Speaker 1: Cass smashed Saints. What's going on? Huddersfield lost again? Are
Speaker 1: they well and truly gone? Okay? Are beat Wiggans? Youth side?
Speaker 1: Cartwright has turned the Catalans tied? All left see you
Speaker 1: in a world of pain to lose lost to waki
Speaker 1: a close one again. Welcome to the twenty third episode
Speaker 1: of Super League three sixty, a podcast primarily designed to
Speaker 1: allow me to show off that I can do some
Speaker 1: rhymes at the start of every week.
Speaker 2: My name is Lee Addison and my name is John Davison.
Speaker 2: I think the question is when is your next poetry
Speaker 2: book coming out?
Speaker 1: That's right, that's right, the poet Lee Addison, the new
Speaker 1: poet laureate. I'm a coach in Australia. Johnna journo in
Speaker 1: the UK. He's got an Aussie accent. I've got an
Speaker 1: English accent. Working out for yourselves. Take the table after
Speaker 1: twelve rounds. There's a new team on top of the
Speaker 1: Super League every week, isn't they, John Lee, Rhino's the
Speaker 1: top now They've played twelve and there on eighteen points.
Speaker 1: Warrington in second on eighteen and Saint Helen's in third
Speaker 1: on eighteen. Yet Warrington have played one less game, so
Speaker 1: to me, it just seems like those three are rotating
Speaker 1: who's at top at the top of the table each week.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I think there's the change apart from
Speaker 2: that would be you know, whole Care and Lea kind
Speaker 2: of on the march, aren't they. And I think I
Speaker 2: think Wakefield are a bit too. But I think, as
Speaker 2: we said last week, the top six apart from Lee,
Speaker 2: I don't think the top six is going to change,
Speaker 2: and it'll obviously change who's sitting where and you know
Speaker 2: the League Leaders Shield or the minor premiership in your
Speaker 2: coincident surroundings. Yeah, I think that that could change. But yeah,
Speaker 2: it'll be interesting to see what the impact Wigan, I
Speaker 2: don't want to say throwing the game against and that's
Speaker 2: probably a bit hard fielding a team which meant they
Speaker 2: had no chance of winning, perhaps.
Speaker 1: Even Leeds big win against Field this weekend has meant
Speaker 1: their points differential has jumped significantly higher than Warrington's, but
Speaker 1: like I said, Warrington played one less game. Saint Helen's
Speaker 1: points differential is only thirty eight, so they're well behind
Speaker 1: the other two. Hull KR are in fourth on sixteen.
Speaker 1: Wakefield Trinity in Wakefield Trinity are in fifth on sixteen.
Speaker 2: They're doing really well. Wigan in sixth.
Speaker 1: It's six playoff spots, that's right, yes, so Wigan are
Speaker 1: in the playoff spots on fourteen. Lee Leopards are on
Speaker 1: twelve in seventh. Catalans are also on twelve, but they're
Speaker 1: in eighth. Cast Tigers on ten in ninth place, Hull
Speaker 1: left c on eight in tenth place. Bradford Bulls are
Speaker 1: with them on eight points but they're in eleventh. York
Speaker 1: Night and Toulouse are on six points in twelfth and
Speaker 1: thirteenth respectively. And propping everybody up is Huddersfield Giants. Lee's
Speaker 1: laugh this week? Have you noticed John on YouTube and
Speaker 1: on some websites as well, how the word emotional is
Speaker 1: overused so you'll click on you know, there'll be something
Speaker 1: that they want you to click on. It will say
Speaker 1: John Davidson's emotional in capital letters, tiraid about whatever it
Speaker 1: may be. So I want everybody over the next seven
Speaker 1: days to look out for the clickbait the word emotional.
Speaker 1: So the reason this has come to my mind is
Speaker 1: woken up this morning. Obviously I knew that city the
Speaker 1: city played today, so I checked it was Pep Guardiola's
Speaker 1: last game, and the first thing I saw on youtubeer
Speaker 1: was Pep Guardiola's emotional in capital letters speech, and then
Speaker 1: it was Most Salar's emotional speech as he's leaving Liverpool
Speaker 1: and so on and so forth. So yeah, I think
Speaker 1: I've seen it three times already. This morning Rugby League
Speaker 1: tweet of the week Adam West, fresh from his Batman costume, said,
Speaker 1: people in rugby league complain about a lack of exposure
Speaker 1: in the media, then serve up this ship show in
Speaker 1: what will be one of the marquee fixtures of the season.
Speaker 1: We don't help ourselves as a sports sometimes. Johnny's tweet
Speaker 1: of the week first grade against the undred nineteen side
Speaker 1: Johnny's jab please.
Speaker 2: Yeah, we're obviously talking about the whole how we can
Speaker 2: go on Thursday night. I'm glad we didn't do an
Speaker 2: after the hoodo because that was it was a farce.
Speaker 2: It was embarrassing. Now there are a few elements to it.
Speaker 2: I think it's fair for every coach to pick, you know,
Speaker 2: what team I want to pick, and the fact that
Speaker 2: Wembley is what five six days away now, you know,
Speaker 2: I think I think Wigan were burnt two years ago
Speaker 2: when they lost Kieran and Tyler dupri to disciplinary points
Speaker 2: miss Wembley and who.
Speaker 1: Knows didn't heal k I get some injuries as well
Speaker 1: from yeah.
Speaker 2: They've got some knocks. I don't know how serious they
Speaker 2: are as we record, but yeah, but I think they were.
Speaker 2: There's also who knows what players are playing with injury
Speaker 2: because we know pretty much nearly every game they'll be
Speaker 2: players who are playing with injuries. They're rarely ever one
Speaker 2: hundred percent fit, are they? Lee? You know that as
Speaker 2: a coach. But the thing is, when this this ficture
Speaker 2: was scheduled, it could have been scheduled at round one,
Speaker 2: round two, round three, round twenty seven. Why schedule it
Speaker 2: a week before the Challenge Cup? Fine? And when it
Speaker 2: was I was told this the other day when it
Speaker 2: was scheduled, both clubs, Whole Can Wiggan flagged with the
Speaker 2: raphon So so why you know this isn't great scheduling but
Speaker 2: they never changed it. So yeah, it's just it's an
Speaker 2: own goal. Got It's absolutely stupid. And the thing is
Speaker 2: a lot of people are hating on Wigant and I
Speaker 2: get that because Salford it wasn't the same situation, but
Speaker 2: last year they fielded an under eight inside as a
Speaker 2: bit of a two fingers to the RFL and they
Speaker 2: got flogged by Sen Helens. I think it was only
Speaker 2: two nil and they got a massive fine. So you
Speaker 2: know why, why is there not a similaration?
Speaker 1: Why kangaroo kangaroo court? So yeah, so there's there's two
Speaker 1: elements to this. Number One, the Rugby Football League don't
Speaker 1: have enough checks and balances to make sure that teams
Speaker 1: put in in theory they're their best players. Now why
Speaker 1: why is this important? It's important because people have season tickets.
Speaker 1: It's important because there's broadcasters, it's important sponsors, it's important
Speaker 1: because of the betting markets, and it's it's not rocket
Speaker 1: science to ask every squad to name their top twenty
Speaker 1: and they're the starred players, and you've got to play
Speaker 1: as many of these starred players as possible in every fixture.
Speaker 1: That's one way of going about it, right. So if
Speaker 1: you don't have that check and balance in place, and
Speaker 1: that means coaches can pick whatever side they want and
Speaker 1: therefore I assume those checks and balances aren't in place.
Speaker 1: That's why Salford we were hit with a fine last
Speaker 1: year and therefore everyone can legitimately ask, well, why we're
Speaker 1: going to hit with a fine Well, that makes it
Speaker 1: sound to me like they're just making it up as
Speaker 1: they go along. So Wigan are perfectly entitled, as far
Speaker 1: as I know, to pick the side that they want.
Speaker 1: The absolute blame completely goes on the doorstep of the
Speaker 1: Rugby Football League here. So Wigan and hu k Are
Speaker 1: have competed in the last two Super League Grand finals.
Speaker 1: Juk Are were in the last Challenge Cup final, Wigan
Speaker 1: were in the Challenge Cup final the final before and
Speaker 1: guess who's playing each other.
Speaker 2: In the next one now?
Speaker 1: And even that, Yeah, even somebody with a surface knowledge
Speaker 1: of rugby league who's been watching the game for maybe
Speaker 1: the last year and a bit would be able to
Speaker 1: put that together and they'd look at the ficture list,
Speaker 1: and especially when the two clubs are going, hang on
Speaker 1: a minute, this is a problem. It's just ridiculous. It's
Speaker 1: absolutely ridiculous and and shame on, shame on the RFL.
