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Speaker 1: The the the the the the the the the the.

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Speaker 2: The the.

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Speaker 1: The the.

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Speaker 2: The the.

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Speaker 1: The the the the the the dout the b the

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the the the the the the the the the dout

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the the.

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Speaker 3: The Alright, welcome all you chad nerds, dorks, fast boys,

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slow boys. It is time time to reconnect with one

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of our good buddies, Base lit Analyzer. You know him

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from the Internet as the analyzer of literature par excellence.

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He has a channel that will be linked after the stream.

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You can't tag people in the live streams that in

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the titles anymore. I don't know why, but I will.

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Speaker 2: Add it later.

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Speaker 3: And we're gonna be getting into a couple films that

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I like.

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Speaker 4: I actually like both of them.

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Speaker 3: I see some people in the chat are already not

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fans of weapons. I thought both films were good, But

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it turns out that BLA has done a previous pretty

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extensive prisoner's analysis. I'm told I didn't actually know he

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did one. I also have added Prisoners to Esoteric Hollywood three.

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So it's a perfect subject for both of us to cover,

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and both of these films have a lot of similarities.

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But before we get to that, BLA, how you doing.

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Speaker 2: I'm doing well, man, Thanks for having me. I really

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got a lot to say about these I think that

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I was not a fan of weapons. I have some

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I don't know about Harsh, but I got some things

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to say about it. But I do think these two

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films go together and thematically. And Prisoners, I think is

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an extremely dark film, but it is really well done.

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The New York Times came out with a list of

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the top fifty films of the twenty first century. I

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didn't really agree with the list, so I came out

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with my own and I put Prisoners at number two.

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Speaker 4: Oh wow, list, So what was one?

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Speaker 2: One was The Passion of the Christ, which is not

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on any lists, and three, I think three was Children

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of Men. There have been a number of really great

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films that there will be blood. There's you know, a

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lot of the ones that you and I both covered

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are are on there. A lot of people forget. The

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weird thing about the list is a lot of people

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look at the list and they totally forget what films

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were made in the twenty first century, because there's been

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a real dearth of great films made of this century, right,

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and and a lot of the great films tend to

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be pretty timeless, but movies maybe the twentieth century, tend

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to be clearly put into a twentieth century category. And

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now we have in the last you know, twenty four

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to twenty five years, we have a whole bunch of

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films that are completely unlike anything I think from the

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twentieth century. And Prisoners is as a lot that it's

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sort of I don't know, you could place it in

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a framework of other films, but it is so dark

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and so new. There's something so new about it that

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I think it really should be placed there. Weapons. On

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the other hand, I mean, we're going to get into it, so,

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but I think that I think that the way the

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films were executed is completely different, and that says something

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about the way that films are made. Now.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, let's start with Prisoners, because it is, I agree,

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a better film for sure, and I am a fan

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of it. I remember watching it when it came out,

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I watched it again, and then I recently watched it

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before writing us start calay with three, and that's a

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perfect place to start. Just briefly about Villainieux. I've not

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seen every villain New film.

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Speaker 4: I don't like them.

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Speaker 1: All.

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Speaker 3: I don't like a lot of people like Arrival. I

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think it's a propaganda didn't care for it. Prisoners is

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great enemy. I'm a big fan of that. I think

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it's really good. It's a Caro, really good fan of that.

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I do like Blood Runner twenty forty nine. A lot

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of people don't like those. So before we get into it,

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just briefly, do you like or dislike those that I listed?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that this director, Denny Villeneuve.

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Speaker 3: Is well, of course Doune, I love Doune, but go ahead.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I think he's one of the great directors working today,

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and he's he's really improved. His movies tend to lead

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on to the next movie. You can you can see

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that they were all kind of leading up to Dune

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and Blade Runner twenty forty nine, of course was It's

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funny because I didn't know what to expect with that.

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I figured it would be good because his films prior

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to that were solid, solid, in a way that most

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directors don't tend to. He has the same sort of template,

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but he reinvents his movies as they go on, and

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I think that Blade Runner twenty forty nine really was

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like a launch pad for the rest of these movies,

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because before that his I mean, when you go back

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to his early films like Insnd's if you've seen that one,

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he was kind of an art house director. A lot

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of great filmmakers start off as art house directors, and

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then they go into his movies go into a real

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twenty first into the twenty first century, and into a

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kind of post apocalyptic or dystopian setting where we look

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at things with a brand new machine to them. I

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did not think that Arrival was Arrival was not in

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my top fifty. I thought Charlie Sheen's The Arrival was

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better than a Rival. I thought that it was like again,

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like you said, it was a total propaganda piece, and

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you know, it had Jiji and Pang, you know, saving

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the world at the end of the Gnostic Egg, and

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it was too I think the reason it was not good, though,

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aside from all that, was that it was too sentimental.

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There was too much sentimentality, and the film was like

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sacarine and saturated, and that plays to a section of

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the audience. I think that sort of relies on that

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sort of thing. But but the rest of the movies

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are hard. I mean, Sacario is like a sick movie.

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That movie is awesome.

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: And so later on and then Dune. I mean I

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I was very hesitant about Dune when I first sawt

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I actually saw it like four times before I really

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liked the film for some reason. And then I was

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I was sick one day and a friend of mine

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was like, dude, just if you're sick, just sit there

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and watch Dune. Just watch it all day. And I did,

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and it totally changed my mind about the movie. And

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we went to see into and there was a lady.

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There was a black lady in the front with a

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sleeping bag in the in the movie theater, and I

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was like, what is this? Is she living here or something?

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And then she like rolled up into the sleeping bag

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and she was all about she was like, was the

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Dune Worm.

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Speaker 3: I was gonna say, you just you found out that

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she was the worm? She was the the worm Emperor. Yeah, Alito,

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the worm Emperor.

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Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, Lisa, and I've got you. But she was

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yelling at in the theater and and I thought it

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was awesome. I thought it was really really cool. Uh.

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And so you know this this one, I remember seeing

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this one in the theater and this is one of

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his kind of earlier works, and I didn't really know

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what to expect going into I know, it was like

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Jake Jill and Hall. I like his movies, you know whatever.

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So I went to see it because the previews didn't

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really indicate what this movie was going to be about,

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and it was. So it's so much darker than you

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could have imagined walking into it for the first time.

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I mean, it really is pretty incredible. It's a pretty

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it plumbs the deaths.

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Speaker 3: So yeah, let's start with Prisoners and then we'll get

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to Weapons because Weapons is more recent, kind of more

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in the in the popular zeitgeist, because it was a

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success to the box office and critically speaking. So I

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remember going to see Prisoners, and just like you said,

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it was way darker than I expected. And I remember

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one of the reasons I went to see it was

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because at the time when it came out, Lord Voldemort

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mentioned it because he said, you.

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Speaker 2: Either got this new movie out.

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Speaker 4: And the villain is called Alice Jones. Okay, the villain

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in the movie is named after.

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Speaker 3: Me, folks, that's not accidental. And of course Paul Dano

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is playing a sort of villain named Alex Jones and

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I don't. I think it's interesting. I don't know if

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they really intentionally did that. It's possible, but that was

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the thing that made me think at the time, I

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need to go see this, and I think I'm thinking, okay,

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this is some sort of murder mystery. And as you noted,

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I'm sure most people in the audience have already seen this.

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It does end up being way darker. I think you

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could argue is it is a kind of a cult film,

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although the occult or the Satanic is not explicit in

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the film, because we end up thinking maybe they're just

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angry boomer atheists now who are going to teach everyone

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a lesson due to you know, the death of their

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of their their child. But then we have all these

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other elements that seem to come in, like mind control,

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a trauma based mind control, ritual abuse, the programming through mazes,

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and the use of mazes. So it definitely goes, as

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you said, in a very dark direction. I think a

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few people noticed, and I'm not sure what to make

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of this, but Jillenhall does wear a prominent free Masonic

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ring in the movie as a detective, So so yeah,

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going into it, you think that it's one thing, and

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I think everybody was kind of surprised.

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Speaker 4: There was also an.

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Speaker 3: Interesting theme very early on in the film between you know,

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Hugh Jackman being the father who loses the daughter and

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then of course almost loses his own life, but he's

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a prepper, and they make specific reference to various Christian

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sort of evangelical principles when he's taking his son hunting

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at the very beginning, and you go down and you

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see the basement and he's got all this prepper gear everywhere.

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When I saw that initially, I was like, oh, here

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we go. We're going to have you know, everybody who's

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a Christian is some sort of evil idiot, you know,

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fundamentalist into the world prepper. It didn't exactly go in

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that direction. There's a little bit of it though, because

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of course, when the daughter is shown gone and she's disappeared,

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this sort of sends Hugh Jackman into a rage and

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he becomes a kind of vigilante where he wants to

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exact his own justice, his own venge. He's going to

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you know, waterboard and torture Paul Dano until Alex Jones

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until he gets the information out that he wants. But

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the thing that I think rescued it from that anti

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sort of Christian perspective or anti fundamentals perspective was that, well,

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Huge Agmen is actually kind of right, right. It's almost

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like everybody who's kind of on the trail just kind

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of has a piece of the puzzle, and we as

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the audience are kind of on the journey of a maze,

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and so the movie is a kind of amaze and

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we're trying to figure it out, and we all kind

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of have these pieces of the puzzle. But as we

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notice with Jillen Hall, which we'll mention in a moment,

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sometimes the things that are sort of the the key

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elements of the puzzle or the things that put the puzzle.

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Speaker 4: Together, they're actually in our face the whole time.

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Speaker 3: And that's what Jillen Hall mentions, and I'll let you

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give your take.

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Speaker 2: Well, we have different characters who are lost in different

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sections of the maze and they don't don't know that

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they're in them, and we see this, you know, we

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see it on the medallion, a kind of talisman from

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the guy that.

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Speaker 3: They exactly well, he's a Catholic priest who has actually

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abused boys.

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Speaker 2: Well, the Catholic priest. So so there are different layers

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to the maze. It's and that's interesting because when Jillen

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All breaks into David Desmalchian's house and he sees the

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the whole house is covered in a maze. And and

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that's when I think the movie really conveys to the

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audience that there's no escaping the maze, that it's just

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a continuous maze until he finds the this book that

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says if you find this, then you can make your

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way out. So then we realize that there is one

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character who's made his way out of the maze, but

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it seems to be by design. Then we find ourselves

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in along the journey, like you were saying, with different

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pieces of it. We find that at one point Jillen

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Hall has nothing to do, so he, you know, he

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starts knocking on doors of all the offenders in the

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region and then he in the in the zone, and

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then he finds this Catholic priest. Catholic priest is seemingly

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in his own maze of guilt and alcoholism and creeperdom,

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and he's face lying, face down in his own house.

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And then we go behind the fridge into an abyss.

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We find this this other section of the house that's

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in a basement, which is mirroring the later outside prison

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under the car at the Demon Woman's house. But when

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we go down there, we see this guy tied up

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in a chair and we're wondering, who, wonder who is

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this and that so we learned that that guy is

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the guy in the picture who is the Boomerstock guy

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who has the medallion on with the Winnebago who went

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to the priest to offer his confession and says that

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he has on alived sixteen human people. We'll say, and

256
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so apparently there's there's even layers of creeps in the movie.

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There's the creep and then there's the creep who is

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even worse that he left tied up down in the

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biss and he tries to tell the cops this is

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what happened, but he's also lost it. He's also kind

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of catatonic, like Paul Danna's character is. We see we

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see characters who return to the crime scene. We have

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the character who returns to the vigil. We have characters

264
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who return to the house. We have red herrings. But

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all of what's interesting about this movie is that it's

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not like the normal. It's not like Sherlock Holmes the

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End detective story or a murder mystery where there are

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red herrings and we're supposed to think it's one person,

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and we we know the whole time it's not Hugh Jackman.

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But Jillenhall also seems to know that it's not him,

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but he still has to follow him, and by following him,

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he ends up learning the truth of who the character is.

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He's like you said, he's also Hugh Jackman's character is

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also right, because this sort of is where I think

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the movie represents different layers of how complex humanity is.

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Because the main the reaction I think that most people

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would have right away when their kid goes missing is

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exactly what Hugh Jackman does. He goes insane. And that's

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one thing I think that show. It's sort of lacking

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that we don't see that in news stories. A lot

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of times. We don't see people a lot of times.

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You know, you get the you get the dad of

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the person, and they come up and they're all calm,

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and they give a speech and it's been a day.

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In this one, Hugh Jackman is insane. He waits for

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Paul Dano to get released, and he attacks him physically

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in the parking lot. Then he goes and takes the

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law into his own hands because he thinks that nobody

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else is doing it. But then what what happens with

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that is that he ends up in his own prison

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and he realizes. I think that throughout the thing that

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that there's a scene where he gets on his knees

293
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and he prays, and he's saying the Lord's prayer, but

294
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he can't say forgive us those who trespass against us

295
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because he's he's locked up, because he's got this guy

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who's locked up in a waterboard closet. And the again,

297
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the irony is that he himself is going to end

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up in almost the same exact pay.

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Speaker 3: Each each character, in many ways is in some kind

300
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of a prison.

301
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Speaker 2: That's right, and I think that the only are The

302
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way that the audience is supposed to maneuver through the

303
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maze is obviously through the person of Jake Jillen Hall.

304
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And that's interesting because because jill and Hall, his character

305
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who's Detective Loki, which you know, the names are significant

306
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in this movie. He's a kind of uh, he's not

307
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a he's not a trickster, but he's kind of navigating

308
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between two worlds. And I think that's the deal with

309
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the occult symbolism and the you know, he's got a

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his neck tattoo, it's like it's not a black sun,

311
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it's not a sun wheel, but it's like a sun

312
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with a cross in it. And then he's got the

313
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Masonic ring. He's got runes tattooed on his Speaking of runes,

314
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he's got runes tattooed on his on his knuckles. And

315
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I think this shows that he's kind of a liminal character.

316
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He's like a psychopomp. He's he's marked, and he's coded

317
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with occult symbolism. So he's navigating between the Christian world

318
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of Hugh Jackman's family life and the satanic world of

319
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the bad people. But he's our guide through the through

320
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the dark spaces of the film.

321
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Speaker 4: Yeah, excellent point, excellent bringing.

322
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Speaker 3: I think also it's worth mentioning, as I put in

323
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a strikeli with three that and I don't know if

324
00:19:15,039 --> 00:19:18,039
this is the case, but the film also perhaps draws

325
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upon real events and crimes like the Franklin cover up. Yeah, well, yeah,

326
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the first thing reminding of was, you know, Nick Bryant's

327
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Franklin Scandal book, and of course there's a there was

328
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a connection between boys town h and Catholic charities and

329
00:19:36,400 --> 00:19:41,319
so forth that were being used to supply male street

330
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children to politicians and elites. Although this film doesn't directly

331
00:19:47,880 --> 00:19:52,359
implicate political figures, again, it just sort of bear bears

332
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similarities in parallels to some of these real cases. And

333
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I even mentioned the McMartin preschool case, which also I

334
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think could be perhaps an influence on the story, all

335
00:20:03,319 --> 00:20:05,519
of which is real, all which is very sused, especially

336
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when the FBI declassified the Martin case stuff, and a

337
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lot of what Ted Gunnerson had said was actually vindicated.

338
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That there were tunnels, which the media and everybody made

339
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fun of, so that was all crazy, satanic panic stuff.

340
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Speaker 4: But some of these.

341
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Speaker 3: Elements are actually are actually real, So it's important not

342
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to overcorrect and go in some other direction.

343
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Speaker 4: So I did want to ask you that.

344
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Speaker 3: Because I noted that you know Loki has the the Runes,

345
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he has these marks, and of course, obviously Loki from

346
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Nordic mythology, what was the significance that you give to

347
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Gillenhall's character being Loki the only significance.

348
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Speaker 2: I think is that one of the major things that

349
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sticks out to me is there's a scene when we

350
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see him from above and behind and he's got his

351
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hands on his head and he's sort of looking at

352
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pictures that he spread out out in front of him.

353
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So we're supposed to see what he's you know, our

354
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point of view is that we're seeing him, and we're

355
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seeing his point of view, and he when he puts

356
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his hands on his head, we see that his knuckles

357
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are tattooed with ruins and and and things from the

358
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UH and astrological symbols. But the one that really sticks

359
00:21:16,480 --> 00:21:19,799
out is he has an Odell run, which kind of

360
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looks like a like a like a ribbon, you know,

361
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that you would tie on your on your lapel. It's

362
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called the Odell run and it signifies heritage. And I

363
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think that this is also in political circles, can't I

364
00:21:35,279 --> 00:21:39,759
mean careful, but but his uh the rune signifies heritage,

365
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and that that that comes back into play when he's

366
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talking to the priest and he says that he grew

367
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you know, he spent three years in uh can Core

368
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a boy's home or something like that, so he knows

369
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what the priest is up to. He knows how to

370
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navigate the world. He knows he also it's it's funny

371
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because we see him in this dark place, but we

372
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also see that he has something to unlock the way

373
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that these people are. In other words, he when he's

374
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talking to the wife, when he when he first I

375
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think one of the key scenes is that when he

376
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goes into the house to first talk to the wife,

377
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and the wife asked him if he has children. He

378
00:22:17,119 --> 00:22:19,359
doesn't answer the question, but he stands up and he says,

379
00:22:19,359 --> 00:22:22,799
I'm gonna find your daughter, and that makes him some

380
00:22:22,839 --> 00:22:26,160
sort of charged character. He's a he's a marked care

381
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he's almost like a psychopomp because he knows how to

382
00:22:30,160 --> 00:22:32,599
navigate the world, but he also knows how to bring

383
00:22:32,640 --> 00:22:36,319
her out of it somehow, and we believe, we don't realize.

