34.560 --> 00:02:36.000 Interesting or. 41 00:02:37.479 --> 00:02:41.759 Those pretty clever. It's it's it's just like the things 42 00:02:43.719 --> 00:02:45.479 this always gets like the crypto people angry. 43 00:02:45.520 --> 00:02:48.520 But I think. 44 00:02:50.719 --> 00:02:55.240 There are there are there are transactions that are not 45 00:02:55.400 --> 00:02:59.960 within the balance of the low and those and they're 46 00:03:00.039 --> 00:03:06.400 obviously many of those in different countries, and normally cash 47 00:03:06.520 --> 00:03:12.000 is used for these transactions. But but but in order 48 00:03:12.039 --> 00:03:16.639 for illegal transactions to occur those the cash. 49 00:03:16.520 --> 00:03:18.759 Must also be used for legal transactions. 50 00:03:18.800 --> 00:03:24.560 You need an illegal to legal bridge. 51 00:03:26.000 --> 00:03:27.199 That's where crypto comes in. 52 00:03:29.120 --> 00:03:30.560 So is it kind of the darknet stuff? 53 00:03:32.120 --> 00:03:34.879 It can't be entirely dark because otherwise how do you 54 00:03:34.879 --> 00:03:39.000 buy normal stuff? And cash these days is used just 55 00:03:39.759 --> 00:03:43.000 much rarer. It's hard, it's like increasingly difficult use cash. 56 00:03:43.199 --> 00:03:47.240 Some places you can't use cash at all. So there's 57 00:03:47.240 --> 00:03:54.039 a there's a forcing function for transactions that are illegal, 58 00:03:54.120 --> 00:03:56.520 quasi illegal and in some cases legal, but the've got 59 00:03:56.560 --> 00:03:58.919 to have some it's got to be both legal and illegal. 60 00:03:59.000 --> 00:04:01.759 It doesn't count otherwise otherwise you simply it can't just 61 00:04:01.759 --> 00:04:04.800 be transactions within an legal economy, because how do you 62 00:04:04.840 --> 00:04:08.080 buy like, you know, food and a house or something, 63 00:04:08.159 --> 00:04:11.719 you know, So you must have a legal to illegal bridge. 64 00:04:12.280 --> 00:04:15.159 So where I see crypto as as effectively as a 65 00:04:15.199 --> 00:04:20.439 replacement for cash, but not as a replacement for as 66 00:04:20.439 --> 00:04:24.279 a primary not not as I do not see crypto 67 00:04:24.360 --> 00:04:30.199 being the primary database. So now this is this is 68 00:04:30.319 --> 00:04:33.079 something that's taken to me like I'm being judgmental about crypto, 69 00:04:33.160 --> 00:04:35.160 and it's actually I think there's a lot of things 70 00:04:35.160 --> 00:04:39.759 that are illegal that shouldn't be illegal. But you know, 71 00:04:40.399 --> 00:04:44.959 so it's not as the I think that sometimes governments 72 00:04:45.000 --> 00:04:47.879 just have too many laws about that they should I 73 00:04:47.920 --> 00:04:49.360 should have so many things. 74 00:04:49.160 --> 00:04:49.800 That are illegal. 75 00:04:50.040 --> 00:04:52.959 Didn't you say that on Mars there'd be less loss hopefully? 76 00:04:53.120 --> 00:04:58.000 Yeah, you also propose of direct democracy on Mars. 77 00:04:58.360 --> 00:05:04.439 I think probably that's the best, I mean, probably the 78 00:05:04.439 --> 00:05:04.839 best thing. 79 00:05:06.040 --> 00:05:08.959 Mars technocracy, the most technocracy. 80 00:05:09.480 --> 00:05:12.199 And you want to make laws super short and simple, right. 81 00:05:12.600 --> 00:05:15.600 Well, yeah, I mean like if people can't understand laws, 82 00:05:15.639 --> 00:05:19.439 then how do you then what's usually going to happen 83 00:05:19.519 --> 00:05:22.120 is some special interests in a bamboos of public with 84 00:05:22.240 --> 00:05:25.600 long laws. Yep, and then the lord is like reading 85 00:05:25.600 --> 00:05:27.480 this law is like the size of the Lord of 86 00:05:27.519 --> 00:05:30.600 the Rings, but a very boring version of it. 87 00:05:30.720 --> 00:05:33.279 Like the dealership thing is just crazy to me, you know, 88 00:05:33.480 --> 00:05:36.000 like America is supposed to be competitive, free market. 89 00:05:37.120 --> 00:05:41.439 It's weird, right, yeah, absolutely, so anyway, it's just sick. 90 00:05:41.480 --> 00:05:44.240 You want to keep the lawder short and give them 91 00:05:44.240 --> 00:05:46.519 some kind of sunset period so they don't just stay 92 00:05:46.519 --> 00:05:49.000 there forever. I'd like it's just accumulate over time and 93 00:05:49.079 --> 00:05:53.199 just eventually it'll be unwieldy. So the laws should have 94 00:05:53.240 --> 00:05:59.000 some time prime associated with them. They automatically go away. 95 00:05:59.160 --> 00:06:02.079 So I mean, it's just keep a little short to 96 00:06:02.120 --> 00:06:07.120 avoid trickery and and sort of special interests that ultimately 97 00:06:07.160 --> 00:06:12.079 does not matter for the public. And and then I 98 00:06:12.079 --> 00:06:18.519 think direct directmocracy is less susceptible to corruption than representative democracy. 99 00:06:18.959 --> 00:06:22.839 So you know, corruption just being like to what degree 100 00:06:22.920 --> 00:06:25.240 is this actually being taken that do not serve, that 101 00:06:25.360 --> 00:06:29.519 generate the interests of the population, you know, do not 102 00:06:29.600 --> 00:06:34.160 need a results in a net increase in population happiness 103 00:06:34.240 --> 00:06:39.160 as a whole. So that's that's that's why I think 104 00:06:39.319 --> 00:06:40.639 probably the direct is better. 105 00:06:44.879 --> 00:06:45.480 And then you. 106 00:06:47.319 --> 00:06:51.120 Have things in real time, so you know, if you 107 00:06:51.120 --> 00:06:54.000 want to vote on something, you just you can vote on. 108 00:06:53.959 --> 00:06:54.600 It real fast. 109 00:06:57.560 --> 00:07:00.120 Probably make it, I would say, make it easier to 110 00:07:00.120 --> 00:07:02.639 get rid of laws then to put them in because 111 00:07:02.759 --> 00:07:06.160 these things tend to have a lot of inertia and 112 00:07:06.240 --> 00:07:12.120 to have a bias towards having laws go away and 113 00:07:12.199 --> 00:07:15.680 not be there, you know, so like maybe it takes 114 00:07:15.680 --> 00:07:18.040 sixty percent to put alaw in place for forty percent 115 00:07:18.160 --> 00:07:18.759 to remove it. 116 00:07:18.800 --> 00:07:25.879 To theming like that. Yeah, let's try it. You know, 117 00:07:25.920 --> 00:07:26.600 see what happens. 118 00:07:27.800 --> 00:07:30.600 The bills are extremely long that they pass. No one 119 00:07:30.639 --> 00:07:31.240 reads them. 120 00:07:31.560 --> 00:07:35.279 Yeah, hardly anyone in Congress has read the bill. And 121 00:07:35.279 --> 00:07:36.920 if you even if they've read the bill, if you 122 00:07:37.000 --> 00:07:38.240 quized them on the details. 123 00:07:37.920 --> 00:07:38.439 They would not. 124 00:07:39.240 --> 00:07:40.120 They'll find their page. 125 00:07:40.759 --> 00:07:43.279 Yeah, there's like, tell me what's Yeah this there was 126 00:07:43.319 --> 00:07:44.199 no idea. 127 00:07:44.759 --> 00:07:46.920 It seems kind of alarming that that's like the status 128 00:07:47.000 --> 00:07:48.639 quo and everyone just accepts it. 129 00:07:48.759 --> 00:07:53.079 But yeah, these laws tend to be written by industry 130 00:07:53.199 --> 00:07:57.759 groups as well, so that that they'll write the law 131 00:07:58.879 --> 00:08:03.560 and then and then interact with the Congressional staff and 132 00:08:05.439 --> 00:08:06.759 but most of the work would be done by the 133 00:08:06.800 --> 00:08:09.560 industry groups, and so they're going to write laws that 134 00:08:10.560 --> 00:08:12.160 entrench their position. 135 00:08:12.480 --> 00:08:14.680 It's like the people are the players buying the ref 136 00:08:14.800 --> 00:08:16.959 like you were saying earlier, Is that exactly so. 137 00:08:16.879 --> 00:08:23.279 You get the regultary capture of the exactly. Yeah, the 138 00:08:23.279 --> 00:08:26.639 players shouldn't be paying the ref salary type of thing. Well, 139 00:08:26.680 --> 00:08:28.839 the REF should be thinking I'm going to retire and 140 00:08:29.759 --> 00:08:36.720 get paid by the players. So it's kind of amazing 141 00:08:36.759 --> 00:08:38.480 that it works as well as it is, given all 142 00:08:38.480 --> 00:08:48.039 these issues so yeah, so then hey, hell I end 143 00:08:48.159 --> 00:08:56.039 up getting valaria and anyway in two thousand and one, yeah, 144 00:08:56.080 --> 00:08:56.799 two thousand. 145 00:08:56.519 --> 00:09:00.279 And one, Yeah, us about this the malaria thing that 146 00:09:00.360 --> 00:09:02.399 was you went on vacation, right, yeah, we're South Africa 147 00:09:02.559 --> 00:09:03.000 with Kimball. 148 00:09:03.000 --> 00:09:06.320 Actually yeah, it's crazy, and then came back and had 149 00:09:06.559 --> 00:09:08.320 like a near death case of hilaria. 150 00:09:08.840 --> 00:09:10.399 Yeah, we live grew up in So Africa. 151 00:09:10.480 --> 00:09:13.879 We'd go to the bushfelt all the time, to what 152 00:09:13.960 --> 00:09:16.320 you guys call Safari, and you just we just had 153 00:09:16.320 --> 00:09:18.799 a house in the bush, used to go there every 154 00:09:19.000 --> 00:09:22.240 every few weeks or so. I don't think we ever 155 00:09:22.279 --> 00:09:23.960 took malaria tablets. 156 00:09:23.679 --> 00:09:25.519 Yeah, I think. 157 00:09:26.320 --> 00:09:31.360 And then suddenly yeah, right, like and so we were 158 00:09:31.399 --> 00:09:34.320 we were told to and we did take malaria tablets 159 00:09:34.960 --> 00:09:39.840 them as well. And and when you got back, they 160 00:09:40.639 --> 00:09:42.759 was in Stanford and they couldn't figure out what was 161 00:09:42.759 --> 00:09:45.480 wrong with him. Our uncle who's a doctor in South Africa, 162 00:09:45.759 --> 00:09:48.559 he has malaria. And they's like, no, no, he doesn't 163 00:09:48.559 --> 00:09:52.360 have malaria. We checked check again. Malaria kind of hides 164 00:09:52.399 --> 00:09:52.799 in the body. 165 00:09:52.840 --> 00:09:54.679 And then. 166 00:09:55.320 --> 00:09:57.279 So this was after PayPal got started. 167 00:09:58.320 --> 00:10:01.559 Oh this is two thousand and one, so sort of 168 00:10:01.639 --> 00:10:04.559 after the pay PayPal coups. I was, I was on 169 00:10:04.600 --> 00:10:07.039 the PayPal board and I was providing, you know, providing 170 00:10:07.120 --> 00:10:13.919 sort of product advice and whatnot. But in December, late 171 00:10:13.919 --> 00:10:17.879 December two thousand, went on a trip to South Africa. 172 00:10:18.519 --> 00:10:22.000 Came back January, early January two thousand and one. I 173 00:10:22.080 --> 00:10:25.799 had a spare case malaria almost I had next to. 174 00:10:26.960 --> 00:10:33.120 Five days and yellow. And he just said early morning 175 00:10:33.120 --> 00:10:36.159 til later night, just waiting to see. And then they 176 00:10:36.200 --> 00:10:39.679 seem to be get some some jamas for him. And 177 00:10:40.000 --> 00:10:43.799 the closest store was based for lease or something, so 178 00:10:44.159 --> 00:10:48.000 I just got into some pajamas and then then the 179 00:10:48.039 --> 00:10:50.879 next thing, after five days rod and he said, so 180 00:10:51.080 --> 00:10:54.600 these buddies onamas. 181 00:11:01.120 --> 00:11:05.279 And you were sleepy, I mean, like you're it affected 182 00:11:05.320 --> 00:11:07.200 your brain? That that harsh? 183 00:11:07.279 --> 00:11:09.039 Yeah, no, it was bad. It's really bad. 184 00:11:10.240 --> 00:11:11.799 Does that a change your perspective? 185 00:11:12.120 --> 00:11:14.919 How did the like influence you after that? I don't know. 186 00:11:17.720 --> 00:11:22.399 I don't think it changed me that much. Would you say, no, 187 00:11:22.440 --> 00:11:23.120 I don't think it did. 188 00:11:26.120 --> 00:11:28.399 Yeah, but how many times have you been on I 189 00:11:28.480 --> 00:11:30.440 lost like fifty pounds though it was great now. 190 00:11:32.200 --> 00:11:39.200 No more vacation, so well, yeah it was. It was. 191 00:11:39.360 --> 00:11:41.120 It took me like almost six months to get back 192 00:11:41.120 --> 00:11:47.200 to normal sou And then in two thousand and one, 193 00:11:48.120 --> 00:11:53.320 I was thinking about, you know what you next, and. 194 00:11:51.639 --> 00:11:54.879 And I thought the. 195 00:11:58.200 --> 00:12:01.200 You know, this is like okay, sustainable energy, like a 196 00:12:01.240 --> 00:12:08.039 basical electric cars, solar space. And then a friend of 197 00:12:08.039 --> 00:12:10.759 mine asked me, you know, so what are you gonna 198 00:12:10.759 --> 00:12:13.960 do next? I said, well, you know, that's so I 199 00:12:14.039 --> 00:12:15.879 would love to do something in space, but I didn't 200 00:12:15.879 --> 00:12:18.720 think anything of there's anything that a private individual could 201 00:12:18.720 --> 00:12:20.799 do in space. But at least I'm gonna go on 202 00:12:20.840 --> 00:12:22.759 the NASA website and find out when people are going 203 00:12:22.799 --> 00:12:24.879 to Mars. And I go on the net web NAST 204 00:12:24.919 --> 00:12:28.519 website and it's nowhere to be found, and so I'm like, well, 205 00:12:28.519 --> 00:12:33.360 this is pretty weird, and then ask that it was 206 00:12:33.360 --> 00:12:35.480 actually a NASA policy not to talk about it. 207 00:12:36.200 --> 00:12:40.039 Really, yeah, that's time. Why why was that? 208 00:12:40.159 --> 00:12:47.559 Do you think what I sold is that when George 209 00:12:47.600 --> 00:12:53.360 Bush the first was when he was elected, he said 210 00:12:54.120 --> 00:12:56.120 he has not NASA to put together a plan to 211 00:12:56.279 --> 00:13:00.000 send people to Mars. In ninety days, they came back 212 00:13:00.080 --> 00:13:02.039 of the plan and it was five hundred billion dollars, 213 00:13:03.480 --> 00:13:06.480 and it says all that this is like political suicide. 214 00:13:06.919 --> 00:13:11.960 So then after that talk of man missions to Mars 215 00:13:11.960 --> 00:13:12.720 were banned. 216 00:13:14.919 --> 00:13:15.600 That's what I sold. 217 00:13:17.519 --> 00:13:21.559 So anyway, so it's like, well, you know, maybe there's 218 00:13:21.600 --> 00:13:24.080 something that can be done here to get the public 219 00:13:24.120 --> 00:13:25.519 excited about going to Mars. 220 00:13:25.759 --> 00:13:28.919 And if I get the public excited, then they will 221 00:13:29.360 --> 00:13:34.159 vote mass that I have more funding. And so the. 222 00:13:34.200 --> 00:13:37.799 Original idea for SpaceX was just to have a philanthropic 223 00:13:37.840 --> 00:13:38.559 mission to Mars. 224 00:13:39.240 --> 00:13:42.240 Yeah, just started as a graphic of a of a 225 00:13:42.279 --> 00:13:45.000 pot plant. You just need to get the pot plan 226 00:13:45.120 --> 00:13:47.480 to Mars, you know. It was like an inspiration sure, 227 00:13:47.840 --> 00:13:50.159 just as a as a as a way to prove 228 00:13:50.200 --> 00:13:51.399 to the world that it could be done. 229 00:13:52.480 --> 00:13:52.720 Yeah. 230 00:13:53.000 --> 00:13:57.480 So the mission was called Mars Oasis. There was seas 231 00:13:57.519 --> 00:14:01.320 and dehydrated nutrient l that would hydrate upon landing. You 232 00:14:01.639 --> 00:14:05.480 get this great picture of green plants right background and 233 00:14:05.639 --> 00:14:07.600 be like the first sort of life as we know. 234 00:14:07.559 --> 00:14:08.200 It on Mars. 235 00:14:08.399 --> 00:14:11.600 And the you can also learn, you know, a lot 236 00:14:11.600 --> 00:14:14.039 about what does it take to keep plants alive and 237 00:14:14.080 --> 00:14:16.600 have a little miniature greenhouse on on sof to Mars. 238 00:14:18.480 --> 00:14:21.039 So that's that's why I initially pursued as as like 239 00:14:21.159 --> 00:14:23.879 a way to basically increase NASA's budget. 240 00:14:23.879 --> 00:14:24.200 That was. 241 00:14:24.360 --> 00:14:27.679 It wasn't let's create a space company. It was how 242 00:14:27.679 --> 00:14:29.720 do we get Nasta's budget increased so we can go 243 00:14:29.840 --> 00:14:34.440 sim people tomorrows. And I've trying to figure out how 244 00:14:34.440 --> 00:14:39.440 to get this thing launched. And the rockets, the European 245 00:14:39.440 --> 00:14:42.279 and US rockets are too expensive and I can afford them. 246 00:14:42.480 --> 00:14:47.039 So I went to Russia to try to buy some 247 00:14:47.279 --> 00:14:56.080 ICBMs in two thousand and one, literally, and the keptu 248 00:14:56.600 --> 00:14:58.360 raising the price on me, and it was quite being 249 00:14:58.399 --> 00:15:03.399 quite difficult, and I said, I, you know, I could 250 00:15:03.399 --> 00:15:08.159 afford to pay like nine million dollars for ICBM, but 251 00:15:08.320 --> 00:15:11.320 not twenty because we need to do two of these 252 00:15:11.320 --> 00:15:14.360 missions because odds are good that one would fail and 253 00:15:14.360 --> 00:15:21.639 then it could have a negative impact potentially. So that 254 00:15:21.720 --> 00:15:25.120 was pretty weird. Being muscular for buy ICBMs in two 255 00:15:25.159 --> 00:15:25.840 thousand and one. 256 00:15:26.080 --> 00:15:26.759 That's amazing. 257 00:15:27.399 --> 00:15:29.399 Negotiate to buy an ICPN. 258 00:15:30.000 --> 00:15:30.240 Yeah. 259 00:15:31.320 --> 00:15:34.159 I caught up the military and say, well, you know 260 00:15:34.159 --> 00:15:38.440 they're gonna go They're gonna get rid of these things 261 00:15:38.519 --> 00:15:41.720 anyway because of the introduction treaties. So it's like, if 262 00:15:41.720 --> 00:15:44.000 you listen, if you're gonna throw it away, I'll buy 263 00:15:44.080 --> 00:15:48.159 take it off your hands. You know, they have to. 264 00:15:48.919 --> 00:15:52.600 It was like s S eighteen to never. It was 265 00:15:52.639 --> 00:15:59.159 the biggest nuclear mussile in the Russian fleet. And but anyway, 266 00:15:59.159 --> 00:16:04.159 they're know decommissioned these things, so why why not just 267 00:16:04.279 --> 00:16:09.879 tell me them it's dead? And then there's very time 268 00:16:09.879 --> 00:16:11.519 I talked to them, the price you go off, and 269 00:16:11.559 --> 00:16:15.120 I'm like, this is is not good because you know, 270 00:16:15.519 --> 00:16:18.000 even if once we do a deal, we're probably gonna 271 00:16:18.000 --> 00:16:25.600 get shrafted afterwards too, and this is the pre deal shafting. Well, 272 00:16:25.679 --> 00:16:27.519 it's like it's what's going to be after or its 273 00:16:27.600 --> 00:16:30.360 you know, when after I've given them money and it's good, 274 00:16:30.799 --> 00:16:36.639 so so that I yeah, so, And then I started 275 00:16:36.679 --> 00:16:39.399 looking into it as like why rockets cost so much? 276 00:16:41.240 --> 00:16:45.639 And there's nothing fundamental about why did you cost so much? 277 00:16:45.639 --> 00:16:48.399 If you add up the materials let's say, if you 278 00:16:48.399 --> 00:16:51.000 you know, it's not like the word materials cost that much. 279 00:16:51.159 --> 00:16:52.720 Really just need to figure out a smart way to 280 00:16:52.759 --> 00:16:56.600 get the materials in that shape, and and then you 281 00:16:56.720 --> 00:16:59.720 need we need to make rockets re usable. So like 282 00:17:00.159 --> 00:17:02.440 in any form of transport, if it's not reusable, it's 283 00:17:02.480 --> 00:17:07.720 extremely expensive. You know, if cars were single use, you know, 284 00:17:08.480 --> 00:17:10.519 and you need a round trip, you know, for a 285 00:17:10.519 --> 00:17:12.599 car for twenty thousand dollars, then you around trip because 286 00:17:12.759 --> 00:17:13.640 forty thousand dollars. 287 00:17:15.759 --> 00:17:19.279 That's crazy. So it's the same thing is true for 288 00:17:19.640 --> 00:17:21.920 aircraft and boats and rockets and everything. 289 00:17:22.000 --> 00:17:25.759 So so there were the rockets were expensive even as 290 00:17:25.799 --> 00:17:29.640 expendable things, but then they were also not reusable. So 291 00:17:31.559 --> 00:17:33.599 there's no way we're going to have a city on 292 00:17:33.640 --> 00:17:40.440 Mars unless we can have reasonable, low cost, reliable rockets. 