1 00:00:00,040 --> 00:00:00,760 Speaker 1: Good morning, Dan, sir. 2 00:00:00,800 --> 00:00:01,679 Speaker 2: How are you doing today? 3 00:00:02,600 --> 00:00:04,559 Speaker 1: I am doing very well. How you doing? 4 00:00:05,280 --> 00:00:07,679 Speaker 2: Absolutely fantastic? And I'm gonna start it off and I 5 00:00:07,759 --> 00:00:09,679 hope I'm not being freaky weird. But first of all, 6 00:00:09,679 --> 00:00:12,279 I don't trust AI. But this this thing that happened 7 00:00:12,320 --> 00:00:14,839 over the weekend in Iran, do you think AI technology 8 00:00:14,880 --> 00:00:15,720 had anything to do with it? 9 00:00:18,000 --> 00:00:21,359 Speaker 1: I mean, do I think AI technology had anything to 10 00:00:21,359 --> 00:00:22,480 do with it? In what level? 11 00:00:22,600 --> 00:00:24,239 Speaker 2: To make it so precise? 12 00:00:27,559 --> 00:00:32,640 Speaker 1: You know, what I can say with more confidence is 13 00:00:32,679 --> 00:00:37,640 that AI is absolutely being used to sway some decisions. 14 00:00:37,920 --> 00:00:40,679 You know, people are able to generate videos that look 15 00:00:40,840 --> 00:00:44,479 like it is actually of the scene people are and 16 00:00:44,479 --> 00:00:46,439 it's just spam those all over the internet. So I'm 17 00:00:46,520 --> 00:00:49,600 very confident saying that, regardless of you know, what is 18 00:00:49,600 --> 00:00:54,799 actually happening, AI is absolutely going to be changing our 19 00:00:54,840 --> 00:00:58,119 perception of what happens. And you see that all over 20 00:00:58,119 --> 00:00:59,280 the news, all over the news. 21 00:00:59,520 --> 00:01:01,560 Speaker 2: Well, I use said for show prep. And that's the 22 00:01:01,560 --> 00:01:03,719 thing about it. I'm not stealing their words. I just 23 00:01:03,840 --> 00:01:06,719 when I have a question, instead of going to eighteen 24 00:01:06,840 --> 00:01:09,640 billion pages on Google, I'll just go to chat, GPT 25 00:01:10,000 --> 00:01:11,799 and all of a sudden, it's all in one area. 26 00:01:12,959 --> 00:01:16,799 Speaker 1: Mm hmm, yeah, you're playing with fire, my friend. Oh no, 27 00:01:17,159 --> 00:01:21,560 you're playing with fire. Yeah. 28 00:01:21,560 --> 00:01:25,680 Speaker 2: Because with chat GPT, I don't know if it's clickbait. 29 00:01:26,000 --> 00:01:27,079 I don't know if I trust it. 30 00:01:28,599 --> 00:01:31,040 Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, the really interesting thing about chat shabt or 31 00:01:31,120 --> 00:01:33,879 any of these other large language models is from the 32 00:01:34,079 --> 00:01:36,599 from the standpoint of somebody who's using it, they can 33 00:01:36,640 --> 00:01:41,040 be confidently wrong. I mean, just so confidently wrong. You know. 34 00:01:41,239 --> 00:01:43,760 I'll give you an example. I was thinking, you know, 35 00:01:43,840 --> 00:01:46,879 it kills, which you know, I know, it sounds like 36 00:01:46,920 --> 00:01:49,879 we're telling everybody don't use AI, don't use a computer, 37 00:01:49,959 --> 00:01:51,599 or turn everything off. That's not what we're doing, right, 38 00:01:51,719 --> 00:01:53,959 We've never advocated for that. But you know, I was 39 00:01:54,000 --> 00:01:57,400 thinking about getting a new camera and I, you know, 40 00:01:57,519 --> 00:02:00,680 just asked it, Hey, you know, balance, give me the 41 00:02:00,680 --> 00:02:02,640 pros and cons of each of each of these models. 42 00:02:02,879 --> 00:02:05,079 And it was telling me this camera has this really 43 00:02:05,120 --> 00:02:07,719 important feature that I wanted, and I was thinking about 44 00:02:07,719 --> 00:02:09,960 getting it. Come to find out, go look up, go 45 00:02:10,000 --> 00:02:12,960 to get it. It doesn't have that extremely important feature. 