Speaker 1: Did Aaron ask for this? Yeah, all right, that's what
Speaker 1: I thought. Indeed, we've got to giveaway. Do we need
Speaker 1: to talk about coming up a little bit? We won't
Speaker 1: do that now because it would be in poor taste.
Speaker 1: I'll explain later. Aaron Falk, Saltlet Tribune, Well played, sir,
Speaker 1: Happy Thursday, Hey.
Speaker 2: Happy Thursday. Spent. I gotta I gotta say really quick. Uh,
Speaker 2: one of the oldest, the oldest I've ever felt in
Speaker 2: a sports world. I thought. I thought was watching Chipper
Speaker 2: Jones retire someone that I grew up loving, and I'm
Speaker 2: watching this at a bar and it's his last game.
Speaker 2: I'm like, I feel, I feel something. But I'll say,
Speaker 2: listening to the commercial breaks and listening to Emma Smith
Speaker 2: on behalf of Depends drop me to my knee. Just now,
Speaker 2: I feel a billion.
Speaker 1: Oh man, I needed that today. Thank you, sir. That
Speaker 1: combined with the bump man, you're coming in off the top,
Speaker 1: rub coming in hot man. I appreciate the time. All right, Aaron,
Speaker 1: Let's start with the very eventful Saturday night in Salt
Speaker 1: Lake City last Saturday, as Brigham Young rolled up to
Speaker 1: Salt Lake and went down to Provo with a win.
Speaker 1: In their back pocket. They're now undefeated. You know what,
Speaker 1: let's just get right to the good stuff. The holding
Speaker 1: call has been hotly debated. I don't think it's something
Speaker 1: that can be summarized with one reductive statement, like black
Speaker 1: or white in a vacuum. Yes, letter of the law.
Speaker 1: That is a foul, and b y U fans will
Speaker 1: simply latch onto that. And that's not wrong. I want
Speaker 1: to be clear, I'm not saying that it is, but
Speaker 1: it is a little bit more complex and nuanced. I
Speaker 1: thought Joel Klatt did a good job of equating it
Speaker 1: to a strike zone in baseball, where when the yump
Speaker 1: establishes what he's going to call that game, it kind
Speaker 1: of mandates you to adjust your swing to that strike zone.
Speaker 1: But what was your takeaway from the holding call heard
Speaker 1: around the world that Saturday night.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I think I'm in that camp of
Speaker 2: you know, you look at you look at it, and
Speaker 2: you see, you know, you read the rule and you see,
Speaker 2: you know, once once as past the point of being
Speaker 2: blocked and you see an arm extended like that, you
Speaker 2: put yourself in position to have that that flag thrown
Speaker 2: right like you know, Well, one day we can talk
Speaker 2: about the appearance of evil and the need to avoid it. Right,
Speaker 2: But when you get into that situation, if if in fact,
Speaker 2: and I'm not smart enough nor did I pay close
Speaker 2: enough attention to know truly how how many times or
Speaker 2: that that play happened and wasn't called or not. But
Speaker 2: clearly Kyle whitting Anfield's that that is a situation that
Speaker 2: they were allowed to get away with, not just in
Speaker 2: this game, but you know, in sort of Big twelve
Speaker 2: play throughout the year. He said, there's there is a
Speaker 2: difference between pac full officiating and Big Fuell officiating in
Speaker 2: that regard. And to do that in a moment where
Speaker 2: you know the game is on the line, you're you're
Speaker 2: the largest crowded stadium history is celebrating and you have
Speaker 2: to do it again, That's that is gutting. So I
Speaker 2: understand the frustration, and I understand the gloating on the
Speaker 2: other side. I mean, man, it is It's truly one
Speaker 2: of those things where it goes your way and you
Speaker 2: know you are we are a big believer in backing
Speaker 2: the referees and it doesn't and we hate them all.
Speaker 2: I mean, it's it is truly just dependent on your
Speaker 2: personal bias at this.
