Speaker 1: Golf Smarter number three hundred and eighty six, published on
May twenty eight, twenty thirteen.
Speaker 2: Welcome to Golf Smarter Mulligans, your second chance to gain
insight and advice from the best instructors featured on the
Golf Smarter podcast. Great Golf Instruction Never gets Old. Our
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like this that are no longer available in any podcast app.
Speaker 3: A fellow teammate of mine recently who in the PGA appear,
and he came out to watch a friend of mine play.
We're playing for Simmons, and we handed him a Persimmons
driver to hit a shot, and he hit it about
two hundred and ten yards. I mean, he just couldn't
hit it at all. But with the modern driver that's
ten ounces or eleven ounces and it's forty six inches
long and has a giant titanium head on it, he
can just sort of slap at it with his hands
and get one hundred and five miles an hour of
club hits. Bee knocked the thing out there two hundred
and eighty yards.
Speaker 1: And you don't like this.
Speaker 3: No, I don't like this. It's dumbing down. The game.
The thing that's been eliminated from the game has been
having to hit long irons, and that's how golf courses
are designed. But they're great architects designed these courses and
they said, there's ten par fours on a golf course.
So the golf course is designed to have typically three
long par fours meaning two three and four iron for
appro chat, and then they're going to have four mid
range five six and seven irons for a pro schot
and then three short part fours eight nine oher edge.
So the reason that they do that is to test
the skill set of the professional player, the top amateur
player on a professional championship course. The player has to
show their ability to play long irons, mid irons, and
short irons. That's golf.
Speaker 1: Today's equipment could be hurting your game with John Lagerts
of this is.
Speaker 2: Golf Smarter, sharing tips and insights from golfers and golf
professionals to help lower your score. It's worked for your host.
Speaker 1: Welcome to the Golf Smarter podcast.
Speaker 3: John, Thanks for having me out.
Speaker 1: I appreciate you coming out to a studio here and
staring out at uh at the Marine Country Club and
talking about taking a little walk on the fairway there.
Speaker 3: It's beautiful. It's a beautiful place.
Speaker 1: Idiots. You know what I recently discovered. And I've been
asking a lot of people and I'm no one's ever
done this, And I'll ask you, have you ever walked
on a golf course barefooted?
Speaker 3: Yes?
Speaker 1: Wow?
Speaker 3: That was part of my training at one point actually,
how so, Yeah, I was working with I had a
mental teacher that we were working that side of when
I was on tour, and he had never played golf before,
but he felt that it was important for me to
experience getting more grounded while I was playing. And he
was kind of more of a spiritualist in a sense,
so interesting, and he would we'd go out t off
at six in the morning. He just walk around with
me and play barefoot. And he wanted me to.
Speaker 1: Oh he wanted you to play barefoot?
Speaker 3: Yes, yeah, he wanted me to feel connection to the
earth that way as I was walking.
Speaker 1: And it was that a valuable lesson for you, because
I just found it's like just walking out on the
on the on a fairway, it's luxurious. I mean the grass,
it's yeah.
Speaker 3: I meaning to do this when I was a kid.
My dad had nice lawns around the house, so you know,
I would walk around barefoot. So it brought that back
to me. And yeah, it's it helped me feel something
maybe that I wasn't really tuning into before. And I
think later on, when I started getting more technical with
my swing and that sort of thing, I started to
understand ground pressures and ground forces and and Bradley and
I spent a lot of time working on those concepts
with the ABS students or Advanced Ball Striking students.
Speaker 1: And that is your that's your.
Speaker 3: Academy, our website, Yeah.
Speaker 1: Advanced ball Striking dot com.
Speaker 3: Spall Striking dot com.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And I'm fascinated. So you were working with a
mental coach during the process or before you got into
heavy part of your mechanics. I mean, where did you
go first with that?
Speaker 3: When I came I came out of as a youth.
I was one of the early prodigies of a book
called The Golfing Machine.