46 00:02:13,039 --> 00:02:16,159 It doesn't have it at all. And I almost spent 47 00:02:16,199 --> 00:02:20,120 a couple thousand dollars on something that it doesn't have, 48 00:02:20,360 --> 00:02:24,120 so yeah, you always have to check it and that's it. 49 00:02:24,159 --> 00:02:26,479 That's on a good day that you can get away 50 00:02:26,479 --> 00:02:28,520 with just checking something, and that there are people who 51 00:02:28,520 --> 00:02:32,639 think of politicians even and numerous politicians have said this, 52 00:02:32,800 --> 00:02:34,479 Oh yeah, I just use chat GYBT and it gives 53 00:02:34,479 --> 00:02:36,520 me the answers. My friend, it does not give you 54 00:02:36,560 --> 00:02:41,680 the answers. It's that's not how this stuff works good 55 00:02:41,680 --> 00:02:42,639 at something's very bad. 56 00:02:42,680 --> 00:02:45,360 Speaker 2: At others, you're giving us a full vision of what 57 00:02:45,360 --> 00:02:47,719 we're missing. That's what I love about kill switch is 58 00:02:47,719 --> 00:02:49,120 that you're saying, by the way, I'm gonna tap you 59 00:02:49,120 --> 00:02:50,719 on the shoulder every time where I think you're you're 60 00:02:50,840 --> 00:02:54,199 you're gonna need an education here, and you're just so 61 00:02:54,439 --> 00:02:55,599 open and transparent. 62 00:02:55,680 --> 00:03:00,479 Speaker 1: Dude, Well, you know we The thing is, there things 63 00:03:00,479 --> 00:03:03,759 that we don't know. And when I say we, I 64 00:03:03,840 --> 00:03:05,840 mean there are things that you know, society doesn't know, 65 00:03:05,879 --> 00:03:08,000 you know, the non you know, technical people don't know. 66 00:03:08,360 --> 00:03:10,879 But there are things, quite frankly that even the people 67 00:03:10,879 --> 00:03:14,639 who make chat GPT don't fully understand why chat GPT 68 00:03:14,840 --> 00:03:17,120 does some things. And if you sit them down and 69 00:03:17,159 --> 00:03:19,879 you ask them why is it doing this? They don't know. 70 00:03:21,360 --> 00:03:24,080 That is kind of scary, and we should all be 71 00:03:24,240 --> 00:03:27,840 very open about that. That, hey, on the technology, and 72 00:03:27,840 --> 00:03:30,319 there's some things we don't understand, but there's also some 73 00:03:30,560 --> 00:03:36,919 open questions. You know, would we like for AI to 74 00:03:37,000 --> 00:03:42,639 be helping police arrest people? That that's not necessarily a 75 00:03:42,719 --> 00:03:45,919 yes or no question for everybody, but we should be 76 00:03:45,960 --> 00:03:47,719 aware that it's happening, which a lot of people aren't 77 00:03:47,719 --> 00:03:49,840 aware that it's happening. It's not science fiction. This is 78 00:03:49,879 --> 00:03:54,800 happening right now. And okay, how should this be used? 79 00:03:55,000 --> 00:03:58,439 Should AI be used in quote unquote solving crime? And 80 00:03:59,280 --> 00:04:04,319 we're not the general public is not being allowed into 81 00:04:04,360 --> 00:04:07,759 those conversations and a kill switch, we say, nope, we 82 00:04:08,080 --> 00:04:10,199 need to be involved in those We should know what's happening. 83 00:04:10,439 --> 00:04:11,240 We have the right to know. 84 00:04:11,800 --> 00:04:13,879 Speaker 2: How do you feel though, when people say you've just 85 00:04:13,919 --> 00:04:16,519 got to live with AI? Sometimes I feel like that 86 00:04:16,519 --> 00:04:20,560 we're being dumbed and down. It's like, because I love 87 00:04:20,680 --> 00:04:22,439 to do research, I love to make sure that my 88 00:04:22,480 --> 00:04:25,199 spelling is correctly, but it's like, why am I having 89 00:04:25,199 --> 00:04:27,720 a problem with spelling because I'm being dumbed down? 90 00:04:29,319 --> 00:04:32,199 Speaker 1: You know, it's funny you mentioned that an MIT study 91 00:04:32,720 --> 00:04:35,959 just came out. I think last week that said that 92 00:04:36,920 --> 00:04:41,560 relying on AI can potentially reduce your ability for critical thinking. 93 00:04:41,560 --> 00:04:44,439 Oh boy, I mean think about it. It's it's like, 94 00:04:44,519 --> 00:04:47,399 you know, it's like doing push ups. If if you 95 00:04:47,560 --> 00:04:49,920 do you know, if you do a couple push ups, 96 00:04:50,000 --> 00:04:52,319 you know, a day or something like that, and then 97 00:04:52,519 --> 00:04:56,160 just for a year, you never you don't lift anything 98 00:04:56,199 --> 00:04:58,120 at all, and then try and then you need to 99 00:04:58,120 --> 00:04:59,560 do a push up. You can have a really hard 100 00:04:59,600 --> 00:05:02,319 time doing push ups. Same thing. Your brain is a muscle. 