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Speaker 1: What's up, everyone, and welcome to another episode of the

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Epstein Chronicles. In this episode, we're gonna get right back

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to the Michael Thomas investigation with the OIG investigators. Question, So,

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when you're watching Epstein on July twenty third, did you

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see a psychologist talk with them at all? Thomas? That

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was on the morning Watch? But no psychologists is on duty? Question?

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Oh okay, so you were there from eight You were

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watching them Thomas from midnight to eight am Thomas, while

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I was watching him until well, exactly from one point

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thirty to eight am. Question. Now, when inmates, though, like Epstein,

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he's on suicide watch and then placed back into the shoe,

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how soon after are they typically provided a cellmate, mister Thomas,

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I don't know. Question is it right away? Thomas? I'm

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sure it's right away? Question, So it's like you typically, like,

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is the cell mate already in there when they place

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him in with someone? Thomas? I don't know. It could

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be either or I'm sure that they made certain provisions

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and stuff to make sure that he was with somebody

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that he felt comfortable with, or whatever the case. Question

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do inmates that are on suicide watch and psychological observation.

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Do they always go from there to the shoe or

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ever into somewhere else? Thomas, what do you mean? Question? So,

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if someone's on suicide watch or psychological observation Thomas on

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the second floor. Question on the second floor, when they're

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released from that, do they always get placed into the shoe? Thomas? No,

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it can be either or if they have some more

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shoe time that they have to serve or anything like that,

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they can go back to the shoe, but their shoe

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time is up. I'm assuming I'll say it's whatever the

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psychologists say. If they say that they're clear to go

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to population, they'll take them the population question. Okay, what's

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the difference between suicide watch and psychological observation Thomas, suicide

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watch one has a smock in a blanket an observation,

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they have clothes. Question. That's the only difference, Thomas, that's

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the only difference. We still just watching them out there.

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There's no difference, Thomas or anything like that. Yeah, no difference.

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You watch them. Question, same area, same cell, just what

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they're wearing, Thomas. Yeah, same area, same cells, and what

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they're wearing. Absolutely question Okay, and is it your understanding

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the Epstein was both on Suicide Watch and Psychological Observation. Thomas,

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I don't know if he was on psychological I knew

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when I watched them he was on suicide Watch at

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the time. Question Okay, did any other inmate that you

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were in the shoe when you were working in the

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shoe in July and August twenty nineteen, were any of

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them also people that were on suicide Watch or psychological Observation? Thomas,

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I don't know. Question No, would that be on the

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hot list if they were? Thomas, it probably would. I

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don't know if it's something that other inmates I couldn't

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tell you that there was five times suicides or that

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I couldn't tell you. Question okay, and are there any

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other additional requirements for people to come off of suicide

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Watch or Psychological Observation asides from having a cell mate? Thomas,

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I don't know. Question do they have to get do

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they have to pay closer attention to them? Thomas? I

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don't think so. I just say that everything is still

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standard practice. Question Okay, so when you're working in the shoe,

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do you treat everybody the same? Thomas, No, I treat

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everybody the same. Question okay, So you don't look after

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certain people more than others. Thomas, No, I don't pay

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more attention to one person or another. Question. Okay, And

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is that the case with Epstein as well? You aren't informed, like, hey,

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make sure you're paying more attention to him. He's your

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priority Thomas. No question. So no one ever said Thomas

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cuts him off? No, absolutely not. Back to the question

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that he's a priority inmate. Okay, And I may have

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asked you this, so I apologize if it's repetitive, Thomas,

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it's all right. Question. But was Epstein required to have

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a cell mate during his stay in the shoe? Thomas,

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I don't know. Question. You just don't know, Thomas, I

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don't know exactly, but I don't know. I don't know,

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but I would say if he was previous suicide, yeah,

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he was probably required to have an inmate. Question. Are

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you aware that the staff psychologist ever issued a requirement

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for him to have a cell mate? Thomas, No, I'm not.

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I don't know. Question. So did anyone, including the psychologist, peers, supervisors,

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or others ever tell you that Epstein was required to

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have a cell mate? Thomas, No question. Do you have

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the email mister redacted. Let me see, is there one

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more stack? Redacted? So this is the email from that

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redacted from Psychology and it says to suicide Watch Psychological

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Observation Update seven point thirty twenty nineteen. Do you know

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if you ever received this email? It says inmate Epstein

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is being taken off psych observation and needs to be

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housed with an appropriate cellmate. Do you remember ever receiving that? Thomas.

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Usually they send this out to everybody, like it's sent

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out to everybody, but I don't remember seeing it. I'm

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sure if it was sent out and all that stuff,

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I'm sure it got to me, but I don't remember

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seeing it. Question. No, And I'm not saying that you

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received it. I'm just asking if you had received it,

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like either by forward. Did anyone ever forward the email

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to you? Or did anybody did you ever see it? Thomas? No,

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my name's not on here? Question? Yeah? Yeah, yeah, No,

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I know your name isn't on here. Thomas. Uh huh. Question.

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You're right, That's why I'm just asking if you have

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ever forwarded that to you? Thomas, Uh huh. Question. Okay,

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do any of these names that are on here, especially

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towards the bottom here. Any of those names look like

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people that would work in the shoe, Thomas. It could

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be a bunch of these people that worked in the shoe.