Speaker 1: A lot of people are familiar with that, sure show
on that.
Speaker 3: And I did that for all through junior golf, college golf,
and then my first year as a professional playing on
the Australian Tour. But I quickly realized that that technique
that I was being taught wasn't going to cut it
at that level the guys that were the great players
of that time. This was sort of at the end
of the personmon age. I got to play against you know,
Greg Norman, Nick Faldo, you know, these guys in the
late eighties when you were still hitting per Simon.
Speaker 1: And and they playing in the Australia.
Speaker 3: And yeah, playing in the Australian Open, and you know,
the PGA down there, and I was just a young
rookie and you know, standing on the driving range and
listening to the sound of contact, impact of what these
guys were doing compared with the little golf machine swing
that I had that was all kind of based on
kind of a hand throw centrifugal force, kind of a
swinging what we would call a swinging technique, wasn't I
could tell that wasn't really going to cut it. So
I had to make some changes if I wanted to
win on, you know, at that level. So I just
went home and I went back to my teacher and said,
I don't think this is going to work. Although I
was a pretty good player, I mean I was making
cuts and that sort of thing. But I mean I
was a long ways away from being able to win,
you know, to go that low on those courses down
there that were tight long, you know, really tough greens
are super fast. I mean, it was just much more
difficult than a lot of the stuff that was going
on over here.
Speaker 1: So it sounds interesting that you're saying that getting to
the tour and winning on the tour are different beasts.
Speaker 3: Yeah, absolutely, because in college golf, you know, I I
won a couple of times at the you know, collegiate levels,
and All American that sort of thing. Okay, Yeah, And
we had a really good team and Kevin and Kevin
Sutherland a lot of people might know that name from
the PJ twos on the team with me and his
younger brother David who played on the PGA Tour, and
Tim loss a lot was another good player, and so
myself and another guy named Doug Harper, and that was
we had five All Americans on our team. We went
to the NC to a championship, so you know, you
don't see that very often.
Speaker 1: That's pretty awesome. Yeah. Yeah. So anyway, the difference of
getting on the tour and succeeding.
Speaker 3: And winning on yeah, so being able to win at
the college level and being able to win at the
pro level. I mean it was a big, you know,
big leap. In college, you could shoot maybe three or
four under and win a tournament, you know, and on
you know, to of course, let's say like Pasa Tiempo
or something here would be like a world class per
simon track. You go down to Australia and now you're
playing that caliber course like you Alster mckensey layouts and
set up for tournament conditions with tight pharaoh's and long
ruff or you know, fast, super fast greens, and guys
are shooting you know, twelve under or fourteen under on
courses that are you know, just feel like they're impossible
to shoot those kind of scores. I remember playing in
the Australian Open at Royal Melbourne and you know, Greg
Norman shoots back to back sixty six's and I just thought,
I thought to myself, I mean, there's not even six
birdies out there, you know. If the greens were so
fast and it's windy and it was just so hard.
I mean I shot up pair of seventy threes or
something and played really well. I mean made the cut by,
you know, four or five shots easily. I played really
good and I'm and I'm seeing a pair of sixty
six is up there, going wow, that's that's another level.
That's something that's and what is it? I mean, how yeah,
well what you know, so that kind of that kind
of golf. You know, Peter Senior another great player that
was winning down there, and I mean these guys, it
was just a different sound when they struck the ball.
But that sound is being created by something, by something
in physics, you know, it's something different is happening. And
I had a high speed camera, a ten thousand shutter
frame camera at the time, and which was not everybody
had those back then, and I would I would set
it up in front of myself and then behind me
might be a guy like Peter Senior or somebody, and
then they didn't know that I was kind of filming them,
you know, like see like I'd get out of the way,
like you know, go change clubs or something. And but
I I put together some nice footage and also got
some great footage of Mo Norman up in Canada when
I played up there, and he let me film them.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well I read that on the website, and you
said that you promised him you'd never show it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and I still have. Like, I mean, I'll show
it to people, but I'm I'm not going to post
it on YouTube and all that stuff. It's just something special,
you know. But anyway, yeah, getting back to that, So
I started to study what was going on, and I
could see what was happening with the shaftlex and these
guys were holding shaft flex all the way to impact.
