WEBVTT 1 00:00:05.120 --> 00:00:07.919 Oh g is, folks, it's showtime. 2 00:00:08.640 --> 00:00:10.599 People say good money to see this movie. 3 00:00:10.919 --> 00:00:12.160 When they go out to a theater. 4 00:00:12.439 --> 00:00:16.199 They want closed soda, pop, popcorn, and no monsters in 5 00:00:16.239 --> 00:00:17.239 the projection booths. 6 00:00:17.359 --> 00:00:19.199 Everyone pretend podcasting isn't boring. 7 00:00:20.239 --> 00:00:41.079 Cut it off, Hey, folks, Welcome to a special episode 8 00:00:41.119 --> 00:00:41.880 of the Projection Booth. 9 00:00:41.880 --> 00:00:44.479 I'm your host Mike White. On this episode, I am 10 00:00:44.520 --> 00:00:47.159 talking with Bill Burke. He is the founder of the 11 00:00:47.200 --> 00:00:48.719 Optimism Institute. 12 00:00:49.039 --> 00:00:50.000 Talk to him a little. 13 00:00:49.799 --> 00:00:53.039 Bit about optimism and his podcast, talk a lot about 14 00:00:53.079 --> 00:00:57.320 his early days over at AMC N TCM aka Turner 15 00:00:57.359 --> 00:01:00.399 Classic Movies. Had a great time talking with me. Burke, 16 00:01:00.439 --> 00:01:02.280 and I hope we have a great time listening to it. 17 00:01:02.439 --> 00:01:05.480 Thank you so much and enjoy this interview. As somebody 18 00:01:05.599 --> 00:01:09.200 named Mike White, there's a lot of Bill Burke's out there, 19 00:01:09.480 --> 00:01:12.400 so yes, who are you Bill Burke? Tell me the 20 00:01:12.439 --> 00:01:13.519 Bill Burke story. 21 00:01:13.560 --> 00:01:17.400 Please. The most famous and growing up was Billy Burke, 22 00:01:18.040 --> 00:01:21.920 who played the good Witch of the Doors and apparently 23 00:01:22.439 --> 00:01:25.480 she had that funny movie Apparently that was her voice 24 00:01:25.920 --> 00:01:28.640 and she was just singing in the rain character. She 25 00:01:28.760 --> 00:01:31.640 was a big star in silent movies. And then I 26 00:01:31.680 --> 00:01:35.719 went they went to talkies that voice sidetractor. But anyway, 27 00:01:36.640 --> 00:01:38.959 I was sharing with you off the interview. I was 28 00:01:38.959 --> 00:01:41.920 born in Detroit and moved when I was only three 29 00:01:41.959 --> 00:01:44.079 years old, but it was a rabbit Detroit fan. Grew 30 00:01:44.120 --> 00:01:46.719 up around the media business, so my late father, we 31 00:01:46.719 --> 00:01:50.120 were in Detroit, sy ran radio station there WJR. Moved 32 00:01:50.120 --> 00:01:51.920 to New York where he built his career, and I 33 00:01:52.079 --> 00:01:55.319 grew up around media. Watched way too much television when 34 00:01:55.319 --> 00:01:59.560 I was a kid, loved movies, read the TV and 35 00:02:00.120 --> 00:02:03.879 variety of trades when I was like en and so 36 00:02:04.120 --> 00:02:07.079 just always. My dad didn't steer any of us into 37 00:02:07.079 --> 00:02:10.520 that world, but just naturally gravitated towards it, and so 38 00:02:11.159 --> 00:02:13.759 had summer jobs in the field. Took full advantage of 39 00:02:13.800 --> 00:02:17.680 the lucky connections I had, And then when I was 40 00:02:17.879 --> 00:02:20.159 getting out of business school, I wound up getting a 41 00:02:20.240 --> 00:02:23.680 job at Turner Broadcasting in Atlanta, and I was in 42 00:02:23.759 --> 00:02:26.520 charge of new business development. And probably a big part 43 00:02:26.560 --> 00:02:29.120 of the reason you ever found me was that business 44 00:02:29.120 --> 00:02:31.599 plan I developed. It was not my idea, but I 45 00:02:31.639 --> 00:02:34.159 developed a business plan the sort of numbers behind turd 46 00:02:34.159 --> 00:02:38.919 classic movies, and in the early nineties, cable was the 47 00:02:38.960 --> 00:02:42.120 wild West and Ted was the cowboy ready fire aim. 48 00:02:42.199 --> 00:02:45.879 We were just doing stuff and this got approved, this 49 00:02:46.000 --> 00:02:48.800 business plan, and I wanted to stay with the network, 50 00:02:48.840 --> 00:02:52.000 and my boss was like, he reported to Ted, they 51 00:02:52.039 --> 00:02:53.759 would just keep going and what do you mean, we'll 52 00:02:53.800 --> 00:02:56.759 start hiring people. So basically I was the de facto 53 00:02:56.879 --> 00:03:00.639 general manager when we started Turner Classic Movies and reporting 54 00:03:00.680 --> 00:03:03.120 to Gunny brad Siegel who was running T and T 55 00:03:04.120 --> 00:03:06.639 and so from there that was just the creatiest ride 56 00:03:06.960 --> 00:03:10.400 launching that channel, and then was promoted to run TVs Superstation. 