WEBVTT 1 00:00:05.120 --> 00:00:09.759 Oh jee is, folks, it's showtime. People say good money 2 00:00:09.759 --> 00:00:12.160 to see this movie. When they go out to a theater. 3 00:00:12.439 --> 00:00:15.960 They want clod sodas, pop, popcorn, and no monsters. 4 00:00:16.120 --> 00:00:19.519 In the Projection Booth, everyone for tend podcasting isn't boring. 5 00:00:20.239 --> 00:00:38.079 Got it off? 6 00:00:40.039 --> 00:00:42.759 Hey, folks, welcome to a special episode of The Projection Booth. 7 00:00:42.759 --> 00:00:45.399 I'm your host Mike White. On this episode, I am 8 00:00:45.439 --> 00:00:49.079 talking with Martin Bean and Kevin Hebberd. They are the 9 00:00:49.200 --> 00:00:52.960 editors of the new documentary Drift from twenty twenty six. 10 00:00:53.320 --> 00:00:56.439 That is not the Drift, which is a narrative film 11 00:00:56.479 --> 00:01:00.439 also coming out this year. This is about Isaac Drift right. 12 00:01:01.000 --> 00:01:05.319 He is an Army veteran who loves to climb. He 13 00:01:05.480 --> 00:01:11.760 climbs a lot of tall buildings, take some absolutely stunning photographs. 14 00:01:12.120 --> 00:01:15.159 His stuff is all out on Instagram. I'm going to 15 00:01:15.239 --> 00:01:17.879 link to that. It was fascinating talking with Martin and 16 00:01:17.959 --> 00:01:21.280 Kevin all about how this project came together and how 17 00:01:21.319 --> 00:01:24.719 they work together to help shape this documentary, which was 18 00:01:24.760 --> 00:01:27.879 directed by Dion Taylor. As more details of the release 19 00:01:27.959 --> 00:01:31.120 come out, I will be sure to give updates otherwise. 20 00:01:31.280 --> 00:01:33.120 Thanks so much for listening, and I hope you enjoyed 21 00:01:33.159 --> 00:01:35.959 the interview. Kevin and Martin, I'm so curious. Tell me, 22 00:01:36.200 --> 00:01:37.760 how do you guys know each other? Why did you 23 00:01:37.760 --> 00:01:38.760 first start working together? 24 00:01:39.319 --> 00:01:40.959 And we met a while back. We were on a 25 00:01:41.400 --> 00:01:43.560 I think it was We're here. You don't know, it's 26 00:01:43.560 --> 00:01:46.319 been a while. I love Martin for at least a 27 00:01:46.359 --> 00:01:49.719 good five six maybe even longer than that. Years now. 28 00:01:50.480 --> 00:01:53.000 We were working on a either it was an Amazon 29 00:01:53.040 --> 00:01:56.560 project or an HBO project, and he was the lead 30 00:01:56.760 --> 00:02:01.120 on it. And so when I came in i met him. 31 00:02:01.879 --> 00:02:04.439 I always say, he's like always rough around the red edges, 32 00:02:04.480 --> 00:02:05.439 but you're always. 33 00:02:05.159 --> 00:02:05.959 Gonna love him. 34 00:02:06.319 --> 00:02:08.879 And that's exactly who he was. He like, he is 35 00:02:08.919 --> 00:02:10.560 who he is, and that's who what I love about 36 00:02:10.639 --> 00:02:13.199 him so much, so he doesn't just word it's what 37 00:02:13.280 --> 00:02:15.400 I love. We've known each other for a while. It's 38 00:02:15.400 --> 00:02:17.759 been really nice. Honestly, if we've done I don't know, 39 00:02:17.800 --> 00:02:19.639 five or six projects together at this point, so. 40 00:02:19.800 --> 00:02:20.479 It's quite a bit. 41 00:02:20.599 --> 00:02:21.280 Yeah. 42 00:02:21.439 --> 00:02:25.479 Is that pretty typical to work with co editor frequently 43 00:02:25.599 --> 00:02:25.840 like that? 44 00:02:26.639 --> 00:02:28.840 After I met Martin, I wanted to work with him 45 00:02:28.879 --> 00:02:32.120 all the time. When we were on Escaping Twin Flames, 46 00:02:32.520 --> 00:02:35.879 an editor had backed out and I immediately called Martin. 47 00:02:35.919 --> 00:02:37.960 I said, you got to get on this project. So 48 00:02:38.879 --> 00:02:39.840 he's this great editor. 49 00:02:40.400 --> 00:02:42.360 How do you guys work together? How do you split 50 00:02:42.479 --> 00:02:43.080 up the project? 51 00:02:43.759 --> 00:02:46.560 I don't know, Like it's more just taking scenes and 52 00:02:46.599 --> 00:02:50.360 seeing what, like we played our strengths. We don't have 53 00:02:50.400 --> 00:02:52.840 an unconventional approach to this. I don't think. 