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Speaker 1: Welcome back, everyone to a new episode of You're Wrong

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with Molly Hemingway, editor in chief of The Federalist and

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David Harsani, senior writer at the Washington Examiner. Just as

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a reminder, if you'd like to email the show, please

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do so at radio at the Federalist dot com. We'd

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love to hear from you. Molly. It's been a pretty

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busy week.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it seems like we had a couple of weeks

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where things were just normal crazy, and then we picked

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up again into the what we saw in the early

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days of the Trump administration, which is a higher level

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of craziness.

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Speaker 1: I saw the MSNBC host his name escapes me, but

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he had to take a break because he said that

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things were just too crazy for him with Trump.

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Speaker 3: Was it Laurence o'donnald. I didn't see Lawrence o'donald. Okayea,

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Lawrence o'donald. I have to say I kind of understood

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what he was talking about. It gets a little bit much.

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I'm like, I don't even know what am I writing about?

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What happened yesterday? Who knows?

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Speaker 2: It's you know, in general, whether you're a journalist or not.

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I think taking a break from political chaos is a

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healthy thing for everybody to do. For sure, they should

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not wield their lives around politics.

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Speaker 1: But Molly, we cannot take a break today or right

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now because the purpose of this podcast is politics. So

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let's talk about the I don't know what to call it.

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I guess we'd call it the kerfuffle over the Trump

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administration's deportation of two to three hundred I'm not exactly short.

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The number is Venezuelans to uh to Venezuela who are

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accused of being gang members. Do you know the name

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of the gang?

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Speaker 4: Okay, let's back up just a second here, so you

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don't like how.

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Speaker 2: The Trump administration did send plane folds of Venezuelans to

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l Salvador, Salvador as part of an agreement they made

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with the President of El Salvador to how some of

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our worst elements who have illegally come to this country.

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So this was done under multiple statutes, but one of

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them is the Alien Enemies Act of seventeen ninety eight,

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which says that this act can come into effect at

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times of war. It can also come into effect at

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a time of predatory incursion and also invasion. I think, sorry,

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I don't have it in front of me, and so

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under the Act. Well, first off, Trump named members of

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the Trendeaarragua group a terrorist group. He said they were

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under they were classify as terrorists and they have some

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support from their nation state, which is Venezuela. There were

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also people I think involved in this which are with

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MS thirteen, which is another really bad group that is

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not like a typical criminal gang in that they engage

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in terrorism or the attacks on people who are unrelated

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to their criminal enterprise as a form of threat and intimidation. Anyway,

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the Venezuelans I think were the Trende Arragua people, and

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they were deported and a judge, someone representing the interests

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of the people who are being deported, tried to stop it.

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And this one Judge Boseburg, was like, yeah, you're going

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to stop that right now. I'm putting a temporary restraining

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order under on you right now. And even if the

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planes are in the air, you have to turn them around. Sorry,

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I just wanted to get that part of the story out.

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Speaker 1: I hear you, I hear yeah. That's all. That's all right.

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The uh, the Alien Enemies Act has only been enacted

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three times in history, right, the War of eighteen twelve,

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World War One, and World War Two. I know where

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you stand on this. I think, do you think it's

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unreasonable to have some concerns about enacting this, about ignoring

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a judge's order even if he's wrong, because if he

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is wrong, then a higher court will over you know,

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will overturn his decision. And those are concerning concerning things.

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To me. I'm not concerned about getting rid of these guys.

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I don't think Trump is inventing a group, you know,

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is trying to get rid of, you know, an immigrant

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who is completely peaceful. I'm sure these people are criminals,

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and I'm sure they're terrible people, and I want them

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out of the country. But don't you have any concerns

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about the precedence that this kind of thing sets moving forward,

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especially using this law. I don't care how old it

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is or not old it is, but I do care

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that it's properly enacted. I don't feel like we're in

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a time of war, and I don't feel like it's

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especially different today than it was five years ago as

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far as predatory aliens in the country. But anyway, so

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it's just two things.

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Speaker 2: One the actions are being undertaken under multiple authorities, and

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to a time of war is just one of the things.

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The triggers the Alien Enemies Act, also incursions and invasions.

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And the question that is everybody roiled right now is

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whether a solitary inferior Court judge can take over operations

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like this. You know, he says, I don't care if

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the plane is in the air, you're going to turn

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it around. I just want before we talk about the

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balance of powers issues in play. I think it's also

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important to just think about the facts of the case.

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But we talked last week about Supreme Court stuff, and

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there are constitutional scholars that are totally theory based. They're

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like autistic for theory.

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Speaker 4: And then there are.

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Speaker 2: People who do constitutional law who care a lot about

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the underlying facts of a given case. And whether you're

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SKILLI alike in being focusing on principle and just writing

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that to the ends of the earth and whatever tests

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are in play for that, or whether you think that

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you should look at the actual case at hand. That's

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kind of one of the debates you see on the

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Supreme Court.

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Speaker 1: Anyway, I want the autistic people because because yeah, I'll

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keep going.

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Speaker 4: Sorry, go ahead, go ahead, no.

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Speaker 1: Because then everything becomes malleable. This is just like how

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liberals treat the Constitution. Vern Obama said that we have

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to inject empathy or something into the rulings. I mean,

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this reminds me of you know, this reminds me of that.

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I think there's a place in time for them that's

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in legislation and in governing, not in thinking about the law.

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But anyway, I'm sorry interrupted you. You know you were

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moving from if.

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Speaker 2: You forgive me another tangent really quickly. Do you know

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the Bostock ruling that was causing a lot of drama

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a few years ago, in which Gorsich said that sexual

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orientation and transgender status were included in the Civil Rights

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Act when they said no discrimination on the basis of sex,

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And he took this very hyper literal, autistic approach to

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reading that law to say, well, like his whole thing

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when this was something Justice Kagan had introduced in oral

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argument was to say that like, let's say someone has

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a party and they discriminate against gay people, and one

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of the people there says that their wife is coming

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to the party, and if the wife, sorry, if this

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is one of the people there says their spouse is

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coming to the party, and if the spouse is a

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wife or the spouse has a husband, if that a.

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Speaker 4: No, wait, sorry, you might need to clean this up.

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Speaker 2: He's like, let's say there's someone at the employees The

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employee at the party says their spouse is coming, and

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the employer is like, great, And it turns out that

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the spouse is a man versus a woman. That's discrimination

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on the basis of sex. And so therefore the Civil

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Rights Act includes prohibitions on discrimination on the basis of

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gender orientation or same sex attraction status. And the thing was,

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Congress had thought a lot about whether to include those

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provisions and had decided not to. And further, there's a

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lot of evidence that at the time that the Civil

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Rights Act was enacted that nobody even knew of gender ideology.

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And they also allowed federal laws discriminating against gay people

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in federal employment. So the argument was absurd, but it

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was hyper literal. And you see then the problem with

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being hyper literal and how you sometimes have to think about,

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like a little bit about context.

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Speaker 1: Of course, I don't mean you should never have any context.

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I think that people also get the Constitution wrong, right.

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I mean there are decisions I think people are being

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hyper literal and maybe they're not getting the meaning. I'm

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not saying that any of this is perfect. I'm saying

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that we and the argument I see a lot from

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now from people defending Donald Trump and this situation is

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like he can ignore the court because he has decided

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that what he's doing is constitutional. And that's fine. And

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I actually think what he's doing is probably constitutional. But

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that doesn't mean we ignore judges and don't go to

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a higher court, which will either we have autional crisis

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if higher courts say it's not okay, not right now.

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Speaker 2: Some team has actually shown itself to be working with

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this judge quite a bit, even as they say we

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don't recognize your authority to question like there is there

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are certain things that are considered non justiciable, which means

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they're not for judicial review. And this case actually deals

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with one of the areas which is under this Act

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the authorities granted to the executive This has been reviewed

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by the Supreme Court, and the Supreme Court has affirmed

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that this is that the balance of powers goes to

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that the executive branch gets to handle this stuff without

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it being under judicial review from every podunk judge on

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Earth on the plane issue, Like, I think it does

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help explain why the Supreme Court views certain things as

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non justiciable. So let's say that the judge says, turn

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that plane around right now, and let's say that the

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plane has enough fuel to land in Venezuela or in

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land in El Salvador, but not enough fuel to return

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to the United States. Does that mean that Donald Trump

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has to follow that order?

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Speaker 1: I don't know. I don't know.

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Speaker 2: Say there are sensitive issues that have been handled by

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Marco Rubio and the leaders of foreign governments that are

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clearly you know, clearly in Article two of the Constitution

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and not Article three, and that the judges order contra

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judges order actually makes it an intolerable incursion on Article

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two authorities and responsibilities.

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Speaker 5: What are you.

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Speaker 1: Situation exactly exactly. I am not, I am not. I'm not.

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People are going to write this show, They're going to

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write us email, They're gonna yell at me about something.

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The case I'm not making. I could already see it.

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I understand the administration's position. I actually am sympathetic to it.

