WEBVTT 1 00:00:29.920 --> 00:00:32.759 Welcome to mid Rats with sal from Commander Salamander, an 2 00:00:32.799 --> 00:00:36.079 Eagle one from Eagle Speak at seer Shure your home 3 00:00:36.119 --> 00:00:39.479 for a discussion of national security issues and all things maritime. 4 00:00:40.600 --> 00:00:43.479 And welcome on board everybody to your pre fourth of 5 00:00:43.560 --> 00:00:47.280 July free for all. We really appreciate you all taking 6 00:00:47.320 --> 00:00:49.759 time to join us today, whether you are live or 7 00:00:49.799 --> 00:00:52.439 you're getting it via the podcast. But if you are 8 00:00:52.479 --> 00:00:54.840 with us live, i'd like to extend the invitation. Go 9 00:00:54.880 --> 00:00:57.039 ahead and head over and find the chat room. You 10 00:00:57.079 --> 00:00:59.320 can roll right in there if you have some observations 11 00:00:59.320 --> 00:01:01.359 you would like to show during the course of the show, 12 00:01:01.920 --> 00:01:04.760 are some questions that you wanted to throw Mark or 13 00:01:04.840 --> 00:01:08.239 my way, please do. This is a free for all format, 14 00:01:08.319 --> 00:01:10.680 so we have the things that we want to chat 15 00:01:10.719 --> 00:01:13.680 about today, but obviously if there's something that's tickling your 16 00:01:13.719 --> 00:01:15.879 rib you would like for us to chat about, that's 17 00:01:15.920 --> 00:01:19.079 the perfect place to do it. And as always, I'll 18 00:01:19.120 --> 00:01:22.040 just put the altocol out there. If you are with 19 00:01:22.200 --> 00:01:25.519 us Live and you aren't already subscribed to the podcast, 20 00:01:25.560 --> 00:01:28.719 you can head over to iTunes, Spotify, Spreaker, wherever you 21 00:01:28.760 --> 00:01:32.000 get your podcasts, find us subscribe that way, we will 22 00:01:32.040 --> 00:01:34.840 be waiting for you can't beat the price. And on 23 00:01:34.879 --> 00:01:37.120 that note, Mark, Hey, happy Sunday to you. 24 00:01:37.640 --> 00:01:41.200 Hey, thank you very much. Well, I just disappear. Nope, 25 00:01:41.200 --> 00:01:45.840 and hope you're still here. My screen disappeared. That's always shocking. 26 00:01:46.840 --> 00:01:50.159 Yeah, we had a little experience we're talking about in 27 00:01:50.200 --> 00:01:52.040 the pre show for the listeners, just so you know 28 00:01:52.079 --> 00:01:54.560 you're not the only people that happens to. It's kind 29 00:01:54.599 --> 00:01:58.079 of a running too. I don't know if we've been 30 00:01:58.120 --> 00:02:00.359 keeping track of how many times I've been able to 31 00:02:00.400 --> 00:02:03.280 log on like ten seconds before the those starts, even 32 00:02:03.359 --> 00:02:06.760 when we have a guest and you had a little 33 00:02:06.760 --> 00:02:09.800 trouble having to do a Chrome update, shaking a chicken, 34 00:02:11.000 --> 00:02:13.360 make a sacrifice the ball, and everything else, but you 35 00:02:13.400 --> 00:02:15.080 did get your computer up and running in time for 36 00:02:15.159 --> 00:02:16.759 us to do a little bit of appreciative Yeah. 37 00:02:16.759 --> 00:02:20.000 It what's the what's the character that joebu or from 38 00:02:20.120 --> 00:02:24.280 a major league mcclass of rum and a cigar and 39 00:02:24.319 --> 00:02:25.960 then all of a sudden it came came. 40 00:02:25.879 --> 00:02:29.560 Up so good nough, So I mean it's it's you know, 41 00:02:29.560 --> 00:02:31.240 we did a free for all last week, but we 42 00:02:31.280 --> 00:02:33.599 always joked and we only do an hour and we 43 00:02:33.639 --> 00:02:37.000 could probably talk. Sometimes our post show goes another twenty 44 00:02:37.000 --> 00:02:39.759 minutes if we don't ever record it. But there's a 45 00:02:39.800 --> 00:02:42.479 lot going on. But what what what broke above your 46 00:02:42.479 --> 00:02:44.280 background noise the most for you this week? 47 00:02:45.560 --> 00:02:48.280 Well, uh, you know, obviously there's been a lot of 48 00:02:48.280 --> 00:02:54.879 discussion about the the success of the Irane, the Iranian 49 00:02:55.439 --> 00:03:00.800 the attack on the Iranian nuclear program and uh so 50 00:03:00.919 --> 00:03:03.080 you know that's that's been, that's been there. We've got 51 00:03:03.080 --> 00:03:04.879 a lot of other stuff going on. We you know, 52 00:03:04.960 --> 00:03:07.919 there Jerry doctor, Jerry