54 00:02:52.919 --> 00:02:56.560 I think we just we We compliment each other really well, 55 00:02:56.560 --> 00:02:59.000 and we work well together, and we understand each other's 56 00:02:59.039 --> 00:03:03.159 sensibilities instincts well enough that like we don't end up 57 00:03:03.199 --> 00:03:05.520 having to redo a lot of work. We can match tones, 58 00:03:05.599 --> 00:03:10.080 and we can retrofit sequences and work story in similar ways, 59 00:03:10.159 --> 00:03:13.840 and we communicate well. And we've worked well together long. 60 00:03:13.719 --> 00:03:16.280 Enough that like we have a we have an ability 61 00:03:16.280 --> 00:03:20.599 to communicate and like a shorthand that goes a long way. 62 00:03:21.280 --> 00:03:23.039 I imagine you both have to be working on the 63 00:03:23.080 --> 00:03:25.479 same type of software, are you both like Avid guys? 64 00:03:26.000 --> 00:03:28.159 It depends on what are the project calls for The 65 00:03:28.240 --> 00:03:30.639 last one that we did, Drift, that was all Adobe Premiere. 66 00:03:31.120 --> 00:03:33.240 For the most part, it's been Avid, but now Premiere 67 00:03:33.319 --> 00:03:36.680 is making its head away into the dock space. With 68 00:03:36.759 --> 00:03:39.360 this last project, there were so many different formats that 69 00:03:39.400 --> 00:03:41.280 we were working with. It just handled it like a pro. 70 00:03:41.479 --> 00:03:47.759 So yeah, there was go pro, drone footage, body cam docs, documentations, 71 00:03:48.520 --> 00:03:53.199 home movies from wayback in the early nineties. So what 72 00:03:53.520 --> 00:03:55.560 it could just handle any format it was. It handled 73 00:03:55.599 --> 00:03:59.080 it really well, thousands of hours of stuff like really, 74 00:03:59.159 --> 00:04:02.400 it chewed it all up and made it usable real quick. 75 00:04:02.960 --> 00:04:04.520 How did you guys get involved with Drift? 76 00:04:05.039 --> 00:04:07.520 So the last project we worked on, which was Escaping 77 00:04:07.560 --> 00:04:11.319 Twin Flames with the team and out Lesseners got involved 78 00:04:11.319 --> 00:04:16.399 with the company hit An Empire, and this project had started. 79 00:04:16.560 --> 00:04:19.800 There was like a loose rough cut of it, and 80 00:04:20.240 --> 00:04:22.120 since we had just worked with her, she reached out 81 00:04:22.160 --> 00:04:24.360 to both of us and said, this project would be 82 00:04:24.399 --> 00:04:26.879 great for you guys. So we're all like minded but 83 00:04:26.959 --> 00:04:30.879 have different We'll come from different you know, ethnic backgrounds 84 00:04:30.879 --> 00:04:33.120 and culture backgrounds, and we all just kind of like 85 00:04:33.199 --> 00:04:36.199 meshed well with the storyline. And I think that's another 86 00:04:36.240 --> 00:04:38.279 thing that why she reached out to us. 87 00:04:39.040 --> 00:04:40.959 And what kind of shape was the story in when 88 00:04:41.000 --> 00:04:41.480 you got. 89 00:04:41.279 --> 00:04:44.600 To it was it like wow, it was very long. 90 00:04:44.879 --> 00:04:49.399 It was a very long rough cut and so pacing 91 00:04:50.160 --> 00:04:52.720 story A lot of it was all over the place 92 00:04:53.399 --> 00:04:56.399 and it just needed to be reconformed, rethought a different 93 00:04:56.439 --> 00:04:59.879 way through, and Martin had started, actually had started before 94 00:05:00.040 --> 00:05:03.759 I did, before I came on. The previous editor did 95 00:05:03.759 --> 00:05:06.720 a really good job, but they didn't have enough time 96 00:05:07.000 --> 00:05:09.879 to really get the traction. They needed to figure out 97 00:05:09.920 --> 00:05:12.000 what the story was going to be and explored the story. 