WEBVTT 1 00:00:02.200 --> 00:00:04.839 You see somethings going to happen. 2 00:00:06.320 --> 00:00:10.560 What's gonna happen? 3 00:00:15.480 --> 00:00:15.519 What? 4 00:00:24.839 --> 00:00:29.519 Welcome to the Occult Rejects. This episode, I got Cherry 5 00:00:29.559 --> 00:00:33.079 Power with us again. She was with us before we 6 00:00:33.119 --> 00:00:36.679 covered the book The Left Hand Path of taro Uh, 7 00:00:36.719 --> 00:00:40.920 Breaking Taboos, confronting shadows and achieving self love. She came 8 00:00:40.960 --> 00:00:42.920 on the show. She talked about it and the way 9 00:00:42.960 --> 00:00:46.079 that she looks at Taro highly highly suggests to go 10 00:00:46.159 --> 00:00:49.320 check out that episode after this one and check out 11 00:00:49.399 --> 00:00:52.960 a book. But before we introduce her, let me introduce Judith. 12 00:00:53.159 --> 00:00:55.079 We got the loon? What is going on? Judith? Will 13 00:00:55.079 --> 00:00:56.359 you hi? 14 00:00:56.560 --> 00:00:59.039 Thank you for having me. Jerry, I am so happy 15 00:00:59.079 --> 00:01:03.039 to see you come back. You can reach me at 16 00:01:03.159 --> 00:01:07.599 YouTube and on x as the Loan and if you 17 00:01:07.719 --> 00:01:10.719 want to follow, my AUNC page is also on Instagram 18 00:01:10.719 --> 00:01:12.840 on Jesus under Judus Swanson. 19 00:01:13.519 --> 00:01:15.079 I can't wait for today's discussion. 20 00:01:15.920 --> 00:01:20.680 Thank you, And what about your You mentioned the YouTube? Correct? Yes, yes, okay, 21 00:01:21.799 --> 00:01:25.799 based just making sure making sure. Thank you very much, Judus. 22 00:01:25.799 --> 00:01:29.400 I appreciate you making it always. And Sherry, please let 23 00:01:29.439 --> 00:01:31.400 everybody know what your dealer is, you know, tell them 24 00:01:31.400 --> 00:01:35.079 about your book or whatever you'd like to promote, promote please, Oh. 25 00:01:34.719 --> 00:01:37.439 Thank you. I'm so happy to be back on here. 26 00:01:37.959 --> 00:01:42.040 Thanks for the space. Well, yes, I just published a 27 00:01:42.079 --> 00:01:45.519 book on by Star Books called The lat Hand Path 28 00:01:45.560 --> 00:01:50.480 of Taitoo and it's available anywhere books are sold. You 29 00:01:50.519 --> 00:01:54.480 can order it now. And I have been a chartist 30 00:01:54.599 --> 00:01:58.239 for over like Around the Day, Canday and a half. 31 00:01:58.640 --> 00:02:01.719 And I'm also a witch left hand Path, which obviously 32 00:02:02.359 --> 00:02:06.680 and you can find me on Instagram and threats at 33 00:02:06.879 --> 00:02:14.120 Cherry Red Underscore Tarot and that's you'll also find all 34 00:02:14.159 --> 00:02:17.039 of my links there. I have basically and mainly like 35 00:02:17.120 --> 00:02:21.479 a patron and yeah, I mean also if you're interested 36 00:02:21.520 --> 00:02:25.919 in reading, you can book from there. And I'm Mexican. 37 00:02:26.080 --> 00:02:28.360 I live in Mexico, and I'm very proud and very 38 00:02:28.400 --> 00:02:29.199 happy to be here. 39 00:02:29.800 --> 00:02:33.080 Awesome, Awesome, I love it. Thank you very much for 40 00:02:33.120 --> 00:02:35.240 coming on again. Really had a blast last time, and 41 00:02:35.240 --> 00:02:39.319 I'm sure it'll be great this time. I guess what 42 00:02:39.400 --> 00:02:41.960 I wanted to ask You might have probably covered it 43 00:02:42.000 --> 00:02:44.639 in the first time you're on slightly, but I didn't 44 00:02:44.639 --> 00:02:47.400 want to ask. I guess what was your exposure to 45 00:02:47.759 --> 00:02:50.560 Santa Morte? Was that something you sorted researching in were 46 00:02:50.560 --> 00:02:52.919 you're kind of exposed to it. You're just wondering how 47 00:02:52.960 --> 00:02:55.479 you came across that ms. 48 00:02:55.719 --> 00:02:59.639 It's everywhere here in Mexico because it's where it originated. 