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It's the argument, it's the backstopped arguments that I'm seeing

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from administration officials. Actually are people connected to Trump that

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they have a right to simply ignore courts and that's

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just fine just because someone acts on constitutionally, well, Congress

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acts on constitutionally sometimes and they're overturned by the courts.

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The resident has a good case here. Do these aliens

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have a right to judicial review? You're saying not. I'm

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not a scholar. I don't know that much about this law.

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But that is a reasonable issue, I think to adjudicate

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in a court. Don't you think so?

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Speaker 2: That is the that is the issue here, and I

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would say no, this has already been decided by the

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Supreme Court. I think the remedy if you think that

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Donald Trump should not protect Americans from violent terrorist organizations

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is to impeach him. If you think so, there's all

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you know. That's the actual proper course is to go

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to Congress and have them try to impeach Trump for

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deporting trend Are Ragua and MS thirteen.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you're flippantly like, I no, you do you loaded

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that question up? What if I said I want to

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impeach Donald Trump because he's ignoring the judicial branch that

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would be a better I think case that he wants

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venezuela and killers.

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Speaker 2: You don't have a case that he's ignoring. I mean

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he's responding to every single thing. You've got the top

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Justice Department officials responding to every single thing, not just

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on this case, but on literally a hundred cases that

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they are having to fight to just to just to

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retain their Article two authority.

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Speaker 1: It's an airing problem besieged.

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Speaker 2: By billionaire funded lawsuits every step of the way. And

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the reason why this is an issue is because of

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a recent problem where inferior court judges are issuing global

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injunctions on the activities of the of the Article two branch.

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And that's inappropriate and it actually needs to stop, and

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the Supreme Court needs to stop it. And you have

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had multiple justices writing that they think this is something

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that could get out of control. Like for years now,

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they're saying, these global injunctions are a massive problem, and

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they really rose up people judges nominated by both parties

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do them, but they kind of rose up during the

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first Trump administration as a major major issue. And it

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also is flooding the Supreme Court's emergency docket. It's making

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things really untenable in terms of rule of law and

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balance of powers. And so the Supreme Court should issue

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some very strong guidance and like one of the things

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they could do this doesn't affect this case, but to

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just tell judges that if they're going to do an injunction,

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they could do it just in their sphere of command,

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as opposed to a global injunction, like just on the

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cases that have been brought or in the area that

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they oversee, not nationwide or throughout the world.

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Speaker 1: I hear what you're saying. I just think it's a

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dangerous precedent to set. For instance, Mahmud Khalil is being deported.

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He is going to go in front of a judge, right,

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there's due process for him. He's not just thrown on

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a plane. Let me give you an example. If we

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have a president like Joe Biden or when you don't

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trust and he just says this class of alien, which

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is what this is about, can be deported because we're

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in war and without any kind of due process. I

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think that's something we need to think about enacting so easily.

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Let's remember in World War One, Wilson threw anti war

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protesters as a class into prison, and we barely had

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any due process.

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Speaker 2: Here's a difference between anti war protesters as a class

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and illegal immigrant terrorists.

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Speaker 4: As a class.

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Speaker 1: I know that one is one is criminal and evil

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and the other is just a political speech. My point

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is that no one has prosecuted any of these people

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as terrorists. You know what I'm saying. It's just the

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president's word on it. But we have to laws.

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Speaker 2: There are laws governing the designation of classes as terrorists.

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Those laws were followed, right.

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Speaker 1: The Venezuelan group that he says terrace has never been

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prosecuted under any terrorism law.

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Speaker 4: That's it's a different. That's a different.

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Speaker 1: It's a unilateral But so then it's just a unilateral

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admit a presidential move, right, it's not, which is.

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Speaker 4: Why if you have a problem with it.

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Speaker 2: To me, the appropriate recourse is to impeach the president.

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Right and Article one, which is I think are should

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be our best, most superior branch should take an active

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role if they have a problem, and if the people

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have a problem with.

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Speaker 4: This, and they might.

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Speaker 2: Now, when you say, what would you do if a

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president you didn't like deported a class of non citizens?

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And I have to be honest, like, this is what

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I learned with.

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Speaker 4: The Khalil thing. What is his name? Khalil Muchmud, Mahmud, Khalil, muckmud, Khalil.

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Speaker 2: Sorry, I there are people I greatly respect who are

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mortified by the Rubio deportation plan. There they say this

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is a horrible incursion on free speech, that just because

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he supports Hamas and has been a ringleader of destabilizing

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campus protests, this does not mean that we should have

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the right or ability to deport him.

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Speaker 4: And I.

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Speaker 2: Realize, like I have extremely different ideas about the due

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process protections for citizens and non citizens. I think almost

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like the two shouldn't meet. We're in a contract with

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fellow citizens, and it's hard enough to keep that going

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when it applies to non citizens, even if they're here

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legally as he is, even if they were awarded a

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green card, which is like a very nice gift to

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have given someone like him.

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Speaker 4: I still don't think that that's the same. Now.

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Speaker 2: I'm not freaking out about the due process that he's

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being afforded because he's here legally, But when you're getting

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to criminal violent terrors, terrorists and gangs who are here illegally,

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I just just.

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Speaker 1: Don't I agree, I don't think about it. Non citizens,

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we should be able to deport them for almost any reason.

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We feel like if they don't, we don't think they

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belong to Illegals and criminals for sure, should be just

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checked out of this country immediately. I'm trying to make

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a theoretical point to you, and this is autistic theoretical

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points that you were mentioning before the president unilaterally maintains

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there's a group of people in this country who are terroristic.

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I think he's right about these people from as far

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as I can tell. But he can just say it,

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and there's no way without due process to make sure

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that that is true.

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Speaker 4: Well done.

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Speaker 2: He did follow the law in designating them that way,

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but he can just.

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Speaker 1: Do that unilaterally. And what I'm saying is, do you believe, Well.

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Speaker 2: It's not it's like acting like he just came up

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with it in out of nowhere. There's a law that

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has a process by which a president may do this

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that was passed by Congress and signed into law by

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the Senate, and he followed that, sorry, sign into law

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by the President, and he followed that. And so it's

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not just like a unilateral thing. You have a process

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here that's been followed. That's actually okay.

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Speaker 4: I think.

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Speaker 1: I also concerns me that we're not actually in a

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war and that we're using a law that is meant.

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I know it has other facets, but it is really

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an extraordinary first of all, incredibly abused law like Wilson

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abused that law and a FDR abused that law. And

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I'm just I just worry about that stuff, and I

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think it's reasonable to worry about that stuff. I'm not

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saying in the end, Trump's not right. I'm just saying

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that this idea that you can well it's his name,

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Holman or whatever. The immigration He's like, I don't care

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what judges say. Well, you're just the bureaucrat. You don't

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get to say you don't care what judges say.

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Speaker 2: I did not see him say that, but I did

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see him respond to a reporter saying, wasn't this law

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passed in the eighteenth century? And he said, you mean,

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like our constitution? And I thought that was a good response.

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I also want to highlight the difference between this act,

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which you say is a problem because of how it's

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been used by bad presidents, but compare it to the

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Logan Act, which we which was also in eighteenth century

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law that has never been used effectively or successfully, and

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was used to run the Russia collusion hoax against Americans.

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And I don't remember the Washington Post saying that it

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shouldn't be used because it was old and had never

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been tested by the Supreme Court.

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Speaker 1: You know, no, I no trust me. I agreed that

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there's a hypocrisy. In fact, I think the Logan Acts

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probably should unconstantitutional. Actually think the Alien ins edition actually

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be unconstitutional as well. I just I think there needs

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to be better protections. But I know that is what

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it is. It's the law. I get it. I'm not

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you know.

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Speaker 1: Now, I want to talk about John Roberts. You know

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so John Roberts, he came out any you know, and

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he said that you know, in two hundred years, you

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know what did he say? The precedent is for more

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than two centuries. It has been established that impeachment is

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not an appropriate response to disagreement concerning a judicial decision.

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The normal appellate review process exists for that purpose. I

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agree with the latter part of that statement. But the

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impeachment processes as how I understand it, again, not no

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constitutional scholar. Here is a political action. So if I

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decide and voters decide that they want to impeach a judge,

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a justice, a politician, a president, but it really is

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a political decision, do you agree with that or not?

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Speaker 4: I don't.

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Speaker 3: So.

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Speaker 2: I think that judges, federal judges serve lifetime.

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Speaker 4: I should say sentences terms.

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Speaker 2: They have lifetime appointments for good behavior, meaning not if

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you disagree with their decision, but if they've done something

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to violate the integrity of the institution that they serve in, that's.

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Speaker 4: When you can impeach them.

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00:24:06,759 --> 00:24:09,640
Speaker 2: That's different than just saying I don't like this person

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or I don't like this decision. The whole point of

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the lifetime appointment is to protect judges from from people

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just disagreeing with a particularly controversial decision and retaliating against them.

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But that does not mean that I agree with John

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Roberts here. For a few different reasons. First and foremost,

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he just should.

