Speaker 1: What's up everyone, and welcome back to the Epstein Chronicles.
We're gonna pick up where we left off with the
Sarah Ransom deposition, so let's get back to it. Menager.
How long did you stay on the island during this
first trip? Ransom? A few days? Menager? Was it a
week or two days? Ransom? I can't remember, Menager. Apart
from redacted and redacted, Jeffrey and yourself, is there anyone
else you recall being on that first trip, mister Gergis
Objection Ransom on that particular first trip, I can't remember.
I just remember redacted, redacted, Jeffrey, myself on the first trip. Manager,
when you got to the island, was there anyone else there? Ransom? Yes?
There was a lovely couple from Zimbabwe somewhere in Africa.
I think they were either South African or from Zimbabwe.
But they were a really lovely middle aged couple. Chef
like staff, really nice staff on the island. Manager, any
other guests, No, not the first trip. Manager. Did you
engage in any sexual acts with Jeffrey Epstein on your
first trip? Ransom? Yes? Manager. What happened? Gerghis Objection Ransom?
It was I had to give him a massage in
his bedroom manager, And how did that come about? Ransom?
So the entire basics were explained to me. There's this
wealthy dude, this philanthropist, loves women, loves getting massages, and
this was a nice way to make extra cash, which
is great. I got to the island. Oh, I was
made to massage Jeffrey on the plane. Sorry, that's where
I gave my first massage to Jeffrey. So my first
massage started with him on the plane with his feet
and his hands. On that trip I was I had
to give him other massages like legs, arms, feet, hands, head, shoulders,
and it wasn't straight away, but they got more sexual.
Then I was called to his bedroom manager. Okay, I
just want to make sure we're talking about the same timeframe.
There was a massage you gave on the plane on
the way down there, Ransom, Yes, Menager, that was not sexual. Ransom,
that was not sexual, No, Menager, was that before or
after he was having sex with redacted in the open
bed in the plane area? Ransom? It was before. It
was before they had sex because we all fell asleep, Menager. Okay,
And then how did the massage come about? Ransom on
the island or Menager, No on the plane, just on
the plane, Ransom. Jeffrey asked me in a massage, the Menager.
So you were asleep and Jeffrey woke you up. McCauley objection, Ransom.
When we first got on the plane, we sat down,
you know, like when you first get on an airplane,
you settle in, and Chad and Chad and Chad and
I massaged them, and then it was after that we
kind of all fell asleep. And then I woke up
and I saw Jeffrey n redacted Meninger, Okay, Ransom. So
in that effect, I was probably sitting I was facing
the bed, Menager. You were rear facing Ransom. Yeah, Menager,
Can I just hand you back defendants Exhibit one? Is
it still in your recollection the same place? Ransom. Yeah.
We switched seats a few times, Menager. So where was
Jeffrey when you gave him the massage on the airplane, Ransom?
He was. He was seated at the front manager in
front of where you were, Ransom. We weren't really all
seated throughout the entire duration of the flight. So as
soon as the flight took up, we took our seat
belts off and kind of moved around freely. Because it's
not a commercial flight. You can do that on a
private plane, So we weren't in our seats the whole
entire time. There was a lot of moving around Menainger. Okay,
can you just draw on the defendants Exhibit one where
he was when you gave him a massage? Ransom. I
can't remember specifically on the seat or where I was
facing that I gave Jeffrey as massage, So I'm not
comfortable putting something because that's speculating. Menager. Do you have
a general area at all? Was it in the front area? Ransom?
The general area? The general area here is at the
front of the plane and then the bed at the
back of the plane, Manager, So which of those two
general areas was the massage? Ransom? So the massage was
at the front, because I didn't give it to him
on the bed. It was in the front of the plane.
I don't remember what specific seat plan I gave him
a massage, Meninger. Was he wearing clothes Ransom, yes, Menager
during the whole massage Ransom, during the whole massage, yes, Menager.
What was he wearing ransom. I don't remember, Menager. Did
he have on shoes? Ransom, Yes, he had on shoes
when he walked onto the plane, but then he took
his shoes off to have the massage, Menager. And do
you recall what he said when he asked you to
give him a massage? Ransom? Yes, he asked me to
massage his feet and massage him. Menager. Were you surprised
by that request? Ransom? No, Menager? Why not ransom? Because
Radakta told me that he liked to get massages from
girls and that he paid them for him. Mener. Did
he pay you for that massage on the plane? Ransom? No, Menager.