49 00:02:59.759 --> 00:03:04.280 So I, to be quite honest, I'm not exactly sure 50 00:03:04.479 --> 00:03:09.199 when was the first time that I came upon the 51 00:03:09.240 --> 00:03:14.479 Cult of Santamerte. It was probably on like media or 52 00:03:14.520 --> 00:03:17.840 the news, or maybe just on the street, you know, 53 00:03:19.039 --> 00:03:24.800 because she's literally everywhere. You'll find people wearing like pendants 54 00:03:24.879 --> 00:03:28.039 of her, people wearing her like on t shirts. You 55 00:03:28.120 --> 00:03:31.360 will see if you go to like occult stores here 56 00:03:31.439 --> 00:03:35.280 where they said where they sell things for witchcraft and such, 57 00:03:35.840 --> 00:03:38.960 you will find a lot of like effigies, like statues, 58 00:03:40.319 --> 00:03:45.199 candles with Santa Marta, and yeah, you just get curious 59 00:03:45.199 --> 00:03:47.240 and maybe you'll learn a little bit more about it. 60 00:03:47.280 --> 00:03:49.319 There have been there have been a lot of stories 61 00:03:49.599 --> 00:03:55.199 also in national news about her, and uh, yeah, it's 62 00:03:55.240 --> 00:03:59.960 it's pretty much already like permeated a lot of aspect 63 00:04:00.240 --> 00:04:05.680 of Mexican culture. Even those who are not like believers, 64 00:04:06.240 --> 00:04:11.199 they know, have a very general idea of what the 65 00:04:11.280 --> 00:04:16.360 cult is and what she represents. But of course there 66 00:04:16.399 --> 00:04:20.720 are as in most or I would say all aspects 67 00:04:20.720 --> 00:04:25.000 of belief. There are different ways to approach you know, 68 00:04:25.399 --> 00:04:30.680 every practice, every deity or entity. So yeah, I mean 69 00:04:30.720 --> 00:04:34.360 there's a lot of versions, and none of them is 70 00:04:34.439 --> 00:04:39.240 necessarily like valid or like invalid or true versus untrue. 71 00:04:39.839 --> 00:04:43.759 So yeah, I mean as a Mexican, like you just know, 72 00:04:45.639 --> 00:04:50.720 and the connotation on media and the news is unfortunately 73 00:04:51.000 --> 00:04:54.920 largely negative. But I think that in the past five 74 00:04:55.079 --> 00:04:58.560 or ten years it's really beginning to shift a lot. 75 00:05:02.439 --> 00:05:04.399 One thing I did want to ask, I think you 76 00:05:04.480 --> 00:05:05.959 kind of even said how that might be a little 77 00:05:05.959 --> 00:05:09.759 bit differences. Would you say, like maybe in different like 78 00:05:10.399 --> 00:05:13.319 towns or areas, there might be a little bit of 79 00:05:13.360 --> 00:05:16.920 a different flare on the idea, maybe smaller like things 80 00:05:16.920 --> 00:05:20.399 that kind of go along with the local stuff. 81 00:05:21.279 --> 00:05:26.160 There are subtle variations. Because I think that the first 82 00:05:26.240 --> 00:05:33.120 recollections of something similar like to Santa Marte, where you 83 00:05:33.160 --> 00:05:37.519 can trace it back to the nineteen forties, maybe in 84 00:05:37.720 --> 00:05:42.279 like I know that it happened like in Vera Cruz, 85 00:05:42.480 --> 00:05:47.800 which is like on one of the coastal areas in Mexico, 86 00:05:48.480 --> 00:05:53.519 and in Vera Cruz you have like these place that 87 00:05:53.680 --> 00:05:58.160 is very famous nationwide, and I think even internationally the 88 00:05:58.319 --> 00:06:01.920 name is Catemaco, and it's kind of like if Mexico 89 00:06:02.000 --> 00:06:07.360 had like a witchcraft capital, that would be it, because 90 00:06:07.439 --> 00:06:10.560 there's a lot of like brujos, and there are different 91 00:06:10.639 --> 00:06:14.519 variants and all kinds of like witchcraft that is practiced there, 92 00:06:15.240 --> 00:06:17.839 and it has a lot of like there's a lot 93 00:06:17.920 --> 00:06:22.040 of stuff like urban legends and like scary stories and things. 94 00:06:22.079 --> 00:06:25.720 Some of them have truth behind them, some not. But 95 00:06:25.959 --> 00:06:30.680 it's like a place that is very known because a 96 00:06:30.720 --> 00:06:35.839 lot of people, some of them like powerful politicians and 97 00:06:36.079 --> 00:06:40.399 like people in Mexican entertainment business, they go there to 98 00:06:40.639 --> 00:06:44.199 get some work done, like spiritual work and boukhetia and 99 00:06:44.240 --> 00:06:48.480 that sort of thing, but like also you know, just 100 00:06:48.560 --> 00:06:52.639 regular people and over there. I think that there was 101 00:06:53.759 --> 00:06:58.879 a witch in the like myth to late sixties. Then 102 00:06:59.399 --> 00:07:01.839 his name was smart Dale, and I don't know which 103 00:07:01.920 --> 00:07:07.160 type of which craft he practiced, but apparently he was 104 