Speaker 1: Two promoted teams and Kisse Stahmer are slipping down. Yet
Speaker 1: Huddersfield fans all have a big frown. They are the
Speaker 1: ones in the wooden spoon Spot Saints and our top
Speaker 1: of the lot Lee are getting their acting gear for
Speaker 1: all the Ghostly and Johnna here. Welcome to the twenty
Speaker 1: second episode of Super League three sixty a Prime, a
Speaker 1: podcast primarily about the top tier of British rugby league.
Speaker 1: My name is Lee. Can't get me word right, Addison.
Speaker 1: It's a Prome podcast and I'm John Davidson. If it
Speaker 1: was on Amazon Prime. It's on Amazon I think, so
Speaker 1: it could be. Yeah, I mentioned kir Starmer. Then you
Speaker 1: looks like you're going to get your seventh prime minister
Speaker 1: in ten years or something. John, So, I don't know
Speaker 1: if you're putting your hat in the ring.
Speaker 2: I'm not putting my hat in the ring.
Speaker 3: It's kind of similar to as you would know what's
Speaker 3: happened in well in Australia all back when it was
Speaker 3: you know, rather than then Gillard and then right again
Speaker 3: and then Abbot and then what was it Turnbullne and
Speaker 3: Morrison and then.
Speaker 1: I say exactly what I say when it comes to
Speaker 1: rugby league coaches and football coaches and sports coaches in general.
Speaker 1: When you have to change boss so much, it says
Speaker 1: a lot more about the recruiters rather than the recruited.
Speaker 1: I'm a coach in Australia. John is a journalist in
Speaker 1: the UK. Please read the description or listen to old
Speaker 1: pods to make our introduction shorter. This podcast is also
Speaker 1: being aired on the Ashes Rugby League Rugby League Coach
Speaker 1: podcast platforms as well as the Rugby League Coach YouTube too,
Speaker 1: and if you subscribe to those you won't miss a thing.
Speaker 1: Also thanks to Rugby League dot Com. I do want
Speaker 1: to say before I start those who listen to the
Speaker 1: Rugby League Coach podcast just had a week off from
Speaker 1: doing that, just to give myself a few hours. John,
Speaker 1: Let's go through the table. What am I going to
Speaker 1: see when I look at this Super League table? John?
Speaker 2: Uh, you're going to see? Well, I haven't checked it lightly.
Speaker 3: Begin I say Wigan obviously on the on the march
Speaker 3: and the rise, big win over leads, okay, ask quick
Speaker 3: past the least so they're definitely.
Speaker 2: Moving up and a win for the wire and.
Speaker 1: Yeah I never lost for to lose A big win
Speaker 1: for win for Cass as well, So k Are and
Speaker 1: Wakefield Sorry and Warrington are the two teams that have
Speaker 1: played one less game, so I'll get that straight before
Speaker 1: we start. Saint Helen's the top of the ladder. Everyone
Speaker 1: else has played eleven games. Saints are top with eighteen,
Speaker 1: Leeds and Warrington are in second and third respectively on sixteen.
Speaker 1: Who k are in fourth with fourteen. Two other teams
Speaker 1: are on fourteen. That's Wakefield in fifth and Wigan in sixth.
Speaker 1: Two teams on ten Lee in seventh and Catalans in eight. Hull,
Speaker 1: lef C, Bradford Bulls, Castleford Tigers are the three teams
Speaker 1: in ninth, tenth and eleventh respectively on eight points, and
Speaker 1: York and to Lose are in twelfth and thirteenth on
Speaker 1: six points respectively. Holding up everybody else at the bottom
Speaker 1: of the ladder on four points is the unleashed Huddersfield Giants.
Speaker 1: Before we go any further, a couple of weeks ago
Speaker 1: we read out a tweet from someone that accused Neil Holding,
Speaker 1: who played three hundred and sixty games, mostly for Saints
Speaker 1: but also Rochdale, Aldham and Bradford played for Great Britain
Speaker 1: on four occasions, two in the early eighties. It was
Speaker 1: a great little half somebody sent in a tweet. It
Speaker 1: was part of our questions. We asked for questions and
Speaker 1: this was the third thing that was on there. Just
Speaker 1: to put it in some kind of context. We literally
Speaker 1: just read it out. I laughed because it was preposterous. Basically,
Speaker 1: he didn't like the fact that that tweet was written John,
Speaker 1: and he gave me a call. We had a very
Speaker 1: fair conversation. So it's an apology from me for reading
Speaker 1: it out. Quite frankly, I just read it out and
Speaker 1: didn't have time to filter it. And yes, so my
Speaker 1: apologies to Nil holding.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and I made a tongue in cheek a comment
Speaker 3: about Tommy Robinson. But anyone who wants to know about
Speaker 3: Tommy Robinson, obviously he's a criminal, and you can find
Speaker 3: out about all these conditions. It's not actually his real mind,
Speaker 3: but you can go online and find those out. And yeah,
Speaker 3: I guess we'll move on.
Speaker 1: Rugby League tweet of the Week Steve Mascord said, people
Speaker 1: have shorter attention spans. I get it will origin be
Speaker 1: like this now. I know this is Super League three sixty,
Speaker 1: but we do mention the NRL. John, I was at
Speaker 1: Magic Round at the weekend. I was bored out in
Speaker 1: my brains. I went on Friday.
Speaker 2: You hadn't drag enough, had you.
Speaker 1: True? If I want to watch touch football, so touch rugby,
Speaker 1: I'll watch touch rugby. It's awful. I don't like it.
Speaker 1: There's no jeopardy between attack and defense. The game looks
Speaker 1: like a game of rugby league for ten minutes and
Speaker 1: then it totally opens up. What I did notice is
Speaker 1: I've not been to Magic Round for five years. I
Speaker 1: think it will at least be another five years based
Speaker 1: on this before I go again. Only went because I
Speaker 1: didn't have to pay for the ticket, and the crowd
Speaker 1: is a lot younger, so they're obviously doing something right.
Speaker 1: And people have automatically linked the faster rock speeds as
Speaker 1: the reason people are happier with with rugby league in Australia,
Speaker 1: and that's something else that's happened in Britain. And this
Speaker 1: is why it's an important conversation. But it's a bit
Speaker 1: more complicated than that. John, Yes, mention the NRL, but
Speaker 1: also link it back to Super League. This faster rock
Speaker 1: that we are seeing in rugby league at the minute,
Speaker 1: what impact is it having?
Speaker 3: Jeez lely, that's scientifical, and to answer how long have
Speaker 3: we got? Look to tie it back to what you
Speaker 3: originally said, Yeah, I mean, I think it's common knowledge
Speaker 3: that people these days, younger people have shorter attention spans
Speaker 3: and that's down to technology and social media and dunal
Speaker 3: screening and sometimes three screening. I don't think necessarily rugby
Speaker 3: league's popularity in Australia is down to the faster rucks
Speaker 3: of the rules changes. I think that's down to the
Speaker 3: thought that the ball in play more often means more entertainment,
Speaker 3: which equals more evals. There may be some validity to that,
Speaker 3: but there's definitely I don't know. Maybe you could call
Speaker 3: it the culture war, you know between the traditionalists light
Speaker 3: yourself and some other people on the sport, and then
Speaker 3: there's obviously a lot of people would feel the same
Speaker 3: way as you do. I do get it, and I
Speaker 3: don't want to see touch footy either between you know,
Speaker 3: the way the game has always been played to what
Speaker 3: we have at the moment. But the impact, yeah, I mean,
Speaker 3: I think I think a lot of a lot of injuries,
Speaker 3: a lot of lopsided score lines. I don't think it
Speaker 3: certainly had an impact in super I don't think the
Speaker 3: impact has been as great as been in the NRL
Speaker 3: because I was at Wakefield on Friday night, and why
Speaker 3: you could say, oh, well, you know there was forty
Speaker 3: eight ammiments and points and Wakefield just went through Catlands,
Speaker 3: But a lot of that was down to just how
Speaker 3: bad cut Lands were as well. They effectively give it,
Speaker 3: gave up. So yeah, I don't do I answer your
Speaker 3: question a long way. I don't think Origin will probably
Speaker 3: be like that. I think they will, like they always
Speaker 3: red for Origin, don't let a bit more physicality go.
Speaker 3: They let a few more hard shots go, and it
Speaker 3: is kind of an old fashioned usually more of an
Speaker 3: arm wrestle.
Speaker 2: That's probably my.
Speaker 1: Prediction also, John, I mean, if the referees have to
Speaker 1: do that, I mean, one pattern I'm seeing over the
Speaker 1: last few weeks is if scores blow out on a
Speaker 1: Thursday and Friday. On Saturday, all of a sudden, the
Speaker 1: games are a bit closer, and I can't help but
Speaker 1: think that the referees are giving less six games, They're
Speaker 1: allowing more latitude at the rug. The games were definitely
Speaker 1: slower on Saturday. The field was boggier because it's been
Speaker 1: raining a lot here in Brisbane. Yes, so they're obviously
Speaker 1: playing around with the game. They've played around with the
Speaker 1: game in England to the point where last year it
Speaker 1: was WrestleMania. This year it's now touched football and no
Speaker 1: wonder people get confused and this fake engineering of the
Speaker 1: product that we're trying to do. How about we just
Speaker 1: reward the tackle again. I mean, I'm a guide in
Speaker 1: the world rugby league person. I can tell you that
Speaker 1: these opinions positive or negative about rugby league, they're actually
Speaker 1: not related to age. They are related to people's taste
Speaker 1: of sport. And I think I would there's so many
Speaker 1: people in their early twenties that I've heard say they
Speaker 1: don't like the game at the moment, and using an analogy,
Speaker 1: I would say, this is like two boxers being in
Speaker 1: a ring. One of them has to wear heavy gloves,
Speaker 1: the other one can go bare knuckle. That's the sort
Speaker 1: of analogy I would come up with, because the balance
Speaker 1: between attack and defense has gone has gone completely skew
Speaker 1: with the other way.
Speaker 2: Now.
Speaker 1: Now you did say earlier that catalans are poor, etc. Etc.
Speaker 1: It's all part of the same recipe. Right. So if
Speaker 1: your preseason, if your recruitment, your recruitment for years, quite frankly,
Speaker 1: has been geared towards a certain type of game, and
Speaker 1: then all of a sudden the game changes at the
Speaker 1: drop of a hart. If you're a club that has
Speaker 1: a coach, for example, that has never coached before, which
Speaker 1: the Catalans work had, even if the coach has coached
Speaker 1: for twenty years, doesn't mean they're alive to change is
Speaker 1: very quickly. It could creep up on them before they
Speaker 1: behored they have chance to change. So there's so many
Speaker 1: things that's impacting the game all around the world, and
Speaker 1: the big indicator in England is the injuries because there's
Speaker 1: a shorter preseason than there is in the NRL. In
Speaker 1: the NRL, I think it's a fine line. In the NRL,
Speaker 1: I think it's too long and arduous. In Super League
Speaker 1: it's it's it's not long enough.
Speaker 2: And you mean the other way around.
Speaker 3: No, you said you said the NRL the season's pre
Speaker 3: season our preseason.