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, I'm sorry.
Speaker 2: Another issue, another issue lead is that we're going to
Speaker 2: go to Paris a week after Wembley, so there's going
Speaker 2: to be an effected and I think they've already sold
Speaker 2: five thousand odd tickets for Paris whatever, So there's going
Speaker 2: to be an impact on the Wembley attendance as well
Speaker 2: because you particularly well off, you can't afford down to
Speaker 2: go down to London for a game or for a
Speaker 2: weekend and then the next week fly over to Paris.
Speaker 2: Like I was in Paris a couple of weeks ago.
Speaker 2: It's not a cheap place to go. How did the
Speaker 2: Paris one come about? Was that organized by the club?
Speaker 2: In the RFL? That the Paris was organized by Wigan
Speaker 2: and Catlands because it celebrates twenty years since cal and
Speaker 2: Dragons were founded and also thirty years since the first
Speaker 2: game in Super League, which was Paris v Sheffield, But
Speaker 2: it was determined before the Wembley date was set. Now
Speaker 2: the thing is, look, if we're can win, if Mani
Speaker 2: Peter can go, well, I was justified resting on those players.
Speaker 2: If they don't win, he's probably going to cop a
Speaker 2: bit more. But it's just as you said, we didn't
Speaker 2: have to have this game a week before Wembley. We
Speaker 2: could have had Wigan v Bradford, York v Whole KR,
Speaker 2: Saint Helen's v Toulouse. Do you know what I mean,
Speaker 2: any you know understandable likely fixtures of teams that may
Speaker 2: have been playing at Wembley and it's not that hard
Speaker 2: to work. Yeah, who was likely to be at Wembleyne
Speaker 2: who wasn't? Well?
Speaker 1: I mean the chances of Bradford or York being there
Speaker 1: are very remote. So yeah, Dick, interesting question, he said,
Speaker 1: what do you andly think about throwing a bunch of
Speaker 1: kids in against grown men? Wigan lads did well against
Speaker 1: KR but will that damage them? I'm genuinely interesting how
Speaker 1: that damages them or makes them better? So I suppose
Speaker 1: that leans towards me as a as a from a
Speaker 1: coaching perspective. The look, Gareth, it won't do them any
Speaker 1: harm because it was gang mentality. Nobody was on their own.
Speaker 1: It wasn't one kid, one kid just being thrown in
Speaker 1: on their own to be exposed in the middle or
Speaker 1: on a wing or something like that. So it was
Speaker 1: gang mentality. They're all being put in together. Also, it
Speaker 1: depends very much on the individual, so it's a case
Speaker 1: by case basis. Some players take to first grade rugby
Speaker 1: league like ducks to water. Remember watching Philip Sammy graduate
Speaker 1: from my academy and make his NRL debut and in
Speaker 1: his first game, you know he plays for the Titans. Now,
Speaker 1: in his first game he looked like he played one
Speaker 1: hundred NRL games, just because that's his mentality. He doesn't
Speaker 1: overanalyze things.
Speaker 2: Whatnot.
Speaker 1: Ronaldo Mullatalo, who's arguably a far better footballer, when he
Speaker 1: played his first game, he was error strewn because he's
Speaker 1: all action and would overthink it, et cetera, et cetera.
Speaker 1: So every player is different. So quite frankly, I think
Speaker 1: the Wigan lads would have got together and really pulled
Speaker 1: together and thought, we've got nothing to lose here, let's
Speaker 1: go out and make a name for ourselves. And then
Speaker 1: we were also asked how important Wiggans Academy is to
Speaker 1: rugby league in the UK, considering the players it produces
Speaker 1: for Wigans, Super League, the Championship, then Reland occasionally will
Speaker 1: be Union. I'll throw that to you, John, I think
Speaker 1: that was Gareth as well.
Speaker 2: I think yeah, I mean it's it's a very important
Speaker 2: Kada because they are, you know, huge producers of talent.
Speaker 2: I think they're the most prolific in the country. By
Speaker 2: aw I mean you look just look away from where
Speaker 2: you look at the other clubs and you go, okay, Lee,
Speaker 2: they've got your minor Hanley, They've got Josh Charley, They've
Speaker 2: got Jack Hughes. You know. At Warrengon the've got Sam
Speaker 2: Powell and I think there's some other o Liam Byrne.
Speaker 2: You know. Leeds have got James McDonald, whole k Are
Speaker 2: have got three, they've got Oliver Gildert, they've got Joe
Speaker 2: Burgess and they've got there's another one of Tom Davies,
Speaker 2: you know. So it is yeah, but the thing is
Speaker 2: in just jumping back to what your previous comment, I
Speaker 2: don't think it's usual normal to blood ten youngsters in
Speaker 2: a seventeen like I think there was eight in the
Speaker 2: first team and then another two on the bench, and
Speaker 2: the fact lead that they were so young that two
Speaker 2: of them could not actually have the sponsor the Toad,
Speaker 2: which is a bedding company on their shirts because they
Speaker 2: weren't legally old enough to allow to have. I mean,
Speaker 2: I can't remember when that's happened before. I mean, that's yeah,
Speaker 2: it's just it's a really embarrassing look for the sport.
Speaker 2: Everyone knows it, and it pisces me off when you
Speaker 2: have Wigan fans who are trying to defend it because
Speaker 2: it's all about your club and whatever. It's not to
Speaker 2: do with an anti Wigan or pro Wigan thing. It's
Speaker 2: it was just a bad look for the sport. It
Speaker 2: doesn't matter if it was you know, Leads and Saint
Speaker 2: Helen's doing it, it doesn't matter who. It's just it was.
Speaker 2: Really it's a massive angal. I just I can't believe
Speaker 2: that that game wasn't rescheduled or moved to a different
Speaker 2: time when you know we could have done that.
Speaker 1: You did mention after the hooter before that will be
Speaker 1: back closer towards the end of the season, I'd say,
Speaker 1: because a lot of these games the gig you can
Speaker 1: tell the players are just clearly just trying to get
Speaker 1: through them. And that goes to me next question just
Speaker 1: before I get there, last question about the about the
Speaker 1: Wigan Academy was from just d on on x Simon
Speaker 1: Paul said, can we discuss if this is the poorest
Speaker 1: Super League season ever? Vast majority of games are dreadful,
Speaker 1: standard is low and lots of teams are awful. The
Speaker 1: damage this season is doing too Potential TV rights could
Speaker 1: cost us millions. Geez, the worm has turned in a
Speaker 1: few weeks, hasn't it. There's most people were telling us
Speaker 1: how great it was a few weeks back.
Speaker 2: Well heard. I heard some cheerleaders the other day saying
Speaker 2: we all knew that the playpool wasn't big enough what
Speaker 2: I was on I don't remember them saying that last
Speaker 2: year when I wrote that, you know not to say
Speaker 2: the old I told you so. But look, I don't
Speaker 2: know if it's the worst super League ever or I've
Speaker 2: not seen every season of super League. I've only been
Speaker 2: found it closely since twenty thirty and twenty four I
Speaker 2: know in twenty fourteen there were sporting teams and obviously
Speaker 2: it was cut after that and Bradford London that you
Speaker 2: were terrible particularly. But the thing is all the games
Speaker 2: are televised now. We haven't had that before, have we,
Speaker 2: So we haven't seen every game historically. But things are very,
Speaker 2: very stretch. I mean it has been in the last
Speaker 2: couple of weeks alone, it's been some absolutely dreadful games
Speaker 2: like Huddersfield's and Helen's Hull of C Bradford. There's just
Speaker 2: some really really I mean that Leeds Huddersfield game and
Speaker 2: we're going to talk about it later on. I wasn't
Speaker 2: out of the game, but I spoke to a couple
Speaker 2: of people who were in the stands and I've seen
Speaker 2: the headlights. Like Huddersfield, it's like they couldn't tackle, let
Speaker 2: alone catch the ball. Like it was just it was
Speaker 2: like Leeds were beating up, you know. Yeah, And it's
Speaker 2: not good for anyone, you know what I mean. It's
Speaker 2: not good for Leeds, it's not good for Hddersfield, it's
Speaker 2: not good for the sport. So yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 2: Do you think it's the worst. I don't. Yeah, I'm
Speaker 2: not trying to be I hate to tell.
