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Speaker 1: W m n H rip the dobles. We're back from

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the brand.

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Speaker 2: He has stand out in the dark.

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Speaker 3: You know he was sadly and I will ever win

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our spark.

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Speaker 2: And res sadly and all that.

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Speaker 4: Is wrong startup but it keeps saving me. But no,

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I'll not got into this. No, say the things that

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you wanted to see.

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Speaker 2: I try to shout.

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Speaker 3: Try it means I do it for yourself past me.

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I am passing, but we would knowing.

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Speaker 5: That there's somebody aunt.

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Speaker 2: It's not tis not, it's not so much talking. I

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think it through all me. I want to stop from me, So.

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Speaker 5: Don't fro me. It's words you.

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Speaker 6: A person so around I know it's so do the

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isolation in the crowd. The blame is along on you

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and all I'm saying it because now you're feeling me

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was tough.

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Speaker 2: Now we're both going into this. No, no, say the.

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Speaker 5: Things that show miss try to shoats every time.

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Speaker 2: I'll do it. That's bastly by.

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Speaker 3: We must not as on the last show, stop sids nothing.

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Speaker 7: Sima stopping away.

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Speaker 5: I think it's true to me. I stop for.

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Speaker 7: Don't bottle shows says.

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Speaker 2: Don't get a sitting show. No don't miscaus you don't.

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Speaker 8: Soon No, alright, that is don't fool me twice by

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the band the Marches, And of course you heard that

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the first time on American radio here on WM and

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H on this very program. And we've got let's see

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who we have here. I believe Kate Morrow is with

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us via Microsoft teams. Kate, can you hear me?

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Speaker 9: Yeah?

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Speaker 10: I can hear you.

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Speaker 8: Hello, excellent, Welcome to the show. Is anyone else from

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the band with you? Or are you?

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Speaker 9: Is it?

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Speaker 8: Are you flying solo?

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Speaker 10: Unfortunately the ghettos can't come with me, so I'm playing solo.

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Speaker 9: But I'm very happy to be here.

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Speaker 8: That is quite all right. We're very happy to have you.

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Welcome to the show. I love your sound particularly and

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you probably hear this all the time, but I'm particularly

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taken with the vocals and the harmonies. And do all

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four of you sing live?

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Speaker 9: Yes?

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Speaker 10: So that's something we've just started to incorporate into our

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live sets. I was the last one to start singing

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yes us vocals.

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Speaker 8: Well, you don't see a lot of singing drummers, and

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you know, I think it's obvious why. I mean, you know, drumming,

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it's the most physical instrument, right, you're using all four

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of your limbs, so it's probably challenging. I've always assumed anyway,

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that it's it's challenging for drummers to sing because you're

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already using a lot of wind. You're already you're you're

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already doing so much. How has that been for you?

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You said that you were the last of the four

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to really start singing. I mean, how how has that

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been for you? Has it been challenging or is it

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kind of come naturally or what's happened?

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Speaker 9: Like I bet both.

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Speaker 10: You know, when I'm playing live, I usually do tend

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to sing along with it a microphone, although I don't

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seem very good. Then we're starting to that, we're starting

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to incorporate into our set, and I'm having time to

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practice with the ghettos, get used to playing west the

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drums at the same time, and it's going really well.

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It sounds amazing when we have all four of us,

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So I'm enjoying it.

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Speaker 8: Is it important to you as a band to replicate

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because I would imagine this is very difficult because again,

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such a it seems to me. And again, when whether

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it's that song or November, it seems like it's such

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a key part of your sound, those those harmonies. Is

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it important to be able to replicate that live? Or

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do you not worry about it as much? Maybe live

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it can be a little looser and a little raw,

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or I mean, how do you approach that? Do you

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do you really try to replicate what's what's what you've

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recorded or or is it not that big of a deal.

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Speaker 10: No, I think we definitely are trying to make sure

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our life sound is quite similar to the tracks.

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Speaker 8: Yeah, and so we are.

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Speaker 9: We haven't working on it.

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Speaker 8: It is important, do you like, how do you in

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terms of practicing, uh, kind of replicating that vocally? Do

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you do you ever, like just sit like the four

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of you and just try singing the parts and and

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you know, you each find your octave or do you

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just or do you just play the songs and practice,

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you know, the singing obviously while you're playing.

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Speaker 10: Do you know when we've tried to do it like

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a capella, we usually just end up laughing. We have

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to do it with all the instruments in the film. Yeah,

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it was we'll just sit and laugh at each other.

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Speaker 8: No, that makes sense, That makes sense. Now, how long

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has the band been around. You're relatively new, right the Marches, Yeah,

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we are.

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Speaker 10: So the four of us came together in May twenty

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twenty four, so it's been in nearly two years. Nearly

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two years.

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Speaker 8: Next, okay, okay, so relatively relatively new. Now I'm curious

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about So I was reading this, So the BBC it

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says here, and you can tell me if this is right,

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but it says here the BBC kind of has introduced

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you as calling you, uh, Glasgow's freshest girl band. And

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when I see that, something occurs to me. Now, obviously,

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so you're you're all females in the band, but I

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find it odd that that someone would uh point that out.

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I'm only bringing it up because I'm curious how you

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feel about when say, the BBC refers to you as

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Glasgow's freshest girl band, Because to me, it's weird that.

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You know, it's like, you don't call a bunch of

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dudes in a rock band. You don't call them a

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boy band, you know, unless you're referring to you know,

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a specific genre, right, But but how do you feel

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about that? Like to me, it seems almost sexist when

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the BBC goes out of their way to label you

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as that. You know, you're a rock band, you happen

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to be for women, but why do you need this

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special label? I'm curious how you feel about that, do

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you know?

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Speaker 9: I think you can take it in a number of ways.

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And you know, we are all females.

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Speaker 10: We are all female bands, so that's simpletly understandable.

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Speaker 9: The presenters who said that they were females.

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Speaker 10: Themselves, okay, and the Glasgow scenes there aren't many for

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or aren't many all female bands. Yeah, I can understand

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why they have said that. You know, it's not something

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that we're deliberately, you know, not trying to mark ourselves

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as obviously we are a gheto band, that is us. However,

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you know, like you said, you could say a rock band,

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you could say whatever. However we just took it as

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we just took it as a compliment from the BBC

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and all they listened to so many bands every day

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that if they're calling us the freshies ghetto bands in Glasgow,

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then I think we are quite happy to take that

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as a compliment.

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Speaker 8: Yeah, no, that's good. That's a great way to look

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at it. Yeah, it just struck me as strange but

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as you mentioned too, it was it was women who

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are saying it, so that changes the context a bit too.

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So so that's good, that's good. But I mean, but

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you are, you are a rock band. And and for

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for anyone who you know, for anyone who was joining

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us late who didn't hear the track, don't fool me twice,

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I mean, you're I'm curious to know more about your

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sound and your influences because I I hear some different

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things in there, but like, who are some of your influences?

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Speaker 10: Well, some of our influences definitely have to be fleet

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with Mac. For example, the Bangles when we're starting out,

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those were the Kina bands that we're saying, very much

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fan our sound. Now we have changed direction, you know,

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don't for me twice is the start of our more

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rockier sound. Yeah, and so we are just cant finding

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their feet there. And you could say, like alanis motor

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Set for example, definitely an influence there.

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Speaker 8: Yeah, Yeah, I like the Fleewood Mac. I can definitely

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hear that. I'm a big Fleetwood Mac fan, and I

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know what you mean. Yeah, that's that's definitely And and

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again it kind of goes to that vocal approach right,

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you know, it reminds me of a very very evocative

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of of Fleewood Mac.

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Speaker 10: And then oh, absolutely we do call our singer Stevie

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next because she does and just like her.

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Speaker 8: Rethinks, Yeah, that's that's fantastic. That's fantastic. So Don't Fool

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Me Twice as the newest single, and then you've got November,

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which we also did play on the show. Really like that,

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and then you've got You've got a couple others before that.

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What's what's kind of the do you have plans to

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do an EP or a full album or there's so

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many different ways to release music these days, but are

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you going to do more singles? Do you know kind

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of what your forward trajectory is.

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Speaker 9: As far as that, Yes, absolutely so.

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Speaker 10: I think our next plan is to release an EP okay,

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which is very exciting, going along the lines of Don't

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for Me Twice and that more rockier sound. Yeah, November

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and Don't Form Me Twice was released on like our

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double asage release, it was put on vinyl, and November

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was the end of our first chapter together kind of

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like our old sound, and then Don't for Me Twice

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is the beginning of our new sound, So the beginning

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then of our EP and What's the Cup in twenty

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twenty six.

