WEBVTT

1
00:00:01.360 --> 00:00:06.320
<v Speaker 1>It's Night Side with Dan Ray on WBZY Boston's news video.

2
00:00:07.839 --> 00:00:10.880
<v Speaker 2>Beg you, Dan Watkins. As we move into our nine

3
00:00:11.000 --> 00:00:15.880
<v Speaker 2>o'clock hour, we're going to talk about the testimony today

4
00:00:15.919 --> 00:00:19.719
<v Speaker 2>at the Karen Reid retrial. So this is really, however

5
00:00:19.719 --> 00:00:21.800
<v Speaker 2>you want to phrase it. This is the second week.

6
00:00:21.839 --> 00:00:25.440
<v Speaker 2>There was some testimony last week. I thought it was

7
00:00:25.640 --> 00:00:30.280
<v Speaker 2>very interesting testimony today. Now again the testimony is a

8
00:00:30.320 --> 00:00:33.159
<v Speaker 2>prosecution witness. You have to sort of weigh that a

9
00:00:33.200 --> 00:00:36.719
<v Speaker 2>little bit. But I want to talk a little bit

10
00:00:36.840 --> 00:00:42.679
<v Speaker 2>about what the prosecution witness said, what he testified to,

11
00:00:42.719 --> 00:00:45.079
<v Speaker 2>and who he was, and how I think it might

12
00:00:45.200 --> 00:00:48.679
<v Speaker 2>impact the jury. I think talking to one of my

13
00:00:48.880 --> 00:00:52.679
<v Speaker 2>legal beagles today, they thought that the first few days

14
00:00:53.359 --> 00:00:58.439
<v Speaker 2>of this trial has has gone pretty well for the prosecution.

15
00:00:58.600 --> 00:01:02.039
<v Speaker 2>Now again, the we won't know until the jury comes

16
00:01:02.039 --> 00:01:05.640
<v Speaker 2>in with their verdict. But I have to give you

17
00:01:05.719 --> 00:01:09.680
<v Speaker 2>my thoughts as the trial proceeds on a if not

18
00:01:09.719 --> 00:01:12.000
<v Speaker 2>a day to day basis, a week to week basis.

19
00:01:12.040 --> 00:01:14.680
<v Speaker 2>As I think all of us know, this is the

20
00:01:15.120 --> 00:01:18.519
<v Speaker 2>second trial. First trial ended in a hung jury. So

21
00:01:18.640 --> 00:01:24.640
<v Speaker 2>today on the witness stand, the prosecutors called a digital

22
00:01:24.760 --> 00:01:28.000
<v Speaker 2>intelligence expert. What we're really talking about here a forensics.

23
00:01:28.239 --> 00:01:30.640
<v Speaker 2>I mean, forensics is a broad umbrella term that can

24
00:01:30.719 --> 00:01:34.400
<v Speaker 2>mean anything that is sort of scientifically related. We're not

25
00:01:34.439 --> 00:01:37.760
<v Speaker 2>talking about junk science, but we are talking about something

26
00:01:37.760 --> 00:01:41.560
<v Speaker 2>that is scientifically related. And of course all of us

27
00:01:41.560 --> 00:01:43.599
<v Speaker 2>think of it in terms of, you know, DNA and

28
00:01:43.640 --> 00:01:45.599
<v Speaker 2>how that they can go back on some of these

29
00:01:45.959 --> 00:01:50.959
<v Speaker 2>criminal cases and find DNA, make DNA matches on people.

30
00:01:52.400 --> 00:01:54.760
<v Speaker 2>You know, they discarded Pizza cross as the guy that

31
00:01:54.920 --> 00:01:58.480
<v Speaker 2>did down in Long Island. He was a suspect in

32
00:01:58.959 --> 00:02:02.400
<v Speaker 2>the murders of several women on this this beach in

33
00:02:03.280 --> 00:02:05.319
<v Speaker 2>nott Rhode is on the Long Island, excuse me, on

34
00:02:05.400 --> 00:02:11.039
<v Speaker 2>Long Island. So in this instance, the focus today was

35
00:02:11.319 --> 00:02:15.000
<v Speaker 2>on the cell phone of the victim in this case,

36
00:02:15.280 --> 00:02:19.759
<v Speaker 2>John O'Keefe, the Boston you know, the late Boston police

37
00:02:19.759 --> 00:02:25.719
<v Speaker 2>officer who Karen Reid is accused of killing. She's looking

38
00:02:25.759 --> 00:02:29.080
<v Speaker 2>at the most serious charge, a second degree murder charge.

39
00:02:29.599 --> 00:02:33.159
<v Speaker 2>So the prosecutor called this fellaw Ian Whiffen, the digital

40
00:02:33.319 --> 00:02:38.879
<v Speaker 2>intelligence expert with a company called Celebrate, and he focused

41
00:02:38.960 --> 00:02:43.080
<v Speaker 2>on O'Keefe's cell phone. And I won't get into you

42
00:02:43.120 --> 00:02:46.879
<v Speaker 2>know a lot of the detail, and you can you

43
00:02:46.919 --> 00:02:49.479
<v Speaker 2>can follow up on that with me if you want.

44
00:02:50.199 --> 00:02:56.039
<v Speaker 2>But essentially, he claimed that they were able with his

45
00:02:56.599 --> 00:03:02.960
<v Speaker 2>with O'Keefe's cell phone to basically show a couple of

46
00:03:03.000 --> 00:03:08.719
<v Speaker 2>things which I think are pretty important. One is that

47
00:03:08.759 --> 00:03:15.439
<v Speaker 2>the cell phone really was in the area where his

48
00:03:15.560 --> 00:03:22.599
<v Speaker 2>body was found for several hours. Several hours now there

49
00:03:22.639 --> 00:03:27.759
<v Speaker 2>was a flagpole on the opposite side of the lawn.

50
00:03:29.599 --> 00:03:34.719
<v Speaker 2>Said according to Whiffin that the phone apparently was near

51
00:03:34.800 --> 00:03:37.919
<v Speaker 2>a flagpole on the opposite side of the lawn, but

52
00:03:38.080 --> 00:03:45.240
<v Speaker 2>on the lawn now. Could have O'Keefe discarded the cell

53
00:03:45.280 --> 00:03:48.840
<v Speaker 2>phone or dropped the cell phone, I guess. But the

54
00:03:48.879 --> 00:03:51.800
<v Speaker 2>fact that those of us who have cell phones know

55
00:03:51.919 --> 00:03:54.759
<v Speaker 2>that we're always touching our pocket to make sure we

56
00:03:54.800 --> 00:03:56.520
<v Speaker 2>have our cell phone, that I'll leave no, I got

57
00:03:56.520 --> 00:03:59.120
<v Speaker 2>my cell phone. I feel better, Okay, thirty seconds later,

58
00:03:59.120 --> 00:04:02.080
<v Speaker 2>where's my oh yes, my back pocket or whatever. So

59
00:04:02.199 --> 00:04:07.280
<v Speaker 2>that is interesting fact that the jury can take into

60
00:04:07.280 --> 00:04:10.639
<v Speaker 2>consideration or testimony that the jury can take into consideration.

61
00:04:11.599 --> 00:04:17.040
<v Speaker 2>And then the other thing that Withffin talked about was

62
00:04:17.079 --> 00:04:24.879
<v Speaker 2>that the phone's battery temperature and the Applehealth Dot data

63
00:04:24.920 --> 00:04:28.480
<v Speaker 2>on the phone. He said the battery temperature started off

64
00:04:28.519 --> 00:04:33.600
<v Speaker 2>at about eighty degrees and then a few hours later

65
00:04:34.079 --> 00:04:41.040
<v Speaker 2>it went as low as thirty seven degrees. Now that's

66
00:04:41.079 --> 00:04:45.839
<v Speaker 2>a tough one to overcome, because if O'Keefe did go

67
00:04:46.000 --> 00:04:51.000
<v Speaker 2>into the house, as the defense wants to convince the jury,

68
00:04:51.879 --> 00:04:53.600
<v Speaker 2>what did he do. Did he bring the cell phone

69
00:04:53.600 --> 00:04:56.240
<v Speaker 2>in the house and put it in the refrigerator? Probably not?

70
00:04:57.000 --> 00:05:00.959
<v Speaker 2>Probably not. So I think that the inclusion that maybe

71
00:05:01.120 --> 00:05:05.160
<v Speaker 2>could be drawn from that is that the cell phone

72
00:05:06.360 --> 00:05:09.959
<v Speaker 2>not only was on the lawn for the entirety, but

73
00:05:10.160 --> 00:05:15.199
<v Speaker 2>maybe it was on the lawn with in fact John O'Keefe,

74
00:05:15.199 --> 00:05:18.199
<v Speaker 2>which of course would be a devastating conclusion. Now again,

75
00:05:18.600 --> 00:05:22.399
<v Speaker 2>forensic science and all of that. Look, you watch any

76
00:05:22.480 --> 00:05:25.600
<v Speaker 2>TV show these days, and people do watch these shows.

77
00:05:30.839 --> 00:05:33.680
<v Speaker 2>I like to watch the show on Sunday Night called Tracker.

