Speaker 1: What's going on? Thank you so much for listening to
this podcast. It is heard live every day from noon
to three on WBT Radio in Charlotte. And if you
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smartphone or tablet, And again, thank you so much for
your support. Yesterday we spoke with Terry Donovan, the Republican
nominee for the mayor of Charlotte. Today we are chatting
with Rob Yates. He is a Libertarian nominee for mayor
of Charlotte. Early voting began yesterday. Rob, Welcome to the program.
Speaker 2: How are you not too bad? How's it going?
Speaker 1: Oh, you know, not too bad. It's a Friday, that's
half the battle.
Speaker 2: So it's a beautiful friday, though. I'll take it.
Speaker 1: It is, it absolutely is. I think this is second fall,
second autumn, I believe is what they call it here
in Charlotte. All right, so first, tell us a little
little bit about your bio, like who are you? If
people don't know who you are? Your background, why you
are running for this position.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so it's my second time running for MARIV Charlotte.
I ran for General Assembly in between. I am a Libertarian,
which I'm finding a lot of people are unaware of
what that means, but I'm happy that I've been able
to provide some of that information. I'm the communications director
for the Libertarian Party of North Carolina. I've been in
Charlotte for almost twenty years now, and I'm running because
I've just watched things in the city decline that don't
need to be declining. Definitely not the Charlotte I've moved into.
We're losing some of the things that give the city
charm and make it unique and special. And I really
think I have some ideas and some policy suggestions that
I have to put out there and help turn things around.
Speaker 1: You said things that are declining that should not be declining.
So do you have any examples of what those things
might be?
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I think we all know what the
answers are going to be. It's we certainly have a
public safety issue, and it is much more significant than
it was ten and fifteen years ago. We are housing
costs that are really prohibitive to growth in generational wealth
and sort of starting to create a wealth gap, some
class separation that we don't need to see. Food, transportation
and infrastructure issues. They're perhaps not as bad as people
would like to say during an election season, sure, but
they're getting worse. They're continually getting worse. And then we have,
I think a burgeoning issue with just overall economics. Things
are getting really expensive and job growth is not keeping
up with the clots of people.
Speaker 1: All right, So you also mentioned a moment ago that
things are changing and not for the better, and you know,
sort of hearkening back to this period ten fifteen years ago.
And I have to ask as a libertarian, generally libertarians
oppose the kinds of things that the city of Charlotte would,
you know, promote and do building arenas for example, right,
all sorts of these types of shiny projects and such.
And they say, they would say that those are like
that's the reason why Charlotte became this destination for so
many people and why it was booming, you know, ten fifteen,
twenty years ago. So do you consider that to be
part of the thing that has been diminished?
Speaker 2: So I love questions like this because because we can
really sort of break down what's actually happening versus what
the people who make these deals and benefit from these deals,
which is why I would argue they make them what
they say is happening. Charlotte's been attractive to people because
we have a business friendly environment. We are a fairly
young and high tech city. Historically we've been a pretty
safe city. Big businesses have come here, they've attracted jobs.
Other jobs have come up around those jobs. People can
start a small business or traditionally could start their own
business here fairly successfully. And that's the kind of city
that attracts a sports team. I certainly don't buy into
the idea that we need to give a billionaire one
hundred and fifty million dollar handout to fix his little
pet project playground while our citizens are struggling to put
food on the table.
Speaker 1: What about the light rail system, all of the parks right,
all of the school construction. These were all of the
things that taxpayers have been asked to fund, or been
forced to fund through taxpayer dollars off viously over the
last you know, fifty years. And then those are the
things that are cited as the things that help attract
those very businesses.
Speaker 2: So sure. I mean, obviously, when you pour money into
something and there's an expectation of a return on that,
you're going to have to have some sort of tangible product.
To what degree that's attracting business versus business coming in
and that driving growth. I mean, I would argue it's
the latter pretty substantially. We do have public money coming in,
and libertarian perspective is always going to be a more
decentralized governance. So the idea that at a high level,
what's right for say the outer banks North Carolina is
certainly not what's right for New York City or San Francisco.
