WEBVTT 1 00:00:03.640 --> 00:00:06.879 On June thirteenth of twenty twenty six. We are going 2 00:00:06.960 --> 00:00:10.640 to Iceland. And when I say we, I mean you, 3 00:00:11.439 --> 00:00:15.199 Me and Shana and Tooks from the research team and 4 00:00:15.279 --> 00:00:19.399 Sydney Copp who helped identify Christopher Roof. For as long 5 00:00:19.399 --> 00:00:21.960 as I can remember, Iceland has been number one on 6 00:00:22.000 --> 00:00:25.480 my travel list and it still somehow eluded me for 7 00:00:25.519 --> 00:00:28.960 all these years. So I'm inviting you to come experience 8 00:00:29.039 --> 00:00:32.520 Iceland with me for the very first time. We'll visit 9 00:00:32.600 --> 00:00:37.719 secret geothermal lagoons, waterfalls, geysers, the Continental Rift, and black 10 00:00:37.759 --> 00:00:41.960 sand beaches littered with icebergs. We'll take a private boat tour, 11 00:00:42.359 --> 00:00:45.640 see the glaciers, see puffins and hang out and rekuvic 12 00:00:46.119 --> 00:00:49.520 It will be I'm sure a life changing six days. 13 00:00:50.159 --> 00:00:53.520 Tickets go on sale at noon Eastern today, but because 14 00:00:53.560 --> 00:00:57.079 of presale, there's actually only a few tickets left, so 15 00:00:57.240 --> 00:01:00.560 reserve your spot asap. Check out out the link in 16 00:01:00.600 --> 00:01:03.960 the show notes or on Instagram. I cannot wait to 17 00:01:04.000 --> 00:01:17.239 see you in Iceland. This is a studio both and production. 18 00:01:27.400 --> 00:01:31.400 It's impossible to deep dive Hunters Washington and its importance 19 00:01:31.439 --> 00:01:36.280 to keys and as crimes without further exploring the keys family, 20 00:01:36.560 --> 00:01:43.799 the Christian Identity movement, and Keys's childhood girlfriend Annie. Let's 21 00:01:43.799 --> 00:01:47.159 begin with the Christian identity movement as a whole and 22 00:01:47.239 --> 00:01:50.959 how and when the Keys family became involved. You may 23 00:01:51.000 --> 00:01:53.840 recall all the way back in season one, Episode five, 24 00:01:54.000 --> 00:01:56.719 I briefly examined some of the tenets of the Christian 25 00:01:56.760 --> 00:01:59.920 identity and the two Callville churches that the Keys family 26 00:02:00.200 --> 00:02:03.519 were members of during their time there, the Ark and 27 00:02:03.599 --> 00:02:07.239 the Christian Israel Covenant Church. In this episode, will be 28 00:02:07.239 --> 00:02:09.719 taking a look at the histories of these churches and 29 00:02:09.800 --> 00:02:14.000 their contemporaries and how multiple factions of the same teachings 30 00:02:14.039 --> 00:02:17.719 coalesced in Stephens County, Washington, and shaped how the Keys 31 00:02:17.800 --> 00:02:20.800 family came to be, who they were and where they were. 32 00:02:23.280 --> 00:02:26.680 According to the Southern Poverty Law Center, the Christian identity 33 00:02:26.719 --> 00:02:29.879 principles started to become a more widespread movement around the 34 00:02:29.919 --> 00:02:34.280 early nineteen fifties when klu Kluck's clan organizer Wesley Smith 35 00:02:34.360 --> 00:02:37.960 founded the Church of Jesus Christ Christian in Lancaster, California. 36 00:02:38.840 --> 00:02:41.479 The church was founded largely in response to the Civil 37 00:02:41.560 --> 00:02:45.560 Rights era. According to the Anti Defamation League, they believe 38 00:02:46.080 --> 00:02:48.800 that whites of European descent can be traced back to 39 00:02:48.840 --> 00:02:52.240 the Lost Tribes of Israel. Many consider Jews to be 40 00:02:52.319 --> 00:02:55.759 the Satanic offspring of Eve and the Serpent, while non 41 00:02:55.800 --> 00:03:01.879 whites are mud peoples created before Adam and Eve. Almost immediately, 42 00:03:01.960 --> 00:03:05.000 the Church of Jesus Christ Christian had ties to racially 43 00:03:05.039 --> 00:03:09.800 motivated terrorism. In the nineteen sixties, Wesley Smith's right hand man, 44 00:03:10.280 --> 00:03:15.439 William Potter Gale, recruited Aryan Nations founder Richard Gurrant Butler, 45 00:03:15.879 --> 00:03:18.319 and Gale was suspected to have been involved in multiple 46 00:03:18.360 --> 00:03:23.759 bombings of African American churches in Alabama. By the nineteen seventies. 