WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.120 --> 00:00:03.000 My grown son, Ryan, who is an avid reader, said 2 00:00:03.000 --> 00:00:04.719 I've got this book series you got to read, and 3 00:00:04.799 --> 00:00:07.040 normally I'm not gonna lie like he likes a lot. 4 00:00:06.960 --> 00:00:09.320 Of fantasy books. And I was like, I don't know. 5 00:00:10.000 --> 00:00:12.080 But then he said, no, it's about this guy who's 6 00:00:12.119 --> 00:00:16.879 a wizard and a private investigator in Chicago now, and 7 00:00:16.920 --> 00:00:19.239 I was like, okay, you had me at wizard who's 8 00:00:19.280 --> 00:00:22.359 also a private investigator. The books were The Dresden Files, 9 00:00:22.719 --> 00:00:24.879 and he gave me the first one, which is called Stormfront, 10 00:00:25.320 --> 00:00:29.600 and it's so entertaining and so interesting, and the lead character, 11 00:00:29.640 --> 00:00:35.719 Harry Dresden, is in my view, probably an aspirational type 12 00:00:35.799 --> 00:00:38.640 character for a lot of men. He's not only a wizard, 13 00:00:38.960 --> 00:00:42.240 he's a private detective. He is an investigator, and he's 14 00:00:42.280 --> 00:00:45.759 also perpetually kind of grumpy. I mean, he's he's really 15 00:00:45.799 --> 00:00:47.759 got an all in one package, and he's been created 16 00:00:47.799 --> 00:00:50.840 by author Jim Butcher, who joins me now to talk 17 00:00:50.880 --> 00:00:54.600 about his Is this your seventeenth book coming out twelve months? 18 00:00:54.640 --> 00:00:56.439 Is that coming out seventeenth? Did I see that? 19 00:00:58.280 --> 00:01:01.240 Well, it'll be the eighteenth book in the Dress and Files, 20 00:01:01.280 --> 00:01:03.520 if you don't count the two collections of short stories. 21 00:01:03.600 --> 00:01:06.719 You count them as the twentieth and then I've got 22 00:01:07.560 --> 00:01:09.239 I think nine other books out as well. 23 00:01:09.439 --> 00:01:11.120 Well, I love it or not dress in books. 24 00:01:11.359 --> 00:01:15.280 I want to start by by saying, you know, Jim, 25 00:01:15.400 --> 00:01:17.079 first of all, I'm glad you're coming on the show. 26 00:01:17.120 --> 00:01:18.040 That's thing number one. 27 00:01:18.079 --> 00:01:20.760 My son is very excited about you being here and 28 00:01:20.799 --> 00:01:22.159 has given me a bunch of nerdy. 29 00:01:21.959 --> 00:01:22.799 Questions to ask you. 30 00:01:23.159 --> 00:01:25.439 But I went to your website and I went to 31 00:01:25.480 --> 00:01:30.680 your about page, and your about page at jimdash Butcher 32 00:01:30.719 --> 00:01:33.319 dot com has to be the greatest about page in 33 00:01:33.319 --> 00:01:37.959 the history of about pages, because you clearly outline how 34 00:01:38.000 --> 00:01:42.319 you got published and it was definitely not a straight 35 00:01:42.400 --> 00:01:46.120 line uphill for you. And I love that you shared 36 00:01:46.280 --> 00:01:49.599 this story of perseverance. So if you could kind of 37 00:01:49.599 --> 00:01:52.319 for my listeners who haven't read the about page, how 38 00:01:52.359 --> 00:01:54.280 did you get from nineteen year old kid writing a 39 00:01:54.359 --> 00:01:57.079 terrible first novel, that's what you said, to being a 40 00:01:57.120 --> 00:02:01.760 guy who's now published we'll call it twenty stories or 41 00:02:01.879 --> 00:02:05.040 encapsuled books about about Harry Dresden. 42 00:02:07.439 --> 00:02:10.840 Oh well, it's one of those stories that I like 43 00:02:10.919 --> 00:02:13.479 to tell because it keeps me humble, or or I 44 00:02:13.479 --> 00:02:16.560 hope it does. But yeah, I wrote my first book 45 00:02:17.000 --> 00:02:19.599 and it was an It was a terrible book. So 46 00:02:19.680 --> 00:02:22.639 I wrote another one and that one was terrible as well, 47 00:02:23.159 --> 00:02:25.599 and then I wrote four more and those are also awful. 