98 00:05:12.079 --> 00:05:14.839 And so got lucky because Martin was the one that 99 00:05:15.600 --> 00:05:18.240 sifted through all the footage and he parsed out a 100 00:05:18.279 --> 00:05:21.639 lot of the stuff that may not be necessary sadly 101 00:05:22.079 --> 00:05:25.439 for him. That's what I know, but I enjoy that, 102 00:05:25.560 --> 00:05:27.360 so it's my favorite part. 103 00:05:27.480 --> 00:05:30.399 So yeah, now, is that all the four hour cut 104 00:05:30.399 --> 00:05:32.639 footage or is that the raw footage? Are you going 105 00:05:32.680 --> 00:05:33.600 back to studs for this? 106 00:05:34.439 --> 00:05:39.199 Both end up using some of the framing that had 107 00:05:39.240 --> 00:05:42.720 been done, but yeah, no, a lot of it. Regardless 108 00:05:42.759 --> 00:05:44.560 of what you end up doing, right, you have to 109 00:05:44.839 --> 00:05:47.800 know what you have to work with, because otherwise you 110 00:05:47.839 --> 00:05:51.040 can never trust your decisions because like you're constantly second 111 00:05:51.040 --> 00:05:54.040 guessing yourself and saying, oh, because you accidentally explore it 112 00:05:54.439 --> 00:05:56.480 all the time. You got to be able to look 113 00:05:56.519 --> 00:05:59.600 at it and say, Okay, we're gonna approach this a 114 00:05:59.600 --> 00:06:03.560 certain way, and without an informed ability. 115 00:06:03.079 --> 00:06:05.920 To make that decision. You just you just hoping and praying, 116 00:06:06.000 --> 00:06:09.560 which is no way to get anything done, honestly. Yeah. No, 117 00:06:09.639 --> 00:06:13.360 we took sequences and stuff, but yeah, for a lot 118 00:06:13.399 --> 00:06:15.079 of it was just rebuilding it. 119 00:06:15.759 --> 00:06:18.439 Have you gotten into a project like this before where 120 00:06:18.519 --> 00:06:20.600 somebody else would come in and done stuff and then 121 00:06:20.680 --> 00:06:24.040 you're being brought in to finish things up a few times? 122 00:06:24.120 --> 00:06:27.800 Yeah, yeah, a few times. Yeah. Yeah. It's usually because 123 00:06:27.839 --> 00:06:29.839 they just want to see another way through, get another 124 00:06:29.959 --> 00:06:33.360 editor's vision on at what you would do differently, how 125 00:06:33.360 --> 00:06:35.040 would you tell this story? And most of the time 126 00:06:35.079 --> 00:06:37.399 it's like how would you tell it more succeedingly? More 127 00:06:37.800 --> 00:06:41.079 like just type how tight can you make the storyline 128 00:06:41.240 --> 00:06:43.920 and bring it down? Like we had it was like 129 00:06:43.920 --> 00:06:45.879 a four hour cut, and so we needed to get 130 00:06:45.879 --> 00:06:50.759 it pap sharpen it and refine it into into something that. 131 00:06:51.560 --> 00:06:54.360 Arcs a little more cleanly and lands a little more 132 00:06:54.639 --> 00:07:00.399 succinctly and you know, moves more with more intent. A 133 00:07:00.439 --> 00:07:02.439 lot of times things get lost in the sauce a 134 00:07:02.439 --> 00:07:05.639 little bit and you have really good ideas, right, but 135 00:07:05.759 --> 00:07:08.920 it's this big thing that like, and things fall apart 136 00:07:08.959 --> 00:07:11.560 for a variety of reasons. But like a lot of 137 00:07:11.560 --> 00:07:15.920 times things become forest for the tree situations, or things 138 00:07:15.959 --> 00:07:17.879 become too precious with certain people. 139 00:07:18.319 --> 00:07:21.959 It's difficult to do this right, Like it's this artwork. Yeah, 140 00:07:22.040 --> 00:07:26.240 especially with docs. The amount of hours of footage that 141 00:07:26.319 --> 00:07:28.839 you have if you can make you go crazy to 142 00:07:28.879 --> 00:07:32.519 think of, like how do I even start building this plane? 143 00:07:32.639 --> 00:07:36.040 Like with just the first edit, look at number one, 144 00:07:36.800 --> 00:07:41.680 so she when you know Isaac Wright, the main subject 145 00:07:41.720 --> 00:07:46.079 of Drift, he alone have what like two thousand photos 146 00:07:46.120 --> 00:07:48.759 that he had taken? How do you parse that down 147 00:07:48.839 --> 00:07:51.240 to what makes him who he is? 148 00:07:52.079 --> 00:07:54.680 Well, and turn it into a storytelling element, right, give 149 00:07:54.759 --> 00:07:57.040 it an arc and let it reflect the arc that 150 00:07:57.120 --> 00:08:00.360 you're trying to portray. You know, this guy gives us 151 00:08:00.360 --> 00:08:02.879 a bunch of photos that he likes, and so it's like, okay, 152 00:08:03.040 --> 00:08:05.759 how do we turn this into a thematic element? How 153 00:08:05.759 --> 00:08:08.720 do we make it part of the whole instead of 154 00:08:08.759 --> 00:08:09.879 just pretty stuff? 