Speaker 1: Hey, folks.
Speaker 2: We're recording at Chainlink's smart Con event, and joining me
Speaker 2: is vivek Ramon, who is the co founder and CEO
Speaker 2: of Etherealized. VIVEC.
Speaker 1: Great to have you, Thanks so much for having me.
Speaker 1: Good to see you.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Vivic, tell us a bit about yourself and what
Speaker 2: is etheroralized.
Speaker 3: So I'm not a crypto person. I'm actually a Wall
Speaker 3: Street person, which is finally in vogue now. I spent
Speaker 3: eleven years on Wall Street at the traditional finance banks
Speaker 3: Morgan Stanley, UBS, Stochebank, No Mira from twenty twenty nine
Speaker 3: to twenty twenty and I traded a bunch of credit
Speaker 3: products which are we're the backbone of the US economy.
Speaker 3: But their technology, their operations, their settlement was the most
Speaker 3: stone age type technology I've ever seen, and so I
Speaker 3: did it for eleven years, built up an amazing network,
Speaker 3: love everyone on Wall Street, but nothing ever changed in
Speaker 3: tech land.
Speaker 1: So I left Wall Street, which.
Speaker 3: People don't do that often, and shared found Ethereum and
Speaker 3: I was like, this thing is It's the platform where
Speaker 3: Wall Street should tokenize and trade their assets. So I've
Speaker 3: been working on that for five years independently. For a
Speaker 3: long time, I knocking on a lot of doors, getting
Speaker 3: a lot of rejections last year when the regulatory wind shifted,
Speaker 3: when the ethtfs were approved, when Larry Fink started saying
Speaker 3: the whole world's gonna be tokenized, I was like, now
Speaker 3: it's time to actually mobilized and institutionalized. So sure I
Speaker 3: set up Etherealized, backed by the Ethereum Foundation and Metallic
Speaker 3: with support from the etherorem ecosystem overall to build the
Speaker 3: institutional arm for.
Speaker 1: The Etherem ecosystem. And that's that's what Etherialized is today.
Speaker 2: That's incredible. And to your point, Etheroreum has become this
Speaker 2: layer that all of Wall Street and all the tradifi
Speaker 2: forms want to build on. I mean Black Rock launched
Speaker 2: Biddle on their first Exactly what is it like looking
Speaker 2: back again you're a Wall Street guy and seeing all
Speaker 2: these institutions and firms coming in.
Speaker 3: It's it's almost like sigh over relief because I felt
Speaker 3: like I was wrong for so long. I was like,
Speaker 3: I was like, I swear that I see blockchain as
Speaker 3: a solution to Wall Streets. Just technology and operational issues
Speaker 3: and everything wants to upgrade for the technology era. But
Speaker 3: the financial sector hadn't, so I was like, am I crazy?
Speaker 3: And after some time when you saw the regulatory hostility,
Speaker 3: I was like, will I ever be able to build
Speaker 3: in the US with a financial platform? And so seeing
Speaker 3: that it's finally not only vindicated, but like now all
Speaker 3: trientify firms are they have a blockchain mandate, they actually
Speaker 3: have to integrate blockchains. Just it's good to see that
Speaker 3: we will be able to realize the potential of blockchains
Speaker 3: becoming the hub for all financial activity as well as
Speaker 3: much more than that. But to start getting the financial
Speaker 3: sector financial sector on board is a is a really
Speaker 3: really good upgrade to the whole system and a really
Speaker 3: cool use case to show.
Speaker 2: It feels like the markets, the economies, and possibly parts
Speaker 2: of the government will all run on blockchain rails eventually.
Speaker 2: It seems that's the direction that Puck is heading in.
Speaker 3: I think that the ironic part is when blockchains are
Speaker 3: that backbone that you said for governments and for the
Speaker 3: financial sector and for social media and for everything, no
Speaker 3: one's going to know they're using a blockchain, so etherea
Speaker 3: is going to be invisible, but it'll be everywhere, kind
Speaker 3: of like the Internet, Like no one thinks about the Internet,
Speaker 3: but it's everywhere. But now we have the Internet for money,
Speaker 3: and it's safe and it's secure, and it's reliable, and
Speaker 3: it's global and it's not owned by anyone. And that's
Speaker 3: why like Ethereum is such a standout platform to win
Speaker 3: this blockchain race.