48 00:02:26.479 --> 00:02:28.879 And it was right around that point that. 49 00:02:28.840 --> 00:02:30.759 I decided, okay, you know what, maybe I should start 50 00:02:30.800 --> 00:02:34.280 trying to learn from people. So I wound up going 51 00:02:34.680 --> 00:02:38.319 over to the English Department, from where I had started 52 00:02:38.319 --> 00:02:41.280 off in computers, and I decided that I did not 53 00:02:41.360 --> 00:02:43.599 want to work a computer job. And I went from 54 00:02:43.599 --> 00:02:47.039 there to business business programming, and I realized that I 55 00:02:47.039 --> 00:02:49.439 did not want to do that either, and I tried, 56 00:02:50.680 --> 00:02:52.319 and this was all I was writing on the side, 57 00:02:52.319 --> 00:02:55.000 And then I tried. I tried going into education, and 58 00:02:55.840 --> 00:02:57.520 I had the problem with that was they send you 59 00:02:57.520 --> 00:03:00.520 out to observe teachers in class, and it was just 60 00:03:00.840 --> 00:03:02.360 the particular teachers I was observing. 61 00:03:02.400 --> 00:03:05.120 The boy they were miserable people, and so I didn't 62 00:03:05.120 --> 00:03:05.919 want to do that either. 63 00:03:06.120 --> 00:03:08.240 And then I thought, okay, well, maybe if I'm going 64 00:03:08.280 --> 00:03:10.319 to take this book thing seriously, I should go to 65 00:03:10.360 --> 00:03:12.680 I should, you know, learn something official in school. 66 00:03:12.759 --> 00:03:14.639 So I went to the English Department, said I want 67 00:03:14.639 --> 00:03:15.759 to write novels. This is the right place. 68 00:03:15.800 --> 00:03:17.800 They said, yes, absolutely. So I went to English and 69 00:03:17.800 --> 00:03:19.800 I wrote another book and it was terrible. And then 70 00:03:19.840 --> 00:03:22.680 I heard about the professional writing department in the journal 71 00:03:22.840 --> 00:03:25.479 in the journalism school at the University of Oklahoma that 72 00:03:25.599 --> 00:03:29.000 was actually taught by a professor who was also a 73 00:03:29.039 --> 00:03:32.560 novelist with forty books out, and so it was a 74 00:03:32.639 --> 00:03:34.479 much more kind of a practical training, you know, where 75 00:03:34.479 --> 00:03:37.080 they were saying, okay, let's let's The first class I 76 00:03:37.080 --> 00:03:39.120 took was called writing a genre fiction novel. 77 00:03:39.319 --> 00:03:39.639 There you go. 78 00:03:39.759 --> 00:03:42.400 And so I wrote several genre fiction novels in class. 79 00:03:42.400 --> 00:03:44.240 I wrote a couple in class, and they were also bad. 80 00:03:44.759 --> 00:03:49.479 And so so finally I decided, and I just I'd 81 00:03:49.520 --> 00:03:51.879 been arguing with the teacher left and right, because I mean, 82 00:03:51.960 --> 00:03:56.000 I had gotten my bachelor's degree in English literature, you know, 83 00:03:56.120 --> 00:03:59.080 with an emphasis with an emphasis in creative writing, and 84 00:03:59.360 --> 00:04:01.319 meanwhile she had merely published forty novels. 85 00:04:01.319 --> 00:04:02.319 And you know, I was kind of at that age 86 00:04:02.319 --> 00:04:03.319 where I still knew everything. 87 00:04:04.719 --> 00:04:08.800 Yeah, I've forgotten most of it now, but as as 88 00:04:08.800 --> 00:04:10.599 but as as it went, I decided, all right, the 89 00:04:10.599 --> 00:04:12.159 way the best way for me to prove that this 90 00:04:12.240 --> 00:04:14.599 teacher is wrong about all the things she's she's trying 91 00:04:14.599 --> 00:04:16.240 to get me to do, because I was going to 92 00:04:16.279 --> 00:04:18.240 be writing swords and horses fantasy. That's that's what I 93 00:04:18.240 --> 00:04:19.800 wanted to write. I wanted to be the next Tolkien. 94 00:04:20.800 --> 00:04:24.160 And uh, you know, she kept suggesting, Hey, Jim, you 95 00:04:24.199 --> 00:04:26.240 know you keep talking about Buffy the vampire, sli hair 96 00:04:26.279 --> 00:04:27.920 and babble on five in class, maybe you should try 97 00:04:27.959 --> 00:04:30.920 writing like an urban fantasy book or or a science 98 00:04:30.920 --> 00:04:31.519 fiction novel. 