1 00:00:01,360 --> 00:00:03,839 Speaker 1: Yes, indeed off of a weekend that he has seen 2 00:00:04,040 --> 00:00:08,000 Bobby O. Wardley, did we not say dangerous spot for 3 00:00:08,160 --> 00:00:12,240 Joseph Parker. Bobby O. Wardley gets Rayfield's been frothing for 4 00:00:12,320 --> 00:00:18,000 like twenty four hours, a controversial TKO win, although he earned, 5 00:00:18,399 --> 00:00:20,920 he earned this victory that I'm saying that to get 6 00:00:20,920 --> 00:00:23,719 the WBO's interim heavyweight title. We're ready to recap that. 7 00:00:24,480 --> 00:00:26,920 We've got a women's world title fight later in a 8 00:00:26,920 --> 00:00:28,839 week that we'll talk a little bit about because it's 9 00:00:28,839 --> 00:00:31,519 gonna be up before we're back on. And then some 10 00:00:31,559 --> 00:00:34,520 fight news and a little nostalgia, a little heavyweight titled Nostalgia, 11 00:00:34,560 --> 00:00:38,000 a thirty fifth anniversary of a significant heavyweight title fight. 12 00:00:38,920 --> 00:00:42,679 All coming up here on the Fight Freaks Unite recap podcast. 13 00:00:42,719 --> 00:00:46,359 I am the somewhat capable host TJ. Reeves. Hello, Dan Rayfield, 14 00:00:46,399 --> 00:00:49,399 our insider. Fight Freaks Unite is his substack, his newsletter 15 00:00:49,759 --> 00:00:51,759 be subscribed to that get all the goods, get all 16 00:00:51,799 --> 00:00:55,640 the deats. Did you know that there's now new vernacular? 17 00:00:55,719 --> 00:00:58,640 Has your son brought this to you? My teenage twins, 18 00:00:58,679 --> 00:01:01,920 your teenage son that I was not aware that the 19 00:01:02,000 --> 00:01:05,439 t as in like tea that you drink, not the 20 00:01:05,519 --> 00:01:10,439 letter T. The T means the info, the critical news, 21 00:01:10,560 --> 00:01:14,840 the details. In the current pop culture vernacular, Rayfield has 22 00:01:15,000 --> 00:01:18,040 Rayfield has the T. You have the T. The dat's 23 00:01:18,079 --> 00:01:20,799 the info, the inside stuff. Have you ever been complimented 24 00:01:20,840 --> 00:01:21,200 that way? 25 00:01:21,319 --> 00:01:26,599 Speaker 2: Besides, if I knew that was a thing, I would say, clocket. 26 00:01:26,400 --> 00:01:29,760 Speaker 1: Oh, okay, there you go, that one, you know. But 27 00:01:30,000 --> 00:01:32,280 the twins are going, oh, yeah, that's the T. Oh yeah, 28 00:01:32,319 --> 00:01:33,959 you got the T. And I'm like, what are we 29 00:01:34,000 --> 00:01:37,280 talking about with the T? And the T means you 30 00:01:37,359 --> 00:01:39,920 got the goods, you got the info, you got the details, 31 00:01:39,959 --> 00:01:40,920 you have the knowledge. 32 00:01:41,040 --> 00:01:45,920 Speaker 2: You actually, on Twitter a couple of days ago, having 33 00:01:45,959 --> 00:01:48,680 nothing to do with boxing, I said, I have no 34 00:01:48,760 --> 00:01:52,840 idea what my son's slang means anymore, Okay, but conversation. 35 00:01:52,359 --> 00:01:54,359 Speaker 1: Catching you up on what the tea means? 36 00:01:54,359 --> 00:01:56,359 Speaker 2: That's not what he uses, Okay, I'm. 37 00:01:56,200 --> 00:01:58,519 Speaker 1: Just saying, if he does, that's what that means. 38 00:01:58,319 --> 00:02:01,200 Speaker 2: At least, and all him and the kids are all 39 00:02:01,239 --> 00:02:03,680 like obsessed with this whole six seven thing. I have 40 00:02:03,760 --> 00:02:05,680 heard no idea, correct. 41 00:02:05,359 --> 00:02:06,480 Speaker 1: Because it's a TikTok thing. 42 00:02:06,480 --> 00:02:06,920 Speaker 2: And I'm. 43 00:02:08,360 --> 00:02:10,319 Speaker 1: Dance and you know, okay. 44 00:02:09,960 --> 00:02:13,479 Speaker 2: But Lockett Lockett, the T Clockett. 45 00:02:13,520 --> 00:02:16,360 Speaker 1: You've got the T on the substack, on the newsletter, 46 00:02:16,879 --> 00:02:18,680 be there for all of the info. Thank you for 47 00:02:18,719 --> 00:02:21,840 finding us on the podcast outlets, Apple, Spreaker, Spotify, make 48 00:02:21,879 --> 00:02:24,639 sure you're following, subscribing, ratus and review us. If you 49 00:02:24,759 --> 00:02:28,000 enjoy the content, rate us and review us. That helps 50 00:02:28,199 --> 00:02:30,520 in the algorithms. And also the YouTube page, Big Fight 51 00:02:30,560 --> 00:02:32,520 Weekend YouTube page. We do a lot of content there 52 00:02:32,520 --> 00:02:35,280 with nostalgia. We got some more live stuff coming up. 53 00:02:35,280 --> 00:02:38,240 Great interview with Mark Kriegel about the Mike Tyson book recently. 54 00:02:38,840 --> 00:02:41,120 All kinds of stuff there. We go live before and 55 00:02:41,159 --> 00:02:43,759 after Big Time Fights, so and some of that's coming. 56 00:02:44,039 --> 00:02:45,800 So you notice a Big Fight Weekend YouTube page. 57 00:02:45,840 --> 00:02:48,360 Speaker 2: Yes, I dare say, by the way, that like my 58 00:02:48,599 --> 00:02:53,039 my the demographic, let's say, of those who participate and 59 00:02:53,080 --> 00:02:56,439 subscribe and read my newsletter, probably none of them use 60 00:02:56,479 --> 00:02:57,639 the word t or clockett. 61 00:02:57,680 --> 00:03:01,919 Speaker 1: But their kids, their nieces and nephews. This is the vernacular, 62 00:03:02,000 --> 00:03:04,400 this is the slang. And we're going to try to 63 00:03:04,439 --> 00:03:05,759 give you some tea here on what. 64 00:03:05,719 --> 00:03:07,879 Speaker 2: Happened about that. When it comes home about that one, 65 00:03:08,039 --> 00:03:08,680 we'll see. 66 00:03:08,520 --> 00:03:10,840 Speaker 1: Yeah, let's see what he knows all right. H So 67 00:03:11,400 --> 00:03:15,280 let's get to it. The WBO interim heavyweight title fight. 68 00:03:15,360 --> 00:03:19,080 Joe Parker putting his position on the line. He was 69 00:03:19,199 --> 00:03:23,719 in line to fight Alexander Usik and took the risk. Yes, 70 00:03:24,159 --> 00:03:27,080 and took the risk to fight Fabio Wardley. In this fight. 71 00:03:27,120 --> 00:03:30,280 We well documented it, we built it up, and now 72 00:03:30,360 --> 00:03:33,879 the upset has happened in what was I will say this, 73 00:03:34,000 --> 00:03:36,759 it was a tremendous fight. I got the chance to 74 00:03:36,759 --> 00:03:40,280 take it in. There was drama right away, big punches 75 00:03:40,360 --> 00:03:43,319 right away. I believe it's a fight of the year candidate. 76 00:03:43,439 --> 00:03:45,960 Wardly gets the win. I know you're three to two 77 00:03:45,960 --> 00:03:48,319 to one blast off on the referee coming up about 78 00:03:48,360 --> 00:03:51,120 the stoppage, but let's get into it. Your thoughts on 79 00:03:51,159 --> 00:03:53,719 the fight and ultimately Wardly with the upset. 80 00:03:53,840 --> 00:03:56,759 Speaker 2: Right before we get to the ending of the fight. 81 00:03:56,800 --> 00:03:58,439 And it was a terrific fight. I don't know if 82 00:03:58,479 --> 00:04:01,840 I necessarily have it at the level that you're talking 83 00:04:01,879 --> 00:04:03,719 about as the fight of the year. Will it be 84 00:04:03,800 --> 00:04:06,000 on that list when people go through and make their 85 00:04:06,439 --> 00:04:09,400 top five or ten. Yeah, yeah, I would think that's sure. 86 00:04:09,400 --> 00:04:10,840 Speaker 1: I'm still going to be It's got to be in 87 00:04:10,840 --> 00:04:11,360 the top five. 88 00:04:11,560 --> 00:04:13,879 Speaker 2: It's got to be fair. That's fair what was at. 89 00:04:13,840 --> 00:04:17,319 Speaker 1: Stake, and these guys bombed each other and the crowd 90 00:04:17,439 --> 00:04:19,959 roaring had you had a lot of what you would 91 00:04:20,000 --> 00:04:21,199 want out of a fight of the year. I'm not 92 00:04:21,240 --> 00:04:23,920 saying it is. I'm saying it should be considered. 93 00:04:24,480 --> 00:04:28,120 Speaker 2: Some people may pick it. I I personally won't pick it. 94 00:04:28,160 --> 00:04:29,720 I can tell you that right away. I mean, I'll 95 00:04:29,800 --> 00:04:32,759 certainly give it its plaudits and it's due, uh, but 96 00:04:32,879 --> 00:04:35,519 it won't be number one. Nonetheless, it was a terrific fight. 97 00:04:35,879 --> 00:04:38,600 Both guys were gentlemen and class actual leading up to 98 00:04:38,639 --> 00:04:41,120 the fight, and and even with what happened at the 99 00:04:41,160 --> 00:04:44,160 end of the fight, both guys showed class. Joseph Parker 100 00:04:44,160 --> 00:04:48,920 and Faby Wardley are immensely likable guys as people, as fighters, 101 00:04:49,319 --> 00:04:51,680 and so from that perspective, it's all good. And they 102 00:04:51,680 --> 00:04:53,839 put on a rumble. They put on an excellent fight. 103 00:04:53,879 --> 00:04:56,639 You mentioned that Joseph Parker risked his position as the 104 00:04:56,680 --> 00:04:59,240 next mandatory challenger for Alexander Ustik if he wants to 105 00:04:59,279 --> 00:05:02,800 maintain the undisputed status, which it feels like he does. 106 00:05:03,639 --> 00:05:06,839 You know he was. He didn't maintain the undisputed status 107 00:05:06,839 --> 00:05:08,639 the last time, and that was because he had a 108 00:05:08,680 --> 00:05:11,319 contract to do a rematch with Tyson Fury. If he 109 00:05:11,399 --> 00:05:13,399 if he had his choice, he would not have given 110 00:05:13,480 --> 00:05:16,439 up that title. He would have maintained it. But you know, 111 00:05:16,480 --> 00:05:18,600 the combination of the contract plus the you know, crazy 112 00:05:18,600 --> 00:05:20,519 amounts of money that he was able to make for 113 00:05:20,560 --> 00:05:22,199 that rematch compared to what he would have had he 114 00:05:22,240 --> 00:05:25,160 done the do mandatory at the time, you know, it 115 00:05:25,240 --> 00:05:28,240 was obviously much less money. So I feel like he 116 00:05:28,279 --> 00:05:31,560 will keep that position, He'll keep that belt and they'll 117 00:05:31,600 --> 00:05:34,160 do the fighting. By the way, Fabio Wordley, coming off 118 00:05:34,199 --> 00:05:37,480 a great matchup like this and exciting puncher, and being 119 00:05:37,519 --> 00:05:40,959 that he is from Britain and the and the excitement 120 00:05:40,959 --> 00:05:43,560 around what happened on Saturday night, you got to figure 121 00:05:43,800 --> 00:05:46,800 that Afusika does agree to fight him, that they can 122 00:05:46,920 --> 00:05:50,399 go to you know, a big stadium or wherever in 123 00:05:50,439 --> 00:05:52,879 the UK and absolutely at a big event. I mean, 124 00:05:52,879 --> 00:05:55,319 I don't know if it draws ninety thousand like some 125 00:05:55,319 --> 00:05:57,600 of the other pipes, but could they put it at 126 00:05:58,079 --> 00:06:00,879 you know, Toddenham for example, where they drew sixty five 127 00:06:00,959 --> 00:06:03,439 for you know, a Tyson Fury fighter for Ben and 128 00:06:03,439 --> 00:06:05,040 you Bank. I mean, yeah, I'm sure they could do 129 00:06:05,120 --> 00:06:07,279 that and that would be a big event over there. 130 00:06:07,279 --> 00:06:09,360 And Frank Warren was speaking about after the fight at 131 00:06:09,360 --> 00:06:11,560 the postfight press powers that if they can work the 132 00:06:11,560 --> 00:06:13,759 deal out. You know, he obviously promotes Worley in Parker, 133 00:06:13,759 --> 00:06:16,560 he does not promote Busick. But they their teams all 134 00:06:16,560 --> 00:06:18,439 know each other and I feel like they get along 135 00:06:18,480 --> 00:06:20,560 with each other. He was talking about the prospect of 136 00:06:20,600 --> 00:06:22,600 doing that fight in March. We talked about on the 137 00:06:22,639 --> 00:06:25,000 last or one of the last shows that Hoosick announced 138 00:06:25,000 --> 00:06:27,240 he's back in some training. He's back is okay, and 139 00:06:27,480 --> 00:06:29,720 he's gonna fight next year and fight for three more years. 140 00:06:29,759 --> 00:06:32,240 So there's literally no reason not to do that fight. 141 00:06:32,279 --> 00:06:35,759 There's not like there's some other major opponent that he 142 00:06:35,759 --> 00:06:39,199 could fight in place. Fabia Wardley just defeated the guy 143 00:06:39,240 --> 00:06:41,600 that's like the number two heavyweight in boxing. So anyway, 144 00:06:41,680 --> 00:06:44,519 terrific fight, Like you said, bombs away the whole. 145 00:06:44,600 --> 00:06:47,519 Speaker 1: Let me prompt you. He Parker was in trouble in 146 00:06:47,560 --> 00:06:49,680 the second round of his fight. Let's go right, Fabby 147 00:06:49,759 --> 00:06:51,560 Wordley was in trouble then like two or three und 148 00:06:51,680 --> 00:06:53,560 I understand. But in the second round of the fight, 149 00:06:53,720 --> 00:06:56,600 Wardley hurt. Joseph Parker had him in the corner, caught 150 00:06:56,680 --> 00:06:59,519 him with a good upper cut, stunned him. The crowd 151 00:06:59,600 --> 00:07:01,800 is roar. I mean we had drama right away at 152 00:07:01,800 --> 00:07:02,199 my point. 153 00:07:02,199 --> 00:07:04,519 Speaker 2: Pick it up from there, yeah, I mean it was 154 00:07:04,920 --> 00:07:07,399 not a heavyweight waltz. I mean we've seen lots of 155 00:07:07,439 --> 00:07:10,279 fights between I mean, one thing I always take pause 156 00:07:10,319 --> 00:07:14,040 with is when you have a matchup between punchers, people 157 00:07:14,079 --> 00:07:15,480 go into the fight thing, Wow, this is gonna be 158 00:07:15,480 --> 00:07:17,199 a hell of a fight. These guys are both big punchers. 