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Speaker 1: Welcome to this edition of The High Strangers Factor, copyrighted

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on the Paranormal UK Radio Network. I'm Steve Ward along

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with Andie Mercer and Susie Bastile. A High Strangest Factor

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was created by Andy Mercer and myself about five years ago.

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Susie has joined the show with the old timers a

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little more recently and we have had a wide variety

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of guests covering all aspects of the unexplained and the paranormal. Today,

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we will be talking to a longtime friend of mine

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who will be revealed shortly. But of course you've already

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seen the banner, so you know who he is. Uh.

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Andy and Susie, welcome back to the show. Hello, Hello,

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and let's let's do a little Susie. Now, you're you

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don't have a presence on Facebook anymore? Is that correct?

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Speaker 2: No?

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Speaker 3: I'm very mysterious lately.

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Speaker 1: Okay, so maybe we should just call you by your

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name Susie. That all you know, Uh, mysterious females just

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have one name that works for me.

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Speaker 4: Yeah?

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Speaker 1: But but where can now you? You do have some

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websites uh to do with your work about pug Wedges

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and the uh the Bridgewater triangle.

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Speaker 3: Yep, puckes dot blogspot dot com. There's also a contact

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form if anyone has Puck questions or exciting and then

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I'm the Puck Whisper on YouTube. No recent videos, but

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we actually have some some planned for a comeback when

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it is not field work season and I'm not outside

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in my free time.

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Speaker 1: Okay, maybe you could come back as a horror host

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or something like that.

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Speaker 3: You never know what I'm going to pop up as.

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Speaker 1: Again, very good and Andy, Please tell us what's going

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on with your publishing company.

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Speaker 5: Well, I'm still working on the next book at the moment.

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It's taken a bit longer than I thought. I have

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to go for a process of turning the word document

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into in design layout so it can be printed. And

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because the one I'm working on is in English, Greek,

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Latin and Hebrew, every time I transfer to in design

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it completely MUXI collapsed, and having to reformat the whole

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thing every time I go along, which is delaying things

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somewhatch is a bit of a pain. So I hopefully

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had to work out really now basically, but I'll be

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probably middle septeen related for it finally comes out.

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Speaker 4: That was very well, must have met.

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Speaker 5: Had some issues regarding posting to America which you may

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have heard about, which thankfully seemed to be resolving themselves.

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Is a great news because a lot of my customers

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are in It would have been a pain in the

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backside for me, but it's been resolved. It seems that

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I'm being raw male sort of something else, so that's

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getting back on track. But it's been a bit of

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a funny week having to sort of look into all

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these changes have been going on, so that's kept me

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rather busy. But otherwise, yeah, things have been pretty good here.

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Speaker 1: So do you have a command with different languages?

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Speaker 5: Well, not especially, no, thanks, I have a friend who

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does speak Greek, which is helping. It's more of a

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case of transposing the text. It's going from one format

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to another to reformat it correctly. So it's a it's

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an old, very old text I'm reproduced and that's been

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out of print for a long time, which has some

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significant elements to I meantioned last time that I have

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played a major role sort of occult circles. So it's

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just a case of getting that transference and lay up

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correct because it is going from a four size down

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to what's called royal size.

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Speaker 4: It means to be reformatted, which.

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Speaker 5: I quite enjoyed doing normally when it's just all the

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English text, But this one's taking a lot more work.

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Speaker 4: The night envisions.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean I've got a bit of a graph

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of a feud language, nothing special, so I couldn't translate

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stuff directly.

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Speaker 3: I've been learning a new language while I've been off

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being mysterious. Oh yes, that Narrogansetts, which is a tribe

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in Rhode Island.

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Speaker 4: So okay, next over what I've not heard of it before?

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Speaker 1: Are you good enough in that language where you could

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order something through a drive through window?

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Speaker 3: They? I don't think i'd get the food I wanted

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if I tried to drive through.

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Speaker 1: Well, Bill, it's a damn good thing. I'm here to

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bounce out to this intellectual crew here, Otherwise, you know,

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we would be out of touch with people. I'm here

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for the comic relief and the eye candy. One more

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questions for Andy, what your Do you still have your

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dark ambient music?

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Speaker 4: We absolutely yes.

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Speaker 5: Dark Mysterium on YouTube are still putting together other people's

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music into long tracks and compose of my own stuff.

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I've not done my to it for quite a while,

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to be honest, you that I've relaunched the Panel the

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UK Radio Network's YouTube channels. It's now called the Panel

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the UK Network, leaving up the YouTube that the radio

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bit because I have other things on them as well

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now and that's.

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Speaker 4: Been quite a bit of time up. You've been putting

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on some of the.

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Speaker 5: Old Cryptic file videos, you remember that, the kind of

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top new top five star clips. I've been doing some

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of those, putting those onto its channels come to life

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quite nicely at the home.

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Speaker 4: You've got quite a few new subscribers, which is good.

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So that's kept me quite busy.

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Speaker 1: I remember the very creepy one with a face that

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when when when you have your videos up, I don't.

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I'm not thinking, oh ai c g I. It's a

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real damn thing.

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Speaker 5: Everything I put around. But I am freezey convinced is genuine.

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Anything that looks even baby fake or flawed. I don't

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bother using it. Of course people argue they're all fake,

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of course, but pretty much convinced most of those are believable.

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Some of them are things called by accidents and are

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investigation scenes, and you always kind of con to the

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investigation team before and to discuss.

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Speaker 4: You know what, you know what he's what, is it

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real and just double check.

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Speaker 5: So I'm reasonally confident that they are real, but you

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never know, of course, is the internet leeds doing as

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it could be completely nonsense.

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Speaker 1: Well that night I slept up the covers over my

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face and held my bed to the floor, just because

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that's what I did after I saw The Exorcist and

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one one more thing. You produce other shows besides this

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one still on the UK Paranormal Radio.

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Speaker 5: Oh yes, absolutely eyes so you know they seen of

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the raw audio and ed up and add music. I'm

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doing about four shows and we've had a couple of

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people have gone a bit quiet for a while, but

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of happens in the summer. People kind of decided to

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go out and do other things rather than record their

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YouTube or very good shows. But yeah, a few old

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ones have come back and had a break. So yeah,

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Will got quite a few shows on the network. Still

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it's pretty good.

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Speaker 1: Okay, Well, let's introduce our guests. Bill Conkoleski has been

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the stake director of the Michigan chapter of the Mutual

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UFO Network since two thousand and four. Lifetime of his

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own UFO and Abduction Encounters. He spent the last three

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decades actively investigating these otherworldly phenomena, trying to make some

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sense of the bizarre events that have happened to him personally.

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What he's discovered confronting these coasic mysteries is that reality

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is far stranger than he could have ever imagined. Ton

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Koaliski is the author of the autobiographical books Experiencer Raised

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in Two Worlds in its sequel Experiencer II, Two Worlds Collide.

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His personal abduction experiences have been chronicled in the sci

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fi documentary Abduction Diaries, streaming documentary Abducted by Aliens, UFO

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Encounters of the Fourth Kind, television series Alien Conspiracy, They

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Are Here, and the ABC News special UFOs Seeing Is Believing.

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He has also served as consultant to Netflix's Unsolved Mysteries,

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the History channels Hangar one and UFO Hunters, National Geographics Channel,

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The Truth Behind, as well as the science channels Uncovering

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Aliens and Close Encounters Bill Welcome to the High Strangers Factor.

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Speaker 2: Oh thanks for having me on.

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Speaker 1: Great great to see you again. Let's now I can't

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remember when I joined Michigan New Fund I do remember

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having one of those blue cards with twenty eleven on it,

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so it's it's been at least been that long. And

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back in the good old days, we you would, you know,

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before COVID and all that nonsense, we would congregate. I guess.

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It was a suburb of Flint, Michigan. Yeah, yeah, at

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place called Walley's Restaurant, and it was really you would

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have your your training meeting, training meetings in the beginning,

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and then people would show up and you know you

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you'd pay your dues or whatever, and you always they

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always had a great spread, a great brunch, and the

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one of the most you always had a speaker, a

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good speaker set up in quite a variety. But we

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would sit around for what an hour or two over

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a brunch, and you get to hear people's experiences. I

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mean I didn't have much to experience except I had

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read a lot of stuff and I could interject a

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lot of things and pretend like I was intelligent. But

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it was just such a good time. Now do you

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still do you have something like that set up still

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for Michigan.

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Speaker 6: Be find Yeah, we certainly do. Things are a bit

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more diverse now in a variety of different types of meetings.

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But when COVID hit, Walley's actually closed right before COVID hit,

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and then they never reopened and during after COVID, and

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in fact the building has been demolished now it's not

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even there any longer. But we have moved to Frankenmuth

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and so, but we have our Franken Mouffon meetings now

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and then a couple of the meetings during the colder

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months we have it via Zoom because during COVID all

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of our meetings were by zoom and some people prefer that,

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some people prefer to meet in person, so we sort

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of split the difference. And then in every September this year,

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September twenty sixth and twenty seventh, we meet in Houghton

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Lake for the UFO Contact Conference. Our meeting is embedded

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in that conference. And in fact, next year in May,

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we're doing something a little special for our meeting.

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Speaker 2: We're having three speakers.

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Speaker 6: It's going to be in Troy, Michigan, right off of

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the Expressway I seventy five, and it's going to be

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Jack Bouchong, who was the radar operator from the Big

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March eighth, nineteen ninety four event in Michigan, Ray Schumansky,

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who's going to be talking about the nineteen sixty six

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flap in Michigan, the swamp gas flap. And then also

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Nicolelon who's an experiencer.

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Speaker 1: So I remember I spoke at that first Houghton Lake

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meeting with you and several other speakers way back in

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the old days. Also you mentioned the swamp gas sightings.

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That was probably the one of the things that sparked

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my interest when I was in junior high. And as

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you guys probably know, I've talked about it many times

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about in March of sixty six, there was a wave

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of sightings not just in Michigan but in the Midwest,

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and that's when doctor Heinek came down when he was

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still attached to Project Blue Book, and suggested that some

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of the sightings might be a swamp gas. So, Bill,

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you had a was it twenty sixteen, you had a

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swamp gas conference? Well, actually in the same let's see,

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it was next to the Weber Inn.

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Speaker 2: I think, yeah it was, and ever oh, go ahead, yeah.

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Speaker 6: So it was the fiftieth anniversary of the big nineteen

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sixty sixth wave, and we wanted a time in as

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close as possible to March, which was the biggest month

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here in Michigan. March fourteenth was an Arbor's Big Day

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with over one hundred witnesses between three am and seven

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am one night over the campus.

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Speaker 2: And so ann Arbor was where we had the conference.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that was that was pretty cool. And the uh

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it was ten years after those sightings that doctor Heineck

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spoke at a new found symposed him at the Webber

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Inn and which I u which I was thrilled because

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I didn't have any money. I was sharing rent and

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an apartment and I was able to drive to this

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great UFO conference and I got to see uh well

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obviously doctor Heineck. Even I even still have that recording

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somewhere in my archives. And Ray Stanford was there, another

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great UFO investigator that we just lost. I actually, did

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you meet Gray Barker when you were when you when

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he was there? No, okay, I actually cross paths with

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Gray Barker in the lobby. Of course, they wouldn't let

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him speak because he was too weird and controversial. But

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it was great because I had a friend of mine

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had met him, and I sort of cornered him and

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asked him a bunch of questions. It is uh in

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his army had a stack full of Srian, the latest

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Soserian publication with vegetable Man on the cover. So and

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I got one. I got a freequent. But anyway, so

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much for reminiscing. I guess I'm not sure where to start.

245
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But since you have chronicled some of your own personal experiences,

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was it the having those experiences? Is that that what

247
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started you on your path or your interest in this realm?

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Or were you interested seemingly independently And this just came

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along side.

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Speaker 6: What I was like to say, is that UFOs had

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an interest in me before I had an interest in them.

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My very first memory at age two is a little

253
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gray guy coming in my room staring at me in

254
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my crib and freaking out and having my mom just,

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you know, not even come. So she just kept saying,

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go to sleep, go to sleep, And it was the

257
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being was just there for a few moments and then

258
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walked out of the room, and then they returned when

259
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I was age four, and I had experiences age seven

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to nine, and you know, really my whole life. So

261
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now over fifty years of remembered experiences and when I

262
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had one particular encounter when I was a senior in

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high school, I was with two friends. We were in

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Sterling Heights, Michigan, February, so the sky was dark and

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the three of us were in his chavette Me and

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my two friends while we were parked outside another friend's

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house waiting for her to get home from work. A

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blue ball of light about the size of a car,

269
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about the height of two telephone poles, slowly drifted over

270
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the sky above us. Then a white ball of light

271
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came in, ping pound all over the sky, and that disappeared.

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And then a red ball of light appeared in the

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middle of the sky, grew dou about the size of

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a full moon, so very large right, and then shrank

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and disappeared, and we were dumbfounded.

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Speaker 2: We didn't know who to tell.

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Speaker 6: One of my friends said, well, maybe we should tell

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the police, like, good luck. You know, we're three high

279
00:15:44,919 --> 00:15:47,039
school seniors. Let's go tell the police. We saw you

280
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a vote, And and so my other friend says, well,

281
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maybe we should tell Selfridge International Guard Base, which was

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also quite close. And I said, okay, so you're not

283
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going to tell the police. But you want to tell

284
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a military And so we didn't know who to tell

285
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until when I was in college. A friend of mine

286
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I told her the story and she said, hey, you

287
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know there's this place in Chicago called the Center for

288
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UFO Studies.

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Speaker 2: You should go tell them. So on a trip out.

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Speaker 6: There that I was going to take anyway, I stopped

291
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in and met doctor Mark Rodeger and I told him

292
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my story and he said, oh, that's very interesting. Did

293
00:16:23,120 --> 00:16:25,679
you tell your state moofon chapter? And that was the

294
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first time I'd ever heard the word moufon And this

295
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was nineteen ninety three, and so I'm like, okay, what's

296
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that whatever. He gave me the name of the state

297
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director at the time, a woman by name a Shirley Coin.

298
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I came back to Michigan, rang her up, told her

299
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my story. I was really impressive how receptive she was

300
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to what I had to say.

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Speaker 2: And then I said, okay, actually.

302
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Speaker 6: I have some more stories, and soon I was over

303
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at Shirley's house quite a bit after that, unloading everything

304
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that had happened to me in my life up that point.

305
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And so that's how I got onboarded, if you will,

306
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into move on. And since this was ninety three. It

307
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wouldn't be long before the March eighth, nineteen ninety four

308
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event hit, and I started thinking, like, oh, my gosh,

309
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is it always going to be like this? Like March eighth,

310
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nineteen ninety four on the west side of the state,

311
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there were over three hundred witnesses in one night to

312
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this array of UFOs over by Lake Michigan, And so

313
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I was all excited. And of course nothing quite matched

314
00:17:33,920 --> 00:17:37,279
that in the thirty years whatever since. But I mean,

315
00:17:37,319 --> 00:17:38,960
we still get a lot of great sightings on a

316
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regular basis. But so, yeah, yeah, the contact phenomena has

317
00:17:45,799 --> 00:17:51,359
always been my focus because it's been my life. Another experienceer,

318
00:17:51,640 --> 00:17:54,319
Sandy Nichols, once asked me, you know, did I ever

319
00:17:54,400 --> 00:17:56,720
wish that none of this had ever happened? And I

320
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said to him, you know, I'm like, I wouldn't recognize myself.

321
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I wouldn't I wouldn't you know, I would be a

322
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completely different person. And once you get into you know,

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once you confront this, once you accept it into your

324
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life as real, you just can't put it down.

325
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Speaker 2: You carry it with you everywhere.

326
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Speaker 6: It's not even if when it's in the back of

327
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my mind it's the foundational reality of what.

328
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Speaker 2: My life has become.

329
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Speaker 6: And I don't think I could ever just say, man,

330
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I'm not interested in this subject anymore, because the phenomena

331
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would continue to exist.

332
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Speaker 2: In my life even if I chose to ignore it.

333
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Speaker 6: And you know, I always say that there's what two

334
00:18:40,119 --> 00:18:43,920
big mysteries in life, right is there are we alone

335
00:18:43,960 --> 00:18:46,559
in the universe? And what happens when we die? And

336
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why not spend your time looking into one of those mysteries?

337
00:18:51,079 --> 00:18:56,519
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, I have more questions, but Andy and

338
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Susie please feel free to step down.

339
00:19:00,279 --> 00:19:05,559
Speaker 4: Question which didn't soundary, but why do you think you Bill?

340
00:19:06,200 --> 00:19:08,000
Why you so?