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Speaker 8: Oh, very cool Now in terms of because you talk

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about that kind of your old sound and your new sound,

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that that transition, is that something that you decided as

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a band in other words, was it Is it intentional

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or is it more just sort of organic, like that's

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kind of the direction you're you're going and you're just

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going with it. I'm curious about that. Is that something

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you where you sat down and you said, you know,

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the four of you said we need to go, we

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want to change direction, or or is it just kind

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of something that's happening.

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Speaker 9: So it just kind of happened in the room.

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Speaker 10: The four of us set and we write our songs together.

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Whilst writing Don't for Me twice and a couple of

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our others which are unreleased.

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Speaker 9: We realized, wow, we love playing the sound.

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Speaker 10: It comes so easy to us, like it's definitely the

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direction we wanted to head, and so we decided to

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make that kind of move and say, okay, it is

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quite a big change up going down the more rockier route,

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but definitely yeah.

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Speaker 9: That's when we decided this is where we want to go.

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Speaker 8: Okay, okay, Yeah, so it sounds like kind of a

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kind of a combination of both. Right, it's you know,

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you kind of naturally started doing that, but but then

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once you realize it's working, you know, and don't exactly Yeah,

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and it makes sense. I mean, Don't Fool Me Twice

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is a great track. I definitely want to hear more

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of that. So that's that's that's really good. And you've

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done some festivals, right, yes, we have.

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Speaker 9: We did our first set of festivals this year.

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Speaker 10: Yeah.

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Speaker 8: I was looking at this so let's see, uh, come

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back around. Oh yeah, oh, there's a bunch of them

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listened here. How many of you done? It looks like

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you've done quite a few, right, Yeah, so yeah.

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Speaker 9: We've done quite a few.

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Speaker 10: Most noticeable we played Scotland's biggest outdoor festival, Beldrum up

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in Inverness.

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Speaker 8: Okay.

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Speaker 9: We managed to do two stages there.

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Speaker 10: We did a live electric set and then we also

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did an acoustic set as well on a slightly smaller stage,

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which was really fun. And we've done some festivals local

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to where we live in the west of Scotland as well. Yeah,

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that's been a nice mix of the smaller ones and

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then obviously Scotland's biggest, so it'd been really fun.

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Speaker 8: That's great because the thing about festivals is, you know,

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and I always say, and obviously you know this because

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you're experiencing it, but I always say, especially for young,

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new emerging bands, festivals, not only do they get you

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in front of these very large crowds, so they expose

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you to you know, a potentially whole new fan base

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and can help you to build a fan base very quickly,

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but also the networking opportunities that come with playing festivals

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it's unparalleled. You know, you meet, you meet all these

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other artists that you're playing with, but also you know

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all kinds of industry people at these festivals and that

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helps you build so you know, so you build an audience,

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but you also build a network and a reputation within

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the industry that is so critical. So festivals are if

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you can play. And we've got a lot of guests.

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We've had a lot of guests from the UK who

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who've been you know, we've done a festival or two,

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but no one who's done as many as you have.

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And it seems like you really, I mean, you're really

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just approaching that head on, which is fantastic. I tell

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everybody play every festival you can because it is so

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it is so critical. I mean you can make big

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leaps and bounds as playing festivals. So that's that's fantastic.

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Speaker 9: Absolutely. Yeah.

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Speaker 10: You don't know who's going to be there watching you,

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so as it's just a great way to reach new people, nuisances,

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different places, make connections, as you said, so your network,

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so absolutely And what is.

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Speaker 8: This by the way, the uh it says you sold

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out the SWG three Poetry Club show. What's that?

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Speaker 9: Yes, So s WG three is a venue in Glasgow.

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The Poetry Club is the name of the venue.

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Speaker 10: So that was where we did our headline show for

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our single Feel at All and we managed to completely

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sell out that show.

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Speaker 8: Oh excellent, excellent, Okay, very good. Yeah, so you're off

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to a great start. Now are you playing? Are you

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playing consistently? Are you touring? Are you are you doing

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a lot of like like what's the live situation?

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Speaker 10: Now?

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Speaker 8: I can tell you here in the United States, a

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lot of a lot of bands kind of hype, at

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least in this part of the country, A lot of

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bands kind of hibernate a little bit in the winter.

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They you know, they're active recording and writing, but they

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don't play out as much. But what's what's the situation

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where you are as far as live shows.

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Speaker 10: So we did our last live show of the year

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on the set December. That was our headline show for

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the release of Don't Film Me twice in November so

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that as well, that was in Glasgow.

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Speaker 9: That was really cool.

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Speaker 10: We are taking a little bit of a break over

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new year, starting to write some new songs and then

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in februe March time we're actually going on a tour.

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Speaker 8: Oh outstanding are you now? Are you going on your

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own tour or are you opening for for somebody? Or

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what's what are you doing for the tour?

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Speaker 10: So far it's I believe it as a headline tour.

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I believe it might be a joint headline in one

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of the locations. It's oh to be one hundred percent

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confirmed as yet, however, yet it does look as if

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will be the headline.

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Speaker 9: So it's very exciting.

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Speaker 8: Oh, very good. That is outstanding. Outstanding And can you

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talk a little bit too about the themes of of

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your songs because I saw something about you know this

302
00:16:53,120 --> 00:16:55,360
is more than you know? You kind of think of it.

303
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It's it's not just a band, but a movement, and

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it's it seems like there's there's certain themes that come up,

305
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you know, like empowerment and and uh you know and

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and uh taking control and and so forth. I mean,

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can can you talk a little bit about that? And

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I'm curious how important that is to you as a

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band to kind of like, you know, do you have

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a certain message that you're trying to put forth.

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Speaker 10: Yeah, I would definitely say Impowerment's a really good one.

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Definitely one of the themes. Yeah, I guess like our

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message is just I suppose that as empowerments really.

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Speaker 9: We just write music.

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Speaker 10: We love what we do, and we want to just

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put out music that we love to play, we love

317
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to listen to, and so yeah, that's that's definitely what I.

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Speaker 9: Would say for that.

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Speaker 8: Yeah, outstanding. Well Will in a moment, I'm gonna play

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this track November, which is the I think the first

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00:17:50,319 --> 00:17:52,799
song of your band that we've played on the show.

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But uh, you know, we're always happy to to kind

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of be the you know, the entry point into American

324
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radio for some of these great bands that are that

325
00:18:03,079 --> 00:18:05,440
are coming out of your your area. There's so much,

326
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so much incredible talent there. But so we're gonna play

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that track in a moment and we'll let you go.

328
00:18:10,599 --> 00:18:13,480
But Kate, thank you so much for joining us. And

329
00:18:13,680 --> 00:18:16,599
where's the best place to go online or the best

330
00:18:16,640 --> 00:18:19,200
places to go for people to keep up with everything

331
00:18:19,279 --> 00:18:21,240
that The Marches is doing, because you've got a lot

332
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going on, So we want to make sure our listeners

333
00:18:22,960 --> 00:18:24,720
know how they can follow you online.

334
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Speaker 9: Yes, absolutely so.

335
00:18:27,440 --> 00:18:30,240
Speaker 10: The best place you can beaches is probably our Instagram.

336
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We are The Marches Music on Instagram. We've got blue

337
00:18:33,240 --> 00:18:35,079
Tech so you'll be able to find us and you

338
00:18:35,160 --> 00:18:37,759
can get our music on Apple Music, in Spotify and

339
00:18:37,839 --> 00:18:39,839
all the user of stream insights as well.

340
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Speaker 8: Outstanding, outstanding. All right, Kate Morrow, thank you so much.

341
00:18:43,400 --> 00:18:45,160
We'll let you go. We're going to hit that track.

342
00:18:45,279 --> 00:18:47,279
But we will definitely do this again in the future.

343
00:18:47,400 --> 00:18:49,359
Like I said, we're big fans. I love the vocals.

344
00:18:49,440 --> 00:18:52,480
It's just sounds so good. And I'm glad Fleetwood Matt

345
00:18:52,519 --> 00:18:54,880
came up because now that totally makes sense to me.

346
00:18:55,039 --> 00:18:59,079
But yes, absolutely, absolutely so, we will do this again

347
00:18:59,119 --> 00:19:00,839
in the future. Keep up the great work. We'll talk

348
00:19:00,880 --> 00:19:04,640
to you soon. Thanks Kate, thank you so much for

349
00:19:04,759 --> 00:19:07,880
having me. Thank you you got it. Bye bye bye.

350
00:19:09,160 --> 00:19:11,920
All right, I didn't mean to start the track yet.

