WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.240 --> 00:00:03.399 Tuesday Afternoon more NBA Basketball with one of our favorites, 2 00:00:03.480 --> 00:00:07.879 Lee Ellis, ESPN Australia, head of Global Pickup. But Lee, 3 00:00:08.000 --> 00:00:11.400 quite frankly, I don't mean to make you feel awkward 4 00:00:11.480 --> 00:00:13.679 or uncomfortable, a little bit of a pioneer. I don't 5 00:00:13.679 --> 00:00:16.600 know that I've ever really talked to you about this. Yeah, 6 00:00:16.640 --> 00:00:22.039 you were among the first podcasters covering the NBA basketball. 7 00:00:22.120 --> 00:00:23.320 Is that a fair statement? 8 00:00:24.559 --> 00:00:26.920 Well somewhat, yes. I mean I wouldn't say I was 9 00:00:26.960 --> 00:00:29.679 the pioneer. I think that really title goes to Ski 10 00:00:30.160 --> 00:00:33.439 Pass and JD because they created a podcast before even 11 00:00:33.479 --> 00:00:36.240 I knew what a podcast was. But I certainly did 12 00:00:36.359 --> 00:00:38.280 come in and ride their coattails for a while there, 13 00:00:38.280 --> 00:00:41.479 and we began the show on NBA TV back in 14 00:00:41.520 --> 00:00:44.359 twenty thirteen. So you know, I wouldn't say I was 15 00:00:44.560 --> 00:00:46.479 the number one draft pick in that sense. I'd say 16 00:00:46.520 --> 00:00:49.439 I was a free agent signing. But I certainly like 17 00:00:49.520 --> 00:00:51.439 to feel that I made a contribution to the show. 18 00:00:51.479 --> 00:00:54.640 And you know, now it's amazing how many people. In fact, 19 00:00:54.799 --> 00:00:57.600 just today, here I am in Indianapolis, a guy came 20 00:00:57.679 --> 00:00:58.880 out to me on the street and he said, man, 21 00:00:58.920 --> 00:01:02.039 I remember you from the bus Jones Day's in Toronto, 22 00:01:02.200 --> 00:01:04.920 So that was quite a kind of freaky to sort 23 00:01:04.920 --> 00:01:07.079 of still hear that just out on the street, because 24 00:01:07.879 --> 00:01:09.719 you know, that was at a different time I think, 25 00:01:09.760 --> 00:01:12.640 you know, I don't think when the guys originally started 26 00:01:12.640 --> 00:01:15.000 it not even Twitter or Facebook or anything like that 27 00:01:15.079 --> 00:01:18.719 even existed, and they were doing a podcast and they've 28 00:01:18.719 --> 00:01:21.560 grown it into something that continues today. In fact, I 29 00:01:21.560 --> 00:01:25.640 believe it's going to be twenty years in January from 30 00:01:25.680 --> 00:01:28.760 when Skeets, Tats and jd did their very very first 31 00:01:28.760 --> 00:01:32.920 podcast back in JD's the basement of his house. I 32 00:01:32.920 --> 00:01:35.599 think it was back in two thousand and six in Toronto. 33 00:01:35.680 --> 00:01:39.319 So it's quite remarkable, how, you know, our journeys, everybody's 34 00:01:39.359 --> 00:01:41.799 journey is slightly different. But yes, the seeds of where 35 00:01:41.840 --> 00:01:46.640 I am today were planted in Toronto about fifteen or 36 00:01:46.680 --> 00:01:47.400 sixteen years ago. 37 00:01:47.439 --> 00:01:49.959 For myself, what was the name of the pod you 38 00:01:50.000 --> 00:01:52.480 guys had on NBA TV? Was it No Dunk's? Was 39 00:01:52.519 --> 00:01:54.560 it the Starters? I honestly can't remember what the name 40 00:01:54.599 --> 00:01:55.959 of the NBA TV pod was. 41 00:01:56.359 --> 00:01:59.040 Yeah, yeah, we were the Starters on MBA TV and 42 00:01:59.280 --> 00:02:02.359 that was the TV show and a podcast. But yeah, 43 00:02:02.400 --> 00:02:04.879 We did that for six seasons, and it was honestly 44 00:02:04.920 --> 00:02:07.640 one of those sort of pinched me moments. Literally every day. 45 00:02:07.719 --> 00:02:09.719 In fact, I remember saying to my wife, like, I 46 00:02:09.759 --> 00:02:14.120 can't believe on NBA TV wearing plaid shirts. I'm talking 47 00:02:14.120 --> 00:02:17.439 to my friends about basketball, you know. So one day 48 00:02:17.479 --> 00:02:19.879 Shack came in while we were recording, got me in 49 00:02:19.919 --> 00:02:22.360 a headlock, and I'm like, I don't know how to 50 00:02:22.400 --> 00:02:24.639 explain this to anybody. Is you know. People would ask 51 00:02:24.680 --> 00:02:26.319 me like, hey, do you get on NBA TV, like 52 00:02:26.360 --> 00:02:28.680 that's a cool job, And I'm like, I can't really 53 00:02:28.719 --> 00:02:30.520 tell you because I don't know. There wasn't like a 54 00:02:30.560 --> 00:02:33.560 blueprint that I followed. It was just a few things happened, 55 00:02:33.560 --> 00:02:35.680 and the next thing I know, I had the biggest 56 00:02:35.680 --> 00:02:37.439 man in the world get me in a headlock on TV. 57 00:02:37.599 --> 00:02:39.759 So it's crazy. 