Hendrix I see is on the 53 00:03:07.960 --> 00:03:11.000 staff of the the people trying to get the ship 54 00:03:11.000 --> 00:03:14.439 building program going. He sounds like he's doing doing well. 55 00:03:14.599 --> 00:03:16.919 But among other things, there was a there was a 56 00:03:17.000 --> 00:03:19.680 post an x what do you call him tweet? I 57 00:03:19.719 --> 00:03:22.840 don't know what to call him now, tweet tweet, Yeah, 58 00:03:23.000 --> 00:03:24.919 by a guy by a guy who goes by the 59 00:03:24.960 --> 00:03:29.240 name of Infantry Dort and uh he he was, you know, 60 00:03:29.360 --> 00:03:32.319 talking about he didn't want to slide into Islamophobia, I 61 00:03:32.319 --> 00:03:35.960 don't think, but he talked about some culture shock issues 62 00:03:36.000 --> 00:03:42.919 facing our forces who were involved in Afghanistan Iraq, and uh, 63 00:03:43.400 --> 00:03:46.800 you know that that caused me to think about, Uh, 64 00:03:47.800 --> 00:03:52.199 Samuel Huntington's the clash of civilizations, which has been critiqued 65 00:03:52.199 --> 00:03:55.439 by a number of people has not been exactly right, 66 00:03:55.560 --> 00:03:59.000 but a lot of other people are looking at and gone, yeah, 67 00:03:59.120 --> 00:04:01.800 we see these these new boundaries. With the end of 68 00:04:01.840 --> 00:04:06.039 the Cold War, the nation state and the and the 69 00:04:06.120 --> 00:04:10.599 advance of globalization, the nate state, nation state becomes less important, 70 00:04:10.599 --> 00:04:13.319 and then people are falling where their countries, you know, 71 00:04:13.360 --> 00:04:18.040 I have have have kind of gone by the wayside 72 00:04:18.120 --> 00:04:21.279 or are not as important to them as there as 73 00:04:21.399 --> 00:04:23.639 other things that a lot of times, religion and some 74 00:04:23.680 --> 00:04:27.160 of the other aspects of life have taken over their 75 00:04:27.759 --> 00:04:31.079 their center spot in their lives. So, you know, it's 76 00:04:31.120 --> 00:04:33.600 a pretty He makes a pretty good point somewhere along 77 00:04:33.639 --> 00:04:38.120 the way that that he's unaware of people. You know, 78 00:04:38.160 --> 00:04:40.439 you could be a French Canadian, you can be a 79 00:04:42.240 --> 00:04:48.079 a Algerian French person, but he's never heard of anybody 80 00:04:48.160 --> 00:04:52.879 being a half half Catholic, half Muslim. And you know, 81 00:04:52.920 --> 00:04:56.000 there there are certain cultural things and we're seeing a 82 00:04:56.040 --> 00:04:59.279 lot of this stuff come out coming into play these days. 83 00:04:59.680 --> 00:05:05.079 But the Glastonbury event, a lot of other places where 84 00:05:05.120 --> 00:05:07.879 we're seeing people who are not assimilating into the culture 85 00:05:08.000 --> 00:05:10.439 of the of the nations they're currently living in, but 86 00:05:10.600 --> 00:05:14.959 are hanging on to their their center, which is, you know, 87 00:05:15.040 --> 00:05:19.439 their religion, not necessarily their race, not anything else or 88 00:05:19.480 --> 00:05:22.040 where they came from, but the religion that they that 89 00:05:22.079 --> 00:05:22.800 they belong to. 90 00:05:24.040 --> 00:05:26.079 Yeah, you and I have done a good job over 91 00:05:26.079 --> 00:05:29.360 the last fifteen years. We try to you know, it'll 92 00:05:29.399 --> 00:05:31.319 touch on now and the things you can't avoid some things 93 00:05:31.319 --> 00:05:34.639 and evolve politics or some of the cultural issues. But 94 00:05:35.160 --> 00:05:37.759 I think, you know, inside the lifelines of a national 95 00:05:37.800 --> 00:05:41.480 security discussion, I think I think there this is something 96 00:05:41.519 --> 00:05:46.560 that's worthy of discussion because when we look at you, 97 00:05:46.759 --> 00:05:50.959 within the last one hundred fifty years or so, two 98 00:05:50.959 --> 00:05:53.720 of the major waves of immigrants came to this country. 