293 00:17:40.599 --> 00:17:45.839 That's fundamentally the issue. So so I came to conclusion 294 00:17:45.880 --> 00:17:49.720 that even if this Males Away susmission was successful, it 295 00:17:49.759 --> 00:17:55.160 would still knock results in. It would not materially further 296 00:17:55.240 --> 00:17:59.720 the goal of being a multiplant species because the rocket 297 00:17:59.759 --> 00:18:03.200 technology was not good enough and it was not getting better. 298 00:18:03.319 --> 00:18:05.039 In fact, it was arguably getting worse. 299 00:18:05.720 --> 00:18:09.039 So so the real thing that needed to be solved 300 00:18:09.039 --> 00:18:13.279 here is reusable rocketry and lowering the cost of access 301 00:18:13.279 --> 00:18:17.599 to space, and that that's like, okay, well I'm gonna 302 00:18:17.640 --> 00:18:23.960 try to do that. So I've got SpaceX started in 303 00:18:24.079 --> 00:18:30.319 early two thousand and two. Basically I was living in 304 00:18:30.359 --> 00:18:34.200 pala Alta at the time, but most of the engineering 305 00:18:34.240 --> 00:18:37.680 expertise was in southern California, so that's why I moved 306 00:18:37.680 --> 00:18:38.880 to LA. 307 00:18:40.559 --> 00:18:43.599 Did you ever have any like even inkling of imagination 308 00:18:43.759 --> 00:18:46.039 that you could be doing, you know, a dozen launches 309 00:18:46.079 --> 00:18:50.160 a year and being contracted with NASA? Is that even 310 00:18:50.240 --> 00:18:50.519 like it? 311 00:18:51.039 --> 00:18:52.440 I thought that was fair, I know, I thought we 312 00:18:52.480 --> 00:18:56.440 had you know, terms of success or something like that. 313 00:18:57.440 --> 00:19:00.319 You ended up being chief engineer, right, because no one 314 00:19:00.319 --> 00:19:02.119 wanted to give up their secure jobs of. 315 00:19:02.240 --> 00:19:09.359 U I and something exactly I actually tried to hire. Basically, 316 00:19:11.039 --> 00:19:15.440 there's been a number of tents at doing a a 317 00:19:15.440 --> 00:19:18.400 private rocket company or commercial rocket company, and it all 318 00:19:18.559 --> 00:19:24.000 or really they all failed effectively. And then that's to 319 00:19:24.359 --> 00:19:26.279 the degree that it was like a joke in the 320 00:19:26.519 --> 00:19:29.960 aerospace industry, like how do you make a large portion 321 00:19:30.599 --> 00:19:33.559 large portion in the rock you know, start with the 322 00:19:34.400 --> 00:19:35.599 how do you make how do you make a small 323 00:19:35.640 --> 00:19:40.519 portion in the rocky industry? Start with a large one. 324 00:19:41.880 --> 00:19:43.000 Going to be smaller business? 325 00:19:44.319 --> 00:19:48.599 Yeah, that's how many jokes. So many times just jumped 326 00:19:48.599 --> 00:19:54.039 to the punchline, you know. So the Yeah, it was 327 00:19:54.119 --> 00:19:56.880 very hard to recruit people because I had not built 328 00:19:56.920 --> 00:20:02.920 any physical hardware before, and I kept being called Internet 329 00:20:02.920 --> 00:20:08.160 guy for the longest time for ages. As the finally 330 00:20:08.200 --> 00:20:10.319 start I made for the first ten years, they're calling 331 00:20:10.359 --> 00:20:18.759 me Internet guy, but we basically at Internet entrepreneur slash fool. 332 00:20:21.039 --> 00:20:22.920 He's trying to start a Rockey company. That's what if 333 00:20:22.920 --> 00:20:26.039 an idiot. That was generally how it went. So it 334 00:20:26.079 --> 00:20:29.319 was quite hard to recruit people, and you know, especially 335 00:20:29.359 --> 00:20:32.039 if something's got like a secure job at you know, 336 00:20:32.079 --> 00:20:35.920 buying a lockeed or something like that, then trying to 337 00:20:35.960 --> 00:20:39.279 recruit them to be you know, chief engineer of us 338 00:20:39.400 --> 00:20:40.319 started Rocket company. 339 00:20:40.359 --> 00:20:41.119 I was so hopeless. 340 00:20:42.079 --> 00:20:46.079 So basically no nobody, nobody who was who was good 341 00:20:46.480 --> 00:20:48.319 was willing to join, and there was no point in 342 00:20:48.400 --> 00:20:52.559 hiring somebody wasn't good. So I ended up being chief engineer, 343 00:20:54.200 --> 00:20:56.240 you know, which is yeah. 344 00:20:56.319 --> 00:20:57.200 So the. 345 00:20:59.359 --> 00:21:01.440 First three launch has failed and probably if I had 346 00:21:01.480 --> 00:21:05.240 been better than we would have gotten to at BIT sooner. 347 00:21:05.440 --> 00:21:08.960 So it took me a while to learn all these things. 348 00:21:09.079 --> 00:21:12.000 So from books or books and talking to people. 349 00:21:12.200 --> 00:21:14.880 Did you go to Utah and talk to anybody like it? 350 00:21:15.359 --> 00:21:16.359 At he Orbital? 351 00:21:17.279 --> 00:21:17.759 Oh? Yeah? 352 00:21:17.839 --> 00:21:27.279 Visited atk Orbital was Dallas, Virginia, So yeah, I visited 353 00:21:27.319 --> 00:21:27.720 a t K. 354 00:21:28.680 --> 00:21:34.480 I visited Orbital and the Orbital. 355 00:21:34.160 --> 00:21:37.160 Had had a success with the solid rocket based Pegasus, 356 00:21:38.799 --> 00:21:41.839 but they'd also gotten like an eight launch deal from Darper. 357 00:21:43.000 --> 00:21:45.319 So you're like, okay, if you've got if you're starting 358 00:21:45.319 --> 00:21:47.119 off with basically an eight launch s deal from Darper, 359 00:21:48.319 --> 00:21:52.200 that's a good situation. And we did not have a 360 00:21:52.279 --> 00:21:54.640 large seal from anyone. 361 00:21:55.160 --> 00:21:56.599 And Pegasus is a. 362 00:21:58.200 --> 00:22:02.079 I mean, there's some claar engineering with Pegasus, but fundamentally 363 00:22:02.240 --> 00:22:04.759 I think launching rockets from planes is not tensible. 364 00:22:06.440 --> 00:22:08.440 It sounds like it would be a good idea, but 365 00:22:08.480 --> 00:22:08.759 it's not. 366 00:22:10.240 --> 00:22:13.519 And then even Oval went away from doing that with 367 00:22:13.680 --> 00:22:15.920 their as soon as you get past certain size that 368 00:22:16.920 --> 00:22:17.759 went to ground launch. 369 00:22:18.200 --> 00:22:21.480 I was reading somewhere that at if I call Morton 370 00:22:21.519 --> 00:22:25.839 that they were doing snowcats, they were doing ski lifts, 371 00:22:25.839 --> 00:22:27.920 and they sold that to the man who made the 372 00:22:27.920 --> 00:22:31.799 DeLorean heat Really yeah, I just read that in their Wikipedia. 373 00:22:31.799 --> 00:22:33.359 I'm like, oh, that's fascinating. When to come around. 374 00:22:36.799 --> 00:22:48.799 So yeah, So yeah, so I got SpaceX going, and 375 00:22:50.599 --> 00:22:53.880 that was very difficult. 376 00:22:54.440 --> 00:23:01.079 We got the Falcon one rocket built. It was very simple. 377 00:23:01.160 --> 00:23:05.359 It's the simplest overall rocket that's a liquid fuel, so 378 00:23:05.680 --> 00:23:11.880 it had the potential for reusability, for useful reasbility, and 379 00:23:11.920 --> 00:23:17.079 then yeah, we had three failures. Finally got to orbit 380 00:23:17.839 --> 00:23:23.200 at the end of two thousand and eight, so. 381 00:23:22.319 --> 00:23:27.200 That was incredible going down to Quadalon and watching you. 382 00:23:27.200 --> 00:23:28.440 Wrote it like a blog for a while. 383 00:23:28.680 --> 00:23:28.880 Yeah. 384 00:23:28.920 --> 00:23:30.079 I actually still have it up there. 385 00:23:30.599 --> 00:23:33.519 It's a little and it's an old, old blogging platform 386 00:23:33.519 --> 00:23:37.720 that Google still keeps alive. It's called quas Rockets dot 387 00:23:37.759 --> 00:23:39.519 blogspot dot com. 388 00:23:39.599 --> 00:23:41.319 I think it's gonna get a lot of traffic soon. 389 00:23:42.039 --> 00:23:42.960 Yeah, totally say it. 390 00:23:43.079 --> 00:23:43.480 Check it out. 391 00:23:43.519 --> 00:23:43.960 It's all there. 392 00:23:44.160 --> 00:23:48.640 It's a photos and photos of There was one photo 393 00:23:48.640 --> 00:23:50.880 of Elaine picking up a satellite. 394 00:23:51.799 --> 00:23:53.839 We launched the rocket and the rocket. 395 00:23:53.519 --> 00:23:56.000 Exploded, which was very, very very sad. 396 00:23:56.119 --> 00:23:56.920 Everyone's excading. 397 00:23:56.960 --> 00:23:59.759 People are pouring their heart and sold into the rocket 398 00:24:00.400 --> 00:24:05.319 and the satellite was i think in the US Navy 399 00:24:06.119 --> 00:24:10.559 Air Force Academy and it was thrown out of the 400 00:24:10.599 --> 00:24:13.960 rocket and fell through the roof of the hangar. 401 00:24:14.319 --> 00:24:19.000 Well, this is like we really thinking exactly, it's like 402 00:24:19.039 --> 00:24:21.519 a like a like a stand up small tool shed. 403 00:24:21.799 --> 00:24:23.240 Yeah, it wasn't supposed to do that. 404 00:24:24.359 --> 00:24:29.519 Maybe the size of this room. The rocket it had. 405 00:24:29.880 --> 00:24:33.200 This is the first Lord failure, so the it had 406 00:24:33.240 --> 00:24:37.599 a there's a cracked limited beanut on that that cracked 407 00:24:38.359 --> 00:24:42.160 during during leftoff and created so the engine there was 408 00:24:42.160 --> 00:24:45.039 an engine fire the this this wouldn't have been the 409 00:24:45.119 --> 00:24:48.119 end of the world, but there was a one of 410 00:24:48.160 --> 00:24:53.319 the the helium lines was steel mesh overapped with the 411 00:24:53.759 --> 00:24:57.640 kevlost sleeve and it melted the sleeve the. 412 00:24:59.759 --> 00:25:00.359 And so we. 413 00:25:00.480 --> 00:25:06.279 Lost pressure, pneumatic pressure which caused the engine ballast to close. 414 00:25:07.480 --> 00:25:11.359 So about thirty seconds after lift off, the engine shot 415 00:25:11.400 --> 00:25:15.680 itself off due to the engine fire, and then it went. 416 00:25:15.960 --> 00:25:20.559 It went ballistic and it basically smashed in the rocks 417 00:25:20.640 --> 00:25:27.119 just on a calple hundred Feueralk shore and when it 418 00:25:27.200 --> 00:25:31.880 when it's it was quite a big explosion. Actually in 419 00:25:31.920 --> 00:25:36.559 an explosion. The satellite, which was in a faring, went 420 00:25:36.559 --> 00:25:40.519 through the faring on a ballistic arc back onto the island, 421 00:25:41.519 --> 00:25:45.079 smashed through the tool shared roof and onto the floor 422 00:25:46.039 --> 00:25:50.839 in a pretty reasonable condition, like it wasn't totally gnarled. 423 00:25:52.599 --> 00:25:53.200 We use it. 424 00:25:53.400 --> 00:25:58.640 So we gave them back their satellite, so like we 425 00:25:58.680 --> 00:26:03.319 didn't lose your satellites may need summer affair, but it 426 00:26:03.359 --> 00:26:09.440 was so improbable that the satellite would come back. We 427 00:26:09.519 --> 00:26:15.319 had a couple more failures after that. Yeah, two thousand 428 00:26:15.319 --> 00:26:16.960 and eight was particularly diffult year because we had the 429 00:26:16.960 --> 00:26:21.319 third failure in two thousand and eight, the tales around 430 00:26:21.400 --> 00:26:24.960 financing round collapsed such a nightmare and I got divorced, 431 00:26:25.000 --> 00:26:25.880 and it was. 432 00:26:26.359 --> 00:26:29.519 I think two thousand and eight was bad year, really 433 00:26:29.599 --> 00:26:30.119 really bad. 434 00:26:32.079 --> 00:26:36.640 Yeah, that year. Yeah, I don't think anyone could. I 435 00:26:36.680 --> 00:26:37.759 think twenty eighteen. 436 00:26:39.039 --> 00:26:40.839 I think twenty eighteen was worse. 437 00:26:41.079 --> 00:26:43.000 What's well with the Model three ramp? 438 00:26:43.079 --> 00:26:46.359 Right? Oh, there were so many things that happened so strong, 439 00:26:46.440 --> 00:26:47.039 it's insane. 440 00:26:47.400 --> 00:27:01.519 Yeah. So yeah, sorry, so we're in two thousand and two. Sorry, 441 00:27:01.640 --> 00:27:08.920 space X moved down to l A and it was 442 00:27:08.960 --> 00:27:11.279 just it was pretty fun in the beginning, Like generally 443 00:27:11.279 --> 00:27:14.559 start ups are pretty fun in the beginning, and then 444 00:27:14.559 --> 00:27:19.759 you go through the you know, chasm of doom, Yeah, 445 00:27:22.039 --> 00:27:23.599 chasm of doom, Yeah. 446 00:27:25.319 --> 00:27:27.480 Exactly, it's rough despair. 447 00:27:28.480 --> 00:27:31.079 Yeah, it's usually always like everyone's like super optimistic and 448 00:27:31.119 --> 00:27:37.039 excited for first year or so, and then the then 449 00:27:37.279 --> 00:27:41.039 things started to go awry and there's usually many years 450 00:27:41.039 --> 00:27:48.640 of grief before there's finally day dawns. So yeah, so 451 00:27:48.960 --> 00:27:56.640 it's like two thousand and two, and then about in 452 00:27:56.720 --> 00:28:05.200 two thousand and three is when h Rosen and JB. 453 00:28:05.359 --> 00:28:07.599 Strabo called me up and said, hey, we want to 454 00:28:07.640 --> 00:28:14.039 have lunch. I want to say, hold Rosen. I think 455 00:28:14.079 --> 00:28:21.799 that's his name, but he he rarely had. He was 456 00:28:21.839 --> 00:28:29.039 a pioneer in space technology and electric vehicles, which crossover uh, 457 00:28:29.440 --> 00:28:32.720 and he'd done some Rosen Motors, which is like a 458 00:28:32.720 --> 00:28:37.599 sort of an electric vehicle company, and but he'd also 459 00:28:38.079 --> 00:28:42.519 been pioneer in ge stationary satellites. So he called me 460 00:28:42.599 --> 00:28:47.279 up and said, hey, let's have lunch, like lunch at 461 00:28:48.240 --> 00:28:53.240 like Smith and Lansky or something in in Alsigondo where 462 00:28:53.319 --> 00:28:54.200 SpaceX started. 463 00:28:55.519 --> 00:28:56.839 And so. 464 00:28:58.319 --> 00:29:03.759 Stravel and Rosen talking about space stuff, and then so 465 00:29:03.759 --> 00:29:06.680 I was talking about electric cars, and I said, oh, yeah, 466 00:29:06.680 --> 00:29:08.359 you know, so I was gonna be working on electric 467 00:29:08.359 --> 00:29:14.440 car technology at Stanford and and JB said, you know, 468 00:29:14.480 --> 00:29:18.799 we should take a drive in the Tea zero from 469 00:29:18.839 --> 00:29:23.160 AC propulsion, and I was I was like, yeah, you know, 470 00:29:23.680 --> 00:29:27.559 because the timing is like lettin my own factories was 471 00:29:27.599 --> 00:29:31.200 really like the critical breakthrough needed for compelling electric cars. 472 00:29:32.279 --> 00:29:34.880 And so I was like, okay, I'll go try out there. 473 00:29:35.200 --> 00:29:40.920 T zero, which had spec similar to what we eventually 474 00:29:40.920 --> 00:29:47.480 bought to markets tells the road store. So then I so, yeah, 475 00:29:47.519 --> 00:29:49.519 so I got I got a ride in the T zero, 476 00:29:51.000 --> 00:29:55.759 and then I tried to convince Ala Caconi and Tom 477 00:29:55.839 --> 00:30:01.319 Gage to commercialize the T zero. Now that the teaser, 478 00:30:01.519 --> 00:30:05.559 and there's like lots of stuff online about it. You know, 479 00:30:05.680 --> 00:30:08.680 it didn't have doors or a roof, so clearly you 480 00:30:08.680 --> 00:30:13.279 need to add those things or any safety systems. And 481 00:30:13.359 --> 00:30:15.960 it was very unreliable because it was just like a 482 00:30:16.000 --> 00:30:17.000 sort of a proof of concept. 483 00:30:17.079 --> 00:30:20.039 Basically it was basically like canned assembled. 484 00:30:20.079 --> 00:30:22.359 You guys really had trouble scaling it. 485 00:30:24.559 --> 00:30:27.599 It's I mean it literally didn't have doors or a roof, 486 00:30:28.319 --> 00:30:34.119 or any airbags or an effective cooling system for the battery, 487 00:30:34.799 --> 00:30:38.000 and it was not safe, and it was very unreliable 488 00:30:38.759 --> 00:30:42.839 breakdown like you it need to be baby buy an 489 00:30:42.839 --> 00:30:44.400 engineer or would not you can use it. 490 00:30:45.759 --> 00:30:49.039 So but nonetheless, it did get like zero. 491 00:30:48.880 --> 00:30:52.359 To sixty I think, you know, under four seconds two 492 00:30:52.359 --> 00:30:54.480 and fifty mile range. 493 00:30:55.839 --> 00:30:57.880 It was enough to convince you that. 494 00:30:57.799 --> 00:30:58.680 It was possible. 495 00:30:59.039 --> 00:31:03.599 I mean it was possible because if you go from 496 00:31:04.000 --> 00:31:09.319 the interests you have lead Acid to to Letimon, you've 497 00:31:09.359 --> 00:31:11.759 got about a four x energy dwncity improvement. So you've 498 00:31:11.759 --> 00:31:13.440 got if you've got to say, a sixty mile range 499 00:31:13.519 --> 00:31:15.440 with lead acid, you're gonna have about a turn of 500 00:31:15.480 --> 00:31:18.680 fifty mile range with with litiumon for the same weight. 501 00:31:22.240 --> 00:31:25.319 So but it was it was cool to see it 502 00:31:25.319 --> 00:31:31.839 in action with with ac propulsion. So I tried hard 503 00:31:31.839 --> 00:31:34.759 to convince those guys. I could really pester them a 504 00:31:34.759 --> 00:31:40.279 lot to going to to commercialize the T zero, and 505 00:31:40.319 --> 00:31:44.039 they just did not want to do it. Weirdly, the 506 00:31:44.079 --> 00:31:49.680 thing they wanted to make was an electric sion. And 507 00:31:49.680 --> 00:31:52.920 I'm like, you guys, nobody's gonna pay seventy thousand dollars 508 00:31:53.000 --> 00:31:56.400 for an electric sion. Okay, that was their idea, seventy 509 00:31:56.440 --> 00:31:59.599 thousand dollars for an electric sion. I'm like, there's not 510 00:31:59.640 --> 00:32:03.440 gonna work. Okay, you will sell like fourteen of these things, 511 00:32:04.799 --> 00:32:08.319 you know, And I'm like, you know, I have like 512 00:32:08.359 --> 00:32:13.240 the email trails in these Yeah, I mean I think 513 00:32:13.240 --> 00:32:19.680 they're still still around. So in fact, but I even say, listen, 514 00:32:20.839 --> 00:32:22.839 even though I think this is the dumbest idea ever, 515 00:32:23.440 --> 00:32:27.640 I will I will pay. I will fund one tenth 516 00:32:27.640 --> 00:32:32.440 of it if you can find bine other people. And 517 00:32:32.559 --> 00:32:34.039 I think the only other person I could find he 518 00:32:34.079 --> 00:32:38.240 would was gay Brin. So it's like, okay, so Gay 519 00:32:38.480 --> 00:32:40.599 and I are the only ones willing to do this, 520 00:32:40.720 --> 00:32:42.680 I think, And so they didn't actually get her off 521 00:32:42.680 --> 00:32:46.160 the ground, but I said it's going to fail, okay, 522 00:32:47.200 --> 00:32:52.480 but at least it's something and and so then eventually 523 00:32:52.759 --> 00:32:55.799 I said, I'm like, listen, if you guys are not 524 00:32:55.839 --> 00:32:59.920 going to commercialize the teaser, do you mind if I 525 00:33:00.119 --> 00:33:03.799 do it? And they're like no, yeah, that'd be totally fine, 526 00:33:03.880 --> 00:33:06.920 Like okay. 527 00:33:07.079 --> 00:33:08.960 So then I was gonna it's like, okay, so I. 528 00:33:10.480 --> 00:33:14.480 Go do this with with JB and we'll go commercialized 529 00:33:14.519 --> 00:33:17.279 to create a commercial version of the T zero and 530 00:33:17.599 --> 00:33:21.960 then engage. And Coconi said, well, you know there's some 531 00:33:22.000 --> 00:33:24.160 other people who also want to do it. Do you 532 00:33:24.240 --> 00:33:27.119 want to maybe team up with them? He said there 533 00:33:27.119 --> 00:33:29.640 were two other groups that wanted to do it, And 534 00:33:29.680 --> 00:33:32.160 I was like, okay, sure, you know, maybe this is 535 00:33:32.160 --> 00:33:33.440 the way that I can have my cake and eat 536 00:33:33.440 --> 00:33:37.519 it too. You know, last work never works up. God damn, 537 00:33:37.880 --> 00:33:40.000 Try to have your cake and eat it too, doesn't it? 538 00:33:42.000 --> 00:33:43.079 This one's going to be easy? 539 00:33:43.759 --> 00:33:43.839 No? 540 00:33:44.000 --> 00:33:45.119 I mean, well. 541 00:33:46.720 --> 00:33:48.119 I didn't think it would be easy, but it was 542 00:33:48.160 --> 00:33:51.599 like I thought, maybe I can allocate like twenty to 543 00:33:51.640 --> 00:33:53.880 thirty hours a week and just work on product and 544 00:33:53.920 --> 00:33:56.640 engineering and then other people can do those stuff. But 545 00:33:56.680 --> 00:34:00.880 I don't even like doing those souff anyway, So that 546 00:34:01.000 --> 00:34:08.719 it didn't work out. So so that then tom Gage said, 547 00:34:09.199 --> 00:34:10.760 he said, he said there were two teams, but I 548 00:34:10.760 --> 00:34:14.480 only ever met one, and that was ever hard toppening 549 00:34:14.519 --> 00:34:19.440 and right, but like, the thing that is really bugs 550 00:34:19.519 --> 00:34:23.039 about them is they everhard. Particular the worst guy I've 551 00:34:23.039 --> 00:34:24.440 ever worked with. And I want to make a note 552 00:34:24.440 --> 00:34:27.079 of this. He is literally the worst person I've ever 553 00:34:27.119 --> 00:34:30.280 worked with. And I've worked with some real ditchbacks. 