And when you get into Charlotte, what's right for Charlotte
might not even be what's right for Raleigh. And what's
right for district Sick might not be what's right for
District three. The more you can localize things, the more
you can specialize the response. If the compromise that we
ended up with was we're going to have a really
nice greenway system and people are going to not pay
a whole bunch of property taxes, like I could probably
be pretty happy with that.
Speaker 1: You mentioned public safety in your at your website. By
the way, I should tell people where to find information
about you and your campaign. It is at prosper Charlotte
dot com. Correct prosper Charlotte, prosper Charlotte dot com. So
when the public safety plank of the platform, you say
funds are wasted on unnecessary military equipment, but the police
union insists cops are not paid enough. So do you
disagree that police are not paid enough or do you
do you think they are? And then what do you
think is the solution to improving public safety?
Speaker 2: So again another good question, but I actually have to
reject the premise of the question. And here's why I
think we need to complete we think our approach to
public safety. So, first of all, we spent something like
a million dollars a couple of years ago on a
military truck for bomb threats that could break through walls
of buildings. And the average person is more likely to
die from a coconut falling on your head than you
are from a bomb explosion in the United States, But
there is a million dollars. Whether or not an individual
officer is paid enough or not should really be based
on the merit of that officer's performance. So then we
get into an incentive structure, and you have to look
at what sort of outcome are you incentivizing. I want
to really push a true community policing initiative where cops
are embedded in the communities where they're serving, They're expected
to be there for a long time, They're rewarded based
on crime reduction in the community, their incentives sort of
get involved in the community. There are a few things
out there that I think we could give cops more
of and better. Certainly, if they need body armor, like
protection of law enforcement is not something you're gonna finally
pushing back on. Another thing I would like to see
is really try to give every single cop a cruiser
and have him or her keep it at home. Just
the presence of the police cruiser is going to deter
people that maybe don't have a natural criminal event, but
are sort of, you know, push to the break and
commit some sort of violent act. This is just a
start a true public safety reform initiative that drives better outcomes. Again,
you have to look at everything. You have to reduce
housing costs at the low end so people can afford
place to live. You have to give opportunities so people
have jobs. You have to ensure that police are in
the place where violent crimes are being committed. And you
have to stop asking police to play babysitter for some
of these silly, victimless crimes right now. And you have
to stop the sensationalism too. Charlotte being in the national spotlight. Granted,
the arena stabbing was horrific, and I think it triggered
a lot of people's emotions because the video was out there.
I was unhappy I saw it. Sometimes that's a difficult
image to get out of your head. But there are
a couple things going on right now. One, we as
a city are at a baseline that I would argue
is unacceptable in terms of public safety, because there is
a real, if very small chance for anyone going out
in most parts of Charlotte that you could be a
victim of violent crime. But on the other hand, we
have seen some initiatives and acted that appear to be
paying dividends. We're in the third year of a decline
in violent crime, particularly violent crime. It's very hard to
say over the last five years how much the COVID
bump has affected where we were and where we're going.
But the fact is we're in a place. Again, that
is just not acceptable and we have to address it
from there because people should be able to feel safe
when they walk up.
Speaker 1: Wait, hang on second. You called it the COVID bump.
You think COVID drove up crime?
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I think that we saw a spike
around twenty twenty, twenty twenty one.
Speaker 1: Yeah, was there something else going on?
Speaker 2: There were potentially lots of things going on.
Speaker 1: Not potentially there were. There was an entire movement around
defunding the police, right, so.
Speaker 2: Interesting, So you think it was directly related to that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'd say the social justice protesting cops, calling them,
you know, pigs and killers and wanting to defund law
enforcement and making them take a knee in order to
prove that, you know, they they're sorry for systemic injustice
and all of that.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Absolutely, I'd say that that had a more of a
direct impact than COVID.
Speaker 2: So yeah, that's actually a good point. So we see
an extreme position on either side and a pen and
swinging back and forth. That doesn't serve anyone. We could
in fact eliminate violent crime tomorrow. If we went into
a police state, we could have you know, they talk
about the National Guard. We could have the army come
through and patrol the streets, and instantly you see violent
crime almost disappear. But I don't think that's the country
we live in or the country we.