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Speaker 4: Not be weighing in on this.

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Speaker 2: It's inappropriate for the reason that you said, right, it's

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a legislative question. He's the chief Justice of the Supreme Court,

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that's in a different branch. It's not really for him

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to opine on this. It's also inappropriate because he's probably

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going to oversee some cases dealing with this very dispute,

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and to weigh in against one of the parties in

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such a prejudicial manner like he did unnecessary today is

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just wrong. But then, more than anything, I would say,

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the case is not that Boseberg should be impeached because

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people disagree with his decision. The case is that he's

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unconstitutionally taking authority from a different article branch of God.

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Speaker 1: It didn't take any authority hold on.

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Speaker 2: He actually did when he's telling the President how to

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00:25:32,160 --> 00:25:37,319
run operations involving a hostile foreign government. That's not his role.

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That is an article to branch authority. And that's the

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entire crux of the debate. Now, you can say you

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can you can disagree with what I just said there,

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but the debate is not about disagreement with a decision.

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It's about disagreement about whether he has any role here

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00:25:54,480 --> 00:25:59,680
at all whatsoever. That's the Is this justiciable is the issue.

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00:26:00,160 --> 00:26:08,359
And Trump's position is that the judge is unconstitutionally taking

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this power.

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Speaker 4: So it's not so.

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Speaker 2: Roberts was wrong in how he assessed the actual nature

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of the argument.

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Speaker 1: I think if Roberts would probably viewed as that he

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is defending his branch of the government. It was a

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pretty neutral statement as far as it goes. He was

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just saying that the proper appropriate is this and this,

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which you actually agree with, and I disagree with because

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I don't know when the last time we had an

447
00:26:33,480 --> 00:26:38,119
impeachment over high crimes and misdemeanors. Most impeachments are politically motivated.

448
00:26:38,200 --> 00:26:41,880
Every Trump impeachment was politically motivated, and nothing, there's nothing

449
00:26:41,920 --> 00:26:45,680
to stop you from doing that. It's become a political tool.

450
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But I'm just doing this to be yelled at by

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all the listeners.

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Speaker 2: I a really important thing, But I would like to

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push back, if you don't mind, on this Alien Enemies Act,

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which is the thing at issue.

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Speaker 4: Yes, it's an old law.

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00:27:02,440 --> 00:27:06,000
Speaker 2: It can only be invoked by the president or executive

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00:27:06,039 --> 00:27:12,839
branch under certain conditions. The president must make a public

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00:27:12,920 --> 00:27:16,480
proclamation about the incursion or invasion or war. And he

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00:27:17,079 --> 00:27:20,039
did that, and then he has the authority. It's pretty

460
00:27:20,039 --> 00:27:24,359
extraordinary to declare that these things are occurring and that

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he can remove these people. The sorry, I'm trying to

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00:27:34,200 --> 00:27:37,039
find something here about okay. So the case that looked

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00:27:37,039 --> 00:27:40,759
into this was Ladeki versus Wadkins, in which Harry S.

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Truman invoked the Act three years after World War Two,

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and the Supreme Court was very clear that the Acts

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removal powers extend beyond times of war or even warlike actions,

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and that it was the president's power alone to invoke

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the Act, and that it involves matters of political judgment.

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00:28:07,960 --> 00:28:10,839
This is a quote, matters of political judgment for which

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judges have neither technical competence nor official responsibility. So these

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00:28:16,759 --> 00:28:20,759
are the separation of powers issues. Now it gets into

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whether you can do a temporary restraining order like Boseburg

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is trying to do. But the argument of the Trump

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team is that Boseberg has no authority to even consider

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a temporary restraining order, that he has no authority to

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turn government aircrafts around in mid flight, that he does

477
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not have the authority to substitute his judgment for these

478
00:28:44,480 --> 00:28:48,119
incursions for the presidents, and that he has no authority

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to issue a nationwide injunction.

480
00:28:54,920 --> 00:28:57,759
Speaker 4: And that's the issue. It's not like a decision. It

481
00:28:57,799 --> 00:28:59,720
wasn't even we didn't even reach a decision. It was

482
00:28:59,759 --> 00:29:00,559
just a order.

483
00:29:01,119 --> 00:29:05,319
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's an order to review whether these people need

484
00:29:05,519 --> 00:29:09,039
do process. I don't agree. Maybe he's wrong, but it's not.

485
00:29:09,920 --> 00:29:12,599
And maybe he's wrong about the plane specifically, like maybe

486
00:29:12,640 --> 00:29:17,039
he has no business stopping them, But I just you're

487
00:29:17,240 --> 00:29:19,519
the thing is that you just had a Schmorgsborg of

488
00:29:19,559 --> 00:29:23,400
things that are a problem, right, but they're all all different.

489
00:29:24,039 --> 00:29:28,400
Stopping a plane, Yes, ordering judicial review seems well within

490
00:29:28,440 --> 00:29:29,279
the bounds of.

491
00:29:30,079 --> 00:29:32,200
Speaker 2: Why do you okay, But that's why I said, the

492
00:29:32,200 --> 00:29:34,759
Supreme Court says it's not subject too.

493
00:29:34,880 --> 00:29:38,599
Speaker 1: So the Supreme Court said that abortion was an issue

494
00:29:38,599 --> 00:29:40,559
of privacy and they were wrong. That doesn't mean that

495
00:29:40,599 --> 00:29:42,680
you can never have a case that takes it back

496
00:29:42,680 --> 00:29:45,599
to the Supreme Court to either clarify what this is

497
00:29:45,640 --> 00:29:48,079
about or to say that the law it self might

498
00:29:48,119 --> 00:29:49,200
be unconstitutional.

499
00:29:50,359 --> 00:29:53,839
Speaker 4: I think you can attempt to challenge that. I do.

500
00:29:54,559 --> 00:29:58,119
Speaker 2: But for the Supreme Court's decision to have any meaning,

501
00:29:59,119 --> 00:30:04,640
you have to follow until such time as it's successfully overturned.

502
00:30:04,880 --> 00:30:06,400
And so what I mean by that is, if the

503
00:30:06,400 --> 00:30:11,079
Supreme Court says that the president's actions are not subject

504
00:30:11,200 --> 00:30:15,799
to judicial review under this Act, then that means they're not.

505
00:30:16,039 --> 00:30:17,880
You know, you can try to work the case through,

506
00:30:18,000 --> 00:30:21,920
but you can't enjoin the president from doing what the

507
00:30:21,960 --> 00:30:23,960
Act says he can do, what the Supreme Court has

508
00:30:24,000 --> 00:30:28,400
reviewed and affirmed he can do without Like, you can't

509
00:30:28,440 --> 00:30:30,960
just do that willy nilly and then blame the victim

510
00:30:31,079 --> 00:30:34,920
of someone not following the Court's precedent and not following

511
00:30:34,920 --> 00:30:39,960
the law, Like you can't blame the victim for not

512
00:30:40,160 --> 00:30:42,480
following things when he's the one actually following things and

513
00:30:42,519 --> 00:30:44,720
it's the judge who's acting in a renegade fashion.

514
00:30:45,960 --> 00:30:48,119
Speaker 1: And I think I'm slightly annoyed by this as well

515
00:30:48,160 --> 00:30:51,559
because of the broader issue of Donald Trump declaring emergencies

516
00:30:51,599 --> 00:30:57,000
about everything and just running everything through executive orders. Congress

517
00:30:57,160 --> 00:31:01,480
literally doing nothing. They've handed the tower of power over

518
00:31:01,559 --> 00:31:04,119
to him, They handed the emergency power over to him.

519
00:31:04,240 --> 00:31:05,960
I mean, the whole government is not This is not

520
00:31:06,000 --> 00:31:07,839
how government's supposed to be run. And I don't really

521
00:31:07,839 --> 00:31:10,920
blame him. This is something that has been happening for

522
00:31:10,960 --> 00:31:15,400
a long time, but especially since Obama and Gosh. I mean,

523
00:31:15,480 --> 00:31:17,720
it's no way to run a government because tomorrow there'll

524
00:31:17,720 --> 00:31:19,680
be a Democrat and he's going to overturn everything. We're

525
00:31:19,680 --> 00:31:21,599
going to go back and it's going to just be anarchy.

526
00:31:21,640 --> 00:31:22,480
It's instable.

527
00:31:22,599 --> 00:31:25,680
Speaker 2: Even if that weren't true, that we'd go back to

528
00:31:25,720 --> 00:31:29,599
something else, it's still true that our article one branch

529
00:31:29,759 --> 00:31:34,079
Congress has been throwing away its authority for like one

530
00:31:34,119 --> 00:31:37,240
hundred years, and it has caused a crisis in the country.