57 00:03:11.199 --> 00:03:13.719 IF actually was in the new media part of Time War, 58 00:03:14.159 --> 00:03:18.439 but frankly got disillusion with big corporate life. Left are 59 00:03:18.800 --> 00:03:21.639 just started off for a while, then came back to Atlanta, 60 00:03:21.719 --> 00:03:23.879 ran the Weather channel companies for a couple of years, 61 00:03:24.240 --> 00:03:26.159 and then left there and moved back to Maine. Wanted 62 00:03:26.199 --> 00:03:29.319 to be a writer, maybe teacher. This a very long answered, 63 00:03:29.360 --> 00:03:31.039 a very quick question. Good. 64 00:03:31.919 --> 00:03:34.199 I asked for the life story. You've given it to me, though, 65 00:03:34.639 --> 00:03:35.840 this is pretty quick for that. 66 00:03:36.280 --> 00:03:38.479 Yeah, I gets self continent so then, But anyway, I 67 00:03:38.520 --> 00:03:40.599 wrote an article about leadership lessons I learned from Ted 68 00:03:40.639 --> 00:03:45.000 Turner sent it to him via his secretary twenty five pages. 69 00:03:45.280 --> 00:03:47.280 She called back in about five minutes and said, Ted 70 00:03:47.319 --> 00:03:49.520 wants to talk to you. And he gets on the phone. 71 00:03:49.520 --> 00:03:51.080 He said, I love what you wrote bound this says great. 72 00:03:51.120 --> 00:03:53.759 I want you to write my biography. It's the longest 73 00:03:53.759 --> 00:03:56.520 thing I've ever written, but you'd be great, So long 74 00:03:56.560 --> 00:03:59.759 story shorter. I wrote Ted's autobiography. I was just like 75 00:04:00.039 --> 00:04:02.879 ghost writer. Put my name on the coverage, generously called me. 76 00:04:02.960 --> 00:04:04.879 Ted came out two thousand and eight. That got me 77 00:04:04.879 --> 00:04:07.840 in a different path, which really was good for me 78 00:04:08.120 --> 00:04:12.360 storytelling writing. I actually co wrote and directed a back 79 00:04:12.400 --> 00:04:14.479 to Detroit doc to me about the auto bail out 80 00:04:14.520 --> 00:04:17.439 called Look Another Day. I came out twenty sixteen, I 81 00:04:17.439 --> 00:04:22.160 want to say. And it also my late father founded 82 00:04:22.160 --> 00:04:24.639 a minorleague baseball team in Maine that I oversaw for 83 00:04:24.680 --> 00:04:28.600 about fifteen years, Portland Sea Dogs Redstox Doba affiliate. As 84 00:04:28.639 --> 00:04:31.600 we were contemplating that, I did an academic fellowship with 85 00:04:31.639 --> 00:04:33.560 my wife called the Advanced Leadership in this Ship at 86 00:04:33.600 --> 00:04:36.319 Harvard University. It was an amazing program, and in that 87 00:04:36.439 --> 00:04:38.800 I started something called the Optimism Institute. I had this 88 00:04:38.879 --> 00:04:42.439 feeling that the world is getting more pessimistic than it 89 00:04:42.439 --> 00:04:44.040 should be. That it's not good for our health and 90 00:04:44.040 --> 00:04:47.160 frankly not good for our society. I'm having a terrific time. 91 00:04:47.199 --> 00:04:50.839 I host a podcast every week called Blue Sky Right, 92 00:04:50.879 --> 00:04:53.439 a few people working on the tough challenges made which 93 00:04:54.000 --> 00:04:56.560 make us pessimistic, but approaching them of the sense of 94 00:04:56.560 --> 00:04:59.639 optimism and solutions, and I'd been a great experience for me. 95 00:04:59.639 --> 00:05:04.639 I've loved that. I enjoy this whole podcast ecosystem through that, 96 00:05:04.759 --> 00:05:06.959 I think that's how I found you, Mike. I still 97 00:05:07.000 --> 00:05:10.519 love movies, and I don't run a movie channel anymore, 98 00:05:10.560 --> 00:05:12.920 but I have fond memories and I'm just really pleased 99 00:05:12.959 --> 00:05:14.759 to have this chance to talk to you in your audience. 