Speaker 1: Point, yeah, one hundred percent, and that will color the
Speaker 1: judgment of fans for sure. I try to exist in
Speaker 1: the space of being a little bit agnostic when it
Speaker 1: comes to doing the show, so I can accurately do
Speaker 1: the job, and I like you, I get the frustration
Speaker 1: of the utes, and I get the elation of the
Speaker 1: cougars for sure. But let's move over to what happened
Speaker 1: Aaron after the game. I was there, saw you and
Speaker 1: our guy ck up in the press box, and went down,
Speaker 1: watched the rest of the game on the sideline and
Speaker 1: went and said hello to Coladi and a Rod everybody
Speaker 1: after the game, offer my congratulations, and then kind of
Speaker 1: took the scene in dodging water bottles as I was
Speaker 1: right in front of the must a lot of water
Speaker 1: bottles being thrown, And as I'm making my way home
Speaker 1: walking across campus, my phone just blows up and all
Speaker 1: the messages were did you hear what Mark Carlan just said?
Speaker 1: And I said, now I'm walking home, And so somebody
Speaker 1: sent me the link to the social video and I
Speaker 1: watched it and I went, oh, no, he is going
Speaker 1: to be in so much trouble based off of what
Speaker 1: appears to be a pretty no nonsense guy, and brett
Speaker 1: Or Mark the commissioner of the Big Twelve, And I actually,
Speaker 1: Aaron thought forty k and a public reprimand was a
Speaker 1: good outcome when you question the integrity of the league
Speaker 1: and you use terms like they stole it from us.
Speaker 1: I thought I'd wake up to a voice recording of
Speaker 1: Mark Harlan asking brett Or Mark to find him two
Speaker 1: more points. So it was not a great look for
Speaker 1: the ad who, in my experience, is a measured smart guy.
Speaker 1: I wonder what your takeaways were.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I was sitting in the you know,
Speaker 2: in the press box high above the field. Audio is
Speaker 2: pumping in all and so I'm not in that room.
Speaker 2: All of a sudden, you just hear the words I've
Speaker 2: been an athletic reretor for twelve years, and my fingers
Speaker 2: took over and I'm just writing this quote down as
Speaker 2: fast as possible because I know what's coming is going
Speaker 2: to be something extremely interesting.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 2: I think this was a stunner, And you know, you
Speaker 2: you look around and there are just so many takes
Speaker 2: where it's like I've never I have not seen an
Speaker 2: athlete di record do this. You know, it's just it's
Speaker 2: so rare, and I think you're you're spot on to
Speaker 2: use those where it's stolen it is those are it's
Speaker 2: just inflammatory.
Speaker 1: And uh.
Speaker 2: The thing that I'm still scratching my head about a
Speaker 2: little bit and wondering, you know what brett yor Mark
Speaker 2: really feels about all this is the is that line.
Speaker 2: You know, we were happy to be in the Big
Speaker 2: twelve and tonight we're not. And and what whatever you
Speaker 2: want to say, We've we've heard for a decade how
Speaker 2: bad Pact twelve officiating was right and and now you know,
Speaker 2: if we want to talk about maybe maybe this is
Speaker 2: inconsistent Big twelve officiating. But this is a to me,
Speaker 2: I'm I'm still scratching my head that this is a
Speaker 2: Big twelve problem in the eyes of Mark Harlan and
Speaker 2: what that actually means. And I'm trying to unpack that,
Speaker 2: and I'm not sure I have my answer yet. But
Speaker 2: I can see that line in particular, doing a lot
Speaker 2: of public relations damage for the university, and it spans
Speaker 2: at least in truck stop country, and it is a
Speaker 2: lot of a lot of public relations.
Speaker 1: Damage sure, and it also does not help the narrative
Speaker 1: and I don't live online, but I certainly am a
Speaker 1: human who does this for a living, So you have
Speaker 1: to stay plugged in to some extent. And I think
Speaker 1: it's very fair to say that several members of the
Speaker 1: Utah fan base were very how shall I say, confidence
Speaker 1: about year one of the Big Twelve, and probably with
Speaker 1: merit because this team was picked to win the conference
Speaker 1: by Vegas and the media and others. But that brought
Speaker 1: a lot of pushback from other people in the conference
Speaker 1: about the narrative that you think you're too good for us,
Speaker 1: you think you should be in the Big Ten, but
Speaker 1: you're not, and this is a necessary home for Utah
Speaker 1: until the next shift happens. And then when Mark says
Speaker 1: something like that, I just think it furthers the narrative
Speaker 1: that is permeating throughout the Big Twelve that Utah thinks
Speaker 1: they're too good for that conference. And you add to
Speaker 1: the fact they have one conference win. It's just, you know,
Speaker 1: the Utah right now taking someone else in that direction.
Speaker 1: What are your thoughts on that?