58 00:02:39.919 --> 00:02:42.360 It's funny, man, because I can. I mean, look, I'm 59 00:02:42.400 --> 00:02:45.400 a basketball sicko like you are. And so I watch 60 00:02:45.560 --> 00:02:47.879 NBA TV and I can remember watching back in the 61 00:02:47.960 --> 00:02:51.319 day and I was watching just some recap or highlight 62 00:02:51.400 --> 00:02:54.120 you and they're like, hey, don't forget tomorrow. At whatever time, 63 00:02:54.520 --> 00:02:57.439 tune in to the Starters, a basketball podcast I'm like, 64 00:02:57.439 --> 00:02:59.800 what are you saying? What is this? I don't even 65 00:02:59.840 --> 00:03:03.599 know what any of this is. And you know, now 66 00:03:03.680 --> 00:03:07.159 everybody has a podcast. We podcast this show, and if 67 00:03:07.159 --> 00:03:11.360 you're in the ecosystem of media and sport period, chances 68 00:03:11.360 --> 00:03:13.360 are if you don't have a standalone pod, you pod 69 00:03:13.439 --> 00:03:17.319 your live show like we do here. And would you 70 00:03:18.360 --> 00:03:21.560 characterize it as something that was kind of like beyond 71 00:03:21.599 --> 00:03:23.840 anything you dared to dream about as far as how 72 00:03:23.840 --> 00:03:24.479 you got into it. 73 00:03:24.560 --> 00:03:25.360 I always find it. 74 00:03:25.319 --> 00:03:28.639 Interesting to hear the origin story of how people were 75 00:03:28.680 --> 00:03:30.680 able to carve out their piece of real estate in 76 00:03:30.719 --> 00:03:33.199 this ecosystem that's really hard to find real estate in. 77 00:03:34.400 --> 00:03:36.280 Yeah, I mean, that's a great way of putting it 78 00:03:36.319 --> 00:03:38.919 because you know, again, no one really knew what it 79 00:03:39.039 --> 00:03:40.639 was or what it was going to become. And I 80 00:03:40.680 --> 00:03:42.879 remember again in the early days speaking to those guys 81 00:03:42.919 --> 00:03:45.639 because they had normal jobs, skeets passed and JD who 82 00:03:45.639 --> 00:03:48.199 I'm referring to here, So they would record their pod 83 00:03:48.240 --> 00:03:50.960 at like six o'clock in the morning over Skype, you know, 84 00:03:51.360 --> 00:03:54.159 put the podcast out there, then go about their daily jobs. 85 00:03:54.439 --> 00:03:56.120 And so there was no money in it. They weren't 86 00:03:56.159 --> 00:03:58.159 like sitting back rolling in money. They had to put 87 00:03:58.159 --> 00:03:59.879 all their own money and time into it, and j 88 00:04:00.240 --> 00:04:02.800 had just become a father and they were just trying 89 00:04:02.840 --> 00:04:05.520 this thing that no one really knew what happened. But 90 00:04:05.599 --> 00:04:09.039 because at the time Apple iTunes, I think it was 91 00:04:09.039 --> 00:04:11.439 still called then you know, people from around the world 92 00:04:11.599 --> 00:04:14.520 started listening to it because basketball is such a global sport, 93 00:04:14.960 --> 00:04:17.160 and that encouraged the guys and it inspired them to 94 00:04:17.240 --> 00:04:19.879 keep going, and eventually they made it to The Score, 95 00:04:19.959 --> 00:04:23.319 which is an independent sports TV network in Toronto, and 96 00:04:23.360 --> 00:04:26.600 from their NBA TV got hold of it and moved 97 00:04:26.639 --> 00:04:30.160 us all down to Atlanta. And you know, so again 98 00:04:30.199 --> 00:04:33.439 the story itself is sort of even when I'm saying 99 00:04:33.439 --> 00:04:35.600 this to you, and I've said this on numerous podcasts 100 00:04:35.639 --> 00:04:37.639 over the years, I'm sort of like, man, it's amazing 101 00:04:37.639 --> 00:04:39.879 how many things just had to sort of line up 102 00:04:39.879 --> 00:04:42.560 and be ready to go. And you know, getting