101 00:05:02,959 --> 00:05:05,600 You know, if I can speak metaphorically, if you're used 102 00:05:05,600 --> 00:05:08,759 to making decisions about what kind of camera should I buy? 103 00:05:09,279 --> 00:05:11,839 Should I let my kid eat you know, these fruit 104 00:05:11,920 --> 00:05:15,240 snacks or eat this cake or eat this apple? Should 105 00:05:15,279 --> 00:05:18,360 I say this to my boss or not say this 106 00:05:18,399 --> 00:05:21,240 to my boss? And you leave all that to the computer. 107 00:05:22,199 --> 00:05:25,160 Then one day when you're not buy a computer or 108 00:05:25,160 --> 00:05:28,000 something else and you need to make a decision, you're 109 00:05:28,040 --> 00:05:31,680 gonna have a harder time making that decision. So these 110 00:05:31,720 --> 00:05:34,279 are societal things that we don't necessarily really think about. 111 00:05:34,319 --> 00:05:36,680 Where you know, this isn't is a computer? You know, 112 00:05:36,839 --> 00:05:38,639 is the computer going to go full sky Net and 113 00:05:39,040 --> 00:05:41,360 destroy of all of us? Okay? You know let's leave 114 00:05:41,399 --> 00:05:44,000 that for a little bit in the future. This stuff 115 00:05:44,040 --> 00:05:46,439 is having effects on us right now. 116 00:05:47,759 --> 00:05:51,240 Speaker 2: Two major stories came out this weekend with AI technology 117 00:05:51,279 --> 00:05:54,480 firmly attached to them. Number one, the book that copied 118 00:05:54,480 --> 00:05:57,040 the other author and all of a sudden, people are going, 119 00:05:57,079 --> 00:05:59,240 what is going on here because now it's got book 120 00:05:59,279 --> 00:06:02,759 talk and TikTok can trouble. And number two, the Tesla 121 00:06:02,839 --> 00:06:06,480 taxi that's not like all over the dang news, that's AI. 122 00:06:07,399 --> 00:06:10,680 Speaker 1: Mm hmmm. Yeah. And again this is this is one 123 00:06:10,759 --> 00:06:16,120 of those things where I think we're being told, oh, yes, 124 00:06:16,279 --> 00:06:21,160 by we're being told that listen, it's here, it's always 125 00:06:21,160 --> 00:06:26,000 going to be here, deal with it. And that's not 126 00:06:26,120 --> 00:06:29,839 actually that's not actually the case. That's not actually the case. 127 00:06:29,839 --> 00:06:33,000 We we still have the ability to make decisions about 128 00:06:33,079 --> 00:06:36,800 how much involvement we want the AI to have in 129 00:06:36,800 --> 00:06:41,120 our lives. You know, maybe a robotaxi is a great idea, 130 00:06:42,360 --> 00:06:46,480 or maybe better wages for drivers is a great idea, 131 00:06:47,240 --> 00:06:51,120 or maybe more train lines is a great idea. I 132 00:06:51,160 --> 00:06:53,839 don't know, you tell me these No, I just gave 133 00:06:53,879 --> 00:06:57,959 you three options. Maybe there's ten options, but the idea 134 00:06:58,000 --> 00:07:00,319 and maybe those three options that I gave you all 135 00:07:00,360 --> 00:07:02,800 sound great or all sound bad to you. But the 136 00:07:02,879 --> 00:07:05,079 idea here is that these are all decisions that we 137 00:07:05,120 --> 00:07:09,079 can make, and what's happening is be a little flipping here. 138 00:07:09,120 --> 00:07:12,160 There's this As a society, we've gotten used to this 139 00:07:12,279 --> 00:07:16,240 idea that there's a small group of nerds in Silicon Valley. 140 00:07:16,319 --> 00:07:18,399 And you know, I'm not being mean here, me being 141 00:07:18,560 --> 00:07:20,319 nerd myself. You know, growing up a nerd, you know 142 00:07:20,360 --> 00:07:22,120 what I mean. I bought my first computer as soon 143 00:07:22,160 --> 00:07:24,639 as I could, and I was programming, man, you know 144 00:07:24,680 --> 00:07:26,800 all this other stuff. Man, that's me. But we've gotten 145 00:07:26,839 --> 00:07:28,519 used to this idea that there's a small group of 146 00:07:28,560 --> 00:07:31,480 nerds in Silicon Valley who handle all the computer stuff. 