99 00:04:31.800 --> 00:04:33.879 I poo pooed it, But finally I decided to prove 100 00:04:33.879 --> 00:04:34.319 her wrong. 101 00:04:34.560 --> 00:04:36.600 And the way I decided to do it, I was 102 00:04:36.639 --> 00:04:39.839 going to do absolutely everything she told me to do. 103 00:04:39.879 --> 00:04:41.680 I was going to fill out all her little forms 104 00:04:41.680 --> 00:04:43.800 and do all her little worksheets. 105 00:04:43.480 --> 00:04:46.120 And and you know, follow every little rigid thing that 106 00:04:46.160 --> 00:04:48.160 she was teaching me about about how to write a 107 00:04:48.160 --> 00:04:51.360 good story, and that would show her what terrible cookie 108 00:04:51.399 --> 00:04:52.800 cutter patlum crap. 109 00:04:52.560 --> 00:04:54.120 Would have emerged from that all the process. 110 00:04:54.920 --> 00:04:56.600 So I did, and I wrote the first book at 111 00:04:56.600 --> 00:04:59.720 the Dresden Box, which which showed her. 112 00:05:00.879 --> 00:05:03.199 But as it worked, as. 113 00:05:03.040 --> 00:05:05.199 It turned out, you know, she I turned in the 114 00:05:05.240 --> 00:05:07.959 first couple of chapters of Dresden Files. And bear in 115 00:05:08.000 --> 00:05:09.759 mind that This was a teacher who believed in preparing 116 00:05:09.800 --> 00:05:11.800 you for the reality of the New York publishing world, 117 00:05:11.800 --> 00:05:13.720 which is a very cut through kind of place. You know, 118 00:05:13.759 --> 00:05:15.480 if you don't do your job there, you don't stay. 119 00:05:16.040 --> 00:05:19.519 And you know, her critique had included such things as 120 00:05:19.680 --> 00:05:22.560 rolling up the chapters I'd handed into her, leaning across 121 00:05:22.560 --> 00:05:24.759 her desk, popping me on the head with him and saying, 122 00:05:24.759 --> 00:05:25.519 what were you thinking? 123 00:05:25.759 --> 00:05:26.720 She was that kind of teaching. 124 00:05:27.879 --> 00:05:29.839 So I hand her the first, you know, the first 125 00:05:29.839 --> 00:05:32.480 thirty pages of the first Dressdent Files book, and she 126 00:05:32.519 --> 00:05:34.480 picks it up and starts flipping through them and reading 127 00:05:34.519 --> 00:05:36.839 them and reading them and reading them, and finally she 128 00:05:36.879 --> 00:05:39.879 looks up at me and says, well, you did it. 129 00:05:40.519 --> 00:05:43.600 I said what, because that was not something I'd ever 130 00:05:43.680 --> 00:05:45.639 expected to hear from her. You know, she was always 131 00:05:45.680 --> 00:05:47.120 the I mean, she would tarry uppart. 132 00:05:47.519 --> 00:05:48.319 She's like, you did it. 133 00:05:48.680 --> 00:05:51.839 This is of saleable quality, this is professional level writing. 134 00:05:52.079 --> 00:05:53.519 I don't know if this will be the first thing 135 00:05:53.560 --> 00:05:56.000 you sell, but you will be able to sell this book, 136 00:05:56.240 --> 00:05:59.279 so you know, please, you know, you know, by all means, 137 00:05:59.480 --> 00:06:00.920 keep this book if you're gonna be able to sell 138 00:06:00.920 --> 00:06:01.920 it one day, even if it's not the. 139 00:06:01.920 --> 00:06:04.199 First eving sell. And I was like, wow. 140 00:06:04.319 --> 00:06:06.000 She's like, okay, now come back in next week with 141 00:06:06.040 --> 00:06:08.319 an outline for the rest of it, and she meant 142 00:06:08.360 --> 00:06:11.839 the rest of the novel roll I roll in the 143 00:06:11.839 --> 00:06:13.920 next week with an outline for it for a twenty 144 00:06:13.920 --> 00:06:17.360 book long series with a giant three book capstone trilogy 145 00:06:17.399 --> 00:06:20.600 at the end. And I handed into her and it's 146 00:06:20.639 --> 00:06:22.519 a console course, right, so you just you're just talking 147 00:06:22.519 --> 00:06:25.120 for forty five minutes. And I handed into her and 148 00:06:25.199 --> 00:06:27.160 I'm chattering with her and I'm just going on and on, 149 00:06:27.199 --> 00:06:29.680 and at some point I realized we're forty minutes into 150 00:06:29.720 --> 00:06:32.319 the into the meeting, and she hasn't gotten to say 151 00:06:32.360 --> 00:06:32.920 anything to me. 152 00:06:33.000 --> 00:06:34.519 So I kind of stop and go, what do you think? 