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<v Speaker 1>It's Night Side with Dan Ray on WBZ Foston's Radio.

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<v Speaker 2>All right, as I think all of you know, the

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<v Speaker 2>Karen Reid trial is now in the hands of the jury.

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<v Speaker 2>So it's been a long slog, not only for Karen

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<v Speaker 2>read in this trial, but also in her last trial.

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<v Speaker 2>It's been a long slog. So the jury today got

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<v Speaker 2>the case I guess around two forty and they were

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<v Speaker 2>allowed to deliberate for till two thirty till four thirty,

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<v Speaker 2>a little less than two hours. And you would not

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<v Speaker 2>expect it in a case of this complexity and this challenge,

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<v Speaker 2>such a challenging case, that they would have come up

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<v Speaker 2>with a verdict. So the situation that we find ourselves

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<v Speaker 2>in is that the jury will spend the weekend on

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<v Speaker 2>their own and they will reconvene on Monday. There apparently

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<v Speaker 2>today was some motion made by the defense lawyers which

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<v Speaker 2>would have had Karen Reid I guess was denied by

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<v Speaker 2>the judge. I've never heard of this before, a motion

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<v Speaker 2>whereby Karen Reid would have assisted in the What they

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<v Speaker 2>do is they have eighteen jurors who listen to the case.

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<v Speaker 2>Rob if you could clear that call in number five,

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<v Speaker 2>that would be a good thing, if you had a moment. Okay,

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<v Speaker 2>thank you very much. I appreciate it. And let me

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<v Speaker 2>know with this SoundBite. I can always send that to

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<v Speaker 2>you during the break if I have to. I have that.

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<v Speaker 2>We can take care of all of that. So they

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<v Speaker 2>will spend the weekend on their own, not talking about it,

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<v Speaker 2>not listening to shows like Nightside, not reading the newspaper

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<v Speaker 2>or anything like that. We will then see how it results,

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<v Speaker 2>what happens. I have no idea as to how the

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<v Speaker 2>jury will go on any of these counts. There are

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<v Speaker 2>three major counts, second degree murder, manslaughter while operating a

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<v Speaker 2>vehicle under the influence of liquor. There are a couple

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<v Speaker 2>of what's called lesser included charges there involuntary manslaughter, motor

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<v Speaker 2>vehicle homicide and a simple OUI and then the third

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<v Speaker 2>leaving the scene of an accident resulting in death. So

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<v Speaker 2>these are serious charges and it is a lot for

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<v Speaker 2>the jury to consider, and they will resume their consideration

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<v Speaker 2>Monday morning. And I am interested to find out now

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<v Speaker 2>that the case has been finished, the closing arguments today

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<v Speaker 2>and the instructions of the jury. As I started to

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<v Speaker 2>talk about this motion that was made where by somehow

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<v Speaker 2>never heard of this before. That the defense said that

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<v Speaker 2>in order to maintain the integrity of the judicial system

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<v Speaker 2>that the defendant would never been done before. What they

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<v Speaker 2>do is, you have eighteen people on the jury, and

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<v Speaker 2>eventually twelve will become the jew rows, and six of

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<v Speaker 2>them have to be They basically take them out of

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<v Speaker 2>it kind of looks like a watto barrel, and they

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<v Speaker 2>tick out six who become alternate jurors. And the motion

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<v Speaker 2>that was made was that Karen Reid would be able

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<v Speaker 2>to participate in that. It's generally done by the Clerk

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<v Speaker 2>of Courts, as it was today. Anyway, the point of

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<v Speaker 2>the story is that this case has always been full

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<v Speaker 2>of surprises, and we'll see. I mean, I think the

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<v Speaker 2>jury could come back with anything. They could come back

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<v Speaker 2>with acquittal, they could come back with convictions on some all.

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<v Speaker 2>I don't think they're going to come back with a

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<v Speaker 2>second degree murder. I think that's that is a in

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<v Speaker 2>my opinion, a not guilty pretty clearly. But I'd love

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<v Speaker 2>to know what you think. So here the number six, one, seven, two, five, four,

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<v Speaker 2>ten thirty, six one seven, nine, three, one, ten thirty.

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<v Speaker 2>We were missing a couple of sound bites here and

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<v Speaker 2>I'm going to take a quick break here. Rob and

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<v Speaker 2>I are going to get our act together, and we'll

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<v Speaker 2>be right back after the break here on Nightside.

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<v Speaker 1>You're on night Side with Dan Ray on w b Z,

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<v Speaker 1>Boston's news radio.

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<v Speaker 2>Last night we talked about the case a little bit.

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<v Speaker 2>We started talking about the Karen Read case and then

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<v Speaker 2>we we moved on to the the situation there was

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<v Speaker 2>quickly developing in the Middle East. So tonight I decided

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<v Speaker 2>to do the reverse because obviously people had an opportunity

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<v Speaker 2>towards the end of the show last night to talk

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<v Speaker 2>about the Middle East, and uh, they had an opportunity

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<v Speaker 2>in the beginning of the show to talk about Karen Reid. So,

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<v Speaker 2>having explain to you why I took him in reverse order,

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<v Speaker 2>there was one caller who called in and he leaves

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<v Speaker 2>voicemails for me. He's a caller who just doesn't like

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<v Speaker 2>me or doesn't like my show, and he's I like

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<v Speaker 2>to talk to these people or talk about these people,

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<v Speaker 2>and they're often mistaken, never in doubt. And this is

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<v Speaker 2>this caller doesn't leave his name, but his voice will

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<v Speaker 2>be recognized. And of course when you leave a voicemail,

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<v Speaker 2>for me on the machine. I tell you, hey, this

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<v Speaker 2>might meet be on the air. So we're ab going

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<v Speaker 2>to play the cut that I just sent you. It's

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<v Speaker 2>only seventeen seconds long. But this was a caller who

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<v Speaker 2>was very upset with our discussion. We had a very

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<v Speaker 2>high level legal discussion with a veteran criminal defense lawyer,

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<v Speaker 2>Phil Tracy. Caller predicted the outcome of the case, and

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<v Speaker 2>he put a deadline on it. So I don't know

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<v Speaker 2>if his outcome is going to be right, might be,

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<v Speaker 2>but certainly the deadline that he put on his past

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<v Speaker 2>cut number ten. Go right ahead, Robb.

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<v Speaker 3>Karen read jury will come back and look till late

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<v Speaker 3>afternoon tomorrow with a not guilty verdict. That's making a

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<v Speaker 3>fool out of till Tracy, you and Hank Bennan and

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<v Speaker 3>believe me, I will call to rub it in tomorrow evening.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, if you're out there listening tonight and you'd like

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<v Speaker 2>to call in and take a victory lap and rub

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<v Speaker 2>it in. Oh the jury didn't come back with a verdict. Oh,

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<v Speaker 2>I see. Well, I wonder if this caller, whose voice

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<v Speaker 2>is a very distinctive voice, by the way, is going

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<v Speaker 2>to have the backbone to call in and say, guess

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<v Speaker 2>what I was wrong because he was wrong. Now I

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<v Speaker 2>don't know, and I've said all along, I don't know

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<v Speaker 2>how the case will come out because I haven't been

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<v Speaker 2>in the courtroom every day. I'm prepared to do my

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<v Speaker 2>show every day. So if he's listening and he wants

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<v Speaker 2>to call in and take a victory lap, feel free

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<v Speaker 2>because not only well the words speak for themselves seventeen

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<v Speaker 2>seconds of your thoughts last night, which proved to be

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<v Speaker 2>wrong again. Sorry, no one is hanging their head. Phil

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<v Speaker 2>Tracy's not hanging his head. I'm not hanging my head,

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<v Speaker 2>and Hank Brennan isn't hanging his head. We all happen

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<v Speaker 2>to We all happen to be lawyers. Phil Tracy and

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<v Speaker 2>Hank Brennan a very experienced trial lawyers in the courts

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<v Speaker 2>of Massachusetts. And I'm sure that you probably have a

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<v Speaker 2>deep Whoever this caller is, I'm sure you probably have

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<v Speaker 2>a deep legal background. I bet you probably at some

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<v Speaker 2>point of watch Judge Judy a couple of times, and

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<v Speaker 2>so you have a degree from the school of Judge Judy.