341
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Speaker 6: I think the question that should be asked, maybe as

342
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a first question in a lot of questions like that,

343
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is how many people is this happening too? And whenever

344
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you crunch in numbers as strange as this is, it

345
00:19:27,559 --> 00:19:30,119
comes out to the millions, like this has happened to

346
00:19:30,119 --> 00:19:34,559
millions of people, and and so then I'm not necessarily

347
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one of a tiny handful of people. I'm one of

348
00:19:38,480 --> 00:19:41,119
several million people that have had some variety of the

349
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have of this happened to me? For me, it runs

350
00:19:45,400 --> 00:19:48,680
in my mom's side of the family. I kind of

351
00:19:48,720 --> 00:19:50,839
look at this as kind of like a disease in

352
00:19:50,880 --> 00:19:54,079
a weird, abstract way. There's a few different ways you

353
00:19:54,119 --> 00:19:59,440
can catch it. In my situation, it's genetic and because

354
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it runs a my family.

355
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Speaker 2: But you could.

356
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Speaker 6: Also have it if you say, marry somebody who has

357
00:20:09,319 --> 00:20:12,519
these types of experiences, or you're best friends with somebody

358
00:20:12,519 --> 00:20:16,000
who has these type of experiences. There's a good chance

359
00:20:16,079 --> 00:20:21,680
at some point, somewhere, somehow it's going to happen, and

360
00:20:21,880 --> 00:20:23,799
you're going to be there, and it's going to happen

361
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to you as well. And once it happens to you,

362
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once it tends to cling to you, and you tend

363
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to have more of these types of situations even when

364
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that other person is no longer around, and the other way.

365
00:20:36,599 --> 00:20:40,200
And I can verify this by two examples of people

366
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I know quite closely. They had experiences. They're both frequent

367
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flyers like I am. And when they moved out of

368
00:20:50,599 --> 00:20:55,759
their homes, the homeowners who bought their places reached out

369
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to them and said, I'm having a lot of weird

370
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things happen in this house.

371
00:21:01,720 --> 00:21:04,319
Speaker 2: Do you know anything about this? Did any of this

372
00:21:04,440 --> 00:21:05,200
happen to you?

373
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Speaker 6: So I think there's kind of a stickiness to property

374
00:21:08,880 --> 00:21:12,000
to like you. Again, you could catch it genetically, you

375
00:21:12,000 --> 00:21:14,200
could catch it from somebody else, or you could catch.

376
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Speaker 2: It from being in the wrong place at the wrong time.

377
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Speaker 3: In your experience from all the people that you've spoken with.

378
00:21:22,480 --> 00:21:27,000
Do people tend to understand what's happening to them right

379
00:21:27,039 --> 00:21:29,720
away or do they maybe mistake it for other things

380
00:21:29,759 --> 00:21:33,200
like a poltergeist or a haunting or things like that

381
00:21:33,440 --> 00:21:34,559
at first.

382
00:21:35,599 --> 00:21:37,519
Speaker 6: Well, you know, it all depends on the type of

383
00:21:37,559 --> 00:21:42,599
experience that you have. But for sure, a friend of

384
00:21:42,640 --> 00:21:46,799
mine and Steve's, the late Chris Bailey, we used to

385
00:21:46,839 --> 00:21:50,920
have this thing that we would do about once a year.

386
00:21:51,039 --> 00:21:54,000
We would get together and I would bring him all

387
00:21:54,079 --> 00:21:59,440
the UFO reports that could potentially actually be ghost sightings

388
00:21:59,680 --> 00:22:03,720
or some other sort of spiritual phenomena, and he would

389
00:22:03,759 --> 00:22:06,200
bring all the ghost sightings that could possibly be U

390
00:22:06,240 --> 00:22:08,759
A Foe related and we would look at each other's

391
00:22:08,880 --> 00:22:12,720
cases from that perspective, from each other's perspective, and yeah,

392
00:22:12,759 --> 00:22:15,160
there was definitely some overlap, Like depending on who the

393
00:22:15,160 --> 00:22:21,720
witness was, they could interpret marginally ambiguous phenomena to be

394
00:22:21,839 --> 00:22:24,960
on one in one lane or the other lane. And

395
00:22:25,000 --> 00:22:30,640
that was always that always really fascinated me. And if

396
00:22:31,599 --> 00:22:35,680
you're having sort of Poltergeis activity, I had Poltergeiss activity

397
00:22:35,720 --> 00:22:39,200
growing up. If you don't have, if you don't know,

398
00:22:39,279 --> 00:22:41,559
if you're not familiar with the content.

399
00:22:43,759 --> 00:22:48,920
Speaker 1: Yep, we've build his winked out on us. We hopefully

400
00:22:49,279 --> 00:22:55,039
hopefully early. And this is this is when you start

401
00:22:55,240 --> 00:22:57,720
when I shouldn't search an objective search.

402
00:22:57,960 --> 00:23:01,440
Speaker 5: It's just interesting, was saying about family connection. I, as

403
00:23:01,519 --> 00:23:03,440
you guys, know, very much into the accults have written

404
00:23:03,440 --> 00:23:05,559
books on the topic, and the ghost something all that.

405
00:23:05,839 --> 00:23:09,680
My adoptive parents as as a child, no interest, no

406
00:23:09,759 --> 00:23:12,240
experience whatsoever. But when I found my birth mother about

407
00:23:12,279 --> 00:23:14,680
ten years ago, very interested in that sort of thing.

408
00:23:14,720 --> 00:23:18,440
Her and my half sister both very interested in the paranorm.

409
00:23:18,799 --> 00:23:20,960
Not done much with it, but they have a strong interest.

410
00:23:21,079 --> 00:23:23,319
So it kind of explains where mine comes from.

411
00:23:23,319 --> 00:23:23,359
Speaker 4: Me.

412
00:23:23,559 --> 00:23:25,839
Speaker 5: No, I didn't spend any time with them growing up,

413
00:23:25,839 --> 00:23:28,400
of course, So yeah, I get the you're just saying,

414
00:23:28,400 --> 00:23:32,720
Bill about the idea about family connection. I'm adopted as

415
00:23:32,759 --> 00:23:35,119
a baby, and my adoptive parents have no interest in

416
00:23:35,240 --> 00:23:38,799
the supernatural. They called nothing the adult. When I met

417
00:23:38,839 --> 00:23:41,359
my birth mother, about ten twelve years ago. Now I

418
00:23:41,359 --> 00:23:43,480
found out she was very interested in supernatural as is

419
00:23:43,559 --> 00:23:45,880
my half sister. So there was a kind of family

420
00:23:45,880 --> 00:23:49,200
connection for me there mine's saying mine's more supernatural ghosts,

421
00:23:49,240 --> 00:23:52,200
she would say, experience. But there was a connection then,

422
00:23:52,279 --> 00:23:54,960
the family of interest. At the same my adoptive parents

423
00:23:55,000 --> 00:23:57,880
had none at all, apart from my discovered not that longer.

424
00:23:58,000 --> 00:24:01,960
My my adoptive father's mother was the wise woman of

425
00:24:02,000 --> 00:24:03,799
the village where she grew up in Wales and the

426
00:24:03,880 --> 00:24:07,039
last century before I was undred. There's a bit of

427
00:24:07,039 --> 00:24:09,160
a witchcraft connection there as well, which I thought was

428
00:24:09,240 --> 00:24:09,920
quite fascinating.

429
00:24:09,960 --> 00:24:12,440
Speaker 4: But sorry, we lost you from home and for your back.

430
00:24:12,920 --> 00:24:15,559
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, you know, I get abducted all the time.

431
00:24:15,680 --> 00:24:18,960
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, but we figured that you know, if you

432
00:24:18,960 --> 00:24:20,880
can talk about it, you will.

433
00:24:21,759 --> 00:24:23,920
Speaker 6: Yeah that My screen just went white and then this

434
00:24:24,440 --> 00:24:27,079
like little message came and said look here to enter

435
00:24:27,119 --> 00:24:27,559
the studio.

436
00:24:27,720 --> 00:24:32,279
Speaker 3: Like okay, as we were talking about, yes.

437
00:24:32,839 --> 00:24:37,000
Speaker 1: Yes, did the message say stop upstaging Steve?

438
00:24:38,880 --> 00:24:44,319
Speaker 6: So anyway, probably not so when I was growing up.

439
00:24:44,400 --> 00:24:46,440
You know, I'm not as old as Steve. But when

440
00:24:46,440 --> 00:24:50,599
I was growing up, this was still before like the

441
00:24:50,599 --> 00:24:58,799
the UFO thing really landed in public like culture close

442
00:24:58,880 --> 00:25:02,079
and I was sick or seven when Close Encounters came out,

443
00:25:02,640 --> 00:25:04,960
and I didn't see that movie in fact too much later.

444
00:25:05,319 --> 00:25:10,119
So while I was having really straight up abduction experiences

445
00:25:10,359 --> 00:25:13,519
as a small child, I didn't know where to put

446
00:25:13,519 --> 00:25:16,680
it because I didn't see anything like this on television

447
00:25:16,960 --> 00:25:20,039
or in books or anything like that. Nothing seemed to

448
00:25:20,160 --> 00:25:23,400
match what was happening to me. And it wasn't until

449
00:25:23,440 --> 00:25:28,440
I had my Communion moment that I was able to

450
00:25:28,680 --> 00:25:32,039
pick up a copy of Whitley Steever's Communion after being

451
00:25:32,079 --> 00:25:34,200
freaked out by seeing the book in a bookstore like

452
00:25:34,279 --> 00:25:39,160
so many people, and I said, oh, well, maybe this

453
00:25:39,200 --> 00:25:42,359
will provide some answers. And what it gave me was

454
00:25:42,680 --> 00:25:45,440
a context to put the phenomena of everything that happened

455
00:25:45,440 --> 00:25:49,920
to me, but didn't really provide answers.

456
00:25:49,319 --> 00:25:49,640
Speaker 3: It just.

457
00:25:52,599 --> 00:25:56,799
Speaker 2: Blown in what had happened to me. And it's really creepy.

458
00:25:57,480 --> 00:25:59,799
Speaker 6: You tell people the ones that you can trust while

459
00:25:59,799 --> 00:26:03,079
you're growing up, you know, I don't know how to

460
00:26:03,119 --> 00:26:05,599
describe it. I'm just going to tell you exactly what happened.

461
00:26:05,640 --> 00:26:08,200
There were these little people with big eyes. I got

462
00:26:08,200 --> 00:26:11,160
this cut on my arm. It's still there, So that's real,

463
00:26:11,759 --> 00:26:14,200
et cetera, et cetera. And then you see something like

464
00:26:14,200 --> 00:26:16,359
that and you're like, oh my gosh, I'm not only

465
00:26:16,359 --> 00:26:19,279
not alone, but this is a bunch of people in

466
00:26:19,400 --> 00:26:24,440
this category. And so that's how I came to sort

467
00:26:24,440 --> 00:26:26,920
of get into that. But it's not to say that

468
00:26:27,839 --> 00:26:30,960
I haven't ghosts, because I've seen a ghost. I've seen

469
00:26:31,880 --> 00:26:34,680
all sorts of Pelter guests, Poulter guys stuff in the house.

470
00:26:34,720 --> 00:26:36,960
Speaker 2: Growing up, I'm the youngest of five.

471
00:26:37,279 --> 00:26:42,920
Speaker 6: I have four older brothers, and my two oldest brothers go,

472
00:26:43,079 --> 00:26:49,599
we go in a strange paranormal encounter contest, and then

473
00:26:49,640 --> 00:26:51,920
the two brothers in between us. So you get my

474
00:26:51,920 --> 00:26:54,200
two older brothers, lots of stuff happened to him, the

475
00:26:54,240 --> 00:26:59,720
next two brothers nothing between them, absolutely zero, and then

476
00:26:59,759 --> 00:27:02,759
it picked up with me again and it was off

477
00:27:02,799 --> 00:27:05,559
to the races. So I always thought that was really

478
00:27:05,599 --> 00:27:10,200
strange that to the brothers somehow got to pass on this.

479
00:27:11,319 --> 00:27:14,279
But yeah, so yeah, it was really deep in my family.

480
00:27:14,319 --> 00:27:17,759
And when I was growing up, my parents said to

481
00:27:17,799 --> 00:27:21,119
my oldest brothers not to talk about anything that happened

482
00:27:21,160 --> 00:27:24,200
with them around me until I was older. They didn't

483
00:27:24,200 --> 00:27:27,960
want to scare me. They didn't want to influence what

484
00:27:28,000 --> 00:27:30,680
was happening to me. But if I were to say anything,

485
00:27:30,799 --> 00:27:34,839
you know, listen whatever, and which is what they did

486
00:27:34,920 --> 00:27:37,680
until I think I was probably about thirteen, where they

487
00:27:37,720 --> 00:27:40,119
started saying, Okay, we're going to share some stuff too,

488
00:27:41,079 --> 00:27:43,880
and I was like, wow, Wow, that's crazy.

489
00:27:44,480 --> 00:27:46,359
Speaker 3: And you said it was on your mother's side of

490
00:27:46,359 --> 00:27:46,880
the family.

491
00:27:47,559 --> 00:27:51,720
Speaker 6: Yeah, my mom had some stuff happened to her by

492
00:27:52,440 --> 00:27:55,319
including the house that we grew up in. There was

493
00:27:56,160 --> 00:27:58,839
somebody with a small hand trying to pull her out

494
00:27:58,880 --> 00:28:03,240
of bed, other memories that she shared with us, and

495
00:28:04,279 --> 00:28:06,799
a lot of strange things amongst my cousins.

496
00:28:07,319 --> 00:28:10,880
Speaker 2: And yeah, you all Phoe directly. You full related stuff

497
00:28:10,880 --> 00:28:13,079
and also ghosts stuff.

498
00:28:14,119 --> 00:28:17,160
Speaker 6: It seems to kind of go hand in hand, at

499
00:28:17,240 --> 00:28:18,559
least in my family.

500
00:28:19,160 --> 00:28:23,559
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's interesting that it was two and two with

501
00:28:23,720 --> 00:28:28,400
your siblings because you know, genetically, if this did have

502
00:28:28,440 --> 00:28:32,480
some kind of genetic component, if it's inherited, you know,

503
00:28:32,599 --> 00:28:35,880
you're getting an X chromosome from your mother, but she's

504
00:28:35,920 --> 00:28:38,680
got two one from each parent, and there's a fifty

505
00:28:38,680 --> 00:28:40,359
to fifty shot. You know which one are you going

506
00:28:40,440 --> 00:28:44,160
to get? So I mean you have because it's five

507
00:28:44,480 --> 00:28:47,319
five of you, so it's three and two, but it's

508
00:28:47,359 --> 00:28:50,400
about a fifty to fifty chance. So it was just

509
00:28:50,480 --> 00:28:56,160
an interesting statistic there that my nerd brain latched.

510
00:28:55,839 --> 00:29:01,000
Speaker 6: Onto and talking about phenomena that you wouldn't think would

511
00:29:01,039 --> 00:29:06,359
happen together. But somehow does I want to share this

512
00:29:06,440 --> 00:29:09,839
story because I think it might resonate a little bit.

513
00:29:10,559 --> 00:29:14,359
So it was October tenth, twenty ten. I remember the

514
00:29:14,440 --> 00:29:17,759
date specifically because it was ten ten ten. This did

515
00:29:17,799 --> 00:29:19,559
not happen to me, but it was a story that

516
00:29:19,640 --> 00:29:22,400
was shared with me. I don't know if any of

517
00:29:22,440 --> 00:29:26,599
you are familiar with Tina Ronan from Indiana. She was

518
00:29:26,720 --> 00:29:29,519
once part of a group called the Indiana Ghost Trackers.

519
00:29:29,920 --> 00:29:33,640
And Indiana is a state that's right just below Michigan,

520
00:29:34,279 --> 00:29:37,680
and so she was right on the border. And when

521
00:29:37,720 --> 00:29:40,559
they would go to different cemeteries as a ghost hunting

522
00:29:40,559 --> 00:29:43,160
group with their equipment to try to see if they

523
00:29:43,200 --> 00:29:47,039
could pick up something. They one time did a field trip,

524
00:29:47,319 --> 00:29:49,960
which you know, I guess they did occasionally into Michigan

525
00:29:50,480 --> 00:29:52,720
and there was a cemetery that they went to on

526
00:29:52,759 --> 00:29:55,480
that particular night of October.

527
00:29:55,000 --> 00:29:56,279
Speaker 2: Tenth, twenty ten.

528
00:29:57,640 --> 00:30:01,880
Speaker 6: Tina was walking around by herself in the cemetery that night.

