Speaker 1: What's up everyone, and welcome to another episode of the
Epstein Chronicles. In this episode, we're going to pick up
where we left off with Michael Thomas interview with the
OIG Inspectors. Question. All right, so probably around eightish is
when you're thinking, Thomas, Yeah, about eightish or so. Question. Okay,
did you handle or touch any of Epstein's files or paperwork? Thomas? No?
Question during your shift? Would you ever handle any files? Thomas? No,
they're in sleeping No, we don't touch any of those Thomas.
You're talking about any files inside his cell? Question? No,
the files that you guys have that you maintain for
the inmates. Thomas. No, I didn't touch any of those things. Question.
I think they're called two ninety twos or something. Thomas. Oh, yeah, No,
I didn't touch any of those things. Question. And did
you ever touch them during your shift? Thomas during a shift? No? No,
Thomas will excuse me, let me change that. After you
finished feeding, you marked that you fed everybody. But that's
not a paperwork thing. I think, if I'm not mistaken,
that's done on the computer. Question. Okay, so that's not
something you do. He gets caught off by Thomas. Yeah,
continues the question, like on August ninth, you would have
gone into Epstein's file Thomas, no question. Have you ever
seen Epstein's file? Thomas, no question. No. Do you know
anybody that did potentially remove files from Epstein's files? Thomas,
no question. Do you know that anybody that went back
into the shoe and removed any like tags or documents
or Thomas I was gone, I don't know. Question. Okay,
but did you remove anything from the office Thomas, I
didn't remove anything, No question. No another question after that?
Can I ask do you know where the file is kept?
Thomas no question. And so you never removed or destroyed
any of Epstein's paperwork Thomas no, I did not question.
And you never removed or destroyed any signs related to
Epstein Thomas No. I did not question that were up
in the shoe Thomas No, I did not question. Did
you ever access any BOP database such as bop ware
Century True View after Epstein was discovered on August tenth?
Thomas no, I haven't been back to that institution, no question. No,
And you can only access that from the institution. Thomas, exactly. Question.
Did you ever discuss anyone altering any documents Thomas No,
I did not question or removing any documents. Thomas No.
I did not question accessing any BOP database Thomas No,
I did not question. Did anyone tell you that they
destroyed anything? Thomas No, they did not question moved anything?
Thomas no, sir. Question or access to any database? Thomas no, sir.
Question have you reported for any shifts following August tenth,
twenty nineteen, Thomas no. Question. No. Were you placed on
administrative leave? Thomas yes. Question by whom? Thomas, whoever is
in charge? I can't remember what my letter says. It's
the ward and I guess. Question. So they didn't speak
with you directly? Thomas No. I got a letter in
the mail. Question and that's how they informed you? Thomas Yeah.
Question Okay, what did the letter say, Thomas, I'm placed
on administrative leave pretty much? Question Oh, Thomas and the
whole bunch of pending something. I can't remember the exact
lettering wording what they said? Question? Okay? And is that
what you remain on now? Administrative leave? Thomas No, I'm
on the question in definite suspension. Thomas yeah. Question did
you communicate with Noel after Epstein's body was discovered Thomas, Nope. Question,
So you have not communicated with her since Thomas, besides
one time we had a sit down and talk after
the case was over. Well after the thing, we just
had a union meeting. That was it. Question okay, Thomas,
and she did come there that type of thing, but
we didn't discuss the case. Question and you didn't discuss
the case Thomas, No, we did not. Question. Okay. So
who from MCC have you communicated with regarding Epstein's indictment
or incident? I mean on August tenth Thomas nobody question
No one, Thomas nobody question. I'm assuming aside from your
union representative. Thomas. Well, I just actually just started to
him more often. But yeah, question okay, so he would
be the only one Thomas, Yeah, him the union president.
Question Okay. Can ten and this is something that I
just thought of when you just took a break, something
that I realized I didn't ask. Can ten South obtain
access to the shoe? Thomas? Yeah? Question? And can you
do that without telling anyone allowing them to enter? Tom No,
you're talking about from the outside, No, Thomas, they have
to come through the shoe to get to ten South.