visas 103 00:04:42.639 --> 00:04:44.800 even to come and work in America is not easy 104 00:04:45.000 --> 00:04:48.279 as well. We have to somehow convince the immigration lawyers 105 00:04:48.279 --> 00:04:51.079 that we were, you know, worthy of getting work visas 106 00:04:51.120 --> 00:04:53.879 and things like that. And then I remember again, you know, 107 00:04:53.920 --> 00:04:56.040 when we're doing a podcast in Toronto, there was no 108 00:04:56.480 --> 00:04:58.319 time limit, so you know, you can go for an 109 00:04:58.319 --> 00:05:00.120 hour or an hour and a half or whatever. We 110 00:05:00.160 --> 00:05:01.959 came to the NBA TV and we had a forty 111 00:05:02.000 --> 00:05:05.040 four minute show daily that we had to hit and 112 00:05:05.079 --> 00:05:07.240 I remember just thinking like, oh my god, this is 113 00:05:07.360 --> 00:05:09.920 like crazy. You can't be as loose on TV. You 114 00:05:09.959 --> 00:05:11.680 certainly have to dress it a little nice, so you 115 00:05:11.720 --> 00:05:13.839 have to be a little more, you know, professional in 116 00:05:13.879 --> 00:05:15.959 how you approach it. You can't certainly can't swear and 117 00:05:16.000 --> 00:05:17.920 things like that that you can on a podcast. So 118 00:05:18.360 --> 00:05:21.000 it was a real adjustment. But I think we all 119 00:05:21.040 --> 00:05:24.319 got motivated and inspired by so many people who saw 120 00:05:24.439 --> 00:05:28.399 us as non former players, just fans of the game 121 00:05:28.560 --> 00:05:31.079 trying to bring an entertaining angle to it. Like we 122 00:05:31.079 --> 00:05:34.040 we never claimed to be former pro players or anything 123 00:05:34.079 --> 00:05:37.079 like that. We were just guys who you know, started 124 00:05:37.120 --> 00:05:39.759 something new that grew into a TV show, And you know, 125 00:05:39.839 --> 00:05:42.360 our love for the game is what so many people 126 00:05:42.439 --> 00:05:44.839 around the world I think could relate to and connect with. 127 00:05:45.319 --> 00:05:46.600 And I think it's really cool. Man. 128 00:05:46.720 --> 00:05:49.279 I always applaud people that have the courage to just 129 00:05:49.360 --> 00:05:52.199 try stuff like we love this, so let's go try it, 130 00:05:52.279 --> 00:05:54.720 Let's see what it turns into. Let's give it some effort. 131 00:05:54.800 --> 00:05:57.920 Let's give it some you know, some real energy and resources. 132 00:05:57.959 --> 00:06:00.439 And yeah, stories like that are really cool. All right, 133 00:06:00.879 --> 00:06:04.560 let's before we get to nick Pacers tonight. I said 134 00:06:04.560 --> 00:06:06.879 this earlier, Lee, I want to see if you agree. 135 00:06:07.680 --> 00:06:12.360 I think Minnesota last night beats almost every team in 136 00:06:12.360 --> 00:06:16.759 the NBA except the team they played right like. And 137 00:06:16.759 --> 00:06:19.879 there's a lot of conversation today about Aunt this and 138 00:06:20.000 --> 00:06:22.759 Julius randall that, and certainly there's some things that we 139 00:06:22.759 --> 00:06:25.839 can get into that are probably fair. I thought last 140 00:06:25.920 --> 00:06:28.759 night was far more about who Oklahoma City is as 141 00:06:28.800 --> 00:06:30.240 opposed to who Minnesota is not. 142 00:06:30.920 --> 00:06:31.879 I was quick to. 143 00:06:33.360 --> 00:06:36.519 Be a little bit skeptical about Okase's ability to run 144 00:06:36.560 --> 00:06:39.000 through the playoffs, only because we haven't seen it before. 145 00:06:39.560 --> 00:06:43.680 But in a vacuum, last night was an incredibly entertaining 146 00:06:43.720 --> 00:06:46.800 basketball game, and I think if you're Minnesota, you're just 147 00:06:46.920 --> 00:06:49.439 kind of like they might be better than us and 148 00:06:49.519 --> 00:06:51.120 everybody else. Give me your thoughts on that. 149 00:06:51.800 --> 00:06:53.720 Yeah, well, and I think you know what you're saying 150 00:06:53.720 --> 00:06:55.480 with the Thunder is they were the number one seed 151 00:06:55.519 --> 00:06:57.959 with a you know, by a mile in the Western Conference, 152 00:06:57.959 --> 00:07:01.160 whereas the Wolves were the six seed any other season. 