554 00:34:32.599 --> 00:34:40.480 Okay, to be number one takes a lot. It's not easy. 555 00:34:41.360 --> 00:34:43.800 His version of the story is like, is that out 556 00:34:43.800 --> 00:34:47.159 of the blue he pitched me on on funding on 557 00:34:47.239 --> 00:34:52.320 funding his electric car company, and and and he convinced 558 00:34:52.320 --> 00:34:56.360 me to do it. Totally false, Okay, I was like, 559 00:34:56.639 --> 00:35:00.639 I'm creating an electric car company. It's like the Gage said, 560 00:35:00.639 --> 00:35:03.800 well maybe you could team up. It's like, okay, well 561 00:35:04.199 --> 00:35:08.159 that that might be worth worth doing. And and so 562 00:35:08.800 --> 00:35:12.199 the company ended up being basically five people. 563 00:35:12.679 --> 00:35:14.400 This is right Toppening. 564 00:35:15.559 --> 00:35:22.159 Uh, you know, everhard struggle myself and so there's the 565 00:35:22.159 --> 00:35:27.199 five of us, and like topping always tries to write 566 00:35:27.800 --> 00:35:30.320 right right out of the history books because they had 567 00:35:30.360 --> 00:35:32.920 a huge battle, and they made me choose which one 568 00:35:33.039 --> 00:35:36.880 was going to be CEO. It's Right or Everhard, And 569 00:35:36.920 --> 00:35:39.679 I told JV, and is like, which one because I 570 00:35:39.719 --> 00:35:43.800 really didn't know want to be CEO. So they're like, okay, 571 00:35:43.840 --> 00:35:48.400 well both have issues, but maybe right has bigger issues 572 00:35:48.440 --> 00:35:51.400 than Toppening. That's what JV said, so maybe you know 573 00:35:51.719 --> 00:35:54.639 lesser evals. I was like, okay, fine, I gotta make 574 00:35:54.639 --> 00:35:56.760 a choice here because the two of them would not 575 00:35:58.360 --> 00:35:59.880 they would not they refuse to be the same ble. 576 00:36:00.639 --> 00:36:01.199 So I was like. 577 00:36:03.000 --> 00:36:06.639 A lot of drama that has so much trauma. And 578 00:36:06.679 --> 00:36:11.519 I was like, okay, you know, it's not like I said, like, 579 00:36:13.639 --> 00:36:20.360 you know, you know less or evils. So it's like 580 00:36:20.400 --> 00:36:24.880 I said, you're right, sorry, you know, not that I 581 00:36:24.920 --> 00:36:27.320 didn't think he had good points, but I gotta if 582 00:36:27.360 --> 00:36:29.760 I got to pick one, and I don't. I was 583 00:36:29.760 --> 00:36:33.199 trying not to be I've gotta make this rocking company work, 584 00:36:33.559 --> 00:36:39.840 so okay, so then made uh you know, it's like right, 585 00:36:40.559 --> 00:36:43.840 you know, it's like I had to leave then anyway, 586 00:36:47.599 --> 00:36:53.719 So we've got the Basically, we we we jammed a 587 00:36:54.960 --> 00:37:01.840 superpulsion powertrain and backpack into a Lotus lease with the 588 00:37:01.880 --> 00:37:04.760 first productyping like really just jammed it in, you know. 589 00:37:07.199 --> 00:37:16.519 And in retrospect this was not a good idea because 590 00:37:16.639 --> 00:37:20.599 the the car ended up weighing like like sixty percent 591 00:37:20.679 --> 00:37:24.039 more than in the lease or on that order, and 592 00:37:24.320 --> 00:37:26.239 we didn't have enough follow you to put the battery pack, 593 00:37:27.199 --> 00:37:29.800 and we had to meet all we invalidated all of 594 00:37:29.840 --> 00:37:32.480 the crash tests because the weight distribution was different. It 595 00:37:32.559 --> 00:37:35.920 was heavier, so none of the crash tests were valid anymore. 596 00:37:36.360 --> 00:37:39.159 To redo the airbags, the air conditioning air conditioner ran 597 00:37:39.199 --> 00:37:42.719 off a belt fan, so we didn't have a belt van, 598 00:37:42.840 --> 00:37:45.320 so we had to have a new air conditioning system, 599 00:37:45.320 --> 00:37:50.599 so to change the HVAC system. And so basically in 600 00:37:50.639 --> 00:37:53.519 the end, only about like I think six or seven 601 00:37:53.519 --> 00:37:55.639 percent of the parts ended up being in common with 602 00:37:55.679 --> 00:38:00.599 the lease. So and I went through a lot of 603 00:38:00.599 --> 00:38:03.960 trouble trying to shoot one everything in there, and I mean, 604 00:38:04.000 --> 00:38:06.079 it's a cute car, but it's ten percent too small, 605 00:38:06.880 --> 00:38:15.679 it's like, and then the costs ended up being crazy, 606 00:38:15.840 --> 00:38:23.360 and yeah, and then then yeah, there was there was 607 00:38:23.360 --> 00:38:27.960 an ordit of for the costs of the production costs 608 00:38:27.960 --> 00:38:30.199 of the roads to buy one of the investors that 609 00:38:30.320 --> 00:38:34.840 joined in two thousand and seven. And and then they 610 00:38:34.880 --> 00:38:37.920 caught me up and said, hey, the the numbers that 611 00:38:37.960 --> 00:38:41.199 Martin is telling you, Theybore's telling you about the roads 612 00:38:41.360 --> 00:38:42.400 are totally false. 613 00:38:42.519 --> 00:38:42.960 Oh boy. 614 00:38:44.320 --> 00:38:46.199 And I was like, what do you mean? Like he said, no, 615 00:38:46.280 --> 00:38:48.639 we just didn't order it there. It's more than twice 616 00:38:48.800 --> 00:38:52.320 of what do you say, the Yeah, it's like we 617 00:38:52.320 --> 00:38:54.679 would have to sell this car for a quarter million 618 00:38:54.719 --> 00:38:59.000 dollars in order to make to not lose money, Like 619 00:38:59.199 --> 00:39:04.599 this is insane. So anyway, then we obviously had to 620 00:39:04.599 --> 00:39:07.840 fire everhard. There was no choice about that. 621 00:39:10.400 --> 00:39:10.599 Yeah. 622 00:39:10.679 --> 00:39:12.679 And then it turned out not only had he misled 623 00:39:12.679 --> 00:39:17.639 me directly, if he'd instructed others to also lie. Yes, 624 00:39:17.760 --> 00:39:19.880 when I say, like somebody, that's like the worst person 625 00:39:19.880 --> 00:39:29.159 who worked with it was pretty bad. So the SpaceX 626 00:39:29.159 --> 00:39:31.559 also hadn't gotten over at that time. So I was like, man, 627 00:39:34.159 --> 00:39:43.400 So like, okay, I asked, what's his name, Harris, I'm 628 00:39:43.400 --> 00:39:45.159 really guy. 629 00:39:46.440 --> 00:39:50.239 When banking on the name Interim. 630 00:39:51.000 --> 00:39:57.440 Uh yeah, he he ran like a manufacturing company. I mean, 631 00:39:57.480 --> 00:39:59.320 he seemed pretty smart. The problem The problem that I 632 00:39:59.360 --> 00:40:02.360 found with Testa was we were start up in Silicon 633 00:40:02.440 --> 00:40:09.480 Valley building a car that was really manufacturing and materials engineering, 634 00:40:09.480 --> 00:40:13.119 and it's really like all the talent was for You 635 00:40:13.159 --> 00:40:18.239 think there was probably talent, you know, in Detroit to Japan, 636 00:40:18.920 --> 00:40:20.599 but if you took any of those guys in to 637 00:40:20.960 --> 00:40:23.360 run Tesla, they would run out like a car company 638 00:40:23.360 --> 00:40:23.599 and then. 639 00:40:23.519 --> 00:40:24.760 It would be destroyed. 640 00:40:24.800 --> 00:40:26.599 Well, no idea, you can take somebody who's running. 641 00:40:26.760 --> 00:40:29.360 I could not take someone from a massive company culture 642 00:40:29.400 --> 00:40:31.920 and having to do a startup. And yet you couldn't 643 00:40:31.920 --> 00:40:34.440 find anyone in the Silicon Valley who knew who knew 644 00:40:34.519 --> 00:40:36.880 enough about making cars. And so we kind of found 645 00:40:36.880 --> 00:40:39.280 a middle, middle of the road who he was. He 646 00:40:39.320 --> 00:40:41.400 was an expert in manufacturing. 647 00:40:41.960 --> 00:40:47.039 X CEO of Flextronics, was an investor, and he agreed 648 00:40:47.079 --> 00:40:49.119 to just be joined us the interim CEO. 649 00:40:49.320 --> 00:40:51.039 And this is two thousand and seven. 650 00:40:51.360 --> 00:40:54.559 Yeah, but I mean Tesla was a company you tried 651 00:40:54.679 --> 00:40:56.440 so hard not to be CEO of. 652 00:40:59.760 --> 00:41:03.480 Yeah. But the thing is this is misinterpreted. If I 653 00:41:03.480 --> 00:41:05.880 say that, it's misinterpreteds like I somehow don't love Teesla, 654 00:41:05.920 --> 00:41:08.719 which I do. It's just like I tried not to 655 00:41:08.719 --> 00:41:10.480 go insane with work on. 656 00:41:10.559 --> 00:41:10.960 Yeah, you can. 657 00:41:11.360 --> 00:41:14.400 Being to see of a real startup is eighty hours 658 00:41:14.440 --> 00:41:16.079 a week. Being CEE of two is one hundred and 659 00:41:16.119 --> 00:41:17.960 sixty hours a week, and there's only one hundred and 660 00:41:17.960 --> 00:41:21.800 sixty nine hours or something of sleep of one hundred 661 00:41:21.800 --> 00:41:23.920 and sixty eight hours a week, so like you just 662 00:41:23.960 --> 00:41:25.000 can't physically do it. 663 00:41:26.519 --> 00:41:32.800 Yeah, I mean the pain level is extreme, so that's yeah. Anyway, 664 00:41:32.880 --> 00:41:37.920 let's try quite hard not to be to you, but 665 00:41:38.320 --> 00:41:41.719 had to be no choice that or tells him die, 666 00:41:42.440 --> 00:41:44.559 so so that yeah. 667 00:41:45.679 --> 00:41:50.639 Everhard Gut was fired in July two thousand and seven, 668 00:41:51.119 --> 00:41:53.639 and he was at the time we didn't know he'd 669 00:41:53.639 --> 00:41:55.760 instructed other people to lie, so we thought he was 670 00:41:55.800 --> 00:41:58.599 just you know, it wasn't as bad. But once he 671 00:41:58.719 --> 00:42:01.559 left the building then it turned out no, he'd actually 672 00:42:01.599 --> 00:42:06.440 orchestrated a massive deception, which is quite bad. 673 00:42:08.840 --> 00:42:15.440 So yeah. Yeah. 674 00:42:15.440 --> 00:42:17.000 He also says he came up with the name of 675 00:42:17.119 --> 00:42:19.840 Tells the Motors Motors, which is false. I was created 676 00:42:19.840 --> 00:42:23.119 by a guy in ninety five and more of a 677 00:42:23.280 --> 00:42:27.039 he knows this because we went to great length we had. 678 00:42:26.920 --> 00:42:29.239 To buy the trademark. Yeah, exactly, So you can come 679 00:42:29.199 --> 00:42:34.679 about the name. It was a trademark ninety five, So 680 00:42:34.800 --> 00:42:38.320 it's like there's a whole bullshit backstory of it. But 681 00:42:39.199 --> 00:42:42.519 the guy, we almost almost had to change the name 682 00:42:42.559 --> 00:42:45.480 of the company because the guy who owned tells the 683 00:42:45.519 --> 00:42:51.239 motors wouldn't communicate with us, and so eventually we sent 684 00:42:51.840 --> 00:42:55.440 the nicest kind of company. Now, who's weirdly Martin's best friend, 685 00:42:55.440 --> 00:42:59.840 which I don't understand, but Mark Toppening super nice guy. Actually, 686 00:43:00.920 --> 00:43:05.000 you can't not like Mark, It's impossible. He's super nice guy. 687 00:43:05.079 --> 00:43:07.480 So this said Mark to go sit on the guy's 688 00:43:07.480 --> 00:43:11.840 door step and not leave until he until he agreed 689 00:43:11.880 --> 00:43:14.480 to at least negotiate with us or something. You talked 690 00:43:14.519 --> 00:43:17.599 to us, And then we ended up buying the trademark 691 00:43:17.639 --> 00:43:20.639 for seventy five thousand dollars. 692 00:43:21.440 --> 00:43:25.199 Yeah, was he the one who owned the domain too? 693 00:43:25.679 --> 00:43:27.840 No, that was a whole different nightmare. 694 00:43:29.920 --> 00:43:32.199 Now that domain guy that took us ten years to 695 00:43:32.199 --> 00:43:38.639 buy that tis dot com domain. Man, it was it 696 00:43:38.679 --> 00:43:42.519 is I think still like a networking engineer at Junifler. 697 00:43:44.559 --> 00:43:48.760 So yeah, there was, and that costs us like ten 698 00:43:48.800 --> 00:43:53.000 million dollars. Yeah, that was crazy, Like just the guy 699 00:43:53.119 --> 00:43:54.039 just held out. 700 00:43:54.559 --> 00:43:55.960 Was he just sitting on the domain or was he 701 00:43:56.079 --> 00:43:56.800 using it for something? 702 00:43:56.960 --> 00:44:01.599 It was impossible to No, he wasn't using it for anything. 703 00:44:01.639 --> 00:44:06.840 The name it's like Twitter handle Falcon heavy. We're fighting 704 00:44:06.840 --> 00:44:07.320 for that one. 705 00:44:08.800 --> 00:44:09.000 Yeah. 706 00:44:09.119 --> 00:44:12.079 So man, that was to us ages to buy the 707 00:44:12.119 --> 00:44:16.119 Tails economy, but we're gonna have to change the name 708 00:44:17.199 --> 00:44:19.719 to be something else. 709 00:44:19.760 --> 00:44:24.639 And actually the lead candidate. 710 00:44:24.360 --> 00:44:28.920 Was was Faraday as the name because Faraday invented the 711 00:44:28.960 --> 00:44:33.320 electric motor and then Tails look perfected the electric motor 712 00:44:33.320 --> 00:44:34.519 with the AC induction motor. 713 00:44:35.000 --> 00:44:35.400 So it was. 714 00:44:37.039 --> 00:44:39.480 So if we couldn't do Tales, that would do Faraday. 715 00:44:39.519 --> 00:44:42.960 And then ironically a competitor was later created. 716 00:44:43.000 --> 00:44:49.519 Cool, let's start up yeah China, right, yeah, yeah yeah. 717 00:44:50.599 --> 00:44:54.239 So did you guys have a Faraday a logo or anything? 718 00:44:54.280 --> 00:44:55.320 Were you that far down there? 719 00:44:55.360 --> 00:44:59.039 No, we didn't really even have a tail logo until 720 00:44:59.239 --> 00:45:04.599 later because there's nothing to sell or anything. So but 721 00:45:05.199 --> 00:45:07.760 in the end, the tel the logo and the Tailor 722 00:45:07.880 --> 00:45:17.280 font was done by me working with basically a little firm. 723 00:45:17.400 --> 00:45:22.440 That's why the Tailor and SpaceX there's some similarities between 724 00:45:22.440 --> 00:45:27.159 the the fonts, and that's because I just don't buy 725 00:45:27.199 --> 00:45:33.519 the same people. Yeah, I spent a lot of time 726 00:45:33.559 --> 00:45:37.920 on the tails and space x fonse the get a little. 727 00:45:38.440 --> 00:45:46.679 That's cool, Yeah, sure, sure, excellent, all right, awesome. 728 00:45:55.960 --> 00:45:57.719 It would be much easier if if the world was 729 00:45:57.719 --> 00:46:00.159 flat or if you're not if you're in a flat situations, 730 00:46:00.199 --> 00:46:03.880 those things are not flatten. You've got the world has 731 00:46:04.039 --> 00:46:07.039 undulations and curves, and and then your the car can 732 00:46:07.079 --> 00:46:09.079 be at any kind of at any kind of angle, 733 00:46:10.000 --> 00:46:12.079 and then if you if you accelerate or break, it's 734 00:46:12.079 --> 00:46:15.039 actually gonna tip a little bit. Yeah, we've got sort 735 00:46:15.039 --> 00:46:17.880 of pitch and mule compensations. 736 00:46:18.119 --> 00:46:19.320 That's where it gets really tricky. 737 00:46:20.119 --> 00:46:23.440 Yeah, I mean they're doing just amazing work. It literally 738 00:46:23.480 --> 00:46:26.440 just blows my mind every time, like there's an update, 739 00:46:26.599 --> 00:46:28.960 like you think it's like wow, I can't believe. It's 740 00:46:28.960 --> 00:46:31.679 just good, and then it just gets better. 741 00:46:32.000 --> 00:46:34.519 Like the big one was the faster lane changes, like 742 00:46:34.880 --> 00:46:38.760 you push the turn second was like like immediately, it's really. 743 00:46:38.480 --> 00:46:40.320 Awesome, satisfying. 744 00:46:40.400 --> 00:46:42.800 Yeah, well I was kind of just like before, I 745 00:46:42.840 --> 00:46:45.199 was like, Okay, it's not that good, but it feels 746 00:46:45.199 --> 00:46:47.480 good because like I can't believe a computer is doing this, 747 00:46:47.840 --> 00:46:49.480 and we got the faster ones and I was like, 748 00:46:49.519 --> 00:46:51.639 oh my god, it was so bad before. 749 00:46:52.599 --> 00:46:56.159 You know, Yeah, I mean it'll be able to just 750 00:46:56.760 --> 00:46:59.719 do crazy maneuvers like like a high speed chase technically 751 00:47:01.599 --> 00:47:04.039 because it's it's you don't always want to buy into 752 00:47:04.079 --> 00:47:06.559 the thing to be conservative in any and actions that 753 00:47:06.639 --> 00:47:14.360 it takes. But there's there's quite a significant foundational rewrite 754 00:47:14.519 --> 00:47:19.480 in the TEES autopod system that's almost completely Yeah, and 755 00:47:19.559 --> 00:47:20.360 what what part of. 756 00:47:20.360 --> 00:47:24.119 The system like perception, like planning or. 757 00:47:24.199 --> 00:47:24.599 Just like. 758 00:47:26.440 --> 00:47:33.039 It's it's instead of having planning, perception, image recognition all 759 00:47:33.039 --> 00:47:35.199 be separate, they're they're they're being combined. 760 00:47:36.719 --> 00:47:47.480 So yeah, I don't even understand what effectually like the 761 00:47:47.480 --> 00:47:51.239 the sort of neural net is absorbing more and more 762 00:47:51.280 --> 00:47:56.599 of the problem beyond simply the is this is if 763 00:47:56.599 --> 00:47:58.639 you see an image, is this a car or not? 764 00:47:59.519 --> 00:47:59.719 Or what? 765 00:48:00.079 --> 00:48:00.360 You know? 766 00:48:01.679 --> 00:48:03.519 It's it's kind of what do you what do you 767 00:48:03.559 --> 00:48:08.920 do from that? Three D labeling is the next big thing, 768 00:48:10.039 --> 00:48:12.599 where the car can go through a scene with eight 769 00:48:12.639 --> 00:48:18.239 cameras and and and and kind of paint a paint 770 00:48:18.239 --> 00:48:20.960 a path and then you can label the path in 771 00:48:21.039 --> 00:48:24.519 three D. This is probably two or three order of 772 00:48:24.559 --> 00:48:28.679 magnitude improvement in labeling efficiency and labeling accuracy, you know 773 00:48:30.760 --> 00:48:34.920 two through orders improvement in labeling efficiency and significant improvement 774 00:48:35.000 --> 00:48:38.639 in labeling accuracy as opposed to having to label individual 775 00:48:38.639 --> 00:48:44.039 frames from eight cameras at thirty six frames a second. 776 00:48:44.119 --> 00:48:49.519 Just drive through the scene, rebuild that scene as a 777 00:48:51.079 --> 00:48:54.199 three D thing with it, so it's like there might 778 00:48:54.199 --> 00:48:56.119 be a thousand frames that we used to create that 779 00:48:56.159 --> 00:48:59.239 scene and then you can label all at once. 780 00:49:00.519 --> 00:49:01.880 Is that related to the dojo thing? 781 00:49:01.920 --> 00:49:03.280 You mentioned that the autonomy day. 782 00:49:04.119 --> 00:49:07.360 Now dojo's for learning, for training the neural net. That's 783 00:49:07.400 --> 00:49:09.400 like when you're trying to build the neural net that 784 00:49:09.440 --> 00:49:11.679 you ship into the car, Dojo speeds it up by 785 00:49:11.679 --> 00:49:12.800 hardware accelerating it. 786 00:49:13.920 --> 00:49:15.079 Yeah, exactly. 