There's no other way from anybody from the outside or
from any other part of the institution to get to
the shoe besides from the outer door. Well, what about
the intake system? This is me asking the question. You
know the HVAC system? Could someone crawl through there? I
don't know. I have questions though. Question okay? So could
have could have anyone from ten South access the shoe
without you or Noel being Thomas? No question? And can
you just show who was in ten South when you
were there? Can you show me on the daily assignment roster?
So who would have been in ten South when you
guys were there? Thomas redacted? Question? And do you remember
if redacted visited the shoe at any time? Thomas? I
don't remember. Question. Would they have been the closest unit
to you though? Thomas? Yeah? Question okay, but you don't
recall Thomas, I don't recall. Question okay. And for feeding
or any counts or anything like that, did you guys
or would you typically interact? Thomas? Yeah? Well, if they
just for the count to help them count? Question? Okay?
Would he personally? What time would he be onto same
shift as you until eight am? Thomas? Yeah, same shift? Question,
would he possibly be the person that showed up at
five thirty am in the shoe? Thomas No, because he
was on for the Morning Watch if he was on
there from twelve am to eight am. Question all right,
but you don't recall, Thomas, somebody coming in at five
thirty Question who showed up at five thirty am? Thomas? No,
I don't recall anybody coming in at five thirty am.
Question Okay, so four am was Lieutenant redacted? But you
don't remember anybody at five thirty am? Thomas. No, I
don't remember anybody at five thirty am. Question all right,
but there's no You were there and there there is
no way that anyone could have accessed the shoe from inside. No, well,
or you allowing them to get in, Thomas, to allow
them to get in? Yeah? Question okay, And you said
epstein cell was locked when you went in there, and
when you did find him and rip the thing off,
did you notice that his body was either cold or warm? Question? Thomas,
I didn't notice. Question you didn't notice that, Thomas? No.
Question Is there anything that I'm missing? Anything you want
to add to this? Thomas, I don't. I guess I'm
not well versed. Question please well versed in what Thomas
well versed in the policy or anything? But no, I
have nothing to add. Question okay, would you like to question?
I just have a follow up question, Thomas sure. Question.
When we showed you that email from redacted, you said
that you've seen that before. Right. Question said I've seen
that before or excuse me? Answer by Thomas, I said
I've seen that before. Question not that email specifically, but
you've seen that type of email sent out from psych before. Thomas,
I said, I've seen that type of email that you know.
I thought I didn't read the top of the email
because some of them just say and why am all staff?
Because they say all staff and it sent out to everybody? Question?
Is it normally sent out to everyone? Thomas? No, Sometimes
it is sometimes with that specific probably just sent out
to the shoe and staff. Because my name wasn't on
it and I'm not custody, so it was probably just
sent out to custody. Question if it was an important discussion,
it's something that needed immediate attention, would they have sent
it out Thomas above my pay grade? Question? No? Would
they normally send it out to all staff? Thomas Noah
doesn't have to question. Okay, now, Agent redacted, just ask
you a question. How could anyone have come in and
out of nine South out of the shoe? Question ten South?
Question ten South, but out of the show you if
you were sleeping? Thomas, Uh huh. Is it possible someone
could have come onto or into the shoe and left
without you knowing if you were sleeping? Thomas, No question,
because you would have had to let them in. Thomas.
I would have had to let them in. Question. Is
there any other way that they could have got in
without you letting them in? Thomas? No question. Could someone
else have a key that they could have used? Thomas,
It would have come from control keys. The only other
keys are in control? Question? So the only other key
is in control? Thomas, yeah. Question. Okay, So the count
the sheets we spoke about the count sheets and the
signature that's Noel's Thomas, yeah. Question the initials were Noel's,
not the counts that was on the rounds. I mean, sorry,
the round sheets. Thomas, Uh huh. Question, Noel took initials
were on it. Do you recall when Noel signed those sheets? Thomas, No,
I don't question. If the video let's just say you
guys were both asleep at one point. Thomas, Uh huh.