Speaker 2: Sorry, yeah, my mistake.
Speaker 1: Listening skills, John. The preseason in the NRL is longer
Speaker 1: than our duous too ardus. I believe too long. The
Speaker 1: preseason in Super League is the opposite, and you're seeing
Speaker 1: the athletic response quite frankly, Lee's laugh this week. You know,
Speaker 1: the super League website is not secure, so when I
Speaker 1: try and get on it on my laptop, I have
Speaker 1: to go through the security thinking on my laptop because
Speaker 1: it says this could be imitating another website.
Speaker 3: I do remember just a story in December. It was
Speaker 3: around Christmas or ease, and I think that the Super
Speaker 3: League website had either been hacked over down for a
Speaker 3: couple of days.
Speaker 2: At that point.
Speaker 1: So I'll tell you what.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, I'm not a I'm not a web
Speaker 3: hosting guru or anything, but yeah, I would imagine that
Speaker 3: it's probably something done on the cheap.
Speaker 1: John I'm a one man business band and my three
Speaker 1: websites that I almost all secure. That's all I'll say.
Speaker 2: The Sultan Steve Jobs.
Speaker 1: Johnny's tweets of the week. How many times do we
Speaker 1: need to check the same thing over and over? Madness
Speaker 1: discuss Yeah.
Speaker 2: I mean that was from the Hottest Fields and Helen's Game. Now.
Speaker 3: I don't generally like to be critical of referees or
Speaker 3: video referees or officials because we all make mistakes and
Speaker 3: you know no one is perfect, but some of the
Speaker 3: video refereeing this season in Super Bigue has been diabolical
Speaker 3: and the display on Thursday night, I mean it was
Speaker 3: a shot. Is that a fair word. I mean it
Speaker 3: was a pretty sharp game anyway. I mean Huddersfield were
Speaker 3: absolutely dreadful. Lola here to dropouts, he put straight out.
Speaker 3: They were just really really bad. I mean Huddersfield they
Speaker 3: are a championship team in disguise. They should be playing
Speaker 3: in the championship. Put that aside. The Hardersfield came back
Speaker 3: into the second half and had a real dig but
Speaker 3: the video referee there was one try I can't remember
Speaker 3: who scored it, but it was effectively came off the
Speaker 3: head of this and Hell's played from a kick and
Speaker 3: Hubs was scored. You could see it the first replay,
Speaker 3: but he went back and checked everything about three times
Speaker 3: and it was took about three minutes. You just what
Speaker 3: are you doing? Like, there's got to be a time
Speaker 3: or all this. There's got to be someone And just
Speaker 3: to be clear, the bunker system in the RAL was
Speaker 3: very different a super league. They have more cameras, they
Speaker 3: have more money, better facilities in the NRL, but Super league.
Speaker 3: There's got to be an impeticisy. Okay, we need a
Speaker 3: decision quickly here and if you can't make a decision,
Speaker 3: then go back to the rest cars because same with
Speaker 3: the captain's challenge is taking an age and there are
Speaker 3: things that the viewer at home can spot quickly and
Speaker 3: go okay, yeah that's a try, that's not a try,
Speaker 3: and officials seem scared to make a decision. And it
Speaker 3: is weird because there's hardly any media in the UK
Speaker 3: in British rugula league, and the criticism is really social
Speaker 3: media and fans. But even then it's not you know,
Speaker 3: it's not Liverpool or Arsenal, is it? So yeah, I
Speaker 3: just they just seem scared to make a decision. It's
Speaker 3: really tough to watch.
Speaker 1: I have the misfortune of studying both the Bunker and
Speaker 1: in the NRL and the Super League version of it.
Speaker 1: And you are right, it's far too long. Some burd
Speaker 1: has made a comment and we reiterated it last week.
Speaker 1: You games of rugby league ending sometimes thirty minutes later
Speaker 1: than they should and that impacts people's days, particularly if
Speaker 1: it's a night fixture. I mean, can you imagine some
Speaker 1: of the times people are getting home twenty minutes can
Speaker 1: make a hell of a difference at night time, particularly
Speaker 1: if you've got to go over the Pennines. And I
Speaker 1: just think Rugby League needs to get a grip of
Speaker 1: it and they need to put some kind of time
Speaker 1: limit on it. Yes, they don't have the camera angles,
Speaker 1: but they're never going to have the camera angles until
Speaker 1: things change. So you've got what you've got, Just make
Speaker 1: a decision and get on with it. Johnny's jab this
Speaker 1: week you want to talk about the participate the partition
Speaker 1: fee that Catalans and to lose have to pay, and
Speaker 1: I suppose we will lean on the Catalans performance and
Speaker 1: what you wrote this week as well well with it.
Speaker 1: Well we're here, yeah.
Speaker 3: I mean I put out an opinion piece hours ago
Speaker 3: that you can read for free online at my Patreon. Basically,
Speaker 3: it's a long read, a bit of a deep dive
Speaker 3: on the can Lands, their future and how they're going
Speaker 3: this season. And there are a lot of factors in it.
Speaker 3: But one of the big factors is this nie million
Speaker 3: quid that they have to pay every year for all
Speaker 3: the teams from England and the match offishals to fly
Speaker 3: over for their games. Now, this has impacted them heavily.
Speaker 3: They've cut back on their salary cap spending and I
Speaker 3: think they're looking at their coaching situation. They've also cut
Speaker 3: back on what they're spending on coaches, and according to
Speaker 3: people that I've spoken to, you know, the way they
Speaker 3: travel to the UK in terms of when they fly,
Speaker 3: where they fly from, where they stay in the UK,
Speaker 3: they travel time, you know from you know, if they
Speaker 3: flying to Manchester and then they have to travel the
Speaker 3: whole long game or whatever. All that's been impacted as
Speaker 3: well because they're looking to do it as cheap as
Speaker 3: they can. I just think basically it's an absolute joke
Speaker 3: that they have to pay even though they are unequal.
Speaker 3: They should be an equal member of the competition. And
Speaker 3: the same is for to lose, and so it's even
Speaker 3: harder for to lose because they've only got half the
Speaker 3: central distribution this year. But I just think it's it's
Speaker 3: an absolute joke that they're having to do this and
Speaker 3: it is competing, you know, with one arm behind their back.
Speaker 3: And I think we're really seeing, particularly Friday night, we're
Speaker 3: seeing the results of that.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 3: I don't I don't think they're a hell's chance of
Speaker 3: making the top six this season. They didn't make it
Speaker 3: last season and from where they were a couple of
Speaker 3: years ago, you know, at Old Trafford at Wembley, it's
Speaker 3: really disappointing.
Speaker 1: As soon why are they being made to pay this money?
Speaker 3: But they may have been made to pay the money
Speaker 3: because there is a certain number of English clubs who think,
Speaker 3: why have we got them in the competition? What do
Speaker 3: they bring? They've not brought in a TV deal. The
Speaker 3: French national team is not performing particularly well. You could
Speaker 3: argue it's gone backwards and they don't bring any away fans,
Speaker 3: so it's purely kind of you know, it's one way
Speaker 3: perspective and they don't really think that the French should
Speaker 3: be paying their way in the same is that the
Speaker 3: Sky deal. You know, Sky isn't going to get any
Speaker 3: more money from people watching the sport in France because
Speaker 3: it's the different broadcaster, so you know why they should
Speaker 3: have to pay their way in the competition. But it's
Speaker 3: just a completely unfair perspective for you know, it's not
Speaker 3: equal competition, is it. Yeah, And I think we're seeing
Speaker 3: that now because they are really struggling on and off
Speaker 3: the field. I mean there was reports in min Australia
Speaker 3: at the start of the year that Catalan's Dragons were
Speaker 3: looking for a buyer in Australia, you know, and I've
Speaker 3: heard some speculation recently that the owner, Bernard Gash, is
Speaker 3: looking to get out, is a bit fed up. And
Speaker 3: he's been there for twenty years. You know, people need
Speaker 3: to remember he's been like the Warriors in New Zealand
Speaker 3: have been one of the success stories that club. You know,
Speaker 3: how it's competed, how it's grown, and you know, we
Speaker 3: need to help the French.
Speaker 2: We need.
Speaker 3: France used to be you know, what was it in
Speaker 3: the seventies or the fifties or both. You know, they
Speaker 3: were one of the top nations in rugby league, you know,
Speaker 3: the Big three. And I don't think we can afford
Speaker 3: to let France with her on the vine. So at
Speaker 3: this point, you know, with the fact that the English
Speaker 3: game is running out of money, it's just a case
Speaker 3: of all right, well, well, you know they seem to
Speaker 3: have fat pockets, we'll take some more money out of
Speaker 3: theirs to distribute amongst ourselves.
Speaker 1: It's really sad that some English clubs turn their nose
Speaker 1: up at the Catalan and to Lose and anybody that's
Speaker 1: London and London to anybody that's not from the M
Speaker 1: sixty two corridor. Yeah, with some smart administration, I'm sure
Speaker 1: they could make plenty of money from to Lose and
Speaker 1: Catalans playing on TV. If if the Australian game can
Speaker 1: make money from Papua New Guinea and from New Zealand
Speaker 1: Warriors being in the competition, that I'm pretty sure the
Speaker 1: English game can do the same with some lateral thought.
Speaker 1: Also in terms of performance, we can we can be
Speaker 1: saying the Catalans are in all sorts right now, but
Speaker 1: they're still in eighth. I'd just like to remind those
Speaker 1: small sided, small minded individuals out there that right now,
Speaker 1: as things stand, the Catalans sit above all f C.
Speaker 1: Bradford Bulls, Cattle For Tigers, York Knights and Huddersfield Giants,
Speaker 1: who all sit in and around or not a million
Speaker 1: miles away from the M sixty two corridor. Indeed, To
Speaker 1: Lose are still above Huddersfield Giants, the birthplace of the game.
Speaker 1: So and I don't even go into the next division
Speaker 1: and have a look at so many of those clubs
Speaker 1: and that have had the benefit of being on rugby
Speaker 1: league's birth doorstep and are managing to mess up their
Speaker 1: administration so much. At their struggling to survive in the
Speaker 1: division below A too so below too so. This whole
Speaker 1: thing knocks me sick. John Catalans in particular have brought
Speaker 1: so much to Super League, so much to the Challenge Cup,
Speaker 1: so much to British rugby league in general. I do
Speaker 1: agree with you that a good France would be very
Speaker 1: good for rugby league in general too. There's there's something
Speaker 1: very attractive about a competition where more than one language
Speaker 1: is spoken, I think from from so many viewpoints and
Speaker 1: if certain people in rugby league can't see that then
Speaker 1: then I feel sorry for them quite frankly. And on
Speaker 1: that note, one of those clubs, Huddersfield are propping everybody
Speaker 1: up in the in the in the Super League table.
Speaker 1: Are they championship club in disguise?
Speaker 3: Well, I mean you watch the game on on Thursday
Speaker 3: and you think that, and you know they're barely getting
Speaker 3: anyone to their games. The team's you know, struggling beyond
Speaker 3: belief in terms of like media profile, publicity, it's almost
Speaker 3: non existent. You know, their new coach who hasn't arrived yet,
Speaker 3: but you know he wasn't assistant the times, but he's
Speaker 3: a Q Cup coach. I'm not sure if you're aware
Speaker 3: of him laying your well.