78
00:05:33.720 --> 00:05:37.160
<v Speaker 2>It's the one show that I have an opportunity to

79
00:05:37.199 --> 00:05:42.199
<v Speaker 2>really watch. And they're using all sorts of data, forensic data,

80
00:05:42.319 --> 00:05:45.160
<v Speaker 2>digital data, and that's what this guy Wiffin was talking

81
00:05:45.199 --> 00:05:50.959
<v Speaker 2>about today. So this is cut number twenty one. This

82
00:05:51.120 --> 00:05:56.360
<v Speaker 2>is within being asked by the prosecutor Hank Brennan about

83
00:05:56.399 --> 00:05:58.120
<v Speaker 2>what we've just talked about. This will give you a

84
00:05:58.120 --> 00:05:59.600
<v Speaker 2>little bit of a sense of what went on in

85
00:05:59.639 --> 00:06:00.759
<v Speaker 2>court toe they cut twenty one.

86
00:06:00.800 --> 00:06:04.519
<v Speaker 3>Please rub the fact that the center dots are in

87
00:06:04.560 --> 00:06:09.160
<v Speaker 3>different spots. Is that inconsistent with a phone being in

88
00:06:09.199 --> 00:06:11.480
<v Speaker 3>the same place not moving that entire night.

89
00:06:13.600 --> 00:06:16.319
<v Speaker 1>It could indicate movement, it could indicate refinement.

90
00:06:16.519 --> 00:06:17.720
<v Speaker 3>Is it impossible to tell?

91
00:06:18.079 --> 00:06:20.839
<v Speaker 1>Its possible to tell at this level of detail anyway.

92
00:06:21.040 --> 00:06:27.160
<v Speaker 3>Are all these dots, given the range ten meters are

93
00:06:27.240 --> 00:06:30.560
<v Speaker 3>under Are all these dots and all these readings of

94
00:06:30.680 --> 00:06:34.079
<v Speaker 3>the high frequency data that you compiled for that night,

95
00:06:34.160 --> 00:06:39.399
<v Speaker 3>are they all consistent with Michel Keif's phone being near

96
00:06:39.720 --> 00:06:41.040
<v Speaker 3>the flagpole and.

97
00:06:40.920 --> 00:06:41.879
<v Speaker 2>Not moving that night.

98
00:06:44.600 --> 00:06:45.879
<v Speaker 1>I think that's a reasonable assumption.

99
00:06:48.079 --> 00:06:54.839
<v Speaker 2>Okay. Brennan also questioned with it about he refers here

100
00:06:54.879 --> 00:07:01.160
<v Speaker 2>to the phone took its last steps. Obviously he's referring

101
00:07:01.160 --> 00:07:06.399
<v Speaker 2>to O'Keefe taking his last potentially his last last steps.

102
00:07:06.399 --> 00:07:10.079
<v Speaker 2>And they've got the time down to twelve thirty two,

103
00:07:10.800 --> 00:07:13.879
<v Speaker 2>and it didn't move again until six four am, which

104
00:07:13.920 --> 00:07:16.160
<v Speaker 2>I believe is the time when his body was actually

105
00:07:16.160 --> 00:07:22.720
<v Speaker 2>discovered and properly moved by EMTs. This has cut twenty three, Please.

106
00:07:22.519 --> 00:07:26.360
<v Speaker 3>Rob After twelve thirty two, sixteen when this phone took

107
00:07:26.399 --> 00:07:31.279
<v Speaker 3>its last steps did it move again until six h

108
00:07:31.360 --> 00:07:32.839
<v Speaker 3>four or one am.

109
00:07:33.000 --> 00:07:36.879
<v Speaker 1>There would no more steps or flight climb or any

110
00:07:36.920 --> 00:07:39.759
<v Speaker 1>other health activity recorder during that time.

111
00:07:41.079 --> 00:07:46.680
<v Speaker 2>So referring to at one point the phone suggested that

112
00:07:46.800 --> 00:07:51.160
<v Speaker 2>it had moved up a few feet, which someone you know,

113
00:07:51.720 --> 00:07:55.399
<v Speaker 2>which the defense will potentially argue that that showed him

114
00:07:55.639 --> 00:07:59.040
<v Speaker 2>walking up a flight of steps into the house, but

115
00:08:00.160 --> 00:08:05.600
<v Speaker 2>the prosecution anticipated that argument and it was explained by

116
00:08:06.600 --> 00:08:11.120
<v Speaker 2>this digital intelligence expert that the phone, while it was

117
00:08:11.160 --> 00:08:14.199
<v Speaker 2>in the car and moving from from point A to

118
00:08:14.240 --> 00:08:18.680
<v Speaker 2>point B, could have gone up you know, elevation. It's

119
00:08:18.720 --> 00:08:23.000
<v Speaker 2>all related, I guess to C level. So I think

120
00:08:23.040 --> 00:08:30.959
<v Speaker 2>that's pretty damning testimony in terms of again forensic testimony. Obviously,

121
00:08:31.040 --> 00:08:33.600
<v Speaker 2>the defense has not put on their case, the prosecution

122
00:08:33.679 --> 00:08:37.639
<v Speaker 2>has not finished presenting their case. But I think that

123
00:08:38.120 --> 00:08:44.559
<v Speaker 2>this guy, Ian Wiffen could be a pretty important witness,

124
00:08:45.679 --> 00:08:49.879
<v Speaker 2>and testimony from this witness that the that the jury

125
00:08:49.919 --> 00:08:52.480
<v Speaker 2>may want to focus on. So what I'm gonna do

126
00:08:52.519 --> 00:08:54.279
<v Speaker 2>is gonna take quick break. I'm going to invite you

127
00:08:54.320 --> 00:08:59.360
<v Speaker 2>to join the conversation. If you have a strong opinion

128
00:08:59.519 --> 00:09:02.480
<v Speaker 2>on what happened in court today, feel free if you

129
00:09:02.519 --> 00:09:06.039
<v Speaker 2>feel what happened in court today will be dismissable by

130
00:09:06.120 --> 00:09:09.840
<v Speaker 2>the defense. Feel free as well. Six one, seven, two, five, four,

131
00:09:10.000 --> 00:09:14.360
<v Speaker 2>ten thirty six, seven, nine, three, one ten thirty. Again,

132
00:09:14.399 --> 00:09:16.440
<v Speaker 2>we're not going to follow this every day, but when

133
00:09:16.480 --> 00:09:19.320
<v Speaker 2>there is a day either for the prosecution or defense

134
00:09:19.960 --> 00:09:23.759
<v Speaker 2>which seems to be significant, we're going to talk about it,

135
00:09:23.799 --> 00:09:26.440
<v Speaker 2>and I hope you join us. Coming right back on Nightside.

136
00:09:27.360 --> 00:09:32.679
<v Speaker 1>Night Side with Dan Ray. I'm WBZ Boston's news radio.

137
00:09:33.519 --> 00:09:36.720
<v Speaker 2>So I've tried to explain what went on in condensed

138
00:09:36.799 --> 00:09:42.480
<v Speaker 2>form in court today and what I think its impact

139
00:09:42.519 --> 00:09:46.840
<v Speaker 2>will be. I do believe that a lot of the

140
00:09:48.200 --> 00:09:52.080
<v Speaker 2>forensic materials that have baffled people other juries over the

141
00:09:52.159 --> 00:09:56.279
<v Speaker 2>years have now come to be accepted by a lot

142
00:09:56.360 --> 00:10:00.360
<v Speaker 2>of Americans. We assume that the DNA is going to

143
00:10:00.360 --> 00:10:02.639
<v Speaker 2>be accurate. Now. I know that there's all sorts of

144
00:10:02.759 --> 00:10:07.240
<v Speaker 2>arguments prone against PROW and against it, but and and

145
00:10:07.320 --> 00:10:10.360
<v Speaker 2>some of it can be considered you know, junk science.

146
00:10:10.480 --> 00:10:14.559
<v Speaker 2>Lie detectors are not necessarily involved and used allowed in

147
00:10:14.960 --> 00:10:18.039
<v Speaker 2>Massachusetts courts, although light detector has been around a long time.

148
00:10:18.720 --> 00:10:22.919
<v Speaker 2>I just think that this testimony today from this digital

149
00:10:23.000 --> 00:10:27.480
<v Speaker 2>intelligence expert Ian Wiffin, again, I wasn't in the court room,

150
00:10:27.600 --> 00:10:30.240
<v Speaker 2>wasn't able to read the jury, but it sounded to

151
00:10:30.279 --> 00:10:34.039
<v Speaker 2>me as if it was pretty convincing, and it also

152
00:10:34.360 --> 00:10:38.480
<v Speaker 2>seems to be based on science that is pretty acceptable.

153
00:10:38.879 --> 00:10:41.840
<v Speaker 2>I don't know that the defense lawyers will be able

154
00:10:42.600 --> 00:10:46.480
<v Speaker 2>to do much with Ian Wiffin on cross examination. We

155
00:10:46.600 --> 00:10:50.799
<v Speaker 2>will see, but I'd love to know from you if

156
00:10:50.840 --> 00:10:55.360
<v Speaker 2>you listen tonight, if you if you watched it, that's

157
00:10:55.399 --> 00:10:57.639
<v Speaker 2>the best. I mean, it's it's streamed by most of

158
00:10:57.679 --> 00:11:00.679
<v Speaker 2>the local outlets, station TV station, It's now in some

159
00:11:00.720 --> 00:11:05.840
<v Speaker 2>form of fashion. If if you watch the local news tonight,

160
00:11:06.960 --> 00:11:09.200
<v Speaker 2>did it? How would have it impacted you? If you

161
00:11:09.279 --> 00:11:13.159
<v Speaker 2>remember this jury? Again, I think that I do not

162
00:11:13.440 --> 00:11:19.000
<v Speaker 2>believe that Wiffin was available at the first trial. I

163
00:11:19.080 --> 00:11:22.919
<v Speaker 2>believe that this is a new witness. I did not

164
00:11:23.120 --> 00:11:26.159
<v Speaker 2>cover the first trial, have not covered the second trial

165
00:11:26.600 --> 00:11:29.679
<v Speaker 2>on a day to day basis. But if I'm incorrect

166
00:11:29.679 --> 00:11:32.279
<v Speaker 2>on that, feel free to correct me. I think that

167
00:11:32.360 --> 00:11:37.600
<v Speaker 2>this was a great witness, a solid witness for the

168
00:11:37.639 --> 00:11:42.799
<v Speaker 2>prosecution today and a witness that the jurors probably will remember.