529
00:30:01,960 --> 00:30:03,839
There was a large group sort of in the center

530
00:30:03,880 --> 00:30:06,000
of the cemetery trying to see if they could speak

531
00:30:06,039 --> 00:30:08,799
to somebody get some response, and then there were other

532
00:30:08,960 --> 00:30:12,319
groups of people walking around the perimeter of the cemetery.

533
00:30:13,119 --> 00:30:16,160
So Tina says, she looks up in the sky and

534
00:30:16,200 --> 00:30:20,559
she sees three silver discs, three flying saucers in the

535
00:30:20,599 --> 00:30:25,200
sky over the cemetery. And you know, she you know

536
00:30:25,279 --> 00:30:27,440
the irony of it. You go to look for ghosts

537
00:30:27,480 --> 00:30:30,680
and you see UFOs in the cemetery. And as she's

538
00:30:30,720 --> 00:30:34,319
watching them, she says, she starts to see them fade away,

539
00:30:34,640 --> 00:30:36,559
like cloak or whatever.

540
00:30:36,720 --> 00:30:37,960
Speaker 2: They're just disappearing.

541
00:30:38,720 --> 00:30:41,240
Speaker 6: And then at that point she hears a growling at

542
00:30:41,240 --> 00:30:45,400
her feet, and she looks down and she declares to me,

543
00:30:45,519 --> 00:30:47,440
this is the first time I'd ever heard this term.

544
00:30:47,960 --> 00:30:51,279
She says, she sees a puckwadgie and she drew a

545
00:30:51,319 --> 00:30:54,960
sketch of it, and it was this little squat guy

546
00:30:55,119 --> 00:31:00,559
kind of on all fours. And see in Indiana, Michigan,

547
00:31:00,680 --> 00:31:05,319
southwest Michigan, just right over the Indiana border. And so

548
00:31:05,359 --> 00:31:07,599
she and I still have the sketch of it somewhere.

549
00:31:07,599 --> 00:31:11,160
Had I known, I could have provided it. But so anyway,

550
00:31:11,240 --> 00:31:13,160
she's looking at this little thing and sprowling at her,

551
00:31:13,200 --> 00:31:15,720
and then she says it takes off, and she was

552
00:31:16,440 --> 00:31:22,759
very clear about the saying being that thing. And then

553
00:31:23,440 --> 00:31:25,440
so she goes and she wants to tell the rest

554
00:31:25,480 --> 00:31:28,720
of the group, hey, I saw these UFOs. Hey I

555
00:31:28,759 --> 00:31:32,000
saw this puckwadgie. And then as she looks up to

556
00:31:32,039 --> 00:31:36,240
see where they are, she sees this parade of black

557
00:31:36,519 --> 00:31:41,240
phantom like people wiz past her. Shadow people whiz past

558
00:31:41,319 --> 00:31:44,839
her really quickly and head towards the center group. And

559
00:31:44,920 --> 00:31:47,519
she's like, oh no, they're in danger. That was her thought.

560
00:31:48,200 --> 00:31:50,839
And then when she got to them, she said that

561
00:31:50,880 --> 00:31:53,559
the group was unaware that there was anything that was

562
00:31:53,559 --> 00:31:56,920
approaching them or anything. She was the only one who

563
00:31:56,920 --> 00:31:59,880
had seen anything that night, and she got a hat trick.

564
00:32:00,200 --> 00:32:04,480
You know, she saw you know, a UFO cryptid and

565
00:32:05,440 --> 00:32:06,480
a ghost.

566
00:32:06,960 --> 00:32:10,839
Speaker 3: You do get puckwage sightings along with the UFOs of

567
00:32:10,880 --> 00:32:14,039
some sort. Actually, and I'm going to be the first

568
00:32:14,039 --> 00:32:15,039
to bring up Keel.

569
00:32:14,880 --> 00:32:19,519
Speaker 1: Tonight I was on the verge. But you see, Billy

570
00:32:19,599 --> 00:32:21,960
takes squares to see when I'm going to bring up

571
00:32:22,039 --> 00:32:22,960
John Keele.

572
00:32:23,880 --> 00:32:27,200
Speaker 3: Tonight because I was about to bring up the Mockman prophecies.

573
00:32:27,720 --> 00:32:31,160
He actually talks about it. In the Mockman Prophecies. There

574
00:32:31,160 --> 00:32:36,000
were sightings of red lights over the Ohio River, and

575
00:32:36,039 --> 00:32:40,880
then somebody looked across the river and saw an outline

576
00:32:40,880 --> 00:32:44,400
of a little person. And then you know, up here

577
00:32:44,400 --> 00:32:47,400
where I live, we have the Bridgewater Triangle not too

578
00:32:47,480 --> 00:32:51,319
far from me where uh you know, going back, like

579
00:32:51,440 --> 00:32:56,960
pre colonial lore has puckwadges associated with something the tribes

580
00:32:56,960 --> 00:33:00,680
here called type a wonkas, which are like spoof lights

581
00:33:00,759 --> 00:33:03,680
or orbs or like a Will of the Wisp type thing.

582
00:33:04,720 --> 00:33:09,440
But Bridgewater Triangle has a lot of UFO sightings. Now

583
00:33:10,599 --> 00:33:17,279
it's mostly starlink sightings. Unfortunately I've got that that page bookmark.

584
00:33:18,319 --> 00:33:21,799
But yeah, they do seem to go hand in hand.

585
00:33:22,519 --> 00:33:28,480
And actually Bridgewater Triangle has a shadow person cited commonly

586
00:33:28,599 --> 00:33:31,319
with pocologies as well. That's very interesting.

587
00:33:32,119 --> 00:33:32,480
Speaker 4: M hm.

588
00:33:33,200 --> 00:33:36,519
Speaker 1: Let me do our station identification here. Just like a

589
00:33:36,559 --> 00:33:39,599
real radio show. You are listening to The High Strangers

590
00:33:39,640 --> 00:33:43,279
Factor a copyrighted on the Paranoble UK Radio network. Today

591
00:33:43,319 --> 00:33:46,240
we are talking to Bill conkole Eski about his experiences

592
00:33:46,440 --> 00:33:51,440
investigations and Michigan upon and by the way, Bill, I

593
00:33:51,480 --> 00:33:54,799
wanted to I misspoke when I say, I asked if

594
00:33:54,799 --> 00:33:58,400
you had met Gray Barker, and then I sat at

595
00:33:58,480 --> 00:34:01,400
the at that symposium. Well, he would have been about

596
00:34:01,400 --> 00:34:03,759
five years old, I think. So I didn't see any

597
00:34:03,759 --> 00:34:07,079
five year old kids wandering around in nineteen seventy six,

598
00:34:08,880 --> 00:34:12,320
right now, Okay, So that's my apologies there. He was

599
00:34:12,400 --> 00:34:15,280
quite a character. But also, and this is when I

600
00:34:15,320 --> 00:34:17,639
was going to bring up John Keel. Very cool that

601
00:34:17,679 --> 00:34:20,559
Susie brought him up first. It takes the pressure off,

602
00:34:20,599 --> 00:34:27,800
you know. But Keel believed that a certain percentage maybe

603
00:34:27,840 --> 00:34:31,159
it was twenty percent of people that were naturally psychic

604
00:34:31,800 --> 00:34:34,320
or the kind of people that would have these kinds

605
00:34:34,320 --> 00:34:40,679
of experiences. And I'm doing this talk on the high

606
00:34:40,679 --> 00:34:43,599
strangest aspects of the locke Ness Monster. And there's a

607
00:34:43,679 --> 00:34:47,920
character named doctor Donald Ulmend an exorcist who exercise or

608
00:34:47,960 --> 00:34:52,719
so he said, the lock Ness Monster. Well, he believed

609
00:34:52,920 --> 00:34:58,039
that due to a lot of sightings and so forth,

610
00:34:58,519 --> 00:35:01,280
that this thing may have been more of more paranormal

611
00:35:01,599 --> 00:35:04,079
or more like an apparition than a flesh and blood

612
00:35:04,199 --> 00:35:07,360
like plesiosaur. But He said that his I don't know

613
00:35:07,400 --> 00:35:10,400
whether it was his mother or grandmother had second sight,

614
00:35:10,840 --> 00:35:13,760
and he believed that people that had second sight were

615
00:35:13,760 --> 00:35:17,920
the ones actually seeing NeSSI and the people like me

616
00:35:18,360 --> 00:35:21,119
that don't have it would would probably not see it.

617
00:35:21,599 --> 00:35:25,079
Do you think there's anything too, like say, in your family,

618
00:35:25,159 --> 00:35:29,960
for example, you and your older brothers are maybe more

619
00:35:30,000 --> 00:35:35,360
psychically sensitive, or is there something completely else going on now?

620
00:35:35,760 --> 00:35:39,159
Speaker 6: I do think there's some of that to that for sure,

621
00:35:39,599 --> 00:35:44,199
And I've heard I've been around the block certainly with

622
00:35:44,320 --> 00:35:47,880
his phenomenon hearing people's stories, and I've heard many stories

623
00:35:47,920 --> 00:35:51,280
where certain people in a group will see something clear

624
00:35:51,320 --> 00:35:53,639
as day, and other people won't see it at all,

625
00:35:54,039 --> 00:35:59,760
And that includes cryptids. Yeah, but I remember the story

626
00:35:59,800 --> 00:36:02,079
of from these two guys that were watching a UFO

627
00:36:02,239 --> 00:36:04,280
trying to get people's attention to look up at it,

628
00:36:04,599 --> 00:36:06,679
and people would look up in the sky and shrug

629
00:36:06,719 --> 00:36:10,199
their shoulders and they're like, can't you totally see the thing?

630
00:36:10,280 --> 00:36:13,559
Speaker 2: We both see it. It's right here and nobody else

631
00:36:13,599 --> 00:36:14,079
could see it.

632
00:36:14,960 --> 00:36:20,199
Speaker 7: And you mention that too with ghosts, Oh, absolutely, very

633
00:36:20,320 --> 00:36:23,280
much the case that people will see something very clearly

634
00:36:23,320 --> 00:36:25,599
before them, and other people will actually know something there.

635
00:36:25,599 --> 00:36:27,679
Speaker 5: I can't see anything. Well, you're you're talking about now,

636
00:36:27,760 --> 00:36:31,159
it's something in built with us, this sort of psychic sense.

637
00:36:31,199 --> 00:36:35,239
And my experience of others suggest the more you do

638
00:36:35,280 --> 00:36:37,039
these things, the more you're involved in these things, the

639
00:36:37,039 --> 00:36:39,719
more it become attuned to what's going on around you.

640
00:36:39,800 --> 00:36:42,480
So if you had experiences from two years old, then

641
00:36:42,519 --> 00:36:44,199
you're absolutely going to be saying so for.

642
00:36:44,159 --> 00:36:45,400
Speaker 4: The most of your life. I deafinitely.

643
00:36:45,400 --> 00:36:47,639
Speaker 5: I mean, I've seen quite a few different phenomena of

644
00:36:47,679 --> 00:36:49,119
the years accorded it for you, but as well, but

645
00:36:49,719 --> 00:36:51,599
I've never had the level of experiences you've been having

646
00:36:51,639 --> 00:36:52,519
the bill at all.

647
00:36:53,679 --> 00:36:59,039
Speaker 6: Yeah, pardon from me talking about all sorts of phenomena

648
00:36:59,119 --> 00:37:03,400
that aren't like aliens, when that's.

649
00:37:03,519 --> 00:37:05,480
Speaker 5: That we are very much to think of these things

650
00:37:05,519 --> 00:37:08,440
are all all one thing, or it's the same one,

651
00:37:08,519 --> 00:37:09,119
whatever it is.

652
00:37:09,199 --> 00:37:11,360
Speaker 1: So now you can go where you want the opportunity

653
00:37:11,559 --> 00:37:12,039
over here.

654
00:37:12,159 --> 00:37:18,000
Speaker 6: So my one real ghost sighting, So there was a

655
00:37:18,079 --> 00:37:19,920
gentleman who lived here in Michigan.

656
00:37:20,039 --> 00:37:22,559
Speaker 2: His name was David K. Wood. Steve would remember.

657
00:37:22,320 --> 00:37:27,719
Speaker 6: Him, and he passed from cancer unfortunately. Gosh, it was

658
00:37:28,920 --> 00:37:34,400
it was like fifteen years ago maybe, and actually I

659
00:37:34,400 --> 00:37:37,920
think it was closer to twenty years now, and I

660
00:37:38,079 --> 00:37:40,239
was good friends with him, and a lot of people

661
00:37:40,239 --> 00:37:44,159
who were good friends with him all had encounters of

662
00:37:44,199 --> 00:37:48,280
when he was passing that they were visited by him.

663
00:37:48,719 --> 00:37:52,280
And in my case, I was laying in bed and

664
00:37:52,360 --> 00:37:55,159
I woke up and there's this shaft of light at

665
00:37:55,199 --> 00:37:58,360
the foot of the bed, and it was there was

666
00:37:58,360 --> 00:38:00,760
no shape to it, it was just shaft of light,

667
00:38:01,159 --> 00:38:04,599
and I heard David's voice. It was he had a

668
00:38:04,760 --> 00:38:11,119
very distinctive voice, and I heard his voice say, whatever

669
00:38:11,400 --> 00:38:15,719
doesn't kill you makes you stronger, and whatever kills you

670
00:38:15,800 --> 00:38:19,159
makes you stronger. And then the light just sort of

671
00:38:19,159 --> 00:38:23,199
faded away and disappeared, and so I thought at that point,

672
00:38:23,280 --> 00:38:26,719
like I'm like, my gosh, David's dead. He didn't actually

673
00:38:26,760 --> 00:38:28,880
pass until the next day. He was in a coma

674
00:38:28,960 --> 00:38:31,760
for about a week his last week of life, and

675
00:38:32,239 --> 00:38:34,960
a mutual friend of ours land he said he also

676
00:38:35,039 --> 00:38:39,119
had visited her, and so, you know, I thought he

677
00:38:39,199 --> 00:38:42,199
was maybe while he was still somewhat tethered going and

678
00:38:42,480 --> 00:38:44,960
you know, on his goodbye to her, saying goodbye to

679
00:38:44,960 --> 00:38:48,199
everybody before he wasn't you know, he didn't have the

680
00:38:48,239 --> 00:38:49,159
passport to come.

681
00:38:49,079 --> 00:38:49,840
Speaker 2: Back any longer.

682
00:38:50,960 --> 00:38:58,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, So, how having had all these experiences and much

683
00:38:58,360 --> 00:39:02,039
time to think about them, Uh, do you feel that,

684
00:39:03,280 --> 00:39:06,239
like Andy was mentioning, that these things are many of

685
00:39:06,280 --> 00:39:10,480
these things are connected and aren't you know, completely distinct

686
00:39:10,719 --> 00:39:17,679
like ets or or physical nuts and bolts, entities, ghosts

687
00:39:17,760 --> 00:39:23,519
or something different, you know, and so cryptids or something different. Myself,

688
00:39:23,599 --> 00:39:26,320
I tend to think that there's sort of a duality.

689
00:39:26,360 --> 00:39:29,280
I think some of these things, you know, I've gone

690
00:39:29,320 --> 00:39:32,920
back to the idea that some of the beings, the

691
00:39:33,400 --> 00:39:38,519
craft or whatever may actually be physical, but and many

692
00:39:38,559 --> 00:39:41,000
of the other ones are much more in the realm

693
00:39:41,079 --> 00:39:44,800
of Archelian or or something that a Kiel and Jacques

694
00:39:44,800 --> 00:39:48,400
Folly would would describe. So do have you had any

695
00:39:48,480 --> 00:39:51,400
time to kind of process that and you know and

696
00:39:51,480 --> 00:39:55,119
have kind of a general overview of what's going on?

697
00:39:55,719 --> 00:39:56,000
Speaker 2: Okay?

698
00:39:56,320 --> 00:39:59,280
Speaker 6: So all right, So first of all, I'll mention two experiences.

699
00:39:59,320 --> 00:40:01,960
I mentioned this I had on my arm that came

700
00:40:02,039 --> 00:40:05,400
when I was seven. I was brought on board, I

701
00:40:05,440 --> 00:40:08,079
was placed in a chair that I couldn't even though

702
00:40:08,079 --> 00:40:10,119
I wasn't strapped to it, I couldn't move from it.

703
00:40:10,519 --> 00:40:13,599
And yeah, they sliced my arm. I don't know why.

704
00:40:13,639 --> 00:40:15,519
That was a very strange thing to do to me.

705
00:40:16,800 --> 00:40:19,239
And you know, over the years, of course, I see

706
00:40:19,280 --> 00:40:23,039
other people with these physical markings that come from their encounters.

