Speaker 1: Set. Apparently Doom's plot or one of his plots or
story whatever, He's going after people who have caused incursions,
and the list so far would include Monica Rambo, Doctor Strange,
Steve Rogers, Peter Parker, scart Witch, and stay with Me
Venom Because if you think about it, you know, Vanam
Noah Homie went there. So what do you think about
that as far as like, Okay, the world's are collapsing,
there's a bunch of stuff going on, and Doom's idea,
like it almost sounds like He's gonna go around taking
these characters out to maybe stop these incursions. I don't know,
but what do you think about that as far as
that would be you know, kind of like Thanos, where
oh my idea is to save the world. We're gonna
make it half. This kind of gives doctor Duma somewhat
good guy point of view because like, well, I'm just
trying to help, because I'm trying to stop these people
that have caught like went back in time they shouldn't have,
or went to a different universe and they shouldn't have.
Like how do you feel about that as a log
line for Doom potentially in a Doom's Day.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean it's been interesting to think about like
how does this And obviously I don't have like comic
book background and just dig through like the past stories,
but thinking about like, okay, how how is this gonna
be a two parter for Avengers? Like how does the
Secret Wars part connect with Doomsday? And I guess there
could be something to do with that where like Doomsday
is you know, part of that isn't him being fullen villain?
And maybe Secret Wars is more of that kind of thing.
So interesting idea. Can you toss me that list one
more time?
Speaker 1: So Monica Rambou So obviously that happened in even though
I've only watched the Marvels once, I felt like she
didn't cause it. Yeah, but like remember there's like an
incursion happening and then she does. I'm like, I'm gonna
go save us, and she goes. But maybe I'm wrong,
Maybe I'm missmambing that happened. Maybe it was her powers.
Does anyone in the chat remember how the incursion happens
in Marvels. Maybe it was just her powers and we're forgetting,
but she like sacrifices herself and that's how she ends
up in the X Men world, right, Ah, yes, yeah,
Strange is always messing with stuff, like I feel like
multiple times he's done something. Well even then too, because
remember Cleia, she says like what it says the word incursion. Yeah,
and I can't remember what he did to cause it,
but like he did something Rogers, we know what he
did there. He went back, like he said where he
wasn't supposed to write with Peggy. That's gonna be the one.
I think they haven't said that, but I just feel
like that's the You were supposed to drop these stones
off and come back. You weren't supposed to stay there
and enjoy your time. Peter Parker. Obviously that was No
Way Home Venom. That was like Noaing Home in Scarlett,
which I'm not sure what that could be.
Speaker 2: Maybe could argue to the as their kids, It's.
Speaker 1: True even creating those kids. You might argue that could
have caused them and bounced right, which is It's funny
because I feel like I remember when we when we
were reviewed back in the day, Meetairker, when we reviewed
Wanta Vision, and if you remember, Wanta Vision was the
same year No Way Home was coming up, So when
he she did all that stuff. I remember all of
us like, oh, that's how Toby Andrew get here. That's
the villains, because clearly it's gonna be this ripple. But
then in each movie those never happened. It was always
someone like it was the a new character breaking the
multiverse rules or the timeline. So that's one thing I
like in like a like in a storyline way of
like none of this was actually planned, but if you
do it this way, it kind of makes it look
like it was planned, Like, hey, doctor Doom, saw what's
going on, and you guys are abusing it. My only
hang up, though, is where I'm lost on this working
if it's true, is with Thanos. His plan was, hey,
to make the universe better. We got a half it.
But then obviously that's like, well that's a moral, like
you're killing billions of people, right, I need to know
why what's the villain hook for Doom? Because to me,
if they go, hey, Steve Rogers, you going in the
past calls an incursion that could kill bunch of people,
you have to die. Now. I can't say Doom's like
wrong in that right, because it's just Steve being very
selfish not saying he doesn't deserve it, but it's like
if you're if you're causing this, you kind of have
to you have to go away. So that's what I'm
trying to wait, Like what is unless there's a way
where the heroes can not die?
Speaker 2: So kind of just discussed on Loki right in terms
of having like the what do they call it, the
Golden Timeline or whatever it was, and trying to like
snip the other yes passages because like there's only this one,
but like a sacred timeline. Yeah, the sacred Timeline. There
you go, Like kind of just comes down to perspective
and in terms of what you think is right. I mean,
I guess if there's like this theory that if they
just let it go crazy that eventually it all crash
and everyone will die, well obviously want to avoid that.
So it's like, yeah, why would Steve be allowed to
do this when like other people cannot.
Speaker 1: So I feel like Steve would sacrifice himself too. If
you're to say, hey, like everyone, let's say they just
come and say, hey, that universe you came from, everyone's
gonna die if you don't do this.