And there's a difference between a guy that's timing the
shaft into impact. They are, in other words, they are
trying to time the straightening of the shaft so in
other words, it flexes a transition and then it starts
to unflex and you're trying to time it so that
the shaft ends up straight at impact. And that's what
we call swinging technique, and that's what most people do.
But they're really great strikers, you know, you're Ben Hogan,
people like that that are holding shaft flex all the
way to impact. And again, you can't get confused by
looking at power Golf and seing that where the pictures
in the nineteen forty eight book, or where the shaft
is flexing the wrong direction that we had to do
with the camera lenses at that time. There's a distortion
of rolling shutter and that sort of thing. It's a
that those are not accurate and people are still confused
by that to this day. But that actually wasn't happening.
It was actually the shaft was actually flexing the other
direction because of the camera, so it would be flexing back,
not forward. You couldn't hit the ball of the shaft.
But history it was so that book's still there are
still confuses people to this day, and I still get
questions on that on the site. But anyway, so yeah,
I really realized that that was one of the things
that was causing the ball to sound differently because when
the energy is held in the shaft and you've got
a pre stressed club shaft coming into impact, that's stored energy.
In other words, what happens is the club head it
doesn't decelerate as much from the forces of impact as
it would if the shaft has already lost it. It's
stored energy and it's just straight and now it's just
a momentum strike. It's the momentum of the clubhead, of
the weight of the clubhead and that's how most people
play golf, but there's a different way of doing it
that these great strikers have figured out, and that's how
to hold shaffles all the way to impact. And that's
basically the core direction that the advanced ball striking moves
the students towards. We show the students how to do that,
and it's a little bit of work.
Speaker 1: But once you yeah, it sounds like it's a lot
of work.
Speaker 3: Well, it depends. It depends on the player if it's
already a good player.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Like you know, like Brad Hughes, you know, came to
me and we had known each other from playing on
the tour, but he'd come across some of my thoughts
on the game on a website that I'd been involved with,
and he contacted me and just said, you know, I
want to come up and visit you. And so we
just he came up here and we spent a week
together and it didn't really take long for him to
get him back to striking the ball well again because
he had a lot of the the core things there.
We just need to get as muscle strength back up
because the lightweight gear that everybody's playing, it's it's like
swing cancer. It slowly kills your swing over time because
you lose the muscle tone. It's just like going to
the gym. If you in the preciminage, guys were swinging
you know, fourteen, fifteen, even sixteen ounce drivers, and now
everybody's got a ten eleven ounce driver. So right away,
oh wow, I hit this really far. It's light and
it has a big head, and I don't have to
worry about, you know, missing the ball again. Swing as
hard as I want at it, and I get all
this speed. I can hit it a mile. But over time,
your muscles lose a little bit of their tone because
you're not swinging a heavier club. So it's just like
going to the gym and working out, and then you
don't work out for a year, Well you don't. All
of a sudden you're not as strong as you were,
so you need to the heavier gear. People don't like
it at first, like, oh it's too heavy, it's shafts
are too stiff. But if you practice with it and
train with it, it's just like going to the gym.
You get stronger. And if you look at the great
ball strikers, they're all pretty strong, like certainly in the forums,
and you see these big forearms, and it's putting forearm rotation,
adding that into the equation in a big way actively,
so you're actively striking it with forearm rotation. I mean,
Hogan talked about this and five lessons and briefly, but
it's there. But why why do all these great strikers
have big forearms if it wasn't necessary, you know, if
it's just a passive throw of the hands and the
impact like you know most people are teaching, then you
wouldn't see that. But I don't think it's a coincidence
that you see all these you know Snead and Hogan
and Nelson and George Knudsen and you know Moe and Peterson,
you know Norman, like all these guys had you know, guns,
Tom Watson, right, I mean you had strong forearms, you know,
Nicholas Palmer, you know where do I stop? Right?