153 00:06:35.279 --> 00:06:36.920 And I can still. 154 00:06:36.680 --> 00:06:39.600 Remember the look on her face, right, she just got 155 00:06:39.600 --> 00:06:41.839 this kid on board. I finally got this kid on board. 156 00:06:42.000 --> 00:06:44.000 I can't derailing now, That's what I can see the 157 00:06:44.040 --> 00:06:45.959 look on her face now, And she. 158 00:06:45.920 --> 00:06:48.079 Can because there's no way you're gonna go sell a 159 00:06:48.079 --> 00:06:50.079 twenty book series in New York as a first time 160 00:06:50.120 --> 00:06:52.480 offering you. This is not gonna happen. And so she says, 161 00:06:52.480 --> 00:06:54.439 I think you can sell a twenty book long series 162 00:06:55.199 --> 00:06:58.759 should be doing, okay, And I was like, okay, great. 163 00:06:58.800 --> 00:07:01.519 And because I charged full speed ahead, and because she 164 00:07:01.519 --> 00:07:04.439 hadn't told me it was impossible, I did it. 165 00:07:05.120 --> 00:07:07.360 Did you ever dream small ever? 166 00:07:08.879 --> 00:07:13.399 Well? Apparently no. I mean, I'm just right. 167 00:07:14.160 --> 00:07:16.759 I'm just writing ridiculous wizard books, right like I write 168 00:07:16.759 --> 00:07:17.600 popcorn books. 169 00:07:17.639 --> 00:07:19.839 But I want to write like the very very best 170 00:07:19.879 --> 00:07:22.040 popcorn books. That that's head of my goal was a writer. 171 00:07:22.240 --> 00:07:24.319 Let's talk about Harry Dresden, because now that we know 172 00:07:24.439 --> 00:07:27.000 he sprang forth out of a desire to prove your 173 00:07:27.000 --> 00:07:27.839 instructor wrong. 174 00:07:28.319 --> 00:07:31.439 How did you decide? How did Harry Dresden come to be? 175 00:07:31.759 --> 00:07:31.800 Like? 176 00:07:31.839 --> 00:07:33.720 At what point were you like, Okay, I got a wizard, 177 00:07:33.959 --> 00:07:35.439 and let's give him a job. Okay, is he going 178 00:07:35.480 --> 00:07:36.199 to be a firefight? 179 00:07:36.319 --> 00:07:36.399 No? 180 00:07:36.720 --> 00:07:37.879 Is he going to be? Is he gonna be? 181 00:07:38.079 --> 00:07:38.160 No? 182 00:07:39.040 --> 00:07:41.199 I know he'll be an investigator? Or was that? 183 00:07:41.360 --> 00:07:44.079 Were you looking for the investigator first or the wizard first? 184 00:07:44.120 --> 00:07:45.879 And they all came together? How did he come to be? 185 00:07:47.480 --> 00:07:49.120 I knew I wanted to write I wanted to write 186 00:07:49.120 --> 00:07:51.639 an investigator. I wanted to write a wizard. That that part, 187 00:07:51.879 --> 00:07:54.040 you know, because I was putting it together, and I'm 188 00:07:54.079 --> 00:07:56.279 hitting here thinking about it, and it's like, okay. So 189 00:07:56.480 --> 00:07:58.639 it was a very it was a very mechanical, very 190 00:07:58.639 --> 00:07:59.680 inorganic process. 191 00:07:59.800 --> 00:07:59.959 Right. 192 00:08:01.000 --> 00:08:03.560 Basically, what I did was I went and picked my 193 00:08:03.600 --> 00:08:07.240 top half dozen wizards and my top half dozen private investigators, 194 00:08:07.240 --> 00:08:09.680 you know, from various books, and then I chopped them 195 00:08:09.680 --> 00:08:12.759 into bits and reassembled them like this Frankenstein. 