00:07:07.199 --> 00:07:12.600 the one who first received like a visit from what 105 00:07:12.639 --> 00:07:16.519 would who would later be known as Santa Marte. And 106 00:07:16.600 --> 00:07:19.240 at first it was like a vision while he was 107 00:07:19.279 --> 00:07:24.439 doing this ritual, you know, and afterwards, you know, well, 108 00:07:24.439 --> 00:07:29.000 here in Mexico, Catholicism is very interspersed with these types 109 00:07:29.040 --> 00:07:34.879 of beliefs. So he went after the vision was over, 110 00:07:35.120 --> 00:07:38.439 he called upon a priest from like a local priest, 111 00:07:39.360 --> 00:07:47.160 because Santa Marte had asked like to be like not worshiped, 112 00:07:47.160 --> 00:07:49.680 but she was like saying that she would be there 113 00:07:49.800 --> 00:07:54.160 to help anyone who called for her, particularly like for 114 00:07:54.399 --> 00:07:59.160 things that had to do with having like a peaceful death, 115 00:07:59.879 --> 00:08:02.959 or to you know, get well if they were sick, 116 00:08:03.160 --> 00:08:07.839 things like that, and gave him a series of instructions 117 00:08:07.920 --> 00:08:11.959 on how to approach her. And after a division evaporated, 118 00:08:12.040 --> 00:08:15.959 there was kind of like what they say, like an 119 00:08:16.079 --> 00:08:20.519 image left on one of the walls where he worshiped. 120 00:08:21.040 --> 00:08:24.240 So he went and got this priest. But of course 121 00:08:24.279 --> 00:08:27.839 the priest was horrified because he's a Catholic prist, so 122 00:08:27.879 --> 00:08:30.199 he said that that was themonic and that he would 123 00:08:30.240 --> 00:08:32.360 have no part in it and that was not of God, 124 00:08:32.480 --> 00:08:36.679 blah blah blah. But Matteo went ahead and he said, well, 125 00:08:36.879 --> 00:08:41.000 it's okay if the Catholic church won't admit or won't 126 00:08:41.039 --> 00:08:46.559 help me, and he started, you know, this practice worshiping 127 00:08:46.639 --> 00:08:50.679 Santa Martin, and gradually people found out about it through 128 00:08:50.720 --> 00:08:53.759 word of mouth and it started, you know, growing and 129 00:08:53.799 --> 00:08:59.480 growing until it eventually reached Mexico City, also some parts 130 00:08:59.480 --> 00:09:04.919 of the northern side of Mexico. And the thing that 131 00:09:05.559 --> 00:09:09.360 makes Santa Morte kind of like you your question was 132 00:09:09.399 --> 00:09:13.720 about if like it varied according to the regions. I 133 00:09:13.799 --> 00:09:20.919 would say that maybe it has a different type of 134 00:09:21.080 --> 00:09:24.639 audience depending on of which part of the country you 135 00:09:24.679 --> 00:09:29.720 are in, because people like in the north of Mexico, 136 00:09:30.000 --> 00:09:32.399 of course, they they are like in the in the 137 00:09:32.480 --> 00:09:37.000 border and they deal with a lot of maybe uh 138 00:09:37.279 --> 00:09:40.799 threats from like organized crime and things like that, or 139 00:09:40.840 --> 00:09:44.840 they are involved in maybe some of these activities, or 140 00:09:44.879 --> 00:09:48.679 they want protection against their enemies things like that, so 141 00:09:48.840 --> 00:09:51.919 it takes on like a different flavor. They're kind of 142 00:09:51.960 --> 00:09:57.000 like more from against enemies. But if you go to 143 00:09:57.159 --> 00:10:00.840 Mexico City where there's like an altar, the first like 144 00:10:01.480 --> 00:10:06.759 really like nationwide and internationally known altar to Santa Martin 145 00:10:07.120 --> 00:10:10.799 in the Pito that was established that altar by a 146 00:10:10.919 --> 00:10:15.879 lady named Enriquetta. I don't remember if her her last 147 00:10:15.960 --> 00:10:19.080 name was Dromo or what is her name, but she 148 00:10:19.480 --> 00:10:22.480 put a statue of Santa Marte like in the garage 149 00:10:22.480 --> 00:10:25.799 of her house and opened it to the public. And 150 00:10:25.919 --> 00:10:29.279 that is where like I think most of the people 151 00:10:29.399 --> 00:10:33.879 go and pay their respects to Santa Martin. The flavor there, 152 00:10:34.080 --> 00:10:36.720 if you want to call it, that is a lot 153 00:10:36.840 --> 00:10:42.080 more like inclusive. It's not limited to