Speaker 1: Lucky Land Casino, asking people what's the weirdest place you've
Speaker 1: gotten lucky? Lucky in line at the Delhi I guess ah,
Speaker 1: in my dentist's office more than once.
Speaker 2: Actually do I have to say?
Speaker 1: Yes?
Speaker 3: You do?
Speaker 2: In the car before my kid's PTA meeting?
Speaker 1: Really?
Speaker 4: Yes?
Speaker 1: Excuse me? What's the weirdest place you've gotten lucky?
Speaker 5: I never win?
Speaker 1: And tell well, there you have it.
Speaker 2: You could get lucky anywhere playing at lucky landslots dot com.
Speaker 1: Play for free right now? Are you feeling lucky? No,
Speaker 1: We're just necessary foid. We're gonna be my long eighteen
Speaker 1: plus terms conditions of place he wants every day else
Speaker 1: step into the world of power, loyalty and luck.
Speaker 3: I'm gonna make him an offer you can't refuse.
Speaker 1: With family, canoli's and spins mean everything?
Speaker 3: Now you want to get mixed up in the family business,
Speaker 3: Introducing The Godfather at champacasino dot com.
Speaker 5: Test your luck in the shadowy world at the Godfather slot.
Speaker 3: Someday I will call upon you to do a service
Speaker 3: for me.
Speaker 1: Play the Godfather now at champacasino dot com. Welcome to
Speaker 1: the Family vdW Group.
Speaker 6: No purchase necessary.
Speaker 3: I believe we're privited by loss.
Speaker 7: He terms and conditions eighteen plus.
Speaker 1: Lucky Land Casino, asking people what's the weirdest place you've
Speaker 1: gotten lucky? Lucky in line at the Delhi I guess ah,
Speaker 1: in my dentist's office more than once.
Speaker 6: Actually do I.
Speaker 2: Have to say?
Speaker 5: Yes?
Speaker 1: You do? In the car before my kid's PTA meeting.
Speaker 5: Really?
Speaker 1: Yes, excuse me? What's the weirdest place you've gotten lucky?
Speaker 1: I never win? And tell well, there you have it.
Speaker 2: You can get lucky anywhere playing at Lucky landslots dot com.
Speaker 1: Play for free right now. Are you feeling lucky? Nope,
Speaker 1: we're necessary for We're going to be my long eighteen
Speaker 1: plus terms and conditions plus ont say details Wait the
Speaker 1: Lucky Land slots. You can get lucky just about anywhere.
Speaker 5: It's your captain speaking. We've got clear runway and the
Speaker 5: weather's fine, but we're just gonna circle up here a
Speaker 5: while and get lucky. Oh no, nothing like that. It's
Speaker 5: just these cash prizes add up quick. So I suggest
Speaker 5: you sit back, keep your trade table up right, and
Speaker 5: start getting lucky.
Speaker 1: Play for free at Lucky landslots dot com.
Speaker 6: Are you feeling lucky?
Speaker 1: No purchase, No necessary void. We're prohibited by Law eighteen
Speaker 1: plus terms and conditions apply a website for details.
Speaker 7: You are now listening to True Murder, The most shocking
Speaker 7: killers in true crime history and the authors that have
Speaker 7: written about them, Gasey, Bundy, Dahmer, The Nightstalker DTK. Every week,
Speaker 7: another fascinating author talking about the most shocking and infamous
Speaker 7: killers in true crime history. True Murder with your host,
Speaker 7: journalist and author Dan Zupanski, Good Eating. Three young women
Speaker 7: abducted and brutally murdered. For years, their killer remained a
Speaker 7: mystery as the cases turned. Then a crime Stoppers call
Speaker 7: led to his arrest. Charming and handsome serial killer Oscar
Speaker 7: Ray Bolan married a member of his legal defense team,
Speaker 7: and he toyed with the criminal courts for decades while
Speaker 7: on death row. This is the first book about Bolan
Speaker 7: and his victims. Book they were featuring this evening is
Speaker 7: Death Row Romeo, The True Story of Oscar Ray Bolan,
Speaker 7: with my special guest, journalist and author JT.
Speaker 8: Hunter. Welcome back to the program, and thank you very
Speaker 8: much for geting this interview. JT. Hunter.
Speaker 6: Hey, Dan, glad to be here, Thanks for having me back.
Speaker 8: Thank you very much. Another wild tale that I had
Speaker 8: not heard of, and I'm sure the audience is not
Speaker 8: so familiar with. So here we go with death Row Romeo.
Speaker 8: Let's get right into this. I want to ask you
Speaker 8: the typical question why you got involved with this? This
Speaker 8: is an incredible story, and I think that's enough I
Speaker 8: think to know. Let's start with as you do. You
Speaker 8: set the scene in January twenty fifth, nineteen eighty six,
Speaker 8: Churches Fried Chicken and Tampa area, and Natalie Blanche Hally,
Speaker 8: twenty six years old, and you say she's a daughter
Speaker 8: of Charles Holly, a lawyer, judge and state legislator from
Speaker 8: Penelas County. Tell us a little bit about Natalie Blanche
Speaker 8: Holly and where she's working and what she's doing, and
Speaker 8: tell us the encounter then about with officer or Deputy
Speaker 8: Sheriff Ron Valente that same evening.
Speaker 6: Okay, well, well, Natalie Holly is a young young lady
Speaker 6: twenty six years old at the time, and as you said,
Speaker 6: she was working at Church's Fried Chicken restaurant. She was
Speaker 6: a knight manager there on the evening of January twenty six,
Speaker 6: nineteen eighty six, and shorked pretty late. She worked into
Speaker 6: the wee hours of the morning working that late shift.
Speaker 6: Particular night, she worked a shift as normal, cleaned the
Speaker 6: place up, locked it up, secured it and everything, and
Speaker 6: left sometime early in the morning, around one thirty or so,
Speaker 6: and she walked out in the parking lot, got in
Speaker 6: her car along with the co employee, helped her close
Speaker 6: the restaurant down and lock it up, and you know,
Speaker 6: they went there their separate ways, and the co employee watched,
Speaker 6: you know, as Natalie drove out of the parking lot
Speaker 6: and drove down the street. And later on that evening,
Speaker 6: the deputy that you mentioned with the Hillsborough County Sheriff's office,
Speaker 6: his name was Ron Valenti was he was a pretty
Speaker 6: pretty young deputy sheriff, hadn't been on the force for
Speaker 6: too long, just a couple of years.
Speaker 9: He was also working in.
Speaker 6: The league shift. And around around two o'clock that morning,
Speaker 6: so roughly about a half an hour after Natalie had
Speaker 6: closed up and left the restaurant, Valente Officer Valente was
Speaker 6: on his way to a service call in Tampa there
Speaker 6: and he came to an intersection at Lake Magdalen Road
Speaker 6: and Smitr Road, which was the intersection there turned right
Speaker 6: at a stop sign and saw two cars parked over
Speaker 6: on the side of the road. One of the cars
Speaker 6: had its urgency hazard lights blinking, the one the one
Speaker 6: in front, and then the other car was parked ray
Speaker 6: behind it. So, you know, obviously this being a little
Speaker 6: unusual to have two cars sitting there with one of
Speaker 6: them with its emergency lights blinking. The deputy pulled up there.
Speaker 9: To check it out and see what was going on.
Speaker 6: And he pulled up to the first car there, the
Speaker 6: one with the ergency lights, looked inside, you know, put
Speaker 6: his spotlight in there inside, and nobody was in there.
Speaker 6: So he car forward a little bit more to the
Speaker 6: to the second one that was behind it there, and
Speaker 6: found a man and a young man and a young
Speaker 6: woman inside that one in the front seats. The man
Speaker 6: was sitting in the driver's seats and the young woman
Speaker 6: was sitting right next to him in the passenger seat.
Speaker 6: And Pty Flint, you know, came up there, and you know,
Speaker 6: as you might imagine, he kind of went up and said,
Speaker 6: you know, hey, what's going on you guys?
Speaker 4: Okay? Everything all right? Do you have an accident? You
Speaker 4: need help.
Speaker 6: Sort of thing, And you know, the man behind the
Speaker 6: wheel said, you know, we're fine. I just I just
Speaker 6: ran out of gas and she was helping.
Speaker 4: She was going to take me to.
Speaker 6: The to the station to get some more gas, basically
Speaker 6: what he told the deputy. And you know, at the time,
Speaker 6: the deputy thought it was a little strange the response
Speaker 6: that he was given, because if the if the man
Speaker 6: had ran out of gas, it was kind of weird,
Speaker 6: kind of weird that he was in the driver's seat,
Speaker 6: they're going to drive her car to get gas instead
Speaker 6: of her driving him to get gas. So it just
Speaker 6: didn't quite mesh with what he said. But so the
Speaker 6: deputy asked to asked the woman directly, you know, is
Speaker 6: everything okay?
Speaker 4: You know, and and she she looked.
Speaker 6: Over at him, and that the band next to her
Speaker 6: kind of looked at her for a second. Then she
Speaker 6: looked over at the deputy and said, yeah, you know,
Speaker 6: everything's okay, officer. And so, you know, Valente was satisfied
Speaker 6: everything seemed to be what it was supposed to because
Speaker 6: the woman didn't indicate any sort of distress or didn't
Speaker 6: seem nervous or anything like that. So he was her
Speaker 6: answer basically satisfied him, and so he said, okay, you know,
Speaker 6: he says, have a good night and all that sort
Speaker 6: of thing, and drove on to on his way to
Speaker 6: respond to the original call he had gotten, leaving both of.
Speaker 9: Them sitting there in the dark.
Speaker 6: And it turns out, you know, later that the woman
Speaker 6: was Natalie Holly in the car there.