153 00:07:01.199 --> 00:07:03.639 If you had the one versus the sixth seed. The 154 00:07:03.800 --> 00:07:06.920 number one said should win fairly comfortably. Now, Game three 155 00:07:07.160 --> 00:07:10.879 was that season on the line type of response from Minnesota, 156 00:07:10.920 --> 00:07:12.920 and you could almost see Oklahoma City kind of let 157 00:07:12.959 --> 00:07:14.319 go of the rope there a little bit once he 158 00:07:14.360 --> 00:07:16.560 got out of hand in the second half. But then 159 00:07:16.600 --> 00:07:19.560 they regathered and regrouped and sort of showed last night 160 00:07:19.600 --> 00:07:21.639 they flexed their muscles a little bit more, saying like, hey, 161 00:07:21.680 --> 00:07:23.800 we are better than this team. They have got a 162 00:07:23.839 --> 00:07:26.680 few vulnerabilities and I think they exposed them last night. 163 00:07:26.680 --> 00:07:28.000 And I hope to give a lot of credit to 164 00:07:28.000 --> 00:07:30.920 Shay Gildas Alexander, because you know, he's almost gone to 165 00:07:30.959 --> 00:07:33.120 that point where he was a big fan favorite, and 166 00:07:33.160 --> 00:07:35.720 now people are starting to turn on him, criticizing him 167 00:07:35.720 --> 00:07:38.399 for the free throw embellishment whatever, you know, whatever that 168 00:07:38.519 --> 00:07:41.000 really means. But he's gone out there and led his 169 00:07:41.079 --> 00:07:43.439 team and he handled everything. And I put a lot 170 00:07:43.480 --> 00:07:45.879 of it actually back into that Denver Nuggat series as well, 171 00:07:46.120 --> 00:07:48.680 where they looked bad against the Nuggets at times, but 172 00:07:48.879 --> 00:07:51.959 as really good teams do they get the job done, 173 00:07:52.079 --> 00:07:54.000 and I think that's important. I think that does sort 174 00:07:54.000 --> 00:07:55.519 of build you up and get you ready for the 175 00:07:55.560 --> 00:07:58.319 next round. Whereas the Timberwolves, I mean, when you have 176 00:07:58.360 --> 00:07:59.879 a win like that, I think it was forty two 177 00:08:00.040 --> 00:08:03.680 points in game three, it's almost it's almost like too much. 178 00:08:04.279 --> 00:08:05.920 They didn't have to fight, they didn't really have to 179 00:08:05.920 --> 00:08:08.800 do everything. They just sort of everything they threw up 180 00:08:08.839 --> 00:08:11.480 went in. But it wasn't like they had something really 181 00:08:11.519 --> 00:08:14.079 solid to fall back on because last night they kind 182 00:08:14.079 --> 00:08:16.199 of got exposed a little bit. And Anthony Edwards. I 183 00:08:16.199 --> 00:08:17.920 heard what he said after the game, because he'd been 184 00:08:17.920 --> 00:08:19.839 criticized and not taking though shots. He said he made 185 00:08:19.839 --> 00:08:21.879 the right place. Maybe he did. I think there is 186 00:08:21.920 --> 00:08:25.439 an argument there, but you also expect your start to 187 00:08:25.560 --> 00:08:28.600 sort of say, well, it's a bit like Karl Anthony 188 00:08:28.600 --> 00:08:32.279 Town's here in Indiana on Monday night where or Sunday night, 189 00:08:32.279 --> 00:08:35.200 excuse me, where he was like, right, I'm putting my 190 00:08:35.240 --> 00:08:37.600 team on my back and we are not losing this game. 191 00:08:37.840 --> 00:08:40.320 And I didn't really see that from Anthony Edwards, like 192 00:08:40.360 --> 00:08:43.080 he didn't go down fighting. He played well enough, but 193 00:08:43.159 --> 00:08:45.759 it wasn't the sort of epic performance where you thought, man, 194 00:08:45.799 --> 00:08:47.639 he left it all on the table there last night. 