196 00:08:12.560 --> 00:08:14.519 And uh uh and and. 197 00:08:14.279 --> 00:08:16.000 And then and you know, I was just picking my 198 00:08:16.000 --> 00:08:19.160 favorite traits from various wizards, various various private eyes. And 199 00:08:19.199 --> 00:08:21.560 what I realized was that wizards and private eyes in 200 00:08:21.560 --> 00:08:25.399 the realm of literature, they have the same job. They 201 00:08:25.480 --> 00:08:27.519 go into places other people aren't willing to go, to 202 00:08:27.600 --> 00:08:30.000 find out things that other people aren't willing to find out. 203 00:08:30.040 --> 00:08:31.160 And that's and. 204 00:08:31.079 --> 00:08:32.720 That was when I realized, oh wow, there's a lot 205 00:08:32.759 --> 00:08:33.919 of synergy going on here. 206 00:08:35.559 --> 00:08:37.240 And so after after that, you know. 207 00:08:37.360 --> 00:08:39.919 Whether they're going into the the the criminal underworld or 208 00:08:39.960 --> 00:08:42.279 the the literal underworld, you know, that's kind of what 209 00:08:42.320 --> 00:08:44.679 wizards do. And and so I realized, Okay, I've got something. 210 00:08:44.720 --> 00:08:46.519 I've got a good thing going here. So I took 211 00:08:46.519 --> 00:08:50.080 my favorite bits of shear Locke and Spencer and Travis 212 00:08:50.200 --> 00:08:53.399 McGee and and several other you know, several dashal hammock characters. 213 00:08:53.720 --> 00:08:55.559 Uh And I mixed them with my favorite wizards from 214 00:08:55.559 --> 00:08:57.720 my fantasy books and just took my favorite traits from 215 00:08:57.720 --> 00:08:59.720 the wizards. And it's like, I absolutely have some that 216 00:08:59.799 --> 00:09:02.440 have have somebody who's going to be really, really snarky 217 00:09:02.480 --> 00:09:04.279 and lip off to absolutely anyone. 218 00:09:04.759 --> 00:09:06.679 I need somebody who's going to who's going. 219 00:09:06.600 --> 00:09:10.039 To be extremely, extremely stubborn and just can't be deterred 220 00:09:10.039 --> 00:09:11.200 from from his course of action. 221 00:09:11.759 --> 00:09:12.159 Uh uh. 222 00:09:12.279 --> 00:09:14.320 And and I also I wanted to write a lot 223 00:09:14.360 --> 00:09:17.480 of humor because I felt like that was sort of, 224 00:09:17.519 --> 00:09:19.759 you know, sort of played to my strength as a writer. 225 00:09:20.559 --> 00:09:23.480 And so I put this character together and I assembled 226 00:09:23.519 --> 00:09:25.840 him as this Frankenstein. I put him in this story. 227 00:09:26.080 --> 00:09:28.320 And at the time, it felt like a complete waste 228 00:09:28.360 --> 00:09:30.279 of time. It felt like I was just doing this, 229 00:09:30.360 --> 00:09:32.879 you know, as a class project. You know, it wasn't 230 00:09:32.919 --> 00:09:35.000 going to turn out into anything cool or meaningful or 231 00:09:35.000 --> 00:09:38.919 anything like that. And here we are, you know, I'm 232 00:09:38.960 --> 00:09:40.000 working on book nineteen. 233 00:09:40.039 --> 00:09:41.320 Now, Well, let me. 234 00:09:41.360 --> 00:09:43.639 Just say I and I know this is probably gonna 235 00:09:43.639 --> 00:09:45.960 be blasphemy, knowing what you just said earlier, in the interview, 236 00:09:45.960 --> 00:09:49.120 but I have never been able to make it through 237 00:09:49.399 --> 00:09:54.159 any token book. I have tried multiple times to get into. 238 00:09:54.519 --> 00:09:56.399 But it's the notion that I have to have a 239 00:09:56.440 --> 00:09:59.559 glossary in the back to explain to me the words 240 00:09:59.559 --> 00:10:02.480 and people and stuff of a fantasy land that I 241 00:10:02.480 --> 00:10:05.360 don't enjoy for whatever reason, it doesn't connect with me. 242 00:10:05.720 --> 00:10:07.960 But with The Dresden Files, you drop him into modern 243 00:10:08.039 --> 00:10:10.639 day Chicago, so I have a frame of reference. I understand. 244 00:10:10.840 --> 00:10:13.200 It's one of the reasons I love Buffy. Yeah, I 245 00:10:13.200 --> 00:10:15.679 love Buffy the Vampire Slayer because you have all the 246 00:10:15.720 --> 00:10:18.000 monsters and everything, but it's modern day, right, So I 247 00:10:18.000 --> 00:10:20.320 don't have to be a lover of fantasy to love 248 00:10:20.360 --> 00:10:22.480 the Dresden Files because it already feels familiar. 249 00:10:22.960 --> 00:10:24.440 That's what I love about it, right. 