like necessarily people 154 00:10:42.120 --> 00:10:45.840 who who are involved in organized crime or who are 155 00:10:45.919 --> 00:10:50.919 cops or who work in these types of like dangerous jobs. 156 00:10:51.440 --> 00:10:58.480 They are like your everyday people. You know, business people, parents, 157 00:11:00.039 --> 00:11:03.879 people from every walk of life basically go and worship 158 00:11:04.200 --> 00:11:08.519 Santa Marte there, live offerings, things like that, And I 159 00:11:08.559 --> 00:11:13.240 would say that maybe if we have to like categorize it, 160 00:11:13.440 --> 00:11:16.759 if you go north, it's kind of like a bit 161 00:11:16.840 --> 00:11:20.679 more connected with like danger and crime and things like that. 162 00:11:21.279 --> 00:11:26.440 If you go to Mexico City, it's like more inclusive outsiders. 163 00:11:26.519 --> 00:11:29.600 Also a lot of like gay people, people who work 164 00:11:29.720 --> 00:11:33.320 like sex workers and things like that they go and 165 00:11:33.360 --> 00:11:36.200 worship there as well. It's super inclusive. And if you 166 00:11:36.240 --> 00:11:38.600 go to Vera Cruz, maybe it has like a little 167 00:11:38.639 --> 00:11:41.360 bit of a more serious tone as far as you know, 168 00:11:41.440 --> 00:11:44.879 people who go to Katemaco there it's usually for specific 169 00:11:45.480 --> 00:11:49.039 like rituals and like petitions that are like of a 170 00:11:49.120 --> 00:11:54.279 certain level of commitment. So that would be kind of 171 00:11:54.360 --> 00:11:58.159 like maybe the three vibes that you would get, you know, 172 00:11:58.279 --> 00:12:01.039 from Santa Marte here in Mexico go. But there's a 173 00:12:01.039 --> 00:12:04.720 lot of other places where she's worshiped that maybe don't 174 00:12:04.759 --> 00:12:10.039 have as much of a visible presence online or on 175 00:12:10.200 --> 00:12:16.600 the media, but I'm sure that they exist. Yeah, I'm sorry. 176 00:12:16.759 --> 00:12:19.320 I have a cool question because here in the Western world, 177 00:12:19.720 --> 00:12:24.679 when you say Satan Moota, people think she's associated with death, 178 00:12:25.200 --> 00:12:28.759 but only But from how you explained that, it sounds 179 00:12:28.759 --> 00:12:32.600 like she's also associated with healing and protection. So what 180 00:12:32.639 --> 00:12:36.720 would so what exactly would she be just a patron 181 00:12:36.799 --> 00:12:38.519 of those three or is there more too? 182 00:12:40.320 --> 00:12:42.879 The thing is that the way that we see death 183 00:12:43.200 --> 00:12:47.279 is death and life are the same thing. And I 184 00:12:47.320 --> 00:12:50.799 don't know how fen you are with like in Mexico, 185 00:12:51.440 --> 00:12:55.840 even though it's a very misogynistic culture in many ways, 186 00:12:56.159 --> 00:13:00.480 but there's this contradiction and if you go into the 187 00:13:00.519 --> 00:13:03.679 houses of the average Mexican, if you look to the 188 00:13:03.799 --> 00:13:07.840 media and culturally, like our history and all that, it's 189 00:13:07.879 --> 00:13:13.639 a matriarchy in many ways. So when the Spanish colonized 190 00:13:14.840 --> 00:13:19.720 the indigenous Mexicans, what they did was to like fuse 191 00:13:19.879 --> 00:13:25.960 the virgin Mary with the local feminine deities. So Santa 192 00:13:26.080 --> 00:13:30.960 Marte kind of like I think sprong as a reaction 193 00:13:31.200 --> 00:13:37.240 to against that many centuries later, you know, because in Mexico, 194 00:13:37.320 --> 00:13:40.879 death has always not only been respected and revered and 195 00:13:41.000 --> 00:13:45.360 celebrated and worshiped, it has like it's part of our 196 00:13:45.480 --> 00:13:48.879 daily lives. And we understand we don't really see a 197 00:13:49.039 --> 00:13:52.440 difference at the end of the day when it comes 198 00:13:52.480 --> 00:13:55.399 to you know, life and death. It's part of like 199 00:13:55.559 --> 00:13:59.639 one same cycle. It's like life and existence in it's 200 00:13:59.679 --> 00:14:04.799 to tell. So the way that we talk about that 201 00:14:05.080 --> 00:14:09.960 and relate to it is very familiar. It's like someone 202 00:14:10.519 --> 00:14:13.799 we've known our whole lives, even if we are like 203 00:14:14.639 --> 00:14:18.600 not devotees of Santa Marte, but it's always there. I mean, 204 00:14:18.600 --> 00:14:23.120 we're not afraid to talk about it because yeah, it's 205 00:14:23.200 --> 00:14:26.440 very different from here than you know, from in the 206 00:14:26.559 --> 00:14:29.879 United States, because you have like a different kind of 207 00:14:30.720 --> 00:14:35.320 religious thinking that plays the foundations of the United States. 