159 00:07:17,199 --> 00:07:19,560 They're gonna stalk each other, they're gonna bomb away. The 160 00:07:19,639 --> 00:07:21,199 thing about it is a lot of times when those 161 00:07:21,240 --> 00:07:24,360 matchups happen, it does unfold like that. But there's plenty 162 00:07:24,360 --> 00:07:26,920 of times where it doesn't unfold like that because both 163 00:07:26,959 --> 00:07:29,560 guys are wary of the other man's power, and so 164 00:07:29,639 --> 00:07:33,000 it turns into be slightly more tactical or less interesting 165 00:07:33,920 --> 00:07:35,879 than it may have been in terms of the perspective 166 00:07:35,920 --> 00:07:39,040 going into the fight. But Wordley and Parker were the 167 00:07:39,199 --> 00:07:42,519 first part where they both are good punchers and they 168 00:07:42,560 --> 00:07:44,399 both let it all hang out and they both took 169 00:07:44,720 --> 00:07:48,160 big shots. They both they delivered big shots, and uh, 170 00:07:48,519 --> 00:07:50,160 you know, it was it was what you want to see, you. 171 00:07:50,160 --> 00:07:52,560 Speaker 1: Know, So this just to just to refresh you and 172 00:07:52,600 --> 00:07:55,000 for the audience. This specific sequence is laid in the 173 00:07:55,079 --> 00:07:59,199 round and Parker ends up spitting his mouthguard out. They 174 00:07:59,199 --> 00:08:01,199 call it the gums in England, and on the broadcast, 175 00:08:01,240 --> 00:08:04,160 maybe got it punched out. I know, I saw him, 176 00:08:04,240 --> 00:08:05,759 he got rid of it. He got rid of it 177 00:08:05,800 --> 00:08:10,720 to buy time, and I know your opinion, your opinion, okay, Well, 178 00:08:10,759 --> 00:08:13,519 and then the cornerman comes up and the cornerman slow 179 00:08:13,560 --> 00:08:16,920 playing it because he's buzzed, and it's Darren Barker, right, 180 00:08:17,199 --> 00:08:20,279 and Barry Jones correct. They both went crazy on the 181 00:08:20,319 --> 00:08:24,959 broadcast about your boy Howard Foster the referee giving Parker 182 00:08:25,079 --> 00:08:28,439 extra time to recover and not letting Mordley press the 183 00:08:28,480 --> 00:08:31,800 advantage of having him hurt there in the corner. So 184 00:08:31,879 --> 00:08:34,960 that's the first dubious part of how this thing was 185 00:08:34,960 --> 00:08:37,840 maybe officiated, because that, I mean, that was a big moment. 186 00:08:37,960 --> 00:08:41,279 He had him clearly hurt in the corner late in 187 00:08:41,320 --> 00:08:43,679 that second round. It was eye opening and now it's like, hey, 188 00:08:43,720 --> 00:08:45,679 the fight is on, so go ahead. Yeah. 189 00:08:45,759 --> 00:08:47,399 Speaker 2: Well, I mean, and there was a lot of maybe 190 00:08:47,440 --> 00:08:49,919 not moments like that where it was something specific, but 191 00:08:49,919 --> 00:08:52,279 in terms of a guy being hurt, but like I mentioned, 192 00:08:52,279 --> 00:08:55,320 Fabia Wordley was you know, it was hurt several times 193 00:08:55,360 --> 00:08:58,480 in fight. I felt like and as was Parker. It's 194 00:08:58,519 --> 00:09:01,000 a heavyweight fight. I mean, that's gonna happen. Both guys 195 00:09:01,360 --> 00:09:03,840 were resolute, if you will, in terms of being able 196 00:09:03,840 --> 00:09:05,720 to take the shots. You know, I remember at one 197 00:09:05,720 --> 00:09:09,279 point the announcer we're talking about, and this is probably 198 00:09:09,360 --> 00:09:10,639 late in the fight. I want to say, maybe like 199 00:09:10,720 --> 00:09:13,039 round eight or nine or ten or something like that, like, 200 00:09:13,080 --> 00:09:15,240 how can they not have been a knockdown at this point? 201 00:09:15,279 --> 00:09:16,679 Which was pretty amazing? 202 00:09:16,720 --> 00:09:19,559 Speaker 1: Where do you come down? Do you believe their chins 203 00:09:19,639 --> 00:09:23,360 are that good? Or maybe did this demonstrate in combination 204 00:09:23,559 --> 00:09:27,480 maybe they're not elite big time bombers. No, it's a 205 00:09:27,519 --> 00:09:29,159 combo of both. What do you think? 206 00:09:29,559 --> 00:09:29,799 Speaker 2: I mean? 207 00:09:29,919 --> 00:09:33,840 Speaker 1: Because they lasted each other, Dan with big shots. 208 00:09:34,240 --> 00:09:36,720 Speaker 2: Wardly, we're just getting to know he hasn't been in 209 00:09:36,799 --> 00:09:39,200 with big punchers. But based on everything I have seen, 210 00:09:39,240 --> 00:09:40,960 and I've seen a number of his fights, it's got 211 00:09:40,960 --> 00:09:43,600 a good chin. Joseph Parker. I've watched his entire career. 212 00:09:44,200 --> 00:09:46,480 He definitely has a good chin. The guy other than 213 00:09:46,519 --> 00:09:49,720 what happened Saturday, had only been stopped once in a 214 00:09:49,799 --> 00:09:52,799 long career by Joe Joyce, you know, five years ago 215 00:09:52,879 --> 00:09:58,440 or whatever it was. And and traditionally fighters who are 216 00:09:58,480 --> 00:10:02,840 of Samoan background, they have the big neck, that's part 217 00:10:02,879 --> 00:10:06,679 of their character, of their of their build. They've been 218 00:10:06,759 --> 00:10:08,720 known to have good chins. You can go through, you know, 219 00:10:08,840 --> 00:10:12,519 David Tua as an example a Samoan background from New Zealand, 220 00:10:12,600 --> 00:10:14,879 amazing chin, one of the greatest chins in heavyweight history. 221 00:10:15,000 --> 00:10:16,759 The fact that Joseph Parker has a good chin is 222 00:10:16,799 --> 00:10:18,559 not a surprise. And he's been in with a lot 223 00:10:18,600 --> 00:10:22,799 of good fighters for the years, including Fabio Wordley, including 224 00:10:23,159 --> 00:10:25,600 Anthony Joshua who didn't come close to knock and hang 225 00:10:25,679 --> 00:10:28,200 him out, and others. So no, I believe it's a 226 00:10:28,480 --> 00:10:31,399 it's a matter of both men are able to take 227 00:10:31,440 --> 00:10:33,200 good punches, you know, in addition to being able to 228 00:10:33,240 --> 00:10:37,639 deliver them with real punching power. So look at the 229 00:10:37,720 --> 00:10:40,240 point we got, you know, you talk about about how 230 00:10:40,240 --> 00:10:42,120 he was hurt in the second round, and that's fair, 231 00:10:42,639 --> 00:10:44,919 but by the time they got to like round eight, 232 00:10:45,080 --> 00:10:50,360 nine ten, Parker had basically been the boss. He he 233 00:10:50,519 --> 00:10:53,200 there was moments in every round where Wordley would have 234 00:10:53,240 --> 00:10:55,399 a cup. If you look at the official score cards 235 00:10:55,399 --> 00:10:57,639 at the time of the knockout, this was not it 236 00:10:57,720 --> 00:10:59,320 was they were. They were on the way to what 237 00:10:59,399 --> 00:11:01,720 would have been, Yes, at that moment in time, would 238 00:11:01,720 --> 00:11:04,159 have been a majority decision, because one of the judges 239 00:11:04,159 --> 00:11:06,480 had it ninety five to ninety five, but the two 240 00:11:06,559 --> 00:11:09,279 other judges, one judge had it ninety eight to ninety 241 00:11:09,279 --> 00:11:11,519 two in favor of Parker and one judge had it 242 00:11:11,639 --> 00:11:14,360 ninety six and ninety four in favor of Parker, which 243 00:11:14,679 --> 00:11:18,000 both seemed understandable. I don't think the ninety eight ninety 244 00:11:18,000 --> 00:11:20,399 two was some kind of crazy outlier. I feel like, 245 00:11:20,480 --> 00:11:23,519 you know, you scored that fight. Honestly, he absolutely could 246 00:11:23,519 --> 00:11:24,799 give him eight of those. 247 00:11:24,919 --> 00:11:27,279 Speaker 1: I thought scoring along that it was six to three 248 00:11:27,440 --> 00:11:29,799 going into the tenth round, fair, So, I mean, I 249 00:11:30,360 --> 00:11:33,240 thought he was in command at that point. But this 250 00:11:33,360 --> 00:11:36,360 is boxing. Anything can happen, and now we're going to 251 00:11:36,360 --> 00:11:37,840 get to the drama of what did happen. 252 00:11:38,000 --> 00:11:40,799 Speaker 2: Yes, right, so obviously they got to that eleventh round, 253 00:11:40,919 --> 00:11:45,320 and you know, Wordley had been coming on. You know, 254 00:11:45,399 --> 00:11:49,519 he did have a good tenth round, and look what happened. Happened. 255 00:11:49,559 --> 00:11:52,559 If you watched the fight, had he definitely nailed Parker 256 00:11:52,600 --> 00:11:55,000 with an uppercut, had him backing up into the ropes, 257 00:11:55,039 --> 00:11:58,080 he was letting his hands go, and the way I 258 00:11:58,240 --> 00:12:00,799 characterized what I was seeing, I saw a lot of 259 00:12:00,840 --> 00:12:02,919 agreement with what I posted when I put it on 260 00:12:02,960 --> 00:12:07,360 social media. I very strongly felt at that moment that 261 00:12:07,480 --> 00:12:11,120 it wasn't that Joseph Parker was hurt. He was tired. Yeah, yeah, 262 00:12:11,360 --> 00:12:14,200 it had been a grueling fight, but being tired is 263 00:12:14,200 --> 00:12:16,919 not grounds to stop a fight. He was tired, he 264 00:12:17,039 --> 00:12:19,879 was not hurt, so he did back into the ropes. 265 00:12:20,000 --> 00:12:23,519 And if you watch what became the finishing sequence, as Fabio, 266 00:12:23,559 --> 00:12:25,679 Wordley is throwing punches and he's doing his job, and 267 00:12:25,720 --> 00:12:28,679 I have nothing bad to say about Wordy, but a 268 00:12:28,679 --> 00:12:31,679 lot of those punches missed. He slipped a few punches, 269 00:12:32,000 --> 00:12:34,279 and even though he had not thrown a lot back 270 00:12:34,320 --> 00:12:37,600 in terms of the to make the fight continue on 271 00:12:38,039 --> 00:12:41,639 he did right before the stoppage, get Wordy off him. 272 00:12:41,639 --> 00:12:43,960 Because Joe was backed up to the ropes. He threw 273 00:12:44,000 --> 00:12:46,759 a nice left hand and well, I don't know if 274 00:12:46,759 --> 00:12:49,360 it connected or connected full or maybe grazed and whatever, 275 00:12:49,480 --> 00:12:52,320 but it was certainly a very discernible punch that did 276 00:12:52,360 --> 00:12:55,679 make Wordy back up, either because he maybe shoved him 277 00:12:55,679 --> 00:12:57,080 a little bit or he maybe he clipped him a 278 00:12:57,080 --> 00:12:59,720 little bit with the punch, but he definitely got in 279 00:12:59,720 --> 00:13:03,399 a punch and so okay. And then right after that, 280 00:13:03,480 --> 00:13:05,159 Wordley comes back and he has him on the ropes 281 00:13:05,200 --> 00:13:08,840 again and he's missing some of those shots, and yeah, 282 00:13:09,000 --> 00:13:13,919 Parker's absolutely guessed, and the referee, Howard Foster, stepped in 283 00:13:13,960 --> 00:13:17,559 and stopped the fight. And while is it the worst 284 00:13:17,559 --> 00:13:21,000 stoppage I ever saw, No, if it was stopped in 285 00:13:21,000 --> 00:13:23,279 a fight where you're talking about a couple of prospects 286 00:13:23,320 --> 00:13:25,879 or young guys or and it's just a six rounder 287 00:13:25,919 --> 00:13:29,320 on an undercart, it wouldn't even register, probably just because 288 00:13:29,600 --> 00:13:32,080 that's to be expected. But I believe that when you're 289 00:13:32,080 --> 00:13:35,679 in that position that the you have to understand who 290 00:13:35,679 --> 00:13:39,039 you're refereeing. Number one, you have to understand the magnitude 291 00:13:39,080 --> 00:13:41,519 and stakes of the event, and you also have to 292 00:13:41,600 --> 00:13:44,360 understand the history of the fighters who are involved. And 293 00:13:44,399 --> 00:13:46,600 I'm not saying that you're gonna, you know, sway one 294 00:13:46,639 --> 00:13:48,399 way or the other, because you're looking to, you know, 295 00:13:48,440 --> 00:13:50,080 get a certain guy to win or anything like that. 296 00:13:50,320 --> 00:13:53,000 But you have to have a recognition of your surroundings. 297 00:13:53,279 --> 00:13:56,440 You know, this is a guy there. There's never been 298 00:13:56,480 --> 00:14:00,879 a knockdown, there's there's no discernible injuries. Guys are not bleeding. 299 00:14:02,039 --> 00:14:05,840 You know. It was not in any way stoppage, time a. 300 00:14:06,000 --> 00:14:09,000 Speaker 1: Hold on time out. Parker was bleeding. Talk to Parker, 301 00:14:10,360 --> 00:14:11,720 look what he was bleeding. 302 00:14:11,879 --> 00:14:14,519 Speaker 2: But it happened to the last on his nose. 303 00:14:14,519 --> 00:14:16,120 Speaker 1: All right. So this is where you love the back 304 00:14:16,120 --> 00:14:19,000 and forth, and we tend to disagree at times. And 305 00:14:19,039 --> 00:14:20,960 I know you're going to go off about Howard Foster, 306 00:14:21,039 --> 00:14:22,279 but you know what, I'm going to use my ray 307 00:14:22,279 --> 00:14:25,559 Field terminology here on the Fight Freaks to Night Recap podcast, 308 00:14:25,600 --> 00:14:27,840 you talk all the time and I have to listen incessantly. 309 00:14:27,840 --> 00:14:30,480 There's a good word about the range of acceptable scoring. 