787 00:49:16.159 --> 00:49:18.719 Are you guys has that up and running yet or no? 788 00:49:19.079 --> 00:49:21.639 It might be we might have first one at the 789 00:49:21.719 --> 00:49:25.800 end of this year, but next year. I think it's 790 00:49:25.880 --> 00:49:29.559 very likely next year, maybe this year. But it's essentially 791 00:49:29.639 --> 00:49:33.440 meant to as a massive amounts of video input and 792 00:49:33.960 --> 00:49:39.440 then and then train against vast amounts of data so 793 00:49:39.480 --> 00:49:41.000 that it can be used in the inference engine in 794 00:49:41.039 --> 00:49:43.880 the car. It's just like a human really, It's like 795 00:49:44.360 --> 00:49:46.199 how long does it take you to learn a subject 796 00:49:46.760 --> 00:49:50.880 versus do a subject. You know, it's like hard to learn, 797 00:49:51.119 --> 00:49:54.920 say calculus, but once you learned it, then you can 798 00:49:55.239 --> 00:49:59.039 you know, integrate something fast or something. It's like it's 799 00:49:59.079 --> 00:50:02.400 a it's really the same same basic thing. 800 00:50:03.000 --> 00:50:05.360 Yeah, I mean, that'll just really tighten the feedback loop. 801 00:50:05.480 --> 00:50:07.679 Like at some point it just gets impossible to catch 802 00:50:07.679 --> 00:50:10.320 you guys, and like the rest of the people haven't 803 00:50:10.360 --> 00:50:12.920 even really like started the rest of the auto industry, 804 00:50:13.440 --> 00:50:15.599 and like the feedback loop is just getting so tight 805 00:50:15.639 --> 00:50:18.960 with autopilot now, it's just like makes it a lot easier. 806 00:50:19.800 --> 00:50:20.920 I think it will. 807 00:50:21.760 --> 00:50:24.400 They will catch up eventually, at least they will catch 808 00:50:24.400 --> 00:50:28.400 a t where TESA is now. I don't know things 809 00:50:28.440 --> 00:50:31.079 like like for example, we're talking about maps and directions 810 00:50:31.159 --> 00:50:37.079 and how today like computer based and navigation is a 811 00:50:37.119 --> 00:50:41.159 trouble considered trivial. But you know, back in ninety five 812 00:50:41.199 --> 00:50:44.000 it was not true. Yeah, it was considered very hard 813 00:50:44.480 --> 00:50:47.840 and the computer power you had was tiny, so like 814 00:50:48.039 --> 00:50:51.840 the code had to be super tight. I couldn't have 815 00:50:51.880 --> 00:50:54.840 fluffy code if you're you know, trying to execute something 816 00:50:54.880 --> 00:50:58.840 on like a three eighty six, you know, like very 817 00:50:58.920 --> 00:51:04.840 very puny amount of memory and compute. So so now 818 00:51:04.840 --> 00:51:10.199 it's but but now maps, directions are are easy. I 819 00:51:10.239 --> 00:51:12.360 think it's at some point in the future, it might 820 00:51:12.440 --> 00:51:18.000 be a decade or something, then autonomy will will seem easy. 821 00:51:18.320 --> 00:51:20.920 Yeah, I mean it will obviously be commoditized in the 822 00:51:20.960 --> 00:51:21.800 long term. 823 00:51:22.000 --> 00:51:23.639 Yes, it will. 824 00:51:24.119 --> 00:51:27.239 It will seem easy in ten years, but there will 825 00:51:27.280 --> 00:51:31.360 be a long stretch there where there will be vast 826 00:51:31.360 --> 00:51:37.400 differences between cars. Well, I have I have the order industry. 827 00:51:37.599 --> 00:51:44.920 It is used to slow rates of improvements, so you know, 828 00:51:45.079 --> 00:51:50.280 it's this will not really a car yet that matches 829 00:51:50.320 --> 00:51:51.360 the original model s. 830 00:51:51.679 --> 00:51:52.679 Maybe you canug. 831 00:51:54.360 --> 00:51:56.280 If you look at like the E p A ratings, 832 00:51:57.039 --> 00:52:00.320 it literally is just all below Yeah. 833 00:52:01.199 --> 00:52:04.599 So that was twenty twelve and it's twenty twenty, so 834 00:52:04.639 --> 00:52:06.880 it's it's still like pretty hard to get a car. 835 00:52:07.760 --> 00:52:12.440 Let's say that's there's not a car available at the 836 00:52:12.480 --> 00:52:15.239 price of the models that has the capabilities of the 837 00:52:15.280 --> 00:52:16.679 models of twenty twelve. 838 00:52:16.760 --> 00:52:18.599 It's kind of exactly what you were talking about with 839 00:52:18.679 --> 00:52:20.079 the Elise, where you're like, oh, we'll just put a 840 00:52:20.119 --> 00:52:22.960 battery in the Eleise, and that kind of showed you like, Okay, 841 00:52:23.000 --> 00:52:24.599 we really need to ground up electric. 842 00:52:24.599 --> 00:52:31.039 Disney hasn't done that, like the sort of founding principles 843 00:52:31.079 --> 00:52:39.320 of Teesla. We're basically completely wrong. So the premise going 844 00:52:39.320 --> 00:52:41.440 in is like, it's not going to be that hard. 845 00:52:41.559 --> 00:52:44.280 You know, we'll just take the Lotus Lease, you know, 846 00:52:44.320 --> 00:52:47.960 a nice light, lightweight car, and we'll take AC propulsions 847 00:52:48.639 --> 00:52:50.840 drive unit technology and we'll. 848 00:52:50.639 --> 00:52:53.920 Put them together and we'll have electric car. It'd be great. 849 00:52:54.159 --> 00:52:59.199 This sounds pretty easy, except the AC propulsion technology it 850 00:52:59.519 --> 00:53:03.880 could not be industrialized. Like it was like basically hand 851 00:53:03.960 --> 00:53:08.599 crafted electronics with an analog motor controller. Yeah, and so 852 00:53:08.719 --> 00:53:11.599 depending if there was hot or cold, you would respond 853 00:53:11.639 --> 00:53:18.719 differently or not at all, and the motors were hand round. 854 00:53:18.760 --> 00:53:21.360 It was just like it was like impossible. It cannot 855 00:53:21.360 --> 00:53:26.519 scale this technology. You can have like Finickey individually made 856 00:53:26.599 --> 00:53:30.280 super expensive prototypes, but you could. We ended up using 857 00:53:30.280 --> 00:53:35.199 none of the AC propulsion technology. So yeah, it's something 858 00:53:35.199 --> 00:53:38.079 that looks cool and works well at an individual prototype level, 859 00:53:38.079 --> 00:53:42.440 does not necessarily scale. And then the like I said, 860 00:53:42.440 --> 00:53:44.599 it was like maybe seven percent of the parts of 861 00:53:44.639 --> 00:53:47.800 the original roads that were in common with the Lotus Lease. 862 00:53:48.519 --> 00:53:50.199 It would have been way easier if we started from 863 00:53:50.239 --> 00:53:55.000 blank slate. It would have been a better car. So 864 00:53:55.760 --> 00:53:59.320 but I think like the real test of any given 865 00:53:59.320 --> 00:54:02.920 startup is how does it respond to adversity and adapt 866 00:54:03.199 --> 00:54:04.760 and and and and just figure it out? 867 00:54:05.159 --> 00:54:05.400 You know. 868 00:54:05.480 --> 00:54:10.400 So like most things are just when they start out, 869 00:54:10.400 --> 00:54:12.559 they're just they don't make a lot of sense. But 870 00:54:12.599 --> 00:54:16.079 then as long as you adapt quickly, then you can 871 00:54:16.159 --> 00:54:22.760 make the company work. And you know, if you say 872 00:54:22.800 --> 00:54:27.639 like some sort of confinity, you know, doing doing pomp 873 00:54:27.679 --> 00:54:30.639 out tokens with the infrared port made no sense, but 874 00:54:30.639 --> 00:54:33.519 they adapted quickly to online payments, you know, That's that 875 00:54:33.639 --> 00:54:39.480 was that was key. And yeah, at at x dot 876 00:54:39.519 --> 00:54:42.559 com was originally going to buy it off way more 877 00:54:42.599 --> 00:54:44.239 than a could chew by trying to all the banking 878 00:54:44.280 --> 00:54:47.159 services and then also focused on payments. It's like, if 879 00:54:47.199 --> 00:54:48.840 we do all these banking things, we're gonna need a 880 00:54:48.840 --> 00:54:50.800 banking license, and banking license going to slow us down. 881 00:54:51.360 --> 00:54:52.960 We're just focused on payments, so we can just get 882 00:54:52.960 --> 00:54:55.800 a payment you know, license from the state and it's 883 00:54:55.880 --> 00:54:58.119 just like fifty bucks or something. You can be a 884 00:54:58.239 --> 00:55:03.280 money transmitter literally, and so you just go to it 885 00:55:03.320 --> 00:55:03.920 daft quickly. 886 00:55:05.960 --> 00:55:07.760 You kind of need to be naive, though if you 887 00:55:07.840 --> 00:55:11.159 had known as much about manufacturing, you might not have 888 00:55:11.360 --> 00:55:13.519 done it. 889 00:55:14.199 --> 00:55:17.960 Yeah, yeah, this would have been. 890 00:55:20.280 --> 00:55:24.159 It would have been difficult to I guess if you 891 00:55:24.159 --> 00:55:26.159 know the outcome is going to be good in the end. Sure, 892 00:55:26.519 --> 00:55:28.280 it sort of depends on how much foretnoledge do you 893 00:55:28.320 --> 00:55:29.440 have about it. 894 00:55:29.440 --> 00:55:29.559 It. 895 00:55:30.199 --> 00:55:34.679 Manufacturings is insanely difficult. It's underappreciated. It's difficulty. 896 00:55:35.679 --> 00:55:37.000 Yeah, I know, that's totally true. 897 00:55:37.199 --> 00:55:42.320 Yeah, even making the roads store, which we only peak 898 00:55:42.400 --> 00:55:46.639 made abound six hundred roadsters in a year, but you know, 899 00:55:46.719 --> 00:55:49.559 call it like ten a week or something like that, 900 00:55:49.679 --> 00:55:52.639 you know, ten or twelve a week. So you know, 901 00:55:52.719 --> 00:55:55.280 if two got made in a day, that was a 902 00:55:55.320 --> 00:56:02.159 big day and tells us making over a thousand cars day. 903 00:56:02.199 --> 00:56:04.800 Now what I find amazing is from start to finish, 904 00:56:04.800 --> 00:56:07.159 your car is made in forty eight hours. 905 00:56:07.719 --> 00:56:09.559 Yeah it's been would count start to finishing? 906 00:56:09.679 --> 00:56:12.400 Yeah, it depends. But you can see the role of 907 00:56:12.440 --> 00:56:13.119 aluminum in. 908 00:56:13.159 --> 00:56:15.000 One section of the factory and you can see the 909 00:56:15.000 --> 00:56:17.719 cars coming out the other end, and then it is astounding. 910 00:56:17.719 --> 00:56:20.159 And cars have been built for a long time, but 911 00:56:20.159 --> 00:56:22.920 but this is just astounding. It's still when you you 912 00:56:22.960 --> 00:56:25.039 don't appreciate when you're driving a car, how much goes 913 00:56:25.079 --> 00:56:28.599 into the level of detail of ten thousand parts that 914 00:56:28.639 --> 00:56:30.599 come together, the shaping of everything that. 915 00:56:30.519 --> 00:56:34.920 Doesn't unique unique cards. Wow, the back alone is several 916 00:56:34.960 --> 00:56:36.639 thousand cells and it all. 917 00:56:36.480 --> 00:56:40.880 Comes together with people that are skilled. But you know, 918 00:56:41.000 --> 00:56:43.920 skills are changing. Is as things become a little bit 919 00:56:43.960 --> 00:56:46.440 there's more, there's more autonomy, but it's not it's not 920 00:56:46.719 --> 00:56:49.320 autonomy is not perfect. So you do need to have 921 00:56:49.360 --> 00:56:53.079 a lot of people there and and these cars have 922 00:56:53.159 --> 00:56:53.800 to be perfect. 923 00:56:54.079 --> 00:56:54.840 I mean, it's just. 924 00:56:56.280 --> 00:56:59.079 Just if we've given how much complexity there is no 925 00:56:59.159 --> 00:57:01.880 car it's rockable. They cost as of those they do this. 926 00:57:02.079 --> 00:57:03.360 There's so much that's in a car. 927 00:57:06.159 --> 00:57:08.280 So so what sort of processes did you remove, like 928 00:57:08.440 --> 00:57:13.000 you know, first principles type thing approach from the elise 929 00:57:13.119 --> 00:57:16.119 to like the model ass Like, was it a massive 930 00:57:16.199 --> 00:57:16.800 jump there? 931 00:57:17.119 --> 00:57:21.159 Yeah, I mean it's gigantic. Yeah, tells that never made 932 00:57:21.199 --> 00:57:22.920 a car, made. 933 00:57:22.800 --> 00:57:24.119 A full car before. 934 00:57:25.360 --> 00:57:29.079 The uh lotis made the non power trained portion of 935 00:57:29.159 --> 00:57:34.199 the roadster, and then it tells about the battery pack, motor, 936 00:57:36.360 --> 00:57:39.679 par electronics, charger, and then put put a roll together 937 00:57:39.840 --> 00:57:44.199 at the end. And that final assembly was actually at 938 00:57:44.239 --> 00:57:49.440 an old Ford dealership in Menlo Park. You can see 939 00:57:49.480 --> 00:57:51.719 some of the stuff in Revenge of the Electric Car. 940 00:57:51.840 --> 00:57:54.239 Yeah. See, yeah, it's. 941 00:57:54.079 --> 00:57:56.760 Great, just gives you crazy perspective to look back on it. 942 00:57:56.880 --> 00:57:57.280 Crazy. 943 00:57:57.360 --> 00:58:01.000 We need a third one, yeah, I mean the idea 944 00:58:01.000 --> 00:58:04.760 of having a car like a car assembly tiny plant 945 00:58:04.800 --> 00:58:10.320 in Menlo parkable places. And that was just because we 946 00:58:10.840 --> 00:58:14.599 managed to sub lease the four dealership closed down and 947 00:58:14.639 --> 00:58:18.639 we managed to get it like this deal from Stamford 948 00:58:19.039 --> 00:58:21.519 because the SAM is going to redevelop it and they 949 00:58:21.639 --> 00:58:24.920 so and they they're We figured they'll probably take it 950 00:58:25.039 --> 00:58:27.679 way longer than they expected to redevelop it. So we said, well, 951 00:58:27.679 --> 00:58:29.719 you're not bringing it to anyone. Can we pay you 952 00:58:29.760 --> 00:58:31.519 like fifty cents of square foot and you can kick 953 00:58:31.559 --> 00:58:34.440 us out, kick us out whenever you want. And and 954 00:58:34.480 --> 00:58:37.400 it was actually huge dealership and it had enough room 955 00:58:37.440 --> 00:58:39.480 to do final assembly of the cars, so we just 956 00:58:39.480 --> 00:58:40.840 did final assembly the cars there. 957 00:58:41.239 --> 00:58:41.719 Amazing. 958 00:58:42.000 --> 00:58:45.719 Yeah, and one of the most absurd places to build 959 00:58:45.800 --> 00:58:47.199 cars on Earth is Menal. 960 00:58:47.519 --> 00:58:49.880 No test track or anything, just the road outside or some. 961 00:58:50.159 --> 00:58:54.559 Yeah, well we would actually the early roasters were very unreliable, 962 00:58:54.599 --> 00:58:58.760 so we generally put about fifty miles of just normal 963 00:58:58.840 --> 00:59:03.360 driving around the Bay area with somebody following you and. 964 00:59:04.519 --> 00:59:06.679 Looks from people it's like what is that? 965 00:59:06.920 --> 00:59:09.599 Yeah, but we put fifty miles in each one of 966 00:59:09.639 --> 00:59:11.000 those cars because they just have a lot of things 967 00:59:11.000 --> 00:59:14.199 that are break down in the first fifty miles. So 968 00:59:15.880 --> 00:59:23.280 and then yeah, battery production was in Sant Colas. Yeah, 969 00:59:23.960 --> 00:59:27.239 so man, that was there is a lot of detail 970 00:59:27.440 --> 00:59:29.400 and all that. But going from the road so to 971 00:59:29.840 --> 00:59:34.880 MODELES was massive leap because the the models is quite 972 00:59:34.880 --> 00:59:38.400 a sophisticated sedan where we test about the whole thing 973 00:59:38.559 --> 00:59:39.920 as opposed to buildey power. 974 00:59:39.760 --> 00:59:41.119 Train and. 975 00:59:42.599 --> 00:59:48.159 Yeah, so you know, competing against Sycamacy's BMW AUDI type thing. 976 00:59:50.199 --> 00:59:54.960 So that that was that was a massive leap of difficulty. 977 00:59:56.000 --> 00:59:58.440 We did get the new me planted, but really that 978 00:59:58.559 --> 01:00:01.880 just meant we got eight box. Yeah, because they stroked 979 01:00:01.880 --> 01:00:06.360 the planet of all the great equipment. The only equipment 980 01:00:06.679 --> 01:00:10.159 that turn On GM left behind was the stuff that 981 01:00:10.159 --> 01:00:12.679 that they could not use anywhere else, So they only 982 01:00:12.760 --> 01:00:16.800 left the most tracky, broken pieces of equipment behind. We 983 01:00:16.920 --> 01:00:19.960 managed to use some of it, but but yeah, in 984 01:00:20.440 --> 01:00:23.920 the paint drop, I mean some of the things were 985 01:00:23.960 --> 01:00:28.320 literally not even worth the scrap value. So it was 986 01:00:28.360 --> 01:00:31.760 like not worth it to call the scrap metal dealer. 987 01:00:31.599 --> 01:00:33.519 What did you do with it? We made it. 988 01:00:33.519 --> 01:00:36.039 We made a lot of those things work. Oh you 989 01:00:36.039 --> 01:00:40.679 did plastic injection molding machines and we made work and 990 01:00:40.719 --> 01:00:43.440 the paint robots, we mostly made those work. That the 991 01:00:43.480 --> 01:00:45.760 assembly that the body production line had to be made 992 01:00:45.960 --> 01:00:48.679 new because they constructed there was just nothing. So we 993 01:00:48.760 --> 01:00:51.679 made the body production line for month Less was created 994 01:00:51.719 --> 01:00:52.239 from scratch. 995 01:00:54.480 --> 01:00:55.039 Yeah, and. 996 01:00:57.199 --> 01:01:01.119 Worked out, but it was very difficult. It's also in 997 01:01:01.119 --> 01:01:04.679 the beginning, the the top suppliers would not work with 998 01:01:04.760 --> 01:01:08.559 us or we would get like their D team because 999 01:01:08.599 --> 01:01:11.320 like who wants you know, if if they like they 1000 01:01:11.400 --> 01:01:14.119 got all the customers, like they've got you know, the 1001 01:01:14.159 --> 01:01:16.960 big car companies they got like Toyota, or they got 1002 01:01:17.000 --> 01:01:21.880 you know, I. E. And W forward as customers and 1003 01:01:21.880 --> 01:01:25.719 and a startup. Who Now you're you're in the pliers position. 1004 01:01:25.880 --> 01:01:27.639 Which team are you going to sign to us to 1005 01:01:27.719 --> 01:01:31.400 start up that everyone says going bankrupt? You're gonna sign 1006 01:01:31.440 --> 01:01:35.519 assign the interns and rejects. Okay, it's not going to 1007 01:01:35.559 --> 01:01:37.320 be your top team. The same thing with the top 1008 01:01:37.320 --> 01:01:39.800 team is going to go to like Toyota, you know, 1009 01:01:40.039 --> 01:01:42.320 your big customers, the top teams. So we would get 1010 01:01:42.320 --> 01:01:44.760 the worst team usually at the supplier company. If the 1011 01:01:44.760 --> 01:01:45.880 supply would even work with. 1012 01:01:45.880 --> 01:01:48.719 Us, You think that influenced you to vertically integrate more. 1013 01:01:49.199 --> 01:01:54.440 It was vertically integrate or die makes sense. Yeah, we 1014 01:01:54.559 --> 01:01:58.159 tried outsourcing the battery production originally was going to be 1015 01:01:58.159 --> 01:02:02.119 made at this place that made I think barbecue grills 1016 01:02:02.159 --> 01:02:08.239 in Thailand. Yeah, and I was like, man, they have 1017 01:02:08.239 --> 01:02:09.719 no idea how to make a battery. 1018 01:02:09.800 --> 01:02:12.239 And I was like, this is crazy. We're moving it to. 1019 01:02:14.840 --> 01:02:18.039 Back to headquarters in Strlis and we're gonna make it 1020 01:02:18.079 --> 01:02:24.039 here because they're basically once there's a massive amount of 1021 01:02:24.039 --> 01:02:28.000 work going from a prototype to production, and so you 1022 01:02:28.000 --> 01:02:31.159 need a fast feedback loop with engineering, and if that 1023 01:02:31.360 --> 01:02:33.599 feedback loop is all the way out in Thailand is 1024 01:02:33.719 --> 01:02:36.199 just no way. It's it's like, it's not like it's 1025 01:02:36.519 --> 01:02:38.760 if you have an existing production line that you already 1026 01:02:38.840 --> 01:02:41.360 know how to make it a volume that you can move, 1027 01:02:41.760 --> 01:02:45.400 but you cannot create a production line never existed that's 1028 01:02:45.400 --> 01:02:48.960 super far away from where the engineers are. It's gonna 1029 01:02:48.960 --> 01:02:52.199 it's red beef disaster. And also the cells were coming 1030 01:02:52.199 --> 01:02:55.119 from Japan, so they go from Japan, they go to Thailand, 1031 01:02:55.159 --> 01:02:57.400 they go through customs, they'll be waiting and that then 1032 01:02:57.440 --> 01:02:59.719 they'd be going to a battery packed. Then that battery 1033 01:02:59.760 --> 01:03:03.199 pack were sent to England, then Lotus if this is 1034 01:03:03.360 --> 01:03:07.760 this is these all things that got changed, but the 1035 01:03:07.800 --> 01:03:09.639 supply chain, like let's say they've been a problem with 1036 01:03:09.639 --> 01:03:11.880 the cells, you would only find if this plan years 1037 01:03:11.960 --> 01:03:13.920 change was so long that you would only find out 1038 01:03:13.960 --> 01:03:15.559 that it didn't work five months later. 