384
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I think till the end of the film that we

385
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believe that he's going to catch her. And this is

386
00:22:39,559 --> 00:22:43,200
so unlike reality. It seems to be truthful but not

387
00:22:43,319 --> 00:22:47,200
factual because the the you know, when when someone goes

388
00:22:47,240 --> 00:22:49,279
missing for twenty four hours, it's like the twenty four

389
00:22:49,279 --> 00:22:51,200
hours is up, then the seven days is up, and

390
00:22:51,359 --> 00:22:53,880
we're almost never gonna find him, but we believe that

391
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he's going to find him, and then he does.

392
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Speaker 1: Uh.

393
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Speaker 2: But it also means that Jake Jillanall I think is

394
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one of the even though he's sort of mediating between

395
00:23:02,680 --> 00:23:07,000
these two layers of consciousness or spiritual realms, he also

396
00:23:07,119 --> 00:23:09,559
is a character that I think we watched the film

397
00:23:09,599 --> 00:23:14,039
and we he's He's like the most truthful character. He's pure.

398
00:23:14,519 --> 00:23:17,359
He never sees he eats one time at the beginning

399
00:23:17,359 --> 00:23:19,480
of the film. We never see him sleep. He tells

400
00:23:19,519 --> 00:23:22,359
the boss, you know, you could have told me that

401
00:23:22,400 --> 00:23:23,720
you could have told me they were gonna be there,

402
00:23:23,759 --> 00:23:25,519
I would have stayed up all night. At the end

403
00:23:25,559 --> 00:23:27,880
of the film, he's still the case is closed and

404
00:23:27,920 --> 00:23:30,759
he's still up in the freezing in the cold. Afterwards,

405
00:23:31,119 --> 00:23:33,319
he's in the car. He's got blood on his face,

406
00:23:33,359 --> 00:23:37,079
covering one eye. He's you feel like he's blind. But

407
00:23:37,119 --> 00:23:38,920
he's still going to get the girl to the hospital.

408
00:23:39,319 --> 00:23:41,960
And he seems to be the only character which is

409
00:23:42,200 --> 00:23:45,599
different from Hugh Jackman, because Hugh Jackman's character becomes reckless

410
00:23:45,960 --> 00:23:48,759
and starts to break his own code. You can feel

411
00:23:48,799 --> 00:23:52,359
with Hugh Jackman that he knows that what he's doing

412
00:23:52,480 --> 00:23:55,319
is wrong, and that he ends up in an unchristian

413
00:23:55,400 --> 00:23:59,079
place and that he's forgotten that the Lord says vengeance's

414
00:23:59,119 --> 00:24:01,839
mine because he he wants to do anything to save

415
00:24:01,880 --> 00:24:06,160
his daughter, but he crosses the line at some point.

416
00:24:06,319 --> 00:24:08,920
And the weird thing about that is that he's actually

417
00:24:09,039 --> 00:24:14,000
right in a way, because the Alice Jones character, it

418
00:24:14,039 --> 00:24:15,960
is funny every time his name comes up in the thing.

419
00:24:16,440 --> 00:24:18,000
And I don't know if they knew. I don't know

420
00:24:18,000 --> 00:24:19,960
if they knew that because this is like twenty thirteen,

421
00:24:20,039 --> 00:24:21,839
so I don't know, but it seems like they would.

422
00:24:21,880 --> 00:24:23,279
It would be obvious that they would know what they

423
00:24:23,319 --> 00:24:27,839
were doing. But when he attacks Paul Dana's character in

424
00:24:27,839 --> 00:24:31,799
the parking lot, he's he tells him, you know, he

425
00:24:31,920 --> 00:24:34,160
was there with the girls. Later on he's singing the

426
00:24:34,200 --> 00:24:37,680
Batman song. He finally ends up telling him secrets from

427
00:24:37,720 --> 00:24:40,839
his waterboarding closet, and he knows where they are, but

428
00:24:40,920 --> 00:24:44,279
it took him that far to get to to get

429
00:24:44,319 --> 00:24:48,599
something out of him, And then you're like, well, this

430
00:24:48,680 --> 00:24:50,680
guy's also locked in some sort of person if he's

431
00:24:50,720 --> 00:24:53,319
a Johnny Gosh character, which we find out he was

432
00:24:53,359 --> 00:24:55,720
taken from his home when he was little. He gets

433
00:24:55,759 --> 00:24:58,079
reunited with his mother at the end, but he's also

434
00:24:58,240 --> 00:25:01,440
completely fractured in dissociated. He doesn't even seem to know

435
00:25:01,440 --> 00:25:08,519
where he is, but he also holds He also holds

436
00:25:08,559 --> 00:25:10,839
he's not just a victim in the movie Great. He

437
00:25:10,920 --> 00:25:14,319
is a grown man and he does make decisions in

438
00:25:14,400 --> 00:25:17,200
the film, even though it seems like he's completely out

439
00:25:17,200 --> 00:25:19,319
of his mind. So he may not face some sort

440
00:25:19,359 --> 00:25:22,640
of criminal justice, but he seems to face a divine

441
00:25:22,799 --> 00:25:25,799
justice in the film, which seems to work through Hugh Jackman.

442
00:25:26,160 --> 00:25:31,240
Speaker 3: Well, yeah, we noticed that the Dano character. When Jackman

443
00:25:31,319 --> 00:25:35,559
eventually walls him up in that abandoned place and makes

444
00:25:35,640 --> 00:25:37,920
just a tiny hole and he's able to use the

445
00:25:38,000 --> 00:25:41,000
shower and turn the water up and all that, it's

446
00:25:41,039 --> 00:25:48,640
almost as if Dano returning to the type of underground

447
00:25:48,759 --> 00:25:52,319
darkness abyss place which he had originally been in, as

448
00:25:52,359 --> 00:25:54,960
all the kids that were taken were put into this

449
00:25:55,319 --> 00:25:59,960
labyrinth scenario. This triggers him to kind of eventually maybe

450
00:26:00,160 --> 00:26:03,799
come back to his actual core personality where he remembers

451
00:26:04,240 --> 00:26:08,759
the whole thing, and at one point he actually gives

452
00:26:08,839 --> 00:26:12,839
the information to Hugh Jackman about you know what's actually

453
00:26:12,920 --> 00:26:14,640
going on. I'm not saying it was good or right.

454
00:26:14,680 --> 00:26:16,240
I'm just saying that this seems to be what's going

455
00:26:16,240 --> 00:26:17,839
on is that he kind of returns to that place

456
00:26:17,960 --> 00:26:20,480
of the cave or the labyrinth or the abyss or

457
00:26:20,519 --> 00:26:23,359
what the underworld, which is where we find out ultimately

458
00:26:23,359 --> 00:26:26,799
the kids end up being put in this underground place

459
00:26:27,039 --> 00:26:31,160
to especially my control them or trauma based my control them,

460
00:26:31,200 --> 00:26:34,599
to make them into these sort of controlled operatives of

461
00:26:34,640 --> 00:26:37,960
these two evil hippies exippies.

462
00:26:38,240 --> 00:26:42,119
Speaker 2: Yeah, there's there's also a real there's a moral ambiguity

463
00:26:42,160 --> 00:26:46,440
that occurs when they take off the hood and they

464
00:26:46,480 --> 00:26:48,279
see what they've done to this character. I mean they

465
00:26:48,400 --> 00:26:52,960
really you know, you understand what is what Hugh Jackline's

466
00:26:53,039 --> 00:26:56,319
character is doing, but they've also crossed the line into

467
00:26:56,359 --> 00:27:00,400
something that seems to be working this they're actually working

468
00:27:00,519 --> 00:27:05,240
the very thing that the Satanic Lady intended, which is

469
00:27:05,799 --> 00:27:06,440
she says at.

470
00:27:06,359 --> 00:27:08,799
Speaker 3: The end of the key to act that way and

471
00:27:08,839 --> 00:27:11,279
to realize, just in the rage, to realize there's not

472
00:27:11,319 --> 00:27:12,440
a God.

473
00:27:12,680 --> 00:27:16,960
Speaker 2: Yes, and the the the key line for the folks

474
00:27:17,000 --> 00:27:20,160
at home is when we find out why all this occurred,

475
00:27:20,160 --> 00:27:22,680
and it's at the end of the movie, when Melissa Leo,

476
00:27:22,839 --> 00:27:26,359
the Satanic lady, says that their war is a war

477
00:27:26,480 --> 00:27:29,000
against God, and she says that their most this is

478
00:27:29,039 --> 00:27:34,480
real Miltonian satanic level stuff. She says that their purpose

479
00:27:34,759 --> 00:27:40,000
was to break people's faith, so it's specifically aimed at

480
00:27:40,000 --> 00:27:43,240
people like Hugh Jackman, and and she actually succeeds. For

481
00:27:43,319 --> 00:27:47,200
most of the film, she doesn't fully succeed, but in

482
00:27:47,240 --> 00:27:49,839
fact she succeeds to the point where she seems to

483
00:27:49,880 --> 00:27:52,039
break him, but he's but in the midst of prayer,

484
00:27:52,359 --> 00:27:55,000
and then later on he subverts his faith to return

485
00:27:55,079 --> 00:27:59,000
to her house as a carpenter by the way to say, oh,

486
00:27:59,079 --> 00:28:01,200
I'm here to do an act penance and charity, but

487
00:28:01,240 --> 00:28:03,759
it's simply to find his daughter. So there's a there's

488
00:28:03,799 --> 00:28:06,680
like a real there are layers of nuance and ambiguity

489
00:28:06,759 --> 00:28:09,680
with with what's happening. I think one of the other

490
00:28:09,759 --> 00:28:13,759
key scenes is when Terrence Howard's wife they bring her

491
00:28:13,839 --> 00:28:16,599
to see what's happened. She sees this man they've made

492
00:28:16,640 --> 00:28:20,000
into a hell bound mutant. I mean, he's just totally broken,

493
00:28:20,680 --> 00:28:25,799
and her response is like keep going. Yeah, she she's

494
00:28:25,839 --> 00:28:29,000
horrified at first, but she says basically keep going. She

495
00:28:29,000 --> 00:28:31,519
she kind of I mean Terrence Howard has been helping

496
00:28:31,599 --> 00:28:34,559
Hugh Jackman with the thing, but she provides an impetus

497
00:28:34,640 --> 00:28:36,559
to keep going and keep doing what they're doing, which

498
00:28:36,559 --> 00:28:39,000
is which is another layer. I think in the movie

499
00:28:39,000 --> 00:28:42,079
that is unforeseen and totally crazy. We never see that

500
00:28:42,160 --> 00:28:46,240
in movies. In fact, it goes so far that that

501
00:28:46,480 --> 00:28:50,160
Hugh Jackman ends up leaving the hospital running away. There's

502
00:28:50,200 --> 00:28:53,359
all sorts of things. There's the alcoholism right that that.

503
00:28:53,680 --> 00:28:57,200
There's the house. There's this father had committed suicide. There's

504
00:28:58,039 --> 00:29:00,440
there's the the relationship with his son. He ends up

505
00:29:00,440 --> 00:29:02,559
turning on his son in a way. He tells his son,

506
00:29:02,559 --> 00:29:03,759
you're gonna be the man of the house, but then

507
00:29:03,799 --> 00:29:06,160
he turns on him. And you notice that when that happens,

508
00:29:06,160 --> 00:29:08,400
when he turns out of the house, he knocks over

509
00:29:08,440 --> 00:29:10,720
the girl's dollhouse as if their whole house has been

510
00:29:11,200 --> 00:29:15,240
UH toppled toppled over. There's the violation of the house

511
00:29:15,240 --> 00:29:17,960
where the guy sneaks into the houses UH. In this

512
00:29:18,079 --> 00:29:21,759
act of UH, he's trying to recreate the events that

513
00:29:21,799 --> 00:29:24,160
have happened to him. There are the snakes and the serpents,

514
00:29:24,160 --> 00:29:27,759
that crawl over everybody. There's the relationship with Jake Jalen

515
00:29:27,759 --> 00:29:30,000
Hall between his boss where you know, this is a

516
00:29:30,079 --> 00:29:32,440
unique movie again because we always have the boss who's like,

517
00:29:32,480 --> 00:29:36,759
you know, you're you're five days from retirement, or who's like, uh,

518
00:29:37,240 --> 00:29:39,039
you know, you can't keep doing this, you're breaking theles,

519
00:29:39,039 --> 00:29:41,319
and this one he tells his boss, fuck you, I'm

520
00:29:41,319 --> 00:29:42,680
gonna you know, you should have done this, and I'm

521
00:29:42,680 --> 00:29:44,559
gonna keep doing what I'm doing. In the boss was like, okay,

522
00:29:45,039 --> 00:29:50,039
I trust you, keep going with it. So, uh yeah,

523
00:29:50,079 --> 00:29:53,359
it's really fantastic. I mean, it's so long. It doesn't

524
00:29:53,359 --> 00:29:55,079
seem like it would be so long like that. How

525
00:29:55,200 --> 00:29:57,240
how are they going to catch these these kids and

526
00:29:57,279 --> 00:30:00,359
they the fact that one of them runs away and

527
00:30:00,440 --> 00:30:02,759
get saved by the way at the end of the movie,

528
00:30:02,880 --> 00:30:08,440
which mirrors the which mirrors the Desmalcian character who had

529
00:30:08,519 --> 00:30:11,799
run away and who is now recreating his life in

530
00:30:11,880 --> 00:30:15,880
this in this cult is another thing that we just

531
00:30:15,920 --> 00:30:17,160
don't see in films.

532
00:30:18,119 --> 00:30:18,279
Speaker 4: Yeah.

533
00:30:18,319 --> 00:30:25,039
Speaker 3: I think also it's worth mentioning labyrinths and labyrinth y symbology.

534
00:30:25,720 --> 00:30:29,880
In the ancient Egyptian world, the labyrinth was an image

535
00:30:29,880 --> 00:30:33,680
of the Underworld. The film has a lot of layers

536
00:30:34,039 --> 00:30:36,960
like that as well, as you mentioned, with different labyrinths,

537
00:30:36,960 --> 00:30:39,920
and as you get to one point of the labyrinth,

538
00:30:40,000 --> 00:30:41,839
you think you figured it out, and there's actually another layer,

539
00:30:41,839 --> 00:30:45,400
another level of you know, this concentric circles getting to

540
00:30:45,440 --> 00:30:49,880
the center of the labyrinth. Greek mythology, you know, the subconscious,

541
00:30:49,880 --> 00:30:50,680
the unconscious, the.

542
00:30:50,640 --> 00:30:51,519
Speaker 4: Darkn man of the id.

543
00:30:52,359 --> 00:30:56,480
Speaker 3: The Middle Ages labyrinth symbology dealt with the idea that

544
00:30:56,519 --> 00:30:59,119
this whole life was a maze that we're going through

545
00:30:59,160 --> 00:31:01,279
to get to the aft life. And so the maze

546
00:31:01,319 --> 00:31:04,920
is a lot of neoplatonic images and symbols, taking us

547
00:31:04,960 --> 00:31:08,079
back to the one to utilize some of the neoplatonic

548
00:31:09,039 --> 00:31:12,599
philosophy of medieval maze theology, and then we get to

549
00:31:13,799 --> 00:31:17,200
more modern and sort of esoteric, hermatic, occultic, or even

550
00:31:17,200 --> 00:31:21,440
satanic uses of it, which here could apply, as we've

551
00:31:21,480 --> 00:31:26,119
said already, to various characters being imprisoned. They themselves are

552
00:31:26,160 --> 00:31:29,000
prisoners within this maze, and we are also on the journey,

553
00:31:29,000 --> 00:31:33,880
as you said with Jillen Hall, just to solve it,

554
00:31:34,319 --> 00:31:39,079
and the overall goal that this is, I think the

555
00:31:39,119 --> 00:31:44,000
big twist that nobody expected was these elderly hippies who

556
00:31:44,000 --> 00:31:47,119
had undergone I think they lost their son or something,

557
00:31:48,359 --> 00:31:50,559
but at one point they seem to have been sort

558
00:31:50,559 --> 00:31:53,920
of Jesus freak people, almost like maybe they were Jesus.

559
00:31:53,960 --> 00:31:56,440
You know, the Jesus Revolution in the nineteen sixties, the

560
00:31:56,519 --> 00:32:00,279
Jesus People of California, who many of these hippies had

561
00:32:00,279 --> 00:32:05,359
converted through evangelical movements, is actually the origin of the

562
00:32:05,359 --> 00:32:10,200
Calvary Chapel denomination, the vineyard movements. They all come out

563
00:32:10,200 --> 00:32:14,039
of the nineteen sixties and seventies Jesus People's stuff, and

564
00:32:14,079 --> 00:32:16,160
so we get the impression that maybe even these people

565
00:32:16,160 --> 00:32:19,400
were of that ilk and then they decided they turned

566
00:32:19,480 --> 00:32:22,359
a vendetta against God after that they had had something

567
00:32:22,400 --> 00:32:26,319
bad happened to their child and set them on this

568
00:32:27,240 --> 00:32:33,119
course to wake up everyone else that there's no God,

569
00:32:33,200 --> 00:32:38,319
which again really kind of only suggests Satanism to me,

570
00:32:38,480 --> 00:32:41,000
because if you're an atheist and you've come to the

571
00:32:41,000 --> 00:32:45,119
conclusion there's no God and nothing matters, who cares about

572
00:32:45,119 --> 00:32:47,599
a quest? Why do you care about a quest? You know,

573
00:32:47,680 --> 00:32:51,480
to convince everyone else. You're not going to convince everyone else, right, So,

574
00:32:51,519 --> 00:32:55,319
a very serious, committed atheist would just assume that everybody's

575
00:32:55,400 --> 00:32:58,000
everybody's everyone's dumb, and they're going to believe their delusions.

576
00:32:57,799 --> 00:33:02,799
There's no point or purpose really in exercising this vendetta

577
00:33:03,039 --> 00:33:05,680
unless there's something that you think you're getting out of it.

578
00:33:07,240 --> 00:33:10,319
But here they're not getting famous. They're not doing anything

579
00:33:10,400 --> 00:33:16,440
other than causing very heinous traumatic actions to happen, as quote,

580
00:33:16,440 --> 00:33:20,240
a war against God, which again suggests more of a

581
00:33:20,279 --> 00:33:21,519
satanic approach.