351
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That is Kate Morrow from the band The Marches, and

352
00:19:16,039 --> 00:19:17,960
I really this is another great song. You heard it

353
00:19:18,000 --> 00:19:20,799
here first on American radio here on WM and H.

354
00:19:20,920 --> 00:19:23,799
This is another great track. This is called November and

355
00:19:23,920 --> 00:19:25,920
the band is the Marches.

356
00:19:30,359 --> 00:19:35,559
Speaker 2: November for Saint Day. Oh change.

357
00:19:37,680 --> 00:19:43,160
Speaker 3: We rode away as fors go canty.

358
00:19:45,119 --> 00:19:47,440
Speaker 2: Don't like good daily run.

359
00:19:48,119 --> 00:19:54,759
Speaker 3: The engines are this say, we rode away as far

360
00:19:55,000 --> 00:19:56,480
as lit go.

361
00:19:56,880 --> 00:20:04,400
Speaker 2: Canty go both beast and snow room. And there is

362
00:20:04,759 --> 00:20:06,720
no one here to see.

363
00:20:07,279 --> 00:20:12,720
Speaker 3: But well, neso, that's no, there's no stuff, no asking

364
00:20:13,079 --> 00:20:14,680
beady grace.

365
00:20:16,279 --> 00:20:17,680
Speaker 5: Can belly.

366
00:20:22,000 --> 00:20:25,160
Speaker 2: Now let to pick up the pieces.

367
00:20:25,119 --> 00:20:28,920
Speaker 11: Everybody knowing you're out of rubby chasers.

368
00:20:29,279 --> 00:20:31,960
Speaker 2: February the funny be in.

369
00:20:36,400 --> 00:20:40,960
Speaker 12: Stoping chasing a definite in Plascas on second morning.

370
00:20:41,319 --> 00:20:45,880
Speaker 13: But I am got far know February the fly w

371
00:20:51,079 --> 00:20:54,240
the the non Saint Week were both.

372
00:20:54,319 --> 00:21:00,559
Speaker 3: Yt inside walks behind us now but we were not okay,

373
00:21:00,799 --> 00:21:05,720
And I finds it out just thinking, now do we

374
00:21:05,960 --> 00:21:07,000
go both.

375
00:21:06,920 --> 00:21:11,079
Speaker 2: Best and slow root men? But there is no one

376
00:21:11,480 --> 00:21:12,559
here to say.

377
00:21:13,039 --> 00:21:17,119
Speaker 3: But when this so it's no, there's no stopping now

378
00:21:18,000 --> 00:21:20,400
a can beady raise.

379
00:21:21,799 --> 00:21:31,079
Speaker 2: Hay Now I writing to pick up the peace, says.

380
00:21:30,880 --> 00:21:34,559
Speaker 5: Everybody know out of reach chase.

381
00:21:34,359 --> 00:21:43,880
Speaker 2: On Fabulary, if only be him stepn'try saying the death

382
00:21:44,119 --> 00:21:45,400
in Alaska.

383
00:21:45,839 --> 00:21:50,000
Speaker 5: Was like no, but I am got far as.

384
00:21:49,559 --> 00:21:51,559
Speaker 2: Fabulary only.

385
00:22:11,440 --> 00:22:15,920
Speaker 3: Never left here to pick up the pieces. Everybody, Norman,

386
00:22:16,279 --> 00:22:17,039
you're out.

387
00:22:16,799 --> 00:22:21,119
Speaker 2: Of Maria Chase or it's February. It's funny it'd be.

388
00:22:21,480 --> 00:22:29,119
Speaker 3: Here nights like cha say every last time.

389
00:22:29,720 --> 00:22:30,279
Speaker 5: It's like the.

390
00:22:30,440 --> 00:22:35,160
Speaker 2: Morning, but I ain't got no tebulary.

391
00:22:34,920 --> 00:22:41,559
Speaker 5: Funny, Well you now want.

392
00:22:41,880 --> 00:22:43,200
Speaker 2: Anything of the peace?

393
00:22:43,319 --> 00:22:48,880
Speaker 11: Saverybody knowledge of my beach chase on February.

394
00:22:49,480 --> 00:23:00,839
Speaker 2: Funny Ben November fourteenth was changed.

395
00:23:04,079 --> 00:23:06,319
Speaker 8: So good that is November. The band is the Marches.

396
00:23:06,400 --> 00:23:08,359
Thank you again to Kate Morrow from the Band the

397
00:23:08,440 --> 00:23:11,640
Marches for joining us earlier. I really enjoyed talking with her.

398
00:23:11,799 --> 00:23:14,680
And it's all about the vocals with that band. That's

399
00:23:14,799 --> 00:23:16,839
so good. I'm actually gonna sneak in one more. We're

400
00:23:16,839 --> 00:23:18,960
gonna play one more track from the Marches. This one

401
00:23:19,000 --> 00:23:21,440
we have not played on the show before, but it's

402
00:23:21,480 --> 00:23:24,200
a short one. It's only three minutes, but it's another

403
00:23:24,240 --> 00:23:26,680
great song. I really again, I really really like their

404
00:23:26,720 --> 00:23:29,160
sound a lot. We'll play this too. This is called

405
00:23:29,200 --> 00:23:31,559
talking too much and again the band is the Marches,

406
00:23:40,680 --> 00:23:42,279
the mom she's no luck, but I.

407
00:23:42,319 --> 00:23:42,839
Speaker 2: Got a bunch.

408
00:23:43,920 --> 00:23:47,920
Speaker 12: Well it'll be this time.

409
00:23:49,160 --> 00:23:50,079
Speaker 10: You So.

410
00:23:52,319 --> 00:23:55,240
Speaker 2: Why can't you see taking it down?

411
00:23:55,400 --> 00:23:56,559
Speaker 14: Li Spice.

412
00:23:57,720 --> 00:24:00,200
Speaker 3: Song cry, I.

413
00:24:00,279 --> 00:24:10,400
Speaker 2: Need inside, Honan, say why can't you be cause you're

414
00:24:10,759 --> 00:24:14,000
talking to Mary must Must.

415
00:24:13,920 --> 00:24:20,799
Speaker 12: Talking yet un intuiting, because you're talking to Mars and

416
00:24:21,079 --> 00:24:25,480
mors too much, talking all the accomplished.

417
00:24:26,279 --> 00:24:37,559
Speaker 2: You're talking yos. How are you being?

418
00:24:38,640 --> 00:24:40,319
Speaker 13: How you be when I'm gone?

419
00:24:41,880 --> 00:24:52,559
Speaker 2: Oh it's nothing from me. I didn't last no, so yeah,

420
00:24:52,680 --> 00:24:58,160
I need in say ho say, why can't you be?

421
00:24:58,359 --> 00:25:04,720
The way? Gotcha talking too much?

422
00:25:04,880 --> 00:25:12,720
Speaker 12: Too much, too much talking coming Susie, gotcho tuckings er

423
00:25:12,880 --> 00:25:16,279
must too much, too much shocking as.

424
00:25:16,119 --> 00:25:21,319
Speaker 6: Its doing, compting, gotcha talking too.

425
00:25:21,319 --> 00:25:24,480
Speaker 5: Much to the last, too much talking here, I know

426
00:25:25,279 --> 00:25:25,680
I'm in.

427
00:25:25,759 --> 00:25:29,480
Speaker 2: SOUSI got socking so.

428
00:25:29,759 --> 00:25:34,160
Speaker 5: Much, too much, too much stock in askins.

429
00:25:33,640 --> 00:25:37,880
Speaker 2: Sewing cot talking y'all sleep.

430
00:25:43,319 --> 00:25:57,000
Speaker 11: Ye goscha shocking so much to matter, too much.

431
00:25:57,000 --> 00:26:29,720
Speaker 2: Stopping here, I know coming suits too much, too much,

432
00:26:29,920 --> 00:26:30,519
too much.

433
00:26:32,480 --> 00:26:34,559
Speaker 8: Oh my god, that is so good talking too much.

434
00:26:34,680 --> 00:26:38,000
The band is the Marches. That is so good. By

435
00:26:38,039 --> 00:26:41,640
the way, during our conversation with Kate Morrow from the

436
00:26:41,720 --> 00:26:44,079
band The Marches, let's see, we had a couple of

437
00:26:46,000 --> 00:26:48,759
a couple of messages come in via Matt connorton dot com.

438
00:26:49,440 --> 00:26:54,880
Lauren says, absolutely love, don't fool me twice and Louise said,

439
00:26:54,960 --> 00:26:58,839
had the Marches on repeat over the festive period, bring

440
00:26:59,000 --> 00:27:01,559
on the new year so wonderful. Yep, So the March

441
00:27:01,680 --> 00:27:03,880
is getting some love. So thank you again of course

442
00:27:04,480 --> 00:27:07,240
to Kate Morrow from the band The Marches for joining us.