208 00:14:35.480 --> 00:14:41.639 It's kind of like more like evangelistic, and it was 209 00:14:41.720 --> 00:14:45.000 very different and over here it was like the brutality 210 00:14:45.080 --> 00:14:48.679 of Catholicism, you know, the Inquisition and all that. But 211 00:14:49.480 --> 00:14:52.919 we already were like really hardcore here. I mean, the 212 00:14:53.000 --> 00:14:55.679 rituals and the beliefs that we had here, and like 213 00:14:55.840 --> 00:14:59.080 that's what's looked like in the face and in the US, 214 00:14:59.240 --> 00:15:03.240 like this never happened, you know, and there were there 215 00:15:03.360 --> 00:15:07.200 was no fusion of traditions over there and over here, 216 00:15:07.240 --> 00:15:11.519 there was like a complete fusion of like cultures and beliefs. 217 00:15:11.879 --> 00:15:17.480 So it's I wouldn't say that she's a patron of 218 00:15:17.519 --> 00:15:21.440 this and this and this specifically, because I know of 219 00:15:21.559 --> 00:15:24.279 people here in Mexico who will go to her for 220 00:15:24.440 --> 00:15:27.639 like pretty much anything and everything. When you go to 221 00:15:27.720 --> 00:15:31.919 some of these like occult esoteric stores here, you will 222 00:15:31.960 --> 00:15:39.480 find effigies and candles for santamorte, for health, for like abundance, 223 00:15:39.919 --> 00:15:44.120 for love. You will find like for protection, for like 224 00:15:44.279 --> 00:15:47.000 legal justice. You know, people who have like cases in 225 00:15:47.080 --> 00:15:52.080 quarter or relatives who are in prison. Whatever. I mean, 226 00:15:52.120 --> 00:15:56.440 there's a candle for that, you know. So it's not 227 00:15:56.840 --> 00:16:00.679 like she's devoted specifically to one thing. She's like she 228 00:16:00.840 --> 00:16:02.200 covers many things. 229 00:16:02.720 --> 00:16:05.840 Yeah, do you think that part right there? Her covering 230 00:16:05.840 --> 00:16:07.559 many things could even be a little bit of like 231 00:16:07.639 --> 00:16:11.600 kind of like Mary's Catholic like influence or not so 232 00:16:11.679 --> 00:16:15.240 much influence. But like the other other version, you know 233 00:16:15.279 --> 00:16:19.039 what I'm saying, because you go to marry for anything. Yeah, 234 00:16:19.080 --> 00:16:20.919 you could see that like maybe crossing over. 235 00:16:21.919 --> 00:16:26.039 Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I mean you still like the aparage. 236 00:16:26.120 --> 00:16:29.039 Mexican is very quada lupano, which is like, you know, 237 00:16:29.120 --> 00:16:32.960 devoted to the virgin of But there are so many others, 238 00:16:33.000 --> 00:16:37.879 particularly in recent times, that you know, that figure like 239 00:16:37.960 --> 00:16:45.200 of the Benevolent Mother no longer cuts it because you 240 00:16:45.240 --> 00:16:48.399 have people who are like on the fringes of society 241 00:16:50.039 --> 00:16:54.200 who are fighting like to stay alive, whether because they're 242 00:16:54.440 --> 00:16:57.759 what they do for a living is dangerous, or maybe 243 00:16:57.759 --> 00:17:01.000 they make very little money, or or they are you know, 244 00:17:01.159 --> 00:17:09.240 struggling with really difficult things, you know, alcoholism, drug dependence 245 00:17:09.279 --> 00:17:13.319 and sort of thing. And I think that Santa Marte 246 00:17:13.519 --> 00:17:20.640 comes across is very universal and therefore non judgmental. There 247 00:17:20.680 --> 00:17:25.279 are some traits, of course, of the connection with Catholicism 248 00:17:25.359 --> 00:17:29.559 as far as like some people do like incorporate her 249 00:17:29.720 --> 00:17:34.400 into sort of like masses and they say Catholic prayers 250 00:17:34.440 --> 00:17:38.400 to her in her honor, and like there's no rule book, 251 00:17:38.759 --> 