Speaker 1: And Andy Jagger nineteen seventy seven asked the question to me.
Speaker 1: He said, hope you may be able to give an
Speaker 1: insight and honest assessment of Jim Lenehan and your next
Speaker 1: quod cheers all the best had a bit of a well.
Speaker 1: I don't know that much about him, quite frankly, so
Speaker 1: I did a little bit of research. Basically his coach
Speaker 1: for a long time, right, so, his coach for about
Speaker 1: twenty years. I think it is at levels that we
Speaker 1: can recognize. Burley, I think is his club, and he
Speaker 1: took over from rix Stone in his first incarnation. Rick
Speaker 1: Stone was successful with them, and then he took over
Speaker 1: and they weren't successful anymore. So I was having a
Speaker 1: look at this and thinking oh loo. But then he
Speaker 1: did end up back at Burley some years later and
Speaker 1: won the premiership at least once. So look, there's nothing
Speaker 1: to suggest that you have a dud and there's nothing
Speaker 1: to suggest that you've got the the best coach since
Speaker 1: Jesus was born either, So look, I can't say to
Speaker 1: Huddersfield fans based on what I've heard in my time
Speaker 1: in Australia or not heard, and what have looked at
Speaker 1: and what I'm looking at the levels, I can't sit
Speaker 1: here and say to Huddersfield fans everything's going to be fantastic.
Speaker 1: But he obviously impressed somebody enough in that organization to
Speaker 1: pip some other people. I mean, you broke a story
Speaker 1: a couple of weeks ago that the Cronola resistant was
Speaker 1: in the mix. There could be other factors. John So.
Speaker 1: I was offered a professional job in England ten years
Speaker 1: ago actually now, and everything was great until they told
Speaker 1: me how much was on offer in the contract.
Speaker 3: Well, my good that you mentioned that. My understanding with
Speaker 3: Daniel Holdsworth is that he knocked back the job. Now
Speaker 3: he was offered it, he knocked it back. I don't
Speaker 3: know why I offered it, why.
Speaker 2: He noted back.
Speaker 3: Sorry, I would presume financial reasons, but he was in
Speaker 3: the mix for that job. So I don't think Jim
Speaker 3: Anahan was the first pick. Make of that what you will,
Speaker 3: but look, I wish him all the best. I think
Speaker 3: it's a very difficult job and it's hard to see
Speaker 3: with hardestfield they need. You know, they've got a lot
Speaker 3: of players off contract. They really need to move a
Speaker 3: lot of players on. And I didn't make you know, look,
Speaker 3: we're already in May. You know this, this already players
Speaker 3: off contract for next season. You need to be getting
Speaker 3: deals now. But I think all the other clubs are
Speaker 3: very active. So you know, you look at York and
Speaker 3: Cartleford who are in similar positions, have made some big
Speaker 3: signings or are about to. So yeah, they really need
Speaker 3: to pull their finger out because I think they are
Speaker 3: a championship club in waiting Huddersfield.
Speaker 2: And maybe.
Speaker 3: Maybe going down to the championship could be a good
Speaker 3: thing for them. You know, they've done it before and
Speaker 3: come back. I did interview Tony Smith last week. I
Speaker 3: had a couple of hours chatting with him and that
Speaker 3: was fascinating and he obviously his first senior gig was
Speaker 3: at Hardisfield and he got well, he got them relegated,
Speaker 3: but he took them down and then he took them
Speaker 3: back up.
Speaker 2: But it was.
Speaker 3: Funny that he was telling me a story about he
Speaker 3: flew over for a job interview and he paid his
Speaker 3: own way and he never got that rembursed by the club,
Speaker 3: which I thought was funny, but you could say, look
Speaker 3: at least he showed, he showed how keen he was
Speaker 3: because he paid his own AFO over from Sydney where
Speaker 3: he was assistant coach in Paramatta and he had a
Speaker 3: successful stint at Huddersfield. So we'll see what the future
Speaker 3: brings for the unleashed Giants.
Speaker 1: Where will Brody Croft play next year? He's going to Warrington.
Speaker 2: I think I think it's pretty much done. Yeah, I
Speaker 2: think it's pretty much done.
Speaker 3: It's quite interesting because obviously George Williams is leaving. They
Speaker 3: needed a half replacement. They've got you and Owen there,
Speaker 3: They've got Leon Hayes, they've got Mark Snead, but I
Speaker 3: think they needed a more experienced half and they have
Speaker 3: gone for a big name. When I spoke to officials
Speaker 3: at Warrington a while ago, they denied Brodie Croft as
Speaker 3: then they were talking to him at present and played
Speaker 3: down the look of replacement. But they've been very quiet
Speaker 3: and I think they've got that done. And it's also
Speaker 3: interesting because I think there was some st George of
Speaker 3: a war interest. There was interest from Perth and I
Speaker 3: think Leeds did want to keep him. But it's another
Speaker 3: play leaving Leeds. There are so many players leaving Leeds
Speaker 3: at the end.
Speaker 2: Of this year.
Speaker 3: You really look at the recruitment at Leedsers and you think,
Speaker 3: what the hell are they doing? You know, Harry Newman,
Speaker 3: James McDonald, mclire, Ledski going to Perth, Croft going to Warrington,
Speaker 3: Ryan Hall. I think it's probably likely to retire. You know,
Speaker 3: they also need to pull their fingers out because they're
Speaker 3: losing I think yeah, four or five of their first thirteen,
Speaker 3: which you know, particularly some important positions there.
Speaker 1: Ian Bleede is there isn't he as the director of
Speaker 1: whatever and rugby? To be fair at Salford, I think
Speaker 1: he was an integral part in them getting some cut
Speaker 1: price players and putting the team together to succeed under
Speaker 1: a couple of different coaches. So I would assume they
Speaker 1: have a plan. I don't think it's I don't think
Speaker 1: this is a ship that's got holes in the struggling
Speaker 1: to fill the holes.
Speaker 3: I think, you know, I think in terms of Salford,
Speaker 3: I think the likes of Poor Roley and Paul King
Speaker 3: and Ian Ortson before that had a very big part
Speaker 3: in those signings as well. And if they do have
Speaker 3: a plan, you really have to wonder what it is
Speaker 3: because they let Jacksonfield go, who was a half back
Speaker 3: and obviously son of a cub Ledge and he's been
Speaker 3: killing at Wakefield Men. McCormick is another one, a local
Speaker 3: junior who's going to Wakefield and Cameron Smith is going
Speaker 3: at the end of the year.
Speaker 2: Who's another local junior who.
Speaker 3: Obviously the system the local juniors count less on the cap,
Speaker 3: so it's obviously a benefit to have those local juniors.
Speaker 2: So yeah, it's it's quite weird when you look at Leeds.
Speaker 3: You know a number of their signings that have made
Speaker 3: Mattouiti is on loan playing at holl of Cea. He
Speaker 3: can't get into the Leeds team. Ethan O'Neil they signed
Speaker 3: in the off season, he can't get in the Leeds team.
Speaker 3: He was online at l FC. So we don't know
Speaker 3: what's happened with Brad Arthur either. He could be gone,
Speaker 3: so you kind of look at it. I look at
Speaker 3: it this way for Leeds. I think this year is
Speaker 3: their year if they're going to win something at Old Trafford,
Speaker 3: because I think like next year, I wouldn't say they're
Speaker 3: going to be rebuilding next year. But I don't think
Speaker 3: they're going to be as strong unless they make some
Speaker 3: very very big signings.
Speaker 1: York have made some resignings and they're also after a
Speaker 1: player from the NRL.
Speaker 3: Yes, I broke the story that they'd resigned to Mattafa,
Speaker 3: they full back who's been very very good this season,
Speaker 3: so that's that's a key retention for him. And I've
Speaker 3: also re signed David No Filuma and Cody Hunter No
Speaker 3: for Luma obviously longer at the West Tigers. He was
Speaker 3: horrendous at Salford and then resurfaces that Halifax did well
Speaker 3: and he seems to have, you know, got his ocus back,
Speaker 3: got his head right and he's doing really well at York.
Speaker 3: And the other one another story that I broke was
Speaker 3: Can mckinness. Now apparently talks with Perth for Cam mc
Speaker 3: guinness have broken down, and I think York are with
Speaker 3: a very good chance of signing him, and I think
Speaker 3: that'd be a massive sign. I'm a big fan of
Speaker 3: Cam mcinness as a player. You just look at his
Speaker 3: face and he's someone who who bleeds on the pitch, doesn't.
Speaker 2: He like he He just plays with a lot of heart.
Speaker 3: And passion and I think he's the kind of guy
Speaker 3: you can build a club around. You know, he's a leader,
Speaker 3: he sets the tone for a squad, and yeah, I
Speaker 3: think he'd be a fantastic market for signing for York
Speaker 3: if they can, if they can pull it off for
Speaker 3: you know, a top professional.
Speaker 1: Thirty two years old at present.
Speaker 3: So yeah, I think I still think, you know, if
Speaker 3: you signed him for two years, I think he can
Speaker 3: get good value out of him for two years. He's
Speaker 3: obviously not going to spend five years there, but I
Speaker 3: think in terms of the short term, I think I
Speaker 3: think he could be a really good.
Speaker 1: I'm glad you've mentioned the shorts term because in Master's
Speaker 1: Rugby League you get different color shorts depending on your age,
Speaker 1: and so maybe that needs to be brought in for
Speaker 1: Super League. With all the signings that the Trumpeting of
Speaker 1: London got a new owner on board.
Speaker 2: They've diverted.
Speaker 3: I think some of the ownerships said there's an Andrew
Speaker 3: Gray who is a Brisbane based entrepreneur. I'm not really
Speaker 3: that sure about his background, but effectively they have sort
Speaker 3: of moved around the ownership. I think it's I think
Speaker 3: Gary Heatherington has twenty percent and then the Lockier Grant
Speaker 3: Weshll Consortium has the Romani eighty and then they've sold
Speaker 3: part of that to Andrew Gray, So there's some changes
Speaker 3: in London. They've moved into I think it's London Irish's
Speaker 3: training complex. That's where their women and their reserves are
Speaker 3: going to play. And they've made some highers off the field.
Speaker 3: So yeah, they're geary up. I mean I think the
Speaker 3: key bid is they don't know what division they're going
Speaker 3: to be next year.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and that's a massive thing. I mean, if you
Speaker 1: think about the conversation we've just had about the South
Speaker 1: of France, those those Landingers, you know that you can
Speaker 1: assume that anybody with xenophobic thoughts is going to have
Speaker 1: similar thoughts about those, and particularly if those Londoners have
Speaker 1: some Australians thrown in as well. And depending on how
Speaker 1: conversations went at Magic Round this weekend will depend one
Speaker 1: way or the other in terms of sorry, it will
Speaker 1: influence one way or the other where London had end up.