155 00:08:10.439 --> 00:08:12.839 Well, how do you even organize your thoughts around something 156 00:08:12.879 --> 00:08:16.439 like that? Are you doing like note cards or right now? 157 00:08:16.759 --> 00:08:19.480 How do you even decide this is how I'm going 158 00:08:19.519 --> 00:08:21.439 to start approaching this or how we are going to 159 00:08:21.439 --> 00:08:23.639 start approaching those I would say. 160 00:08:23.439 --> 00:08:25.519 No, cards are usually like a good start. I don't 161 00:08:25.519 --> 00:08:27.040 know if we used a lot of note cards on 162 00:08:27.079 --> 00:08:29.959 this one, because there was already kind of like it 163 00:08:30.000 --> 00:08:33.360 was already somewhat built, but I would think, like, no cards. 164 00:08:33.600 --> 00:08:35.879 There's like a program called MIRO. I don't do you 165 00:08:35.919 --> 00:08:38.120 know this? A mirror board was like we use that. 166 00:08:39.039 --> 00:08:42.039 I remember Martin when he first took it on, he 167 00:08:42.200 --> 00:08:43.960 was you just want to I just want to know 168 00:08:44.000 --> 00:08:46.919 how Isaac is able to do these things, And that 169 00:08:47.039 --> 00:08:49.120 was like, how does he get into a building? How 170 00:08:49.159 --> 00:08:51.440 does he take these photos? What is it that he 171 00:08:51.480 --> 00:08:53.639 does to even get to where he's at now? And 172 00:08:53.679 --> 00:08:56.360 that kind of was like ground floor. Right. 173 00:08:57.000 --> 00:08:59.279 When I go through things, I just take tons and 174 00:08:59.279 --> 00:09:02.759 tons and tons and tons of notes, not even because 175 00:09:02.759 --> 00:09:05.960 I'm necessarily going to use them again, but just because 176 00:09:06.000 --> 00:09:09.519 it helps me to like embed things in my mind 177 00:09:09.639 --> 00:09:14.080 and process things. As I'm watching footage, I'm constantly writing 178 00:09:14.120 --> 00:09:17.360 things down, just streams of consciousness, ideas for things or 179 00:09:17.440 --> 00:09:20.799 like shots that might match up with other things or 180 00:09:20.960 --> 00:09:25.480 anything really, and the mirror board helps tremendously. But at 181 00:09:25.519 --> 00:09:27.799 the end of the day, yeah, it's really about finding 182 00:09:27.840 --> 00:09:30.480 a hook for your beginning, right, because you used to 183 00:09:30.600 --> 00:09:35.200 know where your story starts, right, But in terms of constructing, 184 00:09:35.600 --> 00:09:38.960 like mechanically the beginning, you need a hook, get the 185 00:09:39.000 --> 00:09:41.279 audience in, and then you really got to be able 186 00:09:41.279 --> 00:09:44.519 to find a turn into your end, and you've got 187 00:09:44.559 --> 00:09:46.759 to be able to land something right. And if you 188 00:09:46.799 --> 00:09:50.759 can get those things together, then you can start stringing 189 00:09:50.840 --> 00:09:55.799 things together and finding pivots. Because to your point, like 190 00:09:55.840 --> 00:09:59.120 when you're constructing something, it's your pivots in your terms, 191 00:09:59.159 --> 00:10:02.480 which are really like the mechanical things, like not the 192 00:10:02.519 --> 00:10:05.240 story things, but the mechanical things that like can actually 193 00:10:05.240 --> 00:10:07.279 get you through a story and gets you through a doc. 194 00:10:07.639 --> 00:10:10.519 So it's about it's really about finding and isolating those things, 195 00:10:10.799 --> 00:10:12.360 and then you build into them. 196 00:10:12.240 --> 00:10:14.679 And build out of them as you can. I always 197 00:10:14.720 --> 00:10:17.720 start with what like grounds the subject. I guess what's 198 00:10:18.120 --> 00:10:22.440 like the human element, like what makes it evoke like 199 00:10:22.519 --> 00:10:25.000 some type of humanist to everyone that could easily understand. 