Speaker 8: You also talked that the officer was suspicious enough or
Speaker 8: did his job enough, that he ran the two vehicle
Speaker 8: tags in the first car on Black nineteen eighty four,
Speaker 8: as you ride, a Grand Prix was registered to Oscar
Speaker 8: Ray and Cheryl Boling, and neither vehicle was stole and sold.
Speaker 8: There was no red flags, and as you say, he
Speaker 8: resumed his patrol. Right now, you talk about an attorney
Speaker 8: named Gerald Sage. He's out on his usual Saturday morning
Speaker 8: jog and he found a woman. Tell us what he finds,
Speaker 8: and tell her what he what he finds, and then
Speaker 8: later what the crime scene texts find.
Speaker 6: Okay, so yeah, it's Gerald Stage. You know. Later that
Speaker 6: morning it was about two am when when the deputy
Speaker 6: came on Natalie Holly and the car belonging to the
Speaker 6: Bowlin's Oscary and Cheryl Bowlin. So seven thirty five and
Speaker 6: a half hours later, this Cheryl Sage is out going
Speaker 6: for a jog and comes across, as you said, this,
Speaker 6: this this body lying in the wheat there, just a
Speaker 6: little bit off the road and an overgrown orange groove,
Speaker 6: and you know, he obviously graces back and calls the
Speaker 6: calls the sheriff's office, and you know, they come out
Speaker 6: and respond to the scene there and they find this
Speaker 6: this woman, this woman's body there. She had been she
Speaker 6: had she had met a brutal end. It was pretty
Speaker 6: pair right. She had been stabbed numerous times. You know,
Speaker 6: they later came to determine she was stabbed about ten times.
Speaker 6: And her eyes are still open in death, so you know,
Speaker 6: as if as if, you know, still experiencing the violence
Speaker 6: of it, the shock of it. And there was an
Speaker 6: apron wrapped around her with Church's chicken written on it,
Speaker 6: and you know, they were able to determine that the
Speaker 6: body was Natalie Holly, and they ended up finding her
Speaker 6: car about four miles away from where the body was,
Speaker 6: which wasn't very far away from the church's restaurant where
Speaker 6: she worked either. And uh, you know, you know kind
Speaker 6: of calculating, well, you know, if she was going straight
Speaker 6: home after leaving work, which way she would she had gone.
Speaker 6: They determined that where the where the car was located
Speaker 6: was consistent with the direct pride back to her house.
Speaker 6: And you know, later on they.
Speaker 9: Came to some.
Speaker 6: Uh you know, the theory as to how what had happened,
Speaker 6: how she had been stopped, and they figured that, uh
Speaker 6: that Bolan may have bumped her get her to pull
Speaker 6: over on the road there and then you know, obviously
Speaker 6: uh put her under his control. You know, he had
Speaker 6: a he had a gun with him at the time
Speaker 6: he pulled her over. And even at the time that
Speaker 6: officer of Valente, Deputy Valente came by there and spoke
Speaker 6: to them that he was Bulan was pressing a gun
Speaker 6: to Natalie's waste the whole time.
Speaker 4: So that's that's how Natalie ended up.
Speaker 6: Becoming a victim of Bolan.
Speaker 8: You talk about there was some evidence. There was an
Speaker 8: athletic shoeprint identified as men's track brand tennis shoes. There
Speaker 8: was some fiber carpet fiber, and so there was impressions
Speaker 8: and there was some forensic evidence at that time. But
Speaker 8: you say, as well, despite the barbarity of the barbarity
Speaker 8: of the crime, Tampa Bay Residents' attention was for another
Speaker 8: horrific event. Tell us a little bit about that before
Speaker 8: we talk about November fifth, nineteen eighty six.
Speaker 6: Well, in the day that they found Natalie's body, it
Speaker 6: was the same day that the Space shuttle, the Challenger
Speaker 6: Space Shuttle exploded. As you know, most people that heard
Speaker 6: that where they were viewing at the time, they heard
Speaker 6: huge news event. So you know, perhaps not surprisingly that
Speaker 6: kind of took center.
Speaker 4: Stage and kind of took a little bit away from the.
Speaker 6: News or coverage of Natalie's murder.
Speaker 8: Next, talk about November fifth, nineteen eighty six and his
Speaker 8: next victim. Stephanie Collins, seventeen years old, born in Kansas,
Speaker 8: a senior at high school. Tell us a little bit
Speaker 8: about what she was doing, where she was working, and
Speaker 8: how she goes missing.
Speaker 6: Okay, so Stephanie Collins, this is later later on the
Speaker 6: same year. As you said, she's a high school student.
Speaker 6: She's a senior, seventeen year old senior at Chamberlain High
Speaker 6: School there in Tampa. You know, she was was by
Speaker 6: all accounts a very well liked young lady there at
Speaker 6: the school and was active in the school choir and whatnot.
Speaker 6: And you know, it being getting close to Christmas. She
Speaker 6: was wanting to earn a little extra money so she
Speaker 6: could buy some nice gifts for her for her family
Speaker 6: and friends, and so on this particular day on November fifth,
Speaker 6: she stopped by the police that she worked part time,
Speaker 6: which was an Ecker drug store there and in the
Speaker 6: Tampa in the Tampa suburb there, Carol Wood is the
Speaker 6: name of it, off of Dale Mabrey Road.
Speaker 9: So she stopped by there.
Speaker 6: You know, she pulled into the shopping center parking lot
Speaker 6: and got out, went into eckerd and talked to the
Speaker 6: the manager in there to see if she could get
Speaker 6: some extra work. And you know, he actually offered to
Speaker 6: let her work that night because he needed somebody, but
Speaker 6: she had a a choir concert coming up that she
Speaker 6: needed to prepare for. There was choir practice that same night,
Speaker 6: so she wasn't able to take him up on the
Speaker 6: offer to work that night.
Speaker 4: So she you know, thanked him and.
Speaker 6: Walked out of the drug store to go back to
Speaker 6: her car, and that was the last time that anybody
Speaker 6: saw her alive. Around four fifteen in the evening around
Speaker 6: November fifth.
Speaker 8: You write about her parents tearful televised plea for her
Speaker 8: safe return but you write. December fifth, nineteen eighty six,
Speaker 8: one month after Stephanie's disappearance, a man named Donald Gibson
Speaker 8: spots a group of vultures. Tell us what he first
Speaker 8: sees and what he discovers to his whoror.
Speaker 6: Okay, So yeah, this guy, he was he was driving
Speaker 6: to work in the morning there on December fifth, and
Speaker 6: he spotted this this flow the birds, you know, these
Speaker 6: large birds gathered up by the road is you know
Speaker 6: sometimes you see you know, it's road killed that sort
Speaker 6: of thing.
Speaker 9: So he saw that, you know, at first he thought.
Speaker 6: That they might be turkeys or something, but but he
Speaker 6: got closer, he saw they were actually Italy vultures. And
Speaker 6: you know, in Florida we have these, uh these turkey vultures,
Speaker 6: so that that's what they ended up being. And so
Speaker 6: he was a little curious about it, just wanted to
Speaker 6: kind of see what it was. So he so he
Speaker 6: he pulled up there and got out of his car
Speaker 6: and walked off to the side of the road there
Speaker 6: and dirt road a little bit there and then and
Speaker 6: he he saw what was attracting the birds, and it
Speaker 6: was a pair of pair of human feet and uh ahead,
Speaker 6: human head that was, you know, the getting the attention
Speaker 6: of the birds. They're they're obviously feasting on it. So
Speaker 6: he found this badly Decomo's body there, you know, off
Speaker 6: the road there a little bit and it was wrapped
Speaker 6: up in some cloth and obviously notified the police quickly,
Speaker 6: and they responded out there and you know, investigated and
Speaker 6: found uh, found this badly uh decomposed, you know, feltonized
Speaker 6: body out there with a wrapped up in a hospital
Speaker 6: tal it turned out it said hospital property on it,
Speaker 6: and they, you know, they later were able to identify
Speaker 6: the remains as those of Stephanie Collins.
Speaker 4: So she had been missing.
Speaker 6: Just about a month exactly when her when her body
Speaker 6: was found. And you know, similar to Natalie Holly, she
Speaker 6: Stephanie Collins had been stabbed, but she'd also had skull injuries.
Speaker 6: Her skull had basically been crushed, uh in part of it.
Speaker 7: You're right.
Speaker 8: On the same day, the Pascal County Sheriff's Office received
Speaker 8: word of another gruesome discovery. Moving crew discovered the body
Speaker 8: of twenty six year old Terry Lynn Matthews. Tell us
Speaker 8: what they found and what was her condition? Tell us
Speaker 8: a little bit about her, all right.
Speaker 6: So, yeah, So Terry Lynn Matthews twenty six, same age
Speaker 6: as Natalie Hawley, and uh you know, and this this
Speaker 6: is the same day that they found Stuffannie Collins's body.
Speaker 6: Strangely enough, but they found they found Terry's body in
Speaker 6: a witted area in a rural part of Pascoe County.
Speaker 6: Her body was fully closed. It was ramped in, wrapped
Speaker 6: up in a in a sheet that was that was wet,
Speaker 6: which was odd because there had not there hadn't been
Speaker 6: any rain recently or anything, so it was strange that
Speaker 6: the sheets she was wrapped wrapped in were wet. But
Speaker 6: like like Collins and Holly, Terry Lynn Matthews had also
Speaker 6: been been stabbed repeatedly. She'd been stabbed in the neck
Speaker 6: and chest and then similar to Stephanie Collins, she also
Speaker 6: had head injuries launch trauma, head injuries and uh, you know,
Speaker 6: Matthews had been She had worked at at a bank
Speaker 6: in Tampa predecessor of being in America. Essentially she worked.