100 00:05:15.519 --> 00:05:17.439 A lot of people do a little bit of a 101 00:05:17.439 --> 00:05:19.160 lot of things. It sounds like you do a lot 102 00:05:19.160 --> 00:05:21.800 of bit of a lot of things that'd be fair 103 00:05:22.279 --> 00:05:24.480 there you ask, it'd still be a little But yeah, 104 00:05:24.480 --> 00:05:27.600 I've been really lucky, and I do have a My 105 00:05:27.680 --> 00:05:29.839 podcast has a really wide range of. 106 00:05:29.920 --> 00:05:32.079 People, and I love that. I love to learn, I 107 00:05:32.120 --> 00:05:34.480 love to read actually think, and I've seen that in 108 00:05:34.519 --> 00:05:38.959 my optimistic people. They're interesting thread that I didn't expect, 109 00:05:38.959 --> 00:05:42.800 but one is a sense of lifetime learning. And Kelly Corrigan, 110 00:05:42.800 --> 00:05:44.439 who's a great writer. She was on my show and 111 00:05:44.480 --> 00:05:48.240 she said, well, yeah, it's a fundamentally optimistic position to take, 112 00:05:48.680 --> 00:05:51.720 to believe there's always more to learn. It is applied 113 00:05:51.800 --> 00:05:54.240 to movies. There's always another movie you haven't seen. It's 114 00:05:54.240 --> 00:05:56.040 always a great one you forgot about that you can 115 00:05:56.079 --> 00:05:58.399 see again. What a great way to go through life. 116 00:05:59.079 --> 00:06:01.399 So yeah, it's been a great experience for. 117 00:06:01.399 --> 00:06:03.800 Me being a movie fan. I used to be a 118 00:06:03.879 --> 00:06:06.600 huge fan of AMC and that used to be the 119 00:06:06.920 --> 00:06:11.480 channel and I would watched my first buster, Keaton on 120 00:06:11.560 --> 00:06:15.079 AMC when there was a marathon. How does AMC relate 121 00:06:15.160 --> 00:06:17.639 to TCM and how do those early days come about 122 00:06:17.639 --> 00:06:19.480 for you? For TCM, it. 123 00:06:19.519 --> 00:06:22.680 Was American Movie Classics. They were the incumbent, They owned 124 00:06:22.720 --> 00:06:25.759 the category. George Clooney's father was the host. 125 00:06:26.079 --> 00:06:27.439 Yeah, they were big. 126 00:06:28.120 --> 00:06:32.000 And what happened was Ted Turner bought the MGM. He 127 00:06:32.079 --> 00:06:34.920 bought all of MGM in the late eighties and then 128 00:06:35.000 --> 00:06:37.839 quickly realized he couldn't afford all of the MGMs. That 129 00:06:37.920 --> 00:06:41.160 sold off the working studio in a deal where everyone 130 00:06:41.160 --> 00:06:43.399 thought he was nuts because they didn't see the value. 131 00:06:43.759 --> 00:06:47.040 He kept the movie Library and that was not just MGM, 132 00:06:47.079 --> 00:06:50.800 but also pre nineteen forty eight Warner Brothers, so Casablanca's 133 00:06:50.839 --> 00:06:53.639 in there, and then I think it wasn't part of 134 00:06:53.639 --> 00:06:55.879 the same jaie. He also owned the RKO Library, so 135 00:06:56.000 --> 00:06:59.920 King Kong, Citizen Kane, and that was used to launch 136 00:07:00.759 --> 00:07:04.600 people forget That's TNT started as basically a kind of 137 00:07:04.639 --> 00:07:08.439 classic movie channel and some sports, and then it kept 138 00:07:08.480 --> 00:07:11.319 evolving to get more modern, more sports, had Sunday Night 139 00:07:11.439 --> 00:07:15.720 NFL briefly which we will forget NBA, And so these 140 00:07:15.839 --> 00:07:20.560 movies were collecting dust. Ted was also famously colorizing many 141 00:07:20.600 --> 00:07:23.600 of them, which is so polarized. We could talk about that, 142 00:07:24.000 --> 00:07:26.000 but a virtue of that was the first step in 143 00:07:26.040 --> 00:07:29.360 colorization is a pristine restoration of the black and white print. 144 00:07:30.040 --> 00:07:33.480 And so we had these classic movies that were collecting dust. 145 00:07:33.560 --> 00:07:37.639 And Ted was never a seller. He could have AMC 146 00:07:37.680 --> 00:07:39.360 would have paid a lot of money to run Gone 147 00:07:39.399 --> 00:07:42.240 with the Wind, but Ted didn't like that idea. And 148 00:07:42.319 --> 00:07:44.800 so the idea was like, what could we do with 149 00:07:44.839 --> 00:07:47.319 this stuff? And Brad Siegel came down to Atlanta. He 150 00:07:47.399 --> 00:07:51.639 actually had worked in programming at AMC. He understood that business, 151 00:07:51.680 --> 00:07:54.519 understood how valuable it was and we said, you know what, 152 00:07:54.560 --> 00:07:57.160 there's room for two of these channels, and most people 153 00:07:57.199 --> 00:07:59.600 don't know that