Speaker 1: I would imagine, and I think when you do look
Speaker 1: at the Super League and you look at the ladder,
Speaker 1: the way things are panning out right now, there's so
Speaker 1: much that makes sense when you consider that somebody in
Speaker 1: Australia looked at the Super League and said we need
Speaker 1: to bring it back down to ten teams because of
Speaker 1: basically the relative strength of everybody from one to eight
Speaker 1: nine and then potentially the strength of London when you
Speaker 1: consider the investment that's taken place as well. So it's
Speaker 1: such a big thing John, and there'll be an element
Speaker 1: of statis I think until Leeds know what Brad Arthur
Speaker 1: is doing, until London know what the NRL are doing,
Speaker 1: and so many players and clubs will be in that
Speaker 1: that static mold. Until such timers they can move forward
Speaker 1: based on these decisions.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think Steve Mascold wrote a story from quite
Speaker 3: adjacent demetri So they've had England internationals reach out to
Speaker 3: them say they want to join the Broncos, the London Broncos.
Speaker 3: But the NRL isn't the only way London could go up.
Speaker 3: Obviously with the iron g criteria, they could replace a
Speaker 3: harders field. I don't know how the schools are exactly
Speaker 3: at the moment, but obviously London are going to go
Speaker 3: up in performance on the field, They're going to go
Speaker 3: up in finances, They're going to go up in the
Speaker 3: fandom area because they've been streaming their games on YouTube
Speaker 3: and they've had an increase in intendances and social.
Speaker 2: Media views and all that sort of stuff.
Speaker 3: So yeah, it's going to be an interesting few months
Speaker 3: with the NRL. Who knows what's going to happen there, Lee, Yeah,
Speaker 3: who knows. We hopefully we'll have some news in the
Speaker 3: next few days, but I think there's no certainty that
Speaker 3: an investment or a partnership is going to be secured. Yeah,
Speaker 3: I wouldn't betting my life on I put it that way.
Speaker 1: Maybe the RFL should hire the Witness general manager as
Speaker 1: this new CEO because he's just left Witness. What's going
Speaker 1: on at Witness? Things are changing?
Speaker 3: Yes, I believe a bit of an exclusive. I believe
Speaker 3: Tim Holmes will be leaving the Witness Vikings.
Speaker 1: I think they managed to coach him.
Speaker 2: There you go.
Speaker 3: It's a small world Rugby leasion. I think I think
Speaker 3: they're going to announce it this week Witness. I have
Speaker 3: been chasing Damn for comment. But yeah, there's a few
Speaker 3: changes off the field. What are the directors? Andy harribin
Speaker 3: Or I probably pronounced his name correctly, apologies.
Speaker 2: He departed a while ago.
Speaker 3: And yeah, I think I think there's some some off
Speaker 3: field things going on at Witness. I think there is
Speaker 3: some speculation they'll be coming back there spending next season.
Speaker 3: They're players spending and obviously, look, it's hard times in
Speaker 3: the Championship, isn't it. We've talked a lot about the
Speaker 3: Championship in this podcast, you know, Featherston, Salford, Halifax, North Wales.
Speaker 3: You can just go on and on. So the Championship
Speaker 3: this season is a very weird and odd. Division teams
Speaker 3: don't play each other same amount of times. They sometimes
Speaker 3: they don't play for a month. I just there was
Speaker 3: a press release out just about the eighteen ninety five Cup,
Speaker 3: the semi finals, and I think the finals on a
Speaker 3: Monday night. I don't know if that's the type on
Speaker 3: the press release, but I'm sure they said that the
Speaker 3: final is gonna be on the thirty always on a
Speaker 3: Monday night, So maybe Monday dot Fuddy is back.
Speaker 2: Maybe that's the.
Speaker 1: Maybe they'll play it in black and white.
Speaker 2: Two.
Speaker 1: Is the game in a complete state of flux or
Speaker 1: what is it? Is it a pivotal point because wherever
Speaker 1: you look at the game, be it the Championship, be
Speaker 1: it the lower echelons of Super League, be it the
Speaker 1: NRL involvement, and the other one I want to bring
Speaker 1: in is the England side. I mean, it's such a
Speaker 1: pivotal year for England as a as a nation in
Speaker 1: rugby league. We've had the demise of Wales, Scotland and
Speaker 1: Ireland over the last two decades and you quite frankly,
Speaker 1: it looks like England have slipped off a pedestal or
Speaker 1: two as well. So now they have a new coach
Speaker 1: in Brian McDermott, who's only been appointed for this tournament essentially,
Speaker 1: and already he's probably lost the half back George Williams.
Speaker 1: Is nothing to suggest that he would have picked him.
Speaker 1: And also a staff member who's been on board for
Speaker 1: a long time has been moved on too, told us
Speaker 1: about that, yeah.
Speaker 3: I mean, and he's made a lot of changes to
Speaker 3: the back room staff. Chris Barron, the head of performance
Speaker 3: has gone he works at Wigan. Then the analyst there
Speaker 3: a Wigan whose name escapes me, he's also left.
Speaker 2: And there has been reports that.
Speaker 3: Oh, Paul Wellens and I'm trying to think who was
Speaker 3: the other coach was Shaw and Lacklan But yeah, basically
Speaker 3: Brian mcdervert's come in. He's kind of what the slate
Speaker 3: clean with the England set up. A lot of those
Speaker 3: people had been there for fourteen years or you know,
Speaker 3: at least at least the Sean Wayne area, if not
Speaker 3: before that, so he wants to clean slate.
Speaker 2: Brian McDermott, he did.
Speaker 3: He did actually say in his first press so that
Speaker 3: George Williams was going to be his captain. So you know,
Speaker 3: my understanding is that George is very, very unlikely to
Speaker 3: play in the World Cup. He not had his surgery
Speaker 3: yet and it's very major surgery, could be a five
Speaker 3: six month recovery, so you know that I think that's
Speaker 3: a blow.
Speaker 2: For England.
Speaker 3: You know, I think Maddie Lee's I can't remember if
Speaker 3: made Le's has been ruled out for the World Cup
Speaker 3: or not, but obviously picked up that serious injury against
Speaker 3: Wigan and the Challenge Cup semi final lot last weekend.
Speaker 3: So England's not in fairness and we saw this last
Speaker 3: year with Maddy Ashton and a few others Victor Bradley.
Speaker 3: England's not strong enough to be able to go into
Speaker 3: a World Cup or an ashes missing a couple of
Speaker 3: top twenty.
Speaker 1: Players, let's go through the side. David Ray. David Wright
Speaker 1: wrote to me on.
Speaker 2: My room David Wae is he coaching?
Speaker 1: Bring David Right what wrote to me on my Rugby
Speaker 1: League coach Socials, which is at Rugby lea coach by
Speaker 1: the way, and he said, this is a question for
Speaker 1: your three hundred and sixty podcast. If you were three
Speaker 1: sixty potters, sorry, if you were the England coach, what
Speaker 1: would your seventeen be for the end of the year.
Speaker 1: So I quickly looked at the last team that England
Speaker 1: put out, So we're going to literally go through it.
Speaker 1: John aj Brimson was the fallback? Is the fallback better
Speaker 1: than aj Brimson that we can put there based on
Speaker 1: what you've seen? Not in kind former you? No, the
Speaker 1: wings were Joe Burgess and Tom Johnston. Joe Burgess will
Speaker 1: be about forty two, won't bother it'll be And.
Speaker 2: If you're picking now, mine would be Dom Young and
Speaker 2: Mary Ashton. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Well Dom Young was in the side. I think did
Speaker 1: we get injured for that week?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 1: So Dom Young, Matty Ashton, Herbie and Harry Newman were
Speaker 1: the centers. I mean Herbie, yes, who else? Because Harry
Speaker 1: Euman's not being parried playing much.
Speaker 3: Newman couldn't get in the Leeds team until this weekend
Speaker 3: and has not been playing particularly well, so I'd probably
Speaker 3: had Jake Wardle in of herring him.
Speaker 1: The halves were George Williams and Harry Smith, so I
Speaker 1: definitely would like Jake Connor based on current form, and
Speaker 1: Marky Lewis. Okay, mikey Lewis was on the bench. Props
Speaker 1: were Mike mckeekon Matty Lees and on the bench was
Speaker 1: Alex Walmsley, Morgan Smith's and mikol Ageletski, so I'd say
Speaker 1: that's five middles. I don't know if I don't know
Speaker 1: if the modern game and the way it's been refereed
Speaker 1: in Australia which you soon will translate to the World Cup,
Speaker 1: I don't know if you need three props.
Speaker 3: Quite frankly, yeah, I think I think Luke Thompson definitely
Speaker 3: deserves to be in there. I think if you're putting
Speaker 3: Victor Radley at thirty and you'd have Morgan Knoles in there,
Speaker 3: obviously complain middle. I think Morgan Smithy's would definitely be
Speaker 3: in there, might be nickin I think did a good job,
Speaker 3: probably not been as informed as he was last year,
Speaker 3: but I still think he's probably a good good shout
Speaker 3: for the twenty four minutes. But in terms of other props,
Speaker 3: I think probably Alex Warmsley. No Aledski's an interesting one. Yeah,
Speaker 3: I think, yeah, I'm just trying. I think who else
Speaker 3: has been, you know, whether you're looking at Nathan Havard
Speaker 3: or who else is out there, But I think Luke
Speaker 3: Thompson is the big one who missed the Ashes who
Speaker 3: were definitely being being my team anyway.
Speaker 1: Jez Liton started at nine, but I'll be honest, from
Speaker 1: a coaching perspective, he is a real liability in the
Speaker 1: defensive line early when there is a bit of rugby
Speaker 1: league for ten minutes before the game starts going sideways.
Speaker 1: So what hooker can we have that's a bit more
Speaker 1: solid defensively for at least the first fifteen minutes or
Speaker 1: so before Jess Liton comes on. Because I would definitely
Speaker 1: have Jess Litton in that seventeen I think.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think, I think on form at the moment,
Speaker 3: you'd be picking brand o'neils just starting nine and then
Speaker 3: bringing jes.
Speaker 2: Just Litton on for the either.
Speaker 1: The last thirty or the last twenty back role Callum Watkins,
Speaker 1: who again I mean he's not young anymore. Kaipe Is
Speaker 1: Paul I think would be a lock in the side,
Speaker 1: and Morgan Knowles was the lock the loose forward. So
Speaker 1: what would you do differently.
Speaker 3: There, Junior Incember, It definitely has to be in the
Speaker 3: seventeen I personally he didn't have a great year last year,
Speaker 3: but he's a phenomenal athlete and he's been in outrageously
Speaker 3: good form this year and he's the point of difference.
Speaker 2: You look at the pure.
Speaker 3: Size of him, the speed, the strength, you know he's
Speaker 3: he brings an X factor and I'd have him in
Speaker 3: my team.
Speaker 1: So look, in terms of talent, I don't get too
Speaker 1: excited by what we've just read out, okay, but also
Speaker 1: I also don't think the Australian side is anywhere as
Speaker 1: near as strong as we made it look in England
Speaker 1: last year. There's so many weaknesses in that side. And
Speaker 1: I said this when we're doing the Ashes Rugby League podcast,
Speaker 1: when we did the clips, I got battered for this
Speaker 1: in my home country where I live right now, and
Speaker 1: it all a lot of how we approach things as
Speaker 1: an English nation is about where what kind of pedestal.