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<v Speaker 2>Let me go to the callers. Six months, seven, two, five, four, ten,

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<v Speaker 2>thirty six one, seven, nine, three, one, ten thirty. First

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<v Speaker 2>up is Gideon in Quincy. Gideon, thank you for calling in.

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<v Speaker 2>You are next on Nightside. Hey, how are you?

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<v Speaker 4>Thank you? I'm great.

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<v Speaker 3>Thank you.

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<v Speaker 4>First of all, Dan, I do like you and I

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<v Speaker 4>do like your show, so I want to start with that.

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<v Speaker 2>Thank you.

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<v Speaker 4>You're welcome. Okay, So about Karen Reid, what I really

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<v Speaker 4>want to say is, I don't think she's a murderer.

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<v Speaker 4>I just don't believe that. You know, I agree with you.

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<v Speaker 2>I yeah, I agree with you. I don't think she Yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>I don't think the case was made to a convictor

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<v Speaker 2>on the second degree murder charge. I agree with you.

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<v Speaker 4>Go right ahead, right And you know, with the alcohol

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<v Speaker 4>and everything, we don't really know what happened. I'm not

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<v Speaker 4>sure i'd buy the widespread conspiracy. But based on her behavior,

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<v Speaker 4>you know, I understand she was the next day, she

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<v Speaker 4>was worried about whether.

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<v Speaker 5>She'd hit him.

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<v Speaker 4>She was not behaving like a murderer. Now, you know,

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<v Speaker 4>maybe leaving the scene of an accident. But you take

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<v Speaker 4>the fact they charged her with murder, and then you

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<v Speaker 4>add on top of that some of the mistakes that

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<v Speaker 4>were made of the trial and what was you know

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<v Speaker 4>true for Procto, the things he said, looking through her phone,

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<v Speaker 4>with the looking for the nude pictures. You take all that,

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<v Speaker 4>put it all together, and I hope she gets a pass.

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<v Speaker 4>I feel sorry for the family. I feel sorry for

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<v Speaker 4>the victim, I really do. But I just don't think

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<v Speaker 4>she's a murderer. And you put it all together, and

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<v Speaker 4>I think that she I think she should get a pass.

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<v Speaker 2>You know, well, here's the prom my thought. Okay, no, no,

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<v Speaker 2>those thoughts, and I agree with you. In order to

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<v Speaker 2>prove murder, even murder in the second degree, you have

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<v Speaker 2>to prove a level of intent that I just don't

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<v Speaker 2>think is there. However, when when you have someone whose

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<v Speaker 2>life has been cut short, and you have someone who

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<v Speaker 2>and I don't know exactly how old mister O'Keeffe, officer

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<v Speaker 2>O'Keefe was, but it looked to me like he was

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<v Speaker 2>somewhere in his forties. He obviously had many years of life.

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<v Speaker 2>Something happened, something happened. It's up to the jury to

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<v Speaker 2>decide if what happened involved her, So if if hypothetically

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<v Speaker 2>she was overserved, and if hypothetically she had been in

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<v Speaker 2>an argument with mister O'Keefe, and if hypothetically the argument

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<v Speaker 2>got heated and he wanted to go into the to

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<v Speaker 2>the party and she had no interest in doing that.

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<v Speaker 2>And if she decided that she was once he left

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<v Speaker 2>her vehicle or the vehicle, she was going to make

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<v Speaker 2>a dramatic departure, let's put it like that, and in

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<v Speaker 2>the middle of a snowstorm, I guess was a pretty

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<v Speaker 2>intense snowstorm, decided to just step on the gas and

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<v Speaker 2>go away to make the point that she was upset.

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<v Speaker 2>And if, unfortunately the car was in reverse and not

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<v Speaker 2>in forward going you know, in drive, If if the

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<v Speaker 2>jury would have believed that, do you still give her

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<v Speaker 2>a pass?

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<v Speaker 4>I don't, you know, I don't know. It's tough. I mean,

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<v Speaker 4>I'm glad I'm not on that journey jury. I mean,

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<v Speaker 4>I'm really glad, And I don't know. But I just

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<v Speaker 4>think that if the government, I think I think it

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<v Speaker 4>seems a little unfair that the government can charge her

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<v Speaker 4>with murder and then sort of say, well, okay, she's

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<v Speaker 4>not a murderer, but well then jumped down to you know,

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<v Speaker 4>leaving the scene of an accident and manslaughter. I just

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<v Speaker 4>feel it should be you know, either murder or not murder.

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<v Speaker 2>Well again, there's well, Gideon, Gideon, there's there's every case,

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<v Speaker 2>the facts of the case to find what the charge

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<v Speaker 2>might be. Now, is she overcharged? I would armor from

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<v Speaker 2>the case I saw that she's overcharged when he come

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<v Speaker 2>to murder. But can you get a man slain of

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<v Speaker 2>conviction out of there? Voluntary or involuntary? I think that's possible,

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<v Speaker 2>certainly on the involuntary leaving the scene of an accident.

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<v Speaker 2>You know, again, that's tough because that's a state of

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<v Speaker 2>mind situation, motor vehicle homicide. That's that's that's doable. So anyway, look,

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<v Speaker 2>it's the way the court system works. The court system

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<v Speaker 2>isn't perfect. Yeah, as someone once said, it's the second

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<v Speaker 2>worst court system in the world, and the first worst.

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<v Speaker 2>The worst ones are all the others. So we'll see.

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<v Speaker 4>They say the same thing about democracy, right, all the others.

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<v Speaker 2>That's a good one.

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<v Speaker 4>That's a great time.

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<v Speaker 2>Geddy and I enjoyed the conversation. Thank you very much.

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<v Speaker 2>Let me go to Matt in Florida. Matt has strong

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<v Speaker 2>viewpoints always. Matt, welcome back, Dan.

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<v Speaker 5>What do you think happened? You've you've yet to give

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<v Speaker 5>your theory. Well, or can you not because you know

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<v Speaker 5>they could see you?

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<v Speaker 2>No, no, no, I can give a theory. I can

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<v Speaker 2>give a theory.

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<v Speaker 5>I want to I want to hear it. I've been

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<v Speaker 5>waiting for it for years.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, well, the more I look at it, I find

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<v Speaker 2>it difficult to believe that he got into the house.

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<v Speaker 2>And I know that there's all the evidence that people

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<v Speaker 2>will hear that he get into the house and he

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<v Speaker 2>got into a fight and either was intentionally killed or

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<v Speaker 2>someone hit him with a lucky punch and he hit

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<v Speaker 2>his head. But he's dead in the house. And then

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<v Speaker 2>at some point someone said, well, what are we going

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<v Speaker 2>to do? And you've got like all these people kicking around,

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<v Speaker 2>and they're going to conclude, you know, let's just put

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<v Speaker 2>them out in the front lawn. No one's going to

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<v Speaker 2>notice that. That, to me, stretches credibility. What doesn't stretch

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<v Speaker 2>credibility is that there could have been a horrible accident,

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<v Speaker 2>meaning that these two folks are have a and no

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<v Speaker 2>one knows, I mean the only person who knows, and

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<v Speaker 2>maybe she doesn't even know because she had apparently she

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<v Speaker 2>was over served that night. So so assume they have

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<v Speaker 2>a big, a big argument and she's turned the car

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<v Speaker 2>around and the car she thinks the car is in drive,

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<v Speaker 2>and it's actually in reverse. He gets out of the car,

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<v Speaker 2>and she decides that she's going to make a dramatic

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<v Speaker 2>getaway and hits the gas pedal thinking she's going to

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<v Speaker 2>go forward, and it goes backwards by mistake.