147 00:07:31,680 --> 00:07:34,279 You do the computer stuff, I'll just look at what 148 00:07:34,319 --> 00:07:36,480 you do on my phone, or when you release something, 149 00:07:36,519 --> 00:07:40,600 I'll use it, Or that some politicians get to make 150 00:07:40,720 --> 00:07:45,360 choices about what we do with our lives as respect 151 00:07:45,399 --> 00:07:47,600 to technology, and that's not the case at all. We 152 00:07:47,639 --> 00:07:49,720 get to make these decisions. We either people who use 153 00:07:49,759 --> 00:07:52,879 these things or who use us for our data. We 154 00:07:53,000 --> 00:07:55,920 make these decisions too. But we need to be informed 155 00:07:55,959 --> 00:07:58,480 about what's happening. 156 00:07:59,319 --> 00:08:01,160 Speaker 2: I'm a face to person if you can't give me 157 00:08:01,160 --> 00:08:03,199 face to face time. We're not doing it. And you know, 158 00:08:03,399 --> 00:08:04,959 because those things when I get on the phone and 159 00:08:05,000 --> 00:08:06,720 all of a sudden, I'm talking to an AI voice, 160 00:08:06,720 --> 00:08:07,519 I can't do it. 161 00:08:08,480 --> 00:08:11,720 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, oh, and you know, and we'd kind of 162 00:08:11,759 --> 00:08:13,759 being sold that. No, No, you'll get used to it. 163 00:08:13,879 --> 00:08:16,680 You'll get used to it. And that's the thing. People. 164 00:08:17,279 --> 00:08:20,519 People are humans that are an amazingly adaptive species. We 165 00:08:20,560 --> 00:08:22,319 will get used to almost anything. Have you been in 166 00:08:22,360 --> 00:08:25,839 a way mo, No, Oh my gosh. So you know 167 00:08:26,120 --> 00:08:28,560 you know what I'm talking about, right, the same thing robotaxis. Right, 168 00:08:28,959 --> 00:08:32,000 I've been in one. You would be shocked. So I 169 00:08:32,000 --> 00:08:33,879 didn't want to get in, you know, full disclosure. So 170 00:08:34,000 --> 00:08:35,720 you know, I was in San Francisco and some friends 171 00:08:35,720 --> 00:08:37,679 wanted to get in, and you know, I had to 172 00:08:37,679 --> 00:08:39,039 get in with them. We're going to some bar or 173 00:08:39,039 --> 00:08:42,080 something like that, and okay, I get in and it 174 00:08:42,120 --> 00:08:45,360 went from in about two minutes, it went from this 175 00:08:45,399 --> 00:08:49,519 is really weird to I forgot that there wasn't somebody driving. 176 00:08:49,559 --> 00:08:50,440 Speaker 2: Oh my god. 177 00:08:51,080 --> 00:08:54,879 Speaker 1: Humans are such an adaptive species that something that seemed 178 00:08:54,919 --> 00:08:59,120 like magic five minutes ago will just seem normal to us. 179 00:08:59,759 --> 00:09:02,919 That being said, the things that are being sold to us, 180 00:09:02,919 --> 00:09:05,600 the things that are being pushed on us by you know, Frankly, again, 181 00:09:05,639 --> 00:09:08,360 when I say pushed on us, it's a This is 182 00:09:08,360 --> 00:09:10,240 not a government that is doing this, is not an 183 00:09:10,360 --> 00:09:12,759 organization of like minded people. This is you know, these 184 00:09:12,759 --> 00:09:15,960 are companies that stand to make some money. Is this 185 00:09:16,039 --> 00:09:19,039 something we want? And if it is something we want, 186 00:09:19,320 --> 00:09:22,039 how should it be used? It doesn't necessarily have to 187 00:09:22,039 --> 00:09:24,039 be used in the way that Meta wants us to 188 00:09:24,120 --> 00:09:25,720 use it, or Google wants us to use it, or 189 00:09:25,759 --> 00:09:27,840 the makers of chat GBT open a I want us 190 00:09:27,840 --> 00:09:31,080 to use it. Perhaps there's other ways to use these possibilities, 191 00:09:31,120 --> 00:09:33,679 these technologies, but we should be able to make those decisions. 192 00:09:34,200 --> 00:09:37,120 Speaker 2: Scary stuff here, scary stuff. We'll be back with Dexter 193 00:09:37,159 --> 00:09:41,759 Thomas Junior. Coming up next. The name of the podcast 194 00:09:41,919 --> 00:09:45,080 is kill Switch. We are back with Dexter Thomas Junior. 