Speaker 1: I'd hate to say to everyone we told you, soul,
Speaker 1: but myself and Johnny the intrepid journalist out there on
Speaker 1: the mean streets of sixty two England, we predicted this.
Speaker 1: We predicted this. That the fact there was fourteen teams,
Speaker 1: you're just spreading the talent based too thin. And it's
Speaker 1: not just purely a Super League thing. It's about the
Speaker 1: rugby league playerpool full stop. Because Australia have also expanded
Speaker 1: their competition and they're expanding it again and what we're
Speaker 1: seeing is more and more players going to the top
Speaker 1: echelon of the sport that possibly shouldn't be there. So
Speaker 1: we're robbing Peter to pay Paul. So we are taking
Speaker 1: players from our state based competitions in Australia to play
Speaker 1: in the Super League, and some of them are playing
Speaker 1: in the NRL too. Let's you know, let's not forget
Speaker 1: the Saint George LAWAA Dragons haven't won a game in
Speaker 1: fifteen matches and they're at the bottom of the NRL. Also,
Speaker 1: the best English players seem to be playing in the
Speaker 1: NRL too, So what you actually have in Super League
Speaker 1: is the best English players minus maybe the top ten,
Speaker 1: and then a load of state league players and some
Speaker 1: NRL x NRL players who are very much at the
Speaker 1: end of their careers. I mean, we're going to celebrate
Speaker 1: another signing this week who's ancient and this is just
Speaker 1: turning into a very easy competition quite frankly, for some
Speaker 1: players to make a quick quid.
Speaker 2: I think it's also important notly that next year, in
Speaker 2: a year after, it's going to be even worse because
Speaker 2: who's in the UK at the moment. The CEO of
Speaker 2: the Perth Bears and the general manager of P and
Speaker 2: G Chiefs, Michael Chamis and his recruitment manager, and they're
Speaker 2: not only signing English players who've already gone to Perth,
Speaker 2: but they're also signing P and G players are either
Speaker 2: at London or across Super League. And they're also signing
Speaker 2: Australian keyways players like Toby sext and whatever. So there's,
Speaker 2: as you said, like Australia's expanding, and naturally players are
Speaker 2: going to go where there's better opportunity, better money, so
Speaker 2: that's going to be another drag. So to expand at
Speaker 2: the same time without actually having more players is lunacy.
Speaker 1: Game day five two three on X said Huddersfield Giants
Speaker 1: surely their time is up and we had this as
Speaker 1: a news item too, So obviously, if we're looking at
Speaker 1: the future of the game with all this in mind,
Speaker 1: there's a couple of things we need to consider. London
Speaker 1: are going well in the division below and are clearly
Speaker 1: preparing and talking like a future Super League franchise, except
Speaker 1: now the noises are they've never had any assurances so
Speaker 1: on and so forth. But they're doing everything right from
Speaker 1: what we can see. Huddersfield from what we can and
Speaker 1: are probably doing everything wrong or not doing much right,
Speaker 1: and there's unleashed, yes, unleashed on the bottom of the ladder.
Speaker 1: And also there's some other teams slipping down that we'll
Speaker 1: talk about. So but the first one, the obvious one,
Speaker 1: is hard to field giants. So they're even below the
Speaker 1: newly promoted side.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, and they've been at least since what
Speaker 2: twenty twenty two, they've been struggling for kual Ho and
Speaker 2: before that, you know, after the Pool innocent era, they've
Speaker 2: been struggling. And to me they look like a championship
Speaker 2: team in disguise. The stadium. You know, they're not going
Speaker 2: to have a stadium soon. The crowds have gone absolutely nowhere.
Speaker 2: The coaching situation, Jim Lenna in his first game, they
Speaker 2: get beaten by fifty two points. So if you're him
Speaker 2: and he was the second choice Daniel holds, is he
Speaker 2: over already? Is it? Yes? That was his right last week.
Speaker 2: If you hear him, you're headingly on Friday night, like
Speaker 2: Jesus Christ, can I get the next flight back to
Speaker 2: the Gold Coast?
Speaker 1: Well gets where he's going to try and recruit players
Speaker 1: from well, exactly they need they need, they need to
Speaker 1: recruit plase.
Speaker 2: But look, the whole thing with London and look, London
Speaker 2: quietly for a while have been petitioning the other Super
Speaker 2: League clubs about a vote to have fifteen teams in
Speaker 2: Super League. Now I think most well some of us,
Speaker 2: I think you're probably the same. I'll speak for you here.
Speaker 2: I think some of us would say that's a bad idea. Now.
Speaker 2: I like what London had been doing this year. I
Speaker 2: like their plans. They're putting a lot of money in
Speaker 2: and I think they should come up in the Super League.
Speaker 2: But I think it should be the IMG criteria. Now,
Speaker 2: whether Huddersfield will be dropping an IMG points, you would
Speaker 2: think because the crowds are terrible, the performances are terrible.
Speaker 2: I don't think their social numbers are particularly good. But
Speaker 2: you can't guarante with the CIS and we have. You
Speaker 2: can't guarantee who's going down, can you. And I think
Speaker 2: it would be unfair for to lose York and it
Speaker 2: won't be Bradford, but Bradford as well, because they've just
Speaker 2: literally come out, particularly unfair on to loose and York
Speaker 2: because they've only got half the money. So I think
Speaker 2: going to fifteen would be would be a big, big,
Speaker 2: big mistake. But I do think with London what they're doing, like,
Speaker 2: how long are they supposed to you know, spend two
Speaker 2: million a year on players when they know the ceiling
Speaker 2: is already you know they're at the ceiling now, aren't
Speaker 2: they in the Championship? Yeah, I just I think moving
Speaker 2: to fifteen would be a mistake. But I think London
Speaker 2: deserved to go up, and I think it. Look Huddersfield,
Speaker 2: I think they've had a long crack at it many
Speaker 2: many years. We're not seeing any progress, any change, and
Speaker 2: I think it is time for them to drop out
Speaker 2: of the top of the vision.
Speaker 1: I've got a real ingenious way of deciding who goes
Speaker 1: down and who goes up. The team that finishes bottom
Speaker 1: of the Super League go down, and whoever wins the
Speaker 1: Championship goes up. You don't need to pay anythink tanks
Speaker 1: for that, by your rationale. So the drag this Georgia
Speaker 1: Laura Dragons will go down? Who who comes up with
Speaker 1: the burly Bears? Or we're talking about the English? We
Speaker 1: were talking about the English, but well, the thing is
Speaker 1: the difference in Australia is is actually some very financial
Speaker 1: teams underneath the NRL, and some of them are in
Speaker 1: better financial some of them are in better financial nick
Speaker 1: than some of the lower NRL the teams it seems so.
Speaker 2: New Town Jets.
Speaker 1: There's a few, I mean Cabra Matta for example, and
Speaker 1: some of the other league's clubs in Sydney, some of
Speaker 1: the clubs in Wollongong. There's plenty of clubs up here
Speaker 1: in Brisbane and to one mother are quite cash rich.
Speaker 1: So I mean, I'm not suggesting it should happen, but
Speaker 1: it won't happen now. But as we were talking about Britain, Yeah,
Speaker 1: just why doesn't the bottom team just go down and
Speaker 1: the team that wins the championship go up? No need
Speaker 1: to pay anybody anything for that, just and then there's
Speaker 1: another team sliding down to hahle f C. What's going
Speaker 1: on there? Well, decision to sack John cart right or
Speaker 1: to let him go whatever?
Speaker 2: Yeah, look, look, I think all there's a lot of
Speaker 2: issues here. Like I think that the whole John Carter
Speaker 2: we talked about this a few weeks ago, like they've
Speaker 2: completely bottled and mismanaged that, and I think they tried
Speaker 2: to spin it as in, oh well we wanted to
Speaker 2: bring Steve mcnamaray in I don't think that's the reason
Speaker 2: that they got rid of him, And I think, what
Speaker 2: since they got rid of him when they handled it
Speaker 2: badly they've have they lost three in one one, I think,
Speaker 2: I think, but I think a lot of I think
Speaker 2: a lot of it comes back to the administration that
Speaker 2: came in two years ago, and they did sign initially
Speaker 2: a lot of older injury playing players like John Asiada,
Speaker 2: and their recruitment has been quite quite poor, and they've
Speaker 2: had been hit with a lot of injuries there, and
Speaker 2: you add that into what I happened with the coach
Speaker 2: and the players. Clearly, like John Cartwright, they were playing
Speaker 2: for John cart Right. They did well last year. They
Speaker 2: hadn't been going great this year, but they were still
Speaker 2: in the balance, but they were playing for John Cartwright
Speaker 2: and then he gets knifed and it's just, yeah, chickens
Speaker 2: coming home to roost. I know there was an interview
Speaker 2: on Friday Night where they tried to be a lot
Speaker 2: of blame towards the Adam Pearson era and what went
Speaker 2: on there. And obviously, you know the club was didn't
Speaker 2: have a lot of resources and there were issues. But
Speaker 2: I think a lot of the decisions that have been
Speaker 2: made by the new administration off ce have been quite
Speaker 2: poor and it is a bit of yeah, chickens coming
Speaker 2: home to roost and they are a half seer of
Speaker 2: big club. You know, they've got a big fan base.