169
00:11:42.960 --> 00:11:47.279
<v Speaker 2>Let's go to the phones six one, seven, two, four, ten, thirty, six, one, seven,

170
00:11:47.360 --> 00:11:51.360
<v Speaker 2>ninety I've said this before. I always like to know

171
00:11:51.480 --> 00:11:54.120
<v Speaker 2>if you are still as committed to your belief in

172
00:11:54.159 --> 00:11:58.080
<v Speaker 2>this case, whether you believe Karen Reid is guilty or

173
00:11:58.120 --> 00:12:02.120
<v Speaker 2>not guilty, if that interview has changed, and what may

174
00:12:02.159 --> 00:12:06.840
<v Speaker 2>have caused it to change. We are into the second retrial.

175
00:12:06.960 --> 00:12:09.240
<v Speaker 2>Feel free. Let me go to Joe. Joe, you were

176
00:12:09.279 --> 00:12:11.759
<v Speaker 2>next on our first this hour, first this week on Nightside.

177
00:12:11.799 --> 00:12:12.399
<v Speaker 2>Welcome Joe.

178
00:12:12.919 --> 00:12:16.200
<v Speaker 4>I'd like to make some points, two or three points

179
00:12:16.200 --> 00:12:17.840
<v Speaker 4>and get your comments first.

180
00:12:17.919 --> 00:12:20.039
<v Speaker 2>Go right ahead, Joe. I know that's why you called

181
00:12:20.320 --> 00:12:21.639
<v Speaker 2>I'm all ears. Go right ahead.

182
00:12:22.000 --> 00:12:26.399
<v Speaker 4>Karen Reid said on a TV interview, I hit him,

183
00:12:26.519 --> 00:12:28.759
<v Speaker 4>I hit him, I hit him. Do you think she

184
00:12:28.799 --> 00:12:32.879
<v Speaker 4>could have had a blackout when if she did hit him?

185
00:12:33.919 --> 00:12:35.720
<v Speaker 2>I don't know. I don't know that she said that

186
00:12:35.799 --> 00:12:36.840
<v Speaker 2>on a TV interview.

187
00:12:36.879 --> 00:12:40.320
<v Speaker 4>I think on TV, Dan, Maybe some of your callers

188
00:12:40.399 --> 00:12:41.360
<v Speaker 4>can back me up.

189
00:12:41.879 --> 00:12:45.320
<v Speaker 2>Okay, that's fine. I think she is reported to have

190
00:12:45.480 --> 00:12:51.600
<v Speaker 2>said that in the morning, while you said a TV interview.

191
00:12:51.639 --> 00:12:53.399
<v Speaker 2>I don't think she said it on a TV interview.

192
00:12:53.440 --> 00:12:56.840
<v Speaker 2>I think that that there was audio in the courtroom. No,

193
00:12:57.600 --> 00:13:00.879
<v Speaker 2>let me help you out, Joe, Okay, please help you out.

194
00:13:01.080 --> 00:13:06.960
<v Speaker 2>I think that there was a police dash cam running

195
00:13:07.559 --> 00:13:11.080
<v Speaker 2>the morning that the body was discovered, at approximately six

196
00:13:11.159 --> 00:13:16.039
<v Speaker 2>o'clock the morning after whatever happened happened. And I believe

197
00:13:16.120 --> 00:13:19.840
<v Speaker 2>that that that that picked her up, that that that

198
00:13:19.879 --> 00:13:23.240
<v Speaker 2>her comments. It wasn't like she sat down for an

199
00:13:23.240 --> 00:13:27.000
<v Speaker 2>interview and admitted in the in the you know, the

200
00:13:27.000 --> 00:13:33.039
<v Speaker 2>the the cold well lit you know interview situation, yes,

201
00:13:33.120 --> 00:13:34.480
<v Speaker 2>I hit him, I hit him, I hit him. I

202
00:13:34.480 --> 00:13:36.559
<v Speaker 2>don't didn't want people to come away with that impression.

203
00:13:36.759 --> 00:13:40.919
<v Speaker 2>She apparently blurted that out as what lawyers would call

204
00:13:41.000 --> 00:13:48.720
<v Speaker 2>an excited utterance or a statement against interest at approximately

205
00:13:48.840 --> 00:13:52.480
<v Speaker 2>the moment when they found they went back and they

206
00:13:52.480 --> 00:13:56.080
<v Speaker 2>found his body on the front lawn. That's that's so,

207
00:13:56.360 --> 00:13:58.559
<v Speaker 2>that's what that's what I think you're referring to. Go ahead, Joe.

208
00:13:59.000 --> 00:14:03.440
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, and Dan, my prejudice tell me that I would

209
00:14:03.519 --> 00:14:06.759
<v Speaker 4>like to see her free of all charges, because how

210
00:14:06.799 --> 00:14:10.679
<v Speaker 4>do you explain the dog bites and how do you think, Dan,

211
00:14:10.840 --> 00:14:13.639
<v Speaker 4>that she's being framed. I'd like your opinion.

212
00:14:14.759 --> 00:14:17.799
<v Speaker 2>I don't believe she's being framed, to be honest with you,

213
00:14:18.000 --> 00:14:22.720
<v Speaker 2>I think that there's enough evidence here which the jury

214
00:14:22.720 --> 00:14:25.080
<v Speaker 2>could believe to convict her. I think there's enough evidence

215
00:14:25.159 --> 00:14:28.879
<v Speaker 2>which the jury could believe to acquit her in terms

216
00:14:28.960 --> 00:14:33.320
<v Speaker 2>of the dog bites or the animal bites. If John

217
00:14:33.360 --> 00:14:38.720
<v Speaker 2>O'Keefe was theoretically hit by her, and if he lost

218
00:14:38.759 --> 00:14:42.440
<v Speaker 2>consciousness and was on that lawn that morning for five

219
00:14:42.480 --> 00:14:48.039
<v Speaker 2>and a half hours, it's conceivable that any animal might

220
00:14:48.080 --> 00:14:52.200
<v Speaker 2>have come along and and chewed on his arm. So

221
00:14:52.759 --> 00:14:55.480
<v Speaker 2>but I again, I'm not in the courtroom. I'm not

222
00:14:55.519 --> 00:14:57.919
<v Speaker 2>an expert. I'm just telling you what I truly think.

223
00:14:58.120 --> 00:15:01.120
<v Speaker 4>Okay, Dan, you have the bet jarre better than all

224
00:15:01.240 --> 00:15:01.759
<v Speaker 4>the rest.

225
00:15:02.600 --> 00:15:04.960
<v Speaker 2>Well, I appreciate that. And you're a poet, but you

226
00:15:05.039 --> 00:15:08.159
<v Speaker 2>don't know it. Hey, thanks, Thanks Joe. I appreciate you. Carl,

227
00:15:08.200 --> 00:15:11.440
<v Speaker 2>thank you much so you you you're rooting for her

228
00:15:11.519 --> 00:15:16.000
<v Speaker 2>to be acquitted obviously right of all charges.

229
00:15:16.080 --> 00:15:17.799
<v Speaker 4>And I hope she makes a lot of money on

230
00:15:17.840 --> 00:15:18.399
<v Speaker 4>her book.

231
00:15:19.080 --> 00:15:22.399
<v Speaker 2>Okay, Joe, and you you have stuck with that opinion

232
00:15:22.480 --> 00:15:27.759
<v Speaker 2>from Jump Street, right, you haven't switched back and forth, right, Okay,

233
00:15:27.840 --> 00:15:30.080
<v Speaker 2>that's great. You're a man of your conviction. Thank you, Joe,

234
00:15:30.120 --> 00:15:33.080
<v Speaker 2>I appreciate it. Let me go to Joe Inn and Salem.

235
00:15:33.159 --> 00:15:35.559
<v Speaker 2>Joeanne a different point of view, maybe the same go ahead,

236
00:15:35.639 --> 00:15:35.879
<v Speaker 2>joe In.

237
00:15:37.200 --> 00:15:38.240
<v Speaker 5>Hi, Dean, how are you.

238
00:15:39.080 --> 00:15:41.039
<v Speaker 2>I'm doing great. Did you get a chance to watch

239
00:15:41.039 --> 00:15:42.559
<v Speaker 2>any of that testimony today?

240
00:15:43.559 --> 00:15:43.679
<v Speaker 6>Oh?

241
00:15:43.759 --> 00:15:46.600
<v Speaker 5>I've been following this case since now the beginning, since

242
00:15:46.799 --> 00:15:52.360
<v Speaker 5>early twenty twenty three. Yes, and Ian Whiffen did testify

243
00:15:52.399 --> 00:15:53.240
<v Speaker 5>in the first trial.

244
00:15:53.840 --> 00:15:56.559
<v Speaker 2>Okay, fair enough, Okay, thank you for that correction.