Did you expect them to ransom? Well, it was. It
was the beginning of the trip, so I'm hardly going
to I don't really know you. Can you please pay me?
It's not something you really discuss. I don't think it's
not really appropriate. It's not very business like Menager. And
you were clothed during the massage on the plane Ransom, yes, Menager.
Where was the second massage ransom on his island? Menager?
Where on the island? Ransom? So the second time I
massaged them was probably on It was I was then
asked to massage them again later that day, to massage
him again in the open plan seating area on the island. Menager,
who asked you to do that? Ransom? Redacted? Menager? So
redacted was on the island? Answer? Yes, Menager? Did she
travel with you? Ransom? Not all. I can't remember specifically
who who is traveling with us. I can't say that
I one hundred percent remember her on that first flight.
I don't. I can't visually see her there, but I
know that she traveled with us pretty much every time
with Jeffrey. She traveled everywhere with Jeffrey Meninger. How many
times did you go to the island ransom several? Menager?
How many? Ransom? Several? Several times. There were multiple occasions
that I went to the island, Menager three times? Ransom
several several. I can't remember how many times specifically, Menager.
I understand you don't have a specific answer. Ransom, yeah, Menainger.
Do you believe it was more than ten times? Ransom?
I don't think it was as much as ten times. No,
maybe a little bit less, but not that many. Menager.
Do you know how many times you went on the
private plane versus a commercial plane Ransom. I flew both,
so I can't remember how many times I did commercial,
how many times I did private? I mean it was
I know that I did fly commercially at some times
when the plane wasn't available, Menager. And the total number
of trips to the island you think was less than
ten times, mister Gergis objection, Ransom, there was several times.
I'm not sure if it was more than ten. I
don't know the accurate number. It was several times, Menager.
Did you go through any type of passport control when
you went to the island at all? Ransom? No, they
didn't check passports. Oh, I bet you they didn't. If
you want to have underage girls come in, can't be
checking passports, now, can you? Menager? How did you get
from where the plane landed to the island? Ransom? Jeffrey speedboat? Menager?
Was that the only method? Ransom? Also a helicopter? Menager?
Who flew the helicopter? Ransom? I don't a guy, Menager?
Was he cute? Gergis objection? Ransom? I don't remember. Gurgis objection.
And I direct the witness not to answer, Menager. I'm
learning about super yachting. I thought I would find out
about the helicopter gergis. I thought you were going to
ask if he was taller than six feet or less
than six feet. I thought that was the next series
of questions, Menager. So you said the second massage you
gave Jeffrey was on the island the same day you
flew down there the first time. Ransom, yes, Menager. And
it was in the open plan area. Ransom yes. Manager,
And you recall redacted being the one to ask you
to give the massage. Ransom. We were all sitting there socially,
Jeffrey asked me, and that wasn't a sexual massage in
the seating area on the island. The second massage, he
was still training me to massage, so my standards weren't
quite high enough. Manager, How did he train you to
massage them? Ransom? He let the girl's massage me in
front of him. He showed me how to because his
body is full of notts so and he likes his
massage really hard. So when you really push on those
knots that he has, you have to be quite firm
with him. Manager. So he told you that he liked
what he liked ransom. Yes. Yeah, and some of the
other girls, sorry redacted, showed me how he liked his massages. Menager.
Was he clothed during the second massage Ransom? Yes? Manager?
Were you clothed Ransom? Yes? Menager. Did any sexual contact
occur on the second massage Ransom? No, Menager. When do
you recall there being a third massage ransom the next day? Menager?
And what happened that gave rise to the third massage Ransom?
I was called to Jeffrey's bedroom to massage, Menager? Who
called you ransom? I don't want to speculate, so I
can't remember specifically who called me, Menager. Okay, so the
third person you don't recall, ransom, It was a female.
It was either redacted or redacted. So I can't remember
which of the two that called me, because they called
me many times during the duration of my trip, Menager.