195 00:08:47.679 --> 00:08:49.120 I think he had a little bit more in the 196 00:08:50.039 --> 00:08:52.440 Chamber and we'll see. Now they obviously go to a 197 00:08:52.519 --> 00:08:55.039 must win game in Oklahoma City, but you know, and 198 00:08:55.240 --> 00:08:57.679 there's people saying, ah man, Oklahoma City, like you know, 199 00:08:57.720 --> 00:09:00.080 the NBA doesn't want that. Well, I'm the opposite. I 200 00:09:00.120 --> 00:09:01.600 think this is great for the league. I think there's 201 00:09:01.600 --> 00:09:03.879 a bit more parody, there's a bit more evenness, and 202 00:09:04.000 --> 00:09:06.360 every team is a chance, and we're seeing that with 203 00:09:06.759 --> 00:09:10.240 you know, we're likely to get Oklahoma the City and 204 00:09:10.279 --> 00:09:12.559 Indiana in the finals. I'm fine with it. I think 205 00:09:12.559 --> 00:09:14.840 these both fun teams to watch. I love watching the 206 00:09:15.120 --> 00:09:18.120 young stars emerge, and I think we've set up for 207 00:09:18.120 --> 00:09:21.159 a really, really fun finals. However it turns out, because 208 00:09:21.559 --> 00:09:24.159 the other one is maybe we get Minnesota versus New York, who, 209 00:09:24.200 --> 00:09:27.879 of course had that incredible trade right before training camp 210 00:09:27.879 --> 00:09:30.120 started last season, so that would be a fun way 211 00:09:30.120 --> 00:09:32.200 to cut the season as well. But you know, I 212 00:09:32.200 --> 00:09:34.360 think no matter what happens, people are going to criticize 213 00:09:34.360 --> 00:09:36.720 the league and criticize the game and things like that, 214 00:09:36.759 --> 00:09:39.240 because that's the nature of social media these days. But 215 00:09:39.320 --> 00:09:41.960 as a fan and as an analyst, I'm really enjoying it. 216 00:09:43.200 --> 00:09:45.720 So let's dig into the ants stuff for a minute. 217 00:09:46.559 --> 00:09:50.480 Because you know Game three he comes out of the 218 00:09:50.480 --> 00:09:55.639 gates completely on fire, and certainly, if you want to 219 00:09:55.639 --> 00:09:58.679 see more engaged in Game three out of the gates, 220 00:09:59.039 --> 00:10:00.039 I guess I can. 221 00:10:00.279 --> 00:10:01.159 Concede that point. 222 00:10:01.960 --> 00:10:05.480 But what I saw last night from Oklahoma City is 223 00:10:05.480 --> 00:10:09.200 Mark Dagnola lets to move off of the Hartenstein stuff. 224 00:10:09.240 --> 00:10:13.399 He puts chat into the five, he goes small, and 225 00:10:13.440 --> 00:10:16.200 then on every dribble, handoff, on every pick and roll, 226 00:10:16.320 --> 00:10:19.919 on every off ball action, you have first of all 227 00:10:20.000 --> 00:10:23.440 lout Dort who plays defense like he's a middle linebacker, 228 00:10:24.600 --> 00:10:29.399 Jalen Williams who's like all NBA defense caliber, Shay who's 229 00:10:29.399 --> 00:10:32.399 six 's eight, and then either Alex Caruso or Case 230 00:10:32.480 --> 00:10:35.679 and Wallace that are both just absolute dogs on the perimeter. 231 00:10:35.799 --> 00:10:39.000 And they blitzed Aunt on every single pick and roll 232 00:10:39.879 --> 00:10:42.799 one hundred percent of his drives. He was double teamed. 233 00:10:42.840 --> 00:10:44.559 Every time he put the ball in the deck. They 234 00:10:44.600 --> 00:10:47.399 ran two defenders at him. Lee, I don't know what 235 00:10:47.440 --> 00:10:49.679 you do if your Aunt, because they're just like you 236 00:10:49.720 --> 00:10:51.960 go back and watch it. There's no room for him 237 00:10:52.039 --> 00:10:55.559 to get his shots off. And he did make the 238 00:10:55.679 --> 00:10:57.879 right play, I thought more often than not, and his 239 00:10:57.919 --> 00:11:01.519 teammates did knock down shots, so you know, you hear 240 00:11:01.600 --> 00:11:05.000 the inside guys like Kenny always talks about, if you're 241 00:11:05.039 --> 00:11:06.720 one of the great players, I need you to take 242 00:11:06.759 --> 00:11:09.120 eighteen to twenty shots, then I know kind of where 243 00:11:09.159 --> 00:11:12.840 you're at. And if those shots are forced in the 244 00:11:12.879 --> 00:11:16.200 face of two and three defenders, they're not high quality looks. 