AMC can't run Gone with the Wind 154 00:07:59.680 --> 00:08:02.439 or Citizen Kane or actually we had a license deal. 155 00:08:02.680 --> 00:08:05.879 They did get some RKO films, and so we decided 156 00:08:05.920 --> 00:08:08.399 to go right after them, not necessarily to knock them 157 00:08:08.439 --> 00:08:10.639 off the block, but to coexist. And so that's how 158 00:08:10.680 --> 00:08:14.240 it came about. And I was just so many stories 159 00:08:14.360 --> 00:08:16.120 we didn't know what to call it. One of our 160 00:08:16.160 --> 00:08:19.199 points of differentiation was going to be we had a 161 00:08:19.240 --> 00:08:21.040 line it doesn't have to be old to be classic, 162 00:08:21.560 --> 00:08:23.959 the we, for example, had because of MGM, we owned, 163 00:08:24.040 --> 00:08:27.040 Rocky we owned I can't remember some of the examples 164 00:08:27.079 --> 00:08:29.079 we used, but that's a good one. And so that 165 00:08:29.120 --> 00:08:31.519 was gonna be a point of differentiation. TNT had a 166 00:08:31.519 --> 00:08:34.480 franchise called Our Favorite Movies. At one point we thought 167 00:08:34.480 --> 00:08:37.320 about calling it our Favorite Movies. We actually had about 168 00:08:37.320 --> 00:08:39.360 five names we were going to put in a focus groups, 169 00:08:39.360 --> 00:08:41.720 one of them being Turner Classic Movies. And I was 170 00:08:41.759 --> 00:08:44.399 in charge of this, like twenty thousand dollars focus group 171 00:08:44.399 --> 00:08:47.200 in Ohio or something, and Ted got wind of the 172 00:08:47.200 --> 00:08:49.240 fact that we were spending money on a focus group 173 00:08:49.840 --> 00:08:52.600 and back when you still used to get typed memos. 174 00:08:52.960 --> 00:08:54.559 I wasn't even on the memo. You send it to 175 00:08:54.600 --> 00:08:57.840 my boss and my boss's boss. It's that Turner Classic 176 00:08:57.960 --> 00:09:00.519 Movies is the name of the new channel, and that 177 00:09:00.639 --> 00:09:03.799 was it. That was the entire memo. I called my boss, 178 00:09:04.279 --> 00:09:06.879 so I guess for calling off the fuckers scroops. So 179 00:09:07.200 --> 00:09:09.519 that's how we got the name. And then funny fast 180 00:09:09.519 --> 00:09:12.919 forward to the day of the launch. He's walking up 181 00:09:12.960 --> 00:09:15.840 to the podium in Times Square and he whispers in 182 00:09:15.879 --> 00:09:18.720 the ear of our pr person, is it Turner Movie 183 00:09:18.720 --> 00:09:22.039 Classics or Turner Classic Movies and he's in Turner Classic. 184 00:09:22.080 --> 00:09:25.000 We thanks, and he got it right in the announcement, 185 00:09:25.639 --> 00:09:29.919 so we pitched. Cable operators would say, why do we 186 00:09:29.960 --> 00:09:32.600 need this? And we tried to explain, not only do 187 00:09:32.720 --> 00:09:35.519 we now have the same movies, been way more movies. 188 00:09:35.559 --> 00:09:39.600 So AMC was repeating movies like crazy. They'd show them 189 00:09:39.639 --> 00:09:43.159 at eight o'clock, eleven o'clock, two o'clock, same movie. The 190 00:09:43.200 --> 00:09:45.600 old expression was they ran the sprockets off those movies. 191 00:09:46.279 --> 00:09:48.919 We are thing was we're going to show up to 192 00:09:49.039 --> 00:09:52.600 four hundred movies a month, different movies. You could do 193 00:09:52.600 --> 00:09:54.720 that because those older movies are shorter, but we had 194 00:09:54.720 --> 00:09:57.639 such a huge library, so the pitch was these could 195 00:09:57.679 --> 00:09:59.799 live side by side. And then eventually what happened was 196 00:09:59.799 --> 00:10:02.639 when we were head to head with them, we became 197 00:10:02.720 --> 00:10:05.120 the more popular channel. AMC saw the writing on the 198 00:10:05.159 --> 00:10:08.639 wall and that's when they morphed into something different. So 199 00:10:08.679 --> 00:10:12.440 I'd argue that too. It's one of those sometimes capitalism 200 00:10:12.519 --> 00:10:15.720 works in a good way. They're the best for everybody. 201 00:10:16.039 --> 00:10:19.000 TCM had this huge library and this incredible service, and 202 00:10:19.080 --> 00:10:21.600 AMC morphed into something else that was very valuable and 203 00:10:21.639 --> 00:10:24.600 everything went along well. So another long. 204 00:10:24.440 --> 00:10:26.840 Answer to a simple question, that's how it came about. 