Speaker 1: Chikin's one digital gold.
Speaker 3: Ethereum I think is gonna win the platform for everything,
Speaker 3: and I want to make sure that happens because that
Speaker 3: is the ultimate potential of blockchains. So yeah, we're here
Speaker 3: to advance Etheroereum responsibly and get to show real use cases.
Speaker 2: So walk us through what's the mission of etherorialized and
Speaker 2: how can folks leverage the platform and so forth.
Speaker 3: So Etheroralized started off educating institutions about all the things
Speaker 3: they can do with blockchains, and that includes tokenization. That
Speaker 3: includes building their own custom blockchains, which are layer twos
Speaker 3: on Ethereum, and that includes using applications, building applications, decentralized finance,
Speaker 3: I like to call it decentralized finance, programmatic finance programming,
Speaker 3: or assets actually unlock automation. We started educating about all
Speaker 3: of that across the board to the byside of Wall Street,
Speaker 3: to the cell side of Wall Street, to asset managers,
Speaker 3: to investment advisors and taught about everything very quickly. We
Speaker 3: realize that everyone wants to deploy something in Ethereum, but
Speaker 3: no one has the expertise to do it.
Speaker 1: So we built up.
Speaker 3: An engineering arm. So we started building the solutions. So
Speaker 3: we're building ways. We're building ways to tokenize assets, We're
Speaker 3: building ways to build different layer twos. We're building infrastructure
Speaker 3: like privacy, so tokenized assets can actually be compliant trade privately.
Speaker 3: So we're building a lot of tools, and the idea
Speaker 3: is to onboard as many assets, as many institutions, and
Speaker 3: as many new players into the Etherorem ecosystem.
Speaker 2: So we've seen Etherorem's ecosystem blossom and grows significantly. And
Speaker 2: you have a lot of layer two so are you
Speaker 2: also working with the layer twos?
Speaker 1: Absolutely?
Speaker 3: I think the layer twos are such an important part
Speaker 3: of Etherem's ecosystem. I think any blockchain system that thinks
Speaker 3: that the whole financial sector will live on one layer
Speaker 3: is it's a little naive in my view. I think
Speaker 3: every firm wants their own customized blockchain, they want their
Speaker 3: own block space, they want some privacy, some public. They
Speaker 3: want some compliance integrations into some parts of the chain.
Speaker 3: That is only possible with a modular architecture, and that's
Speaker 3: where the layer twos come in. The layer twos can
Speaker 3: be faster, they can be cheaper, they can have different
Speaker 3: security assumptions, they can have different Wallstreet players on them,
Speaker 3: they can onboard the world that way.
Speaker 1: So I think the layer twos, I see a.
Speaker 3: World We're gonna have a blossoming amount of layer twos
Speaker 3: all plugging into this liquidity hub that's Ethereum Layer one.
Speaker 1: So do you see a future.
Speaker 2: And I'll give the example of Sony because they built Sonyum.
Speaker 2: I believe a layer that many brands and companies this
Speaker 2: is kind of the model build our own blockchain using
Speaker 2: the security layer of the Ethereum Layer one and getting
Speaker 2: the smart contract benefits and all that jazz.
Speaker 3: It's almost like saying companies build on the Internet, but
Speaker 3: they build their own companies, Like they're not building new
Speaker 3: internets every time, but they build their companies on top
Speaker 3: of the Internet. So companies want to maximize profits, and
Speaker 3: companies want to have their own ecosystem and have their
Speaker 3: own customer retention. I always say, like Ethereum isn't a
Speaker 3: it's not a charity. It's the best place to do business.