1039 01:03:15.960 --> 01:03:16.360 Yikes. 1040 01:03:17.679 --> 01:03:20.000 Yeah, and then you have five months of scrap inventory. 1041 01:03:20.360 --> 01:03:25.159 So this is a recipe for a disaster. So that 1042 01:03:25.159 --> 01:03:29.519 that got moved to Saint Carlos sales ship directly to 1043 01:03:29.679 --> 01:03:34.039 Saint Carlos. Put it in a module, figure out why 1044 01:03:34.039 --> 01:03:37.800 the module's not working, fix it, maybe put into a pack, 1045 01:03:39.039 --> 01:03:41.400 like there is no reason why the roast of battery 1046 01:03:41.400 --> 01:03:43.800 pack had like it was like sixteen sort of blades 1047 01:03:44.360 --> 01:03:47.480 was if was modules, if one of them didn't work, 1048 01:03:47.480 --> 01:03:49.119 you could pull it out and put another one in. 1049 01:03:51.440 --> 01:03:57.199 Because that happened, then we can then Yeah, so you 1050 01:03:57.239 --> 01:03:59.400 don't really need modules in my view, should just go 1051 01:03:59.440 --> 01:04:05.000 from cells pack at this point. But yeah, it was 1052 01:04:05.039 --> 01:04:08.480 a very difficult thing going from roads to to modelized. 1053 01:04:08.559 --> 01:04:10.559 The fact that like the Model three still has modules 1054 01:04:10.639 --> 01:04:12.000 is kind of vestigial. 1055 01:04:11.719 --> 01:04:12.440 It's fastigial. 1056 01:04:12.920 --> 01:04:16.360 Yeah, because if the modules the model three are not 1057 01:04:16.559 --> 01:04:20.960 actually interchangeable, so there's no point in modules. 1058 01:04:21.000 --> 01:04:23.039 Really, you just have a should just have a pack. 1059 01:04:25.599 --> 01:04:27.599 Was that done? Is just save costs then or or 1060 01:04:27.719 --> 01:04:28.599 some other reason. 1061 01:04:29.000 --> 01:04:33.519 It start off because it's not it's not a sensible reason. 1062 01:04:35.519 --> 01:04:39.960 The reason that there were seals modules and pack goes 1063 01:04:40.000 --> 01:04:43.119 back to the early roads to days, where we'd make 1064 01:04:43.159 --> 01:04:46.599 a module, that module would have problems and so then 1065 01:04:46.599 --> 01:04:48.599 you could flop out a module. It's like like a 1066 01:04:48.639 --> 01:04:50.880 server act. The idea was like, you know, if you 1067 01:04:50.880 --> 01:04:52.920 have a bunch of servers in a server room and 1068 01:04:53.000 --> 01:04:55.800 one of the servers flakes out, you can pull it out, 1069 01:04:56.199 --> 01:04:59.880 put another round. So without avagur replace, so you could 1070 01:05:00.079 --> 01:05:02.599 place a small fraction of pack instead of the whole pack. 1071 01:05:04.239 --> 01:05:06.719 Then that then that concept just carried forward into Model 1072 01:05:06.800 --> 01:05:11.599 s X and three, but without the the original logic 1073 01:05:11.679 --> 01:05:15.920 no longer exists because the modules are not interchangeable. You 1074 01:05:15.960 --> 01:05:22.760 can't just swap out a module. So but these things 1075 01:05:22.800 --> 01:05:28.000 just have a lot of innotia. So we really want 1076 01:05:28.000 --> 01:05:31.039 to move to no such thing as a module as 1077 01:05:31.079 --> 01:05:31.880 just sells and pack. 1078 01:05:32.920 --> 01:05:35.960 Yeah, yeah, because I mean, initially they had the battery 1079 01:05:36.000 --> 01:05:39.280 swap facility right at Harris Ring, I mean, and then 1080 01:05:39.320 --> 01:05:41.079 the Model three. I don't think I have that capability 1081 01:05:41.119 --> 01:05:43.639 that you could actually swap the whole pack out quickly, right. 1082 01:05:44.559 --> 01:05:48.920 Don't It does not right, SNX still have the ability 1083 01:05:48.960 --> 01:05:52.960 to do a fast pack swap. But things essentially evolved 1084 01:05:52.960 --> 01:05:55.320 in the same direction that phones evolved. You know, for 1085 01:05:55.360 --> 01:05:59.000 a long time phones had swappable battery packs, and now 1086 01:05:59.599 --> 01:06:01.800 basically nobody, almost nobody makes a phone with a swapt 1087 01:06:01.800 --> 01:06:05.000 full of battery pack. As soon as the range gets 1088 01:06:05.000 --> 01:06:08.199 past a certain point. Then I agree, yeah, it doesn't 1089 01:06:08.239 --> 01:06:10.639 make sense. But but this was far from clear at 1090 01:06:10.639 --> 01:06:13.599 the time of designing the modeless, So we weren't in 1091 01:06:13.639 --> 01:06:17.159 a lot of trouble to make the SNX pack capable 1092 01:06:17.199 --> 01:06:20.280 of of a fast swap with quick disconnects and bolts 1093 01:06:20.320 --> 01:06:22.079 coming only from the bottom and that kind of thing. 1094 01:06:22.480 --> 01:06:25.000 And then we did that demo. We're just swapped out 1095 01:06:25.079 --> 01:06:27.079 two packs faster than full of gas. 1096 01:06:27.159 --> 01:06:27.719 It's amazing. 1097 01:06:28.760 --> 01:06:32.159 It's kind of ridiculous to me, like taking the battery 1098 01:06:32.159 --> 01:06:35.159 out of your cars some you know, Harris Ranch, and 1099 01:06:35.960 --> 01:06:37.960 put a new battery in and you come back it 1100 01:06:38.039 --> 01:06:40.639 was kind of like, it's good that super charging got 1101 01:06:40.639 --> 01:06:41.199 a lot better. 1102 01:06:41.760 --> 01:06:45.000 Yeah, it was just way better to to increase the 1103 01:06:45.079 --> 01:06:49.320 range of the pack and have better faster charging. So 1104 01:06:51.280 --> 01:06:54.960 but but this debate, which seems obvious in retrospect, was 1105 01:06:55.000 --> 01:07:00.320 not obvious at the time. And yeah, back then, I 1106 01:07:00.400 --> 01:07:04.400 think at least a lot of phones had swappable packs 1107 01:07:05.480 --> 01:07:08.719 because this was would have been designed in you know, 1108 01:07:08.920 --> 01:07:11.039 we had the first prototype out in twenty ten for 1109 01:07:11.119 --> 01:07:16.360 the modeless, So back twenty ten, let's say, the thought 1110 01:07:16.360 --> 01:07:18.320 process going into this in two thousand and nine would 1111 01:07:18.320 --> 01:07:21.280 have been, you know, at a time when I don't know, 1112 01:07:21.280 --> 01:07:24.400 maybe most phones had softable packs or something like that. 1113 01:07:24.440 --> 01:07:26.639 You know, the iPhone was like two thousand and seven 1114 01:07:26.719 --> 01:07:32.960 or something, iPhone one. And yeah, so then it doesn't 1115 01:07:33.039 --> 01:07:37.119 didn't make sense. But you know, copanies have a lot 1116 01:07:37.119 --> 01:07:40.199 of momentum. So the the sn X pack is still 1117 01:07:40.199 --> 01:07:44.599 a soppable pack because they say it was like two 1118 01:07:44.639 --> 01:07:47.440 hour trials to change the design. And Model three still 1119 01:07:47.480 --> 01:07:52.280 has modules even though twodn't have modules, and somebody we 1120 01:07:52.440 --> 01:07:54.280 like what you'll see in any given product is that 1121 01:07:54.360 --> 01:07:59.840 the errors in the structure of an organization will manifest 1122 01:07:59.880 --> 01:08:04.840 them selves in the product. So you know that's where Well, 1123 01:08:04.840 --> 01:08:07.400 we have a module team, so we have modules like ways, 1124 01:08:07.440 --> 01:08:10.639 I just combine the module team with the pack team 1125 01:08:10.679 --> 01:08:15.599 and then the WIL modules. So generally the Yeah, the 1126 01:08:15.719 --> 01:08:17.920 errors in the organization manifest themselves in the product. 1127 01:08:19.720 --> 01:08:22.960 You can see where the organizational boundaries are. Uh. 1128 01:08:24.000 --> 01:08:25.840 And then then you off and get like a box 1129 01:08:25.920 --> 01:08:27.479 in a box. It's like, wait, why is this thing 1130 01:08:27.560 --> 01:08:32.159 have two boxes? Well, because this team wanted to have 1131 01:08:32.199 --> 01:08:34.279 an enclosure and this team wanted to have an enclosure, 1132 01:08:34.760 --> 01:08:40.199 and so they have an enclosure on an enclosure. This 1133 01:08:40.239 --> 01:08:43.279 is still the case with the sound It's like, what 1134 01:08:43.359 --> 01:08:45.279 a silly thing, But that's actually the case with the 1135 01:08:45.319 --> 01:08:49.520 Model three. Well three battery pack has a top enclosure 1136 01:08:49.880 --> 01:08:52.880 and the car also has an underbody. Yep, what's the 1137 01:08:52.880 --> 01:08:57.000 point of that. That doesn't make any sense because the 1138 01:08:57.039 --> 01:08:59.079 pack the pack team wanted to have an enclosed battery 1139 01:08:59.119 --> 01:09:02.840 pack and the body team wanted to happen in closed body. 1140 01:09:03.359 --> 01:09:04.960 Yeah it makes sense, but you don't. 1141 01:09:04.800 --> 01:09:05.039 Need to. 1142 01:09:07.439 --> 01:09:13.079 So yeah, awesome, this is all this and and putting 1143 01:09:13.079 --> 01:09:14.680 the top cover on the battery pack is a big 1144 01:09:14.720 --> 01:09:18.119 pain in the neck. So as mass and class and stuff, 1145 01:09:18.119 --> 01:09:19.600 so that should definitely go away in the future. 1146 01:09:22.640 --> 01:09:25.119 Lots of brackets on brackets, that kind of thing. 1147 01:09:26.279 --> 01:09:29.439 So you survived the production hell of the Model three, 1148 01:09:30.000 --> 01:09:32.039 which was pretty intense. 1149 01:09:32.279 --> 01:09:38.399 I mean that was like, it's stupidously difficult, and I mean, 1150 01:09:38.399 --> 01:09:38.880 I think it's. 1151 01:09:41.680 --> 01:09:42.159 It has a. 1152 01:09:44.319 --> 01:09:45.800 I don't know if it's accur up, but I think 1153 01:09:46.319 --> 01:09:49.840 might be accurate. Is the first company co company to 1154 01:09:49.840 --> 01:09:53.399 reach volume production I think on an eighty eighty or 1155 01:09:53.439 --> 01:09:54.159 ninety years. 1156 01:09:54.039 --> 01:09:56.720 Or something like that in the US. 1157 01:09:56.800 --> 01:09:58.920 Yeah, And it's a harder time to do it for sure. 1158 01:09:59.239 --> 01:10:00.319 Yeah. 1159 01:10:00.439 --> 01:10:03.880 The complexity of of like what people the regulatory requirements 1160 01:10:03.920 --> 01:10:06.760 and the minimum expectations for a car at this point 1161 01:10:06.800 --> 01:10:10.079 are dramatically more than they were eighty or ninety years ago. 1162 01:10:10.359 --> 01:10:11.920 And the place you chose to do it too. 1163 01:10:14.359 --> 01:10:18.600 Yeah, so that was it was a super difficult one. 1164 01:10:21.560 --> 01:10:24.880 I mean there's like there's lots of car company startups, 1165 01:10:24.880 --> 01:10:28.039 but that's doing the prototype is the easy part. Building 1166 01:10:28.079 --> 01:10:33.319 the production system is one hundred times hotter. So I 1167 01:10:33.319 --> 01:10:36.800 mean that's where you see the things fail, like they've 1168 01:10:36.800 --> 01:10:40.000 been over the course of the last century, probably thousands 1169 01:10:40.039 --> 01:10:42.279 of car company startups, most of which people have never 1170 01:10:42.279 --> 01:10:44.880 heard about, you know, occasionally hear about something like a 1171 01:10:44.920 --> 01:10:50.359 Dorian or Attucker. Most of them there's there's there's not 1172 01:10:50.439 --> 01:10:54.840 even a footnote, and it's it's because of the difficulty 1173 01:10:54.840 --> 01:11:00.319 of production. And then and here's a real important point 1174 01:11:00.439 --> 01:11:02.600 that is not well appreciated. This is a point that 1175 01:11:02.640 --> 01:11:05.079 should be advanced by short sellers. But I'm not seen, 1176 01:11:06.560 --> 01:11:12.640 I'm not seen it articulated, which it should be. The 1177 01:11:12.760 --> 01:11:16.600 incumbent car companies make most of their money from selling 1178 01:11:17.279 --> 01:11:22.600 spare parts to the existing fleet at high margins, and 1179 01:11:22.640 --> 01:11:27.159 they'll sell the new cars either it de factos zero 1180 01:11:27.239 --> 01:11:29.840 margin or even at a loss. It's kind of like 1181 01:11:31.039 --> 01:11:34.800 printers and cartridges or razors and blades. You sell the 1182 01:11:35.000 --> 01:11:37.800 razor at a loss, celebrates of profits, sell printer at 1183 01:11:37.800 --> 01:11:42.079 the last sequartris and a profit. Or video game consoles. 1184 01:11:43.359 --> 01:11:45.680 You know, the actual cost of say an Xbox is 1185 01:11:45.720 --> 01:11:47.279 six hundred dollars, we can buy it for three or 1186 01:11:47.319 --> 01:11:49.239 four hundred dollars because they make it up in the 1187 01:11:49.319 --> 01:11:50.960 games that are boord So. 1188 01:11:52.760 --> 01:11:54.439 This is this now. 1189 01:11:55.079 --> 01:11:57.600 So if you're a new company, you do not have 1190 01:11:57.680 --> 01:12:01.439 a fleet, so you have no fleet with which to 1191 01:12:01.479 --> 01:12:06.520 subsidize the sale of your new cars. This is the 1192 01:12:07.199 --> 01:12:09.359 this is the primary reason there has not been a 1193 01:12:09.439 --> 01:12:12.680 successful car company start up in the United States. This 1194 01:12:12.840 --> 01:12:21.119 is the primary reason. So because the incoming car companies 1195 01:12:21.159 --> 01:12:23.199 have eighty percent of their fleet outside of a warranty 1196 01:12:23.279 --> 01:12:25.760 or something like that. Maybe it's seventy percent, but approximately, Like, 1197 01:12:25.800 --> 01:12:29.600 if a car lasts for say twenty years or something 1198 01:12:29.680 --> 01:12:32.399 like that, and the warranty is for four years, then 1199 01:12:32.600 --> 01:12:37.960 it's eighty percent out of warranty. So even if they 1200 01:12:38.000 --> 01:12:42.239 stopped selling new cars, they would still the profit would increase. 1201 01:12:44.479 --> 01:12:48.520 So, according to Edmunds, dealerships make twenty percent of their 1202 01:12:48.560 --> 01:12:51.600 revenue but fifty percent of their profits on service. 1203 01:12:51.920 --> 01:12:59.199 Yeah, exactly so, and the the car companies themselves will 1204 01:12:59.239 --> 01:13:01.159 often make more than one hundred percent of their profit 1205 01:13:01.319 --> 01:13:03.039 on selling spare parts. 1206 01:13:03.359 --> 01:13:04.159 Wow. Yeah. 1207 01:13:04.399 --> 01:13:06.800 So if like, if at the point in which they're 1208 01:13:06.800 --> 01:13:08.439 making stay one hundred and ten percent of the profit 1209 01:13:08.520 --> 01:13:10.680 from selling spare parts, it means that they're actually selling 1210 01:13:10.720 --> 01:13:14.279 the new class Atalyzes. So this this is a this 1211 01:13:14.479 --> 01:13:18.159 is the very difficult thing to overcome. In order to 1212 01:13:18.199 --> 01:13:23.319 overcome it, the a car has to be significantly more 1213 01:13:23.359 --> 01:13:27.960 compelling then other than other vehicles, such that people are 1214 01:13:28.039 --> 01:13:31.359 willing to pay a premium, and that you can. 1215 01:13:31.399 --> 01:13:35.920 Actually be prizitive cash flow. 1216 01:13:37.239 --> 01:13:41.920 Aspirationally profitable selling new cars, not simply selling spare parts 1217 01:13:41.920 --> 01:13:46.520 of the fleet. So I mean, for Tesla's fleet, is 1218 01:13:47.039 --> 01:13:51.359 probably ten percent of Tesla's fleet or selling in less 1219 01:13:51.359 --> 01:13:54.720 than twenty percent is out of warranty, whereas eighty percent 1220 01:13:54.840 --> 01:13:56.840 of the other car makers is out of warranty. So 1221 01:13:58.319 --> 01:14:01.520 this makes it very difficult. Also, electric cars need much 1222 01:14:01.600 --> 01:14:07.800 less servicing, so that that's another difficult thing. So so 1223 01:14:08.079 --> 01:14:11.439 this is this is the main this should be the 1224 01:14:11.520 --> 01:14:15.000 main argument advanced. I think for why a car a 1225 01:14:15.079 --> 01:14:20.560 new cock company cannot be successful the main one. And 1226 01:14:20.720 --> 01:14:23.319 so yeah, then, like I said, the in order for 1227 01:14:23.520 --> 01:14:25.439 that car to have cock company to have any chance, 1228 01:14:25.479 --> 01:14:29.039 there must be it must be compelling enough that people 1229 01:14:29.039 --> 01:14:33.039 will pay for you. Otherwise there's no chance. And I 1230 01:14:33.079 --> 01:14:35.000 think there's actually in order for a cock company to 1231 01:14:35.039 --> 01:14:40.039 be successful, it has to succeed on two on two 1232 01:14:40.119 --> 01:14:44.560 fundamental technology discontinuities, one being electrification, the other one being autonomy. 1233 01:14:45.279 --> 01:14:47.920 I think not even even pure electrification by itself is 1234 01:14:48.000 --> 01:14:53.399 not enough. So you can, like it says the movie 1235 01:14:53.399 --> 01:14:57.159 production line, there there have been two major technology step 1236 01:14:57.239 --> 01:15:02.119 changes being electrification and aton me and the combination of 1237 01:15:02.199 --> 01:15:04.920 those two is the only thing that's the only opening 1238 01:15:05.000 --> 01:15:06.479 for a new cock company to make it. 1239 01:15:08.479 --> 01:15:11.960 Yeah, makes sense. I mean, without autonomy, you'd probably have 1240 01:15:12.039 --> 01:15:16.840 to wait for EVS to reach price parody. With autonomy, 1241 01:15:16.880 --> 01:15:20.119 you can drive many more miles and bridge that gap easier. 1242 01:15:20.840 --> 01:15:23.000 And it's like, well, Tesla's mote in some ways or 1243 01:15:23.239 --> 01:15:26.399 not mote, I guess, but like Tesla's advantage in many 1244 01:15:26.439 --> 01:15:29.399 ways is bigger because like, these are two such different 1245 01:15:29.520 --> 01:15:31.760 technologies that are happening at once that you've been working 1246 01:15:31.800 --> 01:15:33.760 on while nobody else has. So it's like that much 1247 01:15:33.800 --> 01:15:35.800 harder to replicate now that it's been accomplished. 1248 01:15:35.840 --> 01:15:42.239 Almost, it's very hard for it's very hard for any 1249 01:15:42.720 --> 01:15:48.439 any new C company to end of the market. That 1250 01:15:48.560 --> 01:15:52.600 they have to make it a very compelling product, I 1251 01:15:52.680 --> 01:15:56.000 meaning they have to have some significant technology advancements in 1252 01:15:56.079 --> 01:16:01.479 the electric drive train and the battery pack and just 1253 01:16:01.600 --> 01:16:05.119 generally with the car itself, and then the autonomy has 1254 01:16:05.159 --> 01:16:07.960 to be very compelling. Autonomy in and of itself is enormous, 1255 01:16:09.279 --> 01:16:15.000 so that both of those things company must be successful 1256 01:16:15.760 --> 01:16:19.560 in doing or they will end up in the cemetery. 1257 01:16:20.920 --> 01:16:22.840 So that's that's the real challenge of it. 1258 01:16:26.960 --> 01:16:30.079 Yeah, well even with like the I mean the software updates. 1259 01:16:30.079 --> 01:16:32.600 I mean that's something that no other manufacturer can really 1260 01:16:32.640 --> 01:16:34.479 even get right. They can't do it over the air. 1261 01:16:34.840 --> 01:16:36.840 You have to take your car into you know, because 1262 01:16:36.840 --> 01:16:39.279 it doesn't work right. So that's a core component of 1263 01:16:39.760 --> 01:16:43.560 providing updates. Instead of getting your revenue now from the 1264 01:16:43.680 --> 01:16:47.079 dealership and spare parts stuff, you can actually send software 1265 01:16:47.119 --> 01:16:47.640 as a service. 1266 01:16:47.680 --> 01:16:47.840 You know. 1267 01:16:47.880 --> 01:16:49.359 We actually did a whole podcasts on this. 1268 01:16:50.239 --> 01:16:53.880 Well, I've all this is to minimize service costs, whereas 1269 01:16:54.000 --> 01:16:56.800 the other companies this is I wouldn't say that goes 1270 01:16:56.800 --> 01:16:59.199 to maximize service costs, but it's certainly not to minimize it. 1271 01:17:01.279 --> 01:17:05.600 The car companies also have two different businesses as the dealerships, 1272 01:17:05.760 --> 01:17:12.079 where their business is actually just service. And I don't 1273 01:17:12.119 --> 01:17:15.000 think it's anyone's surprised that that people don't like going 1274 01:17:15.039 --> 01:17:18.239 to their dealer. I mean it's like it's it's because 1275 01:17:18.319 --> 01:17:21.479 their incentives are actually not aligned with the with the 1276 01:17:21.520 --> 01:17:25.159 customers incentives. Their goal is bring you back as often 1277 01:17:25.199 --> 01:17:25.800 as possible. 