Speaker 1: What's up, everyone, and welcome to another episode of the
Epstein Chronicles. In this episode, we're gonna get right back
to the Michael Thomas investigation with the OIG investigators. Question, So,
when you're watching Epstein on July twenty third, did you
see a psychologist talk with them at all? Thomas? That
was on the morning Watch? But no psychologists is on duty? Question?
Oh okay, so you were there from eight You were
watching them Thomas from midnight to eight am Thomas, while
I was watching him until well, exactly from one point
thirty to eight am. Question. Now, when inmates, though, like Epstein,
he's on suicide watch and then placed back into the shoe,
how soon after are they typically provided a cellmate, mister Thomas,
I don't know. Question is it right away? Thomas? I'm
sure it's right away? Question, So it's like you typically, like,
is the cell mate already in there when they place
him in with someone? Thomas? I don't know. It could
be either or I'm sure that they made certain provisions
and stuff to make sure that he was with somebody
that he felt comfortable with, or whatever the case. Question
do inmates that are on suicide watch and psychological observation.
Do they always go from there to the shoe or
ever into somewhere else? Thomas, what do you mean? Question? So,
if someone's on suicide watch or psychological observation Thomas on
the second floor. Question on the second floor, when they're
released from that, do they always get placed into the shoe? Thomas? No,
it can be either or if they have some more
shoe time that they have to serve or anything like that,
they can go back to the shoe, but their shoe
time is up. I'm assuming I'll say it's whatever the
psychologists say. If they say that they're clear to go
to population, they'll take them the population question. Okay, what's
the difference between suicide watch and psychological observation Thomas, suicide
watch one has a smock in a blanket an observation,
they have clothes. Question. That's the only difference, Thomas, that's
the only difference. We still just watching them out there.
There's no difference, Thomas or anything like that. Yeah, no difference.
You watch them. Question, same area, same cell, just what
they're wearing, Thomas. Yeah, same area, same cells, and what
they're wearing. Absolutely question Okay, and is it your understanding
the Epstein was both on Suicide Watch and Psychological Observation. Thomas,
I don't know if he was on psychological I knew
when I watched them he was on suicide Watch at
the time. Question Okay, did any other inmate that you
were in the shoe when you were working in the
shoe in July and August twenty nineteen, were any of
them also people that were on suicide Watch or psychological Observation? Thomas,
I don't know. Question No, would that be on the
hot list if they were? Thomas, it probably would. I
don't know if it's something that other inmates I couldn't
tell you that there was five times suicides or that
I couldn't tell you. Question okay, and are there any
other additional requirements for people to come off of suicide
Watch or Psychological Observation asides from having a cell mate? Thomas,
I don't know. Question do they have to get do
they have to pay closer attention to them? Thomas? I
don't think so. I just say that everything is still
standard practice. Question Okay, so when you're working in the shoe,
do you treat everybody the same? Thomas, No, I treat
everybody the same. Question okay, So you don't look after
certain people more than others. Thomas, No, I don't pay
more attention to one person or another. Question. Okay, And
is that the case with Epstein as well? You aren't informed, like, hey,
make sure you're paying more attention to him. He's your
priority Thomas. No question. So no one ever said Thomas
cuts him off? No, absolutely not. Back to the question
that he's a priority inmate. Okay, And I may have
asked you this, so I apologize if it's repetitive, Thomas,
it's all right. Question. But was Epstein required to have
a cell mate during his stay in the shoe? Thomas,
I don't know. Question. You just don't know, Thomas, I
don't know exactly, but I don't know. I don't know,
but I would say if he was previous suicide, yeah,
he was probably required to have an inmate. Question. Are
you aware that the staff psychologist ever issued a requirement
for him to have a cell mate? Thomas, No, I'm not.
I don't know. Question. So did anyone, including the psychologist, peers, supervisors,
or others ever tell you that Epstein was required to
have a cell mate? Thomas, No question. Do you have
the email mister redacted. Let me see, is there one
more stack? Redacted? So this is the email from that
redacted from Psychology and it says to suicide Watch Psychological
Observation Update seven point thirty twenty nineteen. Do you know
if you ever received this email? It says inmate Epstein
is being taken off psych observation and needs to be
housed with an appropriate cellmate. Do you remember ever receiving that? Thomas.
Usually they send this out to everybody, like it's sent
out to everybody, but I don't remember seeing it. I'm
sure if it was sent out and all that stuff,
I'm sure it got to me, but I don't remember
seeing it. Question. No, And I'm not saying that you
received it. I'm just asking if you had received it,
like either by forward. Did anyone ever forward the email
to you? Or did anybody did you ever see it? Thomas? No,
my name's not on here? Question? Yeah? Yeah, yeah, No,
I know your name isn't on here. Thomas. Uh huh. Question.
You're right, That's why I'm just asking if you have
ever forwarded that to you? Thomas, Uh huh. Question. Okay,
do any of these names that are on here, especially
towards the bottom here. Any of those names look like
people that would work in the shoe, Thomas. It could
be a bunch of these people that worked in the shoe.