707
00:40:23,119 --> 00:40:27,880
So there's very clearly a physical aspect to this besides

708
00:40:28,000 --> 00:40:30,199
me and my friends seeing the UFOs things like that.

709
00:40:30,400 --> 00:40:33,480
And I could think of other physical, very physical examples.

710
00:40:34,440 --> 00:40:38,360
My four year old experience. They came into my room

711
00:40:39,119 --> 00:40:42,239
and they pulled me out of body, and they wanted

712
00:40:42,280 --> 00:40:46,559
to see how I could operate independently apart from my body,

713
00:40:47,440 --> 00:40:50,159
and they seemed to be satisfied, and they popped me

714
00:40:50,199 --> 00:40:56,239
back in my body. I'm giving fairly edited versions of

715
00:40:56,280 --> 00:41:00,360
these accounts, but you can buy my book and learn

716
00:41:01,039 --> 00:41:01,679
both books.

717
00:41:01,760 --> 00:41:01,880
Speaker 4: Right.

718
00:41:02,840 --> 00:41:03,039
Speaker 2: Yeah.

719
00:41:03,199 --> 00:41:08,079
Speaker 6: So, so I've had these experiences where I've been out

720
00:41:08,119 --> 00:41:12,760
of body and I've been in body. And I think

721
00:41:12,880 --> 00:41:21,559
my theory is that these beings probably went through uh

722
00:41:22,000 --> 00:41:26,920
evolution up to and beyond our point, and their technology

723
00:41:27,519 --> 00:41:31,119
reached a point where they were able to at some

724
00:41:31,280 --> 00:41:35,599
point whole consciousness out of a physical form and pop

725
00:41:35,639 --> 00:41:40,119
it into something or somebody else. That and I think

726
00:41:40,159 --> 00:41:43,840
that if you follow technology, you know, I would say

727
00:41:43,840 --> 00:41:48,480
some if there is some sort of electro thing, spirit soul,

728
00:41:48,679 --> 00:41:52,239
kind of energy thing in us, running us that at

729
00:41:52,239 --> 00:41:55,199
some point that specific part of us might be.

730
00:41:55,159 --> 00:41:58,039
Speaker 2: Able to be isolated and transferred to somebody else.

731
00:41:59,280 --> 00:42:03,000
Speaker 6: Although in more mentality seekers out there dumping millions into

732
00:42:03,079 --> 00:42:05,639
the you know, the research for it, et cetera. And

733
00:42:05,880 --> 00:42:10,480
so when their society realized that they could do this,

734
00:42:11,360 --> 00:42:15,320
they realize that the body is essentially no more than

735
00:42:15,360 --> 00:42:18,800
a vehicle that they could drive when they needed to.

736
00:42:19,639 --> 00:42:21,880
Speaker 2: And so I think that some of.

737
00:42:21,840 --> 00:42:24,519
Speaker 6: The beings, if that's what you want to call it,

738
00:42:25,039 --> 00:42:30,960
are actually non corporeal. They exist in sort of a

739
00:42:31,039 --> 00:42:35,159
etheric or energy state, which is like just really saying

740
00:42:35,199 --> 00:42:38,800
that they're ghosts, which is they're this psychic energy that

741
00:42:38,840 --> 00:42:42,400
when they need to be physical, they have these drones,

742
00:42:42,480 --> 00:42:45,800
these grays that they pop themselves into, and then they

743
00:42:45,800 --> 00:42:49,800
can interact with us physically when they need to, and

744
00:42:49,880 --> 00:42:52,320
when they don't need to be physical, then they can

745
00:42:52,320 --> 00:42:56,800
communicate with us directly, telepathically, pull us out of body,

746
00:42:57,280 --> 00:42:58,079
things like that.

747
00:42:58,480 --> 00:42:59,880
Speaker 2: And then if they're just.

748
00:43:00,239 --> 00:43:05,280
Speaker 6: Sort of energy and ghosts are and energy and foot

749
00:43:05,320 --> 00:43:08,079
seems to be able to jump in and out of physicality,

750
00:43:08,559 --> 00:43:12,159
you really just have this giant, you know, cosmic etheric

751
00:43:12,280 --> 00:43:19,719
pool that is lowering itself its physical vibration to interact

752
00:43:19,760 --> 00:43:23,440
with us in our dumb stage of evolution before they

753
00:43:23,440 --> 00:43:28,199
go back to their natural state. I just recently read

754
00:43:28,920 --> 00:43:31,679
a book. It's called Angst in the Shadows. It's by

755
00:43:31,719 --> 00:43:34,360
a gentleman by the name of Eric Nansteel, who I've

756
00:43:34,360 --> 00:43:37,440
had the pleasure to meet. He's actually going to be

757
00:43:38,639 --> 00:43:43,039
featured in Ancient Aliens this season, their second episode, so

758
00:43:43,119 --> 00:43:46,880
in about a week, and he posits, based upon his experiences,

759
00:43:47,480 --> 00:43:51,559
that he thinks that the beings, that the Grays are

760
00:43:51,639 --> 00:43:56,960
lacking a soul, like at some point evolutionarily they integrated

761
00:43:57,039 --> 00:44:02,320
so much with technology that the soul just seemed to

762
00:44:02,360 --> 00:44:05,920
slip away from them, and that they're interested in us

763
00:44:06,199 --> 00:44:10,360
because we have souls and.

764
00:44:09,280 --> 00:44:10,039
Speaker 2: They value that.

765
00:44:10,960 --> 00:44:14,679
Speaker 6: So which is kind of the counterpoint to the type

766
00:44:14,719 --> 00:44:18,480
of experiences that I'm having, but shows that really the

767
00:44:18,960 --> 00:44:21,639
jury is still out on what exactly is going on.

768
00:44:22,000 --> 00:44:25,000
But I don't think they're physical by nature. I think

769
00:44:25,280 --> 00:44:27,440
they're just physical when they need to interact.

770
00:44:27,159 --> 00:44:33,280
Speaker 1: With us, and why what's their fascination with us? If

771
00:44:33,320 --> 00:44:37,400
in fact, there's something like a million incidents over time

772
00:44:38,280 --> 00:44:40,360
what the hell are they doing? I mean, don't they

773
00:44:40,360 --> 00:44:42,000
have any other hobbies? What's going on?

774
00:44:43,199 --> 00:44:45,960
Speaker 6: So you know, you know when I when I sort

775
00:44:45,960 --> 00:44:50,000
of try to like ease into the phenomena, float in it,

776
00:44:50,480 --> 00:44:54,480
see what makes sense, not not look at anything critically,

777
00:44:55,199 --> 00:44:58,920
look at data, and just let it sort of all

778
00:44:58,960 --> 00:45:03,199
sink in. I'm one of those people that have come

779
00:45:03,280 --> 00:45:07,440
to the belief that they put us here originally, that

780
00:45:08,199 --> 00:45:13,519
maybe they either picked on some previous form of ape

781
00:45:13,679 --> 00:45:16,760
that was on the planet, or they just outright dropped

782
00:45:16,840 --> 00:45:20,119
us here on Earth, and that we're their creations, and

783
00:45:20,280 --> 00:45:24,400
being their creations, they look after us, they come back

784
00:45:24,440 --> 00:45:30,639
and visit us again, and that there's a foundation to

785
00:45:30,679 --> 00:45:34,039
the phenomena. It's really with them, it's about the reproduction.

786
00:45:35,320 --> 00:45:37,719
They're trying to figure out how to make us out

787
00:45:37,760 --> 00:45:41,400
in space, maybe a version of us and some sort

788
00:45:41,440 --> 00:45:45,039
of gray being out in space. Maybe one day that

789
00:45:45,760 --> 00:45:49,519
hybrid race will come and take over the Earth. Maybe

790
00:45:49,519 --> 00:45:53,440
they'll just exist on other planets. But that seems to

791
00:45:53,480 --> 00:45:57,840
be a key point of what they're dabbling in. Why

792
00:45:57,840 --> 00:46:02,239
would somebody who has the freedom of an etheric existence

793
00:46:03,159 --> 00:46:06,719
be so fascinated with a physical existence.

794
00:46:07,760 --> 00:46:10,559
Speaker 2: I don't know because they can maybe I don't know.

795
00:46:13,039 --> 00:46:17,679
Speaker 1: One time, did I just interrupt somebody? Okay, uh just

796
00:46:17,679 --> 00:46:20,559
just blurred in? What time you and I were having

797
00:46:20,599 --> 00:46:24,360
a discussion and I told you how how little I

798
00:46:24,480 --> 00:46:29,079
experienced and you told me that sometimes friends of yours

799
00:46:29,119 --> 00:46:34,119
that were in that same situation, if the more time

800
00:46:34,159 --> 00:46:37,920
they spent, you know, in your company, hanging around with you,

801
00:46:38,400 --> 00:46:44,159
sometimes they would begin to have experiences, what psychic experiences

802
00:46:44,239 --> 00:46:46,440
or whatever outside themselves.

803
00:46:46,719 --> 00:46:49,039
Speaker 2: I can think of a handful of people that that's happened.

804
00:46:49,119 --> 00:46:55,079
Speaker 1: Yeah, maybe you should charge.

805
00:46:55,559 --> 00:46:58,679
Speaker 6: And another thing that I think brings in if we're

806
00:46:58,719 --> 00:47:02,840
just talking about phenomena in general, I don't know anybody

807
00:47:02,920 --> 00:47:06,480
who has really taken the time to hone their skills

808
00:47:06,840 --> 00:47:10,239
as a remote viewer, and I mean really invest themselves

809
00:47:10,239 --> 00:47:13,079
in it. I don't know anybody who hasn't started having

810
00:47:13,760 --> 00:47:19,760
really bonkers stuff happened to them. And that is yeah,

811
00:47:19,880 --> 00:47:23,119
just it's been a universal thing. If somebody says, yeah,

812
00:47:23,159 --> 00:47:24,920
you know, I tried a little bit of remote viewing,

813
00:47:25,159 --> 00:47:27,960
you know, you know whatever I mean, I'm talking about

814
00:47:27,960 --> 00:47:31,320
the people that are are that's their thing. You know,

815
00:47:31,360 --> 00:47:36,400
they always have the strangest stories and yeah, it.

816
00:47:36,320 --> 00:47:37,960
Speaker 3: Would have been nice for you to tell me that

817
00:47:38,079 --> 00:47:39,400
about six months ago.

818
00:47:42,360 --> 00:47:44,440
Speaker 1: So have you been doing remote viewing Susie?

819
00:47:45,199 --> 00:47:48,159
Speaker 3: It was after Oh, you're gonna get his name before

820
00:47:48,159 --> 00:47:55,079
I do, Steve, we interviewed the the the Black Matter,

821
00:47:55,119 --> 00:47:57,440
Bigfoot guy Simeon.

822
00:47:57,159 --> 00:47:58,679
Speaker 1: Oh, doctor Simeon Hine.

823
00:47:59,400 --> 00:48:03,639
Speaker 3: Yes, it was after we we we met him over

824
00:48:03,719 --> 00:48:10,840
on Max that I started, uh toying with that. And

825
00:48:10,960 --> 00:48:15,159
I have to mention again, I'm very envious of Bill's

826
00:48:15,199 --> 00:48:19,039
friend who was looking for ghosts and found a puck wedge,

827
00:48:19,199 --> 00:48:25,039
because I look for puck wedgies and keep finding ghosts.

828
00:48:26,079 --> 00:48:27,880
Speaker 1: But yeah, it has been.

829
00:48:30,280 --> 00:48:34,199
Speaker 3: I I had experiences before, but they've definitely ramped up

830
00:48:34,239 --> 00:48:38,920
since then. I've had a very interesting summer. We'll have

831
00:48:38,960 --> 00:48:41,360
to talk about it, Steve and Andy on another night

832
00:48:42,199 --> 00:48:46,119
because that's probably an hour by itself. But that had

833
00:48:46,400 --> 00:48:49,119
what you just said has been my experience as well.

834
00:48:49,800 --> 00:48:53,360
Speaker 1: So we could Andy, we could interview Susie and uh

835
00:48:53,679 --> 00:49:00,800
we wouldn't have to pay her absolutely, Bill. Joe, Yeah,

836
00:49:01,199 --> 00:49:03,639
don't worry. The check is it's either going to hit

837
00:49:03,719 --> 00:49:05,679
Michigan or Indiana somewhere in the Midwest.

838
00:49:05,719 --> 00:49:06,599
Speaker 2: Don't worry.

839
00:49:07,239 --> 00:49:11,079
Speaker 1: Joe mcmonagall one of the big name military remote viewers

840
00:49:11,400 --> 00:49:15,400
written several books. He told the story one time and

841
00:49:16,360 --> 00:49:19,239
he said he was, and of course he was. He's

842
00:49:19,239 --> 00:49:23,800
a gifted psychic. He was maybe maybe the best remote

843
00:49:23,880 --> 00:49:26,719
viewer next to inco Swan, I don't know. But he's

844
00:49:26,760 --> 00:49:32,519
lying in bed one time and this lizard thing a

845
00:49:32,519 --> 00:49:35,159
few feet tall, were a couple of feet tall, walking

846
00:49:35,199 --> 00:49:39,119
on two legs, walks into his bedroom at the foot

847
00:49:39,159 --> 00:49:42,039
of the bed and is looking at him, and the

848
00:49:42,119 --> 00:49:45,719
cat alerted on it. This thing turned around and went

849
00:49:45,760 --> 00:49:48,360
to the door and went into the bathroom, and the

850
00:49:48,400 --> 00:49:51,480
cat followed it in there, and then apparently it vanished.

851
00:49:51,800 --> 00:49:54,760
And he has no explanation. It was funny because, of course,

852
00:49:54,800 --> 00:49:57,760
you remember Rosemary Ellen Guiley, who we lost a few

853
00:49:57,840 --> 00:50:01,519
years ago. I told that story and she says, oh, yeah,

854
00:50:01,559 --> 00:50:03,400
I was with Joe when he told that. In person.

855
00:50:03,480 --> 00:50:06,719
I'm thinking, oh, you know, I just read about this stuff.

856
00:50:06,840 --> 00:50:13,119
Other people actually know these people, but yeah, they that's true.

857
00:50:13,119 --> 00:50:15,280
And I have dabbled with remote viewing a little bit,

858
00:50:15,639 --> 00:50:20,039
had some minor success. Its fascinated about it when I was,

859
00:50:20,280 --> 00:50:22,239
you know, listening to Art Bell in the old days

860
00:50:22,239 --> 00:50:26,519
on Coast to Coast a m and would just would

861
00:50:26,519 --> 00:50:30,360
love to be able to be good at it or

862
00:50:30,400 --> 00:50:33,239
I could so I could know things. That's what that's

863
00:50:33,280 --> 00:50:37,119
what it is. It's a tool to know things. And

864
00:50:37,360 --> 00:50:39,639
I did some by the way, I won't belabor this,

865
00:50:39,719 --> 00:50:42,480
but I, uh, there was a period of time a

866
00:50:42,480 --> 00:50:46,639
few years ago where I caught myself lucid dreaming several times.

867
00:50:46,920 --> 00:50:48,599
So when I would do that, I would have a

868
00:50:49,159 --> 00:50:52,800
command ready h and I would, you know, would give

869
00:50:52,840 --> 00:50:55,760
that command because I wanted to remote because I heard

870
00:50:55,760 --> 00:50:59,880
that Joe mcmonagall would could remote view when he was

871
00:51:00,159 --> 00:51:02,920
uh lucid dreaming. Of course he had all the skills.

872
00:51:03,280 --> 00:51:06,800
So I would give a command like mars or whatever,

873
00:51:07,079 --> 00:51:10,880
and I'd always feel this, uh this motion. It'd be

874
00:51:10,960 --> 00:51:13,280
dark and I feel like I was going somewhere, and

875
00:51:13,320 --> 00:51:16,559
then I would actually see something would come into view.

876
00:51:16,800 --> 00:51:18,480
And I'm pretty sure it was all out of my

877
00:51:18,719 --> 00:51:22,440
uh careative imagination. But yeah, that was. So have you

878
00:51:22,519 --> 00:51:27,679
have you uh practiced remote viewing uh as a discipline?

879
00:51:28,480 --> 00:51:32,840
Speaker 6: Yeah, I first picked it up. I don't even know

880
00:51:32,880 --> 00:51:36,719
if it's still out there doing it thing, but I imagine

881
00:51:36,559 --> 00:51:40,719
it probably is in some version. I learned off of

882
00:51:40,800 --> 00:51:45,519
Courtney Brown's website, okay, online free course. And then when

883
00:51:45,519 --> 00:51:50,239
I was the far site, yeah, fire sight or or

884
00:51:50,920 --> 00:51:53,880
farsight dot org, I think yeah. And after that I

885
00:51:53,920 --> 00:51:57,880
started accepting targets from people and yeah, I got enough targets,

886
00:51:58,000 --> 00:52:01,000
just just nailed enough targets. Times I was way off,

887
00:52:01,360 --> 00:52:05,760
like nowhere close, right, But I mean the odds of

888
00:52:05,960 --> 00:52:10,000
ever being right once right when you just you know,

889
00:52:10,079 --> 00:52:11,559
here's a bunch of numbers, what is that?