Speaker 1: Want to live in, right then. I don't know anybody
that's advocating for a police.
Speaker 2: Exactly one hundred percent. I'm just that's an example for contrast.
So when you swing the entire other way and it's
defund the police and anyone who's in law enforcement you know,
is automatically a Nazi, well then you're going to get
that sort of encouragement that leads to a bump of
criminal behavior. I do think that the sort of the relicship
of purpose that the lockdown lockdown brought. I mean, we
we sort of set the whole world into an existential crisis.
So I think that played into it psychologically. See of
this confluence of events that's very, very bad for people
looking to lower crime.
Speaker 1: Now, yeah, well, I would say my guess is that
locking people down allowed for the explosion during the summer
of fiery but mostly peaceful riots. I think you would
not have seen the kind of explosion had people not
been locked down and driven to the point of insanity.
Just prior. But yeah, but I don't think that's the
cause of the you know, the crime, the crime increase.
I think it has a lot to do with, you know,
telling people that join law enforcement because they want to,
they want to help people, they want to protect people,
and then being told that that makes them nazis. You know,
they don't want to do the job. Then a lot
of a lot of good people don't want to do
the job, and yet a lot of and we still
don't have all of the ranks full.
Speaker 2: And I do think that that's where a properly designed
community policing initiative works, is that the again, the incentive
structure for the officers involved is to truly get to
know the people in their community. So it's like the example,
I like to say, and you know this, but so
Johnny and Billy get in a fight on the street
corner and the cops break it up, but they know
Johnny and Billy's parents where they're locked in with Johnny
and Billy's school, so they're able to intervene. And instead
of putting a fourteen year old in the system and
creating all these barriers to true rehabilitation and coming out
of it, and just two kids getting in a fight.
You have right Now Again, the kids get put in
a system. There are now criminals they have to go
up against all these things. A lot of the kids
that are engaged in this behavior are already facing some
difficulties where they are in life. With the community Policing initiative,
the incentive is to fix everything from the baseline, and
it could. I mean some of the things sound sort
of trite, like you could have barbecues or basketball games
or whatever it may be, go door to door, give
out cards, but that builds trust back in the police,
and then the community engages. So when we say community policing,
it's not this sort of I think it gets a
very like this must be like some new wave leftist
nonsense mumbo jumbo, and it's not. It is engaging everyone
in the act of taking care of their communities.
Speaker 1: My guest is Rob Yates. We gotta pull up there
for a second. So when I was a kid, my
grandpa died with Alzheimer's, and before he died, my mom
and my dad took care of him as he got worse.
Forty years ago, there were no treatments and not much
support for caregivers and family. Things are different today because
of the work of so many people, including the Alzheimer's
Association of Western Carolina. It's a great organization with awesome
people with huge hearts. I've been a supporter for twenty
five years. This cause means a lot to me. I
participate in the annual Walk to end Alzheimer's and I'm
leading a Charlotte team again this year, and it's called
once again Pete's Pack. You can sign up and you
can join the team and walk with us. It's on
October eighteenth, that truest field. Sign up at alz dot
org slash Walk and then you could search for my
team name Pete's Peck. There's also a link at thepetepod
dot com. There's also a link in the description of
this podcast. Also, I'll be am seeing the Gastonia Walk
on October eleventh, and so you can make a team
and join that one too, or make a donation and
help me hit my goal of five thousand dollars. If
you do, I really appreciate it.
Speaker 3: There are a bunch of other walks all over the Carolinas.
You can go to alz dot org slash Walk for
all the dates and locations. We're closer than ever to
stopping Alzheimer's. Can you help us get there? Will you
walk with me? For a different future, for families, for
more time for treatments. This is why we walk.