195 00:09:45,919 --> 00:09:47,519 I got to tell you how freaky this day has 196 00:09:47,559 --> 00:09:49,679 been in the way that not even thirty minutes ago, 197 00:09:49,720 --> 00:09:53,440 I was with George Takai, who's talking about everything Star Trek, 198 00:09:53,559 --> 00:09:55,519 and all of a sudden, I'm having this conversation with you, 199 00:09:55,559 --> 00:09:58,320 and I'm going, holy crap, Star Trek could actually be real. 200 00:09:58,799 --> 00:09:59,000 Speaker 1: You know. 201 00:09:59,039 --> 00:10:01,799 Speaker 2: It's like, you know, it's so bizarre that it's It's 202 00:10:02,159 --> 00:10:05,039 like on Star Trek it was always about the future, 203 00:10:05,080 --> 00:10:07,559 and you're you're talking about that's where we're going, dude. 204 00:10:08,720 --> 00:10:10,960 Speaker 1: Yeah, well, you know, I mean, think about it. When 205 00:10:11,360 --> 00:10:13,960 when George k was on, I mean, shout out to him, man, 206 00:10:14,000 --> 00:10:16,600 I mean amazing you get to talk to him. You know, 207 00:10:16,960 --> 00:10:22,080 the future sounded like a great place. Yeah, I mean 208 00:10:22,159 --> 00:10:25,000 think about that. Think about Jetson's. I mean, Jetson's was 209 00:10:25,080 --> 00:10:27,519 kind of a parody, but we got everything but except 210 00:10:27,519 --> 00:10:30,720 for the flying cars now, but it sounded great. The 211 00:10:30,799 --> 00:10:34,120 future sounded really cool and it was optimistic. Now, ask 212 00:10:34,200 --> 00:10:36,159 almost any about the future and they're scared out of 213 00:10:36,159 --> 00:10:38,879 their minds. Yep, yep. Yeah. And I can tell you why. 214 00:10:38,919 --> 00:10:43,960 It's not because AI specifically, it's not because of computers 215 00:10:44,039 --> 00:10:47,639 or whatever. Specifically, it's because we feel like we don't 216 00:10:47,679 --> 00:10:51,559 have control, and largely it has been taken away from 217 00:10:51,679 --> 00:10:54,759 us because we've allowed, again say it again, a small 218 00:10:54,840 --> 00:10:57,159 group of nerds in Silicon Valley to make some decisions. 219 00:10:57,519 --> 00:10:59,519 And it doesn't have to be like that. 220 00:11:00,120 --> 00:11:03,240 Speaker 2: I did some research on uncertainty and The reason why 221 00:11:03,279 --> 00:11:06,000 we many of us are are uncertain is because we're 222 00:11:06,000 --> 00:11:07,600 trying to get back to a past that we would 223 00:11:07,639 --> 00:11:09,519 like to rewrite. And so when you say that we're 224 00:11:09,559 --> 00:11:11,120 afraid of the future, of course we are because we 225 00:11:11,120 --> 00:11:13,360 don't know what's what's up there. We would rather live 226 00:11:13,399 --> 00:11:14,639 in the past that we already know. 227 00:11:15,600 --> 00:11:18,120 Speaker 1: Mm hmmm, m m. Yeah. I think that makes a 228 00:11:18,159 --> 00:11:19,840 lot of sense. And I think there was there was 229 00:11:19,879 --> 00:11:22,720 also a time, you know, when we were you know, 230 00:11:22,720 --> 00:11:24,879 think of the night, you know, think of how we 231 00:11:24,879 --> 00:11:27,639 were so into futuristic stuff. You know, there was a 232 00:11:27,639 --> 00:11:29,360 little there was the Y two K thing, you know, 233 00:11:29,360 --> 00:11:30,799 the Y two K, but we were a little scared 234 00:11:30,840 --> 00:11:33,440 about that. But you know, think about how music videos 235 00:11:33,440 --> 00:11:36,159 look back then. It's oh, everything's silver and shiny. We're 236 00:11:36,159 --> 00:11:37,960 going to be in space and you know, we're gonna 237 00:11:37,960 --> 00:11:39,720 be able to talk to each other using computers. We 238 00:11:39,799 --> 00:11:43,919 do that now and we all kind of resent it, 239 00:11:44,799 --> 00:11:48,679 you know, and yet no, but I think you're totally correct. Yeah. 240 00:11:48,720 --> 00:11:51,639 Speaker 2: One of the scariest things with AI recently happened a 241 00:11:51,679 --> 00:11:53,679 month ago, and that is I was at this big 242 00:11:53,720 --> 00:11:56,840 retirement party and they played a song that sounded so 243 00:11:57,120 --> 00:11:59,799 amazingly perfect in the way that it was very frank 244 00:12:00,080 --> 00:12:02,240 Natra and I said, I went up to the person, 245 00:12:02,279 --> 00:12:06,200 I said, who is that actually singing? Nobody? It's a computer. 246 00:12:06,320 --> 00:12:10,399 It was AI generated And it scared the bejeebi's at 247 00:12:10,480 --> 00:12:12,519 me because that I was so convinced that that was 248 00:12:12,559 --> 00:12:13,639 a great piece of music. 