WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.280 --> 00:00:03.240 I do believe it is really like a paradigm shift 2 00:00:03.759 --> 00:00:06.120 in terms of how we should think about money. So 3 00:00:06.200 --> 00:00:09.800 I think that's where bitcoin is actually very educational, almost 4 00:00:09.880 --> 00:00:14.160 like a platform opens the many questions and answers around 5 00:00:14.279 --> 00:00:18.079 the world and around why, you know, countries get into 6 00:00:18.120 --> 00:00:22.960 financial problems, why there's inflation and all that stuff. It's 7 00:00:23.000 --> 00:00:27.359 not only technology, it's not only economic. It's more like 8 00:00:27.399 --> 00:00:31.640 a social science or social topic which everybody would benefit from. 9 00:00:31.600 --> 00:00:32.240 Knowing more about. 10 00:00:37.079 --> 00:00:40.240 Hey, folks, welcome into the Thinking Crypto podcast. I'm your host, 11 00:00:40.240 --> 00:00:44.600 Tony Edward, and we are recording in Prague at Treasure's office. 12 00:00:44.960 --> 00:00:47.880 And joining me is Matte Jaques, who is the CEO 13 00:00:48.159 --> 00:00:48.759 of Treasure. 14 00:00:48.880 --> 00:00:52.679 Mate, great to have you, Thanks for having me, Yeah, Te. 15 00:00:52.679 --> 00:00:57.119 Great event yesterday, awesome launch of the Treasure Safe seven. 16 00:00:57.799 --> 00:00:59.759 I got to play around the device. It's beautiful, it's 17 00:00:59.799 --> 00:01:01.600 great and there's a lot of cool features. So I'm 18 00:01:01.640 --> 00:01:04.280 excited to dive into the details there. But I like 19 00:01:04.280 --> 00:01:06.719 it to kick it off with people's backgrounds, you know, 20 00:01:06.840 --> 00:01:09.280 tell us about where you were born, about growing up, 21 00:01:09.519 --> 00:01:11.879 and how your professional background, how you ended up a 22 00:01:11.920 --> 00:01:13.480 treasure of course. 23 00:01:13.680 --> 00:01:16.200 So I'm from the Czech Republic. 24 00:01:16.400 --> 00:01:20.920 I was born fifty kilometers from outside of Prague. 25 00:01:21.879 --> 00:01:22.640 I call it home. 26 00:01:23.040 --> 00:01:26.439 We're based here, the office is obviously here. Most of 27 00:01:26.480 --> 00:01:33.120 our people are from the country, and my background is 28 00:01:33.159 --> 00:01:39.480 actually very non tech. I studied music, you know, in 29 00:01:39.519 --> 00:01:43.879 my early days. But actually I always have been sort 30 00:01:43.920 --> 00:01:47.079 of I guess you could call it like entrepreneurial or 31 00:01:47.599 --> 00:01:50.000 getting in all kind of like projects, you know, and 32 00:01:50.640 --> 00:01:55.359 managing people and managing projects, et cetera. And I was 33 00:01:55.400 --> 00:01:58.400 always kind of interested in back in general. 34 00:01:59.079 --> 00:02:01.359 So you know, I kind of. 35 00:02:02.439 --> 00:02:04.799 Always like the idea of like building startups, you know, 36 00:02:04.879 --> 00:02:09.360 scaling them up, et cetera. So so, yeah, one thing 37 00:02:09.439 --> 00:02:13.360 led to another, and then I kind of saw that 38 00:02:13.719 --> 00:02:18.439 the product management is actually super interesting kind of area 39 00:02:18.479 --> 00:02:20.919 of expertise that I would like to dive deeper into 40 00:02:22.199 --> 00:02:25.280 because that's literally about, you know, building the right product 41 00:02:25.319 --> 00:02:30.479 for the right people. And then seven years ago I 42 00:02:30.520 --> 00:02:34.360 applied for a job with Treasure. So that's how this 43 00:02:34.479 --> 00:02:37.039 whole went down, this whole thing. 44 00:02:37.199 --> 00:02:39.680 So I applied, I got in. 45 00:02:40.360 --> 00:02:43.319 It was a farther small company, maybe thirty forty people, 46 00:02:45.240 --> 00:02:50.840 and and yeah, I started building new software products features. 47 00:02:51.360 --> 00:02:55.319 Then I became sort of ahead of suite and chief 48 00:02:55.360 --> 00:02:59.919 product officer, and then finally three years ago, I was 49 00:03:00.080 --> 00:03:03.599 offered the cur control by the founders of the company. 