Speaker 1: Chatting with Rob Yates, he is the Libertarian candidate for
mayor of Charlotte and Rob before the break, we were
talking about public safety, one of the biggest issues. If not,
I would submit it is the biggest issue that's driving
the problems with crime in Charlotte and in Mecklenburg. You know,
at a larger level is the judicial system. And if
you were to win, obviously the mayor is not in
charge of the judicial system. But I mean yesterday or
a couple days ago, we had the Charlotte Mecklinburg Police
released their data and they were pointing out the challenge
they've got with repeat, repeat offenders that keep getting turned loose.
I think they cited some fifteen year old who's got
like one hundred.
Speaker 2: And twelve more than one a day.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's insane. And how can you, if mayor, apply
pressure to the judicial system or would you even do that?
Speaker 2: So I would absolutely do that. You know, I can
sit here and I can talk about community policing, example statistics,
we can look at other ways of policing the community.
We can talk about social change and underlying issues. But
the fact is, if violent people are on the streets,
they're going to do violent things. And it is it
is unreal the number. And you know, it hasn't been
some swell of people that are getting out on these
these full cashlests bills or violent criminals being released, but
it's way more than it should be. I mean, I
would argue should probably be zero. But I think that
the mayor and Charlotte, at least on paper, is not
particularly powerful. There are sort of delineated responsibilities bully pop
it and bully pulpit abilities, and then behind the scenes capabilities,
and I think that with the judicial system there's real
opportunity to really push on some of the DA's on
I mean, even the judges and the magistrates in line
with law enforcement and other people that agree like, hey,
we need to stop letting these people out. And that's
something that I would make a very high priority. If
someone has stabbed someone before and is on trial or
is a waiting trial or for multiple stabbings, that person
probably shouldn't be walking around, especially the previous previous guilty verdicts.
Speaker 1: Yeah, all right, I want to hit on transportation as
well and a couple other topics here Robyates. You can,
by the way, find more of his information and his
positions at prosper Charlotte dot com. More with Robbyates in
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who you are. Visit creative video dot com. We're chatting
with Rob Yates. He's the libertarian candidate for mayor of Charlotte.
His website prosper Charlotte dot com. All right, Rob, let's
talk a little bit about transportation. Do you support do
you endorse the one cent sales tax increase for the
transit system and roads as the mailers keep reinforcing it's
all about the roads in the mailers.
Speaker 2: So I want to say this like as crystal player
as possible, because mar Lyles has come out in favor
of it. Terry Donovan was in favor of it. Now
she's saying not now. I am adamantly opposed to the
fourteen percent one point sales tax increase to the entire referendum.
And if you're listening to this, I encourage you to
vote no.
Speaker 1: Okay?
Speaker 2: And why where to start first? If you ever want
to go down sort of a descent into the mailstream
rabbit hole, go look at the structure of just how
CATS is run. Just to start with, who reports to who.
There's two different boards, some people sit on different ones.
One executive reports to the city council, but they can't
actually make changes to CATS. It's the most convoluted thing
I've seen, so difficult to get anything done there. Then
you sort of look at how well CATS is doing,
and this is just the public transportation side, and it
doesn't seem to be you know, getting the people to
the places they need. It seems very arbitrary where it's
laid half the people on there, I read, I can't
confirm the statistic. I should clarify that. I don't want
to speculate. I don't like the hyperfectly. But I read
that half the people riding caps are not paying their fares.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, well, we don't know that data because they
don't collect it. They make no effort to collect it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean even it's like ten percent, that seems
pretty wild to me. Second, we have poured so much
money into quote unquote infrastructure development or transportation however they
want to frame it, and if we end up completing
the project, it's delayed by years. It goes way over cost.
You know, the red line they're still dangling that carrot.
And to do this they want to charge you fourteen
percent more. It's going to start with two hundred and
forty dollars a year and probably in and based on promises.
If you read the plan, if you read the proposals,
there's really nothing concrete in there. They don't know how
it's going to be administered. In particular, the oversight board
is supposed to be independent. It's being chosen right now
before the initiative would even pass. And you know, someone
who didn't win the primary and city council is applying
to be on there says she's independent. I mean, the
whole thing is this giant insider deal. And then again
I'm against taxes and spending in general. But if you're
going to do it, if we must do it, I
would like to see it go to help people. But
instead this seems to be a big give out giveaway
to developers. The yes for met crowd. I mean they
have three point three million upfront and spending for this.