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<v Speaker 5>That's right, the eyes.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's the only conceivable theory that makes any sense

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<v Speaker 2>to me. Although I can't prove that, right, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>I don't know that the prosecution should prove that.

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<v Speaker 5>Yeah, right. And this is the thing. I was so

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<v Speaker 5>into the conspiracy, and you know, I listened to Brennan,

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<v Speaker 5>who I can't stand. I don't like him, but I

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<v Speaker 5>mean his I thought his closing arguments were actually pretty good.

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<v Speaker 5>And like, I just think Karen Reid got really really

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<v Speaker 5>really really really times a thousand lucky in that there

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<v Speaker 5>was just no evidence of what actually happened. You know,

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<v Speaker 5>I think she actually, after years of looking at this,

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<v Speaker 5>I don't know, I just I'm doing a complete one

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<v Speaker 5>eighty here, but I think she did it, and she

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<v Speaker 5>got a great lawyer, and she lucked out in that.

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<v Speaker 5>You know, he didn't, you know, what if he saw

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<v Speaker 5>the car coming back where then he slipped, And you know, like,

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<v Speaker 5>I just think she got really lucky in that there's

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<v Speaker 5>really no evidence against her, really, and I just that's

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<v Speaker 5>my theory now, is just that she got lucky. There's

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<v Speaker 5>no evidence and all the evidence has really fed the

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<v Speaker 5>conspiracy because the heart evidence is it's more plausible looking

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<v Speaker 5>at the heart evidence that there was a conspiracy versus

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<v Speaker 5>her actually hitting them.

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<v Speaker 2>But so let me ask you this. Okay, if you

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<v Speaker 2>go back to the to the conspiracy, if he went

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<v Speaker 2>into the house and there were words exchanged and a

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<v Speaker 2>fight ensued, and I know that people are gonna call

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<v Speaker 2>it in, tell me about the rug was taken out

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<v Speaker 2>and the dog was put somewhere. All of that. I

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<v Speaker 2>was hoping that the forensics on the automobile would be

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<v Speaker 2>more dispositive of what might have happened. But let's assume

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<v Speaker 2>hypothetically that it for no good reason, there's a fight

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<v Speaker 2>and somebody pushes him, and this can happen. People hit

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<v Speaker 2>their head and they die. I mean they you know,

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<v Speaker 2>no one was intentionally going to kill him, But let's

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<v Speaker 2>assume that that is the theory. I think that in

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<v Speaker 2>that situation, and I'm not I don't believe that is

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<v Speaker 2>what happened. But I would think that that it would

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<v Speaker 2>be very difficult to get you know, five six, seven,

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<v Speaker 2>eight nine people who were in the house at that

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<v Speaker 2>point to say, Okay, here's what we're going to do.

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<v Speaker 2>We're going to put him out in the front lawn.

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<v Speaker 2>And we're all everybody's mum's, you know, nobody's saying anything, right,

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<v Speaker 2>There's just too many people there, and and well, I think,

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<v Speaker 2>what did they go ahead? Go ahead?

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<v Speaker 1>Right?

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<v Speaker 5>So what I think could have happened really was and

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<v Speaker 5>what I believe was there was a fight, and you know,

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<v Speaker 5>he walked out on his own volition and then passed out.

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<v Speaker 5>You know, they yelled at him, they said, get the

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<v Speaker 5>hell out of hair, you drunk, and he just was

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<v Speaker 5>walking out and you know, basically passed out. Because I

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<v Speaker 5>can't get over the evidence of the toeture of of

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<v Speaker 5>the snowplow driver and the the testimony of the kid

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<v Speaker 5>who was picking up his girlfriend from the house or

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<v Speaker 5>his sister and he said he saw Karen Reid, but

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<v Speaker 5>no one else was in the suv. Those those are

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<v Speaker 5>two third party people who have nothing to do with it.

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<v Speaker 5>The snow plow driver and the kid picking up his

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<v Speaker 5>sister or his girlfriend.

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<v Speaker 2>I just can't snow the snowplow. Yeah, the snowplow driver

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<v Speaker 2>doesn't give me much of a problem because I've been

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<v Speaker 2>I covered enough snowstorms, uh, and have driven in enough

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<v Speaker 2>snowstorms at night that if you're if you're in the

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<v Speaker 2>middle of a snowstorm, and particularly I'm not a snowplow driver.

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<v Speaker 2>And once the snow there's three or four inches of

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<v Speaker 2>snow on the ground or two or three inches of

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<v Speaker 2>snow on the ground, things have covered up, so that

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<v Speaker 2>again I'd like to know more about the time of

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<v Speaker 2>when he came by. And uh, but whatever, we'll we'll

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<v Speaker 2>find out. We neither one of us were in the

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<v Speaker 2>court room for the entirety for the trial. And I

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<v Speaker 2>learned a long time ago, both as a lawyer and

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<v Speaker 2>as a reporter. Uh, the only people who really are

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<v Speaker 2>going to understand this case, and maybe they won't are

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<v Speaker 2>the yours.

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<v Speaker 5>That's fair. And I just, I just I have no

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<v Speaker 5>faith in humanity, So I think, I think I don't.

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<v Speaker 5>Every day I run into people and I just shake

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<v Speaker 5>my head and go, what is what is wrong with

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<v Speaker 5>this world? So I don't believe that you know, However,

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<v Speaker 5>many people are on that jury. I cannot believe that

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<v Speaker 5>every single one of them can have sat there rationally

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<v Speaker 5>and listen to everything. I just don't. I just can't

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<v Speaker 5>do it. But well, interesting, I'll tell you this, that's

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<v Speaker 5>for sure.

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<v Speaker 2>If they do hook her for something, it's going to

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<v Speaker 2>be the she never should have done those television interviews.

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<v Speaker 5>Well, and that's what makes me think, ultimately, I think

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<v Speaker 5>she did it. You know, she's just like I said

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<v Speaker 5>at the beginning of the phone call, my final answer,

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<v Speaker 5>I think she did it. She just really lucked out

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<v Speaker 5>in that there was just no hard evidence against her

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<v Speaker 5>because I don't I haven't seen it yet. You know.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, again, it's it's one of those it's one of

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<v Speaker 2>those cases, and maybe we'll never know the truth. I

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<v Speaker 2>just think it was a huge mistake how her lawyers

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<v Speaker 2>allowed her to do those phone calls, to do those interviews.

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<v Speaker 2>I just think that it's.

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<v Speaker 5>Oh, can I ask you one last quick question as

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<v Speaker 5>a lawyer, would you do you see do you think

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<v Speaker 5>it's weird that no one in the house or the

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<v Speaker 5>lady google in how long does it take to die

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<v Speaker 5>in the snow? Do you find it bizarre that not

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<v Speaker 5>one of them have done a TV interview or is

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<v Speaker 5>that just kind of the right thing to do, just

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<v Speaker 5>don't even get involved, to shut up and just let

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<v Speaker 5>it take its course.

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<v Speaker 2>Why would anyone do a TV interview here? I mean,

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<v Speaker 2>no one, No one is going to No one is

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<v Speaker 2>the person who you know, if there was someone who

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<v Speaker 2>get well, no, but I'm saying there, why would anybody?

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<v Speaker 2>First of all, all you're going to do is put

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<v Speaker 2>yourself under the light of suspicion. So if you did something, uh,

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<v Speaker 2>if you were somehow involved, you don't do the interview.