00:17:41.599 it's you can't say this is allowed, and this is 252 00:17:41.640 --> 00:17:46.960 not allowed because everyone here makes makes their their beliefs 253 00:17:47.000 --> 00:17:50.640 and their like practice and their faith, their own but 254 00:17:52.799 --> 00:17:57.519 it's kind of like more inclusive and more universal because 255 00:17:57.839 --> 00:18:02.039 even if let's say it's someone didn't have a mother figure, 256 00:18:02.480 --> 00:18:06.160 or if their mother figure was very lacking or very negative, 257 00:18:07.319 --> 00:18:11.960 Santa Marte is like truly universal because she connects with 258 00:18:12.079 --> 00:18:14.880 us all because she was there at the beginning and 259 00:18:14.960 --> 00:18:18.680 she will be there at the end regardless of anything 260 00:18:18.720 --> 00:18:22.559 we do. So I think that alone is what makes 261 00:18:22.559 --> 00:18:27.079 her like a very good alternative for people who are 262 00:18:27.119 --> 00:18:36.680 looking for a protector that is completely accepting and someone 263 00:18:36.720 --> 00:18:41.400 who still has that mothering sense, you know. But and 264 00:18:41.480 --> 00:18:46.359 she manifested like like with feminine energy from the beginning 265 00:18:46.400 --> 00:18:51.559 to this witch that I mentioned. But yeah, I mean 266 00:18:51.680 --> 00:18:55.200 I think that's that's the thing with Santa Marte. That's 267 00:18:55.279 --> 00:18:59.400 why she's like quickly, if not replacing like the Vision 268 00:18:59.440 --> 00:19:04.400 Delu aka the Virgin Mary Mexican version, maybe she's not 269 00:19:04.519 --> 00:19:08.759 replacing fully, but she is like competing like on very 270 00:19:08.759 --> 00:19:12.640 similar levels of like endearment and respect and attention. 271 00:19:16.920 --> 00:19:23.720 Thank you, you mentioned something about Guadalupe, not to get 272 00:19:23.759 --> 00:19:27.400 off the topic. That's the same one that I think. 273 00:19:27.400 --> 00:19:29.119 It's like a painting or whatever where now they're finding 274 00:19:29.119 --> 00:19:30.680 that might be like music in the air and there's 275 00:19:30.720 --> 00:19:34.000 actually like stuff within her eyes. I covered something a 276 00:19:34.000 --> 00:19:37.279 long time ago about like this painting of Guadalupe. There's 277 00:19:37.279 --> 00:19:39.400 some wild stuff in that thing. I don't know that's 278 00:19:39.440 --> 00:19:39.960 the same thing. 279 00:19:41.160 --> 00:19:45.160 Yeah, I don't know. I'm a bit skeptical because anything 280 00:19:45.200 --> 00:19:48.759 that comes from the Catholic Church directly and that is 281 00:19:48.839 --> 00:19:52.599 kind of sponsored by them, I'm very skeptical of. So. Yeah, 282 00:19:52.640 --> 00:19:54.839 I know that there have been like lots of studies 283 00:19:54.920 --> 00:20:01.960 on that figure and that sort of thing. I basically 284 00:20:01.960 --> 00:20:05.880 see it as an instrument of like colonial manipulation and 285 00:20:05.960 --> 00:20:10.440 mind control. So it has taken a life of its 286 00:20:10.440 --> 00:20:14.160 own because of the faith of like so many millions 287 00:20:14.200 --> 00:20:18.799 and millions of Mexicans for centuries. So now it has 288 00:20:18.839 --> 00:20:22.119 like a different type of value, and I wouldn't be 289 00:20:22.160 --> 00:20:25.279 able to like so easily discounted. But as far as 290 00:20:25.319 --> 00:20:29.720 you know, there being like like evidence and proof, I 291 00:20:29.799 --> 00:20:32.759 would be a bit skeptical about that. 292 00:20:33.200 --> 00:20:41.079 Yeah, what is so I guess what would be some practice? 293 00:20:41.079 --> 00:20:44.359 Is there any like specific practices or I do know, 294 00:20:44.400 --> 00:20:46.039 I think I could be wrong. Isn't there like once 295 00:20:46.079 --> 00:20:48.720 a month, like they pray with rosary beads? Or something 296 00:20:48.759 --> 00:20:51.359 like that's kind of a tradition or something like that, 297 00:20:51.519 --> 00:20:53.079 Like what kind of practices go wrong. 