They're not spending three point three million because they want
to see people helped. They're spending three point three million
because they stand a profit a whole lot from this deal.
Speaker 1: Well, I mean, and the whole benefit of and this
was explain the argument when the Blue Line was built
was that it does serve as an economic development generator
along the fixed rail corridor in a way that bus
rapid transit, for example, does not. Bus stops are not permanent.
You could just pick them up and move them, and
so they don't generate economic development around them. But a
train station does, you know, putting more high density housing
along the corridor. And look, it did work according to
their projections, right that that was what they said was
going to you look at South End. That was what
was predicted and that was promised. So that's what and
they were right about that.
Speaker 2: No to an extent. I mean, it's very hard to
point to a singular cause of economic development, Charlotte. I mean,
we've been doing well as a city overall for the
last thirty years. Just building a train and putting high
density housing around it does not necessarily mean you're going
to see corresponding development. And I mean I have libertarian
reasons for this. I would argue that sort of centralized,
top down planning never works, and you're setting yourself up
for failure. But this proposal is particularly agreed just one.
I mean, prices are high, people are hurting, and it
doesn't look like it's going to be getting better, and
they're taking that money away. It's going to affect me,
but I'll be okay. It's the people who really can't
afford it that are going to, i mean, feel it
the most, and it's not going to help them. We're
talking even if every single projection the guests from met
crowd is making comes true, which I suspect none of
them are. But we're years away from seeing benefits on this.
We have problems right now. And then on the backdrop
of all that, like you mentioned the stadium deals earlier,
you know, we're throwing money away for billionaires little pet projects.
We've seen money squandered and wasted in lots of places.
We have behind the door deals to retiring sheriffs for
a city council that has really become sort of insular.
If their first premise for promoting this as as a
positive thing is trust us, that alone should be enough
for everyone to vote.
Speaker 1: Now you mentioned housing there. This is also a big issue,
the affordable housing situation. I talked with Terry Donovan about
this yesterday. How do you get more starter homes in Charlotte,
how do you and you say in your at your
website prosper Charlotte dot com that you'll ensure that housing
prices adjust at a reasonable rate relative to the market
and affordable housing exists for everyone in all income brackets.
How does a mayor do that? How would you do that?
Speaker 2: So this is uh, you know, you mentioned something I
think on the people texting you after yesterday where someone said,
why isn't there a debate? Yeah, there actually was a
debate Mary Lyles and I debated a few weeks ago
the Stevenson Tuesday forum.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2: I thought Harry was going to show up, but it
was just the two of us. But I mentioned that
because I had discussed some of these plans in terms
of affordable housing on there in detail and just bringing
it back up trying to stay consistent. But there are
some places where I've really looked into the codes, the rules,
the restrictions and what the state says, what Raley says,
and talk to council, and I think there are places
that we could really push some boundaries on restrictions and
open up the market. So what we have right now
is this City Council Approval Model UDO. What's allowed, what isn't.
It's incentivizing some high density stuff, but that's not bringing
value anywhere. It's not enticing people to move up, opening
up places that turn into starter homes. It's just creating
high density housing that's way more expensive. I want to
open up the market.
Speaker 1: I want to so how how do you do that?
Speaker 2: I want to remove the owning restriction. I really want
to remove z owning restrictions. I don't want people to
have to ask permission to build on their properties.
Speaker 1: Isn't that what the UDO is testing now? That the UDO,
and that's why you're seeing all of these large tracts
that were you know, one home on five six seven
acres or so, that are now getting torn down, sold off,
torn down and replaced with don't call them duplexes, their
duets or duets or whatever they are, right, But that's
Isn't that what we are seeing right now? And people
aren't happy about it.