250 00:10:25.679 --> 00:10:27.679 That's one of the great advantages that when I'm writing Dresden, 251 00:10:27.720 --> 00:10:29.960 you know, I can say, Okay, they were in a Walmart, 252 00:10:30.000 --> 00:10:31.679 and that's all I have to say, because people have 253 00:10:31.720 --> 00:10:33.159 been in Walmart, you know. 254 00:10:33.600 --> 00:10:36.240 And after that I can and I can establish these. 255 00:10:36.080 --> 00:10:38.519 Places that are very familiar, that are that people are 256 00:10:38.519 --> 00:10:40.960 comfortable with, and then fill them with these you know, 257 00:10:41.159 --> 00:10:44.080 fantastic incredible creatures that maybe they're not. 258 00:10:44.000 --> 00:10:45.000 Familiar and comfortable with. 259 00:10:45.039 --> 00:10:48.399 But because we've got this setting, you know that, you know, 260 00:10:48.639 --> 00:10:50.320 it feels like, okay, maybe this could happen. 261 00:10:50.799 --> 00:10:51.919 Let me give him a little bit more time to 262 00:10:51.919 --> 00:10:52.759 see how it plays out. 263 00:10:52.960 --> 00:10:53.639 Well, I want to. 264 00:10:53.919 --> 00:10:55.480 My son is the one who introduced me to you, 265 00:10:55.519 --> 00:10:56.840 and he sent me a long email. I'm going to 266 00:10:56.879 --> 00:10:58.000 afford it to you so you can see all of 267 00:10:58.000 --> 00:11:00.320 his nerdy questions as well. But he said, and I 268 00:11:00.320 --> 00:11:01.919 want to read this. I want to read this in 269 00:11:01.960 --> 00:11:05.080 its entirety, this part of it anyway, mister Butcher, thank 270 00:11:05.120 --> 00:11:07.279 you for the wild ride that has been Harry's life 271 00:11:07.360 --> 00:11:09.240 and for letting us in on it. It's got to 272 00:11:09.240 --> 00:11:12.080 feel crazy on some level that so many people resonate 273 00:11:12.120 --> 00:11:14.600 with the series. The truth is you've just written some 274 00:11:14.720 --> 00:11:17.639 damn good books. I look forward to continuing the adventure 275 00:11:17.639 --> 00:11:19.440 in twelve months. That is the next book, coming out 276 00:11:19.480 --> 00:11:22.120 in January. Also, while I know that some fans out 277 00:11:22.120 --> 00:11:24.320 there would kill me for this, I hope you don't 278 00:11:24.320 --> 00:11:27.679 give us all the answers. There's something real and bittersweet 279 00:11:27.759 --> 00:11:30.919 about not knowing the history of this organization or that artifact. 280 00:11:31.200 --> 00:11:34.200 Even if you yourself know every detail. I hope you 281 00:11:34.279 --> 00:11:37.600 keep your own Tom Bombadil hidden away in there, sir. 282 00:11:37.799 --> 00:11:40.480 That is from my son super Nerd love this kid, 283 00:11:40.519 --> 00:11:42.679 and he loves you. So I wanted to ask you 284 00:11:42.799 --> 00:11:46.399 kind of about that question. How far in advance, like 285 00:11:46.799 --> 00:11:49.799 you're about to release twelve months, how far was the 286 00:11:49.840 --> 00:11:53.120 story put together in terms of your twenty book arc 287 00:11:53.519 --> 00:11:55.519 that you pitched to your teacher. 288 00:11:55.720 --> 00:11:59.080 Are you on track in that arc story wise? 289 00:11:59.200 --> 00:12:01.399 Or is the story evolved since you came up with 290 00:12:01.440 --> 00:12:02.360 that twenty book arc. 291 00:12:04.720 --> 00:12:07.600 It's it's evolved a little. I'm still mostly on track. Wow, 292 00:12:08.279 --> 00:12:10.080 I've never written a twenty book long I've never written 293 00:12:10.080 --> 00:12:12.320 it right now, I think it's gonna wind up being 294 00:12:12.320 --> 00:12:15.000 twenty five books total. I've never written a twenty five 295 00:12:15.000 --> 00:12:17.279 book long story before though, So, I mean, originally it 296 00:12:17.279 --> 00:12:18.080 was going to be twenty. 