582
00:33:21,599 --> 00:33:22,680
Speaker 4: And even though the film.

583
00:33:22,519 --> 00:33:26,640
Speaker 3: Doesn't explicitly mention the satanic, they do when they when

584
00:33:26,680 --> 00:33:29,759
they go to what was the guy's name that the

585
00:33:29,839 --> 00:33:36,759
guys uh that has the this recreating his whole background Bob. Yeah.

586
00:33:37,039 --> 00:33:40,359
When they go to his his sort of hovel that

587
00:33:40,440 --> 00:33:44,799
he's living in, Uh, they they find books and texts

588
00:33:44,839 --> 00:33:47,599
that actually are shown on screen that discuss you know,

589
00:33:47,680 --> 00:33:49,880
like I forget the exact term, I put it.

590
00:33:49,880 --> 00:33:52,640
Speaker 2: In the in My Visible Man, The Invisible Man.

591
00:33:52,880 --> 00:33:55,240
Speaker 3: Yeah, and there's I think there's something also that's shown

592
00:33:55,240 --> 00:33:59,440
that mentions like mind control or trauma or something like that.

593
00:34:00,599 --> 00:34:05,119
Speaker 2: Yeah. The detective has read the book Jake Killenhall, and

594
00:34:05,200 --> 00:34:07,119
he says it involves mind control and trauma.

595
00:34:08,079 --> 00:34:08,639
Speaker 4: Yeah.

596
00:34:08,679 --> 00:34:13,039
Speaker 3: And again you know, we think that this is going

597
00:34:13,079 --> 00:34:16,559
in one direction and it just like amazed, Oh, we

598
00:34:16,559 --> 00:34:19,119
actually get turned around in the other direction. And that

599
00:34:19,320 --> 00:34:22,440
was a good foil, right, because we were thinking, oh,

600
00:34:22,519 --> 00:34:25,280
this is the guy, you know, he's the weird creeper,

601
00:34:26,519 --> 00:34:28,880
but we're taken out of that into other directions. I

602
00:34:29,000 --> 00:34:31,880
think it's I think it's interesting that it mentions in

603
00:34:31,920 --> 00:34:36,199
the context of the mind control and all that, the

604
00:34:36,199 --> 00:34:41,599
cocktail of I forget what it was like LSD and academy.

605
00:34:41,679 --> 00:34:44,159
Speaker 4: Yeah, so they actually talk about the.

606
00:34:44,119 --> 00:34:47,320
Speaker 3: Cocktail that's used, which actually, again, when you talk about

607
00:34:47,400 --> 00:34:50,360
LSD and that kind of stuff, you're talking about CIA

608
00:34:50,679 --> 00:34:54,400
based mind control, you're talking about things like the Finders. Again,

609
00:34:54,840 --> 00:34:58,599
this might also bear a lot of similarities to the Finder's.

610
00:34:58,159 --> 00:35:00,159
Speaker 4: Case as well, if you're from ELI.

611
00:35:00,320 --> 00:35:04,719
Speaker 2: With that. The the black goo drink that they make

612
00:35:04,760 --> 00:35:07,440
them drink reminded me of the scene where Nick Cage

613
00:35:07,599 --> 00:35:10,440
ends up with the LSD maker and Mandy. It was

614
00:35:10,480 --> 00:35:15,159
like the same exact you know, hyper LSD drink, right,

615
00:35:15,400 --> 00:35:19,639
And and I see the movie as I didn't see

616
00:35:19,679 --> 00:35:24,559
it as as atheistic so much as theistic satanism.

617
00:35:24,800 --> 00:35:25,880
Speaker 4: Yeah that's what I'm saying.

618
00:35:26,559 --> 00:35:28,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, they don't mention it in the movie, but it

619
00:35:28,440 --> 00:35:32,280
has all the hallmarks of of I mean, it's really

620
00:35:32,360 --> 00:35:37,880
it's it's Miltonian, it's Dante and uh one, you know,

621
00:35:38,119 --> 00:35:42,440
it's I'm stealing this. But the difference between but C. S.

622
00:35:42,519 --> 00:35:45,599
Lewis says that the difference between Dante's Inferno and T. S.

623
00:35:45,639 --> 00:35:50,239
Elliott's Wasteland is that the wasteland is where you trudge

624
00:35:50,280 --> 00:35:52,880
through the wasteland, but it's truly a wasteland. It's a wasteland.

625
00:35:52,920 --> 00:35:56,679
Getting through it, it becomes ugly, whereas going down the

626
00:35:56,760 --> 00:36:00,159
Nine Circles, crossing the Abyss into the Ninth Circle in

627
00:36:00,280 --> 00:36:04,079
Dante is beauty. It's it's hellish, but there's a kind

628
00:36:04,079 --> 00:36:06,800
of a terrible beauty to it. And two of the

629
00:36:06,880 --> 00:36:09,719
characters that he comes across in the Inferno are Minos

630
00:36:09,800 --> 00:36:12,719
and the Minotaur. And it's worth mentioning that the minotaur

631
00:36:13,039 --> 00:36:15,559
is at the center of the maze and his fed children,

632
00:36:15,679 --> 00:36:18,639
so he doesn't kill Minos. And this this bring this

633
00:36:18,679 --> 00:36:21,960
brings to mind the Shining for me, because Jack is

634
00:36:22,039 --> 00:36:23,840
lost in the maze at the end of the Shining

635
00:36:24,800 --> 00:36:27,559
and he is trying to you know, DNA. He's trying

636
00:36:27,559 --> 00:36:30,599
to trap Danny in the maze. He becomes a beast character.

637
00:36:30,960 --> 00:36:32,960
And the interesting thing about this movie is that the

638
00:36:32,960 --> 00:36:37,079
beasts are all hidden, and it has all the hallmarks

639
00:36:37,119 --> 00:36:41,960
of Book one of Paradise Lost, because Satan says at

640
00:36:42,000 --> 00:36:44,440
the beginning of the book that you know, the reason

641
00:36:44,480 --> 00:36:47,679
the serpent makes its way into Creation is because Satan

642
00:36:47,800 --> 00:36:51,000
hears about this thing called creation above them after the

643
00:36:51,039 --> 00:36:53,599
war and heaven, and so he makes his way up

644
00:36:53,679 --> 00:36:57,079
as the serpent to try and invert, subvert and pervert

645
00:36:57,079 --> 00:36:59,480
God's creation any way they can. They're gonna heap sin

646
00:36:59,599 --> 00:37:02,639
upon them forever by doing this. And the person who

647
00:37:02,719 --> 00:37:06,239
is his confidant is beels Above. And in the scene

648
00:37:06,239 --> 00:37:08,599
where he goes into Bob's house and it's covered in

649
00:37:09,039 --> 00:37:12,760
mazes everywhere, he uncovers these snakes, black snakes all over

650
00:37:12,800 --> 00:37:15,880
the house, and he finds a beels Above pigs head

651
00:37:15,960 --> 00:37:18,000
in the sink. So there are flies, the Lord of

652
00:37:18,000 --> 00:37:20,880
the flies. There are flies everywhere. And like you said,

653
00:37:20,920 --> 00:37:25,079
you know, it's sort of a red herring in the

654
00:37:25,119 --> 00:37:28,800
sense that we think that he has the children's clothes

655
00:37:28,800 --> 00:37:31,559
and accoutrama, and instead it ends up that that's what

656
00:37:31,599 --> 00:37:33,480
he was doing breaking into the house so he can

657
00:37:33,519 --> 00:37:36,360
recreate this. Also, they dig up the yard and they

658
00:37:36,360 --> 00:37:39,559
find mannequins with their faces caved in real satanic shit,

659
00:37:40,119 --> 00:37:42,920
which is obviously supposed to mimic what he saw in

660
00:37:43,000 --> 00:37:47,159
real life when they were in this basement of this house.

661
00:37:47,480 --> 00:37:49,760
The other thing is that, unlike a lot of other

662
00:37:49,800 --> 00:37:54,639
movies where we have this sort of satanic ambiance atmosphere,

663
00:37:54,679 --> 00:37:56,920
like eyes Wide shut or something, where there's like a

664
00:37:57,000 --> 00:37:59,000
sheen to it, and we have these elites and they're

665
00:37:59,039 --> 00:38:01,880
all rich, this is full of working class people in

666
00:38:02,280 --> 00:38:05,639
rural Pennsylvania. It's all rainy, it's dark, it's gritty the

667
00:38:05,679 --> 00:38:09,239
whole time. And these are like normal, normal, steaming people.

668
00:38:09,320 --> 00:38:14,079
So the war, the the satanic war that they're waging

669
00:38:14,119 --> 00:38:17,920
on these normal people, seems to be magnified in that sense.

670
00:38:17,960 --> 00:38:21,119
I think they don't they're not even around to see

671
00:38:21,159 --> 00:38:23,480
what the harm that they've caused with these people.

672
00:38:23,719 --> 00:38:26,119
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think this is a grim's fairy tale kind

673
00:38:26,159 --> 00:38:29,239
of element going on with actually with both films weapons

674
00:38:29,239 --> 00:38:34,719
and with this because you have this friendly, kindly seeming

675
00:38:34,760 --> 00:38:38,199
grandmother character who's actually the old witch that you know

676
00:38:38,239 --> 00:38:40,599
in the story, like she's throwing the little kids in

677
00:38:40,639 --> 00:38:44,679
the oven. We'll get a similar type of approach to

678
00:38:45,199 --> 00:38:48,480
this sort of middle class spiritual warfare that's going on

679
00:38:48,599 --> 00:38:51,920
in Middle America in Weapons. And like you said, in

680
00:38:51,960 --> 00:38:55,559
both films, we don't have you know, high power billionaires

681
00:38:55,599 --> 00:39:00,639
that Tom Coomb is encountering in states with the Mask.

682
00:39:00,800 --> 00:39:04,440
We have working class people, grandmas. And so that's another

683
00:39:04,519 --> 00:39:06,960
element which I think makes it maybe even creepier in

684
00:39:07,000 --> 00:39:10,519
both films is because we have the presence and power

685
00:39:10,599 --> 00:39:15,039
of a kind of witchcraft you could say, at the local, Midwest,

686
00:39:15,119 --> 00:39:19,920
small town level, not at you know, Bill Harford's upstate

687
00:39:20,039 --> 00:39:22,599
New York invitation only elite party.

688
00:39:23,360 --> 00:39:28,920
Speaker 2: Yeah. Instead of back mask Joscelyn Pook backwards orthodox chanting

689
00:39:29,039 --> 00:39:32,559
in a you know, insane Crowley and sex ceremony, we

690
00:39:32,639 --> 00:39:38,440
get Jesus songs in a Winnebago from a mind altered,

691
00:39:38,800 --> 00:39:42,159
mind shattered Johnny Gosh character each Alex John's, which is crazy.

692
00:39:43,360 --> 00:39:45,760
The one one of the differences between these two films

693
00:39:46,440 --> 00:39:48,840
is that I don't think it's necessarily a strength for

694
00:39:48,920 --> 00:39:51,840
movies to go for realism. It's not it's not realism

695
00:39:52,000 --> 00:39:56,079
or facts that sort of convey or you know, truth

696
00:39:56,199 --> 00:39:59,639
or make for a more truthful movie experience. But I

697
00:39:59,639 --> 00:40:04,800
think the there is something about the logistics of human life.

698
00:40:05,000 --> 00:40:08,159
And one thing I like about Prisoners is that it

699
00:40:08,199 --> 00:40:11,840
happens on Thanksgiving Day, we see Christmas lights come out.

700
00:40:11,880 --> 00:40:14,360
It all is linear. It takes place in a we

701
00:40:14,440 --> 00:40:17,039
have day to day suffering. When we see the woman

702
00:40:17,679 --> 00:40:21,760
in bed, you know, all knocked out on xanax or whatever,

703
00:40:22,519 --> 00:40:24,559
we know that she's been in bed the whole time,

704
00:40:24,960 --> 00:40:27,519
like she hasn't gotten up, which she finally gets up

705
00:40:27,559 --> 00:40:30,320
it's been three days or whatever. In Weapons, I think

706
00:40:30,639 --> 00:40:33,920
what's weird is that when the children disappear and we

707
00:40:33,960 --> 00:40:36,800
start to see again, we see another carpenter sort of figure.

708
00:40:36,800 --> 00:40:40,119
We see Josh Brolin as this as a contractor. We

709
00:40:40,159 --> 00:40:43,079
see him go to this broken house again. The house.

710
00:40:43,239 --> 00:40:46,880
The house in films, in literature always serves as an

711
00:40:47,320 --> 00:40:51,719
exterior model of the character's inner psyche and how together

712
00:40:51,800 --> 00:40:54,920
they are. But it's like there's a scene where he's

713
00:40:54,920 --> 00:40:56,800
sitting there and his wife comes in. He know's asleep

714
00:40:56,840 --> 00:41:00,280
in his kids bed, the kid's gone, he's pining for kid.

715
00:41:00,320 --> 00:41:01,719
His wife comes in and goes, I'm going to I'm

716
00:41:01,719 --> 00:41:04,119
going to work, and he's like okay, and he gets

717
00:41:04,199 --> 00:41:06,000
up and he goes to work. And it makes you wonder.

718
00:41:06,039 --> 00:41:08,679
It's like, well, you still have to live your normal life.

719
00:41:08,679 --> 00:41:10,480
You still have to keep living. You probably, you know,

720
00:41:10,519 --> 00:41:12,320
you can only be away from work for so long.

721
00:41:12,360 --> 00:41:15,760
You you gotta still pay the bills. But what does

722
00:41:15,800 --> 00:41:18,000
it look like when you do that? And it seems

723
00:41:18,039 --> 00:41:21,280
that Josh Brolin does start playing detective like the other

724
00:41:21,360 --> 00:41:25,519
characters do, but there seems to be something lost, almost

725
00:41:25,599 --> 00:41:28,480
as if the characters are cold. They don't have the

726
00:41:28,559 --> 00:41:31,800
kind of burning fire to find the truth that they

727
00:41:31,840 --> 00:41:36,039
do in Prisoners. But maybe that speaks to the war

728
00:41:36,159 --> 00:41:38,960
that the witch is making on people, and and you know,

729
00:41:39,199 --> 00:41:42,280
or the way modern life, for contemporary life is cold.

730
00:41:42,360 --> 00:41:44,280
I'm not sure, but that one bothered me. That bothered

731
00:41:44,320 --> 00:41:48,599
me in the movie. It bothered me that the you know,

732
00:41:48,679 --> 00:41:50,840
of course, the teacher lady goes straight to the liquor

733
00:41:50,840 --> 00:41:52,599
store and she's buying liquor and then she goes in

734
00:41:52,679 --> 00:41:55,559
the house. And but it bothered me, like, like how

735
00:41:56,119 --> 00:41:58,599
there's a knock on her door and she's like, who's

736
00:41:58,679 --> 00:42:01,039
knocking at the door. She walks outside, and she walks

737
00:42:01,039 --> 00:42:02,719
through the door and walks all the way to the

738
00:42:02,719 --> 00:42:04,719
street without looking to the left and right, like somebody

739
00:42:04,719 --> 00:42:09,679
could come into the house. Those sorts of logistical things

740
00:42:09,679 --> 00:42:12,199
in movies really bother me. We don't have that in Prisoners,

741
00:42:12,199 --> 00:42:15,039
but we do have it in Weapons. But I thought Weapons,

742
00:42:16,519 --> 00:42:20,840
you know, I thought Weapons was a much darker and

743
00:42:20,880 --> 00:42:27,280
away movie because both movies involve children. It always bothers

744
00:42:27,320 --> 00:42:30,400
me in movies when you have characters who are playing children,

745
00:42:30,400 --> 00:42:33,199
and they are children, so you have to cast children

746
00:42:33,239 --> 00:42:35,440
to play the children. But the only thing that the

747
00:42:35,519 --> 00:42:39,000
children go through the actors and Prisoners is like the

748
00:42:39,000 --> 00:42:40,920
little girl comes in on the wheelchair at the end,

749
00:42:41,159 --> 00:42:43,559
and she kind of says by and leaves, and that's

750
00:42:44,000 --> 00:42:46,519
we don't really see them much. The rest is about

751
00:42:46,519 --> 00:42:49,079
how people deal with the fact they're gone. But in Weapons,

752
00:42:49,119 --> 00:42:52,239
we continuously see the children. I mean, you have children

753
00:42:52,280 --> 00:42:56,000
locked in this basement, You have children chasing the witch

754
00:42:56,000 --> 00:42:58,079
at the end, and then they use the children to

755
00:42:58,199 --> 00:43:00,000
tear the witch apart at the end of the film.

756
00:43:00,079 --> 00:43:01,679
I found that incredibly disconcerted.

757
00:43:02,519 --> 00:43:06,800
Speaker 3: Well, uh yeah, let's move on then to Weapons, because

758
00:43:08,800 --> 00:43:12,559
I think that's the essence of Prisoners. Appreciate your your

759
00:43:12,559 --> 00:43:15,679
take on that, and I also appreciate when people disagree

760
00:43:15,719 --> 00:43:19,440
and we have differences of takes on films before we

761
00:43:19,519 --> 00:43:22,239
get to weapons. I would say that really, in the

762
00:43:22,320 --> 00:43:25,199
last couple of years, I've not actually seen a whole

763
00:43:25,199 --> 00:43:26,679
lot of films that I thought were that great. Of

764
00:43:26,679 --> 00:43:29,960
course BLA and I did. We did The Surfer with

765
00:43:30,079 --> 00:43:33,079
Nick Cage, which was good, it was enjoyable. Did we

766
00:43:33,079 --> 00:43:36,159
do another film on that stream? I can't remember, impile,

767
00:43:36,400 --> 00:43:38,800
that's right. I didn't care for the second one. I

768
00:43:38,840 --> 00:43:44,119
did like Mission Impossible part of one of two. But

769
00:43:44,880 --> 00:43:49,360
I did like the the movie Long Legs. I thought

770
00:43:49,400 --> 00:43:53,920
Long Legs was really good horror movie. I thought Heretic

771
00:43:54,199 --> 00:43:56,000
with Hugh Jackman was good. I don't know if you

772
00:43:56,039 --> 00:43:56,400
saw that.