245 00:11:16.200 --> 00:11:19.559 So what was Ant kind of supposed to do when 246 00:11:19.639 --> 00:11:23.799 the OKC game plan was clearly we are going to 247 00:11:23.799 --> 00:11:26.679 throw two of these dog defenders at him every time 248 00:11:26.679 --> 00:11:27.559 he gets the ball, and. 249 00:11:27.519 --> 00:11:30.200 We are going to make other players beat us. 250 00:11:30.240 --> 00:11:34.399 And they almost did, because they scored forty one points 251 00:11:34.399 --> 00:11:36.320 in the fourth quarter against one of the best defensive 252 00:11:36.320 --> 00:11:38.559 teams that we've seen in a long time. I'm just 253 00:11:38.639 --> 00:11:40.879 not sure what Ann was supposed to do last night 254 00:11:41.039 --> 00:11:43.200 in the face of that game plan that was designed 255 00:11:43.200 --> 00:11:44.639 to take him entirely out of it. 256 00:11:45.519 --> 00:11:47.440 Yeah, I mean, it's again, it's a good question, and 257 00:11:47.759 --> 00:11:49.879 it's a fair way to sort of analyze it, because 258 00:11:50.279 --> 00:11:52.600 you know, we always sort of say like we want 259 00:11:52.600 --> 00:11:54.679 the guys to step up and make the big play, 260 00:11:54.720 --> 00:11:57.679 and that doesn't necessarily mean make the big shot. I guess, so, 261 00:11:58.000 --> 00:12:00.279 you know, from what I saw, had a couple of 262 00:12:00.320 --> 00:12:03.440 those drives where he went inside fairly quickly. Now, if 263 00:12:03.440 --> 00:12:06.799 you know the double is coming, then maybe that's on 264 00:12:06.960 --> 00:12:09.159 the coaching staff there of Chris Pinch, but it's also 265 00:12:09.240 --> 00:12:11.919 maybe on Anthony Edwards to get into that action a 266 00:12:12.000 --> 00:12:14.759 little quicker to try to beat that double, or you know, 267 00:12:14.840 --> 00:12:16.480 see if he can get a switch to get a 268 00:12:16.519 --> 00:12:19.919 defender that you prefer to have there. I mean, it's 269 00:12:19.960 --> 00:12:22.399 always we're all Monday morning quarterbacks after the game and 270 00:12:22.440 --> 00:12:24.919 we can you know, analyze and criticize and things like that. 271 00:12:25.279 --> 00:12:27.279 But he had a couple of moves because he is 272 00:12:27.320 --> 00:12:30.240 so athletic and he is so fast that he can 273 00:12:30.320 --> 00:12:33.320 cruise inside to me, you know, seemingly at will. But 274 00:12:33.799 --> 00:12:35.600 last night he did it a couple of times, but 275 00:12:35.639 --> 00:12:38.720 then he sort of hesitated. And again maybe the leadership 276 00:12:38.720 --> 00:12:40.759 from him is like, I don't want to have to 277 00:12:40.759 --> 00:12:42.840 do it all myself. I want to show trust and 278 00:12:42.879 --> 00:12:46.320 faith in my teammates. And you know, again, there's no 279 00:12:46.440 --> 00:12:48.480 real right answer, because if he has one of those 280 00:12:48.519 --> 00:12:51.360 games where he goes for forty five points or fifty 281 00:12:51.360 --> 00:12:53.840 points or something like that, then maybe people will criticize 282 00:12:53.879 --> 00:12:55.240 him anyway and say, hey, you've got to trust your 283 00:12:55.279 --> 00:12:58.240 teammates more. But it's a tough one. I mean, I 284 00:12:58.240 --> 00:13:01.799 remember Jason Tatum's, fortunately his last game of the season 285 00:13:02.279 --> 00:13:04.320 in New York City against the next He had forty 286 00:13:04.320 --> 00:13:06.960 two points and he was carrying his team, you know, 287 00:13:07.000 --> 00:13:08.759 putting them into a spot where they were going to 288 00:13:08.759 --> 00:13:11.120 win the game. Now they ultimately didn't, but what I 289 00:13:11.159 --> 00:13:13.720 saw from him was a leader who was like, I 290 00:13:13.759 --> 00:13:15.759 know these other guys can do it, but tonight, I'm 291 00:13:15.759 --> 00:13:17.759 going to step up and do it. And he was 292 00:13:17.759 --> 00:13:20.480 on the way to doing that before I unfortunately got injured. 293 00:13:20.559 --> 00:13:23.879 So there's always you know, again, it's always easy to 294 00:13:23.919 --> 00:13:26.080 look back, I think, and sort of pinpoint things and 295 00:13:26.120 --> 00:13:27.799 say you should have done this, he should have done that. 296 00:13:28.159 --> 00:13:31.480 Either way, I think Anthony Edwards will learn from last 297 00:13:31.559 --> 00:13:33.600 night's game and we'll see how it plays out in 298 00:13:33.639 --> 00:13:36.039 Game five and not just for this season but beyond, 299 00:13:36.080 --> 00:13:39.799 because I truly think he has got that elite level 300 00:13:40.480 --> 00:13:43.399 competitiveness in him and ultimately he'll become better for it. 301 00:13:44.120 --> 00:13:45.320 Before we move out East. 302 00:13:45.759 --> 00:13:49.159 A thought on Julius Randall, who, in fairness, has had 303 00:13:49.399 --> 00:13:52.720 the best spring that he's ever had as an NBA player. 