200 00:10:25.039 --> 00:10:28.080 And once I find that one thing, then I can 201 00:10:28.120 --> 00:10:31.919 start building from there. That's pretty much actually the entire 202 00:10:32.039 --> 00:10:34.480 story of Isaac, right, It's like, why is he doing 203 00:10:34.480 --> 00:10:38.320 what he's doing? What is the cathartic moment that he 204 00:10:38.320 --> 00:10:40.879 would take the risk of climbing buildings to take photos. 205 00:10:41.519 --> 00:10:43.440 I don't want to spoil anything, obviously, I don't know what, 206 00:10:43.879 --> 00:10:47.879 but his reasons for doing it is what I latched 207 00:10:47.919 --> 00:10:51.840 onto and I could build from there. He battles with PTSD, 208 00:10:52.039 --> 00:10:56.600 he battles with childhood drama, and I don't want to 209 00:10:56.639 --> 00:11:00.759 speak for Isaac, but that's that's what grounded beginning of 210 00:11:00.799 --> 00:11:04.240 the narrative of his story of why he's doing these things. 211 00:11:04.240 --> 00:11:06.679 We expand on it more and you get to see 212 00:11:06.679 --> 00:11:08.080 how he got to where he is now. 213 00:11:08.159 --> 00:11:11.080 But yeah, I've looked through a lot of the images 214 00:11:11.200 --> 00:11:15.360 that he's taken out on the Instagram and it's just amazing. 215 00:11:15.440 --> 00:11:18.320 Some of these shots just start rap picking. 216 00:11:19.120 --> 00:11:21.240 We were all in that group text and occasionally he'll 217 00:11:21.279 --> 00:11:24.480 just show us what he's doing video wise, so you'll 218 00:11:24.519 --> 00:11:27.039 see him. He'll say, lick what I did today. He'll 219 00:11:27.039 --> 00:11:29.080 climb like he was climbing Times Square a couple months, 220 00:11:29.080 --> 00:11:30.759 like maybe a month ago. He was just like, here, 221 00:11:30.840 --> 00:11:33.399 here's some footage, you know, not not to put in 222 00:11:33.440 --> 00:11:35.720 the film, just to show that he's still doing. 223 00:11:36.360 --> 00:11:38.440 Martin, you talked about the whole idea of building in 224 00:11:38.679 --> 00:11:40.679 versus out kind of thing, and I'm curious as far 225 00:11:40.720 --> 00:11:43.399 as what what How did you decide like this is 226 00:11:43.440 --> 00:11:45.320 what we're going to do, or Kevin, you talked about 227 00:11:45.360 --> 00:11:48.120 like here's the one thing that I hooked onto and 228 00:11:48.120 --> 00:11:52.120 then that gave me the grounding basically to start you're building. 229 00:11:52.679 --> 00:11:54.720 How did you guys decide, Okay, we're going to do 230 00:11:54.799 --> 00:11:56.960 this scene the scene, or are we're going to do 231 00:11:57.000 --> 00:11:59.519 the overall package first? 232 00:11:59.799 --> 00:12:03.000 It's there's a lot of exploring this scene work because 233 00:12:03.000 --> 00:12:06.080 a lot of times you're directed by your limitations, right, 234 00:12:06.360 --> 00:12:08.639 It's more about what you don't have than what you have. 235 00:12:08.960 --> 00:12:11.840 You say, oh, okay, any one of these scenes can 236 00:12:13.240 --> 00:12:17.000 hit this plot point or hit this idea, this character point, 237 00:12:17.120 --> 00:12:20.120 but like, we only have one scene that can do 238 00:12:21.279 --> 00:12:24.759 this one thing, right, or we only have this moment 239 00:12:25.080 --> 00:12:29.679 that isn't even a scene that anchors this this other idea, right, 240 00:12:30.039 --> 00:12:33.879 And so it really becomes often and I can't give 241 00:12:33.919 --> 00:12:37.159 you a discrete example right now, I'm sorry, but it 242 00:12:37.200 --> 00:12:42.840 becomes often filling holes, right, and then backing into figuring 243 00:12:42.840 --> 00:12:46.159 out how to build the most complicated, most difficult things. 244 00:12:46.240 --> 00:12:48.720 Right, you say, Okay, we got everything we need. 245 00:12:48.799 --> 00:12:51.240 We think we think all of these things can execute 246 00:12:51.240 --> 00:12:53.919 these emotional ideas of these plot points, and now we 247 00:12:54.000 --> 00:12:55.720 got to fill these holes, and we got to get 248 00:12:55.960 --> 00:13:01.320 this idea across across the entire narrative. Now the whole 249 00:13:01.399 --> 00:13:04.720 narrative has to reflect a larger idea, so it all 250 00:13:04.919 --> 00:13:09.200 grows up together. And again it's all through communication and 251 00:13:09.279 --> 00:13:11.919 discussing over and over what these things are, not only 252 00:13:11.960 --> 00:13:14.799 what they're supposed to do mechanically and the plot points. 