890
00:52:11,760 --> 00:52:13,079
Speaker 2: I'm like, oh my gosh, it's this sting.

891
00:52:13,159 --> 00:52:18,079
Speaker 6: It is that, and that it convinced me that that

892
00:52:18,880 --> 00:52:22,280
it's valid. And then I started thinking, I'm like, well,

893
00:52:23,480 --> 00:52:27,000
I'm at a point where I invest either invest a

894
00:52:27,000 --> 00:52:31,960
whole lot more into this and get better at it,

895
00:52:33,239 --> 00:52:36,119
or I you know, or I just kind of stopped

896
00:52:36,159 --> 00:52:39,840
because I realized that it's going to be time considered, and.

897
00:52:41,559 --> 00:52:44,320
Speaker 2: I asked myself, you know, what would I do with this?

898
00:52:45,400 --> 00:52:49,000
Speaker 6: And while that question just sort of hung there, I'm like, Okay,

899
00:52:49,239 --> 00:52:51,000
if I can think of a really good reason to

900
00:52:51,679 --> 00:52:54,800
dive into it hardcore, I'll come back to it. But

901
00:52:54,920 --> 00:52:58,239
otherwise I just kind of said, okay, I know it exists.

902
00:52:59,679 --> 00:53:01,039
That's that's good enough for me.

903
00:53:02,000 --> 00:53:07,800
Speaker 1: Right now, you know one of the things that you're

904
00:53:07,840 --> 00:53:12,119
providing with Michigan New Fon. I mean, we've all talked

905
00:53:12,119 --> 00:53:16,400
to people that have had experiences and at one point

906
00:53:16,400 --> 00:53:20,840
they've been completely alone, you know, ordinary people experiencing extraordinary

907
00:53:21,280 --> 00:53:26,360
situations like you have. But and until they know they

908
00:53:26,360 --> 00:53:29,400
have a place they can go to tell other people

909
00:53:29,440 --> 00:53:32,800
about their experiences or to kind of network with others,

910
00:53:33,280 --> 00:53:38,360
they can feel pretty alone. So the having a group

911
00:53:38,480 --> 00:53:42,480
like Michigan New font And I know from sitting there

912
00:53:42,840 --> 00:53:47,480
during those brunches where that there's one lady told me

913
00:53:48,360 --> 00:53:51,960
she was traveling westbound and I ninety four in the

914
00:53:52,639 --> 00:53:58,519
Kalamazoo Portage area that's a really busy area and near

915
00:53:58,559 --> 00:54:01,159
Western Edge Avenue, and she said, all of a sudden,

916
00:54:01,840 --> 00:54:04,039
everything was like she was in a I mean she

917
00:54:04,119 --> 00:54:08,400
was driving daylight. Everything she was in a fog. It

918
00:54:08,440 --> 00:54:10,559
looked looked it was wasn't clear in front of her

919
00:54:10,679 --> 00:54:13,000
or back of her. She didn't know whether to hit

920
00:54:13,039 --> 00:54:17,800
the accelerator or hit the brakes. And then she came

921
00:54:17,840 --> 00:54:21,840
out of it on the freeway driving and it was

922
00:54:21,880 --> 00:54:25,719
like she had missing time on a busy freeway, you know,

923
00:54:25,920 --> 00:54:29,239
and what you know, what if she didn't have a

924
00:54:29,880 --> 00:54:32,920
place or a resource to go to to talk to

925
00:54:33,000 --> 00:54:36,800
other people about that bizarre experience, she might think she

926
00:54:36,920 --> 00:54:37,960
was just losing her mind.

927
00:54:39,119 --> 00:54:40,800
Speaker 6: So I think if she didn't have a place to

928
00:54:40,800 --> 00:54:43,280
go to, like move on, someplace that she was familiar

929
00:54:43,320 --> 00:54:46,360
with that she could go to, that she would be

930
00:54:46,440 --> 00:54:49,440
like ninety nine percent of everybody who has these type

931
00:54:49,480 --> 00:54:52,519
of experiences, they just don't have some place to go to.

932
00:54:53,199 --> 00:54:57,800
What I do maybe about twenty five thirty library talks

933
00:54:57,840 --> 00:55:02,400
every year within again about the phenomena, And when I ask,

934
00:55:02,480 --> 00:55:06,079
people raise their hand how many people have heard of mufan, it's,

935
00:55:06,440 --> 00:55:09,280
you know, out of a group of like forty to

936
00:55:09,320 --> 00:55:11,960
fifty people as it usually is, maybe one or two

937
00:55:12,079 --> 00:55:16,760
have heard of it, really, and so I mean that

938
00:55:17,320 --> 00:55:20,719
that is common people have an interest in the phenomena,

939
00:55:21,159 --> 00:55:25,159
and a lot of people during the Q and a

940
00:55:25,159 --> 00:55:29,199
afterwards they bring up their own personal stories and they've

941
00:55:29,199 --> 00:55:31,639
never heard of a group like this, So that means

942
00:55:31,679 --> 00:55:35,119
they're like the vast majority of people who are having

943
00:55:35,199 --> 00:55:39,199
strange things happen to them never reach out to somebody

944
00:55:39,239 --> 00:55:42,360
they don't know and share their story, even if it

945
00:55:42,480 --> 00:55:47,800
could be a non anonymous or confidential So I think, yeah, this,

946
00:55:48,480 --> 00:55:51,599
you know, weird stuff happens everywhere all the time. And

947
00:55:51,639 --> 00:55:53,760
in fact, you know, I'm going to go even a

948
00:55:53,800 --> 00:55:58,000
little bit further in that when people talk about different

949
00:55:58,840 --> 00:56:05,960
areas that are high encounter areas to high event areas,

950
00:56:06,519 --> 00:56:10,440
that I think that it's just a matter of almost

951
00:56:10,440 --> 00:56:16,719
an art putting an artificial line somewhere around a geographical location,

952
00:56:17,199 --> 00:56:19,599
and that if you expend it, you're still going to

953
00:56:19,679 --> 00:56:23,320
get about the same number of phenomena. And if you

954
00:56:23,440 --> 00:56:27,159
put this like triangle, circle, square, whatever you want anywhere

955
00:56:27,880 --> 00:56:30,239
and you look, you're going to find a ton of

956
00:56:30,239 --> 00:56:35,039
paranormal phenomena. And I know that John Tenny very dup

957
00:56:35,039 --> 00:56:38,360
Belye believes this as well. We definitely concur on this

958
00:56:38,920 --> 00:56:41,840
that you know, within mouf on my the data that

959
00:56:41,880 --> 00:56:45,559
comes in, it really just shows wherever there's more people,

960
00:56:46,119 --> 00:56:50,039
more people report things, and at the phenomena seems to

961
00:56:50,440 --> 00:56:53,639
phenomena in general seems to happen everywhere.

962
00:56:54,840 --> 00:56:59,639
Speaker 3: I've always wondered, is it just that there has been

963
00:57:00,519 --> 00:57:03,760
one person that came forward in an area that made

964
00:57:03,920 --> 00:57:08,440
other people feel more comfortable to share their experiences, and

965
00:57:08,480 --> 00:57:12,960
that's where we kind of get these triangles or hot spots.

966
00:57:13,079 --> 00:57:17,440
It's just because people. One person kind of had thehon

967
00:57:17,519 --> 00:57:21,199
ase to speak about it, and then that made other

968
00:57:21,239 --> 00:57:23,000
people feel comfortable to speak out.

969
00:57:24,159 --> 00:57:29,599
Speaker 6: Yeah, I think so, very definitely anytime somebody somehow, and

970
00:57:29,679 --> 00:57:32,920
I never can figure out why some people get on

971
00:57:32,960 --> 00:57:35,920
the news with their sightings when they get on the

972
00:57:35,960 --> 00:57:39,960
news with mediocre sidings at best, when all of these

973
00:57:40,000 --> 00:57:44,280
great sightings somehow never reached the news. But in the

974
00:57:44,360 --> 00:57:47,039
comment section, if you go to the website version of

975
00:57:47,079 --> 00:57:50,599
these stories, in the comment section, there's tons of people

976
00:57:50,679 --> 00:57:54,760
saying that they've had stuff happen to It definitely draws

977
00:57:54,800 --> 00:57:55,760
people out.

978
00:57:55,960 --> 00:57:56,880
Speaker 2: And I think a.

979
00:57:56,920 --> 00:58:01,199
Speaker 6: Very visible example of this in the UFO phenomena. Anyways,

980
00:58:01,840 --> 00:58:06,920
the recent drone flat like New Jersey or whatever, a

981
00:58:07,000 --> 00:58:10,119
couple of people saw drones, somehow made it into the news.

982
00:58:10,760 --> 00:58:14,880
Now other people were saying that they saw drones. And

983
00:58:14,920 --> 00:58:18,320
then anytime anybody saw something they didn't know what it was,

984
00:58:18,760 --> 00:58:21,239
be it a plane or a shooting star or whatever,

985
00:58:21,639 --> 00:58:25,960
they were calling it a drone and suddenly drone, grown, drone, drone, drone,

986
00:58:26,320 --> 00:58:28,760
and it's the story blew up and blew up and

987
00:58:28,800 --> 00:58:31,719
blew up. And then much like the balloon story from

988
00:58:31,760 --> 00:58:35,559
a couple of years prior. He just disappeared as suddenly

989
00:58:35,679 --> 00:58:38,400
as it sprang up. You had all of these elected

990
00:58:38,440 --> 00:58:42,760
officials saying that the federal government owed them an explanation,

991
00:58:43,400 --> 00:58:47,559
stories of these drones, if you will, flying over military bases,

992
00:58:48,519 --> 00:58:53,599
affecting you know, the FAA's duties, and all sorts of

993
00:58:53,639 --> 00:58:56,519
stuff like that, and then just nobody talked about it.

994
00:58:56,559 --> 00:59:00,519
Just all went away overnight. But yeah, that's a case

995
00:59:00,559 --> 00:59:04,159
of where somebody talks about something and then soon everybody's

996
00:59:04,199 --> 00:59:04,960
talking about it.

997
00:59:07,159 --> 00:59:11,599
Speaker 1: You mentioned John Tinney, a great, really good guy, fascinating guy,

998
00:59:11,679 --> 00:59:16,239
great lecturer and author. He told the story. He lives

999
00:59:16,280 --> 00:59:19,840
in Royal Oak, Michigan, to the suburb next to the

1000
00:59:19,840 --> 00:59:22,239
one I grew up in, and one time he was

1001
00:59:22,280 --> 00:59:25,159
on the streets. It's in daylight downtown Royal Oak. He

1002
00:59:25,199 --> 00:59:27,599
looks up and he sees an object, a metallic object

1003
00:59:27,800 --> 00:59:30,239
in the sky, and he's trying to get other people's

1004
00:59:30,239 --> 00:59:33,639
attention to look at it, and nobody cares or they

1005
00:59:33,639 --> 00:59:35,519
don't see it or whatever. But he looks down the

1006
00:59:35,519 --> 00:59:38,000
street and he sees a young girl looking up and

1007
00:59:38,039 --> 00:59:41,119
she's focused on it. So there's like two people in

1008
00:59:41,199 --> 00:59:43,559
this crowd of people that can see this thing and

1009
00:59:43,639 --> 00:59:46,760
care about it. So it was just bizarre the way

1010
00:59:46,840 --> 00:59:52,000
that these things sort of I don't know, revealed themselves

1011
00:59:52,320 --> 00:59:56,000
to certain people. How do you feel these days that

1012
00:59:56,559 --> 01:00:02,960
FON Euphon's always been pretty good handling basic reports and

1013
01:00:03,960 --> 01:00:07,719
cataloging them. But do they pay much attention, I mean,

1014
01:00:07,719 --> 01:00:11,519
the general organization to the high strangest aspects of some

1015
01:00:11,559 --> 01:00:12,559
of these things.

1016
01:00:13,440 --> 01:00:13,760
Speaker 2: Yes.

1017
01:00:14,159 --> 01:00:19,079
Speaker 6: So the way that when I joined Moufon in ninety three,

1018
01:00:19,440 --> 01:00:23,119
Shirley Coin was not only the Michigan State director, she

1019
01:00:23,239 --> 01:00:29,760
was also the director of abduction investigations for move On and.

1020
01:00:29,559 --> 01:00:31,559
Speaker 2: The group sort of.

1021
01:00:33,039 --> 01:00:37,320
Speaker 6: When she left it took a while before them to

1022
01:00:37,320 --> 01:00:41,599
get some solid traction again. And then Kathy Martin was

1023
01:00:41,599 --> 01:00:47,159
the name of the woman started up the Abduction Research Team,

1024
01:00:47,800 --> 01:00:51,519
which then became the Experiencer Research Team, which became the

1025
01:00:51,559 --> 01:00:52,199
Experience or.

1026
01:00:52,320 --> 01:00:55,119
Speaker 2: Resource Team, and now the ERT.

1027
01:00:57,199 --> 01:01:01,320
Speaker 6: It has several investigators that are dedicated to looking at

1028
01:01:01,880 --> 01:01:07,320
contact cases and cases that aren't just straightforward UFOs and

1029
01:01:07,639 --> 01:01:11,119
so as as a member of the group, I can't

1030
01:01:11,159 --> 01:01:13,199
say I'm a.

1031
01:01:15,360 --> 01:01:16,920
Speaker 2: Veteran investigator of it.

1032
01:01:18,320 --> 01:01:20,679
Speaker 6: The the stuff that takes up a lot of my

1033
01:01:20,840 --> 01:01:27,440
time is often outside actually move On's scope. But looking

1034
01:01:27,559 --> 01:01:30,400
at a lot of these cases that come in, yeah,

1035
01:01:30,440 --> 01:01:33,880
they're all over the place there, I mean they're somebody.

1036
01:01:35,039 --> 01:01:35,239
Speaker 1: You know.

1037
01:01:35,360 --> 01:01:39,880
Speaker 6: People will report demons and just all sorts of other

1038
01:01:40,000 --> 01:01:46,679
strange phenomena, and and we do our best to to

1039
01:01:46,719 --> 01:01:49,519
try to look into the at least the UFO or

1040
01:01:49,559 --> 01:01:53,800
contact aspect of it. But people report all sorts of

1041
01:01:54,360 --> 01:01:58,519
other things, and I mean there our charge is to

1042
01:01:58,599 --> 01:02:01,239
investigate UFO sighting, so we try not to get too

1043
01:02:01,320 --> 01:02:07,559
far from that. I remember when this was before Zoom.

1044
01:02:07,599 --> 01:02:11,400
It was on a conference call a couple like nearly

1045
01:02:11,440 --> 01:02:17,519
twenty years ago. Jan Harzen, the international director at the time,

1046
01:02:18,320 --> 01:02:21,920
said okay, we got to stop looking into bigfoot sightings.

1047
01:02:21,960 --> 01:02:24,119
Speaker 2: We're not a bigfoot group, we're a UFO group.

1048
01:02:24,840 --> 01:02:28,119
Speaker 6: And so somebody said on the call, well, what if

1049
01:02:28,360 --> 01:02:31,079
a bigfoot's being seen in the same area as UFOs

1050
01:02:31,320 --> 01:02:32,519
And he's like, well, that's simple.

1051
01:02:33,000 --> 01:02:34,840
Speaker 2: We investigate the UFOs.

1052
01:02:34,960 --> 01:02:38,800
Speaker 6: The bigfoot stuff goes to the bigfoot people, and someone says, well,

1053
01:02:38,840 --> 01:02:40,960
what if somebody sees the UFO and a bigfoot at

1054
01:02:40,960 --> 01:02:44,039
the same time. He's like, well, then great, we investigate

1055
01:02:44,039 --> 01:02:48,199
the UFO, they investigate Bigfoot. And then someone else says, well,

1056
01:02:48,199 --> 01:02:50,800
what if somebody sees Bigfoot coming off of a UFO,

1057
01:02:52,519 --> 01:02:57,039
And Jan again says he's like, He's like, well, of course,

1058
01:02:57,039 --> 01:03:00,320
we investigate the UFO, they investigate Bigfoot, And so that's

1059
01:03:00,320 --> 01:03:02,960
when I jumped in. I said, well, isn't this technically

1060
01:03:03,000 --> 01:03:06,239
an entity coming off a craft? So what you're saying

1061
01:03:06,639 --> 01:03:10,800
is that we investigate alien sidings, but they better not

1062
01:03:10,920 --> 01:03:11,599
have long hair.