310 00:14:30,799 --> 00:14:33,759 So now let's go through the range of a stoppage. 311 00:14:34,120 --> 00:14:37,120 So we have, on the one hand, the absolute correct 312 00:14:37,120 --> 00:14:39,720 time to stop a fight, perfect it should have been 313 00:14:39,720 --> 00:14:43,000 stopped right there. Then we have the range of what 314 00:14:43,120 --> 00:14:45,159 is the worst stoppage you've ever seen, Like you've said, 315 00:14:45,200 --> 00:14:46,840 and this was not the worst stoppage I've ever seen. 316 00:14:47,360 --> 00:14:50,799 This one I believe is more in the range of 317 00:14:50,840 --> 00:14:54,519 a correct stoppage for these two points. Number one, he 318 00:14:54,679 --> 00:14:57,879 beat him up for about a sixty second time period 319 00:14:58,080 --> 00:15:02,440 where Parker is wobbling all over the He's hurt, he's tired, 320 00:15:02,759 --> 00:15:06,240 he's bleeding, he's not firing back. The announcers are saying, 321 00:15:06,279 --> 00:15:09,799 he's not firing back, he's not holding The crowd is 322 00:15:09,879 --> 00:15:14,639 roaring to me. It's in the range of an acceptable stoppage. 323 00:15:14,679 --> 00:15:17,159 Speaker 2: Now, okay, that's fine, but hold on, hold on? What 324 00:15:17,240 --> 00:15:20,279 was your did you would you as I thought? 325 00:15:20,440 --> 00:15:23,879 Speaker 1: It was probably one punch too soon. I thought it 326 00:15:24,000 --> 00:15:27,159 was on the verge of one more significant punch that 327 00:15:27,279 --> 00:15:30,679 should be it. And don't we oftentimes say that you 328 00:15:30,759 --> 00:15:33,799 want a fight to be a punch too soon rather 329 00:15:33,799 --> 00:15:36,559 than a punch too late. I realize the stakes. I 330 00:15:36,600 --> 00:15:38,559 realized what was going on. But the argument can also 331 00:15:38,600 --> 00:15:42,039 be made Joseph Parker put himself in that position by 332 00:15:43,159 --> 00:15:45,639 by wearing that hold on, let me finish by engaging. 333 00:15:46,000 --> 00:15:48,720 By wearing down, he put himself in position where he 334 00:15:48,759 --> 00:15:51,799 could get stopped, and Wordley was taking it to him. 335 00:15:51,840 --> 00:15:54,679 It's not as if that the whole sequence was only 336 00:15:54,720 --> 00:15:57,360 five or ten seconds Dan, it's about sixty seconds. 337 00:15:57,360 --> 00:15:59,840 Speaker 2: As you know, as I said, he's roughing up down. 338 00:16:00,440 --> 00:16:04,519 He's tired, not hurt. And he also was disagree that 339 00:16:04,600 --> 00:16:08,960 he was hurt earlier in that sequence. Maybe not at 340 00:16:09,000 --> 00:16:10,000 the very very end. 341 00:16:10,039 --> 00:16:11,879 Speaker 1: He is a little stunned when he's looking at the 342 00:16:11,919 --> 00:16:16,840 referee when the reference anyweight championship like in your line, 343 00:16:16,879 --> 00:16:19,039 I'm well aware of what was at stake and again 344 00:16:19,159 --> 00:16:22,679 say to you, for me, it's within the range of 345 00:16:22,720 --> 00:16:26,279 an acceptable stoppage because he had been beating him up. 346 00:16:28,600 --> 00:16:32,039 Speaker 2: Is that Howard Foster for decades has sucked and this 347 00:16:32,159 --> 00:16:35,440 is just another one that adds to his lore as 348 00:16:35,480 --> 00:16:38,799 one of the worst referees I've ever laid eyes on it. Okay, 349 00:16:39,240 --> 00:16:42,519 he is terrible, and why he keeps catching these biggest. 350 00:16:42,200 --> 00:16:44,919 Speaker 1: Then why did the WBO have him on the list. 351 00:16:44,919 --> 00:16:48,320 Speaker 2: Because if you knew how the British Boxing Border Control operates, 352 00:16:48,519 --> 00:16:49,399 you would understand. 353 00:16:49,639 --> 00:16:52,720 Speaker 1: But doesn't the WBO dictate for their no fight. 354 00:16:53,080 --> 00:16:55,000 Speaker 2: No they do not, So I will explain it to 355 00:16:55,039 --> 00:16:56,600 you since you need to be schooled a little bit. 356 00:16:56,960 --> 00:16:59,000 And if you take a look at what Gustavo Oliveri, 357 00:16:59,039 --> 00:17:01,360 who is the president of the WBO post on his 358 00:17:01,440 --> 00:17:03,919 social media to remind somebody else who was making the 359 00:17:03,960 --> 00:17:06,759 same statement, is that number one in a lot of plays, 360 00:17:06,839 --> 00:17:09,440 especially like in the United States, sanctioning bodies do not 361 00:17:09,519 --> 00:17:13,759 pick judges or referees. They some commissions give them the 362 00:17:13,880 --> 00:17:17,440 respect to allow them to make recommendations. But let's just 363 00:17:17,480 --> 00:17:20,119 take the Nevada State Athletic Commission for a minute. That 364 00:17:20,240 --> 00:17:22,720 the organizations have nothing to do with picking judges. They 365 00:17:22,759 --> 00:17:25,000 may send them a list of a you know, for 366 00:17:25,079 --> 00:17:27,160 their title fights, of people that they are okay with. 367 00:17:27,359 --> 00:17:29,519 Speaker 1: But the commission reason that I know this, hence the 368 00:17:29,519 --> 00:17:32,400 reason I prompted all of this by saying on the 369 00:17:32,480 --> 00:17:33,480 WBO's list. 370 00:17:33,920 --> 00:17:37,640 Speaker 2: But in terms of the WBO or I'm sorry. In Britain, 371 00:17:38,200 --> 00:17:42,319 what they do is they pick a British referee and 372 00:17:42,480 --> 00:17:46,559 one judge, and the other two are typically international judges, 373 00:17:46,759 --> 00:17:49,480 so they had no say so in who the referee was. 374 00:17:49,559 --> 00:17:53,319 Now that doesn't mean they wouldn't that they could potentially pick, 375 00:17:54,200 --> 00:17:57,559 you know, a a non British referee, which obviously there's 376 00:17:57,640 --> 00:18:01,000 been non British referees in fights, but that's been pretty 377 00:18:01,079 --> 00:18:03,720 much the way they do things. So the organization didn't 378 00:18:03,720 --> 00:18:05,640 have a say so. And it's not just in Britain, 379 00:18:05,680 --> 00:18:09,799 it's pretty much everywhere. The local commission that oversees as 380 00:18:09,799 --> 00:18:11,720 the regulator, they're the ones that have the right to 381 00:18:11,799 --> 00:18:14,960 choose who's going to referee or a judge a fight. 382 00:18:15,079 --> 00:18:16,799 I mean, and we've discussed this when it comes to 383 00:18:16,839 --> 00:18:21,519 suspensions and drug testing and all that. The organizations their 384 00:18:21,599 --> 00:18:25,000 purview is the title is the sanction that type of thing, 385 00:18:25,200 --> 00:18:28,519 the regulation of the bout, whether it's medical or officiating, 386 00:18:28,720 --> 00:18:30,640 that is the purview of the local commission. So the 387 00:18:30,799 --> 00:18:34,519 WBO cannot be held in any way accountable for Howard 388 00:18:34,559 --> 00:18:37,200 Foster being appointed. That would be Robert Smith from the 389 00:18:37,240 --> 00:18:39,279 British Boxing Board of Control and the rest of that 390 00:18:39,400 --> 00:18:43,279 organization that made that appointment. Now, Howard Foster has a 391 00:18:43,359 --> 00:18:47,279 litany of bad things in his background. He's been a 392 00:18:47,359 --> 00:18:50,240 judge it feels like forever, and if you go back 393 00:18:50,279 --> 00:18:53,359 and look through the course of recent times or even 394 00:18:53,359 --> 00:18:55,920 older times, I'll just give you a couple. First of all, 395 00:18:55,960 --> 00:18:57,880 he is the referee in what some would argue is 396 00:18:57,880 --> 00:18:59,960 maybe the worst stoppage in the history of British boxing, 397 00:19:00,359 --> 00:19:02,920 and that was the first fight in twenty thirteen. That's 398 00:19:02,960 --> 00:19:05,160 how far back, we have to go. That was the 399 00:19:05,200 --> 00:19:08,000 match for the super middle white title, the first match 400 00:19:08,240 --> 00:19:12,160 between George Groves and Carl Frotch, where he stopped that 401 00:19:12,240 --> 00:19:17,000 fight in the ninth round, and and and Froch, you know, 402 00:19:17,559 --> 00:19:19,279 ended up having a rematch because there was so much 403 00:19:19,319 --> 00:19:21,839 criticism of that stoppage. I mean that you could you know, 404 00:19:22,119 --> 00:19:23,720 you could google that, they'll find and. 405 00:19:23,599 --> 00:19:26,400 Speaker 1: By the way, just alert everybody, because you're a savant 406 00:19:26,400 --> 00:19:28,759 with these things. That was way more egregious than this 407 00:19:29,279 --> 00:19:33,359 your mind, absolutely absolutely so. But that that that's like, 408 00:19:33,640 --> 00:19:35,839 that's the big one in his background. But he also 409 00:19:35,960 --> 00:19:38,480 was involved in others. I mean, he was the one 410 00:19:38,519 --> 00:19:42,119 who didn't stop the fight between Daniel Dubis and Kevin 411 00:19:42,200 --> 00:19:45,400 Lorena when Duba was down three times in the first round, 412 00:19:45,920 --> 00:19:49,799 and then uh when Lorena was down later but didn't 413 00:19:49,839 --> 00:19:53,240 seem nearly as damaged as Daniel Dua was in that 414 00:19:53,359 --> 00:19:55,839 first run. He's short circuit of that fight in round three. 415 00:19:57,160 --> 00:20:00,279 Not unsurprisingly, he leaned in favor of the British fighter 416 00:20:00,359 --> 00:20:04,680 Daniel in that fight, as he did against against Joseph 417 00:20:04,720 --> 00:20:05,880 Parker in last night's fight. 418 00:20:06,359 --> 00:20:08,319 Speaker 2: Now, if you look at and and he's also was 419 00:20:08,319 --> 00:20:10,440 involved in a Fabia Wardley fight that was only two 420 00:20:10,559 --> 00:20:13,559 years ago in twenty twenty three, when Fabia Wardley fought 421 00:20:13,559 --> 00:20:16,920 Mike Kofe, who was journeyman ish, but Wordley was still 422 00:20:16,960 --> 00:20:18,799 not that established, so he was sort of still on 423 00:20:18,839 --> 00:20:21,599 the rise. Uh. That was a fight that Wardley ended 424 00:20:21,680 --> 00:20:25,920 up winning on a on a flurry of shots where 425 00:20:25,920 --> 00:20:27,920 he scored what was ruled a knockdown. But if you 426 00:20:27,960 --> 00:20:30,240 go back and look at the video, clear as day 427 00:20:30,680 --> 00:20:32,880 that coffee slipped and it should never have been ruled 428 00:20:32,920 --> 00:20:35,759 the knockdown, much less the fucking stoppage of the fight. 429 00:20:36,160 --> 00:20:38,079 So and again I come with the receipts and we 430 00:20:38,119 --> 00:20:40,440 could go and spend fucking do a whole show just 431 00:20:40,440 --> 00:20:42,559 in how shitty Howard Foster is. I just gave you 432 00:20:42,559 --> 00:20:43,720 three glaring examples. 433 00:20:43,759 --> 00:20:45,880 Speaker 1: So what So the logical follow up is what's up 434 00:20:45,920 --> 00:20:48,319 with the British Boxing Board of Control continuing to give 435 00:20:48,400 --> 00:20:51,839 him these prime assign answered in huge fights. That's the 436 00:20:51,880 --> 00:20:52,400 real question. 437 00:20:52,759 --> 00:20:56,880 Speaker 2: I have no idea. All I know is this my my, my, 438 00:20:57,160 --> 00:21:00,599 my good pal Steve Smoker's I'll be rolling over in 439 00:21:00,599 --> 00:21:02,960 his grave right now after that stoppage. You know that's 440 00:21:03,000 --> 00:21:04,559 a guy, and we can go through and pick out 441 00:21:04,599 --> 00:21:06,440 some of the referees that that just had an idea 442 00:21:06,440 --> 00:21:08,319 of when to stop. And I always go back to this. 443 00:21:08,920 --> 00:21:10,200 I don't remember what year it was, It's a long 444 00:21:10,240 --> 00:21:11,880 time ago. And I was out of fight and I 445 00:21:11,960 --> 00:21:14,960 ran into Smoger in the hotel and we were always friendly, 446 00:21:15,400 --> 00:21:17,680 uh And when we sat down, we talked, and I 447 00:21:17,839 --> 00:21:20,839 was interested in his referering philosophy. And I've done this 448 00:21:20,880 --> 00:21:23,200 with other officials that I've met through the years, just 449 00:21:23,240 --> 00:21:26,039 to hear from them without the controversy of what something 450 00:21:26,079 --> 00:21:28,759 that just happened. Just what do you look for when 451 00:21:28,799 --> 00:21:31,359 you stop a fight or when you let a fight continuer, 452 00:21:31,440 --> 00:21:33,200 or however you want to phrase it. And one of 453 00:21:33,200 --> 00:21:35,160 the things that Steve said to me, and and I've 454 00:21:35,160 --> 00:21:36,359 heard him and I heard him say this to me a 455 00:21:36,359 --> 00:21:38,799 couple of times for the years, there is what he 456 00:21:38,880 --> 00:21:42,279 called the telling blow, like the clear shot where the 457 00:21:42,319 --> 00:21:44,240 guy's head is rocked and his eyes roll up, or 458 00:21:44,480 --> 00:21:48,440 some kind of uh, you know, body motion or something 459 00:21:48,680 --> 00:21:51,359 that would indicate to you that he's lost his consciousness 460 00:21:51,440 --> 00:21:53,720 in some fashion, or he's not in control of his 461 00:21:53,799 --> 00:21:56,839 senses or his movements. That type of thing. And in 462 00:21:56,880 --> 00:21:59,880 the fight between Parker and Wordley, that shot never came. 463 00:22:00,240 --> 00:22:02,599 You can tell me all you want that he was hurt, fine, 464 00:22:02,799 --> 00:22:05,599 he was taking some incoming that he wasn't thrown back, 465 00:22:05,599 --> 00:22:07,960 But there was never a moment where I felt and 466 00:22:08,000 --> 00:22:10,519 I'm sure that, and Joseph Parker said so after the fight, 467 00:22:11,000 --> 00:22:14,279 that he was not in control of his senses, that 468 00:22:14,319 --> 00:22:15,839 he didn't know where he was, that he was out 469 00:22:15,880 --> 00:22:18,720 on his feet, maybe buzzed a little bit, but absolutely 470 00:22:18,759 --> 00:22:21,640 knew what was going on where he was all that 471 00:22:21,720 --> 00:22:24,240 kind of stuff. So from that perspective, at that level, 472 00:22:24,279 --> 00:22:26,799 that fight should not have been stopped. And furthermore, I 473 00:22:26,839 --> 00:22:30,000 will praise Joseph Parker and Andy Lee, his trainer, who 474 00:22:30,039 --> 00:22:32,480 have nothing but add tons of respect for a ball, 475 00:22:32,759 --> 00:22:35,279 their whole team. They came to the press conference and 476 00:22:35,319 --> 00:22:37,279 at a moment when I have been present for a 477 00:22:37,359 --> 00:22:40,599 thousand guys who have just ripped and been shipped all 478 00:22:40,599 --> 00:22:43,599 over the officiating and went absolutely fucking crazy about the 479 00:22:43,640 --> 00:22:46,920 ending of a fight, Joseph Parker was an absolute gentleman. 