Speaker 3: If a company wants to deplub blocking strategy, you do
Speaker 3: it on Ethereum. You build your own layer two, You
Speaker 3: have your own customer attention, you have your new revenue sources,
Speaker 3: you have a new innovation. Coinbase did it with Base,
Speaker 3: Robinhood's doing it with their chain, and yeah, Sonium, like
Speaker 3: people outside of finance, there's a lot of potential outside
Speaker 3: of finance too. Sonium world Chain is doing this with
Speaker 3: their own ecosystem. There's so many and we're at the
Speaker 3: we're at the very start of the adoption curve, so
Speaker 3: there's gonna be a lot more.
Speaker 2: It's amazing and I can't wait for the Clarity Act
Speaker 2: to pass, where there's going to be more clarity where
Speaker 2: these companies can now don't have to look over your shoulder,
Speaker 2: there's no ambiguity. They can just hit the ground, put
Speaker 2: their head down and start working. Are you expecting like
Speaker 2: even more innovation and incredible stuff coming out after that?
Speaker 1: Oh?
Speaker 3: I think the Genius Act the stable Coin Bill was
Speaker 3: the prelude, but look at what happened. The stable Coin
Speaker 3: Bill is now in law and every single bank, every
Speaker 3: single finteche everyone's launching their own stable. So see what
Speaker 3: happens with a little bit of regulatory clarity. When the
Speaker 3: Clarity Act ultimately passes, it's gonna unleash I think ten
Speaker 3: x the innovation because that applies to defied, applies to
Speaker 3: other retailgnized assets, it applies to frameworks for all different
Speaker 3: kinds of blockschain architectures.
Speaker 1: That's going to unlock some real upsides.
Speaker 3: So I mean, I got the opportunity earlier this year
Speaker 3: to testify in front of Congress about the Clarity Acts,
Speaker 3: so we're familiar with it. We're very supportive, and it's
Speaker 3: a matter of when, not if. But when blockschain's got
Speaker 3: codified in the law, then we'll see the real the
Speaker 3: real potential. The bull market hasn't even started yet. This
Speaker 3: this many little like up and down and aneath is nothing.
Speaker 3: I think the real thing is going to happen when
Speaker 3: we have regulatory clarity. Every company is deploying and then
Speaker 3: you have ethereum the networks to be pervasive and the
Speaker 3: assets gonna be worth trillions.
Speaker 1: And that's what I'm excited for.
Speaker 2: It's amazing. I can't wait to see what innovation comes
Speaker 2: out after this bill passes. Absolutely talk to us about
Speaker 2: etherialize and how you're working with institutions. I don't know
Speaker 2: if you can name drop, but you know, like give
Speaker 2: us some mock scenario of maybe someone who came to
Speaker 2: you and say, hey, we want to do this and
Speaker 2: how you're helping them.
Speaker 3: Unfortunately, can't name drop, but that's a that's a good
Speaker 3: thing out of that thing, right. But we like to
Speaker 3: say the worthy ambassadors to Ethereum because there's a lot
Speaker 3: of things that you can do. So some institutions want
Speaker 3: to tokenize assets perfect, we'll either help do it for them,
Speaker 3: We'll point them at partners. Some institutions want to create
Speaker 3: their own Layer twos. Again, we'll do it for them.
Speaker 3: We'll point into partners. Some want to deploy on Layer twos.
Speaker 3: Some want to just learn about the space. Someonet to
Speaker 3: learn about what DeFi is. Some want to design privacy architecture.
Speaker 3: We want to be the one stop shop for institutional
Speaker 3: adoption for Ethereum. So sure it's not Ethereum isn't one
Speaker 3: size fits all.
Speaker 1: That's a good thing. That's why I have the Layer
Speaker 1: two roadmap.
Speaker 3: We're here to be a funnel and sort of guide
Speaker 3: people and navigate people through the potential what this platform
Speaker 3: can do.
Speaker 2: Have you had anybody approach you, I mean, maybe too
Speaker 2: early for this, because there's still we need the Cloudy Act.
Speaker 2: I want to launch my own token, rewards token to
Speaker 2: build my brand and customer retention and stuff like that.
Speaker 3: Absolutely, and we do need the Clarity Act to make
Speaker 3: it like very low risk. All this should be codified.