Question for a couple of hours. Would she have filled
it up, sign those sheets before or after? Because she
would not have committed those she wouldn't have done those rounds.
Did you ever see her pull those round sheets out
and initial them? Thomas, No, I really wasn't paying attention
to what she was doing. I really don't remember. Question.
Have you ever worked in the shoe with Noel before? Thomas,
It's possible. I don't know. I don't really remember. Maybe
I have, I don't really remember. It's possible, But like
I said, I don't know. Question. Okay, the reason I
asked if you ever worked with Noel before? And you
said the most of the time you do the rounds
and the counts. Thomas, Uh huh. Question would it have
been kind of awkward that both of you guys sat down,
didn't discuss the fact you're not going to do the counts,
don't discuss the fact you're going to do the rounds,
and just sat down, slept and you know, went on
the computer. But no one spoke about the facts. But
someone between the both of you guys, you initialed the
rounds the count slips and also the round sheets. Thomas,
speaking of I don't believe that we had any conversation.
I don't really remember any conversation that we had or
anything like that. There are some things that are just
not spoken about. It could have been like I said,
I was exhausted. Hey listen, I did whatever whatever, and
she did whatever whatever, and that was it. Question does
it mean Thomas, there wasn't. No, he gets cut off
if you worked with her in the past. Does that
mean you guys did the same thing in the past, Thomas, No,
question and just knew Thomas, No, it doesn't mean that.
Absolutely not. Question. How come either of you didn't nudge
each other to say, hey, let's go question or Thomas,
I can't say what happened, what was going on with her?
I knew what was going on with me. I was
just as you could see by roster. And that's not
my work roster. That's just my overtime roster that you
all pulled up and brought to me. It's every day,
every day. And I was just I had things that
I had going on at the time. And I think
the point being there, and again, because you're under oath,
we just want to make sure that we're clear here.
In fact, it was like an unspoken thing you guys did,
but it seemed to be so natural that you didn't
conduct any rounds or any counts. So it just seems
odd that you wouldn't have happened like that in the
past if there was no discussion that we're had, mister Thomas,
like I said, if I did work with her, I
don't remember if I did or did not. I mean,
it's quite possible. I don't remember everybody that I work
with in the shoe, but it wasn't something that we
just spoke about. Question isn't it kind of awkward that
the one night that both of you guys decided that
the rounds are not going to be done, the counts
are not going to be done, that this incident happens Thomas?
It is. Question is it possible Thomas cuts them off?
But it's never happened before, so of course it's an
awkward thing. Question is it possible that you guys haven't
done any of the rounds or counts on shifts before? Thomas? No,
that's not possible. I wouldn't put that all to label
one night for every night that happens in the shoe.
Absolutely not. I wouldn't label that question. He admitted already
that he didn't conduct all of the rounds and rounds
he's documented, but he thinks he's done the majority of them.
Is that correct, Thomas, I said, I'm not perfect? Question right, Thomas,
And I've done my rounds. I've done all my rounds
all the time. But I'm not a perfect person. I
may have slipped up here or there sometime, but I
have done my rounds just one particular night. He gets
cut off, But not. I think what you said before,
you're not perfect. You haven't done all your rounds. But
that mostly Thomas. I would say that on schedule that
I do my rounds ninety to ninety five percent of
the time, and sometimes I don't do half an hour.
I do it on the hour. Question, well, what about
he gets cut off by Thomas. You know what I mean.
But it's still the rounds getting conducted. Question And what
for the counts? And now we're talking specifically for the shoe, Thomas,
we're talking about specifically for the shoe. I usually get
every count done, every count done. All right, folks, we're
gonna wrap up right here. And in the next episode
dealing with the topic, we're gonna pick up where we
left off. All the information that goes with this episode
can be found in the description box.