47 00:03:23.840 --> 00:03:27.719 The church inspired other religious leaders to preach its abhorrent beliefs, 48 00:03:28.120 --> 00:03:32.719 including street minister Peter Peters. In addition to racism and 49 00:03:32.759 --> 00:03:38.280 anti Semitism, Peters believed gay people should be exterminated. He 50 00:03:38.360 --> 00:03:41.599 took those beliefs and his Church of Jesus Christ Christian 51 00:03:41.639 --> 00:03:45.000 tenets to the Laporte Church of Christ in Colorado, where 52 00:03:45.000 --> 00:03:48.680 he became pastor in nineteen seventy seven. In short order, 53 00:03:49.159 --> 00:03:52.800 that church transitioned from a more traditional Christian ministry to 54 00:03:52.879 --> 00:03:56.520 one of Christian identity, and despite losing the majority of 55 00:03:56.560 --> 00:04:03.759 its parishioners. Peters rebuilt Peter's worked to build the congregation 56 00:04:03.879 --> 00:04:07.560 by hosting a radio show largely airing in rural areas 57 00:04:07.599 --> 00:04:12.159 of Texas, California, Nebraska, New Mexico, and Utah and touring 58 00:04:12.199 --> 00:04:15.840 with road shows. And those road shows would take him 59 00:04:15.879 --> 00:04:20.319 to Torrance, California, where both Heidi and Jeff Keys and Ray, 60 00:04:20.639 --> 00:04:24.079 eventual owner of the Hunter's Farmhouse, were living at the time. 61 00:04:26.519 --> 00:04:30.399 Due to his extensive background in schooling and farming, agriculture 62 00:04:30.399 --> 00:04:34.519 and agroeconomics, Peters used the farm crisis of the nineteen 63 00:04:34.560 --> 00:04:38.199 eighties to reach vulnerable farmers and rural workers who were 64 00:04:38.199 --> 00:04:43.399 seeking both leadership and advocacy, and so by supporting a 65 00:04:43.480 --> 00:04:47.839 vulnerable and terrified population, he was able to manipulate and 66 00:04:47.879 --> 00:04:52.519 eventually utilize them to spread his ministry of hate. Peters 67 00:04:52.560 --> 00:04:58.759 toured specifically southern California, Utah, Colorado, Idaho, and eventually Washington. 68 00:05:00.959 --> 00:05:03.319 And while this may seem like a history lesson in 69 00:05:03.399 --> 00:05:06.560 fucked up Christianity, I promise this is all going to 70 00:05:06.600 --> 00:05:11.439 converge in some very familiar places. While Pete Peters was 71 00:05:11.480 --> 00:05:14.800 spreading hate up and down the West Coast, former Baptist 72 00:05:14.920 --> 00:05:19.240 and excommunicated Mormon art Bullah was self appointing himself a 73 00:05:19.319 --> 00:05:23.480 leader of the fundamentalist Mormons in northwest Utah, the religion 74 00:05:23.560 --> 00:05:27.639 that Israel Keys was born into. Some of Bullah's more 75 00:05:27.680 --> 00:05:32.319 controversial beliefs included plural marriage, that Adam of Adam and 76 00:05:32.399 --> 00:05:37.000 Eve was actually a reincarnated deity with multiple wives, that 77 00:05:37.040 --> 00:05:40.560 black people could never comprehend nor preach the spiritual truths 78 00:05:40.560 --> 00:05:43.680 of Joseph Smith and Brigham Young, and that he himself 79 00:05:43.839 --> 00:05:47.959 was a prophet of God. Like Peters, Bullah was also 80 00:05:48.120 --> 00:05:54.120 devoutly homophobic. Bulla's sister Anne would marry a man named 81 00:05:54.120 --> 00:05:57.680 Barry Byrd around this time, and together they founded the 82 00:05:57.720 --> 00:06:01.720 Marble Fellowship Community Church in the ghost town of Marble, Washington, 83 00:06:02.319 --> 00:06:07.079 the town immediately north of Calville. The Marble Scripture was 84 00:06:07.160 --> 00:06:11.000 largely inspired by and interpreted from, that of Pete Peters 85 00:06:11.160 --> 00:06:16.240 and Christian Identity. In fact, Peters frequently spoke at the church. 