Speaker 1: Right?
Speaker 3: Trevino even right. You don't see too many people with thin,
little weak forearms being great ball strikers.
Speaker 1: Today. You're seeing guys in phenomenal golf shape or just
phenomenal shape. Yeah, Tiger's led the way on that. It
seems like he's a completely different body than the old
school players.
Speaker 3: Yeah, but then you know you have a guy like Cabrera, right,
just one of the Masters. There's a guy, doesn't you know,
It doesn't look like he walked out of the fitness van. Yeah,
so there's something else going on there. And to be honestly,
that's the first time, you know, in the last well
since I started following golf a little bit again, that's
the first time I've seen a guy really hit it
good coming down the stretch hmm, you know, and hitting
it straight and hitting it stiff and look like he
really had control over it. I mean, this year's Masters,
that was really impressive of what Cabrera did, I thought,
But he looks like a guy that just walked out
of the sixties. Like, yeah, I feel like I can
hand him. I could hand him a set of per
Simmon and little blades and he just go and wipe
everybody out. I mean, I think he'd win a lot
more if it was if golf was played back in
the old way.
Speaker 1: You you come off kind of like a throwback you.
I mean, we were talking about sound recording a little
while ago before we started this interview, and you're talking
about tubes and listening to vinyl, and now you're talking
about per Simmons and you're not that old of a guy.
I mean, you're much longer than I am. But you
seem to have this love of the way it used
to be.
Speaker 3: Well, it's what I have is a love for quality.
Speaker 1: Okay.
Speaker 3: So if quality is better now than I love that.
I mean I'm not a throwback. I just like quality.
I mean, we talked a little bit about music, but
you know, I think anyone that knows music understands the
vinyl records sound better than digital recording. I mean, you
can go on and on about that. That's a whole
other com So is.
Speaker 1: The quality of golf, And that's a multiple question. Is
quality of golf or is it quality of golf equipment?
Or is it quality of golflers.
Speaker 3: The quality of ball striking, I would say, okay, And
here's how you tell. Like, if you take a modern player, Well,
you can't dig these guys out of the grave and
see how they would do with the modern gear. That's
not possible. But you can hand the modern players the
old gear and see how they would do, and I
would say that they don't do nearly as well as
the players in the past, because it's a different game
because it's a different equipment. So if you hand a
modern player a set of Persimmon woods and a blot
of golf ball that spins at a much higher rate,
so it's much more difficult, difficult to control. If you're
not playing well, it's easier to access tight pin placements
and that sort of thing. If you're really good and
you can control the spin of the ball, you can
hit it into the green and spin it left or
spin it right, and a lot of this has been
a lot as the shot making being able to curve
the ball where the golf ball holds its curvature all
the way into the green. So basically what's happening now
is the ball goes up, it curves to the apex
and falls straight down, and you don't have the ball
curving nearly as much as in the Blotta age. So
I would say that the players now are not as
good because every time I've handed you know, a young
player of per Simons, say try and hit this, they
can't even hit it at all. I mean, a fellow
teammate of mine recently who is a you know in
the PGA up here and he came out to watch
a friend of mine play. We're playing Per Simmons, and
we handed him a personmon driver to hit a shot,
and he hit it about two hundred and ten yards.
I mean, he just couldn't hit it at all. But
with a modern driver that's ten ounces or eleven ounces
and it's forty six inches long and has a giant
titanium head on it, can just sort of slap at
it with his hands and get one hundred and five
miles an hour a club hit speed, knock the thing
out there two hundred and eighty yards.
Speaker 1: And you don't like this.