298 00:20:52.960 --> 00:20:57.279 With Yeah, I mean, as I said, some people like 299 00:20:58.240 --> 00:21:01.319 hold masses in her own this has to be done 300 00:21:01.440 --> 00:21:04.279 like kind of like outside of Catholic Church because they 301 00:21:04.319 --> 00:21:08.599 don't approve of it, and it's like admitted as an 302 00:21:08.599 --> 00:21:13.279 official like saying by any means, but people still like 303 00:21:13.480 --> 00:21:16.440 let's say that you happen to find a priest that 304 00:21:16.640 --> 00:21:19.319 is a Catholic ordained priest, but maybe they are like 305 00:21:19.880 --> 00:21:23.640 open or accepting of this idea, like even if non officially, 306 00:21:24.359 --> 00:21:26.599 maybe you can ask a priest to like come to 307 00:21:26.680 --> 00:21:30.200 your home and hold a mass in order of Santa Marte. 308 00:21:30.319 --> 00:21:33.920 I'm sure that happens. And as I said, there is 309 00:21:33.960 --> 00:21:39.680 no set rule book. Yeah, people do row adios for her, 310 00:21:39.880 --> 00:21:42.599 but I don't know, like I think that maybe is 311 00:21:42.680 --> 00:21:44.640 like once a day. It can be once a day 312 00:21:45.720 --> 00:21:46.960 or three times a day. 313 00:21:47.160 --> 00:21:50.200 You know, it did the amount of devotion and what 314 00:21:50.319 --> 00:21:57.119 people promise to Santa Marte, you know, and one important 315 00:21:57.160 --> 00:22:00.720 thing is that you never like with Morte. 316 00:22:01.359 --> 00:22:05.200 Devotion to her and like being in connection with her 317 00:22:05.920 --> 00:22:10.720 comes very differently, like you say, from other types of 318 00:22:10.960 --> 00:22:15.640 you know, practices or like believe systems, because she is 319 00:22:15.720 --> 00:22:18.920 considered more like a member of your family. You know, 320 00:22:19.119 --> 00:22:22.440 once that she is present in your in your life, 321 00:22:22.519 --> 00:22:26.039 in your house, you are expected to treat her as family. 322 00:22:26.160 --> 00:22:29.599 So this is why the offerings people bring her can 323 00:22:29.680 --> 00:22:33.960 be like money, like pour her drinks, bring her cigarettes. 324 00:22:34.319 --> 00:22:38.920 Some people bring her like marijuana cigarettes if they if 325 00:22:38.920 --> 00:22:44.240 they themselves like are users fools. And you are expected 326 00:22:44.279 --> 00:22:46.400 to like talk to her as you would talk to 327 00:22:46.559 --> 00:22:49.680 like a friend over drinks, you know, or over like 328 00:22:49.960 --> 00:22:51.480 a cup of coffee. 329 00:22:51.559 --> 00:22:51.759 You know. 330 00:22:52.440 --> 00:22:56.039 So it is a very personal and in a way 331 00:22:56.119 --> 00:23:00.960 informal practice. But you know, those those who like do 332 00:23:01.119 --> 00:23:05.920 more elaborate rituals for like specific purposes that I wouldn't 333 00:23:05.960 --> 00:23:08.920 know because I would have to have like personal knowledge 334 00:23:09.000 --> 00:23:11.960 or involvement in that, and so far I haven't like 335 00:23:12.079 --> 00:23:17.079 participated in any such ceremonies or rituals. I know that 336 00:23:17.359 --> 00:23:22.359 there are people that do bring like maybe sacrifices money, 337 00:23:22.599 --> 00:23:31.200 of course, but usually it's very very like personal, and 338 00:23:31.279 --> 00:23:37.440 there is no like organism or soul authority that sanctions 339 00:23:37.480 --> 00:23:42.319 how to petition her or how to like work with her, 340 00:23:42.799 --> 00:23:47.119 or like present your devotion to her. So it would 341 00:23:47.160 --> 00:23:50.960 be kind of like difficult to like establish because you know, 342 00:23:51.799 --> 00:23:54.880 there's a pilgrimage around like maybe once a year that 343 00:23:55.000 --> 00:23:59.039 some people do to this alter in Mexico City, in Tepito. 344 00:24:00.039 --> 00:24:02.559 I don't know the I'm not sure right now. It 345 00:24:02.599 --> 00:24:05.599 doesn't come to mind the exact date when this happens. 346 00:24:06.279 --> 00:24:09.319 But I mean, yeah, people do like a big celebration there. 347 00:24:09.400 --> 00:24:12.720 They bring things, they bring their effigies and and all 348 00:24:12.759 --> 00:24:17.920 of that, but it's I don't think that it can 349 00:24:18.000 --> 00:24:23.079 be said that there are like specific procedures that are 350 00:24:23.200 --> 00:24:24.119 to be followed there. 