Speaker 6: She worked a night shift typically too, and worked the
Speaker 6: night of December fourth, so just you know, the night
Speaker 6: before she'd worked and after work it stopped by her
Speaker 6: boyfriend's house and was last seen, you know by him
Speaker 6: leaving about, you know, early in the morning, about two
Speaker 6: fifteen in the morning or so in the morning of
Speaker 6: December fifth, which was the morning her body was found. Atally,
Speaker 6: when she didn't call him later just to say that
Speaker 6: she got home safely, her boyfriend got a little worried,
Speaker 6: as you might imagine, and so he decided to go
Speaker 6: out looking for and drove from you know, drove the
Speaker 6: route from from his place to where her house was,
Speaker 6: where she lived with her parents in a little town
Speaker 6: called Reserve Town in Florida. So on his way there,
Speaker 6: he passed by the post office in Landa Lakes and
Speaker 6: spotted you know, her car sitting there in the parking
Speaker 6: lot of the post office and pulled up to it
Speaker 6: to take a look, and found a bunch of envelopes
Speaker 6: mail that was addressed to her her parents kind of
Speaker 6: littered around on the ground there right outside the car there,
Speaker 6: and you know, obviously she was nowhere to be found.
Speaker 8: You say too, that they found a pink and turquoise
Speaker 8: ear rings, pair of pink and turquoise e rings, and
Speaker 8: her front her person in the front seat. Now you
Speaker 8: talk about Oscar Ray Bolan born in January nineteen sixty two,
Speaker 8: his father, Oscar Ray Bowlan Senior and Mary Brock tell
Speaker 8: us about his life and what you found him growing
Speaker 8: up in the environment in Portland, Indiana.
Speaker 6: Yeah, so Bolan, you know, he he was described by
Speaker 6: his mom as being a little bit different than her
Speaker 6: other kids. He was she described as being very quiet
Speaker 6: and odd acting is what she called called it. But
Speaker 6: he wasn't in trouble much growing up with uh as
Speaker 6: far as you know, formal problems with authority or or
Speaker 6: law enforcement. He didn't seem to have any real real
Speaker 6: problems as far as that went, but he did.
Speaker 9: He did have some.
Speaker 6: Injuries when he was growing up. When he was younger,
Speaker 6: he fell off a roof of a house and hit
Speaker 6: his head and you know, as you might imagine, he
Speaker 6: hit it so hard that it wasn't good. He got
Speaker 6: a lost consciousness, had a concussion, and apparently had had
Speaker 6: quite a few concussions growing up as a kid. And
Speaker 6: when he was a little bit older he was hospitalized
Speaker 6: for having a vitamin vitamin deficiency vitamin K deficiency.
Speaker 9: Was described as a loner.
Speaker 6: By some and did eventually as he got more into
Speaker 6: his teenage years, did eventually end up having some adverse
Speaker 6: encounters with law enforcements, you know, started having some some thefts,
Speaker 6: things like this, and by the time he was fifteen,
Speaker 6: he spent some time in juvenile attention, was let out
Speaker 6: on probation. Shortly after that, ended up leaving home, going
Speaker 6: out on his own and started working, you know, just
Speaker 6: various various jobs, construction jobs, things like that. His his
Speaker 6: his family members owned a carnival and he started working
Speaker 6: with them and some of the puble dose and things
Speaker 6: like that. So that's how he survived there after he
Speaker 6: after he moved out.
Speaker 8: Around that time, you say, or soon after he meets
Speaker 8: his future wife. But at that time Cheryl Haffner, and
Speaker 8: again you say, he talks about the continued petty theft
Speaker 8: or convicted of theft, nothing any more serious than that.
Speaker 8: Even say he receies a ten year of prison sentence,
Speaker 8: but then it was suspended one year probation. But in
Speaker 8: the eighties, Bollen plans to move to the Sunshine State,
Speaker 8: to Florida with Hafner, and he relocates to Pascal County.
Speaker 8: Tell us what he does there and how he survives
Speaker 8: again in this area before we talk about nineteen eighty
Speaker 8: two and a major incident with Halfner.
Speaker 6: Well, he had relatives there in Florida, and you know,
Speaker 6: I think part of the reason why he decided to
Speaker 6: relocate back down to Florida was he was starting to
Speaker 6: have too many, so many bad marks against him, so
Speaker 6: to speak, up there and where he was, so he
Speaker 6: kind of wanted to get away from all that. So
Speaker 6: he had relatives there in Florida, and you know, they
Speaker 6: helped him get various jobs when he moved down there.
Speaker 6: He worked all kinds of all kinds of jobs, you know, carpenter, welder,
Speaker 6: security guard, truck driver, lived all different areas in the
Speaker 6: in the Tampa Bay area. And you know that that
Speaker 6: kind of eventually ended up with with what you mentioned
Speaker 6: there about this incident in eighty two with his girlfriend there.
Speaker 6: He they had some sort of argument and he ended
Speaker 6: up forcing her into his car and basically basically held
Speaker 6: her hostage for for several hours in his car just
Speaker 6: kind of drive and around the stuff in the area
Speaker 6: there in the Tampa Bay area. He ended up getting
Speaker 6: arrested for it for false imprisonment, but the charges ended
Speaker 6: up being dropped subsequently because his girlfriend, Cheryl Hafner, refused
Speaker 6: to cooperate in the prosecution of it, so he didn't
Speaker 6: end up having to face any sort of repercussion for
Speaker 6: that incident.
Speaker 8: You talk about. Soon after, his brother Arthur was killed
Speaker 8: in a hit and run, and this seemed to affect him.
Speaker 8: But in February eleventh, nineteen eighty three, Hafner and Bolin
Speaker 8: were married in Brooksville, Florida, and you say later just
Speaker 8: a few months later a grand theft again tell us
Speaker 8: what happens in the eighties between the couple and what
Speaker 8: their life could be characterized by.
Speaker 6: Well, they had a they had a volatile relationship, and
Speaker 6: they had some they had some tough times. In December
Speaker 6: of eighty five, right before the new year there, Cheryl
Speaker 6: gave birth to their their son, their first child, oh,
Speaker 6: Christopher Bowling, And you know, it was following a difficult pregnancy.
Speaker 6: The pregancy was it difficult for her. She was a
Speaker 6: diabetic and had a lot of medical issues going on
Speaker 6: with that. So, uh, he was he was born, which
Speaker 6: you know, obviously for most people would normally be a
Speaker 6: joyous occasion, but in this particular instance, it didn't work
Speaker 6: out that way. That the child, Christopher had been born prematurely.
Speaker 6: He didn't have his lungs weren't fully developed. Uh, you know,
Speaker 6: he ended up living not even days after being born.
Speaker 6: So this obviously impacted Cheryl quite a bit. But it
Speaker 6: also it also really hit hit Bowling hard. He took
Speaker 6: it really hard, and Cheryl went into a depression and
Speaker 6: and and Bowling and it wasn't doing too much better.
Speaker 6: So it definitely was something that that impacted him deeply.
Speaker 6: You know. He later he later talked about it, mentioned
Speaker 6: that he thought it was it was it was as
Speaker 6: hard on him as as it was on her. And
Speaker 6: you know, it wasn't long after that that and Natalie
Speaker 6: Holly ended up being killed. You know, it was just
Speaker 6: it was less than a month after that.
Speaker 8: You talk about within months, like you say that he
Speaker 8: was looking at the fast food restaurant, and we get
Speaker 8: back to Church's Chicken and Natalie Hawley. As you do
Speaker 8: in this, you talk about other arrests and the difficulty,
Speaker 8: the difficult pregnancy. Tell us about as you take us
Speaker 8: through the three murders, the investigation for police, what have
Speaker 8: they done in terms of linkage, and what have they
Speaker 8: done in terms of gathering forensic evidence and what are
Speaker 8: some of the conclusions that they do have and they
Speaker 8: have made and tell us a little bit about the
Speaker 8: task force that is.
Speaker 2: It is Ryan here and I have a question for you.
Speaker 2: What do you do when you win?
Speaker 6: Like?
Speaker 2: Are you a fist pumper, a woo or a hand
Speaker 2: clapper a high fiver? I kind of like the high five.
Speaker 2: But if you want to hone in on those winning moves,
Speaker 2: check out Chumback Casino at chumbacasino dot com. Choose some
Speaker 2: hundreds of social casino style games for your chance to
Speaker 2: redeem serious cash prize. There are new game releases weekly
Speaker 2: plus free daily bonuses, so don't wait. Start having the
Speaker 2: most fun ever by casino dot com.
Speaker 6: No for necessary et by lossy terms conditions eighteen plus.
Speaker 1: Step into the world of power, loyalty and luck.
Speaker 3: I'm gonna make him an offer he can't refuse.
Speaker 5: With family, canolis and spins mean everything.
Speaker 3: Now you want to get mixed up in the family.
Speaker 5: Business, Introducing The Godfather at Champa Casino dot com.
Speaker 3: Test your luck in.
Speaker 1: The shadowy world at the Godfather Slode.
Speaker 3: Someday I will call upon you to do a service
Speaker 3: for me.
Speaker 1: Play the Godfather now at champacasino dot com. Welcome to
Speaker 1: the family vdW group. No perches necessary if we were
Speaker 1: privited by loss he terms and conditions eighteen plus assembled.
Speaker 6: Okay, Well, you know, there were some similarities between the
Speaker 6: three murders well as far as the victims went, as
Speaker 6: far as how they were, how they how they were
Speaker 6: last seeing, how they were abducted, and then also as
Speaker 6: far as a forensic evidence at the scene, there were
Speaker 6: some some common elements that that later later came up
Speaker 6: as far as fiber evidence that was recovered at the scene.