1063
01:03:14,079 --> 01:03:17,320
Speaker 3: And that's like say, like me being a detective and saying,

1064
01:03:17,440 --> 01:03:20,719
I'm going to investigate this drug deal and ignore that

1065
01:03:20,880 --> 01:03:23,199
body that was clearly murdered.

1066
01:03:22,800 --> 01:03:23,679
Speaker 1: Over in the corner.

1067
01:03:23,880 --> 01:03:27,519
Speaker 3: Like the evidence that goes together sometimes you can't separate it.

1068
01:03:28,000 --> 01:03:30,880
Speaker 1: That's true, it could have been a domestic dispute.

1069
01:03:32,239 --> 01:03:36,320
Speaker 6: So like it reminds me of Also the Kinross incident

1070
01:03:36,840 --> 01:03:41,360
nineteen fifty three happened in over Lake Superior here in Michigan.

1071
01:03:42,079 --> 01:03:47,320
The was a UFO was spotted on radar over the

1072
01:03:47,360 --> 01:03:50,719
Sioux Locks. They scrambled an F eighty nine Scorpion jet,

1073
01:03:51,079 --> 01:03:54,360
which pursued it out over Lake Superior. They watched on

1074
01:03:54,519 --> 01:03:59,960
radars as the jet and the object intersected and then both.

1075
01:03:59,719 --> 01:04:01,920
Speaker 2: Dis appeared forever. They never found the plane.

1076
01:04:02,400 --> 01:04:05,639
Speaker 6: So Project Blue Book came in and asked, oh, what

1077
01:04:05,679 --> 01:04:08,119
did the UFO look like? And they're like, we only

1078
01:04:08,159 --> 01:04:11,199
saw it on our radar. And so they said, well

1079
01:04:11,239 --> 01:04:12,079
then we're just going to.

1080
01:04:12,079 --> 01:04:13,280
Speaker 2: Say you had a faulty radar.

1081
01:04:13,599 --> 01:04:15,760
Speaker 6: They're like, well, what about those pilots that went down

1082
01:04:16,760 --> 01:04:19,039
or whatever happened to them over the lake.

1083
01:04:19,280 --> 01:04:20,679
Speaker 2: And they're like, what's that got to do with your

1084
01:04:20,719 --> 01:04:23,960
faulty radar? If nobody saw it, all you have is

1085
01:04:24,000 --> 01:04:24,639
this radar.

1086
01:04:25,119 --> 01:04:27,559
Speaker 6: And and so the accident report from the Air Force

1087
01:04:28,079 --> 01:04:31,960
claimed that the pilots probably went down due to piland vertigo,

1088
01:04:32,559 --> 01:04:35,440
and they don't include the UFO spotted on the radar.

1089
01:04:35,960 --> 01:04:39,119
So you have the UFO report saying faulty radar. Yeah,

1090
01:04:39,159 --> 01:04:42,559
the accident report saying is probably vertigo and not mentioning

1091
01:04:42,679 --> 01:04:44,239
what was seen on the radar.

1092
01:04:45,199 --> 01:04:46,559
Speaker 2: And yeah, and.

1093
01:04:46,519 --> 01:04:49,840
Speaker 1: Didn't did John Chitty follow that case? And yeah, he

1094
01:04:50,920 --> 01:04:55,480
finally got the widow the back pay of her husband

1095
01:04:55,480 --> 01:04:59,280
disappeared and correct me if I'm wrong. I think he Yeah,

1096
01:04:59,320 --> 01:05:04,440
there's a a stone or a marker in a cemetery

1097
01:05:04,639 --> 01:05:08,239
or about that incident, and it says something to the

1098
01:05:08,280 --> 01:05:12,639
fact that gives his name. Uh, he died defending the

1099
01:05:12,679 --> 01:05:16,079
Earth from extraterrestrials or something like that.

1100
01:05:16,480 --> 01:05:18,960
Speaker 6: Yeah, that was Felix Mankla, the guy who was actually

1101
01:05:19,320 --> 01:05:22,159
the pilot. Robert Wilson was the other person in the plane.

1102
01:05:22,599 --> 01:05:25,119
And yeah, so Don in Louisiana, they have a little

1103
01:05:25,440 --> 01:05:28,360
memorial erected to him, and it said that he died

1104
01:05:28,920 --> 01:05:34,159
intercepting a UFO over the water. It wasn't as dramatic

1105
01:05:34,199 --> 01:05:36,679
as you put it. I like your story better, but.

1106
01:05:37,480 --> 01:05:40,800
Speaker 1: Well, it was so cool that he, after all these decades,

1107
01:05:41,159 --> 01:05:45,400
he was instrumental in getting that woman her the money

1108
01:05:45,440 --> 01:05:49,159
that she deserved from her husband being in the military.

1109
01:05:49,280 --> 01:05:53,639
So he tells the story much better than than you

1110
01:05:53,679 --> 01:05:56,920
and I do. But yes, yeah, he's he's quite an

1111
01:05:56,920 --> 01:06:02,039
interesting gentleman. Andy, SU's any any other further questions, I know,

1112
01:06:03,039 --> 01:06:05,400
And he's looking at the clock on the wall and

1113
01:06:05,440 --> 01:06:06,320
he no.

1114
01:06:09,559 --> 01:06:13,079
Speaker 4: But now, just I mean, I've got something fall again. Now.

1115
01:06:13,079 --> 01:06:15,960
Speaker 5: Of course, your own first experiences, I found them actually fascinating.

1116
01:06:15,960 --> 01:06:20,639
Listening to another broadcast earlier today, my question is how

1117
01:06:20,639 --> 01:06:21,519
do you stay sane?

1118
01:06:23,960 --> 01:06:25,960
Speaker 1: And let me tell you, I've known Bill for quite

1119
01:06:26,000 --> 01:06:30,039
a while He's a very easygoing, chilled out guy, and

1120
01:06:30,079 --> 01:06:31,840
he appears to be very sane to me.

1121
01:06:33,440 --> 01:06:35,360
Speaker 2: Record, that's all. You need.

1122
01:06:38,199 --> 01:06:41,079
Speaker 5: A few accounts that kind of thing before about this

1123
01:06:41,119 --> 01:06:43,119
sort of thing, because I mean him have to bear

1124
01:06:43,119 --> 01:06:45,239
to offload a lot of this stuff to people. I mean,

1125
01:06:45,480 --> 01:06:48,360
I'm alled psychotherapist, so I can understand sort of workers

1126
01:06:48,360 --> 01:06:51,000
of the mind with extraordinary experiences. I mean I have

1127
01:06:51,159 --> 01:06:54,719
had clients in the past who've had extraordinary experiences you know.

1128
01:06:54,960 --> 01:06:57,639
I mean don't just mean sort of their life to this,

1129
01:06:57,719 --> 01:07:00,559
I mean really real panel experiences to do for these

1130
01:07:00,639 --> 01:07:02,719
to talk about, to talk to people about it.

1131
01:07:04,480 --> 01:07:07,679
Speaker 6: So well, me, I got three things to pull from

1132
01:07:08,119 --> 01:07:10,519
what you had just said there, starting with the most

1133
01:07:10,599 --> 01:07:13,800
recent thing. There are a lot of psychologists and psychiatrists

1134
01:07:14,239 --> 01:07:17,599
who take an interest in this phenomena and will attend

1135
01:07:17,639 --> 01:07:21,920
meetings from reach out to me directly. Sometimes will attend

1136
01:07:23,239 --> 01:07:27,800
experience or get togethers that sort of thing, and without

1137
01:07:27,880 --> 01:07:28,719
asking them.

1138
01:07:29,039 --> 01:07:30,880
Speaker 2: You know, I don't say do you think I'm normal?

1139
01:07:31,039 --> 01:07:31,760
I seem normal?

1140
01:07:32,199 --> 01:07:37,760
Speaker 6: You know, well, they they sometimes volunteer that an interesting

1141
01:07:37,840 --> 01:07:41,320
thing that I did several years ago. I've well, for

1142
01:07:41,719 --> 01:07:44,079
one of the TV shows I was on I did

1143
01:07:44,119 --> 01:07:49,440
the Minnesota Multi Phasic Personality Index. I think that's what

1144
01:07:49,440 --> 01:07:53,679
the ICE stands for, and it was a personality test whatever.

1145
01:07:53,760 --> 01:07:56,719
It said that I'm not fantasy prone, but I have

1146
01:07:57,360 --> 01:08:02,119
encountered some degree of PTSD. Another time, there was an

1147
01:08:02,199 --> 01:08:06,119
experiment done by some doctors at a hospital in Detroit

1148
01:08:07,400 --> 01:08:09,800
where they wanted me to stay three nights in the

1149
01:08:09,840 --> 01:08:13,079
hospital all wired up to see if there was anything

1150
01:08:13,159 --> 01:08:16,319
funky with my sleep pattern. They were looking at that

1151
01:08:16,479 --> 01:08:20,319
as a possible reason for people claiming these sort of things,

1152
01:08:20,760 --> 01:08:25,560
and they they found enough abductees' experiencers to rub together

1153
01:08:25,920 --> 01:08:29,880
to have a test group, and then they also had

1154
01:08:29,880 --> 01:08:32,399
a control group. I don't know how many people were

1155
01:08:32,399 --> 01:08:35,359
in each group whatever, so I just knew I slept

1156
01:08:35,359 --> 01:08:38,680
there for three nights, and then afterwards, during the personal

1157
01:08:38,720 --> 01:08:42,760
debrief I got, they said that I kind of blew

1158
01:08:42,800 --> 01:08:46,760
their experiment because I had a better sleep pattern than

1159
01:08:46,800 --> 01:08:49,800
not only the rest of the experiencers but also the

1160
01:08:49,920 --> 01:08:50,640
control group.

1161
01:08:50,960 --> 01:08:52,680
Speaker 2: I had the best sleep out.

1162
01:08:52,479 --> 01:08:55,279
Speaker 6: Of anybody on either side of it, which which kind

1163
01:08:55,319 --> 01:08:58,359
of amused me. But so yeah, they you know, they

1164
01:08:58,800 --> 01:09:01,439
you know they they're in the group. You know I

1165
01:09:01,479 --> 01:09:05,079
share fully and you know I've gotten that sort of

1166
01:09:06,680 --> 01:09:13,640
informal approval that I'm just not nuts. But you know, anyway,

1167
01:09:14,600 --> 01:09:21,119
the other thing I think is interesting about it was that, gosh,

1168
01:09:21,159 --> 01:09:23,119
I'm trying to think of the other two things.

1169
01:09:22,800 --> 01:09:27,199
Speaker 2: That you brought up. Oh oh yeah, so about being

1170
01:09:27,359 --> 01:09:27,960
about being?

1171
01:09:28,359 --> 01:09:30,960
Speaker 6: You know how I handle this because this is a lot,

1172
01:09:31,039 --> 01:09:33,920
This is a handful, and when you go out looking

1173
01:09:33,920 --> 01:09:36,319
for information on it, you have a lot of people

1174
01:09:36,439 --> 01:09:41,439
with their own pet theories about what's going on, and

1175
01:09:41,640 --> 01:09:44,399
a lot of times it doesn't speak to you at all. Like,

1176
01:09:44,439 --> 01:09:47,359
for example, when people talk about the galactic counsel or

1177
01:09:47,760 --> 01:09:50,439
arcurians and things like that, I'm like, I have no

1178
01:09:50,600 --> 01:09:53,520
idea what you're talking about. This does not resonate with

1179
01:09:53,640 --> 01:09:54,439
me at all.

1180
01:09:55,520 --> 01:09:55,720
Speaker 7: You know.

1181
01:09:56,000 --> 01:09:59,760
Speaker 2: It's it's just there's these perspectives and.

1182
01:09:59,760 --> 01:10:02,039
Speaker 6: They try to, you know, say, oh, you know this

1183
01:10:02,279 --> 01:10:04,640
is this is what's happening to you. I'm like, nope,

1184
01:10:05,000 --> 01:10:07,560
you know, you haven't. You haven't experienced what I experienced.

1185
01:10:07,600 --> 01:10:11,640
But since it's happened to me since my very first

1186
01:10:11,720 --> 01:10:15,319
memory in life, it's always been with me. This is

1187
01:10:16,119 --> 01:10:19,720
foundational to who I am. People who have these type

1188
01:10:19,760 --> 01:10:22,800
of experiences for the first time later in life, say

1189
01:10:22,880 --> 01:10:26,039
they're in their twenties, thirties, forties, whatever, and they have

1190
01:10:26,119 --> 01:10:30,359
their first encounter. It could be just devastating to them,

1191
01:10:30,520 --> 01:10:33,279
especially if they haven't thought about the subject, especially if

1192
01:10:33,319 --> 01:10:36,720
they've chosen to dismiss this subject and they have something

1193
01:10:36,800 --> 01:10:39,840
that says, you know, all of your life, you've built

1194
01:10:39,880 --> 01:10:44,159
this story and then flu it's gone, and now you

1195
01:10:44,239 --> 01:10:48,119
have to accept this as reality and rethink the way

1196
01:10:48,159 --> 01:10:52,119
you've thought about everything your entire life. But as a kid,

1197
01:10:52,239 --> 01:10:56,079
you know, incrementally, I'm integrating my encounters with my life,

1198
01:10:56,600 --> 01:11:00,199
and so again after fifty years, it's it's that's what

1199
01:11:00,239 --> 01:11:04,199
it is. And also it means I've been talking about

1200
01:11:04,239 --> 01:11:08,359
my stuff publicly since nineteen ninety nine, so I've had

1201
01:11:08,439 --> 01:11:09,680
a lot of opportunity.

1202
01:11:09,800 --> 01:11:11,119
Speaker 2: Just it's cathartic.

1203
01:11:11,279 --> 01:11:14,359
Speaker 6: Say it over and over and over again, and it

1204
01:11:14,439 --> 01:11:19,640
becomes easier every time. I was once on a podcast,

1205
01:11:19,920 --> 01:11:22,640
it was out of England, so I don't know if

1206
01:11:22,680 --> 01:11:25,760
this is a big podcast or what or the women

1207
01:11:25,760 --> 01:11:28,520
that run the show are known. I forget their names,

1208
01:11:28,520 --> 01:11:32,039
but two women were the hosts of the show and

1209
01:11:32,159 --> 01:11:35,000
they invited me to be on as a guest, and

1210
01:11:35,159 --> 01:11:38,960
so they're like, so you know, what do you do?

1211
01:11:39,039 --> 01:11:42,000
And I said, well, I'm State Director of Michigan MOFON

1212
01:11:42,399 --> 01:11:43,199
and they're like, move on.

1213
01:11:43,359 --> 01:11:43,720
Speaker 2: What's that?

1214
01:11:44,319 --> 01:11:47,640
Speaker 6: So I'm like, okay, I'm either brought on a show

1215
01:11:47,720 --> 01:11:51,319
because of mofon or because of my personal stuff in

1216
01:11:51,359 --> 01:11:54,399
a nutshell, and so I'm like, okay, don't know about mofon.

1217
01:11:54,479 --> 01:11:59,640
Here's stuff about mofon, blah blah blah. And then they're like, oh,

1218
01:12:00,079 --> 01:12:05,479
have you ever seen a UFO yourself? I'm like, so

1219
01:12:05,920 --> 01:12:08,079
they don't know about move On and they don't know

1220
01:12:08,119 --> 01:12:11,399
about my experiences, but they invited me on their show.

1221
01:12:11,560 --> 01:12:14,439
I'm like and and and I'm like why did they

1222
01:12:14,439 --> 01:12:15,319
invite me on?

1223
01:12:15,720 --> 01:12:17,399
Speaker 2: So anyway, so I start talking.

1224
01:12:17,159 --> 01:12:23,079
Speaker 6: About my abductions and after however, several minutes, one of

1225
01:12:23,079 --> 01:12:26,640
the women said, your stories are very fascinating, but I

1226
01:12:26,680 --> 01:12:28,079
can't see as I believe you.

1227
01:12:28,960 --> 01:12:32,239
Speaker 2: And this is the first. This never happens to me.

1228
01:12:32,600 --> 01:12:36,399
Speaker 6: Nobody ever just comes out and says that, let alone

1229
01:12:36,399 --> 01:12:40,319
on a podcast. And so I'm like, oh, that's a first.

1230
01:12:40,960 --> 01:12:44,560
And so I mean, people may or may not believe it,

1231
01:12:44,600 --> 01:12:48,279
but to be that blunt is different for me.