Speaker 2: He'd be like, I got one more week with her
die happy with that?
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly, unless, like I said, unless, to me, the
only pitches that whether it's strange or somebody has a
pitch where hey, we can fix the incursions without having
to kill people, and Doom's method is like I'm just
gonna kill people. That's how I think maybe they'll do
the villain side, as the hero say hey, we could
save everybody and stop the incursions, where Doom's gonna say like,
let's not risk that, Let's just kill these people and
just take them out right away, you know, which is
again some similar vibes to infinnie War and whatnot. But
you know it's I think that's gonna happen.
Speaker 2: So yeah, yeah, But going back to what you said
there of like all these yeah, rather than it being
one event that seemingly opened the multiverse and got us
into the multiverse saga, you're right, it was super messy,
and that's like, yeah, ultimately, yeah, fig he's there, he's
the Watcher, he's overseen everything, and he's like putting his
little fingers and stuff. But like, ultimately, these movies are
written by different people and directed by different people, and
so everyone is probably just given the directive like, oh, yeah,
make a time, you know, bust open the timeline in
some way, and they all kind of go at it
in a different way, but specifically in the case of
Doctor Strangers as makes me curious of like clear having
that line of like, oh, we got to go fix
the mistake, you bit of creating this incursion. And so
it's like I always assumed that was just like a
setup for the next Doctor Strange. But if that was
all the way back then the set like actually a
setup for what was then Kang Dynasty and has now
been like reworked to dosday, that is very smarting cool.
And even if it was intended for Doctor Strange and
they're like, you want we can actually pivot this and
I can actually like kind of segue into Doomsday, is
also kind of nice and kind of convenient and cool.
So I don't know, it sounds like, yeah, if they
make this all work, sure, I think it will be
messy no matter what I mean. Obviously, what do we
I don't even know what phase wrong. That's how messy
things have gotten. It's like four there you go, But like,
oh yeah, Thunderbolts ended phase five? What yeah, I have
to do it with anything. You know, it's extremely random.
But uh yeah, so it's it's all very messy, but
I'm curious to see how it all comes together. I guess,
like I don't know what F four be in that
realm too, Like I guess they will have by the
time they're in Doomsday in theory, if they're in A
six months six they were like, I don't know if
I want to spoil that movie, but like there's things
in there that are I don't know if they'd call
it's an incursion like quote unquote, but they're doing crazy
science stuff that could seemingly cause things like that to happen.
Speaker 1: Well, I feel like even what Doom is wanting from
that family, they would cause an incursion, right, you'd think
that that that's where maybe they kind of equal each
other out where they don't count because he kind of
needs their help to fix X, Y and Z. You know.
Speaker 2: So even though I feel like a man Deadpool like
events of those.
Speaker 1: Dead Pol Wolverine should definitely be on But that's the
thing with dead Pool Wolverene. I could see them be
on the list, But this rumor is specifically for Doomsdays.
That's why I could see that being for Secret Wars,
you start to dive into more of those those other.
Speaker 2: As you do you think that this plot point is
like a section of the movie where Doom is teaming
up with all these different people tackling these incursions, or
is it strictly this like doctor Strange one and that's
the one that's like leading the whole plot of like
that section of the movie.
Speaker 1: I think it's gonna be all these ones, because I
could see that. I do think, unfortunately, I think it's
gonna have very similar vibes to Infinny War, where it
was than I was going all these different places get
in the stones, right. I think this is Doom going
all these different universe versus like I think with Monica.
I think there's no mistake that she's in the X
Men universe and we're getting up like the Fox x
Men universe. But we're getting them right.
Speaker 2: But not that guy I wisered his name, the guy
who played Beast a chair, right.
Speaker 1: Yeah he is, well, I think so, yeah, you'll see
Grammar Avengers chair. What a thing to search up. Let's
see here, Yeah he is.
Speaker 2: He was on a He was on a chair, So okay,
I was gonna say then like is that funky? But no,
I actually could be the perfect segue of how that
crew gets connected with six.
Speaker 1: So like you got them, you got F four, and
then you got the MC crew, which all Sam sucres
Spider Man, uh again. But also to that list, like
that's the thing where like the two that to me,
all these makes sense, Peter Parker, that's easy. He's in there, Monica,
she's in the X Men universe, Doctor Strange, Steve Rogers
makes sense. The two that are the interesting ones for
me are one vem because that would to me imply
you're gonna get Tom Hardy, which.
Speaker 2: I don't think is baggage there is.