304 00:13:52.840 --> 00:13:54.440 As a Nick fan, I can speak to it. 305 00:13:55.240 --> 00:13:57.759 I always was skeptical of the way the previous Nick 306 00:13:57.799 --> 00:14:01.000 team was built only because j Allen's awesome. But if 307 00:14:01.000 --> 00:14:04.519 your number two offensive option is Julius Randall, you're going 308 00:14:04.559 --> 00:14:06.600 to run into games like we've run into over the 309 00:14:06.639 --> 00:14:09.799 past two where he is watching from the fourth quarter, 310 00:14:09.960 --> 00:14:11.879 like he's watching from the bench in the fourth quarter, 311 00:14:12.440 --> 00:14:14.960 and I just for all the ant stuff, I'm looking 312 00:14:15.000 --> 00:14:18.879 at Julius one of seven, five points, five turnovers. And 313 00:14:18.919 --> 00:14:21.039 the problem with Julius Randall, this has always been the deal. 314 00:14:21.600 --> 00:14:24.919 If he's not scoring, if he's not involved offensively and 315 00:14:25.000 --> 00:14:27.960 making shots, he's just not as engaged defensively. 316 00:14:28.639 --> 00:14:30.240 And we saw it last night. 317 00:14:30.360 --> 00:14:32.720 So what's your take on what we've seen from Julius 318 00:14:32.799 --> 00:14:34.240 Randall over the past couple of games. 319 00:14:34.799 --> 00:14:36.600 Yeah, well, I mean go back to those first two 320 00:14:36.639 --> 00:14:39.000 games in ok See, and he was really aggressive from 321 00:14:39.039 --> 00:14:41.480 the start. They're almost like he was like, Okay, I'm 322 00:14:41.519 --> 00:14:44.279 going to show the years of my experience here because 323 00:14:44.279 --> 00:14:46.759 you're hitting freeze and he was aggressively on for a shot. 324 00:14:46.960 --> 00:14:50.360 But certainly that has been the criticism of Julius Randles 325 00:14:50.399 --> 00:14:53.000 throughout his career, where some nights he looked like an 326 00:14:53.039 --> 00:14:56.639 all NBA caliber player, and other nights like last night, 327 00:14:57.000 --> 00:14:59.000 he does seem to be sleepwalking a little bit more. 328 00:14:59.039 --> 00:15:01.720 And I think that can assistancy is tough for a 329 00:15:01.720 --> 00:15:04.120 lot of players because you have those good games and 330 00:15:04.120 --> 00:15:05.879 then all of a sudden things aren't going your way. 331 00:15:06.159 --> 00:15:08.799 What do you have as a backup? When do you 332 00:15:08.879 --> 00:15:12.039 go to Plan B? And Julius doesn't really seem to 333 00:15:12.080 --> 00:15:14.440 have that, Whereas you know, you would like to see 334 00:15:14.480 --> 00:15:16.960 him go inside again, maybe try to draw some fout, 335 00:15:17.039 --> 00:15:19.480 get some high percentage looks, whatever it is. If the 336 00:15:19.480 --> 00:15:21.840 three is not falling, if the mid range is not falling, 337 00:15:22.200 --> 00:15:25.120 have something else there in your bag, And at times 338 00:15:25.159 --> 00:15:28.639 he does. But again it's a little bit frustrating because 339 00:15:28.720 --> 00:15:30.879 there are times where it just seems like he's just 340 00:15:30.960 --> 00:15:32.759 not focused on the game. And again, last night was 341 00:15:32.799 --> 00:15:35.480 a must win really for the Wolves. I mean, obviously 342 00:15:35.480 --> 00:15:38.840 they're still statistically in it, but for all intents and purposes, 343 00:15:38.840 --> 00:15:42.000 are going to lose in five games here. And it 344 00:15:42.080 --> 00:15:46.360 was just a frustrating way because I thought, even though 345 00:15:46.399 --> 00:15:48.519 it was close last night, I always felt that the 346 00:15:48.559 --> 00:15:50.679 thunder were in control. And I think you know that 347 00:15:50.840 --> 00:15:52.759 that was sort of reflected in the score. In the end, 348 00:15:53.080 --> 00:15:56.200 the Wolves gave it everything, but ultimately they just didn't 349 00:15:56.240 --> 00:16:00.320 have that same or that same aggression that they had, 350 00:16:00.919 --> 00:16:03.000 you know in Game three which got them that huge win. 351 00:16:03.080 --> 00:16:05.759 And you know, the