245
00:15:57.840 --> 00:16:00.480
<v Speaker 5>Him and Jessica Hyde was the other prosecute. You shouldn't

246
00:16:01.279 --> 00:16:04.600
<v Speaker 5>with this regarding the cell phone data.

247
00:16:05.320 --> 00:16:09.080
<v Speaker 2>And you know, let me ask you this. How did

248
00:16:09.159 --> 00:16:12.480
<v Speaker 2>the defense attack that testimony in the first trial.

249
00:16:14.440 --> 00:16:17.360
<v Speaker 5>Well, it was just kind of a battle of you know,

250
00:16:17.399 --> 00:16:21.960
<v Speaker 5>the experts, you know, it's it was I can't really

251
00:16:21.960 --> 00:16:23.240
<v Speaker 5>remember everything.

252
00:16:23.480 --> 00:16:27.919
<v Speaker 2>So was there another Yeah, I'm just asking. I'm asking

253
00:16:27.960 --> 00:16:30.080
<v Speaker 2>the question, and if you don't know the answer, the

254
00:16:30.120 --> 00:16:33.200
<v Speaker 2>best answer is to say, g I'm not sure. Did

255
00:16:33.240 --> 00:16:37.320
<v Speaker 2>they bring in a digital expert to counter what he

256
00:16:37.399 --> 00:16:41.000
<v Speaker 2>had to say? A digital expert? Who who would have

257
00:16:41.039 --> 00:16:44.600
<v Speaker 2>suggested that, hey, it's impossible to tell where their phone was?

258
00:16:44.759 --> 00:16:47.240
<v Speaker 2>Or did did they did they have anyone who challenged

259
00:16:47.360 --> 00:16:49.919
<v Speaker 2>you know who? You know? Normally you get each each

260
00:16:49.960 --> 00:16:52.840
<v Speaker 2>side as an expert in normal cases, and then it's

261
00:16:52.919 --> 00:16:56.159
<v Speaker 2>up to the jury to decide which expert is more incredible.

262
00:16:57.320 --> 00:17:00.159
<v Speaker 5>Exactly, yes, And the defense did bring in somebody. They

263
00:17:00.159 --> 00:17:02.799
<v Speaker 5>brought in Richard Green, who is going to be bringing

264
00:17:02.840 --> 00:17:04.079
<v Speaker 5>in again for this trial.

265
00:17:04.680 --> 00:17:05.160
<v Speaker 2>And if you.

266
00:17:05.279 --> 00:17:09.640
<v Speaker 5>Listen to Ian's testimony today, he had said a colleague

267
00:17:09.880 --> 00:17:14.359
<v Speaker 5>had called to inquire. It was Richard Green who called Ian.

268
00:17:16.640 --> 00:17:18.640
<v Speaker 6>So you know, what is this?

269
00:17:18.799 --> 00:17:21.359
<v Speaker 2>What is the significance in your mind of that you in,

270
00:17:22.759 --> 00:17:25.880
<v Speaker 2>Because I mean Richard Green had called Ian Whippin in

271
00:17:25.920 --> 00:17:27.319
<v Speaker 2>the beginning before Ian.

272
00:17:27.119 --> 00:17:30.920
<v Speaker 5>Whiffen had an opinion to say like, look it, do

273
00:17:30.960 --> 00:17:34.039
<v Speaker 5>you think this happened? You know, And it wasn't until

274
00:17:34.119 --> 00:17:37.319
<v Speaker 5>after when all of a sudden, Ian Whiffan comes out

275
00:17:37.359 --> 00:17:40.200
<v Speaker 5>and says, you know something opposite. I can't tell you

276
00:17:40.279 --> 00:17:42.119
<v Speaker 5>what he said. That was the first I learned him

277
00:17:42.119 --> 00:17:42.640
<v Speaker 5>that today.

278
00:17:43.079 --> 00:17:46.119
<v Speaker 2>So so so you're like, you're like, Joe, it sounds

279
00:17:46.119 --> 00:17:51.799
<v Speaker 2>to me as if you're convinced that that Karen Reid

280
00:17:51.920 --> 00:17:54.279
<v Speaker 2>is not guilty of any of these charges. That's that's

281
00:17:54.279 --> 00:17:56.480
<v Speaker 2>the impression I got from you. Correct.

282
00:17:56.759 --> 00:18:00.680
<v Speaker 5>Oh, absolutely, I mean there's just too many, too many

283
00:18:00.720 --> 00:18:07.039
<v Speaker 5>coincidences with the investigation, and just you know, it's it's

284
00:18:07.119 --> 00:18:10.119
<v Speaker 5>just way too many. If there's one, two or three. Fine,

285
00:18:10.440 --> 00:18:12.319
<v Speaker 5>but all of these ones that you're telling me a

286
00:18:12.440 --> 00:18:13.920
<v Speaker 5>mass gape police troopers.

287
00:18:14.119 --> 00:18:15.880
<v Speaker 2>So let me let me ask you what do you think?

288
00:18:16.079 --> 00:18:18.960
<v Speaker 2>So you think you think that I just want to,

289
00:18:19.039 --> 00:18:23.400
<v Speaker 2>you know, because I am not sure. I have my

290
00:18:23.480 --> 00:18:26.119
<v Speaker 2>own thoughts, but i'd rather find out from you, since

291
00:18:26.160 --> 00:18:28.759
<v Speaker 2>you've watched probably more of the trial, the first trial

292
00:18:28.799 --> 00:18:30.759
<v Speaker 2>and even now the second trial that I have. So

293
00:18:31.200 --> 00:18:34.640
<v Speaker 2>you're convinced, therefore, that O'Keefe went into the house and

294
00:18:34.720 --> 00:18:36.799
<v Speaker 2>something bad happened inside the house.

295
00:18:37.880 --> 00:18:40.440
<v Speaker 5>Yes, I don't believe any any you know, they didn't

296
00:18:40.440 --> 00:18:43.400
<v Speaker 5>mean to, you know, kill him, but yees, you know.

297
00:18:43.599 --> 00:18:46.799
<v Speaker 2>And so then so then you think that they do

298
00:18:46.839 --> 00:18:50.000
<v Speaker 2>you think that they said, geez, he's dead, let's put

299
00:18:50.039 --> 00:18:53.359
<v Speaker 2>him on the front lawn. Or do you think they said, well,

300
00:18:53.519 --> 00:18:55.640
<v Speaker 2>put him out in the front lawn and he'll wake up.

301
00:18:55.839 --> 00:18:58.000
<v Speaker 2>I mean, what how do you think he ended and

302
00:18:58.079 --> 00:18:59.160
<v Speaker 2>why on the front lawn?

303
00:19:00.839 --> 00:19:02.799
<v Speaker 5>Well, we have first of all, you're not going to

304
00:19:02.960 --> 00:19:07.640
<v Speaker 5>transport a body into anybody's vehicle. That's extra DNA. You know,

305
00:19:07.680 --> 00:19:10.039
<v Speaker 5>if they ever did do it any investigation, which we

306
00:19:10.079 --> 00:19:12.160
<v Speaker 5>know they've never even went in the house, and they'd

307
00:19:12.160 --> 00:19:15.160
<v Speaker 5>go into my house or your house if the body

308
00:19:15.240 --> 00:19:18.599
<v Speaker 5>was found on our lawn. But I think that, you know,

309
00:19:18.920 --> 00:19:23.839
<v Speaker 5>maybe a Socca punch was thrown to John O'Keefe. He

310
00:19:23.960 --> 00:19:26.640
<v Speaker 5>banged his head on something hard. And I mean, it

311
00:19:26.680 --> 00:19:28.279
<v Speaker 5>happens all the time. It happened to you.

312
00:19:28.440 --> 00:19:32.759
<v Speaker 2>Okay, So let's let's ass Joe in. Let's assume that happened. Okay,

313
00:19:33.240 --> 00:19:36.319
<v Speaker 2>So now you got However, many people are in the

314
00:19:36.319 --> 00:19:41.680
<v Speaker 2>house who witnessed this. Why would not someone have said, hey,

315
00:19:41.759 --> 00:19:43.920
<v Speaker 2>let's call an ambulance and you know, he may be

316
00:19:44.000 --> 00:19:45.599
<v Speaker 2>a jerk, but we don't want him to die in

317
00:19:45.640 --> 00:19:50.200
<v Speaker 2>the house. Or how did what do you do you

318
00:19:50.240 --> 00:19:51.799
<v Speaker 2>think they said, well, look, we'll put him out of

319
00:19:51.799 --> 00:19:54.039
<v Speaker 2>the lawn and nobody's going to notice him till the spring.

320
00:19:54.359 --> 00:19:56.119
<v Speaker 2>That's what boggles my mind.

321
00:19:56.240 --> 00:19:59.279
<v Speaker 5>No, no, I don't believe that. I first of all,

322
00:19:59.279 --> 00:20:01.319
<v Speaker 5>I don't believe buddy that was I don't believe the

323
00:20:01.359 --> 00:20:03.480
<v Speaker 5>young kids were fully aware of what was going on.

324
00:20:04.200 --> 00:20:06.720
<v Speaker 5>I think, you know, I mean people say conspiracy. I

325
00:20:06.799 --> 00:20:08.720
<v Speaker 5>call it a cover up. All it takes is three

326
00:20:08.799 --> 00:20:11.880
<v Speaker 5>family members and a good you know relationship with you know,

327
00:20:12.000 --> 00:20:12.839
<v Speaker 5>law enforcement.