Speaker 1: We put our opponents on and I think there's so
Speaker 1: many weaknesses there that we can exploit. From the Australian perspective,
Speaker 1: the problem we have now is that in the World
Speaker 1: Cup we might have to play everybody else but Australia
Speaker 1: just to get to Australia and Samoa are going to
Speaker 1: look strong. Tonga will be strong as well, and I
Speaker 1: think I am excited in the sense that brand new coach,
Speaker 1: brand new eyes, but I don't know if Brian McDermott
Speaker 1: is the coach to do this. They need to play
Speaker 1: more football, they need to chance their arm. They can
Speaker 1: try and go into a grind. He has said that.
Speaker 1: He said that in his first press so that that's
Speaker 1: you know he you know, he used the clitchkow Tyson
Speaker 1: Fury energy and you know you don't you don't stand
Speaker 1: toe to toe with Clichko, which is obviously not what.
Speaker 3: Fury did and Fury Clicho. So yeah, I think he
Speaker 3: understands that. On the Kangaroos, I think, as you know Lee,
Speaker 3: he wasn't the strongest Kangaroo's team for the Ashes. But
Speaker 3: the fact that the World Cups in Australia and you
Speaker 3: get this with the Tongue and the Simon teams that
Speaker 3: came out to England in the last couple of years.
Speaker 3: It will be a stronger austraining team. You'll get the
Speaker 3: Tron Mitchell, You'll get Tommy Turbo. There'll be other players
Speaker 3: who didn't come or decided to have surgery and they'll
Speaker 3: put that off because it's the home World Cup. So
Speaker 3: I think the Kangaroo team will be a better team
Speaker 3: come October than what we saw last October.
Speaker 1: Absolutely, and New Zealand, who were fantastic last.
Speaker 3: Yes, well New Zealand if you look at some of
Speaker 3: their players who are in form, you know, Dylan Brown
Speaker 3: for Dylan Brown for example, Canum Ponger is gonna play
Speaker 3: for New Zealand, so you know that's a big win
Speaker 3: for them. Yeah, I think I think the Kiwis will
Speaker 3: be strong. Tonga will be Yeah, look at you look
Speaker 3: at Kohla and On Kauwatu, just two of their players,
Speaker 3: Adam fanil Blake. Yeah, I think I think Tonga and
Speaker 3: then Samala they're probably gonna have a few more, are they.
Speaker 3: Isn't Tino likely to to defect obviously? The Hammer you know, Yeah,
Speaker 3: it's I'm really could afford the World Cup obviously, find
Speaker 3: down there and go to a few games. But yeah,
Speaker 3: it isn't going to be easy for for England. I
Speaker 3: don't think.
Speaker 1: It's a real pivotal the year for them in that regard.
Speaker 1: I mean last year was pivotal, and every year that
Speaker 1: they don't do something is going to you know, it's
Speaker 1: going to have that pe word attached to it.
Speaker 3: That's the point I was going to make when you
Speaker 3: said about being pivot on crossroads. I don't really want
Speaker 3: to say that because I probably say it too regularly
Speaker 3: and nothing happens. But you do eventually come that think
Speaker 3: they'll bill be a breaking point at some point, or
Speaker 3: maybe there's just lots of little breaking points and not
Speaker 3: a big not a big one.
Speaker 2: But yeah, I don't disagree with this sentiment.
Speaker 1: Rich early Bird wrote us a message which is linked
Speaker 1: to this too, which was about academy teams. So he asked,
Speaker 1: or he said, I believe all Super leagueams should have
Speaker 1: an academy. If the lads in the academy don't have
Speaker 1: a match, then they should be able to play for
Speaker 1: their community club. Sixteen to nineteen year olds will only
Speaker 1: developed by playing too many academy lads play too few games.
Speaker 1: A licensing of a handful of academies is making the
Speaker 1: player pool smaller. To know Lee's opinion on this, For instance,
Speaker 1: York have no sides officially outside of first team. This
Speaker 1: cannot be the case from twenty to twenty seven lads
Speaker 1: in hull It academies are playing just a handful of games.
Speaker 1: It can't be good for development. So I will answer
Speaker 1: that John Rich one hundred percent. Look, England are as
Speaker 1: good at rugby league as Australia and Australia's offshoots such
Speaker 1: as Samoa and Tonga and New Zealand. The only way
Speaker 1: they're going to get better at rugby league is by
Speaker 1: playing more rugby league. So Rich, you're absolutely right. Now
Speaker 1: I don't know the details of why some academies exist
Speaker 1: and why some academies don't exist, and John will be
Speaker 1: able to furnish us with some of that, I'm sure soon.
Speaker 1: But when I look at all the problems that exist
Speaker 1: in English rugby league right now, a lot of them
Speaker 1: cause by not having much money. One of the cheapest
Speaker 1: ways to get better rugby league teams is develop develop
Speaker 1: your own and in theory, in some sports, you can
Speaker 1: make money because they get sold to others. We don't
Speaker 1: have that system in rugby league, but occasionally there is
Speaker 1: compensation if contracts are broken, so there needs to be again.
Speaker 1: I mean, we keep talking about pivotal moments and crucial
Speaker 1: points in rugby league's world in England, this is another
Speaker 1: one where do we want what do we want to
Speaker 1: do with our juniors? What's the goal what we're trying
Speaker 1: to achieve? Was that mainly well it wasn't to anybody
Speaker 1: else my room.
Speaker 3: Yeah, well look I think ideally what the goal should
Speaker 3: be is to win a World Cup, to win an ASHES.
Speaker 3: But to answer this in a roundabout way, I disagree
Speaker 3: a little bit slightly because the academy is very controversial,
Speaker 3: But I think the fact is in the RFL tried
Speaker 3: to change this while ago. When they didn't I remember
Speaker 3: correctly it was Sulford Cass might have been whole Car
Speaker 3: as well. They didn't give the licenses. There was a
Speaker 3: big outcry and then they backpeddled and said, yeah you
Speaker 3: can have a license. But the problem is the player
Speaker 3: pool at the amateur level and the participation is not there.
Speaker 3: Now we all know participation has dropped off massively. The
Speaker 3: overall figures are being what's.
Speaker 2: The word.
Speaker 1: Maniated.
Speaker 3: Yeah, well they made to look better because there's a
Speaker 3: lot more girls playing rugby league, which is great, But
Speaker 3: in terms of boys, the drop off particularly I think
Speaker 3: around thirteen four and fifteen is massive and a lot
Speaker 3: of clubs, amateur clubs have actually gone. Now you can
Speaker 3: talk about York and you say, well, how many amateur
Speaker 3: clubs are in the York area are There's not many.
Speaker 3: I think there's maybe half a dozen. I don't know
Speaker 3: exactly numbers. I know in an area like Hole, a
Speaker 3: lot of the amateur clubs have gone, and that's one
Speaker 3: of the reasons why Hole and FC and k I
Speaker 3: had to join academy for a while. So we actually
Speaker 3: need to go a step below the academy and actually
Speaker 3: try and get kids playing generally, which increases the player pool.
Speaker 3: So there actually are more talented kids getting into that
Speaker 3: academy stage. But I would agree with Rich in the
Speaker 3: sense of they don't play enough games and the reserves
Speaker 3: don't So this is where the feeder system when it
Speaker 3: comes to the championship clubs.
Speaker 2: This is where that needs to happen. So if you.
Speaker 3: Use the example what's a good example York and Newcastle.
Speaker 3: We'll use that one because effectively, are you know, if
Speaker 3: you're in that York squad or you're a young player
Speaker 3: and you're not playing Super League, you go out and
Speaker 3: play Championship at Newcastle because that's a much better stand,
Speaker 3: a tougher environment than reserves football. And the gap there
Speaker 3: isn't really a great stepping stone from under nineteen's academy
Speaker 3: football and two super League into first team. So that's
Speaker 3: kind of another gap that we've not really bridged. But
Speaker 3: we don't have enough players to go around. This is
Speaker 3: say things.
Speaker 1: So to that point, that was the first thing you
Speaker 1: went to. You said, not all can have academies because
Speaker 1: there's not enough community clubs and enough players. One of
Speaker 1: the key one of the key, Yeah, I did say,
Speaker 1: it wasn't John. What I'm saying is, though participation improves
Speaker 1: if there's a pathway. Yes, So it's chicken and egg, Okay.
Speaker 2: It is it is. That's true.
Speaker 1: So kids that are talented at sport will literally decide
Speaker 1: at a certain age thirteen, fourteen, fifteen, which directions are going.
Speaker 1: So if you happen to be good at rugby league,
Speaker 1: happen to be good at rugby union, happen to be
Speaker 1: good at soccer, and happen to be good at cricket,
Speaker 1: which many people are because they're good at sport. In
Speaker 1: terms of pathway, there's a clear fourth out of all that.
Speaker 1: So there's a chicken and an egg element. Okay, so
Speaker 1: you've heard the phrase build it and they will come.
Speaker 1: They're all linked. So participation is not exclusive from performance.
Speaker 1: In terms of the bigger pool you have in participation,
Speaker 1: the more chance more cream will come to the top.
Speaker 1: But it also goes the other way too. Those people
Speaker 1: who are participating need somewhere to go or else I'll
Speaker 1: just drift off. So it's all part of the same thing.
Speaker 1: So he's not wrong. But there are reasons, and it's
Speaker 1: happened because all you did was listen of reasons why
Speaker 1: it's happened, you know. But they're all if you have
Speaker 1: a looked back. So whoever the new CEO is and
Speaker 1: whoever takes over the game or doesn't take over the game,
Speaker 1: need to look at the whole thing because they're absolutely linked.
Speaker 1: It's participation and performance are literally part of the There
Speaker 1: are almost two cheeks of the same backside because everyone
Speaker 1: starts as a participant and they eventually become a performer
Speaker 1: or don't become a performer. So it's everywhere you look,
Speaker 1: there's an issue, John.
Speaker 3: And the other element to that I just added is visibility,
Speaker 3: isn't it, Lee, Because you're right, everyone starts a participant,
Speaker 3: but most people start as a participant because they're inspired,
Speaker 3: or they see on TV, or they read about in
Speaker 3: the paper, or their dad takes into a game and
Speaker 3: they say, I mean for me, it was I don't know,
Speaker 3: Cliffey Lyons. I'm trying to think other players in the
Speaker 3: late eighties, early nineties, you know it was you go
Speaker 3: out and I think that a lot of the modern
Speaker 3: generation might have been Benji Marshall. You know, they saw
Speaker 3: him playing, you know, and you want to go out
Speaker 3: and try and be Benji Marshall or Sean Johnson or whoever.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 3: Calen Pong are probably now Reese Walsh now like. But
Speaker 3: the fact in England is the players aren't big stars.
Speaker 3: They're not seen everywhere, they're not read about, they're they're
Speaker 3: kind of operating in a bubble. Unless you're in the
Speaker 3: rugby league bubble. You're not really that inspired, are you.