443
00:27:07,319 --> 00:27:10,480
And if you are listening live on Saturday. Coming up

444
00:27:10,559 --> 00:27:13,799
in the third hour, we have the Far North. Really

445
00:27:13,880 --> 00:27:18,440
looking forward to speaking with Lee Wilding from the Far North.

446
00:27:19,160 --> 00:27:21,200
It's actually a solo project. It sounds like the name

447
00:27:21,240 --> 00:27:23,319
of a band, but it's actually a solo project that

448
00:27:23,400 --> 00:27:28,200
seems to be a trend. But his music is amazing too.

449
00:27:28,319 --> 00:27:30,119
So that'll be coming up today on the third hour.

450
00:27:30,200 --> 00:27:32,799
In the meantime, we do have some more music news

451
00:27:33,000 --> 00:27:37,319
to share. This is very interesting to me if you

452
00:27:37,440 --> 00:27:40,880
are interested in music industry news. Hopefully it's interesting to

453
00:27:40,960 --> 00:27:45,880
you music business worldwide. Reporting that Billboard just made free

454
00:27:46,000 --> 00:27:50,519
streams worth more on its US charts, YouTube is not

455
00:27:50,759 --> 00:27:55,559
happy and is pulling its data. So Billboard, of course,

456
00:27:55,680 --> 00:27:58,119
you know, they've got their various charts. I used to

457
00:27:58,279 --> 00:28:00,359
love when I was a kid, because I was music

458
00:28:00,400 --> 00:28:07,480
industry nerd, probably starting in high school. I would I

459
00:28:07,519 --> 00:28:10,559
remember going to the school library and I would always

460
00:28:10,640 --> 00:28:13,359
look for the newest Billboard magazine and I would read that.

461
00:28:13,480 --> 00:28:15,319
That's how much of a music industry nerd I was

462
00:28:15,359 --> 00:28:16,200
from a very young age.

463
00:28:16,640 --> 00:28:16,799
Speaker 10: You know.

464
00:28:16,880 --> 00:28:20,240
Speaker 8: I obviously I played an instrument and I was into

465
00:28:20,279 --> 00:28:22,400
playing music, but I was also very fascinated by the

466
00:28:22,519 --> 00:28:25,680
music business. So I would read Billboard. I wouldn't necessarily

467
00:28:25,720 --> 00:28:27,680
read it cover to cover. There's some things I wouldn't

468
00:28:27,720 --> 00:28:29,759
necessarily pay attention to, but I always like to look

469
00:28:29,799 --> 00:28:32,119
at the charts. You know, you've got the Billboard Hot

470
00:28:32,160 --> 00:28:34,000
one hundred, and you've got you've got all these different

471
00:28:34,039 --> 00:28:35,880
charts in Billboard. And of course now you can access

472
00:28:36,000 --> 00:28:37,960
it all online if you have a subscription, which I

473
00:28:38,039 --> 00:28:40,519
don't because I'm not going to spend that money. But

474
00:28:42,680 --> 00:28:46,559
but the way that Billboards, so the way that Billboard

475
00:28:46,759 --> 00:28:49,720
used to back in the day, back in my day.

476
00:28:49,839 --> 00:28:53,759
The way that is, you know, what would go into

477
00:28:53,880 --> 00:28:58,400
the into calculating the chart positions would be metrics like sales,

478
00:28:58,960 --> 00:29:03,759
because back then singles would you know, you would have singles.

479
00:29:03,799 --> 00:29:06,279
You would have you had Vinyl forty five records if

480
00:29:06,319 --> 00:29:08,799
you go way back. But of course you also had

481
00:29:08,920 --> 00:29:12,279
cut singles if you remember cus singles. I was in

482
00:29:12,359 --> 00:29:14,119
a band called the Jinkston We used to joke that

483
00:29:14,200 --> 00:29:15,720
we were going to release a single.

484
00:29:16,279 --> 00:29:16,839
Speaker 2: We never did.

485
00:29:17,720 --> 00:29:19,559
Speaker 8: And of course you had CD singles and so forth,

486
00:29:19,680 --> 00:29:24,000
so you had single sales, but you also of course

487
00:29:24,079 --> 00:29:28,160
had radio airplay. Radio airplay would play a big role

488
00:29:28,960 --> 00:29:32,960
in how Billboard would calculate the charts, and I'm sure

489
00:29:32,960 --> 00:29:37,079
it still does obviously, But and also MTV. I don't

490
00:29:37,160 --> 00:29:40,880
know if but I don't think MTV. I don't think

491
00:29:41,000 --> 00:29:44,880
rotation of a music video on MTV was ever a

492
00:29:44,960 --> 00:29:47,359
part of the data that Billboard would use. I could

493
00:29:47,400 --> 00:29:49,640
be mistaken about that, but I don't think that it was.

494
00:29:51,000 --> 00:29:53,440
I don't think they ever used that data. As far

495
00:29:53,519 --> 00:29:55,559
as the charts, I think it was all airplay and sales,

496
00:29:56,119 --> 00:29:59,839
not not MTV or vh one or anything like that. Again,

497
00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:02,599
I'm pretty sure I'm right about that. But but so

498
00:30:02,759 --> 00:30:05,519
today it's all different, right, because we have the Internet.

499
00:30:05,640 --> 00:30:09,759
So today things that go into Billboard charts are things like, uh,

500
00:30:10,039 --> 00:30:12,839
you know, how many people are listening to a song online?

501
00:30:12,960 --> 00:30:14,920
Radio airplay is still, of course a big part of it,

502
00:30:15,000 --> 00:30:19,920
but but online, what's happening online? You know, it's much

503
00:30:19,960 --> 00:30:23,079
more complicated now, right, It's it's because it used to be.

504
00:30:23,759 --> 00:30:25,920
If you're if the only data points you're using are

505
00:30:26,200 --> 00:30:28,359
you know, you can have a concrete number you can

506
00:30:28,400 --> 00:30:31,960
look at, right, how many did this track sell in

507
00:30:32,119 --> 00:30:35,480
terms of singles? How many did it sell in the stores?

508
00:30:37,079 --> 00:30:40,960
And you know radio stations when they report their playlist data,

509
00:30:41,279 --> 00:30:43,839
you know, how many spins did this get? Okay, these

510
00:30:43,880 --> 00:30:47,119
are these are metrics that we can use and calculate,

511
00:30:48,119 --> 00:30:50,559
and you know, they have whatever formulas they use, obviously

512
00:30:50,680 --> 00:30:53,200
one ways more than the other. But but you figure

513
00:30:53,240 --> 00:30:54,880
it out, right, you have hard numbers to look at,

514
00:30:55,519 --> 00:30:57,640
and I guess you still have hard numbers to look at.

515
00:30:57,720 --> 00:31:01,839
But now it's like, you know, and you've got many

516
00:31:01,880 --> 00:31:05,799
different streaming services and it's a lot, right, So it's

517
00:31:05,920 --> 00:31:09,640
all much more complicated now. One of the ways that

518
00:31:10,000 --> 00:31:13,759
people access music to listen to his YouTube. It's the

519
00:31:13,880 --> 00:31:16,079
easiest way, you know, you can go on YouTube finds

520
00:31:16,160 --> 00:31:18,960
us about anything. You're not going to get as high

521
00:31:18,960 --> 00:31:22,720
a quality file as you would if you actually purchase

522
00:31:22,799 --> 00:31:25,519
a wavefile or an MP three. A wave sounds better

523
00:31:25,559 --> 00:31:28,680
than an MP three, a CD sounds better than either one,

524
00:31:28,799 --> 00:31:31,200
and a vinyl record sounds better than all of it.

525
00:31:31,319 --> 00:31:35,759
But but you can go on YouTube and just listen

526
00:31:35,799 --> 00:31:38,640
to music. And that's what a lot of people do.

527
00:31:38,759 --> 00:31:40,880
That's how a lot of people discover new music is YouTube.