328
00:20:13.400 --> 00:20:15.599
<v Speaker 2>So you put him on the lawn, right so you

329
00:20:15.680 --> 00:20:19.440
<v Speaker 2>put him on the lawn, right, and then what do

330
00:20:19.480 --> 00:20:22.079
<v Speaker 2>you hope do you at that point say well, we

331
00:20:22.160 --> 00:20:24.440
<v Speaker 2>got to figure out another way. Oh let's pint it

332
00:20:24.480 --> 00:20:26.559
<v Speaker 2>on the woman who dropped him off. Is that is

333
00:20:26.599 --> 00:20:27.160
<v Speaker 2>that what you think?

334
00:20:27.279 --> 00:20:27.440
<v Speaker 3>No?

335
00:20:28.079 --> 00:20:30.759
<v Speaker 5>No, I don't think that was the original plan. I

336
00:20:30.799 --> 00:20:32.480
<v Speaker 5>think it was. I mean, he was at the edge

337
00:20:32.519 --> 00:20:34.799
<v Speaker 5>of the lawn. He was on Brian Obert's property, but

338
00:20:34.839 --> 00:20:37.680
<v Speaker 5>he was at the edge. I think the like the

339
00:20:37.799 --> 00:20:42.960
<v Speaker 5>scenario is the plow hit him. I think that was

340
00:20:43.000 --> 00:20:44.960
<v Speaker 5>going to be it. The wish she was looking for

341
00:20:45.079 --> 00:20:47.640
<v Speaker 5>him and she happened to have a crack tail light.

342
00:20:48.759 --> 00:20:49.839
<v Speaker 5>It just fit together.

343
00:20:50.640 --> 00:20:55.319
<v Speaker 2>So you think they put him on the lawn and

344
00:20:55.400 --> 00:20:58.079
<v Speaker 2>the now the plow guy has said, I believe that

345
00:20:58.200 --> 00:21:02.079
<v Speaker 2>he never saw anything but that alone. But I think

346
00:21:02.079 --> 00:21:04.519
<v Speaker 2>they put him on the lawn. Well, okay, fine, I

347
00:21:05.160 --> 00:21:09.519
<v Speaker 2>think to that strange credibility. That's that's strange credulity in

348
00:21:09.559 --> 00:21:14.799
<v Speaker 2>the sense that I think if if they were corrupt people,

349
00:21:15.640 --> 00:21:18.839
<v Speaker 2>uh and particularly corrupt police, they probably would have been

350
00:21:18.839 --> 00:21:19.759
<v Speaker 2>more creative than that.

351
00:21:21.240 --> 00:21:23.240
<v Speaker 5>Well well, I mean, you know, you got to look

352
00:21:23.240 --> 00:21:25.960
<v Speaker 5>at people's paths too, and it's out there, it's public

353
00:21:26.359 --> 00:21:27.119
<v Speaker 5>it's not made up.

354
00:21:27.160 --> 00:21:27.880
<v Speaker 6>It's not rumor.

355
00:21:28.000 --> 00:21:31.920
<v Speaker 5>There's very public things about Brian Albert out there. I

356
00:21:32.000 --> 00:21:33.759
<v Speaker 5>originally when I heard it.

357
00:21:35.519 --> 00:21:39.720
<v Speaker 2>Again, just just emphasize, just emphasize Brian Albert. There's no

358
00:21:39.759 --> 00:21:42.759
<v Speaker 2>one else on trial at this point, so uh, let's

359
00:21:42.880 --> 00:21:45.519
<v Speaker 2>let the defense in the court of law put put

360
00:21:45.559 --> 00:21:48.039
<v Speaker 2>it in. I don't want to be making any having

361
00:21:48.119 --> 00:21:54.160
<v Speaker 2>any allegations made against When you say something like it's

362
00:21:54.200 --> 00:21:56.160
<v Speaker 2>out there, I don't know what it's is. If you

363
00:21:56.200 --> 00:21:59.799
<v Speaker 2>know what I'm saying the news in the news, I understand, Well,

364
00:21:59.839 --> 00:22:02.799
<v Speaker 2>that's fine. Let the news defend themselves. I'm going to

365
00:22:02.880 --> 00:22:05.440
<v Speaker 2>defend my station and make sure that my station is

366
00:22:05.480 --> 00:22:08.680
<v Speaker 2>not sued. That's all I'm saying. All right, right, great,

367
00:22:08.759 --> 00:22:10.640
<v Speaker 2>good enough, Joe Inn hate to do this to you.

368
00:22:10.759 --> 00:22:12.960
<v Speaker 2>I've gone well into the news, so I gotta let

369
00:22:13.000 --> 00:22:14.720
<v Speaker 2>you run. But thanks very much. Interesting.

370
00:22:15.000 --> 00:22:16.720
<v Speaker 5>Interesting, you appreciate it.

371
00:22:17.119 --> 00:22:19.160
<v Speaker 6>Hey, thanks time, and you're great.

372
00:22:19.720 --> 00:22:22.079
<v Speaker 2>Thank you very much. I appreciate you. Call call again. Thanks,

373
00:22:22.079 --> 00:22:24.279
<v Speaker 2>good night. We'll take a roy quick break. Here's the

374
00:22:24.319 --> 00:22:25.599
<v Speaker 2>news at the bottom of the hoar. A couple of

375
00:22:25.599 --> 00:22:27.759
<v Speaker 2>minutes later, I got Steve coming up, Jack coming up

376
00:22:27.839 --> 00:22:29.880
<v Speaker 2>in a room for you one at six one, seven, two, five,

377
00:22:29.920 --> 00:22:32.000
<v Speaker 2>four to ten thirty and two at six one, seven,

378
00:22:32.079 --> 00:22:35.559
<v Speaker 2>nine three one ten thirty. My plan is to change

379
00:22:35.640 --> 00:22:39.400
<v Speaker 2>topics at ten o'clock. The number of phone calls that

380
00:22:39.440 --> 00:22:41.319
<v Speaker 2>we get will determine that if you want to talk

381
00:22:41.319 --> 00:22:43.319
<v Speaker 2>more about this, we can go into the ten o'clock

382
00:22:43.359 --> 00:22:44.920
<v Speaker 2>how if you don't, we'll wrap it up at ten.

383
00:22:45.039 --> 00:22:46.440
<v Speaker 2>Back after this on Night Side.

384
00:22:47.240 --> 00:22:50.599
<v Speaker 1>You're on Night Side with Dan ray on'ell you Bzy

385
00:22:50.880 --> 00:22:52.160
<v Speaker 1>Boston's News Radio.

386
00:22:52.799 --> 00:22:54.079
<v Speaker 2>Back to the phones we go. Let me go to

387
00:22:54.119 --> 00:22:56.839
<v Speaker 2>Steve and Cambridge. Steve, welcome back. You've been away for

388
00:22:56.839 --> 00:22:59.240
<v Speaker 2>a while. Where you've been. I've missed you, all right?

389
00:22:59.279 --> 00:23:02.599
<v Speaker 7>I just Dan, for one reason or another, I've been

390
00:23:03.720 --> 00:23:04.920
<v Speaker 7>not not calling.

391
00:23:04.960 --> 00:23:08.559
<v Speaker 2>But that's okay. Always great to hear your voice.

392
00:23:08.559 --> 00:23:13.480
<v Speaker 7>Go right ahead, Thank you, Dan. I have asking for

393
00:23:13.599 --> 00:23:17.880
<v Speaker 7>your opinions as a man who is an attorney and

394
00:23:18.079 --> 00:23:21.480
<v Speaker 7>also has spent a lot of time reporting on crime

395
00:23:21.680 --> 00:23:23.920
<v Speaker 7>and litigation in Massachusetts.

396
00:23:24.400 --> 00:23:24.640
<v Speaker 2>Sure.

397
00:23:25.599 --> 00:23:28.000
<v Speaker 7>Do you think her appearance in the courtroom is good?

398
00:23:28.799 --> 00:23:30.480
<v Speaker 2>No? No, I don't.

399
00:23:31.279 --> 00:23:33.240
<v Speaker 7>I mean, if you were a lawyer, wouldn't you tell

400
00:23:33.240 --> 00:23:34.599
<v Speaker 7>her to look a little more demure?

401
00:23:36.359 --> 00:23:42.519
<v Speaker 2>Yeah? I think she's she's a very attractive woman. I

402
00:23:42.559 --> 00:23:46.799
<v Speaker 2>think she's also expressive. Uh and and again I haven't

403
00:23:46.799 --> 00:23:50.160
<v Speaker 2>been in that courtroom, so it's difficult for me to imagine,

404
00:23:50.200 --> 00:23:55.759
<v Speaker 2>but I do think that she has. She comes across

405
00:23:55.799 --> 00:23:59.640
<v Speaker 2>probably a little I want to pick a good word here,

406
00:24:01.119 --> 00:24:05.319
<v Speaker 2>a little cooler than that I would like if I

407
00:24:05.359 --> 00:24:06.279
<v Speaker 2>were representing her.

408
00:24:07.359 --> 00:24:09.440
<v Speaker 7>I mean, if I were her lawyer, for example, I

409
00:24:09.480 --> 00:24:11.359
<v Speaker 7>would tell her to wear her hair differently.

410
00:24:13.039 --> 00:24:16.200
<v Speaker 2>Well, yeah, I mean all of that. There are consultants

411
00:24:16.240 --> 00:24:20.960
<v Speaker 2>for all of that, as you can imagine. And I

412
00:24:21.000 --> 00:24:23.559
<v Speaker 2>think that at this point it might be too late

413
00:24:23.640 --> 00:24:28.480
<v Speaker 2>to change her appearance, because I think everyone, even the

414
00:24:28.599 --> 00:24:32.480
<v Speaker 2>current jurors, were probably exposed to the first trial, and

415
00:24:32.559 --> 00:24:36.920
<v Speaker 2>if she were to change her hairstyle dramatically, now that

416
00:24:37.039 --> 00:24:40.039
<v Speaker 2>might be perceived as disingenuous.