50 00:03:03.919 --> 00:03:07.840 That's amazing, incredible journey moving up in the company. What 51 00:03:07.919 --> 00:03:10.240 was your first encounter with bitcoin and what was your 52 00:03:10.240 --> 00:03:12.719 aha moment that pulled you in and said, wait, I 53 00:03:12.759 --> 00:03:13.759 get what bigcoin is? 54 00:03:14.520 --> 00:03:17.199 It literally was when I started in the company. 55 00:03:17.199 --> 00:03:20.360 I mean I was interested in in general and even 56 00:03:20.599 --> 00:03:25.719 back in school, in economy, sociology, even psychology, those kind 57 00:03:25.759 --> 00:03:28.000 of I think topics are. And by the way, I 58 00:03:28.000 --> 00:03:32.919 also was always sort of like very much like a 59 00:03:33.000 --> 00:03:35.280 freedom slash individualistic person. 60 00:03:35.319 --> 00:03:36.520 You know, I like my. 61 00:03:38.199 --> 00:03:42.840 Sort of endeavors or how to say, experiences in nature, 62 00:03:43.159 --> 00:03:45.280 you know, like climbing and all that stuff. So I 63 00:03:45.319 --> 00:03:47.479 think that kind of all these things sort of connected 64 00:03:47.520 --> 00:03:51.360 together when I joined the company, and I had the 65 00:03:51.599 --> 00:03:55.639 amazing opportunity to basically be coached and taught by the 66 00:03:55.680 --> 00:03:57.840 founders of the whole hardware bold industry. 67 00:03:58.120 --> 00:03:58.319 Right. 68 00:03:58.560 --> 00:04:02.439 So, because I always really like to read a lot 69 00:04:02.680 --> 00:04:08.080 and study quite a lot, I you know, read many 70 00:04:08.159 --> 00:04:12.400 bitcoin books and again got coached by by they founders, 71 00:04:12.400 --> 00:04:14.840 and then I think that's where it clicked, you know, 72 00:04:14.879 --> 00:04:18.160 I was like, Okay, so this really it's not just 73 00:04:18.240 --> 00:04:21.360 like some like money to egch, but it's als like 74 00:04:21.759 --> 00:04:23.079 much bigger problems in the world. 75 00:04:24.079 --> 00:04:25.920 And do you feel like at the start of bitcoin 76 00:04:26.079 --> 00:04:30.279 is this kind of pivotal moment in history where money 77 00:04:30.319 --> 00:04:34.959 is changing, the distribution of power is changing, because, like 78 00:04:35.040 --> 00:04:37.879 you mentioned, being able to be your own bank and 79 00:04:38.040 --> 00:04:41.360 have that self sovereignty so to speak, it seems like 80 00:04:41.560 --> 00:04:44.360 that was the birth of something very new in this 81 00:04:44.439 --> 00:04:47.079 digital age that is going to change the dynamic of 82 00:04:47.160 --> 00:04:49.360 people in governments and currency and much more. 83 00:04:50.040 --> 00:04:52.839 Yeah, I do believe it is really like a paradigm 84 00:04:52.879 --> 00:04:56.600 shift in terms of how we should think about money. 85 00:04:56.639 --> 00:05:01.680 So I think that's where bitcoin is actually educational, almost 86 00:05:02.319 --> 00:05:05.160 almost like a platform, I would say for sure, because 87 00:05:05.199 --> 00:05:08.079 when when you when you read about it, when you 88 00:05:08.120 --> 00:05:10.920 try to get this exactly this sort of a moment, 89 00:05:11.759 --> 00:05:17.120 it sort of opens all the how to say, the 90 00:05:17.199 --> 00:05:21.519 many questions and answers around the world and around why 91 00:05:21.759 --> 00:05:25.639 you know, countries get into financial problems, why there is 92 00:05:26.360 --> 00:05:30.639 inflation and all that stuff. So I think that's yeah, 93 00:05:30.680 --> 00:05:34.639 that's where I would say it's not only technology, it's 94 00:05:34.639 --> 00:05:35.439 not only. 95 00:05:37.040 --> 00:05:38.279 Economic. It's more like. 96 00:05:38.399 --> 00:05:41.879 Almost like a yeah, like a social science or social topic, 97 00:05:42.160 --> 00:05:45.519 which sure should kind of everybody would benefit from knowing 98 00:05:45.560 --> 00:05:46.000 more about. 99 00:05:46.720 --> 00:05:50.959 Yeah, it's fascinating. And then from Bitcoin, this whole crypto 100 00:05:51.040 --> 00:05:53.959 asset class and industry was established. 