Speaker 6: You know, the the police in Tampa were obviously they
Speaker 6: were working the case as hard as they could. They
Speaker 6: were they were trying to they were trying to establish
Speaker 6: all these similarities and trying to come up with suspects.
Speaker 6: And they you know, they they asked for assistance from
Speaker 6: the FBI for a profile, criminal personality profile of the killer.
Speaker 6: So the FBI prepared that for them, so they had
Speaker 6: that information, but there wasn't a lot of positive movement
Speaker 6: in the case as far as getting closer to finding
Speaker 6: out who did it. So, you know, two a few
Speaker 6: years later after the after the last body discovery that
Speaker 6: that of Terry Lane Matthews, you know, several years after
Speaker 6: that and in the summer of nineteen ninety, the Hillsborough
Speaker 6: County Sheriff decided to call together the task force as
Speaker 6: you mentioned, to be made up of personnel from his office,
Speaker 6: Hillsborough County Sheriff's Office there, but also from Pasco County
Speaker 6: Shriff's office, Tampa Police Department, and also personnel from the
Speaker 6: FBI as well. And this task force was going to
Speaker 6: be devoted to trying to solve these three murders, the Hally,
Speaker 6: Collins and Matthews murders. And the sheriff, you know, appointed
Speaker 6: a captain there to oversee this. His name was Gary Terry,
Speaker 6: was a veteran there of the Sheriff's office, have been
Speaker 6: there a couple of decades, a lot of experience, so
Speaker 6: he was appointed to head the task force there. He
Speaker 6: had actually successfully overseen a similar task force that had
Speaker 6: been put together just a few years before to work
Speaker 6: on a serial killer case there in the Tampa area
Speaker 6: another another serial killer case, the Bobby Joe Long case.
Speaker 6: So Terry had experienced had experienced with that, so he
Speaker 6: was he was decided he would he would head up
Speaker 6: this task force as well on this case to try
Speaker 6: to solve these three murders.
Speaker 4: And you talk about.
Speaker 6: Okay, go ahead. Sorry, Well, I'm just gonna say. You know,
Speaker 6: they kept working the case, and not long after actually
Speaker 6: this task force was formed, they got a real lucky break.
Speaker 6: They had a call come in on a crime stoppers
Speaker 6: hotline in Indiana and Fort Wayne, Indiana, July twelfth, actually,
Speaker 6: and the caller provided some detailed facts about the three murders,
Speaker 6: the Hallway, Collins, and Matthews murders that had occurred there
Speaker 6: in Tampa Bay. And the information provided, you know, identified
Speaker 6: Oscar Ray Bowen as the other person who had been
Speaker 6: involved in those murders.
Speaker 8: You talk about the killer of being the caller, pardon me,
Speaker 8: that was Daniel Coby. Who was Daniel Coby? And how
Speaker 8: does he get to be privy to this information?
Speaker 9: Well, by this time Cheryl.
Speaker 6: Happener, Oscar Ray's girlfriend then wife. By this time she
Speaker 6: and Oscar Ray had separated and had divorced, and Cheryl
Speaker 6: had remarried and she was now Cheryl Kobe. So she
Speaker 6: had married Daniel Kobe.
Speaker 1: And.
Speaker 6: You know, at some point had kind of spilled her
Speaker 6: guts so to speak to her husband, her new husband,
Speaker 6: and she told Daniel about some things that she had
Speaker 6: experienced or scene with when she was still married to Bolin,
Speaker 6: and Kobe ended up calling the crime stoppers you know,
Speaker 6: after after that, some time after that, and gave them
Speaker 6: the information, and you know, basically said that she told
Speaker 6: the crime stoppers there that that one had had been
Speaker 6: involved in the murder of the chicken woman, even going
Speaker 6: so far as to describe the encounter with the deputy
Speaker 6: alongside the road their deputy.
Speaker 3: So wow.
Speaker 8: You also talk about that the associates of Bolan at
Speaker 8: that time had provided an alibi for him, so there
Speaker 8: was no further investigation that correct.
Speaker 6: Yeah, you know they had, they had they had run
Speaker 6: the uh, the information on the car back then, and
Speaker 6: you know, Bolan's name had had had been there and
Speaker 6: the police records and whatnot, and they had they had
Speaker 6: looked at him.
Speaker 9: Early on in the case.
Speaker 6: But like you said, there was a there was an
Speaker 6: alibi for him, so they kind of marked him off
Speaker 6: and kept looking. Wow.
Speaker 8: You talk about within twenty four hour whereas Captain Terry
Speaker 8: sent Detective King and Corporal Lee Baker to Union City,
Speaker 8: Indiana to interview in person Cheryl Boby, and she met
Speaker 8: them at Portland, Indiana Police Department. Tell us what she
Speaker 8: told them in that interview at in Portland Police Department.
Speaker 6: Well, the detectives went up there to Indiana and they
Speaker 6: interviewed her, and you know, at first she was pretty
Speaker 6: reluctant to talk to them, but eventually eventually did and
Speaker 6: she told them she gave him a lot of information
Speaker 6: to leak Bowen to the three killings. She also pointed
Speaker 6: them to Boland's brother Philip as having been involved, not
Speaker 6: directly in the murders, but having been involved after the
Speaker 6: fact and disposing the bodies things like that. So so
Speaker 6: that that opened up a whole other area of inquiry
Speaker 6: for the for the detectives there, But she gave them
Speaker 6: enough evidence to allow them to move forward with you know,
Speaker 6: formal charges against Poland and being an indictment and uh,
Speaker 6: you know, going forward with the rest and prosecuting.
Speaker 8: You talk also that Daniel Kobe had other motivation other
Speaker 8: than altruism or public safety when he went public with
Speaker 8: this information or later when he went public with this
Speaker 8: information as and and identified himself as an anonymous caller.
Speaker 8: Tell us a little bit about this little motivation for
Speaker 8: Daniel Kobe to do this.
Speaker 6: Well, well, he called you know, probably out of spite,
Speaker 6: you know, he and and Sheryl had braided and worked
Speaker 6: together anymore. And you know, he was obviously not in
Speaker 6: a good mood about that. I'm not happy with that situation.
Speaker 6: So he decided he probably wanted to get back at
Speaker 6: her a little bit, and so figured by conveying this
Speaker 6: information that she had given him, you know, under trust confidentially,
Speaker 6: that he could get back her a little bit, you know,
Speaker 6: either by getting back at her former husband to hurt
Speaker 6: her that way, or you know, having her involved in
Speaker 6: it directly as well.
Speaker 8: You talk about that there were ten days of interviews
Speaker 8: and they secured valuable evidence. What type of evidence that
Speaker 8: they get in those ten days regarding that they could
Speaker 8: use later.
Speaker 6: Well, it turned out that Cheryl had accompanied Bolin Oscar
Speaker 6: Ray Bowlin h to when he went to get rid
Speaker 6: of a bunch of the evidence in the murders. Cheryl
Speaker 6: had had gone along with him back to Natalie Holly's car.
Speaker 6: Remember this was the car that the deputy Valente had
Speaker 6: found them in. So so Cheryl accompanied Oscarray back to
Speaker 6: that car and you know, watched him as he wiped
Speaker 6: the car down and you know got a you know,
Speaker 6: a big branch tree branch that was on the ground
Speaker 6: and used it to wipe away the tire tracks from
Speaker 6: from his vehicle that had been left there at the scene.
Speaker 9: And also.
Speaker 6: You know, getting rid of of other items that might
Speaker 6: link him to to that murderer. And then also with
Speaker 6: respect to your disposal of the other bodies of Stephanie
Speaker 6: Collins and Terry Lynne Matthews. So they got evidence on
Speaker 6: all these things. Between Cheryl and Philip Bowen.
Speaker 8: You talk about too, that the police don't stop there.
Speaker 8: They ask her to be if she'd be wired, and
Speaker 8: then three days of visits in prison. You don't talk
Speaker 8: about any kind of guidance. We'll say on what kind
Speaker 8: of questions to get to elicit this kind of evidence.
Speaker 8: But it is incredible some of the information that she
Speaker 8: gets from him at this visit. And you say, despite
Speaker 8: that he's guarded. So tell us a little bit about
Speaker 8: this initiative by police and what they get from this.
Speaker 8: As a result, Bolan.
Speaker 6: Had been It turned out that Oscar Ray had been
Speaker 6: arrested for another crime and was serving time in Ohio.
Speaker 6: For this crime, he was sentenced convicted of a rape
Speaker 6: and a sentenced to prison in Ohio, So he was
Speaker 6: serving time in Ohio by the time this Prime Stoppers
Speaker 6: call came in, by the time the Florida investigators got
Speaker 6: all this information linking Oscar Ray to these three murders.
Speaker 6: So once they got that, once they talked to Cheryl, Yeah,
Speaker 6: they said, you know what, we want you to try
Speaker 6: to get some more direct information from Oscar Ray himself.
Speaker 4: So they set it up so that she.
Speaker 6: Would go visit him, you know, during the visitation.
Speaker 9: Hours or whatnot at the prison there in Ohio.
Speaker 6: So she had that several times, trying to get him
Speaker 6: to incriminate himself. And you know, while he would, he
Speaker 6: would he would discuss a lot of things kind of
Speaker 6: around the peripheral area I guess of the crimes. He
Speaker 6: never really you know, came out and directly incriminated himself.
Speaker 6: He didn't didn't give information that uh that would make it,
Speaker 6: you know, a slam dunk kind of kind of case,
Speaker 6: so to speak. He did say a lot of incriminating things,
Speaker 6: a lot of things that that really showed that he
Speaker 6: had knowledge of these crimes, and you know, certainly certainly
Speaker 6: seemed to be involved with him, which you know, there's
Speaker 6: a there's a lot of quotation of it in the book,
Speaker 6: like the conversations between between Cheryl and Oscar Ray there
Speaker 6: in the prison. The things he's saying, even though he's
Speaker 6: you know, he's purpose, he's being guarded. You know, he
Speaker 6: obviously doesn't he's worried that someone might be listening or
Speaker 6: something like that. So so he's very guarded. But there
Speaker 6: is a lot, a lot of things he says that
Speaker 6: do really rate some flags.