531
00:31:37,759 --> 00:31:39,960
And the best thing that could happen right now would

532
00:31:40,000 --> 00:31:42,839
be for Congress to debate some of these issues, including

533
00:31:43,279 --> 00:31:47,359
whether this is the proper venue to get rid of

534
00:31:47,680 --> 00:31:51,720
terrorists who are terrorizing Aurora, Colorado in other places. And

535
00:31:52,640 --> 00:31:55,960
you know what, Congress should have a more active role,

536
00:31:56,319 --> 00:31:58,319
not just because it makes it more permanent, but because

537
00:31:58,319 --> 00:32:01,640
it's actually what the Constitution gave them.

538
00:32:01,720 --> 00:32:04,400
Speaker 1: I mean, this is another eighty twenty issue. What you're

539
00:32:04,440 --> 00:32:06,680
talking about a word debating. No one's going to think

540
00:32:06,680 --> 00:32:08,440
about it like I'm thinking about it. They're going to

541
00:32:08,480 --> 00:32:10,799
be like these Venezuelan killers need to be chucked out

542
00:32:10,799 --> 00:32:12,759
of the country, and they are one hundred percent right

543
00:32:12,880 --> 00:32:16,400
on that we should rewrite immigration law to make it

544
00:32:16,440 --> 00:32:20,920
easy to depoor people, even Mahu Khalil. He has too

545
00:32:20,960 --> 00:32:23,240
many protections as a non citizen to be here and

546
00:32:23,279 --> 00:32:26,880
to support terrorist groups. It's insanity. It's just a suicidal

547
00:32:27,400 --> 00:32:30,279
you know, these suicidal laws, and Congress should be dealing

548
00:32:30,359 --> 00:32:32,000
with that AnyWho.

549
00:32:33,759 --> 00:32:39,400
Speaker 2: It is madness for a single solitary inferior court judge,

550
00:32:39,480 --> 00:32:41,680
one who by the way, was involved in the Russia

551
00:32:41,720 --> 00:32:46,519
collusion hoax, to try to take over presidential powers. It

552
00:32:46,759 --> 00:32:52,359
risks destabilizing the entire judicial branch. And so what John

553
00:32:52,440 --> 00:32:54,759
Roberts should have done. And I think there's even a

554
00:32:54,759 --> 00:32:58,359
way of interpreting what he was saying as like trying.

555
00:32:58,039 --> 00:33:00,680
Speaker 4: To get other people to calm down by.

556
00:33:00,599 --> 00:33:05,440
Speaker 2: Defending I don't know. We're at a dangerous point already.

557
00:33:05,480 --> 00:33:07,880
The left does not respect the authority of the courts.

558
00:33:08,079 --> 00:33:11,319
The right has been But you do things like this

559
00:33:11,480 --> 00:33:17,200
that are so offensive to Americans about which branch of

560
00:33:17,240 --> 00:33:20,319
government handles stuff like this, and there's going to be

561
00:33:20,359 --> 00:33:23,279
broad public support for just ignoring the courts. I don't

562
00:33:23,359 --> 00:33:27,720
want that to happen. I think that John Roberts's refusal

563
00:33:27,880 --> 00:33:33,480
to rein in the global injunctions is a threat to

564
00:33:33,599 --> 00:33:37,880
the country basically because if we lose respect for the

565
00:33:37,920 --> 00:33:41,720
courts because they're acting so crazy and lower and the

566
00:33:41,759 --> 00:33:45,799
lower courts, it could destroy the country. I don't mean

567
00:33:45,839 --> 00:33:49,319
to be so hyperbolic, but it's a serious problem here.

568
00:33:49,759 --> 00:33:52,039
Speaker 1: I agree it's a serious problem. I think you're slightly

569
00:33:52,119 --> 00:33:55,759
exaggerating what a serious problem. It is not exaggerating that

570
00:33:55,839 --> 00:33:58,279
these lower court judges are a problem. I agree with

571
00:33:58,319 --> 00:34:01,359
that completely, but that they will likely always be overturned

572
00:34:01,400 --> 00:34:03,799
by court that cares about the Constitution in the end,

573
00:34:04,119 --> 00:34:06,640
and that will solidify belief in the in the courts,

574
00:34:06,680 --> 00:34:09,239
not undermine it. I don't know, can you LEGI I

575
00:34:09,280 --> 00:34:11,199
think there needs to be judicial reforms that are going

576
00:34:11,239 --> 00:34:13,880
to happen with the way Congress is now, I don't.

577
00:34:13,519 --> 00:34:16,039
Speaker 2: Know the legislature would be the right place to tamp

578
00:34:16,119 --> 00:34:18,119
that down. I do think the Supreme Court could quite

579
00:34:18,199 --> 00:34:23,599
easily provide some guidance on when and how to issue I.

580
00:34:23,519 --> 00:34:25,039
Speaker 1: Mean that would be best junctions.

581
00:34:25,800 --> 00:34:27,880
Speaker 2: So I just want to say there was a judge

582
00:34:27,880 --> 00:34:30,239
who gave them a like set it up for them

583
00:34:30,400 --> 00:34:34,360
on the issue of whether you can review temporary restraining orders,

584
00:34:34,599 --> 00:34:38,760
because there's this like practice of not viewing those as reviewable.

585
00:34:39,280 --> 00:34:42,960
But they should be in cases like we're seeing, where

586
00:34:43,039 --> 00:34:45,719
it could cause wars to break out, or it could

587
00:34:45,719 --> 00:34:48,000
cause billions of dollars to be spent wrongly, you know,

588
00:34:48,039 --> 00:34:51,880
all this kind of stuff, And that judge teed it

589
00:34:52,000 --> 00:34:54,519
right up for them, and they whiffed that was the

590
00:34:54,920 --> 00:34:58,280
that was related to the case, the two billion dollars.

591
00:34:58,360 --> 00:35:00,599
Speaker 1: I mean, I guess I could make a just another

592
00:35:00,639 --> 00:35:04,920
theoretical A judge you know, says you can't take those bombs,

593
00:35:04,960 --> 00:35:07,960
take get the missiles back, We're not bombing the huties today,

594
00:35:08,000 --> 00:35:10,239
and tells the president he can do it. It's obviously

595
00:35:10,440 --> 00:35:16,199
a completely unconstitututional thing to do. So I can understand

596
00:35:16,239 --> 00:35:19,000
why people are concerned. I get that. My concern is

597
00:35:19,440 --> 00:35:22,880
that things are falling apart that we that we're not

598
00:35:22,960 --> 00:35:25,119
going to have any rule of law. There's going to

599
00:35:25,199 --> 00:35:27,559
be another one day there'll be a progressive president, and

600
00:35:27,599 --> 00:35:29,920
I will be very nervous for him to be or

601
00:35:30,000 --> 00:35:32,360
she to be using emergency powers in this way for

602
00:35:32,519 --> 00:35:36,159
bad things. Gosh, I think to think about one day,

603
00:35:36,599 --> 00:35:37,039
one day.

604
00:35:37,599 --> 00:35:39,159
Speaker 4: As we've already experienced it.

605
00:35:39,320 --> 00:35:40,719
Speaker 1: But also like what I know.

606
00:35:40,840 --> 00:35:44,199
Speaker 2: I yeah, I'm going I don't know exactly what criminal

607
00:35:44,960 --> 00:35:46,920
immigrant terrorist class.

608
00:35:46,960 --> 00:35:48,880
Speaker 4: You're worried about a progressive business.

609
00:35:48,920 --> 00:35:51,440
Speaker 1: It's such an unfair way of framing it. I am

610
00:35:51,480 --> 00:35:54,960
not worried about them. I'm worried about people in the

611
00:35:55,039 --> 00:35:58,440
in the in the executive branch, ignoring the judicial branch.

612
00:35:58,480 --> 00:36:00,920
I'm not worried about Venezuelan in te I love people

613
00:36:01,039 --> 00:36:03,519
keep doing that to me and trying to frame me up,

614
00:36:03,599 --> 00:36:05,800
you know, send me up that way. I'm not concerned

615
00:36:05,800 --> 00:36:08,159
about them. If they are sent to El Salvage or

616
00:36:08,159 --> 00:36:09,599
I don't even care where they're sent, as long as

617
00:36:09,639 --> 00:36:12,000
they're out of here. I don't want a single illegal

618
00:36:12,320 --> 00:36:14,719
immigrant to be in this country, violent or not.

619
00:36:15,440 --> 00:36:18,320
Speaker 2: You said that I was being hyperbolic, which which I

620
00:36:18,360 --> 00:36:19,719
want to say something.

621
00:36:19,559 --> 00:36:21,519
Speaker 1: So slightly exaggerated problem.

622
00:36:21,519 --> 00:36:26,679
Speaker 2: I want to say something in your defense on that there.

623
00:36:26,840 --> 00:36:29,920
I do think people sometimes act like a bad thing

624
00:36:30,000 --> 00:36:34,840
happening in the judicial system is intolerable for even a moment,

625
00:36:35,400 --> 00:36:37,800
and they forget that sometimes we've gone through this in

626
00:36:37,840 --> 00:36:44,679
the past, and I think it was Mike Fragoso over

627
00:36:44,880 --> 00:36:47,719
at Ethics and Public Policy Center who raised this, but

628
00:36:47,719 --> 00:36:51,960
it could have been someone else that. In nineteen seventy three,

629
00:36:53,039 --> 00:36:57,880
a single Supreme Court Justice William O. Douglas ordered the

630
00:36:57,920 --> 00:37:01,159
American bombing of Cambodia to be stopped.

