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<v Speaker 1>Let's say good morning now to Richard Simon, the author

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<v Speaker 1>of Unplug How to Break Up with your Phone and

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<v Speaker 1>Reclaim your Life.

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<v Speaker 2>Good morning Richard, Good morning Amy.

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<v Speaker 1>Great to be here, Great to have you. Thanks for

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<v Speaker 1>getting up early with this. So you wrote this book,

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<v Speaker 1>and I saw the press release on it, and I go, oh,

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<v Speaker 1>my gosh, I have to read this book. And I

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<v Speaker 1>will tell you that since reading it, I've noticed even

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<v Speaker 1>more how pervasive our phones are. Like I'll find myself

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<v Speaker 1>sitting on the couch just playing Solitaire and other word

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<v Speaker 1>games four hours at a time, and it's just this

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<v Speaker 1>time suck and then like I'll put the phone down

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<v Speaker 1>and then I'll get this feeling like I need to

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<v Speaker 1>pick it up and play another game. And I was like,

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<v Speaker 1>oh my gosh, why is that.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, the core piece of dopamine. Dopamine is the most powerful,

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<v Speaker 2>one of the most powerful molecules in the brain. And

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<v Speaker 2>each time you tap your phone, whether it's with Solitaire

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<v Speaker 2>or whether it's Internet browser or WhatsApp, whatever it might be,

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<v Speaker 2>it releases dopamine, which just becomes more and more pleasurable.

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<v Speaker 2>And the smartphone is literally a shortcut machine. And that's

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<v Speaker 2>what's going on behind the scenes in your mind.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, so the premise of the book seems pretty straightforward.

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<v Speaker 1>You know that it may be time to break up

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<v Speaker 1>with your phone. But I want to ask you kind

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<v Speaker 1>of what is the goal of the book, Like, what

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<v Speaker 1>gave you the idea to write it?

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<v Speaker 2>Sure, and I'll started with me. I was sick of

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<v Speaker 2>my smartphone taking up hours of my day. The average

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<v Speaker 2>American adult spends more than five hours of dating on

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<v Speaker 2>their smartphones. We don't get that time back, and as

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<v Speaker 2>a father to young kids, in twenty nineteen, I realized this.

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<v Speaker 2>I had enough. So in twenty twenty, I turned my

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<v Speaker 2>smartphone off for an entire year, and it was one

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<v Speaker 2>of the most transformative moments of my life. And what

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<v Speaker 2>I realized is that look at all the various self

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<v Speaker 2>help articles and books everyone is espousing hacks noble as

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<v Speaker 2>they might be, but deleting social media, putting a rubber

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<v Speaker 2>band around your phone, digital stabbus, all these things are great,

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<v Speaker 2>but for something as addictive as a phone, as you

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<v Speaker 2>are just talking about it doesn't go far enough. So

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<v Speaker 2>I end up interviewing dozens of people over the course

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<v Speaker 2>of the last couple of years and found that the

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<v Speaker 2>first step to establishing a more effective relationship with your

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<v Speaker 2>smartphone is to turn it off.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, so turn off completely. So no GPS, no texting,

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<v Speaker 1>no social media, just done.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah. So, there are four different styles that outline the

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<v Speaker 2>book in terms of turning it off. The most popular

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<v Speaker 2>one I think that will resonate for your listeners is

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<v Speaker 2>to switch to a basic phone. And when I say

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<v Speaker 2>basic phone, I mean basic like calling and texting. There

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<v Speaker 2>are some like Kosher phones or wise phones that have

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<v Speaker 2>more features. For the sake of recalibrating the reward pathways

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<v Speaker 2>in your brain, I highly recommend switching over to a

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<v Speaker 2>basic phone. You can have your same phone number, you

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<v Speaker 2>can switch over the simcard at your local AT and

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<v Speaker 2>T Verizon, your T Mobile story. And by doing that,

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<v Speaker 2>by switching over to a basic phone, you're going to

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<v Speaker 2>regain the most precious resource source in life, which is time.

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<v Speaker 2>You're gonna get hours back because you're not gonna want

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<v Speaker 2>to text on this terrible device because it takes forever

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<v Speaker 2>the text and it'll completely reset you. So one of

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<v Speaker 2>the four breakup styles are recommend is switching to a

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<v Speaker 2>basic som.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, So then Richard also tell me like you said

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<v Speaker 1>that one of the things you noticed when I was

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<v Speaker 1>reading your book, you said you you and your wife

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<v Speaker 1>would come sit down on your couch at night and

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<v Speaker 1>you wouldn't talk to each other because you just stick

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<v Speaker 1>your noses in your phones and you're doing your own thing.

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<v Speaker 1>How did that immediately change when you turned your phone off.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, my wife, and she's a doctor, she's a physician.

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<v Speaker 2>She's very very busy in terms of her hours. And

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<v Speaker 2>what would end up happening is during the day. I'm

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<v Speaker 2>sure many other married couples who are listening go through this.