Speaker 2: They do produce a lot of players, but you just
Speaker 2: have to wonder, like you know, some of the Jake
Speaker 2: Arthur I mean, and I'm not singlely one player out,
Speaker 2: but a lot of a lot of this signings. You
Speaker 2: just you know Oliver Homes, you know, over the last
Speaker 2: couple of years, like you're just what's going on there? Yeah?
Speaker 1: Yeah, and John Cartwright has gone to Catalans and even
Speaker 1: got them winning.
Speaker 2: So look, I think you look at John carter Right's career,
Speaker 2: he's a good coach. He's a very honest, down to
Speaker 2: earth bloke, straight shooter, and I think most people on
Speaker 2: the sport know that he was treated badly. So it's
Speaker 2: good to see him gig gigan as I wrote a
Speaker 2: deep dig dive on Catalans the other week, you know,
Speaker 2: and after Wakefield game, you're like Jesus there in a
Speaker 2: massive hole. But I think he's a really smart appointment.
Speaker 2: So well done to them for making him their their
Speaker 2: head coach.
Speaker 1: There's some dumb people in rugby league who fall for
Speaker 1: certain would be coaches who can put power points together
Speaker 1: and speak in terms of platitudes and soundbites and coach.
Speaker 2: Speak talking about Anthony Seubog no.
Speaker 1: Comment, and then they fail to see that rugby league
Speaker 1: is a physical game and quite often a coach who
Speaker 1: keeps things awfully simple and as an ability to get
Speaker 1: the players to play for him or her or themselves,
Speaker 1: they tend to be the successful ones.
Speaker 2: And I can't remember.
Speaker 1: Jack Gibson confusing the hell out of anybody, even when
Speaker 1: he was talking in the media. I have no doubt
Speaker 1: Wayne Bennett doesn't confuse anybody. I have no doubt Craig
Speaker 1: Bellamy does not confuse anybody. And those three coaches between
Speaker 1: them have won an awful lot of premierships, have been
Speaker 1: in an awful lot of grum finals.
Speaker 2: Well, I think the modern segue and it isn't a
Speaker 2: crack at Anthony Seabob. But what Karen Thorn is doing
Speaker 2: at Manly now seven wins from eight games, I can't remember.
Speaker 2: I mean, there probably is a similar record in another sport,
Speaker 2: maybe in football or basketball or whatever, but in rugby league,
Speaker 2: I can't think of another coach who's had taken over
Speaker 2: from another coach who's been sacked, who's a rookie coach
Speaker 2: who literally retired five six months ago and had an
Speaker 2: immediate impact like that, and he's he has simple five things.
Speaker 2: He's you know, they're playing, they respect him, they're playing
Speaker 2: for him. And even on the weekend, you know they're
Speaker 2: missing Tommy Turbo, they're missing Cola, they're missing Hoppawadi, they're
Speaker 2: missing I can't say his buddy name but Homoly, and
Speaker 2: they still grow out of win.
Speaker 1: I'll just I know you're a Manly fan, John, but
Speaker 1: I want to remind you this is Super League three sixty,
Speaker 1: not Manly. We're in the See Eagles three sixty. You
Speaker 1: keep trying to mention them every week and I'm not
Speaker 1: entertaining it.
Speaker 2: I'm not entertaining. I'm having a great one.
Speaker 1: But you are right about caring for and you know
Speaker 1: you're getting old as a bloke when you've coached somebody
Speaker 1: who's coaching in the NRL as I did. The reason
Speaker 1: I mentioned the powerpoints and everything else is I can
Speaker 1: imagine John cart Right as a very very very very
Speaker 1: much a footballers coach and he's a straight shooter and
Speaker 1: straight shooter can be interpreted as tells the truth all
Speaker 1: the time, or doesn't talk in platitudes and doesn't try
Speaker 1: and confuse people, and everybody can clearly understand what he's saying,
Speaker 1: and it's only done people who think that those people
Speaker 1: aren't smart.
Speaker 2: That's all I'll say on that matter.
Speaker 1: Moving forward, Cam mckinness has gone to York. You're very excited,
Speaker 1: John Soul's James Harvey, who said, does the Cam McGinnis
Speaker 1: signing open the door for more bigger names to York
Speaker 1: in twenty twenty seven? Yeah, if you like Coctor genarians.
Speaker 2: Look I don't. I think, Well, I haven't seen camp
Speaker 2: play much this season. Look, I think he's a fantastic
Speaker 2: signer for York. I think it is a bit of
Speaker 2: a statement, you know. I think he's still good enough
Speaker 2: to be playing the nr row next year. I think
Speaker 2: he's a fantastic from what I've seen of him and
Speaker 2: you know written about him. Just a real leader, a
Speaker 2: hard worker. And I think it's great for York. I
Speaker 2: think you're for New York fan. Were show some real ambition.
Speaker 2: So I say congrats too, Yeah, I do, I do too.
Speaker 1: Been facetious is the much difference between the town of Lee,
Speaker 1: the city of Bradford, and Lost Vegas. John, you've been
Speaker 1: to all three. I've been to two of them. I've
Speaker 1: been to two of them. My dad lives there, one
Speaker 1: of them, my brother.
Speaker 2: I would say congrats to Lee and Bradford for taking
Speaker 2: the plunge going to Vegas. It was going to be
Speaker 2: half see some but they both pulled out. Now how
Speaker 2: competitive a game, I guess we'll see. We haven't seen
Speaker 2: a competitive Super LEW game in Vegas yet in two years.
Speaker 2: But look, it shows a fair bit of ambition for
Speaker 2: both cups. What I don't personally like, and this is
Speaker 2: just the personal opinion, is they've decided to promote that
Speaker 2: using the Lee chairman, the Lee CEO, and I think
Speaker 2: two of the Bradford owners playing poker in a stadium.
Speaker 2: Why are we using owners and CEOs to promote a
Speaker 2: game when we've.
Speaker 1: Got Probably because it's the owners and CEOs who are
Speaker 1: making these kind of decisions. So they went to the
Speaker 1: star of the show. But Lee, I'll just get give
Speaker 1: you an example.
Speaker 2: If mainly are plying the roosters, are you going to
Speaker 2: see Scott Penn and Nick Polydis doing a one minute poker,
Speaker 2: you know what I mean? If they're playing in Vegas,
Speaker 2: are they're going to do a video? Like? No one
Speaker 2: cares who these people are, no one wants to see them.
Speaker 2: You've got Adrian lamb That, You've got lock On Land,
Speaker 2: You've got nick A Rama, You've got Long of Black, Like,
Speaker 2: let's push the players to promote the sport like they're
Speaker 2: the ones playing on the field, not what some ego
Speaker 2: maniac is doing in the boardroom, Like I just that
Speaker 2: to me is just so much of what's wrong with
Speaker 2: the sport.
Speaker 1: In England outside of the coach and the players, And
Speaker 1: forty years ago, nobody even cared that much about the coach.
Speaker 1: By the ways, because of the way TV has generated
Speaker 1: interest in the coach. But outside of the coach and
Speaker 1: the players, nobody gives a flying flamingo about the other
Speaker 1: people at a club. And there's a strong correlation between
Speaker 1: CEOs and chair people who keep their powder dry, who
Speaker 1: keep a lower profile and have successful organizations. There's a
Speaker 1: strong correlation between those two things. The ones that feel
Speaker 1: the need to push their barrow all the time seem
Speaker 1: to take their eye off the ball of doing the
Speaker 1: job quite a lot and covering a lot of their
Speaker 1: a lot of their a lot of their errors. I
Speaker 1: mean it's particularly prevalent in this country. Who the journalists
Speaker 1: say is a good CEO. It's the one who gives
Speaker 1: them quotes all the time.