Speaker 1: But at the same time, I think it is kind
of funny if like, if we're closing the X Men universe,
they have said they're not doing anymore Sony Spider Man
like universe stuff right now, so that kind of could
kind of be a fun way to use Doom's day
as like a way to like, oh, that's why we're
seeing more of Beaus. And that's why I'm saying it
because like Doom takes that out right. But yeah, and
I don't get me wrong, I especially I don't like
those movies. I would if Figers sit me down and
be like, hey, do you think Tom Hardy would add
any numbers of the box office as Venom would say, yeah,
he would, right, like I think people do like him,
so yeah. And then but that so that one's curious
as far as k what happens there. But then that
last one Scar, which to me is curious because as
of right now, she's like dead, right, But I always
thought she'd be dead and then she'd be resurrected. This
would infer that she's maybe already alive and out there
somewhere in Doom's like looking for her if he's on
her on his hit list, right. So that's where I'm
not too sure how that work. Is a situation where
she's in a bubble somewhere, is a situation where she's
been alive for a while, just in hiding, like that's
what was because I know Skirt, which is going to
be in there. It's just that's why I'm very curious
of how they bring her back, particularly just in the
sense of where were left off with her right and stuff,
because I thought she would have.
Speaker 2: Been back before cope, But I've always felt like she's
alive she was not killed by those rocks and she's
hiding away. Maybe she's like Voldemort where she got shrunk
down to like a baby and like grow, which not
actually doing that, but like something, you know, that kind
of idea to regain your power.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I have to bring in. I don't think I
have tweet, but I have let me bring in because
I didn't send you don't But it's a question. We
got a patron question from John with no age, but
it's going to go right into what we're talking about here.
Where can I find it? But the other part of
the story was okay, yeah, so, uh, this can set
up Strange team up with Doom. Wouldn't make sense if
Doom is after the other ones that cause incursion. Wasn't
Strange a major participation in Newly Home? And that's what
I wonder because that was this other rumor going around
that in I don't know it's Doom Day or Cecret Wars,
but one of those that there's gonna be kind of
some sort of trio team up between Doom, Clear and Strange,
and that might post Strange as the villain. Now we
don't know if this is like a variant of Strange, right,
But I think that could be the way where even
if he's on Doom's hit list, that I have more
uses for Doctor Strange in his power set, right, he
might not be worth just killing. We're like Peter, you
could just you just kill, right, like he's very powerful
one not but like he's not opening up any portals
where Doctor Strange is gonna happen. And obviously the Russo
said this was faking from the last Avengers or the
last movie, but they're in that big concept art leak
that happened at the be end of this year. There
was multiple images of Doom and Strange together. So I
think there that's gonna happen.
Speaker 2: Whether it's I hope it's not a mind control thing,
but even if you hope, not working with Range just
because of his power, using it for his power and
somehow convinces him that he needs to help for some reason.
I think that would be really interesting to see, especially
after obviously you know Doom is being played by Downey
and just thinking about the back and forth that Downy
and Cumberbatch had in Infinity War all that's like I
really liked their scenes together and so to have them
working with each other still, and like you think he
would question that if you ever see his Doom's face,
But like, I don't know, maybe Doom just has the
mask on the whole time and so he can't can't
actually like see that it's Downy and be like, wait,
what's going on here? This is or maybe he used
that to his advantage. Maybe he's like, hey, I have
Tony helped me out with that as this guy who
sacrificed myself for everyone else, So that could be he
could use that to his advantage. I mean, I feel
like he's got to do something like that, right If
he's dipping all his universes, he's probably seen that there
is this guy that looks a whole lot like him.
Speaker 1: I I really hope, at least with the six one
six characters, that's the route they go where they show
up and he's friendly and he just seems like he's
Iron Man, but then that switch happens and it's like,
oh no, even though there's I don't know, I know
people have had this theory because I don't know if
I think Downey he shared a lot of Comba covers,
but I think he shared one cover which was for
a storyline of Doom controlling bodies. So some people have
this theory, which I don't know if I like, but
some people have this theory that this doctor Doom is
an iron Man variant, but Doom is taking over his
body so he can do that, right, so he can
go to the six one six and be hey, I'm
your friend Tony Stark and then the future that would
leave room for them to cast another one. Now, don't
get me wrong, I'm not the biggest fan that RDYJ
is doom thing, but it's kind of like what you
said with the mind control or bought, Like, I'd rather
just be a bad iron Man you kill off than
you meet a Doom down the line. I don't know
if I needed. Like, I guess that's a big goal
as oh there's a Doom behind everything and he's just
using people. But I just I don't know, I just
I you like, you know.
Speaker 2: Yeah, initially when it happened, I was not stoked with
the downy casting, but like they already confirmed that. I
want them to do it right, you know, like I
don't want to get like a half azzed version of it.