Speaker 3: So that's that's a big problem the top level.
Speaker 2: That I know. This.
Speaker 3: Back when I was a kid, you know, Michael Jordan
Speaker 3: was the biggest star in the world, and you know
Speaker 3: I used to play basket or whatever. I wanted to
Speaker 3: be like Michael Jordan's, you know, the whole Gatorade campaign,
Speaker 3: like Mike. I'd like to be like Mike, you know.
Speaker 3: So you've got to be You've got to be seen,
Speaker 3: and you've got to be out there. And that's that's
Speaker 3: why people want to go and play football, because the
Speaker 3: football is the premier league. Players are stars and they
Speaker 3: also get paid a ship ton of money.
Speaker 1: When I was a kid, first of all, I thought
Speaker 1: I wanted to be goalkeeper for Manchester City in England,
Speaker 1: and I played soccer for a few years and then
Speaker 1: all of a sudden, by accident, by actions of the universe,
Speaker 1: I ended up playing some rugby league. And one of
Speaker 1: the things that made me decide I'm going to play
Speaker 1: rugby league rather than football soccer was our schoolboy final.
Speaker 1: So when we played all the schools in Suffold, our
Speaker 1: final was played at the Willows and I looked at
Speaker 1: the soccer, I played the football and I played in
Speaker 1: the finals in that too. They weren't played at main
Speaker 1: Road or Old Trafford, and I thought, I know which
Speaker 1: sport I'm going to get more reward out of. And
Speaker 1: this is what I mean about the reward and the
Speaker 1: pathway and that's literally what determined or basically swung it
Speaker 1: that way, put it that way and the other. It
Speaker 1: was better at rugby league than I wasn't goal. So yeah,
Speaker 1: So review of games from last round Bradford today where
Speaker 1: you are beat All left C sixteen fourteen. Bradford's tries
Speaker 1: came from Blake Ryan and four goals from Atkin. All
Speaker 1: left C scored with Bachelor, the other Litton and three
Speaker 1: goals from Hardacre. So Bradford hadn't won for five matches.
Speaker 1: All Left C were down to twelve and there were
Speaker 1: no tries in the first forty minutes. Tell us about that. Yeah, Look,
Speaker 1: it wasn't a great game. There was some real basic
Speaker 1: It felt at one point people couldn't catch pass. There
Speaker 1: were some real basic errors and it was in terms
Speaker 1: of the touch footy you were talking about earlier.
Speaker 2: Was the entertain because it was a bit of a
Speaker 2: slag fest.
Speaker 3: It was very defensive orientated, but there was a few
Speaker 3: moments of brilliance. Ethan Ryan's try in the corner were sensational,
Speaker 3: and Hollo came back and almost snuck it with twelve men,
Speaker 3: but yeah, used of fading. Basically red misted got red card.
Speaker 3: That was a you know, a brain explosion from him
Speaker 3: and you know went down accordingly. So yeah, an important,
Speaker 3: important win for for Bradford. But it was not a
Speaker 3: high quality game. Shall we say, did.
Speaker 1: The crowd react accordingly?
Speaker 2: Was it?
Speaker 1: Was it big crowd? Was it?
Speaker 2: I didn't see the number.
Speaker 3: I looked, it looked a decent credit odds or the
Speaker 3: sun was out which always helps. Yeah, it was obviously
Speaker 3: the only the only Sunday game. But yeah for Bradford,
Speaker 3: I think, as you said that that won for a
Speaker 3: while important two points and they you know, they shod
Speaker 3: a lot of fight and a lot of ticker Bradford,
Speaker 3: so credit to them for that. They did grind out
Speaker 3: the result. But when they had twenty or fifteen minutes, however,
Speaker 3: it was with an extra main you really, you know,
Speaker 3: you back them to get the win.
Speaker 2: There with an extra man for such a long period.
Speaker 1: Whole KR scored twenty at Lee. Lee only returned with
Speaker 1: sixteen points a bit of a comeback in the second half.
Speaker 1: Lee tries to Alec Layinki, Charlie and Hughes for Lee
Speaker 1: goals too, for Cook tries to whole kr from Hicku,
Speaker 1: Davis and Morgue and four goals from Martin. It says,
Speaker 1: I've got some words here from the BBC website, incredible
Speaker 1: second half comeback and then I've looked at the scores
Speaker 1: and I'm thinking it was only twelve points.
Speaker 3: Hell, yeah it was. It was an exciting end. Lee
Speaker 3: were what twenty to six down and fought back and
Speaker 3: almost almost stole at the end, and Cook with a
Speaker 3: knock on which you know, very late on proved proved influential.
Speaker 2: But I think it a bit of story, bit of
Speaker 2: stupidity from Michael Lewis.
Speaker 3: You know, got sim mind right on half time for
Speaker 3: you know, basically Lang all over in the tackle trying
Speaker 3: to slow down the opposition and I think he had
Speaker 3: another trip as well, So you know, I think Michael
Speaker 3: Lewis he really needs to get that stuff out of
Speaker 3: his game.
Speaker 2: I think it proved quite costly.
Speaker 3: Four whole cards didn't cost them the two points in
Speaker 3: the end, but yeah, I think it showed. It showed
Speaker 3: that Lee Are, you know, starting to hit some form
Speaker 3: and come back strong. I think they are a good
Speaker 3: chance to make the six I think you named well
Speaker 3: the table was earlier and I think they're sitting seventh.
Speaker 3: I don't really see anyone else apart from the sixth
Speaker 3: chasing that. I don't think cant Land unless a massive
Speaker 3: turn around there. But I think Leah, you know, showing
Speaker 3: their worth even though they didn't get a win.
Speaker 1: Nicola Frodsham wrote towards and said, how does Mikey Lewis
Speaker 1: get away with tripping? It's happened a couple of times
Speaker 1: now and nothing has been done. Nicola, if the Rugby
Speaker 1: Football League knew rugby league and knew how to run
Speaker 1: a game, they would be writing to whole ky are
Speaker 1: if there's a pattern and saying we are aware that
Speaker 1: one of your players regularly trips and giving them some
Speaker 1: laws in which they need to refer to next time
Speaker 1: he gets excited and trips someone. But it's pretty simple
Speaker 1: if you ask me so. And again it comes down
Speaker 1: to focus and maybe resource as well. But care I
Speaker 1: mean Mikey Lewis, Look, there are so many limitations in
Speaker 1: his game actually, and this is one of them, and
Speaker 1: I'd expect better from somebody that we're thinking of being
Speaker 1: one of the halves in the England side. I'd expect
Speaker 1: an awful lot better. Quite frankly, to lose actually had
Speaker 1: a better come back than whole k Are. They were
Speaker 1: eighteen nil down at halftime, but the game ended to
Speaker 1: lose sixteen Warrington twenty four tries to lose were just
Speaker 1: arm ashall Bolt scored too, he scores every week and
Speaker 1: good on him. And Rouge kicked two Warrington They're twenty four.
Speaker 1: Two came from Kings, one from Smith, one from Wood
Speaker 1: and four goals from Snaide. What was this game like, John, Yeah,
Speaker 1: it was.
Speaker 3: It was similar one to go an eighteen year lap,
Speaker 3: sorry twenty four near lap and then you think the
Speaker 3: game's over and then to lose come roaring back to
Speaker 3: do A few times this season said come alive when
Speaker 3: the game's effectively over and Mark they've got Simmini which
Speaker 3: obviously played in their hands, but you know they left
Speaker 3: themselves too much to do and didn't get a win.
Speaker 3: And I think for Warrington, after the disappointing challenge Cap
Speaker 3: Semi four legsit important for them to bounce back with
Speaker 3: the two points.
Speaker 1: What happens when players are knackered because they're playing too
Speaker 1: much and not fully conditioned or as they should be.
Speaker 1: What happens is they start to pick and choose what
Speaker 1: they do within games and within rounds in the competition.
Speaker 1: And basically what a lot of that can be put
Speaker 1: down to is teams like Warrington and others will go
Speaker 1: to to lose or play against to lose, go off
Speaker 1: red hot, start easily get over the top of them,
Speaker 1: and then they'll just ease off the gas subconsciously because
Speaker 1: they won't save a bit of energy to lose and
Speaker 1: realize they probably deserve to be on this field against
Speaker 1: against the likes of Warrington, and then and they come
Speaker 1: back at them. And because our game is a physical sport,
Speaker 1: a lot of it comes down to players' moods and
Speaker 1: mentality and if you are one or two percent off,
Speaker 1: then things can switch quite considerably. That said, I mean,
Speaker 1: we talked about Catalan's Wolves, we talked about Huddersfield's Wolves
Speaker 1: to lose. How far off that either are they really? Now?
Speaker 3: No, I don't I don't think so. Look, I think
Speaker 3: you know they need a more squad depth to lose.
Speaker 3: They need more players who've played in Super League regularly
Speaker 3: and you know, experienced the division. But you know, I
Speaker 3: think they are a well coached side and they're definitely
Speaker 3: you know, they're definitely competing. There's definitely effort there and yeah,
Speaker 3: just quite often it's not enough.
Speaker 1: Wigan twenty four leads four. The manner of the victory,
Speaker 1: the size of the victure was a bit of a shock. Actually.
Speaker 1: Tries to Wigan who was sixteen aer up at half
Speaker 1: time from Faramunt Kieran. He scores every week to the
Speaker 1: lad good on him, Hodkinson and wardle and four goals
Speaker 1: from Kieran as you're still flying out the line and
Speaker 1: killing people John and Leeds. Leeds only try came from Seavol. Surprise, surprise.
Speaker 1: Tell us about that game, mate, Yeah, I.
Speaker 3: Mean I was at Wakefield which was on at the
Speaker 3: same time, so I've only seen the bit of the replay,
Speaker 3: a bit of the highlights, but yeah, fantastic weigand performance
Speaker 3: went up sixteen zerol really you know, strong defensively. I
Speaker 3: think the highlight for me was Jack Farraman's hit on Michaelsivo.
Speaker 3: You know, all of seventy five kg's of Jack farra
Speaker 3: Man and I think c is about one hundred and ten.
Speaker 1: But yeah, Civo opened his body up. When you do that,
Speaker 1: if you open your body up and try and get
Speaker 1: past someone and you're not quick enough to get past them,
Speaker 1: and Faraman came in at exactly the right time. I
Speaker 1: saw that on Instagram and yeah it was good.
Speaker 3: But no, I think it's just you know, Wigan, you know,
Speaker 3: they seem to have really turned a corner obviously the
Speaker 3: last fortnite. They're very motivated, they're pumped up. You know,
Speaker 3: they've got a good blend of players and leads. Yeah,
Speaker 3: disappointing from them. I know they did have a try disallowed,
Speaker 3: which is probably a little bit harsh, but yeah, a
Speaker 3: bit of a lesson. I thought this was a really
Speaker 3: good chance for Leeds two. You know, they've beaten Warrington,
Speaker 3: the Beans and Helens have beaten Whole car Flank, Holk
Speaker 3: and Las Vegas. Wigan was probably the last challenge, you know,
Speaker 3: show the title credentials. But it was a bit of
Speaker 3: a well, it was a disappointing evening for him.