99 00:05:54.759 --> 00:05:57.439 I'll just use as a data point the Irish and 100 00:05:57.480 --> 00:06:00.399 the Italians, because those big waves are you know, those 101 00:06:00.439 --> 00:06:03.720 people that were third or fourth generation in But when 102 00:06:03.720 --> 00:06:07.160 those individuals showed up in the first generation and the 103 00:06:07.199 --> 00:06:11.000 second generation, one thing that characterized them more than anything 104 00:06:11.079 --> 00:06:14.560 else were how much they loved this country and why 105 00:06:14.560 --> 00:06:18.000 they came to this country. Especially on the Union side 106 00:06:18.000 --> 00:06:20.600 and World War Two, you had a lot of Irish 107 00:06:20.639 --> 00:06:23.600 that had barely been off the boat and they filled 108 00:06:23.639 --> 00:06:27.079 out some civil War autist, I'm sure will correct me, 109 00:06:27.360 --> 00:06:31.160 but it was a couple of regiments of Irish that 110 00:06:31.199 --> 00:06:34.399 fought on the Union. There's actually some smaller units around 111 00:06:34.480 --> 00:06:37.279 Charleston area mostly that fought for the Confederacy as well. 112 00:06:37.800 --> 00:06:41.720 Very patriotic, very self sacrificing for their country. The big 113 00:06:41.759 --> 00:06:47.680 wave of of Italians, it came over here in the 114 00:06:47.720 --> 00:06:50.839 first couple of decades of the twentieth century, especially right 115 00:06:50.839 --> 00:06:54.199 after World War One. We had no shortage of Italian translators. 116 00:06:54.279 --> 00:06:57.800 During World War Two, they were great Americans. You look 117 00:06:57.839 --> 00:07:02.720 at even the way they were treated after December seventh 118 00:07:02.800 --> 00:07:06.439 of forty one. Japanese Americans, a lot of them at 119 00:07:06.439 --> 00:07:09.720 that point were second generation. Even though they were put 120 00:07:09.759 --> 00:07:12.600 in camps, they enlisted in tremendous numbers and produced the 121 00:07:14.519 --> 00:07:17.360 most decorated unit in the US Army in World War Two, 122 00:07:17.399 --> 00:07:20.360 or one of the Japanese Americans units. So you have 123 00:07:20.439 --> 00:07:24.199 that data point. And the Japanese came here that was 124 00:07:24.920 --> 00:07:28.600 mostly Buddhist culture, though a lot of them became Christians 125 00:07:28.639 --> 00:07:29.920 when they came over here. And of course you had 126 00:07:29.920 --> 00:07:32.000 a lot of the Christians from Nagasaki who came over 127 00:07:33.040 --> 00:07:37.279 as well. But that is a different flavor of people 128 00:07:37.480 --> 00:07:41.439 that have come here. And I'll use one example that 129 00:07:41.519 --> 00:07:43.839 covers two different parts of the country and I'll name 130 00:07:43.959 --> 00:07:46.839 names because she's been out there and been quite advocate 131 00:07:47.439 --> 00:07:51.920 advocating her position. You look at Representative il Han Omar, 132 00:07:52.439 --> 00:07:54.160 and there's also I can't recall her name off the 133 00:07:54.160 --> 00:07:56.079 top of my head, but she's a state representative for 134 00:07:56.199 --> 00:08:00.360 Maine from around Lewiston. They're both from Somalia. And when 135 00:08:00.360 --> 00:08:04.879 you look at ill hand Omar specifically, her father was 136 00:08:05.120 --> 00:08:09.600 a colonel in the communist government of Somalia that got 137 00:08:09.639 --> 00:08:13.680 overthrown in a revolution, was in a refugee camp, came 138 00:08:13.720 --> 00:08:15.680 to the US, I'm believe when she was nine years old, 139 00:08:16.279 --> 00:08:18.920 and she got elected to Congress, and she's got a 140 00:08:18.959 --> 00:08:22.000 lot of her family over here in the best country 141 00:08:22.199 --> 00:08:26.680 in the world, and yet you will find somebody who 142 00:08:27.759 --> 00:08:31.199 at every turn has the worst things to say about 143 00:08:31.519 --> 00:08:34.200 her adopted nation that she represents in one of our 144 00:08:34.279 --> 00:08:38.120 highest bodies an official can be elected to. And very 145 00:08:38.120 --> 00:08:42.440 similar that's been echoed in Maine with that Somali community that. 146 00:08:42.440 --> 00:08:43.240 You have there. 147 00:08:44.799 --> 00:08:50.000 I am here to represent the issues of Somali Americans. 