101 00:05:54.120 --> 00:05:55.600 What are your thoughts looking back to. 102 00:05:55.680 --> 00:05:57.800 When bigcoin was started to where the market is now, 103 00:05:57.800 --> 00:06:00.800 where you have adoption from major banks in Wall Street 104 00:06:00.879 --> 00:06:04.360 and trad fin institutions, but also in general regular people 105 00:06:04.399 --> 00:06:07.879 being able to participate. But in addition you have blockchain 106 00:06:07.920 --> 00:06:09.720 tech like smart contracts and much more. 107 00:06:11.680 --> 00:06:16.720 So it's super multifaceted industry now, which is kind of nice. 108 00:06:16.759 --> 00:06:20.680 We see the adoption by more and more people. You know, 109 00:06:20.720 --> 00:06:24.720 the estimates are probably six hundred million people or maybe more, 110 00:06:24.879 --> 00:06:29.639 adding a couple hundreds every year, so it's growing, you know, 111 00:06:29.720 --> 00:06:33.120 pretty fast. Again, the adoption is almost like exponential in 112 00:06:33.160 --> 00:06:36.839 that sense. And you know, and it's a free market, 113 00:06:38.279 --> 00:06:40.519 which I'm by the way, big believer, and it's how 114 00:06:40.560 --> 00:06:44.279 it should be. So there are new services, new opportunities, 115 00:06:44.399 --> 00:06:48.160 new technological advancement, et cetera. And I think where we 116 00:06:48.199 --> 00:06:51.160 specifically come as a maybe as a company or even 117 00:06:51.240 --> 00:06:56.360 my own personal persuasion that we should be sort of 118 00:06:56.560 --> 00:06:57.480 careful or. 119 00:06:57.480 --> 00:07:03.480 Mindful of the true ownership of bitcoin and crypto. 120 00:07:03.560 --> 00:07:05.879 That's where obviously where gasure comes in as a product 121 00:07:05.879 --> 00:07:11.360 as well, because there are many now products that look 122 00:07:11.480 --> 00:07:14.759 like bitcoin or etherorem but they are actually not, right 123 00:07:15.240 --> 00:07:18.079 of course, spoken at the ETFs as an example, or 124 00:07:18.120 --> 00:07:22.839 even stocks of companies that are that are you know, 125 00:07:22.879 --> 00:07:25.560 treasury companies, et cetera. That's not the real ownership of 126 00:07:25.600 --> 00:07:29.399 bitcoin itself. And that's where I would remind everybody maybe 127 00:07:29.439 --> 00:07:31.480 to do the homework there, because it's kind of a 128 00:07:31.480 --> 00:07:35.600 pity because then it if you own this asset instead 129 00:07:35.639 --> 00:07:39.680 of the private keys from bitcoin itself, then it just 130 00:07:39.759 --> 00:07:44.680 removes you further further apart from the actual ownership, which 131 00:07:44.720 --> 00:07:48.920 is a pity because that's how that's why bitcoin started 132 00:07:48.959 --> 00:07:51.480 to exist to begin with, right so, and not to 133 00:07:51.560 --> 00:07:54.600 have like super leveraged financial products, but to be able 134 00:07:54.639 --> 00:07:58.279 to own proper non governmental money, you know, directly. 135 00:07:58.800 --> 00:08:01.639 That's a great point, and I think it's like a 136 00:08:01.680 --> 00:08:05.079 double edged sword, right where yes, it brings in more capital, 137 00:08:05.160 --> 00:08:07.519 Yes it gives more exposure to bitcoin, but it doesn't 138 00:08:07.600 --> 00:08:10.800 it takes away the ownership exactly exactly. And I try 139 00:08:10.800 --> 00:08:13.519 to remind people of that, like I believe in self costing. 140 00:08:13.519 --> 00:08:16.519 I've been self casting for a long time. And if 141 00:08:16.519 --> 00:08:18.519 you don't have access to your private keys, just know 142 00:08:18.639 --> 00:08:22.199 you don't actually own that bitcoin or that asset, just 143 00:08:22.199 --> 00:08:24.319 like you don't necessarily own the money in the bank, 144 00:08:24.959 --> 00:08:26.720 because the bank can take your money at any point. 145 00:08:26.759 --> 00:08:28.519 There's nothing stopping it from doing exactly. 146 00:08:28.600 --> 00:08:31.079 And they have just you know, some few percent of 147 00:08:31.079 --> 00:08:33.279 what they actually glean they own right like and a 148 00:08:33.320 --> 00:08:36.200 whole That's how and they are legally allowed to do so, 149 00:08:36.279 --> 00:08:37.360 like to boost the business, et cetera. 