Speaker 2: Well, I mean people will say they use Russell Crowe
Speaker 2: to promote the first Vegas game in the first year,
Speaker 2: and he is a co owner of Sessity, But they
Speaker 2: use Russell Crowe because he's a Hollywood actor.
Speaker 1: Who also has a very low profile role public role
Speaker 1: in South Sydney. He doesn't interfere at all, and he's
Speaker 1: not in the press every thirty seconds.
Speaker 2: He's also globally known, particular in America. People know who
Speaker 2: he is because he's had a massive career for thirty
Speaker 2: forty years.
Speaker 1: Like, are you telling me they don't know who Derek
Speaker 1: Beaumont is in America?
Speaker 2: Maybe they do, Maybe they do they maybe they do.
Speaker 1: Eighteen ninety five Cup Final, what a joke, Just to
Speaker 1: let you know. That's what John sent me through as
Speaker 1: a topic. That's so that's all I've got to go on.
Speaker 2: Well, it's on a Monday, it's on a Monday Bank
Speaker 2: holidayly and it's scheduled a day before tomorrow today thirty first,
Speaker 2: a day after the last round of Championship games. So
Speaker 2: presumably they're going to get rescheduled or people are going
Speaker 2: to back up twenty four hours later and play Oh
Speaker 2: my god, we don't even have a venue for it yet.
Speaker 2: It's just we talked. We talked about the scheduling for
Speaker 2: the Whole Car Wigan game.
Speaker 1: I mean, what is the eighteen ninety five Cup John
Speaker 1: for those who don't know.
Speaker 2: So it was brought in I'm going to say four
Speaker 2: or five years ago basically as the Challenge well a
Speaker 2: Challenge Cup of equivalent for the lower team, so the
Speaker 2: teams in the Championship in League One. It was a
Speaker 2: chance for them to get to Wembley and play it
Speaker 2: as a curtain rate well it was actually played after
Speaker 2: the Challenge Cup final, but a chance for them to
Speaker 2: play at Wembley because obviously you're a semi pro team
Speaker 2: and you're playing against Wigan and Leeds in Whole Car
Speaker 2: you aren't going to like in all reality, and it's
Speaker 2: not like football. You're not going to have You're not
Speaker 2: going to get there, are yea. So it gave them
Speaker 2: a separate competition. Now it doesn't have a sponsor anymore.
Speaker 2: They've taken away the IMG points for winning it. I
Speaker 2: think the prize is thirty five grand to win it.
Speaker 2: So it's just like, what what are we doing with this? Why?
Speaker 2: You just I don't I don't know, Lee, Like I
Speaker 2: just I'm rough running out of words at this point.
Speaker 1: Like it's just that's not good for a journalist. That's
Speaker 1: a that's a that's a red flag. Yeah, it's just there's.
Speaker 2: Any so many times you can beat your head against
Speaker 2: the wall until you know the blood starts coming out
Speaker 2: and the brain starts sleeping out. And that's kind of
Speaker 2: where we're at the point.
Speaker 1: So indeed, in John's detailed topic suggestions, the next one
Speaker 1: is old and latest. I don't know if he's talking
Speaker 1: about crime statistics or or house prices or no.
Speaker 2: There's a bit there's a bit of moving old. And
Speaker 2: I was at the game on Friday night, good winn.
Speaker 2: You know, I thought Midlands, you know, much bigger pack
Speaker 2: that they faced and got dominated defense, but they had
Speaker 2: a real dig and it was actually nice going to
Speaker 2: a championship game saying no captains challenge, no video risk,
Speaker 2: there was any fans, Were there any fans there? I
Speaker 2: think there was about a thousand and two hundred, but
Speaker 2: it was a lovely you know, we're in a heat
Speaker 2: wave in the UK, so it was a lovely night
Speaker 2: for it. But no, the latest is I think Mike
Speaker 2: Ford what I've been told, Mike Board has of pulled
Speaker 2: out of talks of taking over the club, so that's
Speaker 2: a bit of a blow. There are two other groups
Speaker 2: looking at it, but there's still a fair bit of
Speaker 2: uncertainty in old of them. And she's a shame because
Speaker 2: they are back at Boundary Park, which I think is
Speaker 2: really necessary and you know it's got great heritage and
Speaker 2: facilities there, but there is a bit of uncertainly what's
Speaker 2: going to happen at Oldham in the future. I think
Speaker 2: the payday is coming up as well soon, so hopefully
Speaker 2: they can get a takeover sorder, then they can get
Speaker 2: their future sorder. Because obviously the Bill Quinn era, which
Speaker 2: we've talked about a lot. Yeah, you laugh because it's funny,
Speaker 2: but if you're an Oldham fair or an old because.
Speaker 1: Of that video where he just Bill Quinn, I don't
Speaker 1: think him. I thought Bill Quinn was the chairman and
Speaker 1: he's actually talking about himself in the Yeah, times if.
Speaker 2: You're Bill Quinn, no one talks bad about Bill Quinn. Yeah,
Speaker 2: it's just yeah, it's a role. I do actually feel
Speaker 2: sorry for the old and faithful because the last five
Speaker 2: months six months have been an absolute roller coaster, and
Speaker 2: not just talking about Facebook videos but everything. So hopefully
Speaker 2: there's a good outcome of the for the roughiads.
Speaker 1: And in the in the battle of the two clubs
Speaker 1: that went under in the last six months or whatever
Speaker 1: it is, Halifax twenty eight, Salford thirty four. What does
Speaker 1: he Sulford racking up another win. Actually so they they
Speaker 1: seem to be getting it together again slowly, which is good.
Speaker 2: Yeah, they've bought brought in Kiaren Dixon from Oldham obviously
Speaker 2: made Dave Humett Hewitt the permanent head coach. Yeah, two
Speaker 2: year contract or something. No, I think to the end
Speaker 2: of the year. I have heard a few rumors about
Speaker 2: a potential new coach twenty seven. I won't mention the
Speaker 2: name because I have a chance to chase that up, but.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think I can probably confirm it for your
Speaker 1: off record.
Speaker 2: Okay, well we'll do We'll do that. And there's obviously
Speaker 2: staying in a championship with Witness. You know, there was
Speaker 2: a there was a statement made out by the Direct
Speaker 2: Day and the OBN and I broke a story about
Speaker 2: the GM Tim Holmes leaving because of a restruction of club.
Speaker 2: So that's another club in the Championship with I don't
Speaker 2: want to say an uncertain future, but there's a lot
Speaker 2: of talk around Witness and what's going to happen there.
Speaker 1: So well, we've got the enhanced games, maybe we need
Speaker 1: a propped up super League teams that are all being
Speaker 1: propped up by government handouts or something. Back to the
Speaker 1: review of super League from the last round. We've spoken
Speaker 1: off about this at the start. Whole k are sixty
Speaker 1: two Wigan youth side for on Thursday, I think that
Speaker 1: was Leeds beat Huddersfield fifty two nil.
Speaker 2: I want to say special mention to Barry Back and
Speaker 2: Dave Woods because they really they spun the commentary so well,
Speaker 2: like making it sound like it was a fantastic win
Speaker 2: for whole Car and they.
Speaker 1: Play well, it's happening a lot in Australia to the
Speaker 1: game in front of the front of us is a
Speaker 1: game of ping pong and they're talking it up like
Speaker 1: it's amazing.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's really damaging. Comments from from Monster and Jerome
Speaker 2: Hughes on their podcast about you know what's happened with
Speaker 2: the game this year and Phil Goold as well, like
Speaker 2: there's a lot of people who are unhappy and a
Speaker 2: big emotional, emotional emotional ran about touch Fuddy last week.
Speaker 2: But I was crying. I was crying, I was banging
Speaker 2: the table. A lot of people agree with you, and
Speaker 2: a lot of big names in the nrolre with you.
Speaker 1: Yeah, leads fifty two. They've only scored fifty two. It's
Speaker 1: not two lots of fifty two. Led Ski scored two tries. Newman,
Speaker 1: you know you're in trouble. There's an opposition when one
Speaker 1: of the prop scores two tries. Newman scored to all Craft, Civo,
Speaker 1: Paul Mike as evo. His scoring has gone down. McDonald
Speaker 1: and Hankinson they only scored one corner, kicked eight goals.
Speaker 1: Huddersfield scored zip and that was nine tries to zero.
Speaker 1: I'll just keep moving on. Lee forty two left c six,
Speaker 1: Charlie got a hat trick. Towels, Hanley, Holton, Armstrong, Hodgson
Speaker 1: and Lamb scored the rest of them, and Cook scored
Speaker 1: three goals all left c could only manage six and
Speaker 1: they were all to Heartacre Josh Charlie the headline act
Speaker 1: with a hat trick and he's getting close to Ryan
Speaker 1: Hall's record apparently.