631
00:37:02,639 --> 00:37:04,119
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I.

632
00:37:04,039 --> 00:37:06,280
Speaker 2: Think that's fascinating. The case, by the way, is one

633
00:37:06,280 --> 00:37:10,440
that you and I would find very we would probably

634
00:37:10,440 --> 00:37:12,320
agree with it. It was brought by people who said

635
00:37:12,920 --> 00:37:17,360
that no declaration of war had been issued against Cambodia,

636
00:37:17,400 --> 00:37:21,199
and therefore it was illegal what was happening. So the

637
00:37:21,239 --> 00:37:24,000
injunction made sense in that sense.

638
00:37:24,079 --> 00:37:26,400
Speaker 4: Right, But the.

639
00:37:26,360 --> 00:37:29,760
Speaker 2: Bombing continues, they do the injunction, the bombing doesn't stop

640
00:37:29,800 --> 00:37:33,239
for a second, and six hours later, the full Supreme

641
00:37:33,280 --> 00:37:40,000
Court lifted the injunction, thereby averting a constitutional crisis. But

642
00:37:40,039 --> 00:37:43,199
I'm not sure how that case was eventually resolved. I

643
00:37:43,199 --> 00:37:44,440
would actually like to look into that.

644
00:37:44,719 --> 00:37:47,119
Speaker 1: I mean, there's been tons going back to Jackson and

645
00:37:47,119 --> 00:37:50,960
even Yeah and Jackson before where presidents ignore courts. I'm

646
00:37:50,960 --> 00:37:53,719
not saying this is new, it is kind of new

647
00:37:53,800 --> 00:37:56,719
in the new era of originalism. I think you know

648
00:37:56,760 --> 00:37:59,440
what I mean. When the right took that up, and

649
00:37:59,480 --> 00:38:03,960
there are people now that are considered conservatives who teach

650
00:38:04,000 --> 00:38:06,440
at Harvard and other places, who I think don't really

651
00:38:06,480 --> 00:38:11,840
believe in originalism and don't really believe maybe that the

652
00:38:11,920 --> 00:38:14,880
judicial branch should be dictating what is constitutional all the time,

653
00:38:14,920 --> 00:38:17,679
and maybe they have a point historically speaking. I don't know, but.

654
00:38:20,599 --> 00:38:25,559
Speaker 2: Well, it's a problem that requires courage from the Supreme

655
00:38:25,599 --> 00:38:29,360
Court that might not be there. Is what makes me

656
00:38:29,440 --> 00:38:30,559
nervous about it.

657
00:38:31,920 --> 00:38:37,639
Speaker 1: This is almost like Roberts's nightmare, really right, because he

658
00:38:37,679 --> 00:38:40,480
doesn't want to undermine his branch, but he will have to.

659
00:38:40,719 --> 00:38:44,079
Speaker 2: Right, Okay, but what was he doing with his statement today?

660
00:38:44,199 --> 00:38:49,039
He makes the weirdest statements this year. At his end

661
00:38:49,079 --> 00:38:52,639
of the Court end of the year Court in Review

662
00:38:52,800 --> 00:38:56,920
was like, I hear, Russian disinformation is a problem. Or

663
00:38:57,599 --> 00:39:02,079
when he came out against Trump saying that there were

664
00:39:02,079 --> 00:39:05,840
Republican appointed justices and Democrat appointed justices and he was like,

665
00:39:05,920 --> 00:39:09,719
how dare you there are only good justices and no

666
00:39:09,840 --> 00:39:13,840
bad justices or whatever. Like he just has weird statements

667
00:39:13,920 --> 00:39:16,840
that he makes that don't seem to help anything.

668
00:39:17,239 --> 00:39:20,679
Speaker 1: I mean, he's made statements I wouldn't say condemning. But

669
00:39:20,800 --> 00:39:24,159
when Chuck Schumer threatened the cord in another time with

670
00:39:24,239 --> 00:39:26,519
the ethics investigation. I mean, I just feel like he

671
00:39:26,559 --> 00:39:30,920
feels impelled to defend his branch of government. In some sense.

672
00:39:31,280 --> 00:39:33,760
It's not politically savvy. But he doesn't need to be

673
00:39:33,800 --> 00:39:36,320
politically savvy, really, Okay.

674
00:39:37,480 --> 00:39:39,679
Speaker 2: I do think this is the problem with Chief Justice

675
00:39:39,760 --> 00:39:45,239
John Roberts. He claims to want certain things. He came

676
00:39:45,280 --> 00:39:47,119
onto the court saying all he cared about was the

677
00:39:47,199 --> 00:39:50,920
legitimacy of the institution and he wanted fewer five four decisions.

678
00:39:51,400 --> 00:39:54,880
It was a weird goal because a lot of people think,

679
00:39:55,320 --> 00:40:02,079
regardless of their constitutional interpretive philosophy, that you should judge

680
00:40:02,119 --> 00:40:05,920
the law according to what's right and not according to

681
00:40:05,960 --> 00:40:07,280
what's politically popular.

682
00:40:07,599 --> 00:40:07,800
Speaker 4: Right.

683
00:40:08,559 --> 00:40:12,199
Speaker 2: He's almost always in the majority because he wants to

684
00:40:12,280 --> 00:40:18,519
be in majorities to strengthen majorities rather than ruling just

685
00:40:18,719 --> 00:40:23,599
how he thinks is right. Also, he says he said

686
00:40:23,599 --> 00:40:26,440
when he was confirmed, and he says it again sometimes

687
00:40:26,480 --> 00:40:29,039
when he's like on the losing side of tough issues,

688
00:40:29,519 --> 00:40:32,239
that he thinks the job of the court is to

689
00:40:32,360 --> 00:40:35,880
do as little as possible, basically, like to just try

690
00:40:35,880 --> 00:40:38,880
to uphold the given law but don't go any further

691
00:40:38,920 --> 00:40:41,639
than that. But then when it comes to stuff like Obamacare,

692
00:40:42,000 --> 00:40:46,440
which could have clearly been disposed of as unconstitutional under

693
00:40:46,480 --> 00:40:49,119
the law and just be done with. He's like, so,

694
00:40:49,199 --> 00:40:53,519
it is unconstitutional, but we could rescue it by rewriting

695
00:40:53,599 --> 00:40:56,360
the law and reinterpreting everything.

696
00:40:58,159 --> 00:40:58,800
Speaker 4: As a tax.

697
00:40:59,840 --> 00:41:04,320
Speaker 2: He doesn't even stay consistent to his own views, or

698
00:41:04,440 --> 00:41:08,039
he switches votes late. You know, they'll vote right after

699
00:41:08,039 --> 00:41:11,039
a case is heard. He's like switching votes all the

700
00:41:11,079 --> 00:41:13,960
time later, like, oh, I ruled in favor of being

701
00:41:14,000 --> 00:41:17,000
asked about citizenship on the census, but I'm going to

702
00:41:17,119 --> 00:41:19,320
change my vote later because of something I read. Or

703
00:41:19,320 --> 00:41:22,400
in the Obamacare case, it was because he was pressured

704
00:41:22,400 --> 00:41:23,400
by the president.

705
00:41:23,079 --> 00:41:24,679
Speaker 4: Himself to change his vote.

706
00:41:24,800 --> 00:41:29,320
Speaker 2: And when you show yourself being willing to be politically pressured,

707
00:41:29,960 --> 00:41:33,679
that's a reward you give people and an indication of

708
00:41:33,719 --> 00:41:36,719
how they can affect things going forward. If you're brave

709
00:41:37,159 --> 00:41:40,840
and you're courageous and you defend the court as a

710
00:41:40,880 --> 00:41:44,119
non political institution one hundred percent of the time, it

711
00:41:44,239 --> 00:41:48,400
makes it less effective to apply political pressure. You know,

712
00:41:48,760 --> 00:41:50,039
as much as the left does.

713
00:41:50,920 --> 00:41:53,159
Speaker 1: I agree with all that, I am not, as you know,

714
00:41:53,280 --> 00:41:56,639
I am not a fan of democracy, you know, as

715
00:41:56,760 --> 00:42:00,679
kind of just a you know, a majority tearing sort

716
00:42:00,679 --> 00:42:03,480
of views, and Roberts feels like he thinks he's in

717
00:42:03,519 --> 00:42:07,119
a legislature or something, or that he needs validity. I

718
00:42:07,159 --> 00:42:11,519
want the most zealous textualists that you can find on

719
00:42:11,559 --> 00:42:15,000
the court, Like that's what I want. The other stuff,

720
00:42:15,079 --> 00:42:18,800
the empathy, the you know, thinking about what the people want,

721
00:42:18,880 --> 00:42:21,039
that's for other branches to deal with.