205 00:10:27.559 --> 00:10:30.559 Did you guys ever have any sort of problems with censorship, 206 00:10:30.559 --> 00:10:32.360 because that was one of the things I do remember 207 00:10:32.360 --> 00:10:36.120 from AMC was watching straight time the Dustin Hoffmann film 208 00:10:36.480 --> 00:10:40.200 and there being a lot of like forced zooms in 209 00:10:40.320 --> 00:10:43.440 order to avoid showing like MM at Walsh's butt. 210 00:10:44.279 --> 00:10:46.279 Yeah, that's a good question now, because that was the 211 00:10:46.320 --> 00:10:49.840 other thing. We said, we're going to be uncut, and 212 00:10:50.039 --> 00:10:51.440 we made a deal with Ted we are not going 213 00:10:51.519 --> 00:10:54.879 to show colorized movies. But no, and because we were 214 00:10:54.879 --> 00:10:58.279 not over the year and we weren't usually in basic 215 00:10:58.360 --> 00:11:03.240 cable packages an AMC and theory. So a lot of 216 00:11:03.279 --> 00:11:06.639 people aren't understand this subtle difference. But cable channels are 217 00:11:06.679 --> 00:11:09.559 not governed by the FCC only if you have a 218 00:11:09.879 --> 00:11:13.679 public license over the airwaves. When people say, for example, 219 00:11:13.720 --> 00:11:16.279 I heard recently something said Fox News, the FCC should 220 00:11:16.279 --> 00:11:19.519 crack down on them. They don't have jurisdiction. It's a 221 00:11:19.639 --> 00:11:21.600 cable channel, so we could do whatever we want. I know, 222 00:11:22.039 --> 00:11:25.240 we didn't censor. And one interesting thing that's been done 223 00:11:25.279 --> 00:11:28.480 since I left that I give TCM a lot of 224 00:11:28.480 --> 00:11:32.080 credit for. As you go back to these old movies, 225 00:11:32.080 --> 00:11:35.519 there are a lot of racially insensitive material. Stuff you 226 00:11:35.600 --> 00:11:38.320 look at now, Oh my god, it's in the old cartoons. 227 00:11:38.759 --> 00:11:42.039 And so rather they made a tough decision, but they said, 228 00:11:42.120 --> 00:11:45.960 rather than park these movies, we're going to run them 229 00:11:45.960 --> 00:11:49.240 with discussion. And they even did they do what I 230 00:11:49.279 --> 00:11:52.480 saw recently, the beautiful set up to Gone with the Win. 231 00:11:53.240 --> 00:11:56.080 You watch Gone with a Win today, it's, oh my god, 232 00:11:56.360 --> 00:11:59.120 it almost it doesn't quite glamorize slavery, but it comes 233 00:11:59.120 --> 00:12:02.519 pretty close. And so it was very thoughtful. Here are 234 00:12:02.559 --> 00:12:04.480 some of the objections people have to this film. Here's 235 00:12:04.519 --> 00:12:07.639 what the time was like, here's why we still think 236 00:12:07.679 --> 00:12:09.720 it's a classic. Here why we think it's worth watching 237 00:12:09.759 --> 00:12:13.080 and discussing. The handle it beautifully and I believe in that. 238 00:12:13.120 --> 00:12:16.039 I think rather than pretend these things didn't happen, show them, 239 00:12:16.080 --> 00:12:19.600 put them in context. So no, we were very keen 240 00:12:19.679 --> 00:12:22.320 on nowha interruptions. Another thing people did on television, we 241 00:12:22.320 --> 00:12:24.679 did it on TVs that people didn't realize. To make 242 00:12:24.720 --> 00:12:26.720 a movie fit a two hour time slot, there was 243 00:12:26.759 --> 00:12:29.000 a thing called rotoscoping. I think it's called rotoscope. You 244 00:12:29.039 --> 00:12:31.159 could speed it up and slow it down, so you 245 00:12:31.240 --> 00:12:33.840 do it in Westerns. If there's a panorama that took forever, 246 00:12:34.120 --> 00:12:36.840 you'd crank it up so it only took out ten 247 00:12:36.919 --> 00:12:39.320 seconds instead of thirty. We literally would do that to 248 00:12:39.360 --> 00:12:41.600 fit a timeslot. We didn't do any of that on TCM. 249 00:12:42.279 --> 00:12:45.120 We kept saying we're gonna we didn't. We use letterboxing 250 00:12:46.080 --> 00:12:49.799 and if people don't understand that, but especially before flight HCTVS, 251 00:12:49.799 --> 00:12:51.600 you have a square of TV. But these films were 252 00:12:51.639 --> 00:12:55.639 