773
00:43:57,199 --> 00:43:59,719
Speaker 4: I covered that one too, I did you, Okay, I

774
00:44:00,119 --> 00:44:05,000
can't remember. And then there was one of the movies.

775
00:44:04,760 --> 00:44:06,400
Speaker 2: There're so far a few between, like we got to

776
00:44:06,400 --> 00:44:07,239
cover the movie right now.

777
00:44:07,480 --> 00:44:07,639
Speaker 4: Yeah.

778
00:44:07,639 --> 00:44:09,360
Speaker 3: I was gonna say, there's not a whole lot. That's

779
00:44:09,360 --> 00:44:11,400
why I wanted to kind of just kind of look out.

780
00:44:11,599 --> 00:44:13,920
I actually people probably didn't like this.

781
00:44:14,119 --> 00:44:14,920
Speaker 4: I thought, uh.

782
00:44:17,119 --> 00:44:19,559
Speaker 3: Until Dawn was pretty good, and I liked speaking of

783
00:44:19,639 --> 00:44:22,400
Julia Garner, I don't know if you saw Apartment seven A,

784
00:44:22,519 --> 00:44:24,000
which was supposed to be the prequel to.

785
00:44:25,519 --> 00:44:27,760
Speaker 4: Rosemary's Baby. I did like those.

786
00:44:27,800 --> 00:44:30,159
Speaker 3: I just wanted to touch on a few kind of

787
00:44:30,440 --> 00:44:34,239
bright spots that I also liked Smile and Smile too.

788
00:44:34,280 --> 00:44:38,039
I thought both were pretty good horror movies that kind

789
00:44:38,039 --> 00:44:43,119
of show aspects of you know, MK ultra pop star

790
00:44:43,199 --> 00:44:44,519
mind control of that kind of stuff.

791
00:44:45,480 --> 00:44:47,159
Speaker 2: Yeah. There was also Last Night in Soho.

792
00:44:48,039 --> 00:44:49,840
Speaker 4: I did like that. That was good. Yeah, yeah.

793
00:44:50,960 --> 00:44:54,599
Speaker 2: I thought Heretic was well done because it covered Mormonism,

794
00:44:54,599 --> 00:44:58,719
which in a different way. It also had the Labyrinth

795
00:44:58,880 --> 00:45:01,679
in it, and it was a much more philosophical movie

796
00:45:02,559 --> 00:45:04,639
than movies usually have time for. So I thought that

797
00:45:04,679 --> 00:45:06,960
was good. I thought Apartment seven A was pretty good.

798
00:45:07,039 --> 00:45:12,360
I covered the Rosemary's Baby book by Ira Leven along

799
00:45:12,400 --> 00:45:15,079
with Rosemary's Baby the film and then the sequel to

800
00:45:15,119 --> 00:45:19,840
sort of contrast them, and I think that I thought

801
00:45:19,880 --> 00:45:25,960
Long Legs was I thought Long Legs Was was crazy

802
00:45:26,079 --> 00:45:30,519
because it has the whole doll doll baby aspect and

803
00:45:30,519 --> 00:45:33,639
and the one thing that bothers me about that about

804
00:45:33,679 --> 00:45:37,760
that movie is they always shortcut movies where they have

805
00:45:37,920 --> 00:45:41,559
the half psychic FBI agent and it's her first day

806
00:45:41,599 --> 00:45:43,960
on the job and you give her the most difficult

807
00:45:44,000 --> 00:45:45,400
It's like in Silence of the Lambs, Silence of the.

808
00:45:45,400 --> 00:45:47,880
Speaker 3: Leg I was saying, that's on purpose, because that's Silence

809
00:45:47,880 --> 00:45:49,320
of the lambstock sofya.

810
00:45:49,599 --> 00:45:53,000
Speaker 2: Well, it's Silence of the Lambs is you know, considered

811
00:45:53,360 --> 00:45:55,400
a great film and you know, one best picture in

812
00:45:55,480 --> 00:45:59,239
nineteen ninety two or three, and you know, and I

813
00:45:59,280 --> 00:46:02,880
covered Red Drag in the book. I covered uh Manhunter

814
00:46:03,000 --> 00:46:07,800
by Michael Mann And but it's like Clarice, it's her

815
00:46:07,840 --> 00:46:10,000
first day on the job and they give her Hannibal

816
00:46:10,079 --> 00:46:11,519
Lecter as the guy she's supposed to be do.

817
00:46:11,639 --> 00:46:13,480
Speaker 3: Yeah, I said that when I did analysis, that was

818
00:46:13,480 --> 00:46:14,119
making fun of that.

819
00:46:14,239 --> 00:46:18,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's that's pretty crazy. And actually last week on

820
00:46:18,920 --> 00:46:22,480
boiler Room hasher and then pulled up a video of

821
00:46:22,519 --> 00:46:28,280
these guys, this community of people called maskers who it

822
00:46:28,320 --> 00:46:30,920
was basically long Legs. It was a guy who was

823
00:46:31,039 --> 00:46:33,280
long Legs in real life and goes to a community

824
00:46:33,280 --> 00:46:36,760
of long leggers to meet up in Vegas and they

825
00:46:36,800 --> 00:46:41,679
wear doll plastic seen doll masks on their face and

826
00:46:41,760 --> 00:46:43,920
they I mean it was it was the same exact thing.

827
00:46:44,000 --> 00:46:47,559
So It's crazy how that sort of predictive and you know,

828
00:46:47,719 --> 00:46:51,440
ends up the most freakish thing ends up being reality.

829
00:46:51,920 --> 00:46:54,840
I think that the two, you know, I thought Midsommar

830
00:46:55,119 --> 00:46:59,159
was was gross, but I thought that the two the

831
00:46:59,199 --> 00:47:01,639
two best horror. You know, I didn't like horror movies

832
00:47:01,639 --> 00:47:04,239
when I was growing up, and now I think we've

833
00:47:04,280 --> 00:47:07,960
found ourselves in a place where horror movies continuously end

834
00:47:08,079 --> 00:47:11,000
up being the most revelatory films, that they're the best done.

835
00:47:11,239 --> 00:47:15,199
Speaker 3: Well, we live in a horrific age, that's why.

836
00:47:15,280 --> 00:47:18,559
Speaker 2: Yeah, And I thought that Hereditary and The Witch were

837
00:47:19,159 --> 00:47:23,599
sort of dual pieces that were very very well done films.

838
00:47:23,599 --> 00:47:27,519
They're incredibly dark. But the difference with The Witch and

839
00:47:27,960 --> 00:47:30,639
a lot of these other films is that in The Witch,

840
00:47:30,719 --> 00:47:33,679
when you end up with the literal Witch's Sabbath at

841
00:47:33,679 --> 00:47:37,280
the Black Sabbath at the end of the film, there's

842
00:47:37,320 --> 00:47:40,559
this exultation that occurs from the Witch, like she's finally

843
00:47:40,599 --> 00:47:42,920
found the place, and she literally hovers into the air

844
00:47:43,000 --> 00:47:46,239
like a Goya painting, But we sort of know that

845
00:47:46,280 --> 00:47:49,119
she's gonna come to that place and we're horrified by it,

846
00:47:49,599 --> 00:47:52,679
versus other movies where they do sort of the same thing,

847
00:47:53,159 --> 00:47:56,199
but we're supposed to have some sort of joy or

848
00:47:56,239 --> 00:47:59,440
exultation with the character instead of feeling horrified by it.

849
00:48:00,000 --> 00:48:04,199
I thought those were too really well done movies. Also,

850
00:48:04,280 --> 00:48:07,679
the thing about those movies is that they both end

851
00:48:07,800 --> 00:48:11,360
up with a climax where you don't imagine that they're

852
00:48:11,400 --> 00:48:13,280
actually going to go to the place where they go,

853
00:48:13,360 --> 00:48:16,239
and they do so. At the end of Hereditary when

854
00:48:16,239 --> 00:48:21,480
they they conjure pam on this prince of Hell and

855
00:48:21,559 --> 00:48:25,519
he is, you know, he's he's taken over this kid's

856
00:48:25,559 --> 00:48:29,039
body and they're doing this magic ritual. You don't when

857
00:48:29,079 --> 00:48:30,639
you're watching the movie the first time. I don't think

858
00:48:30,679 --> 00:48:33,679
you imagine that they're actually going to succeed and go

859
00:48:33,800 --> 00:48:35,840
into this place that they do. So I think that

860
00:48:36,360 --> 00:48:39,440
it's a particularly I don't know, it's it's I think

861
00:48:39,480 --> 00:48:42,119
that that's a strange place to be in movies, and

862
00:48:42,239 --> 00:48:47,039
it's it's it's dark, but it's there's some sort of

863
00:48:47,199 --> 00:48:49,880
revelatory I think data that we get from from that

864
00:48:50,000 --> 00:48:54,559
kind of film. And Weapons also did that. I mean

865
00:48:54,599 --> 00:48:57,519
it really, it really did go to that place. I

866
00:48:57,559 --> 00:48:58,920
wasn't sure how they were going to get to the

867
00:48:58,920 --> 00:49:00,559
way because when I went into the I didn't know

868
00:49:00,599 --> 00:49:02,719
anything about it, and I watched. We watched the first

869
00:49:02,760 --> 00:49:04,280
three minutes of the film, and I went, this is

870
00:49:04,280 --> 00:49:04,639
a witch.

871
00:49:05,559 --> 00:49:07,679
Speaker 4: Yeah. I did the same thing to Jamie. I was like,

872
00:49:07,719 --> 00:49:08,800
it's gonna be witchcraft.

873
00:49:09,119 --> 00:49:11,519
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's it's either gonna be mk Ultro the Most

874
00:49:11,599 --> 00:49:13,719
Dangerous Game, it's gonna be gnostic, or there's gonna be

875
00:49:13,760 --> 00:49:16,079
a witch, and in this one it was. It had

876
00:49:16,119 --> 00:49:18,400
elements of mk ultran And I thought when the children

877
00:49:18,440 --> 00:49:22,880
were running in there, sort of that Vietnam the famous

878
00:49:22,960 --> 00:49:26,280
Vietnam photo where the little girls running away from the napalm,

879
00:49:26,320 --> 00:49:29,280
I thought, Okay, this is gonna have something. The body

880
00:49:29,320 --> 00:49:30,719
language is gonna have something to do with m k

881
00:49:30,840 --> 00:49:33,599
Ultra or Phoenix a modern Phoenix program or something, or

882
00:49:33,639 --> 00:49:35,199
it's gonna be a witch and this looks like a witch,

883
00:49:35,559 --> 00:49:36,639
and it was.

884
00:49:37,800 --> 00:49:38,400
Speaker 4: Yeah.

885
00:49:38,559 --> 00:49:43,039
Speaker 3: Before we get into some of the movie nuggets, I

886
00:49:43,039 --> 00:49:46,280
do want to talk a little bit about uh both

887
00:49:47,000 --> 00:49:52,360
because we mentioned long legs, and it seems like for

888
00:49:53,119 --> 00:49:56,960
the new reigning Horror Queen, there's a competition between Micah

889
00:49:57,039 --> 00:50:00,599
Munroe and Julia Garner, both of whom seemed to really

890
00:50:00,639 --> 00:50:06,519
be kind of the queens of horror interestingly, and of

891
00:50:06,519 --> 00:50:09,760
course with Michael and Roe, she really kicked it off.

892
00:50:09,800 --> 00:50:11,920
I mean she's in other like student films and whatnot,

893
00:50:11,960 --> 00:50:14,159
but it follows which I thought was a really good

894
00:50:14,760 --> 00:50:18,039
horror film, and then she's kind of followed up with

895
00:50:18,119 --> 00:50:22,800
a consistent, like consistent horror movies, right, I mean the

896
00:50:22,880 --> 00:50:26,639
Guest horror movie, Watcher horror movie, Long Legs horror movie,

897
00:50:26,679 --> 00:50:29,039
significant other horror movie. And I don't know if you've

898
00:50:29,039 --> 00:50:32,079
ever ever saw God as a Bullet, but once again,

899
00:50:32,599 --> 00:50:37,480
this one is explicitly satanic cults and human trafficking.

900
00:50:37,519 --> 00:50:38,760
Speaker 4: Did you see God as a Bullet?

901
00:50:39,480 --> 00:50:41,119
Speaker 2: No? I haven't seen that one.

902
00:50:41,559 --> 00:50:45,199
Speaker 3: I actually recommend everybody should watch guys. It's it's hard

903
00:50:45,199 --> 00:50:47,880
to watch, but it's like revelatory.

904
00:50:47,960 --> 00:50:49,559
Speaker 2: Do you think, why do you think they have these

905
00:50:49,559 --> 00:50:53,320
two these two specific actresses who've sort of gotten to

906
00:50:53,440 --> 00:50:55,639
fill this role. I mean, this is different from the

907
00:50:55,679 --> 00:50:58,679
blonde bombshell of Psycho and that role. It's different from

908
00:50:58,719 --> 00:51:01,519
the kind of final girl the screen queen. I think

909
00:51:01,519 --> 00:51:04,239
there's and it's not just like a millennial or gen

910
00:51:04,480 --> 00:51:07,760
X sort of thing that people can see these characters

911
00:51:07,760 --> 00:51:11,199
in them. I think with with what's her name Michaeh

912
00:51:11,880 --> 00:51:15,119
Michael Monroe. I think I think her thing is that

913
00:51:15,800 --> 00:51:17,920
there's a lot to be said. It's kind of getting

914
00:51:17,960 --> 00:51:20,679
into the minutia about actors in films, but there's a

915
00:51:20,719 --> 00:51:23,880
lot to be said about the the palette of a

916
00:51:23,920 --> 00:51:27,880
person's face, and she sort of has a blank canvas

917
00:51:27,880 --> 00:51:30,360
of a face that you sort of paint horror onto,

918
00:51:31,480 --> 00:51:34,760
you know, the reactions are slightly reserved. Julia Garner is

919
00:51:34,840 --> 00:51:39,039
a much more sort of wholesome looking person, so it

920
00:51:39,079 --> 00:51:41,039
seems to be that her thing is it's much more

921
00:51:41,079 --> 00:51:43,800
horrifying when she is subjected to what the thing that

922
00:51:43,840 --> 00:51:49,760
she's subjected to. But they also are representative of most

923
00:51:49,760 --> 00:51:50,360
of America.

924
00:51:51,039 --> 00:51:54,199
Speaker 3: Yeah, I was gonna say, I mean, you know, in

925
00:51:54,239 --> 00:51:57,199
a lot of pictures, you know, Michael Monroe either looks

926
00:51:57,360 --> 00:52:03,880
like Marilyn Monroe or she looks like, you know, the

927
00:52:04,880 --> 00:52:08,440
town beauty queen. So she has this element of girl

928
00:52:08,519 --> 00:52:13,079
next door, but also in a way very attractive and unique,

929
00:52:13,119 --> 00:52:14,840
even if even though she had but I think both

930
00:52:14,840 --> 00:52:16,639
of them have that sort of they kind of look

931
00:52:17,079 --> 00:52:19,079
like they would be girl next door, but they also

932
00:52:19,159 --> 00:52:22,599
have a little unique appearance that makes them kind of

933
00:52:22,639 --> 00:52:25,920
stand out and both of them sort of being in

934
00:52:26,079 --> 00:52:29,760
a lot of the films at least blonde. I think

935
00:52:29,800 --> 00:52:33,960
there is that, like harkening back to the archetype of

936
00:52:34,199 --> 00:52:38,000
like you said, in Hitchcock, you have usually the blonde

937
00:52:38,039 --> 00:52:42,840
subject of old horror going down, and there also might

938
00:52:42,920 --> 00:52:45,920
be interesting you know, who knows, there might be esoteric

939
00:52:46,000 --> 00:52:48,519
or occult stuff going on. I mean, if you go

940
00:52:48,599 --> 00:52:53,480
back to one of the earliest films that Julie Garners

941
00:52:53,599 --> 00:52:56,480
is in, she's in that class. That's also a pretty

942
00:52:56,480 --> 00:52:59,960
good cult movie. Do you remember, Martha Marcy May Marlene.

943
00:53:00,079 --> 00:53:04,000
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's a yeah exactly, John Hawks.

944
00:53:05,079 --> 00:53:08,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, there's also I think, uh it ironically says something

945
00:53:08,920 --> 00:53:12,280
refreshing about masculinity and femininity. Uh, in the world where

946
00:53:12,320 --> 00:53:15,800
these these two characters, you know, these two actors are feminine.

947
00:53:15,920 --> 00:53:19,320
You know, they're they're girls, and it should be horrifying

948
00:53:20,119 --> 00:53:22,559
in a horror movie for the audience to see something

949
00:53:22,599 --> 00:53:28,280
bad to happen to feminine characters, versus what we're supposed

950
00:53:28,320 --> 00:53:30,880
to think now, which is that it's horrifying to have

951
00:53:31,000 --> 00:53:34,440
a person lose their identity. It's actually it's actually that

952
00:53:34,599 --> 00:53:38,039
it's non it's not human. And so watching these two

953
00:53:38,119 --> 00:53:40,880
characters go through. What they go through I think is

954
00:53:41,599 --> 00:53:45,440
supposed to be anathema to a normal person's sort of

955
00:53:46,760 --> 00:53:47,400
you know, your year.

956
00:53:47,559 --> 00:53:51,880
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's a good that's a good point, right. Yeah.

957
00:53:52,400 --> 00:53:54,719
Speaker 3: If you one last thing, I want't to mention it.

958
00:53:54,760 --> 00:53:56,559
Didn't want to mention it too. I think we'd mentioned

959
00:53:56,559 --> 00:54:00,960
this between you and I. But the uh, the movie

960
00:54:01,039 --> 00:54:01,559
The Guest.