722
00:42:21,159 --> 00:42:24,760
Speaker 2: So anyway, by the way, you were right, and I

723
00:42:24,840 --> 00:42:27,599
was wrong when you said when you mentioned that he

724
00:42:27,639 --> 00:42:31,000
had had a good statement after Chuck Schumer threatened kavan

725
00:42:31,039 --> 00:42:34,960
On gorsicch and also when he pushed back against some

726
00:42:35,039 --> 00:42:40,000
of the politicized politicization of ethics reform. And so I

727
00:42:40,039 --> 00:42:41,639
just wanted to acknowledge that you were right.

728
00:42:42,239 --> 00:42:44,039
Speaker 1: I don't think you said I was wrong. But he

729
00:42:44,519 --> 00:42:47,119
needs to. He feels the need to defend the court,

730
00:42:47,159 --> 00:42:49,559
I think, and that's why sometimes he makes statements probably

731
00:42:49,639 --> 00:42:50,280
that aren't great.

732
00:42:53,400 --> 00:42:55,920
Speaker 7: Elon Musk and Doge need help.

733
00:42:56,000 --> 00:42:58,840
Speaker 5: The watched aut On Wall Street podcast with Chris Markowski

734
00:42:58,880 --> 00:43:01,159
Every Day Chris helps all I packed the connection between

735
00:43:01,159 --> 00:43:02,679
politics and the economy and how.

736
00:43:02,599 --> 00:43:03,599
Speaker 1: It affects your wallet.

737
00:43:03,719 --> 00:43:07,360
Speaker 7: Doge is only highlighting this spending problems, but Congress controls

738
00:43:07,400 --> 00:43:10,760
the per strings. Congress needs to follow through and step

739
00:43:10,880 --> 00:43:13,719
up to control this spending or we'll be back where

740
00:43:13,719 --> 00:43:15,920
we started. Whether it's happening in DC or down on

741
00:43:15,960 --> 00:43:17,599
Wall Street, it's affecting you financially.

742
00:43:17,679 --> 00:43:18,239
Speaker 1: Be informed.

743
00:43:18,280 --> 00:43:20,400
Speaker 5: Check out the Watchdot on Wall Street podcast with Chris

744
00:43:20,480 --> 00:43:23,480
Markowski on Apple, Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts.

745
00:43:26,119 --> 00:43:30,519
Speaker 1: Let's talk about something else right now. I have to

746
00:43:30,519 --> 00:43:32,880
say Donald Trump's tweets make me laugh. I mean, they

747
00:43:32,880 --> 00:43:35,639
are just insane, right, or whatever you call a truth

748
00:43:35,760 --> 00:43:41,599
social tweet. This tweet he had about how the pardons

749
00:43:41,639 --> 00:43:44,039
of Joe Biden that we're done with an auto pen

750
00:43:44,199 --> 00:43:49,039
are all invalid. Now, he assess, because how do we

751
00:43:49,079 --> 00:43:50,840
even know that Joe Biden was there or knew it

752
00:43:50,920 --> 00:43:55,159
was going on, etc. And I don't think he has

753
00:43:55,199 --> 00:43:59,599
the right to overturn pardons. I'm sorry, but it's very interesting,

754
00:43:59,639 --> 00:44:02,119
at least for the historical record, and maybe because we

755
00:44:02,159 --> 00:44:06,199
need to think about the autopen a little more that

756
00:44:06,960 --> 00:44:10,199
Joe Biden, even Jake Tapper has wri in a book

757
00:44:10,239 --> 00:44:12,760
about this, did not know what was going on around him,

758
00:44:13,000 --> 00:44:19,679
Like it is very reasonable to believe that his underlings

759
00:44:19,719 --> 00:44:24,480
and others within the government decided to give I would say,

760
00:44:24,800 --> 00:44:28,679
not even pardons, but immunity in the most I would

761
00:44:28,679 --> 00:44:31,199
say that. I would say no president has had more

762
00:44:31,280 --> 00:44:34,960
corrupt pardens than him leaving office. Maybe Clinton with Mark

763
00:44:35,039 --> 00:44:38,159
Rich but and maybe there's a few others. But this

764
00:44:38,360 --> 00:44:43,400
was not just his family but his political allies. It

765
00:44:43,440 --> 00:44:46,280
was detrimental. I think to justice, you know, justice and

766
00:44:46,320 --> 00:44:50,400
transparency in government. So anyway, I found that interesting. I

767
00:44:50,440 --> 00:44:51,840
don't know what can be done about it. I don't

768
00:44:51,840 --> 00:44:53,119
think you reverse a pardon.

769
00:44:54,519 --> 00:44:58,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think this is again why Congress should have

770
00:44:58,400 --> 00:45:06,400
acted and and invited a twenty fifth Amendment challenge to

771
00:45:06,480 --> 00:45:10,480
Joe Biden as president. There were many people who kept

772
00:45:10,519 --> 00:45:12,960
the country in a position where it was led by

773
00:45:13,000 --> 00:45:14,519
someone who was unable to lead it.

774
00:45:15,000 --> 00:45:17,800
Speaker 1: Is that a congressional thing or is it a cabinet.

775
00:45:17,679 --> 00:45:19,440
Speaker 4: I said they should have invited, Oh.

776
00:45:19,320 --> 00:45:20,760
Speaker 1: Invited, Okay, they should.

777
00:45:20,519 --> 00:45:22,360
Speaker 4: Have encouraged it.

778
00:45:23,960 --> 00:45:25,599
Speaker 2: And I was thinking other people who could have encouraged

779
00:45:25,639 --> 00:45:29,639
it would be the media. I was reviewing. The Washington

780
00:45:29,679 --> 00:45:34,119
Post has this left wing reporter named Isaac Arnsdorf, whose

781
00:45:34,280 --> 00:45:37,679
wife was a clerk on the court the year of

782
00:45:37,719 --> 00:45:41,519
the Dobbs decision Lake, and she's a noted pro abortion activist,

783
00:45:41,559 --> 00:45:44,920
but he's also an activist. And days before the election,

784
00:45:45,039 --> 00:45:49,119
he's all tweeting about or writing stories about how Donald

785
00:45:49,159 --> 00:45:53,360
Trump is making no sense and he's crazy and he's senile,

786
00:45:53,920 --> 00:45:56,840
and I'm thinking yes, And the Washington Post has done

787
00:45:57,159 --> 00:46:03,840
next to nothing on Joe Biden's senility. And during Trump's

788
00:46:03,840 --> 00:46:06,360
first term in office, Trump would like use two hands

789
00:46:06,360 --> 00:46:08,599
to drink a glass of water, and the Washington Post

790
00:46:08,679 --> 00:46:11,920
would quite seriously in tone about the twenty fifth Amendment.

791
00:46:12,280 --> 00:46:16,639
And then when Robert Herr says he's not recommending anything

792
00:46:16,679 --> 00:46:19,960
be done against Biden because no jury would find him

793
00:46:20,000 --> 00:46:23,840
to have the mental acuity needed to stand trial, Everyone's like,

794
00:46:23,920 --> 00:46:26,679
oh okay, and they don't do anything. They don't push

795
00:46:26,760 --> 00:46:29,639
him out, they push him out as the nominee because

796
00:46:29,639 --> 00:46:32,360
they know he probably can't win the election.

797
00:46:32,880 --> 00:46:35,719
Speaker 1: Well, they actually speared. They did. They smeared Robert her

798
00:46:35,800 --> 00:46:38,039
They didn't just say we can't do anything. They tried

799
00:46:38,079 --> 00:46:41,239
to lie about what he said. The Biden lied about

800
00:46:41,280 --> 00:46:43,320
what he said and the moment, and that had they

801
00:46:43,360 --> 00:46:46,079
ever released the audio transfer the audio of that, I'm

802
00:46:46,119 --> 00:46:48,440
not even sure anyway, started to interrupt, but yeah, it

803
00:46:48,440 --> 00:46:49,400
was more well Merrick.

804
00:46:49,199 --> 00:46:53,360
Speaker 2: Garland refused to do it, and yeah, they just I

805
00:46:53,360 --> 00:46:55,119
guess to me a lot of people were to blame

806
00:46:55,159 --> 00:46:59,480
for it. But insofar as nobody was able to successfully

807
00:46:59,599 --> 00:47:03,000
challenge him as president because of these issues, I'm just

808
00:47:03,000 --> 00:47:06,239
going to assume that whether he signed it personally or

809
00:47:06,360 --> 00:47:09,760
had the auto pen, that it's considered like to me

810
00:47:09,880 --> 00:47:12,800
that it's not specific enough in the Constitution about how

811
00:47:12,840 --> 00:47:16,079
it must be done. That I think it doesn't matter

812
00:47:17,039 --> 00:47:21,199
quite how it was done, but the actual question, that

813
00:47:21,280 --> 00:47:24,320
the substance of the issue is just as important. And

814
00:47:24,360 --> 00:47:27,639
I wish we were earnestly trying to find the answer

815
00:47:27,719 --> 00:47:31,079
of whether he knew what he'd done. You remember a

816
00:47:31,480 --> 00:47:35,079
representative Johnson said that he didn't know what he had

817
00:47:35,159 --> 00:47:41,840
done to cut off was it fracking, I think drilling

818
00:47:42,239 --> 00:47:45,159
for energy. He didn't know he had done it. He

819
00:47:45,440 --> 00:47:47,880
might not know he pardoned these people. And I did

820
00:47:47,880 --> 00:47:51,840
find it interesting that the pardon of his son was

821
00:47:52,000 --> 00:47:54,360
done by himself, like you can see, it's like a

822
00:47:54,400 --> 00:47:58,119
shaky signature, whereas the other ones were autopen. I find

823
00:47:58,119 --> 00:48:01,719
that interesting, but I don't interesting what it means exactly.