249 00:12:14,480 --> 00:12:19,320 Speaker 1: Mm hmmm, yeah, you know. And again this is somewhere 250 00:12:20,080 --> 00:12:25,799 where I'm really encouraging us to think about what role 251 00:12:25,840 --> 00:12:29,639 do we want technology to have our lives. For some people, 252 00:12:30,320 --> 00:12:36,279 having fake AI music is totally fine, They're totally cool 253 00:12:36,279 --> 00:12:40,039 with that. For other people that it's it's almost blasphemy, right, 254 00:12:40,240 --> 00:12:42,519 that freaks me out. That freaks me out somebody who 255 00:12:42,679 --> 00:12:46,159 loves electronic music, I love techno. I kind of still 256 00:12:46,159 --> 00:12:48,840 want my techno made by a person. Yeah, you know 257 00:12:48,840 --> 00:12:50,879 what I mean. I kind of still you know, I 258 00:12:50,960 --> 00:12:53,440 want I want those decisions to be made by Well, 259 00:12:53,440 --> 00:12:55,200 I wonder why they did this, Why did they use 260 00:12:55,240 --> 00:12:57,679 that weird little, you know, squeaky sound in there, that 261 00:12:57,720 --> 00:13:00,960 really buzz sound. That's really interesting. There's some human about it, 262 00:13:01,679 --> 00:13:05,120 but we're I think if we look back at today, 263 00:13:05,840 --> 00:13:07,799 ten years in the future, fifty years in the future, 264 00:13:08,600 --> 00:13:11,240 we will think of this period right now, right now, 265 00:13:11,279 --> 00:13:15,480 this period that we're living through, as a turning point, 266 00:13:15,720 --> 00:13:18,559 and what decisions did we make? And you know, not 267 00:13:18,639 --> 00:13:21,480 to throw the name of the podcast out here, but 268 00:13:21,759 --> 00:13:23,879 are there some things that we need to throw the 269 00:13:23,919 --> 00:13:26,879 kill switch on? And kill switch is you know, being 270 00:13:26,879 --> 00:13:29,360 a technical term, but you know it sounds like exactly 271 00:13:29,360 --> 00:13:31,840 what it is. Do we need to shut the system 272 00:13:31,879 --> 00:13:34,879 down for just a second, rethink this and maybe do 273 00:13:34,960 --> 00:13:38,360 something else. Again, I'm not telling people don't use AI ands. 274 00:13:38,360 --> 00:13:40,320 As a matter of fact, I've interviewed plenty of people 275 00:13:40,320 --> 00:13:42,559 about AI and none of them have said AI is 276 00:13:42,639 --> 00:13:45,879 universally bad, don't ever use it. Nobody's saying that just 277 00:13:46,519 --> 00:13:48,120 maybe we need to pause, maybe we need to hit 278 00:13:48,159 --> 00:13:50,879 you know, maybe reset and think about this. 279 00:13:51,320 --> 00:13:53,799 Speaker 2: Would you say that we're living in a beatless moment 280 00:13:53,840 --> 00:13:54,720 when it comes to AI? 281 00:13:56,279 --> 00:13:57,840 Speaker 1: Ooh Beatles' moment? What sense? 282 00:13:58,080 --> 00:14:00,960 Speaker 2: Maaning? Our lives are going to change, just like they 283 00:14:01,120 --> 00:14:04,240 changed when the Beatles came out? I mean everything changed? 284 00:14:05,320 --> 00:14:08,360 Speaker 1: Yeah? Oh, I mean, you know this is one of 285 00:14:08,399 --> 00:14:13,440 those things where I think Beatles plus Michael Jackson plus 286 00:14:13,519 --> 00:14:17,639 James Brown plus I mean, you know, the Beethoven at 287 00:14:17,720 --> 00:14:22,440 all of it, right, and not necessarily because we are 288 00:14:23,120 --> 00:14:27,600 it's going to advance our ability to solve certain diseases, 289 00:14:27,639 --> 00:14:31,759 which is possible, very possible. Actually, not just because it 290 00:14:31,799 --> 00:14:35,879 will take jobs, which is possible. That's also possible, but 291 00:14:35,960 --> 00:14:39,240 also because it's kind of starting to warp our perception 292 00:14:39,320 --> 00:14:43,159 of reality any news event. I mean, I'll just put 293 00:14:43,200 --> 00:14:46,879 it like this, I would. I'm in Los Angeles, as 294 00:14:46,879 --> 00:14:49,919 you know. There have been a lot of protests here, yep. 295 00:14:50,000 --> 00:14:52,519 And I've I've been out there with the camera every 296 00:14:52,600 --> 00:14:56,480 day as a journalist documenting it, and I have seen 297 00:14:56,559 --> 00:14:59,519 and I've posted videos, Hey, here's what I saw, Here's 298 00:14:59,519 --> 00:15:03,279 what I saw, and look at this. But I've also 299 00:15:03,360 --> 00:15:07,559 seen people posting videos that look very realistic. They're also 300 00:15:07,720 --> 00:15:10,960 much more dramatic than my videos, you know, showing police 301 00:15:11,000 --> 00:15:14,799 and protesters beating each other up, fires in the background, 302 00:15:14,919 --> 00:15:19,919 really dramatic stuff didn't happen AI generated. But it's more exciting. 