I don't know specifically who works in the shoe. Question. Okay,
but because you weren't on a regular shoe schedule, you
may not, Thomas interrupts them. Yeah, yeah, they may not
have forwarded that to you. One of those is the chaplain.
That's okay, but you never none of these people ever
forwarded this to you, Thomas, no question. Okay, just because
we talked about it, do you mind just initialing it
and dating it? Thank you, sir, mister Thomas, I wrote twenty,
so I initialed over it. I put the one because
I initialed over it when writing it redacted. What's that, Thomas?
I put twenty? Question this at nineteen, Yeah, Thomas, No,
I put twenty, so I put the one and I
put my initials over it. Oh okay, got it all right? Thanks?
So no one ever informed you that even not only that,
but you needed to keep a close eye on mister Epstein. Thomas, No,
I don't ever recall being informed about that. No, Thomas,
I mean, I'm not a custody he gets cut off. Sure,
I didn't know during your times that you're actually in
the shoe people talking about like and at midnight everybody's gone,
just the people, because you're always with at least one
other person, right, Thomas, Yeah, question, but the other person
you never had this, Thomas, I don't recall question. Conversation. Okay,
do you recall who the MCC warden in July of
August twenty nineteen was, mister Thomas. I can't pronounce his
first name redacted? Question? Is it redacted? Thomas? I was
about to say captain, but redacted Thomas, but you said
the warden right. Question? Yeah, so he gives them the name? Question? Okay, good.
What communication do you have with mcc warden with regarding
to the epstein being housed within the MCC Thomas, I
don't recall. Question none, Thomas, no question. So I'm going
to go through just a couple of names, and the
reason why I'm going to ask the same questions, and
the intention is not to be repetitive, but for you
to specifically think these people to just see if that
helps you recall Thomas, you know, jog something? Question? Yeah,
you know, so you can visualize that person. Question, So,
did the warden ever provide you with special instructions with Epstein?
Thomas No, not that I recall. Question Okay, did the
warden ever tell you that Epstein was required to have
a cell mate well housed at MCC or assigned to
the shoe Thomas, not that I recall. Question did the
warden ever visit the shoe during Epstein's stay at the
MCC Thomas, I don't know. Question. You don't know because
you weren't there during the days. Does the warden typically
just work during the day watch Thomas No. I actually
had an overtime shift with the warden sometime when he
helped out with He worked the shoe with me one time.
Question when did he do that? Thomas, I can't recall.
Question would it have been like in the July or
August of twenty nineteen? Thomas, Nah, this was a long
time ago, A long time ago. Question Sam Warton Thomas, yeah,
Sam Warden question, Okay, do you recall any times that
you were in the shoe during July and August during
Epstein's stay that the warden visited Thomas No, I'm on
morning watch. Question right, that's what I meant because you
had said that sometimes, he though Thomas. Yeah, question, okay,
but not during that time Thomas, not during my time?
No question. Do you know if the warden ever met
with Epstein during his stay here at MCC mister Thomas,
I don't know. Question? Who are the MCC associate wardens
in August of twenty nineteen Thomas redacted, And honestly I
can't remember the other one question? Did the warden ever
talk to you about Epstein? Okay? Did any aw's or
associate wardens Thomas? No question? All right, Thomas, not any question.
So what communications did you have with any mcc aw's,
including redacted, about Epstein being housed within the MCC. None?
What aw's did you communicate with and how were those
communications conducted? Did you ever discuss anything with aws? Did
you ever have conversations with them? Thomas? How's your day going? Question? Yeah?
But not like sitting down talking about different inmates or something, Thomas,
no question, No, all right? And did any aw's ever
provide you with any information with regard to Epstein? Thomas,
no question? Or special instruction Thomas, no question? And did
any AW including aw redacted, ever tell you that Epstein
was required to have a cellmate Thomas, no question. Did
any aw ever visit the shoe while you were in
the shoe? Thomas, no question. No, did any aw ever
meet with Epstein during his stay at MCC? Thomas from
I don't know? Question, Okay, who was the MCC captain
in July and August of twenty nineteen? Thomas, I see
his face, but I can't remember his name. Question was
it redacted? Thomas? Yeah, there you go, There you go. Question,
so it was redacted? Thomas, yeah, question okay, what communication
did you have with Captain redacted with regarding to Epstein
being housed at MCC? None? Would you have any communication
with the captain? Thomas no? Passing by question, did the
captain ever provide you with special instructions with regard to Epstein? Thomas,
no question. Did the captain ever tell you that Epstein
was required to have a cellmate? Thomas, no question. Did
the captain ever visit the shoe during Epstein's stay at
MCC Thomas, I don't know. Question did the captain ever
but not while you were at the shoe? Thomas, Not
while I was in the shoe, No question. Did the
captain ever have a meeting with Epstein during his stay
at the mcc Thomas, I don't know, okay, question do
you want to take a break right now? Answer yes, okay,
So we're going to take a break right here as well,
and in the next episode dealing with the topic, we're
going to pick up where we left off. All of
the information that goes with this episode can be found
in the description box.