417
00:24:40.720 --> 00:24:43.920
<v Speaker 7>But you know, I've seen other cases where the important

418
00:24:43.960 --> 00:24:47.319
<v Speaker 7>case is where the defendant is probably paying a fortune

419
00:24:47.359 --> 00:24:51.960
<v Speaker 7>to be defended, and the defendant does, you know, does

420
00:24:52.039 --> 00:24:57.440
<v Speaker 7>not look like I would want my client to look.

421
00:24:58.799 --> 00:25:01.200
<v Speaker 2>You saying, yeah, how let me ask you this, how

422
00:25:01.240 --> 00:25:05.920
<v Speaker 2>would you just what word would you use to describe

423
00:25:06.920 --> 00:25:07.680
<v Speaker 2>her appearance?

424
00:25:09.559 --> 00:25:13.960
<v Speaker 7>She doesn't. She has kind of the look of oh,

425
00:25:14.039 --> 00:25:18.599
<v Speaker 7>I really, I mean, I dan, you know, I wouldn't

426
00:25:18.599 --> 00:25:21.960
<v Speaker 7>want her to go in looking like a Sunday school

427
00:25:21.960 --> 00:25:25.519
<v Speaker 7>teacher necessarily, but she has the look of kind of

428
00:25:25.559 --> 00:25:28.200
<v Speaker 7>a wild kind of a bit of a wild look.

429
00:25:29.279 --> 00:25:31.599
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I don't I don't know that I would characterize

430
00:25:31.599 --> 00:25:36.160
<v Speaker 2>it as that, I guess one of the things that

431
00:25:36.160 --> 00:25:41.359
<v Speaker 2>that would trouble me. And again, they they've got in

432
00:25:41.599 --> 00:25:46.480
<v Speaker 2>already some of her television interviews that she did after

433
00:25:46.519 --> 00:25:49.079
<v Speaker 2>the first trial, between the first and second trial, and

434
00:25:49.880 --> 00:25:52.920
<v Speaker 2>she doesn't come across in at least the clips that

435
00:25:52.960 --> 00:25:57.799
<v Speaker 2>have been shown in my opinion, as particularly empathetic or likable.

436
00:25:57.880 --> 00:25:59.759
<v Speaker 2>I mean, there is an individual who has lost his

437
00:25:59.799 --> 00:26:05.119
<v Speaker 2>life for whatever happened, and it's also someone who she

438
00:26:05.240 --> 00:26:10.160
<v Speaker 2>apparently at one point fell to, you know, very close to,

439
00:26:11.519 --> 00:26:17.720
<v Speaker 2>and you would think that they would be I don't know,

440
00:26:17.960 --> 00:26:21.200
<v Speaker 2>there would be a demeanor which would be somewhat different

441
00:26:21.240 --> 00:26:25.440
<v Speaker 2>than what we that we see both walking into the courtroom,

442
00:26:25.519 --> 00:26:27.839
<v Speaker 2>walking out of the courtroom, and in the courtroom, it's.

443
00:26:27.640 --> 00:26:30.319
<v Speaker 7>The same kind of thing I'm talking about. And I'm

444
00:26:30.359 --> 00:26:32.720
<v Speaker 7>surprised that lawyers, I mean, I've seen this in other

445
00:26:32.759 --> 00:26:35.839
<v Speaker 7>cases where I don't think the lawyers are getting a

446
00:26:35.839 --> 00:26:39.279
<v Speaker 7>lot of money have suggested. I mean, it doesn't appear

447
00:26:39.319 --> 00:26:41.640
<v Speaker 7>to me that they've suggested to their client, Well, when

448
00:26:41.640 --> 00:26:44.880
<v Speaker 7>you come into the courtroom tomorrow, you know, don't have

449
00:26:45.000 --> 00:26:47.359
<v Speaker 7>your hair flopping all over your shoulders.

450
00:26:47.640 --> 00:26:50.759
<v Speaker 2>Yep. Well, let's see if others agree with you, Steve,

451
00:26:51.400 --> 00:26:55.000
<v Speaker 2>that's an op question. Yeah, sure question. Yeah.

452
00:26:55.039 --> 00:26:56.799
<v Speaker 7>Well, let me just I'll tell you one thing. I

453
00:26:56.839 --> 00:26:59.200
<v Speaker 7>think it's going to be pretty hard for the prosecution

454
00:26:59.400 --> 00:27:03.119
<v Speaker 7>to convinced the jury beyond a reasonable doubt because this

455
00:27:03.240 --> 00:27:07.480
<v Speaker 7>case has so much history that's so convoluted that they've

456
00:27:07.519 --> 00:27:12.920
<v Speaker 7>got a rough road to hoe. I think would you agree?

457
00:27:14.480 --> 00:27:17.559
<v Speaker 2>I think it depends upon the jurors and if they've

458
00:27:17.559 --> 00:27:20.039
<v Speaker 2>been able to pick jurors who are willing to give

459
00:27:20.079 --> 00:27:21.759
<v Speaker 2>it a fresh look. I mean, this is one of

460
00:27:21.799 --> 00:27:24.680
<v Speaker 2>those cases that every juror had to have been exposed

461
00:27:24.680 --> 00:27:27.480
<v Speaker 2>to it, unless you've lived under a rock or you've

462
00:27:27.519 --> 00:27:30.519
<v Speaker 2>just moved to Massachusetts. And even then it's such a

463
00:27:30.640 --> 00:27:34.799
<v Speaker 2>national case. But there are other cases that have generated

464
00:27:34.880 --> 00:27:39.519
<v Speaker 2>as much publicity. And I think that if the jurors

465
00:27:39.559 --> 00:27:41.799
<v Speaker 2>follow what the judge is telling them, and that is

466
00:27:41.799 --> 00:27:44.680
<v Speaker 2>to consider only the evidence that is put in front

467
00:27:44.720 --> 00:27:47.200
<v Speaker 2>of you, Let's see how the case plays out. Let's

468
00:27:47.200 --> 00:27:50.079
<v Speaker 2>tell you this. I think the prosecutor in this case

469
00:27:50.480 --> 00:27:53.079
<v Speaker 2>is a better prosecutor. Though someone said to me today

470
00:27:53.279 --> 00:27:58.160
<v Speaker 2>that they thought that the first prosecutor, Assistant District Attorney Lally,

471
00:27:58.240 --> 00:28:02.079
<v Speaker 2>was a good prosecutor. I watched his open statement pretty

472
00:28:02.119 --> 00:28:04.599
<v Speaker 2>closely a year ago, and I wasn't impressed by it.

473
00:28:04.960 --> 00:28:08.559
<v Speaker 2>I thought that the defense from the get go had

474
00:28:08.559 --> 00:28:15.079
<v Speaker 2>the advantage. I think that Brennan is a It's more

475
00:28:15.119 --> 00:28:18.720
<v Speaker 2>effective in the in the courtroom than than Lally was.

476
00:28:18.759 --> 00:28:20.000
<v Speaker 2>But we'll see how it turns out.

477
00:28:20.200 --> 00:28:25.039
<v Speaker 7>Last question, Dan, are you surprised that this bar has

478
00:28:25.079 --> 00:28:28.240
<v Speaker 7>not come into more scrutiny? I mean, these people are

479
00:28:28.279 --> 00:28:33.440
<v Speaker 7>all it appears wildly drunk. And why isn't this bar

480
00:28:33.640 --> 00:28:38.599
<v Speaker 7>being you know, shut either shut down or sued in

481
00:28:38.680 --> 00:28:41.039
<v Speaker 7>a wrongful death suit? I mean, why isn't a suit

482
00:28:41.119 --> 00:28:42.680
<v Speaker 7>being brought against this bar that all?

483
00:28:42.880 --> 00:28:45.319
<v Speaker 2>I don't know that the one that one hasn't And

484
00:28:45.400 --> 00:28:48.440
<v Speaker 2>I don't know if they're close to the statutal limitations.

485
00:28:48.480 --> 00:28:50.759
<v Speaker 2>I think that they have some time in the statute

486
00:28:50.759 --> 00:28:53.160
<v Speaker 2>of limitations, and they might be waiting for the criminal

487
00:28:53.200 --> 00:28:56.680
<v Speaker 2>trial to resolve itself and see what what evidence has

488
00:28:56.799 --> 00:29:00.680
<v Speaker 2>has gotten in there's no rush again. I I'm assuming

489
00:29:00.720 --> 00:29:02.920
<v Speaker 2>the statute of limitations, and I don't know if that's

490
00:29:02.960 --> 00:29:04.880
<v Speaker 2>off of my head. This would be a wrongful death action.

491
00:29:05.000 --> 00:29:07.240
<v Speaker 2>I'm assuming it's somewhere in the vicinity of six years.

492
00:29:07.640 --> 00:29:10.720
<v Speaker 7>I mean, certainly this bar seems like it was very negligent,

493
00:29:10.920 --> 00:29:14.319
<v Speaker 7>having all these wildly drunk people going out.