1232
01:12:48,760 --> 01:12:49,279
Speaker 2: And so.

1233
01:12:50,960 --> 01:12:53,439
Speaker 3: I was going to say, English people were supposed to be.

1234
01:12:54,239 --> 01:13:00,399
Speaker 1: Yes upper lip, but they gave them a lot of crap.

1235
01:13:00,439 --> 01:13:00,640
Speaker 4: You know.

1236
01:13:01,159 --> 01:13:03,239
Speaker 6: So after she said that, you know, I don't believe you.

1237
01:13:03,640 --> 01:13:06,039
And and she says, and the reason I don't believe

1238
01:13:06,079 --> 01:13:09,720
you is because when you tell your story, you're not

1239
01:13:09,840 --> 01:13:13,239
breaking up emotionally as you tell it. There's no sort

1240
01:13:13,279 --> 01:13:17,840
of emotional underpinning. Like I'm just like, you know, revealing,

1241
01:13:17,920 --> 01:13:20,680
Oh my gosh. And then they took me, uh, you know,

1242
01:13:21,119 --> 01:13:24,279
and so and so, and you know, I'm like, well,

1243
01:13:24,399 --> 01:13:27,359
I mean, you look at Travis Walton, who now has

1244
01:13:27,399 --> 01:13:31,199
been who I mean, his story literally happened fifty years ago.

1245
01:13:31,600 --> 01:13:34,720
Speaker 2: He's been telling his story for fifty years.

1246
01:13:34,479 --> 01:13:40,199
Speaker 6: And and so now I mean, like how many how

1247
01:13:40,199 --> 01:13:41,880
many times has he told that story?

1248
01:13:41,920 --> 01:13:43,800
Speaker 2: He's not going to break up every single time he

1249
01:13:43,800 --> 01:13:46,520
tells it. Oh, I was just close to having a

1250
01:13:46,520 --> 01:13:49,239
cat on screen too. You can do it. Come on, Ouigi,

1251
01:13:49,840 --> 01:13:53,560
come on, Oigi, it's your turn. It's your turn.

1252
01:13:55,560 --> 01:13:56,279
Speaker 1: Three cats.

1253
01:13:56,359 --> 01:13:58,359
Speaker 2: We got a cat, Tricky.

1254
01:14:01,359 --> 01:14:02,039
Speaker 1: How many cats?

1255
01:14:02,079 --> 01:14:04,039
Speaker 2: Bill got two?

1256
01:14:06,039 --> 01:14:09,159
Speaker 6: Mario and Luigi the kids named him.

1257
01:14:09,479 --> 01:14:13,039
Speaker 1: Susie has two. I have six, But that's another story.

1258
01:14:13,279 --> 01:14:17,560
But anyway, go go ahead, continue with the podcast with

1259
01:14:17,640 --> 01:14:19,520
the ladies that didn't believe you.

1260
01:14:20,640 --> 01:14:24,720
Speaker 2: That you know, and so I don't think it just

1261
01:14:24,880 --> 01:14:27,119
wrapped up at that point. I don't know.

1262
01:14:27,199 --> 01:14:30,880
Speaker 6: This was several years ago and I didn't get a

1263
01:14:30,920 --> 01:14:33,920
recording of it, so and like I said, I don't

1264
01:14:33,920 --> 01:14:36,239
remember their names. But yeah, it was definitely one of

1265
01:14:36,239 --> 01:14:39,399
the weirdest ones. I just could never figure out why

1266
01:14:39,399 --> 01:14:40,800
they invited me in the first place.

1267
01:14:41,319 --> 01:14:44,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's funny because it's it's trauma in general, right,

1268
01:14:45,600 --> 01:14:49,119
Like you can be at different points in how you've

1269
01:14:49,720 --> 01:14:53,960
dealt with the trauma and how you've processed it. But I, well,

1270
01:14:54,039 --> 01:14:57,640
I haven't had your experiences. I have someone went to

1271
01:14:57,640 --> 01:15:00,439
prison for attempted murder for something that happen and to me,

1272
01:15:00,920 --> 01:15:03,199
I'll just say the summarize. But I have had people

1273
01:15:03,199 --> 01:15:07,239
say the exact same thing to me about it and say, like,

1274
01:15:07,359 --> 01:15:11,119
you're not showing emotion at all right now when you're

1275
01:15:11,159 --> 01:15:14,199
telling this story. So I don't think that happening. I'm like,

1276
01:15:14,239 --> 01:15:18,439
I've got court records, you know, but that it is

1277
01:15:18,520 --> 01:15:21,760
some people's reactions if you don't get emotional, they think

1278
01:15:21,760 --> 01:15:25,039
you're lying the expectations.

1279
01:15:24,560 --> 01:15:28,079
Speaker 5: It's a certain way. It's dictated that you must. It's

1280
01:15:28,119 --> 01:15:30,239
like you have to react the way they think you're

1281
01:15:30,279 --> 01:15:31,560
supposed to react if.

1282
01:15:31,439 --> 01:15:34,840
Speaker 3: You don't, and it's never right whatever you do.

1283
01:15:35,119 --> 01:15:40,439
Speaker 5: Ridiculous as a therapists and all sorts of nazis stories

1284
01:15:40,439 --> 01:15:43,119
from clients who've been very calm and acted and explaining

1285
01:15:43,119 --> 01:15:44,960
it because they have talked about it before. You know,

1286
01:15:46,079 --> 01:15:49,039
you don't have the bustinances every time explains something traumatic.

1287
01:15:50,159 --> 01:15:52,000
Speaker 6: So I have a just a follow up to that

1288
01:15:52,079 --> 01:15:53,640
if we have time. I don't know how we're going.

1289
01:15:54,920 --> 01:16:04,520
Speaker 2: But so this was about fifteen years ago. I was invited.

1290
01:16:03,920 --> 01:16:09,520
Speaker 6: To be a part of a pilot where they the

1291
01:16:09,600 --> 01:16:12,960
idea for the show was a half hour show. I

1292
01:16:12,960 --> 01:16:15,520
think it was half hour where they would have two

1293
01:16:15,640 --> 01:16:21,000
abductees every show. And so the production company flew me

1294
01:16:21,039 --> 01:16:27,560
out to New York and I was I was supposed

1295
01:16:27,560 --> 01:16:30,920
to be regressed on the show, which I've been regressed before,

1296
01:16:30,960 --> 01:16:33,800
and I be regressed, and I'm so, you know, this

1297
01:16:33,920 --> 01:16:35,520
is fine, you know, it was an honor to be

1298
01:16:35,800 --> 01:16:38,159
I never knew who the other person they selected was.

1299
01:16:38,640 --> 01:16:41,359
They weren't there at the time, but so when I

1300
01:16:41,479 --> 01:16:44,439
was there when we were about to film, like who's

1301
01:16:44,479 --> 01:16:46,840
the person that's supposed to regress me. And this one

1302
01:16:46,840 --> 01:16:49,079
guy says, you know, I'm the one that's going to

1303
01:16:49,119 --> 01:16:51,880
regress you. I'm like, okay, cool, I'm like, what what

1304
01:16:52,239 --> 01:16:54,960
background do you have with this phenomena? And he says,

1305
01:16:55,000 --> 01:16:57,680
I have no background with this phenomena. That makes me so,

1306
01:16:57,880 --> 01:17:03,239
you know, impartial. I'm like, okay, sure, that's fine. I said,

1307
01:17:04,079 --> 01:17:07,920
you know that, just you know know that I'm probably

1308
01:17:07,920 --> 01:17:10,560
gonna be okay. But if you continue to do this,

1309
01:17:11,199 --> 01:17:14,000
you know, and he's like, no, I worked with veterans.

1310
01:17:14,199 --> 01:17:15,399
Speaker 2: I've got this. I'm like okay.

1311
01:17:16,079 --> 01:17:19,399
Speaker 6: So we go and I sit on the couch, and

1312
01:17:20,279 --> 01:17:22,960
all of the other times I've ever been regressed, you know,

1313
01:17:23,039 --> 01:17:28,520
you ease back and you slowly relieve the tension and

1314
01:17:28,760 --> 01:17:33,279
you'd sort of drift into the state of regression.

1315
01:17:34,520 --> 01:17:36,199
Speaker 2: This guy did it a little bit different.

1316
01:17:37,359 --> 01:17:40,039
Speaker 6: I was he I was sitting on the couch and

1317
01:17:40,079 --> 01:17:41,680
then they were filming and he's like, all right, they're

1318
01:17:41,720 --> 01:17:43,359
gonna you know, he's gonna regress, you know.

1319
01:17:43,600 --> 01:17:46,560
Speaker 2: And I'm like, okay, I'm sitting up here. This is different.

1320
01:17:47,159 --> 01:17:49,439
Speaker 6: And and he's like and he puts out his palm

1321
01:17:49,479 --> 01:17:51,520
and he's like, put your hand in my head in

1322
01:17:51,560 --> 01:17:54,680
my palm, so I did, and then he like threw

1323
01:17:54,880 --> 01:17:57,680
me back into the couch and he yelled a sleep

1324
01:17:58,760 --> 01:18:00,800
and I'm like, that's.

1325
01:18:03,760 --> 01:18:06,119
Speaker 2: Because it's like a typical joke show or something.

1326
01:18:06,840 --> 01:18:11,640
Speaker 6: And I'm like he, I mean that was his technique,

1327
01:18:12,359 --> 01:18:14,119
like grab my head, throw me in the couch, and

1328
01:18:14,199 --> 01:18:14,760
yell sleep.

1329
01:18:15,760 --> 01:18:19,199
Speaker 5: Like the therapy as well. It is a technique. It's

1330
01:18:19,239 --> 01:18:21,319
got a particular name which I've forgotten, but it doesn't

1331
01:18:21,359 --> 01:18:23,399
work with a lot of people. It's one of those

1332
01:18:23,560 --> 01:18:25,800
it's a shock tactic one that he can work his

1333
01:18:25,960 --> 01:18:29,800
some but you need the good old fashioned gradual progression.

1334
01:18:29,800 --> 01:18:31,880
Relaxation is far more effective than that.

1335
01:18:32,560 --> 01:18:35,000
Speaker 1: I hope he wasn't doing that the combat veterans, But

1336
01:18:35,199 --> 01:18:38,479
go ahead, and I get.

1337
01:18:38,319 --> 01:18:40,720
Speaker 6: A text, so so here's the thing. So then I

1338
01:18:40,760 --> 01:18:43,720
start going over some of the stuff that happened to me.

1339
01:18:44,159 --> 01:18:46,880
Now I can't really say that anything new came out

1340
01:18:46,880 --> 01:18:49,760
of it, but I was just you know, hitting the

1341
01:18:49,800 --> 01:18:56,960
greatest hits, so to speak. And then they they they

1342
01:18:57,000 --> 01:19:01,960
paused it. The production crew. We lunch and they came

1343
01:19:02,000 --> 01:19:04,359
back and they said, all right, we're going to need

1344
01:19:04,399 --> 01:19:08,760
you to cry, and I'm like, cry, like, yeah, when

1345
01:19:08,800 --> 01:19:11,039
we when we regrets you, when you tell your story,

1346
01:19:11,279 --> 01:19:14,479
we need if if if you you know, if you're

1347
01:19:14,760 --> 01:19:18,119
professional actor, whatever, you know, just bring those tears.

1348
01:19:18,159 --> 01:19:20,920
Speaker 2: If not, do your best. I'm like, I don't think

1349
01:19:20,960 --> 01:19:21,680
I could cry.

1350
01:19:22,640 --> 01:19:28,800
Speaker 6: And at that point, they just were very distant and

1351
01:19:28,880 --> 01:19:31,279
they they knew that we were never going to get

1352
01:19:31,600 --> 01:19:32,680
I was never going to give.

1353
01:19:32,560 --> 01:19:33,359
Speaker 2: Them what they wanted.

1354
01:19:34,479 --> 01:19:37,479
Speaker 6: And and then the show never aired as far as

1355
01:19:37,560 --> 01:19:40,079
I know, And yeah, that's just really strange.

1356
01:19:41,039 --> 01:19:42,600
Speaker 2: They needed me to cry.

1357
01:19:43,640 --> 01:19:47,479
Speaker 1: Yeah, I said, that seems to be rampant in uh.

1358
01:19:47,920 --> 01:19:51,680
Another somebody I know that I won't mention his name.

1359
01:19:52,079 --> 01:19:55,159
He was in one of the well known uh uh

1360
01:19:55,359 --> 01:19:59,840
so called reality uh paranormal shows some years ago and

1361
01:20:00,000 --> 01:20:03,079
he came out of the house and they told him, oh, okay,

1362
01:20:03,279 --> 01:20:05,119
now you have to have to say there's a demon

1363
01:20:05,159 --> 01:20:07,600
in that house. And he said, but there is no

1364
01:20:07,680 --> 01:20:10,079
demon in that house. And so they argued back and

1365
01:20:10,119 --> 01:20:13,800
forth and they cut him out of the show. So that, unfortunately,

1366
01:20:13,960 --> 01:20:15,960
is something that happens quite a bit.

1367
01:20:16,000 --> 01:20:17,039
Speaker 4: I think I.

1368
01:20:17,000 --> 01:20:18,920
Speaker 3: Should get a job on one of those shows because

1369
01:20:18,960 --> 01:20:20,000
I can make people cry.

1370
01:20:24,479 --> 01:20:26,039
Speaker 1: And I don't doubt her either.

1371
01:20:27,159 --> 01:20:30,560
Speaker 6: I actually do a presentation on the mishaps I've had

1372
01:20:30,560 --> 01:20:36,319
with television. There's so many. Another one, National Geographic flew

1373
01:20:36,359 --> 01:20:39,840
me out to Roswell interviewed me in the Roswell Museum,

1374
01:20:40,439 --> 01:20:44,399
and then after about three hours, the director said that

1375
01:20:44,560 --> 01:20:47,920
they wouldn't be able to use my material because they

1376
01:20:47,920 --> 01:20:51,239
were actually bringing me on to be the strange kookie

1377
01:20:51,279 --> 01:20:55,800
guy on the show and that I didn't Yeah, I

1378
01:20:55,840 --> 01:20:58,720
wasn't cookie enough for them. He's like, the way he

1379
01:20:58,760 --> 01:21:01,439
put it was, he goes, So here's the thing. He goes,

1380
01:21:01,520 --> 01:21:04,000
I believe you. He goes, I didn't know what to

1381
01:21:04,079 --> 01:21:06,199
think about this. He goes, I don't really know a

1382
01:21:06,199 --> 01:21:09,359
lot about this, but he goes, I believe that these

1383
01:21:09,359 --> 01:21:11,239
things that you say happen to you, happen to you,

1384
01:21:11,600 --> 01:21:13,079
and that's why we can't use you.

1385
01:21:14,239 --> 01:21:16,920
Speaker 3: And yeah, your hair is too neat. You have to

1386
01:21:17,000 --> 01:21:18,560
mess it up.

1387
01:21:23,119 --> 01:21:25,800
Speaker 1: And it helps if you diet two different colors.

1388
01:21:26,520 --> 01:21:29,600
Speaker 2: Mhm wow.

1389
01:21:30,000 --> 01:21:32,119
Speaker 1: Well, maybe maybe we should have you back, Bill and

1390
01:21:32,119 --> 01:21:34,840
you can kind of do a version of that talk

1391
01:21:34,880 --> 01:21:38,880
about the TV mishaps, because that would be well, it

1392
01:21:38,880 --> 01:21:41,880
would be entertaining and also it would be it's typically

1393
01:21:43,840 --> 01:21:44,239
go ahead.

1394
01:21:45,840 --> 01:21:47,760
Speaker 2: Now, I'm just and That's what I've said to the

1395
01:21:47,800 --> 01:21:48,680
tip of the iceberg.

1396
01:21:49,960 --> 01:21:53,840
Speaker 1: If so many people buy into all this, and you know,

1397
01:21:53,880 --> 01:21:55,960
most of us will watch it, watch some of them

1398
01:21:55,960 --> 01:21:58,960
for entertainment purposes, but there's that one part of our

1399
01:21:59,000 --> 01:22:02,399
brain that's going, Okay, you know what's staged here and

1400
01:22:02,439 --> 01:22:07,520
what's nonsense. Of course, some go all the way, like

1401
01:22:07,600 --> 01:22:11,560
Mountain Monsters, and there's not a shred of truth to that.