528
00:31:41,319 --> 00:31:44,680
So here's what's happening. Just give you some context for

529
00:31:44,799 --> 00:31:47,240
what we're talking about here. So getting back to the story,

530
00:31:48,319 --> 00:31:52,240
so YouTube says again this is from music business worldwide

531
00:31:52,279 --> 00:31:55,720
dot com. YouTube says it will soon stop providing data

532
00:31:56,160 --> 00:32:00,240
to Billboard for inclusion in the US charts, and a

533
00:32:00,319 --> 00:32:04,319
partnership that has lasted more than a decade. The decision,

534
00:32:04,480 --> 00:32:08,799
announced on December seventeenth by Lee or Cohen, YouTube's global

535
00:32:08,839 --> 00:32:12,319
head of music, comes just one day after Billboard revealed

536
00:32:12,440 --> 00:32:18,680
changes to its chart methodology that will actually narrow the

537
00:32:18,880 --> 00:32:23,240
waiting gap between paid and ad sponsored streams. So the

538
00:32:23,319 --> 00:32:25,960
waiting gap, and I did refer to it, but so

539
00:32:26,319 --> 00:32:31,559
different metrics have different weight, so you might have However,

540
00:32:31,640 --> 00:32:36,839
many paid streams might have a certain weight AD supported

541
00:32:36,880 --> 00:32:39,440
streams which are free. You know, like if you go

542
00:32:39,559 --> 00:32:42,039
to listen to a song on YouTube, but before you

543
00:32:42,079 --> 00:32:43,920
can actually hear the song, you've got an AD that

544
00:32:44,000 --> 00:32:46,240
you have to click skip on, or you have two ads,

545
00:32:46,279 --> 00:32:48,319
one you can't skip and then the second one you can.

546
00:32:48,720 --> 00:32:51,759
That's usually how it seems to go, right, So that's

547
00:32:51,799 --> 00:32:55,160
an AD supported stream, So that's free. So in theory,

548
00:32:55,680 --> 00:32:59,880
paid streams would weigh more if you're calculating where on

549
00:33:00,079 --> 00:33:02,920
the chart this track is gonna go this single, you're

550
00:33:02,960 --> 00:33:05,480
gonna you know, because people who are actually paying for

551
00:33:05,920 --> 00:33:09,119
the stream or for the track, I should say people

552
00:33:09,160 --> 00:33:11,400
are like if they're paying to download it, for example,

553
00:33:11,480 --> 00:33:13,880
then you know they might care about it a little

554
00:33:13,920 --> 00:33:15,880
bit more than people who are just going on YouTube

555
00:33:15,920 --> 00:33:18,680
and listening to it for free, so you weigh that.

556
00:33:19,039 --> 00:33:24,839
So so there they've narrowed the gap between in terms

557
00:33:24,880 --> 00:33:29,079
of what each of those metrics weighs paid versus free. Essentially, okay,

558
00:33:29,200 --> 00:33:33,160
under Billboard's current formula for the Billboard two hundred one

559
00:33:33,400 --> 00:33:40,160
album unit equals one two hundred and fifty paid subscription

560
00:33:40,440 --> 00:33:44,000
streams or three thousand, seven hundred and fifty AD supported streams,

561
00:33:44,079 --> 00:33:50,680
a one to three ratio. Billboard's new methodology announced yesterday.

562
00:33:51,039 --> 00:33:52,519
Well this is this was this went up a few

563
00:33:52,599 --> 00:33:57,319
days ago. Announced on December sixteenth, Titans that ratio to

564
00:33:57,559 --> 00:34:00,319
one to two point five, with one album unit now

565
00:34:00,440 --> 00:34:03,880
equaling one thousand paid streams or twenty five hundred AD

566
00:34:03,920 --> 00:34:07,480
supported streams. The same ratio is being applied to the

567
00:34:07,559 --> 00:34:11,760
Hot one hundred chart. In other words, paid streams. This

568
00:34:11,920 --> 00:34:15,400
is the important part. Paid streams will still be weighted

569
00:34:15,559 --> 00:34:19,800
more favorably than ad supported plays, but by a smaller

570
00:34:19,920 --> 00:34:26,280
margin than before. That's interesting. Yet, in a statement today,

571
00:34:26,440 --> 00:34:28,920
Lee or Cohen said the changes do not go far

572
00:34:29,159 --> 00:34:34,559
enough YouTube. This is why YouTube is not happy. YouTube

573
00:34:34,679 --> 00:34:39,320
wants all streams to be counted equally on Billboard's charts,

574
00:34:39,880 --> 00:34:43,559
regardless of whether they come from paid subscriptions or ad

575
00:34:43,679 --> 00:34:47,599
supported services. Before we go any further what Cohen said,

576
00:34:47,840 --> 00:34:51,400
let me just say this, I would think that that

577
00:34:51,480 --> 00:34:54,039
would be a hell of a lot easier for Billboard,

578
00:34:55,000 --> 00:34:58,679
right because if they did it that way, if they

579
00:34:58,719 --> 00:35:04,159
took his his suggestion, just stop giving anything more weight

580
00:35:04,239 --> 00:35:06,639
than anything else. You just count it. You just count

581
00:35:06,679 --> 00:35:10,039
it all. Just the numbers are. What the numbers are,

582
00:35:10,280 --> 00:35:12,559
You count it all, you add it up, there's your numbers.

583
00:35:13,199 --> 00:35:17,559
Because it just seems like it would be a lot easier.

584
00:35:18,280 --> 00:35:18,440
Speaker 12: Now.

585
00:35:18,679 --> 00:35:21,079
Speaker 8: Maybe maybe I say that because as someone who's not

586
00:35:21,119 --> 00:35:24,800
good at math, I want math and numbers to be easy.

587
00:35:25,400 --> 00:35:27,360
That's my natural I have a natural impulse. I have

588
00:35:27,880 --> 00:35:30,840
a bias there, right, I want I always want math

589
00:35:30,880 --> 00:35:34,119
and numbers to be easy because I'm not good at math.

590
00:35:35,000 --> 00:35:38,400
But you know, it does seem like it would be simpler, right,

591
00:35:38,480 --> 00:35:44,480
It'd be a lot more efficient. I mean, they still

592
00:35:44,519 --> 00:35:47,760
I can't imagine how many data analysts Billboard has working

593
00:35:47,800 --> 00:35:51,239
for them. I'm sure it's a lot. But here's what

594
00:35:51,519 --> 00:35:53,920
Cohen said in his statement. Though he said quote Billboard

595
00:35:54,079 --> 00:35:59,400
uses an outdated formula that weights subscription supported streams higher

596
00:35:59,480 --> 00:36:03,880
than add supported. This doesn't reflect how fans engage with

597
00:36:04,079 --> 00:36:09,119
music today and ignores the massive engagement from fans who

598
00:36:09,280 --> 00:36:13,400
don't have a subscription. We believe every fan matters and

599
00:36:13,639 --> 00:36:19,599
every play should count equally. Therefore, after January sixteen, YouTube

600
00:36:19,719 --> 00:36:23,760
data will no longer be delivered or factored into the

601
00:36:24,079 --> 00:36:35,079
US Billboard Charts unquote. Now, in thinking about that, how

602
00:36:35,119 --> 00:36:37,800
does that affect how does that affect artists and labels

603
00:36:37,840 --> 00:36:44,559
and everybody who has music streaming on YouTube? Well, if

604
00:36:44,639 --> 00:36:48,039
you're getting a lot of streams on YouTube or at

605
00:36:48,119 --> 00:36:51,239
well here's here's something. What if you're an artist who

606
00:36:51,960 --> 00:36:56,320
does not put your music on Spotify because you're mad

607
00:36:57,599 --> 00:37:00,320
about how little Spotify pays out, which is a whole

608
00:37:00,360 --> 00:37:02,880
other subject. I'm not trying to take that side street,

609
00:37:03,039 --> 00:37:07,639
but I'm just it works for just this example. Say

610
00:37:07,679 --> 00:37:09,960
you're an artist, and there's a lot of them. There's

611
00:37:10,000 --> 00:37:12,760
both established artists who pulled their music from Spotify because

612
00:37:12,760 --> 00:37:16,440
they're mad, and there's there's independent artists. There's small artists

613
00:37:16,480 --> 00:37:18,280
who just don't want to put their music on Spotify,

614
00:37:18,400 --> 00:37:20,920
which I personally think is a mistake. I think you

615
00:37:20,960 --> 00:37:23,079
should still put your music on Spotify, even if you're

616
00:37:23,079 --> 00:37:26,679
not happy that they don't pay you anything. Because discoverability

617
00:37:27,159 --> 00:37:28,719
is a term that I like to use and that

618
00:37:28,800 --> 00:37:30,639
we use in the industry, that you have to make

619
00:37:30,679 --> 00:37:33,360
your music discoverable in order for people to discover it.

620
00:37:34,000 --> 00:37:36,000
So you want to be in as many places as possible.