824
00:48:02,239 --> 00:48:04,480
Speaker 1: You know, all the stuff that's going on tells me that,

825
00:48:04,840 --> 00:48:07,400
you know, it tells me this is such a cynical worldview,

826
00:48:07,480 --> 00:48:10,519
right here's coming no matter how great a system you have,

827
00:48:10,559 --> 00:48:12,679
and I think we have as good a system as

828
00:48:12,719 --> 00:48:14,519
you can have in politics. If you don't, if you

829
00:48:14,559 --> 00:48:18,000
have bad people in government, if you have corrupt people

830
00:48:18,119 --> 00:48:21,880
and dishonest people. Because there's nothing we can really do

831
00:48:21,920 --> 00:48:25,400
about this. The people elected Joe Biden. Let's say. You

832
00:48:25,440 --> 00:48:29,039
may disagree, but he was the president and he has

833
00:48:29,079 --> 00:48:31,119
the right to partner whoever he wants. I mean, there

834
00:48:31,159 --> 00:48:35,719
is no limitation on that. And it is what it is.

835
00:48:36,039 --> 00:48:41,280
You know, there's no way really to stop it. All right,

836
00:48:41,320 --> 00:48:45,679
on that happy note, let's turn to culture. I love

837
00:48:45,719 --> 00:48:47,599
asking you this, Molly every week. Do you have anything

838
00:48:47,639 --> 00:48:48,039
for us?

839
00:48:48,360 --> 00:48:54,119
Speaker 2: Okay, So I am struggling to finish this book, which

840
00:48:54,159 --> 00:48:58,119
means I'm not doing anything else, including that I had

841
00:48:58,159 --> 00:49:01,159
tickets to see craft Work on Sunday night and I

842
00:49:01,239 --> 00:49:04,840
just couldn't go because I desperately. I just didn't assume.

843
00:49:04,920 --> 00:49:06,639
I didn't realize that I would still be working on

844
00:49:06,679 --> 00:49:07,199
this at this time.

845
00:49:07,280 --> 00:49:09,800
Speaker 1: I ask you about that A Kraftworks still like, is

846
00:49:09,840 --> 00:49:11,480
this the original members of kraft work.

847
00:49:12,360 --> 00:49:14,639
Speaker 2: It's like two guys and one of them died. But

848
00:49:14,719 --> 00:49:15,880
they are supposedly like.

849
00:49:15,840 --> 00:49:18,960
Speaker 4: A good show and a good you know good.

850
00:49:19,360 --> 00:49:23,599
Speaker 1: I love that krowd rock stuff, So what about you?

851
00:49:24,159 --> 00:49:27,360
I have a very very strong recommend. Now, this was

852
00:49:27,360 --> 00:49:32,079
a television show I watched. I would say that if

853
00:49:32,119 --> 00:49:34,800
this had been a movie, it should win Best Picture.

854
00:49:36,400 --> 00:49:41,039
It is a four episode show called Adolescence on Netflix.

855
00:49:42,280 --> 00:49:43,960
It starts Stephen Graham. Do you know who he is?

856
00:49:44,519 --> 00:49:44,760
Speaker 4: Thanks?

857
00:49:44,760 --> 00:49:48,880
Speaker 1: So you're a British actor, real good actor. Here is it?

858
00:49:49,199 --> 00:49:52,599
Watching it? It's about It starts with a police I'm

859
00:49:52,599 --> 00:49:55,719
not going to give anything away, raiding a house to

860
00:49:55,880 --> 00:50:01,079
arrest a young boy who is accused of murder. Thirteen

861
00:50:01,159 --> 00:50:04,800
year old boy. I'm watching it, I'm like, this is

862
00:50:04,840 --> 00:50:07,039
pretty amazing. They're in the car, they're doing this, they're

863
00:50:07,039 --> 00:50:10,920
doing that. There are no cuts. Each episode is an

864
00:50:10,920 --> 00:50:15,400
hour or more and they're done in one take. And

865
00:50:15,480 --> 00:50:17,639
it's not like they're sitting in a room like a play.

866
00:50:17,719 --> 00:50:21,199
There's a lot of movement and you realize this and

867
00:50:21,239 --> 00:50:24,760
you're just impressed by it. But it's really incredibly It

868
00:50:24,800 --> 00:50:26,880
builds a lot of tension because you're just following this

869
00:50:27,000 --> 00:50:29,800
people from room to room. Then a person walks by,

870
00:50:29,840 --> 00:50:33,159
they'll follow that person and it all it goes comes together.

871
00:50:34,760 --> 00:50:36,679
The boy is a thirteen year old. This is his

872
00:50:36,719 --> 00:50:42,599
first acting role and he is mind blowingly amazing at this.

873
00:50:43,159 --> 00:50:46,119
And there are four episode. One is the arrest, the

874
00:50:46,159 --> 00:50:50,039
next is in the school, I think, then it's just lawyers,

875
00:50:50,079 --> 00:50:51,920
and then the final ones the family and how they

876
00:50:51,960 --> 00:50:57,079
deal with what happened. And it is amazing adolescents. Yeah,

877
00:50:57,239 --> 00:50:57,559
it is.

878
00:50:59,199 --> 00:51:02,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, I know we talked about it earlier, like years ago,

879
00:51:02,960 --> 00:51:07,360
I think. But the Alfred Hitchcock movie Rope, which is

880
00:51:07,360 --> 00:51:10,679
one of my very favorites. Yeah, and that is I

881
00:51:10,719 --> 00:51:13,760
think an uncut movie, like it's just all the way

882
00:51:13,760 --> 00:51:17,119
through there. There might be one spot where there's a cut, yeah,

883
00:51:17,159 --> 00:51:18,719
and that that's all one room.

884
00:51:18,800 --> 00:51:21,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it's all in one room. So do you

885
00:51:21,119 --> 00:51:23,320
know in Goodfellas there's a scene where they go to

886
00:51:23,320 --> 00:51:25,440
the copa caban and that's done in one take. So

887
00:51:25,559 --> 00:51:29,920
imagine that going on for an hour and everything's moving.

888
00:51:30,000 --> 00:51:32,480
So I read later about this. There's a one of

889
00:51:32,519 --> 00:51:35,159
them takes place within the school with all the kids.

890
00:51:35,519 --> 00:51:38,039
There were like two hundred kids involved and they had

891
00:51:38,039 --> 00:51:40,760
to move them from room to room and like choreographed

892
00:51:40,760 --> 00:51:42,679
the whole thing, and it was really kind of amazing.

893
00:51:44,199 --> 00:51:46,039
I don't know, I just I watched it and I

894
00:51:46,159 --> 00:51:48,840
was I just I watched it like in one sitting.

895
00:51:48,880 --> 00:51:50,840
It's like four hours long, and I just I was

896
00:51:50,920 --> 00:51:52,800
not bored for a second of it. I just think

897
00:51:52,800 --> 00:51:54,199
it was fantastic.

898
00:51:54,639 --> 00:51:58,360
Speaker 2: So we had a reader email in we have, you know,

899
00:51:58,599 --> 00:52:01,239
of the many reader emails we got, someone was saying

900
00:52:01,360 --> 00:52:04,639
that they hadn't caught up on all of our old episodes,

901
00:52:04,679 --> 00:52:07,440
like they basically just started listening to us more recently,

902
00:52:07,960 --> 00:52:11,400
and they wanted to recommend three TV shows and I'm

903
00:52:11,400 --> 00:52:14,199
pretty sure we've discussed all of them. Two of them

904
00:52:14,360 --> 00:52:17,800
were Bosh, which I love seeing all of it, and

905
00:52:17,840 --> 00:52:21,360
Slow Horses ditto, although I think the later seasons are

906
00:52:21,599 --> 00:52:25,920
much weaker really, And then he also recommended The Pit

907
00:52:26,480 --> 00:52:27,960
and I was like, Oh, I'm definitely going to check

908
00:52:27,960 --> 00:52:30,960
out The Pit because this guy clearly has good taste.

909
00:52:31,400 --> 00:52:33,000
But you said you already talked about it and had

910
00:52:33,039 --> 00:52:34,960
seen it. What is it about?