Speaker 1: So full credit to the Warriors York eighteen Castle for
Speaker 1: twenty four. York will be upset with this because they
Speaker 1: were eighteen twelve ahead at half time. Tries to them
Speaker 1: from Vinnie ya Yawa Vinie. How do you say that, John, Vinnie?
Speaker 1: I count sat now Vinnie Yeah yahwa really yeah? The
Speaker 1: King Wood Galiano and three goals from Hunter Castleford tries
Speaker 1: from Hurst Karaka, how do I say that? And a
Speaker 1: Tony and Grecianna attorney any no? Carry carry?
Speaker 3: Oh?
Speaker 1: That's Gary Gary, isn't it Gary Gary? Right? And Greason
Speaker 1: g C. What's his name?
Speaker 2: He's Gary Gary? No?
Speaker 1: I know that? What about Greasin?
Speaker 2: Uh?
Speaker 1: I'm not say that, mate, right? Mate? Everyone deserves now.
Speaker 2: I can't really I can't see what you're reading though.
Speaker 1: Just try listening to it. We've scored kicked four goals
Speaker 1: Chopsy Turvy game by the look of this, and apparently
Speaker 1: it was the first ever Super League game between the
Speaker 1: two clubs.
Speaker 2: Yes, very tight game, I'd say, you know.
Speaker 3: Defense was on top of your head, aiding twelve at
Speaker 3: half time and Casts just came out a really strong
Speaker 3: second half. You have a man simbing for a high shot,
Speaker 3: but to crash over tries late for Casts, you just
Speaker 3: basically crash balls bang over the line and they closed
Speaker 3: out the game really well.
Speaker 2: Cass.
Speaker 3: I thought just thered, the allowance, speed, they kicked, they
Speaker 3: tackled hard. They really frustrated York who you know, just
Speaker 3: couldn't open them up at the end. And I think
Speaker 3: Asia Nazi was very good in the halves for the target.
Speaker 3: So yeah, a very influential two points for Cast. Obviously,
Speaker 3: wins have been rare in this season.
Speaker 1: Castleford, sorry, Catalans fell off a cliff in the second half.
Speaker 1: It was ten all the half time. Wakefield scored fifty eight,
Speaker 1: so forty eight of them came in the second half.
Speaker 1: Tries to handle a new la. Tate scored two, far
Speaker 1: Tilly scored a hat trick. It was a prop scoring
Speaker 1: a hat trick in seventeen mins off the bench. Off
Speaker 1: the bench. Pitt scored one, Meyers scored one, Tavanger, Pratt
Speaker 1: and Truman. Seven goals from Lino so there, that was
Speaker 1: fifty eight for them. Catalan scored ten and tries from
Speaker 1: Stains and Sexton and sext and kicked the goal.
Speaker 2: Go on.
Speaker 1: We've we've talked a lot about Catalans overall, but like,
Speaker 1: what did you see in this game?
Speaker 2: It was bizarre. I'll be honest with you.
Speaker 3: This first time I've been at Waker this season and
Speaker 3: it's a great stadium now, a great atmosphere, you know,
Speaker 3: eight and a half thousand.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you're right there.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I just I just clicked on a rugby league
Speaker 1: thing and yeah, music. I didn't think it enough music.
Speaker 2: But Wakefield, Wakefield started Paula.
Speaker 3: They would tend it all down for tape was just
Speaker 3: running over people and you thought, okay, this is going
Speaker 3: to be a tough night for the Trinity.
Speaker 2: And then they called back to tries.
Speaker 3: It was ten and a half times, they delicately poised
Speaker 3: and then Catalans just went to I mean, the just imploded.
Speaker 3: It was utterly bizarre, just a remarkable game. I mean,
Speaker 3: Wakefield played some lovely, lovely stuff in the second half.
Speaker 3: They get me wrong, but it was just try, try, try, try,
Speaker 3: try try. I think nine tries in forty minutes so
Speaker 3: for till he came off the bench to score a
Speaker 3: hat trick. I can't remember a prop ever scoring a
Speaker 3: hat trick and I think it was in seventeen minutes.
Speaker 1: There's quite obviously a fitness issue there because of catalan
Speaker 1: because there's a few games where they've fallen off that
Speaker 1: that same cliff in the second half.
Speaker 3: Well, I mean I've wrote I've written about it in
Speaker 3: that opinion piece that I've published today. Ryan Sherrian was
Speaker 3: he called it embarrassing. He was basically scathing, saying we
Speaker 3: need players. You know, we've got players who aren't ap
Speaker 3: to scratch here. We don't have the depths, et cetera,
Speaker 3: et cetera. Nowt you know, I think there are real
Speaker 3: issues of the dragons which I wrote about.
Speaker 2: But yeah, it was. It was very, very poor.
Speaker 3: I mean, forty eight points in forty minutes to conceee
Speaker 3: that defensively. If you talk about touch footy, I mean
Speaker 3: that they should touch footy.
Speaker 2: It was. It was very weak.
Speaker 3: They effectively waived the white flag Catland. So yeah, they're
Speaker 3: they're in crisis, I.
Speaker 1: Would say, in a similar thing to what I just
Speaker 1: said about to lose. Huddersfield was twenty four mil down
Speaker 1: to Huddersfield at halftime. The game ended Huddersfield eighteen. Saint
Speaker 1: Helen's twenty six. Huddersfield's tries came from O'Donnell Swift and
Speaker 1: Evils three goals to Russell. Saint Helen's twenty six came
Speaker 1: from Robinson Murphy Dagnall Delaney and five goals to Hastings.
Speaker 1: So I think there's a pattern. The bigger teams are
Speaker 1: racking up the points and then just taking the kid
Speaker 1: off the rack. Quite frankly, I've seen it a thousand
Speaker 1: times before looking at those results. That's what's happening too.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean that that was a poor game on
Speaker 3: first time. I mean that was one of those games
Speaker 3: where you're kind of like, oh, hope this isn't being
Speaker 3: televised because people won't want to watch it. And there
Speaker 3: was people commenting on my Facebook that then it off
Speaker 3: and watched the darts.
Speaker 2: Now.
Speaker 3: I think darts is completely boring, so I don't know
Speaker 3: anyone would want to watch.
Speaker 1: The We didn't do after the hurtel last week because
Speaker 1: of my business, but one of the reasons was I
Speaker 1: looked at the fixtures. Oh I thought, I don't do
Speaker 1: that at.
Speaker 2: All, so well it look look.
Speaker 3: I was at home watching the hottest Field game and
Speaker 3: Hoddersfield were dreadful in the first half. Saint Helen's were good,
Speaker 3: but then they were quite poor in the second half.
Speaker 3: Harderfield came back, but we had the video referee taking ages,
Speaker 3: We had captains challenges, You had no fans in the stadium.
Speaker 2: It was just just a poor, poor contest.
Speaker 3: I mean, yeah, there's been the common denominator sadly this
Speaker 3: season is the Giants. They've been involved in a lot
Speaker 3: of poor contests and yeah, that was that was a
Speaker 3: tough watch. We've got two questions that I think we've
Speaker 3: covered a nauseum on this podcast, so I'll just brush
Speaker 3: over them, but I want to respect the guys who've
Speaker 3: sent them through so they know that we're listening. Alan
Speaker 3: Redman asked what's the views on respective performances the three
Speaker 3: promoted clubs, Alan, me and John have spoken significantly about
Speaker 3: that it's just going to get worse and worse.
Speaker 1: Bradford will get some wins because they play on a
Speaker 1: field that's smaller than any other in the competition, and
Speaker 1: there's a bit of atmosphere and momentum there because it's
Speaker 1: Bradford Bulls. But they've been heading south for the last
Speaker 1: few weeks and managed to scrape a win against who
Speaker 1: left c and the other two teams being propped up
Speaker 1: by Huddersfield. Kevin Citrus Clark said, will the RFL or
Speaker 1: Super League a scrap the captain's challenge for the sake
Speaker 1: of those watching at home or in the ground, it
Speaker 1: is dreadful, Kevin. We've mentioned that several times myself and John,
Speaker 1: and I don't think they'll scrap it, but they're definitely
Speaker 1: to cut down on the times. Anything you want to
Speaker 1: add to those two things.
Speaker 3: John, No, I mean, I don't know whether they'll scrap
Speaker 3: or not, but it certainly is dreadful. And yeah, I
Speaker 3: mean on the promoted teams. Look, I think Bradford obviously
Speaker 3: have the full full investment, while the other two teams don't,
Speaker 3: so I think that's important to note. And obviously to
Speaker 3: lose have to pay a million quid, which we've also
Speaker 3: talked about. But I think under the circumstances, considering they
Speaker 3: only had you know, October or whatever it was September
Speaker 3: to get ready, I think they're doing all right, like
Speaker 3: they're trying hard, and I think, you know, they're three
Speaker 3: good coaches. But I do also think at the end
Speaker 3: of the season those three clubs will be in the
Speaker 3: bottom six. I don't think that we will see, you know,
Speaker 3: a remarkable shift.
Speaker 2: I may be wrong, but they may not finish bottom.
Speaker 3: You know, A Huddersfield may save them or a cast
Speaker 3: or a hole of sea. But yeah, I think my
Speaker 3: sympathy is with those teams because I think any team
Speaker 3: that goes up you need time and you need the
Speaker 3: equal amount of money in conditions to.
Speaker 2: Be able to no.
Speaker 3: And it's not a level playing field, is it. I mean,
Speaker 3: the thing is we all know that lead like it's not.
Speaker 3: I'm not saying anything revolutionary there. That's just obvious. So yeah, look,
Speaker 3: I think there isn't I've said this many times before,
Speaker 3: I say it again, and you know, maybe we'll have
Speaker 3: fifteen teams next year, but we don't have the player
Speaker 3: quality to go around. And there's a lot of New
Speaker 3: South Wales and Queensland Cup players and other players who
Speaker 3: probably shouldn't be on full time contracts but they are at.
Speaker 2: The moment and they're given. You know, they're given.
Speaker 3: They're all But you know, we could see what's been
Speaker 3: dished out there every week and.
Speaker 1: RL news, like I said, I was at Magic Round Friday, mate,
Speaker 1: the dogs, the Canterbury Bulldogs are absolutely gone. They you
Speaker 1: know I mentioned earlier that rugby leage's a physical games,
Speaker 1: so if people are happy, they tend to play with
Speaker 1: everything they've got. I think it's very input. It's a
Speaker 1: very underrated thing in rugby league. If you if you're
Speaker 1: happy with your coach, you're happy with the team, you're
Speaker 1: happy with the mood and the camp ex etc. You
Speaker 1: give it everything you've got. If you're not subconsciously, you've
Speaker 1: just become a little bit weaker. And that's clear with
Speaker 1: the Bulldogs. They're trying hard, but it's literally not working
Speaker 1: and I think their confidence is absolutely shot. The other
Speaker 1: interesting thing is West Tigers have not won. In fact,
Speaker 1: they've done the exact opposite since Jerome Louie announced that
Speaker 1: he was going to pap In New Guinea and I
Speaker 1: think anybody who's ignoring that is in denial. Yes there's injuries,
Speaker 1: but there's injuries at every NR club And obviously we're
Speaker 1: talking about to lose, We're talking about York and we're
Speaker 1: talking about Bradford and the not even playing field Perth
Speaker 1: Bears because Papua New Guinea are offering tax free incentive
Speaker 1: Perth Bears. It's probably a the flight, a longer flight
Speaker 1: for so many people in Australia to go to Perth.