621
00:37:36,039 --> 00:37:38,760
That's my philosophy. Some people disagree. We've had guests on

622
00:37:38,800 --> 00:37:43,239
the show who disagree. That's fine. But what if you're

623
00:37:43,280 --> 00:37:46,320
not on Spotify for whatever reasons, whatever your reasons are,

624
00:37:47,000 --> 00:37:49,880
and so YouTube is your fallback. YouTube is where people

625
00:37:49,920 --> 00:37:52,320
are going to find you and you want to be charting. Now,

626
00:37:52,360 --> 00:37:56,920
if you're an unsigned or small independent artist, you know

627
00:37:57,599 --> 00:38:00,119
you might maybe it doesn't matter to you because you

628
00:38:00,280 --> 00:38:02,679
know that you're not going to chart, you know, unless

629
00:38:02,760 --> 00:38:06,719
you get like, unless you blow up, you know, unless

630
00:38:06,719 --> 00:38:09,159
you get really big, you're not going to even have

631
00:38:09,239 --> 00:38:11,599
a shot at charting in Billboard anyway. So maybe it

632
00:38:11,639 --> 00:38:17,000
doesn't matter to you, But if that's the long term goal,

633
00:38:17,360 --> 00:38:21,079
it should matter to you. So if you are not

634
00:38:21,360 --> 00:38:26,400
on Spotify, or if you are on Spotify, but that's

635
00:38:26,519 --> 00:38:30,079
not where you're catching fire. You're catching fire on YouTube.

636
00:38:30,320 --> 00:38:35,199
That's where you're getting the spins, the plays. Spins more

637
00:38:35,239 --> 00:38:37,440
of a radio term, but the plays, you're the streams

638
00:38:38,079 --> 00:38:41,159
on YouTube. You want those numbers to count, do you not?

639
00:38:41,519 --> 00:38:44,480
So this is this is going to upset some people.

640
00:38:51,840 --> 00:38:55,239
So let me actually let me read this from from

641
00:38:55,320 --> 00:38:58,440
Cohen's quote again because I just want to make sure

642
00:38:59,000 --> 00:39:00,920
this is the most important thing that he says here,

643
00:39:01,320 --> 00:39:04,079
streaming is the primary way people experience music, making up

644
00:39:04,159 --> 00:39:07,840
eighty four percent of US recorded music revenue. We're simply

645
00:39:07,920 --> 00:39:10,719
asking that every stream has counted fairly and equally, whether

646
00:39:10,760 --> 00:39:13,360
it is subscription based or ad supported, because every fan

647
00:39:13,519 --> 00:39:19,000
matters and every play should count. Unquote, YouTube was first

648
00:39:19,079 --> 00:39:22,519
included in the Billboard Hot one hundred in February of

649
00:39:22,599 --> 00:39:25,199
twenty thirteen. I didn't know that it was that recent.

650
00:39:25,400 --> 00:39:27,880
I mean, we're coming up on twenty twenty six, so

651
00:39:28,039 --> 00:39:31,639
thirteen years ago, I guess. But still I for some

652
00:39:31,760 --> 00:39:33,639
reason I thought it had been even sooner than that,

653
00:39:33,760 --> 00:39:36,400
but it wasn't so, and that was probably a big

654
00:39:36,440 --> 00:39:38,880
decision on Billboard's part when they when they decided to

655
00:39:38,960 --> 00:39:42,559
do that. So YouTube was first included in the Billboard

656
00:39:42,559 --> 00:39:44,960
Hot one hundred in February of twenty thirteen, and was

657
00:39:45,039 --> 00:39:48,320
later added to the Billboard two hundred album chart in

658
00:39:48,480 --> 00:39:53,480
January of twenty twenty. Cohen said, quote, after a decade

659
00:39:53,559 --> 00:39:58,280
long partnership and extensive discussions, Billboard are unwilling to make

660
00:39:58,440 --> 00:40:03,119
meaningful changes. We are committed to achieving equitable representation across

661
00:40:03,239 --> 00:40:06,280
the charts and hopefully can work with Billboard to return

662
00:40:06,400 --> 00:40:15,440
to theirs unquote the question this is interesting. So the

663
00:40:15,519 --> 00:40:20,280
question of how to wait differences different types of streams

664
00:40:20,639 --> 00:40:25,239
has been contested since Billboard first introduced tiered streaming values

665
00:40:25,639 --> 00:40:30,159
in twenty eighteen. Prior to that change, all streams, whether

666
00:40:30,239 --> 00:40:33,280
from paid services like Apple Music or at supported platforms

667
00:40:33,360 --> 00:40:36,840
like YouTube, were counted equally. So there was a time

668
00:40:37,559 --> 00:40:40,719
when when Billboard was just counting them all equally and

669
00:40:40,840 --> 00:40:46,599
not waiting one source of stream versus the other. In

670
00:40:47,119 --> 00:40:50,800
a twenty seventeen interview with Music Business Worldwide, Apple's Jimmy

671
00:40:50,880 --> 00:40:55,480
Iovine argued that having YouTube streams count equally alongside paid

672
00:40:55,599 --> 00:40:59,880
for music on Billboard's Hot one hundred disadvantaged artists.

673
00:41:00,039 --> 00:41:00,119
Speaker 10: Yes.

674
00:41:03,840 --> 00:41:07,400
Speaker 8: I Havin was unequivocal about how his view about his

675
00:41:07,559 --> 00:41:11,599
view that paid streams should carry more weight on industry charts.

676
00:41:12,360 --> 00:41:15,039
He said, quote, I'll put it this way, people who

677
00:41:15,079 --> 00:41:18,960
pay for subscriptions should be advantaged. The labels owe it

678
00:41:19,119 --> 00:41:22,119
to their customers. The most important thing for labels is

679
00:41:22,199 --> 00:41:25,400
to make the paid services compelling and entertaining, and don't

680
00:41:25,480 --> 00:41:29,559
make free services as good as the paid services. Is

681
00:41:29,679 --> 00:41:39,280
that not obvious? Unquote. I don't necessarily disagree with his logic.

682
00:41:39,400 --> 00:41:41,320
I understand the argument that he's making. I think we

683
00:41:41,400 --> 00:41:45,880
all can. I just but again, it just makes it

684
00:41:46,320 --> 00:41:48,519
I mean, doesn't it make it more complicated? The more

685
00:41:48,599 --> 00:41:52,960
complicated you make it too, aren't there more chances for

686
00:41:53,039 --> 00:41:57,000
there to be errors? Calculating errors, math errors? Again I'm

687
00:41:57,039 --> 00:41:59,599
thinking of I know, I'm approaching it with a bias

688
00:42:00,840 --> 00:42:03,199
of someone who the bias of someone who doesn't like math.

689
00:42:04,280 --> 00:42:08,320
But I'm just saying, I mean, I think it's I

690
00:42:08,400 --> 00:42:11,960
think when you try to weight different sources, it just

691
00:42:12,119 --> 00:42:16,239
makes it complicated, because then how do you figure out

692
00:42:16,280 --> 00:42:19,320
how much you should I mean, you know, obviously Billboard

693
00:42:19,360 --> 00:42:21,400
is trying to figure that out now, they're changing how

694
00:42:21,480 --> 00:42:25,440
much they weigh certain sources of streams. When the twenty

695
00:42:25,480 --> 00:42:29,079
eighteen changes were implemented, paid subscription streams were weighted more

696
00:42:29,119 --> 00:42:32,239
heavily than AD supported streams on both charts. On the

697
00:42:32,280 --> 00:42:35,639
Hot one hundred, paid streams were given full point value

698
00:42:36,079 --> 00:42:42,639
AD supported streams two thirds and programmed streams half on

699
00:42:42,719 --> 00:42:45,079
the Billboard two hundred, it took three times as many

700
00:42:45,159 --> 00:42:49,440
AD supported streams as paid streams to equal one album unit.

701
00:42:52,159 --> 00:42:55,880
Recent data shows that the US recorded music industries overall

702
00:42:55,920 --> 00:42:58,840
streaming revenue performance in twenty twenty four was dragged down

703
00:42:59,159 --> 00:43:04,000
by payout from on demand AD supported music services, including

704
00:43:04,079 --> 00:43:10,199
YouTube and Spotify's Freemium tier. Combined, these platforms saw their

705
00:43:10,199 --> 00:43:12,880
revenue contribution to the recorded music industry decline in the

706
00:43:12,960 --> 00:43:16,440
last year, down one point eight percent year over year

707
00:43:16,840 --> 00:43:20,079
to one point eight three billion. Meanwhile, on demand paid

708
00:43:20,119 --> 00:43:25,280
subscription platforms contributed eleven point six eighty five billion dollars

709
00:43:26,360 --> 00:43:29,960
to recorded music right soldiers, up four point six percent

710
00:43:30,039 --> 00:43:32,719
year over year. The disparity and revenue per stream between

711
00:43:32,760 --> 00:43:35,159
paid and free tiers is at the heart of the debate.