150 00:08:37.399 --> 00:08:41.000 I understand that, but it's how we got here. 151 00:08:41.480 --> 00:08:44.000 And therefore I would be mindful and and I think 152 00:08:44.000 --> 00:08:47.399 my job and job of the company is to remind 153 00:08:47.440 --> 00:08:50.960 everybody you know, consider this as well, because the self 154 00:08:50.960 --> 00:08:55.240 custody is sort of superior ownership because it's the true ownership, 155 00:08:55.360 --> 00:08:58.000 unlike the indirect exposure. 156 00:08:58.399 --> 00:09:01.240 Absolutely, so talk to us, talked to us a bit 157 00:09:01.279 --> 00:09:05.720 a bit about how Treasure is approaching educating the masses, 158 00:09:05.799 --> 00:09:08.519 the average person walking in the street, because you know, 159 00:09:08.559 --> 00:09:12.039 this could still be very intimidating to them, right the 160 00:09:12.120 --> 00:09:15.000 technological part. Maybe they're not very tech savvy. They they 161 00:09:15.000 --> 00:09:17.120 only know how to use their smartphone, and certain apps. 162 00:09:17.879 --> 00:09:20.960 How is treasure looking to approach it to make it easier. 163 00:09:20.919 --> 00:09:27.360 Right, some huge believer in persuading the market not by words, 164 00:09:27.399 --> 00:09:31.799 but by actions and by products, by really good experiences 165 00:09:31.799 --> 00:09:35.360 in the products. So and the just our Safe seven 166 00:09:35.360 --> 00:09:37.879 that we have just launched sexual testament to this because 167 00:09:37.919 --> 00:09:40.799 it is the most sort of user from the product 168 00:09:40.840 --> 00:09:43.559 that we have built. It's very beautiful, it has premium 169 00:09:43.600 --> 00:09:47.679 sort of built really literally you would use it the 170 00:09:47.759 --> 00:09:50.679 same way as you would do your high end phone. Right, 171 00:09:50.720 --> 00:09:53.720 So your example that you gave, like maybe people use 172 00:09:53.799 --> 00:09:57.120 only their phones, I would argue that's actually a very 173 00:09:57.120 --> 00:10:00.559 similar experience. It's like it's if you can manage your 174 00:10:01.440 --> 00:10:03.840 you know, has phones wireless headphones, then you can. This 175 00:10:03.919 --> 00:10:06.399 is even easier because headphones don't have displays, you know, 176 00:10:06.480 --> 00:10:07.679 so it doesn't guide you that well. 177 00:10:07.799 --> 00:10:09.639 So so it really is. 178 00:10:09.559 --> 00:10:13.960 Like super super easy. Sure, And yeah, that's how I 179 00:10:14.000 --> 00:10:18.080 think we should educate people by giving them the great products. 180 00:10:18.120 --> 00:10:18.600 And then of. 181 00:10:18.559 --> 00:10:22.519 Course there's the board's part as well, where we you know, 182 00:10:22.559 --> 00:10:24.919 we have pretty solid knowledge base, We have really good 183 00:10:24.919 --> 00:10:28.519 customer support. We even have a service called chess or 184 00:10:28.559 --> 00:10:31.120 Expert where you can actually book a session with a 185 00:10:31.159 --> 00:10:32.320 physical person. 186 00:10:32.559 --> 00:10:34.679 Not AI love that, but yeah, and you can. 187 00:10:34.600 --> 00:10:38.399 Talk about why self custody house self custody. They will 188 00:10:38.399 --> 00:10:40.679 help you to on board you and through the products 189 00:10:40.720 --> 00:10:44.440 and yeah, so all these things we do to serve 190 00:10:44.480 --> 00:10:45.600 as many people as possible. 191 00:10:45.840 --> 00:10:46.440 Absolutely. 192 00:10:46.639 --> 00:10:48.720 Yeah, And to your point, I love that you guys 193 00:10:48.720 --> 00:10:52.080 have that handholding service. So I think that's very important 194 00:10:52.080 --> 00:10:53.679 for a lot of people. You know, myself as an 195 00:10:53.679 --> 00:10:56.440 early adopter and many folks who are earlier adopters. This 196 00:10:56.519 --> 00:10:59.080 is it comes easy to us now, but if someone 197 00:10:59.159 --> 00:11:01.600 who's now encounter bring bitcoin or crypto and they want 198 00:11:01.600 --> 00:11:04.759 to do self class, it can be very intimidating, you know. 199 00:11:05.200 --> 00:11:07.480 So that's great that you offer that service. And to 200 00:11:07.519 --> 00:11:09.600 your point of the device, I was, you know, using 201 00:11:09.759 --> 00:11:13.600 the Treasure Saved seven yesterday and beautiful and it feels 202 00:11:13.639 --> 00:11:15.879 great in the hand. I love the touch screen and everything. 