148 00:08:50.039 --> 00:08:54.039 Completely flipped from what we have seen in previous And 149 00:08:55.320 --> 00:08:57.600 you know, I don't agree with everything that Infantry Door 150 00:08:57.759 --> 00:08:59.960 put in the comment section, but a lot of it 151 00:09:00.120 --> 00:09:03.679 ring true, especially for those of us that deployed on 152 00:09:03.720 --> 00:09:06.559 the ground in the Middle East that I spent most 153 00:09:06.559 --> 00:09:09.120 of much twenty years and twenty one years involved in. 154 00:09:10.120 --> 00:09:13.440 And it's something that it's difficult to have a conversation 155 00:09:13.519 --> 00:09:16.960 about because people will immediately call you the most nasty 156 00:09:17.000 --> 00:09:18.639 things in the world. Though I don't think it bites 157 00:09:18.679 --> 00:09:20.759 as much as it used to. But we need to 158 00:09:20.759 --> 00:09:24.759 look clearly at it because it's a different challenge when 159 00:09:24.759 --> 00:09:27.240 you have people immigrate to this country who do not 160 00:09:27.360 --> 00:09:30.120 want to not only don't want to assimilate, but are 161 00:09:30.639 --> 00:09:33.799 actively hostile to it. And it's founding neath us. 162 00:09:34.799 --> 00:09:37.639 Yeah, and some of the stuff that Infantry Door put 163 00:09:37.679 --> 00:09:43.440 in there was reflects more culture shocked than cultural clash. 164 00:09:43.480 --> 00:09:46.919 I mean, it's although sometimes hard to tell the difference, 165 00:09:47.279 --> 00:09:51.399 but you know, what he reports is not much different 166 00:09:51.399 --> 00:09:53.559 than what I saw when I lived in an Islamic 167 00:09:53.639 --> 00:09:59.799 country back in the late nineteen sixties. So some of 168 00:09:59.840 --> 00:10:04.200 the the activities are apparently timeless. Uh And and if 169 00:10:04.240 --> 00:10:07.039 you have any doubt, you could watch lorens of Arabia 170 00:10:07.080 --> 00:10:10.639 and see some of those activities continued there too. I mean, 171 00:10:10.639 --> 00:10:14.919 it is is the question really is, is there is 172 00:10:14.919 --> 00:10:20.320 it possible for people who are so wrapped up in 173 00:10:20.559 --> 00:10:25.399 their culture to assimilate or even want to assimilate into 174 00:10:25.440 --> 00:10:29.679 a culture they view as being totally counter to their 175 00:10:30.399 --> 00:10:34.679 belief systems, And it is, you know, I find that 176 00:10:34.799 --> 00:10:37.919 I don't I don't know. I'm not proposing that we 177 00:10:37.919 --> 00:10:41.039 we intern anybody and and do all the stuff we 178 00:10:41.080 --> 00:10:45.840 did to the Italians and and the Japanese in World 179 00:10:45.879 --> 00:10:48.080 War two. I'm just curious as to where we're going 180 00:10:48.120 --> 00:10:50.720 to go with this and how how long you know, 181 00:10:51.200 --> 00:10:56.080 the classic line from Abraham Lincoln, you know, kind of 182 00:10:56.120 --> 00:11:01.480 country divided against itself survive and how you know? Right now, 183 00:11:01.519 --> 00:11:03.840 it's a fairly small group of people, but there are 184 00:11:03.840 --> 00:11:09.120 also a lot of We've seen a lot more return 185 00:11:09.279 --> 00:11:13.840 to religious religious behavior. Secularization seems to be kind of fading. 186 00:11:13.840 --> 00:11:17.799 We're getting more young people involved in religion, in Christianity 187 00:11:17.840 --> 00:11:21.120 and other religions. A lot of people are seeking something 188 00:11:21.200 --> 00:11:24.960 to give them a basis because the society as a 189 00:11:24.960 --> 00:11:27.159 whole seems to be a little bit of drift right now, 190 00:11:27.720 --> 00:11:32.000 as whereas the shared values we had if we you know, 191 00:11:32.559 --> 00:11:36.879 sixty eighty years ago, you know there was some we've 192 00:11:36.919 --> 00:11:41.799 been all unite against the communist menace. We could well 193 00:11:41.879 --> 00:11:43.879 not all of us. Some of us just became elected 194 00:11:43.919 --> 00:11:49.759 representatives and centator from New Hampshire where he's from Vermont anyway, 195 00:11:50.080 --> 00:11:52.600 So you know, it's a question, and I think that 196 00:11:52.720 --> 00:11:55.440 is a national security issue. You can you have people 197 00:11:55.480 --> 00:11:58.679 who were in this country who are acting against the 198 00:11:58.720 --> 00:12:01.960 best interests of of the society they live in. 199 00:12:02.039 --> 00:12:05.279 And you mentioned something I think that also ties into it. 200 00:12:05.360 --> 00:12:08.519 And there's a little bit of this that the you 201 00:12:08.559 --> 00:12:11.600 have your relative distance that it takes to travel to 202 00:12:11.679 --> 00:12:15.720 assimilate to a new culture. For