297 00:12:17.879 --> 00:12:19.320 Three, but I think I'm gonna need a couple more 298 00:12:19.360 --> 00:12:21.080 before I get to the end. So far nobody seems 299 00:12:21.080 --> 00:12:21.639 to mind. 300 00:12:23.279 --> 00:12:26.320 But but yeah, I mean, at this point, I'm a 301 00:12:26.320 --> 00:12:30.399 little superstitious about deviating from the from the plan. It's 302 00:12:30.440 --> 00:12:33.000 working out so well, I mean, it just what seems 303 00:12:33.080 --> 00:12:35.279 churlish to turn aside I mean that twenty five year 304 00:12:35.279 --> 00:12:36.840 old kid. He might have thought he knew a whole 305 00:12:36.840 --> 00:12:38.279 lot of things he didn't know, but he also had 306 00:12:38.279 --> 00:12:40.759 some good ideas. And I, you know, I've still got 307 00:12:40.799 --> 00:12:43.759 my my notebooks from class back then, where I was 308 00:12:43.759 --> 00:12:47.039 outlining oh yeah, absolutely, and uh and and yeah, I 309 00:12:47.039 --> 00:12:49.039 outlined kind of the basic structure of what was going 310 00:12:49.080 --> 00:12:49.879 to happen in the story. 311 00:12:49.879 --> 00:12:51.440 I knew what was gonna happen in the story world 312 00:12:51.679 --> 00:12:52.639 all the way through to the end. 313 00:12:53.000 --> 00:12:55.919 And now it's you know, now it's it's I'm getting 314 00:12:55.919 --> 00:12:57.720 close to the end of it, so you know, hopefully 315 00:12:57.720 --> 00:12:59.759 I can make things pay off in a satisfactory way. 316 00:13:00.480 --> 00:13:02.639 My friend Ben Albright just walked in the studio. He 317 00:13:02.759 --> 00:13:05.200 too is a super fan, I found out yesterday. Do 318 00:13:05.240 --> 00:13:06.639 you have a question for Jim, Ben? 319 00:13:07.159 --> 00:13:08.840 Not a question, just to thank you man. 320 00:13:09.200 --> 00:13:11.120 You know, your books help get me through college and 321 00:13:11.200 --> 00:13:14.519 a couple of deployments in Iraq. Even watched the TV 322 00:13:14.600 --> 00:13:17.480 show The Dressed and TV show with Paul Blackthorne. I 323 00:13:17.559 --> 00:13:19.480 enjoyed that as well, So I just to thank you 324 00:13:19.519 --> 00:13:21.919 for creating a world that some of us could get 325 00:13:21.960 --> 00:13:23.440 lost in for a little while and forget about the 326 00:13:23.440 --> 00:13:23.919 world we were in. 327 00:13:24.679 --> 00:13:26.360 Oh, thank you man. 328 00:13:26.399 --> 00:13:29.639 That's what I think the role of especially fantasy writing 329 00:13:29.759 --> 00:13:32.519 is is to get people to escape things for a while, 330 00:13:32.720 --> 00:13:34.360 you know, to get into a different world than our own. 331 00:13:34.399 --> 00:13:36.600 And that's I'm so pleased I was able to do 332 00:13:36.639 --> 00:13:37.919 that for you while you were deployed, man. 333 00:13:37.919 --> 00:13:40.559 And thank you for your service, No, thank you, thank 334 00:13:40.600 --> 00:13:42.600 you for providing the hours of entertainment and enjoyment. 335 00:13:42.639 --> 00:13:43.720 And this is why we do it. 336 00:13:44.639 --> 00:13:46.799 So, Jim, let me ask you this last question before 337 00:13:46.799 --> 00:13:47.960 I have to let you go. First of all, this 338 00:13:48.039 --> 00:13:50.200 has been an absolute delightful interview, and I should have 339 00:13:50.200 --> 00:13:52.080 known it would be after your about page, which I'm 340 00:13:52.120 --> 00:13:55.720 telling you, if there were awards for about pages on websites, 341 00:13:55.759 --> 00:13:58.679 yours would be literally like head and shoulders above everybody else. 342 00:13:59.120 --> 00:14:01.559 But when you hear something like that and you meet 343 00:14:01.600 --> 00:14:03.480 the fans, because I'm sure you do some of these 344 00:14:03.799 --> 00:14:05.559 fan fests or stuff like that, I mean, have you 345 00:14:05.600 --> 00:14:07.919 had the opportunity to go and actually meet people, what 346 00:14:08.000 --> 00:14:08.679 do you get? 347 00:14:09.159 --> 00:14:10.840 What? What do you what do you get. 348 00:14:10.600 --> 00:14:12.799 From those experiences? When you do get to meet the 349 00:14:12.799 --> 00:14:15.480 people like Ben and my son who love your books, 350 00:14:15.720 --> 00:14:16.720 what does that do for you? 351 00:14:20.120 --> 00:14:22.960 It's kind of a recharge, uh, you know, because a 352 00:14:22.960 --> 00:14:25.440 lot of times, you know, I'll get discouraged because you know, 353 00:14:26.240 --> 00:14:28.799 writing is a sort of a marathon occupation, right. 