86 00:06:18.399 --> 00:06:22.399 In nineteen eighty eight, Peters, Bird and Brad Bullaugh, Art 87 00:06:22.480 --> 00:06:26.759 an Anne's older brother, banded together and wrote The Remnant Resolves, 88 00:06:27.279 --> 00:06:31.079 the Christian Identity manifesto later used by Clive and Amen 89 00:06:31.160 --> 00:06:35.120 and Ryan Bundy. In the Bundyville Saga. I highly recommend 90 00:06:35.199 --> 00:06:39.160 the Oregon Public Broadcasting podcast called Bundyville The Remnant to 91 00:06:39.240 --> 00:06:44.240 learn more about them. Clive and Bundy identified as both 92 00:06:44.240 --> 00:06:46.639 a sovereign citizen and a member of the Church of 93 00:06:46.720 --> 00:06:50.920 Latter day Saints aka Mormonism. As it relates to all 94 00:06:51.000 --> 00:06:54.439 of this, the Bundies are well known for their confrontation 95 00:06:54.600 --> 00:06:58.839 with the BLM, that's the Bureau of Land Management, which 96 00:06:58.920 --> 00:07:02.319 led to an armed stone and off. So whether you're 97 00:07:02.360 --> 00:07:05.360 with Black Lives Matter or the Bureau of Land Management, 98 00:07:05.600 --> 00:07:10.279 these people hate you. And then of course there's the Ark, 99 00:07:11.279 --> 00:07:14.240 the church the Keys family and the Keyhole family were 100 00:07:14.240 --> 00:07:17.639 part of while living in Callville. The Ark, too, was 101 00:07:17.680 --> 00:07:21.120 based on Christian identity in the ministries of Pete Peters, 102 00:07:21.879 --> 00:07:26.879 who also occasionally spoke at the Ark. Pete Peters would 103 00:07:26.920 --> 00:07:28.680 go on to be involved in the stand off at 104 00:07:28.720 --> 00:07:32.399 Ruby Ridge and lead the subsequent Rocky Mountain Rendezvous in 105 00:07:32.600 --> 00:07:38.519 Estes Park, Colorado. He also had ties to Timothy McVeigh 106 00:07:38.560 --> 00:07:43.519 and Terry Nichols, and look, I could do a whole 107 00:07:43.639 --> 00:07:47.319 seven season podcast on just all of this, but for 108 00:07:47.360 --> 00:07:50.319 the sake of Israel, Keys and Hunters Washington that all 109 00:07:50.360 --> 00:07:53.439 boils down to the basic tenants spread across these groups, 110 00:07:54.000 --> 00:07:58.240 their practiced and alleged terrorism, their dispute with land management 111 00:07:58.439 --> 00:08:03.160 and the federal government, their targeted hatred, and their various followers, 112 00:08:03.199 --> 00:08:07.800 who all seemed to coalesce in Stephens County, Washington, where Hunters, Marble, 113 00:08:07.839 --> 00:08:12.040 and Calville are right around the same time. All this 114 00:08:12.199 --> 00:08:15.279 is to say, both the Keys family and the Hunter's 115 00:08:15.319 --> 00:08:18.639 farm house were surrounded by folks who held themselves separate 116 00:08:18.680 --> 00:08:22.839 from and often above the law. They were anti government, 117 00:08:23.319 --> 00:08:25.839 and they were prone to take to both terrorism and 118 00:08:25.959 --> 00:08:30.920 violence to stand their ground and enforce their ideas. In 119 00:08:31.000 --> 00:08:35.080 many of these Eastern Washington hate groups we found tended 120 00:08:35.120 --> 00:08:39.600 to be quite incestuous figuratively not literally, As best we 121 00:08:39.639 --> 00:08:43.360 can tell. Here's how these organizations connect to the people 122 00:08:43.399 --> 00:08:49.399 in Israel Keys and his family's lives. Listeners will best 123 00:08:49.519 --> 00:08:52.279 know Pete Peters as both the man who presided over 124 00:08:52.360 --> 00:08:57.120 Israel's childhood girlfriend Annie's mother's marriage, but he also wrote 125 00:08:57.120 --> 00:09:00.840 the booklet found in the Constable cabin titled Death Penalty 126 00:09:00.879 --> 00:09:04.519 for Homosexuals is prescribed in the Bible, likely one of 127 00:09:04.600 --> 00:09:09.600 Heidi's souvenirs from her inspired time in Callville. Chevy and 128 00:09:09.639 --> 00:09:13.720 Shane Keyhoe attended the Ark prior to moving on to terrorism, bombings, 129 00:09:13.759 --> 00:09:18.559 bank robberies and murder, and Heidi keys moved to Richmond, 130 00:09:18.679 --> 00:09:23.120 Utah to become a fundamentalist Mormon, before leaving the world 131 00:09:23.159 --> 00:09:26.000 of art Bulah for his sister's teachings at the Marble 132 00:09:26.080 --> 00:09:31.120 and then the Ark. As I mentioned in episode five 133 00:09:31.159 --> 00:09:34.399 of this season, the oldest Key's child married into a 134 00:09:34.480 --> 00:09:38.720 Christian identity family and Hunters, a family who were friends 135 00:09:38.720 --> 00:09:42.000 with the owner of the Hunter's farmhouse and remain friends 136 00:09:42.000 --> 00:09:46.840 with Heidi Keys. Keyes's sister's brother in law also had 137 00:09:46.840 --> 00:09:49.840 a daughter who married into a family with strong ties 138 00:09:49.879 --> 00:09:53.440 to both the key Hoose and Annie's family. In fact, 139 00:09:54.039 --> 00:09:58.320 Annie now lives in their old home in Missouri. More 140 00:09:58.320 --> 00:10:02.440 on that in a minute, but first let's discuss pipe bombs. 141 00:10:08.399 --> 00:10:12.519 The countdown is on. 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That's uncommon 170 00:11:48.519 --> 00:11:55.279 Goods dot com slash TCBs for fifteen percent off uncommon goods. 171 00:11:55.840 --> 00:11:57.799 We're all out of the ordinary. 172 00:12:00.080 --> 00:12:03.559 Like guns were a big always a big hobby. 173 00:12:03.240 --> 00:12:09.799 Finding explosives and stuff so explosive? Did you make bombs? 174 00:12:11.639 --> 00:12:13.080 Nothing too exciting? 175 00:12:13.200 --> 00:12:15.200 But yeah, I mean I would tinker around. 176 00:12:15.279 --> 00:12:17.120 I'm mostly just designing stuff. 177 00:12:17.159 --> 00:12:19.440 I never say where. 178 00:12:19.279 --> 00:12:20.240 Do you go to blow that up? 179 00:12:20.559 --> 00:12:25.559 Then we'll do that in the backyard. Lots of places 180 00:12:23.320 --> 00:12:23.519 in the. 181 00:12:25.120 --> 00:12:29.240 Bay they go out to the valley again. Yeah, no, I. 182 00:12:29.159 --> 00:12:31.679 Got I gave all, like. 183 00:12:33.120 --> 00:12:35.240 Most of my bomb making stuff away far. 184 00:12:39.440 --> 00:12:41.440 Is it black powder based stuff or did you get. 185 00:12:41.279 --> 00:12:42.039 Into it now or less? 186 00:12:42.120 --> 00:12:42.279 Yeah? 187 00:12:42.399 --> 00:12:43.240 Mostly black powder? 188 00:12:47.440 --> 00:12:52.799 Uh? And when you messed around with that stuff was 189 00:12:52.840 --> 00:12:56.360 it were you using it in conjunction with some type 190 00:12:56.360 --> 00:12:58.799 of crime or were you just sometimes. 191 00:12:58.240 --> 00:13:01.720 But not usually? 192 00:13:02.039 --> 00:13:07.960 I I discovered power tools, uh huh, effective and explosives. 193 00:13:10.679 --> 00:13:11.480 And a lot quieter. 194 00:13:13.840 --> 00:13:15.960 Were you preaching with explosives? 195 00:13:16.559 --> 00:13:17.000 Yeah? 196 00:13:17.120 --> 00:13:18.799 A couple times I was. 197 00:13:21.080 --> 00:13:22.159 I started doing that. 198 00:13:22.000 --> 00:13:22.519 When I was. 199 00:13:24.000 --> 00:13:24.960 I was like fourteen. 200 00:13:26.240 --> 00:13:29.399 The first I'd ever really blew a first time I 201 00:13:29.480 --> 00:13:31.080 blew a lock with a pipe bomb when I was. 202 00:13:31.080 --> 00:13:34.399 About fourteen, like to put a shad or garage or 203 00:13:34.480 --> 00:13:35.919 something that was a. 204 00:13:39.519 --> 00:13:41.480 It was a four service gate orything like. 205 00:13:42.799 --> 00:13:44.320 So this is when you were out in Coalville, and 206 00:13:44.679 --> 00:13:46.840 that's where you would have been living at the time, right, 207 00:13:47.240 --> 00:13:49.600 was it hard not to get caught doing that stuff? 208 00:13:49.759 --> 00:13:52.000 Given and you didn't have any transportation to get away? 209 00:13:52.120 --> 00:13:53.720 I mean, were you must have been doing it in nearby? 210 00:13:53.879 --> 00:13:56.399 I had a motorcycle. Oh okay, I had a couple 211 00:13:56.440 --> 00:14:02.080 of motorcycles. Now that I was the other stuff. 