instance, back when we 203 00:12:15.720 --> 00:12:22.600 were kids, Dearmore and Michigan or my hometown had Lebanese 204 00:12:22.919 --> 00:12:27.159 palesin what's now called Palestinians and Syrians have been coming 205 00:12:27.159 --> 00:12:29.240 here for one hundred and twenty five years. But they 206 00:12:29.240 --> 00:12:34.480 were Christians and they were no different than somebody who 207 00:12:35.879 --> 00:12:38.480 had a German last name or Scottish last name. They 208 00:12:38.639 --> 00:12:42.639 just their redneck accent was worse than mind. Their families 209 00:12:42.679 --> 00:12:44.360 had been for so long, and there was very little 210 00:12:44.360 --> 00:12:47.440 cultural difference, no more than there is between somebody at 211 00:12:47.480 --> 00:12:51.320 English Extraction and somebody of Irish Extraction or the Italian 212 00:12:51.360 --> 00:12:55.519 American Club on the other side of town. So there 213 00:12:55.559 --> 00:12:59.679 wasn't much problem there. But you look at places like Dearborn. 214 00:12:59.759 --> 00:13:02.639 Now are some of the other places where you now 215 00:13:02.759 --> 00:13:06.679 have people who come over there are still wearing the 216 00:13:06.679 --> 00:13:10.320 outfits they wore in Pakistan or you see in the 217 00:13:10.320 --> 00:13:16.960 fundamentalist neighborhoods in Damascus. That's that's not assimilating, and that 218 00:13:17.360 --> 00:13:20.399 is dangerous. So I think it dovetails with another trend 219 00:13:21.440 --> 00:13:25.600 going back to Glastonbury is I think I mentioned it 220 00:13:25.639 --> 00:13:27.559 here before, but I've written about it a few times. 221 00:13:27.559 --> 00:13:31.279 I know part of it was the way I was raised. 222 00:13:32.600 --> 00:13:36.759 Anti Semitism and jew hate was foreign to me because 223 00:13:36.799 --> 00:13:39.759 I just had so many Jewish people I grew up 224 00:13:39.759 --> 00:13:45.240 with here, no different than Methodists. I did not think 225 00:13:46.279 --> 00:13:50.919 that we would have seen in our nation the level 226 00:13:51.039 --> 00:13:53.240 of red and tooth and clawed jew hate that we've 227 00:13:53.279 --> 00:13:58.879 seen in the last two years. And it's not realized, 228 00:13:58.879 --> 00:14:02.360 not just here but another places. And you saw this 229 00:14:02.759 --> 00:14:06.840 as a young adult. I was either still in diapers 230 00:14:06.960 --> 00:14:10.519 or running around in early grade school. But you go 231 00:14:10.600 --> 00:14:13.720 back to the Summer of Love. You look back at 232 00:14:13.720 --> 00:14:17.519 a lot of the anti war protests against Vietnam, and 233 00:14:17.600 --> 00:14:22.120 after that you had the anti nuclear Saint Freeze of 234 00:14:22.320 --> 00:14:26.720 the late seventies and the nineteen eighties, and you've got 235 00:14:26.840 --> 00:14:29.919 had green peace, the environmental movement. Yeah, they had some 236 00:14:30.000 --> 00:14:35.840 fellow travelers on the edge, Students for a Democratic Society, 237 00:14:36.120 --> 00:14:39.559 the IRA, various People's Front for the Liberation of Palestine 238 00:14:39.679 --> 00:14:42.039 National Command. You know, they were on the fringes. They 239 00:14:42.039 --> 00:14:45.679 weren't in the center and their call for violence and 240 00:14:45.759 --> 00:14:48.840 killing or on the fringes at the center of it. 241 00:14:48.840 --> 00:14:52.399 It was a relatively peaceful movement. But that's not true 242 00:14:52.440 --> 00:14:56.320 where you have a very popular group of singers at 243 00:14:56.320 --> 00:15:02.559 a music festival that are calling for the murder of 244 00:15:03.080 --> 00:15:06.840 members of parliament that they disagree with them politically, and 245 00:15:07.320 --> 00:15:12.200 they call for death to the IDF because it rhymes. 246 00:15:12.200 --> 00:15:14.679 But we all know that they're more than just the idea. 247 00:15:14.679 --> 00:15:18.080 If they're interested in and they get away with it, 248 00:15:17.720 --> 00:15:24.480 it's a different vibe that I don't see what type 249 00:15:24.480 --> 00:15:28.080 of positive direction that goes to if there isn't an 250 00:15:28.120 --> 00:15:34.840 honest conversation about that type of violence that is coming 251 00:15:34.879 --> 00:15:38.679 from that particular part of the political spectrum. Those folks 252 00:15:38.679 --> 00:15:41.039 have got to police themselves, but we've got to police 253 00:15:41.080 --> 00:15:44.879 them as well. It's just it, it spirals in a 254 00:15:44.960 --> 00:15:47.399 direction nobody wants to go to if you allow that 255 00:15:47.440 --> 00:15:49.360 type of stuff to go without being challenged. 