Speaker 8: So there's no actual confession. You talk about this. Uh,
Speaker 8: they call him Pop's Baker after this and after they
Speaker 8: realize they're not going to get any information, he comes
Speaker 8: up from the back tell us about this confrontation, very
Speaker 8: very interesting and fascinating.
Speaker 6: Well, and you know, by the time they'd had several
Speaker 6: days of Gerald trying to get this this confession directly
Speaker 6: from the Oscar but by the time that they figured,
Speaker 6: you know, they're not going to get anything more than
Speaker 6: they have.
Speaker 9: Baker he's you know, one of the.
Speaker 6: Detectives from from Tampa there. He was listening in a
Speaker 6: room nearby there.
Speaker 4: And so he comes out and.
Speaker 6: You know, kind of confronts Oscar Ray about it, pressing him,
Speaker 6: trying to get him to to talk about it, and uh,
Speaker 6: Oscar Ray says, you know, I you know, I'd like
Speaker 6: to find you know, I'll talk to you about it,
Speaker 6: but but I think I need an attorney.
Speaker 4: And it was just kind of the magic.
Speaker 6: Words, so to speak, the mentioning of the attorney, and
Speaker 6: Gary Terry, the head of the task force there, had
Speaker 6: had experience with that before. Back again, and this isn't
Speaker 6: the Bobby Joe Long case. There's a similar sort of
Speaker 6: circumstance where they're trying to get information from Bobby Joe
Speaker 6: and he mentioned, you know, maybe needing an attorney, and
Speaker 6: they kind of kept pressing him for information even after
Speaker 6: he said that.
Speaker 4: And you know, it.
Speaker 6: Turned out later on that that has a lot of
Speaker 6: problems with the prosecution of Bobby Joe at trial and stuff.
Speaker 6: So so Terry had learned from that for sure, and
Speaker 6: so once he heard this this mention from Oscar about
Speaker 6: an attorney, he came out and you know, tilled pop speaker,
Speaker 6: you know that we got to stop here, We got
Speaker 6: to stop this interview. You can't you can't go forward
Speaker 6: with it. So, you know, whatever inclination that Oscary may
Speaker 6: have had to talk to that time, you know, it
Speaker 6: went away because you know, he ended up subsequently speaking
Speaker 6: to an attorney and clammed up after that.
Speaker 8: You talk about there's a press conference August first, nineteen
Speaker 8: ninety Sheriff Walter Heinrich, and what's the statement that he
Speaker 8: makes and about and also the statement he makes about
Speaker 8: other suspected murders.
Speaker 6: Well, yeah, the sheriff has this, holds this press conference,
Speaker 6: and a couple of weeks later, so you know, an
Speaker 6: now we're beginning of August nineteen ninety, hold this press conference.
Speaker 6: You know, this had been these three murders had been
Speaker 6: in the news a lot, so there was a lot
Speaker 6: of media attention going on with those. So he called
Speaker 6: express conference to announce that they have this suspect in
Speaker 6: the murder of these women, and.
Speaker 4: You know, also said that the bold one.
Speaker 6: Is suspected in some other murders in Hillsboro County as well,
Speaker 6: you know, possibly five other murders in Hillsborough County there
Speaker 6: and then a couple other ones out of state.
Speaker 4: So he so he makes that announcement and.
Speaker 6: You know, credits obviously the investigators and their efforts and everything,
Speaker 6: but also the crime Stoppers tip that came through. Obviously,
Speaker 6: that really was the break that they needed, that really
Speaker 6: cracked up with a case there for him, and you know,
Speaker 6: also mentioned that based on all the evidence and everything
Speaker 6: that they gathered, that it seemed like that there's a
Speaker 6: serial killer. Not Uscary was a serial killer.
Speaker 8: They're talking about the electric chair and also this guy's busy,
Speaker 8: and you talk about Hillsboro County Sheriff that he's fight
Speaker 8: find a homemade handcuff key when he searches self, so
Speaker 8: he's a higher risk. And then you talk about November
Speaker 8: nineteen ninety he has a girlfriend. Again, it's just crazy.
Speaker 8: It's his first cousin, Charlotte Kennedy tell us a little
Speaker 8: bit about some of the things that he's doing behind bars.
Speaker 6: Well, plans you know, he comes up with obviously this
Speaker 6: attempt to.
Speaker 4: He's this.
Speaker 6: Key that he fashioned, you know, to be able to
Speaker 6: get out of the handcuffs or whatnot. But he's also
Speaker 6: making plans with people he knows, you know, including his girlfriend.
Speaker 6: And one of the things that that they kind of
Speaker 6: that the police kind of stumbled on and monitoring him
Speaker 6: was that he was gonna have this plan where he
Speaker 6: would have have her, have Kennedy, his girlfriend, and another convict,
Speaker 6: the three of them would have this came up with
Speaker 6: this plan where they would kidnap family members of several
Speaker 6: of the key people involved in his prosecution, namely being
Speaker 6: the sheriff there, Walter Heinrich, family members of him, also
Speaker 6: his son who's a judge in the area there, and
Speaker 6: then Gary Terry from the sheriff's office, and then Pops
Speaker 6: Baker as well. It's kidnapped members of their family. And then.
Speaker 7: You know, they.
Speaker 6: Let Oscar Ray out of prison, let him go or
Speaker 6: bad things are going to happen. So they planned to
Speaker 6: abduct him, take him out of state, and then they
Speaker 6: were going to kill him if Bolan wasn't released.
Speaker 8: They also find during this tape conversation that Boland referred
Speaker 8: to a conversation with Douglas Tedrow, Kennedy's brother about the
Speaker 8: strangulation murder of a Dallas woman, Deborah Diane Stone tell
Speaker 8: us why they thought that she might be linked to
Speaker 8: this and what do they do as a result of
Speaker 8: what does Terry do? Is captain Terry do as a
Speaker 8: result of finding out this information that seems to link
Speaker 8: him to Deborah Stone in Texas?
Speaker 6: Well? Yeah, so there was mention during the during the
Speaker 6: conversations there about Kennedy's brother who was with Bolan apparently
Speaker 6: during a murder that had happened in March of eighty seven,
Speaker 6: which was shortly after the the time period there where
Speaker 6: Bolan had been in Tampa and and Holly and Collins
Speaker 6: and and Matthews in December of eighty sixth there had
Speaker 6: been had been killed and uh, you know after that
Speaker 6: Bowlan had made his way out of the state there
Speaker 6: and apparently had been involved in this murder in March
Speaker 6: in the Dallas area there. And you know then later
Speaker 6: on that same year had had ended up raping another
Speaker 6: woman and getting arrested for that, which is how he
Speaker 6: ended up in prison in Ohio there. So so Bolan
Speaker 6: was still still out there active after even after he
Speaker 6: left Florida. And you know, obviously you would have you
Speaker 6: would have kept going if he hadn't then in prison
Speaker 6: there in Ohio for that rape as well.
Speaker 8: You talk about that. Bolan asks at some point, and
Speaker 8: he makes it clear that he's afraid of this electric chair,
Speaker 8: but he asked to see Captain Terry, and there was
Speaker 8: some bond between him and Captain Terry in terms of
Speaker 8: that at least he would agreed to talk to Captain Terry.
Speaker 8: Tell us about this call and what do they get
Speaker 8: if anything as a result.
Speaker 6: Well, yeah, So, so Terry had built up some rapport
Speaker 6: with Bolan, wanting to wanting to to use that to
Speaker 6: to you know, be able to get more information to
Speaker 6: prosecute him with basically, but he had he had built
Speaker 6: up this rapport by kind of helping Bowlin out with
Speaker 6: jail complaints about conditions and things like that.
Speaker 4: And uh, you know, so Bolan kind of had.
Speaker 6: Sort of a trust for him, I guess for Terry.
Speaker 6: And one day he sent a request asking him talk
Speaker 6: to Terry and he wanted to talk to him about
Speaker 6: two murders that had occurred back in eighty five in
Speaker 6: the Tampa area, to to two girls whose bodies had
Speaker 6: been found in floating in the Hillsborough River there. But
Speaker 6: before Terry could get over there, an attorney from the
Speaker 6: Public Defender's office ended up speaking to Bolan, and you know,
Speaker 6: by the time he got out of that meeting, didn't
Speaker 6: want to talk to Terry anymore. So again, you know,
Speaker 6: talk to the attorney and ended up claiming up before
Speaker 6: he could before the police could talk to him.
Speaker 8: You take us to March nineteen ninety one, and Bolan
Speaker 8: is in court in Pascal County, Florida for the Terry
Speaker 8: Lynn Matthews murder, first degree murder. You say, somebody makes
Speaker 8: the comments no remorse, charming, manipulative, you talk about that,
Speaker 8: but you also talk about an incredible again, incredible scene
Speaker 8: in this book. I say, it's very cinematic. Rosemary Callous
Speaker 8: gets a call from her husband, Bob, so tell us
Speaker 8: about a little bit about the first degree murder. And
Speaker 8: then just a couple of weeks later, after Bolan sent
Speaker 8: this thing for kidnapping and Rosemary Callous and the call
Speaker 8: from her husband Bob.