494
00:29:14.319 --> 00:29:16.480
<v Speaker 2>Well, yeah, but it's a bar. I mean, that's what

495
00:29:16.559 --> 00:29:22.599
<v Speaker 2>bars do. And if uh, I think that maybe they're

496
00:29:22.640 --> 00:29:27.079
<v Speaker 2>trying to figure out we're we're the fault. Lies. Yeah,

497
00:29:27.200 --> 00:29:29.599
<v Speaker 2>were people overserved? I don't know. I guess I guess

498
00:29:29.680 --> 00:29:32.640
<v Speaker 2>you got videotape, which would seem to suggest that. I

499
00:29:32.640 --> 00:29:36.440
<v Speaker 2>don't know. Thanks, Thanks, Steve, We'll talk to me. You'll

500
00:29:36.480 --> 00:29:38.319
<v Speaker 2>be a stranger. Thanks, have a great one. Good night.

501
00:29:38.519 --> 00:29:40.680
<v Speaker 2>Coming right back on Nightside, one line at six one,

502
00:29:40.720 --> 00:29:46.640
<v Speaker 2>seven thirty. I got a couple at six one seven. Again,

503
00:29:46.720 --> 00:29:49.079
<v Speaker 2>if you're following this trial, I thought today was a

504
00:29:49.079 --> 00:29:52.200
<v Speaker 2>good day for the prosecution. Agree or disagree, feel free.

505
00:29:52.240 --> 00:29:53.839
<v Speaker 2>Coming back on Nightside.

506
00:29:54.440 --> 00:29:59.119
<v Speaker 1>It's night Side with Dan Ray on Boston's news radio.

507
00:30:00.200 --> 00:30:02.920
<v Speaker 2>We go Gonna go next to Jack is a Newton Jack,

508
00:30:02.960 --> 00:30:04.279
<v Speaker 2>Welcome next to night saga.

509
00:30:04.119 --> 00:30:07.240
<v Speaker 8>Right ahead, Yeah, Hi, how you doing. I haven't good

510
00:30:07.319 --> 00:30:11.200
<v Speaker 8>Jack having called in a while. Uh, I think the

511
00:30:11.240 --> 00:30:16.720
<v Speaker 8>titles actually turned against her. I uh, I was kind

512
00:30:16.720 --> 00:30:19.200
<v Speaker 8>of shocked that all these things have come out in

513
00:30:19.200 --> 00:30:22.200
<v Speaker 8>this second trial and not the first one. And and

514
00:30:22.240 --> 00:30:24.960
<v Speaker 8>I agree with you, mister Brenner is much much better.

515
00:30:25.759 --> 00:30:30.359
<v Speaker 8>And her attitude the previous caller, you know, said it right.

516
00:30:30.640 --> 00:30:33.599
<v Speaker 8>You know, she's a little too cocky, and I mean

517
00:30:33.680 --> 00:30:37.000
<v Speaker 8>she's kind of like gonna go down by her with

518
00:30:37.039 --> 00:30:40.240
<v Speaker 8>her own words, you know. I mean, I don't know

519
00:30:40.240 --> 00:30:41.640
<v Speaker 8>how the jury you can ignore that.

520
00:30:42.480 --> 00:30:46.039
<v Speaker 2>Uh yeah, well again it's it's it's a different jury,

521
00:30:46.160 --> 00:30:50.640
<v Speaker 2>you're right, And let's see how how this this plays out.

522
00:30:51.720 --> 00:30:55.480
<v Speaker 2>I just think this couple that a couple of good days,

523
00:30:56.279 --> 00:30:58.599
<v Speaker 2>uh in the in the opening of this trial for

524
00:30:58.680 --> 00:31:02.200
<v Speaker 2>the prosecution, which you would back, because if the prosecution

525
00:31:02.359 --> 00:31:04.440
<v Speaker 2>doesn't have good days when they're putting in their case

526
00:31:04.480 --> 00:31:07.200
<v Speaker 2>and the case is lost, the question is how effective

527
00:31:07.200 --> 00:31:11.920
<v Speaker 2>will the defense be in rebuttal And that's gonna take

528
00:31:11.920 --> 00:31:14.119
<v Speaker 2>a little bit of time. But at this point I

529
00:31:14.160 --> 00:31:18.200
<v Speaker 2>thought that I thought the idea of the forensic evidence,

530
00:31:18.240 --> 00:31:22.319
<v Speaker 2>the digital sort of evidence, people are much more accepting

531
00:31:22.400 --> 00:31:25.519
<v Speaker 2>of that these days, because they're watching CSI this and

532
00:31:25.599 --> 00:31:31.119
<v Speaker 2>CSI that on television, and I think that that could

533
00:31:31.119 --> 00:31:34.400
<v Speaker 2>work very much against her in this second trial.

534
00:31:35.480 --> 00:31:38.200
<v Speaker 8>Yeah, I think she's gonna be charged with, you know,

535
00:31:38.480 --> 00:31:42.640
<v Speaker 8>in voluntary manslaughter, actually leaving the scene of a crime.

536
00:31:42.880 --> 00:31:46.680
<v Speaker 8>I mean after hitting him. I don't believe that other stuff,

537
00:31:46.680 --> 00:31:49.359
<v Speaker 8>that he was beaten up or anything like that. It's

538
00:31:49.440 --> 00:31:50.680
<v Speaker 8>just a little bit outrageous.

539
00:31:50.960 --> 00:31:53.160
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Well, I was talking with Joeanne about that, and

540
00:31:53.240 --> 00:31:55.720
<v Speaker 2>you know, what do you think kind of happened? You know,

541
00:31:55.799 --> 00:32:02.640
<v Speaker 2>it didn't. It doesn't that that people who would be experienced, well,

542
00:32:02.680 --> 00:32:05.519
<v Speaker 2>let's put them on on the front lawn. But you know,

543
00:32:06.200 --> 00:32:10.599
<v Speaker 2>that's I don't mean to laugh at it, but that

544
00:32:10.720 --> 00:32:14.359
<v Speaker 2>seems to me to be a little I don't think

545
00:32:14.400 --> 00:32:17.960
<v Speaker 2>that that police officers and a bunch of them were there,

546
00:32:18.920 --> 00:32:20.839
<v Speaker 2>would would say, oh, yeah, I got a great idea,

547
00:32:20.880 --> 00:32:22.480
<v Speaker 2>let's put them on the front lawn. No one's going

548
00:32:22.519 --> 00:32:22.960
<v Speaker 2>to notice.

549
00:32:23.000 --> 00:32:23.359
<v Speaker 6>I don't know.

550
00:32:24.160 --> 00:32:26.519
<v Speaker 8>A dog bid them in the middle of the night

551
00:32:26.839 --> 00:32:28.200
<v Speaker 8>and his body was out there.

552
00:32:28.799 --> 00:32:32.160
<v Speaker 2>I guess that's conceivable. There there are coyotes, there are

553
00:32:32.160 --> 00:32:34.960
<v Speaker 2>other animals and you know that are out out there

554
00:32:34.960 --> 00:32:36.039
<v Speaker 2>at night. You never know.

555
00:32:36.960 --> 00:32:38.759
<v Speaker 8>And one of the interesting things about this is it's

556
00:32:38.799 --> 00:32:43.319
<v Speaker 8>really gardnered, really national news. It's in Vanity Fair, it's.

557
00:32:43.160 --> 00:32:47.440
<v Speaker 6>In everywhere, everywhere national.

558
00:32:47.519 --> 00:32:49.720
<v Speaker 8>You know. It's one of those child to just grab,

559
00:32:50.119 --> 00:32:52.480
<v Speaker 8>you know, the national international media.

560
00:32:52.599 --> 00:32:55.119
<v Speaker 2>It's the it's on the evening news, it's on you know.

561
00:32:55.240 --> 00:32:58.519
<v Speaker 2>I've seen it on the ABC's World News tonight and

562
00:32:58.559 --> 00:33:04.200
<v Speaker 2>it's like, whoa. I mean, it's it's caught the imagination

563
00:33:04.400 --> 00:33:10.160
<v Speaker 2>of the public at large. Again. I guess it's it's

564
00:33:10.200 --> 00:33:12.759
<v Speaker 2>a young couple one ends up dead, happens to be

565
00:33:12.759 --> 00:33:15.039
<v Speaker 2>a police officer. How did who done it? How did

566
00:33:15.079 --> 00:33:18.000
<v Speaker 2>it happen? I guess that's the answer. That's the that's

567
00:33:18.039 --> 00:33:20.559
<v Speaker 2>the interest level. Hey Jack, I appreciate your call. Is

568
00:33:20.599 --> 00:33:23.519
<v Speaker 2>always a different take. You always you always bring your

569
00:33:23.519 --> 00:33:25.079
<v Speaker 2>a game. I appreciate it. Thank you much.

570
00:33:25.920 --> 00:33:27.160
<v Speaker 6>Okay, thank you, thank you.

571
00:33:27.240 --> 00:33:29.119
<v Speaker 2>Let me go to Mario and Wilmington. Marry. I want

572
00:33:29.119 --> 00:33:31.200
<v Speaker 2>to get you in here before the ten o'clock news.

573
00:33:31.240 --> 00:33:33.240
<v Speaker 2>Go right ahead, Mario, thank you.

574
00:33:33.319 --> 00:33:35.559
<v Speaker 6>I just want to get three points in with listening

575
00:33:35.599 --> 00:33:38.759
<v Speaker 6>to some of the calls. Last one the animal No,

576
00:33:38.839 --> 00:33:42.559
<v Speaker 6>there's no animals out and driving snowstorms. They they hunkered down,

577
00:33:43.640 --> 00:33:47.400
<v Speaker 6>so it wasn't another animal. Those bite marks or scratches

578
00:33:47.519 --> 00:33:51.039
<v Speaker 6>are not consistent with a hit and run. The other

579
00:33:51.119 --> 00:33:53.440
<v Speaker 6>one is I'm losing faith myself.