961
00:54:02,039 --> 00:54:04,559
Speaker 4: Did you see that? That has Mike Monroe and.

962
00:54:06,079 --> 00:54:09,599
Speaker 3: Matthew Crawley from Downton Abbey Dan Stevens.

963
00:54:09,960 --> 00:54:10,760
Speaker 4: Have you seen The Guest?

964
00:54:11,199 --> 00:54:11,320
Speaker 1: Oh?

965
00:54:11,639 --> 00:54:13,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm trying to remember which one of it.

966
00:54:13,840 --> 00:54:19,000
Speaker 3: And that is a MK Ultra super soldier explicit you know,

967
00:54:19,360 --> 00:54:22,079
creation of a Phoenix program kind of assassin where he

968
00:54:22,159 --> 00:54:24,679
kind of goes hey wire in short circuits.

969
00:54:25,719 --> 00:54:26,360
Speaker 4: But yeah, go ahead.

970
00:54:26,360 --> 00:54:28,239
Speaker 2: When I think of Dan Stevens, I think of that

971
00:54:29,960 --> 00:54:32,280
literal mk Ultra movie he's in Cuckoo.

972
00:54:33,480 --> 00:54:34,880
Speaker 4: Yeah. I didn't like Cuckoo.

973
00:54:35,320 --> 00:54:38,599
Speaker 3: I was hyped for it and it ended up being

974
00:54:38,639 --> 00:54:41,400
this really kind of lame mass of feminist thing, so

975
00:54:41,400 --> 00:54:42,199
I didn't care for it.

976
00:54:43,320 --> 00:54:49,559
Speaker 2: He's just uh, he's like, I don't know, he's uh,

977
00:54:49,679 --> 00:54:52,000
Jose Swiss, Jose Delgado.

978
00:54:52,519 --> 00:54:58,400
Speaker 3: Yeah, there you go, exactly, Okay, so uh, I apologize,

979
00:54:58,400 --> 00:55:00,119
I'm getting this way off track here with the all

980
00:55:00,159 --> 00:55:03,760
the different tie in. So Weapons is just to kind

981
00:55:03,760 --> 00:55:07,880
of set the stage here, oddly enough, directed by Zach

982
00:55:08,119 --> 00:55:11,559
Krieger from Whitest Kids, you Know, and I was always

983
00:55:11,599 --> 00:55:13,159
a fan of that, one of the one of the

984
00:55:13,159 --> 00:55:19,079
best sketch comedies the last several decades, probably next to

985
00:55:19,320 --> 00:55:22,480
other greats like A Million Dollar Extreme, that kind of stuff,

986
00:55:22,480 --> 00:55:24,719
Flight of the Concords. In my view, these are, you know,

987
00:55:24,800 --> 00:55:29,360
great sketch shows and comedies, but I think for most people,

988
00:55:29,400 --> 00:55:32,000
probably Whitest Kuld you know, it's probably up there in

989
00:55:32,039 --> 00:55:34,760
like the top, you know, best sketch shows of all time.

990
00:55:36,079 --> 00:55:39,559
And he did I didn't even realize this until looking

991
00:55:39,639 --> 00:55:42,880
up for this film, but he had done Barbarians, which

992
00:55:44,000 --> 00:55:47,239
excuse me, Barbarian of twenty twenty two, which was a

993
00:55:47,239 --> 00:55:51,440
fun kind of ghetto horror based around an airbnb. That

994
00:55:51,599 --> 00:55:53,960
was a fun one that Jamie and I enjoyed. But

995
00:55:55,559 --> 00:55:58,480
you can see, of course, in parallels between Barbarian and Weapons.

996
00:55:58,519 --> 00:56:02,000
And the reason I'm pointing out why he matters is

997
00:56:02,039 --> 00:56:08,440
because I mean, he wrote it, and I think he

998
00:56:08,719 --> 00:56:11,679
tends to kind of bring horror or his comedy into

999
00:56:11,760 --> 00:56:14,639
the horror. So I think that what we're looking at

1000
00:56:15,079 --> 00:56:18,559
is a kind of a Grim's fairy tale again, because

1001
00:56:18,559 --> 00:56:23,480
we have the witch and you know, the children being

1002
00:56:24,079 --> 00:56:25,480
taken by the witch, et cetera.

1003
00:56:27,199 --> 00:56:28,280
Speaker 4: And it's also in.

1004
00:56:28,800 --> 00:56:31,639
Speaker 3: What I didn't expect was that it was kind of funny.

1005
00:56:32,599 --> 00:56:35,440
So again, because he's a horror or a comedy guy,

1006
00:56:35,480 --> 00:56:37,679
he's bringing that to the horror. So I saw it

1007
00:56:37,719 --> 00:56:43,000
as a satiric, a dark satirical Grim's fairy tale, but

1008
00:56:43,199 --> 00:56:46,599
also with a lot of truth in it. Because just

1009
00:56:46,800 --> 00:56:49,119
this is my overview before we get into the actual

1010
00:56:49,159 --> 00:56:54,599
sequences of the film. Basically nobody is able to figure

1011
00:56:54,639 --> 00:56:59,480
out what's going on because no one is considering witchcraft

1012
00:57:00,159 --> 00:57:03,320
every other possible thing. People were saying, oh, it's it's

1013
00:57:03,400 --> 00:57:06,920
like it's likening everything to the school shooting phenomena of

1014
00:57:07,039 --> 00:57:09,480
Columbine and this and that. I don't think I had

1015
00:57:09,480 --> 00:57:12,079
anything to do with that, I think, and I don't

1016
00:57:12,119 --> 00:57:16,239
know Krieger's own personal spiritual approaches or anything like that.

1017
00:57:16,320 --> 00:57:20,880
I do know that before Trevor Moore died, why just kid,

1018
00:57:20,960 --> 00:57:25,000
you know, was getting very conspiratorial in a lot of

1019
00:57:25,039 --> 00:57:29,159
their sketches. You know, they were referencing pretty much all

1020
00:57:29,199 --> 00:57:32,000
the crazy conspiracy stuff that you could think of, and

1021
00:57:32,159 --> 00:57:36,440
a lot of people noticed that one of their conspiracy

1022
00:57:36,440 --> 00:57:40,000
sketches had gone megaviral before Trevor Moore died.

1023
00:57:40,079 --> 00:57:41,480
Speaker 4: I'm not saying that anything.

1024
00:57:41,559 --> 00:57:44,440
Speaker 3: I don't know or have any evidence of anything nefarious,

1025
00:57:44,440 --> 00:57:46,920
but it is interesting that they went in that direction.

1026
00:57:47,079 --> 00:57:51,280
And then you know, Trevor passes away, and then Kreeger

1027
00:57:51,360 --> 00:57:54,239
makes two films, the first of which is really just

1028
00:57:54,880 --> 00:57:56,679
ghetto horror, I guess you could say, and then this

1029
00:57:56,719 --> 00:57:57,679
one is a little.

1030
00:57:57,400 --> 00:58:02,239
Speaker 4: More It is dark, but again, like.

1031
00:58:02,800 --> 00:58:06,119
Speaker 3: My defense of it is, and I don't people free

1032
00:58:06,159 --> 00:58:11,000
to disagree. My defense of it is that with any

1033
00:58:11,880 --> 00:58:15,280
fairy tale you have pretty gruesome elements, and the purpose

1034
00:58:15,360 --> 00:58:18,480
of the gruesome elements is a kind of a warning. Again,

1035
00:58:18,519 --> 00:58:21,960
I don't know if Kreeger actually had this as his motive.

1036
00:58:22,039 --> 00:58:23,440
Speaker 4: This was my reading of the film.

1037
00:58:23,880 --> 00:58:26,519
Speaker 3: I did like the different misdirections that we had.

1038
00:58:26,320 --> 00:58:27,159
Speaker 4: Throughout the film.

1039
00:58:27,440 --> 00:58:29,159
Speaker 3: I like the fact that it was told in a

1040
00:58:29,239 --> 00:58:32,000
non linear way, kind of like pulp fiction or that

1041
00:58:32,039 --> 00:58:35,880
movie eleven fourteen with Patrick Swayze. That made it fun

1042
00:58:35,920 --> 00:58:40,119
to kind of piece it together the different perspectives of

1043
00:58:40,159 --> 00:58:43,480
the characters storyline of the same event. As I said,

1044
00:58:43,599 --> 00:58:46,159
a couple of them were actually pretty funny. The druggy

1045
00:58:46,199 --> 00:58:51,239
guy was a pretty funny character. Even Paul, the cheating

1046
00:58:51,360 --> 00:58:56,079
police officer, his version of the story is actually pretty comedic.

1047
00:58:56,119 --> 00:58:57,159
Speaker 4: So I think a lot.

1048
00:58:57,119 --> 00:58:59,599
Speaker 3: Of people overlooked that it was supposed to be funny.

1049
00:59:00,280 --> 00:59:03,480
I thought it was funny. I didn't like the couple

1050
00:59:03,679 --> 00:59:07,719
extremely gruesome scenes I had to turn away. I understand

1051
00:59:07,719 --> 00:59:12,559
people's critique to that, Oh, they had to use witchcraft

1052
00:59:12,679 --> 00:59:15,840
to defeat the witchcraft. But again, I think there's a

1053
00:59:15,920 --> 00:59:20,199
lesson here that it's not about getting people to use witchcraft.

1054
00:59:20,239 --> 00:59:23,880
I think the point of the film is that, like humans,

1055
00:59:24,000 --> 00:59:27,800
are the weapons that were actually concerned with. At one point,

1056
00:59:27,920 --> 00:59:31,119
Josh Brolin has a dream where he sees an AK

1057
00:59:31,480 --> 00:59:33,760
forty seven or whatever floating above a house, and a

1058
00:59:33,880 --> 00:59:38,599
dream that's directing him to where the weapons are. And

1059
00:59:39,320 --> 00:59:41,400
you know, in light of the things that have happened

1060
00:59:41,400 --> 00:59:44,400
in the last week or two weeks, the wild events,

1061
00:59:44,519 --> 00:59:47,400
Charlie Kirk and other things, this kind of a movie

1062
00:59:47,440 --> 00:59:48,639
like Weapons is very.

1063
00:59:50,599 --> 00:59:50,800
Speaker 2: Point.

1064
00:59:50,880 --> 00:59:54,679
Speaker 3: Yet, I guess because the weapons aren't what the left says.

1065
00:59:54,760 --> 00:59:58,079
It's not guns, it's not you know this, it's actually

1066
00:59:58,440 --> 01:00:01,960
people who are weaponized. And particularly with a tr and

1067
01:00:02,039 --> 01:00:05,719
Z community, I believe there's a spiritual problem and a

1068
01:00:05,880 --> 01:00:09,239
spiritual weaponizing effect that's going on. This is a lot

1069
01:00:09,280 --> 01:00:12,239
of the research that BX has done in regard to

1070
01:00:12,280 --> 01:00:16,000
certain cults, online groups, sex, satanic groups.

1071
01:00:16,119 --> 01:00:17,400
Speaker 4: Seven six', four et.

1072
01:00:17,480 --> 01:00:25,400
Speaker 3: Cetera the accelerationists have this approach of weaponizing, people and

1073
01:00:25,440 --> 01:00:28,440
that's the real weapons, here not, guns and not this and.

1074
01:00:28,480 --> 01:00:32,159
That SO i didn't read it as a literal invitation to,

1075
01:00:32,199 --> 01:00:35,360
witchcraft but as a satirical grim's fairy tale warning us

1076
01:00:35,360 --> 01:00:39,920
about the fact that the real delusion going on even

1077
01:00:40,000 --> 01:00:43,599
in Small Middle, america small Town Middle, america is not

1078
01:00:44,239 --> 01:00:48,800
corrupt politicians or a teacher that's stealing. Students, no it's

1079
01:00:49,039 --> 01:00:51,320
spiritual and people are under a.

1080
01:00:51,639 --> 01:00:53,400
Speaker 4: Spell SO i love the.

1081
01:00:53,360 --> 01:00:56,039
Speaker 3: Aspect that this film is about pretty much everybody being

1082
01:00:56,119 --> 01:01:00,199
under a, spell and it's not figured out until Well

1083
01:01:00,360 --> 01:01:03,679
Josh brolin actually starts to listen to things like his,

1084
01:01:04,119 --> 01:01:08,239
dreams which in the film kind of symbolize listening to

1085
01:01:08,840 --> 01:01:12,760
the transcendent or to the spiritual or, spirituality and then they,

1086
01:01:12,800 --> 01:01:17,679
realized actually we're up against spiritual, evil you, know As paul,

1087
01:01:17,719 --> 01:01:22,719
says And ephesian six, thrones, principalities, powers dominions in high.

1088
01:01:22,800 --> 01:01:25,280
Places so that's kind of where the film, goes which

1089
01:01:25,480 --> 01:01:28,000
you didn't. EXPECT i, MEAN i did Expect, witchcraft BUT

1090
01:01:28,039 --> 01:01:31,079
i didn't expect the film to go in that. Direction

1091
01:01:31,280 --> 01:01:35,400
Where as you, said it's a very dark. Ending but

1092
01:01:35,599 --> 01:01:37,920
you fight weapons with, weapons AND i don't mean that

1093
01:01:38,400 --> 01:01:41,320
you fight witchcraft with, witchcraft but you fight witchcraft with

1094
01:01:41,480 --> 01:01:44,320
other spiritual, weapons namely with real.

1095
01:01:44,400 --> 01:01:47,400
Speaker 4: Spirituality, yeah excellent.

1096
01:01:47,559 --> 01:01:50,559
Speaker 2: ANALYSIS i think that one thing you brought up is

1097
01:01:50,599 --> 01:01:55,079
that no one considers witchcraft EVEN i think even when

1098
01:01:55,920 --> 01:01:59,000
the teacher has the word which written in what looks

1099
01:01:59,039 --> 01:02:03,440
like blood on our. Right, ah that is just it

1100
01:02:03,519 --> 01:02:07,440
seems to be a word or something that somebody remembered

1101
01:02:07,480 --> 01:02:10,400
from the memory of a of a more normal. Time,

1102
01:02:10,519 --> 01:02:14,199
right they paint the person's car with which it's not

1103
01:02:14,360 --> 01:02:17,920
really spoken of in any other, places and everyone seems

1104
01:02:17,960 --> 01:02:21,039
to kind of be dead in a. Way everyone certainly

1105
01:02:21,079 --> 01:02:24,960
controlled by the one thing that the nonlinear.

1106
01:02:24,800 --> 01:02:27,599
Speaker 3: Apparacha, well it's It's Josh, brolin the painter down there,

1107
01:02:27,679 --> 01:02:29,320
right because he got the he got the bucket.

1108
01:02:29,360 --> 01:02:32,119
Speaker 2: Right, yeah, yeah it was he was the one who

1109
01:02:32,119 --> 01:02:35,440
did it and his whole. Thing there was also a

1110
01:02:35,480 --> 01:02:38,119
gamer aspect with the way that the ar was floating

1111
01:02:38,119 --> 01:02:41,599
above the. House it was like a coin like he

1112
01:02:41,760 --> 01:02:46,960
was on some sort of you, know, uh first person

1113
01:02:47,000 --> 01:02:50,920
shooter game to find, perfect perfect point and and and

1114
01:02:51,079 --> 01:02:53,039
one THING i, noticed and this was the REASON i

1115
01:02:53,039 --> 01:02:56,679
thought it was incredibly dark and they they couldn't have known,

1116
01:02:56,719 --> 01:02:58,679
this or it was predictive or whatever was That when

1117
01:02:58,719 --> 01:03:01,599
we finally see the, witch she reminded me a lot

1118
01:03:01,920 --> 01:03:05,079
of the video of the shooter of the school that

1119
01:03:05,119 --> 01:03:07,599
happened two weeks, ago of The catholic. School remember they

1120
01:03:07,599 --> 01:03:10,559
made the. Video the guy made the video that was

1121
01:03:10,599 --> 01:03:12,559
released at the same time as the shoot.

1122
01:03:12,639 --> 01:03:15,960
Speaker 3: SHOOTING i listened To alex playing those, clips BUT i

1123
01:03:16,039 --> 01:03:17,119
never saw the actual.

1124
01:03:17,199 --> 01:03:18,400
Speaker 4: Video did did he have that?

1125
01:03:18,480 --> 01:03:21,480
Speaker 2: Appearance, WELL i wouldn't. RECOMMEND i, Mean i'm sure people

1126
01:03:21,519 --> 01:03:23,679
here have already seen the, video BUT i. WOULDN'T i

1127
01:03:23,719 --> 01:03:27,440
would not recommend watching the. Videos it's incredibly dark and it's,

1128
01:03:27,559 --> 01:03:30,920
UH i don't even like having things like that in my.

1129
01:03:31,039 --> 01:03:37,719
Phone it was it was purposefully. Satanic you, Know i'm

1130
01:03:37,760 --> 01:03:39,719
not gonna say what he's doing in, it but you,

1131
01:03:39,760 --> 01:03:43,760
know weapons that are marked with sigils and marked with

1132
01:03:44,239 --> 01:03:49,840
marking weapons with AND ammo with memes seems to be

1133
01:03:50,760 --> 01:03:55,159
the the contemporary equivalent of marking sigils on a. Weapon

1134
01:03:56,519 --> 01:03:59,119
it seems to be the exact same, thing sort of

1135
01:03:59,239 --> 01:04:00,880
magically and meme.

1136
01:04:00,960 --> 01:04:04,679
Speaker 3: MAGIC i MEAN ghq has been studying memes as meme.

1137
01:04:04,719 --> 01:04:08,039
Speaker 2: Magic so, yeah and and the and the the way

1138
01:04:08,159 --> 01:04:11,760
that that person's appearance when we saw when we when

1139
01:04:11,960 --> 01:04:15,119
if you look up his, appearance it is remarkably similar

1140
01:04:15,199 --> 01:04:17,960
to The witch in the. Movie it's like the exact same.