203 00:11:16.120 --> 00:11:19.840 So to your point, the usability barrier, breaking that down 204 00:11:20.279 --> 00:11:24.559 will improve adoption. But talk to us a bit about 205 00:11:25.159 --> 00:11:27.360 maybe you can't give away your secret sauce, right, but 206 00:11:27.919 --> 00:11:31.240 you know how you guys try are looking at you know, 207 00:11:31.679 --> 00:11:35.639 user behavior and user habits, and if you can dive 208 00:11:35.720 --> 00:11:38.039 dive a bit deeper, into that and like what makes 209 00:11:38.559 --> 00:11:40.799 the device a great device for people to use? 210 00:11:40.960 --> 00:11:44.519 Yeah. Absolutely, So we have actually in house research team 211 00:11:45.279 --> 00:11:49.600 the whole whole theme that is user experience research that 212 00:11:49.759 --> 00:11:55.080 basically go really long ways to uh, to understand the 213 00:11:55.159 --> 00:11:59.879 users' behaviors. Did they Actually that's the many versions of 214 00:11:59.919 --> 00:12:04.600 the early products with actual people, actually you know users. 215 00:12:05.000 --> 00:12:08.159 We collect that feedback, we apply it in the further development, 216 00:12:09.480 --> 00:12:14.399 and you know, so it's extremely important because ultimately the 217 00:12:14.519 --> 00:12:16.919 user is always right, right, So that's kind of the 218 00:12:17.320 --> 00:12:22.159 saying and when we need to listen to them, and. 219 00:12:21.679 --> 00:12:22.440 So that's one part. 220 00:12:22.480 --> 00:12:27.039 But also we are pretty heavy users ourselves, right, So 221 00:12:27.240 --> 00:12:30.480 that also is some feedback stream or like let's say, 222 00:12:30.480 --> 00:12:34.679 some feedback loop where we kind of see the issues 223 00:12:34.679 --> 00:12:38.320 ourselves and we try to improve upon the experiences that 224 00:12:38.360 --> 00:12:39.799 we have with our own products. 225 00:12:40.200 --> 00:12:42.159 Yeah, that makes sense that you guys are the users 226 00:12:42.200 --> 00:12:43.679 and you believe in self custody. 227 00:12:43.720 --> 00:12:45.279 Absolutely. Yeah. 228 00:12:45.399 --> 00:12:47.960 Let's talk a bit about the new device. There's some 229 00:12:48.039 --> 00:12:51.559 really cool features, like it's quantum resistant, it has full 230 00:12:52.000 --> 00:12:56.080 wireless connectivity. Let's talk about quantum resistance and what that 231 00:12:56.120 --> 00:12:57.919 means with the device and future updates. 232 00:12:59.039 --> 00:13:02.720 So specifically, this device we actually were thinking, Okay, there's 233 00:13:03.039 --> 00:13:07.200 the bus on the market that people might be worried about, 234 00:13:07.399 --> 00:13:10.519 you know, the sort of post quantum cryptography or whether 235 00:13:10.600 --> 00:13:14.759 it will break, you know, the hardware bullets and crypto 236 00:13:14.799 --> 00:13:18.840 industry and bitcoing, et cetera. And since we, uh, we 237 00:13:18.840 --> 00:13:22.000 were about to launch this product, we're thinking, well, maybe 238 00:13:22.080 --> 00:13:26.000 we can apply some of the post quantum protections already 239 00:13:26.080 --> 00:13:30.159 now that that will enable us to build on it 240 00:13:30.200 --> 00:13:34.240 in the future. Because mind you, these devices are for 241 00:13:34.360 --> 00:13:38.000 long term storage, right, It's not like you're sort of 242 00:13:38.080 --> 00:13:41.279 fast consume electronic goods in the way that you would 243 00:13:41.320 --> 00:13:44.519 just buy the next thing, you know, a year later 244 00:13:44.639 --> 00:13:46.519 or something like like you would with your phone or 245 00:13:46.519 --> 00:13:49.320 like people you know, like as much fast exactly with 246 00:13:49.360 --> 00:13:52.039 the hardware bullets. They're actually built in a way for 247 00:13:52.360 --> 00:13:53.440 for years of usage. 248 00:13:53.759 --> 00:13:53.919 Right. 