Speaker 6: Okay, so, yeah, So in March of eighty one, they're bowling,
Speaker 6: you know, makes an appearance there in court in in
Speaker 6: Pascoe County and in connection with the Terry Lynd Matthews
Speaker 6: case and please not guilty to that. And not not
Speaker 6: long after that, a couple of weeks after that, Bob
Speaker 6: Callus ends up following up his wife at her at
Speaker 6: her work there at a car dealership and in the
Speaker 6: Bay area there, and she picks up the phone and notices,
Speaker 6: you know right away that that her husband Bob there
Speaker 6: sounds depressed, and you know, he tells her, you know, honey,
Speaker 6: I love you, but I can't take it anymore. Us.
Speaker 6: I shouldn't have had that boy working for us. And
Speaker 6: just almost immediately after that, Rosemary here's a loud bang
Speaker 6: of a gun being fired, and it was her husband, Bob,
Speaker 6: killing himself. And you know, the boy that he referred
Speaker 6: to that they shouldn't have had working for them was
Speaker 6: Oscar Ray Bowling. They had hired him back in November
Speaker 6: of eighty six to work for their record service there
Speaker 6: in the Tampa area, and you know, he kind of
Speaker 6: played on them and told him he needed money badly
Speaker 6: and all this sort of thing. And when a call
Speaker 6: came in about a disabled vehicle, they let him go
Speaker 6: out and respond to it alone, even though you know,
Speaker 6: typically that's not what they did with with new hires.
Speaker 4: And whatnot, but they let him go out on this
Speaker 4: job alone.
Speaker 6: And it ended up being h end of the beginning
Speaker 6: of December, December fourth of eighty six, and Bowlin took
Speaker 6: out their record truck.
Speaker 4: And basically kind of.
Speaker 6: Just disappeared for for hours. They kind of the kind
Speaker 6: of raised them on the radio or anything, and didn't
Speaker 6: hear from him again until really until the next morning
Speaker 6: he showed back up. You know, it was really disheveled,
Speaker 6: dirty looking and that stuff, and you know, it's kind
Speaker 6: of upset and whatnot. And later on that day they
Speaker 6: were sitting there in the office and the news report
Speaker 6: came on about the Matthews and Stephanie Collins murders. And
Speaker 6: it was strange because oscar Ay got really excited when
Speaker 6: when that coverage news coverage came on and kind of
Speaker 6: ran back and got some of the other guys and
Speaker 6: wanted them to look at it.
Speaker 9: And I was really excited about him.
Speaker 6: It was like, you know, aren't those aren't those girls
Speaker 6: really pretty? And all this sort of thing. And you know,
Speaker 6: later on, obviously they understood why, because you know, he
Speaker 6: had he had just murdered him recently and turned out,
Speaker 6: you know, he used the wrecord in uh in Stephanie
Speaker 6: Collins's sorry in interry, then matthews murder or before bringing
Speaker 6: it back that next morning. So that's why Bob Corlis
Speaker 6: had been so distraught about it, because you know, if
Speaker 6: he if he hadn't hired him, he wouldn't have had
Speaker 6: the record truck to use. And you know, Flas felt
Speaker 6: somehow responsible for the murder. You know, maybe maybe he
Speaker 6: couldn't have pulled it off without the the truck or something.
Speaker 6: So he really, uh, he really took that hard and
Speaker 6: really it really weighed on him, and you know he
Speaker 6: ended with his his suicide.
Speaker 8: You take us to June twenty second, nineteen ninety one,
Speaker 8: say Bolan was unresponsive, rushed to hospital suspected poisoning. In
Speaker 8: his cell was a cardboard box three letters in his cell.
Speaker 8: Six page letter to Captain Terry. Tell us what the
Speaker 8: gist of what he wrote to Captain Terry and what
Speaker 8: did he think he was doing in this letter?
Speaker 6: Yeah, so in the cell there they found the letter
Speaker 6: and the letter was addressed to Terry, and it basically
Speaker 6: told Terry that, you know, if you want details of
Speaker 6: the murders of the Collins, Matthews and Holly murders, you
Speaker 6: can get those from from Cheryl, my ex wife Cheryl.
Speaker 6: That's essentially what the letter said. And you know he
Speaker 6: also basically apologized than a letter to Terry as well
Speaker 6: for or for going out this way, you know, meaning
Speaker 6: that that he was intending to commit suicide. And it
Speaker 6: turned out that Bullen had been you know, saving up
Speaker 6: his medications for a while in the in the jail there,
Speaker 6: and you know, tried to overdose to kill himself. You know,
Speaker 6: they were able to save.
Speaker 4: Him by by pumping out his stomach and whatnot.
Speaker 8: You talk about the opening of the trial with the
Speaker 8: Guardian angels marching outside demanding for asking for his death,
Speaker 8: and you say the prosecution star witnesses, Cheryl Kobe uh
Speaker 8: tell us what she said at trial on the stand
Speaker 8: about that night.
Speaker 6: Well, Kobe testified about the Holly case, about accompanying Oscar
Speaker 6: Ray one night to go get coffee at Burger King
Speaker 6: or something. And you know this this was this was
Speaker 6: real located across the street from the church's restaurant that
Speaker 6: Holly worked out, and Bullan just kind of pulled up
Speaker 6: in the parking lot there facing the church's restaurant. I'm
Speaker 6: just kind of watching it.
Speaker 9: For a while, for a couple of hours.
Speaker 6: They're kind of staking it out, so to speak. You know,
Speaker 6: this was shortly before Holli was abducted. And so we
Speaker 6: also testified about Bulan returning home early in the morning.
Speaker 6: We're in bloody tennis shoes. He had a woman's purse
Speaker 6: with him and he told to hold her. Told the
Speaker 6: chryl that he had abducted this woman from the church's
Speaker 6: for a chicken restaurant that he had scoped out earlier
Speaker 6: that night and told her that, you know, he ended
Speaker 6: up having the killer in Bolin made her.
Speaker 4: Go with them, go with uh with him.
Speaker 6: As he got rid of the body. As we talked
Speaker 6: about a little bit earlier on mm hmm, and she
Speaker 6: you know, she probably rided details about that and and
Speaker 6: details about getting rid of you know, the other evidence
Speaker 6: like the purse and clothing and things like that that
Speaker 6: might link him to the crime.
Speaker 8: You also talk about the next day she was called
Speaker 8: by investigators as a very eerie scene as well. What
Speaker 8: what did she say to investigators? What did they say
Speaker 8: in this close call.
Speaker 6: Well, they wanted to know about the you know, the
Speaker 6: license weight number bet it come up, and she told
Speaker 6: them that, you know it was it was her plate,
Speaker 6: but that the car had been at the house all
Speaker 6: that throughout that whole night and that you know, it
Speaker 6: was there so it couldn't have been out at another location.
Speaker 8: And they asked her why she lied and what was
Speaker 8: her response.
Speaker 9: Garray was sitting there with her, so you know she couldn't.
Speaker 6: She was scared.
Speaker 8: Yeah, now you say July eleventh, nineteen ninety one, also
Speaker 8: Frank Bolin testified as well, but really her testimony was
Speaker 8: the key testimony. What was the verdict? What was a sentence?
Speaker 6: One was guilty first sery murder and received death penalty.
Speaker 6: Sentence of death penalty by a majority vote of the
Speaker 6: of the jury. So he was sentenced to death.
Speaker 8: And that you then talk about October October ninety one,
Speaker 8: Stephanie Collins again, Cheryl Koby providing information. Uh what does
Speaker 8: she say about Stephanie Collins and her participation in that crime?
Speaker 6: Well as it was again is similar to the the
Speaker 6: other circumstance that uh, you know, Bowen tells her that
Speaker 6: and there's a body in the in the trailer there
Speaker 6: and that he needs her help getting rid of it,
Speaker 6: and uh, basically threatens her if she's she's just not
Speaker 6: gonna help them, that you know, something that's gonna help
Speaker 6: it happen to her as well, essentially saying something like,
Speaker 6: you know, you can end up just like that person
Speaker 6: in the trailer in the trailer over there. And it
Speaker 6: turns out that, you know, after he had abducted Stephanie
Speaker 6: Collins from that Eckert shopping plaza, that he had brought
Speaker 6: her back to the trailer there and killed her there
Speaker 6: in the trailer. And and Cheryl Kobe described what she
Speaker 6: saw on the trailer. She said there was blood on
Speaker 6: the curtains and carpets and on the walls. She saw
Speaker 6: a big butcher knife on the kitchen counter that was wet.
Speaker 6: And she testified about riding the bowling down to uh
Speaker 6: location there and watching him throw Collins his body into
Speaker 6: a ditch, so go ahead. Shortly after that, she testified
Speaker 6: that a story came on TV about the Collins murder,
Speaker 6: about the discovery of the body. And but one it said,
Speaker 6: that's her, that's that's the girl that was in the trailer,
Speaker 6: that's her.
Speaker 8: You talk about the two witnesses that testified that on
Speaker 8: the afternoon she went missing, they saw in a white
Speaker 8: van with an unknown male. This is unsettling too. What
Speaker 8: did they see? And again it doesn't talk about what
Speaker 8: they did, But what did they what did they witness?
Speaker 8: What did they witness?
Speaker 6: Well, they saw Stephanie in a white band with someone
Speaker 6: they didn't recognize, and she seemed to be distressed about something.
Speaker 6: She was, you know, waving her arms excitedly and stuff,
Speaker 6: and certainly didn't seem like she wanted to be there,
Speaker 6: and you know, it turned out that somebody testified trial
Speaker 6: that Bolan had a friend who owned a white van
Speaker 6: and that you know, this friend had moaned him that
Speaker 6: band in the past, so there was you know, potential
Speaker 6: link there with with the bands Bolan.
Speaker 8: You talk about another eerie scene in this as well,
Speaker 8: when investigators retrieved Collins' purse. Inside was a piece of
Speaker 8: paper with a handwritten note. What was on that note.