Speaker 2: Of tries scored. He is, yeah, doing very well. Hanley
Speaker 2: I thought was fantastic in the senders. I think he's
Speaker 2: really putting his name in the frame for a World
Speaker 2: Cup selection. That's Ellary's son, isn't it. Yes, that's obviously
Speaker 2: Ellary's Sam. They don't have a close relationship, I believe.
Speaker 2: But are the similarities in terms of the way they play.
Speaker 2: I wouldn't. I wouldn't say they are, but I probably
Speaker 2: didn't see enough of prime Ellery Hanley to properly analyze that.
Speaker 2: But look, I think.
Speaker 1: I'll put Ellery into context for you. Is my favorite
Speaker 1: of a player. I know that, and you know you
Speaker 1: know I'm a tough judge.
Speaker 2: So yeah, he was a freak of a player. And
Speaker 2: I think you know, Minor Hanley has come through the
Speaker 2: Wigan system. He's got a lot of talent. I don't
Speaker 2: think he's in an audue respect as good as his dad,
Speaker 2: but his dad's probably one of the best players to
Speaker 2: ever play the game. So that's not a that's not
Speaker 2: a crack by anyway. But he's a very skillful player,
Speaker 2: big strong, fast athletic, can score a try, I can
Speaker 2: set up a try. And I think he's you know,
Speaker 2: he's having a great scene. I think Lee. Look, we've
Speaker 2: spoken about last week. They've definitely turned a corner the
Speaker 2: Hullow seaside. They dropped ad and Caesar and it seems
Speaker 2: to be list. I saw on social media that Aiden
Speaker 2: Caesar was at the Leeds game. He's former club, rather
Speaker 2: than at Lee watching his teammates. So it's not a
Speaker 2: great look. I mean I ain't seen. It's very close
Speaker 2: to John car Ryan, isn't he But not a great
Speaker 2: not a great look there. Yeah, we've already talked about HALFC.
Speaker 2: I mean they just get worse week to week now.
Speaker 1: We got battered the other week when we put a
Speaker 1: clip out saying something nasty about all f C as well.
Speaker 1: York twenty two, Catalans thirty six. Good win for Catalans
Speaker 1: on the road tries for York two from Barmouth Firth.
Speaker 1: I love that surname. That's very soothing. Roberts and off
Speaker 1: Aloma scored one each on Hunter, which is the exact
Speaker 1: opposite of Barmfoth in a way. Hunters kicked three goals.
Speaker 1: The Catalans thirty six came from Russell aspuro BChE Fartarpi, Sexton,
Speaker 1: Tyson well Tis Stains and goals were from a Spiral
Speaker 1: Beche who scored six of them. Was that a good game?
Speaker 2: I don't think. I think Catlenz are op ad in
Speaker 2: Neil really bad start from York. They came back into it,
Speaker 2: but Carlins played some lovely stuff. I think one of
Speaker 2: the tries that the flick offload was was suburb So
Speaker 2: they're still having a crack York, can't they? Which is good. Yeah,
Speaker 2: they're still I think they had and the centers and
Speaker 2: I think they're named maybe four or five half backs
Speaker 2: in the nineteen men squad, which you don't see every day.
Speaker 2: But yeah, they're definitely having a crack. I think that's
Speaker 2: one thing about York. We're gonna lose the efforts always there.
Speaker 2: And but yeah, after how bad cat Lens were a
Speaker 2: week ago, they were dreadful. That is a good, good
Speaker 2: turnaround for them. Castle, Yeah, what happened here?
Speaker 1: Castle for thirty st Helen's ten Gary Garry with a
Speaker 1: hat trick, greet and Greech and Golding scored one each.
Speaker 1: Weaver kicked five goals and Saint Helen's ten came from
Speaker 1: Murphy Dagnall on a goal from Sailor.
Speaker 2: And Yeah, what the hell happened there? What's the first
Speaker 2: time I think the Castle could have won back to
Speaker 2: back games in about five or six years. Look, I
Speaker 2: got home and turned on the TV and I was
Speaker 2: sixteen up. I think it was about half time. I
Speaker 2: was like, what the hell they were? They were very
Speaker 2: very good gas well deserved Saints on the strength, not
Speaker 2: not anymore than they've been, you know, for quite a
Speaker 2: few weeks. They were just very, very poor every I
Speaker 2: think their set completion was like sixty three percent. They
Speaker 2: dropped off tackles, they dropped balls, discipline was very bad.
Speaker 2: Wells we've got Simbind, Hastings got Simbind. Yeah, they just
Speaker 2: basically got dominated in every facet. But after the Wigan game,
Speaker 2: the semi final couple of weeks ago, and then you know,
Speaker 2: pretty dominant performance dominated by casts. You'd have to raising
Speaker 2: an eyebor or two about that. That's a helles Like
Speaker 2: maybe deform is going to start to nosedive because they've
Speaker 2: been very good, obviously second on the table, very good
Speaker 2: most of the year, but that was they were very
Speaker 2: very poor on Saturday, but for Cass, fantastic result put
Speaker 2: on them. It's been a tough year, but maybe they've
Speaker 2: moving upwards. And yeah, full credit to him.
Speaker 1: To lose eighteen Wakefield twenty two to lose were eight
Speaker 1: mil up at one point, and and that was thanks
Speaker 1: to try from Roumanos and nash Old Bolt he scores
Speaker 1: every week, Ashual Bolt and Ulberg scored one. A bit
Speaker 1: later Sharuks kicked three goals. Wakefield hit back though with Pratt,
Speaker 1: far Tilly, Tavanga, Nicotimo and three goals from Rock And
Speaker 1: this score line is actually quite.
Speaker 2: Similar to the game early in the year.
Speaker 1: It's it seems like a decent battle between the two sides,
Speaker 1: quite frankly, and even though to lose might be near
Speaker 1: the bottom of the ladder, it just seems that they
Speaker 1: might have the ability to get under Wakefield skin. I
Speaker 1: think even though Wakefield and near the top of the ladder,
Speaker 1: So that was I thought that was just as good
Speaker 1: always for to lose in a way.
Speaker 2: It's always a way. Is that some teams in their
Speaker 2: stalls just mare up perfectly, don't they And they seem
Speaker 2: to have an edge over another thing. But yeah, I
Speaker 2: think I think gold kicking for to loose. Like the
Speaker 2: goal kicking. It has been quite poor a year and
Speaker 2: you know you're eight no lap you want to be
Speaker 2: you want to be a twelve noil up day here.
Speaker 2: But some of the defense I saw was not good
Speaker 2: from Toulouse that you know, the effort is there, they
Speaker 2: are trying, but they're just the defense has kind of improved.
Speaker 2: They've got to be able to with stain pressure.
Speaker 1: They need to make it tighter the defense to spread
Speaker 1: apart the Yeah, their system anyway different. Warrington hundred percent
Speaker 1: home record this season, nine wins from nine games in
Speaker 1: all competitions because they beat Bradford twenty six twelve. Warrington
Speaker 1: scored through Feulis, Thomas, Coppowarti, Erwin and Ashton and Irwin
Speaker 1: kicked three goals and Bradford's twelve came from Gill and
Speaker 1: Nicarima and one goal was kicked by Akin and another
Speaker 1: by Hooley.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I think probably a predictable result when
Speaker 2: you saw these teams matching out who was playing obviously
Speaker 2: Bradford are still missing a few important players. Yeah, that's
Speaker 2: really all.
Speaker 1: Some more questions, Dave Campbell asked us, where does Willie
Speaker 1: Peter stand in the list of influential coaches in any
Speaker 1: Capital letters sport over such a relatively short period of time?
Speaker 1: Can I answer that one, John, you can, because I've
Speaker 1: not researched every sport in.
Speaker 2: Every era, and like there might be a handball coach
Speaker 2: from Norway who you know won every trophy in.
Speaker 1: Well it said, it said over such a relatively short
Speaker 1: period of time. Look, yeah, there's plenty more. There's plenty
Speaker 1: more that have done it. Also, I think things get
Speaker 1: a little bit skewed when we look at Willie Peters
Speaker 1: record a little bit right, the He's won two competitions
Speaker 1: in essence, which is the Challenge Cup and Super League.
Speaker 2: The World Club Challenge is one game. Yes, it's competition,
Speaker 2: but is one game.