480 00:22:48,720 --> 00:22:52,640 I was okay, I wanted to continue, Yes, and Andy 481 00:22:52,640 --> 00:22:54,240 basically said the same thing. But at the end of 482 00:22:54,279 --> 00:22:58,319 the day, they congratulated Fabio worldly. They didn't talk bad 483 00:22:58,319 --> 00:23:00,799 about Howard Foster. They didn't really known Howard Foster. He 484 00:23:00,839 --> 00:23:03,759 just said I was good to go. I wanted to continue, 485 00:23:04,079 --> 00:23:06,440 and he said he wished Faby Wardy good luck in 486 00:23:06,440 --> 00:23:08,559 his next assignment. He said, I'd like a rematch, but 487 00:23:08,599 --> 00:23:10,480 he knows that even if he gets a rematch, it 488 00:23:10,480 --> 00:23:13,359 won't be till after when or Lewis Wardley ends up 489 00:23:13,400 --> 00:23:17,319 getting the title fight against Alexander Usik. So I definitely, 490 00:23:17,400 --> 00:23:18,880 and I'm wearing a hat. I will tip my hat 491 00:23:18,880 --> 00:23:21,400 to Andy Lee into Joseph Parker for showing that kind 492 00:23:21,440 --> 00:23:23,559 of class in a very difficult moment. You know, And 493 00:23:23,599 --> 00:23:25,759 I've said, I've said this many times in my career 494 00:23:26,240 --> 00:23:29,000 for for just hold on, but for me, it's when 495 00:23:29,039 --> 00:23:30,960 a guy loses that you find out what they're made of. 496 00:23:31,240 --> 00:23:33,279 Like I remember lots of fights where you're thinking a 497 00:23:33,319 --> 00:23:34,599 guy's gonna act one way and a loss and he 498 00:23:34,680 --> 00:23:36,960 turned out, Wow, he really amed. Now see my mad 499 00:23:36,960 --> 00:23:38,599 When he lost to Brera, I thought it was going 500 00:23:38,640 --> 00:23:40,680 to go crazy in the press, cards and and and 501 00:23:40,680 --> 00:23:42,519 and you know, do his chirpy self and talk all 502 00:23:42,599 --> 00:23:44,880 kinds of shit. He was as humble and respectful as 503 00:23:44,920 --> 00:23:47,000 anybody could have been. And I was really happy to 504 00:23:47,039 --> 00:23:50,400 see uh Parker and Andy act like that and let 505 00:23:50,440 --> 00:23:52,240 guys like me and other pundits send out a problem 506 00:23:52,240 --> 00:23:55,799 with the stoppage to launch our artillery. So I would 507 00:23:55,799 --> 00:23:58,000 say this every time you see Howard Foster, you know, 508 00:23:58,079 --> 00:23:58,839 be wary. 509 00:23:58,960 --> 00:24:00,680 Speaker 1: And that, and why do they keep putting him in 510 00:24:00,720 --> 00:24:03,759 the biggest moments. The phrase that always comes to mind 511 00:24:03,960 --> 00:24:07,640 is adversity reveals character, good and bad. Whatever your character is, 512 00:24:07,680 --> 00:24:11,559 adversity is going to reveal that. I'm just gonna say no, Now, look, 513 00:24:12,519 --> 00:24:14,559 let me just say this in conclusion, and then we're 514 00:24:14,559 --> 00:24:16,240 going to move on to what's next real quick here. 515 00:24:16,559 --> 00:24:18,599 To wrap it up. You often do this to me. 516 00:24:18,839 --> 00:24:21,119 You're much more aggrieved over this than I am. I 517 00:24:21,160 --> 00:24:23,480 thought he was hurt. I thought he was in trouble. 518 00:24:23,880 --> 00:24:26,440 I think he's gonna regret when he watches the fight 519 00:24:26,519 --> 00:24:28,680 back that he put himself in that position when he 520 00:24:28,759 --> 00:24:31,599 was clearly winning the fight, and I didn't have as 521 00:24:31,640 --> 00:24:34,960 big a problem with it. Maybe one more significant punch 522 00:24:35,000 --> 00:24:36,400 than there is no doubt, but he hit him with 523 00:24:36,440 --> 00:24:37,599 a lot of significant punches. 524 00:24:37,720 --> 00:24:39,720 Speaker 2: The one thing he could have done is to mitigate 525 00:24:39,720 --> 00:24:43,160 the circumstances. And it's just and this is the same 526 00:24:43,160 --> 00:24:45,200 for a lot of fighters got that heart, could have 527 00:24:45,240 --> 00:24:47,759 taken a knee, given up the point. I feel like 528 00:24:47,839 --> 00:24:49,799 they felt like they were far enough ahead. He would 529 00:24:49,839 --> 00:24:51,640 have maybe got an extra you know, between the eight 530 00:24:51,720 --> 00:24:54,000 count and whatever to wipe off the gloves and all 531 00:24:54,000 --> 00:24:55,359 the other stuff that goes on. He would have gotten 532 00:24:55,359 --> 00:24:58,119 you know, fifteen ish seconds or so, or ten seconds 533 00:24:58,119 --> 00:25:01,119 at least to help clear the cobwebs a little bit. 534 00:25:01,519 --> 00:25:03,400 And that may have helped. But you know, he was 535 00:25:03,400 --> 00:25:04,880 too proud to take the knee, as ever said. But 536 00:25:05,240 --> 00:25:07,039 if he takes the knee, you know, he's still gonna 537 00:25:07,039 --> 00:25:08,319 win the fight if it goes to the distance. 538 00:25:08,480 --> 00:25:12,079 Speaker 1: So let's move to the next level. And you mentioned Usik, 539 00:25:12,319 --> 00:25:14,759 all right, so call me call me crazy here. So 540 00:25:14,799 --> 00:25:16,960 this this ties in. We're gonna go ahead and tie 541 00:25:17,000 --> 00:25:20,039 into the news. So Queensberry is trying to line up 542 00:25:20,160 --> 00:25:23,039 Derek Chesura and Dillian White to fight on a main event, 543 00:25:23,079 --> 00:25:25,519 which you're about to talk about. Can I ask on 544 00:25:25,559 --> 00:25:29,759 the recap pod where is Moses Etama Because to me, 545 00:25:30,240 --> 00:25:32,640 sitting here at a distance in the United States and 546 00:25:32,799 --> 00:25:36,680 Atama fight with Fabio Wardley, if he's not fighting Usick, 547 00:25:36,720 --> 00:25:38,160 if Usik doesn't want to fight him, if this is 548 00:25:38,160 --> 00:25:41,559 all FF, if that is tremendously intriguing at this point, 549 00:25:41,599 --> 00:25:44,640 they've been active, they both punch big. I'd love to 550 00:25:44,680 --> 00:25:47,839 see that. Why can we not get Atama in the 551 00:25:47,920 --> 00:25:49,640 ring in the next month or two on the same 552 00:25:49,680 --> 00:25:52,920 timeline with Wardley, where if Usik doesn't fight him for 553 00:25:52,960 --> 00:25:55,480 whatever reason, that can be the next fight. All right, 554 00:25:55,519 --> 00:25:57,559 So lay out what you found out and we'll kind 555 00:25:57,559 --> 00:25:59,519 of go from there. On the heavyweight picture, go ahead. 556 00:25:59,359 --> 00:26:01,759 Speaker 2: Yeah, well that would be good fight. But a Tama 557 00:26:01,920 --> 00:26:04,440 is either gonna he's gonna be in a couple more 558 00:26:04,480 --> 00:26:06,680 developmental fights unless he's gonna get a shot at the 559 00:26:06,680 --> 00:26:09,480 big title. So that that that I mean. I don't 560 00:26:09,519 --> 00:26:11,400 I'm not saying don't make the fight, but I understand 561 00:26:11,400 --> 00:26:15,440 from a business perspective why Queensberry wouldn't do that matchup. 562 00:26:15,480 --> 00:26:18,039 It doesn't make sense. After Wardley just did what he did. Okay, 563 00:26:18,079 --> 00:26:21,039 first couple of things. Number One, most likely usk is 564 00:26:21,039 --> 00:26:23,519 gonna fight Wordley unless there's some kind of major score. 565 00:26:23,799 --> 00:26:26,119 So he's gonna get the shot. He's earned it. Whatever 566 00:26:26,160 --> 00:26:28,079 you think about the stoppage, he got the win. He 567 00:26:28,119 --> 00:26:30,880 also had the big camback against Hooney. He also has 568 00:26:31,039 --> 00:26:33,039 you know, uh, the win against. 569 00:26:33,480 --> 00:26:34,519 Speaker 1: A Clark right. 570 00:26:36,319 --> 00:26:38,759 Speaker 2: Well, yeah, Fraser Clark came out in the first round, 571 00:26:38,880 --> 00:26:41,240 right yeah, in the rematch of what was like one 572 00:26:41,279 --> 00:26:43,720 of the nice the best fights always and before the 573 00:26:43,799 --> 00:26:46,480 draw with with Fraser Clark, the fight I just mentioned 574 00:26:46,519 --> 00:26:48,119 this was the fifty to fifty fight when they're both 575 00:26:48,160 --> 00:26:51,480 undefeated in Saudi Arabia where he knocked out David Adela, 576 00:26:51,799 --> 00:26:54,799 which was which was his first rick big win. That 577 00:26:54,960 --> 00:26:56,799 was the one that came after that Kofie fight that 578 00:26:56,839 --> 00:26:59,480 I mentioned where wasn't controversial that Wardley was the winner 579 00:26:59,480 --> 00:27:01,319 because it felt he was gonna win, but it was 580 00:27:01,359 --> 00:27:05,519 a stoppage that was somewhat questionable anyway. So you're looking 581 00:27:05,519 --> 00:27:09,839 at probably in the springtime Usik against Wardly, and that's 582 00:27:09,839 --> 00:27:12,400 an exciting matchup and it would do probably have a 583 00:27:12,440 --> 00:27:14,000 lot of attention. That's the type of fight you want 584 00:27:14,039 --> 00:27:16,680 to see because Parker was probably considered by most going 585 00:27:16,720 --> 00:27:18,759 into the fight is the number two heavyweight in the world. 586 00:27:19,319 --> 00:27:22,000 We discussed that caveats whereas Joshua hasn't fought for a 587 00:27:22,079 --> 00:27:25,079 year and Fury claims he's retired and et cetera, et cetera. 588 00:27:25,559 --> 00:27:27,839 So that's probably what's gonna happen there in terms of 589 00:27:27,880 --> 00:27:30,440 a time. And now Frank is basically like the guy 590 00:27:30,480 --> 00:27:32,960 that has he runs the heavyweight division basically right now. 591 00:27:33,039 --> 00:27:35,039 He's kind of reminds me of like the nineteen eighties 592 00:27:35,119 --> 00:27:37,759 nineties version of Don King, where you know, they loaded 593 00:27:37,839 --> 00:27:40,160 up on all the top contenders and you know, and 594 00:27:40,200 --> 00:27:42,160 things like that. He doesn't have Usik who's the champion, 595 00:27:42,200 --> 00:27:44,799 but he's got all the guys that Usik should be fighting, 596 00:27:46,440 --> 00:27:48,839 including Tyson Fury if he comes out of retirement. So 597 00:27:49,240 --> 00:27:51,079 they had a lot of the heavyweights that were present 598 00:27:51,119 --> 00:27:54,640 at that fight on Saturday Night. So you mentioned the 599 00:27:54,720 --> 00:27:58,440 plans are for a December thirteenth Queen's Very card. That's 600 00:27:58,480 --> 00:28:00,799 going to be most likely there to score in a 601 00:28:00,839 --> 00:28:04,759 third fight with Dylan White. Uh. Dylan White obviously is 602 00:28:04,759 --> 00:28:08,359 coming off of a one sided first round destruction at 603 00:28:08,400 --> 00:28:11,240 the hand most of the Tama. That's a very questionable 604 00:28:11,240 --> 00:28:12,079 pay per view headliner. 605 00:28:12,759 --> 00:28:15,079 Speaker 1: Can I just say it, that's a joke. That's a joke. 606 00:28:15,440 --> 00:28:17,279 It's a joke that that's a pay per view fight 607 00:28:17,359 --> 00:28:18,920 at least in the United States or anywhere. 608 00:28:18,920 --> 00:28:20,880 Speaker 2: The Brits will probably eat that up. I don't know 609 00:28:20,880 --> 00:28:25,359 if maybe they will, but anyway, that that's that's the 610 00:28:25,400 --> 00:28:28,039 thing to Sora. He's actually looked a lot better in 611 00:28:28,079 --> 00:28:30,559 recent fights than White has. But it's White who's already 612 00:28:30,559 --> 00:28:35,039 got two wins against TSA through the years. So whatever, 613 00:28:35,200 --> 00:28:37,160 that's sort of like the old war horse is kind 614 00:28:37,160 --> 00:28:39,920 of close to bowing out for good and whatever. Maybe 615 00:28:39,920 --> 00:28:40,720 they can squeeze it off. 616 00:28:40,720 --> 00:28:42,759 Speaker 1: Why can't we have good things? Why can't we have 617 00:28:44,039 --> 00:28:45,240 somewhere in this mix? 618 00:28:45,559 --> 00:28:47,039 Speaker 2: We have plenty of good things. We had good things 619 00:28:47,119 --> 00:28:48,119 last night's not being I. 620 00:28:48,160 --> 00:28:50,319 Speaker 1: Understand, But I'm just saying, can we not have Etama 621 00:28:50,319 --> 00:28:54,440 fight in November or December? Which again on I'm calling 622 00:28:54,440 --> 00:28:57,599 my shot right here in late October that if Usik 623 00:28:57,680 --> 00:29:00,559 decides not to fight Fabi Owardley, I've to see him 624 00:29:00,559 --> 00:29:03,000 fight at Tama. Let's make that happen. So get a 625 00:29:03,039 --> 00:29:04,599 Tama in the ring one more time and then make 626 00:29:04,640 --> 00:29:07,640 that fight if it was okay. So that's all I'm saying. 