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<v Speaker 2>If you weren't involved, why do you want to put

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<v Speaker 2>yourself The only way you should you would do an

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<v Speaker 2>interview is if you happened to walk out two minutes

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<v Speaker 2>after the uh O'Brien either fell down or it was

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<v Speaker 2>hit by the car, and you somehow gave him multimouth

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<v Speaker 2>resuscitation called nine to one one and saved his life

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<v Speaker 2>and you're a hero.

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<v Speaker 5>No, I just yeah, you're just not getting anything out

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<v Speaker 5>of it. So yeah, all right, thank you, apprecious.

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<v Speaker 2>Thanks Matt, great dear you have great weekend, Happy Father's Day.

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<v Speaker 2>He hung up real quickly six one, seven, two, five, four, ten,

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<v Speaker 2>thirty six, one seven, nine, three, one ten thirty. Again

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<v Speaker 2>it's up to the jury. What generally juries get it right.

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<v Speaker 2>We'll see. I kind of imagine what this woman has

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<v Speaker 2>gone through, uh for the last three years now. Uh,

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<v Speaker 2>this is it just it just shows that that that

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<v Speaker 2>that that life can be unfair. It certainly wasn't fair

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<v Speaker 2>to John O'Keeffe whatever happened to him, and maybe it's

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<v Speaker 2>going to be unfair to Karen Reid. But life is unfair.

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<v Speaker 2>Six one seven, two four thirty, six one seven, nine thirty.

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<v Speaker 2>Coming right back on night Side.

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<v Speaker 1>It's Night Side with Y Boston's News Radio.

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<v Speaker 2>I love that phrase getting stored. That's an interesting piece

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<v Speaker 2>by Mike Macklin. Thank you all. Okay, we're going to

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<v Speaker 2>continue talking about the Karen Reid case. It is now

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<v Speaker 2>in the hands of the jury. I hope that the

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<v Speaker 2>jury I think, I hope the jury can come to

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<v Speaker 2>a decision. Whatever the decision is, I'm willing to accept it.

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<v Speaker 2>I think that, Uh, there's I don't think there should

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<v Speaker 2>be a third trial, although it would be. It's very

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<v Speaker 2>hard for a prosecutor to walk away if there's a

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<v Speaker 2>couple of mistrials. We'll see again. I don't have. I'm

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<v Speaker 2>not particularly invested in the whole case, and for a

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<v Speaker 2>long time really kind of stayed away from the case.

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<v Speaker 2>But there came a point in time where it just

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<v Speaker 2>became too big to avoid. Let me go to Donna

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<v Speaker 2>in Berkeley, Massachusetts. Donna in Berkeley, Welcome, how are you hi, Idanne,

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<v Speaker 2>I've talked to you before.

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<v Speaker 6>I'm on my way to work.

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<v Speaker 7>I'm a nurse.

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<v Speaker 2>Thank you for what you do. Thank you.

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<v Speaker 7>But two things I watched both trials, and if I'm

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<v Speaker 7>not mistaken, doctor Sordy Bellow in the first trial not

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<v Speaker 7>the second trial, said that John o'keith launched three liters

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<v Speaker 7>of blood. And I just had a patient bleed out

400
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<v Speaker 7>last week and she bled out twenty two hundred CC's

401
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<v Speaker 7>of blood. That is a lot of blood. So when

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<v Speaker 7>you're talking about all the forensics and all the evidence

403
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<v Speaker 7>and everything else where, was three leaders of blood if

404
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<v Speaker 7>this man was supposedly died on the side of the road.

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<v Speaker 7>That's one.

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<v Speaker 6>The other one is they never took swaths of each

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<v Speaker 6>of the marks on his arms. They never did that,

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<v Speaker 6>and there's where you probably would have found some DNA

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<v Speaker 6>of whatever. My other question to you is I agree

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<v Speaker 6>with you that I don't think she should have done

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<v Speaker 6>the interviews.

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<v Speaker 7>I think that was kind of.

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<v Speaker 2>A shot in the foot.

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<v Speaker 8>But does she get paid where she's so in debt,

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<v Speaker 8>does she get paid for those interviews?

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<v Speaker 2>Well, in the old days, no self respecting journalists would

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<v Speaker 2>ever pay for an interview that was not considered appropriate. However,

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<v Speaker 2>times have changed, and as we've gotten away from the

419
00:24:58.359 --> 00:25:02.039
<v Speaker 2>big three networks, ABC and b C, CBS. Uh, and

420
00:25:02.079 --> 00:25:06.599
<v Speaker 2>you get to some of these shows that that I

421
00:25:06.640 --> 00:25:10.960
<v Speaker 2>think she was on. Uh, it's not inconceivable that that

422
00:25:11.039 --> 00:25:13.720
<v Speaker 2>she that she was paid, but I don't know, is

423
00:25:13.759 --> 00:25:20.359
<v Speaker 2>it possible? Yeah, but uh, you know, the the journalistic

424
00:25:20.480 --> 00:25:26.200
<v Speaker 2>ethics that existed in the era of Walter Cronkite no

425
00:25:26.240 --> 00:25:30.799
<v Speaker 2>longer exist in my in my opinion, So yeah, so

426
00:25:31.079 --> 00:25:36.599
<v Speaker 2>it's conceivable. But again, I can't imagine that she would

427
00:25:36.599 --> 00:25:43.839
<v Speaker 2>have done those with the with the support of her attorneys,

428
00:25:43.880 --> 00:25:48.720
<v Speaker 2>because it makes their I mean that that she did

429
00:25:48.759 --> 00:25:51.799
<v Speaker 2>not come across in those interviews as an empathetic figure,

430
00:25:52.279 --> 00:25:55.119
<v Speaker 2>and they can be they've been used in court. Obviously

431
00:25:57.079 --> 00:25:59.400
<v Speaker 2>she didn't have you know, she she could have stayed

432
00:25:59.440 --> 00:26:04.200
<v Speaker 2>off the witness stand and obviously and basically choose to

433
00:26:04.319 --> 00:26:08.440
<v Speaker 2>invoke her rights against self incrimination. But once you do

434
00:26:08.559 --> 00:26:10.720
<v Speaker 2>that television interview and it is out there, it's part

435
00:26:10.759 --> 00:26:13.680
<v Speaker 2>of the public record. So I don't think again if

436
00:26:13.720 --> 00:26:16.559
<v Speaker 2>she does, if she does get convicted for anything, those

437
00:26:16.599 --> 00:26:20.359
<v Speaker 2>interviews might be the downfall. We'll have to see, we'll

438
00:26:20.400 --> 00:26:21.160
<v Speaker 2>have to see what.

439
00:26:23.440 --> 00:26:23.640
<v Speaker 5>Right.

440
00:26:23.720 --> 00:26:26.640
<v Speaker 7>And like you said, you know, maybe the lesser chargers,

441
00:26:26.680 --> 00:26:29.480
<v Speaker 7>but you know again about leaving the scene and all that,

442
00:26:29.559 --> 00:26:32.359
<v Speaker 7>they didn't prove that there was a scene yet, you know,

443
00:26:32.839 --> 00:26:36.319
<v Speaker 7>they didn't, they didn't really, the Commonwealth didn't really prove

444
00:26:37.680 --> 00:26:40.920
<v Speaker 7>you know, sure, yeah, yeah, that was Jackson.

445
00:26:41.160 --> 00:26:43.640
<v Speaker 2>That was Jackson's arguments. As a matter of fact, I

446
00:26:43.680 --> 00:26:46.599
<v Speaker 2>had some sound bites of the closing arguments that I

447
00:26:46.680 --> 00:26:49.559
<v Speaker 2>but unfortunately we don't have them available for you. But

448
00:26:49.680 --> 00:26:54.359
<v Speaker 2>you're you're, you're, you're, you're, you're quoting essentially what Jackson

449
00:26:54.359 --> 00:26:56.279
<v Speaker 2>told the jury and if the jury chooses to believe

450
00:26:56.319 --> 00:26:59.799
<v Speaker 2>that and if there was no impact and uh and

451
00:26:59.839 --> 00:27:02.240
<v Speaker 2>they they believe there was no impact.