1278 01:17:27.600 --> 01:17:30.079 Yeah, there were the dealerships, and saves also misligned with 1279 01:17:30.199 --> 01:17:33.600 the the car companies in the during the warranty period 1280 01:17:33.680 --> 01:17:37.439 because the warrant, the car company has to pay for 1281 01:17:37.720 --> 01:17:39.960 the warranty that the service during warranty. 1282 01:17:40.800 --> 01:17:44.359 Uh So it's so it's that they have a conflict 1283 01:17:44.439 --> 01:17:48.239 of you can contrivate contradict of interests. 1284 01:17:50.840 --> 01:17:53.239 Yeah, the car companies to cover the warranty costs, but 1285 01:17:53.680 --> 01:17:57.239 the dealership makes profit on the servicing, so they want 1286 01:17:57.239 --> 01:17:59.760 to maximize servicing even during the warranty period. 1287 01:18:01.159 --> 01:18:01.319 Yeah. 1288 01:18:01.319 --> 01:18:04.279 It's almost like the economic factors you just mentioned have 1289 01:18:04.399 --> 01:18:07.800 created like a complacency where there is no innovation because 1290 01:18:08.800 --> 01:18:12.039 you know, nobody can just start a car company. 1291 01:18:12.359 --> 01:18:19.640 Yeah right, I mean it's like Schumpetter's creative destruction. You know, 1292 01:18:19.760 --> 01:18:22.520 there's like innovation tends to come from new entrants to 1293 01:18:22.600 --> 01:18:26.359 an industry. So if there's if an industry has formed 1294 01:18:26.439 --> 01:18:31.000 an oligopolg or something like that, then the forcing function 1295 01:18:31.680 --> 01:18:34.479 is weak for innovation because innovation tends to come from 1296 01:18:34.520 --> 01:18:42.880 new entrants. Yeah, this is a problem with rockets. There's 1297 01:18:43.359 --> 01:18:47.000 no allowed new entrants, so innovation forcing function is weak. 1298 01:18:49.520 --> 01:18:52.359 But it's encouraging to see rocket booster land and everyone 1299 01:18:52.479 --> 01:18:53.760 is all like, wow, we can't innovate. 1300 01:18:53.840 --> 01:18:59.479 Maybe Yeah, it's actually been surprising how little innovation that's 1301 01:18:59.520 --> 01:19:05.479 been on. And despite SpaceX showing reusable rockets, landing and 1302 01:19:05.560 --> 01:19:09.439 reflying these rockets, many times they're like, come on, you 1303 01:19:09.520 --> 01:19:13.159 know this Covey itt something the same. 1304 01:19:14.159 --> 01:19:15.720 Yeah, tech works just. 1305 01:19:16.119 --> 01:19:16.800 Do the same thing. 1306 01:19:17.039 --> 01:19:20.079 Didn't like Chinese space companies started putting grid fins on 1307 01:19:20.119 --> 01:19:20.680 their rockets. 1308 01:19:21.039 --> 01:19:23.640 I think there's some Chinese rocks that have launched with 1309 01:19:23.680 --> 01:19:27.239 grid fins. Well, you can really use any kind of fin. 1310 01:19:29.319 --> 01:19:33.199 Grid fin is just more predictable across a wide range 1311 01:19:33.199 --> 01:19:38.359 of speeds, So from hypersonics through you know, supersonic, transonic, subsonic, 1312 01:19:39.279 --> 01:19:44.439 they're they're just it's quite easy to predict the behavior 1313 01:19:44.600 --> 01:19:46.520 of a gridfin and the center of pressure where a 1314 01:19:46.520 --> 01:19:48.640 grid fin doesn't change that much, whereas if you have 1315 01:19:48.760 --> 01:19:52.399 a you know, fin fin, like a wing looking thing, 1316 01:19:52.880 --> 01:19:55.000 that you'll see quite a big change in where the 1317 01:19:55.039 --> 01:19:57.640 center of pressure is across a. 1318 01:19:57.680 --> 01:20:05.640 Wide moss regime. Either one or to work the shuttle 1319 01:20:05.640 --> 01:20:06.399 didn't have griffins. 1320 01:20:08.560 --> 01:20:10.560 What do you think about rock and lapse approach of 1321 01:20:10.720 --> 01:20:14.239 trying to use a helicopter to recover the first stage. 1322 01:20:16.880 --> 01:20:21.359 Yeah, I think that's gonna be harder than it seems so, 1323 01:20:22.920 --> 01:20:26.960 but there are boosters quite small, so that the issue 1324 01:20:27.000 --> 01:20:30.840 with the helicopters you run into a max lower problem, 1325 01:20:31.279 --> 01:20:33.520 like the lifting capability of helicopter is not that great, 1326 01:20:34.199 --> 01:20:37.560 and that lifting capability drops with altitude, and then the 1327 01:20:37.720 --> 01:20:40.920 range of helicopters also not that great. So so then 1328 01:20:40.960 --> 01:20:44.520 you end up having to helicopter on a show. And 1329 01:20:44.640 --> 01:20:47.439 then if in that in heavy weather conditions, you can't 1330 01:20:47.439 --> 01:20:50.800 take off, so that you're gonna you have to be 1331 01:20:51.760 --> 01:20:55.920 your weather constraints at the launch point and the catch 1332 01:20:56.000 --> 01:21:00.760 point are end up limiting your launch availability mm hmm. 1333 01:21:02.760 --> 01:21:05.760 And then then you've gotta it's it's it's dangerous. You know, 1334 01:21:05.800 --> 01:21:09.319 you've got somebody in a helicopter with with a you know, 1335 01:21:09.439 --> 01:21:12.079 pilot trying to catch this thing coming out of the skuy. 1336 01:21:15.479 --> 01:21:19.039 It doesn't sound insane, there's a there's certainly the potential 1337 01:21:19.199 --> 01:21:25.039 for somebody, you know, somebody to go wrong. Whereas if 1338 01:21:25.079 --> 01:21:27.840 you have a growing chip's you know, if it's smashes 1339 01:21:27.880 --> 01:21:29.159 into drown ship, it's not a big deal. 1340 01:21:29.199 --> 01:21:33.000 But smashing into helicopter that's a big deal. Yeah, So. 1341 01:21:34.520 --> 01:21:36.359 You know, overall I've been you know that that's what 1342 01:21:36.439 --> 01:21:40.279 I've been pretty impressed with rocket Lab and they're mad, 1343 01:21:40.359 --> 01:21:44.039 they're making they're making a go of it, and they're 1344 01:21:44.079 --> 01:21:44.920 they're gonna. 1345 01:21:46.199 --> 01:21:49.520 Do reasonability, which is important. It's fundamental. 1346 01:21:53.039 --> 01:21:55.640 Do you guys still see yourself doing that city to 1347 01:21:55.720 --> 01:21:57.520 city travel in thirty minutes one day? 1348 01:21:59.000 --> 01:21:59.840 Yeah, there's more. 1349 01:22:00.079 --> 01:22:03.720 Yeah, I think they can. For sure it can be done. Yeah, 1350 01:22:03.800 --> 01:22:06.000 for sure can be done. It is it is loud. 1351 01:22:06.600 --> 01:22:10.880 That's that it's really annoys Is that the biggest concern there, 1352 01:22:12.640 --> 01:22:15.640 both taking off and landing. When it comes in for landing, 1353 01:22:15.720 --> 01:22:23.119 that sonic boom is loud. It's like, yeah, there's actually 1354 01:22:23.119 --> 01:22:28.359 two sonic booms. So it sounds like somebody just discharged 1355 01:22:28.359 --> 01:22:33.079 the double barl shotgun in your backyard. So it's not 1356 01:22:33.159 --> 01:22:36.000 like it's breaking windows or anything, but it's like, it's 1357 01:22:36.079 --> 01:22:37.960 be pretty annoying if it's happening on a regular basis. 1358 01:22:40.479 --> 01:22:42.680 That's basically water amounts you. 1359 01:22:42.720 --> 01:22:46.720 So that you have to off. Sure, So I think 1360 01:22:46.760 --> 01:22:53.239 we'll do. But it can be done, definitely. It's the 1361 01:22:53.319 --> 01:22:56.760 fastest way to get anywhere based on non physics, so 1362 01:22:58.920 --> 01:23:00.680 and I think the economics can be made to work 1363 01:23:00.720 --> 01:23:04.359 as well, so that it would be competitive with international 1364 01:23:04.760 --> 01:23:05.359 air travel. 1365 01:23:05.560 --> 01:23:10.399 Wow, I can't wait for that. I travel a lot 1366 01:23:10.560 --> 01:23:15.039 like today, asier like minium, like twelve hour to fourteen. 1367 01:23:16.520 --> 01:23:18.079 Will you try to keep most of the launches around 1368 01:23:18.079 --> 01:23:19.800 the equator just or would it matter? 1369 01:23:20.079 --> 01:23:23.880 Like it doesn't matter a ton. 1370 01:23:27.119 --> 01:23:30.880 It matters if you're going east to know, if you 1371 01:23:31.079 --> 01:23:33.279 if you launch east, you have the advantage of the 1372 01:23:33.319 --> 01:23:36.720 oath rotation, the closer are of the equator and more, 1373 01:23:36.720 --> 01:23:40.199 you can take advantage of Earth rotation if you if 1374 01:23:40.239 --> 01:23:43.520 you fly west, you're actually counteracting US rotation, so you're 1375 01:23:44.199 --> 01:23:49.279 the LTI blast that you need is higher, but you 1376 01:23:49.399 --> 01:23:54.079 go in either direction. I think one of our one 1377 01:23:54.079 --> 01:23:57.000 of our upcoming launches is actually a retrogate retrograde flight, 1378 01:23:58.399 --> 01:24:02.479 so it's going to go against the lit'll. 1379 01:24:01.680 --> 01:24:02.279 Be fun to watch. 1380 01:24:03.279 --> 01:24:05.920 Yeah, But if Starship is going to launch so many 1381 01:24:06.000 --> 01:24:08.800 times a day, how are you going to produce all 1382 01:24:08.840 --> 01:24:12.279 these raptors? Because we've been we've been touring the SpaceX 1383 01:24:12.359 --> 01:24:14.920 factory in author On and you're doing you're making them 1384 01:24:14.960 --> 01:24:17.640 by hand, right? Are you going to automate any of this? Yeah? 1385 01:24:17.640 --> 01:24:20.640 I wouldn't say it's being made by hand, being assembled 1386 01:24:20.680 --> 01:24:24.960 by hand maybe, but yeah, we have a lot of 1387 01:24:25.079 --> 01:24:29.039 metal printers with a whole Yeah, three D, three D 1388 01:24:29.159 --> 01:24:29.800 metal printing. 1389 01:24:30.000 --> 01:24:32.479 Wow, Yeah, I love it. I mean I think. 1390 01:24:32.399 --> 01:24:35.239 SpaceX is pushing the envelope with metal printing more than 1391 01:24:35.279 --> 01:24:37.640 anyone else. At least that's what's the splash tell us. 1392 01:24:39.520 --> 01:24:44.079 So we also have a foundry. Uh, that's we do 1393 01:24:44.359 --> 01:24:49.760 are casting of exotic parts for a Raptor with a 1394 01:24:49.800 --> 01:24:53.920 lot of CNC machines. It's a very complicated engine to build. 1395 01:24:55.520 --> 01:24:58.600 Merlin looks like a toy relative to Raptor. It's very simple. 1396 01:24:59.760 --> 01:25:03.159 But we're going to make a lot of rafts and starships. 1397 01:25:04.640 --> 01:25:07.960 Are they going to be made in the States? Then yes, Okay, 1398 01:25:08.079 --> 01:25:08.640 they'd have to be. 1399 01:25:11.520 --> 01:25:15.119 Yeah, we can get simple ingredients from outside the US, 1400 01:25:15.199 --> 01:25:17.520 but other than that, we're not We're not allowed to 1401 01:25:17.520 --> 01:25:27.920 transmit any sort of anything that is a sophisticated element 1402 01:25:28.000 --> 01:25:29.640 of a rocket engine. Weren't allowed to transfer out the 1403 01:25:29.720 --> 01:25:34.079 US or rockety stuff is the weapons technology. 1404 01:25:34.319 --> 01:25:36.840 So just a starship when it's assembled to fly there 1405 01:25:36.880 --> 01:25:37.399 and come back. 1406 01:25:42.680 --> 01:25:45.359 Technically, there's a lot of rockets at the bottom of 1407 01:25:45.359 --> 01:25:47.199 the ocean shout. 1408 01:25:48.359 --> 01:25:48.720 And they have. 1409 01:25:51.000 --> 01:25:53.840 So if you're city to city rocket travel works, does 1410 01:25:53.880 --> 01:25:56.079 that mean Tesla doesn't need to build an electric airplane. 1411 01:25:59.439 --> 01:26:03.399 Man building electric airplane has a lot of difficulty associated 1412 01:26:03.399 --> 01:26:03.600 with that. 1413 01:26:04.439 --> 01:26:07.560 Or what about the V tall jet, It's a lot 1414 01:26:07.560 --> 01:26:08.840 of difficulty asia share with that. 1415 01:26:09.479 --> 01:26:14.479 I gotta make sure, well, it takes a messi amount 1416 01:26:14.479 --> 01:26:16.239 of effort to do any one of these things, so 1417 01:26:16.319 --> 01:26:20.720 you can't do them all. It's not possible, say, oh, 1418 01:26:20.800 --> 01:26:22.800 how you I like it? The resources? What's the best 1419 01:26:22.840 --> 01:26:27.960 thing to do? Making a vtall jet can definitely be 1420 01:26:28.079 --> 01:26:34.439 done doing electric aircraft for sure. I mean all transport 1421 01:26:34.479 --> 01:26:40.079 will go electric, accept for rockets, yeah, everything. 1422 01:26:40.560 --> 01:26:42.600 I guess why it seems exciting is because if Tesla's 1423 01:26:42.680 --> 01:26:45.439 leading and energy density and battery technology, then the logical 1424 01:26:45.520 --> 01:26:48.439 next step is like if somebody's build an electric airplane, 1425 01:26:48.439 --> 01:26:50.800 it's the company with the best lightest, most efficient batteries. 1426 01:26:50.880 --> 01:26:51.000 Right. 1427 01:26:54.600 --> 01:26:59.279 Yeah, It's just it's hard. It's an entirely different regulatory regime. 1428 01:27:00.640 --> 01:27:02.880 Like there's there are there aren't any car companies that 1429 01:27:02.920 --> 01:27:07.439 are also aircraft companies, So why don't they just make aircraft? 1430 01:27:08.479 --> 01:27:10.159 Actually, you know, it's kind of funny. There was like 1431 01:27:10.239 --> 01:27:15.560 some conspiracy theories on Twitter because on Instagram, Tesla's category 1432 01:27:16.079 --> 01:27:19.319 it's aid, automotive, and then somehow aircraft has gone. 1433 01:27:21.239 --> 01:27:26.319 Like at the cyber truck event, cyber truck, this is 1434 01:27:26.359 --> 01:27:27.159 like your Wikipedia. 1435 01:27:30.399 --> 01:27:33.239 I think it's incredibly hard to bring an aircraft to 1436 01:27:33.399 --> 01:27:38.199 production and meet all of the regulatory requirements worldwide. 1437 01:27:38.920 --> 01:27:43.199 It's a very difficult thing. So it's not like we're 1438 01:27:44.039 --> 01:27:45.079 something that could be just be done. 1439 01:27:46.079 --> 01:27:48.159 We would have to not do a bunch of other things. 1440 01:27:49.960 --> 01:27:52.239 It's not like there's like a ton of unallocated resources. 1441 01:27:52.359 --> 01:27:55.600 Tells I'm like, oh, what should we do now? It's 1442 01:27:55.720 --> 01:28:02.039 like a constant resource starvation, so there's like why do 1443 01:28:02.039 --> 01:28:05.239 you do this other thing? Okay, but we're starving for resources? 1444 01:28:06.079 --> 01:28:07.920 Then what do we you not do well? 1445 01:28:07.920 --> 01:28:09.680 It seems like that's what's so exciting is now that 1446 01:28:09.760 --> 01:28:12.039 the business is kind of taken this next step. The 1447 01:28:12.279 --> 01:28:16.199 resource like starve is kind of changing, or hopefully slowly changing. 1448 01:28:17.000 --> 01:28:21.279 I mean in the airplane like another car or something. 1449 01:28:21.399 --> 01:28:22.520 It's not yeah, not. 1450 01:28:22.560 --> 01:28:24.800 It'sarily an airplaneses, but just in general, it seems like 1451 01:28:25.319 --> 01:28:27.000 the financial help means you can spend more on R 1452 01:28:27.039 --> 01:28:28.399 and D, you can invest more, Like. 1453 01:28:28.479 --> 01:28:29.279 That's not how it works. 1454 01:28:30.720 --> 01:28:33.439 It's not like if you're just haending more money, you 1455 01:28:33.479 --> 01:28:36.079 could spend it effectively in R and D. But if 1456 01:28:36.119 --> 01:28:38.880 there was a if there was a factory producing excellent engineers, 1457 01:28:38.920 --> 01:28:41.600 that would be true. Where is this factory. 1458 01:28:43.319 --> 01:28:44.119 It doesn't exist. 1459 01:28:46.039 --> 01:28:50.600 So it's incredibly difficult to find the right talent to 1460 01:28:50.840 --> 01:28:53.840 integrate them into an organization and have it be work effectively. 1461 01:28:54.600 --> 01:29:00.199 It's not a money thing. It's just hard to find that. 1462 01:29:00.319 --> 01:29:02.560 This is a short number a small number. 1463 01:29:02.319 --> 01:29:04.880 Of people, you know, more engineers. 1464 01:29:05.720 --> 01:29:10.600 Especially, there's just a fundamental limitation on exceptional engineers. 1465 01:29:11.319 --> 01:29:12.119 There's just not that many. 1466 01:29:12.920 --> 01:29:15.439 So, given like these constraints and all the things you 1467 01:29:15.520 --> 01:29:16.720 have to do, could you tell us like a little 1468 01:29:16.720 --> 01:29:19.399 bit about your thinking on how you prioritize. 1469 01:29:23.359 --> 01:29:27.680 And the prioritize. Prioritizing has usually been out of desperation, 1470 01:29:28.119 --> 01:29:31.640 not choice. It's not like, oh, let's sit back and 1471 01:29:32.479 --> 01:29:36.479 how should we spend these resources. Thing isn't going to work, 1472 01:29:36.479 --> 01:29:38.159 and we're gonna if we don't make it work, we're 1473 01:29:38.199 --> 01:29:43.359 going to go bacraft, you know, and then so we're 1474 01:29:43.359 --> 01:29:44.079 better make it work. 1475 01:29:46.560 --> 01:29:50.520 I mean the Mall free program. 1476 01:29:51.720 --> 01:29:55.159 There were so many mistakes that were made with mal 1477 01:29:55.199 --> 01:29:58.800 three program that the entire company had to be devoted 1478 01:29:58.880 --> 01:30:04.439 to fixing the model reproduction system. So you know, we 1479 01:30:05.279 --> 01:30:11.000 took everyone off solar, almost everyone off battery pack, power 1480 01:30:11.319 --> 01:30:14.520 power pack and that kind of thing. Anyone who is 1481 01:30:14.600 --> 01:30:20.840 working on you know, roadsters, am I everyone stopped doing 1482 01:30:20.920 --> 01:30:23.239 that working Model three or there won't be any Tesla. 1483 01:30:23.920 --> 01:30:26.279 Yeah, it's kind of amazing. You really bet the whole 1484 01:30:26.359 --> 01:30:28.800 company to get to this next level. But you know, 1485 01:30:29.560 --> 01:30:31.560 I mean I have a Model three. I couldn't afford 1486 01:30:31.600 --> 01:30:33.840 a Model less. So like, I'm very thankful that you 1487 01:30:33.920 --> 01:30:35.840 guys decided to at the whole company. 1488 01:30:36.520 --> 01:30:39.920 There's no choice. It's like either you got to you 1489 01:30:40.039 --> 01:30:42.439 got to get to volume. So there's checking an next situation. 1490 01:30:42.960 --> 01:30:46.079 You can't make the car at an affordable price unless 1491 01:30:46.159 --> 01:30:48.359 you have high volume. Unless you have high volume, you 1492 01:30:48.399 --> 01:30:49.560 can't get an affordable price. 1493 01:30:50.039 --> 01:30:52.399 So now what do you do? How do you bootstrap 1494 01:30:52.479 --> 01:30:52.760 this thing? 1495 01:30:53.680 --> 01:30:56.199 You've basically just got to take a giant flying leap 1496 01:30:56.319 --> 01:30:59.239 at high volume and hope you get to the you 1497 01:30:59.319 --> 01:31:02.159 know ground, have a cliff at ledge with your fingertips. 1498 01:31:03.600 --> 01:31:05.880 It's like Indiana Jones were like running down the thing. 1499 01:31:05.960 --> 01:31:08.479 And here's what it actually feels like. It's like that 1500 01:31:09.560 --> 01:31:12.720 temple are doing whatever where it's like there's a damn 1501 01:31:12.800 --> 01:31:17.159 boulder chasing you down, okay, and it's a big hole 1502 01:31:17.199 --> 01:31:17.720 in the ground. 