Thunder were able to sort of 352 00:16:05.759 --> 00:16:08.200 overcome that like a pretty embarrassing loss there, and they 353 00:16:08.240 --> 00:16:11.000 were able to bounce back a lot quicker, whereas it's 354 00:16:11.000 --> 00:16:13.399 almost like maybe the Wolves thought all their work was done. 355 00:16:13.399 --> 00:16:16.759 Who knows, But you know, we'll see the playoffs this 356 00:16:16.840 --> 00:16:18.919 year then, and you know, every series seems to be 357 00:16:18.919 --> 00:16:21.399 a little bit crazy, So there is a chance, you know, 358 00:16:21.480 --> 00:16:23.799 if you sort of think about it, that the Wolves 359 00:16:23.799 --> 00:16:26.159 could still extend this series and get themselves back into it. 360 00:16:26.200 --> 00:16:28.120 But I think they probably blew their. 361 00:16:28.080 --> 00:16:31.159 Chance last night, all right, before we get to tonight 362 00:16:31.759 --> 00:16:35.360 Sunday's game in Indiana, you know, I was ready to 363 00:16:35.360 --> 00:16:38.320 turn it off in the second quarter and ready to say, okay, 364 00:16:38.360 --> 00:16:39.039 this is a sweep. 365 00:16:39.600 --> 00:16:40.759 The next go down twenty. 366 00:16:41.240 --> 00:16:43.879 You know, one of the more under talked about dynamics 367 00:16:43.879 --> 00:16:46.159 of Sunday Lee, in my opinion, is the way New 368 00:16:46.240 --> 00:16:49.600 York closed the second quarter to get it down to thirteen. Now, 369 00:16:49.639 --> 00:16:52.279 that doesn't sound like a lot but when they went 370 00:16:52.320 --> 00:16:55.519 down twenty and Halliburton gets the steal, there's a dunk. 371 00:16:56.600 --> 00:16:59.519 It just felt like there was no way back, even 372 00:16:59.559 --> 00:17:01.879 though the next have come back down from you know, 373 00:17:01.919 --> 00:17:03.720 come back from down twenty points a couple of times 374 00:17:03.720 --> 00:17:05.720 against the Celtics, the Pacers just felt like they were 375 00:17:05.759 --> 00:17:09.279 built differently. When Nie Smith hurt his ankle, that changed 376 00:17:09.319 --> 00:17:12.359 the scope of the game. On Friday, I said, a 377 00:17:12.359 --> 00:17:15.240 couple of different times, can Tom Thibodeau find ten to 378 00:17:15.240 --> 00:17:18.519 fifteen minutes for Landry Shammitt, for Delon Wright even precious 379 00:17:18.519 --> 00:17:21.519 to you who did not play, And he was able 380 00:17:21.640 --> 00:17:24.000 to find some minutes for some of his bench players, 381 00:17:24.039 --> 00:17:26.720 and Jalen was in foul trouble, so of course he 382 00:17:26.799 --> 00:17:28.839 was limited as far as his minutes go, which I 383 00:17:28.839 --> 00:17:31.640 think is good because the starters didn't look like they 384 00:17:31.680 --> 00:17:34.920 were dying down the stretch in Game three because he 385 00:17:34.960 --> 00:17:38.160 was able to get some rest. You know, Kat has 386 00:17:38.240 --> 00:17:40.279 that stretch to the start of the fourth. It reminds 387 00:17:40.319 --> 00:17:43.200 you like how special he is when he's engaged. But 388 00:17:43.279 --> 00:17:46.119 your main takeaways with how New York came back from 389 00:17:46.119 --> 00:17:49.119 that deficit and got it done on Sunday. 390 00:17:49.640 --> 00:17:52.160 Well, it was quite interesting because TJ. McConnell had a 391 00:17:52.200 --> 00:17:54.920 press availability yesterday and he was asked like, did you 392 00:17:54.960 --> 00:17:56.880 guys maybe take you from the gas a little bit 393 00:17:56.880 --> 00:17:59.640 when they were up twenty with about seven minutes to 394 00:17:59.680 --> 00:18:02.200 go in second quarter, and he said, you know, yeah, 395 00:18:02.240 --> 00:18:04.319 subconsciously you do. You sort of feel like you've got 396 00:18:04.359 --> 00:18:06.039 the game in hand a little bit. And then the 397 00:18:06.079 --> 00:18:08.000 Knicks made a little push to get it close with 398 00:18:08.079 --> 00:18:10.599 a half time, and then it was still about double 399 00:18:10.640 --> 00:18:13.799 digits going into the fourth and it felt like then 400 00:18:13.880 --> 00:18:16.839 Karl Anthony Town's had four points and four rebounds, was like, man, 401 00:18:16.880 --> 00:18:19.319