253 00:13:14.600 --> 00:13:16.679 That they're supposed to hit, but what they're supposed to 254 00:13:16.759 --> 00:13:18.840 do emotionally in terms of the larger arc. 255 00:13:19.200 --> 00:13:21.600 As you get closer and closer to the finish, you 256 00:13:21.639 --> 00:13:24.519 tighten it up and it all starts to resonate through 257 00:13:24.559 --> 00:13:30.120 itself with a hopefully at least right a singular idea or. 258 00:13:31.799 --> 00:13:33.039 Some sort of philosophy. 259 00:13:33.159 --> 00:13:36.200 Right, So it's not just the worst thing a documentary 260 00:13:36.240 --> 00:13:38.840 can be, in my opinion, is just a list of 261 00:13:38.879 --> 00:13:43.440 shit that happened, and so without any emotional, full or 262 00:13:43.559 --> 00:13:47.279 real real thought, right should make you think. 263 00:13:47.559 --> 00:13:50.080 So it's like really all about trying to get to 264 00:13:50.120 --> 00:13:53.320 that point. The story is pretty linear. In his lifetime, 265 00:13:53.960 --> 00:13:56.360 we kind of made buckets too. It was like buckets 266 00:13:56.399 --> 00:13:59.679 of information that we wanted to deliver when it was 267 00:13:59.720 --> 00:14:01.720 at We didn't want to put everything up at the 268 00:14:01.759 --> 00:14:05.559 front because of some algorithm. We wanted actually to get dold. 269 00:14:05.759 --> 00:14:09.240 You get like parts information out when it was necessary. 270 00:14:09.759 --> 00:14:12.679 And so I think that's what made this experience a 271 00:14:12.679 --> 00:14:17.360 lot easier, is because we weren't beholden to any kind 272 00:14:17.399 --> 00:14:22.679 of narrative style. And I think that's what the director dion. 273 00:14:23.519 --> 00:14:25.799 He also mentioned too, he didn't want it to be 274 00:14:25.919 --> 00:14:28.000 like your traditional dock. He didn't want it to cut 275 00:14:28.039 --> 00:14:30.440 the same way as a traditional dock. Things that you 276 00:14:30.440 --> 00:14:33.679 would be that were expected to happen. Granted, there are 277 00:14:33.720 --> 00:14:35.919 some moments at the top. We obviously do need a hook, 278 00:14:35.960 --> 00:14:39.440 and we obviously need a little cold open, but going 279 00:14:39.480 --> 00:14:43.240 on forward from that, it was basically you've just let 280 00:14:43.320 --> 00:14:46.120 us have fun and tell the story how we think 281 00:14:46.159 --> 00:14:51.080 it should be told. And then working with drift, Isaac Wright, 282 00:14:51.600 --> 00:14:53.879 he would go He was present the whole way through 283 00:14:54.000 --> 00:14:56.480 making sure that his story was being called properly. And 284 00:14:56.840 --> 00:14:59.840 he's an artist too, so he in a sense of 285 00:15:00.000 --> 00:15:02.600 almost like an editor where you wish you could edit it, 286 00:15:02.720 --> 00:15:04.799 just like when we even take a photos. I wish 287 00:15:04.840 --> 00:15:06.080 I could have done it this way, I could have 288 00:15:06.120 --> 00:15:09.960 colored it that way, and That's what the best part 289 00:15:10.000 --> 00:15:12.600 about editing is is that with flalls and all, you 290 00:15:12.720 --> 00:15:16.320 can still make something beautiful from it. We're of two 291 00:15:16.360 --> 00:15:20.399 different worlds, but brothers in arms in the trenches of 292 00:15:20.840 --> 00:15:23.519 telling his story. He always knew he wanted like his 293 00:15:23.559 --> 00:15:27.480 story would be told on a filmic level. And I 294 00:15:27.480 --> 00:15:30.320 think our first watchdown he was in love. And I 295 00:15:30.360 --> 00:15:33.440 gotta say, it's so hard whenever you're having a subject, 296 00:15:33.960 --> 00:15:37.480 here's a mirror against yourself. Enjoy watching this yourself for 297 00:15:37.519 --> 00:15:39.480 another for an hour and a half to two Our 298 00:15:39.480 --> 00:15:42.759 first cut was like two and a half hours two fifteen. 