Speaker 3: But with a persimmon, no, I don't like this because
it's dumbing down the game. In other words, if you're
if you're a great ball striker, then you should be
able to do it the old way. You should be
able to do it that way. And now if you
if you take the modern gear and add that into it,
then then that's a whole nother argument. But I want
to see that a guy can still do it the
old way. He's not using it as a crutch or
as a handicap. When you watch, you know, some of
the old footage. I mean some of those Shells matches
are great to watch because you can see what those
guys were doing back then. And you know, there's a
lot of really impressive stuff. I mean, people have seen
the Hogan and Sneed match. Of course, that's great stuff.
I mean, you know, but the thing that's been eliminated
from the game has been the long iron play. You know,
having to hit long irons, and that's how golf courses
were designed, right, So the great architects designed these courses
and they said, okay, we're going to have we're going
to have there's ten par fours on a golf course, right,
typically par seventy two, you know, so the par fours
of the heart of the golf course. So the golf
course is designed to have typically three long par fours
meaning two three and four iron for approach shot, okay,
and then they're going to have four mid range five
six and seven irons for approach shot, and then three
short par fours eight nine oer wedge. So the reason
that they do that is to test the skill set
of the player, of the professional player, the top amateur
player on a professional championship course, the player has to
show their ability to play long irons, mid irons and
short irons.
Speaker 1: That's golf, but today it's driver wedge. Well on the.
Speaker 3: Tour, yes, of course. You know what's happening now is
the players are not being properly tested, so they're hitting
I'm seeing guys hit mid irons into.
Speaker 1: Par fives right crazy.
Speaker 3: So what are they doing on par fours? Well, even
the longest par fours they're hitting. I mean, guys are
still hitting short irons and even the longest par fours
at times a lot of mid irons. But to me,
the great thing about the great ball strikers of the
past was their ability to play two irons, three irons,
one iron from the fairway into a par four and
be able to shape a ball into the green and
hold it on a green that was designed to accept
that kind of a shot. And when I look at
the Masters, which we just saw recently here, and if
you look at the AT's say ten and eleven, those
are you know the famous holes, Well those were those
are long par fours that were meant to accept long
iron shots, which means a lower trajectory. So in the
old days, the guys were kind of bumping them into
that green like they'd hid into the front part of
the green. They'd skip, But you didn't see a guy
backing the ball up on the green. I mean it
would it would. It would come in and it would
land and then it would kick forward. And you were
coming into those holes with a lower trajectory shot. Now
I'm seeing guys coming in with eight irons that are
just throwing it at the flag and stopping the ball
on the green, you know, backing them up on the green.
That's not how the hole was designed. I mean, Jones
and McKenzie would be spinning in their graves if they
knew that that was going on. They would not be
happy about that. And it's disrespectful to the game. Wow,
it's disrespectful to the game. It's disrespectful to the history
of the game. And what it does is it makes
the It trivializes the efforts of the great players of
the past, you know, and they look back and they say, oh,
the old footage or whatever. But the other thing about
the masters is those greens were never meant to be
that that fast either. I don't think could the undulating
of the slope, undulations of the slope the greens. If
you go back and look at the old footage they
they were putting like a public course of slow greens
or something, and that's how it was designed really to
play that way. So it's kind of turned into something else.
But what happens when you do that, is it when
you change the game, you change the rules or the
equipment rules or their requirements for equipment. Then the past
is now no longer relevant. Really, it just becomes, you know,
a novelty of the past. And I think that's sad.
You know, Geen Saracen knocked his famous forward in from
two hundred and thirty four yards or some about two
hundred and thirty yards forward, and up until maybe the
end of the eighties, guys were still hitting forwards or
those that length of a shot into say the fifteenth
that Augusta. But now I'm seeing guys hitting mid irons
in there, right, you know? So that too that he
made knocking it in the cup with a forwood. I mean,
that's he did that in the thirties.
Speaker 1: In watching the Masters, the fourteen year old kid who
doesn't have a ton of power but kind of hung
on there. Did you is it? Did you?
Speaker 3: I'm angry about it?
Speaker 1: Tell me? Oh, I love this well.