627 00:29:07,680 --> 00:29:10,160 Speaker 2: So so originally, go back a couple like a month ago, 628 00:29:10,400 --> 00:29:12,640 Frank Warren said in a bunch of interviews that a 629 00:29:12,720 --> 00:29:15,519 Tama was going to headline this December thirteenth card. It's 630 00:29:15,519 --> 00:29:17,960 taking place in the co Op Live in Manchester. Then 631 00:29:18,039 --> 00:29:19,880 they kind of got tangled up when that order went 632 00:29:19,920 --> 00:29:22,400 out for him to fight pool Lev and the WBA 633 00:29:23,000 --> 00:29:25,039 uh you know, got into it with the pool Lef 634 00:29:25,079 --> 00:29:27,160 team because they had already made another fight, so that 635 00:29:27,279 --> 00:29:29,680 was sort of put off. They thought maybe Poolelev would 636 00:29:29,720 --> 00:29:31,839 fight Atama, and they I guess they slowed down the 637 00:29:31,839 --> 00:29:36,039 plans for December so and and and at the same time, 638 00:29:36,119 --> 00:29:37,640 Jasaa said he was going to be on that card 639 00:29:38,000 --> 00:29:41,279 probably uh you know, then not not necessarily against White. 640 00:29:41,319 --> 00:29:43,359 The bottom line though, is now if Jasaa and White 641 00:29:43,400 --> 00:29:46,119 is on that is that show's Maine event. There is 642 00:29:46,240 --> 00:29:49,240 two things that are possible. Either a they could maybe 643 00:29:49,319 --> 00:29:53,039 fight uh Toma against somebody else on the undercard, or 644 00:29:53,960 --> 00:29:56,440 he fights and headlines his own card in February. I 645 00:29:56,440 --> 00:29:57,799 forget the date, but there was a date in February 646 00:29:57,799 --> 00:30:01,000 that Frank mentioned or not completely out of the realm, 647 00:30:01,000 --> 00:30:03,799 but possibly that a Toama could fight both dates December 648 00:30:03,839 --> 00:30:05,920 and February. That would be ideal. But one thing you 649 00:30:05,960 --> 00:30:08,599 have to remember everything is the bottom line they don't have. 650 00:30:08,640 --> 00:30:10,839 It's not this is not a turkey who can spend 651 00:30:10,839 --> 00:30:13,839 whatever he wants. This is a budget and it's not 652 00:30:13,880 --> 00:30:15,880 that they can't get a Toma in the ring. They 653 00:30:15,880 --> 00:30:19,000 have to pay a Toomas opponent so much money that 654 00:30:19,119 --> 00:30:21,119 it blows the budget. So to put him on the 655 00:30:21,160 --> 00:30:24,960 same card, which is sore and white from a budgetary perspective, 656 00:30:24,960 --> 00:30:27,720 probably doesn't work. Not because a Tama is unwilling or 657 00:30:27,759 --> 00:30:29,839 doesn't want to fight. Is that at what point do 658 00:30:29,880 --> 00:30:32,160 you blow your brains out on the cost of an opponent. 659 00:30:32,519 --> 00:30:34,599 So it puts it in a scenario where he can 660 00:30:34,680 --> 00:30:36,920 only be in the main event because the budget's much bigger. 661 00:30:37,000 --> 00:30:39,200 So that's that's kind of down in the weeds. But 662 00:30:39,200 --> 00:30:41,279 the bottom line is a Toma will be back either 663 00:30:41,720 --> 00:30:44,359 December or February, or you know, in a perfect world, 664 00:30:44,400 --> 00:30:47,319 both dates. But that's what they're doing. As Frank has 665 00:30:47,319 --> 00:30:50,039 been doing all these heavyweight fights and uh, you know 666 00:30:51,839 --> 00:30:53,880 the worst time frame is what Frank said. 667 00:30:53,880 --> 00:30:56,240 Speaker 1: All right, so stay tuned for that. There's also heavyweight 668 00:30:56,279 --> 00:30:58,400 news while we're just here on a Geet Kabba yell 669 00:30:58,960 --> 00:31:03,079 also ringside and he might factor in details deeds. Give 670 00:31:03,119 --> 00:31:05,559 me the tack give me the t So. 671 00:31:05,559 --> 00:31:08,119 Speaker 2: If Queensbury announced and I had written this a couple 672 00:31:08,119 --> 00:31:10,279 of weeks ago, but they made it more formal a 673 00:31:10,279 --> 00:31:13,880 few days ago. They promote Agitacabil. Also, he is the 674 00:31:14,000 --> 00:31:16,839 WBC's interim heavyweight title there, so he's got a position 675 00:31:17,319 --> 00:31:20,160 and he's on his own good run. But his last 676 00:31:20,160 --> 00:31:22,440 three fights have been in Saudi Arabia and he hasn't 677 00:31:22,440 --> 00:31:24,920 fought at home in Germany since I want to say, 678 00:31:24,920 --> 00:31:29,359 like twenty twenty three or so. And so the combination 679 00:31:29,519 --> 00:31:32,079 of that and his new status with this title and 680 00:31:32,119 --> 00:31:33,759 how good of a run he's been on, plus the 681 00:31:33,759 --> 00:31:36,359 fact that Queensberry is looking to expand beyond just doing 682 00:31:36,359 --> 00:31:40,440 fights in the UK. You know, they're the official promoter 683 00:31:40,559 --> 00:31:42,960 for many of the fights that take place in Saudi Arabia. 684 00:31:43,519 --> 00:31:46,160 When we had Frank Warren on this podcast, you know, 685 00:31:46,240 --> 00:31:48,440 a few months ago, he talked about and this will happen. 686 00:31:48,440 --> 00:31:51,000 It's just a matter of exactly when they will come 687 00:31:51,039 --> 00:31:53,000 to the United States and put on some events. But 688 00:31:53,039 --> 00:31:56,960 they're going to also go back with not of time 689 00:31:57,759 --> 00:32:01,839 with Fabiel and take him home to Germany to do 690 00:32:01,880 --> 00:32:03,720 a fight for the first time in a while. So 691 00:32:03,759 --> 00:32:06,559 he's gonna fight there, and that's gonna be a big deal. 692 00:32:06,599 --> 00:32:08,759 That's gonna be in January. They don't have an opponent 693 00:32:08,799 --> 00:32:11,359 set yet one hundred percent. But you know, Germany for 694 00:32:11,400 --> 00:32:13,720 a long time was a hotbed nineties two thousands when 695 00:32:13,720 --> 00:32:17,000 you had the battle between Sourland Event and Universal. They 696 00:32:17,039 --> 00:32:19,880 both had very robust television deals. They both had a 697 00:32:19,920 --> 00:32:21,519 good amount of champions, and they put a lot of 698 00:32:21,519 --> 00:32:24,839 tough fights and guys like Darius Mikolchevsky and Arthur Abraham 699 00:32:24,880 --> 00:32:28,160 and Juan Carlos Gomez, obviously the Klitschko brothers when they 700 00:32:28,160 --> 00:32:30,000 were on the way up and in their early title 701 00:32:30,079 --> 00:32:33,000 days with univers and so it was a real hotbed 702 00:32:33,240 --> 00:32:35,640 and it's really petered out. The German action has been very, 703 00:32:35,759 --> 00:32:38,279 very weak recently over the last number of years. The 704 00:32:38,279 --> 00:32:40,880 occasional title fight and this and that, but nothing like 705 00:32:41,640 --> 00:32:42,039 it was. 706 00:32:42,240 --> 00:32:44,799 Speaker 1: And they feel like Raba yells a fun babba, Yelle's 707 00:32:44,799 --> 00:32:46,960 a fun fighter. He's been waiting for a while to 708 00:32:47,000 --> 00:32:50,000 get a bigger fight. So let's see who they match 709 00:32:50,079 --> 00:32:51,960 him up with. And you say January for him, so 710 00:32:51,960 --> 00:32:52,440 we gotta wait. 711 00:32:52,480 --> 00:32:54,599 Speaker 2: Yeah, I wouldn't say it's not gonna be something that's 712 00:32:54,599 --> 00:32:56,200 going to be blow your doors off. They're gonna look 713 00:32:56,240 --> 00:32:59,039 for like a solid opponent, keep him busy. UH. The 714 00:32:59,079 --> 00:33:01,119 date gonna be January tenth, it'll be on his own 715 00:33:01,559 --> 00:33:03,720 and they're going to go to a place an arena 716 00:33:03,759 --> 00:33:06,400 in Oberhaus in Germany. UH and and try to read 717 00:33:06,440 --> 00:33:09,160 you know, not only for Cabrio, but in general terms, 718 00:33:09,160 --> 00:33:12,319 sort of try to build up the German scene because 719 00:33:12,359 --> 00:33:14,519 it's a They've got great fans there and it's been 720 00:33:15,200 --> 00:33:17,759 a hotbed in the past, and there's no reason not to, 721 00:33:18,039 --> 00:33:20,039 uh to try to bring something back to those fans 722 00:33:20,039 --> 00:33:22,519 who you know, there were times in the day where 723 00:33:22,559 --> 00:33:24,759 you know, Clitchko would do a heavyweight defense and be 724 00:33:24,880 --> 00:33:27,759 on UH on their network RTL that he was associated with, 725 00:33:28,119 --> 00:33:31,079 they would have tens of millions of viewers, tens of 726 00:33:31,119 --> 00:33:34,640 millions in a country where in the United States in 727 00:33:34,920 --> 00:33:37,359 those same timeframe, you know, maybe you get a couple 728 00:33:37,400 --> 00:33:39,799 of million on HBO and a country that's you know, 729 00:33:39,880 --> 00:33:43,279 ten times bigger. So so the market can be there 730 00:33:43,279 --> 00:33:44,000 for the right fighter. 731 00:33:44,160 --> 00:33:46,880 Speaker 1: Tell It tells you that if you're active and they're interested, 732 00:33:46,920 --> 00:33:49,319 there's still fight fans that are around. 733 00:33:49,400 --> 00:33:52,559 Speaker 2: And RTL is paying like, you know, seven eight million 734 00:33:52,640 --> 00:33:55,559 dollars to do a clinical event, besides what the other 735 00:33:55,680 --> 00:33:58,160 places around the world were paying, and HBO and the 736 00:33:58,200 --> 00:34:00,240 gate that was sold out of the arena. So they 737 00:34:00,559 --> 00:34:02,960 look at that as a very as a very fertile 738 00:34:03,039 --> 00:34:05,559 market to try to rebuild a little in Germany. And 739 00:34:05,640 --> 00:34:08,000 Tabiel is obviously a guy that feel like they can 740 00:34:08,039 --> 00:34:09,079 do some business with their. 741 00:34:09,280 --> 00:34:11,239 Speaker 1: All right, let's get to some more news real quick. 742 00:34:11,239 --> 00:34:13,559 You've been talking to us about the Janabec eras Landy 743 00:34:13,599 --> 00:34:18,320 Laura three belt middleweight unification fight. Give me, give me more. 744 00:34:18,400 --> 00:34:19,000 Now it's now. 745 00:34:19,039 --> 00:34:21,159 Speaker 2: You want the T you want the T daddy, T go, 746 00:34:21,719 --> 00:34:24,639 I'll give you the T daddy. So my reporting tells 747 00:34:24,679 --> 00:34:26,920 me that yes, this fight, of course was being discussed, 748 00:34:26,960 --> 00:34:29,480 but now I'm told it is signed and it will 749 00:34:29,519 --> 00:34:31,559 take place on December sixth. It will be the co 750 00:34:31,679 --> 00:34:35,119 feature on the PBC on Prime Video card where the 751 00:34:35,159 --> 00:34:38,119 main event will be Pitbull Cruise against Lamont Roach Junior 752 00:34:38,320 --> 00:34:41,000 taking place in San Antonio. This will be to unify 753 00:34:41,159 --> 00:34:43,599 three of the belts in the weight class. You know, 754 00:34:43,679 --> 00:34:46,559 Janabec has already got two of the titles. He's got 755 00:34:46,559 --> 00:34:49,519 the WBO in the IBF title. Yeah, Arislandi Laura Who's 756 00:34:49,519 --> 00:34:53,119 got the WBA title And at long last, after however 757 00:34:53,199 --> 00:34:57,400 many years it's been in terrible, horrible mismatch fights, Laura's 758 00:34:57,440 --> 00:34:59,239 fighting a real guy for the first time in ages. 759 00:34:59,280 --> 00:35:02,440 He has made a liv stealing money as of middleweight, 760 00:35:02,920 --> 00:35:05,320 stealing money in the latter days of his Jinger middleweight 761 00:35:05,599 --> 00:35:08,760 days against complete stiffs or no counts or guys that 762 00:35:08,800 --> 00:35:11,199 didn't belong in the ring with him. You know, Jannenbeck 763 00:35:11,280 --> 00:35:13,320 may not be the highest profile champion, but he is 764 00:35:13,320 --> 00:35:16,760 an Olympian, he is undefeated, he's thirty, he's younger, he's strong, 765 00:35:17,239 --> 00:35:21,159 a lot of bouts. So this is this is interesting 766 00:35:21,400 --> 00:35:25,679 and and the fight itself is not necessarily two guys 767 00:35:25,679 --> 00:35:28,159 with big fan bases, but as a fight to add 768 00:35:28,199 --> 00:35:31,920 some depth, to add something important in terms of a 769 00:35:31,960 --> 00:35:35,239 three belt unification uh to this undercard that they're going 770 00:35:35,320 --> 00:35:38,199 to do on December sixth. To me, I find it 771 00:35:38,239 --> 00:35:40,920 to be intriguing. And Laura, who I was critical of 772 00:35:40,960 --> 00:35:42,480 a thousand times for being one of the most boring 773 00:35:42,519 --> 00:35:45,639 fighters in the world for many many years and then 774 00:35:45,760 --> 00:35:47,719 later ended up having that