299 00:15:43.080 --> 00:15:48.000 Wasn't crazy, and he took it like a professional. It 300 00:15:48.039 --> 00:15:51.879 was very interesting to see his thought process through the whole. 301 00:15:52.879 --> 00:15:55.080 Just like I said, having a mirror pointed her at 302 00:15:55.080 --> 00:15:58.879 yourself the whole time. I can't imagine, as you can see, 303 00:15:59.039 --> 00:15:59.960 we suck in front of the camp. 304 00:16:00.279 --> 00:16:02.759 So yeah, I would probably crawl out of my own 305 00:16:02.799 --> 00:16:04.559 skin if I had to watch myself for two and 306 00:16:04.600 --> 00:16:05.279 a half hours. 307 00:16:05.279 --> 00:16:10.159 That's wild, especially when his story, like we had a 308 00:16:10.240 --> 00:16:13.360 couple of breakthrough moments in the interview that we didn't expect, 309 00:16:13.440 --> 00:16:17.279 especially dealing with his childhood trauma that no one knew happened. 310 00:16:17.279 --> 00:16:22.559 It's just Dion and the was Kate co producer. Kate, 311 00:16:23.360 --> 00:16:26.080 you know, just got this information about his past that 312 00:16:27.000 --> 00:16:29.639 really solidified why he's going up there to climb and 313 00:16:30.000 --> 00:16:32.720 what it is that he needs. It's almost like you 314 00:16:32.799 --> 00:16:35.399 have the hole that you need to fill and this 315 00:16:35.440 --> 00:16:36.759 is the way he was able to fill it. 316 00:16:37.480 --> 00:16:39.279 Not to get too much into the brass tacks, but 317 00:16:39.320 --> 00:16:41.679 I'm very curious as you guys are working together, and 318 00:16:41.720 --> 00:16:45.200 I imagine you're working remotely. You're not sitting in the 319 00:16:45.200 --> 00:16:48.440 same office, back to back, fingers on keyboards kind of thing. 320 00:16:49.279 --> 00:16:53.720 We cut this a lot in the office. Granted it 321 00:16:53.799 --> 00:16:56.399 was like maybe three days on and two days in 322 00:16:56.440 --> 00:16:58.000 the office, or three days in the office and two 323 00:16:58.080 --> 00:16:59.840 days at home, just so we can take our informations 324 00:16:59.840 --> 00:17:02.559 to cutting and bring it back together. But it was, 325 00:17:02.840 --> 00:17:04.640 like I said, like Dion wanted to make sure that 326 00:17:04.720 --> 00:17:09.000 it was like a family cutting this film together, so 327 00:17:09.519 --> 00:17:12.240 he'd ever wanted us to be at home cold time, 328 00:17:12.359 --> 00:17:14.720 like cutting docs. It's very hard to cut a dock 329 00:17:15.519 --> 00:17:16.559 isolate in isolation. 330 00:17:17.640 --> 00:17:20.960 Having each other as sounding boards has got to be great. 331 00:17:20.960 --> 00:17:23.559 And then how often does Deon get to see stuff 332 00:17:23.599 --> 00:17:26.720 and or the producer with Kate and they give notes 333 00:17:26.759 --> 00:17:27.440 on their stuff. 334 00:17:28.200 --> 00:17:31.240 It was every four days. Dion wanted this to see 335 00:17:31.240 --> 00:17:35.079 where we were at. He would come in and I 336 00:17:35.119 --> 00:17:36.720 call him like the idea. He's like an idea man. 337 00:17:36.759 --> 00:17:38.720 He's got these ideas, and then it's a hard job 338 00:17:38.759 --> 00:17:40.839 to take it back and see if we can accomplish 339 00:17:40.839 --> 00:17:42.759 it what he was asking. So Kate was. 340 00:17:42.720 --> 00:17:46.279 Working arm in arm with us every day, going through 341 00:17:46.319 --> 00:17:50.000 footage and grinding out story with us. And then Dion 342 00:17:50.279 --> 00:17:54.440 was coming in and wanted to keep himself fresh, so 343 00:17:54.559 --> 00:17:57.359 he he he would watch sections, but he wouldn't watch 344 00:17:57.400 --> 00:18:00.519 the whole thing, And so he gave us a lot 345 00:18:00.519 --> 00:18:03.359 of freedom to approach it the way we wanted to 346 00:18:03.559 --> 00:18:06.480 and the way we found, like to find our path 347 00:18:06.559 --> 00:18:09.240 through the subject. And then he would come in and 348 00:18:09.279 --> 00:18:12.960 give us notes on the whole thing, very like I 349 00:18:12.960 --> 00:18:16.799 don't know, it wasn't that common right to sit down 350 00:18:16.839 --> 00:18:18.400 and screen the whole thing and give full notes. 