1141
01:04:18,000 --> 01:04:23,559
Person to. Me SO i saw something, weirdly, uh sort

1142
01:04:23,599 --> 01:04:26,800
of weird spiritual syncro that. Happened in terms of that,

1143
01:04:26,920 --> 01:04:30,440
FILM i think, that, yeah all the characters seem to

1144
01:04:30,480 --> 01:04:33,000
be controlled by their. Passions we. Have the most likable

1145
01:04:33,079 --> 01:04:36,239
character is the drug. Addict he's, likable he seems to be.

1146
01:04:36,320 --> 01:04:38,400
HUMAN i, mean he's, funny he's kind of a kind

1147
01:04:38,400 --> 01:04:40,679
of a full character in the. Thing but even he

1148
01:04:40,719 --> 01:04:45,079
gets controlled by The. Witch and it seems that by

1149
01:04:45,119 --> 01:04:46,840
the end of the. Film the, problem one of the

1150
01:04:46,840 --> 01:04:49,760
PROBLEMS i had was that there aren't any characters who

1151
01:04:49,880 --> 01:04:53,119
are likable enough for me to see the vision of

1152
01:04:53,119 --> 01:04:56,519
the film In AND i think that's that's probably, intentional

1153
01:04:56,719 --> 01:04:59,440
that we don't like any of the. Characters it's it's

1154
01:04:59,480 --> 01:05:02,519
a if The Whites, kids you, know is a has

1155
01:05:02,559 --> 01:05:06,760
that famous sketch about The Big, nine then that is

1156
01:05:06,880 --> 01:05:09,840
a satirical statement on the darkness of the modern. World

1157
01:05:09,960 --> 01:05:13,360
and and that is completely different in a way than

1158
01:05:13,440 --> 01:05:18,079
this is because they are unwitting characters playing roles in the.

1159
01:05:18,159 --> 01:05:22,280
Game AND i thought of the Black eyed, children like

1160
01:05:22,920 --> 01:05:27,000
the kids IN. U. C a. G. E s in

1161
01:05:27,039 --> 01:05:30,400
the basement of the, film the whole the sort Of

1162
01:05:30,480 --> 01:05:35,159
vietnam aspect of, it the methed out people running around

1163
01:05:35,199 --> 01:05:39,679
the city causing, havoc the, principle and The skittles. Relationship

1164
01:05:39,800 --> 01:05:43,000
the it sort of has. Everything AND i think that

1165
01:05:43,079 --> 01:05:47,519
the the ultra violence in the film also was gruesome and.

1166
01:05:47,559 --> 01:05:51,679
BOTHERSOME i think that if there's a symbolic purpose of,

1167
01:05:51,719 --> 01:05:54,159
THAT i suppose would be to say that this is

1168
01:05:54,199 --> 01:06:00,599
the kind of, stylized stylized ultra violence that really impacts

1169
01:06:00,639 --> 01:06:03,800
the audience in the sense that this is the result

1170
01:06:03,920 --> 01:06:07,760
of what these things. Are it's not just that people are.

1171
01:06:07,800 --> 01:06:10,280
Disappearing it's not just that people are running, wild but

1172
01:06:10,280 --> 01:06:14,559
that it results in maximum, violence maximum corruption of the,

1173
01:06:14,599 --> 01:06:21,440
body maximum, destruction and it's repugnant to look. At, so you,

1174
01:06:21,480 --> 01:06:24,119
know there also doesn't seem to be much redemption in the.

1175
01:06:24,159 --> 01:06:26,760
CHARACTER i wanted the drug addic character to have some

1176
01:06:26,760 --> 01:06:29,159
sort of redemption even when he's breaking into the house

1177
01:06:29,199 --> 01:06:31,599
and stealing the. SILVERWARE i was, like this character is

1178
01:06:31,599 --> 01:06:34,760
still lower down on the totem pole than the other characters.

1179
01:06:34,800 --> 01:06:39,039
Are the schlub, COP i thought was a perfect counterpoint

1180
01:06:39,039 --> 01:06:43,519
To Jake dillenhall's character And. Prisoners you, know one is

1181
01:06:43,559 --> 01:06:47,480
like almost pure. Cop one is. Purposeful it seems like

1182
01:06:47,519 --> 01:06:49,199
we're with him on the. Journey he's going to get the,

1183
01:06:49,199 --> 01:06:51,480
people and the other one is cheating on his wife.

1184
01:06:52,239 --> 01:06:55,239
Waking it's also funny in movies like the guy went

1185
01:06:55,239 --> 01:06:58,119
out drinking one, night he stayed with this girl and

1186
01:06:58,159 --> 01:07:00,480
now he's too hungover to even get the car and

1187
01:07:00,519 --> 01:07:03,239
go do. ANYTHING i, MEAN i thought that WAS i

1188
01:07:03,280 --> 01:07:06,960
thought that was a little. Much, YEAH i mean, NO

1189
01:07:07,159 --> 01:07:10,920
i JUST i think that the characters were and AGAIN

1190
01:07:10,960 --> 01:07:14,599
i think that that's probably. Purposeful that the characters are completely.

1191
01:07:14,719 --> 01:07:20,000
Controlled and if the movie says anything it's. That if

1192
01:07:20,039 --> 01:07:22,639
it says one thing to, me it's that in a

1193
01:07:22,719 --> 01:07:32,840
world Without, christianity the. Characters, Ultimately witchcraft is ultimately about

1194
01:07:32,920 --> 01:07:35,559
characters finding a. Thing it's a sort of a lens

1195
01:07:35,599 --> 01:07:38,719
through which we see that people worship. Themselves they want

1196
01:07:38,760 --> 01:07:41,360
to be, empowered so they find. Power they find power

1197
01:07:41,400 --> 01:07:44,719
over other, people and they find power over the most helpless,

1198
01:07:44,760 --> 01:07:47,559
people which is sort of what happens in the film

1199
01:07:47,599 --> 01:07:49,239
UNTIL i guess it turns on.

1200
01:07:49,320 --> 01:07:52,800
Speaker 3: Them, Yeah and this is WHERE i would disagree, because

1201
01:07:52,840 --> 01:07:55,760
first of, ALL i didn't throughout the. FILM i NEVER

1202
01:07:56,639 --> 01:07:58,920
i was annoyed by some of the actions Of Josh

1203
01:07:58,920 --> 01:08:01,760
brolin and some of What Julia garner, did BUT i

1204
01:08:01,840 --> 01:08:05,119
never thought that they were unlikable or. Unredeemable in, fact

1205
01:08:05,199 --> 01:08:08,920
it ends up being them fighting each other is part

1206
01:08:08,920 --> 01:08:12,039
of the, spell and the whole thing is only dispelled

1207
01:08:12,079 --> 01:08:14,639
and solved when they actually listened to each other and work.

1208
01:08:14,679 --> 01:08:15,719
Speaker 4: Together so the only.

1209
01:08:15,519 --> 01:08:20,159
Speaker 3: Two good characters overall have to actually team. Up when that,

1210
01:08:20,319 --> 01:08:24,439
happens they end up actually Saving Josh rowland's son And

1211
01:08:24,960 --> 01:08:28,359
alex the you, know the son of the the one

1212
01:08:28,359 --> 01:08:33,479
that uh let me fix the audio levels since somebody's, Complaining,

1213
01:08:35,279 --> 01:08:36,560
yeah the the.

1214
01:08:36,399 --> 01:08:36,880
Speaker 4: Son of.

1215
01:08:38,640 --> 01:08:41,399
Speaker 3: The, child that's that's not under the, witchcraft, right that

1216
01:08:41,520 --> 01:08:43,600
the witch's nephew or whatever he.

1217
01:08:43,680 --> 01:08:44,840
Speaker 2: Is his Name alex.

1218
01:08:44,840 --> 01:08:47,399
Speaker 4: TOO i think somebody the chat said it.

1219
01:08:47,600 --> 01:08:51,199
Speaker 2: Was that's that's. Wild it is It's.

1220
01:08:51,319 --> 01:08:51,640
Speaker 4: Alex.

1221
01:08:52,560 --> 01:08:56,279
Speaker 2: YEAH i think. That you know when they when he

1222
01:08:56,479 --> 01:08:58,119
when he finds her in the parking lot of the gas,

1223
01:08:58,159 --> 01:09:03,279
station and the meth out crazy eyed, skittles Uh Jijinping,

1224
01:09:03,439 --> 01:09:05,760
principles starts running Towards that's one of the things that

1225
01:09:05,760 --> 01:09:07,600
always scares me in the, movies when there's someone running

1226
01:09:07,640 --> 01:09:08,079
at you like.

1227
01:09:08,119 --> 01:09:08,199
Speaker 1: That.

1228
01:09:10,159 --> 01:09:12,960
Speaker 2: Yeah and one thing that WAS i think visceral in

1229
01:09:13,000 --> 01:09:16,520
both of these movies is, that, uh that happened in broad.

1230
01:09:16,600 --> 01:09:19,199
Daylight so the taking happens at, night but this happened

1231
01:09:19,199 --> 01:09:24,880
in broad. Daylight In, prisoners they mentioned how the The

1232
01:09:25,079 --> 01:09:29,159
Boomer garcia character had taken the child in broad. Daylight

1233
01:09:29,239 --> 01:09:31,159
and it's, always, oh you should see the look on your.

1234
01:09:31,199 --> 01:09:33,279
Face it's always this sort of, derision you know, that,

1235
01:09:33,920 --> 01:09:36,439
uh seeing seeing a person horrified and they have the

1236
01:09:36,479 --> 01:09:38,720
secret and they know what they. Did but When Josh

1237
01:09:38,720 --> 01:09:41,800
brolin when the guy's running towards the lady and then

1238
01:09:41,880 --> 01:09:44,319
he crawls under the. CAR i was glad that he

1239
01:09:44,479 --> 01:09:47,399
finally not like kicked the guy in the head or,

1240
01:09:47,399 --> 01:09:49,279
whatever you, know and and saved her and then she

1241
01:09:49,359 --> 01:09:51,199
ran into the BECAUSE i kept, thinking this guy is

1242
01:09:51,199 --> 01:09:54,079
gonna end up being another soy who does nothing in a,

1243
01:09:54,119 --> 01:09:56,319
film which is such a contrast for A Josh brolin.

1244
01:09:56,439 --> 01:09:59,960
Character norm McDonald pointed out That Josh brolin when you

1245
01:10:00,039 --> 01:10:03,279
see the Movie Hail, caesar That Josh brolin was the

1246
01:10:03,399 --> 01:10:05,880
archetype for the. News you, know he had a chisel.

1247
01:10:06,000 --> 01:10:08,520
Jaw you, know he seems to be the strong, characters

1248
01:10:08,560 --> 01:10:11,359
like knocking people, around And George clooney was the soy

1249
01:10:11,479 --> 01:10:13,359
character of the. Movie he gets like thrown into a.

1250
01:10:13,359 --> 01:10:15,960
Corner SO i was glad that he didn't end up being.

1251
01:10:16,000 --> 01:10:18,039
That but you're, right they do work together in the.

1252
01:10:18,039 --> 01:10:22,520
FILM i JUST i WAS i was really disturbed by

1253
01:10:22,560 --> 01:10:25,399
the way that that That alex the kid was treated

1254
01:10:25,399 --> 01:10:27,119
in the. Movie that he's forced to sit there and

1255
01:10:27,199 --> 01:10:30,800
watches the forks in the face and all that, stuff

1256
01:10:30,800 --> 01:10:32,920
and he's got to go to school and you, know

1257
01:10:33,000 --> 01:10:35,640
he's he has to live his normal. Life, well he's

1258
01:10:35,680 --> 01:10:38,600
got this witch at. Him that's probably entirely truthful.

1259
01:10:38,159 --> 01:10:42,239
Speaker 3: Though so, well, yeah and again you know what's what

1260
01:10:42,359 --> 01:10:44,479
are some of the effects of the? Spell, well the

1261
01:10:44,520 --> 01:10:48,760
people can't. Speak they become complete sort of mind controlled.

1262
01:10:48,880 --> 01:10:54,000
Zombies they rush at you to kill or to bite

1263
01:10:54,159 --> 01:10:56,279
or to eat, you you know. EXACTLY i, mean are

1264
01:10:56,279 --> 01:10:59,880
they zombies or just like maniacally possessed. Individuals but they

1265
01:10:59,880 --> 01:11:03,159
also can't. Speak and it's explained at the end of

1266
01:11:03,199 --> 01:11:07,159
the film that after they had broken the spell that

1267
01:11:07,319 --> 01:11:09,319
a couple of years, later some of the kids even

1268
01:11:09,359 --> 01:11:12,880
begin to speak. Again so they were healing after this traumatic.

1269
01:11:13,680 --> 01:11:17,600
Event and the film might not have been intinduing to

1270
01:11:17,600 --> 01:11:20,199
talk about, this but it did make me think about

1271
01:11:20,239 --> 01:11:24,960
how the younger you go with kids the internet and

1272
01:11:25,039 --> 01:11:27,000
living on the, internet being raised on the internet is

1273
01:11:27,039 --> 01:11:32,159
really and not reading is impairing people's communicative and thinking

1274
01:11:32,199 --> 01:11:36,319
and critical thinking. Abilities and so if we think about

1275
01:11:36,359 --> 01:11:39,680
this as a story about how we're actually in a

1276
01:11:39,920 --> 01:11:46,920
spiritual warfare against evil, entities then you, know to young

1277
01:11:47,039 --> 01:11:50,159
children like The alex, characters who are essentially innocent that

1278
01:11:50,399 --> 01:11:53,000
are exposed to and see all this, trauma it's kind

1279
01:11:53,039 --> 01:11:55,680
of the way in the world that young kids are

1280
01:11:55,680 --> 01:12:00,760
seeing right, now, right so they're seeing an insane of traumatic.

1281
01:12:00,840 --> 01:12:04,880
World H and AS i think the film is trying to,

1282
01:12:04,920 --> 01:12:07,880
say even if it doesn't explicit in A christian, way

1283
01:12:08,159 --> 01:12:10,720
is that you're really only going to be able to

1284
01:12:10,760 --> 01:12:13,640
be evil or spiritual evil with a spiritual.

1285
01:12:13,680 --> 01:12:20,119
Speaker 2: Power so, yeah, YEAH i think, that you, Know corunka

1286
01:12:20,119 --> 01:12:24,199
obviously did something to, people and it it sort of

1287
01:12:24,239 --> 01:12:28,000
did to a twofold. Thing, one it made people who

1288
01:12:28,840 --> 01:12:31,880
didn't seem to speak much before speak very, loudly of

1289
01:12:32,000 --> 01:12:33,800
very you, KNOW i, mean look at the, riots and

1290
01:12:34,319 --> 01:12:36,000
that's WHAT i saw in the, film was that people

1291
01:12:36,079 --> 01:12:38,119
running around like that it was Like portland or. Something

1292
01:12:38,960 --> 01:12:41,279
and the other is that it made, People it made

1293
01:12:41,640 --> 01:12:47,079
younger people who were forced to cover their. Face and you,

1294
01:12:47,119 --> 01:12:51,479
know and anyone knows that teenagers who have something terrible

1295
01:12:51,560 --> 01:12:55,680
like this happening at home often do not. Speak they

1296
01:12:55,760 --> 01:12:58,359
they're just completely silent and blanket. Expressionist and one of

1297
01:12:58,399 --> 01:13:00,479
the most alarming things that CAN i think happened to,

1298
01:13:01,439 --> 01:13:05,359
children and that it seems to be that kind Of

1299
01:13:05,399 --> 01:13:07,840
both things happened in the, movie which was which was

1300
01:13:07,880 --> 01:13:13,079
interesting because The witch character is so dynamic and, loud,

1301
01:13:13,119 --> 01:13:16,000
like she looks. Loud she looks is a loud looking.

1302
01:13:16,039 --> 01:13:19,800
Person AND i think it like most most horror, movies.

1303
01:13:19,640 --> 01:13:20,880
Speaker 3: Now those are clown.

1304
01:13:21,039 --> 01:13:24,760
Speaker 2: Too, yes, yeah the most horror movies tend to do this,

1305
01:13:24,880 --> 01:13:30,119
now where they they show you that there's something to be.

1306
01:13:30,119 --> 01:13:32,079
SAID i think this is a, lesson especially for younger,

1307
01:13:32,079 --> 01:13:34,840
people that you really have to navigate the world by

1308
01:13:34,880 --> 01:13:37,319
trusting your. Gut you. Know it's like that old thing

1309
01:13:37,319 --> 01:13:39,039
that like your dad would tell you when you're walking

1310
01:13:39,039 --> 01:13:40,800
down the street at night and you see somebody coming

1311
01:13:40,840 --> 01:13:42,960
your way and something to unfeel right just across the.

1312
01:13:43,000 --> 01:13:46,800
Street women are told that all the, time and we

1313
01:13:46,840 --> 01:13:50,039
see that's increasingly gone away because we're supposed to trust

1314
01:13:50,079 --> 01:13:54,039
people no matter, what because if we see that they

1315
01:13:54,159 --> 01:13:56,760
don't look a certain, way then then we don't trust.

1316
01:13:56,840 --> 01:13:59,560
Ourselves and SO i, mean look at the bus incident

1317
01:13:59,600 --> 01:14:03,560
that just, happen you, know that's that's exactly what this

1318
01:14:04,119 --> 01:14:06,800
ends up sort of. Being and so when The witch

1319
01:14:06,800 --> 01:14:09,199
shows up at the school and she's got her nephew

1320
01:14:09,800 --> 01:14:12,760
who is a grown man who's not saying, anything and

1321
01:14:12,840 --> 01:14:15,960
the aunt is saying is saying, everything and she's this

1322
01:14:16,079 --> 01:14:18,560
loud clown like. Character all of the characters in the

1323
01:14:18,560 --> 01:14:21,239
movie kind of they just go with. It they don't

1324
01:14:21,520 --> 01:14:26,119
they they have no recourse in terms of their, being

1325
01:14:26,439 --> 01:14:29,960
in terms of their, politeness to cross any sort of

1326
01:14:30,000 --> 01:14:33,199
social boundary or social. Line but we could we continuously see.