249 00:13:53.960 --> 00:13:57.480 You can upgrade if you want to do anything. But 250 00:13:57.480 --> 00:13:59.879 but they're built you know, with this in mind, not 251 00:14:00.200 --> 00:14:01.840 just with actually trying to. 252 00:14:03.279 --> 00:14:06.399 Onboard you in the next product straight away. 253 00:14:06.639 --> 00:14:10.679 And why I'm saying this is because because of these 254 00:14:10.919 --> 00:14:15.360 design sort of principles, we are already thinking now how 255 00:14:15.399 --> 00:14:20.120 we can use this advanced cryptography already at almost like 256 00:14:20.240 --> 00:14:24.360 the hardware slash manufacturing level, where you know, so there's 257 00:14:24.399 --> 00:14:27.120 a piece of quote and something called bootloader, and that's 258 00:14:27.159 --> 00:14:29.440 where we apply this and we can build on it 259 00:14:29.519 --> 00:14:33.279 in our updates and firmware and even does sweet and 260 00:14:33.039 --> 00:14:37.240 other software products. So so yeah, that's the idea. 261 00:14:37.440 --> 00:14:38.600 Yeah, that absolutely makes sense. 262 00:14:38.639 --> 00:14:41.840 And I'm assuming as there's further iterations with different types 263 00:14:41.879 --> 00:14:47.840 of a cryptography quantum, the devices can be upgraded. 264 00:14:47.440 --> 00:14:50.200 Firmware wise and things exactly exactly. That makes sense. 265 00:14:50.879 --> 00:14:52.919 One of the things I noticed with the announcement was 266 00:14:53.120 --> 00:14:56.120 the new battery and that gives extended life, but also 267 00:14:56.159 --> 00:14:59.200 if the device is not used for like years, it's still. 268 00:14:59.039 --> 00:15:02.679 Be operational exactly, So exactly because of the design principles 269 00:15:02.720 --> 00:15:04.480 that I've just described that you want to kind of 270 00:15:04.519 --> 00:15:08.120 think about it like long term useage of Because we 271 00:15:08.200 --> 00:15:14.320 are huddlers, we chose battery. It's called lithium iron phosphate 272 00:15:15.000 --> 00:15:17.879 and unlike, for example, lithium ion, which would be like 273 00:15:18.120 --> 00:15:20.399 your normal battery that you have in your phones and 274 00:15:20.639 --> 00:15:25.320 other devices. Sure, this battery, this chemistry actually allows for 275 00:15:26.639 --> 00:15:30.960 the battery to discharge or sell discharge much slower than 276 00:15:31.000 --> 00:15:34.000 the standard battery, which means that if you exactly like 277 00:15:34.120 --> 00:15:36.679 leave it in your jower or whatever and you don't 278 00:15:36.720 --> 00:15:40.679 touch the device, it will take four times slower to 279 00:15:40.840 --> 00:15:43.240 kind of lose the power on its own, right, So 280 00:15:43.279 --> 00:15:45.639 we can just leave it for a year in jower 281 00:15:45.720 --> 00:15:48.399 and when you take it out, it will still function 282 00:15:48.519 --> 00:15:50.879 without you, for example, needing to recharge it. 283 00:15:50.960 --> 00:15:52.120 Yet depending of. 284 00:15:52.120 --> 00:15:55.200 Course on you know, other factors such as I don't 285 00:15:55.200 --> 00:15:59.919 know temperature of the environment and how much battery was left, 286 00:16:00.000 --> 00:16:05.159 et cetera. But it's basically superherior how to say, it's 287 00:16:05.279 --> 00:16:08.200 superior technology for the given use case, which is like 288 00:16:08.320 --> 00:16:09.679 again the long term storage. 289 00:16:09.960 --> 00:16:12.480 Yeah, that's great because one of the feedback items I've 290 00:16:12.480 --> 00:16:15.360 heard from people in general use hardware, wealties make sure 291 00:16:15.600 --> 00:16:19.360 it's charged because you know, it's really great. That's like 292 00:16:19.399 --> 00:16:21.759 a key component having the longer battery exactly. 293 00:16:21.759 --> 00:16:25.039 Because also another feature of this battery is that, with 294 00:16:25.720 --> 00:16:28.159 for example, the land batteries, you would. 295 00:16:29.519 --> 00:16:31.679 You could be or should be worried. 