452
00:27:02.799 --> 00:27:06.960
<v Speaker 7>Time, Yeah, right, there's no scene. Did you see jas

453
00:27:07.200 --> 00:27:11.279
<v Speaker 7>You probably didn't watch it today, but Jackson got choked

454
00:27:11.599 --> 00:27:15.480
<v Speaker 7>choked up on the lost sentence. Did you happen to

455
00:27:15.519 --> 00:27:15.839
<v Speaker 7>see that.

456
00:27:16.440 --> 00:27:19.200
<v Speaker 2>No I didn't explain it, I'm sure you can describe it.

457
00:27:20.599 --> 00:27:24.079
<v Speaker 8>So the last three things he said was not guilty.

458
00:27:24.200 --> 00:27:26.839
<v Speaker 8>And then on the second one he said not guilty,

459
00:27:26.839 --> 00:27:29.079
<v Speaker 8>and you could see him get choked up. And then

460
00:27:29.119 --> 00:27:31.359
<v Speaker 8>on the third one he said not guilty. And it

461
00:27:31.480 --> 00:27:35.200
<v Speaker 8>was like he was so passionate, and it was like, oh,

462
00:27:35.480 --> 00:27:39.640
<v Speaker 8>you had just bled for all involved, but you know,

463
00:27:39.720 --> 00:27:42.279
<v Speaker 8>you just bled that they have worked so hard.

464
00:27:42.279 --> 00:27:45.640
<v Speaker 7>To try to prove her innocence. It was it was

465
00:27:45.720 --> 00:27:46.440
<v Speaker 7>quite a moment.

466
00:27:46.559 --> 00:27:49.960
<v Speaker 2>I thought, yeah, well, again, the burden of proof is

467
00:27:50.000 --> 00:27:52.880
<v Speaker 2>not on them to prove her innocence. The burden of

468
00:27:52.960 --> 00:27:57.160
<v Speaker 2>proof is on the prosecution to prove her guilt all

469
00:27:57.200 --> 00:27:59.799
<v Speaker 2>the elements of the crime charge beyond a reasonable doubt.

470
00:28:00.000 --> 00:28:02.839
<v Speaker 2>It's important to realize that that the burden of proof

471
00:28:03.039 --> 00:28:05.440
<v Speaker 2>is on the government, and the government always has an

472
00:28:05.440 --> 00:28:08.799
<v Speaker 2>advantage in these cases because most people want to want

473
00:28:08.839 --> 00:28:10.759
<v Speaker 2>to believe what the government presents.

474
00:28:11.880 --> 00:28:12.000
<v Speaker 3>Right.

475
00:28:12.200 --> 00:28:15.240
<v Speaker 2>So we'll see, it's it's going to be however it

476
00:28:15.240 --> 00:28:18.240
<v Speaker 2>comes out. It's going to be interesting. I will say

477
00:28:18.319 --> 00:28:22.000
<v Speaker 2>right now, I have no idea how it would come out.

478
00:28:22.559 --> 00:28:24.920
<v Speaker 2>The only way that I think it comes out as

479
00:28:24.920 --> 00:28:28.880
<v Speaker 2>a guilty at any level. Is if the jury somehow,

480
00:28:28.920 --> 00:28:31.160
<v Speaker 2>out of all of the facts that are presented, comes

481
00:28:31.200 --> 00:28:35.079
<v Speaker 2>to this conclusion that there there was a mistake made

482
00:28:35.200 --> 00:28:39.279
<v Speaker 2>and she read the vehicle instead of going forwards, which

483
00:28:39.319 --> 00:28:42.119
<v Speaker 2>she thought the car was in drive, it went backwards.

484
00:28:43.039 --> 00:28:45.599
<v Speaker 8>I have none a quick question for you. Do you

485
00:28:45.759 --> 00:28:49.240
<v Speaker 8>think that this case will ever see the lighter day

486
00:28:49.359 --> 00:28:51.799
<v Speaker 8>in textbooks for all the lawyers to come.

487
00:28:54.720 --> 00:28:58.480
<v Speaker 2>I doubt it, to be honest with you, because I mean,

488
00:28:58.599 --> 00:29:02.200
<v Speaker 2>it could be taken up. But but well, these do

489
00:29:02.400 --> 00:29:06.000
<v Speaker 2>these cases do come along at different times in their

490
00:29:06.359 --> 00:29:10.119
<v Speaker 2>high profile cases. I can think of others in my

491
00:29:10.599 --> 00:29:15.640
<v Speaker 2>career as a as a reporter. Uh, the the Louise

492
00:29:15.680 --> 00:29:18.680
<v Speaker 2>Woodward case was a very interesting case. Do you remember

493
00:29:18.680 --> 00:29:21.680
<v Speaker 2>that was the woman who was in nanny who was

494
00:29:22.359 --> 00:29:25.160
<v Speaker 2>charged with killing one of the bab a child, a

495
00:29:25.319 --> 00:29:27.680
<v Speaker 2>baby that was in her care. So you get those

496
00:29:27.720 --> 00:29:32.440
<v Speaker 2>cases that are emotionally charged. I don't think the O. J.

497
00:29:32.599 --> 00:29:36.960
<v Speaker 2>Simpson case would be in a textbook, because that's that's

498
00:29:37.000 --> 00:29:38.559
<v Speaker 2>my thought. We'll see. I mean, there could be some

499
00:29:38.640 --> 00:29:42.039
<v Speaker 2>criminal lawyer who might try to use the case in

500
00:29:42.119 --> 00:29:46.319
<v Speaker 2>kind of a mood courts situation, I guess, but that's

501
00:29:46.480 --> 00:29:49.480
<v Speaker 2>we'll see. Hey, Donad, thank you for what you do

502
00:29:50.319 --> 00:29:52.839
<v Speaker 2>and thank you for listening to the show. Thank you

503
00:29:52.839 --> 00:30:00.160
<v Speaker 2>so much. Thank you, don I appreciate that home good Thanks.

504
00:30:00.480 --> 00:30:00.599
<v Speaker 5>Uh.

505
00:30:00.880 --> 00:30:03.200
<v Speaker 2>I cliped that a little bit early. I apologize. Six

506
00:30:03.240 --> 00:30:05.680
<v Speaker 2>one seven, two, five, four, ten thirty. We we got

507
00:30:05.680 --> 00:30:08.480
<v Speaker 2>a couple of lines open if you'd like your choice.

508
00:30:08.519 --> 00:30:11.079
<v Speaker 2>Six one seven nine three one ten thirty. I got

509
00:30:11.160 --> 00:30:14.400
<v Speaker 2>Christine and Karen. And I'm glad to have some female

510
00:30:14.480 --> 00:30:18.960
<v Speaker 2>voices on this because I think that, well, women may

511
00:30:18.960 --> 00:30:23.920
<v Speaker 2>have a different perspective. I think that that it. I

512
00:30:24.279 --> 00:30:26.799
<v Speaker 2>just think that that men and women might look at

513
00:30:26.799 --> 00:30:30.000
<v Speaker 2>one of these cases differently. That's not to say all

514
00:30:30.039 --> 00:30:32.720
<v Speaker 2>men and all women. But I'm interested with Karen has

515
00:30:32.759 --> 00:30:34.880
<v Speaker 2>to say. I think I know where she's coming from,

516
00:30:34.920 --> 00:30:37.240
<v Speaker 2>and I know where Christine is coming from. Uh, And

517
00:30:37.279 --> 00:30:39.119
<v Speaker 2>I'm looking forward to hearing from both of them and

518
00:30:39.200 --> 00:30:41.359
<v Speaker 2>maybe you if you want to call six one seven, two, five,

519
00:30:41.400 --> 00:30:44.359
<v Speaker 2>four ten thirty. Six one seven, nine three one ten thirty,

520
00:30:44.400 --> 00:30:45.799
<v Speaker 2>we'll be right back on Night Side.