1327
01:14:33,239 --> 01:14:35,920
That now those sorts of. Things you have to trust your.

1328
01:14:35,920 --> 01:14:38,800
Gut you have to you, know if the person looks

1329
01:14:38,840 --> 01:14:41,680
like long, legs you, know you should just what's the

1330
01:14:41,680 --> 01:14:43,359
morment just assuming they probably.

1331
01:14:43,079 --> 01:14:46,319
Speaker 4: Are that they probably, are, yeah possessed serial.

1332
01:14:46,359 --> 01:14:49,560
Speaker 3: Killer NOW i want to mention, too it's interesting that

1333
01:14:49,640 --> 01:14:55,479
the witch in the film is also stealing the kids

1334
01:14:55,600 --> 01:14:57,800
and putting them in the basement under the spell because

1335
01:14:57,800 --> 01:15:01,279
she's able to in some way through her raft sap

1336
01:15:01,399 --> 01:15:02,680
their youth and.

1337
01:15:02,840 --> 01:15:04,000
Speaker 4: To make herself young.

1338
01:15:04,039 --> 01:15:06,880
Speaker 3: Again because she has, cancer she's on the verge of,

1339
01:15:06,920 --> 01:15:09,760
death but she's become such a powerful witch that she's

1340
01:15:09,800 --> 01:15:14,039
able to, utilize, uh you, know the. Youth and it's

1341
01:15:14,079 --> 01:15:17,880
a form of cannibalism right, again which recalls, uh you

1342
01:15:17,920 --> 01:15:21,680
Know grim's fairy. Tales, uh what's the one where the

1343
01:15:22,000 --> 01:15:26,039
witch is cooking the kids and eating Them gretel And. Hans,

1344
01:15:26,239 --> 01:15:28,840
yeah it recalls. THAT i think that's what's going. On

1345
01:15:28,960 --> 01:15:31,960
but also in reality, AGAIN i, mean there are, people

1346
01:15:32,479 --> 01:15:36,079
whether we're talking about actual satanic, witches cults and, networks

1347
01:15:36,199 --> 01:15:40,880
or the overall vampiric nature of our, society feeding on,

1348
01:15:41,640 --> 01:15:44,239
uh the the, youth feeding.

1349
01:15:43,920 --> 01:15:49,800
Speaker 4: On, prey the predatory.

1350
01:15:49,800 --> 01:15:54,279
Speaker 2: Classes go, Ahead, yeah feeding on happiness and, enjoy feeding

1351
01:15:54,319 --> 01:15:56,640
On christian spirit.

1352
01:15:56,439 --> 01:15:59,760
Speaker 3: Garmin bosia exactly from, look.

1353
01:15:59,760 --> 01:16:02,079
Speaker 2: Look it's, horrible but look at The Charlie kirk thing just.

1354
01:16:02,079 --> 01:16:05,079
Happened there's this there's a vampirical element to how that all.

1355
01:16:05,159 --> 01:16:08,920
Happens AND i think that that the notion of that

1356
01:16:09,119 --> 01:16:13,600
it sends people into this sort of blood. Frenzy so

1357
01:16:13,840 --> 01:16:16,760
there's also the The Teeter peel aspect of, it which,

1358
01:16:16,800 --> 01:16:22,279
is you, know a sort of TRANSHUMANIST i, mean, YEAH

1359
01:16:22,279 --> 01:16:24,800
i was. IT i was. IT i met a ninety

1360
01:16:24,800 --> 01:16:26,520
one year old lady at church the other day with

1361
01:16:26,560 --> 01:16:29,560
the same birthday as me and asked, her you, know

1362
01:16:28,880 --> 01:16:32,039
we were just talking and she she's ninety one year.

1363
01:16:32,039 --> 01:16:34,279
Old lady said to, me, well they keep talking about

1364
01:16:34,279 --> 01:16:36,840
life extension drugs and HOW i can live. Forever BUT

1365
01:16:36,920 --> 01:16:39,119
i Think i'm just going to count my blessings to

1366
01:16:39,199 --> 01:16:40,640
the end of my. Days AND i was, like, yeah

1367
01:16:40,640 --> 01:16:43,119
you don't. Try you don't strike me as the Transhumanist

1368
01:16:43,119 --> 01:16:44,960
Peter teeal type. LADY i think IT'S i think you're.

1369
01:16:45,000 --> 01:16:51,680
Speaker 3: Okay, NOW i did want to mention before we move

1370
01:16:51,720 --> 01:16:56,479
into uh super chats and. Whatnot, guys Remember bla does

1371
01:16:56,520 --> 01:16:59,720
have a book Called. Runes let me ask you briefly about.

1372
01:16:59,720 --> 01:17:03,199
That told us about, it what inspired? IT i do

1373
01:17:03,279 --> 01:17:06,359
have it linked in the show description for The amazon

1374
01:17:06,399 --> 01:17:08,279
link there if you're interested in getting his Book.

1375
01:17:08,359 --> 01:17:12,159
Speaker 2: Root, yeah, thanks, MAN i appreciate. It this is a

1376
01:17:12,159 --> 01:17:19,680
book of. Poetry it's about eighty four. Pages It's megalomania

1377
01:17:19,920 --> 01:17:24,239
in The Third, Reich Imperial rome And troubles era In Northern.

1378
01:17:24,279 --> 01:17:27,479
Ireland and they are a series of WHAT i call persona.

1379
01:17:27,640 --> 01:17:31,199
Poems so one of the THINGS i wrote THAT i

1380
01:17:31,239 --> 01:17:33,840
first wrote this WHEN i was in grad school In

1381
01:17:33,880 --> 01:17:37,239
belfast twenty years, ago at the tail end of The

1382
01:17:37,319 --> 01:17:40,960
troubles and In Northern. Ireland and one of the things

1383
01:17:40,960 --> 01:17:45,199
THAT i was reading A Tacitus Suetonius RICHARD. J, evans

1384
01:17:45,880 --> 01:17:50,039
and one of the things that struck me is, that for,

1385
01:17:50,079 --> 01:17:53,479
instance we all know that when reading history it's almost

1386
01:17:53,560 --> 01:17:57,560
impossible to get a pure account of events in history

1387
01:17:57,720 --> 01:18:02,319
a truthful account, now and that's because there's almost always a,

1388
01:18:02,359 --> 01:18:06,680
disclaimer there's almost almost always a pseudo moralistic disclaimer about

1389
01:18:06,680 --> 01:18:08,439
the thing that you're, reading and look at it in

1390
01:18:08,439 --> 01:18:10,760
the light of this instead of what they used to,

1391
01:18:10,800 --> 01:18:12,680
have which were first person. Accounts so this is a

1392
01:18:12,760 --> 01:18:16,159
kind of pseudo first person account of. Events and each

1393
01:18:16,159 --> 01:18:19,800
of the poems is many of them are in a person's,

1394
01:18:19,880 --> 01:18:21,840
name so they are. PERSONA a lot of them are

1395
01:18:21,840 --> 01:18:26,199
in the first, person and they go into all sorts

1396
01:18:26,239 --> 01:18:31,279
OF i think situations of especially with megalabani as sort

1397
01:18:31,279 --> 01:18:38,000
of the guiding. Word BUT i JUST i see that you,

1398
01:18:38,039 --> 01:18:41,520
know the book was number. ONE i was the number

1399
01:18:41,520 --> 01:18:44,800
one living poet On Amazon poetry for about two. Days

1400
01:18:44,840 --> 01:18:48,600
everybody else ahead of me had been dead for four,

1401
01:18:48,720 --> 01:18:52,920
hundred five hundred, years and SO i think that ironically

1402
01:18:52,960 --> 01:18:56,279
says something about the state of. Literature you talk about

1403
01:18:56,319 --> 01:18:58,439
literature a lot on your share and especially in your

1404
01:18:58,560 --> 01:19:02,279
essays on your, website AND i think that it's important

1405
01:19:02,319 --> 01:19:07,680
that we look through the lens of sometimes of a

1406
01:19:07,800 --> 01:19:13,920
kind of fictional historical fiction or or parables for the

1407
01:19:13,960 --> 01:19:17,920
thing in. Parallel so sometimes it's difficult to look at

1408
01:19:17,960 --> 01:19:21,159
specific events from what we, read because we can't get

1409
01:19:21,199 --> 01:19:23,760
anything truthful, anymore so we look at them in. Parallel

1410
01:19:24,319 --> 01:19:27,199
SO i WOULD i hope people will buy. It it's Called,

1411
01:19:27,279 --> 01:19:31,840
runs and you, know runs came up. Today they've been

1412
01:19:32,680 --> 01:19:36,000
these sorts of things come. Up but they Are runs

1413
01:19:36,119 --> 01:19:42,199
are sign posts Of nordic vocabulary where letters are imbued

1414
01:19:42,239 --> 01:19:46,399
with the kind of spiritual potency and in a pagan.

1415
01:19:46,479 --> 01:19:49,640
Sense and so because the book partly takes place In

1416
01:19:49,640 --> 01:19:52,880
germany in the mid twentieth, century those things are kind

1417
01:19:52,920 --> 01:19:56,119
of sign POSTS i think for the human spirit and

1418
01:19:56,119 --> 01:19:56,600
where we are.

1419
01:19:56,640 --> 01:19:59,479
Speaker 3: Now awesome, Minute LIKE i, Said i've got a LinkedIn

1420
01:19:59,479 --> 01:19:59,920
and put in the.

1421
01:20:00,079 --> 01:20:02,720
Speaker 4: Chat it is in the show. Description my. Chance did

1422
01:20:02,760 --> 01:20:03,199
you See?

1423
01:20:03,479 --> 01:20:07,800
Speaker 2: Ballerina, no, NO i haven't seen. It we meant to

1424
01:20:07,800 --> 01:20:09,800
go see, it but had already. Left we gotta we

1425
01:20:09,840 --> 01:20:10,920
gotta go. See that's the job.

1426
01:20:11,039 --> 01:20:12,960
Speaker 4: Expect it is not what you expect.

1427
01:20:13,000 --> 01:20:15,680
Speaker 3: EITHER i you, Know i've seen the Other John wick,

1428
01:20:15,760 --> 01:20:17,840
movies AND i THINK i did a podcast on those

1429
01:20:18,239 --> 01:20:20,119
a couple of years, ago AND i mean they're just

1430
01:20:20,199 --> 01:20:20,720
kind of action.

1431
01:20:20,840 --> 01:20:21,640
Speaker 4: Movies for the most.

1432
01:20:21,680 --> 01:20:25,319
Speaker 3: Part there are some odd references and, parallels especially with

1433
01:20:25,359 --> 01:20:28,399
a sort of guild of assassins that now we learn

1434
01:20:28,560 --> 01:20:30,920
is a little more like a, mafia perhaps a little

1435
01:20:30,960 --> 01:20:34,439
more like a kind of cult or. Coven and in

1436
01:20:34,479 --> 01:20:36,560
this one they explicitly sort of bring in some of

1437
01:20:36,600 --> 01:20:40,319
the tropes and themes and imagery of M k ultra

1438
01:20:40,520 --> 01:20:43,319
programmed assassin type, stuff and we find out that, no

1439
01:20:43,399 --> 01:20:46,800
it's this, one it's a full on. Cult so there

1440
01:20:46,800 --> 01:20:50,079
were and runs and these sorts of things also coming to,

1441
01:20:50,119 --> 01:20:54,359
play including, witchcraft WHICH i didn't expect Because Boba yaga

1442
01:20:54,680 --> 01:21:00,439
Who's John, wick but also a manifestation of this sort

1443
01:21:00,439 --> 01:21:06,760
of feminine divine assassination justice Through Anna. Dharmas so it

1444
01:21:06,800 --> 01:21:08,960
goes in some odd, Directions that's What i'm trying to.

1445
01:21:09,000 --> 01:21:12,359
Say But runes and witchcraft popped up there THAT i didn't,

1446
01:21:12,399 --> 01:21:15,600
expect AND i also wanted to, mention as the super

1447
01:21:15,720 --> 01:21:18,800
chat here says From jeff Ten, dollars the point made

1448
01:21:18,800 --> 01:21:22,159
about the substitution of memes fort runs is an excellent.

1449
01:21:22,199 --> 01:21:26,840
Observation thank, you. Gentlemen, yeah there was some years ago

1450
01:21:27,279 --> 01:21:30,920
right around, it even before you, know meme magic was

1451
01:21:30,920 --> 01:21:34,319
a hot topic Through Jordan peterson talking about, it particularly

1452
01:21:34,319 --> 01:21:37,920
in regard to the usage of the grouper frog meme

1453
01:21:38,439 --> 01:21:41,720
to Promote Donald trump via Four chan as a sort

1454
01:21:41,760 --> 01:21:45,760
of joke candidate before the twenty sixteen. Election, again they

1455
01:21:45,760 --> 01:21:49,239
were studying even AT, ghq which is The british version

1456
01:21:49,239 --> 01:21:54,760
of THE, nsa the use of meme magic and how

1457
01:21:54,880 --> 01:21:58,760
memes can function in that same kind of way like

1458
01:21:58,840 --> 01:22:00,760
any icon or iconographic.

1459
01:22:00,840 --> 01:22:03,279
Speaker 4: Representation you might and they might.

1460
01:22:03,159 --> 01:22:05,439
Speaker 3: Call it image magic or idle magic back in the,

1461
01:22:05,520 --> 01:22:09,159
day And orthodoxy has a similar. Idea of, course we

1462
01:22:09,199 --> 01:22:12,399
don't think that they're, magical but that there is a

1463
01:22:12,439 --> 01:22:17,000
truth and a power to iconic, imagery iconographic imagery to

1464
01:22:17,119 --> 01:22:21,600
convey messages meaning in. Truth and you know the other,

1465
01:22:21,720 --> 01:22:27,279
side the evil people do the same. Thing so, memes icons,

1466
01:22:27,399 --> 01:22:31,159
imagery image magic so to, speak is another big part

1467
01:22:31,159 --> 01:22:32,600
of this with the element Of.

1468
01:22:32,680 --> 01:22:37,600
Speaker 2: Runes, yeah the the group in the twentieth, century The

1469
01:22:37,720 --> 01:22:43,840
nazis really convey this with their heavy reliance on symbolism

1470
01:22:44,039 --> 01:22:49,439
and this was maximally. Effective and one example of course

1471
01:22:49,600 --> 01:22:52,439
is the sig. Run you know they use the tote

1472
01:22:52,439 --> 01:22:54,760
and cough the death's head on the as the badge

1473
01:22:54,920 --> 01:22:59,960
on the hat of skull and. Bones but the sigroom

1474
01:23:00,359 --> 01:23:04,960
which is supposed to look like a lightning bolt and

1475
01:23:05,119 --> 01:23:09,399
is for a shock troop or. Stormtroopers really sort of you,

1476
01:23:09,439 --> 01:23:12,560
know conveys this sense mixed in With Wabelsburg castle and

1477
01:23:12,600 --> 01:23:14,920
The Black sun and all of these things where you

1478
01:23:15,000 --> 01:23:17,479
have a society of people that USES i, think what's

1479
01:23:17,920 --> 01:23:22,079
what's you, know there's a there are a few poems

1480
01:23:22,079 --> 01:23:24,840
in the in the. BOOK i should, mention by the

1481
01:23:24,840 --> 01:23:27,600
way that when People i'm not trying to change anybody's

1482
01:23:27,600 --> 01:23:30,359
idea about, poetry but one thing THAT i think is

1483
01:23:30,479 --> 01:23:33,039
important to note is that most people probably will never

1484
01:23:33,119 --> 01:23:35,760
own a book of poetry in their, house and SO

1485
01:23:36,319 --> 01:23:39,479
i try to you, KNOW i didn't try to make

1486
01:23:39,520 --> 01:23:41,520
it this, way but you, know one of the things

1487
01:23:41,520 --> 01:23:46,159
that's effective in language is the violence of. Language language

1488
01:23:46,199 --> 01:23:49,079
is ultimately on a Monopoetic it has a kind of

1489
01:23:50,039 --> 01:23:55,039
the words mimic. Actions and we see that language is so,

1490
01:23:55,119 --> 01:23:57,279
important you, know we think and dream in. Words but

1491
01:23:57,479 --> 01:24:01,359
in terms of where society becomes In united often has

1492
01:24:01,399 --> 01:24:04,119
to do with, language and so that becomes, potent especially

1493
01:24:04,199 --> 01:24:08,239
in terms of a militant usage in, diction and that

1494
01:24:08,399 --> 01:24:12,039
particular group of the twentieth century which mimics the very

1495
01:24:12,079 --> 01:24:17,079
same thing In Imperial rome is again packed in and

1496
01:24:17,159 --> 01:24:22,159
loaded with symbolism which is ultimately. Militant and so that

1497
01:24:22,600 --> 01:24:26,800
is a kind of proto version of meme magic, now

1498
01:24:27,159 --> 01:24:29,399
WHICH i think is going to, be you, know unfortunately

1499
01:24:29,439 --> 01:24:33,359
become more more prevalent in terms of what we're up

1500
01:24:33,399 --> 01:24:36,600
AGAINST i think in the. World another thing is THAT

1501
01:24:36,840 --> 01:24:39,640
i need to See ballerina because the stunts are done

1502
01:24:39,680 --> 01:24:42,880
By jackson Spy. Del he did all the stunt designs

1503
01:24:42,880 --> 01:24:45,199
for that and For John Wicki's John Wick's Stunt. Double

1504
01:24:45,239 --> 01:24:46,840
that was my sister's prom date for high.

1505
01:24:46,840 --> 01:24:49,000
Speaker 4: School oh, wow it's. Crazy.

1506
01:24:49,840 --> 01:24:51,920
Speaker 2: Yeah ARVIA dw.

1507
01:24:53,479 --> 01:24:56,920
Speaker 3: Five, dollars il y Slow boy whiteboard two. Dollars check

1508
01:24:56,920 --> 01:25:01,680
Out dangerfield's book. Runs got that link To Rachel wilson five.