296 00:16:31.399 --> 00:16:33.919 About the battery being drained all the way to zero 297 00:16:34.200 --> 00:16:37.200 because at some point it fails, of course, it damages 298 00:16:37.360 --> 00:16:39.919 the device or damages the battery and you cannot really 299 00:16:39.960 --> 00:16:42.519 recharge it again. In this device, that's not the case. 300 00:16:42.559 --> 00:16:44.840 You can actually go all the way to zero and 301 00:16:44.879 --> 00:16:48.320 it's not going to do a sort of damage the 302 00:16:48.360 --> 00:16:49.080 battery itself. 303 00:16:49.240 --> 00:16:50.879 That's amazing. That's pretty groundbreaking. 304 00:16:51.080 --> 00:16:53.399 Yeah, it's it's pretty cool. Yeah, great, great feature. 305 00:16:54.159 --> 00:16:57.159 And then the other part is wireless connectivity. Tell us 306 00:16:57.159 --> 00:17:00.279 about that via Bluetooth, And is there any security risk 307 00:17:00.399 --> 00:17:01.679 with the Bluetooth connection? 308 00:17:02.480 --> 00:17:07.519 So we actually went again through pretty deep like rabbit 309 00:17:07.559 --> 00:17:09.799 hole to make sure that the connection is super secure. 310 00:17:09.839 --> 00:17:14.079 So it's into an encrypted we call it our host protocol. 311 00:17:14.960 --> 00:17:17.039 And I mean. 312 00:17:17.240 --> 00:17:21.359 Theoretically you could you could argue there are some potential risks, 313 00:17:21.440 --> 00:17:25.000 but actually they're not very likely or anything. And by 314 00:17:25.000 --> 00:17:26.759 the way, you can still use the device with the 315 00:17:26.799 --> 00:17:29.839 cable if you want, but it's not a it's not 316 00:17:29.880 --> 00:17:30.839 a big risk honestly. 317 00:17:31.119 --> 00:17:34.680 Oh yeah, for sure. And then I noticed, I don't 318 00:17:34.680 --> 00:17:36.720 know if this is new, but it's like waterproof with 319 00:17:36.799 --> 00:17:39.559 a new aluminum body and the gorilla glass. Is that 320 00:17:39.640 --> 00:17:41.240 new the waterproof aspect or is that? 321 00:17:41.799 --> 00:17:45.240 Yeah? It has it has a certain rating for let's say, 322 00:17:45.279 --> 00:17:47.279 like water splashes or something like this. 323 00:17:48.200 --> 00:17:48.319 Uh. 324 00:17:48.440 --> 00:17:52.079 And we also I think what is quite new with 325 00:17:52.119 --> 00:17:56.960 this device is it is a display because we actually 326 00:17:57.000 --> 00:17:59.839 built like a custom shape display, so we actually worked 327 00:17:59.880 --> 00:18:03.319 with the manufacture that because normally you would you would 328 00:18:03.359 --> 00:18:06.680 look for components on the market that are in specific shape, 329 00:18:06.720 --> 00:18:09.599 so you know, the display would be some like square 330 00:18:09.880 --> 00:18:14.279 or whatever, but we actually wanted the really iconic Chasser shape, 331 00:18:14.440 --> 00:18:17.160 so it actually is you know, like, yeah, can actually 332 00:18:17.480 --> 00:18:19.960 I have the device somewhere here so you know, it's 333 00:18:20.160 --> 00:18:23.680 really the like the iconic shape that is, which. 334 00:18:23.440 --> 00:18:24.640 Is which makes it really nice. 335 00:18:24.799 --> 00:18:26.160 And by the way, it's also good for the us 336 00:18:26.200 --> 00:18:28.160 ability because it's nice. 337 00:18:27.960 --> 00:18:30.359 In your hands, comfortable exactly exactly. 338 00:18:30.759 --> 00:18:33.079 Yeah, it's really great. I think the design is great 339 00:18:33.079 --> 00:18:35.279 and to your point, it's right away. If you see 340 00:18:35.319 --> 00:18:38.119 this device, you know it's treasure. Yeah, yeah, exactly, Yeah, 341 00:18:38.119 --> 00:18:38.799 it's really cool. 342 00:18:39.039 --> 00:18:39.920 I have to say. 343 00:18:41.599 --> 00:18:44.960 Your presentation yesterday, the device set up, it felt like 344 00:18:45.000 --> 00:18:46.319 an Apple presentation. 345 00:18:46.960 --> 00:18:47.640 It's a compliment. 346 00:18:47.920 --> 00:18:51.839 Yeah, definitely a compliment, right because we've seen Steve Jobs 347 00:18:51.839 --> 00:18:54.279 and Apple they set the standard for Yeah, you know, 348 00:18:54.680 --> 00:18:58.799 product so very beautiful. I love everything that you really appreciated. 