303 00:15:20,720 --> 00:15:24,320 And there are a lot of people who believe that 304 00:15:24,480 --> 00:15:27,159 or want to believe it, and those images are the 305 00:15:27,159 --> 00:15:31,039 ones that travel further. Is this okay? I don't know. 306 00:15:31,080 --> 00:15:34,200 Speaker 2: You tell me, don't you think that you're lifting the 307 00:15:34,200 --> 00:15:36,480 game of journalism in what you're doing today, because I mean, 308 00:15:36,799 --> 00:15:39,600 there's so many Edward R. Morrow. I mean, it's like, 309 00:15:39,639 --> 00:15:41,360 this is like I would love to see what his 310 00:15:41,399 --> 00:15:43,399 reaction would be if he were here today to find 311 00:15:43,399 --> 00:15:45,919 out what people like yourself are doing. You're heading to 312 00:15:46,039 --> 00:15:47,600 the soul of a story. 313 00:15:49,080 --> 00:15:52,679 Speaker 1: Well, you know, I mean again, the real big thing 314 00:15:52,720 --> 00:15:55,559 here and the thing that frustrates me about tech reporting 315 00:15:55,879 --> 00:16:02,360 and technology reporting in general, is we again we've allowed 316 00:16:02,360 --> 00:16:06,600 ourselves to feel like we're not allowed to participate. And 317 00:16:07,000 --> 00:16:09,879 I'm just trying to bring the audience. You don't bring 318 00:16:09,919 --> 00:16:13,480 people back into it. You understand what I mean. I mean, 319 00:16:13,639 --> 00:16:16,919 I'll put it like this. My grandma just turned ninety yesterday. 320 00:16:17,440 --> 00:16:20,519 Called her on her birthday, and if I make an 321 00:16:20,559 --> 00:16:22,840 episode that she doesn't understand, she will call me and 322 00:16:22,879 --> 00:16:27,879 yell at meh. And so my grandma understands everything. You know. 323 00:16:28,399 --> 00:16:30,399 Let me give you my grandma some credit, like she's 324 00:16:30,679 --> 00:16:34,519 very sharp, super smart. But I fully expect anybody to 325 00:16:34,559 --> 00:16:38,200 be able to understand what we make because I think 326 00:16:38,200 --> 00:16:39,879 that's a duty that we have. I think, you know, 327 00:16:40,159 --> 00:16:41,919 it's my duty as a host of the show, but 328 00:16:41,960 --> 00:16:44,399 I think also it's a duty as people and I 329 00:16:44,559 --> 00:16:47,000 just want to make sure that we are all involved, 330 00:16:47,080 --> 00:16:51,080 we all understand. So just in the way that you 331 00:16:51,120 --> 00:16:53,960 read about the economy, and if you read an article 332 00:16:53,960 --> 00:16:55,840 about the economy and you think, ah, there's something wrong here, 333 00:16:55,960 --> 00:16:58,519 I don't understand it. Part of that is, you know, 334 00:16:59,039 --> 00:17:01,960 on the reporting, or part of that is you should 335 00:17:01,960 --> 00:17:03,519 be able to understand it. You should be able to 336 00:17:03,600 --> 00:17:06,960 understand the article about politics. We shouldn't allow people to 337 00:17:07,000 --> 00:17:09,440 tell us you don't understand technology, leave it alone. No, 338 00:17:10,039 --> 00:17:13,319 we all, we all have the right to understand. And 339 00:17:13,640 --> 00:17:16,680 that same approach that's taken in every other angle of journalism, 340 00:17:16,720 --> 00:17:20,480 every other place. Technology is no exception. We all have 341 00:17:20,559 --> 00:17:23,119 the right to understand how this affects our lives. 