212 00:14:02.200 --> 00:14:04.600 Before I got my motorcycle, I would just be walking 213 00:14:04.639 --> 00:14:05.240 around in the woods. 214 00:14:05.240 --> 00:14:06.279 I would hike for miles. 215 00:14:09.200 --> 00:14:11.120 I knew, I agreed every. 216 00:14:10.919 --> 00:14:11.720 Inch of that area. 217 00:14:15.759 --> 00:14:18.639 It was in Calville where Keys and the Keeho brothers, 218 00:14:18.759 --> 00:14:21.480 who were as close of friends as Israel could be 219 00:14:21.600 --> 00:14:26.720 with anyone per Scott, began experimenting with pipe bombs, and, 220 00:14:26.799 --> 00:14:30.440 as Scott described, Keys would use them to explode bucket 221 00:14:30.559 --> 00:14:34.720 sized craters into the ground and open force service gates, 222 00:14:35.480 --> 00:14:38.559 which Keys confessed to doing at least once in the 223 00:14:38.559 --> 00:14:42.120 commission of a crime, and you'll recall there were pipe 224 00:14:42.159 --> 00:14:46.720 bomb making supplies found at his constable cabin. In addition 225 00:14:46.840 --> 00:14:49.759 to this, you may also recall that Keys was listed 226 00:14:49.840 --> 00:14:54.159 as a terrorist, which could be in relation to a 227 00:14:54.279 --> 00:14:58.000 series of bombings in Moses Lake, just three hours south 228 00:14:58.039 --> 00:15:02.559 of Calville, where Tammy's son James's father lived in August 229 00:15:02.679 --> 00:15:08.919 two thousand eight. Both bombs were pipe bombs, one of 230 00:15:09.000 --> 00:15:14.080 which was attached to a police scanner. Two Moses Lake 231 00:15:14.159 --> 00:15:17.440 area men died in the bombings, William Walker, an auto 232 00:15:17.519 --> 00:15:21.440 shop owner, and Javier A Dame, who police described as 233 00:15:21.480 --> 00:15:27.399 being linked to local drug trade. Local investigators couldn't connect 234 00:15:27.480 --> 00:15:30.200 the two men, who each found the bombs on their 235 00:15:30.279 --> 00:15:35.720 respective doorsteps. Keys can't be placed anywhere on August second 236 00:15:35.840 --> 00:15:39.279 or third, when the bombings took place. We've been looking 237 00:15:39.360 --> 00:15:42.840 into possible connections between these bombings and Keys or any 238 00:15:42.879 --> 00:15:46.200 of his known associates from Calville for several years now, 239 00:15:47.519 --> 00:15:51.480 and were continuing that investigation. But it's impossible not to 240 00:15:51.559 --> 00:15:54.919 at least bring it up when discussing Keys's history with 241 00:15:55.360 --> 00:16:01.360 pipe bombs, specifically in eastern Washington. Also knowing that in 242 00:16:01.480 --> 00:16:08.840 many ways Keys followed in the Keyhoe brothers footsteps, bank robberies, bombings, murders. 243 00:16:10.639 --> 00:16:14.360 The Keyhoe Brothers also ended up in Arkansas, which we'll 244 00:16:14.399 --> 00:16:18.919 get into in just a few minutes. But all of 245 00:16:19.039 --> 00:16:21.879 this is to say that despite what Keys told the FBI, 246 00:16:22.559 --> 00:16:26.399 he did have ties and maintained those ties with people 247 00:16:26.519 --> 00:16:31.240 in eastern Washington, and the Hunter's Farmhouse would be the 248 00:16:31.320 --> 00:16:34.000 perfect place for Keys to commit a crime during its 249 00:16:34.080 --> 00:16:38.960 period of vacancy. Its located and an incredibly isolated area 250 00:16:39.480 --> 00:16:43.039 and had been owned by anti government standard ground followers 251 00:16:43.120 --> 00:16:46.519 of Christian identity who had animosity toward the Bureau of 252 00:16:46.639 --> 00:16:51.720 Land Management who owned the adjacent lands. If the BLM 253 00:16:51.840 --> 00:16:55.080 or FBI overplayed their hand there, there would almost certainly 254 00:16:55.240 --> 00:17:00.720 be a standoff. The farmhouse was completely surrounded by federal 255 00:17:00.799 --> 00:17:04.440 and tribal land. Because Kisa's sister lived in the area, 256 00:17:04.640 --> 00:17:06.599 it was a place he could return to over and 257 00:17:06.759 --> 00:17:11.759 over again without