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean no doubt, and I guess to go
Speaker 2: back to it, and you know, I think you could
Speaker 2: you could break this down in a in a level
Speaker 2: of conspiracy theory, and we tried to reach out to UH,
Speaker 2: to mister Harlan to get some some more information on
Speaker 2: what he meant here. You know, I think maybe maybe
Speaker 2: you can get some more. But I mean, if it's
Speaker 2: a big twelve issue, is it refereeing consistency or is
Speaker 2: it a big twelve issue that a conference leading team
Speaker 2: is getting set up better to be to be better
Speaker 2: positioned for a college football playoff spot. I mean, I
Speaker 2: can see how some conspiracy theorists go down a very
Speaker 2: deep and scary rap, and that's where I'm really really
Speaker 2: like questioning what that means.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a really good point, actually really good angle
Speaker 1: to take, because you just try to take him at
Speaker 1: his word and then give him the benefit of the doubt,
Speaker 1: because we certainly all deserve that. And I've had emotional
Speaker 1: moments in my life where I'd very much like a
Speaker 1: do over. I want to ask you one more thing
Speaker 1: about this, though, because I honestly erin from the minute
Speaker 1: I heard it Saturday night, I have just been thinking
Speaker 1: about his why why would you do that? You didn't
Speaker 1: have to, ads don't do that? Is it showing his
Speaker 1: head coach that he has his back. Is it really
Speaker 1: believing to your point that something doesn't smell right here?
Speaker 1: Like if you're a smart guy, like if I guess
Speaker 1: the simplest explanation emotional after loss five straight l's heat
Speaker 1: of the moment, robbery game stuff from you know, the
Speaker 1: scale of simply emotional to all the way on the
Speaker 1: other side of maybe something's afoot here. Why do you
Speaker 1: think he decided to take that approach?
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, you know, I and so I'll walk
Speaker 2: it back and be you know, more more measured now here.
Speaker 2: But I think you the most likely outcome in any
Speaker 2: in any situation is we are emotional beings. This guy
Speaker 2: was pissed off, right and and that's the only reason
Speaker 2: that you see him walking onto the field in in
Speaker 2: the run of play, uh and and drawing that penalty.
Speaker 2: This is why you you know, you see him, you know,
Speaker 2: sometime after having at least enough time to pause and
Speaker 2: and and maybe have somebody say don't do this, to
Speaker 2: still be that fired up. I mean, he was clearly, clearly,
Speaker 2: clearly angry. I think that's the most likely you know,
Speaker 2: are we are we just sending a message or are
Speaker 2: we just venting that? This has been a very tough
Speaker 2: year and in this moment when you think you have
Speaker 2: a chance to you know, save your season a little bit,
Speaker 2: that everything just boils over and that that's probably the
Speaker 2: most likely outcome. I don't know that it's as conspiracy
Speaker 2: conspiratorialism as maybe it could be, but nevertheless, like wow,
Speaker 2: like a few people could have stopped him, he could
Speaker 2: have stopped himself, and here we are.
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, and uh, you know, uh, the news cycle
Speaker 1: will move on and people will hone in on something else.
Speaker 1: I do think in ten years there and this will
Speaker 1: be known as the Mark Carlan game. You know, we
Speaker 1: we we often label these games with a beck to Harlen,
Speaker 1: a fourth and eighteen, a Brandon Burton block, a Brett Ratliffe. Crazy.
Speaker 1: This in ten years has to be the Mark Carlin Knight,
Speaker 1: doesn't it.
Speaker 2: Oh no, no doubt about it. I mean, and and
Speaker 2: that is you know, I'll say this, We can will
Speaker 2: break this down with a with a level of of
Speaker 2: of seriousness and scrutiny as we should right now. And
Speaker 2: it is absolutely the thing that becomes lore that that
Speaker 2: makes uh college football something that we that we care
Speaker 2: about and and focus on because there are moments like
Speaker 2: this there are, there are emotions like this there. You know,
Speaker 2: the stakes are this high in Mark Carland's mind even
Speaker 2: in a season like that, And that's why ultimately weak care,
Speaker 2: why fans care, why anybody's in that stadium.