Speaker 1: Also, we seem to put a more a bigger emphasis
Speaker 1: on the League Leaders Shield when it suits us in
Speaker 1: England as opposed to the minor premiership in Australia. So
Speaker 1: in you know, nobody nobody remembers the League Leaders Shield
Speaker 1: or minor premiership. If you don't win the premiership. So
Speaker 1: so that's that. I'm not trying to take away from
Speaker 1: Willy's record all but in terms of where he would
Speaker 1: stand in terms of influential coaches, I mean, one's just
Speaker 1: one's just packed in at Manchester City today who took
Speaker 1: a year to bed in his methods and then the
Speaker 1: year the year after was breaking records left right in
Speaker 1: the center. So so that's just one that springs to mind.
Speaker 1: And we've said this on this podcast before, or I've
Speaker 1: said this anyway. I think some of Willie's work was
Speaker 1: done very well by Tony Smith before Willy got there
Speaker 1: as well. So look, I think Willy's been fantastic. I
Speaker 1: think he's been a great coach for who k Are,
Speaker 1: but I don't I think that's where it sort of sits.
Speaker 1: It's been one of the better Super League performances. Willy's
Speaker 1: big test will come when he's coaching in the NRL.
Speaker 2: Look, I think I'm going to hold judgment until after
Speaker 2: Wembley and after the season ends this year, because if
Speaker 2: he went at Wembley and maybe they win another Grand
Speaker 2: Final and he's got back to back challenge caps, better
Speaker 2: back Grand final win, then you know, and I think
Speaker 2: when you considered the whole car, I haven't contended since
Speaker 2: the mid eighties. I would say it's effective if Paramatta
Speaker 2: were winning the cup now. But Paramatta have had good
Speaker 2: years in the last forty haven't. In two thousand and
Speaker 2: one they should have won the Grand final. They were
Speaker 2: in the Grand final. In two thousand and nine they
Speaker 2: were in the Grand final then was it twenty two
Speaker 2: against Penrith or sometime like that, so twenty one to think, yeah, look,
Speaker 2: I think he's done an outstanding job. That's an outstanding job,
Speaker 2: but he does he does rank highly in terms of
Speaker 2: short term impact, definitely in Super League. But the question
Speaker 2: super league for any sport, Yeah, I mean it's just
Speaker 2: hard to compare sports and areas you mentioned Pep Guardiola.
Speaker 2: I think one of the years a couple of years
Speaker 2: ago when Shefforld, you know, in the Premier League, though
Speaker 2: I had a wage bill of about fifty million quid.
Speaker 2: In Manchester City had to wage bill of two hundred
Speaker 2: million quid. So you know, there's there's factors a play.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but also think about how many rookie coaches have
Speaker 1: won the NRL Premiership. Ricky Stewart first season won a premiership.
Speaker 1: Michael Hagen first season won a premiership. Kieran for and
Speaker 1: first season. You know, you know, I just think the
Speaker 1: question was about bigger picture. Yes, quite Frankly, I think
Speaker 1: let's not get carried away. John Hodson in nineteen eighty
Speaker 1: six said, given Pep has now announced he's leaving Man City,
Speaker 1: as Lee learned anything from him in regards to coaching,
Speaker 1: and are there any coaches from other sports that Lee's
Speaker 1: learned anything from? Well, I think this is the greatest
Speaker 1: question ever on this podcast.
Speaker 2: That's your burner account. That's right.
Speaker 1: If you look at my top book top bookshelf at
Speaker 1: home where I am now, it's Alex Ferguson, Brian Clough,
Speaker 1: the old Nottingham Forest and Arbor County manager late United,
Speaker 1: and then yeah, for forty days or something, and then
Speaker 1: it becomes then it becomes Jose Mourinho, Venga, John Wooden,
Speaker 1: some Pep. So to answer that question, yes, I've learned
Speaker 1: things off Pep there. I particularly early in his tenure
Speaker 1: and even when he was at Barcelona and Bayern. I
Speaker 1: used to look at youtubes and look at some of
Speaker 1: the drills he was doing, particularly the rondo drill that
Speaker 1: is big on, which is basically where players stand in
Speaker 1: a circle and pass to each other with a couple
Speaker 1: of players in the middle trying to get the ball
Speaker 1: off them, a bit like Piggy in the middle. I've
Speaker 1: developed rugby league drills similar to that, or rugby league
Speaker 1: games similar to that to keep people moving. Also, one
Speaker 1: of the big things that I've learned from Pep is
Speaker 1: the ability to use your train to keep injuries to
Speaker 1: a minimum. So use your training in your match preparation
Speaker 1: to keep injuries to a minimum. Thirdly, I think my
Speaker 1: whole philosophy about coaching rugby league has always come from
Speaker 1: sports like soccer, a bit like basketball, rather than sports
Speaker 1: such as NFL, because I believe that rugby league is
Speaker 1: a bit more fluid in terms of pit players should
Speaker 1: look up more and look at space, etc. Than so
Speaker 1: many coaches in rugby league who are very structural and
Speaker 1: put the players in strait jackets. So somebody like PEP
Speaker 1: has has been an influence in that regard. But to
Speaker 1: drill down a little bit deeper, because I'm a little
Speaker 1: bit older, I'd already done about ten or fifteen years
Speaker 1: of reading about coaches before PEP came on the scene.
Speaker 1: And what you find amongst all the great coaches is
Speaker 1: so many similarities. So you Bill Belichick's, You're Alex Ferguson's, etc.
Speaker 2: Etc.
Speaker 1: There's so many similarities in what they do. And don't
Speaker 1: underestimate that Pep has had his mentors too. And by
Speaker 1: twenty eleven twenty twelve, when people were starting to think
Speaker 1: I'm going a minute this, Pep guardy all looker coach.
Speaker 1: I mean I'd already coached at Manley and Penrith, so
Speaker 1: I was well on my coaching journey. So so I've
Speaker 1: learned things off Pep, but I guess it came but
Speaker 1: the more at the back end of what I've learned
Speaker 1: about coaches, and so much of it duplicated what I'd
Speaker 1: seen before. Ben Blackwell said, what is the likelihood of
Speaker 1: Sky agreeing to a new TV deal? TNT are apparently
Speaker 1: in players potential new broadcaster, and if speculation is to
Speaker 1: be believed, if super League was to leave Sky, it
Speaker 1: would force clubs and the comp to up their game
Speaker 1: in marketing and to game game subs for TNT etc.
Speaker 1: By subs, I think Ben means subscriptions.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, it's a great question. I've not heard
Speaker 2: a huge amount about the team negotiations. There has been
Speaker 2: some talk that that T and T are interested, they
Speaker 2: are being brought over by paramounts, So I think that
Speaker 2: could affect any kind of offer of rights at this point.
Speaker 2: But look, look, I think personally for Suberlu, I think,
Speaker 2: you know, what they need is more money. That's kind
Speaker 2: of the crust of the thing. Now, if that means
Speaker 2: breaking up rights with one or two different providers, then great.
Speaker 2: I think ideally to get some free to air coverage
Speaker 2: would be good, But we need to get the most
Speaker 2: out of our rights, which can then go not only
Speaker 2: to distributions to clubs, but in things like marketing and
Speaker 2: promotion and participation, you know, so many things. So I
Speaker 2: hope that TNT are in, you know, in big style.
Speaker 2: I think competition would be great because I think Sky
Speaker 2: their coverage has maybe been treading water for a bit.
Speaker 2: And yeah, I think, you know, going to a new
Speaker 2: writer could kick be a kick up of the ass
Speaker 2: for a lot of on the sport, which is maybe
Speaker 2: what we need.
Speaker 1: B W asked, what's the best move for jack wellsby next?
Speaker 1: Jack wellsby being the Saint Helen's fall back or six
Speaker 1: or substitute or whatever. If it's to leave the club,
Speaker 1: which club would be the best fit b W. I
Speaker 1: think that or he from Pilkinson's are looking for some players.
Speaker 2: Truthful, Look, I don't think you know he only signed
Speaker 2: a new deal Saint Helens not that long ago. I
Speaker 2: don't think he's leaving St Helen's. I know he's come
Speaker 2: back from a serious injury. He's not hit his form yet.
Speaker 2: But I think personally, if you look at some of
Speaker 2: the defensive efforts that Tristan Saler made, I'd be picking
Speaker 2: Jack Wells bit fullback.
Speaker 1: Jack Wells is a good player, but obviously is going on.
Speaker 1: And our l news, I think the big news was
Speaker 1: the diagnosis of Jay Arrow. Unfortunately, I know all too
Speaker 1: well about multi neeur own disease.