521
00:30:46.279 --> 00:30:50.960
<v Speaker 1>It's Night Side with Dan Ray Boston's news Radio.

522
00:30:53.079 --> 00:30:54.759
<v Speaker 2>All right, let's get to the Phone's going to go

523
00:30:54.759 --> 00:30:57.920
<v Speaker 2>to Christine in Denim. Christine, I know how you feel

524
00:30:57.960 --> 00:31:00.000
<v Speaker 2>about this case. Tell us why go right ahead?

525
00:31:01.599 --> 00:31:04.119
<v Speaker 9>Well, I was like that play game Prey today and

526
00:31:04.759 --> 00:31:07.839
<v Speaker 9>we thought, we thought afterwards that everybody would be there

527
00:31:07.960 --> 00:31:11.880
<v Speaker 9>after the court here, but nobody showed up. Everybody was

528
00:31:11.880 --> 00:31:15.279
<v Speaker 9>saying this first time I heard this, that he had

529
00:31:16.480 --> 00:31:20.039
<v Speaker 9>fight moks on his arms and his neck and prime

530
00:31:20.119 --> 00:31:22.759
<v Speaker 9>mops on his arms and neck like he said that.

531
00:31:22.839 --> 00:31:24.839
<v Speaker 9>They said the dog could have killed him with his

532
00:31:25.359 --> 00:31:28.480
<v Speaker 9>bite on his neck, could have he could have been

533
00:31:30.759 --> 00:31:33.680
<v Speaker 9>bitten so badly that he could have died instantly and

534
00:31:33.960 --> 00:31:37.799
<v Speaker 9>been brought outside. I don't know.

535
00:31:38.480 --> 00:31:44.640
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, uh, I guess that's another theory. Uh but yeah,

536
00:31:44.839 --> 00:31:48.799
<v Speaker 2>I think it's that. It's a theory and uh uh,

537
00:31:48.960 --> 00:31:51.880
<v Speaker 2>it's just it's a tragedy all around one. One person

538
00:31:51.960 --> 00:31:56.319
<v Speaker 2>is dead, another person's life has been really uh in

539
00:31:56.759 --> 00:32:01.200
<v Speaker 2>limbo on hold for three years. Even if she's acquitted,

540
00:32:01.319 --> 00:32:02.960
<v Speaker 2>how does she recover? I don't know.

541
00:32:03.079 --> 00:32:06.279
<v Speaker 9>I mean, I feel bad, so bad to his family

542
00:32:06.359 --> 00:32:09.559
<v Speaker 9>and to her family. It's it's terrible for them to

543
00:32:09.640 --> 00:32:12.319
<v Speaker 9>be going through all of this, you know. And that's

544
00:32:12.400 --> 00:32:14.920
<v Speaker 9>you know what they were saying too. I never heard this,

545
00:32:15.640 --> 00:32:18.599
<v Speaker 9>they were saying. I hate to say that they found

546
00:32:18.640 --> 00:32:21.440
<v Speaker 9>a piece of hair on the tail light and that

547
00:32:21.519 --> 00:32:22.920
<v Speaker 9>have belonged to his nephew.

548
00:32:23.279 --> 00:32:23.960
<v Speaker 4>How can that be?

549
00:32:25.599 --> 00:32:29.119
<v Speaker 2>I have no idea. You know, there's a lot of

550
00:32:29.160 --> 00:32:35.759
<v Speaker 2>stuff you hear. Okay, okay, yeah, there's there's just a

551
00:32:35.799 --> 00:32:38.319
<v Speaker 2>lot of stuff that you hear and you don't know

552
00:32:38.359 --> 00:32:42.039
<v Speaker 2>where it's from. So the jury in these cases, they

553
00:32:42.200 --> 00:32:48.880
<v Speaker 2>have to be uh that, they have to be careful

554
00:32:48.920 --> 00:32:52.000
<v Speaker 2>in what they're exposed to, and hopefully they make their

555
00:32:52.079 --> 00:32:54.839
<v Speaker 2>decision based upon what they heard.

556
00:32:55.039 --> 00:32:58.160
<v Speaker 9>I hope, I hope they take their time with us.

557
00:32:59.720 --> 00:33:01.720
<v Speaker 2>Well, that's what the judge told them to do. The

558
00:33:01.799 --> 00:33:04.920
<v Speaker 2>judge said, don't rush a decision. We'll see. It could

559
00:33:04.920 --> 00:33:06.799
<v Speaker 2>be a few it could be a good days.

560
00:33:07.599 --> 00:33:10.480
<v Speaker 9>How come they work cats for the weekend? Like why

561
00:33:10.599 --> 00:33:13.240
<v Speaker 9>they should have been kept? So they don't What if

562
00:33:13.240 --> 00:33:14.519
<v Speaker 9>they go home and talk about it?

563
00:33:14.599 --> 00:33:17.519
<v Speaker 2>I mean, well, they're they're they're told frequently in court

564
00:33:17.559 --> 00:33:19.759
<v Speaker 2>in a case like this, not to discuss it with anyone,

565
00:33:19.799 --> 00:33:22.640
<v Speaker 2>not to read newspaper stories, not to listen to talk

566
00:33:22.720 --> 00:33:27.359
<v Speaker 2>radio shows, not to uh not to watch even television news.

567
00:33:27.599 --> 00:33:32.000
<v Speaker 9>Uh so uh, everybody knows, I.

568
00:33:31.920 --> 00:33:37.920
<v Speaker 2>Mean, but yours take their take their responsibility seriously. Thank goodness.

569
00:33:38.319 --> 00:33:41.279
<v Speaker 2>Christine has always thank you so much, appreciate your calls

570
00:33:41.480 --> 00:33:46.160
<v Speaker 2>and we will talk to thank Christine. I really appreciate it.

571
00:33:46.200 --> 00:33:48.519
<v Speaker 2>Thank you much. Have a great one. Let me go

572
00:33:48.599 --> 00:33:51.400
<v Speaker 2>to Karen in Watertown. Karen, welcome back. How are you?

573
00:33:52.960 --> 00:33:56.000
<v Speaker 10>Andrew well? Thonk you and you're well?

574
00:33:56.039 --> 00:33:57.839
<v Speaker 3>Tour tickets Yep.

575
00:33:58.319 --> 00:34:01.480
<v Speaker 2>I'm kind of a tough day, uh in the in

576
00:34:01.559 --> 00:34:05.559
<v Speaker 2>the business here of I'm not good at migrating information

577
00:34:05.640 --> 00:34:08.760
<v Speaker 2>from one computer to another computer. But that's the story

578
00:34:08.800 --> 00:34:12.360
<v Speaker 2>that that I've shared with Rob in detail, but I'm

579
00:34:12.360 --> 00:34:13.320
<v Speaker 2>not going to talk about that one.

580
00:34:13.400 --> 00:34:19.480
<v Speaker 10>Probably I heard Alan Jackson his complete closing argument. I

581
00:34:19.519 --> 00:34:23.199
<v Speaker 10>had to leave to go to work during prank Brennan's

582
00:34:23.320 --> 00:34:26.079
<v Speaker 10>but I've got most of it, and that was both

583
00:34:26.119 --> 00:34:28.440
<v Speaker 10>of both of them did a great job. And so

584
00:34:28.480 --> 00:34:31.000
<v Speaker 10>I thought after Alan Jackson, I was like, oh my god, like,

585
00:34:31.360 --> 00:34:35.440
<v Speaker 10>how to thank Brandon accounted this? And he did, And

586
00:34:35.599 --> 00:34:37.920
<v Speaker 10>you said you weren't really like wrapped up in this

587
00:34:38.360 --> 00:34:39.519
<v Speaker 10>I am.