Speaker 3: Love this is such a positive something. When I was testifying,
Speaker 3: I told I mean both sides of Congress or the
Speaker 3: Republicans Democrats, and I was like, this is the most
Speaker 3: non partisan technology ever. This makes Democrats should love this
Speaker 3: because it democratizes literally access to finance. Republicans should love
Speaker 3: this because it increases profit margins and creates business opportunity.
Speaker 3: I don't see a more positive some technology out there.
Speaker 3: Maybe AI, but even AI, like I think blockchains are
Speaker 3: more positive some than AI is.
Speaker 1: So so yeah, people are waiting on.
Speaker 3: Clarity, but yes, absolutely rewards tokens, like everything outside of
Speaker 3: finance is also fair game. And that's that's where it's
Speaker 3: gonna be excited to see the innovation that happens on Etherium.
Speaker 2: Oh for sure. So what's on your role map, what
Speaker 2: can we expect in twenty twenty six and things.
Speaker 3: Like that, lots more tokenized assets, lots more intitutional layer
Speaker 3: twos and new novel applications, and real progress on zero
Speaker 3: knowledge proof technology and architecture and privacy.
Speaker 2: Let's double click on the zero knowledge proof aspect, because
Speaker 2: privacy is very important to a lot of these institutions.
Speaker 2: How are you finding that balance with connecting to a
Speaker 2: or building on a public blockchain, connecting to other public
Speaker 2: blockchains and having privacy.
Speaker 1: I think it's stable stakes.
Speaker 3: I think that the space hasn't worked yet, and that's
Speaker 3: why we've seen so many iterations over the last ten
Speaker 3: years of privately held blockchains, company blockchains, consortium chains. The
Speaker 3: reason it hasn't opened up, and that's the reason we
Speaker 3: haven't seen blockchain blossom, is it hasn't happened on public networks.
Speaker 3: So you do need public networks, but on those public
Speaker 3: networks you need the ability to have selective privacy and
Speaker 3: programmable privacy, and we're getting there luckily.
Speaker 1: Ethereums. Not luckily, it's by design.
Speaker 3: Etherem's architecture has invested in zero knowledge proof technology very
Speaker 3: heavily for our last five plus years across the Layer
Speaker 3: one and a lot of the Layer twos. So we
Speaker 3: have the tools in place to eat the privacy that's needed,
Speaker 3: and so we're gonna help build it. We're gonna help
Speaker 3: push the ball forward and create the privacy tools that
Speaker 3: will allow for actual mass adoption.
Speaker 1: And we're close. So, oh, for sure.
Speaker 2: A dumb question, and this is a very new question.
Speaker 1: No such thing.
Speaker 2: There are a lot of institutions building on Etherorem. Is
Speaker 2: there a cap as to how many layer twos can
Speaker 2: be on Etherorem? Does that slow to network down at
Speaker 2: some point let's say a million layer twos? Right? And
Speaker 2: this may be true early to answer to this question,
Speaker 2: but what are your thoughts around that?
Speaker 3: No, I think that the layer two designs pretty brilliant
Speaker 3: because layer twos themselves and customize their fees. They can
Speaker 3: customize how many times they post data to Layer one
Speaker 3: for security for example, everything can be toggled and customizable.
Speaker 3: That being said, Ethereum is continually increasing its capacity to
Speaker 3: have more and more Layer twos in anticipation of a
Speaker 3: world where we have millions of layer twos. So right now,
Speaker 3: if there are a million layer twos, fees would probably
Speaker 3: be a lot higher on Layer one. Sure there's an
Speaker 3: upgrade happening in a month, and there's more upgrades happening
Speaker 3: after where the capacity to have Layer twos while also
Speaker 3: maintaining security and decentralization on Ethereum is maintained perfectly. And
Speaker 3: that's that's what we're excited for. So I do see
Speaker 3: a world of thousands or more of Layer twos and
Speaker 3: ethereymobile to handle.
Speaker 2: That so exciting, Man Revec. We're going to have to
Speaker 2: do an in person and go more deeper into this,
Speaker 2: but thank you so much for joining.
Speaker 1: Me, Thanks for having me. It was fun.
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