342 00:17:23,480 --> 00:17:26,240 Speaker 2: So when you're out there getting the story, how do 343 00:17:26,319 --> 00:17:28,519 you put it in line? In because I mean, the 344 00:17:28,640 --> 00:17:30,559 one thing that that aka come to you as a 345 00:17:30,559 --> 00:17:33,200 brilliant idea today and then and you're going, oh my god, 346 00:17:33,240 --> 00:17:35,400 I still have seven or eight episodes before this one. 347 00:17:35,519 --> 00:17:38,240 How do you have you can relate with me? Can't 348 00:17:38,279 --> 00:17:40,400 you that you? Yes, I mean I could bust the 349 00:17:40,400 --> 00:17:42,480 door open right now, but it has to wait. 350 00:17:43,519 --> 00:17:49,160 Speaker 1: Mm hmm. You know, I mean for this at least 351 00:17:49,160 --> 00:17:54,839 for kill switch, right. We we actually we focus somewhat 352 00:17:54,839 --> 00:17:58,839 on being timely, but not as much as some other places. 353 00:17:59,200 --> 00:18:03,599 My hope is for people to be able to come 354 00:18:03,640 --> 00:18:07,480 back to an episode in a year even and it 355 00:18:07,559 --> 00:18:08,680 still feels relevant. 356 00:18:08,759 --> 00:18:09,359 Speaker 2: Yeah, it does. 357 00:18:10,559 --> 00:18:12,519 Speaker 1: For an example, I mean the most recent one. Again, 358 00:18:12,640 --> 00:18:17,039 speaking of the protests, a lot of people were not 359 00:18:17,200 --> 00:18:21,079 aware that there were predator drones flying over Los Angeles. 360 00:18:22,039 --> 00:18:25,759 And predator drones if you've for your audiences, who's heard 361 00:18:25,759 --> 00:18:28,640 this before, if you've heard of a predator drone, those 362 00:18:28,680 --> 00:18:30,839 are the same things that are used for military strikes 363 00:18:30,839 --> 00:18:34,960 in the Middle East, and the same technology. Now, granted 364 00:18:35,319 --> 00:18:36,960 we have no reason to believe that these things were 365 00:18:36,960 --> 00:18:40,839 actually armed or carrying missiles. Very probably unarmed, but the 366 00:18:40,880 --> 00:18:46,279 same technology was was flying over and watching the protests. 367 00:18:47,200 --> 00:18:52,000 But the government and you know, border patrolled home security 368 00:18:52,000 --> 00:18:55,400 were not telling anybody that they were flying these things. 369 00:18:55,720 --> 00:18:59,559 Some independent researchers had to figure this out by looking 370 00:18:59,599 --> 00:19:03,119 at you know, they were flying the strange hexagonal pattern 371 00:19:03,599 --> 00:19:06,640 over two areas of Los Angeles where the protests were. Now, 372 00:19:06,839 --> 00:19:08,960 maybe you think it's a great idea for these things 373 00:19:09,000 --> 00:19:11,599 to be monitored, or maybe you feel a little bit 374 00:19:11,640 --> 00:19:15,720 weird that military hardware is being used to watch again, everybody. 375 00:19:15,920 --> 00:19:20,160 This includes protesters, this includes business owners, This includes somebody 376 00:19:20,160 --> 00:19:22,000 who says, you know what, I don't believe the news. 377 00:19:22,240 --> 00:19:24,440 I want to go and just watch for myself. I 378 00:19:24,480 --> 00:19:27,799 met lots of those people. Everybody was being watched. Are 379 00:19:27,839 --> 00:19:30,640 you comfortable with that? For some people this is great. 380 00:19:30,680 --> 00:19:34,480 For other people, they feel a little odd. We should know, though, Yeah, 381 00:19:34,880 --> 00:19:36,359 this is going to be this is going to be 382 00:19:36,400 --> 00:19:39,880 a story in six months, in a year, and so 383 00:19:40,759 --> 00:19:42,920 I try to make something where okay, what can I 384 00:19:43,000 --> 00:19:46,079 make that is still going to feel relevant in a 385 00:19:46,079 --> 00:19:47,960 little while. That add to the conversation. 386 00:19:48,039 --> 00:19:49,480 Speaker 2: You've got to come back to this show anytime in 387 00:19:49,480 --> 00:19:51,279 the future. I love where your heart is, dude. 388 00:19:52,359 --> 00:19:54,400 Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, I would love to. I can talk 389 00:19:54,400 --> 00:19:56,559 about this stuff all day because again, it's you know, 390 00:19:56,759 --> 00:19:58,759 it sounds like technology, but really at the heart of 391 00:19:58,799 --> 00:20:01,400 it it is it's about people, and it's about our 392 00:20:01,400 --> 00:20:04,039 decisions and our right to make these decisions. I'd love to. 393 00:20:04,160 --> 00:20:05,200 Speaker 2: Will you'd be brilliant today. 394 00:20:05,200 --> 00:20:08,039 Speaker 1: Okay, hey you as well. Thank you so much.