588
00:34:39.880 --> 00:34:42.920
<v Speaker 2>I don't know. We've talked before. Yeah, that's why That's

589
00:34:42.960 --> 00:34:44.840
<v Speaker 2>why I'm so happy you go ahead.

590
00:34:45.639 --> 00:34:51.000
<v Speaker 10>When Carol went to johnal Keith's mother, I mean emotional,

591
00:34:51.639 --> 00:34:59.159
<v Speaker 10>she lost her son yep, and Karen Reid really self

592
00:34:59.239 --> 00:35:03.159
<v Speaker 10>indicted her. She in tired herself when she agreed to

593
00:35:03.199 --> 00:35:07.480
<v Speaker 10>all these interviews. I think that's probably going to be

594
00:35:09.360 --> 00:35:14.039
<v Speaker 10>her undoing. Let me ask you, I'm not sure you know,

595
00:35:15.679 --> 00:35:16.400
<v Speaker 10>really to.

596
00:35:16.360 --> 00:35:19.400
<v Speaker 2>Ask you a question. Have have you changed your view

597
00:35:20.719 --> 00:35:24.920
<v Speaker 2>during during the case. I thought, for some.

598
00:35:24.800 --> 00:35:31.400
<v Speaker 10>Reason, I've been following this case from the very beginning

599
00:35:32.199 --> 00:35:35.239
<v Speaker 10>when she was when Karen Reid was jailed, and I

600
00:35:35.239 --> 00:35:39.840
<v Speaker 10>thought she probably an alcoholic blackout to around what you did.

601
00:35:40.840 --> 00:35:46.679
<v Speaker 10>But Brennan didn't go there when because she start of uh,

602
00:35:46.920 --> 00:35:50.599
<v Speaker 10>he started mentioning all the pup when she was mentioning

603
00:35:50.599 --> 00:35:53.840
<v Speaker 10>all the possibilities about oh what maybe it was the

604
00:35:53.920 --> 00:35:55.039
<v Speaker 10>snow plow, maybe.

605
00:35:54.880 --> 00:35:55.360
<v Speaker 5>It was this, and.

606
00:35:57.599 --> 00:35:59.559
<v Speaker 10>She was inconsistent and what she said.

607
00:36:03.639 --> 00:36:07.159
<v Speaker 2>You you mentioned the closing arguments, and I now have

608
00:36:07.960 --> 00:36:09.920
<v Speaker 2>a little bit of sound from each of them. I

609
00:36:10.000 --> 00:36:13.599
<v Speaker 2>just want to play a little sound from both the

610
00:36:13.639 --> 00:36:16.960
<v Speaker 2>prosecutor and the defense lawyer. Let me let me start

611
00:36:17.000 --> 00:36:20.840
<v Speaker 2>off with the defense lawyer, Alan Jackson. Okay, So let's

612
00:36:21.039 --> 00:36:23.400
<v Speaker 2>I'm trying to look at these very quickly here and

613
00:36:23.800 --> 00:36:26.000
<v Speaker 2>see which one I want to I want to play

614
00:36:28.000 --> 00:36:33.199
<v Speaker 2>and want it to be Okay, let's let's he's his emphasis. Obviously,

615
00:36:33.239 --> 00:36:36.639
<v Speaker 2>as any good defense lawyer is on reasonable doubt, this

616
00:36:36.679 --> 00:36:42.320
<v Speaker 2>has cut number four. Run Can you play four?

617
00:36:42.599 --> 00:36:45.559
<v Speaker 11>Before we examine the evidence in the case, which we

618
00:36:45.599 --> 00:36:48.599
<v Speaker 11>will do, we need to understand the very foundation of

619
00:36:48.679 --> 00:36:52.719
<v Speaker 11>the entire system of justice in which we operate, the

620
00:36:52.760 --> 00:36:57.639
<v Speaker 11>bedrock on which this entire system is built reasonable doubt.

621
00:36:58.920 --> 00:37:01.320
<v Speaker 11>This isn't just a technical and it's not a slogan.

622
00:37:01.679 --> 00:37:05.880
<v Speaker 11>It's a constitutional shield that protects the innocent and prevents

623
00:37:05.880 --> 00:37:11.000
<v Speaker 11>the government from punishing without proof. The Commonwealth has the

624
00:37:11.119 --> 00:37:14.320
<v Speaker 11>high burden to prove every single element of every single

625
00:37:14.400 --> 00:37:18.400
<v Speaker 11>charge beyond a reasonable doubt and to a moral certainty.

626
00:37:19.320 --> 00:37:21.239
<v Speaker 11>As I said, those powerful words are not just some

627
00:37:21.480 --> 00:37:26.519
<v Speaker 11>legal jargon. They're your mandate, they're your obligation, they're your

628
00:37:26.519 --> 00:37:29.679
<v Speaker 11>community's protection against injustice.

629
00:37:31.039 --> 00:37:36.199
<v Speaker 2>So Dr Karen, that's just a snippet.

630
00:37:39.760 --> 00:37:42.599
<v Speaker 10>County, Okay.

631
00:37:42.679 --> 00:37:44.320
<v Speaker 2>I want you to react to that, and then I

632
00:37:44.320 --> 00:37:46.679
<v Speaker 2>want to play one sound bye from Hank Brennan. Go ahead,

633
00:37:46.880 --> 00:37:50.519
<v Speaker 2>you react to that's a pretty compelling argument that they

634
00:37:50.559 --> 00:37:53.119
<v Speaker 2>can be made in any case, But on a case

635
00:37:53.199 --> 00:37:56.559
<v Speaker 2>like this, where it's not a slam dunk, it becomes

636
00:37:56.559 --> 00:38:00.280
<v Speaker 2>even more compelling your comment, So.

637
00:38:00.360 --> 00:38:04.960
<v Speaker 10>Go ahead about Adam Jackson's. Yeah, he was really convincing,

638
00:38:05.639 --> 00:38:11.000
<v Speaker 10>and I thought, holy cow, how is Hank brand Gold

639
00:38:11.800 --> 00:38:12.840
<v Speaker 10>you know, react to this?

640
00:38:13.159 --> 00:38:15.559
<v Speaker 2>Okay, then let's do this. I just happened to have.

641
00:38:16.079 --> 00:38:20.440
<v Speaker 2>I just happened to have. This was forty seven seconds.

642
00:38:20.480 --> 00:38:23.039
<v Speaker 2>I'm trying to be fair. The Hank Brennan sound by

643
00:38:23.159 --> 00:38:27.119
<v Speaker 2>his forty six seconds. So let's see. You can compare.

644
00:38:27.239 --> 00:38:30.199
<v Speaker 2>You can respond to both of these. This is cut

645
00:38:30.280 --> 00:38:33.679
<v Speaker 2>number nine. Rock the prosecutor in this case, Hank Brennan.

646
00:38:34.079 --> 00:38:41.360
<v Speaker 12>We have inevitably, without any doubt, without any doubt, that

647
00:38:41.559 --> 00:38:46.280
<v Speaker 12>on January twenty nine, twenty twenty two, miss Reid was

648
00:38:46.320 --> 00:38:50.960
<v Speaker 12>with mister Keith and she got drunk. She drank, She

649
00:38:51.119 --> 00:38:54.199
<v Speaker 12>was two to three times over the legal limit, and

650
00:38:54.239 --> 00:38:57.519
<v Speaker 12>they went to a party and after party and they

651
00:38:57.519 --> 00:38:58.079
<v Speaker 12>were fighting.