1503 01:31:18.520 --> 01:31:20.600 Can make that game and you need to jump across 1504 01:31:20.720 --> 01:31:22.880 the hole in the ground and if you slow down, 1505 01:31:22.920 --> 01:31:26.720 the boulder is going to crush you. This is what 1506 01:31:26.840 --> 01:31:28.960 it feels like. It's they're like, I. 1507 01:31:29.000 --> 01:31:33.680 Wonder what you we shall do, like boulder hol on 1508 01:31:33.720 --> 01:31:35.960 the ground and then jump across or you're gonna die. 1509 01:31:36.800 --> 01:31:45.840 So that's basically or you know, get the situation. You know, 1510 01:31:46.000 --> 01:31:48.439 like at this point, maybe we could say like, okay, 1511 01:31:48.560 --> 01:31:53.880 what shall we do at this point? You know, the 1512 01:31:54.199 --> 01:31:57.560 biggest problem we have to solve right now is just 1513 01:31:57.840 --> 01:32:02.520 having production on each onto it because it's insane to 1514 01:32:02.560 --> 01:32:05.840 be making cars in California shipping them to Europe and Asia. 1515 01:32:06.119 --> 01:32:08.880 This is I mean, as it is, making cars in 1516 01:32:08.880 --> 01:32:15.079 the area is pretty absurd. And then you also got 1517 01:32:15.119 --> 01:32:18.960 to ship those cars half around the world, and so 1518 01:32:19.000 --> 01:32:21.399 you got all this finished goes inventory on the water 1519 01:32:21.680 --> 01:32:25.079 that's very high capital carrying costs, and you can finance 1520 01:32:25.159 --> 01:32:26.119 part of it, but not all of it. 1521 01:32:27.279 --> 01:32:31.520 So you know, then you've got the. 1522 01:32:31.520 --> 01:32:36.960 Transport costs, you've got tariffs, you've got you know, every 1523 01:32:37.000 --> 01:32:39.880 time a car gets loaded and unloaded, there's some potential 1524 01:32:39.920 --> 01:32:40.439 for damage. 1525 01:32:40.439 --> 01:32:42.079 It's not zero, you know, So. 1526 01:32:43.680 --> 01:32:46.520 It just creates a lot of cost and then it's 1527 01:32:46.520 --> 01:32:50.399 hard to manage. And the factory complexity in California is 1528 01:32:51.039 --> 01:32:54.920 is amplified because you've got several different regulatory regimes. So 1529 01:32:54.960 --> 01:32:57.359 you're building it seems like you're building Model three, which 1530 01:32:57.359 --> 01:32:59.680 you're actually building several versions of a Model three, depending 1531 01:32:59.720 --> 01:33:00.680 upon whether it's going. 1532 01:33:00.600 --> 01:33:03.960 To China, Japan, Australia, Europe. 1533 01:33:04.520 --> 01:33:09.079 Then you got got down right hand drive. Okay, it's 1534 01:33:09.119 --> 01:33:16.880 like every now everything's gonna go. There's some random bureaucratic 1535 01:33:16.920 --> 01:33:22.239 decision one hundred years ago. Right hand driver, left hand drive. 1536 01:33:22.840 --> 01:33:24.239 This is a megapain in the ass. 1537 01:33:26.319 --> 01:33:26.720 In the middle. 1538 01:33:28.199 --> 01:33:31.960 Yeah. Absolutely. And then all these different languages. 1539 01:33:32.199 --> 01:33:35.079 You know, you can't have like warning labels in English, 1540 01:33:35.159 --> 01:33:38.399 and if they don't speak English, it's like prove I 1541 01:33:38.439 --> 01:33:39.199 don't know what it means. 1542 01:33:40.880 --> 01:33:43.920 So this stickers all over the place for you know, 1543 01:33:45.039 --> 01:33:49.000 or whatever it is. And that's all in one factory. 1544 01:33:49.119 --> 01:33:53.840 So so so the complexity amplifies the difficulty of manufacturing. 1545 01:33:54.640 --> 01:33:55.119 And then. 1546 01:33:56.520 --> 01:33:58.199 You kind of get into the cycle where in the 1547 01:33:58.239 --> 01:34:01.199 first month in the core or well, I say, first 1548 01:34:01.239 --> 01:34:03.720 six weeks in the quarter you build cars for Europe 1549 01:34:03.760 --> 01:34:06.760 and Asia and you get them on the boats, and 1550 01:34:06.920 --> 01:34:10.199 then for the next say three weeks, you voilt cars 1551 01:34:10.279 --> 01:34:12.760 for the east coast of the US or North America, 1552 01:34:13.319 --> 01:34:15.039 and then the final three weeks you built the coast 1553 01:34:15.239 --> 01:34:15.680 cars for. 1554 01:34:16.079 --> 01:34:16.720 The west coast. 1555 01:34:17.479 --> 01:34:21.840 So the deliveries early in the quarter look look very 1556 01:34:22.239 --> 01:34:25.039 very low, and they spank exponentially at the end because 1557 01:34:25.079 --> 01:34:27.840 basically all the cars arrive at the customers. 1558 01:34:27.399 --> 01:34:28.159 At the end of the quarter. 1559 01:34:31.399 --> 01:34:33.880 And then we're like, then we'll have these conversations we've 1560 01:34:33.920 --> 01:34:36.640 got to get out of this wave like and they're like, well, 1561 01:34:36.800 --> 01:34:39.119 they'll punish us very badly if we get out of 1562 01:34:39.119 --> 01:34:41.000 the way because the financials. 1563 01:34:40.600 --> 01:34:44.359 Will look horrible. Yeah, So then we're okay, we'll do 1564 01:34:44.439 --> 01:34:45.000 the wave again. 1565 01:34:49.640 --> 01:34:51.520 And so that so that now we've got a factory 1566 01:34:51.520 --> 01:34:54.680 in Shanghai that should that that'll go a long way 1567 01:34:54.680 --> 01:34:59.800 towards alleviating the complexity and the cost. You know, we'll 1568 01:34:59.800 --> 01:35:02.720 have far a few goods that we need to finance 1569 01:35:02.920 --> 01:35:06.680 that are on boats. Wants to get the factory going 1570 01:35:06.920 --> 01:35:15.920 in Berlin. Branderberg technically close Ble in then then then 1571 01:35:16.279 --> 01:35:19.640 that this massively reduces the complexity of production and uh 1572 01:35:20.319 --> 01:35:23.760 and and reduces the fundamental cost of the vehicle. So 1573 01:35:24.640 --> 01:35:28.039 this will really de stress the company a lot. 1574 01:35:29.199 --> 01:35:30.720 So local production will break the wave. 1575 01:35:31.560 --> 01:35:35.880 Local production will break the wave. I mean, just like 1576 01:35:36.000 --> 01:35:38.239 we've had number of times the headlights have come up 1577 01:35:38.239 --> 01:35:38.800 as an issue. 1578 01:35:39.319 --> 01:35:40.399 Is crazy. 1579 01:35:40.880 --> 01:35:43.760 We've had to ship cars to Europe many times where 1580 01:35:44.199 --> 01:35:49.000 the the supplier of the headlights for the EU headlights 1581 01:35:49.520 --> 01:35:53.359 can match rate uh and and or made them wrong 1582 01:35:53.439 --> 01:35:55.479 or something. And then so we may have to make 1583 01:35:55.560 --> 01:35:58.920 cars with US headlights, ship them to Europe, then ship 1584 01:35:58.960 --> 01:36:01.399 a bunch of EU headlights to Europe, change them in 1585 01:36:01.439 --> 01:36:02.920 the port because they're not all id to exit the 1586 01:36:02.960 --> 01:36:04.760 port until they have the EU headlights. 1587 01:36:04.840 --> 01:36:05.479 Oh my god. 1588 01:36:05.720 --> 01:36:07.239 So that was the port problems we would see. 1589 01:36:07.279 --> 01:36:12.720 That's one of the many poor problems. Like like first 1590 01:36:12.800 --> 01:36:18.000 year quarter last year was a tragedy of errors, not 1591 01:36:18.079 --> 01:36:24.319 a comedy, but a tragedy. Belgium went on strike, right 1592 01:36:24.840 --> 01:36:30.079 and like, what do you mean Belgium's on strike? Yeah, 1593 01:36:36.680 --> 01:36:40.119 a lot of cars were coming into Subruge and like okay, 1594 01:36:41.159 --> 01:36:41.760 now what do we do? 1595 01:36:42.520 --> 01:36:42.800 Nothing? 1596 01:36:43.359 --> 01:36:49.119 Just cars are stuck because okay, but then they're scheduled 1597 01:36:49.119 --> 01:36:50.920 to go off strike in this other day and like okay, 1598 01:36:51.159 --> 01:36:54.880 so then we can move things great, And. 1599 01:36:55.000 --> 01:36:58.560 It was just so many, so many things. Cars got 1600 01:36:58.600 --> 01:37:00.600 stuck in the port of Shanghai because they had wrong sticker. 1601 01:37:01.359 --> 01:37:10.159 Oh my god. Yeah, I know, I know. It's been 1602 01:37:10.279 --> 01:37:11.960 off like just many in China. 1603 01:37:12.319 --> 01:37:14.560 Absolutely like totally agree. 1604 01:37:14.640 --> 01:37:17.039 You don't have to spend like two weeks, three weeks 1605 01:37:18.079 --> 01:37:19.640 on the ocean, go there and. 1606 01:37:19.880 --> 01:37:22.039 Roll sticker and you have to wait so replace. 1607 01:37:22.119 --> 01:37:25.079 People don't appreciate Giggashanghai yet completely. 1608 01:37:25.119 --> 01:37:27.880 Until recently, definitely not yet. 1609 01:37:27.920 --> 01:37:29.279 I think people have realized it. 1610 01:37:29.960 --> 01:37:31.000 It's extremely important. 1611 01:37:31.399 --> 01:37:35.680 Yeah, yeah, and these like shipping times or that, like 1612 01:37:36.000 --> 01:37:38.800 like like technically as possible, if everything goes right, you 1613 01:37:38.880 --> 01:37:41.359 can get the cars are in two weeks, but the 1614 01:37:41.399 --> 01:37:44.079 ships don't don't leave every single day, and then you 1615 01:37:44.159 --> 01:37:47.479 also have to cure you can't just instantly load the cars. 1616 01:37:49.600 --> 01:37:52.479 So the cars you have like send like two thousand 1617 01:37:52.560 --> 01:37:55.359 cars to a lot and like you know, port Oakland 1618 01:37:55.399 --> 01:37:59.520 to Port of San Francisco, accumulate, the cars move, then 1619 01:37:59.520 --> 01:38:02.800 they get to another place. Then they get loaded onto 1620 01:38:02.840 --> 01:38:05.560 the ship one at a time, and then finally the 1621 01:38:05.600 --> 01:38:08.640 ship leaves, and then like sometimes the ship has problems 1622 01:38:09.760 --> 01:38:14.239 and like the storms or somethingstom like it's how to 1623 01:38:14.319 --> 01:38:19.720 go through everything? There's so much drama then yeah, and 1624 01:38:19.760 --> 01:38:24.239 then like the ship's engine brought down. It's like stuck somewhere. 1625 01:38:27.079 --> 01:38:30.199 Yeah, but it's great, Like right now, like everything roll 1626 01:38:30.279 --> 01:38:34.159 off the production line, go directly to the Yeah, sands great, 1627 01:38:34.560 --> 01:38:37.760 it's wonderful. So I have another question. It's like, from 1628 01:38:37.800 --> 01:38:42.239 your perspective, how to Chinese public perceive EV. 1629 01:38:43.640 --> 01:38:45.880 Well, China is very pro EV and it's biggest EV 1630 01:38:46.000 --> 01:38:50.359 marking in the world. I think it's like half of 1631 01:38:50.399 --> 01:38:53.800 old EV's or made and bought in China something like that, 1632 01:38:54.079 --> 01:38:54.359 right now. 1633 01:38:54.479 --> 01:38:59.880 Yeah, yeah, So the China sort of. 1634 01:39:01.880 --> 01:39:05.640 Subsides for evs dropped conservatively, so that did cause a 1635 01:39:05.760 --> 01:39:12.000 reductional lot. But the EV incentives were very high in 1636 01:39:12.119 --> 01:39:16.000 China and now they're much less. They're like a third 1637 01:39:16.039 --> 01:39:19.239 of what they used to be or less, so the 1638 01:39:19.600 --> 01:39:22.760 so that's caused some decline in demand as one would expect, 1639 01:39:23.560 --> 01:39:26.600 but it's still China is still the biggest market for 1640 01:39:26.760 --> 01:39:30.039 EV's in the world, so I think they're very positively received. 1641 01:39:30.600 --> 01:39:31.079 That's great. 1642 01:39:31.239 --> 01:39:35.319 Yea so talking about the incentives, because you I know, 1643 01:39:35.520 --> 01:39:38.359 the price, there was a small price reduction right in 1644 01:39:38.439 --> 01:39:42.199 the Chinese Model three and then but then the subsidies 1645 01:39:42.279 --> 01:39:46.239 were the balance. So it's actually not it's not any 1646 01:39:46.319 --> 01:39:49.039 impact on Tassla in no profit, right. 1647 01:39:50.840 --> 01:39:55.920 No, I don't think so. Well, yeah, I think the. 1648 01:39:58.199 --> 01:40:01.720 Obviously, depending on what percentage of the car is made 1649 01:40:01.760 --> 01:40:03.560 in China, that the parts that are made in China 1650 01:40:03.600 --> 01:40:06.199 are not subject to a tariff, so that's certainly helpful. 1651 01:40:06.960 --> 01:40:12.239 We also save on logistics, and generally we found that 1652 01:40:12.960 --> 01:40:15.479 locally sourced parts in China costs less than in the 1653 01:40:16.079 --> 01:40:18.960 you know, in the US or Europe, so this is 1654 01:40:19.000 --> 01:40:24.359 all pretty helpful. Also, the Tesla got added to the 1655 01:40:24.479 --> 01:40:28.479 purchase tax exemption, which will all the other This is 1656 01:40:29.000 --> 01:40:31.039 I'm not sure if you like realized just how much 1657 01:40:31.079 --> 01:40:34.560 of an outfield battle Tesla has had to sell cars 1658 01:40:34.560 --> 01:40:39.760 in China. It's been a you know, really basically no 1659 01:40:39.920 --> 01:40:43.760 access to any subsidies, and we paid a tariff and 1660 01:40:43.920 --> 01:40:47.279 we had to ship the cars over and every single 1661 01:40:47.359 --> 01:40:52.079 thing was set against Tesla, and still we made progress 1662 01:40:52.520 --> 01:40:56.800 decently well, So I think there will be much better, 1663 01:40:57.199 --> 01:41:01.159 a much better situation with local production, not having to 1664 01:41:01.199 --> 01:41:05.880 do shipping and tariffs, and being able to have lower 1665 01:41:05.960 --> 01:41:10.520 cost local sourcing of components. So make a big difference, 1666 01:41:10.520 --> 01:41:10.760 I think. 1667 01:41:11.279 --> 01:41:13.199 Is that your victory dance when you broke in. 1668 01:41:14.800 --> 01:41:18.319 Yeah, that's great, that's a big deal. Huge. 1669 01:41:20.159 --> 01:41:24.800 Yeah, just uh, just fundamental economics. It kind of makes 1670 01:41:24.840 --> 01:41:28.520 sense that making cars on the continent where there are 1671 01:41:28.720 --> 01:41:32.159 bought will be a lot more efficient than making them 1672 01:41:32.199 --> 01:41:33.760 in California and shipping them around the world. 1673 01:41:34.880 --> 01:41:37.720 Yeah, and you can get paid for the cars before 1674 01:41:37.800 --> 01:41:40.119 paying your suppliers, which seems to not be the case 1675 01:41:40.119 --> 01:41:41.840 if you're shipping around the world, and that could be 1676 01:41:41.880 --> 01:41:43.840 a huge like friction on the whole kind of cash 1677 01:41:43.880 --> 01:41:45.239 flow situation, or it. 1678 01:41:45.319 --> 01:41:47.800 Has been for sure, it will sure make a big 1679 01:41:47.840 --> 01:41:52.520 difference on cash flow because yeah, it's there's just no 1680 01:41:52.680 --> 01:41:55.600 way to get the cars, especially in Europe, but but 1681 01:41:55.760 --> 01:42:01.600 even China to get them to customers, you know, before 1682 01:42:01.680 --> 01:42:04.680 we have to pay spliers. So if you're a rapidly 1683 01:42:04.720 --> 01:42:09.520 growing company, it's it's night and day if if you 1684 01:42:10.520 --> 01:42:12.319 get paid by your customers before you have to pay 1685 01:42:12.319 --> 01:42:15.079 your suppliers, like night and day, because then the faster 1686 01:42:15.159 --> 01:42:18.279 you grow, the video cash cash position is but if 1687 01:42:18.319 --> 01:42:20.680 it's the other way around, where you have to pay 1688 01:42:20.720 --> 01:42:23.640 your suppliers before you get paid for customers get paid 1689 01:42:23.640 --> 01:42:26.479 by customers, then the faster you grow, the. 1690 01:42:28.199 --> 01:42:29.720 Faster your cash position drops. 1691 01:42:30.479 --> 01:42:32.439 Because you're going to spend more money to make it. 1692 01:42:33.359 --> 01:42:35.399 Growth actually causes you to orger into the ground in 1693 01:42:35.479 --> 01:42:38.479 a situation like that. Now it tells us we had 1694 01:42:38.520 --> 01:42:40.760 a mixture of both things where we had a lot 1695 01:42:40.840 --> 01:42:45.840 of customers in say in California, and that's that's fast. 1696 01:42:45.960 --> 01:42:48.199 For sure, we would get paid by customers faster than 1697 01:42:48.239 --> 01:42:50.800 we would have to pay suppliers. But then for cars 1698 01:42:51.079 --> 01:42:55.000 going to Europe and Asia, it's the other way around, 1699 01:42:55.600 --> 01:42:58.000 you know, So we would have to pay suppliers before 1700 01:42:58.039 --> 01:43:03.199 we got paid by by customers. And now we could 1701 01:43:03.479 --> 01:43:05.680 we could off sat some of that with the asset 1702 01:43:05.760 --> 01:43:09.000 back line, which was pretty helpful, but only some of it, 1703 01:43:09.119 --> 01:43:09.560 not all of it. 1704 01:43:10.359 --> 01:43:10.680 So the. 1705 01:43:12.319 --> 01:43:16.039 Just the fundamental financial health for sure improves dramatically by 1706 01:43:16.760 --> 01:43:20.000 just having just been having a factory on the continent. Okay, 1707 01:43:20.039 --> 01:43:24.560 we're not talking next door, but it's just how many oceans, 1708 01:43:24.720 --> 01:43:29.000 you know. It's like, especially Europe was logistically super hard 1709 01:43:29.079 --> 01:43:30.920 because we're on the west coast. If we're on the 1710 01:43:30.960 --> 01:43:33.479 east coast, then then China would be much harder. But 1711 01:43:33.600 --> 01:43:36.439 if if you're on the west coast, you're much harder 1712 01:43:36.439 --> 01:43:38.199 because you've got to go through the Panama Canal or 1713 01:43:38.720 --> 01:43:44.479 even worse around you know, Tierra del Fuego, because sometimes 1714 01:43:44.520 --> 01:43:47.159 the Panama Canal get backed up like the spring, and 1715 01:43:47.239 --> 01:43:51.319 ship is going to the Antarctic. It's like you can 1716 01:43:51.359 --> 01:43:54.520 skip up to the end and the stormy as hell. 1717 01:43:55.319 --> 01:44:00.399 It's so you send a ship around Chile, you shiitting, 1718 01:44:01.199 --> 01:44:04.720 you know, in the middle crazy storms, and then back 1719 01:44:04.840 --> 01:44:07.800 up all the way and then like you know, it 1720 01:44:08.319 --> 01:44:18.840 is so funny, oh my god, so logistic nightmare. So yeah, 1721 01:44:18.840 --> 01:44:21.439 it'd be great to just have have it, not get 1722 01:44:21.520 --> 01:44:26.800 on a boat and crust the Pacific and Atlantic and 1723 01:44:27.039 --> 01:44:27.560 that kind of thing. 1724 01:44:28.399 --> 01:44:32.079 So maybe similar to Vincent's question, what's the biggest advantage 1725 01:44:32.079 --> 01:44:36.319 in choosing Berlin other European countries, Berlin. 1726 01:44:36.039 --> 01:44:43.239 Has the best nightclubs. I went to Bogm once. 1727 01:44:49.039 --> 01:44:49.359 Years ago. 1728 01:44:54.399 --> 01:44:58.560 Well, I don't know. I mean he looked a lot 1729 01:44:58.600 --> 01:45:00.840 of different different locations and. 1730 01:45:02.640 --> 01:45:07.840 I sort of, I don't know. We're could have put 1731 01:45:07.840 --> 01:45:11.039 it in a lot of locations. We needed to move 1732 01:45:11.319 --> 01:45:18.760 move quickly. And actually this this place, you know, it's 1733 01:45:18.800 --> 01:45:22.159 like wherever thirty minutes to the outskirts of Berlin, technically 1734 01:45:22.199 --> 01:45:25.439 in brand Rondeberg. It actually was a place location that 1735 01:45:26.319 --> 01:45:29.760 BMW was going to put a plants there, so a 1736 01:45:29.880 --> 01:45:33.880 ton of the environmental work and all of the permits 1737 01:45:33.920 --> 01:45:36.399 and stuff had already been done and then for some 1738 01:45:36.520 --> 01:45:38.960 reason BMW chose a different location. 1739 01:45:40.800 --> 01:45:43.720 But there's like I guess something on the order of 1740 01:45:43.760 --> 01:45:44.439 a year's. 1741 01:45:44.239 --> 01:45:48.600 Work worth of environmental you know, paperwork and stuff that's 1742 01:45:48.600 --> 01:45:52.119 been done on that location for an auto plant. So 1743 01:45:52.239 --> 01:45:55.760 that's it made it one of the quickest places to 1744 01:45:56.199 --> 01:46:02.359 get going, and the like the government local and state 1745 01:46:02.439 --> 01:46:03.640 government was very supportive. 1746 01:46:05.680 --> 01:46:08.760 So you know, I went there and it's like, okay, 1747 01:46:08.800 --> 01:46:11.119 this seems like some pretty good vibe this place. 1748 01:46:11.600 --> 01:46:15.079 So there's a lovely part of this lovely place, and 1749 01:46:15.560 --> 01:46:19.399 there's an opportunity for like it's it's close enough to Villain, 1750 01:46:19.479 --> 01:46:22.720 that's a young people could still you know, live in 1751 01:46:22.720 --> 01:46:26.600 an apartment in Berlain and commute to the factory. It's right, 1752 01:46:26.680 --> 01:46:28.800 there's a train state station. The actually gonna move the 1753 01:46:28.880 --> 01:46:31.079 train station. It's a small train station, but they're gonna 1754 01:46:31.119 --> 01:46:32.920 move the train station to where you can literally get 1755 01:46:32.920 --> 01:46:33.960 off the train and be. 1756 01:46:34.079 --> 01:46:35.359 Right at the Gaga Vilain. 