shot in a more horizontal sort of landscape mode and 253 00:12:55.720 --> 00:12:57.879 you have to put these boxes. And we have people 254 00:12:57.879 --> 00:12:59.240 calling and say, what have you done? That you wrote, 255 00:12:59.279 --> 00:13:01.759 you broke my TV. No, we're trying to show you 256 00:13:01.840 --> 00:13:04.720 the full sea. There were these old movies bing Ron 257 00:13:04.759 --> 00:13:06.919 where you couldn't see the two characters talking to each 258 00:13:06.960 --> 00:13:09.679 other because they were cut off. So we were really 259 00:13:09.720 --> 00:13:11.879 proud of that, and I think it's one of the 260 00:13:11.919 --> 00:13:15.799 reasons it's so esteem now in Hollywood circles. And we 261 00:13:15.840 --> 00:13:18.559 could talk about what happened when they threatened to cut 262 00:13:18.600 --> 00:13:20.879 the staff and the types of people who came out 263 00:13:20.879 --> 00:13:23.039 in defense, and turning Classic Movies knocked me out of 264 00:13:23.039 --> 00:13:24.080 my chair is pretty cool. 265 00:13:25.080 --> 00:13:28.399 The other thing that TCM has and AMC had this 266 00:13:28.720 --> 00:13:32.480 I can't remember. Wasn't Robert Osbourne on there? 267 00:13:32.919 --> 00:13:34.879 It was on turn Classic Movies. He was like right, 268 00:13:35.320 --> 00:13:37.120 so like Cloney was George Clooney's dad. 269 00:13:37.440 --> 00:13:39.879 Yeah, I'm trying to remember his name as well. But 270 00:13:40.440 --> 00:13:44.039 it was to have those guides and to have those 271 00:13:44.039 --> 00:13:47.480 little intros, sometimes up to fifteen minutes or even more. 272 00:13:47.519 --> 00:13:51.080 And then you have specialized shows where it's those folks 273 00:13:51.159 --> 00:13:53.440 are talking and going back and forth, and to hear 274 00:13:53.480 --> 00:13:56.279 those discussions it's always wonderful. But to get those little 275 00:13:56.279 --> 00:14:00.240 intros and to get that historical perspective, like you're talking about, 276 00:14:00.279 --> 00:14:02.600 like the kind of the warnings in front of things, 277 00:14:02.600 --> 00:14:05.759 but to get that little bit of historical perspective, to 278 00:14:05.799 --> 00:14:08.399 get a little bit of trivia or whatever it is. Yeah, 279 00:14:08.480 --> 00:14:10.679 those just make the movie sometimes. 280 00:14:10.759 --> 00:14:12.919 Yes, by the way, it is Nick Colooney. I couldn't 281 00:14:12.960 --> 00:14:15.600 remember his name as the dead handsome guy, just I 282 00:14:15.639 --> 00:14:18.159 guess Son and Brat. I get Brad Siegel credit for 283 00:14:18.200 --> 00:14:21.360 that because he understood the AMC model, and right away 284 00:14:21.360 --> 00:14:23.879 he said, we got to get Robert Osborne. He was 285 00:14:24.120 --> 00:14:27.159 one of our very first hires. Not only did he 286 00:14:27.240 --> 00:14:29.279 know the movies, he knew the movie stars. He was 287 00:14:29.320 --> 00:14:33.039 one of these guys who he stayed at Betty Davis's 288 00:14:33.279 --> 00:14:37.480 vacation house. He was a Paul Barrett somebody famous's funeral 289 00:14:37.519 --> 00:14:39.559 I can't remember which one. And having to be a 290 00:14:39.600 --> 00:14:42.519 lovely human being. He literally wrote the book on the 291 00:14:42.559 --> 00:14:45.320 history of the Oscars, just all that stuff. Other early 292 00:14:45.360 --> 00:14:48.480 hires we made were researchers who really understood the library. 293 00:14:48.480 --> 00:14:51.480 And there's this, you're one of them. There's people out 294 00:14:51.519 --> 00:14:56.879 there who know these movies inside out in spreadable passion. Yeah, 295 00:14:56.919 --> 00:14:59.279 and so you take and we had, frankly, you run 296 00:14:59.320 --> 00:15:01.960 that many movies really obscure movies and some that were 297 00:15:02.759 --> 00:15:06.240 old but not really classic. Think we're very good. They 298 00:15:06.240 --> 00:15:10.000 made bad movies back then too, but with an introduction 299 00:15:10.200 --> 00:15:12.759 the other thing we did, and frankly it was hardly 300 00:15:12.759 --> 00:15:15.080 to save money, but it was also really cool. When 301 00:15:15.120 --> 00:15:18.440 Ted bought the library, he got all kinds of assets, 302 00:15:18.440 --> 00:15:22.519 including the trailers, so we would instead of spending money 303 00:15:22.679 --> 00:15:26.080 on a team of people to cut original promos, we 304 00:15:26.159 --> 00:15:28.799 came up to these cool little framing divide literally frames 305 00:15:28.840 --> 00:15:31.039 around them, and we ran the trailers. Had some of 306 00:15:31.039 --> 00:15:34.000 these original trailers are hysterical on you you look at 307 00:15:34.000 --> 00:15:35.240 the old techniques they use. 308 00:15:35.600 --> 00:15:37.519 But it brought a lot to the service. 