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I don't know specifically who works in the shoe. Question. Okay,

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but because you weren't on a regular shoe schedule, you

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may not, Thomas interrupts them. Yeah, yeah, they may not

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have forwarded that to you. One of those is the chaplain.

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That's okay, but you never none of these people ever

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forwarded this to you, Thomas, no question. Okay, just because

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we talked about it, do you mind just initialing it

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and dating it? Thank you, sir, mister Thomas, I wrote twenty,

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so I initialed over it. I put the one because

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I initialed over it when writing it redacted. What's that, Thomas?

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I put twenty? Question this at nineteen, Yeah, Thomas, No,

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I put twenty, so I put the one and I

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put my initials over it. Oh okay, got it all right? Thanks?

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So no one ever informed you that even not only that,

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but you needed to keep a close eye on mister Epstein. Thomas, No,

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I don't ever recall being informed about that. No, Thomas,

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I mean, I'm not a custody he gets cut off. Sure,

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I didn't know during your times that you're actually in

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the shoe people talking about like and at midnight everybody's gone,

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just the people, because you're always with at least one

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other person, right, Thomas, Yeah, question, but the other person

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you never had this, Thomas, I don't recall question. Conversation. Okay,

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do you recall who the MCC warden in July of

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August twenty nineteen was, mister Thomas. I can't pronounce his

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first name redacted? Question? Is it redacted? Thomas? I was

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about to say captain, but redacted Thomas, but you said

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the warden right. Question? Yeah, so he gives them the name? Question? Okay, good.

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What communication do you have with mcc warden with regarding

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to the epstein being housed within the MCC Thomas, I

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don't recall. Question none, Thomas, no question. So I'm going

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to go through just a couple of names, and the

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reason why I'm going to ask the same questions, and

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the intention is not to be repetitive, but for you

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to specifically think these people to just see if that

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helps you recall Thomas, you know, jog something? Question? Yeah,

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you know, so you can visualize that person. Question, So,

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did the warden ever provide you with special instructions with Epstein?

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Thomas No, not that I recall. Question Okay, did the

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warden ever tell you that Epstein was required to have

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a cell mate well housed at MCC or assigned to

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the shoe Thomas, not that I recall. Question did the

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warden ever visit the shoe during Epstein's stay at the

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MCC Thomas, I don't know. Question. You don't know because

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you weren't there during the days. Does the warden typically

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just work during the day watch Thomas No. I actually

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had an overtime shift with the warden sometime when he

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helped out with He worked the shoe with me one time.

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Question when did he do that? Thomas, I can't recall.

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Question would it have been like in the July or

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August of twenty nineteen? Thomas, Nah, this was a long

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time ago, A long time ago. Question Sam Warton Thomas, yeah,

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Sam Warden question, Okay, do you recall any times that

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you were in the shoe during July and August during

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Epstein's stay that the warden visited Thomas No, I'm on

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morning watch. Question right, that's what I meant because you

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had said that sometimes, he though Thomas. Yeah, question, okay,

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but not during that time Thomas, not during my time?

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No question. Do you know if the warden ever met

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with Epstein during his stay here at MCC mister Thomas,

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I don't know. Question? Who are the MCC associate wardens

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in August of twenty nineteen Thomas redacted, And honestly I

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can't remember the other one question? Did the warden ever

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talk to you about Epstein? Okay? Did any aw's or

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associate wardens Thomas? No question? All right, Thomas, not any question.

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So what communications did you have with any mcc aw's,

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including redacted, about Epstein being housed within the MCC. None?

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What aw's did you communicate with and how were those

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communications conducted? Did you ever discuss anything with aws? Did

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you ever have conversations with them? Thomas? How's your day going? Question? Yeah?

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But not like sitting down talking about different inmates or something, Thomas,

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no question, No, all right? And did any aw's ever

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provide you with any information with regard to Epstein? Thomas,

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no question? Or special instruction Thomas, no question? And did

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any AW including aw redacted, ever tell you that Epstein

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was required to have a cellmate Thomas, no question. Did

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any aw ever visit the shoe while you were in

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the shoe? Thomas, no question. No, did any aw ever

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meet with Epstein during his stay at MCC? Thomas from

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I don't know? Question, Okay, who was the MCC captain

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in July and August of twenty nineteen? Thomas, I see

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his face, but I can't remember his name. Question was

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it redacted? Thomas? Yeah, there you go, There you go. Question,

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so it was redacted? Thomas, yeah, question okay, what communication

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did you have with Captain redacted with regarding to Epstein

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being housed at MCC? None? Would you have any communication

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with the captain? Thomas no? Passing by question, did the

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captain ever provide you with special instructions with regard to Epstein? Thomas,

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no question. Did the captain ever tell you that Epstein

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was required to have a cellmate? Thomas, no question. Did

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the captain ever visit the shoe during Epstein's stay at

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MCC Thomas, I don't know. Question did the captain ever

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but not while you were at the shoe? Thomas, Not

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while I was in the shoe, No question. Did the

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captain ever have a meeting with Epstein during his stay

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at the mcc Thomas, I don't know, okay, question do

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you want to take a break right now? Answer yes, okay,

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So we're going to take a break right here as well,

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and in the next episode dealing with the topic, we're

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going to pick up where we left off. All of

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the information that goes with this episode can be found

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in the description box.