Speaker 6: Had had had a three digit number and three letters
Speaker 6: and then the name Ray. And there was some testimony
Speaker 6: that Oscar Ray went by the.
Speaker 4: Name Ray, his friends and family called him that, and.
Speaker 6: The numbers and the letters were matched the like this
Speaker 6: plate number of his truck. So that was certainly a strange,
Speaker 6: ultimately unexplainable item of evidence that was found. Yeah, it
Speaker 6: never really did determine how that came to be there.
Speaker 8: Or why you say that he was pronounced guilty and
Speaker 8: sentenced to death for the murder of Stephanie Collins. Then
Speaker 8: you talk about Bolan Philip Bowl and testifying at the
Speaker 8: nineteen ninety two Pascal County trial for the murder of
Speaker 8: Terry Matthews. Now this is an incredible testimony as well
Speaker 8: at nineteen years of age, he's at trial, but at
Speaker 8: thirteen Bolan was trusted to watch him while his parents
Speaker 8: were away. Tell us what he experienced at thirteen years
Speaker 8: old with his uncle.
Speaker 6: So Oscar Ray showed up there at the house one night,
Speaker 6: banged on the door there and had Philip come out.
Speaker 6: And now when Philip came outside there, he heard a
Speaker 6: strange sound, kind of this moaning sort of sound. He said,
Speaker 6: it sounded like like his dog had been run over
Speaker 6: or something. And then he saw something flying over there
Speaker 6: on the ground where the where the noise is coming from,
Speaker 6: and was something and a wrapped up in a in
Speaker 6: a in a sheet, a big white sheet. And he
Speaker 6: watched Oscar Ray go over to the the figure in
Speaker 6: the sheet there and to do several things to it,
Speaker 6: one of which was running water from a hose over
Speaker 6: the top of it, essentially trying to trying to drown uh,
Speaker 6: you know Terry Matthews is Terry Lynn Matthews that was
Speaker 6: was wrapped in the sheets, essentially trying to drown her
Speaker 6: by running water down onto the face there. And that
Speaker 6: didn't seem to be working. Bowlan grabbed a club basically
Speaker 6: that he had and Philip saw him raise it over
Speaker 6: his head like he was going to strike Terrylin there
Speaker 6: and Philip looked away. But he heard these thumping sounds,
Speaker 6: which was the thumping sound of the club striking Matthews
Speaker 6: in the head. And he heard that a few times
Speaker 6: and then the noise stopped.
Speaker 8: You talk about that as well as his testimony. They
Speaker 8: were provided in court a letter that Bowlan had sent
Speaker 8: to Philip November nineteenth ninety one. Tell us what he
Speaker 8: wrote to Philip and what he asked for in that letter.
Speaker 4: Ross Gray, He was essentially trying to get Philip to
Speaker 4: stay out.
Speaker 6: Of out of Florida, not to come back there, not
Speaker 6: not to not to testify at his trial. So he was,
Speaker 6: you know, appealing to him to as a you know,
Speaker 6: as as his brother, as his half brother, appealing to
Speaker 6: him to you just to stay out of the out
Speaker 6: of the state. He obviously knew that he had some
Speaker 6: incriminating evidence against them.
Speaker 8: Now with this sentencing that it looks like he has
Speaker 8: DNA testing. You talk about as well that when they
Speaker 8: did the more complex testing and match Bolin guilty for
Speaker 8: Terry Matthews murder. At the sentencing, what did they try
Speaker 8: to or mitigate or what did they try to use
Speaker 8: as a tactic to mitigate the sentencing and avoid the
Speaker 8: death penalty. What do they try to put forth?
Speaker 6: Well, there was the you know, as frequently as they
Speaker 6: do in these kind of cases, there was a testimony
Speaker 6: from psychologists about Oolan's mental state and whether you know,
Speaker 6: he could have the capacity, the mental capacity to you know,
Speaker 6: to actually know that he's committing these crimes and guilty
Speaker 6: of premeditated murder and all these sorts of things. So
Speaker 6: there was testimony from psychologists about that about you know,
Speaker 6: whether or not he actually knew what he was doing,
Speaker 6: or whether he was mentally ill and these sorts of things,
Speaker 6: or whether he had brain damage that would have.
Speaker 4: Paused him to be acting this way, committing these.
Speaker 6: Kind of crimes, and whether that should be used in
Speaker 6: mitigating his responsibilities.
Speaker 8: You talk about too, that the Hillsbury County detectives suspected
Speaker 8: Bolan for other murders in the Tampa area, and you
Speaker 8: mentioned a Lisa Eisman and Kim Viccario, Connie Jones, and
Speaker 8: a Sharon Hopper, And they also went into investigating him
Speaker 8: as a suspect because he worked in trucking, long haul trucking,
Speaker 8: from eighty five to eighty seven, suspected his involvement in
Speaker 8: murders in at least nineteen states. Tell us what police
Speaker 8: do in terms of that pursuit of further or other
Speaker 8: murders that they could put on him.
Speaker 6: Well, I mean there, you know, they had this information
Speaker 6: from other sources about his involvement in these other murders,
Speaker 6: you know, some of it which was Bolan bragging to
Speaker 6: other inmates and things about Brian c he had committed.
Speaker 6: So you know, they they they followed up as best
Speaker 6: they could, but you know, hard definite evidence that could
Speaker 6: convict him of the of the killings. You know, ultimately
Speaker 6: it ended up being the three and Natalie Holly, the
Speaker 6: Stephanie Collins and material and Matthews with with a three
Speaker 6: that they really had the hard evidence on. You know,
Speaker 6: there was this other case in Texas where they had
Speaker 6: a lot of witness testimony in that case as well, but.
Speaker 4: The Texas UH.
Speaker 6: Texas courts decided not to not to prosecute Bowling for
Speaker 6: that one. They decided especially that you know, they knew
Speaker 6: that he had the three cases pending in Florida, and
Speaker 6: you know that they would let him be be prosecuted
Speaker 6: there in Florida for those.
Speaker 8: You talk about Now we skipped this, but this is
Speaker 8: the beginning of the book, and you talk about October fifth,
Speaker 8: nineteen ninety six before we talk about the the bacle
Speaker 8: that he puts state of Florida and the entire country.
Speaker 8: But talk about October fifth, nineteen ninety six and Rosalie Martinez.
Speaker 6: Yeah, so Rosalwly Martinez was certainly an interesting character in
Speaker 6: the story. In Rosalie had was married to a prominent
Speaker 6: lawyer in the Tampa community there somewhere who traced his
Speaker 6: family traced back to the early days of Ebore City
Speaker 6: there in the cigar industry, a well established family, you know,
Speaker 6: well off, and she ended up marrying into that family.
Speaker 6: So Rosalie was actually very well off. And she she
Speaker 6: worked in the court system there. She had a court
Speaker 6: reporting system for reporting company that she ran, and she
Speaker 6: ended up segueing into working with the Public Defender's office
Speaker 6: in Tampa, and as part of that, she ended up
Speaker 6: working on Oscarray Bowen's case, in his representation and in
Speaker 6: his trials and his appeals and retrials and whatnot. So
Speaker 6: she met Oscary Bowen in I guess it was in
Speaker 6: ninety five, nineteen ninety five, and she was immediately struck
Speaker 6: by him, became fascinated with him. I was attracted to him,
Speaker 6: kind of fell under his his charm.
Speaker 7: Uh.
Speaker 6: He Oscar Ray could be pretty charming when he wanted
Speaker 6: to be, you know, like like he was not in
Speaker 6: common with serial colors, they can have a very charming
Speaker 6: side that they can put on when they want to.
Speaker 6: So she kind of fell under his spell and came
Speaker 6: to the got to the point where she essentially was
Speaker 6: in love with him and decided she wanted to be
Speaker 6: with him instead of with her husband and her family.
Speaker 6: So she left behind her her her well to do
Speaker 6: lifestyle and her you know, life of privilege basically that
Speaker 6: she was living, and left behind her husband and left
Speaker 6: behind her daughters and decided she was going to marry
Speaker 6: Oscar Ray Bowland.
Speaker 4: Even though he was.
Speaker 6: Convicted for these multiple murders you talk about.
Speaker 8: Just an year earlier, in ninety four, the Florida Supreme
Speaker 8: Court overturned his first degree murder conviction for the Natalie
Speaker 8: Holly case because of spousal privilege. Just explain that a
Speaker 8: little bit, because this is very important to this case
Speaker 8: moving forward.
Speaker 6: Yeah, So the spousal privilege in Florida just essentially says
Speaker 6: that one spouse can't be retired to testify against the
Speaker 6: other spouse in court, in criminal court, you know, if
Speaker 6: it will somehow caused them to be exposed to criminal prosecution.
Speaker 6: And so since in Oscar raised trials, since they had
Speaker 6: used testimony from Chryl you know, linking him to these crimes,
Speaker 6: the testimony about for helping him get rid of the bye,
Speaker 6: or helping going with him when he got rid of
Speaker 6: evidence at Natalie Holly's car, and all this sort of thing.
Speaker 6: All that kind of testimony the higher court rules should
Speaker 6: not have been admitted because of the it's because of
Speaker 6: the privilege there.
Speaker 8: So they have the ordered for a retrial, and based
Speaker 8: on that same spousal privilege, they have a problem with
Speaker 8: the other trials as well. So that's he's being successful
Speaker 8: in court at least getting those things re examined. You
Speaker 8: then talk about January fifteenth, ninety seven, Rosalie Bolan appearing
Speaker 8: on Montel Williams to discuss her relationship. Tell us about
Speaker 8: this event and who else also appeared, and just tell
Speaker 8: us a little bit about it. Again, a very un
Speaker 8: eerie scene.