309 00:15:37.919 --> 00:15:40.960 Again largely just at first it was like this would 310 00:15:40.960 --> 00:15:42.240 be an efficient way to do it, and it's like, 311 00:15:42.279 --> 00:15:44.600 this is way more fun than if we did tonight 312 00:15:44.600 --> 00:15:47.279 it all on tournal closet movies. We we actually did some 313 00:15:47.360 --> 00:15:50.639 of that stuff, but the trailers are gold so that 314 00:15:50.759 --> 00:15:53.559 was fun too. But yeah, the studio intro, so one 315 00:15:53.600 --> 00:15:56.799 of our biggest expenditures we were very lead was spending 316 00:15:56.799 --> 00:15:59.639 money on the set that Robert was in. It really 317 00:15:59.679 --> 00:16:03.320 set a tone for the show for the network, and yeah, 318 00:16:03.399 --> 00:16:05.320 we're really proud of all that, but there's a lot 319 00:16:05.360 --> 00:16:06.320 of thought went into it. 320 00:16:06.919 --> 00:16:09.600 And then for you, obviously you've been in the media 321 00:16:09.720 --> 00:16:12.039 world for your entire life, but this must have been 322 00:16:12.279 --> 00:16:14.519 an educational thing for you. Even just seeing a lot 323 00:16:14.559 --> 00:16:15.279 of these movies. 324 00:16:15.480 --> 00:16:17.600 Moins, I had some sense, but I really dove in. 325 00:16:18.440 --> 00:16:22.320 And also it was wild to see the community that 326 00:16:22.440 --> 00:16:25.440 was out there. So when we first launched, we barely 327 00:16:25.480 --> 00:16:28.639 had any cable subscribers. It was a tough time. People 328 00:16:28.639 --> 00:16:30.759 are so used to streaming now, it's a totally different 329 00:16:30.759 --> 00:16:32.759 world than nineteen ninety four. When we launched, it was 330 00:16:32.759 --> 00:16:34.799 like getting on a grocery store shelf. There was only 331 00:16:34.879 --> 00:16:36.679 so much space, and if you wanted to get on 332 00:16:37.039 --> 00:16:38.480 the great nuts, we're going to have to come off 333 00:16:38.519 --> 00:16:40.200 for you to find a slot. At the beginning, we 334 00:16:40.240 --> 00:16:43.000 had very few subscribers, but if you had a satellite dish, 335 00:16:43.039 --> 00:16:44.600 you could pull down the signal. So a lot of 336 00:16:44.639 --> 00:16:48.200 our sands were that, and out of the blue, we 337 00:16:48.279 --> 00:16:52.679 started getting letters some Genie Jean Schalette had a home 338 00:16:52.799 --> 00:16:55.840 in western Massachusetts. I think at that point he was 339 00:16:55.840 --> 00:16:58.919 actually doing these Today Show segments for the young people 340 00:16:58.919 --> 00:17:01.399 out there. He was very well known movie critic on 341 00:17:01.440 --> 00:17:05.799 the Today Show and a celebrity Mike running down the 342 00:17:05.799 --> 00:17:08.359 little hallway. Gee, Charlo just wrote us a letter and 343 00:17:08.480 --> 00:17:10.319 he was amazing. He really levedy to do. We ought 344 00:17:10.319 --> 00:17:12.240 to show that movie because she was in that too. 345 00:17:12.559 --> 00:17:15.920 Really thoughtful, and then we realized there were this community 346 00:17:15.960 --> 00:17:19.200 out there. It was really cool and that was one 347 00:17:19.200 --> 00:17:21.400 of the ways we got distribution because we kept saying, hey, 348 00:17:21.440 --> 00:17:24.000 call your cable operator if you're missing this, call cable. Ever, 349 00:17:24.200 --> 00:17:27.640 we're showing movies you're not seeing on a MC cannabis 350 00:17:27.680 --> 00:17:31.599 ground swell that grew into a fan base eight years later, 351 00:17:32.160 --> 00:17:35.119 rushed to the network's defense whenever it's dropped from a system, 352 00:17:35.400 --> 00:17:38.000 or are they reading the paper that they're doing a downsize. 