256 00:15:50.200 --> 00:15:53.080 Yeah, and it's part of the thing that I am 257 00:15:53.120 --> 00:15:57.559 troubled by is that you know, certainly people are free 258 00:15:57.600 --> 00:16:02.240 to express their views. Yeah. I may not agree with them, 259 00:16:02.279 --> 00:16:06.720 but as as I certainly spent some time defending their right, 260 00:16:06.960 --> 00:16:09.879 as as you did, defending their right to have those 261 00:16:09.919 --> 00:16:11.960 opinions and to be able to talk about them. But 262 00:16:12.080 --> 00:16:14.279 the other side of it is the minute you take 263 00:16:14.360 --> 00:16:17.879 on some of these issues, then you can be accused 264 00:16:17.919 --> 00:16:22.879 of all kinds of of anti you know, you're you're 265 00:16:24.480 --> 00:16:29.039 anti Islamic, you're anti whatever, and it is it is 266 00:16:29.399 --> 00:16:32.879 uh where where you know where? Why can you not 267 00:16:33.240 --> 00:16:37.399 have a conversation about this that doesn't end up in 268 00:16:37.480 --> 00:16:41.200 being resulting in it in a death threat or you 269 00:16:41.240 --> 00:16:44.399 know we're going to I mean, it has just gotten 270 00:16:44.399 --> 00:16:47.679 to the point where the people who need to stand 271 00:16:47.759 --> 00:16:50.159 up and say this, this is not right, what you're 272 00:16:50.279 --> 00:16:53.559 what you know, are not being there. They're being accused 273 00:16:53.559 --> 00:16:56.200 of being a phobic of whatever thing that you're standing 274 00:16:56.279 --> 00:16:58.879 up against, and that that is a problem. I mean 275 00:16:58.879 --> 00:17:02.919 that happened a lot when when just take an example 276 00:17:02.960 --> 00:17:05.359 of parents who were complaining about the some of the 277 00:17:05.440 --> 00:17:09.440 materials their kids were being exposed to at school. You know, 278 00:17:09.680 --> 00:17:12.640 that should have been a nice topic for debate. Why 279 00:17:12.960 --> 00:17:14.759 you know, why the kids should see it when a 280 00:17:14.799 --> 00:17:18.359 kid shouldn't see it, But it got to immediately got 281 00:17:18.359 --> 00:17:22.880 to these parents are you know, accused of all kinds 282 00:17:22.880 --> 00:17:28.480 of a criminal activity necessarily but opinion, you know, bad 283 00:17:28.559 --> 00:17:31.880 think if you will, from nineteen eighty four, so wrong think, 284 00:17:32.279 --> 00:17:36.799 and it's that that cannot stand in this country. We 285 00:17:36.839 --> 00:17:39.400 you know, we need to defend the right for people 286 00:17:39.440 --> 00:17:41.559 to be say what they want and to be right 287 00:17:41.640 --> 00:17:43.279 or wrong and be judged on the merits of what 288 00:17:43.319 --> 00:17:48.599 they say, rather than just attacking them blindly and incorrect. 289 00:17:48.839 --> 00:17:52.559 Freedom of speech. It's a messy area, but I think 290 00:17:52.839 --> 00:17:55.920 you do have a line. Part of the problem is 291 00:17:56.279 --> 00:17:59.119 we allowed ourselves to lose the language, especially over the 292 00:17:59.160 --> 00:18:02.880 last ten years, where words you are violence, but violence 293 00:18:03.200 --> 00:18:06.920 is words type of things. No, you know, people should 294 00:18:06.920 --> 00:18:08.839 be allowed to be insulting, but you've got to draw 295 00:18:08.880 --> 00:18:13.480 a line where there is a clear incitement to that violence. 