1757 01:46:35.840 --> 01:46:38.359 Wow, that's great, that's great, that's perfect. 1758 01:46:38.520 --> 01:46:40.640 You could literally just pop right off and you don't 1759 01:46:40.840 --> 01:46:44.399 if you walk, you don't need a bicycle. So then 1760 01:46:44.439 --> 01:46:47.520 it's like, okay, this is pretty cool. And ya, so 1761 01:46:47.720 --> 01:46:50.800 so young people could be in a Berlain department and 1762 01:46:50.800 --> 01:46:54.319 it's you know, work at Gay Villain. But if you 1763 01:46:54.399 --> 01:46:57.359 want to have more a family situation, but by backyard, 1764 01:46:57.399 --> 01:47:01.640 there's you know, affordable housing available with you know houses 1765 01:47:01.680 --> 01:47:07.600 with yards and stuff that aren't too expensive. Yeah, so 1766 01:47:08.039 --> 01:47:15.239 it seems like a good, good combination of factors. Yeah, 1767 01:47:15.560 --> 01:47:21.920 a lot of talent in the area. So it sounds 1768 01:47:22.000 --> 01:47:27.239 cool to giggle in. It just sounds it just sounds 1769 01:47:27.279 --> 01:47:29.560 like some some cool nightclub. 1770 01:47:29.600 --> 01:47:30.119 I think. 1771 01:47:32.239 --> 01:47:34.159 You can definitely have a cool nightclub that was cooled 1772 01:47:34.159 --> 01:47:39.279 back people like, yeah, that sounds good. Shanghai too, it 1773 01:47:39.319 --> 01:47:44.520 sounds pretty cool. Yeah, should have like a rave cave. 1774 01:47:44.399 --> 01:47:44.640 And the. 1775 01:47:47.720 --> 01:47:51.039 The factory, but you should have like your own nightclub. 1776 01:47:52.680 --> 01:47:55.039 I think that would be who who doesn't know, doesn't 1777 01:47:55.399 --> 01:47:58.199 we should do that. I feel like i'd go for 1778 01:47:58.359 --> 01:48:00.880 sure work at a company with guys Hut the nightclub. 1779 01:48:01.880 --> 01:48:03.000 That sounds way more fun. 1780 01:48:04.800 --> 01:48:06.600 Didn't you want to put a roller coaster into the 1781 01:48:06.720 --> 01:48:07.479 Freemont factory. 1782 01:48:07.600 --> 01:48:09.520 Yeah, you're still going to do that. I mean I 1783 01:48:09.560 --> 01:48:13.479 think that would be pretty fun to do. Yeah, I 1784 01:48:13.720 --> 01:48:16.760 think we can just like do yeah, just basically have 1785 01:48:16.960 --> 01:48:21.000 like we just needed a rail that can support like 1786 01:48:21.119 --> 01:48:22.880 a modified modified Teslas and. 1787 01:48:23.159 --> 01:48:27.279 Then yeah, can you imagine a plaid Yeah, just like 1788 01:48:27.359 --> 01:48:31.199 sip around and around the factory in like five seconds. 1789 01:48:32.000 --> 01:48:35.159 It would be booked for months. Yeah, we should get 1790 01:48:35.199 --> 01:48:38.159 in right now. Awesome. 1791 01:48:38.720 --> 01:48:40.920 Yeah, we're kind of actually versed parts of the factory. 1792 01:48:41.000 --> 01:48:43.760 We have vehicle conveand systems. They just don't move that fast, 1793 01:48:43.920 --> 01:48:46.000 but they're kind of like roller coasters. 1794 01:48:45.760 --> 01:48:48.479 That move so big exactly. 1795 01:48:51.239 --> 01:48:56.840 So yeah, but yeah, we're freeling pretty you know temp 1796 01:48:56.880 --> 01:48:59.760 fade or anything, but feeling pretty good about where things 1797 01:48:59.800 --> 01:49:07.800 are added. And I think this is like a lot 1798 01:49:07.840 --> 01:49:09.640 of good things. You know, the model Wine coming out 1799 01:49:09.680 --> 01:49:15.000 this year, and some exciting announcements about batteries, a lot 1800 01:49:15.039 --> 01:49:23.920 of progress and autopilot. Yeah, so bullying Giga ballin and 1801 01:49:24.520 --> 01:49:26.079 and then make your progress on some of the new 1802 01:49:27.239 --> 01:49:30.239 vehicle developments. I went and solo, the solar roof, solar 1803 01:49:30.279 --> 01:49:32.880 glass roof. Getting that rolled out. 1804 01:49:34.199 --> 01:49:35.920 The cyber truck got received really well. 1805 01:49:35.960 --> 01:49:39.399 I think, yeah, did you expect that many orders? 1806 01:49:41.479 --> 01:49:42.840 Not? No, not really. 1807 01:49:46.840 --> 01:49:49.359 When I first saw the cyber truck and in the 1808 01:49:49.479 --> 01:49:52.680 France's design studio, I mean, you know, you know, and 1809 01:49:52.760 --> 01:49:55.000 had told me that this was a this was a 1810 01:49:55.119 --> 01:49:58.399 daring design. Although I think you're the most excited about 1811 01:49:58.439 --> 01:49:59.479 this design than any dia. 1812 01:50:00.000 --> 01:50:01.159 I think it's the best product ever. 1813 01:50:01.439 --> 01:50:02.479 Yeah, and I saw it. 1814 01:50:02.720 --> 01:50:05.279 I was just taken aback, and not not by the 1815 01:50:05.359 --> 01:50:08.159 design so much by the pure aggression that the truck. 1816 01:50:08.640 --> 01:50:10.520 You stand in front of it and you're like, okay, 1817 01:50:10.560 --> 01:50:14.520 I'm afraid you know, it really is like a badass truck. 1818 01:50:14.880 --> 01:50:15.079 Yeah. 1819 01:50:16.439 --> 01:50:19.159 Well, it seems like like the other reasons why people 1820 01:50:19.239 --> 01:50:21.800 buy a pickup trucks, you know in the US, is 1821 01:50:21.880 --> 01:50:24.920 like because it's like the most bad ass truck, you know, 1822 01:50:25.159 --> 01:50:29.199 like like which one is the toughest truck, And it's like, 1823 01:50:29.399 --> 01:50:31.039 what's tough with a truck tank? 1824 01:50:33.640 --> 01:50:37.920 Like a tank from the future. So it's like. 1825 01:50:43.079 --> 01:50:51.359 And really fine, cyber truck just in case the first 1826 01:50:51.479 --> 01:50:52.560 four are busy. 1827 01:50:57.880 --> 01:51:03.560 Yeah, absolutely, Yeah, It's literally like how you out top 1828 01:51:03.560 --> 01:51:06.479 of a truck, US make a futuristic adored personnel carrier, 1829 01:51:06.600 --> 01:51:08.119 and that's the tougher than a truck. 1830 01:51:08.960 --> 01:51:11.039 And I feel like a Tommy will probably be very 1831 01:51:11.239 --> 01:51:13.600 like mature by the time it ships too, for sure. 1832 01:51:14.159 --> 01:51:16.079 So how many cyber truck orders do we have right here? 1833 01:51:16.680 --> 01:51:25.199 I got one. I ordered three. I mean it's gonna 1834 01:51:25.199 --> 01:51:27.520 be pretty special and I look like other things, so 1835 01:51:28.039 --> 01:51:30.399 you know, yeah, it looks so cool. 1836 01:51:30.520 --> 01:51:32.319 Like the first time I show it to my son 1837 01:51:32.520 --> 01:51:35.600 is like, Daddy, this is something from Alien. 1838 01:51:37.119 --> 01:51:40.479 This is the first impression. Yes it is. 1839 01:51:41.359 --> 01:51:42.760 That's that's how I just designed it. 1840 01:51:42.880 --> 01:51:42.920 Was. 1841 01:51:43.000 --> 01:51:46.520 It's like, what's the you know, let's let's make a 1842 01:51:46.680 --> 01:51:51.720 future futuristic award personal carrier, you know. And so the 1843 01:51:51.800 --> 01:51:54.800 inspiration board was like literally like you know, Blade Runner, 1844 01:51:55.800 --> 01:51:59.880 you know, like sort of Mad Max back to the Future, 1845 01:52:01.560 --> 01:52:06.840 you know, Aliens, you know, they're like, yeah, so. 1846 01:52:08.680 --> 01:52:12.279 That's why it looks like that, Like the pre older 1847 01:52:12.399 --> 01:52:14.840 number is amazing. It's gonna be over like four hundred 1848 01:52:14.880 --> 01:52:15.560 thousand now right. 1849 01:52:15.560 --> 01:52:18.319 I think it was just so risky, and it just 1850 01:52:19.239 --> 01:52:21.359 like at first people were like even people who like 1851 01:52:21.439 --> 01:52:25.640 were hardcore fans will rolled out and then people are 1852 01:52:25.720 --> 01:52:29.920 like wait a minute, like, yeah, it's kind of amazing. 1853 01:52:30.119 --> 01:52:31.760 I want you could see it like there was like 1854 01:52:32.359 --> 01:52:34.760 in person, you could see it happening really fast, like 1855 01:52:35.680 --> 01:52:38.119 the reaction and then they're processing and then you're seeing 1856 01:52:38.119 --> 01:52:39.920 all the features and then the range and the price. 1857 01:52:40.039 --> 01:52:43.680 Those are the compelling things that really like just hit everybody. 1858 01:52:43.960 --> 01:52:46.399 Forty thousand was the biggest genres, like, oh, people are 1859 01:52:46.439 --> 01:52:47.239 gonna be buying. 1860 01:52:47.079 --> 01:52:49.960 And that range too, like it's just actually. 1861 01:52:49.880 --> 01:52:53.960 Sixty nine five hundred miles with two point nine second 1862 01:52:54.079 --> 01:52:54.720 like come. 1863 01:52:54.640 --> 01:52:55.920 On you. 1864 01:52:59.359 --> 01:53:02.279 Yeah, loved it too, right? 1865 01:53:02.640 --> 01:53:04.000 Did Actually? Yeah? 1866 01:53:04.439 --> 01:53:06.479 One of the last things he said, actually did he 1867 01:53:06.520 --> 01:53:08.760 have a drive in it? And no, he saw pictures 1868 01:53:08.800 --> 01:53:10.600 of it, but I think he was not. Obviously he 1869 01:53:10.680 --> 01:53:14.680 died recently, so he didn't. He saw pictures and he said, yeah, 1870 01:53:14.720 --> 01:53:16.880 that's great, and he says send us a note like 1871 01:53:16.920 --> 01:53:17.760 he loves it, you know. 1872 01:53:18.920 --> 01:53:19.119 Yeah. 1873 01:53:19.359 --> 01:53:22.560 So, but you know, you want you want to have 1874 01:53:22.640 --> 01:53:26.800 these things that inspire people. It feels different, not like 1875 01:53:27.239 --> 01:53:30.680 everything else is like the same. It's like variations on 1876 01:53:30.880 --> 01:53:33.520 the same theme. You want to have something different, but 1877 01:53:33.760 --> 01:53:36.479 you feel like how many I wasn't sure if nobody 1878 01:53:36.520 --> 01:53:36.960 would buy it? 1879 01:53:37.159 --> 01:53:41.479 Or a lot of people would buy it. It just wasn't. 1880 01:53:42.520 --> 01:53:45.520 I don't know, but you know, I just told him, 1881 01:53:45.560 --> 01:53:47.279 like listening, if nobody wants to buy this, we can 1882 01:53:47.279 --> 01:53:49.239 always make one that looks like the other trucks. That's 1883 01:53:49.279 --> 01:53:52.920 not like yeah, you don't just try it and there's yeah, okay, 1884 01:53:53.039 --> 01:53:54.800 it was you know, I could just say, okay, it 1885 01:53:54.840 --> 01:53:57.439 was weird failure, but now you know, make one light 1886 01:53:57.479 --> 01:53:58.079 looks just like the. 1887 01:53:58.119 --> 01:54:00.239 Others and they you go. 1888 01:54:01.479 --> 01:54:05.520 So it seems to capture the whole world though, like 1889 01:54:05.640 --> 01:54:08.199 elevated Tesla and the cultural zeitgeist in a way that 1890 01:54:08.359 --> 01:54:10.720 like is so exciting, Like the Travis Scott music video 1891 01:54:10.800 --> 01:54:13.079 already happened, like that was so I was waiting for 1892 01:54:13.159 --> 01:54:15.840 the first music video and I was like, yeah. 1893 01:54:17.079 --> 01:54:17.560 Really cool. 1894 01:54:18.199 --> 01:54:21.600 Yeah, it's gonna be hard to make that, by the way, 1895 01:54:21.680 --> 01:54:25.399 So it's not. It's because because it's a different architecture. 1896 01:54:26.640 --> 01:54:31.960 It's an exoskeleton architecture. So there isn't any cars out 1897 01:54:31.960 --> 01:54:35.399 there that have an exo skeleton architecture. So you've got 1898 01:54:35.520 --> 01:54:38.000 to rethink how the all the internals of the car 1899 01:54:38.159 --> 01:54:41.760 done so that you can use the external shell as 1900 01:54:42.239 --> 01:54:45.680 as as a load bearing structure instead of just basically 1901 01:54:47.199 --> 01:54:50.800 thin cheap metal that is effectively just therefore aerodynamic reasons. 1902 01:54:52.880 --> 01:54:56.359 So you could take you could take the external what's 1903 01:54:56.399 --> 01:54:59.640 called a class office of most cars and still drive around. 1904 01:55:01.119 --> 01:55:04.840 It loses almost no structural value. It's that they usually 1905 01:55:04.840 --> 01:55:09.000 go very very thin sheet metal. So it's a total endoskeleton. 1906 01:55:09.159 --> 01:55:13.159 So there'll be some some challenges building that. 1907 01:55:13.520 --> 01:55:14.920 It's the Starships three. 1908 01:55:15.159 --> 01:55:17.720 It's a starships. You can use the same steel as 1909 01:55:17.760 --> 01:55:18.079 the show. 1910 01:55:19.399 --> 01:55:21.479 I'd love one of those limited quantity ones. 1911 01:55:21.840 --> 01:55:23.680 I don't like Timid shout out it out. 1912 01:55:23.760 --> 01:55:26.359 Yeah, Timid asked about that everyday astronaut. 1913 01:55:27.079 --> 01:55:30.239 Yeah, that's cool guy. He's a cool guy. He really 1914 01:55:30.279 --> 01:55:31.800 knows what he's talking about. It does. 1915 01:55:33.079 --> 01:55:33.119 So. 1916 01:55:34.600 --> 01:55:36.880 Yeah, so there's there's there's a lot of a lot 1917 01:55:36.920 --> 01:55:41.760 of good things and undoubtedly be some you know, sit 1918 01:55:41.880 --> 01:55:45.479 backs along the way, but it's it's looking looking pretty good. 1919 01:55:45.760 --> 01:55:46.319 Should do some. 1920 01:55:46.359 --> 01:55:48.439 Closing thoughts, you know. I just remember when I got 1921 01:55:48.520 --> 01:55:51.199 my Model three. It was like a difficult time in 1922 01:55:51.279 --> 01:55:54.239 my life, and it made it easier and you know, 1923 01:55:54.840 --> 01:55:56.960 you don't have to buy gas, car drives you around. 1924 01:55:57.640 --> 01:56:00.479 It just makes your life better. All of our lives 1925 01:56:00.560 --> 01:56:03.319 in these little ways like all this struggle you do it. 1926 01:56:04.159 --> 01:56:07.079 You know it really makes things better and just makes 1927 01:56:07.319 --> 01:56:12.000 you hopeful and inspired. And you know, I just can't 1928 01:56:12.039 --> 01:56:15.359 thank you and the whole Tesla team and uh enough 1929 01:56:15.479 --> 01:56:18.159 for for all the love you put into the car. 1930 01:56:18.319 --> 01:56:19.399 You know every day. 1931 01:56:19.720 --> 01:56:21.600 It's just happy because I have a Model three. 1932 01:56:21.880 --> 01:56:23.800 That's cool. I'm glad you like it. 1933 01:56:24.000 --> 01:56:28.399 As let's go, I go to you know, maximize the 1934 01:56:29.119 --> 01:56:32.359 we make peel like really touch people's heart for the product. 1935 01:56:32.520 --> 01:56:35.199 And it's like I think, like too many of the 1936 01:56:35.359 --> 01:56:38.960 companies out there, the design these things because it is 1937 01:56:39.119 --> 01:56:42.039 sort of a spreadsheet and sort of marketing surveys and 1938 01:56:42.119 --> 01:56:44.560 that kind of thing without saying do you love it? 1939 01:56:45.119 --> 01:56:48.880 You actually like the product that you're making. Touch my 1940 01:56:49.000 --> 01:56:49.760 heart very much. 1941 01:56:52.239 --> 01:56:55.840 I like, thank you for this chance like doing interview 1942 01:56:55.920 --> 01:56:59.920 with all of us, and as a shareholder and Model 1943 01:57:00.039 --> 01:57:04.399 three owner, I remember like one time you tweak about 1944 01:57:04.840 --> 01:57:07.399 your money is first in and will be lost out. 1945 01:57:08.199 --> 01:57:11.000 I was really touched to see that tweak. I think 1946 01:57:11.039 --> 01:57:13.760 it's like years ago, like right after one of the 1947 01:57:13.880 --> 01:57:17.800 shareholder meeting, I was like like we see, oh will 1948 01:57:17.880 --> 01:57:21.239 do this, you know, And like after I bought my 1949 01:57:21.560 --> 01:57:25.359 Moto three. I'm more believed to the company, like I 1950 01:57:25.520 --> 01:57:27.760 order a motor y and then two side was shrup. 1951 01:57:27.840 --> 01:57:31.399 I was like, I'm a Porsche fans before. 1952 01:57:31.239 --> 01:57:33.600 And then right now like he was gonna get a 1953 01:57:33.640 --> 01:57:35.600 take on until he saw the range. 1954 01:57:35.840 --> 01:57:38.279 Yeah, I was thinking you get a take on, like 1955 01:57:38.479 --> 01:57:40.680 why not, like give it a try, But when you 1956 01:57:40.760 --> 01:57:44.319 look at a spec the the range turned. 1957 01:57:44.119 --> 01:57:46.960 Me off, like yeah, it's absolute already. 1958 01:57:46.960 --> 01:57:49.560 Two oh one, Like who's gonna buy it for one 1959 01:57:49.680 --> 01:57:53.079 hundred and fifty k? Just not talk about money, just 1960 01:57:53.119 --> 01:57:56.359 talk about range itself. The spect it's like it's not 1961 01:57:56.560 --> 01:58:00.319 there yet. So with like one hundred and fifty cake 1962 01:58:00.399 --> 01:58:04.520 plus like nobody gonna buy it. Yeah, so thank you 1963 01:58:05.159 --> 01:58:07.840 and absolutely thank you very much. Well yeah, well I 1964 01:58:07.920 --> 01:58:12.680 thank thanks you guys for your sport. Just really makes difference. Yeah. 1965 01:58:12.720 --> 01:58:15.600 I mean I don't know Tesla, so I hope hopefully 1966 01:58:15.720 --> 01:58:16.039 I will. 1967 01:58:18.079 --> 01:58:21.880 Yeah yeah true in your shareholders call it. 1968 01:58:22.520 --> 01:58:28.239 Yeah, so yeah, I got to save up, but I 1969 01:58:28.279 --> 01:58:30.239 will buy one, and I've got to cyber truck like 1970 01:58:30.279 --> 01:58:34.439 you said. But I've made so many great memories just 1971 01:58:34.520 --> 01:58:36.600 like through these cars, Like I've met all you guys 1972 01:58:37.239 --> 01:58:40.039 through Tesla and this is amazing. Just like what kind 1973 01:58:40.079 --> 01:58:44.000 of community just is created through products that you love 1974 01:58:44.600 --> 01:58:47.239 And I think that really means a lot, Like I 1975 01:58:47.319 --> 01:58:50.439 don't I think I've never seen people being so excited 1976 01:58:50.439 --> 01:58:54.439 about a product before, like having this whole family feeling. 1977 01:58:54.840 --> 01:58:55.680 That's really cool. 1978 01:58:55.960 --> 01:58:58.359 Thank you so much, welcome, thank you. 1979 01:58:59.439 --> 01:59:01.079 Yeah, I just want to say congrats first of all, 1980 01:59:01.079 --> 01:59:02.680 because I feel like this has been it's kind of 1981 01:59:02.720 --> 01:59:06.119 like a feel good moment for Tesla all that's happening. Yeah, obviously, 1982 01:59:06.279 --> 01:59:09.079 thank you, because like you've inspired all of us, and 1983 01:59:09.079 --> 01:59:10.920 I think there's not many things in the world that 1984 01:59:11.000 --> 01:59:13.600 like people get pumped about that are positive about the future. 1985 01:59:13.760 --> 01:59:15.920 Like I really feel like we need that now, and 1986 01:59:16.000 --> 01:59:18.800 so Tesla, like bringing us all together has been really 1987 01:59:18.800 --> 01:59:20.199 awesome and really much needed. 1988 01:59:20.239 --> 01:59:22.600 I think, great, this is this is really cool. 1989 01:59:23.920 --> 01:59:26.119 I think i'd have to agree with what Gally said, 1990 01:59:26.159 --> 01:59:29.239 just whear Tesla's going. You have a car that's actually 1991 01:59:29.279 --> 01:59:31.960 making a difference with the clean energy, changing the earth, 1992 01:59:32.000 --> 01:59:34.560 cleaning things up. I mean it made me excited to 1993 01:59:34.600 --> 01:59:37.279 see and you're so efficient and you can you actually 1994 01:59:37.439 --> 01:59:39.359 get things the way you do it, you just I 1995 01:59:39.399 --> 01:59:42.680 don't know, you get it done. And I trust you 1996 01:59:42.800 --> 01:59:45.840 and I trust the company, and it's it's I don't know, 1997 01:59:46.079 --> 01:59:48.560 such a passion. It's amazing. I don't know. I just 1998 01:59:48.600 --> 01:59:49.720 don't get cut the words out. 1999 01:59:51.600 --> 01:59:53.439 Sometimes a little later we think we get it done 2000 01:59:53.439 --> 01:59:53.760 in the end. 2001 01:59:53.880 --> 01:59:55.479 Yeah, yeah, yeah, always deliver. 2002 01:59:56.640 --> 02:00:01.079 Yes, thank you, you're welcome, Thanks please for it. 2003 02:00:01.800 --> 02:00:04.640 Well, I just want to say, like how I described this, 2004 02:00:05.079 --> 02:00:07.399 this podcast, like we kind of it kind of just 2005 02:00:07.439 --> 02:00:08.800 grew out grassroots, right. 2006 02:00:08.760 --> 02:00:17.520 And thanks for listening. See you in the next episode.