351 00:24:24.359 --> 00:24:27.240 Yeah. 352 00:24:27.960 --> 00:24:32.480 Yeah, Now have you ever been to well what about 353 00:24:32.559 --> 00:24:33.119 day of the day? 354 00:24:34.240 --> 00:24:37.640 Uh huh. Well, the thing is that day of the 355 00:24:37.720 --> 00:24:41.359 day is not precisely like a celebration of Santa Marte. 356 00:24:41.599 --> 00:24:48.480 It is connected. Day of the day is celebrated by 357 00:24:48.640 --> 00:24:53.000 almost i would say every Mexican household in some way. 358 00:24:54.240 --> 00:24:59.720 That celebration has existed since pre Hispanic times because over 359 00:24:59.759 --> 00:25:04.799 here back then there was like the goddess was Mickland 360 00:25:04.839 --> 00:25:09.960 tequickly and she had like this male counterpart. Also, mick 361 00:25:10.079 --> 00:25:13.680 Gland was a place where where the souls of the 362 00:25:13.799 --> 00:25:17.640 dead had to like get to after you know, dying 363 00:25:17.960 --> 00:25:22.000 in this world, and there was like a series of 364 00:25:22.039 --> 00:25:25.400 obstacles that they needed to surpass in order to reach 365 00:25:25.480 --> 00:25:29.559 that destination. So that's why mickland tequickly was like worshiped 366 00:25:29.920 --> 00:25:35.160 because people were like wanted safe passage for the spirits 367 00:25:35.200 --> 00:25:40.000 of their deceased. So from then, well after then the 368 00:25:40.559 --> 00:25:47.240 conquista from the Spanish and Catholicism, it intertwines with those beliefs. 369 00:25:47.279 --> 00:25:50.319 And right now, I mean it's like usually Day of 370 00:25:50.359 --> 00:25:54.759 the Dead is it starts the celebrations on the first 371 00:25:55.880 --> 00:25:59.920 of November, which is what we call for the little death, 372 00:26:00.240 --> 00:26:06.160 like the young death, like children who especially those who 373 00:26:06.200 --> 00:26:10.519 died without being baptized according to the Catholic Church, but 374 00:26:10.640 --> 00:26:15.519 in general, you know, children and like the younger death, 375 00:26:15.599 --> 00:26:19.680 you know, start arriving on November first, and then November 376 00:26:19.720 --> 00:26:24.720 second is when like the older death arrived. And you said, 377 00:26:24.799 --> 00:26:29.319 up this altar if you want on your homes decorated 378 00:26:29.400 --> 00:26:34.279 in specific ways that still carry significance from all the 379 00:26:34.279 --> 00:26:38.599 way from back from Prospanic times. You know the flowers 380 00:26:38.640 --> 00:26:44.680 and pasucci leon and these decorative elements, you know, these 381 00:26:45.240 --> 00:26:49.039 picado which is like paper decorated with like motives and 382 00:26:49.200 --> 00:26:51.279 you know, you see dead. You can see also you 383 00:26:51.279 --> 00:26:56.359 know Catholic saints right now, everything that is used to 384 00:26:56.400 --> 00:27:00.240 decorate and you place usually it's food and drink. It 385 00:27:00.359 --> 00:27:03.480 used to be like actual real food, real drinks. That 386 00:27:03.920 --> 00:27:07.920 the death that your loved ones who have died, that 387 00:27:07.960 --> 00:27:10.680 they used to enjoy when they were living. So you 388 00:27:10.720 --> 00:27:13.720 put that there in a corner of your home with 389 00:27:13.799 --> 00:27:19.240 some candles. People also if they go like all the way, 390 00:27:20.200 --> 00:27:24.160 they like to create like a path with like sempasuchial 391 00:27:24.200 --> 00:27:27.680 flowers from the entrance leading to the altar, so that 392 00:27:28.720 --> 00:27:31.160 the spirits and the source of the death can find 393 00:27:31.200 --> 00:27:35.400 their way to the altar. But if not, I mean 394 00:27:35.440 --> 00:27:39.240 in most businesses and homes and offices and all that 395 00:27:39.279 --> 00:27:43.079 you'll find like small altars just you know, with photographs, 396 00:27:43.119 --> 00:27:49.359 also possessions of like personal belongings of the deceased and 397 00:27:49.400 --> 00:27:52.200 things like that and commemorating them the food and the drink. 398 00:27:52.640 --> 00:28:00.160 Sometimes they are replaced with like pretend food and drink. Know, 399 00:28:00.240 --> 00:28:02.759 if you can't have like actual food there because of 400 00:28:03.079 --> 00:28:06.720 you know, attracting flies or whatever reason, you are at 401 00:28:06.839 --> 00:28:09.359