fight of the year back 775 00:35:47,960 --> 00:35:50,000 twenty eighteen ish I want to say, or twenty seventeen 776 00:35:50,360 --> 00:35:53,320 against Jared Hurd. Ever since then, as he has slowed 777 00:35:53,360 --> 00:35:56,639 down a little bit, He's always had the skills, and 778 00:35:56,679 --> 00:35:59,199 he always had we now know he has a heart 779 00:36:00,119 --> 00:36:03,159 the skills to not get into two tough fights obviously, 780 00:36:03,400 --> 00:36:05,440 but now that he has no choice because his legs 781 00:36:05,440 --> 00:36:07,599 aren't what they were when you know, he ran around 782 00:36:07,639 --> 00:36:10,800 the ring for twelve rounds against Canelo, as he's kind 783 00:36:10,800 --> 00:36:13,079 of stand forced to stand and fight a bit more, 784 00:36:13,360 --> 00:36:15,480 and it makes the fights better for the viewers who 785 00:36:15,679 --> 00:36:18,320 were paying attention. And so that'll be a nice fight 786 00:36:18,360 --> 00:36:21,400 for that undercard. Yes, And then this is what I 787 00:36:21,400 --> 00:36:23,519 think about further down the road, besides just the fact 788 00:36:23,559 --> 00:36:26,400 that there's three belts to be unified, in that it 789 00:36:26,480 --> 00:36:32,079 may provide the opponent if Terrence Crawford there, especially if. 790 00:36:31,920 --> 00:36:35,280 Speaker 1: It's Janna Back who's the younger, bigger puncher, and the 791 00:36:35,280 --> 00:36:37,079 intrig I mean, I don't know if Laura wins like 792 00:36:37,119 --> 00:36:39,840 a boring, awful decision. I'm just saying we can't have 793 00:36:39,920 --> 00:36:41,599 good things. I don't know how appealing that is. 794 00:36:41,800 --> 00:36:43,960 Speaker 2: But if Crawford wants to fight and he doesn't want 795 00:36:44,000 --> 00:36:46,559 to defend against the big monsters at sixty eight and 796 00:36:46,599 --> 00:36:49,000 he says over and over, I'm not going back to 797 00:36:49,039 --> 00:36:51,719 fifty four because I can't make that weight anymore. And 798 00:36:51,760 --> 00:36:54,519 the the sweet spot is one sixty. You want to 799 00:36:54,559 --> 00:36:57,000 go for some stakes out. That's not a big superstar 800 00:36:57,159 --> 00:36:59,519 name either guy. But you know what, he could win 801 00:36:59,599 --> 00:37:02,159 a title, getting another weight class against and pick up 802 00:37:02,159 --> 00:37:04,199 three more belts and just keep adding to his collection 803 00:37:04,239 --> 00:37:06,280 of hard Where he's gonna need a he would need 804 00:37:06,320 --> 00:37:08,719 a bigger, a bigger, a bigger cabinet, probably in the 805 00:37:08,760 --> 00:37:10,280 in the den like the Rayfield collection. 806 00:37:10,360 --> 00:37:12,000 Speaker 1: He needs a new wing. He needs a new wing 807 00:37:12,519 --> 00:37:15,000 of the building. All right, A couple more news, guys, I. 808 00:37:15,239 --> 00:37:17,239 Speaker 2: Didn't tear down my east wing like they didn't. Watching. 809 00:37:17,679 --> 00:37:19,840 Speaker 1: I understand you don't have one hundred and thirty million 810 00:37:19,840 --> 00:37:21,199 dollars innovation in the way I didn't think. 811 00:37:21,239 --> 00:37:23,360 Speaker 2: So I'm gonna go to a ballroom in the end 812 00:37:23,400 --> 00:37:23,840 of my house. 813 00:37:23,960 --> 00:37:28,679 Speaker 1: There's news on Tim Zoo and interesting you did say before, 814 00:37:28,719 --> 00:37:32,599 maybe he's got to change the dynamic. Who's in the corner, 815 00:37:32,800 --> 00:37:35,239 et cetera. And you have you have learned what's the 816 00:37:35,320 --> 00:37:36,440 latest here, what's going on? 817 00:37:36,880 --> 00:37:38,639 Speaker 2: Well, I would know this isn't so much tea. This 818 00:37:38,719 --> 00:37:41,039 is uh, this is Tim's I'm gonna start using that tea. 819 00:37:41,719 --> 00:37:44,599 This is Tim zoo posting on his social media Instagram. 820 00:37:44,639 --> 00:37:47,320 I follow him on Instagram and he announced and this 821 00:37:47,360 --> 00:37:49,840 is not a surprise that he made a trainer change. 822 00:37:49,880 --> 00:37:52,199 I didn't necessarily know who he was gonna go with, 823 00:37:52,480 --> 00:37:54,440 but he had been trained for his entire career by 824 00:37:54,519 --> 00:37:59,400 a man named igor uh Golo golo Ubev in Australia. 825 00:37:59,559 --> 00:38:01,360 That was just trainer got him to the title, and 826 00:38:01,440 --> 00:38:04,119 obviously he helped develop him. But Tim has been in 827 00:38:04,119 --> 00:38:05,719 some rough times over the last year and a half 828 00:38:05,840 --> 00:38:08,000 or so, and he's coming off of that loss once 829 00:38:08,039 --> 00:38:10,880 again to Sebastian Fundora in July where he was completely 830 00:38:10,960 --> 00:38:14,360 outclassed and retired on the stool, and that was a 831 00:38:14,360 --> 00:38:17,400 pretty devastating loss. He had gotten the harsh knockout losses. 832 00:38:17,639 --> 00:38:21,000 Speaker 1: He is in a real crossroad situation right now with 833 00:38:21,039 --> 00:38:22,840 these knockouts to Bachrum and then to Fundora. 834 00:38:22,960 --> 00:38:25,960 Speaker 2: Yes, absolutely so, he made the decision to and and 835 00:38:26,079 --> 00:38:29,840 after he lost against Fundor in the in the July fight, 836 00:38:30,239 --> 00:38:32,159 there was some that we're saying like he should retire, 837 00:38:32,199 --> 00:38:33,400 which I you know, I kind of found that was 838 00:38:33,400 --> 00:38:35,239 a little bit dramatic in my mind. He's thirty years 839 00:38:35,239 --> 00:38:38,519 old and you know, had the three losses. But still 840 00:38:38,719 --> 00:38:40,119 that didn't seem to me the time you're going to 841 00:38:40,159 --> 00:38:42,320 call it a deck. But he did say that he 842 00:38:42,440 --> 00:38:44,440 was going to fight it, you know, continue to fight, okay, 843 00:38:44,639 --> 00:38:46,119 and at that point you're like, he's going to probably 844 00:38:46,119 --> 00:38:48,000 reorganize this team to some degree, and that's what he 845 00:38:48,039 --> 00:38:51,679 has announced that instead of staying with his longtime trainer, 846 00:38:51,679 --> 00:38:55,119 he's going to now train in Miami under the guidance 847 00:38:55,159 --> 00:38:58,559 of Pedro Diaz. Pedro Diaz worked with a bunch of 848 00:38:58,559 --> 00:39:01,800 the Cuban olympian through the years. He you know, out 849 00:39:01,800 --> 00:39:05,199 of Cuba, was very integral on their national team preparation 850 00:39:05,800 --> 00:39:08,320 in the terms of the professional assignments. I first, I think, 851 00:39:08,320 --> 00:39:09,800 in my off the top of my head, first time 852 00:39:09,840 --> 00:39:12,159 I ever met Pedro and uh and got to know 853 00:39:12,239 --> 00:39:14,880 him a little bit, was he he ended up being 854 00:39:15,239 --> 00:39:18,400 the trainer, uh for Miguel Coto for for some of 855 00:39:18,400 --> 00:39:21,440 his bigger fights. Uh when when when he went looking 856 00:39:21,440 --> 00:39:23,840 for a trainer change. He's also was known to have 857 00:39:23,880 --> 00:39:27,199 trained Giromo Riggando, who was obviously one of the top Cubans. 858 00:39:27,360 --> 00:39:29,360 He trained for a for some time a little bit 859 00:39:29,400 --> 00:39:31,840 with Philip Perkovich, the heavyweight. So this is a guy 860 00:39:31,840 --> 00:39:35,199 that's vastly experienced, that's got respect from pretty much everybody 861 00:39:35,519 --> 00:39:38,480 in the business. And uh, the thing about it was 862 00:39:38,480 --> 00:39:40,800 when Zoo was deciding what he's going to do. Uh, 863 00:39:40,840 --> 00:39:43,880 I didn't know this until it was talked about on 864 00:39:44,000 --> 00:39:46,039 I think it was on one of the Australian Fox 865 00:39:46,119 --> 00:39:48,760 or news channels whatever, that that Tim had come to 866 00:39:48,760 --> 00:39:50,760 the United States to do what a lot of guys do. 867 00:39:50,800 --> 00:39:52,920 Anthony Joshua had done this before. Guys did do this. 868 00:39:52,960 --> 00:39:56,039 They came to basically do the rounds in America to 869 00:39:56,079 --> 00:39:58,559 try out different gyms and stee they might mess with, 870 00:39:58,559 --> 00:40:01,320 make appointments with different trainers. So apparently Tim not only 871 00:40:01,360 --> 00:40:03,400 did he come to America and have some time where 872 00:40:03,440 --> 00:40:06,840 he worked with Pedro Paedo Diaz, he also went and 873 00:40:06,840 --> 00:40:10,039 worked a little bit with Abel Sanchez, a top notch trainer, 874 00:40:10,079 --> 00:40:11,679 a guy that's been on the Hall of Fame. Ballot 875 00:40:11,840 --> 00:40:14,000 went and worked out in La with Rudy Hernandez, who 876 00:40:14,039 --> 00:40:17,199 was a very very underrated trainer. He's best known these 877 00:40:17,280 --> 00:40:20,719 days as the trainer for a Junto Nakantani and Anthony Olaskagua, 878 00:40:21,519 --> 00:40:24,800 the brother of the late champion Genera Hernandez. So he 879 00:40:24,920 --> 00:40:27,280 was going with top notch guys and he just decided, 880 00:40:27,679 --> 00:40:31,000 as he said, Pedo Diaz was his guy. So we'll 881 00:40:31,039 --> 00:40:32,360 see if that can work and if he can mayke 882 00:40:32,400 --> 00:40:32,840 a come back. 883 00:40:33,280 --> 00:40:36,159 Speaker 1: Yeh, he has got an uphill climb after a couple 884 00:40:36,159 --> 00:40:40,280 of big ko losses for a guy that you know 885 00:40:40,400 --> 00:40:44,440 again huge superstar in Australia. But that is past tense 886 00:40:44,960 --> 00:40:48,400 right now with those two defeats. Okay, speaking of superstars, 887 00:40:48,480 --> 00:40:54,000 we have news on Manny Pacquial's son making his professional debut. 888 00:40:55,000 --> 00:40:57,360 Tell us more and we got to wait a little 889 00:40:57,400 --> 00:40:59,360 bit relative right now. But what's going on. 890 00:41:00,440 --> 00:41:04,519 Speaker 2: So Paci always had a promotional company was longtime MP Promotions. 891 00:41:04,519 --> 00:41:07,719 Now they've rebranded at Many Pakiao Promotions. They've promoted shows 892 00:41:07,719 --> 00:41:09,960 in the Philippines through the years, but they're going to 893 00:41:10,039 --> 00:41:11,760 be doing a series of events now in the United 894 00:41:11,760 --> 00:41:14,440 States and their first one is going to be on 895 00:41:14,599 --> 00:41:17,199 a November twenty nine. Sean Gibbons, who is Many's right 896 00:41:17,199 --> 00:41:20,800 hand man and been the longtime guy that runs Anti 897 00:41:20,840 --> 00:41:23,519 Promotions down many Pacio Promotions. He said to me that 898 00:41:23,559 --> 00:41:25,480 this was going to be televised on ESPN de Portez 899 00:41:25,480 --> 00:41:27,199 here in the United States. But anyway, they're doing a 900 00:41:27,199 --> 00:41:30,519 card at the Pachanga Resort in Temecula, California, and on 901 00:41:30,559 --> 00:41:32,679 that show, not the main event will be the co feature, 902 00:41:32,840 --> 00:41:35,320 not because it's a big fight, but because it's Manipacio's son. 903 00:41:35,519 --> 00:41:38,880 Many Pakio Junior goes by the nickname Jimuel, that he 904 00:41:38,960 --> 00:41:41,039 is going to make his professional debut. He's been training 905 00:41:41,239 --> 00:41:42,960 as an amateur for the last three years or so. 906 00:41:43,039 --> 00:41:46,880 As trainer is Marvin Simolio, who is the longtime assistant 907 00:41:46,920 --> 00:41:49,199 trainer for Many Packyo Senior and has been in the 908 00:41:49,199 --> 00:41:51,880 Wildcard Gym with Freddie Roach for years. That's where his 909 00:41:51,960 --> 00:41:54,599 son trains and he's turning pro on that card. So 910 00:41:54,639 --> 00:41:58,000 he's in a four round lightweight fight. The opponent that 911 00:41:58,000 --> 00:41:59,639 they picked out from is nobody you ever heard of. 912 00:42:00,119 --> 00:42:04,559 Is a guy also making his professional debut in Brendan Lally. 913 00:42:04,920 --> 00:42:07,960 But anytime you have the son of one of the 914 00:42:07,960 --> 00:42:10,800 greats of all time turn and pro, it's something that 915 00:42:10,880 --> 00:42:13,320 I would think people might be interested to check out. 916 00:42:13,719 --> 00:42:15,880 Speaker 1: One more bit of news item and It's kind of 917 00:42:15,920 --> 00:42:19,559 like in the preview mode because we normally tape on 918 00:42:19,719 --> 00:42:22,480 Thursday leading into Friday and Thursday night. You did mention 919 00:42:22,559 --> 00:42:26,159 this fight Thursday night. Now is the fight between MICHAELA. 920 00:42:26,320 --> 00:42:30,760 Mayer going here against Mary Spencer for the WBA Women's 921 00:42:30,840 --> 00:42:32,119 Junior Middleweight Championship. 922 00:42:32,119 --> 00:42:32,280 Speaker 2: Fight. 