suspicion, and the former and current owners 258 00:17:11.839 --> 00:17:15.839 as of two thousand and five, were at minimum acquaintances 259 00:17:15.960 --> 00:17:20.079 with the Keys extended family. And then there's the weird 260 00:17:20.160 --> 00:17:24.680 timing and Annie. The FBI believe and I agree, that 261 00:17:24.839 --> 00:17:28.480 Keys committed some crime, likely a murder, on this property 262 00:17:28.559 --> 00:17:32.400 on April second of two thousand and five, Annie's first 263 00:17:32.480 --> 00:17:38.519 wedding anniversary. As I mentioned earlier, Annie would eventually leave 264 00:17:38.599 --> 00:17:41.599 the area for Missouri, where she moved into a home 265 00:17:41.720 --> 00:17:45.079 owned by several of the key Hose and Keys's former associates. 266 00:17:46.039 --> 00:17:49.200 That home is just eighty miles north of where Name 267 00:17:49.319 --> 00:17:52.519 Is forty five. Missing person Kara Kopetski, disappeared in two 268 00:17:52.559 --> 00:17:55.519 thousand and seven, a case that has since been solved 269 00:17:55.559 --> 00:17:58.400 and has no ties to Keys. For more information on 270 00:17:58.519 --> 00:18:01.599 Kara's case, check out Our Name Is forty five episode 271 00:18:01.599 --> 00:18:06.400 about it. In fact, Annie lived just off Route seventy one, 272 00:18:06.960 --> 00:18:09.720 where there are multiple sightings of Keys in Missouri and 273 00:18:10.079 --> 00:18:13.559 Arkansas between two thousand and five and two thousand and seven. 274 00:18:15.000 --> 00:18:17.480 The other Missouri Name Is forty five case is that 275 00:18:17.640 --> 00:18:20.960 of Bianca Noel Piper, who disappeared on March tenth of 276 00:18:21.039 --> 00:18:23.599 two thousand and five, not far from Saint Louis on 277 00:18:23.680 --> 00:18:26.440 the other side of the state. Again, we don't suspect 278 00:18:26.559 --> 00:18:31.680 Keys and Bianca's disappearance. However, all of Keyes's activity known 279 00:18:31.839 --> 00:18:36.240 and suspected in Missouri occurs between two thousand and five 280 00:18:36.400 --> 00:18:39.880 and two thousand and seven. Annie moved there in late 281 00:18:39.960 --> 00:18:43.119 two thousand and four. I've reached out to Annie and 282 00:18:43.200 --> 00:18:45.319 have not heard back as of this recording. 283 00:18:47.480 --> 00:18:47.920 Computers. 284 00:18:48.000 --> 00:18:51.000 You mentioned when computers first cannot start doing searches and 285 00:18:51.079 --> 00:18:52.480 looked just wanted to see what was up with the 286 00:18:52.519 --> 00:18:56.440 military guys. When you would have talked before with us 287 00:18:56.480 --> 00:18:59.599 about there were a couple times that you would go 288 00:18:59.680 --> 00:19:01.519 on your computer and do a search just to see 289 00:19:01.559 --> 00:19:05.440 if a body even found or I don't know, arsenal bank, 290 00:19:05.519 --> 00:19:06.400 rubber or whatever it is. 291 00:19:06.880 --> 00:19:08.440 When you were doing it, how would you. 292 00:19:10.240 --> 00:19:10.960 How would you do that? 293 00:19:11.119 --> 00:19:13.000 I mean, did you know names of everybody? 294 00:19:13.119 --> 00:19:17.119 Or would you do just no search a town, or 295 00:19:17.160 --> 00:19:17.839 how would you do it? 296 00:19:18.279 --> 00:19:22.480 I was with the. 297 00:19:24.920 --> 00:19:29.559 Exception of the computer that you guys got, I generally 298 00:19:29.599 --> 00:19:34.839 wouldn't do it on the home computers. I had another 299 00:19:34.920 --> 00:19:37.440 computer that I did use for a while, but for 300 00:19:37.519 --> 00:19:40.759 the most part it was a computer that I was 301 00:19:40.839 --> 00:19:43.200 planning on having around for a while. I would never 302 00:19:43.400 --> 00:19:46.599 do searches on it. Searches I did do were usually 303 00:19:47.359 --> 00:19:52.200 pretty generic. I would type in an area or a 304 00:19:52.279 --> 00:19:56.240 newspaper of an area and type in a keyword. I 305 00:19:56.240 --> 00:19:58.119 would never type in a specific. 