Speaker 3: I mean a fourteen year old kid. I mean you
have to remember three years ago he was eleven, right.
I mean, golf traditionally has been a game that takes
years and years to learn how to play. And when
you dumb the game down with a giant headed driver
that you know, is like a frying pan or a
toaster on a stick, so there's no there's no precision
needed to strike an insert on a per simon, for instance.
The game's been dumbed down to the point to we're
a fourteen year old that just swings hard at it
can hit the ball out there far enough on the
tour now to just kind of contend or whatever.
Speaker 1: So you're saying, if I can interpret this, that today's
equipment is removing a lot of the skill that is
required for competitive golf.
Speaker 3: Absolutely, absolutely it is, and dumbing it down and making
it easier doesn't make the game better. It's just like
playing chess or playing checkers. You know, you're playing on
the same board, but one has chess pieces that have
a very sophisticated game, a very old traditional game. I
think the one change they made was the castling move,
Like back in the late eighteen hundreds or something, and
that was very controversial at the time, but that was like,
that was it. But that game is still being played
the same. So if you go to checkers, then that's
a different you know, it's just kind of a dumbed
down version of a chest in a way, like you
just you know, you have black and red checkers right
that skip over each other, So you know, it's it's
the dumbing the game down. And that's what the mentality
has been over the last twenty years. Like I think
these the people that are running the game or haters,
they hate golf, they're angry.
Speaker 1: It's today running the game that you're talking about, the us.
Speaker 3: USGA, the RNA, the equipment companies, the people that are
that are in control of what happens out there at
the club level, at the professional level, these are people
that are hackers. They hate golf. It's too difficult for them,
and the idea that inventing a club where they can
propel the ball farther it's very selfish. They're thinking for
themselves and they're not thinking about the implications of what's
happening at the professional level. Now, if you hand these
same clubs to the pros that's great for amateurs to
be able to hit the ball next to forty yard,
it's fine. I have no problem with that. At the
club level, people can do what they want. If they
want to ride around on tricycles, that's fine, okay, But
I don't want to see the crafts. Yeah, I don't
want to see tricycle racing. At the pro level. You know,
you got to be on two wheels, you know, go
back to persimmon and blades, get back on two wheels again.
You know, let's see some skill. You know, everybody's got
these crutches, they got this extra you know, long putters
and all this stuff going on cavity backs, all this
stuff to a ball that flies ten percent farther than
maybe fifteen percent, far farther than it used to. So
the classic sixty eight hundred yard course has to be
close to eight thousand yards, So the courses aren't long
enough and doesn't really make sense to have eight thousand
yard golf courses. I mean, I don't think so.
Speaker 1: I don't think no, because well, the eight thousand yard
golf courses are playing into their hand. I mean, these
guys are hitting farther and farther so they make the
courses longer to make it look good on television. I
get a sense that you may be an advocate for bifurcation.
Speaker 3: Absolutely yeah. And because the USGA is not going to change.
I mean they're like a it's like an ocean liner
out there. That's okay, we need you to make a
U turn. It's like it's going to take a long time.
You know, it's not there. They're trying to the grooves thing.
I mean, that was silly.
Speaker 1: You know. It's like the USGA is hiding behind you know,
the protect the integrity of the game, but yet the game.
You know, there are two different things going on. We
got the tour and we've got the rest of us right,
and it's like the USGA. I would hope, in trying
to grow the game is going to make it more
enjoyable for the rest of us. Or should everything be
focused around the elite scratch players And when ninety plus
percent of the people don't even break one hundred, what
should we do about those rules? And who's it for?
Should we let those people?