351 00:18:18.440 --> 00:18:20.960 So it was it was really the freedom was really nice. 352 00:18:20.960 --> 00:18:22.599 And he would come in and give us ideas and 353 00:18:22.640 --> 00:18:25.039 we worked to execute him and we'd meet each other 354 00:18:25.079 --> 00:18:26.200 halfway and all this stuff. 355 00:18:26.240 --> 00:18:30.160 But no, we had a ton of freedom to explore 356 00:18:30.200 --> 00:18:32.759 it and really figure it out, which I think is 357 00:18:33.240 --> 00:18:36.359 really what made it possible Honusly. Fortunately, I don't think 358 00:18:36.359 --> 00:18:38.279 there was a moment where he didn't like what we 359 00:18:38.279 --> 00:18:42.039 were doing, which is I think he said this south 360 00:18:42.039 --> 00:18:45.440 by Southwest, which was he just at one time he 361 00:18:45.559 --> 00:18:49.519 wanted to work with only people that he knew, and 362 00:18:49.559 --> 00:18:52.160 then he realized through cutting this stock that he wanted 363 00:18:52.160 --> 00:18:54.920 to work with people who are like minded. I think 364 00:18:54.960 --> 00:18:57.039 that was like his discovery in this process of cutting 365 00:18:57.039 --> 00:19:00.799 the stock, and it showed throughout the whole process. He 366 00:19:01.200 --> 00:19:04.000 would just throw an idea as crazy and wild as 367 00:19:04.000 --> 00:19:05.519 it could be and see if we could do it. 368 00:19:06.440 --> 00:19:08.839 How often were you guys at each other's throats and 369 00:19:08.920 --> 00:19:11.119 just screaming and yelling at each other and just like, no, 370 00:19:11.160 --> 00:19:12.680 it's got to be this way. No, No, it's going 371 00:19:12.720 --> 00:19:13.319 to be this way. 372 00:19:14.000 --> 00:19:17.000 I don't think we've ever gotten to that where we'rever 373 00:19:17.079 --> 00:19:19.240 at it like a standstill between what I want and 374 00:19:19.279 --> 00:19:22.839 what you want? Really right, Yeah, we're like we're. 375 00:19:22.720 --> 00:19:23.559 Below the line. 376 00:19:23.839 --> 00:19:26.319 None of our ideas are really going to survive anyway. 377 00:19:26.720 --> 00:19:30.920 Like we've been doing this long and yeah, we'll disagree 378 00:19:30.960 --> 00:19:34.000 about things and carry it through the whole thing, and 379 00:19:34.039 --> 00:19:35.960 it'll be like, I knew we should have done this 380 00:19:36.000 --> 00:19:37.759 with that instead of the other thing. 381 00:19:38.319 --> 00:19:40.759 But it's everything. 382 00:19:41.720 --> 00:19:45.720 Becomes subject to the to the thing itself, you know 383 00:19:45.759 --> 00:19:49.160 what I mean. Our preferences are really neither here nor there. 384 00:19:49.279 --> 00:19:53.000 And there's only one thing ever fought for in that 385 00:19:53.039 --> 00:19:56.279 whole project. That was it. It was only one and 386 00:19:56.319 --> 00:20:00.680 it was ten seconds shot of Isaac running a touch 387 00:20:00.759 --> 00:20:03.240 like running football into a touchdown. Like, then, did you 388 00:20:03.279 --> 00:20:06.240 win that fight? I did? It went pretty good. Yeah, 389 00:20:06.400 --> 00:20:09.519 that was one fight. One thing I wanted to keep 390 00:20:09.519 --> 00:20:12.000 in this whole doc is just little Isaac running with 391 00:20:12.000 --> 00:20:15.759 a football and scoring a touchdown. It gets bigger later 392 00:20:15.960 --> 00:20:18.640 of that same scene. But I don't know why I 393 00:20:18.680 --> 00:20:20.960 was so passionate about that. That said part I was 394 00:20:21.000 --> 00:20:25.640 talking about about grounding people in the cathartic human elements. 395 00:20:26.200 --> 00:20:29.519 I'll fight for those. Honestly. We don't yeah, get at 396 00:20:29.519 --> 00:20:32.279 each other very much at all. It's not I'm just 397 00:20:32.319 --> 00:20:34.759 happy to have somebody share the work. And that's the 398 00:20:34.799 --> 00:20:36.160 other thing I was about to say. The only thing 399 00:20:36.160 --> 00:20:39.920 we actually do ripe about are always like notes, it's 400 00:20:39.960 --> 00:20:40.960 never us since the problem. 401 00:20:41.039 --> 00:20:43.319