So when you say they called me, what does that
mean ransom? They come up to me and say, please
go to Jeffrey's bedroom and massage Jeffrey. He is waiting
for you, Menager. What time of day was it, Ransom,
I think it was. I can't remember what specific time
of day it was. Menager, can you describe the island
for me? Were there more than one building on it? Ransom? Yeah,
there were multiple buildings. You had the main house, you
had certain accommodation areas where the girls sit. There were
a various buildings around the island where he used to
have all him and his other guests, like beds and beds,
like little shelter things where him and his guests used
to have sex with the girls, like beds set up
for instant sexual entertainment. So Menager on a beach area, Ransom,
all over the island, all over the island. So if
you go on one of his squad bikes and do
a tour of his island, which I'm sure you guys
have done, you will see multiple buildings around the island. Manager.
And where were you staying during this first trip, Ransom?
I was staying in one of the guest houses that redacted,
the main guest house that all the girls shared. Menager.
Were you staying in your own room? Ransom? No, Menager,
who are you sharing a room with? Ransom? Redacted? I
think redacted slept in the bungalow. She didn't stay per se.
She was explained to be Jeffrey Epstein's girlfriend at the time, Menainger,
When you were asked to give Jeffrey a massage on
the third occasion by a female, do you recall what
words were used? Ransom. I can't remember the exact words, no,
but I was. It was generally it was, can you
please go and give Jeffrey It's kind of like your
turn type of thing. Menainger. Did you know where his
bedroom was? Ransom? I was shown to his bedroom. Menager.
Who showed you to his bedroom? Ransom? I can't remember
who showed me to his bedroom? Menager? All right, tell
me what happened during the third massage, Ransom. So I
went into Jeffrey Epstein's bedroom. His bedroom is like ice cold.
It's always ice cold. He likes his bedroom very well
air conditioned. There was a massage table laid out in
his bedroom. He asked me to undress and that he
wanted to give me a massage, and he asked me
to lay down on the table. He then started touching
my body. I was. I was. It didn't start off
as a sexual massage. It was just, you know, it
was just doing a normal massage, and then he started
to touch me. He touched my vaginal region, and he
touched me all over. Meninger. Were you draped with a towel? Ransom, no,
Menainger for no part of the massage, Ransom for the
I can't remember, Meninger. Was anyone else present in the
room Ransom, No, Menager. And after he started touching you
while you were on the table, did you give him
a massage? Ransom. I can't remember the specific sequence of events,
but I remember the third massage. It wasn't for Jeffrey,
it was for me. He performed the massage on me. Meninger.
Did you tell him to stop? Ransom? No? I did not, Meninger.
Did you have any sexual contact with him? Ransom, No.
He just touched me and he was touching himself too,
so Meninger. Did you have an orgasm? Ransom? I did
have an orgasm. He used a specific vibrator on me,
which it was quite hard not to Meninger. Can you
describe it, Ransom? Yeah, it's quite big. It's not an
actual vibrator. It's really good. You should get one if
you don't. The witness sorry, I'm allowed to talk, Okay, sorry?
Then Ransom goes on. It's all can I draw it.
Can I draw it? I'll draw you the exact I
can actually get you. I actually own one, so I
can get you a photo of it. You know. It's
also in the pictures in the dentist's chair in one
of the photos. So it's like this, mister Gergis, you're fine.
Ms McAuley, you're fine. Ransom. So it's actually a massager
for the shoulders. It's got a long base, it's got
quite a it's like a rubber white head. And yeah,
it was really it's not used for sexual purposes. Meninger.
It's not ransom. No, that's what I'm saying. It's not
a vibrator. Meninger. Okay, Ransom. It was actually quite painful
for me. Meninger, Okay, Ransom. Actually, Meninger, okay, did you
tell him to stop? Ransom? I told him to stop
when he because he pressed the vibrator head on my
clitteris and it was in credit painful. It hurt me.
That's a very sensitive area. And the strength of this
specific device he used is it's not really meant for that, Menager. Right,
did he stop when you said stop? Ransom? No? Manager,
And how long did this massage? Ransom? Interrupts her until
I orgasmed Menager, and then what happened? Ransom? He just
stopped and I got dressed and I left. Manager. Was
there any discussion Ransom? No, Menager. Did he give you
any money? Ransom? No, Gurgis. Can we stop for a moment?