Speaker 1: What is your I don't know. I was going to say,
Speaker 1: what's your favorite part of the off field dynamic of
Speaker 1: that week? But what are what are some of the
Speaker 1: things you're You're a local, you're a resident. You are
Speaker 1: an aggie, not a cougar or a ute. So you're
Speaker 1: a bit agnostic in a way where I think you'd
Speaker 1: have a measured approach to the question, because the off
Speaker 1: field stuff, to me has always been so fascinating when
Speaker 1: it comes to Utah BYU football specifically and the week
Speaker 1: leading up and then the reaction afterwards, because you've got
Speaker 1: a BYU fan base that so badly wants the moral
Speaker 1: high ground all the time that after the game you're
Speaker 1: getting tweets about send me every video of a youthe
Speaker 1: fan that said anything bad to you, and we'll post
Speaker 1: it and we'll call them out. And then you've got
Speaker 1: like the other side of youth fans that want to
Speaker 1: call out the piousness and the judgmental holier than that
Speaker 1: attitude of the BYU fans and we're all this really weird,
Speaker 1: you know, extended family that probably has a lot of dysfunction.
Speaker 1: And I do think at the end of the day
Speaker 1: there's respect and love between the coaching staffs and the programs.
Speaker 1: But what are some of the elements about this week
Speaker 1: and this thing off the field that stand out most
Speaker 1: of you? Oh?
Speaker 2: I mean, I think just that it does create those
Speaker 2: types of bonds you know, within and we can, you know,
Speaker 2: debate how healthy it is from time to time. But
Speaker 2: just the fact that you know, you you went, you
Speaker 2: went to the U. I'm sure you look across you know,
Speaker 2: you don't you don't have this bond because you shared
Speaker 2: chemistry class with somebody, right, you don't have you don't
Speaker 2: have this bond just because of of that moment like this, uh,
Speaker 2: like the game itself and what that means is is
Speaker 2: so is so responsible for the like the love that
Speaker 2: so many people have for their college experience that I mean,
Speaker 2: I think it's it's a just so it's incredibly cool
Speaker 2: how powerful that is. Now sometimes it's a bit scary,
Speaker 2: but I think, you know, just just to know that
Speaker 2: there's something like that has that kind of ability. Is
Speaker 2: is awesome. And then you know, I mean there there
Speaker 2: are so many like dumb and and good quality rivalry
Speaker 2: things happen, and like credit credit to the latter day sayings,
Speaker 2: so like that, put the score up in the in
Speaker 2: the hymns on Sunday afterwards, and are and are bringing
Speaker 2: our bringing smack talk to the pulpit in the name
Speaker 2: of the Lord. That is so funny. I'm sorry, it.
Speaker 1: Is, it is. It's awesome. The whole thing is hilarious
Speaker 1: to me. It's you know, and when you kind of
Speaker 1: remove the emotion and just more mostly observe the whole thing,
Speaker 1: it really is a fun week. And I thought it
Speaker 1: was a fun game. All right, let me move over here.
Speaker 1: So I did not know who Brandon Rose's mother was
Speaker 1: until today, So shout out to I think it's Laurie Rose,
Speaker 1: Laura Lynn something like that, she said I And I'm
Speaker 1: sure the folks up at the Utah football facility are
Speaker 1: just thrilled this today because she sent out a tweet
Speaker 1: that said prayers for Brandon please. This is Brandon Rose's
Speaker 1: mother via social media. He'll be having surgery today and
Speaker 1: Saturday night's game in the second quarter, just before halftime,
Speaker 1: he tore his Liz Frank ligament. They gave him heavy
Speaker 1: pain meds and a steel plated insul so he could
Speaker 1: continue playing. The doctor couldn't believe he was really even
Speaker 1: able to walk. This is extremely painful and your foot
Speaker 1: is totally unstable. Fortunately, with surgery, he'll make a full
Speaker 1: recovery and come back stronger than ever. I'll be with
Speaker 1: him in Utah for a few days to outbout. We
Speaker 1: appreciate the calls, text messages and support now in the
Speaker 1: order of fairness. Earlier in the show, I received a
Speaker 1: message from a source who will remain unnamed, saying he
Speaker 1: did not get shut up, nor did he get any
Speaker 1: pain meds, nor has any athlete ever received pain medication
Speaker 1: opioids to return to the sport At the University of Utah.
Speaker 1: He received an anti inflammatory pill and he did not
Speaker 1: have a fracture. And I'll just say that that's coming
Speaker 1: from somebody who would absolutely know. So what's your reaction
Speaker 1: to this That apparently it was a second quarter injury.
Speaker 1: They marched him out there played in the second half.