353 00:17:38.000 --> 00:17:42.880 I think this is incredible, and everything from hardcore old 354 00:17:42.920 --> 00:17:47.079 movie fans to celebrities to Ryan Reynolds came out of 355 00:17:47.079 --> 00:17:51.880 the woodwork and defended TCM from cutbacks. And Martin Scorsesey 356 00:17:52.000 --> 00:17:54.559 was an early fan because he's a huge film preservationist 357 00:17:55.240 --> 00:17:58.200 and he was an early advocate. Steven Spielberg. It was 358 00:17:58.279 --> 00:18:01.559 just amazing the range of people, and I think another 359 00:18:01.720 --> 00:18:06.160 service we provided was that curation, not just the introduction 360 00:18:06.240 --> 00:18:10.200 of films, but the programming the film noir showcase or 361 00:18:10.240 --> 00:18:13.039 a Star of the month, because frankly, even if you 362 00:18:13.079 --> 00:18:16.359 are a classic movie fan, even today with streaming, it's intimidating. 363 00:18:16.359 --> 00:18:17.920 Where am I going to find these? Which one should 364 00:18:17.920 --> 00:18:20.119 I watch? Wind up watching the same one over and 365 00:18:20.160 --> 00:18:23.160 over again, versus we would serve this up and here's 366 00:18:23.160 --> 00:18:25.720 a movie. Humphrey Boger was in the probably I haven't seen, 367 00:18:26.359 --> 00:18:28.799 so the discovery and a curation and so people can 368 00:18:28.880 --> 00:18:31.200 just say, let's turn on TCM and see what's on tonight, 369 00:18:31.519 --> 00:18:33.319 as opposed to us spend a half hour in the 370 00:18:33.319 --> 00:18:37.200 Blockbuster store on Netflix trying to find this movie. Yeah. 371 00:18:37.319 --> 00:18:40.160 I was really proud of what it became. I was 372 00:18:40.200 --> 00:18:43.160 there from the time it was approved, probably early ninety three. 373 00:18:43.200 --> 00:18:45.519 We went on the air in April ninety four, and 374 00:18:45.559 --> 00:18:47.680 I was done by the fall of ninety five moving 375 00:18:47.720 --> 00:18:51.480 over to TVs, So a lot of what I'm talking 376 00:18:51.480 --> 00:18:54.720 about was done by my successors but hadn't been there 377 00:18:54.720 --> 00:18:56.440 at the beginning. Just really proud of what it became. 378 00:18:56.559 --> 00:18:58.039 It's a really amazing thing to watch. 379 00:18:58.839 --> 00:19:00.960 So tell me more about the OPPOSM project and I 380 00:19:01.079 --> 00:19:04.200 know more about this and how that even came to you. 381 00:19:05.000 --> 00:19:08.880 Yeah, thank you. So I've always been, by nature a 382 00:19:08.920 --> 00:19:12.519 more optimistic person. That was funny. I remember being a 383 00:19:12.519 --> 00:19:15.720 brooding teenager like everybody else. And then out of the blue, 384 00:19:15.759 --> 00:19:18.599 my sister found my high school senior yearbook and my 385 00:19:18.640 --> 00:19:22.119 mom's basement. I didn't have a copy. It's your senior, 386 00:19:22.119 --> 00:19:23.920 I think, so go right to the back, and I'm 387 00:19:23.960 --> 00:19:27.400 looking at the class elections most likely to this best whatever, 388 00:19:27.960 --> 00:19:31.200 And they had a vote for class optimists, and it 389 00:19:31.240 --> 00:19:34.000 was me in another even forty years ago, with a 390 00:19:34.079 --> 00:19:36.480 stupid thumbs up. I guess I've always been this way, 391 00:19:37.279 --> 00:19:39.799 and I have been genuinely concerned. My kids are now 392 00:19:39.920 --> 00:19:42.960 twenty eight and thirty, and they have friends who think 393 00:19:43.000 --> 00:19:44.839 the world's going to end in thirty years because of 394 00:19:44.920 --> 00:19:49.839 climate change, and frustrated by political division, and all understandable, 395 00:19:50.519 --> 00:19:52.880 but I think all also a little bit extreme. And 396 00:19:53.000 --> 00:19:56.680 also I'm a history buff. I think also abs a 397 00:19:56.720 --> 00:19:59.720 good understanding of history and the things we've been through 398 00:19:59.759 --> 00:20:03.240 before four and how the world innecturably keeps getting better, 399 00:20:03.880 --> 00:20:07.240 and that when someone says this country's never been more 400 00:20:07.279 --> 00:20:10.240 divided than we are today, I quickly turned to the 401 00:20:10.279 --> 00:20:14.599