Speaker 2: I think that the way the UDO is structured and
it is it is. I mean, if you want to
disagree with me, you know, I respect you on all ears,
but I would argue there's a very restrictive document overall,
and that's why we're getting instead of expansion, instead of
the market driving true market needs drive the homes that
are being built, you're just getting what the UDO seems
to tell people is what we should have. And that's
why you're seeing a lot of new apartment complexes, a
lot of stuff being crammed in. You know, values are
appearing to go up, but it's really just prices going up.
So people are trying to milk that for what it's worth,
but nothing's getting cheaper.
Speaker 1: Right, Well, I guess I tie that back to the
cost of building, right the reason why big.
Speaker 2: Part of it, without doubt, without a doubt.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And like a builder is not going to build
starter homes for you know, one percent profit because if
anything goes wrong, they have a string of bad weather
or something, they're bankrupt, they're done, and so they're Yeah,
so they've got to have a they've got to have
a cushion of a profit margin in there. And so
that's why you don't see a lot of that entry
level housing anymore. Whereas you can build high density, you
can get the density bonuses and such, you also have
to include you know, affordable housing components and that sort
of stuff for more, for more bonuses. And you know,
given that we are so short on housing, it seems
like you would want as much housing as possible to
be built as quickly as possible, which would then create
more supply.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I think it's better than nothing, obviously. Sure,
So I read a report last week that the US
is now in the worst housing cost relative to income
situation it's ever been in.
Speaker 1: I believe that.
Speaker 2: I verified that. I just saw that going around. But
there are two cities that have managed to avoid this problem,
and it's Austin and Minneapolis. And the reason they did
that is they never stopped building houses, right, and they
didn't ask what kind of houses they needed to build.
They just let the market beside. When you build high
end homes, then wealthy people move into those homes, leaving
their homes behind, and it resets the market ceiling. And
I hate It's not trickle down, it's just market development.
Speaker 1: Sure, it's like the early adopters of like any technology,
they're going to spend the most money upfront, and then
you know, it drives the prices down for everybody else exactly.
Speaker 2: But what happens is people move up to the next
tier of homes. That opens up real starter homes and
people can buy things that they can afford and you
have pride of home ownership. A lot of this high
density housing that we're being told is being built out,
A lot of it is rental, which is fine. I mean,
people need to rent too, but when they're just cramming
as many rental places into an area that's not able
to absorb it, especially in terms of infrastructure, roads, hospitals,
police schools. These things are all being tested, Traffics getting worse,
and it's from huge amounts of rental places being put
in and then it's not even so I hate the
term affordable housing. All housing is affordable to someone. What
we're talking about is housing that meets different income tiers,
and it's not even meeting that need because the market
is so just desperate for you know, literally places that
people can go live that prices are going way up. Yeah,
so you know, you could rent an apartment in the
outskirts of Charlotte for under one thousand dollars pretty easily.
It's ten years ago, and now I think I've read
that seventeen hundred is like the median apartment price in
Charlotte proper.
Speaker 1: Oh gosh, I would say it's probably more over two
grand that we haven't been able to find anything under
two thousand.
Speaker 2: For a two dollars.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's crazy. Yeah, Rob, I appreciate the time. A
reminder that early voting is underway. Rob Yates is the
Libertarian candidate for mayor. His website prosper Charlotte dot com.
Good luck on the campaign trail, Rob, and thanks for
your time. I appreciate it.
Speaker 2: Thank you so much, but it always a pleasure.
Speaker 1: Yes, sir, take care. That's Rob Yate. Here's a great idea.
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Alan says Rob is far and away the best choice
for mayor. Second is the Republican, and very distant third
is the current mayor. Violis Yeah, and look. I asked
Terry Donovan, the Republican, yesterday, about this. I am fully aware,
and Rob is fully aware. He's a Libertarian. He has
run for office before. He knows the demographics, you know,
the voter registration challenges. Shall we say that a libertarian
has in basically every race, but also the Republicans have
in any race really in Charlotte, particularly an at large
race as the mayor's race is, So we shall see.
But you know a third of the voters are unaffiliated,
so there's no party loyalty required there. I'm not in
city limits, so I can't even vote for any of
these mayoral candidates. So good luck to all Right, that'll
do it for this episode. Thank you so much for listening.
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