Speaker 1: Maybe explains the anemic offense or performance in the second half,
Speaker 1: But obviously this is something that broke today and give
Speaker 1: me your thoughts.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, I will say this, like one thing that
Speaker 2: I always have to do in moments like this, and uh,
Speaker 2: it's it's hard and it takes a little bit of time.
Speaker 2: Is like, I truly don't know if this is Brandon
Speaker 2: Res' mom It probably is, but I have no like,
Speaker 2: no other other than someone saying that they are. That's
Speaker 2: the only like I followed that account because I have
Speaker 2: never had any interaction with that before. So I'm trying,
Speaker 2: you know, I think we're all trying to figure things
Speaker 2: out in real time. And like I said, very very
Speaker 2: likely that it is. You know, I don't have any
Speaker 2: any specific reason to doubt it at the moment, but
Speaker 2: like I always kind of come from a place of doubt,
Speaker 2: So I don't know. Part two, I am curious, and
Speaker 2: I'm glad to hear that that you've got that from
Speaker 2: from a source, because I am curious exactly how extensive
Speaker 2: you know, a halftime evaluation is in that moment, Like
Speaker 2: and just to say that there's no fracture would mean
Speaker 2: in my mind that there was an X ray right,
Speaker 2: like there was something something done to to to prove
Speaker 2: where we are, because I think the reality is, you know,
Speaker 2: you look at these guys and and you know, it
Speaker 2: is a sport that breeds warrior mindset, right, and you're
Speaker 2: supposed to push through. Not only that, but you have
Speaker 2: a ton of adrenaline, you have a lot of peer
Speaker 2: pressure to go out and do it. So and and
Speaker 2: and it probably a desire. I mean, Brandon Rose has
Speaker 2: been waiting a very long time to be a quarterback
Speaker 2: that plays for the University of Utah, right and here
Speaker 2: he is in the middle of his moment, playing well,
Speaker 2: and he's probably not incentivized to say, hey, you know what,
Speaker 2: I don't think I can go back out there because
Speaker 2: he doesn't want to lose his job. He doesn't he
Speaker 2: doesn't want to lose that moment. So, you know, do
Speaker 2: I I think it's it's probably imperfect on a lot
Speaker 2: of levels. Do I think somebody was saying, Brandon, I
Speaker 2: don't care, suck it up, go out there and do it.
Speaker 2: Maybe not as much as as it is just internalized
Speaker 2: by the entire setup of you know, here I am,
Speaker 2: I have my moment. I cannot say take me out right,
Speaker 2: And so when he doesn't, look if he goes through
Speaker 2: those checks and he's saying he's gonna he's gonna go
Speaker 2: and he doesn't look bad. Then I think you have
Speaker 2: to be like, you know that that makes sense. It
Speaker 2: makes sense that that that happens from time to time.
Speaker 2: The one that you know, I think I feel like
Speaker 2: just kind of eye test wise, rising against Arizona State
Speaker 2: was one where we're like, maybe he says he can go,
Speaker 2: but the eye test here says this is not working. Right.
Speaker 2: That's that's more of a head scratcher to me than
Speaker 2: than maybe the Brandon Road situation. But again, I don't
Speaker 2: know all the ins and outs of what happened in
Speaker 2: that medical check or not.
Speaker 1: All right, buddy, before I say you loose, what was
Speaker 1: it like introducing the children to Gordon?
Speaker 2: Uh? You know what? They love him. They you know
Speaker 2: Gordon Gordon brings a uh some some great historical knowledge
Speaker 2: and he doesn't take himself too seriously and he's down
Speaker 2: to help them out like that is the beautiful thing.
Speaker 2: I think a lot of people that have done these
Speaker 2: jobs for a long time and all of a sudden
Speaker 2: you get some eager, you know, twenty two year olds
Speaker 2: who maybe you know know or think they know things
Speaker 2: that maybe they don't or whatever it could, it could
Speaker 2: red you the wrong way. Gordon is there to help
Speaker 2: out and it's awesome.
Speaker 1: Gotta love it, buddy. Appreciate the time. Have a good weekend.
Speaker 2: Okay, hey, you too. Take care.
Speaker 1: Aaron Falk, editor of the sports section of the Salt
Speaker 1: Lake Tribune, and get him on Twitter at Aaron Falk
Speaker 1: is where you find him. And he's got two a's
Speaker 1: in Aaron, so check that out.