Speaker 1: So on the Sydney and Brisbane side of Australia, it's
Speaker 1: probably a little bit longer to get to Perth than
Speaker 1: it is to get to pap In New Guinea from Brisbane.
Speaker 1: Actually I think or.
Speaker 2: No, no, I think yeah, I think you're right.
Speaker 1: It's only equidistant at least.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think it is close to the Brisbane and
Speaker 3: I know it's only a forty minute forty five minute
Speaker 3: flight from cans P and G. Obviously the Perth you're
Speaker 3: looking about five hours from Sydney, so I think from
Speaker 3: Brisbane it's probably port most is probably a couple of hours,
Speaker 3: but under five. But yeah, you look at the teams
Speaker 3: that well, you look at the team that Perth assembled
Speaker 3: and you look at what P and G have signed
Speaker 3: already and who they obviously kind of Watson's over there
Speaker 3: having a look, isn't it. I mean, Connor Watson's played Origin.
Speaker 3: He'd be a big signing for Perth. But that's not
Speaker 3: going to happen. It looks like came again. This isn't
Speaker 3: going there. I mean, I don't think Brady Croft would
Speaker 3: have been a big sign for Perth, but he would
Speaker 3: have been, you know, in the mix for the halves.
Speaker 3: If you if you if you're playing, if you're looking
Speaker 3: at onds for next season. Perth days have been massive,
Speaker 3: you know, the favorites of the spoon, wouldn't they absolutely?
Speaker 1: And there's also rumors that all is not well on
Speaker 1: the staff side of things. Yes, Malmoninger is very close
Speaker 1: associate has left the job of general manager of football.
Speaker 1: Their stories surrounding the relationship between Ben Gardener, the assistant
Speaker 1: coach and Malmoninger. There is a rumor that Ben Gardener
Speaker 1: might be the next who KR coach swirling around.
Speaker 3: So I think the thing I'm not I've not heard that,
Speaker 3: but I mean, I think the point with Ben Gardner
Speaker 3: is that he's seen as being the Perth coaching the
Speaker 3: season three, isn't it like a Christian Wolff, Wayne Bennett
Speaker 3: Dolphins Melmonninger. But I don't think mal thinks that he'll
Speaker 3: be hanging over the reins. And you know what's really interesting,
Speaker 3: Lee is that Melmoninger's living at Camber at the moment
Speaker 3: and Ben Garden's living in Sydney. And I didn't realize
Speaker 3: until only recently. I thought he was still on the
Speaker 3: staff at Penrith, but he's not. Why is why are
Speaker 3: they both not living in Perth?
Speaker 2: Now? You know? Setting up the.
Speaker 3: Club and and you know what I mean, Like it's
Speaker 3: just it looks like they're going to what their pre
Speaker 3: season starts in what four months? Five months? You know,
Speaker 3: they need to pull their finger out Perth. Maddie Lees
Speaker 3: is obviously a player they've been linked to interestlely and recently.
Speaker 3: Sorry and this was put to me by someone and
Speaker 3: I think it's spot on, like Perth needs to be
Speaker 3: and they've already signed quite a few, but they need
Speaker 3: to be looking at England for players. They need to
Speaker 3: be they need to be getting an English hub because
Speaker 3: I think it's something like a quarter of the people
Speaker 3: who live in Perth are British as in were born
Speaker 3: in Britain. They've got a massive X back community. It's
Speaker 3: an isolated city Perth in terms of the East Coast
Speaker 3: of Australia. So why would you not build, you know,
Speaker 3: a bit of a hub for the best English players,
Speaker 3: you know, build that around that could be your identity,
Speaker 3: you know, the Perth the Perth British Bears or the
Speaker 3: British Bulldogs.
Speaker 2: Whatever you want to call it.
Speaker 3: So yeah, they are struggling Perth and you know I'd
Speaker 3: like to see them do well. Even though being a
Speaker 3: manly fan and they've got the North Sydney connection. I'd
Speaker 3: actually like to see them do all right. I mean
Speaker 3: obviously lose the mainly, but you don't want them to
Speaker 3: come in a competition and get flogged every week. I
Speaker 3: don't think that will help the sport or the competition.
Speaker 1: So let's look at the tips for next week super League.
Speaker 1: I've just gone on the super League website to get
Speaker 1: the draw and it flashed up not secure or big
Speaker 1: hazard signings. As your connection isn't private, attackers might be
Speaker 1: trying to steal your information super League dot co dot
Speaker 1: uk for example, for example passwords, messages or credit cards.
Speaker 1: I've got the option of going back or I've got
Speaker 1: the advanced options. What should a click on, John, I.
Speaker 3: Think that's always dodgy side you look at through the week.
Speaker 3: I think that's the problem on the boy.
Speaker 1: I've got high security on this website. Anyway, clicked on
Speaker 1: on this on this browser, I've clicked on high advanced
Speaker 1: and this server couldn't prove that it's super League dot
Speaker 1: col dot UK. It's security certificate is from admin dot
Speaker 1: super leigue cold dot UK. This may be caused by
Speaker 1: a misconfiguration or an attacker intercepting your connection. Can you
Speaker 1: imagine how many people they're losing out to with this
Speaker 1: popping up? So I'll give you I do have an option, John,
Speaker 1: don't thret to continue super League dot co dot uk.
Speaker 1: But in brackets it's unsafe. I'm going to take the risk. Okay,
Speaker 1: all right? This is like this is like turning on
Speaker 1: your car when there's a risk of a car bomb.
Speaker 3: It's not all right, give us the list, the picture list.
Speaker 1: I'm in, I'm in, I'm in, I'm in. Right match week,
Speaker 1: We're up to twelve, aren't we. They call it OKR
Speaker 1: and Wigan on Thursday. That will be a good game.
Speaker 1: Are you going?
Speaker 2: Will it be a good game lady?
Speaker 3: Because it's a week out from the Challenge Cup where
Speaker 3: there's two teams play, So yeah, exactly.
Speaker 2: It's another one of those I don't use.
Speaker 3: To use any French, but I fucking hated when you
Speaker 3: literally have the two teams and wig at Warrington had
Speaker 3: this two years ago they played the week before the
Speaker 3: Challenge Cup final. I mean one of them will well,
Speaker 3: probably both of them are rest players. Who knows who
Speaker 3: don't play with the rest, But it just takes the
Speaker 3: sting out of the contest.
Speaker 1: I do think every year what the RFL should do
Speaker 1: is go right, there's probably going to be four teams
Speaker 1: in the Challenge Cup, probably one, two or four teams
Speaker 1: maybe five. Let's keep them apart this round and the
Speaker 1: round after. I don't think the forward planning is the
Speaker 1: you know, the strength of the rfon super so should
Speaker 1: we not bother tip in that side that game?
Speaker 2: I think.
Speaker 3: I mean, it's really hard to know in terms of
Speaker 3: what teams they put it out, but yeah, considering it's
Speaker 3: at home, I'll go with a close wok I'll win.
Speaker 1: On Friday, Lee Leopards play Hull Left Seat and Lee's
Speaker 1: Rhinoles play Huddersfield Giants, Lean Lean. Leeds will win them.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: I think I was at the last Leeds in Huddersville
Speaker 3: game and what Leads scored? Fifty odd Yeah, I think
Speaker 3: Leads will win that one. And if you look at
Speaker 3: you know, Lee were we're a little bit unlacking the
Speaker 3: weekend but played reasonably well and I'll.
Speaker 2: See we're not great, so yeah, looking at recent form,
Speaker 2: we'll back the Leopards.
Speaker 1: Three o'clock on Saturday, Castleford Whole Saints. That's an interesting
Speaker 1: kickoff time for a Castleford home game.
Speaker 2: It is. I'm not sure about that one.
Speaker 1: To lose.
Speaker 3: Are you going to give a tip? By the way, sorry, yeah,
Speaker 3: I think Look kudos to cass but I think I
Speaker 3: think Saint Helen's. You know, they've shown a k act
Speaker 3: for forgetting a results this season.
Speaker 2: They've been relatively consistent, so I'll pick them for that one.
Speaker 1: It won't clash with any soccer by the way. It
Speaker 1: might clash with a playoff final or something, but.
Speaker 3: There is a playoff the head. There's the Championship playoff
Speaker 3: finals on the same time.
Speaker 1: To lose and Wakefield play at seven o'clock on Saturday. Yeah,
Speaker 1: the way Wakefield played on front, I can't look past them.
Speaker 1: They've just got a lot of attacking weapons. Jack Truman
Speaker 1: is having a massive of season and they've got a
Speaker 1: very big and mobile forward pact.
Speaker 2: That's that's bashing teams.
Speaker 1: And York Knights host the Catalan Dragons. I had fancy
Speaker 1: York to get another win there.
Speaker 2: Yeah, to be honest, back you back at York.
Speaker 3: I think it's starting to get a few players back
Speaker 3: from injury York, and I think it's a very winnable
Speaker 3: game for them, So I think I think the Knights.
Speaker 1: On that on that Saturday, Whole City play Southampton at
Speaker 1: four thirty, so Cash should be pretty confident.
Speaker 2: I don't.
Speaker 1: I don't know how many Hall fans live in Castleford,
Speaker 1: so it's probably going to be all right.
Speaker 2: I know one, I know one. Right.
Speaker 1: Do you think any of them will be at Celtic
Speaker 1: and dunfirmly in the Scottish Cup final at three? That
Speaker 1: was better I watched. I watched mate, that's let's let's
Speaker 1: do a podcast one day on the corruption in Scottish football.
Speaker 1: And then on Sunday at three o'clock Warrington host Bradford.
Speaker 1: I can only see one winner there, I think.
Speaker 3: Yeah, look, I think I think Bradford will go there
Speaker 3: and give a good shake. But I think I think Warrenton, Yeah,
Speaker 3: I think I'll get them.
Speaker 1: All good. Look. In terms of after the hooter, guys,
Speaker 1: I'm really busy with something that will hopefully come to
Speaker 1: an end this week, so I'll talk with John. If
Speaker 1: we don't have one this week, don't worry, it will
Speaker 1: come back, but me and me and John will discuss
Speaker 1: where can people get you John? In the interim.
Speaker 3: They can get me on Patreon at Rugby League hub
Speaker 3: dot com read I can get me on Instagram Johnny D.
Speaker 3: Davidson RL and on X and on Facebook as well.
Speaker 1: I'm Rugby League Coach dot comatay you admin, at Rugby
Speaker 1: League Coach dot comdatay you is the email and at
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Speaker 1: Facebook or Instagram with a message on X I am
Speaker 1: at RL coach on the net because I couldn't get
Speaker 1: Billy coach. We'll see you when we see her. Take
Speaker 1: care