Speaker 3: I think at the club level, I mean I have
no problem with the frying pan drivers and all that
people want to hit that stuff. I mean, at the
club level, I don't think it should be banned, long putters, whatever,
it's a whatever they want to do. But at the
pro lem because I'm a professional played on the tour
speaking from that perspective, and the thing is that most
people they watched the pros because they derive inspiration from
that from the professionals. They watch professional they go, wow,
that's really great. I want to be like that, or
they relate to this player or that player. You know,
in the era that I played, you had you know,
Greg Norman. They could drive a person in three hundred yards,
and then you had Corey Paven they could drive a
person in about two hundred and twenty five yards. But
yet Corey Paven could just maneuver the ball around the
golf course on a good a good week and beat
a guy like Greg Norman, which is really impressive. And see,
we don't have that kind of diversity anymore. Maybe there
might be a short hitter that can do well on
a couple courses, you know, but for the most part,
the tour doesn't play tight golf courses anymore. And in
the US Open, they don't really have US Open roff anymore.
I mean I played in you know, a few USGA
events where the rough was like over your ankles and
if you hit it, if you hit it into the rough,
you just wedged out basically, and it was it was
about a half a shot penalty. And you know, when
Rory won the US Open, I mean, that was great
golf that he played, sure, but there was just a
typical PGA Tour event set up. You know, there was
no rough to spe a little bit of rough, but
I was watching him spin the ball back from the rough,
and we know they say that the course was wet
and you know, and then they had a lot of
rain and this sort of thing. But the course definitely
what they should have done is grown the rough really long,
and they can always cut it right. They can always
cut it back if they need to. But to me,
that was a disgrace to see seventeen under as the
US Open record, because eight under par was the record
for what how many thirty years or Hogan and Nicholas
and Hogan set the record, then Nicholas came along and
then Tiger, you know, played some of the greatest golf
ever right at Pebble Beach and then broke the records
at twelve under. And now you have a guy that
comes along, she's seventeen under. But the course wasn't set
up like a US Open. It's not fair. If you
look at the footage from when Hogan wanted Olympic Club,
when he won Olympic Club, but when he lost at
Olympic Club, I would say, yeah, but he you know
that the rough was like almost to his knees. I mean,
he's like pitching out with a wedge on eighteen. He
hooked it in the left rough, foot slipped or whatever,
and you hit in the left rough. And if you
look at the photos of that, I mean that stuff's like,
you know, way up over his ankles, right right, you
know you see that bushes. Yeah, you don't see that anymore.
So the tour and the US g and all, they
want the guys to shoot low. They want the scores
to be low. They think, you know, people are impressed
by that, But I'm impressed by seeing the golf course.
Like I like to stick up for the course itself,
you know, And I want to stick up for the golfer,
stick up for the course itself, and and I like
to stick up for the ball strikers, the guys that
can hit it straight. So how can you be if
you're a straight hitter of the golf, Well, how can
you be rewarded if there's no penalty for guys that
hit a crookeet right?
Speaker 1: Well, for I need to uh wrap this up for
for this episode. Could you stick around because I want
to continue because you know the reason you and I
are doing this is I got an email from Golf
Smarter listener John Pappus and he said that you and
your Aussie partner Bradley Hughes are both big on learning
the swing from impact backwards and I want to spend
a lot of time talking about that, what that means
and how we can institute that in our lives, how
you approach it. Also, he says you have very unique
perspective on today's light equipment and huge driver heads, which
we've touched on. Yeah, and then and again he says
from two thousand that he says that you've said that
from two thousand onward that the pro swings who deteriorated
number of fairways hit has gotten worse and lighter equipment
is hurt.
Speaker 3: So they handed Brent Sedeker, Per Simmon and Blades. Okay,
he's top three in the world.
Speaker 1: Now.
Speaker 3: A few years ago, handed per Simon and Blade sent
him out to Hilton and he shot eighty So what
does that say. It says something. I mean, yeah, I mean,
had he worked with them a little bit, obviously would
shoot eighty. He might shoot seventy two or three. But
I don't think he's just going to necessarily go out
there and shoot sixty six. That's what those things.
Speaker 1: There's a difference, all right, So we can pursue this
further on the next episode. You stick around, Thank you.
I appreciate that, and I appreciate you coming out.
Speaker 3: Yeah, thank you.