The witness is crying. I think maybe we should take
a moment, have a moment. Okay, mark that as defendants
Exhibit number two, and then we'll take a break for
ten minutes. All right, folks, we're going to break right
here too, and in the next episode we'll pick up
where we left off. All of the information that goes
with this episode can be found in the description box.
What's up, everyone, and welcome back to the Epstein Chronicles.
This episode, we're gonna pick up where we left off
with the Sarah Ransom deposition. Menager. So you just described
for us. I think what you recall being the third
massage with Jeffrey Ransom? Yeah, Menager. Do you recall the
next one after that? Ransom? It was? It was basically
the same I was called to give Jeffrey massages Menager
during that first trip to the island. Ransom during the
first trip, Yeah, Menager, can you approximate how many massages
you gave to them during that first trip Ransom? I
would give them up to maybe to a day. The
other girls they had to also give them massages during
that trip, Menager. And you don't remember days that trip
was ransom? No, not specifically how many it was a
few days. It was a few days, Menager. At some
point did the massages become different than the one you
just described as the third massage? Ransom? It was either
Jeffrey lying on the massage, me massaging them and turning
sexual or vice versa. Pretty much from the third sexual
massage I had with Jeffrey. All other massages were sexual. Menager.
Do you recall who was on the flight home from
that first trip Ransom? I don't recall who was on
the flight home. I think it was all the people
that were on the first flight there. Menager. Did you
receive any compensation from Jeffrey during that first trip Ransom?
I received like three hundred bucks or something, not a lot, Menager.
When did you get that ransom at the end of
the trip, Menager? And how was it given to you
ransom in cash? Menager? By whom ransom? That specific time?
It was Jeffrey. Menager. Where were you when he gave
you that money? Ransom? I can't recall where I was
when he gave me the cash. Manager. Did were you
still with the other females that had been on the plane,
Ransom when he gave me the cash? Menager? Yes, Ransom,
I can't recall. I don't remember if someone was with me,
but we all knew that we were going to get cash. Manager.
Did you see him giving cash to anyone else? Ransom?
I saw him give cash to or redacted? Menager? How
much did he give her, if you know, Ransom, I
don't know, Menager. Did you see redacted having any type
of sexual relations with Jeffrey during this trip? Ransom? Yes,
I did, Menager. When did you see that? Ransom? I
didn't see it in the bedroom, but we were called
on like a rotation visit for Jeffrey throughout the day
and evening. Menager, When did you see her redacted having
some type of sexual relationship with Jeffrey on the island
during that first trip, Ransom, I didn't see her perform
sexual acts on Jeffrey. Manager. Did anyone see you performing
sexual acts on Jeffrey during the first trip to the island, Ransom. No, Menager,
did you tell any of these other women about what
was going on during your massages with Jeffrey Ransom? Yes? Manager.
Who did you tell Ransom all the girls that were there? Menager?
And again that is redacted and redacted and redacted, mister
gergis objection. Menager? Do you remember Ransom? I can't say
specifically if redacted was there. I can't remember redacted being there,
so I don't like to bring redacted into the first trip.
I saw her multiple times on the island, but I
can't specifically place her there on the first trip. I
just remember the key people that were there because they
were the most vivid in my memory. Menager. Do you
know if you took any pictures during that first trip? Ransom?
I don't think during that first trip. No, we weren't
actually allowed to bring any electronic devices with us. Menager,
How did you learn that rule? Ransom? Redacted told me,
and the other girls told me? Manager, who are the
other girls? Ransom? Redacted? Menager? Did you take a camera
to the island, Ransom, not the first time, No, Menager.
Did you have a digital camera at the time, Ransom? Yes,
I did, Menager. What kind, Ransom, I can't remember, Menager.
Did you have a phone with a camera on it? Ransom?
I had a BlackBerry, yes, which you could take photos on. Menager,
All right. Do you recall there being any sexual acts
performed on the plane on the ride home during that
first trip? Ransom? No, Menager, Okay. Do you recall going
down a second time Ransom to the island? Menager, yes, Ransom, yes, Manager.
When did that happen? Ransom? Shortly, I can't remember specifically
when it was, but it wasn't on I don't know
the time length. I saw Jeffrey and Glaane and the
crowd quite a lot in New York as well, so
it's not clear to me when the second trip was Menager.