296 00:18:14.039 --> 00:18:19.160 And I don't think just because you're a musician. Music 297 00:18:19.279 --> 00:18:23.039 is an art. Writing is also an art. And if 298 00:18:23.079 --> 00:18:28.200 you write and tell people go out and kill MPs, 299 00:18:29.079 --> 00:18:33.440 and you're in a society where other people have been 300 00:18:33.599 --> 00:18:38.480 jailed who simply write something even more benign than that, 301 00:18:40.200 --> 00:18:44.480 you are throwing kindling on a fire. And we have 302 00:18:44.559 --> 00:18:50.240 similar challenges over here where you have to have equality 303 00:18:50.279 --> 00:18:55.960 before the law and either you cannot incite violence or 304 00:18:56.039 --> 00:18:59.200 you can incite violence. You can't have a situation where 305 00:19:00.039 --> 00:19:02.799 one side of the political spectrum, or one side on 306 00:19:02.880 --> 00:19:07.759 a socio cultural political view is allowed to do whatever 307 00:19:07.799 --> 00:19:11.480 they want, but on the other side disagrees in any way, 308 00:19:11.759 --> 00:19:14.119 then the full power of the law is going to 309 00:19:14.160 --> 00:19:17.680 come down on these people. That is not only contrary 310 00:19:17.720 --> 00:19:21.799 to a free society, it is throwing kindling on a 311 00:19:21.880 --> 00:19:25.240 fire because that pressure will build up in a society. 312 00:19:25.480 --> 00:19:33.359 Societies will take it, there's others won't. And it's something 313 00:19:33.400 --> 00:19:36.400 that you're seeing in spades in the UK, and you're 314 00:19:36.440 --> 00:19:38.680 seeing it a little bit here though. I think it's 315 00:19:38.680 --> 00:19:42.359 gotten a little bit better now because there's a Department 316 00:19:42.359 --> 00:19:46.920 Adjustice that's kind of let what had been abused previously. 317 00:19:47.319 --> 00:19:50.039 Go And again I'm trying really hard not to be political, 318 00:19:50.839 --> 00:19:55.160 but freedom speech should not be a political issue. That 319 00:19:55.200 --> 00:20:00.480 should be bipartisan. You can say somebody is rude, that 320 00:20:00.680 --> 00:20:02.880 was a little uncalled for, or I think that's a 321 00:20:02.880 --> 00:20:06.799 bad faith argument. I think that's fine. But saying you've 322 00:20:06.839 --> 00:20:11.359 said this, I disagree with it. So I'm going to 323 00:20:11.440 --> 00:20:16.640 destroy your family, your name, your business, and I'm going 324 00:20:16.720 --> 00:20:19.559 to dox your house. Those swat agents come over your 325 00:20:19.559 --> 00:20:21.079 house at two o'clock in the morning and shoot your 326 00:20:21.160 --> 00:20:23.240 dog that barks at him as a kick in the door. 327 00:20:24.160 --> 00:20:28.720 That's a totally different matter. And I think the director 328 00:20:28.720 --> 00:20:31.880 of the FBI, Cash Bettel, I think three or four 329 00:20:31.880 --> 00:20:39.039 weeks ago his house was his house was docked. And 330 00:20:39.079 --> 00:20:41.759 there have been other people who are living remotely from 331 00:20:41.799 --> 00:20:46.799 their families. So it's we're reaching that stage with violence. 332 00:20:47.039 --> 00:20:50.000 And I wish everybody from the right, the left, in 333 00:20:50.039 --> 00:20:56.200 the center has a level of intolerance towards calls for violence, 334 00:20:56.200 --> 00:20:59.240 because we should. We should encourage and allow everybody to 335 00:20:59.279 --> 00:21:05.720 have the US debate. You can call people's ideas stupid, wrongheaded, 336 00:21:06.200 --> 00:21:09.680 et cetera, and so forth, but what we can't do 337 00:21:09.960 --> 00:21:14.160 is say will you use the wrong pronoun. That's the 338 00:21:14.279 --> 00:21:17.680 violence is the same as somebody is saying go out 339 00:21:17.720 --> 00:21:21.000 and kill your member of parliament or some other political 340 00:21:21.039 --> 00:21:23.559 person because you disagree with them on a policy issue. 341 00:21:24.160 --> 00:21:28.359 That uh, that's a different, different kettle fish altogether. And unfortunately, 342 00:21:29.279 --> 00:21:31.880 and I hope that this will change, I have not 343 00:21:32.119 --> 00:21:36.839 seen a full spectrum response to people in society saying 344 00:21:36.920 --> 00:21:40.440 we will not accept that, just the opposite, and it's said. 345 00:21:41.400 --> 00:21:44.960 Yeah, it's you know, you look at the universities, uh, 346 00:21:45.119 --> 00:21:46.960 the stuff that's been going on in the Ivy League 347 00:21:47.039 --> 00:21:50.759 and other UH schools where some of these you know, 348 00:21:50.799 --> 00:21:56.440 these anti Semitic groups are taking over libraries, they're you know, 349 00:21:56.480 --> 00:22:00.640 they're they're attacking the Jewish students and the on the campus, 350 00:22:00.680 --> 00:22:03.799 not letting them go to class I mean, and then 351 00:22:03.880 --> 00:22:06.920 you know, the resistance of the administration of those schools 352 00:22:07.000 --> 00:22:10.839 to people saying this isn't right. You've got to enforce 353 00:22:10.960 --> 00:22:15.880 the the the law, which is that they you know, 354 00:22:16.119 --> 00:22:19.359 it is discrimination not to let your Jewish students participate 355 00:22:19.839 --> 00:22:24.440 in the in the benefits of the university. And where 356 00:22:24.680 --> 00:22:27.960 you know, when did the university has become places where 357 00:22:28.640 --> 00:22:32.240 it's not just that you're you're you made a bad argument. 