712
00:43:37,519 --> 00:43:43,039
As Iving said in twenty seventeen, quote, the fact is

713
00:43:43,239 --> 00:43:47,239
that free quote unquote in music streaming is so technically

714
00:43:47,360 --> 00:43:51,159
good and ubiquitous that it's stunning the growth of PA

715
00:43:51,360 --> 00:43:54,440
that it's stunting the growth of paid streaming. Two things

716
00:43:54,559 --> 00:43:58,079
have to happen. Free has to become more difficult or restricted,

717
00:43:58,559 --> 00:44:01,679
and the paid services have to get better unquote. While

718
00:44:01,760 --> 00:44:04,079
free is never going to become more difficult or restricted.

719
00:44:04,239 --> 00:44:08,559
I mean, that's not going to happen. Ever, Cohen's announcement

720
00:44:08,599 --> 00:44:12,559
represents a reversal from twenty nineteen, when He welcomed YouTube's

721
00:44:12,599 --> 00:44:15,320
inclusion in the Billboard two hundred, calling it a quote

722
00:44:15,400 --> 00:44:17,880
very important moment and making the chart a more accurate

723
00:44:17,960 --> 00:44:22,199
representation of what people are listening to unquote. At that time,

724
00:44:22,320 --> 00:44:25,920
Cohen said, quote genres like Latin hip hop and electronic,

725
00:44:26,000 --> 00:44:30,360
which consistently dominate the YouTube charts, will now be properly

726
00:44:30,440 --> 00:44:34,320
recognized for their popularity. This is another great step in

727
00:44:34,400 --> 00:44:39,159
bringing YouTube and the industry together unquote. YouTube reported in

728
00:44:39,239 --> 00:44:41,199
October that it paid more than eight billion to the

729
00:44:41,280 --> 00:44:44,360
music industry during the twelve months from July twenty four

730
00:44:44,440 --> 00:44:48,199
to June twenty five, covering revenue from both advertising and

731
00:44:48,280 --> 00:44:52,599
subscriptions on the Google owned platform. In his statement December seventeenth,

732
00:44:52,760 --> 00:44:56,519
Cohen directed fans to YouTube Zone charts as an alternative

733
00:44:56,599 --> 00:44:59,719
to Billboard's lists. He said, quote, if you're curious about

734
00:44:59,760 --> 00:45:01,559
what we music is making waves on YouTube, you can

735
00:45:01,639 --> 00:45:04,760
visit our charts. Unquote. Well that's a good point, I guess.

736
00:45:06,079 --> 00:45:11,880
So there you have it. The other thing happening very

737
00:45:12,000 --> 00:45:15,920
very quickly with YouTube, and this is from Digitalmusicnews dot com.

738
00:45:16,239 --> 00:45:20,920
YouTube is reportedly terminating channels behind fake AI film trailers.

739
00:45:21,719 --> 00:45:26,519
Our AI music page takedowns. Next, this is short, but

740
00:45:26,679 --> 00:45:29,679
let's do this quickly before we go to break. YouTube

741
00:45:29,719 --> 00:45:33,159
has reportedly started terminating some of the channels be behind

742
00:45:33,320 --> 00:45:37,840
unauthorized artificial intelligence film trailers. Is a crackdown on AI

743
00:45:37,960 --> 00:45:41,880
music accounts coming, though it'll be up to the new

744
00:45:42,000 --> 00:45:45,480
year to deliver an answer, we can be sure of

745
00:45:45,599 --> 00:45:49,599
two related points at present. First, the video sharing giant

746
00:45:50,000 --> 00:45:54,320
has booted screen Culture and KH Studio, a pair of

747
00:45:54,480 --> 00:45:59,440
prominent fake trailer specialists, according to Deadline from the platform

748
00:45:59,559 --> 00:46:03,119
all together, so both those channels have been booted per

749
00:46:03,280 --> 00:46:07,760
the same outlet. The terminations followed considerable pushback against the channels,

750
00:46:08,039 --> 00:46:10,920
and while it probably doesn't need sane said pushback was

751
00:46:10,960 --> 00:46:14,800
set in motion by the involved uploads reach and adjacent

752
00:46:14,920 --> 00:46:18,360
ability to confuse fans or at a minimum, distract from

753
00:46:18,719 --> 00:46:22,880
proper trailers. So, in other words, these channels were making

754
00:46:22,880 --> 00:46:28,559
their own custom trailers for movies. Screen Culture allegedly pumped

755
00:46:28,559 --> 00:46:32,800
out twenty three fake trailers for the Fantastic four First Steps,

756
00:46:33,559 --> 00:46:37,360
with a few outranking the actual trailer itself, boasting around

757
00:46:37,400 --> 00:46:42,079
seventeen million views in search results. Long story short, YouTube

758
00:46:42,119 --> 00:46:46,239
had reportedly slapped screen Culture and KH studio with a

759
00:46:46,360 --> 00:46:51,320
monetization time out, which ended when they started adding disclaimers

760
00:46:51,480 --> 00:46:55,800
like fan trailer and parody to their upload titles. But

761
00:46:55,920 --> 00:46:59,159
the channels, having reportedly generated a combined one billion or

762
00:46:59,239 --> 00:47:01,519
so of views, are said to have reverted to their

763
00:47:01,559 --> 00:47:08,679
old ways, an alleged move that then drove the takedowns. Second,

764
00:47:10,480 --> 00:47:12,760
we can also state with confidence that there's a massive

765
00:47:12,760 --> 00:47:16,400
amount of AI audio inundating DSPs and in the process

766
00:47:16,599 --> 00:47:20,719
stealing fans, playlist spots and royalties from real artists, and

767
00:47:20,840 --> 00:47:22,920
we talk about that on the show all the time.

768
00:47:23,400 --> 00:47:26,000
The impact that AI is having, as most are aware,

769
00:47:26,079 --> 00:47:30,599
allegedly infringing machine made tracks as well as tracks that

770
00:47:30,760 --> 00:47:34,199
make too big a commercial splash, typically face takedowns and

771
00:47:34,440 --> 00:47:37,480
or threats of legal action. In general. However, it's a

772
00:47:37,519 --> 00:47:41,480
different story for the avalanche of AI songs with comparatively

773
00:47:41,679 --> 00:47:44,840
modest stream and view counts. As demonstrated by hard data

774
00:47:44,880 --> 00:47:48,239
and cursory DSB searches alike. These creations, while not yet

775
00:47:48,280 --> 00:47:52,039
outshining genuine music, are subtily expanding their presence on platforms

776
00:47:52,039 --> 00:47:57,280
such as YouTube and Spotify. Well, the thing is as

777
00:47:57,360 --> 00:47:59,960
long as you as long as your channel doesn't get

778
00:48:00,000 --> 00:48:03,559
that huge. You stay under the wire. If you under

779
00:48:03,559 --> 00:48:05,559
the radar would be a better way of putting it right. So,

780
00:48:05,800 --> 00:48:09,440
if your channel gets too big, you might get, for example,

781
00:48:09,719 --> 00:48:12,840
you might get copyright claims or I'm sorry, copyright strikes.

782
00:48:13,039 --> 00:48:15,760
Copyright claims are one thing, copyright strikes or another. You

783
00:48:15,760 --> 00:48:18,599
don't want copyright strikes. You can get copyright claims. I

784
00:48:18,679 --> 00:48:21,320
get copyright claims all the time. I put you know,

785
00:48:21,440 --> 00:48:24,000
this radio show streams on YouTube and obviously we're playing

786
00:48:24,039 --> 00:48:28,000
copyrighted music. I can never monetize this, that's fine. I

787
00:48:28,039 --> 00:48:31,079
can never monetize the show on YouTube, that's fine. Couldn't

788
00:48:31,119 --> 00:48:34,320
do that anyway. It contains advertising. I don't care about that.

789
00:48:34,400 --> 00:48:36,360
I'm just streaming it to YouTube as it just gives

790
00:48:36,360 --> 00:48:39,760
people another way to enjoy the show. They don't block

791
00:48:39,840 --> 00:48:42,440
my videos, they just won't ever let me monetize them.