911
00:52:35,639 --> 00:52:38,360
Speaker 1: Well, we talked about on the episode where we had

912
00:52:38,360 --> 00:52:41,639
a guest host named Mark Hemingway, which he didn't listen to.

913
00:52:41,719 --> 00:52:44,559
Speaker 4: Apparently he did, but I've probably zoned out.

914
00:52:44,519 --> 00:52:46,679
Speaker 1: By the end. I think you've probably listened to the beginning,

915
00:52:46,679 --> 00:52:50,440
and by the end it's kind of like er. I

916
00:52:50,480 --> 00:52:53,920
would say something like that in Pittsburgh, but it is more.

917
00:52:55,519 --> 00:52:58,960
I can't watch it. It's too there's too much blood,

918
00:52:59,000 --> 00:53:03,239
and they really like zoom in on the things going

919
00:53:03,280 --> 00:53:06,800
on Broken Bones operations, you know, I just for me,

920
00:53:06,920 --> 00:53:09,000
I don't need that. I just want drama. I don't

921
00:53:09,039 --> 00:53:13,320
need the realism in that way. And I only watched

922
00:53:13,320 --> 00:53:15,039
an episode or two and it was it was it

923
00:53:15,079 --> 00:53:17,360
was fine has I'm not gonna remember a guy's name,

924
00:53:17,440 --> 00:53:22,320
Noah something is. I think he was an er. Actually, yeah, okay.

925
00:53:22,159 --> 00:53:23,360
Speaker 4: I do kind of remember you talking about that.

926
00:53:23,400 --> 00:53:23,719
Speaker 1: Okay.

927
00:53:23,840 --> 00:53:25,519
Speaker 2: The other thing I wanted to mention a couple of

928
00:53:25,519 --> 00:53:28,159
weeks ago, I said I'd watched like one episode of

929
00:53:28,360 --> 00:53:33,679
White Lotus, Yeah, third season, and there was a clip

930
00:53:33,719 --> 00:53:38,239
going around from the show this week of one of

931
00:53:38,239 --> 00:53:43,079
the characters. It was an amazing actor and I'm forgetting

932
00:53:43,079 --> 00:53:48,960
what his name is, describing his auto gynophilia in detail

933
00:53:49,440 --> 00:53:50,679
to Walter Goggins.

934
00:53:50,960 --> 00:53:54,400
Speaker 1: Okay, to Walter Goggins, that's someone I knew yeah.

935
00:53:53,800 --> 00:53:59,679
Speaker 2: And it is a riveting scene. But also I find

936
00:53:59,719 --> 00:54:03,400
it so I find that show so interesting because it

937
00:54:03,519 --> 00:54:07,480
is the creation of what is his name, Mike White.

938
00:54:08,039 --> 00:54:09,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, I was just thinking about him because he was

939
00:54:09,920 --> 00:54:15,079
on Survivor one season. Was he Yeah? He was. I

940
00:54:15,079 --> 00:54:16,199
love that. You know that.

941
00:54:18,079 --> 00:54:20,559
Speaker 2: The show is far and away the most subversive show

942
00:54:20,599 --> 00:54:26,280
on television to the current sexual politics that we're subjected to,

943
00:54:26,960 --> 00:54:30,159
but Mike White is a member of the community, as

944
00:54:30,159 --> 00:54:34,519
they say, so I just find it fascinating. And the

945
00:54:34,599 --> 00:54:40,840
second season had like amazing scene that involves language barriers

946
00:54:41,519 --> 00:54:45,000
and the protagonist is worried that the man she married

947
00:54:45,119 --> 00:54:48,440
is secretly gay, and well, she kind of figures out

948
00:54:48,480 --> 00:54:51,800
he is and has been just using her for her money,

949
00:54:51,880 --> 00:54:54,159
and she's worried that he's going to have her killed.

950
00:54:54,840 --> 00:54:57,159
And she goes up to the captain of the yacht

951
00:54:57,320 --> 00:55:00,400
that they're on and tries to communicate this with him,

952
00:55:01,400 --> 00:55:04,119
and he explains that he's gay too. She's like, the

953
00:55:04,159 --> 00:55:06,400
gays are trying to kill me and he's like, I'm

954
00:55:06,440 --> 00:55:11,440
gay too, And it's so interesting, like the sexual politics

955
00:55:11,440 --> 00:55:14,079
of that. Like also the first season, the guy who

956
00:55:14,159 --> 00:55:16,880
kind of ends up spiraling out of control is a

957
00:55:17,000 --> 00:55:22,400
drug using gay hotel manager. And then this season where

958
00:55:22,599 --> 00:55:25,400
apparently there's going to be a character who's got auto ginophilia,

959
00:55:25,840 --> 00:55:30,559
and like because he just can explore things in a

960
00:55:30,639 --> 00:55:34,519
much more interesting and honest way. Maybe because of his perspective.

961
00:55:34,559 --> 00:55:35,519
Speaker 4: I don't know, but.

962
00:55:35,599 --> 00:55:37,920
Speaker 1: Well, here's what happened to me in that show. I

963
00:55:37,960 --> 00:55:42,079
was watching the first episode and Steve zah is in

964
00:55:41,559 --> 00:55:44,320
his name I think it is. He's an actor, and

965
00:55:44,360 --> 00:55:47,199
there's just a close up of his junk like for

966
00:55:47,239 --> 00:55:50,880
a long time, and I'm like, what is this show?

967
00:55:51,400 --> 00:55:56,199
Why did Molly tell me to watch it? Please?

968
00:55:56,400 --> 00:56:00,320
Speaker 2: Nobody watch it? Okay, including like the autoginophilia scene is

969
00:56:00,559 --> 00:56:06,639
explicit about his sexual fetish. But we have been constrained

970
00:56:06,679 --> 00:56:10,000
in how we can talk honestly about adult on set

971
00:56:10,440 --> 00:56:15,159
sexual fetish, transgenderism, and everyone acts like you're just not

972
00:56:15,199 --> 00:56:17,159
allowed to talk about it, even though it's a very

973
00:56:17,159 --> 00:56:20,360
real thing. There are people with gender dysphoria from childhood,

974
00:56:20,400 --> 00:56:22,639
there are people who develop it as a sexual fetish,

975
00:56:22,960 --> 00:56:29,800
and polite company doesn't talk about it because it's uncomfortable,

976
00:56:31,480 --> 00:56:35,039
And yet I think, you know, I just think it's important.

977
00:56:34,639 --> 00:56:38,679
Speaker 1: To talk about I do like when people honestly kind

978
00:56:38,719 --> 00:56:42,320
of explore things that most people don't talk about. But

979
00:56:43,760 --> 00:56:47,079
so maybe I'll just skip the those parts.

980
00:56:47,199 --> 00:56:49,079
Speaker 4: Dam rockwell does that sound right?

981
00:56:49,079 --> 00:56:50,760
Speaker 1: Oh? Is Theannada? He's a great actor.

982
00:56:51,440 --> 00:56:51,880
Speaker 4: I think that.

983
00:56:52,119 --> 00:56:52,400
Speaker 1: Yeah.

984
00:56:52,440 --> 00:56:54,039
Speaker 4: So it's just well acted too.

985
00:56:56,480 --> 00:56:59,239
Speaker 1: I mean the reviews or the reviews are great, like

986
00:56:59,400 --> 00:57:02,239
Rotten Tomatoes, it's like ninety nine. You know, people love it.

987
00:57:02,599 --> 00:57:04,320
People tell me to watch it, and maybe I'll just

988
00:57:04,320 --> 00:57:09,599
skip over some of the more pornographic scenes. I guess, Yeah,

989
00:57:09,960 --> 00:57:11,760
it's not for me. I'm an old man now, I

990
00:57:11,800 --> 00:57:12,159
do that.

991
00:57:12,320 --> 00:57:15,320
Speaker 2: I don't even like cussing. I don't like violence, cussing,

992
00:57:16,599 --> 00:57:17,639
gratuitous sex.

993
00:57:19,880 --> 00:57:22,400
Speaker 1: We've talked about this before. It usually like ruins the

994
00:57:22,400 --> 00:57:25,039
momentum of the movie. It's just not necessary like ninety

995
00:57:25,079 --> 00:57:27,000
percent of the time, unless you're watching like seven and

996
00:57:27,000 --> 00:57:31,239
a half Weeks or whatever. Remember that movie.

997
00:57:31,760 --> 00:57:32,719
Speaker 4: Note in the last weeks?

998
00:57:33,199 --> 00:57:36,880
Speaker 1: What is it I confuse it with. That's the funniest

999
00:57:36,920 --> 00:57:38,320
thing is that I was going to confuse it with

1000
00:57:38,360 --> 00:57:39,639
like eight and a half, which I think is a

1001
00:57:39,639 --> 00:57:42,679
Fellini movie. So I just got the wrong number completely.

1002
00:57:45,719 --> 00:57:48,719
I will get more numbers and facts wrong next week.

1003
00:57:48,960 --> 00:57:51,719
Until then, these be lovers of freedom and interest feel

1004
00:57:51,800 --> 00:57:52,079
fact