When was the first time you met Glaine Ransom. I'd
been to the island a couple of times before, and
then I met Glaine on the island, Menainger. Tell me
about your meeting with her, Ransom. I remember being told
by everyone before she arrived who she was, and I
was pretty much told the type of person she was
and that I had to do everything she told me
to do. Who told you that Ransom redacted? Redacted, redacted
and redacted. Every single girl that I came in communication
with told me that Menager And what type of person
did they tell you? That she was? Ransom? She's incredibly intimidating.
She's not someone you want to be stuck in an
alley with at night. Put it that way. She's a
very dangerous character and has connections Menager, And that was
communicated to you by this group of females redacted, redacted,
redacted and redacted Menager, anyone else Ransom. I mean, it
was a general conversation amongst the girls about Golaane. So
there were other girls all the time. So during the
duration of my stay, so pretty much from my when
I first arrived in New York, my entire time was
spent with Jeffrey and Golaane and that crowd. So, yeah,
it was that's about everything. Meninger. Okay, so you met Ransom.
I met a lot of girls who we all had
the same opinion of Golaane. We were all frightened of her.
She had a very odd relytionlationship with Jeffrey. And yeah,
she's not a nice I'm sorry. I know she's your client,
but she's not She's not a friendly, warm person. I
liked her dog though, her Yorkshire Terrier. Her dog was nice. Menager.
You recalled meeting her for the first time on that island, Ransom. Yeah,
she flew in by helicopter, Menager. And that was after
you were on the island a couple of times. Ransom, Yeah, Menager.
Did she fly the helicopter Ransom? I can't remember if
she flew it or not. I just remember her getting out,
like getting out of and going Glaine and I was like,
I was quite frightened when she arrived. So, Menager, was
she alone or with someone? Ransom? I can't remember if
she was with someone. I just remember the first time
I saw her, I was like, is that it? She
didn't look that scary when I first met her. Looks
her deceiving Menager. So the first time you saw her,
she was getting off a helicopter Ransom, Yeah. Manager. And
you don't recall if she flew the helicopter Ransom. I
don't recall if she flew it herself or if there
was a pilot there. I just remember she arrived on
a helicopter. Manager. What's the next thing you remember about
your interactions with her personally? Ransom? She stayed on the
island a few days, and I didn't have a lot
of interaction with her. I avoided her, to be honest, Menager.
Did you take pictures with her? Ransom? No, we weren't
allowed any digital cameras on the island, Menager. Have you
ever taken a picture of her? Ransom? No. I didn't
really feel comfortable and I didn't feel the need to
take pictures of Glane for my photo album, Menager. Apart
from staying away from her and not having a lot
of interactions, do you recall anything else about your first
interaction with her on the island? Ransom? Yeah. She was
incredibly unpleasant to me. She wasn't friendly or warm. Menager.
What did she say or do? Ransom? She was very dismissive,
just another girl, really, Manager. Did you ever give her
a massage? Ransom? No? Menager? Did she ever give you
a massage? Ransom? She massaged me once or twice, but
it was to it was to refine my technique for
Jeffrey Menager. This was on the first time that you
met her, Ransom. Yeah, during that trip she because Jeffrey again,
he's quite specific on how he likes his massages, and yeah,
I'm not that's not my forte massages, Menager. How did
it come about that she was helping you to refine
your massage techniques? Ransom. We were just sitting in the
main area by the big house. That's where we chilled out.
There's a table there as well, and yeah, we were
just sitting on the sofas and I think I can't
remember if I was giving Jeffrey a massage, but we
were all sitting together, and I think he was getting
massaged by one of the girls and we were kind
of taking it in turns Menager. Was it sexual? Ransom? No,
it wasn't sexual, but Glaine was there and I wasn't
doing it properly, and she showed me how to massage
them and how he liked it, Menager. And what part
of his body? Did she show you how to massage? Ransom?
His feet, his hands? Manager? Did she say anything to you, Ransom?
I can't remember specifically what she said to me. She
said a lot of things to me, Manager, Okay, well
tell me what you remember that she said to you.
Gurgis objection? When where? What? What are we talking about? Ransom?