1509
01:25:01,720 --> 01:25:05,279
Dollars everybody should subscribe To bla's channel right. Now he's

1510
01:25:05,319 --> 01:25:09,079
one of the underrated streamers on. YouTube i will give

1511
01:25:10,000 --> 01:25:13,800
that link if you're watching this, later it'll be tagged

1512
01:25:13,920 --> 01:25:19,520
in description after the. Stream jethrow, SAYS jd AND, bla

1513
01:25:19,760 --> 01:25:23,640
we need A Larry nickel impression from both of.

1514
01:25:23,680 --> 01:25:24,319
Speaker 4: You se was?

1515
01:25:24,359 --> 01:25:28,560
Speaker 2: Better, Well hillary was a witch AND i wanted to

1516
01:25:28,680 --> 01:25:33,960
tell You Alex hilary is a. Witch she was this

1517
01:25:34,119 --> 01:25:36,479
is my normal. Voice she was stuffing babies into the

1518
01:25:36,479 --> 01:25:37,520
carcass of a. Pumpkin.

1519
01:25:39,520 --> 01:25:40,279
Speaker 4: Exactly that's.

1520
01:25:40,319 --> 01:25:44,520
Speaker 3: Good let's see we might have some super chests over.

1521
01:25:44,520 --> 01:25:49,239
Speaker 4: Here let's see storm the cat ten. DOLLARS i have

1522
01:25:49,319 --> 01:25:50,920
seen a lot of horror, movies.

1523
01:25:52,640 --> 01:25:55,199
Speaker 3: But the only piece of media that has really spooked

1524
01:25:55,239 --> 01:25:58,840
me Was David bowie's final, Album Black.

1525
01:25:58,960 --> 01:26:02,119
Speaker 4: Star that's, funny it is. CREEPY i felt that it was.

1526
01:26:02,119 --> 01:26:04,760
Speaker 3: Satanic it kind of felt made me feel messed up

1527
01:26:04,760 --> 01:26:04,960
for a.

1528
01:26:05,039 --> 01:26:07,680
Speaker 4: Day, Yeah i'm not a big fan of that.

1529
01:26:08,079 --> 01:26:10,760
Speaker 2: Album that's a good. POINT i mean THAT i think

1530
01:26:10,800 --> 01:26:13,159
he really did wherever he was going in his, career

1531
01:26:13,239 --> 01:26:17,279
he definitely went back to a you, know a specific

1532
01:26:17,359 --> 01:26:19,399
kind of. Occultism he was A David bowie had been

1533
01:26:19,399 --> 01:26:21,439
A crowley and you know the song station To station,

1534
01:26:21,600 --> 01:26:26,319
yeah is a kabbala song from From kefer to. Malcof

1535
01:26:28,159 --> 01:26:31,359
so that in the interviews that he did with what's

1536
01:26:31,359 --> 01:26:33,239
the guy's Named Dick, cavott where he, was you, know

1537
01:26:33,319 --> 01:26:35,199
talking about WHAT i was. On you, KNOW i was

1538
01:26:35,199 --> 01:26:37,039
into all things WHEN i was In. Hollywood he's the

1539
01:26:37,039 --> 01:26:39,159
thin white. Duke SO i agree with. You it's a

1540
01:26:39,159 --> 01:26:41,239
pretty it's pretty dark that he went back there on

1541
01:26:41,239 --> 01:26:41,840
his final.

1542
01:26:41,640 --> 01:26:46,560
Speaker 5: Album David, bowie he's sketching out the kabaalistic tree, mate

1543
01:26:47,399 --> 01:26:50,199
glitch your rhythm ten. DOLLARS i always enjoy when you guys.

1544
01:26:50,319 --> 01:26:54,840
Collapse thank you appreciate. That uh black orthodox foot shoulder

1545
01:26:55,000 --> 01:26:57,720
one dollar a. Dire is it normal For greeks to

1546
01:26:57,760 --> 01:27:00,279
get wasted on? PASCA i was offered a drink three.

1547
01:27:00,319 --> 01:27:04,520
Am everybody usually parties On, pasco so probably.

1548
01:27:11,640 --> 01:27:13,760
Speaker 4: OKAY i do want to mention and ask you to

1549
01:27:14,520 --> 01:27:15,439
before we, GO.

1550
01:27:16,880 --> 01:27:19,920
Speaker 3: I was reading, something SO i was kind of, preoccupied

1551
01:27:19,960 --> 01:27:23,000
BUT i was able to watch here and there as

1552
01:27:23,600 --> 01:27:26,239
When jamie was Watching, eddington and she took a lot of.

1553
01:27:26,279 --> 01:27:30,199
Notes AND i want to know what your view Of

1554
01:27:30,319 --> 01:27:34,920
eddington is because it was really bizarre at least the

1555
01:27:35,319 --> 01:27:36,319
things THAT i caught from.

1556
01:27:36,399 --> 01:27:36,920
Speaker 4: It what did you?

1557
01:27:36,960 --> 01:27:37,159
Speaker 1: Think?

1558
01:27:38,359 --> 01:27:41,359
Speaker 2: Well at FIRST i, thought Like Sam hodde, says that

1559
01:27:41,439 --> 01:27:43,800
this was another ari ast. Film you know the guy

1560
01:27:43,840 --> 01:27:46,479
Born july, fifteenth another one of these. Guys sam, SAYS,

1561
01:27:47,560 --> 01:27:51,119
i you know we had both Covered? Novarata did he

1562
01:27:51,199 --> 01:27:53,680
do know that Was eggers and ARI ASTRAI i get

1563
01:27:53,680 --> 01:27:55,359
confused with BUT i didn't know what to make of.

1564
01:27:55,399 --> 01:27:57,399
IT i was kind of worried about going to see

1565
01:27:57,399 --> 01:27:58,680
it BECAUSE i thought it was just going to be

1566
01:27:58,720 --> 01:28:03,079
another critique of you, know people like us or. Something

1567
01:28:03,159 --> 01:28:06,479
it was going to make the guy who is an

1568
01:28:06,520 --> 01:28:10,439
anti corunka guy into a crazy. Guy and it did do,

1569
01:28:10,640 --> 01:28:16,840
that but it covered kind of a full gamut of the.

1570
01:28:17,079 --> 01:28:19,119
Situation at the, time it seemed to be a kind

1571
01:28:19,119 --> 01:28:22,399
of anti or meta or dark fairy tale for the.

1572
01:28:22,439 --> 01:28:26,079
Time and one thing that it ended up doing Was

1573
01:28:26,439 --> 01:28:29,439
They're the one key scene in the film was when

1574
01:28:29,479 --> 01:28:31,119
we all of a sudden get a point of view

1575
01:28:31,199 --> 01:28:35,760
of a private jet with a group OF Mk delta

1576
01:28:36,439 --> 01:28:41,039
operators or something that moves into the. Town AND i

1577
01:28:41,079 --> 01:28:44,439
think my take is that the entire thing is about

1578
01:28:44,479 --> 01:28:46,319
the people who are not in the, movie and that

1579
01:28:46,439 --> 01:28:49,039
is the people that are running the data. Center so

1580
01:28:49,119 --> 01:28:55,039
the data center is run by the tech overlords who

1581
01:28:56,119 --> 01:28:59,680
push a kind of chaos through this town as a test,

1582
01:28:59,760 --> 01:29:04,479
case and it brings out all the various elements of conspiracy,

1583
01:29:04,479 --> 01:29:09,039
world including the kind of lost single boomer wine mom

1584
01:29:09,600 --> 01:29:12,720
with the daughter who gets lost to A Charlie manson

1585
01:29:12,840 --> 01:29:15,000
cult guy and who ends.

1586
01:29:14,880 --> 01:29:17,640
Speaker 3: UP q tards and then they get in with like

1587
01:29:17,680 --> 01:29:20,880
this this new age kind of, uh you, KNOW q

1588
01:29:21,079 --> 01:29:21,840
shaman type of.

1589
01:29:21,880 --> 01:29:25,880
Speaker 2: Bro, yeah and she ends up as the what's the

1590
01:29:26,000 --> 01:29:29,800
What's Trump's White house? Staff the chief of staff lady's.

1591
01:29:29,840 --> 01:29:32,399
Name she ends up as that kind of. Lady she

1592
01:29:32,520 --> 01:29:37,479
ends up as an ARCH gop conservative influencer type who

1593
01:29:37,800 --> 01:29:43,479
is also living with the the carcass Of Joaquin phoenix

1594
01:29:43,640 --> 01:29:47,199
and cucking. HIM i guess with the young yoga type

1595
01:29:47,199 --> 01:29:50,159
guy just taking over the. Town AND i think the

1596
01:29:50,199 --> 01:29:52,840
events are so surreal towards the end of the movie

1597
01:29:52,880 --> 01:29:56,279
when the bloodbath happens that it's supposed to indicate that

1598
01:29:56,439 --> 01:29:58,840
you can't really trust what you're, seeing even in real.

1599
01:29:58,880 --> 01:30:01,159
Life so most of the movie is lived through. Phones

1600
01:30:01,680 --> 01:30:04,840
but then the phones. Start it's kind of like that

1601
01:30:05,319 --> 01:30:09,840
the thing about how you, know we live in a

1602
01:30:09,880 --> 01:30:12,800
triple post modern world where we've gone through The war

1603
01:30:12,840 --> 01:30:15,000
on the, self but no matter, what you still don't

1604
01:30:15,079 --> 01:30:18,159
use phones in your. Dreams and this movie kind of

1605
01:30:18,520 --> 01:30:20,960
crossed over that. Path it was, like not only are

1606
01:30:21,000 --> 01:30:23,840
they in our, dreams there the phones have become real

1607
01:30:23,880 --> 01:30:25,840
life and we could throw the phone away because now

1608
01:30:25,880 --> 01:30:27,600
what we see in real life ends up like we're

1609
01:30:27,600 --> 01:30:31,039
looking through a. Phone SO i thought it was a

1610
01:30:31,119 --> 01:30:36,079
kind of surreal anti fairy tale for a technocratic world

1611
01:30:36,119 --> 01:30:39,399
as seen in this like dusty this dusty.

1612
01:30:39,479 --> 01:30:44,279
Speaker 3: Testing it's like A, western you. Know and then it's

1613
01:30:44,720 --> 01:30:48,439
really about the placement of that data center.

1614
01:30:48,479 --> 01:30:50,920
Speaker 2: There it. IS i think the whole thing is about,

1615
01:30:50,960 --> 01:30:53,920
that and it's it's crazy that the movie begins with

1616
01:30:53,960 --> 01:30:57,439
this schizophrenic wanderer who kind of comes into town with

1617
01:30:57,560 --> 01:30:59,720
evil on him or, something and the whole town goes.

1618
01:30:59,800 --> 01:31:02,640
Great he brings the THE V i R u s with,

1619
01:31:02,800 --> 01:31:04,760
him and then all of a, sudden the town goes.

1620
01:31:04,760 --> 01:31:06,800
Crazy the world's going crazy on the. Outside it ends

1621
01:31:06,840 --> 01:31:10,720
up with this golden shining quantum facility in the, desert

1622
01:31:10,800 --> 01:31:13,439
like some new temple ball, temple or like The.

1623
01:31:13,560 --> 01:31:17,159
Speaker 3: Chaos this emerged out of the ashes The phoenix out

1624
01:31:17,199 --> 01:31:17,760
of the ashes of The.

1625
01:31:17,840 --> 01:31:18,359
Speaker 4: Chaos.

1626
01:31:18,760 --> 01:31:21,560
Speaker 2: YEAH i thought it was surprisingly well. DONE i didn't

1627
01:31:21,600 --> 01:31:24,359
expect it to do, that not that it was not

1628
01:31:24,479 --> 01:31:27,239
that it was on anybody's side or. ANYTHING i just

1629
01:31:27,279 --> 01:31:31,800
thought it was a pretty, truthful uh sort of, metaphysical you,

1630
01:31:31,840 --> 01:31:35,199
know story about the events that have unfolded and where

1631
01:31:35,239 --> 01:31:35,479
we are.

1632
01:31:35,520 --> 01:31:39,880
Speaker 3: Now, yeah this is a like you, said slow, boy,

1633
01:31:39,960 --> 01:31:43,159
THERE i don't Think i've ever dreamed about my phone.

1634
01:31:43,159 --> 01:31:45,560
EITHER i dream every, night every as soon AS i

1635
01:31:45,560 --> 01:31:48,119
go to, sleep immediately. Dream i've never had a dream

1636
01:31:48,159 --> 01:31:49,439
about a phone or my.

1637
01:31:49,520 --> 01:31:50,000
Speaker 4: Phone that's.

1638
01:31:50,039 --> 01:31:52,960
Speaker 2: Weird, yeah that's that's SOMETHING i think that people should

1639
01:31:53,760 --> 01:31:55,720
once you notice, THAT i think it's something to keep in.

1640
01:31:55,760 --> 01:31:58,600
Mind that's a THAT'S i think that's. Hopeful the moment

1641
01:31:58,600 --> 01:32:00,439
that we go into that is the moment where the

1642
01:32:00,479 --> 01:32:02,279
body mods are truly. Coming so.

1643
01:32:03,800 --> 01:32:05,960
Speaker 3: Bamba dill ten. Dollars i'm A. Baptist i'm interested in.

1644
01:32:06,039 --> 01:32:08,239
Orthodocously can't wrap my head around the perpetual virginity To,

1645
01:32:08,279 --> 01:32:10,319
MARY i don't want to lie to join the.

1646
01:32:10,399 --> 01:32:10,920
Speaker 4: Church have any?

1647
01:32:10,920 --> 01:32:13,239
Speaker 3: Advice, yeah you want to read the essay THAT i

1648
01:32:13,279 --> 01:32:17,880
put into the. Link it Is jerome's essay on the perpetual.

1649
01:32:17,960 --> 01:32:20,800
Virginity Saint jerome's essay is a. Classic, now, guys remind

1650
01:32:20,840 --> 01:32:23,880
you head on over To bla's channel. SUBSCRIBE i always

1651
01:32:23,880 --> 01:32:26,479
love catching up with him and doing these movie. Reviews

1652
01:32:26,520 --> 01:32:30,439
really good. Stuff tonight we'll pick some new films when

1653
01:32:30,439 --> 01:32:32,119
we can find some good ones to do in the near.

1654
01:32:32,199 --> 01:32:38,319
Future anything else other than your. Book we mentioned what

1655
01:32:38,520 --> 01:32:40,560
lit or films are you covering in the near?

1656
01:32:40,600 --> 01:32:44,359
Speaker 2: Future near, Future i'm Gonna i've covered half Of. Shakespeare

1657
01:32:44,359 --> 01:32:46,279
i've covered half of The Jack Bean, eira SO i

1658
01:32:46,279 --> 01:32:48,720
need to get back to covering some More. Shakespeare i'm.

1659
01:32:48,760 --> 01:32:52,520
Covering i'm Reading Northrop Fries Fearful symmetry right now On William,

1660
01:32:52,520 --> 01:32:55,880
blake which is a heavily esoteric, work And i'm seeing

1661
01:32:55,880 --> 01:32:58,000
a lot of literature through kind of through that lens

1662
01:32:58,279 --> 01:33:00,920
in terms of not my personal, lens but how he

1663
01:33:00,960 --> 01:33:04,039
describes it in the. Book probably gonna Do Paul Thomas

1664
01:33:04,039 --> 01:33:07,600
anderson's new movie coming out This, friday the one With Leo, oh,

1665
01:33:07,680 --> 01:33:11,359
yes a revolutionary type. Movie there's also A daniel Day lewis.

1666
01:33:11,359 --> 01:33:12,880
Movie he went to my drama, school So i'll be

1667
01:33:12,920 --> 01:33:15,880
seeing his, movie which is a movie about the troubles

1668
01:33:15,880 --> 01:33:19,039
In Northern ireland and getting married soon and Then i'll

1669
01:33:19,039 --> 01:33:20,199
be back In october To.

1670
01:33:21,439 --> 01:33:22,479
Speaker 3: Yeah thanks, man awesome.

1671
01:33:22,520 --> 01:33:25,680
Speaker 2: Ime my book by runs On. Amazon everybody please.

1672
01:33:26,960 --> 01:33:29,199
Speaker 3: And remember we have a show. Sponsor was this chalk

1673
01:33:29,239 --> 01:33:31,920
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1674
01:33:31,960 --> 01:33:34,680
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1676
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1677
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1679
01:33:47,439 --> 01:33:50,000
also get S R hollywood. Three it'll be coming out

1680
01:33:50,039 --> 01:33:52,319
in about two. Weeks should ship pretty.

1681
01:33:52,319 --> 01:33:53,760
Speaker 4: Soon that was from the.

1682
01:33:53,800 --> 01:33:56,439
Speaker 3: PUBLISHER i think you Said september twenty ninth is when

1683
01:33:56,479 --> 01:33:59,800
he expects it to. Ship that means if you ordered

1684
01:34:00,119 --> 01:34:02,319
From Jeff, bezos WHICH i hope that you never, do

1685
01:34:03,239 --> 01:34:06,039
you'll get it probably pretty. Quick if you order it from,

1686
01:34:06,239 --> 01:34:08,119
me you get a signed copy and.

1687
01:34:08,159 --> 01:34:09,840
Speaker 4: It'll come around that.

1688
01:34:10,000 --> 01:34:13,199
Speaker 3: TIME i can't, promise but already got hundreds of orders

1689
01:34:13,239 --> 01:34:16,079
in AND i thank you guys for your. Patients please don't.

1690
01:34:16,279 --> 01:34:18,960
Complain you don't have to. Worry i'm not stealing your

1691
01:34:19,079 --> 01:34:22,119
thirty forty. Dollars you will get your, BOOK i promise.

1692
01:34:22,199 --> 01:34:24,520
Speaker 4: You, otherwise, everybody have a great. Night thank you so

1693
01:34:24,600 --> 01:34:24,920
much being