1402
01:22:11,840 --> 01:22:14,920
I'll tell you my little story. I was here in

1403
01:22:15,000 --> 01:22:20,880
Point Pleasant taking people's photographs by the Mothman statue and

1404
01:22:20,920 --> 01:22:25,319
answering questions inside the building. Some people came by and

1405
01:22:25,439 --> 01:22:29,520
one of them was related to John Tice, who played

1406
01:22:29,560 --> 01:22:35,680
Trapper in the Mountain Monsters TV show, and that person said,

1407
01:22:35,720 --> 01:22:40,279
how yep, they filmed it all on his property, and

1408
01:22:40,800 --> 01:22:43,159
you know, we were just laughing about some of the

1409
01:22:43,199 --> 01:22:45,399
episodes and the things they would make up, like the

1410
01:22:46,000 --> 01:22:50,920
Bigfoots teaming up with the Chupicabres in West Virginia. So

1411
01:22:51,439 --> 01:22:54,439
but anyway, it was was pretty pretty funny to hear

1412
01:22:54,520 --> 01:22:57,720
that from this person about all the just the way

1413
01:22:57,760 --> 01:23:00,520
they staged it. And then on the other hand, people

1414
01:23:00,520 --> 01:23:02,960
that just bought it with the line and snicker.

1415
01:23:04,319 --> 01:23:06,520
Speaker 6: Yeah, this woman at work once asked me. She's like,

1416
01:23:06,840 --> 01:23:09,319
she's like, how can I get my son to stop

1417
01:23:09,359 --> 01:23:10,720
watching these big foot shows?

1418
01:23:12,560 --> 01:23:13,560
Speaker 2: That was a great question.

1419
01:23:14,119 --> 01:23:17,199
Speaker 6: But speaking of the Mountain Monster show, I think that's

1420
01:23:17,239 --> 01:23:21,199
a show that I remember several years ago I found

1421
01:23:21,199 --> 01:23:24,079
I could trigger Fred Saluga by mentioning the name of

1422
01:23:24,119 --> 01:23:24,720
a TV show.

1423
01:23:24,720 --> 01:23:28,439
Speaker 2: I think that was a show. Yeah, that probably mentioned

1424
01:23:29,159 --> 01:23:30,640
like that show is terrible.

1425
01:23:30,760 --> 01:23:35,520
Speaker 1: Because at the Creature Weekend a few years ago, Uh,

1426
01:23:35,640 --> 01:23:38,960
they invited John Tice, I mean and and the guy,

1427
01:23:39,079 --> 01:23:43,079
and uh they they knew that Bruce Harrington knew that

1428
01:23:43,079 --> 01:23:45,800
he was that was all fake and everything, but just

1429
01:23:45,800 --> 01:23:49,560
just for fun. And then the next year he invited

1430
01:23:49,640 --> 01:23:51,960
all the Mountain Monster guys there. I think been at

1431
01:23:52,000 --> 01:23:55,520
the Mothman Festival a few times. Great guys, they stay

1432
01:23:55,560 --> 01:23:59,560
in character and uh, it's uh. I grew to love

1433
01:23:59,600 --> 01:24:02,720
the show the first time I watched their their Mothman

1434
01:24:02,760 --> 01:24:06,319
episode for about twenty minutes and I said, what is

1435
01:24:06,359 --> 01:24:08,920
this crap? They're not even not even getting the folk

1436
01:24:08,920 --> 01:24:11,960
floor right. And then I got it. I said, oh,

1437
01:24:12,159 --> 01:24:15,399
it's a mockumentary. They're just having fun. So after that

1438
01:24:15,479 --> 01:24:18,359
I was able to enjoy it. Hmm.

1439
01:24:19,039 --> 01:24:19,800
Speaker 2: Now Fred's great.

1440
01:24:19,800 --> 01:24:22,239
Speaker 6: I haven't talked to that guy, uncle Fred in so

1441
01:24:22,279 --> 01:24:23,000
many years.

1442
01:24:23,279 --> 01:24:27,039
Speaker 1: Well, I see him at the Butler. You can do

1443
01:24:27,119 --> 01:24:31,279
the Butler, their their weekend to speak and.

1444
01:24:31,359 --> 01:24:34,439
Speaker 2: Yeah a few times, Yeah, yeah, I.

1445
01:24:34,399 --> 01:24:36,840
Speaker 1: See Fred once in a while, and sometimes you'll show

1446
01:24:36,920 --> 01:24:39,399
up at the Mothman Festival. So so you'll have to

1447
01:24:39,399 --> 01:24:42,479
come down to Point Pleasant. But if you do, let

1448
01:24:42,479 --> 01:24:45,720
me know ahead of time, because right now my house

1449
01:24:45,760 --> 01:24:50,359
looks like a UFO crash site. So but I've got

1450
01:24:50,399 --> 01:24:52,880
to get it straight because a buddy of mine's coming

1451
01:24:52,960 --> 01:24:56,159
down from Tridelphia. He was here last year, so he

1452
01:24:56,399 --> 01:24:58,119
can't even get in the bedroom right now, there's too

1453
01:24:58,119 --> 01:25:01,159
many boxes. But anyway, it'd be great, great to have

1454
01:25:01,279 --> 01:25:02,640
you down to Point Pleasant.

1455
01:25:03,239 --> 01:25:05,239
Speaker 2: Yeah, I was there a couple of years ago.

1456
01:25:05,359 --> 01:25:08,600
Speaker 6: I stopped in the museum and you know, did the

1457
01:25:08,640 --> 01:25:11,279
photo shoot with the statue and the whole nine errands.

1458
01:25:11,359 --> 01:25:11,600
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1459
01:25:11,680 --> 01:25:15,720
Speaker 1: Well, well now you can. You can enjoy Mothman Black

1460
01:25:15,800 --> 01:25:19,520
Light Mini Gulf upstairs over the Point Pleasant Trading Company.

1461
01:25:19,840 --> 01:25:23,920
The graphics are phenomenal. You can do the escape room.

1462
01:25:24,159 --> 01:25:27,000
We have a MothNet escape room, which I refused to do.

1463
01:25:28,159 --> 01:25:31,279
If I fail, I'll never live it down and so

1464
01:25:31,359 --> 01:25:34,720
it's really, uh, it really has grown. But have you

1465
01:25:34,760 --> 01:25:35,760
ever been to the festival.

1466
01:25:37,039 --> 01:25:40,119
Speaker 6: No, you know, it's always fallen on something else that's

1467
01:25:40,159 --> 01:25:43,560
going on here in Michigan. And for the past several

1468
01:25:43,640 --> 01:25:46,760
years that was the same weekend as the UFO Contact,

1469
01:25:47,079 --> 01:25:50,920
although that's now now Contact is the twenty sixth, twenty

1470
01:25:50,920 --> 01:25:54,079
seventh this year, so not the same weekend. But still

1471
01:25:55,439 --> 01:26:00,520
I spent so much capital going to also of stuff

1472
01:26:00,520 --> 01:26:04,520
already this year that it's just one conference too many.

1473
01:26:04,600 --> 01:26:08,600
Speaker 1: Unfortunately, Well it's crazy crowded, so I tell people you

1474
01:26:08,720 --> 01:26:11,439
have to come off season as well so you can

1475
01:26:11,479 --> 01:26:13,399
get into the museum and move around a little bit.

1476
01:26:13,560 --> 01:26:20,600
But so, ladies and gentlemen, shall we close up the episode? Yeah, okay, Bill,

1477
01:26:20,680 --> 01:26:23,920
tell us how people can contact you all about Michigan

1478
01:26:24,039 --> 01:26:25,520
Upon and your books.

1479
01:26:26,039 --> 01:26:28,319
Speaker 2: Okay, for move I'll start with Mofon.

1480
01:26:29,279 --> 01:26:35,159
Speaker 6: Moufon is one UFO investigative group that will actually investigate

1481
01:26:35,199 --> 01:26:37,840
your siting when you report it to them. So please

1482
01:26:37,880 --> 01:26:40,159
go to moufon dot com if you see a UFO

1483
01:26:40,840 --> 01:26:44,119
and if you are interested investigating UFOs, there's no better

1484
01:26:44,199 --> 01:26:46,600
place to go than move On to learn how to

1485
01:26:46,680 --> 01:26:50,399
become a Field Investigator. Also at moufon dot com. If

1486
01:26:50,479 --> 01:26:55,119
you happen to be in Michigan, am im ufon dot

1487
01:26:55,199 --> 01:26:59,920
Org is our state site and basically it's a UFO lodge.

1488
01:27:00,880 --> 01:27:03,479
Many states have them, so maybe check out your own

1489
01:27:03,520 --> 01:27:06,720
state to see what they offer. And I do have

1490
01:27:06,760 --> 01:27:11,199
two books, Experiencer Race in Two Worlds, which is about

1491
01:27:11,239 --> 01:27:13,600
my first twenty years of life, growing up with this

1492
01:27:13,640 --> 01:27:16,720
phenomena in my life, and then I have a Experience

1493
01:27:16,800 --> 01:27:19,680
or Two Two Worlds Clyde, which is about the next

1494
01:27:19,720 --> 01:27:23,399
five years of my life, very intense period.

1495
01:27:23,079 --> 01:27:23,640
Speaker 2: Of my life.

1496
01:27:23,840 --> 01:27:26,880
Speaker 6: And I have enough material for a third book, but

1497
01:27:27,000 --> 01:27:29,840
that'll probably be down the road a little bit before

1498
01:27:29,960 --> 01:27:33,560
I put that out. I'm on Facebook, so please hit

1499
01:27:33,600 --> 01:27:37,840
me up there. I have a website Experiencer dot me,

1500
01:27:38,279 --> 01:27:42,640
so Experiencer dot e, which I don't update as often

1501
01:27:42,680 --> 01:27:44,800
as I should, but I'm an easy target if you

1502
01:27:44,840 --> 01:27:47,079
need want to reach out to me, especially if you

1503
01:27:47,119 --> 01:27:49,279
have abduction encounters.

1504
01:27:49,760 --> 01:27:52,039
Speaker 2: I'd love to powell about that with you.

1505
01:27:53,680 --> 01:27:57,159
Speaker 1: Excellent, Well, Bill, I really appreciate you coming on the show,

1506
01:27:58,199 --> 01:28:01,159
Susie Andy. Any closing words.

1507
01:28:01,800 --> 01:28:04,760
Speaker 5: No, it's not actually fascinating talking to you. I sends

1508
01:28:04,760 --> 01:28:08,840
you a friend request, and we're already friends, so that

1509
01:28:09,119 --> 01:28:09,319
you know.

1510
01:28:10,600 --> 01:28:12,479
Speaker 1: And of course Susie and.

1511
01:28:12,479 --> 01:28:14,960
Speaker 3: I just like to say, if you'd like to pass

1512
01:28:15,199 --> 01:28:18,600
along that pack draw feel free.

1513
01:28:19,520 --> 01:28:20,720
Speaker 1: Oh I tell him? Tell him again.

1514
01:28:20,760 --> 01:28:23,479
Speaker 3: Where he can do that, Well, he can just ask

1515
01:28:23,520 --> 01:28:27,920
you for my email, but anyone else can go toospot

1516
01:28:28,000 --> 01:28:29,680
dot com.

1517
01:28:30,199 --> 01:28:34,520
Speaker 1: Yes, and remember you cannot find Susie on Facebook because

1518
01:28:34,600 --> 01:28:36,279
she often hides in the shadows.

1519
01:28:36,439 --> 01:28:39,239
Speaker 3: And all of my hate mail goes to Steve Ward,

1520
01:28:39,439 --> 01:28:41,399
who is always available.

1521
01:28:41,000 --> 01:28:44,039
Speaker 1: On And I can't tell you how much I enjoy it.

1522
01:28:44,960 --> 01:28:48,399
I reply, it's just I'm if I'm Susie and I

1523
01:28:48,439 --> 01:28:51,920
really get them angry, you know, Okay.

1524
01:28:51,720 --> 01:28:52,439
Speaker 2: Can I can?

1525
01:28:52,479 --> 01:28:52,960
Speaker 1: I just see?

1526
01:28:53,119 --> 01:28:54,479
Speaker 2: This one is really great?

1527
01:28:54,800 --> 01:28:59,399
Speaker 1: So John Lee, Oh, okay, John Lee is the guy

1528
01:28:59,720 --> 01:29:03,920
that's coming down to visit during Mothmath. Go ahead.

1529
01:29:04,920 --> 01:29:08,560
Speaker 6: So so John Lee and Steve they had this great banter.

1530
01:29:09,359 --> 01:29:12,279
Wherever you can catch them together in the same place

1531
01:29:12,319 --> 01:29:15,399
on social media, it's a real treat to watch you

1532
01:29:15,479 --> 01:29:19,159
and John Pope jabs at each other. And I thought

1533
01:29:19,159 --> 01:29:21,880
this was my all time favorite. Back when Steve was

1534
01:29:21,920 --> 01:29:24,880
still in Michigan, Steve put out He's like, hey, I'm

1535
01:29:24,880 --> 01:29:28,239
thinking about putting together like a weird Michigan tour, and

1536
01:29:28,359 --> 01:29:30,760
John responded, yeah, and the tour is Steve.

1537
01:29:35,520 --> 01:29:39,640
Speaker 1: Yes, Well, John and I are a bit twisted and

1538
01:29:39,960 --> 01:29:43,119
somehow there's some kind of strange harmonic that goes on

1539
01:29:43,199 --> 01:29:46,000
there that people have not been able to figure out.

1540
01:29:46,039 --> 01:29:47,359
Speaker 4: But very good.

1541
01:29:47,479 --> 01:29:50,920
Speaker 1: Yes, so watch for that on Facebook. And of course, Susie,

1542
01:29:51,039 --> 01:29:53,000
you can't see you on Facebook. You can't see all

1543
01:29:53,039 --> 01:29:58,039
my my my equips, my my humor, my my, my

1544
01:29:59,159 --> 01:30:01,600
deep thoughts. I guess I'll just have to send you

1545
01:30:01,640 --> 01:30:03,960
an email perfect.

1546
01:30:04,039 --> 01:30:07,680
Speaker 3: I will not be shamed back onto Facebook. But nice try.

1547
01:30:07,760 --> 01:30:12,239
Speaker 1: Okay, Well I tried it all right. The High Strangers

1548
01:30:12,279 --> 01:30:15,159
Factor was created by Steve Ward and Andy Mercer and

1549
01:30:15,199 --> 01:30:17,920
it's got You writed on the Paranormal UK Radio Network.

1550
01:30:18,399 --> 01:30:21,920
Irene Alan block, Mark Johnson and Andy Mercer helm the

1551
01:30:21,960 --> 01:30:26,279
network and he is also producer of this show and

1552
01:30:26,359 --> 01:30:31,079
others on Paranormal UK Radio. He has also composed the

1553
01:30:31,239 --> 01:30:34,600
closing theme for the show, and Brian Zeller composed the

1554
01:30:34,680 --> 01:30:39,119
opening theme for The High Strangest Factor. Susie Fastial provided

1555
01:30:39,199 --> 01:30:43,920
the streamyr connection so you can actually hear us. You

1556
01:30:43,920 --> 01:30:46,640
can also hear me weekly on mcmloney's Military X files

1557
01:30:46,680 --> 01:30:50,000
on the same network and many other platforms. As I

1558
01:30:50,039 --> 01:30:53,159
mentioned earlier, I'm going to be the MC at the

1559
01:30:53,279 --> 01:30:57,039
Mockman Festival coming up the twentieth and twenty first of September,

1560
01:30:57,560 --> 01:31:00,640
and I also will be speaking at two pm Sunday

1561
01:31:01,079 --> 01:31:04,760
on the High Strangious Aspects of a lot Nest Monster.

1562
01:31:05,520 --> 01:31:09,800
Two pm Sunday is what everybody's driving home, so maybe

1563
01:31:09,800 --> 01:31:13,199
maybe they'll broadcast it. I don't know, uh. And I'm

1564
01:31:13,239 --> 01:31:16,600
also going to be the next weekend out in Van Meter,

1565
01:31:16,760 --> 01:31:19,840
Iowa at the Van Meter Visitor Festival as an mc

1566
01:31:20,600 --> 01:31:25,079
if I. After being exhausted and taking down all the creatures,

1567
01:31:25,079 --> 01:31:27,800
I'm putting up in the tt area for the Mothman

1568
01:31:27,880 --> 01:31:30,920
hay Ride. And I am Steve Wards, your uncle host

1569
01:31:30,960 --> 01:31:35,600
here on the high Strangest Factor displaced Michigander deep in

1570
01:31:35,640 --> 01:31:38,800
the Ohio Valley, standing watch on the same road that

1571
01:31:38,960 --> 01:31:43,159
Mothman chased cars in the mid sixties. Andy, Susie and

1572
01:31:43,159 --> 01:31:46,159
I will see you all again in a fortnight. Take

1573
01:31:46,199 --> 01:31:46,399
care