923 00:42:32,320 --> 00:42:36,079 Speaker 1: It's in Montreal. Just once again for the audience here 924 00:42:36,079 --> 00:42:37,960 that maybe didn't hear what you said before, this is 925 00:42:38,000 --> 00:42:39,800 coming up here later this week. 926 00:42:40,880 --> 00:42:43,280 Speaker 2: Well, Michael has established herself as one of the best 927 00:42:43,320 --> 00:42:46,840 female boxers in the world. She currently holds the w 928 00:42:46,960 --> 00:42:49,960 bo's welterweight titles. She had previously been a unified champion 929 00:42:50,280 --> 00:42:52,960 in the junior lightweight division. She's moved up the scale 930 00:42:53,119 --> 00:42:55,519 and after she had the two excellent fights with Sandy 931 00:42:55,599 --> 00:42:58,639 Ryan where she won this WBO title and then defended 932 00:42:58,639 --> 00:43:01,159 the title. What you really wanted and I really thought 933 00:43:01,199 --> 00:43:02,960 there was a good chance this what happened. She was 934 00:43:03,000 --> 00:43:05,239 calling out Lauren Price, who has the other three belts 935 00:43:05,519 --> 00:43:08,079 she had unified against Natasha Jonas, and that would be 936 00:43:08,880 --> 00:43:11,800 a pretty big fight, certainly in Wales or in the UK. 937 00:43:11,920 --> 00:43:14,320 You know, prices from Wales would have been like a 938 00:43:14,320 --> 00:43:17,480 pretty big deal. I guess there was some conversational I 939 00:43:17,480 --> 00:43:20,840 guess they didn't really go too far. Mikaela, you know, 940 00:43:20,840 --> 00:43:23,559 who's always wanted to fight the top opponents out there, 941 00:43:23,800 --> 00:43:26,599 was getting a little bit frustrated, and so she decided 942 00:43:26,599 --> 00:43:28,280 that they could take this opportunity for her to move 943 00:43:28,320 --> 00:43:29,639 up and go for a title on a third way 944 00:43:29,679 --> 00:43:32,800 class and take on Mary Spencer, who's from Montreal. They're 945 00:43:32,800 --> 00:43:35,519 gonna fight the Montreal Casino, a place where Mary Spencer 946 00:43:35,559 --> 00:43:38,400 has fought. You know, this is gonna be her fifth 947 00:43:38,440 --> 00:43:41,119 consecutive fight in that in that building, so clearly a 948 00:43:41,199 --> 00:43:44,639 hometown advantage if you will, for Spencer. But Spencer's also 949 00:43:44,679 --> 00:43:47,800 only ten and two with six knockouts. She's forty years old. 950 00:43:48,360 --> 00:43:50,320 She was a top amateur, but it's been a long time. 951 00:43:50,360 --> 00:43:52,960 She was an Olympian back in two thousand and twelve. 952 00:43:53,239 --> 00:43:55,679 The Kayla was the United States Olympian in twenty sixteen. 953 00:43:55,760 --> 00:43:58,559 So she's much younger by five years at thirty five, 954 00:43:59,360 --> 00:44:02,039 and she's going on going to the home turf. Spencer 955 00:44:02,079 --> 00:44:04,599 had had to grab another title, and if you watch 956 00:44:04,679 --> 00:44:06,960 Mikaela Mayor, she's been in a lot of good fights 957 00:44:07,079 --> 00:44:10,119 as far as entertainment, value for on the female side 958 00:44:10,119 --> 00:44:12,519 of things, she's pretty much always given, you know, pretty 959 00:44:12,519 --> 00:44:14,360 good value for the money. Which he unified at one 960 00:44:14,400 --> 00:44:17,400 thirty against Hamadusha was one of the great fights that 961 00:44:17,440 --> 00:44:19,599 you'll ever see. Actually was ringside for that fight. Tremendous 962 00:44:19,599 --> 00:44:23,880 battle in Las Vegas. So anyway, as women's fights go, 963 00:44:24,599 --> 00:44:26,440 we've discussed as plenty of times, it's a lot easier 964 00:44:26,480 --> 00:44:29,400 to make sometimes these unification fights where the fights where 965 00:44:29,440 --> 00:44:32,039 the top females fighting each other sometimes and it is 966 00:44:32,320 --> 00:44:35,280 for the men because they have fewer options. There's obviously 967 00:44:35,360 --> 00:44:37,760 it's not it's become a lot more lucrative, but it's 968 00:44:37,760 --> 00:44:40,559 still not on the same level as the top male fighters. 969 00:44:40,559 --> 00:44:43,400 We discussed on the last show. Those in the United 970 00:44:43,400 --> 00:44:45,440 States that want to watch the fight. Top Rank, which 971 00:44:45,440 --> 00:44:47,360 we've discussed a thousand times, does not have a TV 972 00:44:47,440 --> 00:44:49,599 deal or a streaming deal, but they do have their 973 00:44:49,840 --> 00:44:52,880 Top Rank Classics Fast channel that you can watch this fight. 974 00:44:52,880 --> 00:44:54,480 They're gonna put it on their fast channel on all 975 00:44:56,039 --> 00:44:57,920 those fast channels that are out there to be and 976 00:44:57,960 --> 00:45:01,639 Pluto and Roku had said, and so that's how folks 977 00:45:01,639 --> 00:45:03,280 can watch it on Thursday evening. 978 00:45:03,400 --> 00:45:06,559 Speaker 1: So again that's on Thursday night Women's world title fight 979 00:45:07,079 --> 00:45:07,519 for I. 980 00:45:07,440 --> 00:45:09,119 Speaker 2: Wanted to see the Price fight. I really want to 981 00:45:09,159 --> 00:45:10,719 see Michael in Price. I thought that'd been a hell 982 00:45:10,760 --> 00:45:11,079 of a fight. 983 00:45:11,840 --> 00:45:14,480 Speaker 1: Stay tuned, you still might down the road, maybe we 984 00:45:14,480 --> 00:45:18,440 can have good things true on that. All right, nostalgia time? 985 00:45:18,719 --> 00:45:23,360 Can it really have been thirty five years ago? Coming 986 00:45:23,440 --> 00:45:27,679 up now? In fact, thirty five years ago Saturday, we're 987 00:45:27,679 --> 00:45:29,679 doing this Sunday night and a Monday. So thirty five 988 00:45:29,760 --> 00:45:32,239 years ago on October twenty fifth, nineteen ninety that A 989 00:45:32,320 --> 00:45:36,920 Vander Holyfield became the undisputed heavyweight champion, thus ending the 990 00:45:37,039 --> 00:45:40,880 lightning in the bottle rain of James Buster Douglass some 991 00:45:41,119 --> 00:45:44,719 eight months after he upset Mike Tyson in Tokyo, Japan. 992 00:45:44,920 --> 00:45:48,079 It was over in less than three rounds with one 993 00:45:48,199 --> 00:45:52,119 booming punch. All right, let's talk about it, including the 994 00:45:52,119 --> 00:45:54,679 background of how we got here. That's fascinating because there 995 00:45:54,719 --> 00:45:58,760 wasn't a whole lot to the fight other than Douglas 996 00:45:58,840 --> 00:46:00,960 laying on the mat like a each whale as he 997 00:46:01,079 --> 00:46:04,119 was counted out for the undisputed title. But as he's 998 00:46:04,159 --> 00:46:07,920 rubbing his nose looking up and and it's over with 999 00:46:08,000 --> 00:46:10,679 one shot. You know, but the the build up to 1000 00:46:10,760 --> 00:46:12,440 this was in the court rooms. It was in the 1001 00:46:12,480 --> 00:46:16,159 courtrooms for Buster Douglas freeing himself from Don King to 1002 00:46:16,320 --> 00:46:19,199 make this fight happen. And then holy Field pulls the upset, 1003 00:46:19,239 --> 00:46:22,280 and it really changed the dynamic of the heavyweight division. 1004 00:46:22,280 --> 00:46:26,840 Speaker 2: Really for any time, anytime the undisputed championship changes hands, 1005 00:46:27,239 --> 00:46:29,880 it's not only a massive event in the ring, it's 1006 00:46:29,880 --> 00:46:32,519 a cataclysmic thing in the business. And so that was 1007 00:46:32,559 --> 00:46:35,320 definitely the case when holy Field knocked out Buster Douglas. 1008 00:46:35,400 --> 00:46:37,920 Of course, most people were hoping that you know, Douglas 1009 00:46:37,960 --> 00:46:40,360 was supposed to be a speed bump fer Mike Tyson 1010 00:46:40,840 --> 00:46:42,559 go to you know, for him to go over to Tokyo 1011 00:46:42,519 --> 00:46:44,679 and pick up you know, and however many millions of 1012 00:46:44,679 --> 00:46:46,719 dollars for a quick night at the office. And then 1013 00:46:47,119 --> 00:46:50,119 the next fight was supposed to be the Evander Holytail fight, 1014 00:46:50,239 --> 00:46:52,119 which was what everybody had looked forward to for years. 1015 00:46:52,119 --> 00:46:57,239 It had been postponed previously because of an injury, and 1016 00:46:57,280 --> 00:46:59,920 it didn't happen. And then, of course Buster Douglas scored 1017 00:46:59,920 --> 00:47:01,880 the big giant upset, but he was still the mandatory 1018 00:47:01,880 --> 00:47:05,000 so the organizations, you know, he got his shot the 1019 00:47:05,159 --> 00:47:07,119 holy Field. Holyfield had been the champion that cruiser weight. 1020 00:47:07,159 --> 00:47:09,039 He'd been biding his time and then put together a 1021 00:47:09,119 --> 00:47:11,840 nice string of wins at heavyweight, and so you know, 1022 00:47:11,920 --> 00:47:13,679 he got the title. Some people, I feel like they 1023 00:47:13,760 --> 00:47:15,360 kind of downgraded a vanter because when he got the 1024 00:47:15,400 --> 00:47:17,800 un disputed heavyweight title, he didn't do it against Tyson. 1025 00:47:17,840 --> 00:47:19,599 He did it only against Buster Douglas. But I always 1026 00:47:19,639 --> 00:47:21,760 felt that was on faery. He certainly ended up proving 1027 00:47:21,800 --> 00:47:23,760 his point, you know, many years later when he when 1028 00:47:23,760 --> 00:47:26,280 he beat Mike Tyson twice on the on the knockout 1029 00:47:26,280 --> 00:47:30,119 and then the ear biting disqualification. But once once, uh, 1030 00:47:30,280 --> 00:47:32,079 Buster had won the title and he had become an 1031 00:47:32,079 --> 00:47:35,440 overnight sensation. He can't even underreest he can't even understand 1032 00:47:35,559 --> 00:47:38,000 how big of a deal Buster Douglas came. Yes, if 1033 00:47:38,000 --> 00:47:39,639 we weren't around at the time, I mean he was, 1034 00:47:40,400 --> 00:47:43,800 you know, instant fame. I mean as big as you 1035 00:47:43,800 --> 00:47:45,119 could see worldwide. 1036 00:47:45,280 --> 00:47:47,480 Speaker 1: Because the fight had happened in Japan. He's on the 1037 00:47:47,519 --> 00:47:51,480 cover of Sports Illustrated, He's on the cover of the covers. 1038 00:47:51,679 --> 00:47:55,840 He's all, yeah, Douglas, He's everywhere. And then again in 1039 00:47:55,880 --> 00:47:58,880 the build up to this he had to disentangle There's 1040 00:47:58,880 --> 00:48:01,239 a big world on the podcast himself from Don King. 1041 00:48:01,480 --> 00:48:03,119 I find it fascinating when you go back in the 1042 00:48:03,159 --> 00:48:07,239 nostalgia and you watch the immediate post fight comments and 1043 00:48:07,360 --> 00:48:11,000 interviews out of the ring in the arena that Jim 1044 00:48:11,119 --> 00:48:13,519 Johnson and Buster Douglas's people were saying, we're going to 1045 00:48:13,559 --> 00:48:16,519 fight a Vander Holyfield next. He's the mandatory We're going 1046 00:48:16,599 --> 00:48:19,400 to fight Avanner Holyfield next. Well, that's where Don King 1047 00:48:19,519 --> 00:48:21,159 tried to step in and say, no, I still have 1048 00:48:21,199 --> 00:48:23,519 a contract with you. It ended up going to federal 1049 00:48:23,599 --> 00:48:29,719 court and Douglas's team prevailed because they were able to 1050 00:48:29,760 --> 00:48:32,519 demonstrate that what a surprise, Don King had not lived 1051 00:48:32,599 --> 00:48:34,719 up to the contract he had with Douglas on the 1052 00:48:34,800 --> 00:48:36,760 number of fights he was supposed to give him. So 1053 00:48:36,800 --> 00:48:40,159 the judge basically said to Buster Douglas, you're free to 1054 00:48:40,199 --> 00:48:42,440 make another fight with somebody else if you want to, 1055 00:48:42,599 --> 00:48:46,079 and that's what's set into motion and negotiation in this fight. 1056 00:48:46,519 --> 00:48:48,760 Speaker 2: Vander was with Main Events, which at that time was, 1057 00:48:49,239 --> 00:48:52,159 along with Don King and Top Rank, the powerhouse of 1058 00:48:52,199 --> 00:48:54,400 boxing at least in the United States, if not the world. 1059 00:48:54,880 --> 00:48:57,280 They promoted. Evander had a lot of good fighters in 1060 00:48:57,320 --> 00:49:00,559 their stable, but ultimately the deal was not me and 1061 00:49:00,639 --> 00:49:03,840 it went to a purspit. Now, purse bids as we 1062 00:49:03,920 --> 00:49:07,800 know today, and most listeners weren't around back then, would 1063 00:49:07,840 --> 00:49:10,119 have no concept of this. Today, a purse bid is 1064 00:49:10,559 --> 00:49:12,599 you always see, okay, it's match from boxing bids or 1065 00:49:12,960 --> 00:49:15,480 top rank bids or you know whoever that that the 1066 00:49:15,480 --> 00:49:17,840 promoter of the fighters involved did on the fight. But 1067 00:49:17,960 --> 00:49:20,159 back then, the Mirage Hotel, which was like the new 1068 00:49:20,199 --> 00:49:23,239 gleaming gem of the Las Vegas trip, was the hot 1069 00:49:23,280 --> 00:49:27,800 place around was owned by Steve Win. Hotels and casinos 1070 00:49:27,920 --> 00:49:31,360 were also a licensed promoters and they could bid on fights. 1071 00:49:31,760 --> 00:49:34,159 And so this fight went to a purspit and there 1072 00:49:34,159 --> 00:49:36,199 was a huge amount of intrigue and what was going 1073 00:49:36,280 --> 00:49:38,400 to happen, who was going to win, how much was 1074 00:49:38,440 --> 00:49:39,880 going to go for it because this was a hot fight. 1075 00:49:40,159 --> 00:49:43,480 You know, Douglas became huge because of the win over Tyson. 