Speaker 2: Mate, So yeah, I mean you he lost your mind
Speaker 2: in you and I think anywhen yeah.
Speaker 1: Oh six seven members of the family, so we're yeah,
Speaker 1: my mom's side are in the ten percent of cases
Speaker 1: that run through families and just like Gy Arrow, my
Speaker 1: mum had the I think they call it the bulber
Speaker 1: version of the motor your own where your voice starts
Speaker 1: to struggle. And obviously, for those concerned about Gai and
Speaker 1: his welfare. They may remember that Rob Burrow, the talking
Speaker 1: issue came a bit later, did it after the limbs?
Speaker 1: Whereas with Jai the talking has already been affected. And
Speaker 1: obviously it's not just talking that happens, it's swallowing food, breath, saliva,
Speaker 1: et cetera. So yeah, it's it's not good. It's not
Speaker 1: good again. The rugby league it is fantastic at getting
Speaker 1: around these people. Is this talks about July being try
Speaker 1: for Jai to raise money, And from a purely selfish
Speaker 1: point of view, and very selfish point of view, this
Speaker 1: is that any high profile people that get M and
Speaker 1: D it can only help people's knowledge of it, and
Speaker 1: it can only help the funding of it because they
Speaker 1: believe they're about fifteen years off a cure ten to
Speaker 1: fifteen years, and that will obviously be expedited with more money.
Speaker 1: And because of the very lopsided world we live in,
Speaker 1: these things don't get prioritized over politicians' expenses and things
Speaker 1: like that.
Speaker 2: So it was heartbreaking news. And yeah, just love and
Speaker 2: sport goes out to join and his family, you know,
Speaker 2: his partner, his daughter, you know, I think I think
Speaker 2: see how Senior handle it really well, and it's great
Speaker 2: to see the support that he's got from the sport.
Speaker 2: And obviously, you know, with seeing what's happened with Rob
Speaker 2: Borrow and what Kevin Sinfield had done. And I think
Speaker 2: rugby league does this really well. But yeah, it's just
Speaker 2: something and it seems to be I mean, we don't know.
Speaker 2: There's no research about the links between M and D
Speaker 2: and rugby league or concussions, but it just seems to
Speaker 2: be such a high you know, and obviously not your
Speaker 2: you know, your mum or people your family, but a
Speaker 2: high incidence of professional rugby league players who are developing it,
Speaker 2: you know, car Web. I think there's quite a few
Speaker 2: other There's obviously a lot in roam union. It's just
Speaker 2: just a real prick of a disease.
Speaker 1: So the three things, the three things that I believe
Speaker 1: that the researchers are really drilling down into is Number one,
Speaker 1: intense exercise. So intense exercise is defined as anything over
Speaker 1: fifteen minutes above a certain heart rate. Basically. Number two
Speaker 1: head knocks. So rugby league in particular are cover those
Speaker 1: first two bases, and rugby union, so many other sports
Speaker 1: as well. I mean, it's not that long ago that
Speaker 1: footballers were heading a ball.
Speaker 2: That was.
Speaker 1: Very tough on the melon and even now, I mean
Speaker 1: you can still have head collisions and you can still
Speaker 1: hit a ball and it not be too pleasant. There's
Speaker 1: so many other things obviously too. And then the third
Speaker 1: one is geographical, so there is a thought. All my
Speaker 1: mum's side are Irish, so there's a potential link, I believe,
Speaker 1: with what might be happening in terms of the way
Speaker 1: foods are farmed in that area. And there's also been
Speaker 1: a breakout in recent years and the Riverina in New
Speaker 1: South Wales, and they're trying to link that or they
Speaker 1: think they did link that with something to do with
Speaker 1: the way water was was processed there or something along
Speaker 1: those lines. So so yeah, they're the three sort of
Speaker 1: main ones I think, and of course there's the genetic
Speaker 1: ones too and it's it's it's quite ironic.
Speaker 2: Actually.
Speaker 1: The gene that they link it to is called sod
Speaker 1: one s o D one, and yes, it is a
Speaker 1: sod of a disease as well. So yeah, that's where
Speaker 1: it is, and I just got to keep on keeping
Speaker 1: on them. Yeah, And just like you, John, I think
Speaker 1: seeing that Jai as a one year old was the
Speaker 1: thing that really got to me. The two things was
Speaker 1: listening to gay speak because it reminded me and my
Speaker 1: mum and seeing he's got a one year old and yeah,
Speaker 1: not good, not good.
Speaker 2: No. I mean I think that the you know, the
Speaker 2: experience that you've had, you know, I can't imagine being
Speaker 2: about that. I know personally one of my best mates,
Speaker 2: his wife was diagnosed quite a few years ago, and
Speaker 2: I know the impact. She's still fighting it, you know,
Speaker 2: but she's in a in a wheelchair and you know,
Speaker 2: as sister living with carers, and it's just what it
Speaker 2: does to people and what it does to families is
Speaker 2: just so tragic. So I think if you can support
Speaker 2: Joy in any way with donations or whatever, let's let's
Speaker 2: get out and do it.
Speaker 1: M Paul Trest said, any update on the NRL investment.
Speaker 1: We talked about this every week, NRL Investment Assistance in
Speaker 1: the Northern Hemisphere. With every week that goes by, I
Speaker 1: feel the need for this to happen becomes more apparent.
Speaker 1: I think Paul's saying the Super League isn't very good
Speaker 1: at the minute. I think that's what he's saying. But
Speaker 1: have you heard anything about Nigel Wood visit and the scene.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I've tried to chase up a bit the last week.
Speaker 2: I think it does depend who you talk to. I
Speaker 2: think some people are saying things are still positive, other
Speaker 2: people are saying not so positive. There has been some
Speaker 2: speculation that there is maybe a lack of unity on
Speaker 2: the NRL side from the likes of Abdo and Lanny's
Speaker 2: about how to proceed. And I think the other thought
Speaker 2: seems to be that the NRL won't make a financial
Speaker 2: or concrete financial offer until their own broadcast dealers sorted,
Speaker 2: which go shatt the moment. So yeah, look, I think
Speaker 2: I've said this before, I'll say it again. I think
Speaker 2: if there isn't a partnership with the NROL where investment
Speaker 2: and expertise comes to Super League, we're all up a
Speaker 2: certain puddle, sorry, a certain creek without a puddle.
Speaker 1: So Super League goals on hold again next week because
Speaker 1: it's a Challenge Cup Final.
Speaker 2: Preview it John, please, Well, my ProView will be brief
Speaker 2: because I will be debuting to Sunny Spain on Thursday
Speaker 2: and I will be enjoying Sunshine, Surf and Sangria all
Speaker 2: the three essa's, so I won't be at the Challenge
Speaker 2: Cup finals. It's probably the first Challenge Cup final, well
Speaker 2: apart from the COVID twenty twenty finals, the first one
Speaker 2: I've missed in fifteen years. So look, I think I
Speaker 2: think it'll be a hell of a game. I think
Speaker 2: Hel Karon, We're going to have got a fantastic rivalry
Speaker 2: that's been building for the last three years. They've played
Speaker 2: in two Grand Finals, they've won one each. I think
Speaker 2: it's it's a game that could go either way. I
Speaker 2: think they're very, very evenly matched, and yeah, I just hope,
Speaker 2: I think we all hope that that's a fantastic game.
Speaker 2: Last year's final was a bit of a grind. It
Speaker 2: was heavy rain. Trying to think the final before that. Look,
Speaker 2: Wigan dominated dominated Warrington. It wasn't a particularly eye catching final.
Speaker 2: I'm hoping for, you know, the ninety seven Grand Final
Speaker 2: style final, you know, something for the ages, That's what
Speaker 2: I would love to see.
Speaker 1: I think they I think they keep the grass a
Speaker 1: little bit longer at Wembley when the rugby league's on,
Speaker 1: and I think the camera angle doesn't always make the
Speaker 1: game look as far as it is. I've always I've
Speaker 1: always noticed that, So yeah, just something am I to
Speaker 1: assume that you're going to be away, so we can't
Speaker 1: record next week as well.
Speaker 2: I do fly back to Beautiful Leads Bradford on Sunday,
Speaker 2: so it should be good to review Sunday night. You know,
Speaker 2: it might be a bit hungover, but that's all right,
Speaker 2: our soldier on.
Speaker 1: For you're talking. You're talking like that's a rare occurrence.
Speaker 1: There we go, all right, have a good week and
Speaker 1: enjoy Spain.