358 00:22:32.480 --> 00:22:36.160 You know, if you disagree with someone, then you're evil 359 00:22:36.519 --> 00:22:39.039 and and and they don't you know that if you're evil, 360 00:22:39.079 --> 00:22:43.640 it's it's that justifies all their actions against you. And that, 361 00:22:44.160 --> 00:22:47.079 you know, that is a deeply troubling, uh part of 362 00:22:47.119 --> 00:22:51.400 our current society where people won't listen anymore, there is 363 00:22:51.440 --> 00:22:54.200 no debate. You're you know, it's a it's become black 364 00:22:54.200 --> 00:22:55.759 and white. You know, if you don't agree with me 365 00:22:55.839 --> 00:22:58.079 on this, I will no longer communicate with you. And 366 00:22:58.119 --> 00:23:01.359 because you're evil, and that that is that is a 367 00:23:01.440 --> 00:23:04.200 very sad thing to have happen. 368 00:23:05.079 --> 00:23:10.640 And it's it's a culture of denouncement, which again has 369 00:23:10.680 --> 00:23:13.720 as a pedigree. You know, it used to be calling 370 00:23:13.759 --> 00:23:17.319 somebody a witch. I remember I lived in Norfolk, Virginia 371 00:23:18.680 --> 00:23:20.920 Witch Duck Road, and I was like, that's a strange name. 372 00:23:20.960 --> 00:23:22.920 And then I read up on some of the Norfolk 373 00:23:22.960 --> 00:23:26.759 history in the first years that Norfolk Virginia, which is 374 00:23:26.799 --> 00:23:29.160 one of the older parts of the US. Yes, that's 375 00:23:29.200 --> 00:23:32.960 where they actually for you Monty Python fans, you know, 376 00:23:33.640 --> 00:23:36.559 dunk the witch in the water. If she floats, she's 377 00:23:36.559 --> 00:23:39.759 a witch. If she sinks, she's been embraced by the 378 00:23:39.799 --> 00:23:42.880 by the water and she's not a witch. Either way, 379 00:23:42.920 --> 00:23:50.000 she dies. But in more recent history, Uh, one thing 380 00:23:50.039 --> 00:23:53.119 I forced my kids to watch is and I think 381 00:23:53.119 --> 00:23:56.279 it's one of the best films ever made is The 382 00:23:56.400 --> 00:23:59.880 Killing Fields about what happened at Cambodia, and they're the 383 00:24:00.160 --> 00:24:04.519 plenty of stuff. There's not really an equivalent that I 384 00:24:04.559 --> 00:24:08.440 can think of, except for maybe the opening episode of 385 00:24:09.640 --> 00:24:12.200 I think it's on Netflix three Body Problem that went 386 00:24:12.200 --> 00:24:15.680 through the cultural what happened during the Cultural Revolution in China, 387 00:24:16.160 --> 00:24:19.839 where this logically leads. When you have a culture of 388 00:24:19.920 --> 00:24:24.880 denouncing people in that type of political environment, it doesn't 389 00:24:24.880 --> 00:24:29.880 have a good history. And again it's everybody should call 390 00:24:29.920 --> 00:24:32.079 it out red life. I don't like when people do 391 00:24:32.119 --> 00:24:33.559 it from the right. I don't like when people do 392 00:24:33.599 --> 00:24:36.039 it to the left, because it has a history, it 393 00:24:36.079 --> 00:24:41.599 has a track record, and it's something everybody should be 394 00:24:41.640 --> 00:24:46.200 conscious of. And it is national security related because when 395 00:24:46.200 --> 00:24:49.920 that feeds people to pick up a gun and shoot 396 00:24:50.119 --> 00:24:55.039 at members of Congress who are playing baseball, are a 397 00:24:55.160 --> 00:25:00.680 presidential candidate who's making a speech or tries to ambush them, 398 00:25:01.039 --> 00:25:05.279 or leaves pipe bombs lying around. There's a connection. You 399 00:25:05.359 --> 00:25:08.519 call for violence clear enough, or if you do not 400 00:25:08.680 --> 00:25:15.680 hold people accountable properly who are planning or supporting violence, 401 00:25:15.799 --> 00:25:19.599