1076 00:49:43,519 --> 00:49:46,079 The vander had a big name already from the Olympics 1077 00:49:46,079 --> 00:49:48,320 all the way through cruiserweights through heavyweights. He was a 1078 00:49:48,599 --> 00:49:52,199 well known fighter at that point. So at the time 1079 00:49:52,280 --> 00:49:54,960 this was the record perspit in the history of purse bids. 1080 00:49:55,599 --> 00:49:59,280 It was later broken. But the biggest purspit ever for 1081 00:49:59,320 --> 00:50:01,519 this time we got this is back in nineteen ninety 1082 00:50:02,199 --> 00:50:05,599 The Mirage, backed by Steve Winn, did thirty two point 1083 00:50:05,639 --> 00:50:08,519 one million dollars on this fight. So I forget what 1084 00:50:08,559 --> 00:50:10,920 the exact split was, but Buster walked away with tens 1085 00:50:10,960 --> 00:50:13,519 of millions of dollars whatever it was, and that's the 1086 00:50:13,559 --> 00:50:15,960 money that he basically lived on, you know, still living 1087 00:50:15,960 --> 00:50:17,960 on probably today to this right. But it was a 1088 00:50:18,000 --> 00:50:19,920 big pay per view fight back in the days when 1089 00:50:20,159 --> 00:50:23,519 showtime pay per view was called set uh, and they 1090 00:50:23,559 --> 00:50:26,360 had worked a lot with the vander Holyfield and they 1091 00:50:26,400 --> 00:50:29,360 put this on and the outdoors at the Mirage, and 1092 00:50:29,559 --> 00:50:32,639 it was a big deal. And during the course of 1093 00:50:32,679 --> 00:50:34,800 the build up to the fight, there was you know, 1094 00:50:34,840 --> 00:50:37,360 who's gonna win? They obviously everybody knew what had happened 1095 00:50:37,360 --> 00:50:40,559 with Tyson, and then Buster Douglas came to the way 1096 00:50:40,639 --> 00:50:42,760 in and as you said, looked a little like a 1097 00:50:42,800 --> 00:50:45,800 beach well, and I hear I've heard. I didn't. Obviously, 1098 00:50:45,800 --> 00:50:47,639 this is before my day covering boxing. I was in 1099 00:50:47,679 --> 00:50:50,199 college when this happened, but I remember years later when 1100 00:50:50,239 --> 00:50:52,000 I was on the beat at the beginning talking to 1101 00:50:52,039 --> 00:50:55,079 some of the veteran writers on hearing their stories. Uh. 1102 00:50:55,519 --> 00:50:57,559 And and I remember talking to some guys about this fight, 1103 00:50:57,599 --> 00:50:59,559 though I remember which one's exactly who were covering this, 1104 00:51:00,039 --> 00:51:02,440 and we're joking around half serious but half for real. 1105 00:51:02,719 --> 00:51:04,400 Is that when they saw what happened at the way 1106 00:51:04,400 --> 00:51:07,639 and then how Busser looked so terrible at the weigh 1107 00:51:07,639 --> 00:51:09,800 in and there and there were stories about how he 1108 00:51:09,960 --> 00:51:12,519 was like ordering room service in the sauna. I mean, 1109 00:51:12,599 --> 00:51:13,639 just crazy shit like that. 1110 00:51:13,800 --> 00:51:17,039 Speaker 1: And he's a good twenty two twenty five pounds heavier 1111 00:51:17,039 --> 00:51:18,880 than he was in Tokyo. It's opful. He was in 1112 00:51:18,880 --> 00:51:20,599 good shape and it was all spare, it was all 1113 00:51:20,639 --> 00:51:24,239 spare tire around the stomach. And he took the robe 1114 00:51:24,239 --> 00:51:26,400 off right for the weigh in and everybody went, oh 1115 00:51:26,440 --> 00:51:26,800 my god. 1116 00:51:27,440 --> 00:51:29,400 Speaker 2: Right and as the as the writers I was hearing 1117 00:51:29,400 --> 00:51:32,079 these stories from talked about how like people couldn't make 1118 00:51:32,079 --> 00:51:34,039 a B line fast enough to get to the sportsbook 1119 00:51:34,039 --> 00:51:36,199 to wager to get the best hots and put their 1120 00:51:36,199 --> 00:51:38,679 money all on a vander Holyfield. Uh. And then of 1121 00:51:38,719 --> 00:51:42,039 course it played out the next night when he showed 1122 00:51:42,119 --> 00:51:44,400 up in the ring with no change, and you know. 1123 00:51:44,440 --> 00:51:48,280 Speaker 1: Clearly, clearly slower out of shape, and holy Field spent 1124 00:51:48,679 --> 00:51:51,199 around or so trying to time him and trying to 1125 00:51:51,239 --> 00:51:53,360 time him in specific for a right hand, and. 1126 00:51:53,320 --> 00:51:55,079 Speaker 2: Then Douglas made one of the worst in the station. 1127 00:51:55,519 --> 00:51:57,840 Speaker 1: You and I have joked all the time that it's 1128 00:51:57,880 --> 00:52:00,320 one thing to have missed with a punch, but to 1129 00:52:00,400 --> 00:52:05,000 miss with an uppercut at range in slow motion was 1130 00:52:05,039 --> 00:52:08,639 just inviting Holyfield to blast him. And that's exactly what happened. 1131 00:52:08,679 --> 00:52:09,320 With one shot. 1132 00:52:09,559 --> 00:52:13,400 Speaker 2: He threw and missed a giant, lunging, wide uppercut and 1133 00:52:13,440 --> 00:52:17,000 Evander landed the absolute perfect right hand counter over it 1134 00:52:17,320 --> 00:52:20,320 right on the chin, put Douglas flat on his back. 1135 00:52:20,320 --> 00:52:22,159 And as I mentioned, as he's laying there taking the 1136 00:52:22,239 --> 00:52:25,920 count from the referee, he's wiping his nose to see 1137 00:52:25,960 --> 00:52:27,639 if he's got a bloody nose or whatever. 1138 00:52:27,800 --> 00:52:30,159 Speaker 1: He didn't even try to get up. He just laid there. 1139 00:52:30,400 --> 00:52:32,440 Speaker 2: He just laid there and they counted him out. And 1140 00:52:32,800 --> 00:52:35,400 you know the image I remember as you see like 1141 00:52:35,480 --> 00:52:39,280 he's laying on the canvas, and the team for Buster Douglas, 1142 00:52:39,360 --> 00:52:42,119 for Vander Holyfield, rather it storms the ring in celebration, 1143 00:52:42,400 --> 00:52:44,880 and you got the late Dan Duva who was the 1144 00:52:44,880 --> 00:52:47,920 patriarch of Main Events, the son of Lou Duva, the 1145 00:52:47,920 --> 00:52:51,920 brother of Dino Duva, the husband of Kathy Duva, basically 1146 00:52:52,000 --> 00:52:55,280 jumped over Buster Douglas's body as they start to celebrate, 1147 00:52:55,320 --> 00:52:57,360 and it's Buster, it's not Buster laying on the mat. 1148 00:52:57,559 --> 00:52:59,400 But you got the other group. You got Holyfield and 1149 00:52:59,440 --> 00:53:02,360 his team is corner, You've got Dan Duva, You've got 1150 00:53:03,199 --> 00:53:06,239 them all celebrating. Shelly Finkel, who was a Vander Holyfield's 1151 00:53:06,280 --> 00:53:09,559 manager at that time and did a tremendous job bringing 1152 00:53:10,159 --> 00:53:12,599 him up through the ranks to get him to the 1153 00:53:12,639 --> 00:53:15,079 heavyweight championship, and that that really made Events. Like I said, 1154 00:53:15,119 --> 00:53:17,800 they were a big, big deal company, but they had 1155 00:53:17,840 --> 00:53:20,079 never had the heavyweight champion. And now when you win 1156 00:53:20,079 --> 00:53:23,280 the heavyweight championship, your fighter, you now take control in 1157 00:53:23,400 --> 00:53:25,719 large measure of the top of the division. That was 1158 00:53:25,760 --> 00:53:30,159 a massive, massive, massive win for the company. And they 1159 00:53:30,159 --> 00:53:33,119 obviously went on and had a long and lucrative relationship 1160 00:53:33,119 --> 00:53:37,239 with Evander beyond that. But the pure joy in the 1161 00:53:37,320 --> 00:53:39,760 in the faces of of that team that won with 1162 00:53:39,800 --> 00:53:42,480 the folks remain Events and with a Vander having accomplished 1163 00:53:42,519 --> 00:53:44,280 what he did, he became by the way we make 1164 00:53:44,320 --> 00:53:46,280 a big deal about it now when somebody does it, 1165 00:53:46,320 --> 00:53:48,920 but this was the first time it ever happened, is 1166 00:53:48,960 --> 00:53:51,880 that a person had become in a multi belt era 1167 00:53:52,840 --> 00:53:55,760 the undisputed champion in two weight classes. This is back 1168 00:53:55,800 --> 00:53:57,519 in the time of the three belt era. Now Vander 1169 00:53:57,559 --> 00:54:00,400 had been the unified champion in the three out there 1170 00:54:00,480 --> 00:54:03,519 at cruiserweight and now he wins all the belts against 1171 00:54:03,559 --> 00:54:05,440 Buster Douglas. That was like a big fucking deal, I 1172 00:54:05,440 --> 00:54:07,599 mean huge. Now now we've seen it happen in the 1173 00:54:07,599 --> 00:54:10,039 four belt time, where you know, Terrence Crawford has dotted 1174 00:54:10,079 --> 00:54:12,559 in a third division out because of what he did 1175 00:54:12,639 --> 00:54:16,000 against Canelo Alvarez. We've seen two divisions with like for 1176 00:54:16,039 --> 00:54:19,000 example Noia. In a way Alexander Usik has also done 1177 00:54:19,000 --> 00:54:21,440 at a heavyweight and cruiserweight. But for Evander to do 1178 00:54:21,519 --> 00:54:23,519 that was a big, big, big deal. 1179 00:54:23,800 --> 00:54:26,639 Speaker 1: And again in the nostalgia, we never got a Douglas 1180 00:54:26,639 --> 00:54:30,079 Tyson rematch for this reason, that's what they had hoped 1181 00:54:30,119 --> 00:54:33,960 to have happened. It never happened, and and holy Field 1182 00:54:34,039 --> 00:54:36,840 and Tyson would not fight for six more years because 1183 00:54:36,880 --> 00:54:40,760 Tyson obviously went to prison after that. He got he 1184 00:54:40,800 --> 00:54:43,320 got charged with rape the following year in March of 1185 00:54:43,760 --> 00:54:45,400 ninety one or the summer of ninety one, and got 1186 00:54:45,440 --> 00:54:48,519 convicted in February of ninety two. So we didn't get 1187 00:54:48,519 --> 00:54:50,320 Holyfield Tyson tried to. 1188 00:54:51,320 --> 00:54:55,559 Speaker 2: Yeah, the holy Field Tyson fighted not happened on multiple occasions. 1189 00:54:55,840 --> 00:54:57,559 That was like a huge fight that people had wanted 1190 00:54:57,599 --> 00:54:59,239 to see. It was never a Vander's fault to fight 1191 00:54:59,320 --> 00:55:01,679 that happened. It was at one point he got injured 1192 00:55:01,719 --> 00:55:04,280 Doug ye and then he got a conviction and whatever. 1193 00:55:04,039 --> 00:55:07,000 Speaker 1: And then Douglas knocked him out and then holy Field 1194 00:55:07,079 --> 00:55:11,079 with the booming shot October twenty five, nineteen ninety became 1195 00:55:11,199 --> 00:55:12,880 undisputed heavyweight championship. 1196 00:55:12,880 --> 00:55:15,159 Speaker 2: I can still remember watching that fight in college at 1197 00:55:15,159 --> 00:55:18,800 a at a like an off campus party that we 1198 00:55:18,840 --> 00:55:21,320 had gone to, and people like chipped in to buy 1199 00:55:21,360 --> 00:55:23,639 the pay per view, and and uh, you know that 1200 00:55:23,760 --> 00:55:24,760 was when you did. 1201 00:55:24,679 --> 00:55:27,079 Speaker 1: The same with two college friends of mine in Memphis, Tennessee, 1202 00:55:27,119 --> 00:55:29,400 and I shout out to my college buddy Raylide. Well, 1203 00:55:29,400 --> 00:55:32,559 we were at Ray's house, we were shooting pool, we 1204 00:55:32,559 --> 00:55:34,480 were having a good time. We were watching the pay 1205 00:55:34,480 --> 00:55:37,800 per view and and you know, after about fifteen minutes 1206 00:55:37,840 --> 00:55:39,920 of the ring walk and the knockout, we were back 1207 00:55:39,920 --> 00:55:43,079 shooting pool again. I vividly remember that after that. 1208 00:55:43,239 --> 00:55:45,679 Speaker 2: It was a good time, crazy crazy in college, I 1209 00:55:45,679 --> 00:55:48,239 can remember two big pay per view parties I went 1210 00:55:48,280 --> 00:55:50,480 to for a big heavyweight title fights. One was the 1211 00:55:50,519 --> 00:55:53,159 Vander Holyfield against Buster and Douglas, and then not too 1212 00:55:53,239 --> 00:55:56,159 long later was when the Vander Holyfield defended the title 1213 00:55:56,360 --> 00:55:58,400 that he had won for Buster against George Truman, which 1214 00:55:58,400 --> 00:56:00,880 was even a bigger deal than the Dougle fight up. 1215 00:56:01,159 --> 00:56:03,639 Speaker 1: So there you go, thirty five years ago at the 1216 00:56:03,639 --> 00:56:07,679 time that we're doing this, Evander Holyfield becomes the undisputed champ. 1217 00:56:08,599 --> 00:56:11,840 And with that we have come to the conclusion of 1218 00:56:11,880 --> 00:56:15,159 another recap pod. My friend, have a good week. This week, 1219 00:56:15,559 --> 00:56:17,840 we encourage the Peaks again to follow subscribe on the 1220 00:56:17,840 --> 00:56:21,519 podcast feed apples Freak for Spotify. I'll also find our 1221 00:56:21,599 --> 00:56:25,119 YouTube page as well. Read Dan Substack the Fight Freak 1222 00:56:25,199 --> 00:56:28,239 to Night Substack subscribe up there beyond the newsletter all 1223 00:56:28,280 --> 00:56:30,519 of it, My friend, have a good week. As we 1224 00:56:30,639 --> 00:56:34,199 rolled towards Halloween is coming Friday and into the month 1225 00:56:34,199 --> 00:56:37,440 of November, we're almost done with twenty twenty five. Big 1226 00:56:37,519 --> 00:56:38,239 Dan have a good week. 1227 00:56:38,360 --> 00:56:39,760 Speaker 2: Thank you. You've bet TJ. 1228 00:56:40,199 --> 00:56:43,000 Speaker 1: There is our insider Dan Rayfield. I'm merely TJ Reeves. 1229 00:56:43,000 --> 00:56:44,760 You've been part of the Fight Freak to Nite Recap 1230 00:56:44,800 --> 00:56:45,239 podcast