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<v Speaker 2>You text each other throughout the day, spouses, and there's

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<v Speaker 2>dozens of texts that are happening. You know, this is happening,

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<v Speaker 2>This is happening. What do you think of this? How

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<v Speaker 2>about this for dinner? This? And before you know it,

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<v Speaker 2>you get back home and you're already caught up when

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<v Speaker 2>everything had happened during the day, there's nothing to catch

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<v Speaker 2>up on, and all of a sudden, you know, we

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<v Speaker 2>stopped this texting throughout the day and we actual like

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<v Speaker 2>sit down and have dinner at the family and like,

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<v Speaker 2>I'm genuinely curious about what happened during the day, And

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<v Speaker 2>same for her in terms of what happened for my day.

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<v Speaker 2>It completely reset our relationship and it grew tremendously since

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<v Speaker 2>I went to this process and with the dozens of

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<v Speaker 2>people I interviewed in the book and in my profile,

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<v Speaker 2>it was the same. Relationships with family just improved so much.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, and well, we hear a lot about how like

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<v Speaker 1>kids who have grown up, they've had smartphones since, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>since they were very young, that they don't communicate as well,

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<v Speaker 1>they don't have those same communication skills because, like you said,

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<v Speaker 1>they text and do short little blurbs as opposed to

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<v Speaker 1>having full on conversations like we used to when we

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<v Speaker 1>were growing up. So I could I can see that correlation.

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<v Speaker 1>If somebody wants to dip their toe in, is there

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<v Speaker 1>a way to dip their toe in?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean for starters, go for a walk. Go

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<v Speaker 2>for a walk around the neighborhood for forty five minutes

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<v Speaker 2>an hour, and don't bring your phone. You're going to

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<v Speaker 2>be going crazy inside the first time you do it.

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<v Speaker 2>This is how addictive a smartphone is. But go for

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<v Speaker 2>a walk for forty five minutes to an hour and

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<v Speaker 2>do it by yourself for the first time. Don't bring

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<v Speaker 2>someone else and just have to embrace your own thoughts.

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<v Speaker 2>That's a smartphone has done is that we are no

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<v Speaker 2>longer able to embrace solitude, We're no longer able to

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<v Speaker 2>truly think. So that's the first step I would do,

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<v Speaker 2>And after you do it a few times, you're going

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<v Speaker 2>to realize this is really really nice. Start doing it

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<v Speaker 2>when you go out to dinner with friends, leave your

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<v Speaker 2>phone at home. The first time you're in the car.

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<v Speaker 2>You might be completely freaking out. That's the withdrawal, it's

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<v Speaker 2>completely natural. Then you're going to realize how special that is.

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<v Speaker 2>So before you go through any sort of detox in

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<v Speaker 2>terms of turning your phone off, I have a whole

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<v Speaker 2>section in my book about preparation. I think those were

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<v Speaker 2>some of the initial things you can do to start

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<v Speaker 2>to realize that, okay, I can do this.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay. And another example that you gave Richard that I

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<v Speaker 1>absolutely loved was you said after you turned your phone

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<v Speaker 1>off or you left it behind. I'm not sure if

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<v Speaker 1>it was before you or after you actually turned the

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<v Speaker 1>smartphone off. As you said, you went to the grocery

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<v Speaker 1>store and you were standing in line and you just

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<v Speaker 1>had to stand there because you didn't have a phone

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<v Speaker 1>to check and how weird that feeling is because we're

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<v Speaker 1>so used to be being connected all the time.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's so true. Yeah, the first day of my detox, Yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>I was at the grocery store and yeah, even just

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<v Speaker 2>for three four minutes, I could only scan the tabloids

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<v Speaker 2>for so long around me, and I'm literally freaking out inside.

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<v Speaker 2>And I'm literally standing in line at a grocery store.

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<v Speaker 2>You'd figure, Okay, you can deal with it for three

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<v Speaker 2>or four minutes, but I was not comfortable enough being

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<v Speaker 2>in my own skin. Now, looking back when it's five

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<v Speaker 2>years later, I mean, I don't go to the grocery

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<v Speaker 2>store with a smartphone ever. So now I'm totally comfortable

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<v Speaker 2>with it. So this whole process to talk about in

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<v Speaker 2>the book, it really will recalibrate the low word pathways

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<v Speaker 2>in your brain.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, Richard Simon, The book is Unplugged, How to break

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<v Speaker 1>up with your Phone and Reclaim your Life. I wish

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<v Speaker 1>we had more time to talk because this is so

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<v Speaker 1>interesting and it really opened my eyes to how much

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<v Speaker 1>we spend time on our phones and don't spend our

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<v Speaker 1>time living our lives. Where can we get the.

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<v Speaker 2>Book, Richard, I'm Plugged if be found at all major booksellers, Amazon, Targets,

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<v Speaker 2>Barnes and Noble, Walmart, your local independent bookstore wherever books

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<v Speaker 2>are sold.

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<v Speaker 1>All right, thank you so much, Richard Simon. Again, the

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<v Speaker 1>book is Unplugged, How to break up with your Phone

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<v Speaker 1>and reclaim your life. It's a quick read, and it's

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<v Speaker 1>really a good read. Richard, appreciate it. Have a great day.

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<v Speaker 2>Thanks so much. Aming you too.