349 00:19:00.039 --> 00:19:02.960 A question regards to the future of self custody as 350 00:19:03.079 --> 00:19:06.880 technology evolves, and there's further iterations. Do you believe there 351 00:19:06.960 --> 00:19:10.480 might be how do I put it, the way we 352 00:19:11.000 --> 00:19:14.440 store self our keys, private keys is going to be 353 00:19:14.440 --> 00:19:18.240 tied to biometrics maybe or retina or so. 354 00:19:18.279 --> 00:19:21.279 The problem with this is actually. 355 00:19:22.400 --> 00:19:26.200 The fact that you could potentially tie the private keys 356 00:19:26.720 --> 00:19:31.319 to some physical object that is unique in the world, 357 00:19:31.799 --> 00:19:35.039 such as a retina. Sure, and that's problematic if you 358 00:19:35.079 --> 00:19:38.839 think about it, because then you could you could basically 359 00:19:38.880 --> 00:19:41.319 make the link between the two because you're not going 360 00:19:41.359 --> 00:19:41.920 to change your. 361 00:19:41.839 --> 00:19:44.200 Eye for example. Yeah, whereas. 362 00:19:45.160 --> 00:19:48.440 With you know what you can basically when you create 363 00:19:48.440 --> 00:19:51.920 a new set of private keys by for example, Chaser, Uh, 364 00:19:52.200 --> 00:19:54.720 it doesn't it doesn't link to anything. So so that's 365 00:19:54.839 --> 00:19:58.759 kind of like a security slash privacy feature. Right, So 366 00:19:58.920 --> 00:20:01.039 if you tie your back up to your i mean 367 00:20:01.079 --> 00:20:04.720 putty parts or somebody or something, then somebody could actually 368 00:20:04.799 --> 00:20:07.960 like affect you and so so it's probably not a 369 00:20:08.000 --> 00:20:09.240 good idea that a good way. 370 00:20:09.680 --> 00:20:11.480 Yeah, it's just curious because you know, you see a 371 00:20:11.480 --> 00:20:15.279 lot of apps now they fingerprint biometric and then you 372 00:20:15.279 --> 00:20:18.039 know you have the folks at World World Cooin World 373 00:20:18.039 --> 00:20:21.119 Cooin they do the So I'm curious, like it's self custody, 374 00:20:21.079 --> 00:20:22.799 you can adapt in it but to your point, there's 375 00:20:22.799 --> 00:20:23.400 a rest there. 376 00:20:23.519 --> 00:20:23.720 Yeah. 377 00:20:23.759 --> 00:20:26.160 Yeah, So it's a completely different story if you talk 378 00:20:26.200 --> 00:20:29.119 about just authentications such as instead of pin that you 379 00:20:29.160 --> 00:20:33.319 would just use your fingerprint to let's say, open an app, 380 00:20:34.039 --> 00:20:36.799 and then you know, that's fine, that's that's not a problem. 381 00:20:36.799 --> 00:20:39.680 But like when when we are talking about connecting to 382 00:20:39.799 --> 00:20:41.599 the private keys, that's a whole different. 383 00:20:41.359 --> 00:20:43.480 Story, and it's probably another great idea. 384 00:20:43.680 --> 00:20:49.640 Sure, yeah, yeah, somebody come and kidnap you or something, right. Yeah, Now, 385 00:20:49.680 --> 00:20:53.319 in regards to AI, are you looking into how you 386 00:20:53.319 --> 00:20:56.000 can leverage AI, and maybe maybe this might still be 387 00:20:56.039 --> 00:20:58.319 too early, but like maybe AI agents or AI in 388 00:20:58.480 --> 00:21:00.559 devices or in the software things like that. 389 00:21:00.799 --> 00:21:03.000 Yeah, yeah, great, great question. So actually it is on 390 00:21:03.480 --> 00:21:04.039 our radar. 391 00:21:05.119 --> 00:21:06.960 So I talked about the fact that we have pretty 392 00:21:07.000 --> 00:21:10.319 great support and I mean we are using it already 393 00:21:10.319 --> 00:21:15.559 today for you know, just saying basically issues of our 394 00:21:15.599 --> 00:21:18.559 customers or users. So if they write to us, actually 395 00:21:18.599 --> 00:21:21.720 AI help with this immensely. But I can also imagine 396 00:21:22.359 --> 00:21:26.240 we would have like help inside of the products like 397 00:21:26.319 --> 00:21:30.640 our Chaser's Feet for example, where it would educate you, 398 00:21:30.720 --> 00:21:34.920 it would help you to make you conscious self custody decisions, 399 00:21:35.400 --> 00:21:39.119 It could even help with some you know, like buy 400 00:21:39.200 --> 00:21:40.920 the dep you know, messaging. 401 00:21:40.960 --> 00:21:42.079