I want it to be good.
Speaker 1: So yeah, oh, and what I was gonna say because
you said something, so back on the Strange thing, I
just want to say because within Findy War, that movie
showed that he's willing to sacrifice himself give the timestone
to win in the end, right, So it's the same
way of if he has to team up, would doom
for a little while, which who knows, and these movies
could be like a couple of years, right, But if
he has to do that, he will to me the
way I look at it, and I don't think it's
gonna have the same result because I think Strange will
survive this sagain go into the next one. But I
think it would be a very uh Snape to Baltimore
situation where Snape is there, he helps him commit many
bad things, but it's to eventually give Harry Potter the
smoking gun of the tier and then you can reveal, Okay,
x Y and Z, that's how you killed Baltimore.
Speaker 2: I think it's strange to him seeing the ten million
timelines and be like, yeah, there's a very specific way
this has to get done.
Speaker 1: Yeah, So I think maybe even the movie that's because
that'd be cool. Imagine if Doomsday ends and Doctor Strange
turns on our heroes and they don't don't let us
in the viewer know that he's doing that to help
us out. But we just think, oh, man, Strange has
turned evil. This what's wrong with the you know Steven,
what's happened? But then in you know, Secret Wars hereials well,
I just had to do that. So that's why I
think if he's with Doom, I don't think he's a
I don't see a universe where they just take the
doctor Strange. We know they kill him and he's a
villain and then that's it. Then a come batch that
would be strange, but also no pun intended, but also
one of my favorite things that we've talked about this
before in what If, there's multiple variations where you see
Strange does become a villain, so you can play on that, right,
you know.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's gonna like is that too? Have we seen
that too many times? Because we got in what If?
We got in multiverse where we saw like that other
yeah too, right, Like we've kind of still been there,
done that to some extent and stuff is like our
six one six one, and like having him turn like
I get rather do that than another variant of him
being evil.
Speaker 1: That could be. That could be because even though they're
kind of playing on the storyline, I think it's in
the ultimate run where they do a story where Reid
finds out that all the variations of him and the
multiverse are all evil except for him, and he's kind
of like broken by that. So I wonder if they
could because I don't think we're anywhere near that with
read right now right, I wonder if they could use
that storyline of Hey, like Steven, this is kind of
your destiny, like, no matter what happens, you are gonna
end up. You know it's for the greater good, but
you're gonna have to make some sacrifices, and they could
play on that, and then he makes that hero turn.
I was gonna say, I agree with you because multiverse madness,
but I guarantee you there's still a huge a percentage
people that I've never seen what if? Right, So for them,
they only saw it once a multiverse madness, so it's
not like a tired concept where and what if he
came back multitude of times as this demon Strange and
the Supreme Strange and all this stuff, and it's been
a while, right, Multiverse madness was what twenty two, So
at this point it's gonna be four years, so there's
some there's some space in between that. So ye, but yeah,
we'll see.
Speaker 2: It's okay, what about he's an incursion, he's ripping up in.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but I feel like the tough thing with him
is where he is. I just don't know if Doom
can get to him. I think I agree, I know.
I think it was last year we talked about this.
There was those reports of Loki might be like a
maguffin to the story. And I could see that because
I could see it's like if if mashin, if Doom
can get on that chair that controls on these timelines,
it's game over, right. So that's why I feel like
maybe he's gonna Maybe that's why he keeps strange of Hey,
I'm trying to get to Loki. I can't get to him.
You're gonna help me in Secret Wars find a way
to get to this guy because he can control everything.
So I think Loki would definitely be on the list.
I think it's just that can Doom get to him?
Some said list he might be out of reach on
that chair, you know, with those horn.
Speaker 2: I think, you know, probably the original, Like they've probably
added in a couple of these other characters in in
the mix to do these roles, probably because like a
Bad Baby was supposed to be a big, you know,
doorway for this stuff. But they just probably really want
a different Like obviously he's still in this movie. We
know he was on a chair, just him though none
of the other people, because right, I kind of Lily
is like retired, right, and then his daughter's done in
this right, But you know, I think they just want
to they don't want to make you have seen Quantumania
to understand this. Yes, they don't want to dive too
deep into that, which makes sense.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Yeah, we're gonna see it's gonna be it's gonna
be fun because soon I don't know if we're getting
anything at D twenty three that's happening in August, but
next year Comic Con that lead up, it's gonna be
gonna be interested see what it all happens there. So uh,
let's take our last ad break and then we're gonna
talk about we talk about multiverses. We're gonna talk some
big multiverse stuff right now, so we'll be right back