652
00:38:58.840 --> 00:39:02.840
<v Speaker 13>They were fighting. It was a relationship and decline and you.

653
00:39:02.880 --> 00:39:06.159
<v Speaker 12>Get out of the car. A had a brief window

654
00:39:06.199 --> 00:39:06.920
<v Speaker 12>of life left.

655
00:39:08.360 --> 00:39:12.880
<v Speaker 13>Oh when he got out and she drove away, she

656
00:39:12.920 --> 00:39:18.159
<v Speaker 13>couldn't let it go. She get drunk, she hit him.

657
00:39:18.519 --> 00:39:19.440
<v Speaker 13>She left them to die.

658
00:39:19.559 --> 00:39:26.159
<v Speaker 2>It's that simple, Okay. I think that is the essence

659
00:39:26.280 --> 00:39:29.639
<v Speaker 2>of both of these arguments when you cut away all

660
00:39:29.679 --> 00:39:34.760
<v Speaker 2>of the specifics. I think that's essentially those are two

661
00:39:34.800 --> 00:39:39.880
<v Speaker 2>good comparative sound bites. You listen to one, you think, oh,

662
00:39:40.039 --> 00:39:43.559
<v Speaker 2>I tend to agree with the defense lawyer. Then you

663
00:39:43.679 --> 00:39:45.920
<v Speaker 2>listen to the prosecutor, and maybe it pulls you over.

664
00:39:46.599 --> 00:39:49.679
<v Speaker 2>What do you think that you're always going to do? Oh,

665
00:39:51.559 --> 00:39:53.639
<v Speaker 2>you didn't expect me to ask me questions?

666
00:39:55.440 --> 00:40:00.079
<v Speaker 10>Apparently, Dan, I'm just following this, like, really.

667
00:40:00.920 --> 00:40:02.039
<v Speaker 2>Well, who better to ask?

668
00:40:03.360 --> 00:40:08.280
<v Speaker 10>They're apparently a very young jury. You know, these are

669
00:40:08.320 --> 00:40:11.599
<v Speaker 10>people who didn't know anything about this case beforehand, so

670
00:40:11.599 --> 00:40:16.519
<v Speaker 10>they're not super well informed people. But apparently they're right.

671
00:40:18.920 --> 00:40:19.639
<v Speaker 10>I have no idea.

672
00:40:20.639 --> 00:40:23.400
<v Speaker 2>Okay, that's my position. I have no idea what the

673
00:40:23.480 --> 00:40:25.920
<v Speaker 2>jury is going to do either, even though you you

674
00:40:26.079 --> 00:40:29.639
<v Speaker 2>had the advantage over me, Karen that you listened to

675
00:40:29.719 --> 00:40:33.559
<v Speaker 2>both trials, uh, And I just I hope the jury

676
00:40:34.480 --> 00:40:37.400
<v Speaker 2>gets can resolve the issues, can come to an agreement

677
00:40:37.559 --> 00:40:41.199
<v Speaker 2>either of a guilt on some charge or charges, or

678
00:40:41.880 --> 00:40:45.960
<v Speaker 2>a complete innocence not guilty across the board. Because I

679
00:40:46.000 --> 00:40:48.320
<v Speaker 2>don't think that most of us can stand a third

680
00:40:48.480 --> 00:40:50.199
<v Speaker 2>trial in this case.

681
00:40:50.360 --> 00:40:53.559
<v Speaker 10>We have to get on with the understand that and

682
00:40:53.840 --> 00:40:56.519
<v Speaker 10>that's what I think is being lost. You know, there's

683
00:40:56.559 --> 00:40:59.800
<v Speaker 10>this all this wearing pink and the whole you know,

684
00:41:00.119 --> 00:41:04.039
<v Speaker 10>we said work Kiara read, she's attractive, particulate.

685
00:41:05.400 --> 00:41:08.199
<v Speaker 14>She was a college she was a college for I'm

686
00:41:08.239 --> 00:41:14.400
<v Speaker 14>going to sound really obnoxious, really bold, but if the

687
00:41:14.440 --> 00:41:19.239
<v Speaker 14>defendant were black or hispanic, there would not be any

688
00:41:19.280 --> 00:41:20.199
<v Speaker 14>of this going on.

689
00:41:21.519 --> 00:41:24.400
<v Speaker 10>She's a white, attractive, wealthy woman.

690
00:41:25.360 --> 00:41:27.639
<v Speaker 2>Well, she maybe may have been wealthy when she started,

691
00:41:27.639 --> 00:41:28.960
<v Speaker 2>but I don't think she's wealthy now.

692
00:41:28.960 --> 00:41:29.320
<v Speaker 3>No, I know.

693
00:41:29.880 --> 00:41:35.360
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, okay, so so so last comment, and I only

694
00:41:35.400 --> 00:41:39.559
<v Speaker 2>have about thirty seconds left. I don't think you want

695
00:41:39.559 --> 00:41:42.320
<v Speaker 2>to take a stab at it. But you listen to

696
00:41:42.360 --> 00:41:45.079
<v Speaker 2>the closes. You tell me you follow the case twice,

697
00:41:45.760 --> 00:41:52.599
<v Speaker 2>both both trials. You're you're you're still not convinced one

698
00:41:52.599 --> 00:41:54.360
<v Speaker 2>way or the other. It sounds to me that's like

699
00:41:54.400 --> 00:41:54.920
<v Speaker 2>what you're saying.

700
00:41:54.960 --> 00:41:58.320
<v Speaker 10>You know what I'm gonna really candid. I told my

701
00:41:58.360 --> 00:42:01.840
<v Speaker 10>boyfriend last night, I said, I have this manifestations vision

702
00:42:02.440 --> 00:42:07.199
<v Speaker 10>that you've been taken away with handcuffs. Okay, and I'm

703
00:42:07.320 --> 00:42:10.880
<v Speaker 10>going with that because I believe that is the most

704
00:42:12.280 --> 00:42:17.079
<v Speaker 10>that we'll give the justice for John CU's Fanley Okay.

705
00:42:17.280 --> 00:42:19.960
<v Speaker 2>We'll leave it at that. We'll see what happens. Karen

706
00:42:20.079 --> 00:42:23.960
<v Speaker 2>is always great to hear your voice. It is drama,

707
00:42:24.039 --> 00:42:28.159
<v Speaker 2>there's no doubt. Thanks Karen. Okay, good night. All right,

708
00:42:28.199 --> 00:42:31.920
<v Speaker 2>so we end the week on a dramatic note. However, however,

709
00:42:31.960 --> 00:42:34.039
<v Speaker 2>we have one more hour left and I want to

710
00:42:34.039 --> 00:42:36.159
<v Speaker 2>take this next hour and I want to give you

711
00:42:36.199 --> 00:42:42.039
<v Speaker 2>an opportunity to salute your favorite father who's either still

712
00:42:42.079 --> 00:42:45.280
<v Speaker 2>with us or has passed on. And it can be

713
00:42:45.400 --> 00:42:47.599
<v Speaker 2>a variety of people. Could be your father, could be

714
00:42:47.639 --> 00:42:51.679
<v Speaker 2>your father in law, could be your grandfather, could be

715
00:42:51.719 --> 00:42:55.960
<v Speaker 2>an uncle, but your favorite father. That's what we're going

716
00:42:56.039 --> 00:42:58.519
<v Speaker 2>to talk about in the next hour, and we're going

717
00:42:58.599 --> 00:43:00.880
<v Speaker 2>to kind of take the temperature down a little bit

718
00:43:01.440 --> 00:43:04.360
<v Speaker 2>and finish the week and slide into the weekend. My

719
00:43:04.519 --> 00:43:07.440
<v Speaker 2>name's Dan Ray. This is Nightside. You have the phone numbers,

720
00:43:07.800 --> 00:43:09.599
<v Speaker 2>dial away coming back right after this