306 00:19:57.759 --> 00:20:00.799 Name, the name of the news paper from the area, 307 00:20:00.960 --> 00:20:01.359 like if. 308 00:20:01.480 --> 00:20:06.880 I would do right, So, yeah, I would do a 309 00:20:07.079 --> 00:20:12.039 search of news from an area I guess, and then 310 00:20:12.359 --> 00:20:15.839 pull up either a newspaper or news channel online news, 311 00:20:17.559 --> 00:20:20.400 type in a key word of something, and just scroll 312 00:20:20.480 --> 00:20:22.440 down the different stories so I found them when I 313 00:20:22.519 --> 00:20:23.000 was looking for. 314 00:20:25.240 --> 00:20:28.319 If I was doing it from an. 315 00:20:28.160 --> 00:20:31.519 Anonymous computer like an airport or a library or something 316 00:20:31.599 --> 00:20:34.559 that I would do, I would just type in what 317 00:20:34.640 --> 00:20:35.359 I wanted. 318 00:20:35.200 --> 00:20:37.519 Right away, bring it up. 319 00:20:39.400 --> 00:20:42.039 Did you know the names? Did you remember the names 320 00:20:42.079 --> 00:20:42.839 of most of the people? 321 00:20:43.799 --> 00:20:44.000 Yeah? 322 00:20:44.160 --> 00:20:46.880 Well, yeah, on the major things. 323 00:20:47.000 --> 00:20:47.160 Yeah. 324 00:20:49.920 --> 00:20:55.160 Studio both and is sponsored by Betterhelp. Winter is essentially here. 325 00:20:55.599 --> 00:20:59.079 The days are getting shorter, the dark is getting darker, 326 00:20:59.599 --> 00:21:02.799 the bed is getting stronger. It's so hard to motivate 327 00:21:02.880 --> 00:21:05.160 when the weather gets cold and the days get short, 328 00:21:05.319 --> 00:21:08.359 and going anywhere feels like a slog, which means it's 329 00:21:08.440 --> 00:21:10.720 time to reach out to remind ourselves that we're not 330 00:21:10.839 --> 00:21:13.880 alone and that life is still happening outside our front door. 331 00:21:14.200 --> 00:21:17.119 As seasons change in, days grow darker sooner, it can 332 00:21:17.200 --> 00:21:19.599 be a tough time for many of us. This November. 333 00:21:19.720 --> 00:21:23.039 Betterhelp is encouraging you to reach out, check in on friends, 334 00:21:23.200 --> 00:21:25.720 reconnect with loved ones, and remind the people in your 335 00:21:25.759 --> 00:21:27.960 life that you're there. Just as it can take a 336 00:21:28.000 --> 00:21:30.519 little courage to send that message or grab coffee with 337 00:21:30.640 --> 00:21:32.720 someone you haven't seen in a while, reaching out for 338 00:21:32.839 --> 00:21:36.119 therapy can feel difficult too, but I promise it's worth it, 339 00:21:36.359 --> 00:21:39.480 and it almost always leaves people wondering why didn't I 340 00:21:39.599 --> 00:21:42.400 do this sooner? I can attest to that this season 341 00:21:42.559 --> 00:21:44.759 isn't for everyone, so it's a great time to reach 342 00:21:44.799 --> 00:21:47.319 out to a Better Help therapist to stay connected and 343 00:21:47.400 --> 00:21:51.160 start working through your fears, anxieties, seasonal depression, and whatever 344 00:21:51.319 --> 00:21:54.440 else is haunting you this gloomy season. My Better Help 345 00:21:54.480 --> 00:21:56.640 therapist Jane has been giving me tools to get through 346 00:21:56.680 --> 00:21:58.880 the darker months of the year, and I'm so thankful 347 00:21:58.960 --> 00:22:01.400 I have her as a grounding and motivational force in 348 00:22:01.480 --> 00:22:04.440 my life. And in this wet and frigid weather it's 349 00:22:04.559 --> 00:22:07.160 literally about to snow here, I'm so glad I can 350 00:22:07.240 --> 00:22:09.160 meet with Jane from the comfort of my own home. 351 00:22:09.400 --> 00:22:12.119 And Jane and all Better Help therapists work according to 352 00:22:12.200 --> 00:22:14.920 a strict code of conduct and are fully licensed in 353 00:22:15.000 --> 00:22:18.000 the US. This month, don't wait to reach out, whether 354 00:22:18.000 --> 00:22:19.920 you're checking in on a friend or reaching out to 355 00:22:20.000 --> 00:22:22.839 a therapist yourself. Better Help makes it easier to take 356 00:22:22.920 --> 00:22:25.880 the first step, and our listeners get ten percent off 357 00:22:25.960 --> 00:22:30.279 their first month at betterhelp dot com slash tcb. That's 358 00:22:30.359 --> 00:22:44.359 better h e lp dot com slash tcb. So what 359 00:22:44.519 --> 00:22:47.200 did Keys do in April of two thousand and five 360 00:22:47.359 --> 00:22:52.279 in Hunters, Washington, Well, if you agree with the FBI, 361 00:22:52.920 --> 00:22:56.680 he likely abducted and murdered the male female Washington couple. 