792
00:48:42,760 --> 00:48:47,519
And again I'm fine with that. But if if I

793
00:48:47,639 --> 00:48:51,920
got big enough where you know, a label, I mean,

794
00:48:51,960 --> 00:48:55,760
I'm a small time, but if I were like this huge,

795
00:48:56,039 --> 00:48:57,760
I mean, if I were big enough, I wouldn't I

796
00:48:57,800 --> 00:49:00,199
would just not stream the show on YouTube any more

797
00:49:00,239 --> 00:49:02,199
because I would know, because I would see what was

798
00:49:02,280 --> 00:49:04,800
coming right. If I were big enough that I got

799
00:49:04,840 --> 00:49:07,039
the attention of the labels, they you know, somebody might

800
00:49:07,119 --> 00:49:10,800
issue an actual copyright strike, and a copyright strike would

801
00:49:10,800 --> 00:49:13,039
put my channel in danger. So I wouldn't do that.

802
00:49:14,000 --> 00:49:15,599
You know, I'm at a level where I you know,

803
00:49:15,840 --> 00:49:18,440
I do it. It's fine, I get copyright claims, but

804
00:49:18,599 --> 00:49:21,480
that just means you can never monetize this video. Fine,

805
00:49:21,559 --> 00:49:27,880
I can't monetize any of them. It's fine. But but

806
00:49:28,000 --> 00:49:31,599
if you get big enough, YouTube notices or someone notices

807
00:49:31,679 --> 00:49:34,719
who will then complain to YouTube effectively, and then YouTube

808
00:49:35,400 --> 00:49:39,000
will begin to penalize you. You know, the first step

809
00:49:39,079 --> 00:49:41,679
might be just demonetizing you. If you have a big channel.

810
00:49:41,760 --> 00:49:45,800
That's if you're monetized and you're making money, you know

811
00:49:45,920 --> 00:49:47,920
you don't want to lose. That's that's the first thing

812
00:49:47,960 --> 00:49:50,719
YouTube might do to you is demonetize your channel. Instead

813
00:49:50,719 --> 00:49:54,079
of just demonetizing specific videos, they might demonetize your entire channel,

814
00:49:54,280 --> 00:49:56,360
and then you've just lost a source of income. And

815
00:49:56,440 --> 00:49:58,280
then the next step might be they're going to take

816
00:49:58,280 --> 00:50:04,239
you down. There's a lot more to this. The article

817
00:50:04,320 --> 00:50:07,519
itself is short, but we're we're getting to that point

818
00:50:07,519 --> 00:50:09,480
where we got to hit a commercial break. Then when

819
00:50:09,519 --> 00:50:11,440
we come back in the third hour, for those of

820
00:50:11,480 --> 00:50:13,559
you listening live on Saturday, we're going to talk to

821
00:50:13,960 --> 00:50:18,239
Lee Wilding from the Far North, another great project, and

822
00:50:18,840 --> 00:50:20,880
we've we've played some of their music on the show,

823
00:50:21,039 --> 00:50:24,920
some of his music on the show, but just really

824
00:50:24,960 --> 00:50:27,559
really good stuff. So there is a lot more to come. Again,

825
00:50:27,599 --> 00:50:29,639
if you are just joining us, we are live, and yes,

826
00:50:29,719 --> 00:50:33,000
we are live, even though it's that that weird dead zone,

827
00:50:33,079 --> 00:50:36,519
that that time distortion that takes place every year between

828
00:50:36,880 --> 00:50:39,840
Christmas Day and New Year's Day, is that you know,

829
00:50:40,039 --> 00:50:42,760
that that weird time where it's hard to even remember

830
00:50:42,800 --> 00:50:44,679
what day of the week it is because time is

831
00:50:44,920 --> 00:50:51,639
just strange. But yes, so we are live. It is Saturday,

832
00:50:51,719 --> 00:50:55,320
December twenty seventh, twenty twenty five. This is Matt Connorton Unleashed,

833
00:50:55,480 --> 00:50:59,119
broadcasting live from the studios of WMNH ninety five point

834
00:50:59,119 --> 00:51:01,239
three FM. By the way, we were live last night

835
00:51:01,280 --> 00:51:04,559
too for Retrospectrum Radio. If you missed it, Santa came

836
00:51:05,000 --> 00:51:07,440
and gave us his post mortem of the holidays. It

837
00:51:07,519 --> 00:51:10,320
was very entertaining. You can check that out Retrospectrum Radio

838
00:51:10,400 --> 00:51:13,400
with poly c every Friday night from eight to ten

839
00:51:13,480 --> 00:51:16,840
pm Eastern here on WMNH ninety five point three FM.

840
00:51:17,000 --> 00:51:19,719
Check social listings. As Paul likes to say, but let's

841
00:51:19,719 --> 00:51:22,199
take a break. We'll show some love to our amazing sponsors,

842
00:51:22,239 --> 00:51:24,599
and then when we come back in the third hour,

843
00:51:24,800 --> 00:51:27,719
the far North. So don't go anywhere. There's plenty more

844
00:51:27,800 --> 00:51:28,039
to come.

845
00:51:33,159 --> 00:51:35,360
Speaker 15: Nana's Kitchen and Pizzeria.

846
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Speaker 16: From Nana's hands, It's to your plate tradition, love and taste.

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That's great, slow fermented dough, flavor so true, each bite

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as story made.

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Speaker 10: Just for you.

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Speaker 15: Six o three two three two nine three six six

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Nana's Kitchen and Pizza Ree fifteen Dartmouth, Dry Auburn, New Hampshire.

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Speaker 10: Kid Piz.

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Speaker 17: Luigi's Pizza Bar and Grilled On.

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Speaker 6: Let's raise a slyes On Hide with topics of the ground, Itizza,

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Pizza Barr.

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Speaker 17: Mine Luigi's Pizza Barre and Grill seven twelve Valley Street, Manchester.

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Come on in or call six two two one zero

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two one. Luigi keeping the tradition alive since nineteen seventy five.

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Speaker 2: Pizza for every one.

860
00:52:40,960 --> 00:52:45,039
Speaker 1: Come join a past to night with each slice, sense

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of it. Everything feels so.

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Speaker 14: Right in times of crisis. You need a law firm

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Speaker 18: Bring your kitchen to life with Queen Citycabinetry, located at

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Speaker 19: Hey everyone's rob as a veto oh host a granite

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live music five days a week and twice on Saturdays,

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everything from blues, country, folk, funk, and a.

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Speaker 2: Whole lot of jazz.

887
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Speaker 19: We have twelve craft beers on tap dedicated to the

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890
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six miles outside of Manchester. Open Tuesdays to Wednesdays four

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to ten Thursday's Sunday eleven to ten. Pembrook City Limits

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where it's all about the music.

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Speaker 17: Disney's Cafe is the place to put a smile on

895
00:54:38,559 --> 00:54:38,960
your face.

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Speaker 1: Judy and the crew will take care of you, bring

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your appetite and treat your.

898
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Speaker 17: Taste buds fry Disneys Cafe is always a winning choice breakfast, lunch,

899
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or supper. Disney's Cafe at eight sixty Elm Street in

900
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Speaker 20: When it comes to keeping WMNH on the air and

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Speaker 20: Trust groll In Computers.

913
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Speaker 4: Seven times out of ten.

914
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Speaker 2: We listened to our music at.

915
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Speaker 16: Night dot con the titled book business program.

916
00:55:54,119 --> 00:55:58,199
Speaker 17: Late Night to Light with DJ Bidas right here on WMNH, Manchester.

917
00:55:58,440 --> 00:56:02,960
Speaker 1: You want to know why because Saturdays and Sunday nights

918
00:56:03,039 --> 00:56:04,039
midnight to four am.

919
00:56:05,360 --> 00:56:10,840
Speaker 15: This hour on WMNH is sponsored by CGI Business Solutions,

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located at five Dartmouth Drive in Auburn. They serve all

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Speaker 21: Behold the harmony of airwaves as you immerse yourself in

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the captivating frequencies of w m NHLP the sunic cart

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Speaker 1: They're transcending through.

931
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Speaker 21: The ether at ninety five point three megahertz frequency modulation.

932
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Our transmissions M and E from the ZF one thousand

933
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Elm streets. It's insurant through the hearts of our creative

934
00:56:56,719 --> 00:57:00,880
realm at one nineteen Canal Street. We're Innovation and Collode.

935
00:57:01,480 --> 00:57:04,639
They're the improor moder of Manchester Public Television Service in

936
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the venerable city of Manchester, New Hampshire, USA. Enrich your

937
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auditory journey with the depth of our license to wesn'tspt

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your missives. Do w m n H ninety five three

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at gmail dot com, or to reverse the virtual corridors

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of w m n hradio dot org. Engage with our

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sonic vibrations by communing with us through the digital channels

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or radio seconds, eager to enthrall you with its mesmerizing

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cadence and envelop you with symmony of foundless auditories, won

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Dude

945
00:57:36,360 --> 00:57:38,760
Speaker 1: W m N h rip the Novels