354 00:14:28.919 --> 00:14:30.440 I mean, it takes months and months and months to 355 00:14:30.440 --> 00:14:31.039 write a novel. 356 00:14:32.320 --> 00:14:34.600 And when I get out to meet the fans, and 357 00:14:34.720 --> 00:14:36.279 there's a lot of times when you're when you're when 358 00:14:36.279 --> 00:14:38.600 you're writing, and it's just like, oh man, nobody's gonna 359 00:14:38.639 --> 00:14:40.519 like this. I mean, it's ridiculous for me to think that, 360 00:14:40.639 --> 00:14:43.480 you know, given the evidence. But still, you know, that's 361 00:14:43.559 --> 00:14:45.039 kind of like what being an artist is. 362 00:14:45.120 --> 00:14:47.039 Right. You're you're worried that eventually people are gonna find 363 00:14:47.080 --> 00:14:49.919 out you're a fake. And so here I am. 364 00:14:50.039 --> 00:14:51.200 You know, I right, But when I get out to 365 00:14:51.240 --> 00:14:53.360 meet the fans, and I'll have these people and they'll 366 00:14:53.360 --> 00:14:55.639 come up to me and they'll tell me, hey, I 367 00:14:55.679 --> 00:14:57.759 was reading this book. I was reading these books with 368 00:14:57.799 --> 00:14:59.919 my father and I, you know, the Will while he 369 00:15:00.080 --> 00:15:03.080 is dying new cancer. And it was everything that we 370 00:15:03.120 --> 00:15:04.919 got to get. We got to read these books together 371 00:15:05.039 --> 00:15:07.360 while that was going on, and it got it let 372 00:15:07.399 --> 00:15:09.720 him escape his pain for a while, and it let 373 00:15:09.799 --> 00:15:11.840 us be closer together because we hadn't been for years 374 00:15:11.840 --> 00:15:12.279 and years, and. 375 00:15:12.279 --> 00:15:13.360 I just want to thank you for that. 376 00:15:13.559 --> 00:15:15.120 And somebody comes up and tells you that story and 377 00:15:15.159 --> 00:15:16.720 you go, oh my god, I was just trying to 378 00:15:16.720 --> 00:15:17.759 pay the bills. 379 00:15:17.960 --> 00:15:18.200 You know. 380 00:15:19.159 --> 00:15:22.200 But but you know, but at the same time, I've 381 00:15:22.200 --> 00:15:25.159 been able to create this and and this, you know, 382 00:15:25.279 --> 00:15:27.039 kind of this little, this weird, little seed that I 383 00:15:27.080 --> 00:15:29.039 planned has grown up into this big tree that that 384 00:15:29.120 --> 00:15:30.759 a lot of people have been able to take shade in. 385 00:15:31.080 --> 00:15:32.960 And when I get out to meet the fans, it's like, Okay, 386 00:15:32.960 --> 00:15:35.000 you know what these books are. You know, they're going 387 00:15:35.080 --> 00:15:36.519 to help people. I mean, they're not They're not going 388 00:15:36.600 --> 00:15:38.279 to change the world. They're not going to alter the 389 00:15:38.320 --> 00:15:40.799 fabric of reality. But they are going to make somebody's 390 00:15:40.879 --> 00:15:43.360 day a little bit better. And and they are going 391 00:15:43.399 --> 00:15:44.759 to make somebody's. 392 00:15:44.440 --> 00:15:46.440 Really rough time a little better than it would have 393 00:15:46.440 --> 00:15:47.039 been without them. 394 00:15:47.440 --> 00:15:50.240 And I feel like, if if I can make that, 395 00:15:50.279 --> 00:15:52.039 as if that could be my contribution to the world 396 00:15:52.080 --> 00:15:54.440 as a human being, that's very satisfying. When I get 397 00:15:54.480 --> 00:15:56.320 to get out meet those people and hear those stories, 398 00:15:56.440 --> 00:15:58.440 it kind of renews my commitment to takes well. 399 00:15:58.679 --> 00:16:01.039 Jim Butcher isopreciate your time. And you know what I 400 00:16:01.080 --> 00:16:03.200 always tell people, Not all of us can cure cancer, 401 00:16:03.240 --> 00:16:05.240