I can't remember specifically what she said to me. All
I know is that she wasn't. She wasn't a particularly
a nice person to me or to anybody, so very dictatorial, manager,
unlimited by time or anything. Do you recall anything Glayne
said to you? Gurgis objection you're asking her Ransom. It
was had a massage, Jeffrey. I remember speaking to her
quite a lot about my fit application. I remember speaking
to Glaine about my psychiatrist about my weight. My weight
was a big issue, and in fact, everything was an
issue with Glaine. Manager during this first time you met her,
other than discussing massages, did the those other topics come up? Ransom.
I can't remember the first encounter with Golaine, but it
was pretty soon after everything snowballed quite quickly. Manager. Well,
you saw her getting off the helicopter, correct Ransom, Yes, Manager,
And you saw her on the island for a couple
of days that time, you said, correct Ransom, yeah. Manager.
So during that time that you saw her over a
couple of days, do you remember any other discussions you
had with her apart from this massage, Ransom, We spoke
about why I was there in New York. I mean
we you know, she got to know me. She asked
me a lot of questions about my family life. I mean,
she questioned me a lot about my personal life. Manager.
Was anyone else present when you were having these discussions
with Glaine Ransom? Yes? Everyone everyone that was redacted, redacted,
Jeffrey and redacted Manager. Was there anyone different on this trip? Ransom?
Redacted as well, redacted. Was there Menager anyone else on
this trip? Ransom? I can't remember Menager? Was redacted, redacted
and redacted there? Ransom, not the first time that I
met Klaine Menager. Was anyone else there? Ransom? I can't
remember Menager. Anything that would help refresh your memory, Ransom,
if you could give me the plane logs or something,
or names or photos. Ten years, as I said, is
an incredibly long time. I don't remember who. I mean,
it was such a long time for me. I came
to New York. My intention was to meet many people,
make new friends, make a new life for myself, so
I didn't really I don't remember names specifically, Menager. Do
you remember any descriptions of other people who were on
the island the first time you met Klaine Ransom? There
were all beautiful people. I just remember being surrounded by
beautiful young people. There were always girls. There were always girls.
You know, girls didn't even have time to kind of
remember girls' names because there was always people leaving the island,
popping in, flying in, So there was a constant flux
of people coming in, popping in visiting Jeffrey and Golaine Menager.
So the first time you met Glaine, you saw her
get off a helicopter. She was on the island for
a couple of days. Any other females you remember being
there on that occasion? Mcaulay Objection asked and answered Ransom redacted, redacted,
redacted and redacted. And I can't remember any others Menager, Menager,
can you remember any descriptions of other people who were
there on that occasion? Gurgis Objection asked and answered, Ransom.
They were beautiful, they were pretty, and they were just
beautiful Menager. Hair color Gurgis Objection, Ransom, normal Menager, height, Ransom.
I don't recall height, Menager, any other physical characteristics at all,
mister Gergis Objection, Ransom, just that they were extremely beautiful.
I've never seen girls like that, Menager. Well you had
been a model in London, right, Ransom, Yeah, I have,
but you know, Jeffrey Epstein wired the elite, didn't he
you know? Him and Glaine, so they were pretty much
the crem dela creme of the crop. I would say
the girls that were around them menager on this first
occasion when you met Glaine and there were beautiful girls
who you don't recall what they look like. You they
were beautiful, Ransom. Yeah, there were beautiful people constantly surrounded
by Jeffrey Epstein and Glaine. They were only surrounded by
beautiful people, beautiful girls, menager. But apart from that, you
don't have any other specifics, Ransom. I don't recall the
appearance of the other girls. I don't. As I will
say again, there was a constant stream of people coming
in going off the island, popping in, popping out, girls
flying in, girls flying out. There were girls on the
island that were their shorter time frames than me and
flew out. I didn't really I hung out with my
crew redacted or redacted. They were my friends. I thought
they were my friends, So I didn't really cozy up
to any of the other girls. It's like high school,
you know, you're not friends with everybody. You ask me
who every one I went to high school with I
don't remember. I don't have a clue. I don't know
who they are. Manager. Do you have a best friend
from school? Gurgis, Objection, Ransom, several, several? I mean, who
has any best friends at school? School? School? We don't
make best friends at school. All right, folks, we're gonna
wrap up this part here, and in the next episode
we're gonna pick up where we left off. All of
the information that goes with this episode can be found
in the description box.