580
00:33:53.559 --> 00:33:53.759
<v Speaker 4>Dad.

581
00:33:53.839 --> 00:33:56.920
<v Speaker 6>I think she's going to get found guilty, but I

582
00:33:56.920 --> 00:33:59.640
<v Speaker 6>don't know if they can use the manslaughter charges at

583
00:33:59.640 --> 00:34:04.440
<v Speaker 6>this point, like they're still charging her with murder. I think, yeah,

584
00:34:04.640 --> 00:34:05.359
<v Speaker 6>there's there's.

585
00:34:05.119 --> 00:34:09.079
<v Speaker 2>A there, there's a there's a second degree murder, there's

586
00:34:09.079 --> 00:34:11.480
<v Speaker 2>a there's a manslaughter, and there's leaving the scene of

587
00:34:11.480 --> 00:34:15.320
<v Speaker 2>an accident. So it's any combination thereof would be in.

588
00:34:15.320 --> 00:34:20.480
<v Speaker 6>Place options the jurors. Okay, all right, gotcha. The other

589
00:34:20.559 --> 00:34:24.800
<v Speaker 6>one was, she's not that attractive to me.

590
00:34:25.239 --> 00:34:29.960
<v Speaker 2>WHOA hold on, Mario, come on, I mean she's a

591
00:34:30.199 --> 00:34:35.039
<v Speaker 2>she's a very presentable looking woman. Okay, let's just leave

592
00:34:35.079 --> 00:34:38.400
<v Speaker 2>it at that. I mean the beauties in the eyevy

593
00:34:38.480 --> 00:34:41.559
<v Speaker 2>behold and Mario, come on, I think most people would

594
00:34:41.559 --> 00:34:43.639
<v Speaker 2>disagree with you, but you ever write your opinion. But

595
00:34:43.960 --> 00:34:46.960
<v Speaker 2>I don't want to go down that valley way if

596
00:34:47.000 --> 00:34:47.480
<v Speaker 2>you don't mind.

597
00:34:48.039 --> 00:34:49.880
<v Speaker 6>She's a great look and you can say she's a

598
00:34:49.880 --> 00:34:51.159
<v Speaker 6>good looking woman and that's.

599
00:34:51.000 --> 00:34:51.440
<v Speaker 2>It, you know what.

600
00:34:51.440 --> 00:34:53.519
<v Speaker 6>I mean, but why not.

601
00:34:53.639 --> 00:34:55.679
<v Speaker 2>That's not what we're trying to assess here. Okay, we

602
00:34:55.679 --> 00:35:00.280
<v Speaker 2>were talking more about her appearance and her demeanor with

603
00:35:00.480 --> 00:35:02.599
<v Speaker 2>Steve from Cambridge as to posed to her.

604
00:35:03.599 --> 00:35:05.920
<v Speaker 6>Yeah, success, last point, if I can get into a

605
00:35:05.960 --> 00:35:10.599
<v Speaker 6>real question, going to get up every morning and being

606
00:35:10.760 --> 00:35:13.960
<v Speaker 6>court like that, it's while like going to work. I

607
00:35:13.960 --> 00:35:17.920
<v Speaker 6>think she's holding up very well. Her personality and her

608
00:35:18.000 --> 00:35:21.079
<v Speaker 6>characters is trying to deal with this. The other is

609
00:35:21.159 --> 00:35:23.400
<v Speaker 6>the DA's, the judges, they're all there and they were

610
00:35:23.440 --> 00:35:26.599
<v Speaker 6>at ease in their office work there. You're having to

611
00:35:26.639 --> 00:35:29.440
<v Speaker 6>go to court every morning. You're up at five maybe

612
00:35:29.800 --> 00:35:33.880
<v Speaker 6>to be there at that court at eight. It's really difficult.

613
00:35:34.000 --> 00:35:36.719
<v Speaker 6>And she's done. She's hung up very well at it.

614
00:35:36.800 --> 00:35:40.079
<v Speaker 6>You know, she's not making any here the lawyers and

615
00:35:40.079 --> 00:35:43.280
<v Speaker 6>everybody else. She's trying to save her life too. At

616
00:35:43.280 --> 00:35:45.800
<v Speaker 6>the same time. Go ahead, Dan, Sorry, no, no, no.

617
00:35:45.840 --> 00:35:50.320
<v Speaker 2>I think that's a good observation. That's one that that

618
00:35:50.360 --> 00:35:54.920
<v Speaker 2>people should consider. Whatever you think about her guilt or innocence,

619
00:35:55.960 --> 00:35:58.519
<v Speaker 2>that that it is. It has to be very strenuous

620
00:35:58.880 --> 00:36:04.320
<v Speaker 2>to have undergone this, and maybe she should let some

621
00:36:04.480 --> 00:36:12.440
<v Speaker 2>of that that anxiety or that loss show. I think

622
00:36:12.480 --> 00:36:15.440
<v Speaker 2>that that gets to the demeanor issue. She comes across

623
00:36:15.960 --> 00:36:18.800
<v Speaker 2>as very cool, calm and collected, and some people would

624
00:36:18.800 --> 00:36:23.320
<v Speaker 2>say that that's amazing, and you made the point that

625
00:36:23.360 --> 00:36:26.360
<v Speaker 2>it's difficult to do. But some would say that that

626
00:36:26.400 --> 00:36:29.840
<v Speaker 2>doesn't help her when the jury's observing her as cool,

627
00:36:29.880 --> 00:36:32.840
<v Speaker 2>calm and collected when we're talking about whether she was

628
00:36:33.320 --> 00:36:36.960
<v Speaker 2>a cause of it or not. She had been arguing

629
00:36:37.000 --> 00:36:39.480
<v Speaker 2>with her boyfriend that night that I think has been

630
00:36:39.519 --> 00:36:42.679
<v Speaker 2>pretty well established and that was the last. You know,

631
00:36:42.760 --> 00:36:45.719
<v Speaker 2>if you had a conversation with a loved one and

632
00:36:46.119 --> 00:36:49.440
<v Speaker 2>harsh words were exchanged and you found out that your

633
00:36:49.440 --> 00:36:53.719
<v Speaker 2>loved one was killed in a totally unrelated accident, you

634
00:36:53.840 --> 00:36:57.239
<v Speaker 2>certainly would for a long long time regret your last words,

635
00:36:57.280 --> 00:36:58.159
<v Speaker 2>if you know what I'm saying.

636
00:36:59.400 --> 00:37:03.280
<v Speaker 6>Yeah, it leads me back to where I do think

637
00:37:03.280 --> 00:37:06.320
<v Speaker 6>he ran out of the Albert house. They figured he

638
00:37:06.480 --> 00:37:10.519
<v Speaker 6>took off, but he collapsed out on the snow bank.

639
00:37:11.119 --> 00:37:14.400
<v Speaker 6>If that's the case there, and then she didn't hit him.

640
00:37:14.719 --> 00:37:17.639
<v Speaker 6>It's just so bizarre that she could have possibly hit him,

641
00:37:17.679 --> 00:37:20.960
<v Speaker 6>but the mockings on his body don't consist of there.

642
00:37:21.840 --> 00:37:24.679
<v Speaker 2>Okay, you got it in. Unfortunately, I'm right at the tent,

643
00:37:24.760 --> 00:37:26.320
<v Speaker 2>so I got to let you go, but we'll stick

644
00:37:26.360 --> 00:37:28.840
<v Speaker 2>with this into the next hour for a little while. Mario,

645
00:37:29.360 --> 00:37:30.559
<v Speaker 2>appreciate your point of view.

646
00:37:30.599 --> 00:37:33.559
<v Speaker 6>Thank you, sir, great schel, thank you, thank you.

647
00:37:33.719 --> 00:37:36.639
<v Speaker 2>Good night. Okay, so Mark and Amy, you guys stay there.

648
00:37:36.679 --> 00:37:38.159
<v Speaker 2>I'll get you right on the other side of the

649
00:37:38.199 --> 00:37:42.440
<v Speaker 2>ten the only line that is opened six one, seven, two, five, four,

650
00:37:42.559 --> 00:37:47.719
<v Speaker 2>ten thirty. Your observations, your comments. We don't do Karen

651
00:37:47.760 --> 00:37:49.960
<v Speaker 2>Reid every night of the week here on Night Side.

652
00:37:50.000 --> 00:37:53.440
<v Speaker 2>Whenever there's a witness that I think is significant, that's

653
00:37:53.440 --> 00:37:54.880
<v Speaker 2>when we'll talk about it. And I think it was

654
00:37:54.920 --> 00:37:59.320
<v Speaker 2>a significant witness today because of the again the digital

655
00:37:59.400 --> 00:38:03.280
<v Speaker 2>forensic technology. I think it was a very important day.

656
00:38:04.039 --> 00:38:05.960
<v Speaker 2>We'll see what the jury thinks at some point in

657
00:38:06.000 --> 00:38:08.039
<v Speaker 2>the next few weeks. Back on Night's Side, right after

658
00:38:08.079 --> 00:38:10.639
<v Speaker 2>the ten o'clock news, and we'll continue with this conversation

659
00:38:10.719 --> 00:38:13.880
<v Speaker 2>and we'll get into a couple of other topics later

660
00:38:13.960 --> 00:38:14.719
<v Speaker 2>on tonight as well,