362 00:22:58.440 --> 00:23:01.759 Keys told the FBI that this specific double murder occurred 363 00:23:01.839 --> 00:23:04.440 between his release from the army and the summer of 364 00:23:04.480 --> 00:23:07.079 two thousand and one and his purchase of the boat 365 00:23:07.759 --> 00:23:10.319 on or around April ninth of two thousand and five, 366 00:23:11.319 --> 00:23:15.079 one week after his time in Eastern Washington and Annie's 367 00:23:15.119 --> 00:23:19.480 wedding anniversary. And there are some very good reasons to 368 00:23:19.680 --> 00:23:23.200 suspect that's when the double murder did occur. Keyes liked 369 00:23:23.240 --> 00:23:27.039 to play with semantics, and it's literally right before he 370 00:23:27.160 --> 00:23:31.599 bought the boat. But when pressed, Halla told me they 371 00:23:31.680 --> 00:23:34.200 believed this was the time and place of the double murder, 372 00:23:34.440 --> 00:23:38.119 mostly because it matched the landscape that Keys wrote about 373 00:23:38.160 --> 00:23:42.799 in his letter to his brothers. Detailing that murder. Specifically, 374 00:23:43.400 --> 00:23:46.599 he mentioned pine needles on the ground, a valley below, 375 00:23:47.240 --> 00:23:52.839 and hearing passing cars. But here's the thing, that could 376 00:23:52.839 --> 00:23:57.799 also be most of Oregon, most of Idaho, most of 377 00:23:57.920 --> 00:24:04.000 the states surrounding Washington. Because Keys's conversations around the male 378 00:24:04.119 --> 00:24:08.119 female couple and Ellensburg and Eastern Washington are entirely separate. 379 00:24:08.680 --> 00:24:11.519 He never indicates that those two events are one and 380 00:24:11.640 --> 00:24:12.000 the same. 381 00:24:12.799 --> 00:24:15.400 So the thing about Washington's little a little simpler from 382 00:24:15.440 --> 00:24:19.240 his perspective. There's only two federal districts there, Eastern and Western. 383 00:24:19.480 --> 00:24:24.400 So Eastern is more like the Goma Yakima. Western is Seattle, right, 384 00:24:24.839 --> 00:24:30.279 and that's good enough line. It's like it's Spokan and 385 00:24:30.400 --> 00:24:33.839 then there's Seattle to Goma. It's in the Western, right. 386 00:24:35.400 --> 00:24:36.880 And I think he'd like to be in a position 387 00:24:37.039 --> 00:24:39.680 to sort of just chat very briefly with one of 388 00:24:39.720 --> 00:24:42.000 those criminal chiefs, if not both, if he needs to 389 00:24:42.200 --> 00:24:43.319 to sort of lay the foundation. 390 00:24:43.839 --> 00:24:48.200 Well, the problem I was talking about anything related to Washington. 391 00:24:48.039 --> 00:24:53.279 Is not playing ball with the right people, because those 392 00:24:53.400 --> 00:24:58.839 I'm almost positive are not going to be federal case. 393 00:24:58.920 --> 00:25:02.279 They're not federal ca Well, why do you think that 394 00:25:02.440 --> 00:25:07.960 I think Kevin explains you like different stuff that Okay, well, 395 00:25:07.960 --> 00:25:09.960 I mean, I think Kevin explained to you that the 396 00:25:10.119 --> 00:25:13.960 jurisdictions that we can exercise is pretty expansive, especially if 397 00:25:14.000 --> 00:25:18.480 it's part of right. I understand that. 398 00:25:18.640 --> 00:25:21.000 But again, we're this is gonna be hard to talk 399 00:25:21.039 --> 00:25:23.680 about without getting into stuff we're not supposed to talk about. 400 00:25:23.799 --> 00:25:32.720 But uh, depending on things, you know, the way things 401 00:25:32.920 --> 00:25:35.039