Speaker 6: Yeah, well this is this is in the midst of
Speaker 6: you know, this this ongoing appeals and seeking retrials and
Speaker 6: everything that was going on with bones cases and you
Speaker 6: know which which by the way, just.
Speaker 9: Went on and on and on, and you know ended
Speaker 9: up being.
Speaker 6: Decades worth of these things. You really just you really
Speaker 6: played the system really effectively and getting these these retrials granted,
Speaker 6: you know, multiple retrials and in each of these cases,
Speaker 6: and then you know, having the appeals after that and
Speaker 6: getting other retrials. It really dragged it on for a
Speaker 6: long time. But but yeah, back in so in January
Speaker 6: ninety seven, as you said, so Rosalie appears on them
Speaker 6: Montel william Show and you know extensively to kind of
Speaker 6: promote his case and kind of defend him and whatnot.
Speaker 6: So so she's on there, Bowland himself is on there
Speaker 6: via video from from prison there Florida State Prison. Also
Speaker 6: on the show, they had the house sister of Terry
Speaker 6: Lynne Matthews and she was not in a good mood
Speaker 6: obviously and not happy what Rosalie was doing and trying
Speaker 6: to do and bringing coverage and attention to Oscar raise
Speaker 6: appeals and whatnot. So she was, you know, pretty confrontational
Speaker 6: with with Rosalie on the show about how you know,
Speaker 6: and really, you know, I wanted to know how she could,
Speaker 6: how could how Rosalie could do what she did, meaning
Speaker 6: how could she leave her husband and daughters for this
Speaker 6: this killer? And Rosie you know, defended her what she did.
Speaker 6: He said, I love him, meaning Oscar Ray, and that
Speaker 6: she's willing to do whatever it takes to prove his innocence.
Speaker 8: You also mentioned Montel Williams again, this is fascinating. He says, two, Rosalie,
Speaker 8: you better hope he doesn't get out of jail. You
Speaker 8: better pray that your four daughters aren't walking down the
Speaker 8: street when he's looking for somebody to rape. I thought
Speaker 8: that was amazing.
Speaker 6: I think he he was the voice of a lot
Speaker 6: of people's reaction to to what happened. I mean, the
Speaker 6: the Rosalie marriage decision to marry Oscar Ay.
Speaker 4: I mean, it was it was a it was a
Speaker 4: big deal when it happened.
Speaker 6: I mean, he got a lot of coverage, a lot
Speaker 6: of media coverage, you know, not just in Florida, but nationally,
Speaker 6: uh even even internationally, and and uh, you know, she
Speaker 6: ended up appearing on twenty twenty. The wedding ceremony itself
Speaker 6: was conducted via telephone and on TV on twenty on
Speaker 6: the show twenty twenty and twenty twenty even did a
Speaker 6: follow up of the story, you know, years later. So
Speaker 6: it was a it was a big deal, this wedding,
Speaker 6: and you know a lot of people really were I
Speaker 6: think I think why it was is people were just
Speaker 6: so you know, probably a combination of of outrage and
Speaker 6: fascination and you know, just wanting to know, well, how
Speaker 6: could somebody do something like this? How could somebody give
Speaker 6: up all all of these things, give up this life
Speaker 6: and this loving family and everything for the serial killer
Speaker 6: on death row.
Speaker 8: Yeah, you also talk about ten murder trials and all
Speaker 8: ten you say, spending almost thirty years, but you say
Speaker 8: he's finally sentenced to death February twenty and thirteen, and
Speaker 8: he's in Stark, Florida. Tell us a little bit, as
Speaker 8: you do, this is rare that you take us right
Speaker 8: into that death chamber, and who of the family and
Speaker 8: who of the law enforcement, if any are there, take
Speaker 8: us into that chamber death chamber?
Speaker 6: All right? So yeah, so you know, as you said this,
Speaker 6: this this seemingly never ending legal process. You know, thirty years,
Speaker 6: three decades really of appeals and retrials for this guy.
Speaker 4: I mean, you can imagine the.
Speaker 6: A cost to this state of Florida.
Speaker 8: Yeah, for all of this.
Speaker 6: I mean it's it's got to be astronomical for three
Speaker 6: decades worth of that stuff going on. But so yeah,
Speaker 6: so they finally do get to the point where he's
Speaker 6: exhausted all of his appeals and his death ward is
Speaker 6: signed by the Governor of Florida, and so he does
Speaker 6: have his execution date and January seventh, twenty sixteen, so
Speaker 6: last year is his date, and you know, he tries
Speaker 6: for one last appeal there to the US Supreme Court,
Speaker 6: and his execution is supposed to come at six o'clock
Speaker 6: PM that day.
Speaker 4: But that that comes and goes.
Speaker 6: You know, he's he's been all prepped and there's you know,
Speaker 6: been been made ready for this sentence of death to
Speaker 6: be carried out. But the six o'clock time comes and
Speaker 6: goes as the Supreme Court appeals going on, of Supreme
Speaker 6: Court considers whether.
Speaker 5: Or not to.
Speaker 6: Stay his execution or not, and you know, hours later
Speaker 6: about ten o'clock finally comes back down the appeal has
Speaker 6: been denied, so that's that's his last last shot at
Speaker 6: getting out of it. And the sentence has passed there
Speaker 6: in the in Florida State Prison by thethal injection and
Speaker 6: no oscars us west words and no services reply, and
Speaker 6: the sentence is carried out. And there are you know,
Speaker 6: there are members of the sentants, the couple of the
Speaker 6: the mothers of of the three women that have been killed.
Speaker 6: Her there. You know, they've they've been dragged through the
Speaker 6: courts this whole time, obviously have gotten much older themselves
Speaker 6: in the process. But but Kathleen Reeves is there. She's
Speaker 6: the mother of Terry Lynn Matthews and she's there to
Speaker 6: witness it, as well as the mother of one of
Speaker 6: the other victims. There a Whitmer there as well, so
Speaker 6: they're there. Natalie Islam by this time had had passed away,
Speaker 6: so she wasn't able to attend, but the others who
Speaker 6: were there to witness it.
Speaker 8: You also talked about Cheryl Kobe couldn't couldn't didn't make
Speaker 8: the third trial because she had diabetes complications and she
Speaker 8: died from soon after. And you say, with this electric
Speaker 8: chair or pardon me, with the lethal injection he joined
Speaker 8: Danny Rowland's, Danny Rowling, Aleen Warno's and Ted Bundy in
Speaker 8: being executed in Florida. Just as we think the story ends,
Speaker 8: there's also the Supreme Court. A week after Bolin's execution,
Speaker 8: the US Supreme Court rules Florida's deathfinitely unconstitutional. And this
Speaker 8: decision gave the right to more than two hundred inmates
Speaker 8: to seek resentencing. And after reading about this thirty years
Speaker 8: of retrials and appeals, what a mess. Anyway, you talked
Speaker 8: about Gary Terry retiring in two thousand and nine as well,
Speaker 8: and just tell us what as you write Gary Terry's
Speaker 8: sort of conclusions after all this, his thoughts and ruminations
Speaker 8: on this case.
Speaker 6: Well, when I you know, I spoke to Gary mister
Speaker 6: Terry about it. He you know, he even now he's
Speaker 6: still affected by by the cases. He still still feels,
Speaker 6: you know, very much connected to them. You know, as
Speaker 6: you might imagine he cases for a long time like that,
Speaker 6: they tend to become a part of these people that
Speaker 6: are working on them, these investigators, and so Terry definitely.
Speaker 4: Still felt impacted by it.
Speaker 6: And he uh uh that Oscar Ray was brother killings
Speaker 6: as well, that he wasn't prosecuted for He really firmly
Speaker 6: believed that that Oscar Ray had had a lot of
Speaker 6: other victims, and he obviously was thankful that the sentence
Speaker 6: was finally carried out. You know, he's still he talked
Speaker 6: to he talked to me about still seeing and his
Speaker 6: head still seeing the crime scenes, you know, finding the body,
Speaker 6: seeing the bodies out there and you know what Oscar
Speaker 6: Ay had done to them, and Oscar Ray's you know,
Speaker 6: reaction afterward, and how nonchalant he was about the killings
Speaker 6: and things, and you know, so it really impacted Terry,
Speaker 6: really hit him an emotional level. So he was he
Speaker 6: was definitely excited, happy, glad to see that the justice
Speaker 6: had been served and the the sentence was finally carried out.
Speaker 6: And you know, he credited the crime Stoppers tip coming in,
Speaker 6: and you know, he pointed to that and said, you know,
Speaker 6: that's really a great example of the value of the
Speaker 6: Crime Stoppers program, is that you know, this case here,
Speaker 6: which if but for that that call, that crime Stoppers
Speaker 6: tip might never have been solved.
Speaker 8: Certainly, I want to thank thank you very much JT.
Speaker 8: Hunter for coming on and talking about death Row Romeo.
Speaker 8: The true story of Oscar Ray Bolan has been fascinating
Speaker 8: for those that might want to take a look at
Speaker 8: You have a Facebook page or some contact for you.
Speaker 8: Tell us a little bit about that.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I'm on Facebook, sleinner JT. Hunter, and you know,
Speaker 6: the book, as well as my other books, are all
Speaker 6: on Amazon. You just plug in the title Death Row
Speaker 6: Romeo or JT. Hunter. They'll pop up there, or the
Speaker 6: publisher's website RJ. Perker Publishing is also on the internet
Speaker 6: as well.
Speaker 8: I want to thank you again JT. Hunter. It's always
Speaker 8: a pleasure having you come on talking about your incredible books,
Speaker 8: Death Row Romeo. Thank you very much, have a great
Speaker 8: evening and hope to talk to you again soon. Thank you,
Speaker 8: thank Take care, take care, good night.